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Speaker 1: Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where our attention

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Speaker 1: is being stolen away from women's sports by the trophy

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Speaker 1: for the Pop Tart Bowl. It's an actual functioning toaster, y'all.

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Speaker 1: I don't care about the game. I don't care about

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Speaker 1: the teams. I do care about the toaster trophy and

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Speaker 1: that sexy ass Pop Tart mascot. It's Tuesday, December seventeenth,

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Speaker 1: and if you think me lusting after a Pop Tart

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Speaker 1: mascot is unhinged. Buckle up for today's show because we

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Speaker 1: got a hilarious and occasionally off the rails group chat

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Speaker 1: with actor and podcast host er Fight Master and comedy

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Speaker 1: writer and stand up Aaron Foley. Plus the BWHL is back,

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Speaker 1: the WNBA is going international kind of, and a tip

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Speaker 1: for all those links you click but haven't gotten to yet,

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Speaker 1: it's all coming up right after this welcome back. Here's

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Speaker 1: what you need to know today. The WNBA announced on

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Speaker 1: Monday that the league's first ever international regular season game

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Speaker 1: will be played next season between the Atlanta Dream and

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Speaker 1: Seattle Storm in Vancouver, British Columbia. Rogers Arena will host

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Speaker 1: the two teams for a game on August fifteenth, and

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Speaker 1: while it's technically international, it'll still be Seattle's closest away

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Speaker 1: game of the season. Vancouver's just over one hundred miles

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Speaker 1: north of Climate Pledge Arena in Seattle. In college hoops,

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Speaker 1: we've got some movement in the AP rankings following a

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Speaker 1: couple big matchups last week. Ucla is still locked in

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Speaker 1: at the number one spot, but notre Name climbed five

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Speaker 1: spots to number three thanks to their win over Yukon.

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Speaker 1: And speaking of Yukon, in the Huskies face another tough

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Speaker 1: opponent tonight in Iowa State. Iowa State just fell out

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Speaker 1: of the top twenty five after losing to Iowa in

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Speaker 1: the Iowa Corns Syhawk series, so you know the Cyclones

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Speaker 1: will be looking to make the most out of playing

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Speaker 1: another ranked opponent. By the way, I've said Syhawk multiple

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Speaker 1: times and I just realized it's Cyclones plus Hawks Syhawk.

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Speaker 1: Cool to three x three basketball, the team USA women

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Speaker 1: won silver at the PHOEBA three x three AmeriCup in

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Speaker 1: Porto Rico over the weekend after winning their group and

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Speaker 1: defeating Chile and Puerto Rico in the quarterfinals and semifinals.

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Speaker 1: The US team of Abby Sue Matty segrest Azare Stevens

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Speaker 1: and Britney Sykes fell to Canada in the final nineteen eighteen.

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Speaker 1: In overtime. Sykes was named the Al Tournament Team, while

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Speaker 1: Canadian player Paige Crozen was named MVP. To Hockey, The

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Speaker 1: PWHL is back in action tonight following a week long

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Speaker 1: international break. The Boston Fleet hosts the Ottawa Charge tonight.

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Speaker 1: We'll link to the full upcoming PWHL schedule in our

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Speaker 1: show notes to Soccer Across the Pond. Prize money for

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Speaker 1: the twenty twenty five Women's European Championship is set to

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Speaker 1: double following a pledge from UEFA, the European soccer governing body.

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Speaker 1: Now there's still a long way to go. The sixteen

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Speaker 1: women's teams that compete next July in Switzerland will share

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Speaker 1: a prize pool of forty one million euros that's about

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Speaker 1: forty three million US dollars, while the men's championship has

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Speaker 1: a total purse of three hundred thirty one million euros.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, ways to go. The European Championship is held

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Speaker 1: once every four years, and the last time the attorney

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Speaker 1: was held it broke attendance record after attendance record, concluding

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Speaker 1: with more than eighty seven thousand fans squishing into Wembley

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Speaker 1: Stadium to watch England defeat Germany in extra time. Quick

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Speaker 1: me a kolpa from yours truly. Last week we shouted

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Speaker 1: out the books in our Good Game book Club, from

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Speaker 1: interviews we've done with authors to books we've recommended when

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Speaker 1: we've talked about different athletes and leagues and issues, and

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Speaker 1: I forgot one. David Barry and Nefwalker came on the

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Speaker 1: show in mid November for a great convo about their

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Speaker 1: book Slaying the Trolls, Why the Trolls are very, very

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Speaker 1: wrong about women and sports. It was a fantastic conversation

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Speaker 1: and it's a fantastic book and such a great holiday

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Speaker 1: present for anyone who cares about women's sports, understanding their

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Speaker 1: potential and economic opportunity, their history, and why the future

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Speaker 1: looks so bright. So my apology is to David Neff.

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Speaker 1: But now I got your own little shout out, So

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Speaker 1: all's forgiven by the book local bookstore. Please, We're going

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Speaker 1: to take a quick break slices when we come back.

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Speaker 1: Genderless Gap Ads, Ron Swanson and Low Bunny. It's time

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Speaker 1: for group Chat with the hilarious Er and erin It's

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Speaker 1: time for another edition of group Chat where we take

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Speaker 1: the t from the text and we put it on

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Speaker 1: the airwaves. Joining us. They're an actor known for work

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Speaker 1: on Gray's Anatomy and Shrill, one of three co hosts

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Speaker 1: of the hilarious podcast Jocular, and a musician. Last year,

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Speaker 1: they released their debut EP Violence through their solo music

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Speaker 1: project fight Master. They love to take a perve minute

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Speaker 1: for a rock climber's hands. It's Er fight Master. What's up?

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Speaker 2: Er?

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Speaker 1: Wow?

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Speaker 2: What an intro? Thank you so much.

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Speaker 1: You're welcome. Joining Er. She's a comedy writer, stand up comedian,

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Speaker 1: and the host of the hur Lights podcast. Her writing

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Speaker 1: credits include two seasons of that ninety show, One Day

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Speaker 1: at a Time, and the sb Award. She's a massive

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Speaker 1: sportsman and she probably dated your ex girlfriend. It's Aaron Boley.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, nailed it, nailed it.

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Speaker 1: If you remember Aaron's past appearance. We went to the

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Speaker 1: bar at the WNBA All Star Game and connected with

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Speaker 1: her snow sister snowballs. What's that called again?

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Speaker 3: Oh god, I don't even know.

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Speaker 1: Is that term for like when you both the same

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Speaker 1: people snowball snowball sisters.

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Speaker 3: I have so many snowballs sisters that I bet you

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Speaker 3: do everywhere I go, just another snowball sister.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for joining. How do you all know each other?

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Speaker 1: Because Aaron, you helped wrangle er because I didn't have

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Speaker 1: R's number, but you did.

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Speaker 3: We just met actually at a UCLA basketball I don't

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Speaker 3: know what would you call that? A fundraiser? Fundraiser and

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Speaker 3: we were sitting next to each other. I was like, Hey,

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Speaker 3: what's going on? And then we were fast friends because

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Speaker 3: we're just ripping on everything.

