Speaker 1: From Marhart where Innovation of Money and Power Collie in
Speaker 1: Silicon Vallet NBN. This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde
Speaker 1: and Ed Ludlow.
Speaker 2: I'm Caroline Heine Bluemberg's world headquarters in New York. Ed Ludlow,
Speaker 2: He's off today. This is Bloomberg Technology coming up. Apple
Speaker 2: races to tweak it smart watch software a head of
Speaker 2: a US ban on its seventeen billion dollar business. Details ahead,
Speaker 2: and a conversation with the CEO of Massimo, which argues
Speaker 2: the device infringes its patterns. Meanwhile, Jeff Bezos's Blue Origin
Speaker 2: Rocket takes to the sky for the first time in
Speaker 2: fifteen months, paving the way for people to.
Speaker 3: Stop flying on New Shepherd again. Full coverage ahead.
Speaker 2: Plus we'll sit down with technology entrepreneur and investor Massello
Speaker 2: Clary as he returns to Soft Facts Open Opportunity Fund
Speaker 2: to support diverse founders. That comma say so much more
Speaker 2: coming up this how at first as a wait check
Speaker 2: on these markets as we've just been hearing from Alex
Speaker 2: and Guy Nazak is on quite a role. Then as
Speaker 2: that one hundred once again hitting that intra day record high,
Speaker 2: we're at up to tenths of a percent.
Speaker 3: The tenure yields actually pulling back.
Speaker 2: Looks still optimism there that the Federal Reserve is done
Speaker 2: on its rate height and actually going to be seeing
Speaker 2: some rate cuts as soon as maybe even March next year,
Speaker 2: some voices being put towards that. Today we look at
Speaker 2: New York crewed up more than two percent. This again
Speaker 2: a geopolitical tension on issue with the Red Sea and
Speaker 2: WORRI is that basically some of this traveling of oil
Speaker 2: is going to take that much longer if they are
Speaker 2: going to have to bypass that particular route. We look
Speaker 2: at what's happening in the world of crypto, because dollar's
Speaker 2: been falling away, but so too has bitcoin. We're down
Speaker 2: by some sevent tens percent, just still at that forty
Speaker 2: two three.
Speaker 3: Hundred dollars level.
Speaker 2: We'll have a dig in conversation on ultimately what the
Speaker 2: ETF is lined up to. Will we get a spot
Speaker 2: bitcoin ETF as soon as January as sanctioned by the seccene. Meanwhile,
Speaker 2: let's turn back to that Blue Origin return to flight
Speaker 2: after fifteen long months joining US now Space Capital founder
Speaker 2: and managing partnership. Anderson also the author of the space economy,
Speaker 2: and while the space economy got the return of a
Speaker 2: key player, how important was this to go as well
Speaker 2: as it seemingly did.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think, I mean it seemed to go flawlessly,
Speaker 4: and it's great to see. You know, it's after fifteen months.
Speaker 4: That's a pretty extended period for any vehicle to be offline.
Speaker 4: I think that a lot of that has to do with,
Speaker 4: you know, there's some some some regulatory checks that need
Speaker 4: to happen before a vehicle.
Speaker 5: Like this comes back online.
Speaker 4: But I also think that Blue Origin sort of in
Speaker 4: their culture and DNA since the beginning, it's very methodical
Speaker 4: and very slow, and so.
Speaker 5: They want to get everything right.
Speaker 4: Like slow as smooth and smooth as fast has been
Speaker 4: their model, and they used to actually stamp tortoises on
Speaker 4: the vehicle after successful flights. And so it's great to
Speaker 4: see it coming, you know, coming back on online. But
Speaker 4: I think you know, the company has big ambition, they're
Speaker 4: going to need to step it up, and so you know,
Speaker 4: they're making some moves to sort of help.
Speaker 5: Make that happen.
Speaker 2: And let's talk about those moves, because not only is
Speaker 2: there a point of the launch the twenty fourth as
Speaker 2: it was reusable rocket doing well, but ultimately a changing
Speaker 2: of the guard. Dave Limp goes from Amazon to become
Speaker 2: the helm of Blue Origin, and we hear from Jeff
Speaker 2: Bezos himself on certain podcasts saying we need to be
Speaker 2: more decisive. How are you going to see that become
Speaker 2: a reality?
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's great to see, you know, and I mean, look,
Speaker 4: you've got so interesting to see the juxtaposition between SpaceX
Speaker 4: and Blue Origin. Both of the companies were founded in
Speaker 4: two thousand and two, both of them have similar ambitions
Speaker 4: and actually similar funding. Bezos continues to invest heavily into
Speaker 4: Blue Origin, with another couple of billion dollars this year,
Speaker 4: which is brings US total investment into the company we
Speaker 4: estimate to be somewhere around ten billion dollars, which is
Speaker 4: actually slightly more than what SpaceX has raised. But if
Speaker 4: you look at the two companies and what they've achieved,
Speaker 4: you know, SpaceX is dominates the launch market. They're launching
Speaker 4: almost one hundred times this year. They're taking NASA astronauts
Speaker 4: to the Space station, delivering a cargo to the space station,
Speaker 4: launching high profile classified missions for the Department of Defense,
Speaker 4: and they're you know, in Pole position to land nas
Speaker 4: astronauts on the Moon. Meanwhile, Blue Origin has new Shepherd flying,
Speaker 4: and they have big aspirations and a lot of really
Speaker 4: interesting things that are in the works. But you know,
Speaker 4: twenty years later, you'd like to see some of those
Speaker 4: things start to come online. Fields like Bezos is very
Speaker 4: confident that their larger orbital vehicle is going to come
Speaker 4: online next year. So next year should be pretty big
Speaker 4: for the company to that.
Speaker 2: And I mean we remind of you as R and
Speaker 2: D through Space Angels, an investor in space X, and
Speaker 2: ultimately the business models are different, and there has been
Speaker 2: more of a focus on space tourism thus far coming
Speaker 2: from Blue Origin.
Speaker 3: But is there enough market share?
Speaker 2: Is there enough reward for this amount of players within
Speaker 2: the space de pardon upun.
Speaker 5: Oh sure? I mean, look, the world runs on space technology.
Speaker 4: GPS is the most visceral, sort of most personal example
Speaker 4: that you that you can give some most successful space
Speaker 4: technology and existence. It's generated trillions of dollars in economic
Speaker 4: value and some of the largest venture outcomes we've ever seen.
