WEBVTT - The Truth About Coming Back From Maternity Leave 0:00:00.000 --> 0:00:01.319 I'm going to get this out of the way right 0:00:01.320 --> 0:00:03.640 off the bat. All the things that you worry might 0:00:03.720 --> 0:00:07.000 happen when you come back from eternity leave, they all happen. 0:00:07.160 --> 0:00:10.520 It's all real. Here's an example. People around the office 0:00:10.600 --> 0:00:13.520 might barely remember you on that topic. You might be 0:00:13.560 --> 0:00:17.119 wondering who I am. I'm Francesca Leavy, co host of 0:00:17.200 --> 0:00:20.599 Game Plan, and I'm fresh back from eternity leave. This week, 0:00:20.720 --> 0:00:22.360 we're gonna be talking about what it's like when you 0:00:22.400 --> 0:00:24.959 come back from work after a long leave. This is 0:00:25.000 --> 0:00:39.640 game Plan. I'm Francesca Lead and I'm Rebecca Greenfield, and 0:00:39.760 --> 0:00:43.199 welcome back. Francesca. Thank you. We missed you while you 0:00:43.240 --> 0:00:46.120 were gone. Thanks. I was gone for a while. Yeah, 0:00:46.240 --> 0:00:48.680 did some good work mile you were gone. Sam Grobert 0:00:48.720 --> 0:00:51.440 did a great job filling in. He did, and that 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:54.040 won't be the last that you guys will hear from him. 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:57.000 But now you're back. I'm back and we are going 0:00:57.040 --> 0:00:59.520 to talk all about me in a few moments. But 0:00:59.680 --> 0:01:03.160 for I'm not the only person that's gone away from 0:01:03.280 --> 0:01:05.800 their job for a long stretch and then had to 0:01:05.840 --> 0:01:07.920 come back and readjust Yeah, there are all sorts of 0:01:07.959 --> 0:01:10.720 reasons that people might leave their jobs for an extended 0:01:10.720 --> 0:01:13.360 period of time and then come back with change circumstances 0:01:13.400 --> 0:01:17.039 like obviously having a kid. It's the big one because 0:01:17.200 --> 0:01:20.120 a lot of people do it. But now as the 0:01:20.160 --> 0:01:23.880 workforce ages, more people are leaving their jobs to take 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:28.640 care of sick family members, like their elderly parents. And 0:01:28.720 --> 0:01:30.959 companies that have the best benefits, like the ones that 0:01:31.040 --> 0:01:34.520 have the really plush maternity leave packages, also are starting 0:01:34.520 --> 0:01:37.680 to offer these elder care benefits where they'll give you 0:01:37.760 --> 0:01:41.560 paid time off to take care of a sick family member. 0:01:42.160 --> 0:01:44.920 And I think people who come back from something like 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:47.560 that or maybe they're you know, maybe you'd be off 0:01:47.640 --> 0:01:51.000 work for disability or some of the reason often have 0:01:51.120 --> 0:01:53.200 a lot in common with people who go out on 0:01:53.280 --> 0:01:56.680 maternity leave or parental leave. They come back and it's 0:01:56.720 --> 0:01:59.400 not like they can get right back to doing exactly 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:03.000 the thing they were doing before. You've kind of changed circumstances. Yeah, 0:02:03.040 --> 0:02:06.200 Like there's not only what like you're saying, this transition process, 0:02:06.240 --> 0:02:09.120 but you might have to go to a doctor's appointment, 0:02:09.680 --> 0:02:12.320 or or you have to continue caring for your elderly 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:15.280 parents even if it's not your full time gig. Yeah, 0:02:15.280 --> 0:02:18.560 and there are stigmas associated with that. I mean, especially 0:02:18.600 --> 0:02:22.200 with parents. There's all this research showing that women when 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:24.280 they have kids and come back to the workforce are 0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:27.320 unfairly judged for many of their actions. And they have 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:30.960 this motherhood penalty where they lose four percent of their 0:02:30.960 --> 0:02:33.680 pay for every child they have controlling for a time 0:02:33.680 --> 0:02:36.079 taken off. So it's like, just because you have a kid, 0:02:36.960 --> 0:02:39.280 and just in case you're wondering, dad's don't have this, 0:02:39.560 --> 0:02:42.840 they get a fatherhood bonus. Because we see parents differently 0:02:42.840 --> 