WEBVTT - Practical Money Hacks with Lisa Rowan #307 0:00:00.120 --> 0:00:02.520 Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I and 0:00:02.600 --> 0:00:06.240 Matt and today we're talking practical money hacks with Lisa Rowan. 0:00:25.480 --> 0:00:28.400 Lisa Rowan is a staff writer at Forbes Advisor, where 0:00:28.440 --> 0:00:31.880 she covers banking and personal finance, and she was previously 0:00:32.000 --> 0:00:34.840 a staff writer at life Hackers two cents covering personal 0:00:34.880 --> 0:00:37.640 finance as well. Prior to that, she was a senior 0:00:37.680 --> 0:00:40.960 writer and an on air analyst at The Penny Hoarder, 0:00:41.159 --> 0:00:44.159 where she launched the Dear Penny advice column syndicated by 0:00:44.200 --> 0:00:47.319 the Tampa Bay Times. Her work has appeared in The 0:00:47.360 --> 0:00:50.800 Washington Post, City Lab and many other publications, and now 0:00:50.840 --> 0:00:55.520 she's recently published her book Money Hacks Plus Ways to 0:00:55.880 --> 0:00:59.520 decrease spending, increased savings, and make your money work for you. 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:03.800 We're excited for an extremely practical conversation today, so Lisa, 0:01:03.960 --> 0:01:06.920 thank you so much for joining us today on the podcast. Hey, 0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:09.759 thanks for having me. It's my pleasure. Lisa. We're really 0:01:09.800 --> 0:01:12.959 excited to have you. Excited for this conversation and so 0:01:13.040 --> 0:01:14.920 many money hacks to get through. It's going to take 0:01:14.920 --> 0:01:17.360 a while to get through two plus, so be here 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:22.440 for eight hours. Listeners, bresh yourselves But before we get 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:24.039 into all that, Lisa, you know one thing that and 0:01:24.080 --> 0:01:26.120 I do every episode is we drink a craft beer 0:01:26.200 --> 0:01:28.559 one because we like the way beer tastes and too. 0:01:28.640 --> 0:01:31.480 It's just this way of prioritizing something in the here 0:01:31.480 --> 0:01:33.760 and now while we're also saving and investing well for 0:01:33.800 --> 0:01:36.399 the future. So, yeah, what's your sporte? Do you have 0:01:36.440 --> 0:01:39.520 a craft beer equivalent in your life? Yeah? Beyond just 0:01:39.680 --> 0:01:42.720 loving craft beer and craft cocktails, like y'all, the thing 0:01:42.840 --> 0:01:47.080 that I spend so much money on, I haven't lately 0:01:47.280 --> 0:01:49.680 because of pandemic issues. But the thing I used to 0:01:49.720 --> 0:01:52.600 spend a ton of money on was anything that would 0:01:52.640 --> 0:01:54.240 get me to the front of the line if I 0:01:54.280 --> 0:01:58.160 was flying, so uh, you know, I had pre check 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:01.600 and global entry, but I also would throw down cash 0:02:01.720 --> 0:02:04.680 if it would do automatic check in for me if 0:02:04.720 --> 0:02:07.000 I was flying Southwest, or if I could pay a 0:02:07.080 --> 0:02:09.280 little extra to sit in the front of the plane. 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:11.600 My whole goal was to be the first person off 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:13.120 the plane at the end of the play, because I 0:02:13.160 --> 0:02:14.720 just wanted to be able to get where I was going. 0:02:14.880 --> 0:02:18.240 I get restless when I fly, and I always have 0:02:18.280 --> 0:02:20.400 to fly to see my family because I live quite 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:23.160 a ways for my family, and so when I fly 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:24.799 to see them, I want to be comfortable. I want 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:28.440 to show up not stressed out. Uh So if I can, 0:02:28.600 --> 0:02:30.280 if I can, just you know, I don't have first 0:02:30.320 --> 0:02:32.919 class money, but I have headed a line for uh 0:02:33.080 --> 0:02:37.840 for economy money. So that's something that I can't resist, 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:40.480 this urge to splurge so that I can just be 0:02:40.520 --> 0:02:43.079 a little more comfortable when I fly. Nice. Well, I'm 0:02:43.080 --> 0:02:45.000 sure you've seen your savings kind of go up over 0:02:45.040 --> 0:02:49.280 the past year, like one small bright side. So well, Lisa, 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:51.359 before we kind of start talking about money, you used 0:02:51.360 --> 0:02:54.960 to own a vintage clothing shop. We recently actually talked 0:02:54.960 --> 0:02:56.800 on the show about posh mark and how difficult it 0:02:56.840 --> 0:02:59.760 is for folks to make money make a margin in 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:03.240 use clothes industry. But like, what did you learn from 0:03:03.240 --> 0:03:07.000 that experience? We're really curious. Oh gosh, I learned so much. 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:10.800 I mostly learned that I was not destined to be 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:13.240 a shop girl, but I was destined to be a writer. 