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Speaker 1: This podcast is presented by Pacific Office Automation, proud partner

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Speaker 1: of the Arizona Cardinals and your one stop shop for

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Speaker 1: Problem solved? Is it put? Is it? Pat? Oh? My goodness,

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Speaker 1: it's put DeAndre oppen Hey put it for dockdown. You've

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Speaker 1: gotta be joking me. Welcome to Cardinals Underground, presented by

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Speaker 1: the Pacific Office Automation. Visit Pacific Office dot Com. Problem solved,

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Speaker 1: updown Tyler Murray, That defender is in multiple pieces? All

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Speaker 1: that was nasty. Writer rights, the latest news and notes

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Speaker 1: from the guys who cover the teams. Rilled by Simmons.

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Speaker 1: Isaiah Simmons is bawling. Bring it on, Bring it on.

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Speaker 1: Slam the ground by foot of Baker like a torpedo.

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Speaker 1: He came flying into the backfield. I scared and nobody.

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Speaker 1: Here's Paul Calvici. You know if I know one thing

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Speaker 1: here on Cardinals Underground, brought to you by Pacific Office Automation,

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Speaker 1: prop partner of the Arizona Cardinals. Paul calvic PAULI Podcast.

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Speaker 1: If there's one thing I've learned about Darren urban a

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Speaker 1: Klodegard They can be um, shall we say, discerning slash demanding,

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Speaker 1: especially around the holidays when they can be very difficult

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Speaker 1: to shop for. So what do I do? What do

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Speaker 1: I get these two fine gentlemen. I'm thinking, Jenna, something

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Speaker 1: that cal VC Consulting is in the middle of launching.

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Speaker 1: You guys ready for this. I know the election season

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Speaker 1: supposedly is over. So to fill that gap that boyd,

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Speaker 1: instead of a mega hat, I'm gonna go Moga make

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Speaker 1: offense great again? How about that? How about a nice

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Speaker 1: Cardinals red ball cap with a flaming acronym Moga make

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Speaker 1: Offense great Again? Kyle, you had the initial reaction, so

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Speaker 1: you're first up. Would you or would you not? Rock

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Speaker 1: that around town? I'm gonna do my best coach speed.

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Speaker 1: You can try to deflect this comment, this topic as

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Speaker 1: much as I can and just say no comment, noncommittal. Okay,

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Speaker 1: he's trying not to hurt my feelings. Darren, m as

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Speaker 1: I've learned on these road trips. We'll cut to the

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Speaker 1: chase and let me know exactly how he feels in

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Speaker 1: three two one, Darren, Yeah, I don't. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: First of all, I'm very excited that you were even

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Speaker 1: considering getting us gifts, you know, but it is very

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Speaker 1: wet because there's not a basic consulting factory would be

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Speaker 1: low cost. Albeit it's the thought that counts, Darren, that's

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Speaker 1: what I've heard. I've heard that. Yeah, I probably wouldn't

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Speaker 1: wear that guy, be honest. Okay, all right, well, uh

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Speaker 1: you know what, I will cut to the chase end.

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Speaker 1: What's wrong with the offense? What do the Cardinals do?

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Speaker 1: Is that an easy answer? Is it an ultra complex answer?

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Speaker 1: Is it going to take the entirety of Cardinals underground

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Speaker 1: to figure it out? Because you know, if nothing else,

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Speaker 1: we are a football think tank here, let's face it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, come on now, uh, Darren, come on, what

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Speaker 1: says you about the offense? We know the first nine

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Speaker 1: games everybody now, the average four hundred plus yards a game,

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Speaker 1: and the last three games it's been declining every single

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Speaker 1: game until this last game? Or what do they have? Kyle?

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Speaker 1: What was it totally two thirty two? Yeah? Before the

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Speaker 1: problem you have to diagnose it. What is wrong? Honestly?

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Speaker 1: I mean I I can't say for certain clearly. I

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Speaker 1: mean I think we can see some of the symptoms

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Speaker 1: of it. I mean, we we've been talking all these

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Speaker 1: weeks about Kyler Murray getting outside and making some plays

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Speaker 1: with his legs and hurting teams that way when they're

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Speaker 1: playing man and man and um, you know, you you

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Speaker 1: get to the point where, you know, with these five

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Speaker 1: man fronts and these mush rushes, and and we said

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Speaker 1: this last week, Paul, I mean, we said, they've got

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Speaker 1: to find a way to make teams pay for stacking

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Speaker 1: up against them in a certain way. And in this case,

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Speaker 1: it seems to be making sure the run game itself,

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Speaker 1: and specifically Kyler Murray running isn't going to hurt them,

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Speaker 1: or scrambling isn't going to hurt them. So they don't

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Speaker 1: play man a man. They don't they don't necessarily blitz again,

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Speaker 1: they mush rush. I mean, if I got paid a

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Speaker 1: lot of money to figure that stuff out, I would

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Speaker 1: That's the first place I would go. I'm not that guy,

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Speaker 1: but I'll be honest, I'm a little surprised it's taking

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Speaker 1: as long as it has to get some kind of

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Speaker 1: answers and for them to come off the two struggles

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Speaker 1: offensively that they did against Seattle and New England and

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Speaker 1: then end up with their lowest yardage total. I believe

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Speaker 1: the second slowest yardage total since Clip Kingsbury took over

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Speaker 1: in the lowest this season. I mean, it's it's surprising.

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Speaker 1: The Rams do have a very good defense. I do

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Speaker 1: think that the Rams they saw quite frankly, I think

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Speaker 1: the way it's gone the best defense they've seen all season.

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Speaker 1: But they need to be more effective than that. And

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Speaker 1: we're seeing the pain of what's going to happen if

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Speaker 1: they can't be more effective than that. Yeah, in the

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Speaker 1: second half, they did put up three touchdowns against the

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Speaker 1: Rams defense that had allowed two touchdowns in the second

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Speaker 1: half all season long, but it was at first half

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Speaker 1: when the game was truly in question. And yeah, they

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Speaker 1: got within three points twice and then it got to

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Speaker 1: be a ten point deficit and they end up losing

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Speaker 1: thirty eight twenty eight in that second half. But the

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Speaker 1: first half was so confounding to go four straight possessions

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Speaker 1: three and out, Kyle, I never thought we'd be talking

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Speaker 1: about that, Yeah, And I mean, the the box score

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Speaker 1: says they got a fifty nine yard touchdown pass on

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Speaker 1: the first possession, but they would have been three and

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Speaker 1: out on that one if not for the face mask.

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Speaker 1: And you can think of blown coverage for the score.

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Speaker 1: So it's not like that was this beautiful drive where

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Speaker 1: everything was clicking. It was kind of one blown coverage

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Speaker 1: where they got that touchdown. I just feel like, certainly

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Speaker 1: every team at this point is going to do this

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Speaker 1: blueprint of let's keep Kyler Murray in the pocket and

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Speaker 1: make him beat us with his arm and make the

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Speaker 1: running backs beat us with their legs. And the tough

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Speaker 1: part about the Rams game was the Rams were playing

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Speaker 1: two high safeties and a lot of times the box

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Speaker 1: was only five players, and the Cardinals still could not

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Speaker 1: run the ball. And when you're not doing that, I mean,

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Speaker 1: we can. You can criticize Cliff Kingsbury all you want,

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Speaker 1: but when a team can't effectively execute against a five

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Speaker 1: man box, there aren't many schematical answers from a play

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Speaker 1: calling standpoint. So I think if teams are gonna line

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Speaker 1: up like that, you have to run the ball. And

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Speaker 1: on the flip side, if a team is going to

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Speaker 1: stack the box and play single high safety, Kyler Murray

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Speaker 1: has to show that he can throw it. And right

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Speaker 1: now the Cardinals aren't doing either of those. So I

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Speaker 1: think I think we know what's going to happen in

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Speaker 1: these last four games, and you're either going to get

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Speaker 1: the light box look or you're gonna get the single

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Speaker 1: high And the Cardinals just have to show that when

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Speaker 1: they have a numbers advantage in a certain area that

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Speaker 1: they can be efficient that way. Are there any analytics

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Speaker 1: you guys have seen or any sort of analysis the

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Speaker 1: x as an os of to what percentage zone coverage

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Speaker 1: Kyler saw against the Rams? My eyeball test, just my

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Speaker 1: own gut feeling watching the game and doing so from

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Speaker 1: the front row, I'm like, you know what, He's not

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Speaker 1: nearly as effective against zone coverages as he would be

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Speaker 1: man to man. Now is at a byproduct of the

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Speaker 1: overall scheme. And as you mentioned, more than one Cardinals

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Speaker 1: player has talked about how they're employing these five man

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Speaker 1: lines and the effect that has is to tie up

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Speaker 1: every single offensive linement. It eliminates the combo blocks. Then

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Speaker 1: they bring the linebackers up to lurk around in the

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Speaker 1: A and B gaps and snuff out any sort of

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Speaker 1: run by the running backs also, and then they crash

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Speaker 1: the edges with Kyler. To Darren's point, you got to

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Speaker 1: make a defense pay for that. There has to be

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Speaker 1: some sign of sort of counter I think we're all

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Speaker 1: surprised hasn't materialized yet. But at the same time, it

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Speaker 1: just seems like guys that against some of those zone coverages,

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Speaker 1: in this case too high a lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of the time, Kyler seems to be holding none of

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Speaker 1: the ball longer than in other situation asians. Once again,

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Speaker 1: that's just an observation in a gut feel. I think

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Speaker 1: naturally that when you play man to man, it's going

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Speaker 1: to be easier for a quarterback to dissect it because

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Speaker 1: you know where most of the guys are going pre snap.