Speaker 4: So the space economy and the opportunity here is much
Speaker 4: larger than just rockets and satellite hardware. But with you know,
Speaker 4: with the launch today, and that's what we're talking about
Speaker 4: in launch SpaceX makes it look really easy that launch
Speaker 4: today was flawless, and it makes it.
Speaker 5: Look pretty easy.
Speaker 4: But of the one hundred plus launch companies that have
Speaker 4: raised twenty seven billion dollars over the last ten years,
Speaker 4: there are only three that are operational SpaceX, rocket Lab
Speaker 4: and New Shepherd if you count it as a suborbital vehicle,
Speaker 4: so there's actually only only two. So we'll see, you know,
Speaker 4: if Ula, which is using Blue Origins engines, comes online
Speaker 4: early next year. We'll see if New Blend comes online
Speaker 4: next year. But we could use some competition here. Competition
Speaker 4: spurs lower costs and more entrance and more innovation, and
Speaker 4: you know, with only a couple of privately funded players,
Speaker 4: we could definitely use some more.
Speaker 2: Is the venture capital there to back such new competition?
Speaker 2: Is it an international center of competition that we need
Speaker 2: to see?
Speaker 4: Well, so, we've been operating in space for decades, but
Speaker 4: it's only recently become a category for investment. Really on
Speaker 4: the heels of SpaceX, going from basically no private market activity,
Speaker 4: investment or entrepreneurial activity, you know, ten years ago, on
Speaker 4: the heels of SpaceX. We've now seen two hundred and
Speaker 4: eighty billion dollars invests to the eighteen hundred unique space
Speaker 4: companies over the last ten years. So there is a
Speaker 4: lot more activity happening today, and most of that is
Speaker 4: coming from venture capital. So three quarters of all of
Speaker 4: the rounds that have gone in that make up that
Speaker 4: two hundred eight billion are from venture capital and two
Speaker 4: thirds of the capitol it's coming from venture capital. So
Speaker 4: and a lot of that action is happening in the US,
Speaker 4: a significant portion of it, but this is an international play.
Speaker 4: Geopolitics is playing into this in a major way. Governments
Speaker 4: around the world are starting to into the importance of
Speaker 4: space technology and they are prioritizing its protection, knowing that
Speaker 4: it gives us positioning, geospatial intelligence and intelligence about the
Speaker 4: movement of goods and activity on the Earth's surface. And
Speaker 4: also it's connecting us now through satellite connectivity, through initiatives
Speaker 4: like Starlink, helping to keep the Ukrainians connected, for example,
Speaker 4: but connecting the remote parts of the planet as well.
Speaker 4: So this is critical national infrastructure, not just for the
Speaker 4: US but for many countries, and we're seeing increased activity
Speaker 4: across the globe.
Speaker 2: Whether it comes from Jeff Bezos, whether it comes from Amazon,
Speaker 2: Project Kaiper, whether it comes from SpaceX, and indeed more
Speaker 2: broadly abroad as well, Chad Anderson is so good to
Speaker 2: catch up with you. Thank you so much as Space
Speaker 2: Capital and Space Angels. Meanwhile, let's shift gears a little
Speaker 2: bit and look at Alphabet right now, because it's going
Speaker 2: to have to pay seven hundred million dollars and alter
Speaker 2: its Google Play policies to settle claims that the app
Speaker 2: store unlawfully dominates the Android mobile applications market USA. Say
Speaker 2: the Blue moslea Ninland joins us more on this case.
Speaker 2: And this was Attorney's General particularly putting forward on.
Speaker 3: This behalf of the consumer, millions of them.
Speaker 2: Ultimately, what are the policies that are going to have
Speaker 2: to change?
Speaker 3: Hearlier.
Speaker 6: Yeah, So this was a case brought by thirty six
Speaker 6: state attorneys general, but the settlement was signed by off
Speaker 6: fifty so this is going to apply across the country.
Speaker 7: So Google agreed to pay some.
Speaker 6: Money, but the bigger changes are ones to its play store.
Speaker 6: So now it's not going to require companies like Samsung
Speaker 6: and Motorola who make its phones, to have the play
Speaker 6: store be exclusively and the only app store available on phones.
Speaker 6: It's also going to allow developers to use alternative payment systems,
Speaker 6: so instead of just using Google Player on the phone,
Speaker 6: you might now be able to start using things like
Speaker 6: Square or Venmo or PayPal. And they also will be
Speaker 6: allowed to tell consumers a little bit more about whether
Speaker 6: they can get cheaper options elsewhere. So for example, they
Speaker 6: could say, hey, you know, if you agree to sign
Speaker 6: up for our subscription online instead of hearing through the app,
Speaker 6: will give you a discount, a three dollars discount, And
Speaker 6: so you know, they might have a link to go
Speaker 6: to their website where you can get a cheaper price.
Speaker 2: All of this begs the question, of course posts the
Speaker 2: epic games lost, and of course they said that they're
Speaker 2: going to be fighting that one. But ultimately this is
Speaker 2: questioning the business model not just of Alphabet's Google, but
Speaker 2: also of Apple and also weez into a whole feeling
Speaker 2: that antitrust is just on fire right now. You'll beat
Speaker 2: in particular the fact that we're seeing case of the
Speaker 2: case being brought m and a falling apart.
Speaker 3: Am I right to feel that it's up the ante
Speaker 3: at the moment?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean this is the thing about anti trust
Speaker 6: is it often takes a long time. So the cases
Speaker 6: that we're talking about that have come to trial this year,
Speaker 6: we're actually really filed or started back in twenty nineteen,
Speaker 6: twenty twenty, so it's taken a long time, but we're
Speaker 6: finally seeing some of the results of the anti trust
Speaker 6: enforcement that has been sort of brewing up to this point.
Speaker 6: And now with the Biden anti trust enforcers who've been
Speaker 6: taking and even more aggressive approach. That's the FTC and
Speaker 6: the Justist Department under Elina Kahn and Jonathan Canter, they've
Speaker 6: been challenging a lot more deals. We had a story
Speaker 6: just earlier this week about how they challenged a record
Speaker 6: number of fifty deals last year, which is more than
Speaker 6: any since they started looking at deals beforehand in the
Speaker 6: nineteen seventies.
Speaker 2: Well, you put the context there for us Leon Anon
Speaker 2: as these things take a long time, but they all
Speaker 2: do seem to be like buses when they all come
Speaker 2: at once.
Speaker 3: Blue most lean Eland has been busy. We thank you
Speaker 3: so much.
