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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Left Sets podcast.

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Speaker 1: My guest today is musician promotion man A and R

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Speaker 1: man manager Phil Carpson. Hello, good evening and welcome. Okay,

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Speaker 1: how'd you sign a c d C? I signed a

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Speaker 1: c d C in It was luck, as most things

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Speaker 1: are in the A and R business. And I don't

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Speaker 1: care who tells you differently. It's ninety five percent luck

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Speaker 1: of being in the right place at the right time

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Speaker 1: and five percent knowing that what is put in front

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Speaker 1: of you might be worth something. And such was the

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Speaker 1: case with a c d C. I was running Atlantic

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Speaker 1: Records outside of America at the time, and so you

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Speaker 1: have the whole world other than America, whole world of

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Speaker 1: America at that time. You remember how many offices were there, Well,

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Speaker 1: the only Lantic office is where Los Angeles and New

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Speaker 1: York and mine in London. But we had distribution throughout

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Speaker 1: the world through w E A. Right. But did did

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Speaker 1: you have any people, I mean, like, did you have

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Speaker 1: somebody in Sydney? No, we had. We had a label

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Speaker 1: manager in Cynema, but but he was not employed by Atlantic.

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Speaker 1: He was employed by the distributor, by our owned distribution company,

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Speaker 1: which is w e A right? So you got after

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Speaker 1: when it was already you got in it was already

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Speaker 1: brianched distribution, but I interrupted. You told me the story.

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Speaker 1: Well we're getting into that in a minute, because it

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Speaker 1: was not quite the case. But you know, we go

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Speaker 1: back to that. So the story of a C d

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Speaker 1: C is this. I'd signed a band called Backstreet Crawler,

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Speaker 1: and Back Street Crawler was put together by Paul Kozov, who,

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Speaker 1: as you know, was the guitarist in Free, in that

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Speaker 1: wonderful guitar solo in all Right Now and Here, put

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Speaker 1: a band together and actually done a tour and recorded

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Speaker 1: a one live show which I heard and I thought this,

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Speaker 1: this is fabulous. When he's done is fabulous. So you know,

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Speaker 1: I signed the band and I was in the project

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Speaker 1: and I just felt it missed a tiny little something

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Speaker 1: and it needs I thought it needed some keyboards in

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Speaker 1: the mix. So I tracked down this guy that occasionally

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Speaker 1: played for the Who Do You Put the Crazy? Played

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Speaker 1: in the Free and later he played in the Who

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Speaker 1: Buzz Bundrick Rabbits. Yeah, so you know, I'm trying to

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Speaker 1: find where the fund can I find this guy? You know?

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Speaker 1: So I've called around all the studios and eventually I

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Speaker 1: found that somebody calling me. I said, oh, well, he's

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Speaker 1: managed by this Australian girl, you know. So I got

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Speaker 1: in contact with this young woman. Her name was Coral Browning,

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Speaker 1: and Coral in those days, she maybe twenty three or

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Speaker 1: twenty four. So she comes into my office and she

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Speaker 1: is dropped dead gorgeous Coral, and you know, really so

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Speaker 1: it's very nice. But she was so professional, you know.

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Speaker 1: She we made the deal for to record on these tracks.

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Speaker 1: And then she said to me, she said, I hope

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Speaker 1: you don't think this is unprofessional of me, but can

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Speaker 1: I talk to you about something else? Well, she could

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Speaker 1: have talked to me about. So she brought out a

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Speaker 1: thing that I've never seen before and certainly never seence

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Speaker 1: since it looked like a briefcase and it opened up

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Speaker 1: like a briefcase, but in the Jaws, so to speak,

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Speaker 1: a screen pop down. This is before the age of videos,

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Speaker 1: so it was a back projection machine that ran Super

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Speaker 1: eight with with audio and it was it was. It

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Speaker 1: was a C d C doing a long way to

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Speaker 1: the top. I caught it almost every day, So people

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Speaker 1: don't realize that today's era, it's truly a long way

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Speaker 1: to the Oh yeah. So anyway, she plays me this

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Speaker 1: thing and and she always reminds me. I stopped it

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Speaker 1: halfway through. I said, stop, I said, just tell me

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Speaker 1: again about this bad She said, well, you know, my

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Speaker 1: little brother manages the band from Australia and at that time,

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Speaker 1: and I said, who gave nobody cared what happened in

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Speaker 1: Australia the easy Beats, you know, by the way, one

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Speaker 1: of the easy Beats was it turns out the brother

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Speaker 1: of a young brother, so of which there are many.

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Speaker 1: So I said, look, he said. She said. This is

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Speaker 1: a record contany called Alberts, and they're pretty big over

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Speaker 1: there and a CDC are doing really well, to the

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Speaker 1: point where they want to get signed. So they've given

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Speaker 1: me a budget to bring the band to England. And look,

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Speaker 1: I've already set up these dates. And she gives me

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Speaker 1: this list of dates with all the opinion making places

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Speaker 1: around London, and she said, well, perhaps you'll you'll come

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Speaker 1: and see them. I said, I don't know. I said,

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Speaker 1: what if I signed him now? And we'll we'll call

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Speaker 1: your little brother on the phone and let's see we

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Speaker 1: can get this done. And then the record company can

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Speaker 1: still send them over, but I'll put them on a tour.

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Speaker 1: In fact, I'm going to put them on the Backstreet

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Speaker 1: Crawler tour to open the Backstreet Crawler. So it says

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Speaker 1: you can do that. I said, I can do that.

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Speaker 1: So we called Michael Browning and I made the deal

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Speaker 1: for a c d C over the phone, which is

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Speaker 1: a matter of records. I'm not giving you any unknown

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Speaker 1: information here, but I signed a c d C for

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Speaker 1: dollars per album delivered finished and how many albums, Well,

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Speaker 1: it's an interesting question because I signed them with the

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Speaker 1: options and I said, okay, we want three albums a year,

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Speaker 1: and we want four options after the first year. So

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Speaker 1: your math will tell you. That was a fifteen album

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Speaker 1: deal which turned out to be the most profitable record

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Speaker 1: deal in the history of the music business. The last album,

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Speaker 1: which was sold by Atlantic to Sony, was sold for

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Speaker 1: ten million dollars. Now this was before the days when

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Speaker 1: I and our people got a piece of the action.

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Speaker 1: But you know when it started to do when Art

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Speaker 1: and bought me up Bentley, So I was thankful for that.

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Speaker 1: But okay, well, Richard Griffith's he was the agent. He

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Speaker 1: tells a story of of course, Paul Kossof dies on

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Speaker 1: the way to do the gig. That's right, he did,

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Speaker 1: and then he says a CDC decided to play anyway,

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Speaker 1: and he said they were like five people in the

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Speaker 1: audience and when they played, those five people left and

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Speaker 1: they thought because they did the whole thing with Angus

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Speaker 1: on the shoulders whatever. Sure, and he said they called

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Speaker 1: everybody they knew for the second set totally four it's

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Speaker 1: more or less true than what happened. We obviously had

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Speaker 1: to cancel the actual Paul, but so we set them

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Speaker 1: up in some pubs around London and it was incredible.

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Speaker 1: It caught far really quickly, and then they're doing the

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Speaker 1: marquee and it's all moving along. And you know, I

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Speaker 1: compiled the first album from their two first Australian records,

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Speaker 1: High Voltage and whatever whatever, right, whatever it was, and

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Speaker 1: that that's what made the first A c d C

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Speaker 1: album had six tracks each each record. So, now, did

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Speaker 1: you stay with a c d C as their representative

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Speaker 1: at the label all through their career there? Sure? Yeah, Okay,

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Speaker 1: so the question becomes, uh, dirty Deeds is not released

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Speaker 1: in America when it's when it's recorded correctly, So what

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Speaker 1: was the company's viewpoint on the act. At that point

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Speaker 1: in time, the and our department hated them. Okay, they

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Speaker 1: said this they're going nowhere. This is a derivative album,

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Speaker 1: and you know we're passing. Fortunately I managed to intercept

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Speaker 1: it before the drop notice went out, but that took

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Speaker 1: a little while to do. So we actually did lose

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Speaker 1: one album out of my fifteen because of that decision.

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Speaker 1: But you know, nobody thought they were going anywhere. And

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Speaker 1: of course what happened later on, many years later, after

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Speaker 1: we've made Back in Black, Um, I got a call

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Speaker 1: from Doug Morris, who was by then president of Atlantic, saying, look,

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Speaker 1: you know we want to release we found we don't

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Speaker 1: have We never put this album because I put it

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Speaker 1: out in Europe, by the way, uh, and we're gonna

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Speaker 1: put it out now. And I remember saying him, are

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Speaker 1: you crazy, because what are you going to do? You're

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Speaker 1: following a Brian Johnson vocal with a Bond Scott vocal.

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Speaker 1: He said, yeah, but look, it's towards the end of

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Speaker 1: the year. We've had a great year. You know this

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Speaker 1: is going to infect effect all our Christmas bonuses. I said,

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Speaker 1: it will, no doubt do that, Doug. But what it's

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Speaker 1: going to do is create a new sales plateau for

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Speaker 1: a C d C. He said, what do you mean.

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Speaker 1: I said, we look at the time, we sold five

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Speaker 1: million back in Blacks, and he said, we're going to

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Speaker 1: do two million with this worse way. I said, you're right,

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Speaker 1: we'll do two million, but you'll never have an A

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Speaker 1: C d C album again that does more than two million.

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Speaker 1: And I was pretty well right on that. Okay, let's

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Speaker 1: dig a little deeper. So the last album with Bond

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Speaker 1: Scott is produced by Mutt Lang. How does that come together?

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Speaker 1: John Kalodna, We then enjoy, you know. And John was

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Speaker 1: really here and I used to work a lot together

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Speaker 1: on making these kind of decisions. And he had seen

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Speaker 1: what Matt had done with a with a group called Tycoon,

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Speaker 1: which was an Atlantic release, and he and Jerry Jerry Greenberg,

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Speaker 1: Jerry Greenberg thought that this would be a very good

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Speaker 1: mix to put together and it turned out to be

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Speaker 1: to be magic. Actually. Okay, now, Back in Black still

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Speaker 1: to this moment, one of the great albums of all

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Speaker 1: time for those about to rock, didn't live up to

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Speaker 1: that level artistically irrelevant of sales. Let's think about it

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Speaker 1: that you know, Dirty Deeds came out in the middle,

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Speaker 1: so suddenly you've got a confused audience. Who's the singer

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Speaker 1: of a c d C. Is it this new guy

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Speaker 1: from Newcastle or is it this great bare chested rock

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Speaker 1: and roller bond Scott. You know, it was confusing. So

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Speaker 1: we did do two million with with and then we

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Speaker 1: did two million with for Those About Rock, which I

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Speaker 1: thought was a pretty good album. Had Doug not made

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Speaker 1: that monumental error, a c d C would have really

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Speaker 1: kept going at that kind of level, but it took

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Speaker 1: the steam out of it. And then after Those About

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Speaker 1: the Rock they had a couple of albums which didn't

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Speaker 1: do that work. Flicking with a Switch, Fly on the

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Speaker 1: Wall were not particularly good. They also made an internal

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Speaker 1: mistake they took Brian Johnson out of the writing mix.

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Speaker 1: One of the reasons that Back in Black did so

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Speaker 1: well was his kind of slightly tongueing, tongue in cheek lyrics,

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Speaker 1: which with anybody else could be cheesy, but with him

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Speaker 1: they worked really well. They touched a nerve in America

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Speaker 1: and all over the world, and at that album now,

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Speaker 1: I think it's something like twenty five million. That album

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Speaker 1: was done, Okay, some people I won't mention their names,

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Speaker 1: but closely involved said a lot of that music was

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Speaker 1: written before barn Scott died. Is that true? Back in Black?

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Speaker 1: Back in they had some riffs that that is absolutely true. Yes,

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Speaker 1: it is true, But the actual lyrics and the melodies

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Speaker 1: that went on them was really the work of Brian

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Speaker 1: and of course mate Langer. I okay, and then I

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Speaker 1: didn't know that Brian was that involved on the lyrics

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Speaker 1: at that point. How did you were you involved in

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Speaker 1: finding Brian? I was They had met Brian finally enough

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Speaker 1: at a show in Newcastle years ago in a club

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Speaker 1: after an A C d C show, and bon Scott

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Speaker 1: arrived at their table and said, if anything happens to me,

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Speaker 1: this is your right. And because he was then in

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Speaker 1: a group called Jordan, which you know doing doing pretty well.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I was involved in making the deal for

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Speaker 1: him to join A C d C with I think

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Speaker 1: Peter Men should taken by then, who did an amazing

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Speaker 1: job with the A C D. So then he got fired,

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Speaker 1: well yeah he did. Whether he fell foul of the

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Speaker 1: Young's eventually. I mean it's not for nothing that they're

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Speaker 1: called the brothers Grim Okay, how'd you get your job

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Speaker 1: with Atlantic Records. To begin with, Uh, it's very interesting. Really,

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Speaker 1: I've actually left the music business for a while and

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Speaker 1: I was actually in the supermarket game. What then, that

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Speaker 1: begs a question, So you're you grew up where in London?

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Speaker 1: In London when your father do for a living? I

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Speaker 1: would say your mother, But at that point usually women

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Speaker 1: didn't tend to work. They said, my mother did not work.

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Speaker 1: My father was with with with a tea company, and

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Speaker 1: my uncle was with a small supermarket company. So everybody said, well,

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Speaker 1: the food business is great, so you've got to get

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Speaker 1: in there. So I first of all them joined the

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Speaker 1: lines before we go. How many siblings? Brothers and sisters? None?

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Speaker 1: Now you're the only kid. Hey, well they've achieved the ultimate?

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Speaker 1: What do you want? So do you think they only

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Speaker 1: wanted to have one kid? I told them they couldn't

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Speaker 1: have any more at that point. Okay, okay, but a

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Speaker 1: lot of times you're the only kid, you know, you're

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Speaker 1: coddle the hopes and dreams or story after story. Rick

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Speaker 1: Rubin was an only kid. What was it like? Were

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Speaker 1: your parents very accepting of you? Or you were a rebel?

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Speaker 1: I was not a rebel. I went to I did

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Speaker 1: pretty well at school, you know, so I was in

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Speaker 1: I was destined to kind of university. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I caught the bug. You know, in England we got

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Speaker 1: this perverse way of school works. It's not the great

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Speaker 1: system that you guys have a good English school. You

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Speaker 1: go right up to the age of nineteen. They call

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Speaker 1: it the sixth form. There's two years in the sixth form,

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Speaker 1: which are probably good is four years in American university.

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Speaker 1: I hate to say that, it is true. So I

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Speaker 1: did not go into the sixth form. I left before

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Speaker 1: simply because the boys in the sixth form and a

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Speaker 1: rock band and as as a skiffle band. Actually, because

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Speaker 1: before you're are we in okay, long before the Beatles.

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Speaker 1: It was before the Beatles. Lonnie darn again, all that stuff.

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Speaker 1: Lonnie Donegan certainly was around. Yeah, it was rock Island

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Speaker 1: Line and all those great songs and this little acoustic

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Speaker 1: guitar band and when they were taking a break and

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Speaker 1: pick up their guitars and plays away. So eventually I

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Speaker 1: decided that, you know, I wanted to play music while

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Speaker 1: I was still at school and the easiest job. I

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Speaker 1: wasn't a great guitar player, but then I realized that

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Speaker 1: a bass guitar, Sandy got four strings, so it's a

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Speaker 1: little easier to articulate four strings and six. So I

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Speaker 1: bought a bass guitar and kind Hofner Okay, just not

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Speaker 1: the same as Paul mcconny, but another model of And

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Speaker 1: that was how I started and joined the local band.

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Speaker 1: Funny enough, the local band I was in was based

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Speaker 1: in Southeast London, where all the great guitar players came from. Really,

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Speaker 1: so not when you know this, but Eric Clapton, Jeff Beck,

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Speaker 1: Jimmy Page, Mit Green, who was an amazing guitar player

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Speaker 1: in a band called Johnny kin and the Pirates. Was

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Speaker 1: that Peter Green related to Peter Green? No, Mick Green.

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Speaker 1: You've got to check out. I mean, Johnny Kinning Parks

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Speaker 1: never made it here. We read about it in English

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Speaker 1: stress right, Yeah, but if you listen to that group,

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Speaker 1: they so those three and uh, Mr Green, who do

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Speaker 1: you personally think is the best. I've got to give

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Speaker 1: it to Jimmy Page really, Although I love Jeff Beck's style,

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Speaker 1: I mean he's incredible. I mean he plays with no pick.

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Speaker 1: I saw him in concert recently and he did something

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Speaker 1: just on harmonics. It was what was that damn song?

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Speaker 1: It was a big old standard of it's time. Judy

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Speaker 1: Garland was in the movie what's the famous movie? Oh,

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Speaker 1: you're talking about over the Rainbowl? Exactly over the rainbow

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Speaker 1: they were. I wasn't too far out of anyway. He

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Speaker 1: played that song on harmonics. I don't think he played

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Speaker 1: like a regular note. It was all harmonics. I'm listening

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Speaker 1: to this guy. Oh my god, what a player. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think he's the best player. Obviously Jimmy could write

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Speaker 1: and produce the Jeff couldn't. That's right. But okay, so

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Speaker 1: you're playing with this band. It's a skiffle band. I no,

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Speaker 1: by then, I sort of that was the school band.

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Speaker 1: But by then I bought a bass guitar. It was

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Speaker 1: an early rock group. You know. We just we covered

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Speaker 1: all the gene vincent things that that's okay? Was that

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Speaker 1: your only job? No, it's still at school. But you

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Speaker 1: didn't go to sixth form. I did not. I left

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Speaker 1: it when I was just seventeen, okay, So I was

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Speaker 1: doing that since I was fifteen, okay, And did the

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Speaker 1: breast of the band also leaves school? Well, they I

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Speaker 1: was not at school with the rest of them. That.

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Speaker 1: Actually I joined a group that was already already going,

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Speaker 1: you know, So could you make a living working for

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Speaker 1: absolutely not. That was just like a semi pro little band,

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Speaker 1: you know. But I got the bunk, you know, I

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Speaker 1: thought I wanted to play and okay, so did you

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Speaker 1: have a day job. I didn't have a day job

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Speaker 1: at that point. No, I was still at school. I'm

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Speaker 1: telling you, let's but what out of school at school

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Speaker 1: and you're playing in the band. You have it? Your

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Speaker 1: parents say, hey, you gotta a bike. I got a

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Speaker 1: litt if. I got a job for a little while.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to be a rocket scientist. I really did.

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Speaker 1: So I got a job at the Air Ministry in London,

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Speaker 1: which lasted about I don't know, four or five weeks,

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Speaker 1: and I was in English. People love an acronyms. Acronyms,

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Speaker 1: you know that said it was Sam for two Ways,

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Speaker 1: Scientific Advisor to the Air Ministry. I loved that. So

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Speaker 1: so there I wasn't there, and somehow I can't even

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Speaker 1: remember how I got to offer to join a group

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Speaker 1: called the Londoners. The Londoners was a seminal English band.

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Speaker 1: This was I guess when was that nineties sixty sixty two. Okay,

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Speaker 1: the Londons that had just come back from Hamburg and

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Speaker 1: they were really on it. They were really happening band.

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Speaker 1: You can read about them. I don't think they made

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Speaker 1: a couple of records in Hamburg. They yeah, they didn't

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Speaker 1: make it at all here, but I heard the name. Yeah, Well,

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Speaker 1: so I joined this band. And my grandmother, who had

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Speaker 1: been a showgirl in the early part of the twentieth century,

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Speaker 1: says to me, she said, well, look though she was

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Speaker 1: a show bises lady and her my aunt, who was

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Speaker 1: a daughter, you know, it was also in the in

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Speaker 1: the show business, says She says. You know what guitar?

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Speaker 1: What what guitar? Do? Player said, when I play a

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Speaker 1: half in a bass guitar show, I don't know what

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Speaker 1: a bass guitar is? What is I said, well, it's

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Speaker 1: like a bass Okay. He said, well, what's the best one?

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Speaker 1: I said, well, Fender Precisions is going to be the

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Speaker 1: best one. She says, you were, just go and get one.

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Speaker 1: I'll pay for it. Said why you know how much

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Speaker 1: they are? They are a hundred and twenty five pounds,

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Speaker 1: you know, which She's right, about two hundred dollars. So

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Speaker 1: she says, yeah, just go and get it. You know.

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Speaker 1: I said, wow, thank you, and she the you needed

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Speaker 1: one of those box things that goes with you know

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Speaker 1: that thing. So you didn't hear I said, what he has?

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00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:23,719
Speaker 1: It's an ample, Like what's the best amplifier? So now

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Speaker 1: I'm no, I'm gonna roll. I said, well, it's a

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Speaker 1: Fender basement amplifier. You know, nobody had a Fender basement app.

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Speaker 1: I mean I've seen one in the shop window in

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Speaker 1: Charing Cross Road and it was the bee's knees. Now

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Speaker 1: you've got to realize, back in those days, the first

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Speaker 1: question when you call up for a job as a

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Speaker 1: musician was what you've got? Okay, Fender base, Fender base,

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, okay, good. If you had a van, you've

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Speaker 1: got you've got the gig without even playing. So but

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a van at that point, but I

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Speaker 1: did get the gig, and I wasn't a bad base player.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't bad, okay, but a little bit slower. If

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Speaker 1: Londoners were happening, how do you get the gig? Do

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Speaker 1: you know? I honestly don't remember. It must have been

355
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Speaker 1: a phone call or something. Musicians used to hang out

356
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Speaker 1: those days in charing Cross Road in London, and there

357
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Speaker 1: was a particular store where it was the birthplace of

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Speaker 1: a lot of bands. It was Jennings Music Store. That's

359
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:27,159
Speaker 1: where they were the Vox distributor, Vox Aunt districtor, and

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Speaker 1: down says they had a basement. I mean back in

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Speaker 1: those days, I was actually in a band with Jeff Beck.

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Speaker 1: It lasted nearly all day, so but you know, we're

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Speaker 1: still friends and we were jamming down. Then we're going

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Speaker 1: to start a band together. I remember driving around London

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Speaker 1: looking for particular musicians to join this band, but it

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Speaker 1: never went past that. Okay, well I'm getting more of

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Speaker 1: a fuel. Okay, so you joined the Londoners and you

368
00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:55,880
Speaker 1: weren't that going a bass player. What happens next, well

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00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,480
Speaker 1: that the Londoners were a really strong band. I mean

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Speaker 1: they really great players. They were one of the first

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Speaker 1: mans to start playing Ray Charles music, for example. So

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Speaker 1: the only place people like to hear what they had

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Speaker 1: to offer actually with the American basis around around England.