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Speaker 1: When it is zone, I think it's more confusing for

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Speaker 1: a quarterback, and I think that's part of the game

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Speaker 1: plan defensively, is you're going against a young quarterback who

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Speaker 1: hasn't dissected defenses in the NFL for very long. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't be surprised if teams are doing more zone.

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Speaker 1: I have not looked at the numbers, but that would

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Speaker 1: make sense to me. Is you try to confuse him

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Speaker 1: as much as possible, and especially in that RAMS game,

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Speaker 1: when you can let your edge defenders keep him in

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Speaker 1: the pocket, then you say, okay, we can only get

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Speaker 1: into your pressure and that's a lot of times hard,

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Speaker 1: but we have Aaron Donald and he can do it.

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Speaker 1: So it was I think a good matchup for the

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Speaker 1: Rams defensive line. I know that, you know. And I'd

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Speaker 1: have to go back and look at the game at

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Speaker 1: Seattle because it's now getting a little bit too far

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Speaker 1: in the rear view for me to remember exactly. But

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Speaker 1: I do remember Paul when we were in New England.

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Speaker 1: I did feel like that game Kyler looked hesitant on

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Speaker 1: some of his throws and looked like he double clutched

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Speaker 1: a couple of times. I don't know if he was

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Speaker 1: seeing exactly what he wanted to see or was comfortable

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Speaker 1: with what he was saying. And I do feel like

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Speaker 1: there was a little bit more of that against the

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Speaker 1: Rams too. Now it was harder to tell. I felt

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Speaker 1: like the Rams pass rush. It's funny we talk about

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Speaker 1: the must rush and they didn't get out. They didn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily allow him to get outside of scramble. But at

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Speaker 1: the same time, I felt like the Rams did a

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Speaker 1: nice job putting pressure on him a good chunk of

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Speaker 1: the time. And that just goes to show how good

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Speaker 1: Aaron Donald is and how good that defensive front is

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Speaker 1: where you can make sure you get contained and still

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Speaker 1: get pressure up in the middle. That's a horrible combination

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Speaker 1: right now for any team, much less a team like

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Speaker 1: the Cardinals that are struggling. But I do feel like

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Speaker 1: he's not real sure of what he wants to do

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Speaker 1: right now. But I don't know how much of that

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Speaker 1: gets laid at his feet, how much of that gets

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Speaker 1: laid at the receiver's feet. You know, they're just struggling

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Speaker 1: so much on so many areas. It would be interesting.

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Speaker 1: I'd love to know what would have happened on that

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Speaker 1: Dan Arnold touchdown if the Rams hadn't completely blown the coverage.

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Speaker 1: If one guy sticks with Dan Arnold and they double

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Speaker 1: covered DeAndre Hopkins instead of triple covering him, does that

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Speaker 1: play even produce anything? And if not, I mean they

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Speaker 1: didn't have any plays over twenty yards against New England.

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Speaker 1: They had two plays over over twenty yards against the Rams.

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Speaker 1: One was the Dan Arnold play where he doesn't get covered.

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Speaker 1: The other one was a twenty seven yard run by

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Speaker 1: Kenyan Drake and the waning minutes of the fourth quarter

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Speaker 1: when it didn't matter anymore. I don't see how this

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Speaker 1: team is going to be able to survive. Like we

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Speaker 1: talked about earlier in the season after the Carolina game

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Speaker 1: where they had all these completions for no yards, you

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Speaker 1: need some of those chunk plays, and talking to Justin Pugh,

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Speaker 1: he was he feels confident in the chunk plays come

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Speaker 1: after you get some kind of rhythm as an offense,

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Speaker 1: and it's a chicken or the egg thing right now.

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Speaker 1: But I really think that they've got to find a

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Speaker 1: way to not be in a position where they've got

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Speaker 1: to grind out ten yards at a time over three

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Speaker 1: hounds to get these first downs and keep drives going.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they've got to find times where they can

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Speaker 1: get and it doesn't have to be twenty but fifteen, twenty,

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Speaker 1: twenty five yard chunks once in a while. You know,

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Speaker 1: they've averaged over five of those plays a game and

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Speaker 1: when they won, and you've got to be able to

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Speaker 1: do that to survive in a lot of ways in

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Speaker 1: this league. Other than a fifty nine yard touchdown catch

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Speaker 1: and run by Dan Arnold on the blown coverage, the

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Speaker 1: next longest pass play was the twelve yard or on

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Speaker 1: fourth and twelve the Keyshawn Johnson correct and the longest

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Speaker 1: by DeAndre Hopkins was ten yards And I mentioned that

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Speaker 1: because in terms of seeing the field on the pick

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Speaker 1: six by Troy Hill, based on DeAndre Hopkins reaction, he

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Speaker 1: was open and instead of the ball went towards Andy

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Speaker 1: Isabella and double coverage. And as Wolf said on the air,

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Speaker 1: that's about as easy a pick six as you'll ever

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Speaker 1: see in the NFL for a defender. So once again

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Speaker 1: that calls into question to Darren's point, is that is

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Speaker 1: that on Kyler? Is that on scheme? Is it on

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Speaker 1: the inability to adjust to the adjustment of what the

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Speaker 1: defenses have done, especially the last three games, because we

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Speaker 1: all hear it kicked around. Is this a slump by Kyler?

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Speaker 1: Is it a aggression? Is it an overall waning a

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Speaker 1: performance by the entire offense? You know, in terms of

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Speaker 1: we know Cliff Kingsbury takes a lot of the blame

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Speaker 1: and culpability himself, that accountability with a play calling. Okay,

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Speaker 1: for once, do we actually fully believe him? Yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: so many different directions you can go, and obviously the

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Speaker 1: probable answer is maybe a little bit of everything. Kyle. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's where I feel like it is. But

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Speaker 1: I do feel like Kyler Murray has done a lot

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Speaker 1: of the quick passing game, and he's certainly accurate and

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Speaker 1: gets that ball out fast. But I go back to

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Speaker 1: Darren's point earlier. When you're getting the four yards and

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Speaker 1: then four yards and you're in those third and threes

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Speaker 1: and third and twos all the time, I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: a manageable distance, but when you're doing it four times

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Speaker 1: five times a drive, eventually you're gonna throw incomplete and

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Speaker 1: you're gonna be in a tough spot. So I agree

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Speaker 1: there where you need to get those chunks. You need

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Speaker 1: to get a first down on first down, or get

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Speaker 1: yourself to second and two to really get that offense going.

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Speaker 1: And you know, Kyler Murray doesn't want to put the

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Speaker 1: ball in harm's way and he doesn't want to force

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Speaker 1: it down the field. But I do think there's that

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Speaker 1: fine line where maybe sometimes you do have to throw

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Speaker 1: into those tighter windows and take those chances, and maybe

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Speaker 1: it results in more in completions and more interceptions. But

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Speaker 1: if you look at the aggregate and your offense is

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Speaker 1: more explosive, that might be the type of risk you

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Speaker 1: want to take to have overall a better level of efficiency.

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Speaker 1: And I would say too, you know, there's this, there

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Speaker 1: is nuance to this. I would agree with Kyle in

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Speaker 1: terms of there are times when I think Kyler might

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Speaker 1: have to be a little bit more aggressive, more than

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Speaker 1: he might be comfortable with most of the time. But

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Speaker 1: there's a difference between doing that. When DeAndre Hopkins to

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Speaker 1: DeAndre Hopkins who's covered closely and Andy Isabella who's covered closely,

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Speaker 1: you know, you want to make sure that the guy

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Speaker 1: at the other end is somebody who can make that play,

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Speaker 1: not only make the play, but make sure that something

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Speaker 1: bad might not happen. And you know, usually the upper

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Speaker 1: echelon receivers or those guys that even if they can't

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Speaker 1: get it, they're going to make sure that something disastrous.

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Speaker 1: The worst that happens is an incompletion. So I do

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Speaker 1: think they've got to find a way. Hopkins is a

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Speaker 1: great example. I think they got to find a way

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Speaker 1: to work them in a little bit earlier. And I

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Speaker 1: do feel like there's there's got to be something there.

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Speaker 1: And again, you can't just do whatever you want based

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Speaker 1: on what the defense is doing to you. But there's

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Speaker 1: got to be something there that's beyond just a you know,

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Speaker 1: a six yard pass on the perimeter. To DeAndre Hopkins

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Speaker 1: and hope he gets a yak and maybe he doesn't.