0:02:45.280 in the workplace, right, So like when a dad has 0:02:45.320 --> 0:02:47.799 to leave a few minutes early to pick up his kid, 0:02:47.880 --> 0:02:50.880 everyone thinks would a stand up guy who handles his 0:02:50.919 --> 0:02:53.000 family responsibilities so well, But when a woman does it, 0:02:53.280 --> 0:02:56.839 she just can't juggle everything. You can't do at all. Yeah, 0:02:56.960 --> 0:03:00.880 because workplaces aren't really set up for work parents, a 0:03:00.960 --> 0:03:03.520 lot of women in particular end up just not coming back. 0:03:03.960 --> 0:03:06.200 And on the face of it, that seems kind of 0:03:06.240 --> 0:03:09.800 crappy to take your maternity leave and then quit immediately after, 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:12.480 but I can kind of see how it happens. You know, 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:14.480 if you were already having some issues with your job 0:03:14.880 --> 0:03:18.200 and then your whole life changes and you have to 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:21.200 add that to balancing this job that you didn't like 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:22.959 that much to begin with. I can sort of see 0:03:22.960 --> 0:03:26.760 how going back can suddenly become a really difficult thing 0:03:26.800 --> 0:03:29.000 to do. And even when you do like your job, 0:03:29.040 --> 0:03:33.400 like you Francesca love it, there are anxieties about coming back. 0:03:33.600 --> 0:03:35.560 And I think it would be fun for us to 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:38.240 go back to an episode that we did with you 0:03:38.360 --> 0:03:40.320 before you left on Atornity Leave, where we talked to 0:03:40.360 --> 0:03:43.360 you about your anxieties and what you were worried about. 0:03:43.600 --> 0:03:50.080 Let's hear what I was freaking out about. There's so 0:03:50.120 --> 0:03:54.440 many complicating interests, you know. There's me wanting all of 0:03:54.480 --> 0:03:56.840 the work that I've done to be maintained and maintained 0:03:56.840 --> 0:04:00.160 well and be in good shape, and the projects I'm 0:04:00.160 --> 0:04:02.400 proud of and feel close to, I want them to 0:04:02.400 --> 0:04:04.080 go well. But then it's like I want them to 0:04:04.160 --> 0:04:06.960 go to well because I want people to want to 0:04:07.000 --> 0:04:09.680 feel relevant and I want people to miss the work 0:04:09.720 --> 0:04:14.960 that I did. So how was that for you? Did 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:18.840 any of that ring true? Well, Sam had the nerve 0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:21.719 to go ahead and do a really good job, so 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:24.880 obviously I'm super threatened by that. But no, it was 0:04:24.920 --> 0:04:27.680 really interesting to listen to because the thing about coming 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:30.760 back is everything that you counted out of happening kind 0:04:30.760 --> 0:04:35.279 of happens. Like some things were done really well without 0:04:35.279 --> 0:04:38.400 me being here, and I'm less necessary for those things. 0:04:38.400 --> 0:04:40.880 But I'm also really happy that a lot of things 0:04:40.880 --> 0:04:42.720 I was working hard on were kept together really well, 0:04:42.720 --> 0:04:44.640 and you did such a great job while I was gone, 0:04:45.279 --> 0:04:48.760 So you know, everything's kind of like where I left it, 0:04:48.880 --> 0:04:51.200 you know, like the things that we're going well are 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:54.039 still going well, and the things that everybody has about 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:55.720 their job that are kind of annoying and frustrating are 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:58.560 still annoying and frustrating, and there's something reassuring about that. 0:04:58.640 --> 0:05:00.719 And you also are talking to me about like the 0:05:00.839 --> 0:05:03.680 weird little things throughout your work day. It's funny to 0:05:03.800 --> 0:05:06.440 like drop back into the same job that you left 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:09.159 so many months later. Because I was a different person, 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:11.640 not just because I was a person without a kid 0:05:11.960 --> 0:05:14.560 back then, but I was