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Speaker 2: But I also I also believe that it's a bit

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Speaker 2: of vanity because I think we kind of look alike,

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Speaker 2: and so I think we were like, should we be friends? Yeah,

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Speaker 2: there was a real ease of communication. And actually I

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Speaker 2: remember watching your stand up God and the person I

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Speaker 2: was with at the time, they're like, Jesus, y'all could

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Speaker 2: be related. And then so then when we met it,

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Speaker 2: the thing I had a really deep like went through

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Speaker 2: a like a tunnel of like recollection, which is why

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Speaker 2: I think you said your name and I kind of

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Speaker 2: held like your hand and shook it for too long.

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Speaker 2: I was back here. I was having a that' so

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Speaker 2: raven moment.

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Speaker 1: I could see it. I could see it for sure. Yer,

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Speaker 1: I want you to tell us. Speaking of names, I'm

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Speaker 1: sure you've said this a million times, but for our

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Speaker 1: listeners that haven't heard it, can you explain your social

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Speaker 1: media name genderless gap Ad.

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Speaker 2: I came into a theater rehearsal one time dressed in

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Speaker 2: all denim and a white hat, and my director at

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Speaker 2: the time went, you look like a genderless gap Ad

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Speaker 2: and I said, I'm changing my handle right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and it is very appropriate. I've never asked or

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Speaker 1: wondered about an origin story. It just felt right.

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Speaker 2: No, And sometimes, like I'm walking around, people will say, like,

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Speaker 2: I think I have a memorable real name, but people

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Speaker 2: will be like, genderous gap Pad. It's kind of awesome.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, fight master is your real name, so

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Speaker 1: you'd think anyone at any time would go for that one.

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Speaker 1: But there is a really nice ring to genderless gap Ad.

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Speaker 2: I think people think I'm I think people think I'm

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Speaker 2: talking with them with the fight master thing, and so

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Speaker 2: sometimes I think people avoid saying it because they're like,

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Speaker 2: you're not going to get me, Like everybody else might

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Speaker 2: believe this, but not me.

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Speaker 3: That's funny genderless gap pad just rolls off the tongue. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: does just look at you and I'm like, okay, yeah.

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Speaker 1: That's like there was a certain time where any photo

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Speaker 1: that had a diverse group of people in it, we

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Speaker 1: would always say it looked like a Benetton ad. Do

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Speaker 1: you remember that? Oh yeah, I'm aging myself. Maybe er

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Speaker 1: doesn't remember. Aaron and I are closer in age, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: that was like you do. That was the go too.

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Speaker 1: Is it looks like a Benetton ad? Okay, Aaron, you

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Speaker 1: were on before. This is your triumphant return to group chat.

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Speaker 1: But for those who might have missed it, give us

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Speaker 1: a quick summary of her lights and why people should

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Speaker 1: watch and listen to it.

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Speaker 3: Well, I've been obsessed with women's sports since nineteen twelve,

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Speaker 3: and so I just decided I started it actually ten

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Speaker 3: years ago and when no one was paying attention, which

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Speaker 3: is always good timing, and then I took a couple

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Speaker 3: of years off, did a rebrand. So it's just basically

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Speaker 3: like a weekly deep dive conversation in the world of

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Speaker 3: women's sports for like an athlete, coach, reporter, journalist, And

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Speaker 3: it's just like kind of you know, trying to elevate

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Speaker 3: them as a human, elevate the sport, and yeah, just

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Speaker 3: getting to know them as like human beings versus like

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Speaker 3: x's and o's. I mean, sometimes it gets nerdy, but

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Speaker 3: I just love like hearing people's origin stories and how

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Speaker 3: they got into what they're doing. And yeah, I just

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Speaker 3: love meeting people. Literally I could talk to like a

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Speaker 3: new person for like an hour and a half about nothing,

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Speaker 3: so pretty much it's pretty fun and nerdy and yeah,

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Speaker 3: and I try to keep it light and fun. There's

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Speaker 3: there's no like hard hitting journalist questions.

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Speaker 1: You ever on the phone and the other person drops

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Speaker 1: out and you wonder how long you were talking before

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Speaker 1: you realize that they weren't there anymore. Because that's me

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Speaker 1: with both new people and like walls, Like I could

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Speaker 1: talk to like inanimate objects for a good hour before

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Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, we're not talking. You did some interviews

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Speaker 1: on the road lately with like Rene Stubbs and Anti Costable.

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Speaker 1: What are those? Are those a specific kind of episode

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Speaker 1: or a different kind of tour?

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Speaker 3: I think I think what it is is like when

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Speaker 3: you start something new and you get really excited and

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Speaker 3: then you just put five live tour dates on your

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Speaker 3: calendar and you have no idea what's going to happen.

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Speaker 3: I would encourage everybody to crawl outside of their comfort

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Speaker 3: zone and then also drink. But it was it was

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Speaker 3: really fun. I just was like, what if I just

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Speaker 3: tried to combine and stand up comedy in a live podcast.

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Speaker 3: I'm not saying it was a cute, it was I

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Speaker 3: would tweak the format. Yeah, just honestly talking like with

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Speaker 3: Annie about Chicago Sky and WNB and like her life

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Speaker 3: as a reporter and how she got into it in

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Speaker 3: front of a live, you know, a live audience. It

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Speaker 3: was so much fun. It was fantastic, you know. So

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Speaker 3: and then Renee, you know, I've known her forever. We

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Speaker 3: met at a comedy club a long time ago, randomly

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Speaker 3: and then I stalked her gently. So yeah, we talked

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Speaker 3: about like, you know, tennis, and she's a big Liberty

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Speaker 3: fan and so it was just it was just so fun.

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Speaker 3: I had like the time of my life. So hopefully

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Speaker 3: we do some I try to get you. You were

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Speaker 3: my first ask and chicken, I know, and I.

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Speaker 1: Was so bummed to miss because the night that you

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Speaker 1: had it was my big Halloween night party. So I

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Speaker 1: was dressed like Ellie the Elephant, and it would have

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Speaker 1: been a perfect time to crash your event. It just

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Speaker 1: was complete other side of town. So we're gonna do

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Speaker 1: it another time. Once you tweak, I'll just be like

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Speaker 1: the debut episode of the better and nearly tweaked version,

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Speaker 1: perfect perfect Er. I'm obsessed with jocular as you know,

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Speaker 1: I was recently on the podcast, so everyone can go

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Speaker 1: find the episode, right, guest, Thank you. It was so

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Speaker 1: much fun. It makes me laugh so much. It's my

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Speaker 1: It's one of two podcast that when I listen walking

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Speaker 1: down the street, I'm fully aware that I look like

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Speaker 1: a lunatic because I'm just walking alone laughing. And it's

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Speaker 1: probably not clear I AirPods. And what was the genesis

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Speaker 1: for that podcast? What inspired it? Uh?