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Speaker 1: And I mean he had eight catches the other day,

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Speaker 1: but his biggest, his most impactful play other than a

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Speaker 1: short touchdown catch was the passing of Bairns. I mean,

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Speaker 1: most of those catches didn't mean a whole lot because

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Speaker 1: of the way the Rams were playing. And I just

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Speaker 1: feel like they gotta find a way. I mean, Christian

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Speaker 1: Kirk can't have one catch for two yards, especially when

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Speaker 1: Larry Fitzgerald wasn't even out there. I mean, where's Christian Kirk?

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Speaker 1: I mean, how does that happen? Yeah? What's that a

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Speaker 1: byproduct of? Is that from the quarterback not finding him

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Speaker 1: not seeing the field? Is that something else that's more

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Speaker 1: fundamental to the offense as far as DHAP is concerned.

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Speaker 1: Did I see someone tweeted out basically they charted his

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Speaker 1: routes from the game and they were all contained the

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Speaker 1: left side of the offense and all in a very

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Speaker 1: small box. They were curls and outs and all within

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Speaker 1: ten to fifteen yard range. Is that accurate? Did you

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Speaker 1: guys see that? Yeah? They weren't. Those weren't all his routes.

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Speaker 1: Those were him being targeted in the game, and they

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Speaker 1: were all in the very same area. So I mean, obviously,

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Speaker 1: on the Dan Arnold touchdown, he was running across the

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Speaker 1: field twenty yards down field, and on those are on

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Speaker 1: the ones he was targeted correct and the pass interference

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Speaker 1: wasn't on there. That was twenty five yards down the field.

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Speaker 1: So he didn't just run those small routes, but when

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Speaker 1: he was targeted, that's where they were, and that and

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Speaker 1: I'd have to go back to see what his routes

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Speaker 1: were otherwise. But that goes back to Kyler Murray not

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Speaker 1: pushing it downfield as much. And that's a great point, Paul.

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Speaker 1: With if Keyshawn Johnson's twelve yard catch was indeed the

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Speaker 1: second longest, there's just no way a passing game can

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Speaker 1: survive when your second longest throw in a game is

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Speaker 1: only twelve yards. They have to get those intermediate game

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Speaker 1: passes going. I mean, we can talk about the deep

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Speaker 1: ones and those are great, but to me an, NFL

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Speaker 1: offense lives and dies on that intermediate passing game, and

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Speaker 1: the Cardinals just don't have it right now. And we

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Speaker 1: can talk about Kyler's legs all we want, but you

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Speaker 1: need to have that intermediate passing game to be a

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Speaker 1: fishing in the NFL. What's funny to me is early

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Speaker 1: in the season when we had this discussion after the

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Speaker 1: Carolina game that day, it felt like everything was totally horizontal,

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Speaker 1: Like I felt like almost every pass was within five

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Speaker 1: yards of line of scrimmage. I never was left with

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Speaker 1: that feeling against the Rams. I didn't feel like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: you're doing everything horizontal, yet you still weren't getting the

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Speaker 1: plays down field. That just I don't know if that's

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Speaker 1: a good thing or a bad thing, but that's just

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Speaker 1: I mean, you felt like you could easily point to, Okay,

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Speaker 1: you can't just make everything horizontal like they did against

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Speaker 1: Panthers when you have what happened against the Rams. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if that makes it better or worse that

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Speaker 1: you weren't getting the kind of production that you wanted to.

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Speaker 1: And we'll see what happens. I don't know what the

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Speaker 1: weather's supposed to be like in New York. I do

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Speaker 1: think New York has a fairly solid defense relatively speaking. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: Russell Wilson feels that way right now, you know, I

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Speaker 1: don't you know, are you going to be facing the

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Speaker 1: better defenses down the stretch here. I mean, Philadelphia's playing terribly,

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Speaker 1: but mostly that's offensively driven and their defense has had

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Speaker 1: their moments, and they're gonna have to play the Rams again.

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Speaker 1: They got to play the forty nine ers again. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they got to find a way to do something here.

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Speaker 1: Most of the reports abread, and there have been numerous

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Speaker 1: ones that have said that Russell Wilson was confused by

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Speaker 1: the Giants defense. Well, if the Giants just confused Russell Wilson,

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Speaker 1: then oh boy, you know, you start gripping my boxers,

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Speaker 1: start to bunge going to New York, thinking what is

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Speaker 1: the Cardinals offense? How are they going to perform against

359
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Speaker 1: that Giants defense? And you're right, Darren, haven't gone to Carolina.

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Speaker 1: I have a bubble screen burned in my brain. It

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Speaker 1: just seemed like there were so many wide receiver screens

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Speaker 1: in that game, and I can't think of a single

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Speaker 1: wide receiver screen. Most likely I'm wrong, but against this

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Speaker 1: latest Rams game, I can't think of a single wide

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Speaker 1: receiver screen. So it seems like, Okay, the Cardinals have adjusted,

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Speaker 1: they have changed certain aspects of the offense, but really

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Speaker 1: what's changed for the worst And Kyle you had this

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Speaker 1: number before the game and you updated it after the game.

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Speaker 1: Isn't it predicated on the number of times Kyler runs

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Speaker 1: the ball? And isn't eighth the magic number? Yeah? I

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Speaker 1: mean I don't know if that's the magic number. It

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Speaker 1: certainly has been, you know, in this season, when he's

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Speaker 1: at eight times or more, I think they're six and one,

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Speaker 1: and they're points per games at around thirty two. And

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Speaker 1: when he's run it a fewer than eight, they're oh

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Speaker 1: in five and the points per games around twenty two

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Speaker 1: or twenty something like that. So it's a there's not

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Speaker 1: a perfect correlation, but I do think there is certainly

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Speaker 1: something there where going back to last year too, when

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Speaker 1: Kyler Murray runs it opens things up offensively, and Cliff

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Speaker 1: Kingsbury said as much in training camp. I remember writing

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Speaker 1: a story about that aspect of it. And he does

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Speaker 1: like to get Kyler Murray out and we'll see what

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Speaker 1: they do. He is pretty coy on Monday about changing

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Speaker 1: anything up. I asked about maybe design rollouts if that's possible,

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Speaker 1: or if out of the shotgun that's not as tenable

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Speaker 1: as somebody like Jared Goff doing it or the Niners

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Speaker 1: doing it. And he said he wants to play to

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Speaker 1: the strength of his personnel and sounding like he didn't

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Speaker 1: really plan on doing it, but it certainly seems like

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Speaker 1: you'd want to get Kyler Murray on the move a

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Speaker 1: little bit to give him simpler reads and also to

393
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Speaker 1: get his legs back into it where if there's nobody

394
00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:04,960
Speaker 1: open down the field, he's already on the move and

395
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Speaker 1: he can look down and maybe make some plays. So

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Speaker 1: we'll see what they do if there's any huge adjustments.

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Speaker 1: But from the way Cliff Kingsbury was talking, it sounds

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Speaker 1: like he feels like this is the best system for

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Speaker 1: what they're doing offensively, and he's gonna stick with it.

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Speaker 1: The other stat is that when Kylo Rush is for

401
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Speaker 1: thirty one yards or less, the Cardinals are now and

402
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,240
Speaker 1: we've been updating this seemingly every week for the past month,

403
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:29,840
Speaker 1: they're one ten and one. That's so, And yeah, it'd

404
00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:32,040
Speaker 1: be great to see him get on the move, obviously

405
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,359
Speaker 1: he's capable of that. How about moving up in the pocket, Darren?

406
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Speaker 1: Is that unfair? When I say, you know what I

407
00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,840
Speaker 1: think of Derek Carr throwing the game winner against the Jets,

408
00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,280
Speaker 1: he stepped up in the pocket Patrick Mahomes through a

409
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Speaker 1: game winner this past week, and he stepped up in

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Speaker 1: the pocket even in the Monday night game. You know,

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Speaker 1: Josh Allen now Josh Allen six five Okay, So is

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Speaker 1: it realistic to think that Kyler has to learn and

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Speaker 1: evolve to the point where he's stepping in the pocket

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Speaker 1: a little bit more as opposed to retreating or going sideways.

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Speaker 1: I do think I think there is something to that,

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Speaker 1: especially from the aspect of I think he's still learning

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Speaker 1: to be a quarterback in this league and what's going

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Speaker 1: to make him most successful. I don't know. And it

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Speaker 1: doesn't excuse it. I mean, you're gonna have to learn

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Speaker 1: how to do it against everybody. But you know, I

421
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Speaker 1: don't I don't know if playing the Rams and Aaron Donald,

422
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Speaker 1: who's pushing right up the middle, is the game where

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Speaker 1: you're like, well, well, how are you stepping up on

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Speaker 1: the pocket more often? Um? Because that that can be

425
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Speaker 1: a dangerous combination there. Uh. And we certainly saw Aaron Donald,

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Speaker 1: you know, do his duty a couple of times there.

427
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Speaker 1: But I think that's I think there is something to

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Speaker 1: that once in a while. I think it's it's tough

429
00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:47,480
Speaker 1: for the offensive Lineman to not necessarily always know exactly

430
00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:49,720
Speaker 1: what Kyler is going to do. Is he is he

431
00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:51,639
Speaker 1: just going to spin out of there every time? And

432
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:53,960
Speaker 1: then once that happens, he's kind of on his own.