Speaker 2: Open Opportunity Fund, a bene capital firm dedicated to funding
Speaker 2: black Latino founded technology companies, so announced that Marcello Claro
Speaker 2: is coming back is returning to the company as a
Speaker 2: vice chairman in general partner. Joining us now is Marcello
Speaker 2: and Paul Judge, Open Opportunity Fund chairman, who's managed to
Speaker 2: lure him back.
Speaker 3: And Paul, I'll start with you.
Speaker 2: Already fun one one hundred million dollars put to work
Speaker 2: on five black Latino tech companies.
Speaker 3: Can you just say.
Speaker 2: How we've managed to make an impact, how we're already
Speaker 2: seen what was it?
Speaker 8: Seven exits as full seven exits so far the companies
Speaker 8: over seventy five percent of them have raised their following
Speaker 8: rounds already. They're growing at one hundred percent of revenue
Speaker 8: year over year, all of them on average, across the portfolio,
Speaker 8: even in this environment. And so it just shows that
Speaker 8: even though minority founders have often overlooked, when they've given
Speaker 8: the chance, they overcome and they outperform.
Speaker 2: And often it's felt if you can't see it, you
Speaker 2: can't be it. Well, here we see it, you know,
Speaker 2: a Latino founder and operator, black operator and indeed founder.
Speaker 2: People realizing that this can be done, but it's still
Speaker 2: so hard. Ultimately, Macelo, why buy that? Why did soft
Speaker 2: Bank let you buy it?
Speaker 9: Ultimately, this is something I started when I was a
Speaker 9: soft Bank back in June twenty twenty, when the whole
Speaker 9: Black Lives Matter was it's a big problem. And one
Speaker 9: day just bothered me to see so many people talk
Speaker 9: and say, you know, we stand behind the black community,
Speaker 9: but really nobody would doing anything. So I went to
Speaker 9: mass and say, hey, why don't we this our business.
Speaker 9: We're a venture we are a venture capital firm. Why
Speaker 9: don't we start a fund to just help Black and
Speaker 9: Latin entrepreneurs. And you know in the with MASSA we
Speaker 9: started this fund. I invited Paul, who were both Henry Cranfellows.
Speaker 9: That's how we met, and we launched it and it
Speaker 9: has proven to be incredibly successful. And then I made
Speaker 9: an appeal to Softpak saying, you know, I think the
Speaker 9: fund needs to return back to his roots, and I
Speaker 9: don't think there's a better duo than doing it than
Speaker 9: a Hispanic entrepreneur or Hispanic investor with Paul, who's probably
Speaker 9: one of the black, one of the best Black investors
Speaker 9: and operators. So we're ready to tackle those seventy five companies.
Speaker 9: And we are already starting to raise for Phone number two,
Speaker 9: and we're going to call on a lot of people
Speaker 9: who always say, you know, we're here to help, And
Speaker 9: this is something I'm incredibly passionate about. You know, I'm
Speaker 9: a Hispanic founder and when I started brid Star, I
Speaker 9: struggled to raise capital, and it's just something that was
Speaker 9: very close to my heart. How hard was it to
Speaker 9: race capital and how my competitors, who were white, was
Speaker 9: so easy for them to raise capital. At the end,
Speaker 9: we ended up racing capital. So I just want to
Speaker 9: make sure it's easy for successful black and Latin entrepreneurs
Speaker 9: to have a fund that's solely dedicated to them.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, some of the security based companies that
Speaker 2: you've founded, your three time founder, you've done that alongside
Speaker 2: other people of color, and I'm sure come up against
Speaker 2: that reticence of sometimes getting people to allocate you the checks.
Speaker 2: I'm interested Therefore, when soft ig is still going to
Speaker 2: be a key investor in Fund two but perhaps not
Speaker 2: founding LP, who are the other institutions and how galvanized
Speaker 2: they are they to still give money at this point,
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 8: There's a lot of organizations that they know that this
Speaker 8: is the right thing to do. But what we've proven
Speaker 8: with Fund one is that it's also the profitable thing
Speaker 8: to do very fun. One is outperforming, is delivering top
Speaker 8: qualtawer returns. And when you look at the portfolio, over
Speaker 8: eighty percent of the companies that we invest in are
Speaker 8: B to B software companies, and so half of those
Speaker 8: companies are areas where minority founders have a unique viewpoint
Speaker 8: like education, finances, workforce development, healthcare. But then half of
Speaker 8: those companies are just solving some of the hardest problems
Speaker 8: in AI and cybersecurity. And so we see organizations, whether
Speaker 8: it be endowments or pinter funds or institutional investors. I've
Speaker 8: found a lot of interest in supporting us in fund
Speaker 8: too and beyond.
Speaker 2: I think of ASUSU founder we've interviewed plenty of times
Speaker 2: trying to fix basically ultimately access to real.
Speaker 3: Estate and credit checking. When you're thinking about.
Speaker 2: The founders, you want to back at the moment, where
Speaker 2: are you finding them? Because you're also someone who's so
Speaker 2: busy looking in Latin America for Latin American founders. Are
Speaker 2: you basing this mainly in America or No?
Speaker 9: I've been buying GP interests of a lot of different funds,
Speaker 9: you know in Brazil, in you know, you know Bicycle,
Speaker 9: which is sort of venture or growth equity fund dedicated
Speaker 9: to Latin America. I've done some in the US press
Speaker 9: or Capital Partners, which is a private equity company, and
Speaker 9: so on. You know, I, like I said, in this
Speaker 9: new part of my life, I want to make sure
Speaker 9: that I'm backing successful people so I can pass on
Speaker 9: my capital, my experience, my contacts, and not necessarily operate myself.
Speaker 9: This is a little bit different because this is you know,
Speaker 9: opportunity fund is really personal to me, and this is
Speaker 9: something that, like I said, I'm clearly passionate of helping.
Speaker 9: I think black and Latino founders are as good as
Speaker 9: any other founders, but sometimes are not given the opportunity.
Speaker 9: So this and my Latin American founders are probably two
Speaker 9: of my favorite areas of interest.
Speaker 2: Now this has become a politicized area, though, and you
Speaker 2: just think about the fearlest fund over in Georgia at
Speaker 2: the moment, which because of the views in which the
Speaker 2: Supreme Court thinks about how money and indeed allocations to
Speaker 2: people getting into university and then allocations and money.
Speaker 3: To diverse people.
Speaker 2: I'm interested in whether you've had any political pushback from
Speaker 2: LPs wanting to get into a fund, or whether you
Speaker 2: still feel that people are interested in basically the profits.