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Speaker 2: The genesis was twenty twenty Actually we were, you know,

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Speaker 2: Katie and Tiana and I were all in our respective

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Speaker 2: homes and we were all sending these memes back and forth,

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Speaker 2: and you know, like twenty twenty months obviously the year

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Speaker 2: where all of these people that were otherwise not watching

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Speaker 2: women's sports had no option but to start watching women's sports,

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Speaker 2: and so you were starting to see all the dialogue

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Speaker 2: start to happen, and in some graceful ways and some

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Speaker 2: ungraceful ways about women and the color of their skin

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Speaker 2: and the amount they were making and whether or not

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Speaker 2: they had children and all this stuff. And and Tienna

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Speaker 2: and I are all very like activist based, we're big

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Speaker 2: old feminists, and we were just kind of, you know,

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Speaker 2: we're so fascinated by the sports themselves, but really becoming

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Speaker 2: fascinated with Oh, this is going to be the come

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Speaker 2: together point for so many important cultural conversations that we're

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Speaker 2: not willing to have, and we want to be there

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Speaker 2: for that conversation, and we want to do it in

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Speaker 2: a funny way. And so that was the genesis of it,

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Speaker 2: and it's mutated in a beautiful way into this very fun,

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Speaker 2: lighthearted queer thing. And our goal is always to bring

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Speaker 2: in listeners that have felt excluded from the sports space

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Speaker 2: and people that maybe did not play sports or don't

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Speaker 2: know anything about sports at all, who don't want to

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Speaker 2: hear anything about statistics.

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Speaker 1: They want to come.

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Speaker 2: They want to hear us talk and joke about the

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Speaker 2: women and queer people who play sports and do it beautifully,

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Speaker 2: and then they get to feel like they are supporting

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Speaker 2: all of these leagues full of women that are all

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Speaker 2: on their margins, you know, And so I think I

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Speaker 2: think the listeners feel good, we feel good doing it,

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Speaker 2: and it's just been a great experience.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I am really waiting for the seminal work that

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Speaker 1: someone writes about twenty twenty, because I'm sure there's been

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Speaker 1: so many think pieces and like shorter things, but it's

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Speaker 1: really fascinating how much came out of stillness or a

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Speaker 1: forced just slowing down. And so for a lot of people,

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Speaker 1: it's been really hard to go back, and a lot

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Speaker 1: of people really struggled with like getting back up to

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Speaker 1: speed after they finally slowed down. But also so many

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Speaker 1: people finally like looked around and like created a new business,

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Speaker 1: created a company, started a podcast, wrote a book, did

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Speaker 1: all these things that like all they really needed was

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Speaker 1: enough time to like stop for one second and listen

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Speaker 1: to their own thoughts. And same goes with like all

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Speaker 1: of our collective reckonings around so many major issues. It's like,

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Speaker 1: if we're busy enough, let's just keep avoiding talking about

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Speaker 1: institutional racism and women getting the shaft. Not literally no

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Speaker 1: perf moment there, but yeah, and then instead we have

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Speaker 1: this opportunity and the question is are we actually going

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Speaker 1: to learn from that at all going forward and try

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Speaker 1: to incorporate more of that stillness and time and space

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Speaker 1: into what we do so we can more creative and

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Speaker 1: fine possibility, or are we immediately rushing back to like

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Speaker 1: that was a little scary and much so let's fill

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Speaker 1: every second of our day again. You know what the.

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Speaker 2: Bravest thing to me about twenty twenty, it was either

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty or twenty twenty one where we had the

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Speaker 2: WNBA bubble twenty twenty right twenty twenty, I think, and

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Speaker 2: we had we had the bubble, and these women who

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Speaker 2: are in this league that was like largely unwatched by

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Speaker 2: most of America, all of these like a league that's

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Speaker 2: like eighty percent black women, they finally have the mic

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Speaker 2: that people are finally watching their games. And at the

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Speaker 2: same time, the BLM movement is happening in full force,

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Speaker 2: and those women without missing ab are like, we're going

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Speaker 2: to use this as an opportunity to do activism and

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Speaker 2: to speak up about you know, police violence and what

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Speaker 2: we believe in. And there was I was just like, whoa, Like,

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Speaker 2: the camera's finally on you, and none of you are like, okay, wait,

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Speaker 2: you guys, this is our time to be really palatable.

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Speaker 2: This is the time to win the hearts. Mind they

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Speaker 2: fully were coming in with those like T shirts, everyone.

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Speaker 1: Wear half shirts, your hair up, cute.

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Speaker 2: Big bikinis. Hid the lesbianism. They were fully like no,

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Speaker 2: like say her name, like I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I found it so brave.

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Speaker 3: And then played the Best Basketball Hours lead. It was

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Speaker 3: mind blowing. I mean, par the dream that documentary. If

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Speaker 3: you haven't seen it, you have to. Everybody has to

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Speaker 3: see that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but it also was like yet another lesson of

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Speaker 1: like actually leaning into authenticity and standing for something. Is

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Speaker 1: the women's sports space. It is the women's sports space.

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Speaker 1: It is what drives and interests people in addition to

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Speaker 1: great sport. And yes, some people are just there to

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Speaker 1: watch great sport. Awesome, and so many other people. To

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Speaker 1: your point, here are the people who listen to your

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Speaker 1: podcast want to be a part of something they've never

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Speaker 1: been invited to before. And the way to do that

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Speaker 1: is to stop thinking about what the average man wants

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Speaker 1: and instead thinking about what matters to you and how

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Speaker 1: you want. I have a friend who has never been

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Speaker 1: interested in sports, and she saw Megan Repina do an

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Speaker 1: interview saying We're not going to the fucking White House,

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Speaker 1: and she was like, who is this? What's happening? I'm

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Speaker 1: interested right, this queer friend of mine, I like this,

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Speaker 1: what's happening? Decided to go to a US Women's National

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Speaker 1: team watch party in the park in Chicago. We have

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Speaker 1: these big like screens and bars and setups when there's

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Speaker 1: big moments like that here in Chicago. But she brought

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Speaker 1: a book because she was like, I think I'm going

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Speaker 1: to be bored, and then a little picnic blanket and

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Speaker 1: like sat really far away from everybody else and then

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Speaker 1: was like by the end of it, booking flights to

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Speaker 1: go to friendlies in other cities and like buying merchant

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Speaker 1: was like, oh my god, whatever this is, I'm obsessed

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Speaker 1: with it, and like that's it. I asked her I

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Speaker 1: wanted to interview her after that for a espnW story

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Speaker 1: because I was so intrigued, and I was like, when

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Speaker 1: was the last time you were at a sports stadium, like,

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Speaker 1: because she went to Soldier Field for one of the

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Speaker 1: US Women's National team games and she said, does Taylor

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Speaker 1: Swift count And I was like, no, it doesn't count

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Speaker 1: as a sporting event that you last went to. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: I think that is fascinating earon that they lean and

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Speaker 1: so hard and it worked.

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Speaker 2: I will say we did cover the eras to her

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Speaker 2: as a sporting event on Jocular because of it, because

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Speaker 2: being three hours long and running for months and months

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Speaker 2: and months, and so that's all I'll say for the

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Speaker 2: swifties out there.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, and Taylor inspired a lot of other people

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Speaker 1: to start running on the treadmill trying to do what

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Speaker 1: she did for three hours and realizing that she is

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Speaker 1: literally superhuman. Okay, let's talk Caitlyn Clark. This Time magazine

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Speaker 1: interview was incredible. Also, wish it had run I don't know,

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Speaker 1: six months ago. Yeah, it's a lot of time and conversation.