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Speaker 1: So that's where we played a lot. And you know,

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Speaker 1: you're playing like three sets a night, and it was

376
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Speaker 1: it showed me what you had to do. And then

377
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Speaker 1: I saw an ad in a in a melody make

378
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Speaker 1: I think it was which as the old English paper

379
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Speaker 1: bass player wanted to join vocal group. I can't sing

380
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Speaker 1: for ship, but still I'll phone up and it turns

381
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Speaker 1: out it's a group called the Springfields, okay, which is

382
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Speaker 1: in those days it was Dusty Springfield and brother Tom

383
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Speaker 1: and Mike Hurst. Mike Hurst went on to produce early

384
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Speaker 1: Cat Stevens records. So you know, the same conversation, what

385
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,640
Speaker 1: do you play with sender base? So but this time

386
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Speaker 1: there was an audition which I passed and I joined

387
00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:02,440
Speaker 1: the Springfields and that was fantastic. I mean they had

388
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Speaker 1: two hits right then, that Islander Dreams and say I

389
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Speaker 1: won't be there, and we're playing all these big places,

390
00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:13,840
Speaker 1: well big two thousand seat package tours, you know in England.

391
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Speaker 1: I think it was pretty much the same in America.

392
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Speaker 1: But they used to have these package tops that would

393
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Speaker 1: go out and I remember doing them with Del Shannon,

394
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Speaker 1: Johnny tillottson. I mean, these were happening names of that time. Okay,

395
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Speaker 1: let's stop for a second. Yes, what are the Londoners

396
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Speaker 1: say when you're gonna quit? I can't repeat that in

397
00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,120
Speaker 1: I mean the band was sort of grinding to a halt,

398
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,000
Speaker 1: to be honest with you. I mean they didn't like

399
00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:41,160
Speaker 1: doing these American bases. They couldn't get work anyplace else.

400
00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,680
Speaker 1: They were thinking of going back to Hamburg. But that

401
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,919
Speaker 1: boat kind of sailed by. Okay, did you play on

402
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 1: those Springfield hits or these? Were they already released? They've

403
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:53,920
Speaker 1: already released by the time I was just a touring

404
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,320
Speaker 1: Musicis you understand? And now you're on tour with all

405
00:22:56,359 --> 00:22:59,480
Speaker 1: these people. Are you the type who ingratiates and becomes

406
00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:01,840
Speaker 1: friends with all the musicians or you stick to yourself?

407
00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:05,080
Speaker 1: Now I was out there, you know, I was, you know,

408
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:09,760
Speaker 1: you gone great with Johnny Tillotson. Terrific guy, sort of.

409
00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,399
Speaker 1: I was in touch with him for years, actually know,

410
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,159
Speaker 1: And it was it was like a family. These tours

411
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,800
Speaker 1: are put together and they last, I don't know, three

412
00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:20,119
Speaker 1: to five weeks or whatever it is, and you become

413
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,840
Speaker 1: a family, you know, and you're all traveling in the

414
00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,959
Speaker 1: same transport. By're on a bus, you know, but not

415
00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:30,120
Speaker 1: like sleepers. It's like a regular bus and Del Shannon

416
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:32,280
Speaker 1: will be up there or Johnny or whatever the other

417
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 1: people we were playing with, and it was It was

418
00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 1: pretty exciting, you know. So how long did it last

419
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,320
Speaker 1: with you in the spring Fields? Just a matter of months.

420
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:40,920
Speaker 1: And when they told me they were going to break

421
00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:43,679
Speaker 1: up in the city in sixty three. I joined in

422
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,399
Speaker 1: sixty two and they why were they going to break up?

423
00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:48,639
Speaker 1: Because Dusty was going to go Dusty wanted to go

424
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,320
Speaker 1: solo and she had some she she fell in love

425
00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:53,720
Speaker 1: with R and B music, you know what had happened.

426
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,280
Speaker 1: They had gone to Memphis before I joined them to

427
00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:01,040
Speaker 1: record an album and she sort of fell in love

428
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:03,399
Speaker 1: with R and B music while she was there, and

429
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 1: that she saw herself getting involved in that line of music.

430
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:10,119
Speaker 1: The interesting thing is, you know, so I know the

431
00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 1: band's going to break up, right, So Mike her sister, people, hey,

432
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,160
Speaker 1: let's get a band together. Oh great, Mike, yeah we will.

433
00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 1: The next day, Dusty said, would you come and be

434
00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:27,320
Speaker 1: my musical director? I said, I'm sorry, I just promised, Mike.

435
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:31,000
Speaker 1: You know you're day late. So, to cut a long

436
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:34,399
Speaker 1: story short, that Mike Hurst band never played a day

437
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:37,560
Speaker 1: and Dusty went on to be Dusty Springfield. Well, okay,

438
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,480
Speaker 1: so you didn't realize she was going to be Dusty

439
00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:41,480
Speaker 1: spring No, I knew she was gonna, I mean she was.

440
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:44,320
Speaker 1: You've got no idea, Okay, were you What was it like?

441
00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 1: Did you have a crush on Dusty Springfield? Actually she

442
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:52,520
Speaker 1: was a very attractive young woman, I got to tell you.

443
00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:56,159
Speaker 1: But you know, and we used to hang out a

444
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,760
Speaker 1: lot together, you know, frankly it was but it was

445
00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:01,879
Speaker 1: just fun. I mean that right, certainly, never I spect

446
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:03,680
Speaker 1: a kind of bit of Okay, So she gets another

447
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:07,720
Speaker 1: musical director, you're with my cursed that doesn't go with nowhere,

448
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 1: absolutely nowhere. So now I'm stuck with my Fender basement

449
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 1: and Fender basement amplifier and Vendor precision based guitar and

450
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,640
Speaker 1: nowhere to go. So I start looking for other jobs.

451
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 1: And because I've been with the Springfields, okay, which was

452
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: a high hope, high profile, think, I was kind of

453
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:28,919
Speaker 1: sought after, you know, scilly because I had the offender

454
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 1: base and Defender basement. At this point, with all this work,

455
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,400
Speaker 1: you must be getting better. Oh I was certainly getting better,

456
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:38,880
Speaker 1: but you know, I mean, you'd Jack Jaco Pastorius were

457
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 1: not up, not quite up at all. I mean in

458
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 1: later years in a way after this happens because when

459
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:48,600
Speaker 1: I joined Atlantic, the guys in Zepplin. Knew I was

460
00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 1: a musician. They used to let me play with them.

461
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:54,639
Speaker 1: But where I having John Paul Jones to go over

462
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 1: and play keyboards and I will play bass and they

463
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,200
Speaker 1: do some old rock songs. They've always very kind to me.

464
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 1: They did things which have just been three or four

465
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:06,359
Speaker 1: chord changes, and that was. This is in rehearsal on

466
00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:10,880
Speaker 1: stage stage, come on. And the interesting is I say

467
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:13,720
Speaker 1: this all the time. John Paul Jones could played better

468
00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:16,600
Speaker 1: bass with his feet the batles of a Hammond organ,

469
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 1: and I could ever manage. I mean, you listen to

470
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:23,479
Speaker 1: since I've been loving you, the unbelievable baseline that's on

471
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 1: the Hammond. You know, he's just a monster musician. So

472
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 1: really I know I knew and made the right decision

473
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 1: because with players there, well that's just I remember myself.

474
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 1: But we all played guitars after the beatles, and I

475
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 1: went to my friend's house side the cheap Japanese guitar.

476
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: He had an E S three thirty five, and he said,

477
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 1: now we're going to change keys, and I said, I'm out.

478
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: That's right, yeah, okay, I get you. So the hearse

479
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 1: biand goes nowhere, nowhere, right, so I joined who the

480
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:58,120
Speaker 1: first one I joined was Houston Wells and the Marksman.

481
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,919
Speaker 1: I mean, I know you know that name well, okay,

482
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 1: So just to refresh those who have not heard of

483
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:06,880
Speaker 1: Houston Walds and the Marksman. It was a English country

484
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 1: band which was could have been destined to go nowhere

485
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 1: except they had recorded with Joe Meek, the legendary Joe Meek,

486
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 1: who was really the first independent producer of note, and

487
00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:23,399
Speaker 1: they made a record Cad Only the Heartaches, which was

488
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:28,200
Speaker 1: a country song and it was a hit and before

489
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,399
Speaker 1: I joined and they had recorded it, so it was

490
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,400
Speaker 1: a huge hit. So then now we're off doing package

491
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:38,159
Speaker 1: tours with Houston Walds and the Marksman, supporting groups like

492
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 1: Billy J Kerryman, The Dakota's, Johnny Kid and the Pirates,

493
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,680
Speaker 1: the Beatles. We supported the Beatles on their first tour

494
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 1: of Scotland. We were actually second on the bill to

495
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,359
Speaker 1: the Beatles. See in those days, the pecking order of

496
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,120
Speaker 1: where you were on the set was dependent on where

497
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: you were in the chart, and we had a big record.

498
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 1: I mean we were like chucking up thirty in on

499
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:04,159
Speaker 1: the chart. Before they must have been higher up than

500
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 1: us because obviously they were the Beatles by then, but

501
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,359
Speaker 1: we actually kept them off number one in Ireland for

502
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:13,560
Speaker 1: a week. You know. It was a big Okay, I

503
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:18,479
Speaker 1: remember when Beatlemania happened in America. Yes, what was it

504
00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:20,639
Speaker 1: like in the UK? At what point did you realize

505
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 1: this was just not another band? Oh boy? I mean

506
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:26,360
Speaker 1: the night the first night, on the date of the tour,

507
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 1: I was sort of mouth almighty of the Houston Worlds

508
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:34,119
Speaker 1: and the marks. We would start with an instrumental okay,

509
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:37,719
Speaker 1: and we're we're wearing sort of country looking gear, you know,

510
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:40,720
Speaker 1: and we're so we're up there and we'll playing this

511
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: thing called guitar boogie shovel, which is a straight kind

512
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 1: of twelve bar blues, and I'll get to the end

513
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:50,040
Speaker 1: of it and we'd start the the riff of the

514
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: next song, you know, and it would be me that

515
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 1: would do. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, how you're doing

516
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,320
Speaker 1: out there? I now like to bring on the star

517
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: of our show, Houston World. Well, that introduction was fine.

518
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,440
Speaker 1: When we were headlining the night in Glasgow, it didn't

519
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: go down so well because I did my thing. Hey,

520
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 1: I now like you to see the star of our

521
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: show and the audience went Houston Worlds, and so he

522
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 1: walked onto total silence. He didn't like that very much.

523
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 1: Very That's when I knew the Beatles owned by the way.

524
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:26,960
Speaker 1: By then, I did have a van by them, and

525
00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 1: it was a white van and it was exactly the

526
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: same as the Beatles van. So we're trying to get

527
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 1: out the gig. People think we're the Beatles and the

528
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 1: band's being rocked. So that's when I knew how big

529
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 1: the Beatles were. Okay, but musically, of course. The first

530
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:43,760
Speaker 1: records came out in sixty two, yes, and it didn't

531
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 1: as I say. First, I Want to Hold Your Hand

532
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 1: was released the very end of sixty three in America.

533
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,440
Speaker 1: She Loves You would come out earlier on Swan, but

534
00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 1: no one had heard it. So when this stuff starts

535
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 1: to come out and everybody's there's a monoculture, everybody's listening

536
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: to the same radio show, etera, etcetera. When was it,

537
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 1: really when did the Beatles sort of take over the scene?

538
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,880
Speaker 1: It was sixty three in England for sure. I mean

539
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:10,520
Speaker 1: they were this tour. I can't remember what month it was,

540
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 1: to be honest with you, but by then they were

541
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: really rocking you know they were happening, so then were

542
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:18,400
Speaker 1: you were fair? Oh? I thought they were terrific. You're

543
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: kidding me. I do remember one actually had that same

544
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:25,200
Speaker 1: thing in Glasgow. Nobody had Rhodes in those days, including

545
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 1: the Beatles. They have one guy, so you know they

546
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 1: were there. They were on the side of the stage

547
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 1: and we were directly under them, so we were going

548
00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 1: right before the Beatles, so they're they're checking us out.

549
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 1: And because you carry your own bloody amplifier onto the

550
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:43,400
Speaker 1: stage and so you get oh notes, the appli was

551
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:46,360
Speaker 1: already there, but you've got your guitar and my lead

552
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:49,320
Speaker 1: in my head. Suddenly, just before we're going on, my

553
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 1: guitar lely crumbles and you know why America accord accords

554
00:30:54,200 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 1: exactly exactly, so it Paul McCartney's hey, Paul man, can

555
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 1: I borrow your cord? Sure? And he lends me the

556
00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 1: guitar chord and the funny thing about That's the only

557
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: into action I had with Paul McCartney until years later

558
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:20,080
Speaker 1: when I made a movie about Sun Records and there

559
00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 1: was a documentary and I wanted Paul to do That's

560
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 1: all right, Mama, with Scotty Moore and d j Fontana

561
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: Elvis's guys, which he you know. I got a hold

562
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: of his manager and he said, look, I know who

563
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 1: you are. You ran Atlantic for years, I mean everybody.

564
00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:36,480
Speaker 1: I mean it was in London, everybody. I was there.

565
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 1: But so he says, did you do you know? Paul?

566
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 1: I said, well, you know, and he made him once

567
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 1: and told him this story, said put that in the

568
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:46,160
Speaker 1: letter you like, and he did. You know, he agreed

569
00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 1: to do this this thing with us, did but he

570
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,240
Speaker 1: didn't remember giving he did. He didn't remember that. Of course,

571
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,240
Speaker 1: of course they just wonder. You never know, things like Okay,

572
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 1: so you're playing and they have a hit with the

573
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 1: country styled act and what goes with what happens? Well,

574
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 1: we did another record with Joe Meet, which I was on,

575
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: and I mean just recording with Joe Meet was an

576
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: incredible experience. So what was it like, Well, it was

577
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 1: there's days before multi track had been invented, right, So

578
00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:19,000
Speaker 1: he had two I p s interest Brisono machines and

579
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:21,440
Speaker 1: he would bounce tracks from one to the other. So

580
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:25,640
Speaker 1: he would build a song, you know, by simply bouncing

581
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: tracks back and forth. And would he do that all

582
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 1: on the same day or would he mix after you left?

583
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:33,680
Speaker 1: He mixed after we left. But by the time he

584
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 1: got to the end over dub, it was pretty done.

585
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: Because you can't actually go back. If you're using that principle,

586
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 1: you're going to go back one or two generations. So

587
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 1: but he would the band would basically do the track

588
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 1: live and he would would do it many times and

589
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,240
Speaker 1: he'd eventually get it right. It was in a tiny

590
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: little it was above a leather goods store in northeast London.

591
00:32:56,960 --> 00:32:59,840
Speaker 1: It was like a two room apartment. It was intense

592
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 1: and the equipment was just these two machines and a

593
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 1: mix of which was a rotary knobs on. It very unsophisticated,

594
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:12,120
Speaker 1: but he got the sounds, you know, and then the

595
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 1: last thing he would do put the vocal on and

596
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,080
Speaker 1: that was it. But the second record went nowhere. Okay,

597
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:21,560
Speaker 1: but at this point in time, there's beatle Mania. Sure

598
00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:23,840
Speaker 1: not longer after that people say, oh, I can make

599
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 1: a lot of dough doing this. Yes, was that somewhere

600
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 1: of the dream, No, because at the time, you know,

601
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:35,240
Speaker 1: the next tour that we did with Houston Wells was

602
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:38,920
Speaker 1: with Billy J. Cramer and the Dakotas, and I think

603
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 1: Johnny Kidd was on that. So by then this the

604
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,480
Speaker 1: Mersey Beat thing had erupted and they're all the foremost

605
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:49,240
Speaker 1: Siller black you know, we too, We tour with all

606
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 1: those people because in this short window where we had

607
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 1: a big hit, we were something a little bit different

608
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,959
Speaker 1: to the Brian Epstein crew, which was the main fodder.

609
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 1: So we just would come in and do our little thing.

610
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 1: So how does it end with that? Badly? You know?

611
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:08,800
Speaker 1: It was Houston World's got too big for his boots.

612
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,200
Speaker 1: I didn't like him. I started a revolution and then

613
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 1: I find it was a revolution of one. So I

614
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:18,600
Speaker 1: got the sack from Houston, Wales and the marksman who

615
00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 1: then disappeared into oblivion. So it didn't really matter. But then,

616
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,480
Speaker 1: because then I've been in the Springfields Houston worlds, and

617
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,680
Speaker 1: I still had my offender base, offender base and a

618
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,960
Speaker 1: van now okay, and I joined a group called the

619
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: Lawn Gibson Trio, which of course you've never heard of.

620
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 1: They they had they were a country band as well,

621
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:42,799
Speaker 1: and they had one hit in England called Some Do

622
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:47,560
Speaker 1: Some Don't. And they also had a radio series, believe

623
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:49,640
Speaker 1: it or not, it's called Side by Side with the

624
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 1: Lawn Gibson Trio on BBC Radio, and each week we

625
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: would do record a show and it would be us

626
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 1: and another man, Wayne Fontana, and the I made vendors

627
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 1: Um the Beatles were on that show with us, you know.

628
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:09,720
Speaker 1: So that lasted a little while. I can't quite remember.

629
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 1: By then, I was about nineteen, and I'm getting and

630
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 1: I'm not making any money, by the way, longer to type,

631
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 1: still living at home. He is still living at home,

632
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 1: you know, coming in late at night, and it's not

633
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,400
Speaker 1: going down that well. And by then my uncle had

634
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 1: really started moving a little bit up the chain in

635
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:31,279
Speaker 1: the supermarket business. So he said, look, you know, I

636
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: can't bring it. The companies too small to bring you

637
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 1: in now, because but if you go and learn the

638
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:40,319
Speaker 1: business somewhere else, you know, then we can put you

639
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:42,719
Speaker 1: in there. He eventually, by the way, became chairman of

640
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 1: safe Way Europe. So wow, okay, he was really in

641
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:47,719
Speaker 1: the supermarket. He really was. In fact, he tried to

642
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:50,319
Speaker 1: buy a safe Way with the leverage buy and that's

643
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 1: the kind of guy he was. So anyway, so I

644
00:35:54,880 --> 00:36:00,439
Speaker 1: get a job with another supermarket and one day the

645
00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 1: guy who was with a salesman for Maxwell house coffee

646
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,879
Speaker 1: and of course birds Custard that you know well came

647
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:10,759
Speaker 1: into you know, take the weekly order, and he's got

648
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,200
Speaker 1: a guy in a nice suit with him and I'm

649
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,240
Speaker 1: on the floor pricing up cans of beans or something,

650
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 1: you know. So the guy in the nice suits, we've

651
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: heard a lot about you. You're one of the youngest

652
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 1: supermarket managers in London. I said, well, yeah, I suppose

653
00:36:26,719 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 1: i am. He says, um, well, we've got a training

654
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:36,040
Speaker 1: program that General Foods and I only usually hire university graduates,

655
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:39,480
Speaker 1: but you're now about the right age, and do you

656
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 1: want to join it? And I joined General Foods and

657
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 1: I was there for almost four years, and it was

658
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 1: really changed my life, actually because I then completely stopped playing.

659
00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 1: I didn't even pick the guitar up again. My actually

660
00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:00,560
Speaker 1: my precision base got stolen. I remember that so really

661
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 1: disheartened me. And I went and thought, I'm going to

662
00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:07,440
Speaker 1: do this. And I was in the General Foods product

663
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:12,040
Speaker 1: development group and doing marketing and setting up sales campaigns

664
00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:15,640
Speaker 1: and this, that and the other, and uh that's that

665
00:37:15,719 --> 00:37:18,720
Speaker 1: led to the next job in a very perverse manner,

666
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:23,399
Speaker 1: which I shall tell you. The General Feros was based

667
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 1: in those days up in Birmingham and we were having

668
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 1: a sales convention in London, and I remember this marketing director,

669
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,200
Speaker 1: the guy that had hired me, said, look, I'm getting

670
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: fed up with the elitism that exists between the salesforce

671
00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:42,880
Speaker 1: and the marketing group. We're all in this together and

672
00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 1: we're going to go. We're having this convention in London,

673
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,319
Speaker 1: and I want each of you to take out a

674
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:55,000
Speaker 1: group of salesmen. Remember I thought, isn't that a bit elitist? Right?

675
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:58,440
Speaker 1: But I didn't say anything, so listen. So I got

676
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:00,759
Speaker 1: my little group of salesman through a four guys, you know,

677
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 1: we're all in suits, and I take them to a

678
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:08,160
Speaker 1: restaurant in Barkley Square. Now I could have walked back

679
00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:13,040
Speaker 1: to the hotel we were staying at ten different ways, okay,

680
00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 1: but for some reason I chose to walk back through

681
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 1: South Molton Street and which is just off Oxford Streep,

682
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:22,520
Speaker 1: and we walked out there. S anyways, it's a recording

683
00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:27,160
Speaker 1: studio there that i'd recorded him, and I said to

684
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 1: this group of salesman, any of you guys ever been

685
00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 1: in a recording studio? And the unsurprising answer was no.

686
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:36,480
Speaker 1: So I said, I just ring the bell, says everybody

687
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:39,399
Speaker 1: I know now Barry in mind, it's a good three

688
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 1: years since I had recorded anything, So I ring the bell.

689
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:45,680
Speaker 1: There's this Swedish engineering there that I would work with

690
00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 1: called dag Fiona and he was a designer of desks,

691
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:53,000
Speaker 1: is quite well known in London at the time. So

692
00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: he said, oh, well, come on up, you know, coming up.

693
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 1: You know, I'm just finished off and mixed with this

694
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 1: Swedish band. So this was what in when did I do? That?

695
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:09,520
Speaker 1: Must have been sixty eight, yes, sixty eight. So I

696
00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:11,319
Speaker 1: got up there and there's this Swedish group. He's just

697
00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:14,239
Speaker 1: in the mixing stage and the manager is there and

698
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 1: Dad introduces me to the manager from what I was,

699
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 1: and the managinon looks at me in a suit with

700
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:22,839
Speaker 1: these three from Bosos, is what what are you doing?

701
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 1: What are you doing like that? So I told him.

702
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: He said, well, you know, I want to start a

703
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 1: record label when you join me. I said okay. Because

704
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 1: he was a very wealthy Swedish guy, knew who he was.