Speaker 9: Ever, well, I'm a huge believer and that's you know,
Speaker 9: when I was when I had my first company, Brice Star,
Speaker 9: I never used a Latino card because I hate having
Speaker 9: to tell people give me a preferential treatment, because I
Speaker 9: was like, you know, I think that's wrong. You know,
Speaker 9: I do believe that we need to we have a
Speaker 9: proven business model. I think the founders that we're back
Speaker 9: in are as good as any other founders, and people
Speaker 9: should not invest with us because it's hey, it's just
Speaker 9: let's help black and Latino. We don't want that. We
Speaker 9: want people to recognize the Opportunity Fund as a top
Speaker 9: quartel fund and we're going to choose some amazing founders,
Speaker 9: some amazing entrepreneurs who I'll tell you, being a Black
Speaker 9: or Latino entrepreneur, you know, you have to try sometimes
Speaker 9: twice as hard, but you know, once once you're there,
Speaker 9: you know, I think that we're as capable of anybody else.
Speaker 9: So that's what we want. We don't want people to
Speaker 9: just give us money because it feels good to back
Speaker 9: black and Latinos. We want people to understand that there's
Speaker 9: a great business model here and that this founders are
Speaker 9: as good as anybody else.
Speaker 2: And you've got the growth as far and some of
Speaker 2: the access prove it. We thank you so much for
Speaker 2: joining us. It's wonderful to have you in the studio.
Speaker 2: From the Open Opportunity Fund of course, Poul Judge there
Speaker 2: and Marcello Claren. I mean, while coming up, we analyze
Speaker 2: the crypto market performed well.
Speaker 3: Waym's had a bit of a run up. Blake LaVita
Speaker 3: Gupt is.
Speaker 2: Joining US, founder and general partner at Delta Blockchain Fund
Speaker 2: a's Bluebow Technology. Time for Talking Tech now first up,
Speaker 2: reshuffling at time on sem in conduct and Manufacturing Chairman
Speaker 2: martinlu will retire in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 3: And seed his role to c C. Way.
Speaker 2: While Way keeps a low profile as CEO, he is
Speaker 2: said to be basically in the driving force behind TSMC's
Speaker 2: advanced packaging business and producing.
Speaker 3: Chips for Apple and Nvidio.
Speaker 2: Meanwhile, Michael nmograts he's doubling down on his expectations for
Speaker 2: a Bitcoin ETF approval in January. Nomgrats, of course, the
Speaker 2: CEO Galaxy Digital Holdings. He's told CNBC he expects SEC
Speaker 2: approval before January tenth Galaxy has partnered with Invesco on
Speaker 2: plans to launch a Bitcoin ETF, one of many. Meanwhile,
Speaker 2: let's continue to discuss the state of the crypto market.
Speaker 2: Cavita Gupter's with found and general partner of Delta Blockchain Fund,
Speaker 2: and I have a feeling.
Speaker 3: So we enter the holiday season, some.
Speaker 2: Of the conversations around the dinner table were a little
Speaker 2: bit easier at the moment with the runoff in bitcoin.
Speaker 2: I mean, how do you feel about January the tenth,
Speaker 2: or at least some sort of date being viewed as
Speaker 2: the one where we get a spot BITCOINYTF.
Speaker 10: Carolyne, It's time.
Speaker 11: This has been going on for too long and SEC
Speaker 11: has never given clarity.
Speaker 10: Of why not or why should And I think with.
Speaker 11: Setting up a date, it's just really it's just counting
Speaker 11: your days and walk into a new year with a
Speaker 11: new approval and having an institutional buy into the space
Speaker 11: which should have been legitimized.
Speaker 10: In US long time back.
Speaker 11: I'm very excited, and believe me, I tweeted this and
Speaker 11: it was seriously but I'm going.
Speaker 10: Through that last year.
Speaker 11: During this time, everybody was texting me and asking me, hey,
Speaker 11: are you doing okay, but you need for New Years.
Speaker 11: And this year, all I'm hearing about is how to
Speaker 11: buy crypto for my boyfriend and for my dad.
Speaker 10: So I think like this is going to be.
Speaker 11: A little crazy New Year, which may or may not
Speaker 11: be enjoyable for me.
Speaker 2: And then everyone gravitates towards bitcoin. But is that the
Speaker 2: crypto of choice at the moment? Is that the area
Speaker 2: that people will be galvanized by such an atfo will
Speaker 2: it spill over? And what about some of the projects
Speaker 2: that even analyzing I.
Speaker 11: Think technology will continue to be the heart of this
Speaker 11: whole industry, like old coins itself. When I say all coins,
Speaker 11: technology coins actually from different layer onns, different layer twos.
Speaker 11: Projects have also fueled up really high. I mean, one
Speaker 11: of the major projects which I'm a huge fan of,
Speaker 11: let's say Polygon, it really went down to around fifty
Speaker 11: cents or forty eight cents when the whole SEC news
Speaker 11: came out directly or indirectly classifying it as a security.
Speaker 11: That has also jumped up to like eighty eight ninety cents.
Speaker 10: Points right, So not just Bitcoin, but of course the
Speaker 10: whole position of SEC or the market that there is
Speaker 10: going to be a huge institution.
Speaker 11: Buy in into the space also moves the other old
Speaker 11: coin up.
Speaker 10: So we are seeing EAT really up and.
Speaker 11: Having a very good holding position at two point two
Speaker 11: from the sixteen hundred base point a sixteen.
Speaker 10: Hundred dollars point where it has been lying.
Speaker 11: So of course it's a whole market and also a
Speaker 11: lot of technology projects which has been coming up, Like
Speaker 11: we are talking about layers, we are talking about aostack.
Speaker 11: Bunch of those projects are also looking at the market
Speaker 11: with a huge adoption with these institutions.
Speaker 2: Talking of institutional play, we did hear from Michael Sonshein
Speaker 2: over at Grayscale about his optimism around his own conversion
Speaker 2: to an ETF.
Speaker 3: Just take a listen, Convita.
Speaker 12: I think that the SEC should and does in fact
Speaker 12: want to create an even playing field, and so we've
Speaker 12: publicly been advocates of the fact that when the Commission
Speaker 12: is ready to give the requisite approvals for SPOT products
Speaker 12: to come to market, that it should be done all
Speaker 12: at once. The issuers who are operationally ready to launch
Speaker 12: their products should come out the gate all at once.
Speaker 2: So say they will come out the gate all at
Speaker 2: once in January, what sort of immediate institution will pickup?
Speaker 3: Do you think that actually.