433
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:57,400
Speaker 1: And um, and if you're mush rushing and you're spinning

434
00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,880
Speaker 1: out over some inside pressure and then there's a guy

435
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:04,280
Speaker 1: right there, it makes a lot harder. So I think

436
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:07,639
Speaker 1: I think there are there's some passing game fundamentals that

437
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:09,720
Speaker 1: he still needs to get better at. I think there's

438
00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:13,480
Speaker 1: still some passing game fundamentals that I think Cliff Kingsbury

439
00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:15,800
Speaker 1: can still work into this offense at some point. Now

440
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,560
Speaker 1: is that now? I know I've heard you talk about

441
00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:20,639
Speaker 1: it on the radio, Paul, I've had some questions in

442
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,720
Speaker 1: the mailbag. You know, I get that you want to install.

443
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:27,720
Speaker 1: There's some different stuff. I know. I know when I'm

444
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:29,719
Speaker 1: looking at some of the things the forty nine Ers

445
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:32,679
Speaker 1: and Bills did on Monday Night, I'm thinking, Wow, I'd

446
00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:36,160
Speaker 1: be interested to see Kyler on doing some of those plays.

447
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,280
Speaker 1: But that's not going to happen now. That's not going

448
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:42,760
Speaker 1: to happen in three practice days before you play the Giants.

449
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:46,200
Speaker 1: That's not going to happen you just there isn't time

450
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:48,800
Speaker 1: to prepare for a game and install a bunch of

451
00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 1: new stuff. I just and feel comfortable enough to run

452
00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:53,879
Speaker 1: it in games that you're gonna be able to execute it.

453
00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:58,000
Speaker 1: So I mean, could they change some things in the offseason, possibly,

454
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 1: but I think right now they got to find what

455
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:03,879
Speaker 1: they need to do within how they're doing it. And

456
00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:09,200
Speaker 1: I mean if you I mean, you guys can disagree

457
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 1: with me, but I mean, if you are really, if

458
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:14,760
Speaker 1: you're good at what you're doing, and you have to

459
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:17,800
Speaker 1: assume that Cliff is good at what he does or

460
00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 1: he thinks he's good at what he does, and Kyler

461
00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 1: is good at what he does, you should have the

462
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 1: antidote for some of this stuff within what you're already doing.

463
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:27,639
Speaker 1: You've just got to figure out what it is and

464
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,840
Speaker 1: you got to execute it. Yeah, I would think so.

465
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:33,359
Speaker 1: And you know, my point, and Wolf disagreed with me

466
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:35,600
Speaker 1: a little bit, was that there's no way in week

467
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 1: fourteen you're installing all these boots and waggles in these

468
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 1: design rollouts when we haven't seen them all year, when

469
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:45,840
Speaker 1: your quarterback seemingly has never been under center. Is entire

470
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,320
Speaker 1: life from high school, college, Wolf's like, well, we've seen

471
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:51,399
Speaker 1: it in the preseason. Yeah, you can count it on

472
00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:53,280
Speaker 1: two hands how many times we've seen in the preseason.

473
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:54,679
Speaker 1: A lot of times that's just for the sake of

474
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:59,159
Speaker 1: showing stuff and put it on film appreciate twenty nineteen exactly.

475
00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:04,239
Speaker 1: So you know, anyway, it's risky if they're gonna go

476
00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 1: and attempt something like that and incorporate it, great, you're

477
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,760
Speaker 1: basically going to get one live practice day to do

478
00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 1: it these days, which is a Thursday. And even that's

479
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,240
Speaker 1: three quarter speed for the most part. So do you

480
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,600
Speaker 1: put that on display against the red hot Giants? Defense

481
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,640
Speaker 1: is playing pretty well and just bottled up Russell Wilson.

482
00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,919
Speaker 1: I do like wolves point that Russell Wilson sort of

483
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,160
Speaker 1: get hit this wall the middle of his second year,

484
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,159
Speaker 1: and defenses kind of did something similar to Russell Wilson

485
00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:30,919
Speaker 1: and try to bottle him up in the pocket and

486
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 1: turn him into a pocket quarterback. At least that was

487
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,199
Speaker 1: always the game plan. And obviously he's navigated through that

488
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:40,199
Speaker 1: and become a perennial MVP candidate, even though he for

489
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,399
Speaker 1: some reason he's ever gotten an actual vote. But you know,

490
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 1: obviously it's worked out for Russell Wilson. So I think

491
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:46,600
Speaker 1: there's light at the end of the tunnel. It's just

492
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:49,400
Speaker 1: can they do it over the next month. Yeah, I'd

493
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 1: be surprised if they went under center and I formation

494
00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,560
Speaker 1: and doing bootlegs like that. But there's versions of the

495
00:24:56,600 --> 00:25:01,879
Speaker 1: shot gun bootleg. Lincoln Riley has done a pretty decent

496
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:06,440
Speaker 1: job of inventing a shotgun bootleg that coaches are probably

497
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:10,040
Speaker 1: been watching, especially as the NFL turns more into the

498
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:13,639
Speaker 1: shotgun game. So there's ways to get Kyler Murray outside

499
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,760
Speaker 1: the pocket. I don't think you're gonna completely scrap what

500
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 1: your offense is, but after three games of this and

501
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:22,639
Speaker 1: knowing that a lot of teams are gonna try to

502
00:25:22,680 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: hem him in, it wouldn't shock me if against the

503
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,400
Speaker 1: Giants there's more things to get Kyler outside. Maybe there's

504
00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,320
Speaker 1: more design runs if his shoulder is feeling good, because

505
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:35,680
Speaker 1: when he was running, especially the Washington game stood out

506
00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:38,440
Speaker 1: when they called a couple design runs that were super effective.

507
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:41,720
Speaker 1: That's a big boost to the offense. And I mean,

508
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:43,359
Speaker 1: you want Kyler Murray to be able to sit in

509
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:46,440
Speaker 1: the pocket and dissect a defense and get those yardage

510
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,480
Speaker 1: just throwing the ball regularly, but at some point, I

511
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,160
Speaker 1: think you're gonna have to manufacture some stuff if it's

512
00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:54,680
Speaker 1: not there quite yet. And you're right, Paul, I think

513
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:57,520
Speaker 1: it's early in his career. He's in his second season

514
00:25:57,560 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 1: and he's learning. But at this point, you gotta do

515
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 1: what you can do to get this offense moving, knowing

516
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:05,720
Speaker 1: there's four games left and the playoffs are still very

517
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: much in the picture, So I think they might have

518
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,639
Speaker 1: to manufacture it a bit down the stretch and and

519
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 1: maybe overhaul a few things in the offseason, but right now,

520
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:17,240
Speaker 1: you're doing anything you can to get going offensively. And

521
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:21,520
Speaker 1: I understand, you know, it always kind of feels like

522
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: Kyler bristles a little bit when you say, you know,

523
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:27,680
Speaker 1: can he get it done without running the ball? And

524
00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:31,479
Speaker 1: I think he likes the idea of being known as

525
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 1: a pocket pastor, and he feels like he can be

526
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 1: a good quarterback even if he doesn't have to run.

527
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 1: And that may be true, and it may and that's

528
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:40,200
Speaker 1: all well and good, but I feel like at this

529
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: point the questions are still going to come until you

530
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:50,280
Speaker 1: show it. And I understand why he wants to why

531
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:53,720
Speaker 1: he feels the way he does or wants to kind

532
00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 1: of be viewed in a certain way. But but we

533
00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:59,880
Speaker 1: when we've seen success, it's because he's run it. At least.

534
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,399
Speaker 1: He throws the ball obviously very well in those but

535
00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: he's able to run the ball too. And if he

536
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,480
Speaker 1: would like a reputation of being a guy who doesn't

537
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:10,840
Speaker 1: have to run to do well, then we've got to

538
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,000
Speaker 1: see some games where that happens, and we have not

539
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 1: seen that yet. You know, you guys, we do these

540
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 1: out of market radio hits, right, and you go on

541
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:20,280
Speaker 1: the phone with a sports talk radio station and the

542
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:22,680
Speaker 1: opposing city of that team that week. And I can't

543
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:24,160
Speaker 1: tell you how many of us I did last year,

544
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,680
Speaker 1: And I always got the same question about Kyler Murray.

545
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,359
Speaker 1: Is Michael Vick? And I'm like, no, he's not a

546
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,919
Speaker 1: running quarterback who can throw. He's a pocket quarterback who

547
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 1: can run. Unfortunately, the running aspect has been eliminated here

548
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 1: over the last few games. So is that too? You

549
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: know we talk about being aggressive, is that because he's

550
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 1: not as willing to be aggressive not only pushing the

551
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:47,320
Speaker 1: ball down field with his arm, but in terms of

552
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 1: running it after the shoulder injury? Perhaps is that a byproduct?