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Speaker 1: But of course, the inevitable is the reaction from the

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Speaker 1: folks who are saying they will now stop rooting for

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Speaker 1: and watching her. The die hard basketball fans who were

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Speaker 1: very much there for the basketball will now stop watching

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Speaker 1: and rooting for her because she mentioned the word privilege,

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Speaker 1: and she talked about how great it would be if

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Speaker 1: we acknowledge and lifted up black players who helped make

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Speaker 1: the league what it is and continue to do so. Aaron,

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Speaker 1: this is predictable potentially even just parroting conversations other people

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Speaker 1: are seeing there. It might not even be people that

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Speaker 1: believe this, they're just like, Oh, I want to be

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Speaker 1: a part of this anti woke thing, so let me

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Speaker 1: copypaste that. I'm not watching Caitlin anymore. But what is

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Speaker 1: your reaction to her finally saying the thing that a

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Speaker 1: lot of people were sort of waiting for her to articulate,

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Speaker 1: and what that means going forward for the league, whether

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Speaker 1: it can actually help repair some of the stuff that

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Speaker 1: we saw so terribly manifest la last season.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, first of all, my reaction to people saying

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Speaker 3: they're not going to watch her again or watch the WNBA, great,

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Speaker 3: bye bye, Masia. Just put slide that manhole cover over,

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Speaker 3: crawl back in to your humanity adjacent life. You obviously

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Speaker 3: had no experience any of the mission statements from day

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Speaker 3: one about the w what the WNBA stands for, you know,

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Speaker 3: just inclusion and equity and social justice. They obviously have

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Speaker 3: missed that for the last twenty eight seasons, so good

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Speaker 3: riddance to that. We got to wed those out anyway.

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Speaker 3: So but yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, she was

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Speaker 3: under so much pressure every single time. Like it's just

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Speaker 3: I felt like, God, we needed to give we have

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Speaker 3: a little a little bit more patience, you know that

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Speaker 3: all of a sudden, you can play the highest level

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Speaker 3: of basketball, what is she you know, fifteen and then

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Speaker 3: speak eloquently about race and inclusion and equit, you know

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Speaker 3: what I mean. So, but obviously she has a responsibility too.

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Speaker 3: So I think the article and I you know, I'm

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Speaker 3: I'm kind of blown away by her first of all,

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Speaker 3: long time coming, but like also gave her a lot

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Speaker 3: of like leeway to have those learning curve for sure,

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Speaker 3: But I'm just so impressed, like how comfortable she is

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Speaker 3: in her own skin, Like that's pretty amazing that, you know,

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Speaker 3: for her just to kind of sit back and be

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Speaker 3: like this is who I am and blah blah blah.

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Speaker 3: And it seemed really sincere and not like a pr move.

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Speaker 3: And so yeah, I'm hoping we just get back to like,

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Speaker 3: you know, awesome basketball in twenty twenty five and not

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Speaker 3: have these like idiots, you know, trolling around saying the

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Speaker 3: dum miss shit.

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Speaker 1: Well, she also provided some really good sort of antidotes

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Speaker 1: to some of the things that people were pissed about

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Speaker 1: like Danna Tarrossi saying, like, you know, get ready, rook,

401
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:10,800
Speaker 1: this is gonna be a tough league. And then here

402
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Speaker 1: we have Kaitlyn Clark literally saying, I was blown away

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Speaker 1: by how shitty the other college players were. They were

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Speaker 1: terrible at guarding me. Were they even trying. That's not

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Speaker 1: a direct quote, but essentially she came hard with it

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Speaker 1: and honest, and she's allowed to say that, and more

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Speaker 1: power to her. But that's the kind of stuff that

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Speaker 1: other players were saying, and they were accused of bullying

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Speaker 1: and not being welcoming and hating her and resenting her,

410
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Speaker 1: and it's like, no, this is just how basketball players

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Speaker 1: talk about basketball, and now that she's doing it too,

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Speaker 1: can we stop with that garbage? And like, er, that's

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Speaker 1: I think you know, you were just mentioning people feeling

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Speaker 1: welcome to talk about sports or at least dip a

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Speaker 1: toe into sports on your show. A lot of people

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Speaker 1: dipped a toe into the WNBA because of Caitlyn Clark,

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Speaker 1: and for some of them when they got there, it

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Speaker 1: was a disappointment to see like that lady that will

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Speaker 1: never forget with the fake and nails that she put

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Speaker 1: on her her hands to try to attack djan A

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Speaker 1: Carrington and make the space something that it hadn't been

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Speaker 1: at all, And I think like, hopefully this can get

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Speaker 1: us back to some of the ways we felt about

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Speaker 1: going to a WNBA game and women's sports space, where

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Speaker 1: it isn't so like everyone's at odds.

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Speaker 2: I think that you're right, Aaron, in the sense of like,

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Speaker 2: these conversations that we are having now because we have

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Speaker 2: people like Kitten and we have people like Angel Reese,

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Speaker 2: they are conversations that actually needed to happen. And when

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Speaker 2: I see people trolling the league, I feel very blessed

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Speaker 2: that they've made themselves so apparent so that we don't

432
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:38,680
Speaker 2: have to invite them to anything or give a shit

433
00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,600
Speaker 2: about what they think at all. I loved this article

434
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:48,040
Speaker 2: with Caitlin because I loved that how when they said

435
00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:53,640
Speaker 2: that she lacked any false humility, she really did. There

436
00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,919
Speaker 2: was like She's like, I'm a great player. This is

437
00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:59,400
Speaker 2: what I've done for the league, this is the visibility

438
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:03,080
Speaker 2: I got. So when she says like, yeah, like I'd

439
00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:04,359
Speaker 2: love to say I worked for all of it, but

440
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:07,720
Speaker 2: I am. You know, I do have privilege, I was like, yeah,

441
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:10,400
Speaker 2: well that if you let line up every other thing

442
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,439
Speaker 2: that she said in that interview, and how honest it

443
00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:15,960
Speaker 2: was there, there would be no reason why that one

444
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,440
Speaker 2: would not also be honest and off the cuff, even

445
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:23,080
Speaker 2: if it was rehearsed. But I think she's also had

446
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:27,239
Speaker 2: time to watch other white players handle these discussions, Like

447
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:30,400
Speaker 2: I think Paige Becker's has done a really remarkable job

448
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:33,480
Speaker 2: kind of always saying, you know, yes, great, thank you

449
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:35,520
Speaker 2: so much for the attention, and here's all the black

450
00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:38,359
Speaker 2: women that helped me get here. And so I think

451
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:41,199
Speaker 2: I think Caitlyn has been able to watch people and

452
00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:44,240
Speaker 2: kind of soak that information in so that when she

453
00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,080
Speaker 2: says these things now about like yeah, God love to

454
00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:49,480
Speaker 2: say I'd worked for it, but it is partially privileged,

455
00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:51,000
Speaker 2: it feels very natural.

456
00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm just proud of her. I was proud of her.

457
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:56,199
Speaker 1: But I think it also, like to Aaron's point, like

458
00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:59,400
Speaker 1: giving her enough grace to get there organically made sense

459
00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:01,960
Speaker 1: because Paigeers grew up in a mixed family, like you

460
00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:05,040
Speaker 1: just had a whole life of figuring out and being

461
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:07,879
Speaker 1: right up next to all this stuff. And Kaylin's just

462
00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:11,359
Speaker 1: a white girl from Iowa, who sure could she gotten

463
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:13,520
Speaker 1: there faster through any number of ways, but she didn't,

464
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,840
Speaker 1: and here she is and it's and it's you know,

465
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,359
Speaker 1: she's twenty two years old and I think still.