Speaker 2: Will be Have you put numbers or thought to that
Speaker 2: when at the same time we also hearing from a
Speaker 2: like some Jamie Diamond.
Speaker 3: He says, look, I would close it down if I
Speaker 3: was in powered.
Speaker 11: I mean, you know, every time Jamie Diamond has taken
Speaker 11: a stage and said something negative about bitcoin, the market
Speaker 11: has really picked up. So he's actually a good sign
Speaker 11: and good ormin for us. So he can go on
Speaker 11: saying all these things, but looking at if one, two,
Speaker 11: or all of them come out based on whatever their applications.
Speaker 10: And Blackstone has made some.
Speaker 11: Changes, a lot of other places, a lot of other
Speaker 11: appliers are making some changes. It's a multi billion dollar
Speaker 11: going into a trillion dollar.
Speaker 10: Market which we are looking into right.
Speaker 11: But I feel like also the technology of custody associated
Speaker 11: with it, theology of able to give it to individual
Speaker 11: clients to have liquidity, that's also important.
Speaker 3: Kavita, so great to catch up with you. Come back
Speaker 3: in January.
Speaker 2: Can we get to a founder and general partner of
Speaker 2: Delta Blockchain Fund.
Speaker 3: Welcome back to.
Speaker 2: Bloomberg Technology and Caroline Hired in New York. Let's get
Speaker 2: a quick check on these markets because while we're still
Speaker 2: rallying on to new highs and then as that one hundred,
Speaker 2: we're fading on bitcoin though a little bit tenure yield
Speaker 2: gets a bid. This is we anticipate that actually we
Speaker 2: will see some FED cuts as soon as maybe even
Speaker 2: March next year.
Speaker 3: That being echoed by another FED member. We're looking at
Speaker 3: the Bitcoin off by one and a half percent.
Speaker 2: Maybe there's some profit taking at the moment we know. Indeed,
Speaker 2: Ark has been selling some of its gray scale bitcoin
Speaker 2: trush shares as bitcoin had been rallying up to about
Speaker 2: forty three thousand. Move on, have a look at some
Speaker 2: of the individual names that we're looking at, because well
Speaker 2: there's some deals being made and video are off on
Speaker 2: about one point five percent. Look call that profit taking
Speaker 2: as well if you'd like. We're looking at a firm
Speaker 2: though really rallying hard, Walmart, deepening that connection there by
Speaker 2: now pay later. We're more than six percent, so rocketing
Speaker 2: higher on further deepening of partnerships there. I'm looking at
Speaker 2: a Lumina though more than five percent. It was one
Speaker 2: of the best performers on then as that one hundred
Speaker 2: today this as we see agitation, could we indeed be
Speaker 2: seeing Carlai can come in try and once again be
Speaker 2: moving to make big impact of this business as they
Speaker 2: sell off their Grail acquisition that ultimately was put off
Speaker 2: by regulators. Illumina On the upside as, many feel that
Speaker 2: actually this investor and an activist at investor at that
Speaker 2: could lay bear some changes for the business. Meanwhile, we
Speaker 2: want to talk about other areas of change and perhaps
Speaker 2: some drama because on Christmas Day, you're no longer going
Speaker 2: to be able to buy perhaps some of Apple's latest
Speaker 2: smart watch devices here.
Speaker 3: In the US.
Speaker 2: Now, this is the company battles on ongoing patent dispute
Speaker 2: for more bluembogs. Mark German joins us now and this
Speaker 2: is the culmination of a pan dispute that came out
Speaker 2: from October.
Speaker 3: And what is it is this posturing?
Speaker 2: Is this actually that you won't be able to buy
Speaker 2: via Apple itself?
Speaker 5: Yeah, this has been going on for quite a while.
Speaker 13: There was a lengthy trial between Apple and Maximo in California.
Speaker 13: This is in relation to patents for blood oxygen saturation.
Speaker 13: Masimo's held patents for years on the technology use in
Speaker 13: not invasively to term the amount of oxygen your blood.
Speaker 5: They believe that.
Speaker 13: They suit Apple over this, that they violate those patents
Speaker 13: for their blood Oxygen app that launched in twenty twenty
Speaker 13: on the Series six. And this is no joke, this
Speaker 13: is not posturing.
Speaker 14: The International Trade Commission, the ITC ruled that there's going
Speaker 14: to be an important junction. That important junction is scheduled
Speaker 14: to come into place on Christmas Day, December twenty fifth.
Speaker 14: Apple has put all the measures in place to stop
Speaker 14: sales of the Ultra two in the Series nine, which
Speaker 14: represent the vast, vast, vast majority of Apple Watched sales.
Speaker 14: These are their newest smart watches. Those sales will stop
Speaker 14: online on Thursday, and by Christmas Eve on the twenty fourth,
Speaker 14: they will stop in Apple's about two hundred and seventy
Speaker 14: US retail store.
Speaker 5: So this is real. We are only a few days.
Speaker 13: Away from this happening, so I would say it's extraordinarily
Speaker 13: unlikely that anything changes. Maybe there's a settlement or cross
Speaker 13: licensing or a licensing agreement, maybe the Biden White House steps.
Speaker 5: Into play lace in the next few days.
Speaker 13: But barring that, sales of the Apple Watch Ultra too,
Speaker 13: sales of the Apple Watch Series nine, those will seize
Speaker 13: to happen through Apple's direct sales Channels by Christmas Marc German.
Speaker 2: Fascinating, great analysis, Thank you for bringing it to us,
Speaker 2: and indeed, well we can ask about whether there is
Speaker 2: anything likely to change in the next few days. As mentioned,
Speaker 2: it's a medical device maker, Massimo has accused Apple of
Speaker 2: copying patented technology for measuring blood oxygen.
Speaker 3: Levels that they used in their smart watch. Joining us now.
Speaker 3: Joe Keiani is the founder.
Speaker 2: And chairman and CEO of Massimo, and it's great to have.
Speaker 3: Some time with you, Joe.
Speaker 2: And look, will anything has Apple in any way turned
Speaker 2: to you, tried to be making any sort of well, agreement,
Speaker 2: negotiate some sort of settlement here.
Speaker 15: No, no, they haven't ever since twenty thirteen when they
Speaker 15: contacted me and said we're the platinum of non invasive monitoring.
Speaker 15: They want us to go in meet with them because
Speaker 15: they want to integrate our technology. We have not heard
Speaker 15: from them, and stead they ended up recruiting twenty five
Speaker 15: of my engineers, including our chief medical officer and CTO
Speaker 15: from a spinoff company. And this is not an accidental infringement.