553
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: See to me, when they go into empty, for example,

554
00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:56,840
Speaker 1: And if Kyler's not willing to run it, then it's

555
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 1: just too predictable. Then the defense all of a sudden

556
00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,480
Speaker 1: doesn't have to worry about the run game whatsoever. And

557
00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:05,399
Speaker 1: they go empty. And I just think it's infinitely easier

558
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:09,320
Speaker 1: for a defense in key critical situations when the offense

559
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: goes empty. Now, maybe they go with a pistol. If

560
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 1: you're telling me they're gonna innovate something for this week,

561
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: I'd love to see the pistol and maybe restore the

562
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:20,880
Speaker 1: threat of play action even out of the shotgun, because

563
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:23,680
Speaker 1: a lot of times a play action fake out of

564
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 1: the gun and there's a running back flanking him, it's

565
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 1: just sort of and it's sort of halfhearted, kind of

566
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 1: fake the handoff. Nobody's really buying. It doesn't suck up

567
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: the linebackers. Isn't convincing at all if they went with

568
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,119
Speaker 1: more of the pistol, for example, Kyle, at this point,

569
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 1: I think that's more feasible. Whether it's more likely or not,

570
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 1: I have no idea. I mean, I think it was

571
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 1: convincing when you were running the ball effectively, But when

572
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 1: you're not running the ball very well, I think the

573
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 1: linebackers naturally aren't going to respect it as much. And

574
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 1: going back to the idea of Kyler not being willing

575
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 1: to run, I think in the Los Angeles game, I

576
00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 1: didn't see any instances of him not being willing to

577
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,560
Speaker 1: I just think they did a really nice job of

578
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: consistently staying in their pass rushing lanes and not giving

579
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: him anywhere to really go. I didn't I didn't ever

580
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 1: see any huge gaps where he could have shot through,

581
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 1: and he turned it down. I just think they did

582
00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 1: a really nice job. And you hate to, hey, you

583
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:19,520
Speaker 1: hear that coaching cliche so much that you have to

584
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 1: give the other team credit. But I do think part

585
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 1: of that game was Los Angeles defense is very good.

586
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 1: I think the Dolphins and the Rams team speed from

587
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 1: what I've seen live, have really stood out, and I

588
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:32,520
Speaker 1: think that's part of it. Like you go back to

589
00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 1: the Jets game, they must rushed and kept Kyler Murray

590
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,040
Speaker 1: in the pocket, but they couldn't get any penetration, so

591
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 1: he had forever to sit back there and dissect the defense,

592
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: and he had a really big game throw and he

593
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,880
Speaker 1: averaged more than ten yards per attempt through the air.

594
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:48,200
Speaker 1: So I think it's it's that that kind of balance

595
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:52,000
Speaker 1: where if he has time to check out the field

596
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 1: and throw it, well, I think he can do it.

597
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 1: But when he's pressured and that process is sped up,

598
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: it's a little harder for a young guy. And even

599
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 1: though we're talking about Kyler Murray as a pocket passer

600
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 1: and trying to do it, I think back to last

601
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: year in Baker Mayfield and Josh Allen. We're still having

602
00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: their issues and their second season. So this isn't an

603
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:13,479
Speaker 1: uncommon thing for young quarterbacks. We've just been spoiled by

604
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,320
Speaker 1: what Kyler Murray has done early in his career. That

605
00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:21,200
Speaker 1: it's a big difference now, but it's not completely unforeseen historically.

606
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 1: And like you mentioned two with Russell Wilson, here's the

607
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,080
Speaker 1: other thing I should mention on Cardinals Underground brought to

608
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 1: you by Pacific Office Automation, proud partner of the Arizona Cardinals.

609
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 1: At halftime, there was a right before halftime, there was

610
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 1: a long conversation between Kyler and Cliff on the bench

611
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 1: one on one. Normally Cliff never sits down ever, but

612
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,920
Speaker 1: the two of them were seated as the Rams had

613
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: the ball and they're putting it together a drive to

614
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:47,120
Speaker 1: take that fourteen seven lead, and they had a long conversation.

615
00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:49,800
Speaker 1: Right before that, Kyler had a long conversation on the

616
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: other side of the sideline. I've never seen him sit

617
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: on the defensive part of the sideline, just him and

618
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 1: d Hop looking to the tablet looking at overhead shots.

619
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:01,360
Speaker 1: Sure enough, at halftime, Cliff shared with Jen Haile, the

620
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,960
Speaker 1: Fox Sideline TV reporter, which she related to me in

621
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:09,240
Speaker 1: the halftime conversation with the TV sideline reporter that Cliff

622
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 1: told Kyler, don't be afraid to go at Jail and

623
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 1: Ramsey because what did de Hop have in that first

624
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 1: half one target? And what they do on that final

625
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 1: possession of the first half after they had that conversation,

626
00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: there was a defensive pass interference, they drew that and

627
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:28,240
Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, d Hop got the production

628
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: in the second half, albeit didn't get a bunch of

629
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 1: chunk rows, but yes he did get catches, etc. So

630
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 1: I think that's part of the process. Maybe he heard

631
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: so much about Jalen Ramsey and what Jalen Ramsey has

632
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: done against some of the premiere receivers. I get it.

633
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: But at the same time Cliff reminded him, I also

634
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: wonder if a reluctance to step up in the pocket

635
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: was because of ninety nine and if the reputation preceded him.

636
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: There it's just me thinking out loud, and it also

637
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 1: makes me wonder, you got a giant's defense, and I'll

638
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: be at his playing pretty darn well. It was a

639
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: fairly no name defense, and maybe this is the week

640
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 1: where Kyler just lets it rip, Darren and he's like,

641
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 1: you know what, here we go. I don't recognize in

642
00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 1: these names, I don't fear in these names. I'll play

643
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: without fear and let's just let this thing rip. That

644
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 1: would be a best case scenario. But I think some

645
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,840
Speaker 1: of that was at play, And you know, sometimes young

646
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 1: quarterbacks have to they have to engage that themselves and

647
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 1: find out the hard way or not. I mean, we

648
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 1: we've set the bar so high for Kyler because of

649
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 1: some of the things he's done and because it is

650
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 1: so easy. How do I explain this? I think in

651
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: some ways, I mean, he he's not a nobody, He's

652
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: a He's a brand that I think carries with him

653
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 1: a certain cascher that if he becomes a superstar quarterback

654
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,000
Speaker 1: on a consistent basis, which I think we all feel

655
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 1: like he can reach that level. He's got the it

656
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 1: factor because of who he is and how he carries

657
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:04,600
Speaker 1: himself and the name and all this stuff. He's not

658
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: gonna have to worry about that. But that also, to me,

659
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:11,520
Speaker 1: raises expectations maybe a little bit higher than if he

660
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 1: was somebody else. I mean, even Josh Allen, who was

661
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: a top ten draft pick. I feel like people were

662
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: willing to say he wasn't gonna be any good. I mean,

663
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 1: you're going to talk about a top ten draft pick

664
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: really high a lot. But at the same time, I

665
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 1: think things are different. And you know, if Kyler Murray

666
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,880
Speaker 1: hits superstar status, I don't know how much credit he's

667
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 1: going to get per se to get there, because I

668
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:37,880
Speaker 1: think everybody was just kind of assuming he was going

669
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 1: to be that guy, whereas like Josh Allen is playing

670
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 1: so great right now and everyone's like, oh my god,

671
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:46,000
Speaker 1: look at this dude. He's turned into this crazy great player.

672
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:50,680
Speaker 1: And I think that's also something that could weigh on

673
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:53,560
Speaker 1: Kyler Murray. I mean, how much is he putting on

674
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 1: his own shoulders that he should be that good already?

675
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 1: How much of this is that impacting him? How much

676
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,520
Speaker 1: is his growth being impacted by everything that a young

677
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:06,520
Speaker 1: quarterback is going through in this league right now because

678
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 1: of protocols and because of the way things are set up,

679
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:12,680
Speaker 1: and because you didn't have the offseason. Not that it

680
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,600
Speaker 1: would derail him altogether, but you know, maybe if he

681
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:18,520
Speaker 1: has this offseason, maybe he's that much further ahead. Maybe

682
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: some of these things he would have sorted out. I

683
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:28,319
Speaker 1: don't know. I just feel like, again not to say

684
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:32,799
Speaker 1: it's acceptable to have all this, just be it is

685
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 1: what it is because you are in the playoff hunt,

686
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:36,799
Speaker 1: and you were five and two and six and three,

687
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,360
Speaker 1: and there were expectations set because you could make this

688
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:43,359
Speaker 1: push for the playoffs. But I don't know. I don't

689
00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:44,920
Speaker 1: I'm not one of those people that all of a

690
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 1: sudden has this big concern that everything is derailed. Before

691
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 1: the season, I thought this team was an eight or

692
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:56,120
Speaker 1: nine win team and they're kind of in that vibe

693
00:34:56,200 --> 00:34:58,319
Speaker 1: right now. And Kyler Murray I thought could have a

694
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 1: really good season. I didn't expect this to be his

695
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,960
Speaker 1: super season. Now as the season went on early I

696
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 1: started changing my mind, and maybe I shouldn't, But I'm like,

697
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,480
Speaker 1: you're maybe you're just gonna face your best defenses down

698
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:12,880
Speaker 1: the stretch, and this is just how it was going

699
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:15,960
Speaker 1: to be after you got through sixteen games. But I

700
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 1: do like your point about how we've been conditioned to

701
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:22,560
Speaker 1: expect instant success from Kyler. Would I would put myself

702
00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 1: in that category, I'd have to raise my amb moment

703
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:27,360
Speaker 1: he became a starter in high school, what do you do?

