WEBVTT - 9021One on One: Michael Lange 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:10.080 It's nine o one with Jenny Garth and Tory spelling. Okay, 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:13.360 you guys, this has been a big one. We had Peppergate, 0:00:14.000 --> 0:00:19.759 and Michael Lang, the director, is here today to talk 0:00:19.760 --> 0:00:21.760 to us about what really happened. 0:00:21.920 --> 0:00:23.520 He's going to set the record straight. 0:00:24.000 --> 0:00:24.599 That's right. 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:28.280 Hey, Michael Lang, Hey, Hey. 0:00:28.840 --> 0:00:31.240 How's how come I'm the only one that looks older? 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:34.800 You really don't you look the same. 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:38.080 This was all dark when you last. 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:43.040 Saw me, all your beard hairs, your beard hairs. 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:44.640 And there was more of this. 0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:48.720 Oh boy, you really don't look older. Like to think 0:00:48.720 --> 0:00:52.080 that it was thirty years ago. My gosh, well not 0:00:52.120 --> 0:00:53.720 the last time we saw you, because we saw you 0:00:53.840 --> 0:00:55.080 the season ten. 0:00:55.760 --> 0:00:56.080 Right, but. 0:00:58.000 --> 0:00:59.840 Oh my goodness, where do we start? 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:03.640 Oh god, should. 0:01:03.400 --> 0:01:05.080 We start with our email exchange? 0:01:05.400 --> 0:01:06.360 Let's just start with that. 0:01:06.800 --> 0:01:12.160 Okay. So obviously our fans know that we had an 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:18.119 incident that we now have called Peppergate where we talked 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:24.360 to a guest star and he from you know, gave 0:01:24.440 --> 0:01:27.520 his perception of how what it was like being on set. 0:01:28.680 --> 0:01:31.200 It started with a story of Shannon coming in with 0:01:31.280 --> 0:01:34.520 a Boa constrictor is that right, Jen, yep? Around her neck, 0:01:34.640 --> 0:01:40.120 around her neck, which you don't remember. 0:01:39.920 --> 0:01:45.560 A constrictor at all on set? No, was it a constrictor? 0:01:45.600 --> 0:01:45.640 No? 0:01:45.760 --> 0:01:50.240 Maybe it was a python constrictor on your neck? You 0:01:50.720 --> 0:01:52.720 I would kill you, It. 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:55.640 Would definitely kill you. Maybe not Hannon, though it might 0:01:55.720 --> 0:01:57.000 kill the bullet constrictor. 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:03.880 Oh man, Yeah, so okay, go on, there was a 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:05.040 deadly bow. 0:02:06.640 --> 0:02:10.040 Because Jen knows I usually have a pretty good memory 0:02:10.080 --> 0:02:12.400 about stuff, and as he started to tell this story, 0:02:12.720 --> 0:02:14.920 I even went, I don't remember that. 0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:17.600 We didn't know that. Neither of us remember the snake. 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:23.160 Yeah, and that's a pretty major thing. So maybe we 0:02:23.200 --> 0:02:26.160 should have started there being like, hmm, things are a 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:29.880 little off. Then it obviously we went into talking about 0:02:29.880 --> 0:02:32.560 he and I. He was the ski instructor and we 0:02:32.600 --> 0:02:35.480 had a romantic scene in front of the fireplace, but 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:37.440 I was still Donna was still in love with David, 0:02:38.000 --> 0:02:43.320 and he told a story that he uh that you 0:02:43.480 --> 0:02:45.840 told me that it was great. I should put the 0:02:45.840 --> 0:02:48.160 scene on my reel. And then when I left the 0:02:48.240 --> 0:02:50.240 set that you said, I don't know why she's on 0:02:50.280 --> 0:02:50.680 the show. 0:02:54.360 --> 0:02:58.760 I don't mean to laugh. I looked at the scene 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:02.359 