0:03:14.960 --> 0:03:16.960 I had always been a writer, you know, before and 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:20.280 after running my shop, and I really had this this 0:03:20.880 --> 0:03:23.720 vision in my mind. I think I watched like you've 0:03:23.720 --> 0:03:27.080 got mail too much or you know, other like fun 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:29.679 shop Girl kind of movies. But I really thought that 0:03:29.720 --> 0:03:32.120 I'd be able to run my shop and also be 0:03:32.200 --> 0:03:34.960 able to like be able to like work on fiction 0:03:35.000 --> 0:03:36.960 projects on the slow day is just sitting at my 0:03:37.040 --> 0:03:39.520 laptop in my shop when it was slow. Then I 0:03:39.560 --> 0:03:41.960 realized that, like one, if you have time to lean, 0:03:42.000 --> 0:03:45.000 you have time to clean your shop. But also if 0:03:45.040 --> 0:03:48.240 you're not busy, you're not making any money selling things, 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:52.280 So that's kind of like a problem. So I just 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:55.600 realized that I was not I was not cut out 0:03:55.640 --> 0:03:59.360 for the day to day business operations of constantly striving 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:02.760 to be able to sell and make money, you know, 0:04:02.880 --> 0:04:05.680 selling use clothes because like I'm sure you discussed on 0:04:05.680 --> 0:04:08.960 that Posh Mark episode, I mean, you are telling a 0:04:08.960 --> 0:04:11.680 bunch of individual things. You can't just do one listing 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:15.320 and change the sizes or change the colors. So it's 0:04:15.360 --> 0:04:17.880 it's a ton of work and there's a ton of variables. 0:04:18.320 --> 0:04:22.440 Um and uh yeah, I definitely learned to, uh don't 0:04:22.600 --> 0:04:25.520 don't try to shy away from your true talents. If 0:04:26.120 --> 0:04:28.080 if you have a dream, figure out a way to 0:04:28.160 --> 0:04:31.120 investigate it without sort of going all the way into 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:33.760 the deep end. That's now, that's a good point. And 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:36.480 I guess you got into it partially because you loved 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:38.640 vintage clothing and you're like, how can I make this 0:04:38.720 --> 0:04:40.680 a full time thing? And then you realized, I don't know, 0:04:40.720 --> 0:04:42.400 maybe I can love it without making it a full 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:45.919 time thing. Yeah, exactly. I started writing a blog about 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:48.440 vintage and thrift clothing when I was just out of college, 0:04:48.480 --> 0:04:51.240 and then it turned into selling items at markets. This 0:04:51.360 --> 0:04:54.360 was in the dawning days of Etsy, but well before 0:04:54.400 --> 0:04:57.919 posh mark existed on other you know, newer platforms like that, 0:04:58.000 --> 0:05:01.160 like deepop, and so I was sell markets and then 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:03.960 uh and online on Etsy and eBay, and then an 0:05:04.000 --> 0:05:08.440 opportunity came out to have a retail space and I 0:05:08.480 --> 0:05:12.280 grossly underestimated how much money you needed to be able 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:15.520 to open and run a retail space. Um, they're not 0:05:15.600 --> 0:05:19.000 joking when they talk about overhead being so high. So 0:05:19.000 --> 0:05:22.640 so it's just my my dream and my finances didn't 0:05:22.680 --> 0:05:25.200 quite match up there. And so I was like, well, 0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:27.520 how do how do I get out of this? Because 0:05:27.520 --> 0:05:29.680 I got into a ton of debt trying to run 0:05:29.720 --> 0:05:32.760 my shop but eventually having to close it. Um. And 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:36.000 so the way out of debt was to write about 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:39.760 financial mistakes a lot and eventually write about, you know, 0:05:39.880 --> 0:05:42.680 writing about how to do your finances right. Well, I mean, 0:05:42.760 --> 0:05:46.080 obviously you have written a lot about money at this point. 0:05:46.400 --> 0:05:48.440 It let's dive into some of the money hacks that 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:52.040 you talked about in your book. It features over seventy 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:54.080 five money hacks, which is a lot um. There were 0:05:54.080 --> 0:05:57.000 definitely a few that I'd never heard of. I wanted 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:58.560 to hear from you two, Like, what was the most 0:05:58.760 --> 0:06:01.520 random money hack that aided into your book in your opinion? Like, 0:06:01.560 --> 0:06:04.320 what was the weirdest one? You know, one of the 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:06.600 weirdest ones that It's not weird to me now because 0:06:06.640 --> 0:06:09.000 I've written about it a lot, but it always surprised 0:06:09.000 --> 0:06:12.080 other people, and therefore it surprised me because we talked 0:06:12.080 --> 0:06:15.400 about it all the time. Was the hack about finding 0:06:15.480 --> 0:06:19.120 unclaimed money that might be in your name? Every state 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:22.719 has a treasury fund for money that's uh that a 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:25.120 company has tried to return to you but couldn't. It 0:06:25.240 --> 0:06:27.760 might be an old landlord with the security deposit. It 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:30.839 might be an old employer with a last paycheck. I 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:32.920 even just got a check from the District of Columbia 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:35.200 where I used to live. It was like eleven dollars 0:06:35.279 --> 0:06:38.599 from CVS refunds that the pharmacy couldn't get to me 0:06:38.720 --> 0:06:41.320 like five years ago. I mean, thank you, I'll take it. 0:06:41.839 --> 0:06:44.880 But you know, I knew that these funds existed and 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:47.320 that you could