704
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:30,000
Speaker 1: We want a state championship big school Texas high school

705
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:33,360
Speaker 1: football as a sophomore in high school? What he became

706
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:35,200
Speaker 1: a starter at Oklahoma, what do you do? We won

707
00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 1: the Heisman, they went into the playoffs, etc. But if

708
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,839
Speaker 1: you go back to early in his career, he did

709
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:44,200
Speaker 1: us some struggles at Texas A and M. So look

710
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 1: and have the expectation has been unrealistic to a certain degree. Sure,

711
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 1: but we've seen it already halfway through this season. That's

712
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:54,960
Speaker 1: the other things. It's not just him. It's the Cardinals

713
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:58,400
Speaker 1: offense that is stalled, that has hit that wall that

714
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,479
Speaker 1: Kyler mentions. I think the big question once again coming

715
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 1: full circle here, Kyle, is you know whether there is

716
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:10,080
Speaker 1: an adjustment to the adjustment that defenses have made. Is

717
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 1: there something they can do to restore the potency and

718
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:17,359
Speaker 1: the scoring of this offense that could actually have them

719
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 1: continue a playoff chase. Yeah, I definitely feel like we're

720
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 1: at a pivotal point at this season, because I mean,

721
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:29,279
Speaker 1: I understand that expectations did get really high when they

722
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: got to five and two and then six and three,

723
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 1: But I think with the way the defense played, to me,

724
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:38,520
Speaker 1: that's been the big surprise that they've been that solid

725
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 1: all season long, and to me that the offense hasn't

726
00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:44,359
Speaker 1: performed to what I thought it would, which I don't

727
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 1: think they were unreasonable expectations to think this offense would

728
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 1: be top ten and right now they're around thirteen in

729
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:54,360
Speaker 1: Football Outsiders DVOA. So I feel like they haven't quite

730
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,959
Speaker 1: lived up to what a reasonable expectation was for them.

731
00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 1: But I also think maybe by the time we get

732
00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 1: to the end of the season, and as this schedule

733
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 1: gets a little softer, as Darren said, when we look

734
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:07,840
Speaker 1: at it and aggregate, by the end, maybe they're gonna

735
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:11,319
Speaker 1: be a pretty decent offense. Maybe they're gonna get to

736
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,120
Speaker 1: top ten if things turn around. Maybe they've made a

737
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 1: pretty good growth, like Darren was saying, from five wins,

738
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 1: maybe you get to nine and you're nine and seven

739
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:22,920
Speaker 1: and then everything was kind of what we expected, although

740
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:25,560
Speaker 1: it was a roller coaster along the way. They might

741
00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:28,719
Speaker 1: not be outside of our expectations by the end of it.

742
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:31,279
Speaker 1: And right now it's you're certainly at the depths of

743
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:35,760
Speaker 1: concern because of what they've done offensively. But I thought,

744
00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:38,400
Speaker 1: as much as people want to get mad at what

745
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 1: Cliff Kingsbury said, this is a cyclical league sometimes, and

746
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:45,480
Speaker 1: there are definitely ups and downs in the NFL. And

747
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 1: the offense has not looked good, and we'll see what happens,

748
00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:50,920
Speaker 1: especially in these next two games against the Giants and

749
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: the Eagles. If they perform poorly offensively, then yeah, to me,

750
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 1: it's a pretty big disappointment what they did. But if

751
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:00,160
Speaker 1: they turn it around, get back on track, and and

752
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:02,400
Speaker 1: things turn out okay, then you can say, Okay, they

753
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:05,239
Speaker 1: played a good Rams, a good Rams team and that

754
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 1: was a blip, and Kyler Murray heard his shoulder and

755
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:09,960
Speaker 1: that was a blip. But this team is still on

756
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:14,960
Speaker 1: a pretty good forecast and look it okay, So we'll

757
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 1: see in a few weeks. I'm not ready to close

758
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:20,000
Speaker 1: the book either way on it. I do think they

759
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 1: need to perform better, but I think we'll definitely know

760
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:25,600
Speaker 1: more after these next two games. And here was the

761
00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:28,280
Speaker 1: other problem against the Rams is the look, your defense

762
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 1: is much better, but they can't withstand an offense that

763
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,719
Speaker 1: is so anemic that the time possession is so lopsided.

764
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:37,880
Speaker 1: So when the Cardinals cut into seventeen fourteen, they score,

765
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:40,920
Speaker 1: de Hoop gets a touchdown after that Fourthtown conversion. Then

766
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:43,479
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, the Rams come back and there's

767
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:45,960
Speaker 1: Jared Goff and he gets the QB sneak and the touchdown,

768
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:47,640
Speaker 1: so they go up ten and game. But wait a minute,

769
00:38:47,680 --> 00:38:49,759
Speaker 1: there's the fumbled pun and the Cardinals punching in two

770
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 1: plays later and they're back within twenty four to twenty one,

771
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:53,759
Speaker 1: and then all of a sudden, the Rams go down

772
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:56,480
Speaker 1: the field again and they make it thirty one twenty one.

773
00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,520
Speaker 1: At that point, gentleman, in the fourth quarter, time possession

774
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,799
Speaker 1: was basically thirty five to fifteen. So that's not going

775
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 1: to work. That's just not you know, so at that point,

776
00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: especially for a depleted defensive line that would face seventy

777
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:16,879
Speaker 1: nine snaps, that's just at some point it's going to give,

778
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:19,839
Speaker 1: and it did in the fourth quarter. So yeah, I mean,

779
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,439
Speaker 1: I don't I don't think the it helped at all

780
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 1: the time of possession, but I do think it's a

781
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: concern that the pass rush has not been there, at

782
00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:31,240
Speaker 1: least at that game, and maybe of late. I watched

783
00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:33,359
Speaker 1: the road games on television, so it's a little bit

784
00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:37,760
Speaker 1: harder to see exactly what's going on. But without Chandler Jones,

785
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,280
Speaker 1: Marcus Golden is getting close, but he's not getting those sacks.

786
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:44,239
Speaker 1: Hasan Reddick has fallen off a bit, devonkan ARD's not

787
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:49,080
Speaker 1: playing much, so they don't have a consistent pass rush presence.

788
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:51,719
Speaker 1: And that's a big issue because this the secondary can

789
00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:54,920
Speaker 1: be up and down, but it's not an elite secondary

790
00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:58,720
Speaker 1: at this point. So I do think the defense deserves

791
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:01,239
Speaker 1: some blame. I mean, there's injuries that have hit it,

792
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 1: so you don't put too much on them, but I mean,

793
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:07,680
Speaker 1: you gave up thirty one points defensively to the Rams,

794
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,280
Speaker 1: and in that second half they really moved the ball well,

795
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,880
Speaker 1: and if they got that fourth and goal, you're up

796
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 1: to thirty eight points given up. So it wasn't a

797
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 1: great performance by the defense by any means. Number two

798
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:23,080
Speaker 1: in sacks right now, Dennis Gardeck with three. What's he

799
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:27,279
Speaker 1: played two dozen defensive snaps all year. In fact, I

800
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:29,319
Speaker 1: made reference to you Kyle full Disclosure on the on

801
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 1: the broadcast, said we need to create maybe there is

802
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:35,880
Speaker 1: an analytic If not, Kyle Odeguard needs to create this.

803
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: I said to Passion Wolf on the air, um sacks

804
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 1: per defensive snap, what is the ratio the productivity? Because

805
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 1: Dennis Gardek has to be up there with three enough

806
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,719
Speaker 1: defensive snaps you can count on two hands. Basically, it's

807
00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:54,040
Speaker 1: probably the best in NFL history. It's just m and

808
00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,640
Speaker 1: that's look. You knew, you knew as soon as Chandler

809
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 1: Jones went out. I feel like there was there might

810
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:00,960
Speaker 1: have been a little bit of more there because I

811
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:02,920
Speaker 1: think they did do a really nice job right when

812
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,880
Speaker 1: Chandler first went out about I mean, Hassan Reddick was

813
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 1: playing really well, and then they got Marcus Golden. He

814
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 1: came in with a lot of energy. But I mean

815
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:13,840
Speaker 1: the reality is is this is what a pass rush

816
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:15,879
Speaker 1: looks like when you lose one of the best pass

817
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:19,240
Speaker 1: rushers in the league and you don't have a second

818
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 1: guy that really does that a lot. I mean, I

819
00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,160
Speaker 1: don't think the pass rush is underperforming for who they are.

820
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:28,360
Speaker 1: They just don't have those guys, and that's the issue.

821
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:30,640
Speaker 1: And then do you do you blitz more? Do you do?