this morning, because you know, directors, we like the prep. 0:03:04.080 --> 0:03:05.960 So I looked at the scene, and it hit me 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:08.280 when I was looking at the scene. First of all, 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:11.720 it was a nice scene. The fire was excellent, and 0:03:11.760 --> 0:03:14.640 I loved my first shot. I'm a genius, my first 0:03:14.680 --> 0:03:17.520 shot pulling back from the fire to that beautiful two 0:03:17.600 --> 0:03:19.720 shot of the two of you. And then the scene 0:03:19.720 --> 0:03:23.560 starts and I'm thinking, well, Tory, he's really good. She's good. 0:03:24.000 --> 0:03:26.679 And then I'm thinking, and he's met kind of mad. 0:03:26.800 --> 0:03:29.440 I mean, he's very handsome, but kind of med. So 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:33.040 I realized what it was. I have no analysis of 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:35.680 the python thing that I can't figure out at all, 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:39.800 but I know exactly what it was he was projecting 0:03:40.960 --> 0:03:43.960 because in his head he was thinking, why am I 0:03:44.080 --> 0:03:50.280 on the show? And after thirty years he somehow spun 0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:53.640 it in his head too that I said, why is 0:03:53.680 --> 0:03:56.119 she on the show? When what I probably what he 0:03:56.200 --> 0:03:59.040 really was hearing was why is he on the show? 0:04:00.560 --> 0:04:04.320 Which actually dovetails with a story because I this is 0:04:04.400 --> 0:04:07.520 so funny that this came up, because there's a story 0:04:07.560 --> 0:04:11.200 I tell about the casting experience from our side of 0:04:11.280 --> 0:04:14.720 the of the room, and that's one of the stories 0:04:14.760 --> 0:04:17.920 I tell his casting session because. 0:04:17.680 --> 0:04:20.200 You cast him right in your episode. 0:04:20.279 --> 0:04:23.360 Okay, this is the this is it's amazing that this 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:27.680 came up with this guy. So basically, Chuck Rosen was 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:29.640 in on the casting session. He did not come to 0:04:29.680 --> 0:04:31.440 all of them, but I think because it was a 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:33.920 scene with you, and it was, you know, a pretty 0:04:33.920 --> 0:04:36.760 important you know, not a huge amount of scenes that 0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:40.359 he had, but important that you had made the decision 0:04:40.880 --> 0:04:44.159 even though there was some kind of chemistry between you 0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:46.880 and the ski guy, but that your heart really belonged 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:49.760 to David. So it was an important scene, a pivotal 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:53.880 decision on Donna's part. So Chuck wanted to be there 0:04:53.880 --> 0:04:56.680 to make sure that we cast the right guy. So 0:04:56.839 --> 0:04:58.839 we saw a bunch of guys and he comes in 0:04:59.080 --> 0:05:03.960 and he was very good, and so we finished and 0:05:03.960 --> 0:05:05.839 I didn't really have any notes for him, but Chuck says, 0:05:05.880 --> 0:05:08.120 can I is it okay if I give him a note? 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:10.279 So I'm like, I mean, he's you know, Chuck was 0:05:10.320 --> 0:05:13.920 the exact producer, so what I thought it was nice 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:17.080 for him to ask, So I said, yeah, of course. 0:05:17.920 --> 0:05:19.880 So he says, and this is so funny because it's 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:22.359 such a producer note as opposed to I mean, a 0:05:22.400 --> 0:05:25.119 director would never give a note like this. But the Chuck. 