Speaker 1: Hi, everybody.
Speaker 2: Welcome to The Phillies Show with Bruben Tomorrow Junior Jim Salisbury.
Speaker 2: I am Todd Zo Lucky. It is Monday, April nine,
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four. The Phillies coming off a sweep of
Speaker 2: the Padres in San Diego. The Phillies are nineteen and
Speaker 2: ten overall, they're eighteen and eight in April.
Speaker 3: Guys, do you know the Phillies have never.
Speaker 2: Won nineteen games in the month of April. Ever, they
Speaker 2: have a chance to do that tonight in Anaheim. They're
Speaker 2: a game and a half behind the Braves. The Phillies,
Speaker 2: who always get off the slow starts, can now say
Speaker 2: they have. They're tied for the third best record in
Speaker 2: Major League Baseball with the Yankees.
Speaker 3: They're really playing good baseball.
Speaker 2: And I thought a good way to start this episode
Speaker 2: would be talking about a guy whom I'm wondering is
Speaker 2: he having a breakout year? And that is Alec Boom.
Speaker 2: We've talked a lot about him. We're kind of touched
Speaker 2: on actually in the last episode moving up to the
Speaker 2: cleanup spot.
Speaker 3: It's having a great year.
Speaker 2: I mean he's driving a ton of runs, he's hitting
Speaker 2: for some power, and am I overstating at guys, when
Speaker 2: I say, is this the year he finally breaks out,
Speaker 2: makes an All Star team, enters the conversation maybe as
Speaker 2: an outside long shot MVP candidate.
Speaker 3: Am I nuts or.
Speaker 1: Not? I think all those things are possible.
Speaker 4: So the beauty of what Alec Bohm brought to the
Speaker 4: table when he was drafted was that the guy was
Speaker 4: just more of a pure hitter than he was a
Speaker 4: power guy in the first place. And he's sort of
Speaker 4: going through that old school progress, right. I always believe
Speaker 4: that if you're and I think of the guy that
Speaker 4: I think about as like a rafa Al Palmaro, And
Speaker 4: I know there was some question about, you know, peds
Speaker 4: and all that stuff later on in his career, but
Speaker 4: Rafael Palmaro was a very very good pure hitter. I
Speaker 4: think he came out of Mississippi State or Mississippior whatever. Anyway,
Speaker 4: he was a really, really, really good hitter. And and
Speaker 4: in fact, when he got to the Cubs in the
Speaker 4: big leagues, he didn't even make he didn't even he
Speaker 4: wasn't had no ability to pull the ball. He hit
Speaker 4: everything from second base to the left side of the field.
Speaker 4: And the question was, well, this guy's at first, basement
Speaker 4: or corner outfitter, is you could ever have enough power
Speaker 4: to play those positions, even though he's like it's just
Speaker 4: a good, like solid singles hitter, gap to gap type
Speaker 4: of a hitter. Well most much like a lot of
Speaker 4: guys who have great bat speed and guys who have
Speaker 4: great eye hand coordination and just ability to hit. I
Speaker 4: think you're seeing that out of Alec Bohm right now.
Speaker 4: He was a very good pure hit. He's always been
Speaker 4: a very good pure hitter. It's always you know, he's
Speaker 4: always been able to go sort of gap to gap.
Speaker 4: But the question was was he going to be able
Speaker 4: to get consistently to the inside pitch the fastball inside
Speaker 4: because he's got really long levers, And whether or not
Speaker 4: he's going to be able to get extension on pitches
Speaker 4: on the inside part of the plate, And will he
Speaker 4: ever really lost the ball consistently, you know, to hit
Speaker 4: thirty five or forty home runs. I think he had
Speaker 4: the raw power to do that, but his swing path
Speaker 4: just isn't It's not like a home run type of
Speaker 4: a launch angle swing path. And I just love the
Speaker 4: fact that he is now. I talked to Charlie Manuel
Speaker 4: about this all the time. He's starting to understand when
Speaker 4: he needs to make contact out front. There's certain pitches
Speaker 4: that he can now instead of letting them get too deep,
Speaker 4: which is a great ability that he has, is letting
Speaker 4: the ball get deep because he can take a fastball
Speaker 4: on the inside part and smoke it to right center
Speaker 4: or smoke it to right But he's also now learning
Speaker 4: that he can get pitches maybe a little softer or
Speaker 4: a mistake pitch in the middle of the plate and
Speaker 4: turn on it. So you see him drilling some balls
Speaker 4: down the left field line. Now, are they going out
Speaker 4: of the ball park all the time? No, But he's
Speaker 4: smoking them and their extra base hits.
Speaker 1: And who cares? I mean, as far as I'm concerned.
Speaker 4: When when you're having those types of a bats and
Speaker 4: you're hitting the herd, who cares Whether you're hitting home runs,
Speaker 4: you're producing runs, you're producing bullets, you're hitting the baseball
Speaker 4: over the place, And as long as you're hitting the
Speaker 4: ball hard somewhere.
Speaker 1: And doing it as consistently as he is, it's a
Speaker 1: fun thing to watch. Man.