a pregnant person, and I 0:05:14.600 --> 0:05:16.599 feel like I was more of a monster than I 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:19.240 kind of realized. So I was in such a bad 0:05:19.279 --> 0:05:21.000 mood all the time. Like I opened up a chat 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:24.240 window to send a message to a colleague, and the 0:05:24.320 --> 0:05:27.719 last chat that I had sent her was from the summer, 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:31.160 and it was just me complaining about somebody not giving 0:05:31.160 --> 0:05:33.800 me a seat in a meeting because I was so 0:05:33.880 --> 0:05:37.640 pregnant and so tired all the time. Reasonable complaint, reasonable, 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:40.760 But I just I realized that I was really annoyed 0:05:40.880 --> 0:05:42.560 and tired a lot of the time at the end 0:05:42.560 --> 0:05:46.359 of my pregnancy. So I'm hoping that coming back, I 0:05:46.360 --> 0:05:49.120 can actually be a more efficient and better worker just 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:53.120 because I'm not as piste off all the time. Well, 0:05:53.160 --> 0:05:55.240 now it seems like a good time to bring on 0:05:55.400 --> 0:05:58.279 our guest who's going to share her experience as about 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:00.640 what it was like coming back from her leave. Anna 0:06:00.720 --> 0:06:03.040 Sale is host of the Death, Sex and Money podcast 0:06:03.080 --> 0:06:05.160 from w n y C Studios, and when she went 0:06:05.200 --> 0:06:08.080 on maternity leave, she took kind of a novel approach. 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:12.479 She decided to talk about it before, during, and after 0:06:12.720 --> 0:06:21.680 her maternity leave on her podcast. Hi Anna, Hi, So 0:06:21.880 --> 0:06:24.240 we're really excited to talk to you about how you've 0:06:24.279 --> 0:06:27.400 integrated your maternity leave with your work and your life 0:06:27.400 --> 0:06:31.080 at work. You've been pretty open on your show about 0:06:31.400 --> 0:06:33.200 the fact that you were pregnant and planning to take 0:06:33.240 --> 0:06:36.080 maternity leave. You did what you called a visible maternity 0:06:36.160 --> 0:06:38.240 leave in some forms. So can you just explain a 0:06:38.279 --> 0:06:39.920 little bit about what that means to you and what 0:06:39.920 --> 0:06:42.880 it looked like. Sure. So my show Death, Sex, and 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:46.320 Money is it's about the things that we all go 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:49.400 through but can have trouble talking about. So that can 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:53.760 be really big things like relationships or grief. But also 0:06:53.920 --> 0:06:56.839 I thought like maternity leave is one of those things. 0:06:56.839 --> 0:07:00.520 It's the things that working women, uh kind of have 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:04.360 a little bit of guilt about as they're approaching it. 0:07:04.600 --> 0:07:07.720 And then when my colleagues who got a maternity leave 0:07:07.800 --> 0:07:09.800 before me, when I would watch them go, it was 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:12.520 like they were super pregnant. I wouldn't see them for 0:07:12.560 --> 0:07:15.040 four months, and then they would come back with a 0:07:15.080 --> 0:07:17.240 cute little baby in the office and it was just like, Wow, 0:07:17.280 --> 0:07:20.880 what on earth did they do down this wormhole? So yeah, 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:22.440 so it just seemed to me like this is like 0:07:22.480 --> 0:07:25.080 a um new parents would just disappear and then they 0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:28.200 would come back and it was like what happens on 0:07:28.280 --> 0:07:32.000 maternity leave. And since I started the show about two 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:35.960 and a half years ago, I got engaged, I got married, 0:07:36.080 --> 0:07:39.000 I got pregnant, So it seemed and that was part 0:07:39.040 --> 0:07:40.560 of what I would talk about on the show so 0:07:40.600 --> 0:07:43.120 when I was going away on maternity leave, it was like, Okay, 0:07:43.200 --> 0:07:47.520 how do I let listeners in on what's going on 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:52.000 