0:05:25.680 --> 0:05:29.520 He said it was really good. So he whatever he 0:05:29.640 --> 0:05:31.760 learned in his produce how to how to cast when 0:05:31.800 --> 0:05:34.880 you're a producer, give him a nice compliment first, that's 0:05:34.920 --> 0:05:38.479 the same in directing school. So he said, it was 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:43.280 really good. But this guy, this guy is just a 0:05:43.279 --> 0:05:46.279 boot guy, and he's only ever going to be a 0:05:46.279 --> 0:05:48.520 boot guy. He's never going to be like an assistant 0:05:48.560 --> 0:05:50.960 manager of the place. He's just going to always be 0:05:51.080 --> 0:05:55.400 the boot guy. And I got the feeling from you 0:05:55.400 --> 0:05:57.920 your performance that you were going to be more than 0:05:57.920 --> 0:06:00.800 a boot guy. But that's not what I'm looking for it. 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:05.160 I'm looking for just the boot guy. And in my mind, 0:06:05.160 --> 0:06:09.000 I'm thinking, I kind of get what he's saying, But 0:06:09.720 --> 0:06:14.400 how is an actor supposed to assimilate that note? I mean, 0:06:15.360 --> 0:06:17.240 it takes a lot. There's a lot to unpack there, 0:06:17.480 --> 0:06:20.000 and it's not just about the boots in the in 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:22.920 the box. But so that's what he says, right, So 0:06:24.320 --> 0:06:28.000 to his credit, to Pepper's credit, he just nodded and oh, okay, 0:06:28.120 --> 0:06:31.159 I got it, and he did it again and it 0:06:31.160 --> 0:06:34.960 seemed dissatisfied Chuck, and he left and he got the part, obviously, 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:38.800 So now we shoot the scene and the next day 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:41.280 I got a call from Chuck. He says, you know what, Michael, 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:46.280 I guess the guy just didn't really take my note 0:06:46.279 --> 0:06:48.280 to heart because he still felt like he was going 0:06:48.360 --> 0:06:54.240 to be more than a boot guy. Oh my god, 0:06:54.960 --> 0:06:57.880 I'm like, oh God, bless him. You know, Chuck, he's, 0:06:57.920 --> 0:06:59.880 you know, such a great you know, such a great 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:01.480 hearted guy. 0:07:02.200 --> 0:07:04.000 All I ever wanted to be was just the boot 0:07:04.040 --> 0:07:05.120 guy guy. 0:07:05.200 --> 0:07:08.080 And believe it or not, whenever I occasionally do you know, 0:07:09.200 --> 0:07:12.119 panels or whatever with actors and wanting to know about 0:07:12.120 --> 0:07:14.800 the audition process, I always tell that. 0:07:14.760 --> 0:07:19.480 Story, just the boots man, just the boots. So what 0:07:19.520 --> 0:07:20.440 did that mean to him? 0:07:20.480 --> 0:07:23.240 That meant like reel it back, or don't don't be 0:07:23.440 --> 0:07:26.800 so high on yourself, or don't feel like matter what 0:07:26.840 --> 0:07:27.600 was Yeah? 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:30.160 I think I think what Chuck meant was he he 0:07:30.240 --> 0:07:33.440 felt like he was a little too yeah, high engaged. 0:07:34.760 --> 0:07:37.720 He's just he's just fitting her for boots and that's it. 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:39.600 And then making out there. 0:07:39.600 --> 0:07:41.640 And then making out with her. And I don't know 0:07:41.680 --> 0:07:43.920 where the boots came into the making out scene, but 0:07:45.160 --> 0:07:49.320 you know, producer notes, they're very strange. But anyway, so 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:52.200 it's funny that thirty years later, this guy pops up 0:07:52.200 --> 0:07:55.440 and there's a big controversy now with me. And also 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:57.960 I loved when he said because I listened to a 0:07:58.000 --> 0:08:00.960 bit of the podcast, you know, your podcast about with 0:08:01.080 --> 0:08:02.920 him saying and I love that he said. I was 0:08:02.960 --> 0:08:07.320 there saying, oh, baby, yeah, that's really great. That's really doll, Doll. 0:08:08.520 --> 0:08:11.559 I'm thinking I don't think I ever would ever, That's 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:14.520 not in my little package of tricks. 0:08:15.200 --> 0:08:17.240 Just say hey, doll, just say it one time. 