466
00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 3: In the calendar year. I mean she was raised in

467
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,800
Speaker 3: like a cornstalk, you know, like, how how are you

468
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:28,240
Speaker 3: supposed to get so eloquent? I mean, you want everybody

469
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,440
Speaker 3: we're like projecting our own experience and how we would

470
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:34,200
Speaker 3: handle things and saying she should have done it this way.

471
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,720
Speaker 3: But then you take a second and you're like, she

472
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:40,280
Speaker 3: is a kid, right, like from the whitest of white,

473
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 3: you know, just concentrating head down, just wanted to play basketball.

474
00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:47,600
Speaker 1: And when when male athletes are that kind of neurotic

475
00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 1: obsessive about their their skill, we allow it in a

476
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:53,679
Speaker 1: way that we never do with women athletes, because, like

477
00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:56,240
Speaker 1: with everything else, we expect the people who are the

478
00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 1: most marginalized to speak to their victimization and expect the

479
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 1: people doing the victimizing to have zero clue that they're

480
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,119
Speaker 1: even doing it or any thoughts on it. And so

481
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:08,439
Speaker 1: with male athletes, we're like, oh, my gosh, she's just

482
00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:11,320
Speaker 1: single minded and it's all he cares about. And with women,

483
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, she's pretending not to know, so she

484
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 1: doesn't have to speak on it, right, it's just such

485
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:17,560
Speaker 1: a different treatment.

486
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:22,920
Speaker 2: Yes, er well, I was thinking about that savage line

487
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:24,920
Speaker 2: that she had because it's it jumped out to me too.

488
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 2: But she says, she says those girls like don't have

489
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 2: any basketball IQ and those those women will never play

490
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 2: basketball again. And I was like, oh my god, yeah.

491
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's how you get great, and like it's up

492
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 1: to everybody to decide for themselves. Do I want to

493
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 1: be Michael Jordan or do I want to you know,

494
00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:51,360
Speaker 1: figure out some balance. But it shouldn't be working out

495
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 1: for her right now. Caitlin Clark and Alone mar were

496
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 1: two of the like big breakout stars of this year.

497
00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:00,320
Speaker 1: Do y'all see any parallels? Are there ways we can

498
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:03,680
Speaker 1: look at their appeal beyond sport? Anything we can learn

499
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,480
Speaker 1: about their explosive popularity that can inform how we market

500
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 1: or present women's sports and athletes, because in a lot

501
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:11,000
Speaker 1: of ways they are very different.

502
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I was just thinking that, like a

503
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:17,040
Speaker 3: like a quick parallel is really what we came back to,

504
00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 3: Like comfortable in your own skin, you know, which is

505
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:22,159
Speaker 3: like a radical act when all of society is just

506
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:24,920
Speaker 3: trying to make you feel uncomfortable every minute of the day,

507
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,800
Speaker 3: and then you feel so uncomfortable about everything, then you

508
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 3: start buying everything. I mean, you know, there's no feel

509
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:36,200
Speaker 3: good in capitalism, you know. So these these two women

510
00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 3: at the top of their game, so young, but at

511
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:42,119
Speaker 3: the top of their game, they've achieved success, and you

512
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 3: feel like you know them, you know, you feel comfortable.

513
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 3: They're so comfortable. And I'm not saying they don't have like,

514
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:51,800
Speaker 3: you know, self esteem moments or whatever, but I don't know,

515
00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 3: it just it just feels like they're so authentic. They're

516
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 3: comfortable in their own skin, and it's empowering, you know.

517
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 3: And I think if we market that for like, you know,

518
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:03,120
Speaker 3: women and athletes and women's sports, of just letting them

519
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 3: be themselves. You know. I used to get so uncomfortable

520
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 3: watching the WIBA fits because it's like my worst nightmare

521
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 3: to put on address and it can but it's so

522
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 3: awesome to see everybody just go into the arena just

523
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 3: perfect like how they want to be. So I think

524
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:25,280
Speaker 3: it's just leaning into that. Authenticity is just huge, and

525
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:27,680
Speaker 3: it's as you can see, like in all these new

526
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,200
Speaker 3: leagues and all this like fervor around women's sports I

527
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:33,560
Speaker 3: think that is a very you know, true connection.

528
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, yard, do you see parallels?

529
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 2: I do, But my the parallel that I see is

530
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 2: as a little harsh. I think that America really loves

531
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 2: a white girl that feels like family, and and part

532
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:59,359
Speaker 2: of that is that they are desexualized. And Caitlin is

533
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:04,000
Speaker 2: not a particularly like she's not leaning into any type

534
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:08,400
Speaker 2: of hyper femininity. And all of the conversations about Alonemar

535
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 2: are about her weight and her height and her broad

536
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 2: shoulders and all these things. And so they're kind of

537
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:19,400
Speaker 2: these women that are we almost are feeling protective of them.

538
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 2: Of course in that like you know, white supremacist way

539
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,400
Speaker 2: that we do feel protective of white women. I think

540
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:30,680
Speaker 2: we're also feeling like we are like rallying around. They're

541
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 2: not getting the vitriol that women who identify and focus

542
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 2: on being hot would get. Right. So, even Angel Reese

543
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 2: is a person who's like, you know, wearing nails and

544
00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:46,960
Speaker 2: getting her hair laid like edges laid for these games,

545
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 2: and is putting on makeup, and she's getting the vitriol

546
00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:52,160
Speaker 2: that we give women on a daily basis for.

547
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 1: Simply were trying.

548
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 2: Yes, any any woman that tries and enjoys like the

549
00:27:57,119 --> 00:28:01,160
Speaker 2: presentation of like being a hot girl whatever, like that's

550
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,399
Speaker 2: when we get mad. And of course when Alona did

551
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 2: the the swimsuits, yeah, that was when there was any

552
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:11,359
Speaker 2: like the most of course negative like trolls come out

553
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 2: of the woodwork for that kind of thing, because this

554
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 2: is her attempt at, like, you know, trying that version

555
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:19,440
Speaker 2: of femininity. But I don't know, I think they've both

556
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 2: got this like sister thing where we've decided that they're there,

557
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:28,200
Speaker 2: they are respectfully de sexualized, and so we can treat

558
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 2: them like we would any woman in our family that

559
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:32,800
Speaker 2: we don't want to have sex with.

560
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 1: I mean, and.

561
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 2: That's why I think that white America, specifically white males

562
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 2: have come around Caitlin like like every every man I

563
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 2: talked to you about Caitlin Clark, you would think that

564
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,560
Speaker 2: she grew up in their hometown.

565
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:47,960
Speaker 1: Right right.

566
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 2: Yeah.

567
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 1: It's it's interesting too because there's there's also and definitely

568
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 1: more so before we've evolved into more disparate presentations of

569
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: women that are acceptable. But it used to be that

570
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:08,239
Speaker 1: only the sexualized women athletes got love and attention, and

571
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:11,280
Speaker 1: it was the ones that were like Caitlin or alone

572
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 1: who weren't leaning enough into their sexuality that were presented

573
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 1: as why women's sports is n't attractive were not what

574
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 1: we want because they're not feminine enough. But now it's

575
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:24,400
Speaker 1: like there's these different spaces in which we allow women

576
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:28,320
Speaker 1: to exist and yeah, it's in you hadn't thought of

577
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,840
Speaker 1: that about them, of the sort of girl next door,

578
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: but not the Alex Morgan type of girl next door.