Speaker 4: I know this is you know, every every hitter gets hot,
Speaker 4: and you know has has those hot spurts and and
Speaker 4: he'll cool off. There's no question. Nobody can hit like
Speaker 4: this for the rest of their lives. It's not going
Speaker 4: to happen. But his overall approach has put him in
Speaker 4: this position. And I think his overall confidence and ability
Speaker 4: to make contact a little bit further out front in
Speaker 4: his in his contact point and being confident to be
Speaker 4: able to do that, you know, reach out more comfortably
Speaker 4: in a more relaxed way. I think it's made him
Speaker 4: It's going to make him one of the more complete
Speaker 4: hitters moving forward, because it's harder to go from being,
Speaker 4: you know, a home run hitter to being like a
Speaker 4: you know, making contact and being able to cover plate
Speaker 4: then going the other way. And I think that this
Speaker 4: is just like an old school progression for a young
Speaker 4: man who now feels very comfortable in his skin as
Speaker 4: a player and is becoming the kind of offensive player
Speaker 4: that I think that they hoped they were getting when
Speaker 4: they drafted him.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think you mentioned he's getting comfortable in his skin,
Speaker 5: and I think hand in hand with that is confidence.
Speaker 5: You mentioned that as well. I just see a very
Speaker 5: confident hitter who has stayed true to his style of hitting.
Speaker 5: If there were ever temptations. And I don't know that
Speaker 5: they ever asked them to lift the ball, but if
Speaker 5: there were ever temptations to do that in baseball in
Speaker 5: the two thousand and twenties, we see a lot of it.
Speaker 5: He's resisted it. He's got a little inside out, and
Speaker 5: he's really learning to use the bat head line drive approach.
Speaker 5: I remember when they drafted him looking at his numbers
Speaker 5: at which toss state, and there was you could see
Speaker 5: a player that just got better. You could just see
Speaker 5: it in the numbers, a player that got better and
Speaker 5: better every year. Kid cod league, which toss state. You
Speaker 5: also could see that he was a selective hitter. He
Speaker 5: really knew the strike zone. One word that bothers me
Speaker 5: is patience. You know, we say, somebody a hitter, or
Speaker 5: be patient. To me, the goal should be selectivity because
Speaker 5: you get a cookie early. Why do you want to
Speaker 5: be patient? But he's a very selective hitter and has
Speaker 5: had that kind of in his DNA, And I just
Speaker 5: see a guy really learning to use the bat head
Speaker 5: to his advantage. And you're seeing the confidence right now.
Speaker 5: And I just think it's an amazing story because and
Speaker 5: the way he hits with on base it's been amazing
Speaker 5: since day one. But I think it's a great story
Speaker 5: because we all know that night against the Mets when
Speaker 5: he made the errors, But that to me was only
Speaker 5: only shows part of his journey. If you look back
Speaker 5: to the spring of twenty twenty two, you remember this Todd.
Speaker 5: I mean, he really lacked confidence. At one point Joe
Speaker 5: Girardi started playing Bryson Stott at third base and pronounced
Speaker 5: that he has a chance to be the opening day
Speaker 5: guy with Bom having to go to Triple A. And
Speaker 5: I remember him walking down the clubhouse to that spring
Speaker 5: and you know, looking at times for long, looking like
Speaker 5: he lost his best friend, just looking like he needed
Speaker 5: a shot of confidence. And he's gotten it, you know,
Speaker 5: with the help of others, but he's gotten it through
Speaker 5: his performance. I mean, he was legitimately a trade candidate
Speaker 5: in in the spring of twenty twenty two. And I'm
Speaker 5: going to tell you how I know this.
Speaker 1: You know, I remember you're writing this.
Speaker 5: Well. I got a call one day, Ruben, from a
Speaker 5: scout from another team and during spring clear Water, and
Speaker 5: he said, hey, look, I've watched Alec Boone play a
Speaker 5: ton I know all about him, you know, between the
Speaker 5: lines as a player, is a good guy. Tell me
Speaker 5: the teammates like him. He's a good guy in the clubhouse.
Speaker 5: So tell me about is you know he's doing that
Speaker 5: background you do on guys, and he kind of swmed
Speaker 5: me to secrecy, and I think, now I'm safe. But
Speaker 5: I mean, you know, I can extrapolate from that that
Speaker 5: he was available for a trade, and so I mean,
Speaker 5: it's so win win. The guy's performing better, he's doing
Speaker 5: a great judge, a core player, and he could have
Speaker 5: been moved on. They could have moved on from him,
Speaker 5: probably a couple of times. So patients I mentioned, I
Speaker 5: didn't like that word, but I do like it in
Speaker 5: this regard in terms of player development. I think because
Speaker 5: of the money and the pressure to get to the
Speaker 5: big league quickly and perform, we lose patience in the
Speaker 5: player development process. I think he's a testament to what
Speaker 5: some patients can do and some player development can do
Speaker 5: at the big league level. Development doesn't start the day
Speaker 5: you arrive in the majors. He's gotten better while playing
Speaker 5: in the majors, and offensively and defensively, and now what
Speaker 5: we're seeing is an immensely confident player, a player who
Speaker 5: believes he belongs, a player who is delivering, a player
Speaker 5: who is I mean when I watched that kid hit
Speaker 5: a double and stand on second base and do this
Speaker 5: and smile, I see joy of the game in that face,
Speaker 5: and I love it. I love a good story, and
Speaker 5: Alec Bowman is a good story, a good human story
Speaker 5: of sticking with it, of getting better of you know,
Speaker 5: going from looking over your shoulder and you're looking tentative,
Speaker 5: like a like a newborn giraffe who can barely stand
Speaker 5: up to a guy who's now going to make a
Speaker 5: best of the All Star Game? Soop?
Speaker 1: How about this?