with me without working during my maternity leave, right because 0:07:52.040 --> 0:07:54.800 I didn't want to do that. So what we decided 0:07:54.880 --> 0:07:57.400 to do was we, in addition to you know, just 0:07:57.400 --> 0:08:00.040 producing some episodes ahead of time, we also had a 0:08:00.240 --> 0:08:04.239 series of guest host who had been on the show before, 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:07.120 and then in the middle of each of their shows, 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:09.800 they would call me up and we would talk and 0:08:09.880 --> 0:08:12.480 I was, you know, on my cell phone talking about 0:08:12.520 --> 0:08:14.880 what was going on in that instant with my infants. 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:17.720 So it was an attempt to sort of show like 0:08:18.000 --> 0:08:21.680 when parents go on parental leave, they don't disappear, they're 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:25.400 doing really important work, they're just not visible in the workplace. 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:29.160 And uh so that's what I talked about. So you 0:08:29.280 --> 0:08:32.319 obligated yourself to staying plugged into work to some extent, 0:08:32.400 --> 0:08:37.280 Then did you regret that at all? In the end? Uh? 0:08:37.440 --> 0:08:41.720 I didn't. And I think probably part of my personality, 0:08:41.920 --> 0:08:46.839 like I, when you're on maternity leave, when you are 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:50.839 used to being in the rapids of the media, it 0:08:50.920 --> 0:08:54.800 can feel isolating all of a sudden. So I appreciated 0:08:55.400 --> 0:08:59.079 having a way to sort of step in but then say, okay, 0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:01.360 that's all I'm doing this week and step away. And 0:09:01.600 --> 0:09:04.440 I liked that, just staying a little bit, a little 0:09:04.440 --> 0:09:06.880 bit in tune with what was happening in the world. 0:09:07.360 --> 0:09:09.240 Can you tell us just how long you took and 0:09:09.320 --> 0:09:13.320 when you got back from leave? Yeah, I I took 0:09:13.400 --> 0:09:16.480 four months off of work. I was thinking about that 0:09:16.559 --> 0:09:18.600 this morning. It's so strange, like, one of the things, 0:09:19.040 --> 0:09:22.040 this is my first child. So one of the strange 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:23.920 things about working when you're pregnant is all of a 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:26.000 sudden people start asking you, like, how long are you 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:29.360 going to take? And I didn't. I knew what I 0:09:29.400 --> 0:09:32.480 was eligible for based on my time at w n 0:09:32.600 --> 0:09:35.200 y C, and and I knew what would be paid. 0:09:35.440 --> 0:09:38.280 And I had decided on four months because that seemed 0:09:38.760 --> 0:09:42.160 more luxurious than three months, but not too long. I 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:44.800 could take up to six months paid leave at w 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:49.079 N y C, which is amazing, So I I opted 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:50.960 to take four months, not knowing what it was going 0:09:51.000 --> 0:09:53.040 to be like to be a parent, and I guess 0:09:53.320 --> 0:09:56.599 as it got closer and closer, I was really surprised 0:09:57.920 --> 0:10:00.360 by the It was anxiety, but I allo I was 0:10:00.400 --> 0:10:04.000 feeling really wistful and sad in a way that I 0:10:04.040 --> 0:10:08.280 wasn't expecting. And I think it was I was mourning 0:10:08.800 --> 0:10:12.960 my work identity of being a childless person, you know, 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:15.959 being part of this team where we all work really hard, 0:10:16.120 --> 0:10:18.839 and you know, I had a measure of flexibility that 0:10:18.880 --> 0:10:21.320 I don't have now to jump in at a moment's 0:10:21.320 --> 0:10:23.720 notice to to put out whatever fire. And when you 0:10:23.720 --> 0:10:27.320 have a kid, your obligations and priorities shift a little bit. 