579
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 2: Well, and I think we can like traditionally for American

580
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 2: gay gay people are invisible in this beautiful.

581
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:47,440
Speaker 3: Sense, like right here where I'm right here over here,

582
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:49,080
Speaker 3: and I.

583
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 2: Say beautiful sense because in like a truly mocking way

584
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,280
Speaker 2: where you know, like people thinking that being gay is

585
00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 2: like people think that being trans is new, right, They're

586
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 2: like four years all of these and you're like, oh

587
00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 2: my god in the water. Yes, like it truly truly.

588
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 3: Invisible mind milk.

589
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:11,960
Speaker 1: Yes, So we have to don't give them that suggestion.

590
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,480
Speaker 1: I promise you that will be a headline next week.

591
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:17,400
Speaker 2: If you well, it might be the almond milk. We

592
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,560
Speaker 2: can't rule it out, but we don't know. But it

593
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 2: was like when when the w NBA was I think

594
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 2: one of the reasons it hasn't done well is because

595
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:29,520
Speaker 2: we they were not pandering to the male gaze in

596
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:31,800
Speaker 2: so many ways, and when they did, it was like

597
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 2: kind of clownish because they're all so just energetically butch,

598
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,960
Speaker 2: even if they're straight, they're energetically but we can't we

599
00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 2: can't avoid that. And and gay people are invisible. And

600
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 2: so it was truly men being like, what is the

601
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 2: w NBA, right, Like, so it's gay women were invisible.

602
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:53,440
Speaker 2: And then hot women are the subject of vitriol because

603
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 2: we just for some reason we hate femininity, and we

604
00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 2: also hate an absence of femininity, and it's just impossible

605
00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:00,560
Speaker 2: to be a woman.

606
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 1: Well also, if we if we find you very attractive,

607
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 1: we don't want you to ruin it. What they've said

608
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 1: for years two about comedy, right, we're uncomfortable with women

609
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: who are hot making themselves less hot in pursuit of

610
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,520
Speaker 1: a laugh. So we like women who are not like

611
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 1: the hottest person in the movie to be the funny ones.

612
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,560
Speaker 1: Otherwise it's offensive that they're taking away their best and

613
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 1: most important virtue, which is the same with hot female athletes.

614
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 1: It's like, we like you in the ads, but once

615
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 1: you're on the field, please don't take away from your

616
00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 1: hotness by being aggressive or physical or otherwise.

617
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 3: Like I just had this this vision er when you

618
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 3: were talking about everything was invisible. How men watch the WNBA.

619
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 3: All they can just see is a ball. They just

620
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 3: see the ball going down the court, but they can't

621
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 3: see anything. It's like ghost.

622
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:49,040
Speaker 1: It's like ghost when like he was making the inanimate

623
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: stuff move to show her there.

624
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 3: Yes, that's how they watched it. That's how men watch.

625
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 1: The WS podcast is only for people over forty. I'm

626
00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: so sorry. So far I've been referencing Ghost and Benetton

627
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 1: really keeping it tightly into.

628
00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 2: You're bringing culture to the young people.

629
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right. Speaking of culture, I have to

630
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 1: ask y'all, do you have one like prime complaint about

631
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 1: the way TV shows, movies, or comedians get things wrong

632
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 1: when they're joking or making content about female athletes and

633
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 1: women's sports. Mine is always that somehow, if they decide

634
00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: to throw in a woman on the co ed team

635
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:25,600
Speaker 1: just for like like hang time or space jam, there's

636
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 1: like token woman. She never wears the uniform everyone else wears.

637
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:31,680
Speaker 1: She's always in a bra top like a sports bra

638
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 1: or a crop top. Like why doesn't she wear the

639
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:41,120
Speaker 1: same uniform. Ever, Oh, cast they have one. They casted

640
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 1: the cartoon and they could only find a cartoon who

641
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 1: wore exclusively crop tops.

642
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 2: Well, if I had that body, I would be wearing

643
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 2: that too.

644
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, Lola Banish, Yeah.

645
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,560
Speaker 3: I just think there's no in between. It's either the

646
00:32:55,680 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 3: woman is like yeah, like ultra femme and she can't

647
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:02,640
Speaker 3: play and she's like, oh my boob, and it's like

648
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 3: if she's playing, it's like to get the guy, and

649
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 3: she's just like, you know, throwing like a toddler, you know,

650
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,719
Speaker 3: and you're just like, I can't who is this person?

651
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 3: Or it's the butchiest of butch Lesbo's that's just like

652
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 3: it's just a scene where she's walking through the house

653
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 3: and like tackling her furniture, you know, and you're like, what,

654
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 3: none of none of this happens, Like how about the

655
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 3: in between?

656
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:28,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fair, So say the extremes.

657
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 2: My my my least favorite misconception. I think that this

658
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:36,240
Speaker 2: happens because of bend Attle, Like Beckham is, when there's

659
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 2: any like plot line or joke about like a coach

660
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 2: and a player having sexual likes. Always I can't express

661
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 2: the people who don't play sports the relationship with you

662
00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 2: you have with your coach is like if you had

663
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:56,800
Speaker 2: a third parent that you hated but you weren't allowed

664
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,440
Speaker 2: you like, you can't get estranged from them at any point. Yeah,

665
00:34:00,520 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 2: And they're also they're also like a leader of a

666
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,960
Speaker 2: dictatorship that you're living under in silence. And there's somehow

667
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:09,799
Speaker 2: even if they're forty years old, they are elderly to you,

668
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 2: and so there's just there's like it's the very opposite.

669
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 1: I don't know. I had one hot coach, so I

670
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:18,360
Speaker 1: kind of get it. I hadn't I had a hot coach,

671
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 1: my high school track coach. Everybody knew he was hot.

672
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 1: During Valentine's Day, you could buy a singing telegram Valentine

673
00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,520
Speaker 1: for people and like someone would walk into their class

674
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:29,680
Speaker 1: and be like, hey, Sarah. I wouldn't know because no

675
00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: one bought me any But in theory it would have

676
00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:35,560
Speaker 1: gone that someone a handful of people from the chorus

677
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:37,160
Speaker 1: would walk in and be like, Hey, Sarah, this is

678
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:41,840
Speaker 1: from you know, Todd, and it would be like, you

679
00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:45,040
Speaker 1: know something about why can't I be a teenager in

680
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,279
Speaker 1: love or whatever whatever that song is. And I was

681
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:51,040
Speaker 1: in class. So he was also an econ teacher, and

682
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 1: he had like nine of them. So they just said,

683
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,600
Speaker 1: mister Clagg, you got nine of these. They're all anonymous.

684
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:58,240
Speaker 1: We're just gonna sing them all at once.

685
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 3: Oh my god. Yeah, like that that was his vibe.