Speaker 2: In terms of development, Rob Thompson, Rubert, I think you
Speaker 2: were there last week in CINCINNATAI he said something that
Speaker 2: if he would have said this two years ago, he
Speaker 2: would been laughed out of the dugout. He said, I
Speaker 2: think right now, Alec Bowma is an above average defensive
Speaker 2: third baseman, and you can I'm sure if you pulled
Speaker 2: ten different scouts, some would say no, some might say yes,
Speaker 2: some might say he's average. But the fact that Rob
Speaker 2: Thompson can say that and not get laughed out of
Speaker 2: the dugout is another example.
Speaker 3: I think of that development, right I mean.
Speaker 2: He's you know, a few years ago he was getting
Speaker 2: mocked for how bad he was defensively, and now he
Speaker 2: is somebody that when the balls hit there, more often
Speaker 2: than not, you feel like he is going to make
Speaker 2: the play.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, this is part of it brings up
Speaker 4: a really big subject about you know, young players getting
Speaker 4: to the big leagues.
Speaker 1: Typically they're not finished products. None of them are.
Speaker 4: I mean, you're watching it with Jackson Holliday, You're watching
Speaker 4: it with all types of plays.
Speaker 1: The guys that get to the.
Speaker 4: Major leagues are almost never ready to actually be they're
Speaker 4: not complete players. They might be ready to compete at
Speaker 4: the major league level in some way, shape or form,
Speaker 4: either defensively or offensively, but they're never a finished product.
Speaker 4: And you know, it took Jimmy Rollins and Chase Suttley
Speaker 4: three two three four years to like really become the
Speaker 4: players that they were going to become. That's why there's
Speaker 4: a real progression here. And he's and alec is a
Speaker 4: perfect example of that, not not just offensively, but defensively.
Speaker 4: Was always a question, Okay, we got to move this
Speaker 4: kind at first base. He can't play third base. He's
Speaker 4: gotta play that he's got to play well. He's worked
Speaker 4: his butt off, Dickerson has done. Bobby's done a great
Speaker 4: job of getting him to the point where he believes
Speaker 4: in himself again as as a total.
Speaker 1: Player, not just as an offensive player.
Speaker 4: I mean, k Long's helped him, you know, continue And
Speaker 4: and there's also one of those things where there was
Speaker 4: a resistance and a recognition that, Okay, this guy can
Speaker 4: still be a productive player without screwing up his swing.
Speaker 4: Let this guy, okay, he's not hitting the ball of
Speaker 4: the ballpark. Let's not and you touched on it a
Speaker 4: little bit. Let's not screw this guy up. Let this
Speaker 4: guy be himself and be the best version of himself.
Speaker 4: And that's what you're seeing starting to see right now.
Speaker 4: And it's going to get better. I really think it's
Speaker 4: going to get better and better. I'm just overall from
Speaker 4: year to year. Uh And and it is a great story.
Speaker 4: I'm really really happy for the guy because I can
Speaker 4: tell you same sort of thing.
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 4: I was one of the spring trainings a couple of
Speaker 4: years ago, and I remember going up to al Hey, Alek,
Speaker 4: how you doing, what's going on? And shaking his hand
Speaker 4: and he he sort of shook my hand and he
Speaker 4: was I could see like there was tentativeness in his eyes,
Speaker 4: you know, there was not, And I think it's I
Speaker 4: think it's really cool, Jim, that you noticed, you know
Speaker 4: now with you know, he's high five and then doing
Speaker 4: all that stuff and doing a little shimmy and that
Speaker 4: kind of stuff. It's cool that he's feeling like he
Speaker 4: knows he belongs and he knows he can be a
Speaker 4: productive major league player.
Speaker 5: Well, how about the fact I'm seeing a kid who
Speaker 5: just loves the game, and it's hard to love the
Speaker 5: game when you're not playing. Well, that's why I hate golf, Ruben.
Speaker 4: I understand sometimes that's a love hate relationship with me.
Speaker 5: Well, one last.
Speaker 2: Thought on Boem for me is, you know, speaking of
Speaker 2: the comfortability and whatnot and being comfortable in his own skin,
Speaker 2: this is a guy now when he signs autographs, he
Speaker 2: might write I love this place. Like he embraced that
Speaker 2: moment to the point where he is signing that on
Speaker 2: autograph baseballs and there's a T shirt that some company
Speaker 2: makes that he with his signature on it. To embrace
Speaker 2: that moment, I think says a lot about his growth
Speaker 2: as a human being.
Speaker 1: You know, yeah, that's a great decision. And I got
Speaker 1: to give Kevin Gregg some love for that.
Speaker 4: You know, in the PR department, he's run out of
Speaker 4: communications with the Phillies for sort of advising him, Hey,
Speaker 4: you know, you're gonna have to face this, you gotta
Speaker 4: You're gonna have to, you know, come clean with it
Speaker 4: and be honest with the.
Speaker 1: People about it.
Speaker 4: And I think they handled it in a beautiful way
Speaker 4: and it's really helped him.
Speaker 5: And remember, like with Alex, now he's graduated. I guess
Speaker 5: you could stay to the cleanup spot last hand full
Speaker 5: of games there last week. But you know, with all
Speaker 5: the hand ringing about they're not slugging, well there are
Speaker 5: slugging percentages is going way up here on the last
Speaker 5: two weeks and they're leading the they're leading the league
Speaker 5: at home runs.
Speaker 1: Now, it's crazy. There you have it, and there you
Speaker 1: have it.
Speaker 5: It's just you can't fret over a slow start when
Speaker 5: you have track records like this, when you have ascending
Speaker 5: players like a bomb, like a start like a marsh Guys,
Speaker 5: who are you know? You have the core nucleus with
Speaker 5: the track records, you have the ascending guys. Nice mix, no.