705
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 1: His name was orker Erhard Larson and he had a

706
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 1: record company called Olga Records, which was doing incredibly well

707
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 1: in the four markets of Scandinavia and the group he

708
00:39:48,200 --> 00:39:51,759
Speaker 1: was in there finish out the recording with was called

709
00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:56,600
Speaker 1: the Hep Stars, which were massive in those markets. I

710
00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: mean they had two sets of equipment and they would

711
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:03,520
Speaker 1: play two places in the day outdoor vessels in the

712
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:08,320
Speaker 1: very short summer of but they were really big. I

713
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,800
Speaker 1: mean they were selling more records in the Beatles in

714
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 1: those days. So I agree to join this guy and

715
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:20,160
Speaker 1: we've start selling Olgor, start trying to market Olga Records

716
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:22,840
Speaker 1: in England, and I made a distribution deal with the

717
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:25,680
Speaker 1: M I. But it was impossible. I mean, they had

718
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,520
Speaker 1: some great stuff, but it was just impossible to get

719
00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:31,279
Speaker 1: it off the ground. But you know, by then, you know,

720
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 1: they noticed me a bit at E M I and

721
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 1: who were distributors of so many American labels at that

722
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:42,719
Speaker 1: point before the days when the American labels had their

723
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:47,600
Speaker 1: own companies. So they introduced me to MGM. So I

724
00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 1: switched from Olga Records to MGM at a great moment

725
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:57,279
Speaker 1: because that was when Stanley Kubrick was finishing up two one,

726
00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:01,840
Speaker 1: and I actually worked with him on setting up the marketing,

727
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:04,520
Speaker 1: you know, for two thousand and one, and he was

728
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:08,360
Speaker 1: absolutely terrific. I mean, my god, what a detail oriented

729
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 1: chap he turned out to be. But you know, that

730
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 1: was a good moment for me there, and that lasted

731
00:41:15,080 --> 00:41:17,080
Speaker 1: about six months, and then I started to get these

732
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:21,359
Speaker 1: calls from this guy called Frank Fenter, and you know,

733
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 1: he's a South African but he's sort of really very

734
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:28,160
Speaker 1: hip kind of guy. And he said, man, you know,

735
00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: I'm leaving Atlantic Records to go and join the phil Walden.

736
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 1: We're going to start a record label. We've got this band,

737
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,399
Speaker 1: the Almond Brothers, but they need someone here and heard

738
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:41,200
Speaker 1: a lot about you, and you know, my my boss

739
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 1: wants to talk to you. I said, well, okay, But

740
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:46,600
Speaker 1: by then I kind of got fed up with the

741
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 1: music business and I've taken an interview with McCann ericson

742
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:55,880
Speaker 1: right the advertising, and I got the job as a

743
00:41:56,000 --> 00:42:02,400
Speaker 1: count director for two products, Danish bacon they still make

744
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,320
Speaker 1: good bacon, mind you, and Lure Pack butter, which is

745
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,840
Speaker 1: also Danish. They were there were sort of premium brand

746
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:12,080
Speaker 1: leaders and I was going to be the account director

747
00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 1: for those two brands. Big job, and it was well

748
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,400
Speaker 1: paid for its time too. It was I was going

749
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,399
Speaker 1: to get three and a half thousand pounds a year

750
00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 1: and a company car. To put into perspective, my father,

751
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 1: who was still at Line's d at this time, was

752
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:30,120
Speaker 1: an area sales manager with four or five guys working

753
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:32,359
Speaker 1: for him, and he was making two and a half

754
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,799
Speaker 1: thousand pounds a year, so it was big deal. I'm

755
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:39,439
Speaker 1: account executive at a big agency is a big deal

756
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:42,839
Speaker 1: to this day. So I agree to take the job.

757
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,760
Speaker 1: And then I started getting these course from Frank Fender

758
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:49,359
Speaker 1: and then from this guy form with an unpronounceable name

759
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:53,560
Speaker 1: that sounded something like no Whosi who Ertie Gertney. So

760
00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:55,200
Speaker 1: it turns out to be a course nessa we heard

761
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:58,319
Speaker 1: again And I'll never forget that meeting. You know, I

762
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,200
Speaker 1: had to show up in my suitain time. And it's

763
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:06,759
Speaker 1: at Clarridge's Hotel in London, and he's got a nice

764
00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 1: suite in there, and he's very total gentleman, right, I

765
00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:15,239
Speaker 1: don't The Urticans were fabulous people, but we've talked more

766
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:17,319
Speaker 1: about that in a moment. But here there he is

767
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:21,399
Speaker 1: in there's magnificent suite, and he tells me that he's

768
00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:23,319
Speaker 1: heard a lot about me and that he knows I

769
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,640
Speaker 1: was a musician. By the way, Dusty has been signed

770
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:28,640
Speaker 1: to Atlantic in the interim. So he says, and we

771
00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 1: know you played for Dusty and we're like, you know.

772
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 1: We talked a bit and he offered me the job

773
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 1: that this guy was just vacating. I said, I don't

774
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:40,759
Speaker 1: think so he said why. I said, well, I'm nothing

775
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 1: like that guy. I'm a marketing guy. It's what I do,

776
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,719
Speaker 1: it's what we want. We want marketing. I said, you know,

777
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:50,000
Speaker 1: I've taken a job. You know. He says, what. I

778
00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 1: tell him what it is and he said. He looked

779
00:43:52,640 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 1: at me in astonishment. He said, you mean you're going

780
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:59,840
Speaker 1: to turn down Atlantic records to work for a fucking

781
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:03,000
Speaker 1: he can come. I said, it's not quite like that,

782
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:05,640
Speaker 1: but you know, yes, I'm turning it down. He said,

783
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: what they paying you? We've got a little bit of

784
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:10,920
Speaker 1: bright heat going on here. I said, they're paying me

785
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: three and a half thousand pounds and a company car.

786
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:17,560
Speaker 1: He said, I'm going to do something I've never done before.

787
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 1: I'll double that. No company car, and don't you dare

788
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:24,879
Speaker 1: ask me for a race for two years? I mean,

789
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:28,879
Speaker 1: what can you do? That's how I started. I never

790
00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:31,640
Speaker 1: knew Armored at that time. It was just ness, weary

791
00:44:31,719 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 1: and me. Next week by then was head of international

792
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:37,960
Speaker 1: and the jazz department was what he was reponsible for.

793
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:43,680
Speaker 1: So I joined Atlantic in uh k In is one

794
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:46,239
Speaker 1: of the first Zeppelin album comes out. The first had

795
00:44:46,280 --> 00:44:49,000
Speaker 1: been had just been released when I joined, and they

796
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:53,319
Speaker 1: were working on the second one. So that was when

797
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:55,839
Speaker 1: I came in, and you know, I thought, oh good,

798
00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:58,200
Speaker 1: this is a great opportunity for me to show what

799
00:44:58,239 --> 00:45:00,160
Speaker 1: I can do. And you know, it was he when

800
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:02,759
Speaker 1: with the design process of the cover and you know,

801
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:06,560
Speaker 1: and so forth, and Jerry Greenberg, who is the president

802
00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 1: of Atlantic then and gone to the band and got

803
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 1: them to put out a whole lot of Loves edited

804
00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:15,320
Speaker 1: version as a single. So I think that's great, this

805
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:19,239
Speaker 1: is a huge I'll schedule the single, which I do.

806
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: I don't think I've actually met Peter Grant at that

807
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 1: point either way, but I'm working on the record. I

808
00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:28,960
Speaker 1: think we may have spoken on the phone, but that

809
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:32,279
Speaker 1: was it. So I put the single out, okay, and

810
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 1: I get this call from Peter Grant manager Yeah, Phil Carson.

811
00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:43,640
Speaker 1: It starts like that. He was a very heavy dude.

812
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:47,319
Speaker 1: I want you to come to my office immediately. Ps

813
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 1: I coached this office and he says, you know, we

814
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:53,200
Speaker 1: don't want to single out. By then I'd chipped the

815
00:45:53,239 --> 00:45:55,760
Speaker 1: damn thing. By the way, three and a half thousand

816
00:45:55,800 --> 00:45:58,000
Speaker 1: of them. He said, you've got to get him back.

817
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:00,080
Speaker 1: I said, I'm not going to get him back. This

818
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:03,760
Speaker 1: is it. You know, I don't care. Jimmy Page doesn't

819
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:06,760
Speaker 1: care get him back. He ses, you want to phone

820
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 1: your boss and ask him. So I called, aren't explained

821
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 1: to her? Do what he tells you? So so I

822
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:18,480
Speaker 1: get these singles like so we were a bit daggers

823
00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:22,560
Speaker 1: drawn Peter Grant right at the beginning. And by the way,

824
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 1: I wish that when I got them back, I kept them,

825
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:28,880
Speaker 1: because you know what they're changing hands for it's like

826
00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 1: hundreds of dollars, but at seven inch anyway, I didn't

827
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:36,400
Speaker 1: keep them. I destroyed them. So that was how my

828
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 1: first meeting with Peter. But we actually got to be

829
00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:42,919
Speaker 1: very friendly. And it turns out he lived very close

830
00:46:42,920 --> 00:46:45,759
Speaker 1: to where I was at school, and you know, we

831
00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 1: just we we built a rapport. And that was he

832
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 1: that intelligent or was the band of that good? Or

833
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:55,879
Speaker 1: was he just a boy? No? No, actually it's all

834
00:46:55,960 --> 00:47:01,720
Speaker 1: of those, yet so much more highly intelligent man could

835
00:47:01,719 --> 00:47:06,160
Speaker 1: be a major Bully. The band was that good, and

836
00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:10,040
Speaker 1: his mission in life was to let Jimmy Page be

837
00:47:10,120 --> 00:47:13,920
Speaker 1: the creative genius that he is keep everybody else away

838
00:47:13,960 --> 00:47:17,799
Speaker 1: from his band. And that's the way they went about it,

839
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:20,279
Speaker 1: because by the time I joined, the first own that

840
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 1: already done pretty well in America, so that they were

841
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:27,719
Speaker 1: really expecting this the second record to come and it

842
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 1: was it was going to be big, so that they're

843
00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:33,720
Speaker 1: actually at that point where with Frank Barcelona, the agent,

844
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:38,000
Speaker 1: Premier Town and Premier Town, and that didn't last long

845
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:41,160
Speaker 1: because the band was so big they didn't need anybody else.

846
00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:45,080
Speaker 1: And Peter saw what he had. He knew what the mystery,

847
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 1: how he could create mystery by keeping people away. But

848
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:51,520
Speaker 1: by that time I got pretty friendly with them, you know,

849
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:54,200
Speaker 1: so I was I was on the road with them

850
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:58,520
Speaker 1: most of the time, and Peter quickly realized he had

851
00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 1: some bozo that he didn't have to pay that with

852
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:04,000
Speaker 1: all the work, you know. So that's how our relationship

853
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:06,920
Speaker 1: sort of flourished for the first few years there, and

854
00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 1: it was just a magic thing to be part of.

855
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:14,760
Speaker 1: And until the drugs kicked in, it was an amazing ride.

856
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:18,800
Speaker 1: I mean, being that close to Led Zeppelin was massive

857
00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 1: for me because I was the conduit to Atlantic. From

858
00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:25,280
Speaker 1: from Atlantic to led Zeppelin, they wouldn't talk to anybody

859
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:28,239
Speaker 1: else except Armett, So it was you know, I was

860
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:31,320
Speaker 1: the man you know at that point. Then what about

861
00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 1: the stores coming seventy one? Well, Armett signed the Stones

862
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 1: and yeah, it was at seventy one. I guess it

863
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:41,560
Speaker 1: must have been about Yeah, yeah, I was by then

864
00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:47,920
Speaker 1: I was working more for Armett than necessary. Uh, you

865
00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 1: don't understand that the the the corporate culture of Atlantic,

866
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:58,960
Speaker 1: It was really no corporate culture. It was Jerry Wexler

867
00:48:59,160 --> 00:49:00,799
Speaker 1: who was in the student and most of the time

868
00:49:01,160 --> 00:49:04,120
Speaker 1: still clinging to the last vestiges of R and B.

869
00:49:04,840 --> 00:49:08,080
Speaker 1: And there was Nessui, who by that time was setting

870
00:49:08,200 --> 00:49:12,239
Speaker 1: up worldwide distribution, which I helped him with. I was

871
00:49:12,239 --> 00:49:14,640
Speaker 1: actually on the board of most of the companies at

872
00:49:14,640 --> 00:49:19,800
Speaker 1: the beginning, and Ahmett, who was signing everything English that

873
00:49:19,960 --> 00:49:24,279
Speaker 1: could move. So I was in the right place at

874
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:27,640
Speaker 1: the right time, which leads me back to what I

875
00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:30,640
Speaker 1: was telling you earlier about the luck factor of being

876
00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:33,640
Speaker 1: an I n R. All these English bands wanted to

877
00:49:33,719 --> 00:49:37,920
Speaker 1: be where a wreath had been, or was an otis

878
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 1: had been, and Benny King had been and Ray Charles

879
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:43,239
Speaker 1: had been. They wanted to be on Atlantic Records. So

880
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:45,839
Speaker 1: the guy running Atlantic Records and have to look very hard.

881
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: People were coming to me. So it was a very

882
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:54,239
Speaker 1: good people Atltic was not famous for rich dealsite it

883
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: was absolutely the opposite. But we broke English acts in America.

884
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,920
Speaker 1: That's why they wanted to be there. So armed had

885
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:09,640
Speaker 1: made a deal with with with with Robert Steward. And

886
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:13,680
Speaker 1: also we were distributed then by Polydor, and so many

887
00:50:13,680 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 1: of these the Stigwood artists were all on Polydor. So

888
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:20,280
Speaker 1: that's how that my office within Polydor at that time,

889
00:50:20,680 --> 00:50:23,880
Speaker 1: and a lot of stuff was coming along. Armored had

890
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:27,960
Speaker 1: signed Yes by the time I joined the company, and

891
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:34,319
Speaker 1: we I thought Yes was a great brand, a great band, uh.

892
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:39,319
Speaker 1: And they recorded the first album yet we simply called Yes,

893
00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:41,800
Speaker 1: right right, but that I think it's called Yes, and

894
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:45,200
Speaker 1: it has an incredible version of every little thing it does.

895
00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 1: That's right, yeah, it does. So they had a couple

896
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:51,120
Speaker 1: of cover versions on that album. Then they did Time

897
00:50:51,160 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 1: and a Word, which was a total stiff in America. Well,

898
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:57,160
Speaker 1: they both were so no records. My dad has turned

899
00:50:57,160 --> 00:50:58,520
Speaker 1: me on to the first one is that if I

900
00:50:58,560 --> 00:51:00,920
Speaker 1: would tell everybody about it. Yeah, how funny. Well it

901
00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:06,120
Speaker 1: still didn't, and neither did Time and a Word. But

902
00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:08,400
Speaker 1: by then I was really working this band because I

903
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,640
Speaker 1: thought they were terrific, and we've sold quite a quantity

904
00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:14,479
Speaker 1: of records within Europe. We had like a top five

905
00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:17,960
Speaker 1: in Belgium, which meant maybe four thousand records. I mean,

906
00:51:18,440 --> 00:51:20,680
Speaker 1: nothing to write home about. But like you said, the

907
00:51:20,719 --> 00:51:25,200
Speaker 1: Atlantic deals were not rich deals anyway. So Atlantic dropped

908
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:28,879
Speaker 1: Yes after Time and a Word okay, and the drop

909
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:33,080
Speaker 1: notice went out and I called up Nessary as it man,

910
00:51:34,040 --> 00:51:36,680
Speaker 1: we can't let this group go, you know, and he

911
00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:41,360
Speaker 1: supported me, so I resigned. Yes, it's to start with

912
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 1: the Yes album. That was what was a deal the

913
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:46,879
Speaker 1: same or words, No, it was pretty much the same.

914
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:49,319
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, they were desperate, they didn't want

915
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:51,560
Speaker 1: to get dropped. So when I called up and said, look,

916
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:54,919
Speaker 1: we're rescinding that the drop notice it was, it went

917
00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:59,919
Speaker 1: down quite well. So we've made another Atlantic record style

918
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:04,520
Speaker 1: deal for VS. And the first record was was the

919
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 1: Yes album at that point Brian Lane, yeah, he was

920
00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:13,319
Speaker 1: not the manager before then. No, the manager before there

921
00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:15,760
Speaker 1: was a guy called Roy Flynn who was the general

922
00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:20,000
Speaker 1: manager of the industry, hang out the speak Easy and

923
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 1: then what had Brian Lane done before? Um? Brian Lane

924
00:52:25,880 --> 00:52:28,719
Speaker 1: before that was not known as Brian Lene was known

925
00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:32,280
Speaker 1: as his real name is Harvey Freed, and Harvey Free

926
00:52:32,280 --> 00:52:36,840
Speaker 1: was a known how can I put this delicately alterer

927
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:41,120
Speaker 1: of the charts? All right? So he people knew he

928
00:52:41,160 --> 00:52:45,279
Speaker 1: could work a little magic by doing that, and he

929
00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:48,200
Speaker 1: came along and I must say it was his idea

930
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:51,160
Speaker 1: to call it the Yes album, and really thought, what

931
00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:53,719
Speaker 1: are people going to ask for? Right? So yes, let's

932
00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:59,520
Speaker 1: call it that. So so we did. Um and Brian

933
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:03,359
Speaker 1: I came to know and love and hate Grin at

934
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:06,640
Speaker 1: the same time. I've always said he's a man that

935
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:09,799
Speaker 1: would could tell you a lie when the truth would

936
00:53:09,800 --> 00:53:12,680
Speaker 1: be a positive advantage, right right, I know a couple

937
00:53:12,719 --> 00:53:15,920
Speaker 1: of people. But nonetheless he did a good job, you know,

938
00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:22,239
Speaker 1: and the man was incredible, And I used everything I

939
00:53:22,360 --> 00:53:25,600
Speaker 1: knew to break them in America because the Americans didn't

940
00:53:25,600 --> 00:53:29,800
Speaker 1: give a funk by this time. Okay, was Peter Banks?

941
00:53:30,160 --> 00:53:33,440
Speaker 1: How did how did he leave the band? They fired

942
00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:36,640
Speaker 1: him after the time and a word album and got

943
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,760
Speaker 1: Steve Howin they fired him and we made another record

944
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:44,640
Speaker 1: with him called Flash, which was good, and there was

945
00:53:44,719 --> 00:53:49,359
Speaker 1: Badger too. Badger was Tony Cabe Tony Cabe and replaced

946
00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:53,040
Speaker 1: by Rick Wakeman, not on the Yes album. Right came later.

947
00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 1: How did he get booted? Well? Tonyk is a great

948
00:53:57,560 --> 00:54:00,560
Speaker 1: Hammond B three player, a really great Hammond be through that.

949
00:54:01,040 --> 00:54:05,799
Speaker 1: Ritt Wolves or Wakeman has so much dimension. You know

950
00:54:06,040 --> 00:54:08,359
Speaker 1: who you're going to get. See. It's an interesting thing

951
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:14,320
Speaker 1: here Atlantic records all of us that were that era,

952
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:19,040
Speaker 1: particularly with Jerry Greenberg, who I cannot say enough about. Okay,

953
00:54:19,400 --> 00:54:23,520
Speaker 1: Jerry Greenberg was a fantastic leader of people. He was

954
00:54:23,640 --> 00:54:25,839
Speaker 1: very young, he was like thirty two when he got

955
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:29,800
Speaker 1: the job running Atlantic, but he knew promotion. He actually

956
00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:33,839
Speaker 1: understood what a hit was, how to get it, how

957
00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:36,680
Speaker 1: to make it work as and a musician as well.

958
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 1: By the way, he was a drummer. Well it's not

959
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:42,600
Speaker 1: really a musicians. He was a drummer. But so but

960
00:54:42,760 --> 00:54:45,800
Speaker 1: the drummer is always a business guy. Yeah, that's sometimes

961
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:50,319
Speaker 1: it's true. That's the last thing a drummer says to

962
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:52,359
Speaker 1: his band before he leaves his Hey, guys, I've got

963
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:55,520
Speaker 1: a couple of songs. But that's another story. So he

964
00:54:55,680 --> 00:54:58,680
Speaker 1: was the He was a great leader, so on I

965
00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:02,399
Speaker 1: really really like working with and you know, I'm so

966
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:05,240
Speaker 1: sorry that when he decided not to do that job anymore.

967
00:55:05,560 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 1: And he and I had such a partnership of record

968
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:12,279
Speaker 1: of recordings. So I digress. We're talking, okay, So when

969
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:15,799
Speaker 1: you're at Yes, are you an A and R guy

970
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:18,600
Speaker 1: who signs the ban Are you a marketing guy or

971
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:21,480
Speaker 1: you the guy goes in the studio and gives recommendations.

972
00:55:21,719 --> 00:55:25,520
Speaker 1: Initially I was the marketing guy, and you know, we

973
00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:28,839
Speaker 1: don't forget that. Ere when I first joined in sixty nine,

974
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:32,400
Speaker 1: we didn't have w e A internactionally, we were distributed

975
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:38,000
Speaker 1: through Metronome in in Scandinavia, PolyGram in England and Germany,

976
00:55:39,560 --> 00:55:42,560
Speaker 1: different labels all over Europe. So my job was just

977
00:55:43,120 --> 00:55:46,960
Speaker 1: cultivating those independent companies and make sure they worked on

978
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:50,480
Speaker 1: Atlantic records. So yes, it was marketing, but I was

979
00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 1: also there to spot English talent that we could sign

980
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:57,000
Speaker 1: just for America, because the deals would be even cheaper

981
00:55:57,040 --> 00:55:58,840
Speaker 1: if we didn't do it for the world, because you

982
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:00,960
Speaker 1: only pay half as for the rest of the world.