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:23.920 Right, Hey, hey, there you go. The only person I 0:08:24.000 --> 0:08:29.920 call doll is Patty Lapone, and I don't need It's 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:31.800 not even doll with her, it's doll. 0:08:32.280 --> 0:08:37.400 It's all, Oh my goodness. Well, I obviously got very 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:41.000 reactive during that episode because you and I always had 0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:45.360 such a great relationship. To this day, whenever I think 0:08:45.400 --> 0:08:50.920 of our directors in our experience, you come to mind, 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:55.320 it was just we we were friends. You were great 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:59.000 at getting all of us, and we, I don't know, 0:08:59.040 --> 0:09:02.199 we just felt our best we're with you. So during 0:09:02.200 --> 0:09:04.560 our email exchange, I felt bad because we did have 0:09:04.600 --> 0:09:06.920 a moment where you said you felt a little hurt 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:10.280 that after all that relationship we had for ten years, 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:13.160 that we immediately believed this guy, and I think it 0:09:13.200 --> 0:09:15.640 was just a re and I apologize for that because 0:09:15.640 --> 0:09:18.440 I was very reactive. I was like, oh my gosh, 0:09:18.480 --> 0:09:20.000 and I thought about it and I was so upset 0:09:20.040 --> 0:09:22.880 and I told Jen I'm so upset afterwards, and then 0:09:23.600 --> 0:09:27.440 our producer Amy and I actually talked after that show, 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:30.040 and she said, Okay, let's just talk it out for 0:09:30.080 --> 0:09:33.920 a second. Even if he thought that for a second, 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:37.559 no one would be that stupid to say it out 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:40.360 loud in an open set about the boss's daughter. And 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:43.800 I was like, who yeah, okay, take myself out of 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:47.360 it and how I was feeling, You're right, so even 0:09:47.360 --> 0:09:49.480 if it was just that and you really thought I sucked. 0:09:49.520 --> 0:09:53.240 But and then Michael said, I said, my eighteen year 0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:56.400 old self is still like holding onto that, and was like, 0:09:56.440 --> 0:09:58.400 oh my god, maybe I sucked. And I was the 0:09:58.440 --> 0:10:01.920 producer's daughter, so was it whole horrible? And Michael Lange 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:04.120 told me to shut the tell my age yearl self 0:10:04.120 --> 0:10:08.239 to shut the fuck up, and I was like, you're right, yeah, 0:10:08.240 --> 0:10:08.720 that's right. 0:10:10.920 --> 0:10:13.400 Well, I feel I feel better now that you guys 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:14.199 have cleared that up. 0:10:14.520 --> 0:10:15.959 Okay, I feel. 0:10:15.800 --> 0:10:17.920 Better, Okay, I feel better too. 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:21.840 I do, because you didn't dis direct that episode. You 0:10:21.960 --> 0:10:26.040 directed thirty No. Twelve more episodes after that, exactly, exactly, 0:10:26.040 --> 0:10:29.040 over the span of season four, all the way to season. 0:10:28.720 --> 0:10:29.840 Ten, exactly. 0:10:30.600 --> 0:10:33.199 That's a long run for That. 0:10:33.200 --> 0:10:34.640 Was one of my first ones. 