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:31.120 So I felt this kind of sadness as maternity leave 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:33.080 was approaching. And I was really surprised by that because 0:10:33.280 --> 0:10:36.200 I thought, like, oh my gosh, four months off of work, 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:39.600 you know, like with a baby, it'll be like the 0:10:39.640 --> 0:10:43.120 best summer vacation. Um, it wasn't like that at all. 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:46.000 But that was a feeling that surprised me that I 0:10:46.200 --> 0:10:48.160 it didn't just feel like, oh my god, I'm so 0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:50.080 excited for this to happen, for me to be able 0:10:50.080 --> 0:10:53.320 to step away from work. Yeah, I remember feeling I 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:55.640 don't know if I felt sad, but I remember feeling 0:10:55.840 --> 0:10:58.840 anxious for sure. But you can go back to the 0:10:58.880 --> 0:11:02.640 tape out on it. Yeah, I think we talked about 0:11:02.679 --> 0:11:06.720 how you were worried about the things that people talk about, 0:11:06.760 --> 0:11:08.840 you know, your job being taken away from you and 0:11:08.880 --> 0:11:13.440 losing the responsibilities, and what would happen to your job 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:15.000 when you are gone, and what it would be like 0:11:15.000 --> 0:11:18.840 when you got back, yeah, and the elements relevance and 0:11:18.840 --> 0:11:21.840 then also what kind of and You've talked about this, 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:23.800 so I'd love to hear your take on it. But 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:26.520 what kind of person you'll be once you have a baby? 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:29.760 Everybody tells you this life changing thing, So I think 0:11:30.120 --> 0:11:33.040 you prepare for a total personality shift, and you're like, 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:35.520 is that person going to be as into their career 0:11:35.880 --> 0:11:39.200 as the pre baby person? Did you have that kind 0:11:39.200 --> 0:11:42.320 of reckoning? Oh? Yeah, I mean I think there's so 0:11:42.360 --> 0:11:45.240 many things to be anxious about when you're pregnant, including like, 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:48.000 how am I going to change with all these hormones 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:50.760 shooting off in my brain that I've never had happened before, 0:11:51.440 --> 0:11:53.880 But also like is this baby going to be healthy? 0:11:54.000 --> 0:11:56.640 And no matter how I'm feeling about work or not work, 0:11:56.679 --> 0:11:59.040 am I going to be able to commit to work 0:11:59.080 --> 0:12:01.760 in the same way that I did before? So I 0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:04.360 was I was feeling all of that. Yeah, So what 0:12:04.480 --> 0:12:06.559 was it like when you first got back. What were 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:09.199 the what were the realities that were the same as 0:12:09.200 --> 0:12:11.679 what you anticipated, and what was different. The first thing 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:14.800 you think about is pumping. Pumping is like the worst, 0:12:15.400 --> 0:12:19.760 It's the worst. It seems pretty destructive. Yeah, Becca has 0:12:19.840 --> 0:12:22.959 heard me talk about it a lot. Yeah, it's like 0:12:23.320 --> 0:12:26.120 I find it. You know, I've never been a smoker 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:28.480 at work, so I've never had something that like, all 0:12:28.520 --> 0:12:30.640 of a sudden, your body says, no matter what's on 0:12:30.679 --> 0:12:33.320 your calendar, you have to stop something for fifteen to 0:12:33.360 --> 0:12:37.040 twenty minutes. And you know, with all the equipment and 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:39.520 carrying that this and that back and forth from work. 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:41.520 I mean that took you know, there were definitely like 0:12:41.600 --> 0:12:44.560 early days where I just like left essential Part number 0:12:44.640 --> 0:12:46.559 one on the kitchen counter and had to go back 0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:47.920 to work. I had to go back and get it. 0:12:48.240 --> 0:12:51.040 So that was It's like the biggest thing I think about. 