983
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:04,600
Speaker 1: So that's what my job was. And as a musician,

984
00:56:04,680 --> 00:56:06,759
Speaker 1: of course, you know, I was able to go into

985
00:56:06,760 --> 00:56:09,359
Speaker 1: a studio and make recommendations. So when I say it

986
00:56:09,400 --> 00:56:13,480
Speaker 1: was very much involved in the Yes album. In fact,

987
00:56:13,520 --> 00:56:17,680
Speaker 1: the engineer that I introduced him to Eddie Offord, because

988
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:23,040
Speaker 1: Eddie was a tape op at that recording studio that

989
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:26,600
Speaker 1: I told you about the practical advision and one of

990
00:56:26,600 --> 00:56:31,319
Speaker 1: the jobs I had before I joined the Atlantic. It

991
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:34,759
Speaker 1: was while I was still making records. This was before

992
00:56:34,760 --> 00:56:38,160
Speaker 1: I tried General Foods. Actually was making cover versions for

993
00:56:38,200 --> 00:56:41,480
Speaker 1: wal Wass of hit albums. And I had this tiny

994
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:44,239
Speaker 1: budget and I had to make an album in a night,

995
00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:49,680
Speaker 1: a whole album. So I would book Eddie with the tapeop,

996
00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:53,520
Speaker 1: but he was also a budgeting engineer, So I book

997
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:58,200
Speaker 1: advision studios from eight to ten for two hours and

998
00:56:58,239 --> 00:57:02,440
Speaker 1: then eleven to one for two hours, okay, knowing that

999
00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:05,400
Speaker 1: nobody's going to be there, Okay, So we were just

1000
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:08,080
Speaker 1: I bought a reel of eight track. Eight track had

1001
00:57:08,120 --> 00:57:10,640
Speaker 1: just come out by then, and we had my own

1002
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:13,919
Speaker 1: eight track tape. We put it on and we would

1003
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:17,080
Speaker 1: make an album in a night. We did that, then

1004
00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,520
Speaker 1: he would mix it in a night too. Everything done

1005
00:57:19,960 --> 00:57:25,120
Speaker 1: finished in a night between eight o'clock and six am

1006
00:57:25,160 --> 00:57:27,640
Speaker 1: in the morning when the cleaners came in, and I

1007
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:30,800
Speaker 1: had problem musicians, by the way, the top session players

1008
00:57:31,040 --> 00:57:34,240
Speaker 1: to get the tracks done and then we just well

1009
00:57:34,280 --> 00:57:36,960
Speaker 1: that's how mud Lang started to doing cover record. I

1010
00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:41,040
Speaker 1: think it is South America, South Africa. So okay, So

1011
00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:43,760
Speaker 1: when you so anyway, I knew. That's how I told

1012
00:57:43,800 --> 00:57:46,200
Speaker 1: you you Eddie, and I introduced Eddie to the band

1013
00:57:46,240 --> 00:57:51,320
Speaker 1: and he became the producer for years. Okay, So what

1014
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:54,920
Speaker 1: were you involved in in that era Atlantic that was

1015
00:57:55,000 --> 00:57:58,720
Speaker 1: not successful that you thought was going to go Well,

1016
00:57:58,800 --> 00:58:01,000
Speaker 1: I'm going to tell you about, but can we tell

1017
00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:02,840
Speaker 1: you about a couple of the sex success I was

1018
00:58:02,880 --> 00:58:04,920
Speaker 1: going to go there, I figured, Okay, a couple of

1019
00:58:04,960 --> 00:58:08,720
Speaker 1: success right, Okay, well I suppose yet how I broke

1020
00:58:08,800 --> 00:58:11,680
Speaker 1: yes in America was because I was the guy that

1021
00:58:11,800 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 1: was taking Jimmy Page or Robert Plant, Scott Mooney you

1022
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:18,120
Speaker 1: know for the hour long in New York City. Yeah,

1023
00:58:18,240 --> 00:58:21,680
Speaker 1: and then up in Boston w b C N with

1024
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:25,400
Speaker 1: Edipus up there. So these guys became my friends. So

1025
00:58:25,600 --> 00:58:28,800
Speaker 1: I would be able to get new stuff with these guys.

1026
00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:32,000
Speaker 1: So they gave yes the time of day, and that's

1027
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:35,280
Speaker 1: how that really started. Breaking because Atlantic was not interested.

1028
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:38,560
Speaker 1: I've gone against the A and R. They dropped them,

1029
00:58:38,600 --> 00:58:41,120
Speaker 1: so now they're going forced to work them again. I

1030
00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:45,040
Speaker 1: mean Jerry Greenberg was extremely supportive, but the rest of

1031
00:58:45,080 --> 00:58:47,800
Speaker 1: them were not so supportive. But so you heard round

1032
00:58:47,800 --> 00:58:49,840
Speaker 1: About as a hit. I thought round About it was

1033
00:58:49,880 --> 00:58:52,080
Speaker 1: a great song. Okay. So then when they start to

1034
00:58:52,080 --> 00:58:55,960
Speaker 1: go off the rails, they do Tales from Topic, Graphic Oceans,

1035
00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:58,920
Speaker 1: they do the three that's two albums, then they do

1036
00:58:58,960 --> 00:59:01,320
Speaker 1: a three album live set. Were you supported of that?

1037
00:59:01,320 --> 00:59:03,800
Speaker 1: Were you telling them, well, this is too much? Well,

1038
00:59:03,840 --> 00:59:06,440
Speaker 1: you know, it's progressive music. You know in England is

1039
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:10,360
Speaker 1: a hot? Was the hot the birthplace really a progress music?

1040
00:59:10,440 --> 00:59:13,240
Speaker 1: I kind of like what they were doing. And you

1041
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:15,440
Speaker 1: talk about that three albums, that it was the biggest

1042
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:18,280
Speaker 1: album in the history of our German record company, that

1043
00:59:18,400 --> 00:59:21,120
Speaker 1: German's love of three albums set for some reason. So

1044
00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:23,800
Speaker 1: you know, so there was no trying to talk them down.

1045
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:25,960
Speaker 1: Will some more as a single or something like that.

1046
00:59:26,160 --> 00:59:31,040
Speaker 1: Not really obviously we wanted singles, but it wasn't to be.

1047
00:59:31,120 --> 00:59:34,800
Speaker 1: And of course eventually you know, the yes thing fell

1048
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:38,600
Speaker 1: apart as well. It just okay, so how w when

1049
00:59:38,640 --> 00:59:41,760
Speaker 1: did you leave Atlantic Records. I left at the end

1050
00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:44,360
Speaker 1: of Okay, so let's go back. Okay. You had success

1051
00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:46,280
Speaker 1: with Yes, and then we were going to see another one.

1052
00:59:47,560 --> 00:59:51,520
Speaker 1: I signed Virgin Records to Atlantic. Wow, that's a big deal. Yeah,

1053
00:59:51,600 --> 00:59:57,400
Speaker 1: it was. My then wife was running a TV show

1054
00:59:57,440 --> 00:59:59,760
Speaker 1: called The Old Gray Whistle Test, which is a legendar,

1055
01:00:00,240 --> 01:00:04,480
Speaker 1: legendary show, and her and the producer decided that they

1056
01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:06,440
Speaker 1: were going to put a piece of music on that

1057
01:00:06,760 --> 01:00:10,040
Speaker 1: someone had brought into them that day. And those days,

1058
01:00:10,040 --> 01:00:13,440
Speaker 1: this is really very early on. It's before videos. So

1059
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:17,320
Speaker 1: this show had a DJ, had a live band in

1060
01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:20,280
Speaker 1: the studio and they would play new music. Where they

1061
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:24,000
Speaker 1: put old film to new music was quite clever. Clever

1062
01:00:24,080 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 1: the way they did that. And then there's the producers

1063
01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:30,200
Speaker 1: worked out that any piece of film if fits any

1064
01:00:30,200 --> 01:00:34,360
Speaker 1: piece of music, eventually it was seen. So they had

1065
01:00:34,360 --> 01:00:37,480
Speaker 1: this old a lot of old film they used. This

1066
01:00:37,560 --> 01:00:40,680
Speaker 1: particularly one was an old skiing thing, you know. And

1067
01:00:41,760 --> 01:00:44,040
Speaker 1: you know, I was a bad boy in those days,

1068
01:00:44,040 --> 01:00:46,280
Speaker 1: you know, And I knew that Tuesday nights when the

1069
01:00:46,280 --> 01:00:48,920
Speaker 1: show was live, that was my date night because I

1070
01:00:48,960 --> 01:00:51,920
Speaker 1: know where I'm going to get caught. You girlfriend was

1071
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:55,840
Speaker 1: in the studio, so She called me one Tuesday afternoon

1072
01:00:55,840 --> 01:00:59,440
Speaker 1: when i'm, you know, getting ready to go out, and

1073
01:00:59,480 --> 01:01:01,400
Speaker 1: she says, you have to come into the show tonight.

1074
01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:03,520
Speaker 1: You know, there's someone you really got to meet. He's

1075
01:01:03,560 --> 01:01:07,000
Speaker 1: bought in this piece of music and you've got to hear.

1076
01:01:07,040 --> 01:01:09,320
Speaker 1: And I didn't know what it was, and side going

1077
01:01:09,360 --> 01:01:11,760
Speaker 1: there and I'm astonished by this piece of music. And

1078
01:01:11,800 --> 01:01:14,240
Speaker 1: the guys she wanted me to meet was Richard Branson.

1079
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:17,440
Speaker 1: So I made a deal with Richard on the spot.

1080
01:01:17,840 --> 01:01:22,200
Speaker 1: I signed Virgin Records for a hundred and twenty five dollars,

1081
01:01:22,360 --> 01:01:24,000
Speaker 1: you know, and they were with us for ten years,

1082
01:01:24,040 --> 01:01:26,800
Speaker 1: with Atlantic for ten years and too. And now this

1083
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:29,400
Speaker 1: is the thing about this guy, Jerry Greenberg, who I

1084
01:01:29,440 --> 01:01:33,560
Speaker 1: know you've interviewed. So I said to him, look, I've signed.

1085
01:01:33,600 --> 01:01:37,720
Speaker 1: I know this is unusual. I've signed this album which

1086
01:01:37,800 --> 01:01:40,840
Speaker 1: is totally instrumental. He said, We've got no chance with

1087
01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:44,560
Speaker 1: that in America. I said, look, it's groundbreaking, trust me.

1088
01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:47,040
Speaker 1: So he gets to work. He says, you're right, it

1089
01:01:47,160 --> 01:01:51,280
Speaker 1: is fantastic. It sounds like a movie soundtrack. So I said,

1090
01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:53,960
Speaker 1: well that's a good idea. You know. He goes to

1091
01:01:54,040 --> 01:01:58,360
Speaker 1: Warner Brothers. The Exhortist had just been made, and the

1092
01:01:58,400 --> 01:02:02,120
Speaker 1: Exhortist soundtrack was cut, done with an orchestra as at

1093
01:02:02,160 --> 01:02:05,800
Speaker 1: great cost. He plays this or somehow someone who gets

1094
01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:09,040
Speaker 1: it to what's in a really freaking freaking and he says,

1095
01:02:09,160 --> 01:02:12,360
Speaker 1: that's going to be my soundtrack. That is how Tubular

1096
01:02:12,400 --> 01:02:16,200
Speaker 1: Bells broke totally down to Jerry Greenberg, right, And I

1097
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:19,360
Speaker 1: think Atlantic, so like twenty million, there was something unbelievable

1098
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:29,960
Speaker 1: figure out it was really incredible. Okay, And you're going

1099
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:32,840
Speaker 1: to talk about a couple of missus, you have to

1100
01:02:32,880 --> 01:02:38,040
Speaker 1: go there yet, Okay, Well, Paul Kosos band was totally start.

1101
01:02:38,760 --> 01:02:44,840
Speaker 1: I suppose my biggest miss ever was the reconstituted Small

1102
01:02:44,880 --> 01:02:48,960
Speaker 1: Faces with Stevie Marritt, you know, Ian mccleagan, Steve Marriott,

1103
01:02:50,040 --> 01:02:54,120
Speaker 1: Kenny Jones and Rick Wills on base and I thought

1104
01:02:54,120 --> 01:02:56,360
Speaker 1: we made a pretty good record. I had to buy

1105
01:02:56,440 --> 01:02:58,880
Speaker 1: them out of A and M and it just went

1106
01:02:59,080 --> 01:03:04,360
Speaker 1: absolutely where nowhere. So that was okay. So how does

1107
01:03:04,360 --> 01:03:10,800
Speaker 1: it end with Atlantic? Um? It ended fives with the

1108
01:03:10,880 --> 01:03:13,800
Speaker 1: last year I was involved in any way with the

1109
01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:19,240
Speaker 1: mainstream Atlantic. Uh. Mick Jones really a foreigner far and

1110
01:03:19,360 --> 01:03:22,160
Speaker 1: up and was getting an Award at a TV show

1111
01:03:22,200 --> 01:03:24,919
Speaker 1: called The Tube, which it took place in a town

1112
01:03:24,920 --> 01:03:30,280
Speaker 1: called Newcastle, New New Newcastle to London is a bit

1113
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:33,640
Speaker 1: like Pittsburgh is to New York. You don't want to

1114
01:03:33,640 --> 01:03:36,560
Speaker 1: go there. But the TV show was being done from

1115
01:03:37,400 --> 01:03:42,160
Speaker 1: from New York, from from newcasts Newcastle. So Mix says

1116
01:03:42,200 --> 01:03:44,440
Speaker 1: to me, look, I'll go. You know, you've got to

1117
01:03:44,440 --> 01:03:49,160
Speaker 1: come with me. I said, okay, all right, uh, and

1118
01:03:49,200 --> 01:03:52,120
Speaker 1: we've got to get a private plane. Well what the funk?

1119
01:03:52,160 --> 01:03:54,680
Speaker 1: I mean, little did he know they were gonna I

1120
01:03:54,680 --> 01:03:57,360
Speaker 1: was gonna recharge the front of the royalty account anyway,

1121
01:03:57,440 --> 01:03:59,960
Speaker 1: So we got a little plane and we go up

1122
01:04:00,080 --> 01:04:04,000
Speaker 1: to to the Tube and you know what it's like

1123
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:05,760
Speaker 1: with TV shows, there's a hell of a lot of

1124
01:04:05,800 --> 01:04:09,600
Speaker 1: hanging about. This particular one was a live show, but

1125
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:12,560
Speaker 1: they would have a live run through with one audience

1126
01:04:12,600 --> 01:04:15,120
Speaker 1: and then then kick the audience out and kind of

1127
01:04:15,120 --> 01:04:18,160
Speaker 1: like I said, l still does it today. That's what

1128
01:04:18,200 --> 01:04:20,680
Speaker 1: they do. So this is the same sort of thing.

1129
01:04:21,200 --> 01:04:24,520
Speaker 1: So I'm just wasting time. You know, I've found an office.

1130
01:04:24,520 --> 01:04:26,320
Speaker 1: There was no one in it, so I'm start going

1131
01:04:26,360 --> 01:04:29,080
Speaker 1: on the phone and doing work, you know, calling America.

1132
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:31,560
Speaker 1: This not the other. Then I hear an American voice

1133
01:04:31,560 --> 01:04:34,160
Speaker 1: that I kind of recognize doing exactly the same thing

1134
01:04:34,320 --> 01:04:37,000
Speaker 1: in another vacant office. Turns out to be a chack

1135
01:04:37,080 --> 01:04:41,480
Speaker 1: on Mark Puma. Mark Human was a runner for led Zeppelins,

1136
01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:43,760
Speaker 1: and I've worked with him a lot in the concerts

1137
01:04:43,760 --> 01:04:47,040
Speaker 1: Eastern concert West days. So I said, what you're doing?

1138
01:04:47,040 --> 01:04:49,120
Speaker 1: I said, well, I've got this band and you know

1139
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:52,480
Speaker 1: we're doing the show tonight. Said what they called it's

1140
01:04:52,480 --> 01:04:55,680
Speaker 1: a Twisted Sister. Now I've never heard of Twisted Sister.

1141
01:04:55,760 --> 01:04:59,120
Speaker 1: But I see them, this group of you know guys

1142
01:04:59,160 --> 01:05:01,680
Speaker 1: would make up, you know, they're all seven ft tall

1143
01:05:01,840 --> 01:05:05,200
Speaker 1: walking around the place. And he says, yeah, well, you know,

1144
01:05:05,320 --> 01:05:08,000
Speaker 1: we've really want to get signed in England. I made

1145
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:11,919
Speaker 1: a deal with a with a independent label, but I've

1146
01:05:11,920 --> 01:05:14,520
Speaker 1: got to do something. And we we we spent out

1147
01:05:14,560 --> 01:05:17,240
Speaker 1: to be honest, we spent our last money getting over

1148
01:05:17,320 --> 01:05:20,600
Speaker 1: here to see if we can get signed. So I said,

1149
01:05:20,840 --> 01:05:23,520
Speaker 1: will I take a look at him? Meanwhile, I mixed

1150
01:05:23,560 --> 01:05:26,120
Speaker 1: on a break. I said, oh, I've just met Mark Humor,

1151
01:05:26,200 --> 01:05:29,400
Speaker 1: you know, and he has got this group called Twisted System.

1152
01:05:29,520 --> 01:05:32,160
Speaker 1: Mixed sense to me, twist his sister. They're all over

1153
01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:35,640
Speaker 1: the radio in New York. Little did I know, and

1154
01:05:35,680 --> 01:05:37,680
Speaker 1: nor did he that on the radio because J J.

1155
01:05:37,880 --> 01:05:42,280
Speaker 1: French the guitar the guitar player had inveigled away to

1156
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:46,960
Speaker 1: buy time cheaply on w n W. And although we

1157
01:05:46,960 --> 01:05:50,160
Speaker 1: were playing with a you know that the hook of

1158
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:53,640
Speaker 1: one of their songs. So Mick thought this was an airplayer,

1159
01:05:53,680 --> 01:05:56,880
Speaker 1: which it actually wasn't. So I thought, that's interesting. So

1160
01:05:56,920 --> 01:05:59,200
Speaker 1: I'll go down there and I'll watch them and the

1161
01:05:59,560 --> 01:06:01,840
Speaker 1: run through. I mean, the songs are pretty good. I

1162
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:03,960
Speaker 1: mean they're not pushing the barriers of rock and roll

1163
01:06:04,120 --> 01:06:08,520
Speaker 1: any further forward, you know, but there's they had something.

1164
01:06:08,560 --> 01:06:11,320
Speaker 1: And then in the show when it went like my god,

1165
01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:15,360
Speaker 1: they were good. They were really good. So the Marxist, look,

1166
01:06:15,400 --> 01:06:20,200
Speaker 1: we're doing the Marquee on Thursday shows on Tuesday. Okay, Mark,

1167
01:06:20,280 --> 01:06:23,640
Speaker 1: he was really an opinion making place in London, helped

1168
01:06:23,680 --> 01:06:27,439
Speaker 1: hell about five hundred people something like that. So he said,

1169
01:06:27,480 --> 01:06:29,600
Speaker 1: would you come down and see the band? I said, sure.

1170
01:06:30,400 --> 01:06:33,640
Speaker 1: I get to the market. It is packed. And I

1171
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:35,800
Speaker 1: missed a rock and roll in London, right. I was

1172
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:38,360
Speaker 1: signed these bands and I thought I knew everything you

1173
01:06:39,000 --> 01:06:44,320
Speaker 1: still do to that. So anyway, they killed the audience

1174
01:06:44,360 --> 01:06:48,320
Speaker 1: because on the live TV show, de Snyder was restrained,

1175
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:51,880
Speaker 1: not so in the Marquis. My god. They were a

1176
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:55,800
Speaker 1: great live band, and they looked brutal up there, you know, brutal.

1177
01:06:56,640 --> 01:06:59,600
Speaker 1: So at the end of it, Mark, Mark, who necessarily,

1178
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:01,360
Speaker 1: what do you I said, Okay, I'll sign them, and

1179
01:07:01,440 --> 01:07:05,600
Speaker 1: he looked at me in astonishment. I said, what to Atlantic,

1180
01:07:06,320 --> 01:07:09,200
Speaker 1: Well that's where I work. Sure, He said, you've got

1181
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:10,520
Speaker 1: to come back and meet that. I said, I do

1182
01:07:10,600 --> 01:07:13,640
Speaker 1: not want to meet the band. I will sign the band. Okay.

1183
01:07:14,040 --> 01:07:16,320
Speaker 1: I'm going to give you enough to make the record,

1184
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:20,280
Speaker 1: no advance beyond that, okay. In those says it was

1185
01:07:20,280 --> 01:07:21,960
Speaker 1: a bit more expensive to make it records than it

1186
01:07:22,040 --> 01:07:25,880
Speaker 1: is of course perversely, but you know, I'll do that.

1187
01:07:26,000 --> 01:07:28,600
Speaker 1: It's don't look for a big deal, but I will

1188
01:07:28,600 --> 01:07:31,120
Speaker 1: sign the band. So eventually he persuades me to come

1189
01:07:31,120 --> 01:07:33,160
Speaker 1: and meet them. But of course they're nothing like that.

1190
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:38,200
Speaker 1: Dee Snyder is. You know, he's a great guy, one

1191
01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:41,240
Speaker 1: of my best friends to this day. So you know,

1192
01:07:41,360 --> 01:07:44,400
Speaker 1: we get talking and I make the deal, and my deal.

1193
01:07:45,120 --> 01:07:48,520
Speaker 1: I didn't call up Jimmy Page, who owned the Soul Studios,

1194
01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:51,520
Speaker 1: which had two bedrooms in it. So I said, you,

1195
01:07:51,760 --> 01:07:53,440
Speaker 1: I've signed this band. I wanted you to give me

1196
01:07:53,480 --> 01:07:55,760
Speaker 1: a decent rate, saying okay, sure, and I want to

1197
01:07:55,840 --> 01:07:59,440
Speaker 1: use your engineer, Stewart Apps. So he made me a

1198
01:07:59,560 --> 01:08:03,040
Speaker 1: very reasonable deal. But still, you know, it's a residential studio,

1199
01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:05,400
Speaker 1: you know. And the deal I made for these guys

1200
01:08:05,480 --> 01:08:09,320
Speaker 1: was sixty dollars that included flying them over to England

1201
01:08:09,360 --> 01:08:14,600
Speaker 1: and back the studio time, everything sixty. So I make

1202
01:08:14,680 --> 01:08:19,320
Speaker 1: the deal, okay. The next Tuesday is the lawyers lunch

1203
01:08:19,400 --> 01:08:22,320
Speaker 1: day at Atlantic Records. The lawyers lunch days, I think

1204
01:08:22,320 --> 01:08:25,600
Speaker 1: they still have it, and is about fourteen of the

1205
01:08:25,640 --> 01:08:29,240
Speaker 1: business side of Atlantic in their plus whoever is the

1206
01:08:29,280 --> 01:08:32,920
Speaker 1: president or chairman at it would occasionally join it. It's

1207
01:08:33,120 --> 01:08:36,960
Speaker 1: where they go over the business things of the of

1208
01:08:37,040 --> 01:08:42,040
Speaker 1: the time. So if I've got anything, if I wasn't there,

1209
01:08:42,560 --> 01:08:45,760
Speaker 1: I would call in, you know. So I got in

1210
01:08:45,800 --> 01:08:47,720
Speaker 1: the room. It's one of the big conference rooms with

1211
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:50,200
Speaker 1: the you know, little speaker in the middle of you

1212
01:08:50,360 --> 01:08:54,320
Speaker 1: visualize it, and fourteen lawyers and business affairs people sitting

1213
01:08:54,320 --> 01:08:57,840
Speaker 1: around there in this particular day, Doug Morris chairing it,

1214
01:08:57,960 --> 01:09:01,880
Speaker 1: you know. So he's um, he said, oh, Phil, what

1215
01:09:01,880 --> 01:09:04,600
Speaker 1: what do you guys? So what, I've signed a band.