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:39.720 I think season Yeah, Peppercaine, Yeah. 0:10:40.000 --> 0:10:41.840 Yeah, because it was right, it was sort of I 0:10:41.840 --> 0:10:46.240 guess midway through season four, seventeen was it? Episode seventeen 0:10:46.400 --> 0:10:49.800 was in it? Yeah, whatever it was. And then the 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.600 irony of it is, you know, as I said in 0:10:52.600 --> 0:10:56.480 my email to you or whatever the Instagram thing I said, 0:10:56.520 --> 0:10:58.839 you know, there were people who said that, who thought, 0:10:59.080 --> 0:11:01.320 not only thought, but said, you know, she only got 0:11:01.320 --> 0:11:04.120 the job because she's the boss's daughter. And the irony 0:11:05.480 --> 0:11:09.080 of now I forgot his name, Pepper, the irony of 0:11:09.120 --> 0:11:13.440 Pepper's story is that I if I ever heard anyone 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:17.720 say that, I would again go down their throat. And 0:11:17.760 --> 0:11:21.559 because you know, I thought you were fantastic in that part, 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:25.040 I mean, you were, Donna. I don't I can't, you know, 0:11:25.200 --> 0:11:28.520 I can't imagine anyone doing that part better than you 0:11:28.559 --> 0:11:29.920 bringing that that person to. 0:11:29.960 --> 0:11:31.520 Life, thank you. 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:34.480 That's why I got so pissed off when people would 0:11:34.679 --> 0:11:36.520 bring that up, and I said, I don't want to 0:11:36.520 --> 0:11:38.480 hear that around me. Don't ever say that to me. 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:41.800 But I get it, and we know that exists. And 0:11:41.840 --> 0:11:46.440 when people, you know, work with people that are their family, 0:11:46.559 --> 0:11:48.240 there's always going to be someone that says it. And 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:52.280 it was something I always tried to excel at because 0:11:52.320 --> 0:11:55.000 I didn't want to ever just remain the boss's daughter. 0:11:55.080 --> 0:11:57.160 In fact, you know, like the first the pilot, there 0:11:57.200 --> 0:11:59.320 wasn't even a name. I was like Kelly's friend. It 0:11:59.360 --> 0:12:02.320 was like friend number one. And obviously I got that 0:12:02.360 --> 0:12:04.600 because of my dad. Like we tell funny stories, but 0:12:05.240 --> 0:12:08.720 you know, but I worked really hard and and I'm 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:13.000 proud of being Donna. So anyway, wait, so now that 0:12:13.040 --> 0:12:15.440 we cleared that up, we just want to we want 0:12:15.440 --> 0:12:18.040 you to tell fun stories about your time on the 0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:18.640 show with us. 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:21.840 Yeah, because when you came in, the show was already 0:12:22.360 --> 0:12:26.120 going well, Like it was already it was going, well, 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:27.199 how was it coming in? 0:12:28.760 --> 0:12:32.040 I was so excited to do the show because you know, 0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:35.400 it was a huge you know, it was culturally, you know, 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:38.440 it was just a huge show. And it was in 0:12:38.480 --> 0:12:42.000 fact I used subsequently in my career, I would always 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:44.199 use nine O two and zero, like when I did 0:12:44.240 --> 0:12:46.520 The OC. I did quite a few episodes of the OC, 0:12:47.120 --> 0:12:50.160 And when those actors would start kind of feeling themselves, 0:12:50.280 --> 0:12:55.640 I would say, well, I would, I would. I would say, 0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:57.760 do you know? And then I would bring up one 0:12:57.760 --> 0:12:59.920 of the characters whose name I won't mention, and he 0:13:00.600 --> 0:13:03.440 and this other actor on Nosie would say no, and 0:13:03.440 --> 0:13:06.679 I would say, exactly, so he was on nine o 0:13:06.800 --> 0:13:10.880 two or maybe she or maybe it I'm not gonna say, 0:13:11.280 --> 0:13:15.160 or another was on nine and oh. And this was 0:13:15.160 --> 0:13:17.880 only like ten years ago, and Nino two and oh 0:13:18.800 --> 0:13:23.240 was a huge hit, Like thirty million people every week 0:13:23.280 --> 0:13:26.600 would watch the show, and these actors could go nowhere 0:13:26.640 --> 0:13:31.440 in the world without being mob by fans. And our 0:13:31.520 --> 0:13:34.560 little show that oh see. You know, it's a it's 0:13:34.559 --> 0:13:37.760 a definitely popular show, but it's not even close to 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:39.880 nine O two and oh. And