822
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:34,200
Speaker 1: And against the Rams it's so tough. I mean, we

823
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:36,759
Speaker 1: were talking about this for the offensive side and what

824
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 1: Kyler Murray might be able to do, but man, the

825
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:43,359
Speaker 1: number of times that it feels like the Cardinals get

826
00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: sucked in on the bootlegs, the play action bootlegs and

827
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,800
Speaker 1: don't have anybody back out there on the back side

828
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:54,440
Speaker 1: when Golf twirls back around and either has an easy

829
00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:57,920
Speaker 1: throw or some more down the field. I just I

830
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 1: wish they could learn to deal with a little bit

831
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:03,240
Speaker 1: better because it just feels like every time it works.

832
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:07,319
Speaker 1: I'm at the point now and I was not this

833
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:09,560
Speaker 1: way over the first half of the season. Look, I

834
00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:12,560
Speaker 1: wasn't the guy screaming Isaiah Simmons needs more snaps, needs

835
00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 1: more snaps because he wasn't better in deove Andre Campbell.

836
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:17,880
Speaker 1: But at this point, I think it would behoove the

837
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:20,000
Speaker 1: Cardinals defense to figure out a way to get forty

838
00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:22,360
Speaker 1: eight on the field for the majority of the snaps.

839
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:24,839
Speaker 1: On defense. I'm not sure how, I'm not sure where.

840
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:26,759
Speaker 1: All I know is the two leading tacklers in that

841
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 1: game against the Rams where you're two starting safeties, and

842
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 1: to Darren's point, when you got a quarterback on the move,

843
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:34,440
Speaker 1: I just I think of Isaiah Simmons. I think of

844
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:37,400
Speaker 1: that athleticism. I just think if you're going to be

845
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:41,000
Speaker 1: innovative and throw a whole bunch of stuff at the offense,

846
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:43,399
Speaker 1: then be innovative enough to figure out where to play

847
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:46,960
Speaker 1: the rookie on most snaps instead of certain pass rush

848
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:50,279
Speaker 1: and passing down situations. I'd love to see forty eight

849
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 1: there out there on a more regular basis. That's my

850
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 1: only Monday Morning quarterback for the week from CALABC Consulting

851
00:42:56,560 --> 00:43:00,719
Speaker 1: Kyle on Isaiah Simmons, Yeah, I mean does feel like

852
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 1: the Cardinals defense is a little short on impact playmakers

853
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 1: right now. There's there's not a bunch of guys. I mean,

854
00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:11,240
Speaker 1: Buddha Baker kind of has that special look and special

855
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:14,399
Speaker 1: speed to him, and Isaiah Simmons certainly has that when

856
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,480
Speaker 1: he's on the field. Can you live with any mistakes

857
00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 1: he makes because you're kind of living more dangerously when

858
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,080
Speaker 1: you've got him out there compared to a Jordan Hicks

859
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:26,320
Speaker 1: or dev Andre Campbell who might not have the athletic upside,

860
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:28,960
Speaker 1: but they know exactly where they should be on basically

861
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,120
Speaker 1: every play, so it's more risk reward. But I think

862
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:34,799
Speaker 1: a lot of people, you know, the fans, would love

863
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,560
Speaker 1: to see Isaiah Simmons out there full time. And when

864
00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 1: he played like that against Seattle, he was he was

865
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 1: an impact player. So I could see them trying to

866
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 1: pump it up down the stretch it and especially you know,

867
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:47,279
Speaker 1: I can understand why they don't want to play him

868
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:48,759
Speaker 1: in bass, and they've kind of had to play a

869
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: lot of bass the last couple of weeks because both

870
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:55,319
Speaker 1: the Patriots and the Rams can go heavy personnel. But

871
00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:57,480
Speaker 1: maybe you do just put him in base packages and

872
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:01,040
Speaker 1: hope he can hold up against the run. Then again,

873
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,080
Speaker 1: I think the Cardinals probably beat the Giants just because

874
00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: they have Chase Edmonds. So you know it's a Chase

875
00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:08,480
Speaker 1: Edmonds factor. You're going to New York, you got Chase Edmonds.

876
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:10,560
Speaker 1: I think that moves the line in Vegas at least

877
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:12,520
Speaker 1: eight or nine points. So I'm not a gambler, but

878
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:15,799
Speaker 1: I would say just that Chase Edmonds factor in New

879
00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:18,799
Speaker 1: York based on his game the Fordham guy at the

880
00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:20,839
Speaker 1: Giants a year ago and then at the Jets over

881
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:23,640
Speaker 1: this season. I mean, Darren, are you with me? Chase Edmonds?

882
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:26,040
Speaker 1: You any who's right in the by line? Who's the

883
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 1: sub story? What do you call it? What do you

884
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:28,920
Speaker 1: get the shoulder story? What do you call it? In

885
00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:33,440
Speaker 1: the prince? What do you call it? The secondary story?

886
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:37,080
Speaker 1: I will say this, I think, especially after the way

887
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 1: Chase Edmonds played last year in New York and having

888
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 1: that in the running game, I think the Cardinals would

889
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 1: kill for a running game running performance like that this

890
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:49,640
Speaker 1: week with everything going on, it would go back to

891
00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:51,880
Speaker 1: what Kyle was talking about, which was I think some

892
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:53,959
Speaker 1: of these things would be helped if their running game

893
00:44:54,280 --> 00:44:58,080
Speaker 1: could provide something to make defenses think about so they're

894
00:44:58,120 --> 00:45:01,319
Speaker 1: not always keying on the pass. And clearly it would

895
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:03,080
Speaker 1: be a good story for us, just like you said, Paul,

896
00:45:03,120 --> 00:45:05,880
Speaker 1: because Chase Edmonds in the New York area is always

897
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 1: a good thing, and you start to wonder, I mean,

898
00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:13,280
Speaker 1: he's I think he's clearly your second most explosive skill player.

899
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:15,600
Speaker 1: I don't know if that's much of even a debate

900
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 1: at this point, and I do think the more you

901
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:21,520
Speaker 1: can get him the ball, whether it's carries or targets,

902
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:25,080
Speaker 1: he makes things happen, and he's turned into a pretty

903
00:45:25,120 --> 00:45:28,239
Speaker 1: solid receiver. It's it's crazy the catches he just comes

904
00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 1: down with very naturally, and we don't even think twice

905
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 1: about him contorting his body and making those catches. So

906
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:36,080
Speaker 1: I think anytime, I mean, if you can get him

907
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 1: up to twelve fourteen touches a game, I think that

908
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:41,360
Speaker 1: could help the offense as well. Yeah, Christian Kirk should

909
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,920
Speaker 1: be I think the second most productive weapon, and obviously

910
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:48,120
Speaker 1: that hasn't materialized. But about Larry Fitzgerald, let's wrap it

911
00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:50,560
Speaker 1: up with this on Cardinals Underground, brought to you by

912
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:53,360
Speaker 1: Pacific Offense Automation prop partner of the Arizona Cardinals, the

913
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:57,759
Speaker 1: Fits actor Darren and he's been activated from the COVID list.

914
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 1: What do you think just the specter of Larry in

915
00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:03,880
Speaker 1: number eleven being out there, even though he doesn't have

916
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:07,240
Speaker 1: a touchdown catch all year, but just the attention he commanded.

917
00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 1: I wonder if that trickled down and helped out other

918
00:46:10,239 --> 00:46:12,960
Speaker 1: guys on the offense more than we realized. So we

919
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:15,719
Speaker 1: saw the absence of Larry, you do wonder about that

920
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:18,600
Speaker 1: a little bit. I mean this this three game slide

921
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:21,920
Speaker 1: and the offensive issues did begin in Seattle, and fitz

922
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 1: did play in that game, but it does feel like

923
00:46:26,239 --> 00:46:28,279
Speaker 1: they've missed him the last two games, even though he

924
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:31,160
Speaker 1: might not be the receiver he once was. And that's

925
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:32,960
Speaker 1: just on the field. I can't even speak of what

926
00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:35,400
Speaker 1: they might be missing off the field. But at the

927
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:38,800
Speaker 1: same time, I don't want to get ahead of myself

928
00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:41,359
Speaker 1: over what we should expect from Larry Fitzgerald either. I mean,

929
00:46:42,920 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 1: there's a lot of guys who are coming off this list,

930
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:47,360
Speaker 1: and if the reports are true and he did test positive,

931
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:50,920
Speaker 1: we don't know how much this hampered Larry. You know,

932
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:55,280
Speaker 1: Devon Kannard said he didn't even have any symptoms or anything,

933
00:46:55,480 --> 00:46:58,680
Speaker 1: And for whatever reason, he hasn't been put back in

934
00:46:58,719 --> 00:47:00,560
Speaker 1: the lineup as much since he came back, and he

935
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:03,080
Speaker 1: hasn't made as big of an impact as maybe beforehand.

936
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,600
Speaker 1: We'll see where Larry is in terms of his stamina

937
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:09,480
Speaker 1: and in terms of what he's able to do. But

938
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:12,080
Speaker 1: I do feel like he can help out there on

939
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:16,000
Speaker 1: a lot of levels in terms of getting everybody on

940
00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: the same page, just to be the leader that you need.