0:12:51.320 --> 0:12:54.360 And I think that even saying that that pumping has 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:57.240 been the biggest stress is the result of me having 0:12:57.280 --> 0:13:03.439 really great, reliable childcare. So for me, I haven't had 0:13:03.480 --> 0:13:07.400 to worry about is my baby safe when I leave 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:11.079 for work. I have a childcare provider who I feel 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:15.240 like is actually my baby is much better off getting 0:13:15.240 --> 0:13:17.240 to spend several hours a day with her because she 0:13:17.320 --> 0:13:21.079 knows what she's doing, um and she's teaching us. Uh 0:13:21.240 --> 0:13:24.079 So I feel like the the the end of maternity 0:13:24.160 --> 0:13:27.680 leave was just this ball of stress about nailing down 0:13:27.720 --> 0:13:32.240 that childcare and but once that was done, I was 0:13:32.320 --> 0:13:35.800 able to shift back to thinking about, Okay, what is 0:13:35.840 --> 0:13:38.160 work going to look like? Yeah, so that that brings 0:13:38.200 --> 0:13:40.880 me to my next question. It's like, there's the added 0:13:41.440 --> 0:13:44.120 I don't know, anxiety of how people are perceiving you 0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:46.520 now that you're a mom. I mean, there's all this 0:13:46.640 --> 0:13:50.320 research showing that people treat moms differently, even if they 0:13:50.320 --> 0:13:52.800 don't act defferitely in the workplace. Is that something you've 0:13:52.960 --> 0:13:56.080 felt just like having this identity of a working mom. 0:13:56.200 --> 0:14:00.840 I have felt incredibly supported by my co workers, but 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:03.960 it is like I definitely have the demon voice in 0:14:04.000 --> 0:14:06.800 the back of my head saying like, oh my god, 0:14:06.840 --> 0:14:08.800 if they in your five minutes like getting to your desk, 0:14:08.800 --> 0:14:11.040 they're going to think you're not committed. You're not committed worker. 0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:12.680 And it's because you have a two baby now you 0:14:12.679 --> 0:14:15.240 know all these you know, it's the it's the guilt 0:14:15.559 --> 0:14:18.760 of um just wanting to make sure to show up 0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:21.200 in the same way that you showed up before, which 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:23.440 is a little more complicated now, you know, like if 0:14:23.480 --> 0:14:27.080 I'm walking out the door heading to work and the 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:30.720 baby starts crying and needs to be you know, given 0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:32.840 a bottle, it's going to take five to ten extra 0:14:32.880 --> 0:14:35.200 minutes than that I wouldn't have to deal with before. 0:14:36.040 --> 0:14:38.840 But I think that I work on a small enough 0:14:38.960 --> 0:14:42.600 team that we are pretty communicative about like can you 0:14:42.680 --> 0:14:44.960 pick up this piece, I'll pick up this piece later. 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:47.640 And and I found the kind of split shift thing 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:50.120 of you know, I have a hard out at the 0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:53.720 end of the work day to relieve June's childcare provider, 0:14:54.160 --> 0:14:56.640 but I after she goes down to bed, I can 0:14:56.680 --> 0:14:58.680 get back on email and do you know, spend a 0:14:58.680 --> 0:15:01.280 few more hours. So I don't think I'm spending a 0:15:01.440 --> 0:15:05.120 few or hours thinking about work. It just looks different 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:06.960 than it did when I could just stay at the 0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:09.920 office until work was done. I think I have had 0:15:10.040 --> 0:15:13.200 less guilt because I'm now working remotely from my team, 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:16.640 so it's not as if they can I'm not visible 0:15:16.720 --> 0:15:19.440 all the time. You know. Um, I think if I 0:15:19.480 --> 0:15:23.560 were returning to the same workplace and you know, wanted 0:15:23.600 --> 0:15:25.440 to make sure I was at my desk at nine am, 0:15:25.560 --> 0:15:28.240 just like I had been before, as opposed to like 0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:33.240 listening to a podcast draft while I'm you know, uh, 