you don't know who 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:43.280 this person was who was on the show. So when 0:13:43.320 --> 0:13:47.439 you start feeling on your oats, just remember that dig in, 0:13:47.760 --> 0:13:51.360 be professional, do your job, and know that this is 0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:55.480 all fleeting, so don't feel so big about yourself. And 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:56.000 that's it. 0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:12.839 You always had a way of just like really speaking 0:14:12.920 --> 0:14:18.040 to the actors like they were your friends, like you're 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:22.080 very a commonality between you and them, and I think 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.880 that that is what always made you so liked by us, 0:14:26.400 --> 0:14:29.120 is that And we kind of let you in in 0:14:29.160 --> 0:14:31.320 a way that we probably didn't let other directors in. 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:36.680 Right. Well, you know, I try to be understanding of 0:14:36.760 --> 0:14:39.880 what goes on in actors' heads. I've done a little 0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:43.280 bit of acting myself, and it's always a crushing experience. 0:14:43.360 --> 0:14:48.640 So I appre no, I mean, I so like. The 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:51.480 other thing that would be would piss me off is 0:14:51.520 --> 0:14:54.640 when the crew would start complaining when an actor would say, 0:14:54.640 --> 0:14:58.280 you're in my eye line, and then the crew and 0:14:58.320 --> 0:15:01.120 I would shut them down to because I'm like, you 0:15:01.160 --> 0:15:06.040 know what, they have to create this world that excludes 0:15:06.720 --> 0:15:10.560 all of this equipment, lights, noises that come in, and 0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:13.800 they have to become a character that they're not and 0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:18.640 create this illusion for the audience and shut the fuck 0:15:18.760 --> 0:15:21.920 up with the eyeline thing whatever they need make that happen. 0:15:22.280 --> 0:15:26.640 It's so hard you can't even imagine. And you bitch 0:15:26.640 --> 0:15:31.440 about this, just shut up and you know, pull focus, okay, whatever, 0:15:31.800 --> 0:15:33.840 you know. It's like it's you know, I know, I'm 0:15:33.960 --> 0:15:36.880 very protective of actors, not that they need my protection, 0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:38.000 but okay, they do. 0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:41.680 Teddy Bear, Teddy Bear. 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:44.920 So basically here. So my thing about nine or two 0:15:44.960 --> 0:15:48.840 and zero, it's I loved the show. I loved everything 0:15:48.880 --> 0:15:52.640 about it. And one of the reasons is like, actually, 0:15:52.680 --> 0:15:55.360 I just drove by that street that we used to 0:15:55.400 --> 0:16:00.600 shoot on, yeah, Calvert, and whenever I drive by there, 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.480 I always think of movie magic to the max, because 0:16:04.720 --> 0:16:09.640 that was a pretty gnarly area and here we are. 0:16:09.680 --> 0:16:12.520 Do you ever think about the porn that was being filmed? 0:16:13.920 --> 0:16:17.760 Okay, I do think about airport flying overhead every. 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:21.880 Pat exactly, and that's another thing that you guys had 0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:26.000 to figure out how to exclude that from your magical 0:16:26.040 --> 0:16:28.840 world that you're creating in front of the camera. So 0:16:30.080 --> 0:16:33.240 whenever I drive by it, I think this show embodies 0:16:33.440 --> 0:16:36.520 movie magic, the height of movie magic, because there we 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:41.560 are across the street from a porn distributing company, driving 0:16:41.600 --> 0:16:43.880 through an area where we could just as soon get 0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:47.920 