Speaker 2: It's a great mix, and it's you know, he's Stot
Speaker 2: might be heating up as well. You know, he's been
Speaker 2: off to a slow start. So man, you get that
Speaker 2: bottom of the lineup going, and you get Johann Ross
Speaker 2: just getting on base a little bit every once in
Speaker 2: a while, it's it's it's so big, and you know
Speaker 2: Bryce is gonna take off at some point. I mean,
Speaker 2: he's been pretty good, but you know he's gonna take
Speaker 2: off at some point. But to have Boem and Stott
Speaker 2: Marsh coming back where it all started for him.
Speaker 3: This week in Anaheim, you know, it looks like a
Speaker 3: pretty good lineup.
Speaker 2: And you're right, like, remember when they were two and
Speaker 2: four and we were talking about how, my gosh, this
Speaker 2: team can just never get off to a good start,
Speaker 2: and now they're nineteen and ten.
Speaker 5: I was thinking about this today that, you know, because
Speaker 5: Turner's been hot and Baum has been otherworldly. You mentioned
Speaker 5: Bryce hasn't even you know, we haven't even seen the
Speaker 5: whites of Bryce's eyes yet. He could have had one
Speaker 5: of those months. He's gonna have one of those months.
Speaker 5: He's gonna have two of those months, two of those
Speaker 5: months where it's like an ops that begins with a
Speaker 5: one point one. You know, right, it's gonna be it's
Speaker 5: gonna be dazzling. So he hasn't even begun to fight yet.
Speaker 1: So this is also the beauty of what baseball is about.
Speaker 4: And people talk about, well, it's such a long Yeah,
Speaker 4: it's a long season because there are the ebbs and
Speaker 4: flows and the adjustments that the played players make and
Speaker 4: and you know, the ability to stay healthy and all
Speaker 4: those things are such an important part. And the great ones,
Speaker 4: the great ones, have the ability to concentrate for one
Speaker 4: hundred and sixty games or the majority of those games.
Speaker 4: And you know, I think about you know, the Hall
Speaker 4: of Fame players, those guys had an ability to uh,
Speaker 4: to be able to perform at a very very high
Speaker 4: level for long, long, long periods of time, years and
Speaker 4: years and years, months and months and months played appearance
Speaker 4: after a played appearance, you know, start after start.
Speaker 1: And so that's what separates the the you know, the.
Speaker 4: Big boys from the little boys, is that their ability
Speaker 4: to do that on a daily basis, and and that's
Speaker 4: the beauty of the game. That's I also will say
Speaker 4: this and reiterate this. One of the reasons why they
Speaker 4: had the slow starts because I don't think they've got
Speaker 4: enough reps in spring training.
Speaker 1: I still believe that to be true.
Speaker 4: Now, I do believe, and we talked about this, that
Speaker 4: at some point their reps were going to be enough
Speaker 4: in during the course of the season where they're gonna
Speaker 4: start doing what they typically would do.
Speaker 1: And you're you're seeing that now.
Speaker 3: One guy who got the reps in spring training was
Speaker 3: Ranger Suarez.
Speaker 1: You know. JT.
Speaker 3: Realmuto said it a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 2: He said, what's a big difference between you know what
Speaker 2: you saw from Ranger in the spring. He's like, well,
Speaker 2: he was there and he competed. So I got a
Speaker 2: trivia question for you guys. This is in the Phillies
Speaker 2: notes yesterday and I love this. I think it's Chris
Speaker 2: Ware and Phillies pr put this one in the notes.
Speaker 2: Ranger swore his last four starts four and oh zero
Speaker 2: point three zero ERA. Each of those four games were
Speaker 2: played in two hours and fifteen minutes or less. He
Speaker 2: is the first pitcher in baseball Major League Baseball to
Speaker 2: win four consecutive starts in a game that's two hours
Speaker 2: and fifteen minutes or less. Since which pitcher you guys
Speaker 2: know him, knew him. I would say Jim Cott a
Speaker 2: little bit more recent than Jim Cott.
Speaker 3: I would slip, I would you're warm, You're warm, You're warm. Rubin.
Speaker 5: Is he warm because he's left hander?
Speaker 3: Now he's warm because he's in that era.
Speaker 5: He's in that era. Steve Carlton.
Speaker 6: Royaladay, Roylladay, Royaladay, Royaliday, July September one of the seventeen
Speaker 6: two thousand and three four straight starts, all under two
Speaker 6: hours and fifteen minutes.
Speaker 4: Another guy, another guy I acquired, another guy I acquired.
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right. I'm posing.
Speaker 5: Do this.
Speaker 4: I'll give it one of these shimmy now that I mean, listen,
Speaker 4: this staff is just ridiculous. I know, I'm sure we'll
Speaker 4: hit on some of it, but from top of the bottom,
Speaker 4: it's just been spectacular.
Speaker 5: I was looking at eight number eighteen, eighteen quality starts, eighteen.
Speaker 7: I've been watching this since and I gotta, you know,
Speaker 7: I gotta sort of refute the power rankings they came
Speaker 7: out with this morning that the Phillies were seventh at
Speaker 7: MLB dot com seventh. I'm like, dude, what is that
Speaker 7: guy smoking?
Speaker 4: There's no way in the world that this is a
Speaker 4: seventh the seventh best team in baseball. I mean, right now,
Speaker 4: they might be number one. They're either one or.
Speaker 1: Two, especially with the pitching.
Speaker 4: I mean, obviously Atlanta's you know, playing their asses off too,
Speaker 4: but I mean, and it's tough to cover some ground,
Speaker 4: but they're they're up there with them, They're right.