686
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 1: Okay, So I'm not saying it's he was young, so

687
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,120
Speaker 1: like when he started teaching, he was like mid to

688
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 1: late twenties, so he's not that far off from the

689
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:11,719
Speaker 1: people he's like teaching and coaching. Anyway, My point is

690
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:13,359
Speaker 1: it is conceivable that you might want to have sex

691
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 1: with your coach, but it's best, because of a million reasons,

692
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:19,160
Speaker 1: to not always have the storyline be that the woman

693
00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:20,880
Speaker 1: bones her coach, because, first of all, that happens too

694
00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 1: much in real life, and usually it's because of an

695
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 1: imbalance of power that's caused by the coach being toxic

696
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 1: and abusive, so let's not make it a cool storyline. Also,

697
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,080
Speaker 1: Pure Knightley was like twelve in every movie where she

698
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 1: was actually active, she was like seventeen in love.

699
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:42,680
Speaker 2: Actually, Sarah, have you ever considered freestyle wrapping? You speak

700
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 2: so quickly off the dome, sorry, so elegantly. I'm like,

701
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 2: let's put it to music.

702
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:53,440
Speaker 1: You know what, people have always said we need another

703
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 1: white rapper.

704
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:56,520
Speaker 2: I've been saying that for years.

705
00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 3: Oh my god. Even my mother says that, yes.

706
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 1: I need to fill the space.

707
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:04,840
Speaker 3: It is true, though, I will second because I obviously

708
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:06,960
Speaker 3: I listen to you, well both do your shows, but

709
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,800
Speaker 3: I can't sometimes I stop. And I've gotten my partner, Sarah,

710
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 3: to listen.

711
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 1: To your show too.

712
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 3: Sarah, I go, it's so she speaks so quickly, and

713
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,759
Speaker 3: it's like a plus. It's like and then and I'm like,

714
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:23,160
Speaker 3: wait what And then normal podcasts I do like one

715
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 3: point five or one point twenty five. For you, it's

716
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:26,879
Speaker 3: almost like point seventy five.

717
00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 1: I wouldn't recommend it, just wouldn't recommend it very fast.

718
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 3: No, but it's amazing You're you're so good at it.

719
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, here's my No. I've got to give you one

720
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:41,520
Speaker 2: more compliment. When when I got home from the recording

721
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:44,880
Speaker 2: of the interview, you to a jocular, I was like,

722
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:46,520
Speaker 2: I was talking to my partner and I was like,

723
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:53,719
Speaker 2: it was so she's so powerful. It was like, I

724
00:36:53,800 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 2: feel like I need to go to the gym.

725
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:03,880
Speaker 1: Big gym energy. I don't know if that's a compliment,

726
00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:04,560
Speaker 1: to be honest.

727
00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:07,120
Speaker 2: I did I went to the gym. I went to

728
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:09,759
Speaker 2: the gym and I thought about all your accomplishments and

729
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:10,640
Speaker 2: I did cardio.

730
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:15,360
Speaker 1: That's my king good about that? Yeah? Yeah, I feel

731
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:17,399
Speaker 1: I mean, I told you last time that you said

732
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 1: I was funny at the SPNW Seve, and I've told

733
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,600
Speaker 1: so many people that. Now I'm going to tell people

734
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: I inspired you to lift. Yes, and they can read

735
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:32,080
Speaker 1: whatever they want into that. Okay, we're running out of time,

736
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:33,439
Speaker 1: but we have to go a little bit over because

737
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:35,359
Speaker 1: I really need your answers for this next question, because

738
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:37,160
Speaker 1: I think they're going to be good. We need your

739
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:41,319
Speaker 1: favorite women's sports reference and pop culture. For example, Out

740
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:44,239
Speaker 1: of Nowhere, Parks and rec Ron Swanson says, you know,

741
00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:46,480
Speaker 1: an ideal night out for me is stepping onto my

742
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,560
Speaker 1: poor chariot, grilling a thick slab of something's flesh, and

743
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,400
Speaker 1: then popping in a highlight reel of the WNBA like

744
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:54,839
Speaker 1: it's a surprising moment on that show. You don't see

745
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 1: it coming. Gloria, the Paul Pell character on Girls, Girls

746
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,239
Speaker 1: I've Ever, says I'm bad at letting go. I have

747
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:03,640
Speaker 1: a Sims character named Val who's been shooting hoops for

748
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 1: twenty years.

749
00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 3: I love that show so much.

750
00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 1: It's the best show. Liz Lemon was part of the

751
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 1: Timeless Torches WNBA dance team for The Liberty on thirty Rock.

752
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:15,960
Speaker 1: There's some good ones. So do you have one that like,

753
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:19,759
Speaker 1: maybe he surprised you or you just didn't see coming,

754
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 1: or one that you just particularly love.

755
00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 2: I I'm sure that this is going to make it

756
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 2: into a TV show at some point. But my my

757
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 2: like thing that I think about is that, you know,

758
00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:33,640
Speaker 2: when we were when I was a kid, we used

759
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:35,880
Speaker 2: to crush, you know, paper and throw it into a

760
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:39,200
Speaker 2: trash can and you'd yell Kobe. And now all the

761
00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 2: kids are yelling Caitlin Yes, And I'm like, man, the

762
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,000
Speaker 2: minute that enters the TV show, I might laugh, but

763
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 2: I also might cry. Yeah.

764
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 1: I feel like Abbot Elementary is the prime show for that.

765
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 2: Yeah.

766
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 1: Abbot Elementary gets a lot of sports references and very deftly,

767
00:38:56,520 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 1: and I feel like I could see them pulling a

768
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:04,600
Speaker 1: Caitlin talk Caitlin, this is how we close on Jocular.

769
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 1: You ask every guest who they would like to be

770
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:11,319
Speaker 1: power slapped by, and our twist on that relates to

771
00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: our sign off, and at the end of every show,

772
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:15,960
Speaker 1: we say a good game, good game, pew. We give

773
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:17,840
Speaker 1: two people good games, and then we say few to

774
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:21,200
Speaker 1: something that deserves our wrath. So I need to hear

775
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 1: your biggest few in women's sports. It can be a person,

776
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 1: a team of ethos, whatever it is.

777
00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 3: I'm going to say fu to seven hundred and sixty

778
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 3: five million to one Soto, because my brain immediately goes

779
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 3: to you could fund a women's softball league, a women's

780
00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:45,719
Speaker 3: baseball league, and I'm I grew up a big baseball fan,

781
00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 3: but now I quit my fantasy baseball league. When the

782
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:53,200
Speaker 3: announcer came out. I'm so irate because I'm so invested

783
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:56,120
Speaker 3: in women's sports that one man to catch fly balls

784
00:39:56,160 --> 00:39:59,920
Speaker 3: can hit sixty five million when you could fund like

785
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:03,920
Speaker 3: eight women's leagues. So fu to all of.

786
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:06,279
Speaker 1: That, but not to Juan Soto, because we have to

787
00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 1: hate the game, not the player.

788
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:11,280
Speaker 3: No, take it one soo. But also, deer Juan Soto,

789
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,360
Speaker 3: I'm sure he's listening. Take that money and invest it

790
00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:16,759
Speaker 3: in women's sports, and then I'll be fine with it.

791
00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:18,640
Speaker 1: Let's all start writing letters to one.

792
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:25,400
Speaker 3: So excuse me, sir, long hand, I do longhandersive yes,

793
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 3: dearest one, do something good.