Speaker 15: This is a deliberate the taking of our intellectual property.
Speaker 3: You spent millions to take on Apple.
Speaker 2: Well, is this because of your business, because of what
Speaker 2: you think. Ultimately you could win out in terms of
Speaker 2: them being forced to pay you for the use of
Speaker 2: your technology or to settle or is this something bigger.
Speaker 1: Well, first of all.
Speaker 15: I'm glad the world can now see we're the true
Speaker 15: inventors and creators of this technology. We want to actually
Speaker 15: let you know that by banning the Apple Watch with
Speaker 15: SBO two ely there's no issue because in Apple's internal
Speaker 15: documents that we saw in court showed that they knew
Speaker 15: that product wasn't good enough to be used medically and
Speaker 15: they didn't even seek FDA clearance.
Speaker 1: Because of that.
Speaker 15: Their own testing showed they got two measurements a day
Speaker 15: on thirty seven percent of the people.
Speaker 1: That's it.
Speaker 15: We get over seventy thousand measurements a day on everyone,
Speaker 15: and they pushed that out anyway, because, as their email showed,
Speaker 15: they thought, and the chaos of COVID this is their quotation,
Speaker 15: they could get market share away from fitbit. So no,
Speaker 15: why we sue them, because this is our intellectual property.
Speaker 1: We have our own product.
Speaker 15: I'm showing here, and we have been in Pulsark symmetry
Speaker 15: business for thirty five years, not only now in the consumers,
Speaker 15: but hospitals. In fact, we just got FDA clearance for
Speaker 15: a product we call Stork, which is a baby monitor
Speaker 15: to help parents monitor their baby's pulsec symmetry when they're
Speaker 15: not next to them.
Speaker 2: Now, an Apple spokesman, Women Joe, has said that the
Speaker 2: company is working on submitting workarounds in the US to
Speaker 2: the Customers Agency, and that's of course in charge of
Speaker 2: actually approving changes to get a product back in the market.
Speaker 2: But do you think the product that you just showed us,
Speaker 2: your product could take any market share?
Speaker 15: Absolutely, we are focusing from hospital to home right now
Speaker 15: with this product, but there's a consumer version of that
Speaker 15: product that we're going to be introducing here shortly. This
Speaker 15: is the freedom Watch that has all of our bio
Speaker 15: sense and capability that we have in these chips that
Speaker 15: we put on the back of these watches, and with
Speaker 15: our distribution channel which is about twenty thousand locations, with
Speaker 15: their near recent acquisition we made of Sound United, which
Speaker 15: is the owners of Bowers and Wilkins. Then in the Morans,
Speaker 15: we hope to pick a good market share for people
Speaker 15: that really care about pulse asymmetry, people with chronic illnesses,
Speaker 15: about a third of the population that buys these watches
Speaker 15: have chronic illnesses and they will benefit from a serious,
Speaker 15: accurate product.
Speaker 2: Joe, Ultimately, what could have been done to stop this?
Speaker 2: Obviously Apple could have come to and bought and license
Speaker 2: the technology. But when ultimately big tech companies or any
Speaker 2: technology companies takes talent, takes employees, well, that's kind of
Speaker 2: just the way in which business is done. What do
Speaker 2: you think, if anything you could have done to stop
Speaker 2: your CTO, your chief medical officer from leaving.
Speaker 15: Well, first of all, not every company does this. Apple
Speaker 15: is the biggest company, the most powerful company. They could
Speaker 15: be an example of how to do things right and
Speaker 15: do things well. They didn't have to steal our people.
Speaker 15: We could have worked with them. But secondly, you know
Speaker 15: this whole ITC case. Apple could have not been even
Speaker 15: under their jurisdiction if they made these watches in the USA.
Speaker 15: The fact that they still haven't, I don't know, it
Speaker 15: says something about their relationship with China.
Speaker 1: This could have been averted for them.
Speaker 5: Now.
Speaker 15: Ultimately, we're suing them in the California and Delaware courts
Speaker 15: for pan infringement, and if we went there, we'll get
Speaker 15: an injunction regardless where they manufactured. But this ITC case
Speaker 15: could have been averted by them by just making it here,
Speaker 15: and they've refused to do it.
Speaker 1: We make it here, make all of our.
Speaker 15: Sensors in New Hampshire, hundreds of millions of LEDs and detectors.
Speaker 15: We bring them here to Irvine and we do the
Speaker 15: final manufacturing. So why they can't make it here, I
Speaker 15: don't understand.
Speaker 3: Would you settle, Joe?
Speaker 15: The short answer is yes, despite their leadership doing some
Speaker 15: of the things they've done to us, and not just
Speaker 15: Massimal but other smaller companies that they sherlocked, or they
Speaker 15: do efficient infringement to for better men of people and
Speaker 15: our Muture shareholders. I put out the Olive branch on
Speaker 15: one of these news programs that I would work with
Speaker 15: them to improve their product, or they can even put
Speaker 15: these chips behind their product.
Speaker 1: But they haven't called it takes two the tangle, and.
Speaker 3: It takes the right price point.
Speaker 2: What sort of dollar amount would be the right from
Speaker 2: a fiduciary duty and responsibility perspective from your part, Joe.
Speaker 1: Well, they haven't even asked. We haven't.
Speaker 3: I mean they're a starting number. Say I'm not I'm
Speaker 3: on the phone.
Speaker 15: Oh come on, I'm not negotiating with you on TV. No,
Speaker 15: there needs to be an honest dialogue. There needs to
Speaker 15: be an apology. These guys have been caught with their
Speaker 15: hands and the cookie jar, and instead of being embarrassed
Speaker 15: and doing the right thing, they're blaming everybody and they're
Speaker 15: fighting everybody.
Speaker 7: You know.
Speaker 15: In twenty twelve, when they decided to make the watch,
Speaker 15: they decided the most important feature was Paul socks. But
Speaker 15: they couldn't do it, so they created a project called
Speaker 15: Rover to see who can They found fifty companies and
Speaker 15: in their own internal documents they said there are two
Speaker 15: stand up companies, Massimo and Circle Corps, both run by
Speaker 15: Joe Kiani. They went to Tim Cook and said we
Speaker 15: should buy them just to get Joe let all that
Speaker 15: technology because they called me to see jobs of the
Speaker 15: healthcare industry. But Tim Cook said, no, you get the
Speaker 15: same result by smart recruiting.
Speaker 1: So what do they do?
Speaker 15: I was paying my people ninety at percentile. It's not
Speaker 15: like I don't pay our people well, believe in them.