drugs or shot on the way to work. And then 0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:51.120 then we go into this stage, which admittedly, if you 0:16:51.160 --> 0:16:55.720 look beyond the actual sets, was pretty crappy, and we're 0:16:55.800 --> 0:17:02.600 creating this magical world of Beverly Hills, super spoiled you know, elite, 0:17:02.640 --> 0:17:06.840 not elite, but you know, privileged humans, and that's the 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:09.480 way we're creating. Then we walk outside of the real 0:17:09.520 --> 0:17:17.000 world to get it's like, oh. 0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:15.840 It is pretty funny when you think about it. 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:19.199 So and the thing about it is the show. What 0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:21.560 I loved about the show, one of the just in 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:25.199 the big general sense, was that it never pretended to 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:28.400 be anything more than what it was. It was very 0:17:28.520 --> 0:17:32.320 grounded in terms of what the show was trying to accomplish, 0:17:32.440 --> 0:17:35.320 what the goal was. From a production point of view, 0:17:35.480 --> 0:17:37.960 and even from an esthetic and creative point of view. 0:17:38.240 --> 0:17:42.200 It was not pretentious, even though it was about potentially 0:17:42.280 --> 0:17:45.840 pretentious people. But the show itself was always here, we're 0:17:45.880 --> 0:17:50.520 presenting this world to you. There it is, and either 0:17:50.640 --> 0:17:53.880 learn from it, not learn from it, enjoy it, whatever 0:17:54.280 --> 0:17:57.680 aspect that you get from watching a television show. It's 0:17:57.760 --> 0:17:59.760 yours for the taking. But we're not going to make 0:17:59.760 --> 0:18:02.520 any comment about it one way or the other, Whereas 0:18:02.560 --> 0:18:06.120 so many shows that I've worked on are just pretentious. 0:18:06.160 --> 0:18:09.520 I think we were so creating and we're so artsy fartsy, 0:18:09.640 --> 0:18:12.560 and it's like, come on, it's a TV show. It's 0:18:12.760 --> 0:18:15.399 entertained I'm not saying it's bad to be artistic, but 0:18:15.520 --> 0:18:20.120 don't you know, that's just part of what we do. 0:18:20.880 --> 0:18:24.639 And I think, right, you're right, And I'm not saying 0:18:24.680 --> 0:18:26.359 that nine to two and O was not. It was 0:18:26.520 --> 0:18:29.000 very art I mean, you know, we did cool shots 0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:32.040 and a lot of movement, and the performances were always 0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:35.800 dead on, and you know, the subject matter was important 0:18:35.840 --> 0:18:39.960 to people so and but it never presented itself as 0:18:40.080 --> 0:18:43.120 like all hoity toity. It was just here, here you go, 0:18:43.280 --> 0:18:45.360 here's our show. I dope you like it. 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:47.960 Seeing as you were on from season four to season intend, 0:18:47.960 --> 0:18:51.800 did you see the dynamic change within the the inner 0:18:51.840 --> 0:18:54.399 workings of the show throughout all those years, because there 0:18:54.400 --> 0:18:56.680 were so many internal changes, Yeah. 0:18:56.560 --> 0:18:58.879 Like with the cast, you mean general like you know, 0:18:59.040 --> 0:18:59.880 like or like. 0:19:02.320 --> 0:19:05.480 Actually believe it or not. And it's an interesting I 0:19:05.520 --> 0:19:08.280 never really thought about it, but a lot of shows 0:19:08.680 --> 0:19:11.880 within like after the first season, it's like a marriage, 0:19:11.920 --> 0:19:15.159 Like the first season is sort of the honeymoon, and 0:19:16.119 --> 0:19:18.600 then then it goes into oh, it's just nice, it's 0:19:18.600 --> 0:19:21.480 a nice, comfortable and then you end up hating each 0:19:21.520 --> 0:19:26.000 other everyone. But that never really happened as far as 0:19:26.040 --> 0:19:28.440 I know on nine o two, and oh, I think 0:19:28.480 --> 0:19:30.359 everyone pretty much got along. 