0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:35.880 putting June's clothes on the beginning of the day, you know, 0:15:35.960 --> 0:15:38.600 multitasking at home. Like I think that that that has 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:42.280 has made it a little less guilt ridden than I think, 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:45.440 um if I hadn't changed up my workplace. Yeah, I 0:15:45.440 --> 0:15:48.280 think the optics of parenthood is the part that people 0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:50.480 worry about, like, oh, I have to leave at five, 0:15:50.520 --> 0:15:54.360 and that looks bad. I actually I felt this way 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:57.360 when I was before I had a kid, And I 0:15:57.400 --> 0:15:59.840 know Pecca has talked about this as well. There is 0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:02.760 you almost feel a little bit there's a little bit 0:16:02.760 --> 0:16:05.760 of a flip side to that, where I mean, there 0:16:05.760 --> 0:16:08.520 are enough people in our newsroom who have kids that 0:16:08.760 --> 0:16:12.840 I feel like there's a fairly universal acceptance of you know, 0:16:12.920 --> 0:16:14.360 you've got to leave it five, you gotta pick up 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:17.440 your kid. But if you it also kind of gives 0:16:17.480 --> 0:16:21.320 you it's just an easily accepted excuse. So it's not 0:16:21.360 --> 0:16:24.000 an excuse, it's a reason. But you know, if you 0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:26.400 if you don't have a kid, you don't have that, 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:29.320 and there's an expectation on childless people. I don't know, Becky, 0:16:29.360 --> 0:16:32.040 you can talk about it more, but that you or 0:16:32.120 --> 0:16:34.200 you just have all the time in the world because 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:36.680 you don't have that hard out. So there is a 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:39.040 way in which it's kind of it's almost kind of 0:16:39.120 --> 0:16:43.400 nice to have those really strict lines on your day. Yeah. 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:47.280 I've definitely read articles that say the biggest productivity hack 0:16:47.520 --> 0:16:51.320 having kids. Yeah, I'm still waiting for the work efficiency 0:16:51.360 --> 0:16:55.560 to kick in. Did you find coming back and that 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:57.880 did things feel different to you? Like, I mean, I 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:00.200 guess you were you know, your circumstances are different because 0:17:00.200 --> 0:17:03.480 you were working remotely. Had you been working remotely before? No? 0:17:04.640 --> 0:17:06.440 Not until I was yeah, I'm a turn to be 0:17:06.480 --> 0:17:09.600 leave because I was surprised at how not different things 0:17:09.600 --> 0:17:11.680 thought when I sort of felt like I stepped back 0:17:11.680 --> 0:17:15.000 into a you know, five months ago, almost to the 0:17:15.000 --> 0:17:17.560 point where people I'd see people and I just kind 0:17:17.560 --> 0:17:19.080 of wave at them and then they do a double take, 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:21.120 and I remember, like, oh right, I have to talk 0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:22.680 to them for a while because I haven't seen them 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:25.880 in so long. Did you like, what did you walk 0:17:25.920 --> 0:17:27.919 back into Did it feel like the same or did 0:17:27.960 --> 0:17:29.280 you have to get used to a lot of new things. 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:32.080 I think. I mean I, on the one hand, I 0:17:32.240 --> 0:17:34.720 totally here, Like I had that experience that you were 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:38.320 having of like, oh, I'm back at work and I'm 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:41.600 doing something that I know how to do, and and 0:17:41.640 --> 0:17:45.520 there was something really nice about that, like I'm putting 0:17:45.880 --> 0:17:49.000 on an old coat that fits just right, um, and 0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:52.000 it's and it's something you know, I knew I know 0:17:52.040 --> 0:17:55.720 how to do my job. Yeah, and