Speaker 15: They began doubling their salaries and bonuses. Some of them
Speaker 15: they gave millions of dollars in RSUs to get them
Speaker 15: some in unlabeled buildings a couple of blocks from me
Speaker 15: for those who didn't want to move to northern California.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is not normal business.
Speaker 2: We will put that to Apple thus far, of course,
Speaker 2: Apple have said that they're looking for a workaround.
Speaker 3: Could they fix us with software?
Speaker 15: First of all, with software, I don't think that could work.
Speaker 15: It shouldn't because our patents are not about the software.
Speaker 15: It's about the hardware with the software. But they could
Speaker 15: do a lot of things differently. Maybe it's time they
Speaker 15: think different or maybe they act different.
Speaker 3: What about the administration? Are they being in touch? Are
Speaker 3: they looking for different behavior?
Speaker 7: Well?
Speaker 1: I believe so.
Speaker 15: You know, the administration has been critical of the top
Speaker 15: four tech company saying they're stepping on smaller arrivals and
Speaker 15: they're going to try to defend that. So I don't
Speaker 15: expect the administration to step in here. And every time
Speaker 15: Apple content them, I guess by a law they have
Speaker 15: to call us to get our response. So, yes, we've
Speaker 15: been in contact with them, and we don't think they
Speaker 15: will intervene. I think their recent stunt to pull the
Speaker 15: products off the market a few days earlier than the
Speaker 15: ITC decided it should be pulled off the market. They're
Speaker 15: trying to get the public to force the Biden administration
Speaker 15: to do something they don't think they should do.
Speaker 1: But I don't think it's going to work.
Speaker 2: Jokiani, it's fascinating talking to you. Please, you're not going
Speaker 2: to negotiate with me on TV. But when or if
Speaker 2: you do, indeed negotiate with Apple, you let us know.
Speaker 10: Please how much watch what you want me to do?
Speaker 3: And Massimo stay well, thank you for your time today.
Speaker 3: The CEO there.
Speaker 2: Meanwhile, coming up, we're going to talk about the health
Speaker 2: of something else now a bench capital in twenty twenty four,
Speaker 2: pitch Books got this outlookout will break down the findings
Speaker 2: next with analyst Carl Stamford is Rumage Technology, Finacial.
Speaker 3: Data and Research from Pitchbook.
Speaker 2: Well, it's out with its twenty twenty four venture Capital
Speaker 2: outlook and we want to break.
Speaker 3: It down for you with the findings.
Speaker 2: Kyle Stamfords here his lead US bench capital research analyst
Speaker 2: at Pitchbook, And well, I mean it hasn't been the
Speaker 2: prettiest of pictures to twenty twenty three. Are we expecting
Speaker 2: VC allocation of funds to pick up a little bit
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 16: Maybe a little bit, right. I don't think we're looking
Speaker 16: at twenty twenty four as a as a full rebound
Speaker 16: for a venture, but certainly fundraising is one area that
Speaker 16: a lot of people are really interesting. We looked at
Speaker 16: our distribution data and tried to model out the next
Speaker 16: four quarters. You know, we do see it to be
Speaker 16: relatively similar, maybe a little uptick in fundraising, but not
Speaker 16: incredibly strong. Right, It's going to be well below the
Speaker 16: records of twenty twenty and twenty twenty one. It's going
Speaker 16: to be well below the historical growth trend. But you know,
Speaker 16: with that distribution data, there can always be a couple
Speaker 16: of billion dollar funds that maybe are raised and increase
Speaker 16: that top line figure. To know more acceptable level for
Speaker 16: the VC market.
Speaker 2: We're looking at a chart of annual VC backed public
Speaker 2: listing value. So ultimately like where the exits come from
Speaker 2: as well, CAR and that's.
Speaker 3: Going to in any way feed better.
Speaker 2: Do you think will we get some public exits, Will
Speaker 2: we therefore get some more interest in money being handed
Speaker 2: back to LPs and LPs wanting to recommit.
Speaker 16: I think too expect it to be this record year.
Speaker 16: Anywhere near what we saw in twenty twenty one is probably,
Speaker 16: you know, kind of a fool's end, right, But when
Speaker 16: you look at where the IPOs happened. What IPOs did
Speaker 16: happen this year, there were thirty nine they've committed completed
Speaker 16: so far. More than half of those are in healthcare.
Speaker 16: Then you look at there's you know, seven hundred and
Speaker 16: twenty unicorns in the US. There's a lot of money
Speaker 16: that's still stuck in the private markets. But we are
Speaker 16: entering a year with a little bit better economic signals
Speaker 16: than we did in twenty twenty three. Russell two thousand
Speaker 16: growth is up twelve percent the last month. Prices, sales
Speaker 16: ratios are expanding a little bit in the public markets,
Speaker 16: and I think we'll get to a spot where founders
Speaker 16: and companies are able to compromise on a price works
Speaker 16: for them and get out into the public market. That's
Speaker 16: what we see. It's not gonna be a great year,
Speaker 16: but it should be better than this year.
Speaker 2: I mean, look then, as that one hundreds at a
Speaker 2: record high. A lot of that's to do with a
Speaker 2: magnificent seven. But I'm sure there's some AI stories that
Speaker 2: can be pitched next year. I'm interested in who, if anyone,
Speaker 2: is committing to.
Speaker 3: The world of VC. Are we seeing.
Speaker 2: A typical LP coming in at the moment you're seeing
Speaker 2: different types of commitments coming from the.
Speaker 3: Institutions, or indeed are they going direct now?
Speaker 2: Are we cutting out a VC entirely and then putting
Speaker 2: allocations towards the startups themselves?
Speaker 16: Sure allocation is not going to get or two vcs
Speaker 16: is not going to get cut right, But what we
Speaker 16: have seen over the past two years is LPs try
Speaker 16: to find their balance and now after the twenty twenty
Speaker 16: two is the stock market shock that really unbalanced their portfolios,
Speaker 16: wasn't allowing them to commit. Now we see in last
Speaker 16: year kind of rebalancing of the broader market, and now
Speaker 16: they know where they see it and they can know
Speaker 16: where to expect inflation to be or interest rates and
Speaker 16: adjust their portfolio in that way. So we do expect
Speaker 16: there to be a little more interested in LP's committing
Speaker 16: to funds. Right, we had thirty two billion dollar funds
Speaker 16: in twenty twenty one, those funds would likely be coming
Speaker 16: back and start fundraising you know, this year, maybe late
Speaker 16: in the year. So we do think that LPs will
Speaker 16: continue committing, not at an extreme pace and very similar
Speaker 16: to what we see this year, but a little.