1216
01:09:04,760 --> 01:09:07,040
Speaker 1: It's a great, great good. Yeah, you're You're always good

1217
01:09:07,040 --> 01:09:10,600
Speaker 1: at that, you know. So I said, yeah, yeah, but

1218
01:09:10,840 --> 01:09:13,880
Speaker 1: this is an American banker, American band. You signed an

1219
01:09:13,920 --> 01:09:16,679
Speaker 1: American banding And I said, yeah, they did this TV show,

1220
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:19,599
Speaker 1: they destroyed the place, and you know, I've made a

1221
01:09:19,720 --> 01:09:23,719
Speaker 1: very reasonable deal. He said, what are they called? I said,

1222
01:09:23,760 --> 01:09:28,720
Speaker 1: twisted sister. He said, twisted fucking sister. I've turned that

1223
01:09:28,760 --> 01:09:32,920
Speaker 1: band down five times. There's a kid in here. Jason

1224
01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:37,280
Speaker 1: Flom thinks they're like I've told him he's fired. If

1225
01:09:37,320 --> 01:09:42,360
Speaker 1: ever he mentioned them again. So I don't, Doug, I

1226
01:09:42,439 --> 01:09:44,679
Speaker 1: really don't know about that. But you know I've signed

1227
01:09:44,720 --> 01:09:47,559
Speaker 1: them and that's it. Like I did tell you, I

1228
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:49,840
Speaker 1: was mouth Almighty and Night earlier on and this was

1229
01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:52,920
Speaker 1: no exception. And I remember him saying to me, on

1230
01:09:53,040 --> 01:09:55,840
Speaker 1: your own head. Then this is really early days for

1231
01:09:56,000 --> 01:10:00,719
Speaker 1: Doug nineteen eighty three, so, and he had not signed

1232
01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:04,559
Speaker 1: anything right that point. So I said, oh, yeah, Doug,

1233
01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:06,960
Speaker 1: on my own head, is it? You know, like yes,

1234
01:10:07,280 --> 01:10:10,599
Speaker 1: Emerson Lake and Palmer, A C, d C. On my

1235
01:10:10,640 --> 01:10:12,880
Speaker 1: own head, like that is it? And you could hear

1236
01:10:13,200 --> 01:10:17,639
Speaker 1: the silence echoing over three thousand miles of telephone lines.

1237
01:10:18,200 --> 01:10:20,920
Speaker 1: And that was the beginning of the end from my

1238
01:10:21,000 --> 01:10:26,000
Speaker 1: relationship with Doug Morris. So I signed Twist his sister.

1239
01:10:26,479 --> 01:10:29,839
Speaker 1: I called up Jason Flom, who reminded me of something.

1240
01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:34,240
Speaker 1: He said, you signed my band. I said, yeah, Doug

1241
01:10:34,320 --> 01:10:36,200
Speaker 1: told me that, you know, he was going to fire

1242
01:10:36,240 --> 01:10:38,479
Speaker 1: you if if you mentioned them again. What do you

1243
01:10:38,479 --> 01:10:41,280
Speaker 1: mean your band? He said, don't you remember one day

1244
01:10:41,320 --> 01:10:44,759
Speaker 1: you were you were in the office and I gave

1245
01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:48,519
Speaker 1: you a package. I said, yeah, I vaguely remember that.

1246
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:51,720
Speaker 1: And I did remember it, because you know what I do.

1247
01:10:51,800 --> 01:10:54,080
Speaker 1: I used to get the eight o'clock flight in the

1248
01:10:54,120 --> 01:10:58,599
Speaker 1: evening back to England, and he had given me this package,

1249
01:10:58,600 --> 01:11:01,840
Speaker 1: as he so rightly said. And I'm sitting in my

1250
01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:05,200
Speaker 1: first class seat, you know, sipping my first class champagne

1251
01:11:05,240 --> 01:11:09,000
Speaker 1: and about to enjoy my first class caveat, and I

1252
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:11,680
Speaker 1: think I better listen to the little Jason's stuff, you

1253
01:11:11,720 --> 01:11:14,920
Speaker 1: know in those days that I think Walkerman had just

1254
01:11:15,120 --> 01:11:18,000
Speaker 1: come out at about that time. So I opened this

1255
01:11:18,040 --> 01:11:20,360
Speaker 1: package he gave me, and the first thing I pull

1256
01:11:20,479 --> 01:11:25,599
Speaker 1: out is like a a a cassette. Then I pull

1257
01:11:25,680 --> 01:11:28,360
Speaker 1: out a picture of this, this band, this before I

1258
01:11:28,360 --> 01:11:32,600
Speaker 1: had seen in women's clothing, you know. And then the

1259
01:11:32,640 --> 01:11:38,120
Speaker 1: next sample is this stenographer's pad, about eight pages of

1260
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:42,200
Speaker 1: closely written notes by Jason for about this band. And

1261
01:11:42,240 --> 01:11:44,360
Speaker 1: I took one look at the picture and one look

1262
01:11:44,400 --> 01:11:46,840
Speaker 1: at the memo, and I look at my champagne and

1263
01:11:46,880 --> 01:11:49,320
Speaker 1: caviare and I threw the whole lot in an airline

1264
01:11:49,360 --> 01:11:51,800
Speaker 1: trash back right, so I didn't even know it was.

1265
01:11:52,800 --> 01:11:56,120
Speaker 1: But I will give him this. You know, he has

1266
01:11:56,160 --> 01:11:58,479
Speaker 1: claimed he signed to his his sister. He did not,

1267
01:11:59,080 --> 01:12:02,320
Speaker 1: but without any shadow of doubt, he broke twist his

1268
01:12:02,439 --> 01:12:05,400
Speaker 1: sister because he made it a mission. He was going

1269
01:12:05,400 --> 01:12:10,200
Speaker 1: around putting up hosters himself everywhere. And you know that

1270
01:12:10,280 --> 01:12:14,439
Speaker 1: nobody cared except Jason Flam about this band, and he

1271
01:12:14,520 --> 01:12:16,840
Speaker 1: did it on his own. And we got that first

1272
01:12:16,840 --> 01:12:19,680
Speaker 1: album up to two hundred thousand or whatever it was,

1273
01:12:19,680 --> 01:12:23,760
Speaker 1: which is enough to make the next album grudging Lee,

1274
01:12:24,040 --> 01:12:28,439
Speaker 1: you know, from digging and so forth. And that was

1275
01:12:28,479 --> 01:12:31,519
Speaker 1: a big, big moment really, because the second album did

1276
01:12:31,560 --> 01:12:33,439
Speaker 1: have songs on it and Doug got behind it. But

1277
01:12:33,640 --> 01:12:37,280
Speaker 1: just remembering someone some little thing after I had made

1278
01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:41,400
Speaker 1: got them in the studio Uh. We were making the

1279
01:12:41,479 --> 01:12:44,000
Speaker 1: record and I realized there was a song on there

1280
01:12:44,040 --> 01:12:46,400
Speaker 1: that could be a hit single. So I said, to

1281
01:12:46,479 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 1: look what we're gonna do. We track everything, then we're

1282
01:12:49,560 --> 01:12:52,880
Speaker 1: going to concentrate on I Am, I'm me. We're going

1283
01:12:52,920 --> 01:12:55,920
Speaker 1: to finish it up, mix it, get it done before

1284
01:12:55,960 --> 01:13:00,120
Speaker 1: we address any overdubs, mixes of anything else, and some

1285
01:13:00,479 --> 01:13:04,360
Speaker 1: Jimmy's studio. Six weeks we do this and it sounds great.

1286
01:13:04,960 --> 01:13:07,200
Speaker 1: So then I got them a gig at the Marquis

1287
01:13:07,240 --> 01:13:10,240
Speaker 1: because people wanted to have the band back. So I said,

1288
01:13:10,240 --> 01:13:12,479
Speaker 1: we're going to do two nights of the Marquee. We're

1289
01:13:12,479 --> 01:13:15,760
Speaker 1: going to record it live. Okay, the B side of

1290
01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:18,679
Speaker 1: a twelve inch version of single will be twenty minutes

1291
01:13:18,680 --> 01:13:22,160
Speaker 1: of Twitter's Sister Life. So the result of all this

1292
01:13:22,240 --> 01:13:24,920
Speaker 1: is I went a little over budget to deal with

1293
01:13:25,000 --> 01:13:28,760
Speaker 1: sixty THO. I think I came in at seventy two

1294
01:13:28,800 --> 01:13:33,320
Speaker 1: thousand on us and I called up Sheldon Vogel, who

1295
01:13:33,400 --> 01:13:37,000
Speaker 1: was the financial actually vice chairman of Atlantic, who was,

1296
01:13:37,040 --> 01:13:40,519
Speaker 1: you know, really enamored by Doug Morrison those days, not

1297
01:13:40,640 --> 01:13:44,320
Speaker 1: so much later, but in those days, and he we

1298
01:13:44,640 --> 01:13:48,400
Speaker 1: have the hell of a row, he said, he said,

1299
01:13:48,400 --> 01:13:52,599
Speaker 1: I've just got this invoice here from Soul Studios and

1300
01:13:52,840 --> 01:13:55,439
Speaker 1: we're not going to pay it. I said, what do

1301
01:13:55,479 --> 01:13:57,200
Speaker 1: you mean you're not going to pay it? He said, well,

1302
01:13:57,240 --> 01:14:00,519
Speaker 1: you're twelve thousand over budget. I've paid rest of it.

1303
01:14:00,640 --> 01:14:04,200
Speaker 1: I'm not paying the overage. I said, well, you do

1304
01:14:04,320 --> 01:14:07,240
Speaker 1: realize this is Jimmy Page's studio. Dude, I don't care

1305
01:14:07,240 --> 01:14:10,479
Speaker 1: whose studio it is. I'm not paying it. So I said,

1306
01:14:10,479 --> 01:14:13,599
Speaker 1: we'll just put me through to arm it. Now you've

1307
01:14:13,600 --> 01:14:15,479
Speaker 1: got to realize I was kind of the golden boy.

1308
01:14:16,479 --> 01:14:18,240
Speaker 1: It was like a lot of people thought I was

1309
01:14:18,320 --> 01:14:22,200
Speaker 1: arm it's illegitimate, but I wasn't as far as I know.

1310
01:14:22,680 --> 01:14:26,320
Speaker 1: So you know, we've he said, that would be ridiculous.

1311
01:14:26,360 --> 01:14:29,360
Speaker 1: Just you know, pay it yourself and I'll reimburse. So

1312
01:14:29,560 --> 01:14:32,400
Speaker 1: I took care of it, and that was a bit

1313
01:14:32,439 --> 01:14:34,880
Speaker 1: of a rough moment for me at the company I

1314
01:14:34,920 --> 01:14:38,000
Speaker 1: worked for, but by then I didn't care, because you know,

1315
01:14:38,760 --> 01:14:42,720
Speaker 1: I was fireproof, still the only person Led Zeppelin would

1316
01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:45,720
Speaker 1: speak to, and this huge track record of artists that

1317
01:14:45,720 --> 01:14:48,360
Speaker 1: I've signed, so it didn't really bother me at all.

1318
01:14:48,960 --> 01:14:52,400
Speaker 1: So the Twisted Sister Record came out to great business

1319
01:14:52,479 --> 01:14:59,439
Speaker 1: of course, and I thought, well, you know, I think

1320
01:14:59,439 --> 01:15:02,759
Speaker 1: I want to make a break. And at that point

1321
01:15:02,880 --> 01:15:06,800
Speaker 1: both Jumy Page and Robert Plant had asked me to

1322
01:15:06,840 --> 01:15:10,800
Speaker 1: manage them, so did a number of other artists. So

1323
01:15:10,840 --> 01:15:12,479
Speaker 1: I thought, well, how can I kind of use this

1324
01:15:12,560 --> 01:15:19,280
Speaker 1: to my advantage? So I called up. I said to Atlantic, Look,

1325
01:15:19,640 --> 01:15:22,479
Speaker 1: the need for an office in London is diminished, you

1326
01:15:22,520 --> 01:15:26,360
Speaker 1: know lately, because all the big English bands you know,

1327
01:15:26,600 --> 01:15:31,400
Speaker 1: on on the way out whatever. You know. I'd like

1328
01:15:31,439 --> 01:15:35,559
Speaker 1: to have my own record label. So Doug thought this

1329
01:15:35,640 --> 01:15:39,120
Speaker 1: was a great idea because then I'm outside the mainstream

1330
01:15:39,160 --> 01:15:43,880
Speaker 1: of Atlantic, so there's no threat of any kind. So

1331
01:15:44,280 --> 01:15:46,599
Speaker 1: I will never forget the meeting that we had when

1332
01:15:46,600 --> 01:15:49,000
Speaker 1: we did this. I said, look, I just wanted like

1333
01:15:49,080 --> 01:15:52,160
Speaker 1: a reasonable deal. But I was making quite a lot

1334
01:15:52,200 --> 01:15:54,720
Speaker 1: of money back in those days. But I want a

1335
01:15:54,720 --> 01:15:56,880
Speaker 1: reasonable deal. I want some kind of salary. Doesn't have

1336
01:15:56,920 --> 01:15:59,080
Speaker 1: to be what you're paying now, but I just want,

1337
01:15:59,160 --> 01:16:03,880
Speaker 1: you know, to any the office paid for, you know,

1338
01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:07,439
Speaker 1: And I want to set up a record label. But

1339
01:16:07,560 --> 01:16:09,920
Speaker 1: I also, you know, want to manage any artist that's

1340
01:16:09,960 --> 01:16:15,439
Speaker 1: on Atlantic. I know I've already got okay, So Doug

1341
01:16:15,520 --> 01:16:17,960
Speaker 1: couldn't wait to make the damn deal. He really couldn't.

1342
01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:21,400
Speaker 1: And Steve Weiss was my attorney in those days, legendary

1343
01:16:21,439 --> 01:16:25,280
Speaker 1: guy as you know, led Zeppelin, Vanilla Fudge, Dustry Springfield.

1344
01:16:25,320 --> 01:16:29,840
Speaker 1: Even so, he's there and we're getting everything we want.

1345
01:16:30,320 --> 01:16:32,920
Speaker 1: And I could see that this steam coming out of

1346
01:16:33,000 --> 01:16:36,080
Speaker 1: Sheldon Vocals is because I make a three year deal,

1347
01:16:36,920 --> 01:16:39,400
Speaker 1: which still was quite a lot of money, even though

1348
01:16:39,439 --> 01:16:44,320
Speaker 1: I took a lower salary. So it's Steve is packing

1349
01:16:44,400 --> 01:16:46,559
Speaker 1: up his stuff, you know that. And I said, Steve,

1350
01:16:46,640 --> 01:16:50,439
Speaker 1: you've forgotten something, you know? He said, quick as a flash,

1351
01:16:50,439 --> 01:16:52,439
Speaker 1: he said, oh yeah, why don't you tell them? Okay?

1352
01:16:52,760 --> 01:16:55,400
Speaker 1: I said, yeah, Well, I've been here quite a length

1353
01:16:55,439 --> 01:16:57,599
Speaker 1: of time. I had some big success with you guys.

1354
01:16:58,160 --> 01:17:02,160
Speaker 1: I think a terminal bonus is in order. And Sheldon

1355
01:17:02,320 --> 01:17:06,720
Speaker 1: looks at me incredulously. He's one of my closest friends now,

1356
01:17:06,760 --> 01:17:08,280
Speaker 1: by the way, I mean, I've got on prairie well

1357
01:17:08,320 --> 01:17:11,919
Speaker 1: with him. But he looked at me incredulously. A terminal bonus,

1358
01:17:13,080 --> 01:17:16,200
Speaker 1: I mean, you've got everything you've asked for. What do

1359
01:17:16,240 --> 01:17:19,240
Speaker 1: you want? And I said half a million dollars he's

1360
01:17:19,240 --> 01:17:22,040
Speaker 1: got his legal batty threw it on the floor. I

1361
01:17:22,040 --> 01:17:24,280
Speaker 1: didn't get half a billion dollars, but I did get

1362
01:17:24,320 --> 01:17:28,280
Speaker 1: a terminal bonus and how much was it? But it

1363
01:17:28,360 --> 01:17:30,360
Speaker 1: wasn't half a billion dollars to leave me, but I

1364
01:17:30,400 --> 01:17:34,559
Speaker 1: got something. So I started this record label, and I

1365
01:17:34,640 --> 01:17:38,000
Speaker 1: knew that it was not going to be easy, so

1366
01:17:38,360 --> 01:17:43,479
Speaker 1: I wasn't that active about signing anything. But by then

1367
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:46,800
Speaker 1: all the English bands that I had anything to do

1368
01:17:46,840 --> 01:17:48,519
Speaker 1: with and something that I had nothing to do with,

1369
01:17:48,840 --> 01:17:51,639
Speaker 1: wanted to be with me. So I opened a management

1370
01:17:51,640 --> 01:17:55,400
Speaker 1: company with Jimmy Page Robert Plant, both with their own

1371
01:17:55,479 --> 01:17:58,960
Speaker 1: solo albums, Bad Company, which I was in partnership with

1372
01:17:59,040 --> 01:18:04,640
Speaker 1: Bud breaker Um who was motorhead. Uh. That's how that

1373
01:18:04,680 --> 01:18:07,960
Speaker 1: company started. So I had a big deal going from

1374
01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:10,920
Speaker 1: the beginning. And then of course I've formed the firm

1375
01:18:10,960 --> 01:18:14,880
Speaker 1: between Jimmy and Paul Rodgers. So I had a really

1376
01:18:15,439 --> 01:18:18,680
Speaker 1: very successful few years there. Look, I did it then

1377
01:18:18,880 --> 01:18:22,200
Speaker 1: with that joint venture sort of slieve. After the third year,

1378
01:18:22,320 --> 01:18:25,160
Speaker 1: they didn't want to play anymore. By the way, the

1379
01:18:25,240 --> 01:18:27,599
Speaker 1: office rent that they were playing was to building I

1380
01:18:27,600 --> 01:18:31,360
Speaker 1: owned in London, so it was it was quite a

1381
01:18:31,439 --> 01:18:34,040
Speaker 1: good moment for me. But by then I've become you know,

1382
01:18:34,120 --> 01:18:37,439
Speaker 1: quite the management side. Didn't like the management as opposed

1383
01:18:37,479 --> 01:18:40,760
Speaker 1: to working for the label. You know. Look, we talked

1384
01:18:40,760 --> 01:18:44,040
Speaker 1: about Jerry Greenberg before and what a great guy he was,

1385
01:18:44,280 --> 01:18:48,320
Speaker 1: and I under him. I think I could have been

1386
01:18:48,360 --> 01:18:51,360
Speaker 1: there forever. I really do. We had a great rapport,

1387
01:18:51,960 --> 01:18:55,840
Speaker 1: but he did and he wanted me to move to London. Sorry,

1388
01:18:55,880 --> 01:18:58,000
Speaker 1: a big one. Leavelandon moved to New York to be

1389
01:18:58,479 --> 01:19:04,000
Speaker 1: executive vice president and a insistant to the president. So um,

1390
01:19:04,040 --> 01:19:06,559
Speaker 1: I didn't go, you know, and in retrospect, I think

1391
01:19:06,600 --> 01:19:08,559
Speaker 1: he was sort of knew what he wanted to go

1392
01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:11,559
Speaker 1: and his sort of grooming me to be the next president,

1393
01:19:11,720 --> 01:19:15,760
Speaker 1: which logically I would have been at that point. So

1394
01:19:15,840 --> 01:19:18,160
Speaker 1: I just wonder, you know, where Doug would have gone

1395
01:19:18,200 --> 01:19:20,640
Speaker 1: had I have made that move. I mean, he's been

1396
01:19:20,680 --> 01:19:25,120
Speaker 1: an enormously successful force in our business. But I did

1397
01:19:25,160 --> 01:19:29,080
Speaker 1: give him his first hit single, and perhaps by not

1398
01:19:29,120 --> 01:19:32,040
Speaker 1: going to America, I did him a big favor. Who

1399
01:19:32,080 --> 01:19:35,280
Speaker 1: knows where life could have gone, you know. Okay, so

1400
01:19:35,360 --> 01:19:38,720
Speaker 1: today you're involved with foreigner I am and anything else?

1401
01:19:38,720 --> 01:19:40,920
Speaker 1: Are you just a foreigner? I've been trying to retire

1402
01:19:41,000 --> 01:19:43,400
Speaker 1: seventy five, you know, I'm trying to give it up,

1403
01:19:43,400 --> 01:19:47,320
Speaker 1: but Foreigners was a great love of mine, even back

1404
01:19:47,479 --> 01:19:50,360
Speaker 1: when Jerry Greenberg and John Klodna signed them, back in

1405
01:19:50,400 --> 01:19:54,519
Speaker 1: the early days. I knew Mick as a musician by

1406
01:19:54,520 --> 01:19:57,000
Speaker 1: the way, back in that era I told you about,

1407
01:19:57,439 --> 01:20:00,400
Speaker 1: so I knew who he was, and he she is

1408
01:20:00,439 --> 01:20:03,679
Speaker 1: a great guitar player who came from the same area

1409
01:20:03,760 --> 01:20:09,280
Speaker 1: as Jimmy Page and Eric Clapton and Jeff Beck. Uh.

1410
01:20:09,479 --> 01:20:13,920
Speaker 1: He's just a brilliant player. And that he didn't form

1411
01:20:14,160 --> 01:20:19,479
Speaker 1: one of those English bands because a French singer came

1412
01:20:19,520 --> 01:20:22,720
Speaker 1: over to record, who used to have Jimmy Page, you know,

1413
01:20:23,640 --> 01:20:26,439
Speaker 1: is his guitar player. He was trying to find a

1414
01:20:26,560 --> 01:20:31,160
Speaker 1: guitarist to go back with him to Paris, and eventually

1415
01:20:31,439 --> 01:20:34,200
Speaker 1: Mick Jones went to Paris Is with Johnny. For years,

1416
01:20:34,479 --> 01:20:37,760
Speaker 1: most Americans have not heard of Johnny Halliday just recently died.