794
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 2: Eric, you are, I'm gonna say you to the LPGA

795
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:40,160
Speaker 2: oh I and I recently wore one of their like

796
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:43,120
Speaker 2: hats on the on the show, and I was like

797
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,600
Speaker 2: getting excited about golf and wanting to talk about this,

798
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 2: and then they came out with their guidelines. Uh, I

799
00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:53,040
Speaker 2: think a month ago, and it's you know, all like

800
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:58,640
Speaker 2: biological sex and gender ship and very trans exclusive, and

801
00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:04,080
Speaker 2: I think think specifically for a sport like golf, it's

802
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,960
Speaker 2: it just feels like such a silly stretch to pretend

803
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:12,760
Speaker 2: that that transness is going to be the big difference

804
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 2: between players, Like you know that there's going to be

805
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:21,440
Speaker 2: this vast space between the talent of a trans woman

806
00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:25,160
Speaker 2: and a sis woman. And my I think the big

807
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 2: few that goes in there underneath of all of my

808
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:32,720
Speaker 2: complaints is every time we exclude trans women, the actual

809
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:38,319
Speaker 2: message is that men are better than women, because these

810
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 2: people are not thinking of trans women as women, They're

811
00:41:40,600 --> 00:41:43,080
Speaker 2: thinking of trans women as men. And so we're saying, well,

812
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:45,160
Speaker 2: we can't have trans women involved because we don't want

813
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 2: men interacting with women's women athletes. And every time we

814
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:53,600
Speaker 2: say it, and every time we believe it, we are

815
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,720
Speaker 2: saying we believe that men are better in every way.

816
00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 2: Even the most mediocre man is better than the best woman.

817
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 2: And so you, LPGA, you had an opportunity to not

818
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 2: be this way. Everyone's rooting for you. Shut the up.

819
00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:20,920
Speaker 3: Mast LPG Aaron, Aaron here, listen. I need you to

820
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:23,600
Speaker 3: take that golf club and shove it up your ass.

821
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 3: Me and Wan Soto.

822
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:30,080
Speaker 1: Sincerely, the nearest Sandpit and yeah name.

823
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:31,960
Speaker 2: I'd love to be proven wrong. I will say that

824
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:33,880
Speaker 2: I'd love for them to be like you guys. We

825
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 2: came up with that letter and we were like, what

826
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:36,319
Speaker 2: were we were?

827
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:39,799
Speaker 1: We were drinking. I felt the same way about their

828
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:42,400
Speaker 1: rollout of a barstool merch collab.

829
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:43,080
Speaker 2: My god.

830
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:47,760
Speaker 1: So maybe we just need to revisit who's in charge

831
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:51,320
Speaker 1: over there. On the number of levels, it's probably Carl.

832
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:53,919
Speaker 1: It's always Carl, that guy.

833
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 3: I tell you, he's just making one bad decision after another.

834
00:42:58,640 --> 00:42:59,840
Speaker 1: You guys are the best. I can talk to you

835
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:02,520
Speaker 1: for hours, and this is already quite long, and people

836
00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:04,560
Speaker 1: will enjoy every single minute of it and have no

837
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: idea They've spent four hours listening to us talk. Thank

838
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 1: you so much for coming on.

839
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 2: Thank you for having us big fans of both of you.

840
00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:18,440
Speaker 3: Thank you so fun, You're the best both of you.

841
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:23,439
Speaker 1: Thanks again to Aaron and Er for taking the time

842
00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 1: we got to take another break. When we come back,

843
00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:27,239
Speaker 1: we indulge in one of the greatest pleasures of the

844
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:35,520
Speaker 1: modern Internet, welcome back slices. We love that you're listening,

845
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:37,040
Speaker 1: but we want you to get in the game every

846
00:43:37,080 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 1: day too. So here's our good game play of the day.

847
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 1: It's real easy. Just subscribe to both Jocular and her Lights.

848
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 1: We'll link to both podcasts in our show notes. Also,

849
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:48,440
Speaker 1: we want to hear from you. Do you have a

850
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:52,160
Speaker 1: favorite women's sports pop culture reference? Ron Swanson Deaf has

851
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:54,360
Speaker 1: front row seats to Indiana Fever games these days, But

852
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: what about characters from other shows? And if you don't

853
00:43:57,040 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 1: have a favorite reference, what shows would you like to

854
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:02,080
Speaker 1: see one? Hit us up on email good game at

855
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:04,879
Speaker 1: wondermediaetwork dot com or leave us a voicemail at eight

856
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:07,759
Speaker 1: seven two two oh four fifty seventy and you know

857
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:10,560
Speaker 1: what I'm gonna say. Don't forget to subscribe, rate and review.

858
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:14,280
Speaker 1: It's easy. Watch closing out all two hundred and fifty

859
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 1: four open Internet tabs at the end of the long

860
00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:23,640
Speaker 1: Day rating five out of five Xouts review. Hear that

861
00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:26,560
Speaker 1: it's the sound of five pounds of pressure being lifted

862
00:44:26,600 --> 00:44:29,640
Speaker 1: off your shoulders. We love the feeling that a company's

863
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:32,359
Speaker 1: closing out all of the open tabs from your work day.

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00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:34,799
Speaker 1: And it's not just your email or your calendar. It's

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00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:36,920
Speaker 1: all those little side projects that you got interested in

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00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:39,520
Speaker 1: looking into, so you opened a new tab to investigate

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00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:41,879
Speaker 1: I don't know how oatmeal soap is made. But then

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00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,320
Speaker 1: a new email arrives, so you say to yourself, nerdy

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00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 1: farmwife dot com, I'm just gonna minimize you for a minute,

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00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 1: and then later you're like, what was the name of

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00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:51,680
Speaker 1: the hot priest in fleabag? And then you catch yourself

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00:44:51,719 --> 00:44:54,400
Speaker 1: halfway down inn Andrew Scott Wormhole, And do you come

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00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:57,600
Speaker 1: back to your soap and your priest lusting? No, you don't,

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00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,040
Speaker 1: And that's okay, because closing out those tes will probably

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00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:03,200
Speaker 1: bring you just as much joy as making that soap

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00:45:03,239 --> 00:45:06,080
Speaker 1: would have, but maybe not as much as that Andrew

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00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 1: Scott wormhole. So if you really can't say goodbye, put

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00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:12,320
Speaker 1: it in pocket. Pocket is a lifesaver, y'all, Pocket dot

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00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:15,600
Speaker 1: com You're welcome. This is not an ad but it

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00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:18,600
Speaker 1: could be call us pocket Now it's your turn, rate

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00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:22,000
Speaker 1: and review. Thanks for listening, See you tomorrow. Good Game, Er,

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00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:27,080
Speaker 1: Good Game, Aaron you Fleabag being only two seasons, incredible show.

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00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:32,239
Speaker 1: We needed more. Good Game with Sarah Spain is an

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00:45:32,239 --> 00:45:35,960
Speaker 1: iheartwomen's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment.

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00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 1: You can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:42,320
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. Production by Wonder Media Network,

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00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 1: our producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones. Our executive

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00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:49,200
Speaker 1: producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan, and Emily Rudder.

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00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:52,680
Speaker 1: Our editors are Emily Rudder, Britney Martinez, Grace Lynch, and

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00:45:52,760 --> 00:45:56,120
Speaker 1: Lindsay Cradowell. Production assistant from Lucy Jones and I'm Your

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00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:57,120
Speaker 1: Host Sarah Spain