0:19:31.240 --> 0:19:34.639 The people came, and people came and went, you know, 0:19:34.760 --> 0:19:37.680 and nobody was there that didn't want to be there. 0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:40.439 I think, yeah, So I think it was great and 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:43.679 the same with the crew was always great. And I 0:19:43.680 --> 0:19:46.119 think it's you know, a lot of it. I think 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:49.240 was also a lot of it, Torri, was because of 0:19:49.280 --> 0:19:54.480 your dad, because there was like I remember, like I 0:19:54.560 --> 0:19:58.440 wanted this, uh this shot. We shot it. I don't 0:19:58.440 --> 0:20:00.280 know if you remember this. We shot it and at 0:20:00.400 --> 0:20:04.760 Lax one time and it was in terminal too, and 0:20:04.800 --> 0:20:06.720 I wanted to I thought when we were scouting and 0:20:06.720 --> 0:20:09.000 I said, oh, wouldn't it be cool if we saw 0:20:09.040 --> 0:20:11.359 a plane. There was these big bay windows at the 0:20:11.440 --> 0:20:13.320 end of the terminal and I said, oh, wouldn't it 0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:15.199 be cool if I panned with the plane and then 0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:18.359 tilt down and reveal the scene inside. And then the 0:20:18.359 --> 0:20:20.919 guy with us said, oh, well, the planes are on 0:20:20.960 --> 0:20:23.960 the ground by then, and I went, oh, okay. And 0:20:24.000 --> 0:20:25.639 then I said, well, what if we got a picture 0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:30.000 of a plane. And Tom Victor, who was the production designer, 0:20:30.680 --> 0:20:32.520 he said, oh, yeah we could, Yeah, let's do that. 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:35.359 So so now I go back and now I have 0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:38.399 to pitch it to Paul Wagner, and I can't remember 0:20:38.440 --> 0:20:41.520 the John Peree I think was the production manager the 0:20:43.520 --> 0:20:48.200 so so I pitched it to them and Paul says 0:20:48.200 --> 0:20:52.040 to me, and this is like the magic words. Do 0:20:52.080 --> 0:20:58.080 you think you could sell this to mister Spelling because 0:20:59.320 --> 0:21:02.479 that's always like so everything was within the framework of 0:21:03.240 --> 0:21:06.000 what's mister Spelling going to think? And it was funny 0:21:06.000 --> 0:21:08.440 that very few people ever called him Aaron. It was 0:21:08.480 --> 0:21:12.400 always mister Spelling or the mister was the other thing 0:21:12.480 --> 0:21:15.160 you could call him, the mister. I actually was finally 0:21:15.200 --> 0:21:17.879 allowed to call him Aaron. I did a pilot and 0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:20.720 I called I kept calling him mister Spelling, and he 0:21:20.760 --> 0:21:25.399 said just call me Aaron. I'm like, oh, that's like okay. 0:21:25.000 --> 0:21:27.119 That's so see, we didn't see that part. So in 0:21:27.200 --> 0:21:29.680 production they would still call him mister Spelling. 0:21:29.400 --> 0:21:33.760 Mister Spelling wild yeah and then but but that was 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:36.240 always sort of the hovering. That was the thing that 0:21:36.320 --> 0:21:39.520 hovered over everything. Was like if you if you're bad, 0:21:39.600 --> 0:21:42.080 you're going to have to talk to the mister or 0:21:42.119 --> 0:21:45.000 mister Spelling, And so no one ever wanted to have 0:21:45.040 --> 0:21:46.400 that conversation with him. 0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:50.719 What do you say, what happened with the plane? 0:21:51.000 --> 0:21:54.080 Oh well, so finally, so I pitched it, and so 0:21:54.240 --> 0:21:58.000 Paul wagged, or John Peay says to Tom how much 0:21:58.040 --> 0:22:00.200 is this going to cost? And Tom said about three 0:22:00.280 --> 0:22:05.600 hundred bucks. So literally, Paul says, for three hundred bucks, 0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:07.760 it's going to be worth it to see you two 0:22:07.800 --> 0:22:16.280 guys look like a bunch of idiots. And of course 0:22:16.640 --> 0:22:18.240 it worked like a charm. 0:22:18.480 --> 0:22:19.040