1417
01:20:37,840 --> 01:20:41,439
Speaker 1: Yes he did. But he was to France what Elvis

1418
01:20:41,560 --> 01:20:46,439
Speaker 1: was to America. I mean, if Elvis had lived, he

1419
01:20:46,479 --> 01:20:49,760
Speaker 1: would be no bigger in America than Johnny Halliday was

1420
01:20:49,800 --> 01:20:53,839
Speaker 1: in France when he died recently. I mean the government

1421
01:20:53,880 --> 01:20:56,920
Speaker 1: closed down the Chasin Lise to do a procession for

1422
01:20:57,000 --> 01:21:00,720
Speaker 1: Johnny Halliday. I mean, he was enormous. Mick wrote a

1423
01:21:00,800 --> 01:21:04,680
Speaker 1: number of his hits and that was that was just

1424
01:21:05,640 --> 01:21:08,519
Speaker 1: quite a big deal for Mick Jones. Believe me. You know,

1425
01:21:08,640 --> 01:21:12,479
Speaker 1: I started, he started Foreigner. He started Foreigner with the

1426
01:21:13,080 --> 01:21:17,960
Speaker 1: mixed started Foreigner. He came back to England, It's started

1427
01:21:17,960 --> 01:21:21,160
Speaker 1: working with Gary Wright in Wonder Wheel and a couple

1428
01:21:21,200 --> 01:21:23,400
Speaker 1: of other projects. They moved to New York and he

1429
01:21:23,479 --> 01:21:26,800
Speaker 1: had this bundle of songs and he took them to

1430
01:21:26,840 --> 01:21:29,920
Speaker 1: Bud Praeger, who was managing Mountain, which was one of

1431
01:21:29,960 --> 01:21:32,880
Speaker 1: the bands that Mick was in. He said, oh, I've

1432
01:21:32,880 --> 01:21:35,280
Speaker 1: got these songs and Bud Praeger said, well, they're pretty

1433
01:21:35,320 --> 01:21:38,519
Speaker 1: damn good. You know, let's den with them. And I

1434
01:21:38,600 --> 01:21:41,439
Speaker 1: must say that not maybe people know this, but Bud

1435
01:21:41,439 --> 01:21:46,120
Speaker 1: Praeger he invested everything he had in Foreigner, everything including

1436
01:21:46,120 --> 01:21:49,160
Speaker 1: his pension plan, you know. And first of all they

1437
01:21:49,200 --> 01:21:53,360
Speaker 1: were turned down by everybody, everybody including Atlantic. But then

1438
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:58,879
Speaker 1: you know, he persevered with Atlantic and eventually had Jim Delahatton,

1439
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:03,200
Speaker 1: Jerry Greenberg, Jim down up was come down. I don't

1440
01:22:03,240 --> 01:22:05,360
Speaker 1: think Jim Della hadn't liked them at all, but Jerry

1441
01:22:05,680 --> 01:22:08,360
Speaker 1: saw something in them, and the rest is history. The

1442
01:22:08,720 --> 01:22:12,680
Speaker 1: funny thing is I vividly remember hearing that song on

1443
01:22:12,720 --> 01:22:15,000
Speaker 1: the radio the first time, and I literally know people

1444
01:22:15,040 --> 01:22:17,920
Speaker 1: talk about this, but I literally drove to the records. Yes,

1445
01:22:18,240 --> 01:22:19,800
Speaker 1: I just had to be able to play it at

1446
01:22:19,840 --> 01:22:23,400
Speaker 1: it for that. I read what you in you said,

1447
01:22:23,439 --> 01:22:25,600
Speaker 1: you know that was but you're right, a lot of

1448
01:22:25,600 --> 01:22:28,439
Speaker 1: people did that. But there's a funny thing about Foreigner

1449
01:22:28,560 --> 01:22:33,559
Speaker 1: that you know, it's worked two hour advantage in later years.

1450
01:22:33,600 --> 01:22:36,280
Speaker 1: But they were a bit of a faceless band. You know,

1451
01:22:36,720 --> 01:22:40,439
Speaker 1: most people out there couldn't name anyone in Foreigner to

1452
01:22:40,560 --> 01:22:44,879
Speaker 1: this day. So what had happened in two thousand and four?

1453
01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:47,439
Speaker 1: I called mack up out of the blue, you know,

1454
01:22:48,720 --> 01:22:51,360
Speaker 1: I said, what what you're doing? I'm seeing anything that

1455
01:22:51,400 --> 01:22:54,519
Speaker 1: you're doing that. He said, well, you know, I've kind

1456
01:22:54,560 --> 01:22:58,120
Speaker 1: of given up, you know, Mick. Sorry. Lou had this

1457
01:22:58,160 --> 01:23:04,719
Speaker 1: illness which prevented him from delivering Blue gram and and

1458
01:23:04,720 --> 01:23:07,040
Speaker 1: and Mick had his own issues back in those days

1459
01:23:07,080 --> 01:23:12,799
Speaker 1: with alcohol and so forth, and he'd might then become sober,

1460
01:23:12,840 --> 01:23:16,880
Speaker 1: but he was still very nervous about doing anything. But

1461
01:23:17,000 --> 01:23:19,960
Speaker 1: this was all in one phone call. You know. You know, man,

1462
01:23:20,000 --> 01:23:22,840
Speaker 1: those songs that they're just too good to be sitting there.

1463
01:23:23,280 --> 01:23:25,920
Speaker 1: He says, I think, you know, let's get a band together.

1464
01:23:26,680 --> 01:23:29,760
Speaker 1: So on the phone, I can hear him perking his ears.

1465
01:23:30,360 --> 01:23:32,720
Speaker 1: We had a good relationship. He knows he knew what

1466
01:23:32,760 --> 01:23:35,240
Speaker 1: I was capable of. I said, he said, what do

1467
01:23:35,240 --> 01:23:36,920
Speaker 1: you think then? Who will be in it? Well? I

1468
01:23:36,960 --> 01:23:40,360
Speaker 1: was managing Jason Bonham, who have finished since since he

1469
01:23:40,400 --> 01:23:43,559
Speaker 1: was a child. And I said, we'll start We'll have

1470
01:23:43,640 --> 01:23:47,040
Speaker 1: Jason on drums. Well, the funny thing is Jason's was

1471
01:23:47,080 --> 01:23:49,600
Speaker 1: on Jerry Greenberg's label. Yeah, I signed him to it.

1472
01:23:49,640 --> 01:23:53,479
Speaker 1: I never knew that connection. So okay, so okay, we'll

1473
01:23:53,520 --> 01:23:56,680
Speaker 1: start with Jason Bonham. Yes, so I said, And I

1474
01:23:56,800 --> 01:23:58,479
Speaker 1: tell you who else I would like to get in.

1475
01:23:58,800 --> 01:24:01,479
Speaker 1: There's a guy I put into yes years a few

1476
01:24:01,560 --> 01:24:03,960
Speaker 1: years ago. He wrote, owner of a lonely art. His

1477
01:24:04,040 --> 01:24:08,400
Speaker 1: name is Trevor Rabin. He's a formidable musician, but he's

1478
01:24:08,439 --> 01:24:11,760
Speaker 1: really doing started doing soundtracks now. But I think I

1479
01:24:11,800 --> 01:24:15,360
Speaker 1: could get him, so I'll call up Trevor. He's very interested.

1480
01:24:15,680 --> 01:24:19,960
Speaker 1: So we had this mix now feeling feeling it though.

1481
01:24:20,960 --> 01:24:25,280
Speaker 1: We had a meeting at Trevor Raban studio. Jason, Trevor,

1482
01:24:25,400 --> 01:24:28,160
Speaker 1: me and and we're ready to go. We're going to

1483
01:24:28,280 --> 01:24:31,599
Speaker 1: find a singer. Jason said, well, what about my singer

1484
01:24:31,680 --> 01:24:34,880
Speaker 1: Charles West. There was a singer of the Jason bonhom band,

1485
01:24:35,400 --> 01:24:38,320
Speaker 1: so we said, well we try him. Why not? So

1486
01:24:38,360 --> 01:24:40,400
Speaker 1: we start thinking about who else is going to be

1487
01:24:40,439 --> 01:24:43,400
Speaker 1: in the band, and you know, they go. Mick goes

1488
01:24:43,439 --> 01:24:45,800
Speaker 1: back to New York and you know I was living

1489
01:24:45,840 --> 01:24:50,000
Speaker 1: here in those days. So Trevor calls me about four

1490
01:24:50,080 --> 01:24:52,519
Speaker 1: days later, said I can't do this. So what do

1491
01:24:52,560 --> 01:24:56,879
Speaker 1: you mean you're pivotable to what we're doing. Jerry Bruckheim

1492
01:24:56,960 --> 01:25:00,640
Speaker 1: is just offered meet like a seven figure number to

1493
01:25:00,760 --> 01:25:03,720
Speaker 1: do it a soundtrack. I think it might be that

1494
01:25:03,760 --> 01:25:07,439
Speaker 1: one about asteroids or something, so I have to do it.

1495
01:25:07,600 --> 01:25:10,160
Speaker 1: By the way, he's a consummate musician, you know you

1496
01:25:10,240 --> 01:25:14,000
Speaker 1: can you can conduct a ninety piece orchestra with no trouble.

1497
01:25:14,280 --> 01:25:18,880
Speaker 1: And incredible engineer too. He's just that guy. But we

1498
01:25:18,880 --> 01:25:21,479
Speaker 1: weren't going to get him. So that was the end

1499
01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:24,479
Speaker 1: of that. But by now Micky is interested. So you know,

1500
01:25:24,560 --> 01:25:26,880
Speaker 1: I managed to get a gig with a radio station

1501
01:25:26,960 --> 01:25:30,360
Speaker 1: up in Santa Barbara that they're doing a charity event.

1502
01:25:30,720 --> 01:25:32,800
Speaker 1: So let's just take a gig for the hell of it.

1503
01:25:33,320 --> 01:25:36,840
Speaker 1: So we get the old Foreigner sound guy, a guy

1504
01:25:36,840 --> 01:25:40,280
Speaker 1: that would played keyboards for years with Foreigner, Tom Gimble,

1505
01:25:40,320 --> 01:25:43,719
Speaker 1: who's the multi instrumentalist that we we have to this day.

1506
01:25:44,360 --> 01:25:49,800
Speaker 1: And Jason and Oh, Jason called up Jeff Pilson. He

1507
01:25:49,840 --> 01:25:52,519
Speaker 1: had been in that movie rock Star with Jeff Pilson,

1508
01:25:52,680 --> 01:25:55,720
Speaker 1: so we've got Jeff Perlson on base. You know, it

1509
01:25:55,840 --> 01:25:59,680
Speaker 1: was a formidable band actually even without Trevor Rabin, so

1510
01:25:59,760 --> 01:26:02,639
Speaker 1: that he goes down great at this charity event, which

1511
01:26:02,680 --> 01:26:07,160
Speaker 1: is in two thousand and four, and he said, well,

1512
01:26:07,200 --> 01:26:09,040
Speaker 1: you know, let's let's have a go. Then let's try

1513
01:26:09,080 --> 01:26:12,840
Speaker 1: and do this, so we did. Unfortunately, Charles West didn't

1514
01:26:12,880 --> 01:26:16,240
Speaker 1: make it because he was so enthusiastic during rehearsals he

1515
01:26:16,240 --> 01:26:18,680
Speaker 1: had completely blown his voice out by the time we

1516
01:26:18,720 --> 01:26:20,720
Speaker 1: did the show. So we knew we had to get

1517
01:26:20,760 --> 01:26:25,800
Speaker 1: somebody else, so we looked around. We audition everybody. I mean,

1518
01:26:26,320 --> 01:26:29,400
Speaker 1: Jimmy Barnes from Australia, who is by the way, I

1519
01:26:29,439 --> 01:26:31,200
Speaker 1: tried to get a band together with him in Jimmy

1520
01:26:31,240 --> 01:26:35,240
Speaker 1: Page years ago, but Jimmy Barnes blew that one. But

1521
01:26:35,400 --> 01:26:38,800
Speaker 1: I still think he's one of the greatest rock singers ever.

1522
01:26:39,320 --> 01:26:42,479
Speaker 1: Remember Cold Chisel. Of course I saw them opening. No,

1523
01:26:42,640 --> 01:26:45,000
Speaker 1: I saw Angel opening. I don't know if I saw

1524
01:26:45,000 --> 01:26:48,440
Speaker 1: a Cold Chisel whatever. There were some great bands in Australia.

1525
01:26:48,560 --> 01:26:51,080
Speaker 1: Well they worked. The thing about the Australian bands, whether

1526
01:26:51,120 --> 01:26:54,360
Speaker 1: they said live, they had a totally down I remember

1527
01:26:54,439 --> 01:26:59,439
Speaker 1: seeing in Excess at the Whiskey was just astounding. Yeah, okay,

1528
01:26:59,479 --> 01:27:02,960
Speaker 1: so it doesn't come together. You're looking for a lead singer,

1529
01:27:03,200 --> 01:27:06,880
Speaker 1: yep uh. And we were going to go out with

1530
01:27:07,000 --> 01:27:10,200
Speaker 1: Charles West again because we couldn't find any we honestly,

1531
01:27:10,360 --> 01:27:15,120
Speaker 1: we auditioned so many people by tape, some pretty name artists.

1532
01:27:16,120 --> 01:27:21,240
Speaker 1: Jodan Turner was one. You know, nobody was really getting it.

1533
01:27:21,320 --> 01:27:24,040
Speaker 1: So at least Charles West was a credible front girl.

1534
01:27:24,920 --> 01:27:28,000
Speaker 1: So we said, okay, it authorized me to get a

1535
01:27:28,000 --> 01:27:31,280
Speaker 1: few shows. I was begging to get twenty tho dollar shows.

1536
01:27:31,680 --> 01:27:34,400
Speaker 1: And it was that difficult because the last tour was

1537
01:27:34,720 --> 01:27:37,960
Speaker 1: terrible with Loue not being able to cut it properly.

1538
01:27:38,520 --> 01:27:42,759
Speaker 1: So but I get a string of dates together and

1539
01:27:42,800 --> 01:27:45,880
Speaker 1: we're getting ready to rehearse, and then Tom Gimbal brings

1540
01:27:45,880 --> 01:27:49,400
Speaker 1: in this tape of this kid Kelly Hansen and we

1541
01:27:49,880 --> 01:27:52,440
Speaker 1: one listened to the tape. He had had a karaoke

1542
01:27:52,840 --> 01:27:56,200
Speaker 1: mix and he's singing that foreigners. So with about five

1543
01:27:56,320 --> 01:27:59,479
Speaker 1: days to go before the first show, we gave Charles

1544
01:27:59,520 --> 01:28:03,000
Speaker 1: West the news and Kelly Hansen took over and changed everything.

1545
01:28:03,360 --> 01:28:06,400
Speaker 1: He's a fabulous front man. Have you seen the band?

1546
01:28:06,600 --> 01:28:08,320
Speaker 1: I haven't seen it with Kelly, but you know what

1547
01:28:08,400 --> 01:28:11,639
Speaker 1: about the videos. You're making some kind of documentary with

1548
01:28:11,760 --> 01:28:15,200
Speaker 1: Lou and they were shot like a Nassau Coli CM

1549
01:28:15,280 --> 01:28:19,200
Speaker 1: or somewhere Jones Beach their online probably three years ago.

1550
01:28:20,400 --> 01:28:24,679
Speaker 1: Uh no, not with The last thing we've we've done

1551
01:28:24,720 --> 01:28:27,240
Speaker 1: with Lou was and the rest of the old band

1552
01:28:27,760 --> 01:28:30,640
Speaker 1: was a series of shows called double Vision where we

1553
01:28:30,760 --> 01:28:34,960
Speaker 1: have the current band plays a whole set and then

1554
01:28:35,520 --> 01:28:39,200
Speaker 1: uh there's a short interval and then the original band

1555
01:28:39,240 --> 01:28:43,840
Speaker 1: comes out. We met Lou, Dennis Elliott, Rick Wells, Al

1556
01:28:43,920 --> 01:28:48,080
Speaker 1: Greenwood and Ian McDonald and they play about five five

1557
01:28:48,120 --> 01:28:50,680
Speaker 1: songs and then we all get together at the end

1558
01:28:50,720 --> 01:28:53,120
Speaker 1: and do I want to know what that wasn't hot blooded?

1559
01:28:53,240 --> 01:28:55,240
Speaker 1: The roof comes off the place to be Franks, Okay,

1560
01:28:55,240 --> 01:28:57,920
Speaker 1: I got a question. Suddenly, I can't remember the name

1561
01:28:58,000 --> 01:29:02,080
Speaker 1: of the movie. I love this movie and it begins

1562
01:29:02,080 --> 01:29:03,680
Speaker 1: with an s or something in any event, it's an

1563
01:29:03,680 --> 01:29:07,320
Speaker 1: English movie about getting a band back together, and the

1564
01:29:07,479 --> 01:29:11,760
Speaker 1: final song is the flame Still burn. Mick wrote that

1565
01:29:13,320 --> 01:29:16,599
Speaker 1: what the hell is it? The group is called Strange

1566
01:29:16,640 --> 01:29:21,040
Speaker 1: fruit Um the name of the movie. I keep forgetting

1567
01:29:21,080 --> 01:29:23,840
Speaker 1: the next. It's a damn good movie. So I love that.

1568
01:29:23,880 --> 01:29:26,000
Speaker 1: But one of the great rockmis how did that song

1569
01:29:26,040 --> 01:29:29,080
Speaker 1: get in the movie? The director new Mick and called

1570
01:29:29,120 --> 01:29:31,120
Speaker 1: him out and said he look, I need the songs

1571
01:29:31,160 --> 01:29:34,799
Speaker 1: I aren't making. I need, you know, a couple of songs,

1572
01:29:35,360 --> 01:29:39,240
Speaker 1: and he wrote seven songs in a week, one of

1573
01:29:39,240 --> 01:29:42,679
Speaker 1: which they were use in the movie Flame Still, which

1574
01:29:42,800 --> 01:29:45,320
Speaker 1: was I think is even better than I Want to

1575
01:29:45,320 --> 01:29:48,120
Speaker 1: Know What Love? Well, we've recorded it again. I've listened

1576
01:29:48,120 --> 01:29:51,240
Speaker 1: to that version. Okay. So with this late day, you're

1577
01:29:51,280 --> 01:29:54,400
Speaker 1: involved with Foreigner and you're trying to get out of

1578
01:29:54,400 --> 01:29:58,200
Speaker 1: the business. Yeah, and I've still got Twisted Sister, of course,

1579
01:29:58,200 --> 01:30:01,799
Speaker 1: and Dee Snyder, so twist Twisted Sister. People don't realize

1580
01:30:02,040 --> 01:30:05,120
Speaker 1: to this day a massive in you, I thought, because

1581
01:30:05,160 --> 01:30:08,000
Speaker 1: I hear from J. J. French all the time, I'm

1582
01:30:08,120 --> 01:30:11,840
Speaker 1: very sure you do. And he said that they did

1583
01:30:11,880 --> 01:30:15,360
Speaker 1: a final tour and he sold his guitars, but then

1584
01:30:15,400 --> 01:30:17,519
Speaker 1: he talked about possibly doing it or is this just

1585
01:30:17,720 --> 01:30:21,120
Speaker 1: D calling a Twisted Sister. No, they went out as

1586
01:30:21,160 --> 01:30:25,240
Speaker 1: Twisted Sister from We put the band back together when

1587
01:30:25,280 --> 01:30:27,599
Speaker 1: I was at a movie company for a while at

1588
01:30:27,600 --> 01:30:30,439
Speaker 1: the shooting gallery and they we did a horror movie

1589
01:30:30,800 --> 01:30:33,759
Speaker 1: with D. That's how I got into the movie business.

1590
01:30:33,960 --> 01:30:36,600
Speaker 1: He called me up and said, look, we need to

1591
01:30:37,040 --> 01:30:38,599
Speaker 1: You've got to come and work at this record only

1592
01:30:38,680 --> 01:30:40,720
Speaker 1: I need you to help me get the soundtrack to go.

1593
01:30:41,120 --> 01:30:44,080
Speaker 1: And we did the most amazing sound tract to Strange Land.

1594
01:30:44,120 --> 01:30:47,719
Speaker 1: It was a Billboard hit was Kid Rocks. First record

1595
01:30:47,760 --> 01:30:52,120
Speaker 1: was on the Snyder's soundtrack and eminem was on it. Uh,

1596
01:30:52,600 --> 01:30:55,000
Speaker 1: we had everybody on this damn record as a big

1597
01:30:55,080 --> 01:30:58,280
Speaker 1: hit soundtrack. Not such a big hit movie, but for

1598
01:30:58,320 --> 01:31:01,200
Speaker 1: a cult movie that costs the little it did okay,

1599
01:31:01,320 --> 01:31:05,000
Speaker 1: you know, And after the movie came up, we decided

1600
01:31:05,040 --> 01:31:08,000
Speaker 1: we're try and cut a Twisted Sister song to go

1601
01:31:08,040 --> 01:31:11,840
Speaker 1: on the soundtrack, which we did and that was pretty good,

1602
01:31:12,160 --> 01:31:14,600
Speaker 1: so we decided to give it a go again. This

1603
01:31:14,760 --> 01:31:18,320
Speaker 1: must have been two thousands something like that, and the

1604
01:31:18,360 --> 01:31:21,080
Speaker 1: first thing we did was we got an offer from

1605
01:31:22,400 --> 01:31:25,639
Speaker 1: what's what's that organization that brings entertainment to the troops

1606
01:31:26,680 --> 01:31:31,000
Speaker 1: us USO to go to Korea. So we did. We

1607
01:31:31,040 --> 01:31:33,120
Speaker 1: went to Career, did a thing for the troops, and

1608
01:31:33,160 --> 01:31:35,479
Speaker 1: by then everybody wants to give it a go again,

1609
01:31:35,560 --> 01:31:38,120
Speaker 1: and we took it up to a pretty good level.

1610
01:31:38,160 --> 01:31:43,879
Speaker 1: We were headlining with Aussie and Metallica in a series

1611
01:31:43,920 --> 01:31:49,040
Speaker 1: of events in Europe and the last time Foreigner did

1612
01:31:49,080 --> 01:31:51,560
Speaker 1: bang your Head, which is no, not bang your head.

1613
01:31:52,120 --> 01:31:55,479
Speaker 1: What's the big one in it's two really big ones

1614
01:31:55,600 --> 01:32:00,679
Speaker 1: to our foreigner about Twisted Sister, big German rock Fest rep.

1615
01:32:01,960 --> 01:32:05,160
Speaker 1: That's that's a I know where you're thinking, but that

1616
01:32:05,280 --> 01:32:09,160
Speaker 1: is the sort of red light area in Hamburg. I know.

1617
01:32:10,160 --> 01:32:14,000
Speaker 1: Now I'm getting to know your green That's a racing track,

1618
01:32:14,120 --> 01:32:16,240
Speaker 1: that is that's a big one. Rock am Ring is

1619
01:32:16,479 --> 01:32:22,439
Speaker 1: a big one. God whackens a massive hundred thousand people sharp.

1620
01:32:23,000 --> 01:32:25,479
Speaker 1: So about three years ago, which was the last time

1621
01:32:25,520 --> 01:32:30,519
Speaker 1: Twister Saister did play Wagon, they headlined and Far and

1622
01:32:30,600 --> 01:32:34,799
Speaker 1: all one of the support bands, and wondered what universit

1623
01:32:34,800 --> 01:32:38,960
Speaker 1: he was in when he was there. Actually we were

1624
01:32:38,960 --> 01:32:43,400
Speaker 1: making a little documentary and so I'm asking Mick questions,

1625
01:32:44,160 --> 01:32:47,840
Speaker 1: and I remember, if I started, He's sitting there knowing

1626
01:32:47,960 --> 01:32:50,280
Speaker 1: he had just done a set, knowing that Twist his

1627
01:32:50,360 --> 01:32:53,880
Speaker 1: sister are headlining. Okay, so that's my first question to

1628
01:32:54,000 --> 01:33:00,679
Speaker 1: Mick Jones was how did Twist his sister change your life? No,

1629
01:33:01,120 --> 01:33:04,439
Speaker 1: we can't continue stories for hours. Phil, You've been fantastic. Literally,

1630
01:33:04,479 --> 01:33:06,160
Speaker 1: I just had to cut you off because we can't

1631
01:33:06,160 --> 01:33:08,559
Speaker 1: go on for four hours. But your stories and your

1632
01:33:08,640 --> 01:33:11,679
Speaker 1: career obviously is unbelievable. You were there when it all happened.