941
00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:22,719
Speaker 1: I do think that that could potentially help them. Yes,

942
00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:25,959
Speaker 1: you go for four on third down in that first half.

943
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:28,720
Speaker 1: You just think, man, if Larry's Larry's in the mix,

944
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:31,839
Speaker 1: maybe you're more successful, especially on third downs. That's just

945
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 1: my gut feeling on that one. So, Kyle, last question,

946
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:38,439
Speaker 1: do the Cardinals need to make the playoffs this year?

947
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:42,319
Speaker 1: Do they need to make the playoffs this year for

948
00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:45,759
Speaker 1: the evolution of Cliff and Kyler and this team as

949
00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:48,799
Speaker 1: they continue to build. How critical is that do you think?

950
00:47:49,960 --> 00:47:52,239
Speaker 1: I think it's important. I mean, when you're right here

951
00:47:52,239 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 1: and you have that chance, it's you don't want to

952
00:47:55,200 --> 00:47:57,799
Speaker 1: waste these type of opportunities. I mean, you think this

953
00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 1: is a team that's growing in the trajector is going up,

954
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 1: but you never know on a year to year basis

955
00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:06,439
Speaker 1: how injuries are going to affect you. And I think

956
00:48:06,640 --> 00:48:08,920
Speaker 1: considering the way they've played at times, this can be

957
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 1: a pretty good football team, and you'd certainly like to

958
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:14,040
Speaker 1: get in and give yourself a chance to maybe catch

959
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:17,160
Speaker 1: fire and get the offense really roll in. So I

960
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 1: don't think this is the type of thing where you say,

961
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,040
Speaker 1: if we went eight and eight, I don't think anybody

962
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,960
Speaker 1: would be extremely happy about that, especially the way they started.

963
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:30,360
Speaker 1: And I think they're not a title contending looking team

964
00:48:30,600 --> 00:48:34,760
Speaker 1: certainly right now and borderline playoff team. But they've shown

965
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:37,040
Speaker 1: in spurts that they can hang with some pretty good teams.

966
00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:39,960
Speaker 1: And I do think it's important, knowing where they were

967
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:42,680
Speaker 1: three weeks ago at six and three. If you don't

968
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:44,799
Speaker 1: make the playoffs this season, it's it's gonna be a

969
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 1: pretty tough pill to swallow. I mean, if you can

970
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:51,240
Speaker 1: somehow get into the playoffs and then you get healthy

971
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:53,880
Speaker 1: again along your defense in front with Jordan Phillips and

972
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:56,000
Speaker 1: you know the Ras Charlotte Lawrences, and you get a

973
00:48:56,080 --> 00:48:59,560
Speaker 1: rotation going back there. You know, it's and we all

974
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:01,480
Speaker 1: know what that means. We all know how different playoff

975
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:05,319
Speaker 1: football is. And just for a young team to experience that,

976
00:49:05,719 --> 00:49:08,160
Speaker 1: and and for Larry to get Larry back into the

977
00:49:08,200 --> 00:49:11,480
Speaker 1: postseason two, that's just you know, if I'm that Cardinal's

978
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:13,799
Speaker 1: locker room, you know, in the absence of Larry, let's

979
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:15,520
Speaker 1: do it for Larry. Now that Larry's back to it

980
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:17,400
Speaker 1: for Fitz, get him into the playoffs at least one

981
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:20,360
Speaker 1: last time in his career. That enough to me is

982
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:22,840
Speaker 1: my Harry high school, you know, rallying cry and PAULI

983
00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:25,400
Speaker 1: pep talk for one last time. Are you Are you

984
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:27,720
Speaker 1: saying that Fitz is going to retire after this season?

985
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:32,400
Speaker 1: Are you announcing something? Did I miss something? No? Absolutely

986
00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 1: not um, but Larry, if you are going to retire,

987
00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 1: you can hit me up. I think you might still

988
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:39,759
Speaker 1: have my number, you know it. Good luck with that.

989
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:42,200
Speaker 1: You know what, you didn't ever ask me of both

990
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:44,520
Speaker 1: Just as a quick side note, I know he's not

991
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:48,680
Speaker 1: a Cardinal, but Scottsdale's own Darryl Bebel, who I went

992
00:49:48,719 --> 00:49:51,040
Speaker 1: to high school with, gets his first one with the Lions.

993
00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:55,319
Speaker 1: That's right. You know, did you did you text your

994
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:58,360
Speaker 1: your buddy Darryl Bebel about how he blew the engagement

995
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:03,919
Speaker 1: announcement for his two daughters pretty one. That was pretty funny. Yeah,

996
00:50:03,920 --> 00:50:06,799
Speaker 1: that was funny. You know. No, I have not talked

997
00:50:06,800 --> 00:50:10,560
Speaker 1: to him, but we have mutual friends. Everybody's really happy

998
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:13,319
Speaker 1: and and it would have been interesting if he if

999
00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:14,880
Speaker 1: he had ended up being the head coach of the

1000
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:17,479
Speaker 1: Cardinals once upon a time and not Bruce Kings, because

1001
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:20,560
Speaker 1: he did in him be with the Cardinals. Hey, it

1002
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 1: wouldn't be the first time that the Lions went with

1003
00:50:22,560 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 1: an in house candidate and the Ford family, So you

1004
00:50:25,600 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 1: you your buddy might be the head coach of the

1005
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:31,600
Speaker 1: Detroit Lions. Effect of this offseason, you never know. Chaparral

1006
00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:34,360
Speaker 1: class eighty eight, baby. And by the way, if his daughters,

1007
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 1: you know, don't follow football, and then the eydn't seed

1008
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:38,120
Speaker 1: in the press. It's sort of like my sister in law,

1009
00:50:38,160 --> 00:50:40,439
Speaker 1: who knows not about sports, watching the Monday night game,

1010
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:44,400
Speaker 1: talking about how the Buffalo Bulls were playing in the

1011
00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 1: Cardinals stadium, kept calling calling him the Buffalo Bulls as

1012
00:50:48,239 --> 00:50:51,960
Speaker 1: in Chicago Bulls, as opposed to the Bills. So that's

1013
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:53,600
Speaker 1: what I have to deal with on my end. So

1014
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 1: there you go, speaking of the Bills and going back

1015
00:50:57,239 --> 00:50:59,839
Speaker 1: to the Cardinals in the playoffs, like, I mean, right now,

1016
00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:03,560
Speaker 1: things are bad and the sky is certainly falling, But

1017
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 1: the Cardinals beat the Bills, and they beat the Seahawks,

1018
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:08,839
Speaker 1: and they were right there with the Dolphins. I mean,

1019
00:51:08,840 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 1: they've played some good teams and done well. So talking

1020
00:51:12,080 --> 00:51:14,560
Speaker 1: about the playoffs, like if the Cardinals turn things around

1021
00:51:14,560 --> 00:51:16,839
Speaker 1: and make it, I don't think they're the easiest out

1022
00:51:16,920 --> 00:51:19,960
Speaker 1: for these top teams. I mean, we're looking at it

1023
00:51:19,960 --> 00:51:22,759
Speaker 1: through a very narrow lens right now, and I don't

1024
00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:25,280
Speaker 1: always mean to be so optimistic, but I do feel

1025
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:28,000
Speaker 1: like looking at overall, the Cardinals have had some pretty

1026
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:29,960
Speaker 1: good moments this year, and if they can turn it

1027
00:51:29,960 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 1: around then get into the playoffs and be competitive in

1028
00:51:33,200 --> 00:51:36,640
Speaker 1: these games. I mean, they've had two bad outcomes this

1029
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:40,040
Speaker 1: year against the Panthers and now the Rams. Beyond that,

1030
00:51:40,080 --> 00:51:42,359
Speaker 1: they they've played some pretty good football. So we'll see

1031
00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:44,680
Speaker 1: where they're at in a few weeks. But you know,

1032
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:47,239
Speaker 1: I think they still can turn it around. And if

1033
00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:49,680
Speaker 1: you get in then I think you can still be

1034
00:51:49,719 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 1: competitive in the playoffs too, depending on the matchup. Obviously,

1035
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:55,160
Speaker 1: Kyle has not heard us talking behind his back with

1036
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:58,560
Speaker 1: his new nickname Kyle three quarters glass, three quarters full

1037
00:51:58,680 --> 00:52:02,680
Speaker 1: odor Guards. So yeah, I mean, it was a lot

1038
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:06,200
Speaker 1: easier to have the holiday cheer before this last week

1039
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:10,560
Speaker 1: of getting out played, but it's I mean, inaggregate, there's

1040
00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:14,799
Speaker 1: still still a pretty decent team. I'm okay with some optimism.

1041
00:52:14,800 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 1: I get plenty of the negative stuff. Again, if you

1042
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:22,640
Speaker 1: get any critics or haters or doubters, just tell them

1043
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:25,360
Speaker 1: Chase Edmonds. It's all they need to know. Chase Edmonds

1044
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:29,399
Speaker 1: in New York. That's enough. Boom Cardinals seven and six

1045
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:31,680
Speaker 1: and it's a three game season that'll do it for

1046
00:52:31,719 --> 00:52:32,600
Speaker 1: Cardinals Underground