Speaker 1: Uptake for VC.
Speaker 2: What about others that we start to see on well,
Speaker 2: the investor list. When I look at the latest AI rounds,
Speaker 2: a lot of the time it's been in Nvidia, A
Speaker 2: lot of the time it's been Alphabet, it's been action corporates.
Speaker 2: Is that something we're going to see in twenty twenty
Speaker 2: four to two?
Speaker 15: Yeah?
Speaker 16: Well, AI is really interesting because all of those large
Speaker 16: corporates that you mentioned are now trying to be the
Speaker 16: lead for AI, right, and so you like you mentioned
Speaker 16: Microsoft and Video, they're very heavy into that sector. Corporates
Speaker 16: have declined, their activity has declined a little bit this
Speaker 16: year broadly speaking, and I think a lot of that
Speaker 16: has to do with, you know, there is still some
Speaker 16: you know, outlook of a recession. They don't want to
Speaker 16: over commit to these long term capital bases. But those corporates,
Speaker 16: those large corporations that are sitting on a large stack
Speaker 16: of cash, do have that money to put to work
Speaker 16: in startups, and we have seen that that is a
Speaker 16: really good place for that money to go.
Speaker 3: We will see if that continues. Carl Stamford.
Speaker 2: It has been great to have you throughout the year
Speaker 2: with your data from pitchbook, and we thank you for
Speaker 2: pushing us toward to twenty twenty four.
Speaker 3: Excited to have you on then.
Speaker 2: Like Matter, it's a startup building computing products that use
Speaker 2: light in place of electricity, and it's raised additional financing
Speaker 2: amid the AI boom, pushing its valuation to a.
Speaker 3: Call one point two billion dollars.
Speaker 2: I'm pleased to say joining us now like Matter CEO,
Speaker 2: Nick Harris, And the reason you are so in demand
Speaker 2: at the moment or in this particular moment of generative
Speaker 2: AI is that it's really constantly, really energy inefficient to
Speaker 2: basically train a big AI large language model. You're thinking
Speaker 2: your work for years, seminal work has been done on
Speaker 2: basically using the lights as a science, as a technology
Speaker 2: to be able to make it more efficient. Can you
Speaker 2: just strip down as how that happens?
Speaker 7: Yeah, absolutely so.
Speaker 17: Today when you look at AI models like Chat, GPT
Speaker 17: and the stuff that Google's doing with Bard and Project Gemini,
Speaker 17: these systems are built on ten thousand node sixty thousand
Speaker 17: nodes supercomputers, and the chips that comprise these massive supercomputers
Speaker 17: building the AI models are burning an enormous amount of energy.
Speaker 17: So what we're doing at light Matter is we're actually
Speaker 17: figuring out how to scale to one hundred thousand nodes,
Speaker 17: how to drive.
Speaker 7: The energy down.
Speaker 17: I mean, just to give you a reference, today computer
Speaker 17: chips have about the same energy density as a nuclear reactor,
Speaker 17: and between the time when I founded the company and today,
Speaker 17: they've actually increased by about five x the amount of
Speaker 17: power per package. It's a tough trajectory. And if we
Speaker 17: want to keep growing in the AI space and getting
Speaker 17: bigger and better models, some fundamental new technologies are needed,
Speaker 17: and that's what we're doing.
Speaker 2: It light better and you're therefore growing. What is it
Speaker 2: your head counters more than fifty percent? Is your last
Speaker 2: VC round which was back in May twenty twenty three,
Speaker 2: how do you Is it about people? Is it about
Speaker 2: talent and that's why you need the money? Or how
Speaker 2: else do you develop as technology?
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 17: So for this round, I think for the first time
Speaker 17: at light Matter, we've had investors approach us and the
Speaker 17: question was really how fast could you go if you
Speaker 17: had effectively, you know, approximately unlimited funding, what would you do?
Speaker 7: And we looked at the headcount requirements.
Speaker 17: We looked at our product pipeline and we decided to
Speaker 17: take on the money.
Speaker 7: To accelerate all of that.
Speaker 17: Where one hundred and fifty people today will be at
Speaker 17: around two hundred and twenty by the end of twenty
Speaker 17: twenty four. And what we're doing is we're taking this
Speaker 17: money to accelerate our interconnect product, Passage, accelerate the development
Speaker 17: of that, get it into data centers at the end
Speaker 17: of next year. And we're incredibly excited to get this
Speaker 17: whole thing kicked off and you're going to start to
Speaker 17: see that. You know, these super ter are based on
Speaker 17: photonics and using light to connect everything up and it's
Speaker 17: going to be critical for the future.
Speaker 7: So this funding is enabling all.
Speaker 17: Of that and massive scale deployment of Passage.
Speaker 3: Okay, so people needed on the R and D side.
Speaker 2: On the sales side, I'm sure, and you're getting it
Speaker 2: into the data centers.
Speaker 3: What's your own business model? How do you charge ultimately
Speaker 3: the customers that you're looking to. I'm thinking of the
Speaker 3: hyper scalers.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 17: On the Passage product side, we sell wafers, so we
Speaker 17: have a semiconductor fab partner. Those wafers ship from them,
Speaker 17: and we ultimately sell to the big semiconductor companies, companies
Speaker 17: like AMD, Intel, Nvidia, and also the cloud service providers
Speaker 17: who are building their own silicon. You've got Google Cloud
Speaker 17: with the TPU, Amazon Aws with Trainium, and so on.
Speaker 17: These are the kinds of companies that we partner with
Speaker 17: and we sell those wafers to them. What they do
Speaker 17: is they take their GPUs and their different processor chips
Speaker 17: and they scale them out on top of passage passages,
Speaker 17: this chessboard that links all of the chips optically and
Speaker 17: allows you to scale up to an entire three hundred
Speaker 17: millimeter diameter wafer and build absolutely massive computing clusters. So
Speaker 17: you can take a rays of these passages, these chessboards
Speaker 17: and scale them out to up to three hundred thousand nodes.
Speaker 7: Is the kind of thing that we're working on today.
Speaker 3: Same heat density as a nuclear reactor. Absolutely fascinating.
Speaker 2: Nick Harris, thanks for painting the picture telling us where
Speaker 2: your technology is going over at like.
Speaker 3: Matter, great hazard time with you. Meanwhile, that does it
Speaker 3: for this edition of bloom Beg Technology. You do not
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