1633
01:33:12,000 --> 01:33:13,600
Speaker 1: You were not only a fly on the wall, you

1634
01:33:13,640 --> 01:33:16,960
Speaker 1: were a participant there. Anything specifically we didn't cover that

1635
01:33:17,000 --> 01:33:20,080
Speaker 1: you need to cover just a little period I had

1636
01:33:20,080 --> 01:33:21,960
Speaker 1: in the movie business, but I had a lot of

1637
01:33:22,000 --> 01:33:26,160
Speaker 1: fun with I made a documentary about Sun Records. I

1638
01:33:26,200 --> 01:33:29,439
Speaker 1: saw that was one on PBS. That was great. American Masters,

1639
01:33:29,479 --> 01:33:32,280
Speaker 1: thank you, and we did. The soundtrack was pretty down

1640
01:33:32,280 --> 01:33:36,000
Speaker 1: good too. I got everybody Paul once I had Paul McCartney.

1641
01:33:36,479 --> 01:33:39,479
Speaker 1: I then called Bob Dylan, Paul McCartney and Bob Dylan,

1642
01:33:39,520 --> 01:33:42,080
Speaker 1: and I called Tom Petty So and Jimmy Page and

1643
01:33:42,160 --> 01:33:45,000
Speaker 1: Robert Plant played on it. It was a marvelous soundtrack,

1644
01:33:45,439 --> 01:33:48,120
Speaker 1: so PBS wanted to do another one, so I did.

1645
01:33:48,200 --> 01:33:51,400
Speaker 1: The house that I met built the story of Atlantic,

1646
01:33:51,800 --> 01:33:54,920
Speaker 1: which was pretty good movie too, So I was quite

1647
01:33:54,960 --> 01:33:58,719
Speaker 1: proud of that departure from music into the movie business.

1648
01:33:58,760 --> 01:34:01,839
Speaker 1: I learned a lot. This little company, the Shooting Gallery

1649
01:34:02,200 --> 01:34:05,120
Speaker 1: had already had a big hit when I joined. They

1650
01:34:05,120 --> 01:34:08,760
Speaker 1: made they made sleem Blade and they specialized in low

1651
01:34:08,800 --> 01:34:13,160
Speaker 1: budget art films. And I think I put the average

1652
01:34:13,160 --> 01:34:16,000
Speaker 1: age up by about ten years when I joined these people.

1653
01:34:16,400 --> 01:34:19,280
Speaker 1: But we had a bit of a run, but they

1654
01:34:19,360 --> 01:34:21,680
Speaker 1: got carried away with it, and that's you know the

1655
01:34:21,720 --> 01:34:25,360
Speaker 1: problem with movie business without a catalog. Karlcoe was the

1656
01:34:25,360 --> 01:34:28,719
Speaker 1: most successful independent movie company of all time. They went bank.

1657
01:34:29,320 --> 01:34:31,960
Speaker 1: It's like now there's st X today. They finally had

1658
01:34:31,960 --> 01:34:34,839
Speaker 1: it hit. The thing I hate about the movie business

1659
01:34:34,880 --> 01:34:39,200
Speaker 1: is everybody has a fucking opinion, okay, whereas the music. Well,

1660
01:34:39,240 --> 01:34:42,200
Speaker 1: now that executives think they're bigger, but reality it comes

1661
01:34:42,240 --> 01:34:45,719
Speaker 1: down to the music, and you know, and it's something

1662
01:34:45,760 --> 01:34:48,639
Speaker 1: you feel or don't. Actually, it's an interesting thing there

1663
01:34:48,680 --> 01:34:52,920
Speaker 1: that I always felt that nobody could catch up with

1664
01:34:53,000 --> 01:34:56,640
Speaker 1: people like Jerry Greenberg and me because we had the

1665
01:34:56,680 --> 01:35:00,719
Speaker 1: greatest possible training that you could ever have from Jerry Wexler,

1666
01:35:01,000 --> 01:35:04,040
Speaker 1: Ahmed ed agin Un that's where Edigan and I remember,

1667
01:35:04,640 --> 01:35:08,200
Speaker 1: and Tom Dowd engineer I remember. I think it was

1668
01:35:08,200 --> 01:35:11,040
Speaker 1: either Tom Dowd or Jerry said to me one day

1669
01:35:11,160 --> 01:35:14,040
Speaker 1: when I got the job and I'm in London, he said, look,

1670
01:35:14,200 --> 01:35:17,160
Speaker 1: if you're going to sign a band, make sure there's

1671
01:35:17,320 --> 01:35:22,160
Speaker 1: at least one virtuoso in the band you're signing, because

1672
01:35:22,320 --> 01:35:26,479
Speaker 1: virtuoso musicians don't play with good musicians. They only play

1673
01:35:26,520 --> 01:35:29,800
Speaker 1: with great musicians. And if you think about it, there's

1674
01:35:29,840 --> 01:35:33,719
Speaker 1: four virtuosos and led Zeppelin right, there's two or three

1675
01:35:33,760 --> 01:35:37,040
Speaker 1: in Yes, you know this is why, as you so

1676
01:35:37,240 --> 01:35:40,920
Speaker 1: rightly put it, it's the music that counts. And that

1677
01:35:41,240 --> 01:35:45,519
Speaker 1: training from those three guys always kept that in my

1678
01:35:45,600 --> 01:35:49,800
Speaker 1: head about I have to remember something Doug Morris said

1679
01:35:49,840 --> 01:35:54,680
Speaker 1: to me on that fateful day. He said, what about this?

1680
01:35:54,760 --> 01:35:57,519
Speaker 1: Because I used to do little talks to our people

1681
01:35:57,560 --> 01:36:00,800
Speaker 1: from time to time, and I'd always quote this virtuoso

1682
01:36:00,960 --> 01:36:05,679
Speaker 1: musicians scenario. What about that that thing you pontificate about

1683
01:36:05,680 --> 01:36:08,200
Speaker 1: when you're talking to people about how you've got to

1684
01:36:08,240 --> 01:36:12,200
Speaker 1: have a virtuoso musician. Who the fuck is the virtuoso

1685
01:36:12,360 --> 01:36:15,880
Speaker 1: musician and twisted sister. I said, d Snyder. He said,

1686
01:36:15,920 --> 01:36:18,680
Speaker 1: what do you mean? I said, he has virtuoso charisma.

1687
01:36:18,920 --> 01:36:23,479
Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely, you know this. But you know that you

1688
01:36:23,479 --> 01:36:25,880
Speaker 1: you bring up a lot of things. One do you

1689
01:36:25,920 --> 01:36:28,160
Speaker 1: have to see the band live in order to be

1690
01:36:28,200 --> 01:36:30,599
Speaker 1: convinced or conn b and make it not be greet

1691
01:36:30,640 --> 01:36:34,720
Speaker 1: live a band. Bands have made it a great live

1692
01:36:34,800 --> 01:36:36,760
Speaker 1: of course, but you know, for me, I had to

1693
01:36:36,800 --> 01:36:39,519
Speaker 1: see a band live. And that's another thing that arm

1694
01:36:39,600 --> 01:36:41,960
Speaker 1: It taught me, you know, is that you have to

1695
01:36:42,000 --> 01:36:46,120
Speaker 1: go and see your bands play, even after you signed them,

1696
01:36:46,160 --> 01:36:50,480
Speaker 1: because that's when you see your band meet their audience

1697
01:36:51,040 --> 01:36:53,679
Speaker 1: and that will teach you how to promote and market

1698
01:36:53,720 --> 01:36:57,479
Speaker 1: that band. Arm It was, and we could we should

1699
01:36:57,520 --> 01:36:59,880
Speaker 1: do another program about armor It, because you know he

1700
01:37:00,120 --> 01:37:04,320
Speaker 1: was my mentor and my friend for many years. I

1701
01:37:04,360 --> 01:37:08,200
Speaker 1: did produce Cold co produced rather the final led Zeppelin

1702
01:37:08,240 --> 01:37:12,320
Speaker 1: concert with which we did from Arment and I just

1703
01:37:12,400 --> 01:37:14,880
Speaker 1: know all my dealings with arm but we're not Legion.

1704
01:37:14,920 --> 01:37:18,040
Speaker 1: But I remember I wrote about the song Black Velvet

1705
01:37:18,520 --> 01:37:20,639
Speaker 1: and I was saying, how you know it wasn't going

1706
01:37:20,640 --> 01:37:24,080
Speaker 1: to Ley Goes. That track is a number one record,

1707
01:37:24,360 --> 01:37:27,479
Speaker 1: which like you know, like six weeks later starting to

1708
01:37:27,479 --> 01:37:30,640
Speaker 1: get traction. Yeah, and it went. Man, they knew this.

1709
01:37:30,800 --> 01:37:34,000
Speaker 1: I mean I remember, way after I left Atlantic, and

1710
01:37:34,280 --> 01:37:37,720
Speaker 1: you know, way after my Strange Land soundtrack had come

1711
01:37:37,760 --> 01:37:39,680
Speaker 1: out with kid Rock on it. He said, I want

1712
01:37:39,680 --> 01:37:42,160
Speaker 1: to go and see this guy kid Rock at the

1713
01:37:42,360 --> 01:37:45,559
Speaker 1: Planet of Roxy and we we we went along and

1714
01:37:45,600 --> 01:37:48,479
Speaker 1: we were sitting there. Kid Rock comes out and nothing

1715
01:37:48,520 --> 01:37:51,680
Speaker 1: had happened yet for kid Rock. Actually, he turns to me,

1716
01:37:51,680 --> 01:37:55,719
Speaker 1: he said, this guy is big as Elvis, and nothing

1717
01:37:55,760 --> 01:37:58,519
Speaker 1: had happened, right, And he was pretty well right. He

1718
01:37:59,479 --> 01:38:02,759
Speaker 1: erupted unbelievably in Kid Rocks. One of the few people.

1719
01:38:03,520 --> 01:38:05,880
Speaker 1: He's made a lot of money, owns his own plane,

1720
01:38:06,040 --> 01:38:07,800
Speaker 1: and he still can work. I mean, I hear from

1721
01:38:07,880 --> 01:38:11,120
Speaker 1: him all the times. He's an interesting character because his

1722
01:38:11,320 --> 01:38:13,360
Speaker 1: image is low class, but he grew up in an

1723
01:38:13,400 --> 01:38:20,679
Speaker 1: upper middle class exactly. But the other thing I think

1724
01:38:20,720 --> 01:38:23,200
Speaker 1: that you were with this is what people don't understand

1725
01:38:23,240 --> 01:38:27,719
Speaker 1: about the music business today. It's mature. You were there, okay,

1726
01:38:27,720 --> 01:38:31,200
Speaker 1: before the Beatles, which showed how much money and what

1727
01:38:31,320 --> 01:38:35,000
Speaker 1: reach you could have, when there was still independent distribution,

1728
01:38:35,240 --> 01:38:39,360
Speaker 1: when these people still own the label. Now nobody in

1729
01:38:39,400 --> 01:38:41,479
Speaker 1: the music business has their own money in the game.

1730
01:38:41,840 --> 01:38:44,280
Speaker 1: When you have your own money in the game. I

1731
01:38:44,320 --> 01:38:47,120
Speaker 1: have a I have a promoter friend who promotes UH

1732
01:38:47,400 --> 01:38:50,439
Speaker 1: clubs in Boston. He says, you've never really been a

1733
01:38:50,439 --> 01:38:52,640
Speaker 1: promoter until you've gone to the A T. M. At

1734
01:38:52,640 --> 01:38:55,040
Speaker 1: two in the morning to withdraw money to pay the band.

1735
01:38:55,920 --> 01:38:59,479
Speaker 1: It's just really so I you know, been there. I

1736
01:38:59,479 --> 01:39:01,040
Speaker 1: mean one of the things on luxury I have. As

1737
01:39:01,120 --> 01:39:03,679
Speaker 1: you know, I was conscious when the Beatles hit. It's

1738
01:39:03,720 --> 01:39:07,280
Speaker 1: like I'm watching some of the Woodstock documentaries and they're

1739
01:39:07,320 --> 01:39:10,960
Speaker 1: talking about Vietnam War. People have no idea what it

1740
01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:13,160
Speaker 1: was like to get your draft. Be freaked out. You're

1741
01:39:13,160 --> 01:39:15,400
Speaker 1: gonna have to go to this we get your ash.

1742
01:39:15,760 --> 01:39:19,280
Speaker 1: It was really crazy. Yeah, I imagine they ovously. That

1743
01:39:19,400 --> 01:39:22,280
Speaker 1: was when Zepplin were breaking at the time of it

1744
01:39:23,040 --> 01:39:25,519
Speaker 1: was raging. You know, that was an awful moment in

1745
01:39:25,560 --> 01:39:29,120
Speaker 1: American history. You know for sure. I saw a Zeppelin

1746
01:39:29,200 --> 01:39:30,840
Speaker 1: a couple of times. First time I saw him with

1747
01:39:30,840 --> 01:39:34,840
Speaker 1: in Haven Uh Collins Yale Bowl, and they were not good.

1748
01:39:34,920 --> 01:39:37,479
Speaker 1: This is just after the third album came out, and

1749
01:39:37,520 --> 01:39:40,200
Speaker 1: you may or may not remember, in seventy five they

1750
01:39:40,280 --> 01:39:46,160
Speaker 1: canceled the tour because of so they were gonna play

1751
01:39:46,160 --> 01:39:48,240
Speaker 1: the Rolls Bowl and they didn't, But they came back

1752
01:39:48,280 --> 01:39:50,559
Speaker 1: in seventies seven and played the Forum for a week.

1753
01:39:51,280 --> 01:39:54,360
Speaker 1: They were unbelievable. They played all of the mean, my

1754
01:39:54,400 --> 01:39:56,920
Speaker 1: favorite led Zeppelin song, it was ten years gone, they

1755
01:39:56,960 --> 01:40:00,160
Speaker 1: played that, I mean really amazing. Yeah, that was I

1756
01:40:00,240 --> 01:40:03,719
Speaker 1: was there for that. Yeah, it was quite I also believe,

1757
01:40:04,200 --> 01:40:06,200
Speaker 1: you know, Robert says he doesn't want to do it.

1758
01:40:07,000 --> 01:40:09,080
Speaker 1: I guess I have a little bit of a bad

1759
01:40:09,120 --> 01:40:13,400
Speaker 1: reaction when these bands get back together solely for the money.

1760
01:40:13,439 --> 01:40:15,519
Speaker 1: It's just, you know, all they I want to have

1761
01:40:15,600 --> 01:40:18,920
Speaker 1: my kids know we were there, we saw your kids.

1762
01:40:18,960 --> 01:40:25,280
Speaker 1: Don't get to seal. I mean, I rub it. He

1763
01:40:25,320 --> 01:40:29,719
Speaker 1: has carved himself an entirely new path. Absolutely, and when

1764
01:40:29,760 --> 01:40:35,160
Speaker 1: we did the event the O two, I mean he

1765
01:40:35,240 --> 01:40:37,920
Speaker 1: had got himself up there. I mean, have you seen

1766
01:40:37,920 --> 01:40:40,320
Speaker 1: any of the film of it? I mean, of course

1767
01:40:40,439 --> 01:40:45,160
Speaker 1: was there foreigner supported that show. He was just astonishing.

1768
01:40:45,200 --> 01:40:49,120
Speaker 1: I mean that that they were absolutely on it. Jason

1769
01:40:49,160 --> 01:40:54,200
Speaker 1: Bonham set them on fire because he knew every nuance

1770
01:40:54,320 --> 01:40:57,200
Speaker 1: that his father played and some he put in himself.

1771
01:40:57,479 --> 01:41:01,200
Speaker 1: He knew every variation of every the song that led

1772
01:41:01,280 --> 01:41:04,920
Speaker 1: Zeppelin had ever played, and he was the driving force

1773
01:41:05,800 --> 01:41:10,560
Speaker 1: that night. Jimmy was playing great, Robert was phenomenal, and

1774
01:41:10,600 --> 01:41:13,679
Speaker 1: John Paul Jans was Joon Paul Jans, who is a genius,

1775
01:41:14,200 --> 01:41:18,800
Speaker 1: and that that night was just magic, absolute magic. So

1776
01:41:19,080 --> 01:41:21,240
Speaker 1: just taking it leads up one for a minute, what's

1777
01:41:21,280 --> 01:41:24,840
Speaker 1: your favorite leads up one album? I liked the second album.

1778
01:41:24,920 --> 01:41:27,600
Speaker 1: That's really I Love Since I've been Loving You is

1779
01:41:27,600 --> 01:41:30,120
Speaker 1: one of the greatest songs of all time for me

1780
01:41:30,479 --> 01:41:32,519
Speaker 1: for a long time. It was the first album for

1781
01:41:32,640 --> 01:41:34,479
Speaker 1: me in certainly days and confused. But you have to

1782
01:41:34,520 --> 01:41:37,200
Speaker 1: understand when the second album came out in America, the

1783
01:41:37,439 --> 01:41:40,280
Speaker 1: single had come out like a week or two before

1784
01:41:40,720 --> 01:41:43,519
Speaker 1: instant hit a whole lot of long I bought that

1785
01:41:43,560 --> 01:41:44,920
Speaker 1: album the day it came out and went to the

1786
01:41:45,040 --> 01:41:47,280
Speaker 1: j a core of that. I played it that and

1787
01:41:47,320 --> 01:41:52,040
Speaker 1: only that for a week straight, and then suddenly everybody

1788
01:41:52,040 --> 01:41:54,439
Speaker 1: bought it and it was all you heard. I could

1789
01:41:54,439 --> 01:41:57,360
Speaker 1: not listen to that album for years, and then when

1790
01:41:57,400 --> 01:41:59,400
Speaker 1: you got back to it, you know, it's it's a

1791
01:41:59,400 --> 01:42:03,080
Speaker 1: great record. But for a minute there was overplayed, but

1792
01:42:03,240 --> 01:42:06,360
Speaker 1: certainly of the first album in physical graffiti for me, Yeah,

1793
01:42:06,760 --> 01:42:11,920
Speaker 1: both but how come Jimmy could never like Robert could

1794
01:42:11,920 --> 01:42:17,360
Speaker 1: never find his own thing. I managed Jimmy for a period,

1795
01:42:17,400 --> 01:42:21,240
Speaker 1: and of course we had the firm manner was managing U.

1796
01:42:21,840 --> 01:42:24,360
Speaker 1: The promblem with the firm was that neither Jimmy nor

1797
01:42:24,439 --> 01:42:27,400
Speaker 1: Paul Rodgers wanted to do the songs for which they

1798
01:42:27,400 --> 01:42:33,720
Speaker 1: were famous. Even so we bed two pretty big too radioactive. Yeah, yeah,

1799
01:42:34,320 --> 01:42:37,080
Speaker 1: some good songs on it. But if only they'd just

1800
01:42:37,240 --> 01:42:40,960
Speaker 1: done a couple of bad company songs and a couple

1801
01:42:41,040 --> 01:42:44,760
Speaker 1: of free or a free song and you know, a

1802
01:42:44,880 --> 01:42:48,600
Speaker 1: yard Birds song and have bled Zeppelin song that I

1803
01:42:48,640 --> 01:42:52,479
Speaker 1: could have been retired many years well, Robert play did.

1804
01:42:52,520 --> 01:42:54,400
Speaker 1: I was a big fan of the album with twenty

1805
01:42:54,479 --> 01:42:56,720
Speaker 1: nine palms, et cetera. But when I went to see

1806
01:42:56,760 --> 01:42:58,880
Speaker 1: him on that door, he would play some Zepplin stuff.

1807
01:42:58,960 --> 01:43:01,640
Speaker 1: Oh he does now. I mean, I managed Robert for

1808
01:43:01,680 --> 01:43:06,519
Speaker 1: a while and we're party company over that, because you know,

1809
01:43:06,560 --> 01:43:10,640
Speaker 1: I remember having a conversation with him outdoors in a

1810
01:43:10,720 --> 01:43:16,200
Speaker 1: restaurant with his band. At one table Robert and me

1811
01:43:16,400 --> 01:43:19,519
Speaker 1: and our respective girlfriends. At another table between us was

1812
01:43:19,600 --> 01:43:24,640
Speaker 1: Nil Rogers and his girlfriend. But with this conversation is

1813
01:43:24,720 --> 01:43:27,639
Speaker 1: becoming heated, so his band, who are listening to everything

1814
01:43:27,720 --> 01:43:31,360
Speaker 1: I'm saying. I'm saying, man, you just do a couple

1815
01:43:31,400 --> 01:43:34,519
Speaker 1: of Zeppelin songs for God's sake, and the band will

1816
01:43:34,600 --> 01:43:37,679
Speaker 1: never do We'll never do Let's I mean fucking band

1817
01:43:38,000 --> 01:43:40,200
Speaker 1: right right? They could be replaced at a minute a minute,

1818
01:43:40,479 --> 01:43:43,680
Speaker 1: We'll never do led Zeppelin's And of course Rom and

1819
01:43:43,720 --> 01:43:46,800
Speaker 1: I parted company over that at that time. And of

1820
01:43:46,840 --> 01:43:49,080
Speaker 1: course then he gets hold of Bill kurbish Ly who

1821
01:43:49,400 --> 01:43:53,040
Speaker 1: talks him into doing led Zeppelin songs and the rest

1822
01:43:53,160 --> 01:43:56,200
Speaker 1: is history, right, and are very good friends. By the way,

1823
01:43:56,320 --> 01:43:59,040
Speaker 1: In fact you mentioned twenty nine Palms. He wrote that

1824
01:43:59,120 --> 01:44:00,439
Speaker 1: so when he was coming to is it me in

1825
01:44:00,479 --> 01:44:03,880
Speaker 1: Palm Springs where I have a house, and you know

1826
01:44:03,920 --> 01:44:07,320
Speaker 1: he was with the Atlanta Miles and that line I

1827
01:44:07,400 --> 01:44:10,240
Speaker 1: hear your voice on the radio is about a Lanta Miles,

1828
01:44:10,680 --> 01:44:13,080
Speaker 1: just a little bit of Okay, how many times you've

1829
01:44:13,080 --> 01:44:17,840
Speaker 1: been married? Who's counting three? Three? And are you married

1830
01:44:17,960 --> 01:44:20,680
Speaker 1: right now? I certainly am yeah? How long? How long

1831
01:44:20,760 --> 01:44:25,360
Speaker 1: is this marriage? Lasted? Twenty years? And you have any children?