Speaker 1: You know, neck and neck with them because of the
Speaker 1: of the length and breadth of their rotation.
Speaker 7: Listen to the listening to these numbers on this on
Speaker 7: this West coast strip. The trip, so Nola went eight inning,
Speaker 7: seven hits, one walk.
Speaker 1: Ten strikeouts, seventy percent strike rate.
Speaker 4: Suarez eight innings, pitch, three hits, no walks, eight k's
Speaker 4: sixty seven percent strike rate. And even Walker, who was
Speaker 4: thrown really well upuntil that one inning he gave, he
Speaker 4: blew up at the end.
Speaker 1: I mean, Heathron is.
Speaker 4: Still you know, six innings, six and the third innings
Speaker 4: six and the third innings most players, most starters can't
Speaker 4: get through the fifth and and uh and ended up
Speaker 4: you know, ninety pitches, fifty nine strikes, sixty six percent.
Speaker 4: They're throwing strikes man and and tremendously rate.
Speaker 5: And it's just been dazzling, and it's it's really good that,
Speaker 5: you know, I mean, you know, it's way too early
Speaker 5: to talk cy Young, but what the heck we're we're
Speaker 5: on the uh, we're on the Todd Pods. We've been
Speaker 5: the rules a little bit. Let's throw it out. If
Speaker 5: they were to do with the cy Young today, and
Speaker 5: it's ridiculously early, I admit it. You probably have the
Speaker 5: winner and the second or third place finisher and Wheeler.
Speaker 5: As far as Wheeler, I mean, it's it's crazy. But
Speaker 5: you know, having with Spencer Turnbull pitching so well, now
Speaker 5: they're gonna give him another start, and it's going to
Speaker 5: allow them to get Wheeler an extra day, and they're
Speaker 5: gonna get Nola an extra day, which it has the potential,
Speaker 5: you know, to pay dividends down the road, sure, down
Speaker 5: the road September October. And it really helps your rotation
Speaker 5: because they're all pitching so well.
Speaker 4: Now here, So here, here's some numbers I actually put together.
Speaker 4: I'm not a numbers guy, but with these numbers, I
Speaker 4: think it's important. So Wheelers had four straight starts with
Speaker 4: one hundred plus pitches. Nola's had five straight starts with
Speaker 4: over with averaging over ninety plus pitches and then Rangers
Speaker 4: last four starts, he's averaged ninety eight pitches. So for them,
Speaker 4: and I know most of these guys don't like to
Speaker 4: get an extra day, especially Wheeler. We've talked about this before,
Speaker 4: but I think in this sense, I think this is great.
Speaker 4: It's a great opportunity to just give them a blow.
Speaker 4: I mean, it's been one month where these guys have
Speaker 4: been like horsing it. They've been horses and it just
Speaker 4: gives them like an extra day right there to get
Speaker 4: them a little bit more you know, a little bit
Speaker 4: more space and a little bit more rest.
Speaker 5: And what it does is it it sends a message
Speaker 5: that is not hard to decipher. The message is they
Speaker 5: were a good club, but we're built to play in
Speaker 5: October and we are built to conquer October this year.
Speaker 5: So you know that's what we're what we're investing in. Uh,
Speaker 5: we're investing in keeping you healthy for October because our
Speaker 5: expectations and our stakes are that high.
Speaker 4: And not only that, but they're also protecting the top
Speaker 4: three guys who are going to pitch in the playoffs.
Speaker 1: So Taylor, Wheeler, Suarez and Nola are the guys that
Speaker 1: might be in that order.
Speaker 5: They're getting those two big guys. They're getting those two
Speaker 5: big guys a little rest early or just saving a
Speaker 5: bullet early because they're expecting to play that seventh month
Speaker 5: and go really deep. And those guys are so hugely important. Uh,
Speaker 5: they're here to win the World Series. That's what that's
Speaker 5: what the that's what the expectation is, and that's what
Speaker 5: the stakes are. And it's you know, it's a cliche,
Speaker 5: but it's it's winning the World Series or a bust
Speaker 5: for this team. They got the payroll, they got the
Speaker 5: track records, they got the stars, they got the experience.
Speaker 5: Now they need to do it.
Speaker 3: Were you guys encouraged with what Walker Walker did yesterday
Speaker 3: in San Diego? You know, up until that last inning,
Speaker 3: you know, he threw a lot of.
Speaker 2: Cutters and sinkers, and he said after the game his
Speaker 2: splitter was bad, so he didn't throw He barely threw
Speaker 2: any splitters.
Speaker 3: And maybe that's just a one start thing. He didn't
Speaker 3: have the feel for the pitch.
Speaker 2: But up until that point, you know, all eyes were
Speaker 2: on him going into that start, right, I mean, can
Speaker 2: you imagine the reaction if he had given up six
Speaker 2: runs in the first three innings, it would have been
Speaker 2: oh my gosh, people back home would have been going bananas.
Speaker 2: But up until that last thing, I know people are
Speaker 2: to say, yay, but all the runs count.
Speaker 3: I understand that. But were you guys encouraged.
Speaker 2: That that that he's going to keep pitching well or
Speaker 2: potentially pitching well going forward.
Speaker 4: I mean, for me, I was surprised. I've actually thought
Speaker 4: he threw a lot better than I thought he would throw.
Speaker 4: I honestly, I honestly thought that he was going to
Speaker 4: struggle more. And the fact that he did not have
Speaker 4: his best pitch, Literally, his best pitch is a split.
