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Speaker 1: The white paper that China has published on Taiwan. It's

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Speaker 1: the first we've seen in a couple of decades, and

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Speaker 1: certainly the first that we've seen since Hi Jin Pin

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Speaker 1: came to power. Let's welcome Samson, ellis Bloomberg's Taibe bureau

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Speaker 1: chief with us here live on Bloomberg Daybreak Asia. So

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Speaker 1: a couple of ways to look at it. Um. There

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Speaker 1: are elements of the white paper, Sam that suggests that

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Speaker 1: peaceful unification is you know, it's absolutely the drive here. Uh.

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Speaker 1: But then there are other ways of looking at it too,

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Speaker 1: when you look at the interpretations by the Global Times

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Speaker 1: and and papers like that. Uh. And there's some suggestion

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Speaker 1: that that Taiwan can be like Hong Kong. And from

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Speaker 1: my own experience living in Taiwan and saying, nobody is

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Speaker 1: really looking at that in a positive light. Hasn't been

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Speaker 1: much reaction so far, Sampson. Well as as you kind

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Speaker 1: of hinted that there, Uh, the overwhelming reaction in Taiwan

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Speaker 1: so far is that, yeah, this isn't gonna happen, or

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Speaker 1: it's not gonna happen anytime. Student at least President Signing

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Speaker 1: One did respond to the white paper, calling it wishful

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Speaker 1: thinking and totally disregarding the reality of the cross strate situation.

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Speaker 1: And by that she largely means that there's no desire

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Speaker 1: on in Taiwan for for this peaceful unification or for

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Speaker 1: any form of unification that the white paper spouses. I

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Speaker 1: think is it sort of the timing as well, in

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Speaker 1: terms of Nancy Polosi's visit last week, we're continuing to

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Speaker 1: see a lot of pressure on Taipei after that visit,

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Speaker 1: paging really trying to, I guess, keep up the rhetoric here. Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 1: It does seem that this white paper, as as you

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Speaker 1: pointed out, you know, this is only the third white

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Speaker 1: paper they've published on Taiwan, and the first since the

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Speaker 1: year two thousands. So this is absolutely a significant policy

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Speaker 1: document that you know, we're all looking at very closely,

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Speaker 1: um and and it does appear that, you know, they

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Speaker 1: they've taken the opportunity of Pelosi's visit to to to

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Speaker 1: put it out early. You know, I don't think they

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Speaker 1: initially planned to release it now, had Pelosi not visited

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Speaker 1: to Taiwan last week, you know, this may have been

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Speaker 1: something that they've looked closer to the Party Congress later

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Speaker 1: this year to to put out. Um. So, yeah, this

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Speaker 1: is absolutely part you know, in addition to the military

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Speaker 1: exercises that we've seen, to the economic coercive measures we've

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Speaker 1: seen from Beijing. You know, this kind of adds to that,

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Speaker 1: you know, on a policy level that you know, just

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Speaker 1: continuing to to put the pressure on Taiwan. As you say,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting, I think that a KMT delegation is visiting China.

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Speaker 1: What do we know about that? And who will they see? Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: they were very keen to play down the timing of

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Speaker 1: of of the trip. You know, they said, oh, this

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Speaker 1: has been planned for months. It's just a coincidence that

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Speaker 1: it's happening a week after Pelosi visited and during you know,

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Speaker 1: the the biggest crisis in intentions in decades. UM. So

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Speaker 1: they say they're not going to meet any high level officials.

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Speaker 1: You know, that still does leave open the possibility that

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Speaker 1: they do meet some officials. What the definition of high

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Speaker 1: level official is is, you know, open to interpretation. They

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Speaker 1: say the main purpose of their trip is to meet

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Speaker 1: Taiwanese living in China, students, business people, um to gauge

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Speaker 1: how they feel about the current situation and just see

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Speaker 1: what the you know, the KMT, Taiwan's main opposition party,

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Speaker 1: and and the you know, the main party in Taiwan

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Speaker 1: that still holds onto the notion of of unification and

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Speaker 1: promote promotes the you know, the eventual unification of between

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Speaker 1: Taiwan and China, just to you know, they're reaching out to,

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Speaker 1: as they say, you know, Taiwanese compatriots on the other

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Speaker 1: side of the right, just to see how they can

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Speaker 1: serve them and listen to their concerns. And just Bloomberg reporting,

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Speaker 1: the President Si also condemned this is disappointing to Taiwanese people.

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Speaker 1: What do these tensions kind of mean for the local

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Speaker 1: elections that we have planned in Taiwan in November, Well,

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Speaker 1: that's definitely very interesting. So yeah, in November, we we

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Speaker 1: get the full slate of local elections. So this is

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Speaker 1: you know, from the mayors of the major cities, the

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Speaker 1: governors of the counties, all the way down to you know,

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Speaker 1: the chiefs of local neighborhoods um and know what's what's

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Speaker 1: interesting to see if you look back over elections in Taiwan,

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Speaker 1: any time China has you know, initiated some sort of

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Speaker 1: crisis or you know, has spoken out very strongly on

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Speaker 1: Taiwan or you know, their their actions in Hong Kong

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Speaker 1: cracking down on descent there. This always plays badly in

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Speaker 1: Taiwan for those who you know would like better relations

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Speaker 1: with China. Um. You know, it definitely has the effect

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Speaker 1: overall of helping the ruling Democratic Progressive Party, which of

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Speaker 1: course you know a spouse is that Taiwan is already

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Speaker 1: a de facto independent sovereign nation. So this trip to

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Speaker 1: China by the kmtum I was speaking to a few

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Speaker 1: people yesterday and they are saying that this will absolutely

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Speaker 1: come up again during the run into the election later

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Speaker 1: this year, might work against him. Yeah, Um, I'm interested

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Speaker 1: in in how you see DPP policy evolving here. I mean,

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Speaker 1: they don't openly talk about independence. Obviously that's a that's

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Speaker 1: a no no. But under what sort of conditions might

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Speaker 1: the DPP look at reunification with with China under a

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Speaker 1: Democrat government something like? I mean, give us how that

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Speaker 1: has changed over over the past years. So so the

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Speaker 1: DPP won't countenance any form of unification with with China.

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Speaker 1: The DPPs, you know, founding stances that is basically largely

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Speaker 1: Taiwanese independence. Um They're not gonna announce independence because in

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Speaker 1: their eyes, Taiwan is already an independent nation. It's just

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Speaker 1: it doesn't have much international recognition. And so their stance is,

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Speaker 1: you know, we we don't need to announce independence because

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Speaker 1: we are already independent. We just need more nations to

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Speaker 1: to recognize that. Um. And so that's a way of

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Speaker 1: kind of sick also signaling to China and the rest

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Speaker 1: of the world and the United States that look, we're

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Speaker 1: not going to be the We're not going to provoke

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Speaker 1: another crisis by formally announcing independence. UM. As for other

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Speaker 1: people in Taiwan, who are, you know more more willing

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Speaker 1: to consider some form of political union with China, The

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Speaker 1: stands very much here is yeah, China would have to

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Speaker 1: democratize first before we could consider anything. Yep. Yeah, I'm

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Speaker 1: very interesting. Sam, thanks very much for being with us

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Speaker 1: on short notice, all kind of surprised by getting this

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Speaker 1: white paper and looking at it. Sam Sinelli's Bloomberg's Taipei

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Speaker 1: bureau chief with his life