1832
01:44:25,520 --> 01:44:28,920
Speaker 1: I have to. I have my daughter Jody, who is

1833
01:44:29,040 --> 01:44:32,799
Speaker 1: in our business. She has invented a way of selling

1834
01:44:32,840 --> 01:44:37,400
Speaker 1: CDs at gigs were by using a charity thing, and

1835
01:44:37,439 --> 01:44:40,679
Speaker 1: there was a line in Billboard recently from the head

1836
01:44:40,760 --> 01:44:45,280
Speaker 1: marketing guide Atlantic says, Jody Carson is singlehandedly saving the

1837
01:44:45,280 --> 01:44:48,800
Speaker 1: physical juice market. I mean she's she's her clients of

1838
01:44:48,840 --> 01:44:53,479
Speaker 1: the whole skin of kid rock and she sells. She's

1839
01:44:53,560 --> 01:44:56,280
Speaker 1: literally she's raised something like three million dollars for the

1840
01:44:56,280 --> 01:45:01,120
Speaker 1: Shriners through this Eagles her work client, and you know,

1841
01:45:01,200 --> 01:45:04,120
Speaker 1: she's made a she created a business out of nothing.

1842
01:45:04,600 --> 01:45:06,880
Speaker 1: If you got four people working for her going to

1843
01:45:07,000 --> 01:45:11,640
Speaker 1: gigs all the time. She started it with she and I.

1844
01:45:11,880 --> 01:45:15,559
Speaker 1: She was assistant to a manager, merchandizing girl and you know,

1845
01:45:15,640 --> 01:45:18,800
Speaker 1: like everything at one time. And I could never figure

1846
01:45:18,800 --> 01:45:21,040
Speaker 1: out why we couldn't sell c ds at gigs, you know,

1847
01:45:21,880 --> 01:45:23,599
Speaker 1: So I said, look, I think you've got to take

1848
01:45:23,760 --> 01:45:27,040
Speaker 1: the CDs to the people. So she and I took

1849
01:45:27,080 --> 01:45:29,240
Speaker 1: a box of CDs each at the end of the show.

1850
01:45:29,840 --> 01:45:34,080
Speaker 1: And this may seem undignified for the manager of the

1851
01:45:34,120 --> 01:45:38,360
Speaker 1: band and a legendary artists or managers. I'd like to

1852
01:45:38,400 --> 01:45:40,720
Speaker 1: pump myself up to be but we're out there going

1853
01:45:40,760 --> 01:45:44,519
Speaker 1: to get your CDs up twenty dollars for a CD

1854
01:45:44,680 --> 01:45:47,880
Speaker 1: come on, come on. We sold a box each that night,

1855
01:45:48,400 --> 01:45:51,200
Speaker 1: so I said, look, it's a little undignified for us

1856
01:45:51,240 --> 01:45:53,040
Speaker 1: to be out there doing this, But we did it

1857
01:45:53,080 --> 01:45:56,000
Speaker 1: a couple more times, and we got this cash from

1858
01:45:56,000 --> 01:45:59,080
Speaker 1: selling these CDs at twenty bucks. Because you can't sell

1859
01:45:59,120 --> 01:46:01,240
Speaker 1: a c D a a rock show for less than

1860
01:46:01,280 --> 01:46:05,200
Speaker 1: twenty dollars because the record label wants, you know, nine dollars,

1861
01:46:05,600 --> 01:46:08,680
Speaker 1: the venue wants like five dollars, so you've got to

1862
01:46:08,680 --> 01:46:11,240
Speaker 1: sell it at that price. Except cause we in Foreigner

1863
01:46:11,640 --> 01:46:14,240
Speaker 1: came up with the idea of pressing our own. We

1864
01:46:14,360 --> 01:46:19,120
Speaker 1: covered every song, We took studio recordings of every hit

1865
01:46:19,560 --> 01:46:24,240
Speaker 1: and eventually specifically for licensing and selling it shows. But

1866
01:46:24,720 --> 01:46:27,160
Speaker 1: you don't have to the original radars can't say no,

1867
01:46:27,400 --> 01:46:30,120
Speaker 1: they don't have to get paid. That's there's that. But

1868
01:46:30,240 --> 01:46:36,200
Speaker 1: the interesting is we did eventually release the those records,

1869
01:46:37,400 --> 01:46:41,200
Speaker 1: and we've got a gold album for see. The thing

1870
01:46:41,200 --> 01:46:44,040
Speaker 1: about Foreigner is that we touched on this before that

1871
01:46:44,080 --> 01:46:47,240
Speaker 1: they were a faceless band. Nobody knew who they were.

1872
01:46:47,720 --> 01:46:51,240
Speaker 1: I discovered round about two thousand five, when we're really

1873
01:46:51,280 --> 01:46:55,040
Speaker 1: starting this that nobody knows who Foreigners are. Okay, you

1874
01:46:55,080 --> 01:46:57,080
Speaker 1: know that thing You're sitting on a plane. The guy

1875
01:46:57,160 --> 01:46:59,760
Speaker 1: next to you said, what do you do right? I said, well,

1876
01:46:59,760 --> 01:47:02,400
Speaker 1: I'm anse rock bands. And they say who, No, not

1877
01:47:02,479 --> 01:47:07,720
Speaker 1: the who? Foreigner? Who No, not the who? Foreigner? I've

1878
01:47:07,720 --> 01:47:10,599
Speaker 1: never heard of Foreigner. Yes, you've heard of Foreigner. You

1879
01:47:10,640 --> 01:47:13,680
Speaker 1: know every song? And I start singing. You know how

1880
01:47:13,680 --> 01:47:16,200
Speaker 1: good I am at that? I start singing the songs.

1881
01:47:16,400 --> 01:47:19,439
Speaker 1: They know every song. So people who say they have

1882
01:47:19,560 --> 01:47:23,240
Speaker 1: not heard of Foreigner, no, every song Foreigner has ever

1883
01:47:23,320 --> 01:47:26,519
Speaker 1: recorded and had a hit with. Do you know Do

1884
01:47:26,600 --> 01:47:30,400
Speaker 1: you know, Bob, that Foreigner has more top ten singles

1885
01:47:30,520 --> 01:47:32,680
Speaker 1: than Journey? Did you know that? Well? I was just

1886
01:47:32,720 --> 01:47:34,479
Speaker 1: going to bring up Journey, and I didn't know that

1887
01:47:34,560 --> 01:47:37,400
Speaker 1: because I went to see the Earth stats Journey. I've

1888
01:47:37,400 --> 01:47:38,880
Speaker 1: seen them a couple of times. I would see even

1889
01:47:38,880 --> 01:47:42,519
Speaker 1: at the Hollywood ball Ones three years ago, and you

1890
01:47:42,560 --> 01:47:46,680
Speaker 1: know Anniel whatever his name is, the Filipino guys, who

1891
01:47:46,760 --> 01:47:50,640
Speaker 1: is that? And the reaction was beyond belief. It was

1892
01:47:50,720 --> 01:47:53,080
Speaker 1: clear it wasn't Steve Prey. But what I realized at

1893
01:47:53,120 --> 01:47:55,840
Speaker 1: that point is the audience on the songs, it was

1894
01:47:55,880 --> 01:47:58,599
Speaker 1: about them now they'd grown up to it. They loved

1895
01:47:58,600 --> 01:48:00,960
Speaker 1: the songs, didn't matter that it wasn't Steve Perry. They

1896
01:48:00,960 --> 01:48:02,960
Speaker 1: were there for the song. The same thing as with four,

1897
01:48:03,000 --> 01:48:06,160
Speaker 1: Absolutely the same movement. But the problem is everybody has

1898
01:48:06,200 --> 01:48:12,640
Speaker 1: heard a Journey everybody. All Right, I challenge what. I know.

1899
01:48:12,680 --> 01:48:14,280
Speaker 1: You're the manager, but I think you're living in a

1900
01:48:14,320 --> 01:48:16,599
Speaker 1: little bit of a bubble. For those of us who

1901
01:48:16,640 --> 01:48:19,439
Speaker 1: lived the first albums in seventy seven, I want to

1902
01:48:19,479 --> 01:48:22,559
Speaker 1: know what love is? Was the eighty four eighty three

1903
01:48:24,000 --> 01:48:26,960
Speaker 1: first album came out in seventy eight, right, they've got

1904
01:48:27,000 --> 01:48:30,880
Speaker 1: together in uh and the want of this was on

1905
01:48:30,920 --> 01:48:35,120
Speaker 1: the fifth album. Right, So anybody who lived through that

1906
01:48:35,200 --> 01:48:38,840
Speaker 1: era knows who foreigner? Well, I have just stopped. What

1907
01:48:39,160 --> 01:48:44,360
Speaker 1: made Journey different was the finality of the Sopranos. Irving

1908
01:48:44,520 --> 01:48:48,240
Speaker 1: says two things made Journey different. Okay, FINALI of the

1909
01:48:48,280 --> 01:48:51,559
Speaker 1: Sopranos and a tour that they did supporting definitely epid.

1910
01:48:52,000 --> 01:48:54,760
Speaker 1: He puts it down to those two things. Well, the

1911
01:48:54,880 --> 01:48:57,639
Speaker 1: way it was only last year that this is years ago,

1912
01:48:57,720 --> 01:49:00,160
Speaker 1: I know because last year they played stadiums them, let

1913
01:49:00,280 --> 01:49:02,479
Speaker 1: know what they did. But many years ago they did

1914
01:49:02,479 --> 01:49:06,120
Speaker 1: a theater tour playing like the Beacon in you that

1915
01:49:06,240 --> 01:49:09,760
Speaker 1: size place and so theoretically, what could you do with

1916
01:49:09,840 --> 01:49:14,160
Speaker 1: foreigner to achieve that same mind share. Um, I am

1917
01:49:14,200 --> 01:49:16,679
Speaker 1: going to disagree with you. Firstly, that everybody has not hurting.

1918
01:49:16,800 --> 01:49:18,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I challenge you to do my test on

1919
01:49:18,680 --> 01:49:22,880
Speaker 1: a plane one day. Okay, people under the age of forty,

1920
01:49:24,000 --> 01:49:28,160
Speaker 1: but people over the age of forty. I'm surprised. People.

1921
01:49:28,880 --> 01:49:32,000
Speaker 1: Our target market is what you've just said. Really, it's

1922
01:49:32,080 --> 01:49:36,120
Speaker 1: forty and up evenly split male female. Funnily enough, but

1923
01:49:36,240 --> 01:49:39,519
Speaker 1: you talked to people of between your age and my age,

1924
01:49:39,840 --> 01:49:42,680
Speaker 1: and you're saying, you know this conversation, they have not

1925
01:49:42,760 --> 01:49:44,840
Speaker 1: heard of foreigner. They will tell you they have not

1926
01:49:44,920 --> 01:49:47,160
Speaker 1: heard of foreigner. I guess no experience, but I trust

1927
01:49:47,200 --> 01:49:50,720
Speaker 1: you've got to do it. Okay, well know they know

1928
01:49:50,880 --> 01:49:53,559
Speaker 1: the songs, but they do not know who recorded. So

1929
01:49:53,680 --> 01:49:55,800
Speaker 1: what I started to do when I realized that was

1930
01:49:56,120 --> 01:49:59,240
Speaker 1: every foreign at print ad that I take has the

1931
01:49:59,280 --> 01:50:03,320
Speaker 1: song titles right. So my mantra to my marketing director

1932
01:50:03,320 --> 01:50:07,120
Speaker 1: Guy is the mentor the songs are the brand. And

1933
01:50:07,240 --> 01:50:09,840
Speaker 1: over the last it's been a slug. I'm telling you,

1934
01:50:10,080 --> 01:50:13,800
Speaker 1: over the last fifteen years, we've changed that perspective. But

1935
01:50:13,920 --> 01:50:17,120
Speaker 1: the reality is here, we are with more hits than Journey,

1936
01:50:17,240 --> 01:50:20,760
Speaker 1: more top ten hits than Journey, and we're worth one

1937
01:50:20,880 --> 01:50:23,639
Speaker 1: third of Journey in the eyes of a promoter. Okright,

1938
01:50:24,000 --> 01:50:27,960
Speaker 1: we're gradually changing that because we're doing great business this year,

1939
01:50:28,320 --> 01:50:30,400
Speaker 1: but this will be next year, will be our third

1940
01:50:30,840 --> 01:50:35,080
Speaker 1: Live Nation headline Amphithy editor, so you know we're looking

1941
01:50:35,080 --> 01:50:37,719
Speaker 1: forward to that one. Last year we had David Coverdell

1942
01:50:38,000 --> 01:50:41,519
Speaker 1: with White Snake and Jason Bonham supporting, and we look

1943
01:50:41,560 --> 01:50:44,720
Speaker 1: into a big, big deal for next year. So we

1944
01:50:44,760 --> 01:50:46,719
Speaker 1: didn't do it this year. We just did state fairs,

1945
01:50:46,760 --> 01:50:51,680
Speaker 1: casinos and did amazing business. And you know that's but

1946
01:50:51,840 --> 01:50:53,880
Speaker 1: every time you've got to tell people who they are.

1947
01:50:54,200 --> 01:50:57,479
Speaker 1: We've got the same number of hits as Fleetwood Mac,

1948
01:50:57,760 --> 01:51:00,719
Speaker 1: We've only got one less top ten song than the Eagles,

1949
01:51:01,320 --> 01:51:04,559
Speaker 1: but nobody has heard in Foreigner. Okay, I'm gonna I'm

1950
01:51:04,560 --> 01:51:07,360
Speaker 1: gonna cut off your sales pitch, and I'm a Foreigner fan.

1951
01:51:07,800 --> 01:51:09,640
Speaker 1: I mean, just like I was talking about, you know,

1952
01:51:09,640 --> 01:51:12,719
Speaker 1: because Rick o'kaseck died at rick Akasak however he wanted,

1953
01:51:12,960 --> 01:51:16,479
Speaker 1: however he did pronounce it, and of course their comeback

1954
01:51:16,600 --> 01:51:19,599
Speaker 1: was with Mutt Lang and you had the same thing.

1955
01:51:19,640 --> 01:51:22,200
Speaker 1: But their album with the album that Mutt Lang Foreigner

1956
01:51:22,320 --> 01:51:27,040
Speaker 1: for stupendous, Okay, I mean, Waiting for a Girl like

1957
01:51:27,120 --> 01:51:30,519
Speaker 1: You doesn't get any better than that. Never mind, you

1958
01:51:30,560 --> 01:51:36,920
Speaker 1: know Jukebox here Jukebox Heroes different, but it's like urgent, unbelieving, unbelievable.

1959
01:51:36,960 --> 01:51:40,519
Speaker 1: I mean, the whole thing was terrific album. But you know,

1960
01:51:41,320 --> 01:51:43,240
Speaker 1: Journey is a different thing. Don't forget they put out

1961
01:51:43,240 --> 01:51:45,760
Speaker 1: all the albums with the other singer, Greg Rowley that

1962
01:51:45,800 --> 01:51:51,080
Speaker 1: were stiff, okay, and they certainly played stadiums before they

1963
01:51:51,240 --> 01:51:55,080
Speaker 1: broke up. But you know, I remember Jeff Beck was

1964
01:51:55,560 --> 01:52:00,759
Speaker 1: managed by Harvey Goldsmith, and before Jeff fired him, Harvey

1965
01:52:00,840 --> 01:52:03,720
Speaker 1: had him everywhere. Jeff Beck is no better today than

1966
01:52:03,760 --> 01:52:06,800
Speaker 1: he ever was. He was always stupendous, But once he

1967
01:52:06,840 --> 01:52:09,519
Speaker 1: was on every TV show, the people who didn't know

1968
01:52:09,600 --> 01:52:14,160
Speaker 1: that realized that promoter. Right. But I'm trying to say

1969
01:52:14,240 --> 01:52:16,280
Speaker 1: is the question is you know whether you can have

1970
01:52:16,439 --> 01:52:18,519
Speaker 1: that foreign or moment and if you tried to get

1971
01:52:18,520 --> 01:52:22,120
Speaker 1: a one of those multi hits in a definitive movie

1972
01:52:22,280 --> 01:52:26,040
Speaker 1: or anything. We have had some successes. We had a

1973
01:52:26,080 --> 01:52:28,720
Speaker 1: sync license for I Want to Know What Love Is

1974
01:52:28,800 --> 01:52:32,599
Speaker 1: was the final episode of Oranges and The New Black

1975
01:52:33,000 --> 01:52:35,880
Speaker 1: and they used the lyrics for a wedding in the

1976
01:52:35,920 --> 01:52:37,679
Speaker 1: thing and they went out went out with the whole

1977
01:52:37,680 --> 01:52:39,760
Speaker 1: So will be on TV forever, Yeah, it will be.

1978
01:52:39,840 --> 01:52:43,439
Speaker 1: It's not as big as the Sopranos. Sopranos that that

1979
01:52:43,640 --> 01:52:46,760
Speaker 1: really broke journey. Okay. But the other thing about now,

1980
01:52:46,880 --> 01:52:49,240
Speaker 1: I mean you talk about people don't know Foreigner. We

1981
01:52:49,280 --> 01:52:51,679
Speaker 1: could sit here and we could talk about the TV

1982
01:52:51,760 --> 01:52:54,599
Speaker 1: shows we watched, and they could be completely different shows.

1983
01:52:54,920 --> 01:52:57,240
Speaker 1: This was an error where if you watched TV, everybody

1984
01:52:57,280 --> 01:53:00,800
Speaker 1: watched when these things would come going out, there was

1985
01:53:00,840 --> 01:53:03,880
Speaker 1: only one radio example, you know, and we we didn't

1986
01:53:03,920 --> 01:53:06,000
Speaker 1: know it was classic rock at the time right there,

1987
01:53:06,040 --> 01:53:08,160
Speaker 1: if that was the only format. Okay, well that begs

1988
01:53:08,160 --> 01:53:14,000
Speaker 1: the question today's music, where personally I'm sort of nowhere

1989
01:53:14,040 --> 01:53:17,160
Speaker 1: with it because you know, I'm seventy five and I'm

1990
01:53:17,160 --> 01:53:22,559
Speaker 1: getting ready to retire. So my whole thing is working Foreigner,

1991
01:53:22,800 --> 01:53:24,880
Speaker 1: trying to get it where I want it to be.

1992
01:53:25,400 --> 01:53:29,799
Speaker 1: And you know, we're working with THEE. Snyder, we're making movies,

1993
01:53:29,840 --> 01:53:32,240
Speaker 1: we're doing all kinds of different things with the who

1994
01:53:32,320 --> 01:53:35,639
Speaker 1: is an incredibly talented man, by the way, much much

1995
01:53:35,720 --> 01:53:40,000
Speaker 1: less playing music now than writing stuff and co producing.

1996
01:53:40,200 --> 01:53:45,200
Speaker 1: His son Cody is making a movie shortly with a

1997
01:53:45,200 --> 01:53:48,559
Speaker 1: big studio, so we're working that side of the business.

1998
01:53:48,560 --> 01:53:51,920
Speaker 1: But with Foreigner, I just want to leave this at

1999
01:53:52,120 --> 01:53:54,800
Speaker 1: least as big as it was back in the day,

2000
01:53:55,200 --> 01:53:57,960
Speaker 1: and we're getting there, you know, but it's it's a

2001
01:53:58,040 --> 01:54:01,240
Speaker 1: struggle for the for the for the reason I told

2002
01:54:01,240 --> 01:54:04,920
Speaker 1: you now. The big thing these days is sync licensing,

2003
01:54:04,960 --> 01:54:08,479
Speaker 1: as you probably know, and sync licensing is the number

2004
01:54:08,479 --> 01:54:12,280
Speaker 1: one driver of streams. So we got a use in

2005
01:54:12,560 --> 01:54:17,040
Speaker 1: um stranger things, and the streams went through the damn

2006
01:54:17,120 --> 01:54:21,840
Speaker 1: roofs was cold as ice. And that's suddenly now we're

2007
01:54:21,880 --> 01:54:25,400
Speaker 1: starting to see younger people coming for because of these things.

2008
01:54:25,439 --> 01:54:29,320
Speaker 1: So we're gung ho after getting if any music supervisor

2009
01:54:29,400 --> 01:54:31,680
Speaker 1: at their listings, I will cut you one hell of

2010
01:54:31,720 --> 01:54:34,000
Speaker 1: a deal extranger of things. They came to you, or

2011
01:54:34,040 --> 01:54:36,720
Speaker 1: you can went to them. Well, Warners have a very

2012
01:54:36,720 --> 01:54:41,440
Speaker 1: good sync licensing department and Warner's own the original thing,

2013
01:54:41,560 --> 01:54:44,080
Speaker 1: so they came to us with that. You know, I

2014
01:54:44,120 --> 01:54:47,880
Speaker 1: don't have anyone out there, you know, because the major

2015
01:54:48,000 --> 01:54:51,960
Speaker 1: labels have almost a lock on this stuff because they've

2016
01:54:52,000 --> 01:54:55,480
Speaker 1: got such a massive amount of repertoire. You will go.

2017
01:54:55,600 --> 01:54:59,240
Speaker 1: You can go to a movie studio meeting, a studio

2018
01:54:59,320 --> 01:55:04,000
Speaker 1: meeting and you'll see a rep from Universal Warner or

2019
01:55:05,120 --> 01:55:10,400
Speaker 1: well Kevin Weaver Atlanta. Keep my god, that guy gets everything.

2020
01:55:11,560 --> 01:55:13,920
Speaker 1: Robert Plant called me up one day after I stop

2021
01:55:14,000 --> 01:55:17,000
Speaker 1: managing him because he used to call me, still calls

2022
01:55:17,080 --> 01:55:20,600
Speaker 1: me frequently. Uh. He said, can you get me like

2023
01:55:21,240 --> 01:55:24,240
Speaker 1: a movie thing? And I called up Kevin and I

2024
01:55:25,080 --> 01:55:28,680
Speaker 1: spent here and I spent three days together. We called

2025
01:55:28,800 --> 01:55:32,040
Speaker 1: up everybody that we knew, everybody because I know a

2026
01:55:32,120 --> 01:55:34,600
Speaker 1: number of directors from that time in film business. He

2027
01:55:34,640 --> 01:55:37,400
Speaker 1: knows everybody. The tour of us sat on that phone

2028
01:55:37,760 --> 01:55:42,800
Speaker 1: and Kevin got him the end title to the Day

2029
01:55:42,840 --> 01:55:47,000
Speaker 1: after Tomorrow, Big movie, right right. Robert, in his wisdom,

2030
01:55:47,040 --> 01:55:54,400
Speaker 1: turned it down. Artists, So thanks so much for being

2031
01:55:55,000 --> 01:55:57,520
Speaker 1: once again. You're listening to Phil Carson on the barb

2032
01:55:57,600 --> 01:56:06,680
Speaker 1: Left That's podcast. We'll see you next week.