Speaker 4: I mean, there's no that's no secret, and for him
Speaker 4: to be able to work around that, not to have
Speaker 4: a feel for it and actually pitch effectively. He effectively
Speaker 4: had a quality start until he didn't have a quality
Speaker 4: start and that last inning and made one bad pitch
Speaker 4: to a guy who was swinging out of his rear
Speaker 4: end to try to hit him run, and he threw
Speaker 4: a fastball basically sinker that sank right back into the
Speaker 4: middle I mean center cut into the middle of the plate.
Speaker 1: I just felt like.
Speaker 4: I just felt like he threw a lot better than
Speaker 4: I even expected, honestly, and you know it's going to
Speaker 4: allow him to continue to pitch, and he pitches like that.
Speaker 4: If he can throw six innings of three run baseball,
Speaker 4: oh my goodness, as a number five starter, as.
Speaker 2: The number five starter, right, I think people need to
Speaker 2: remember that he's probably the number five starter on this
Speaker 2: steam because you don't need hi go.
Speaker 1: No, he's not. He's not getting paid to be a
Speaker 1: number five starter, but that doesn't matter. He's a starter
Speaker 1: on the on the staff.
Speaker 3: And so the money, the money's been paid. It doesn't
Speaker 3: matter what really fits. As long as he can give
Speaker 3: you six innings. You know he's getting that money regardless.
Speaker 1: That's correct, that's correct, And he's been he's listened.
Speaker 7: He's benefited from a lot of run support, run.
Speaker 4: Support, and that's fine. But if he can if he
Speaker 4: can give you six quality innings every time, out, my goodness,
Speaker 4: there's a whole slew of teams that would love that.
Speaker 5: Definitely something to build on for the for the young man,
Speaker 5: I mean, definitely something to build on if he's especially
Speaker 5: if he can separate the first six innings from the
Speaker 5: going off for the seventh and you can see him
Speaker 5: wobbling a little bit there. I think they could even
Speaker 5: get him out of there a batter earlier. But nonetheless,
Speaker 5: I think he should come out of there with something
Speaker 5: to feel good about, something to build on.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was just a little surprised that he didn't,
Speaker 4: that they didn't have somebody warming and ready that after
Speaker 4: the first couple of batters, I probably would have taken
Speaker 4: him out. I don't like like the question Rob Thompson
Speaker 4: because Rob has done a very very nice job. But
Speaker 4: in that situation, and Rob talks about it a lot,
Speaker 4: you know, I want to sort of want to make
Speaker 4: feel make him feel good about his outing. I know
Speaker 4: it's a veteran guy, it's not that big of a
Speaker 4: deal for him, but I bet if it was Christopher Sanchez,
Speaker 4: he probably would not have started that inning.
Speaker 1: But uh uh. That said that said, I thought I thought.
Speaker 4: Maybe that he might get pulled, that somebody would be
Speaker 4: ready if he faltered the first couple of hitters. Why
Speaker 4: put yourself in danger, get him out of there, and
Speaker 4: like let him have a you know, feel good, feel
Speaker 4: good about himself moment.
Speaker 2: So the Phillies opening a three game series Monday night
Speaker 2: in Anaheim. Angels again, another team that the Phillies on paper,
Speaker 2: should be.
Speaker 1: Able to beat.
Speaker 3: They have lost nine out of their last ten. They've
Speaker 3: lost four in a row.
Speaker 2: It's Christopher Sanchez Monday Night versus Griffin Canning, right hander.
Speaker 2: He's one of three at the seven to five o
Speaker 2: e r A Tuesday, Spencer Turnbull getting another shot, his
Speaker 2: last start for a while. If they go back to
Speaker 2: the five man against Tyler Anderson, who's off their pretty
Speaker 2: decent start, and then the series finale Zach Wheeler versus
Speaker 2: Patrick Sandoval. This is only the fourth time the Phillies
Speaker 2: have ever played in Anaheim. Do you know that they
Speaker 2: have not won a game in Anaheim since two thousand
Speaker 2: and three. I was not on that two thousand and
Speaker 2: three trip. I was at the Inquire at the time.
Speaker 2: That was my first year on the beat. Jim Salisbury
Speaker 2: covered that series for me and one of my favorite,
Speaker 2: one of my favorite stories comes from a series I
Speaker 2: was not at.
Speaker 3: Jim, do you know what I'm talking about? That road trip,
Speaker 3: that series in the Anaheim?
Speaker 5: I do remember that trip was Yeah, it was good.
Speaker 5: It was a Monday Tuesday Wednesday series, right, I think so?
Speaker 5: And so, Yeah, Larry Bow and I banged heads a
Speaker 5: little bit on that he was managing the team, and
Speaker 5: I had I had written something during the week that
Speaker 5: ticked him off. So and I had written it in
Speaker 5: my Sunday column in the Inquirer. And uh So the
Speaker 5: team does the clips, all the things that are written
Speaker 5: about the team and all the newspapers and stuff. They
Speaker 5: print them out and stay them together. And so Larry
Speaker 5: they they played a home game on Sunday and Larry
Speaker 5: took the clips on the plane and apparently he read
Speaker 5: something that I wrote and he didn't like. And, as
Speaker 5: John Vukovich later told me, like steam was coming out
Speaker 5: of his ears for five hours.
Speaker 1: You had that you had effect on people.
Speaker 5: You did a few times too, Joe.
Speaker 1: Let's just have you now what's that You did that
Speaker 1: to me a few times too.
Speaker 5: So yeah, so he had about five hours of steam coming.