that was particularly 0:17:55.760 --> 0:17:57.760 nice because I do not how to I didn't you know, 0:17:57.800 --> 0:17:59.119 I do not know how to be a mother. I'm 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:01.439 learning how to be a month um. And so to 0:18:01.520 --> 0:18:05.439 feel like I was good at something, incompetent at something 0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:08.600 by going back at work was a welcome feeling. I 0:18:08.640 --> 0:18:11.320 don't know. For me, I like, I don't know. I'm 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:14.600 I'm finding I love being a mom, I also love 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:18.000 other parts of my life. Well, we appreciate you talking 0:18:18.000 --> 0:18:21.720 about being a mom with us, and hopefully our listeners 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:24.399 will get something out of knowing how to integrate it 0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:26.760 back into their work lives and still have their other identity. 0:18:26.840 --> 0:18:28.879 So thank you so much for coming on. Yeah, thanks 0:18:29.080 --> 0:18:38.640 thank you for having me. So what struck me about 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:41.920 Anna's approach to making it all work as a new 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:46.600 parent was not everybody necessarily has a circumstance. She has 0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:49.760 her own radio show that she's very much the voice of, 0:18:50.440 --> 0:18:53.800 but she, like everybody who takes some kind of parental leave, 0:18:54.240 --> 0:18:56.920 had to figure out She had to navigate her own 0:18:56.960 --> 0:18:59.480 way of making it work. You know, she had to 0:19:00.160 --> 0:19:03.000 figure out what worked for her experiment and come up 0:19:03.080 --> 0:19:07.000 with her own approach to both taking time off and 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:10.480 then integrating herself back in with her colleagues when she 0:19:10.520 --> 0:19:13.479 got back. What I think is unique about Anna as 0:19:13.600 --> 0:19:16.720 she has a huge platform to talk about these things 0:19:16.800 --> 0:19:19.600 and I think normalize some of it. Like we just 0:19:19.640 --> 0:19:23.080 spent a lot of time talking about pumping in the workplace, 0:19:23.320 --> 0:19:25.920 and there was a woman who was in a meeting 0:19:25.960 --> 0:19:28.600 with Donald Trump and when she asked to take a 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:31.840 break to go pump, he thought it was disgusting. But 0:19:32.040 --> 0:19:34.600 obviously pumping is the reality of when you come back 0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:37.320 to work and when your mom and I think the 0:19:37.440 --> 0:19:40.399 more we have conversations like these where we say what 0:19:40.520 --> 0:19:42.280 it is like to be a parent and to work 0:19:42.320 --> 0:19:45.280 at the same time that workplaces will start to adapt 0:19:45.320 --> 0:19:48.359 and hopefully change. You're saying it's Okay, to end a 0:19:48.400 --> 0:19:50.800 meeting with I have to go pump now, and we 0:19:50.840 --> 0:19:53.399 should do it more. You should, U should do it now, 0:19:53.520 --> 0:19:56.280 you should do it. I mean you should do it. It 0:19:56.200 --> 0:19:59.399 It would just confuse people. I can't like pretend to 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:01.960 be a mom to to get fifteen minutes out early 0:20:02.000 --> 0:20:04.840 from a meeting. No, but you can do it to 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:10.160 advance the cause of making the workplace better for parents solidarity. 0:20:10.640 --> 0:20:17.360 Now it's time for half big takes, happy fake takes. Becca, 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:21.000 What is your idea that's not worthy of the story, 0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:23.240 but you want to talk about anyway? Okay, So my 0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:26.879 half big take this week is about taking hooky days. 0:20:27.359 --> 0:20:30.080 I have taken some hooky days, not while I was 0:20:30.119 --> 0:20:33.800 working here, of course not. I was never never bloombird um. 0:20:33.880 --> 0:20:37.399 Once I said I had a migraine, which I do 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:40.920