Speaker 5: So I walked in the clubhouse the next day and
Speaker 5: John Vukovic, who we all loved dearly, gave me a
Speaker 5: little heads up. I actually thought he was kidna at first.
Speaker 5: He said, hey, watch it, he's he's waiting on you,
Speaker 5: and I'm like, so I stepped in the office and
Speaker 5: he unloads on me. Peter Pascarelli was there, and Peter's
Speaker 5: an old hardened ball rider, and he was shaking. This
Speaker 5: is how mad Larry was. He had vain sticking out
Speaker 5: of all parts of his head as he's screaming and
Speaker 5: yelling at me. And then he tried to he kind
Speaker 5: of came at me. I thought he was gonna punch me,
Speaker 5: but he was trying to like slam the door in
Speaker 5: my face and get me out of his office because
Speaker 5: he was sick of looking at me. So there was
Speaker 5: a rubber stopper and there he couldn't get the rubber
Speaker 5: stopper out, so he just blew up and throws me
Speaker 5: out of his office. And so they were kind of
Speaker 5: a cold war for two days in Anaheim. And he
Speaker 5: gave you the breeze. I got some freeze. He got
Speaker 5: the breed evil looks, and you know, meanwhile Vukevich is
Speaker 5: over there laughing, you know, but Larry was really upset
Speaker 5: at me. So the third day I come in the
Speaker 5: clubhouse and I kind of poked my head in the
Speaker 5: office and we decided, you know, as old baseball people do,
Speaker 5: and you clear the air, which and it's over. So
Speaker 5: we we had a little talk and we cleared the air.
Speaker 5: He saw where I was coming from. I saw where
Speaker 5: he was coming from, and it was kind of it
Speaker 5: was kind of all good. And and Vukevich comes down
Speaker 5: the hallway and pokes his head in and uh, he says,
Speaker 5: I just want to make sure everything's all right here.
Speaker 5: Larry pats me on the bank, goes tough love. I'm
Speaker 5: tough love straightening them out, and uh. As I'm walking
Speaker 5: out of the room. This was a Wednesday, Thursdays and
Speaker 5: off day. As I'm walking out of Larry's office, he goes,
Speaker 5: make sure you're in Cincinnati Friday night. I'm leading off
Speaker 5: of BRAU because at that time there was this debate
Speaker 5: that had this monstrous on base percentage and there was
Speaker 5: a lot of people wanting to hit lead off n
Speaker 5: O three. And he says, I make sure in Cincinnati Friday,
Speaker 5: then I'm gonna lead off a breo. So I'm like, hmm.
Speaker 5: So he went from wanting to kill me to dropping
Speaker 5: a story in my lap. And so I had off
Speaker 5: Days story. I wrote like I kind of knew, like
Speaker 5: you know, to couch it a little bit, but I wrote,
Speaker 5: you know, been rumored for a while and talked about
Speaker 5: for a while, but don't be surprised. At Friday Night,
Speaker 5: Larry bau leads off Bobby A Bray and I and
Speaker 5: they went into Cincinnati and sure enough, Bobby Abrao led
Speaker 5: off and they got beat fifteen to one. He did
Speaker 5: well so so that he got off like five games
Speaker 5: and that was it.
Speaker 1: And that brings up that brings up the other story.
Speaker 1: The other story.
Speaker 4: Part of that is that I don't think he ever
Speaker 4: told Bobby a Bray who was going to lead him off.
Speaker 4: He didn't have that discussion with him, and he was
Speaker 4: sort of taken by surprise, and that was like it
Speaker 4: was a thing because he had not been necessarily promised
Speaker 4: that I get.
Speaker 1: The thought was he was promised to be the three
Speaker 1: hole hitter and.
Speaker 4: That's not really I mean, that's where Bobby was used
Speaker 4: to hitting, that's where he wanted to hit, and uh,
Speaker 4: and there was a lot of pride in that. But
Speaker 4: I don't think bo ever literally talk to him about it.
Speaker 4: I don't even know that he mentioned it to him
Speaker 4: and all of a sudden boom, Yeah, it's great that
Speaker 4: he talked to you about because I'm not sure if.
Speaker 1: He told Bobby. He let him know.
Speaker 3: He let him know through the inquiry the off the
Speaker 3: inquir story.
Speaker 5: There you go. So that was that's great ballpark. You
Speaker 5: played in that ballpark as a rookie, Rubin.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I sure did.
Speaker 4: And I mean it's gone through a whole slew of
Speaker 4: transformations and changes, much much prettier now than it was
Speaker 4: back then. But yeah, that's when I got my very
Speaker 4: first my debut. I was pinch running for Dave Parker.
Speaker 4: Dave Parker let off, Dave Parker let off with a
Speaker 4: rocket to write.
Speaker 1: We were down by a run.
Speaker 4: And this is actually it's an interesting story. I mean,
Speaker 4: you want to hear their story because it's kind of funny.
Speaker 4: The Dave Parker, Dave Parker, it's a bullet to right.
Speaker 4: I come in to pinch ront my very first I
Speaker 4: literally could not feel my feet on the ground. I
Speaker 4: could not feel when I came out of the dugout.
Speaker 4: I couldn't feel my feet. They bumped me over to
Speaker 4: second base sacrifice moved me over. I think it was
Speaker 4: Dick Schofielder, whoever it was, but moved me over. I'm
Speaker 4: at second they almost slid past the bag. I never
Speaker 4: knew how like you know, the ground in Major League
Speaker 4: Baseball was. And I almost slid past the bag. Next
Speaker 4: guy hits like a hump back line drive that Henneman
Speaker 4: was against Detroit. Henneman almost catches, and so I have
Speaker 4: to freeze on it. I can't score because Gary Pettis
Speaker 4: is the center fielder. It's first and third, one out.
Speaker 4: Next guy is Max Ventable.
Speaker 1: And he hits an absolute rocket for a double play,
Speaker 1: and we lose the game.
Speaker 4: I get one of my coaches come up to me
Speaker 4: afterwards and goes, you know, you know, do you think
Speaker 4: they remember you if you got doubled off in that situation,
Speaker 4: or if you.
Speaker 1: If I got doubled off, I would have been crucified.
Speaker 1: Are you kidding me?
Speaker 4: And it's like he was sort of blaming me for
Speaker 4: not for freezing on the line drive and not scoring
Speaker 4: on a base to center field because it wasn't hit
Speaker 4: all that well, but Henneman like flagged at it and
Speaker 4: almost almost caught it. So I froze and then it
Speaker 4: went to third base, so Bobby Kanopp could not score me.
Speaker 4: And then Venable hits a bullet the second base first,
Speaker 4: four to sixty three, and.
Speaker 1: The game's over. Do you know that that was Jeter Hines?
Speaker 4: So Jeter Hines was one of my coaches in the
Speaker 4: minor leagues, and he came up to me and said,
Speaker 4: like like, he told me I made a base running mistake.
Speaker 1: Do you know that?
Speaker 4: Literally twenty years later, twenty years later after that play,
Speaker 4: I saw him.
Speaker 1: I was a GM. Then I go to LA and
Speaker 1: he's working for the Los Angeles Dodgers. He came up
Speaker 1: to me. To his credit, this is not a lie.
Speaker 1: He came up to me and said, you know, I
Speaker 1: have something to apologize to you about. Wow, So what
Speaker 1: is it?
Speaker 4: He?
Speaker 1: He said, you know, I told you you.
Speaker 4: Made a mister to base running mistake, and I have
Speaker 4: not slept thinking about that play for like twenty years.
Speaker 4: He said, you absolutely made the right base running play.
Speaker 1: And we were so pissed off that.
Speaker 4: You couldn't score on that play and now rightfully so,
Speaker 4: and that we lost that game because of the next
Speaker 4: hitter hit a double play to end the game, that
Speaker 4: we had to find somebody to blame, and for some
Speaker 4: reason we blamed you. And the reality of it was
Speaker 4: that I and I knew in my heart of hearts,
Speaker 4: you know, when you're a rookie, you know you don't
Speaker 4: you're sort of you know, you don't want to make
Speaker 4: any mistakes, you know. It's a little well for him
Speaker 4: to have done that and to come to me and
Speaker 4: apologize to me about it. I swear to God because
Speaker 4: I thought that about that for years. That was my
Speaker 4: very first appearance as a major league player. And then
Speaker 4: for them to come to me after the game and
Speaker 4: tell me I screwed it up when I was actually
Speaker 4: a pretty good base runner generally, and that was sort
Speaker 4: of one of the things I did well as a
Speaker 4: as a minor league player and and and as an
Speaker 4: eventual major league player. For them to for him to
Speaker 4: find for them to first of all blame me for
Speaker 4: a play that was not to be blamed for.
Speaker 1: That may that hurt for a long time. And for
Speaker 1: him to have apologized later on about that, that was
Speaker 1: pretty cool.
Speaker 5: I was amazed. I couldn't even believe that he remembered
Speaker 5: the play.
Speaker 1: I couldn't even be and and for him to have
Speaker 1: done that was was actually really cool.
Speaker 5: That's a great I gotta I gotta tell this story.
Speaker 5: So you mentioned Max Venable. Yeah, so a few years ago,
Speaker 5: the Phillies bring in his son Will Venable for late
Speaker 5: a late spring training yea try out I don't know
Speaker 5: what you call it, minor league contract. He's gonna he's
Speaker 5: gonna come in for a week to see if you
Speaker 5: make the team.
Speaker 1: So how dare you, Jim, I gotta tell this, how
Speaker 1: dare you?
Speaker 5: So they signed Will and and I'm talking to Todd
Speaker 5: like an hour later, and he goes, they signed Will Vetable.
Speaker 5: I go, it's He goes, what I said, it's pronounced.
Speaker 5: It's spelt v E n A b l A. And
Speaker 5: he's like, he goes, I thought it was Vetable. I said, no,
Speaker 5: it's it's it's Vanoble. He goes, Really, I never knew that.
Speaker 5: So now the day our day go this is he
Speaker 5: goes on. We're up in the press box, in and
Speaker 5: out of the clubhouse. We're finally gonna at like four thirty,
Speaker 5: we're gonna meet with Pete mccannon. They signed the guy
Speaker 5: at nine in the morning. I was four thirty and
Speaker 5: we're gonna talk to Pete mccannon. And we're down the
Speaker 5: left field line in clear Water and Tots Todd says, uh,
Speaker 5: what are your plans for.
Speaker 1: What? He looks at him like he's.
Speaker 5: Got ten heads. Henobly his name is Venable. I immediately
Speaker 5: turn a Jim. I'm like, I am gonna murder you.
Speaker 1: I am.
Speaker 5: I didn't know about that one. That's so good, the
Speaker 5: little things you do to keep your sanity on a
Speaker 5: baseball beat.
Speaker 1: Oh man, that's great.
Speaker 3: Man, that's a great way to end it.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness. Well, thanks everybody for listening.
Speaker 3: We will be back with you later this week.