search your name, uh and see if 0:06:47.320 --> 0:06:49.480 there was any money owed to you. But so many 0:06:49.480 --> 0:06:51.279 people who have read the book and who have talked 0:06:51.279 --> 0:06:52.920 to me, they didn't know about it. And so they're 0:06:52.920 --> 0:06:55.640 coming back to me now and telling me how much 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:58.760 money they were able to get. And so that's the 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.920 one that strikes me as the strangest that I'm like, 0:07:02.320 --> 0:07:04.000 what do you mean none of you knew about this? 0:07:04.400 --> 0:07:07.400 Like I wish I had told you all years ago 0:07:07.480 --> 0:07:09.880 to go look for your money. I know people who 0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:13.520 have gotten thousands of dollars because they typed their name 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:17.520 into the system for their state and found some just 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:19.680 something hanging out in there. And it doesn't mean that 0:07:19.720 --> 0:07:21.960 you neglected your finances, like you run out on a 0:07:22.040 --> 0:07:24.960 job or something. I know someone who had a family 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:28.000 member and it was stocks from an old job that 0:07:28.080 --> 0:07:31.480 had gotten like cashed out, but it was several jobs ago, 0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:33.920 and so like there was a misconnection there and getting 0:07:33.960 --> 0:07:37.680 the money to her family member and they booked a 0:07:37.720 --> 0:07:40.640 trip to Italy like it was the coolest thing. So 0:07:41.080 --> 0:07:44.320 that's that's lately been my favorite one to talk about 0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:47.120 and think about because I just think it, uh, it 0:07:47.200 --> 0:07:50.240 always surprises people, like it's that treasure hunt feeling that 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:54.240 everyone craves, but in real life, it's really like finding 0:07:54.280 --> 0:07:56.920 money in the couch cushions, you know, and you said 0:07:56.960 --> 0:07:58.880 misconnections that it kind of makes me think it's like 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:02.320 it's like the Craigslist misconnections, but for your money. It's like, 0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:09.440 you know, it's like, hey, look, you certainly at Leasta 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:11.480 in the beginning of your book too, you know, you 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:14.680 offered like specific hacks to help with spending problems, and 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:16.840 one that you discuss is not trying to cut a 0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:20.280 problem area of your spending could turkey. So you know, 0:08:20.320 --> 0:08:23.600 why is that a bad tactic in your opinion? Yeah, 0:08:23.680 --> 0:08:25.320 And it's especially at this time of year. I know 0:08:25.320 --> 0:08:27.560 a lot of people are thinking about New Year's resolutions 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:30.680 or they maybe have already like ditched their New Year's resolution. 0:08:31.400 --> 0:08:33.680 And a lot of times when we make a financial 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:36.800 goal for ourselves, it's just completely unattainable. We have set 0:08:36.800 --> 0:08:39.360 our sites too high and it's just not something that 0:08:39.400 --> 0:08:43.520 we can stick to. So if you're trying to save money, 0:08:43.880 --> 0:08:45.640 it doesn't make sense for you to say, well, I'm 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:48.040 going to cut out all of my discretionary spending all month. 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:50.079 I'm not going to buy anything nice for myself. I'm 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:52.160 not going to go out to eat at all. There 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:54.280 are some people who really go like they can do 0:08:54.320 --> 0:08:57.600 a spending fast and really make it work. But if 0:08:57.600 --> 0:09:00.680 that is not your game, I really recommend and instead 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:04.760 of going cold turkey, instead of just like cutting all 0:09:04.800 --> 0:09:08.280 of your spending at once, try to change it by percentages. 0:09:08.360 --> 0:09:10.680 See if you can reduce your spending by ten percent 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:13.560 in a month or in a month, and see if 0:09:13.600 --> 0:09:16.840 you can make changes that will add up. Because if 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:19.719 you can make small changes and then build upon them 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:21.520 as you go, then you're going to be able to 0:09:21.520 --> 0:09:24.880 make more sustainable change rather than have this like Yogo 0:09:25.040 --> 0:09:27.520 system where you're going back and forth between not spending 0:09:27.559 --> 0:09:31.160 at all and then probably overcompensating and spending more. So 0:09:31.200 --> 0:09:33.080 I think if you can, you know, chip away it 0:09:33.120 --> 0:09:36.480 a little by little. Yeah, you don't see instant results 0:09:36.559 --> 0:09:39.360 that are huge in a lot of cases, but what 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:41.720 you really want to see is consistent change over time, 0:09:41.800 --> 0:09:44.440 and that's really going to be a better benefit to 0:09:44.480 --> 0:09:48.920 your finances. Alright. So hack number fourteen actually encourages people 0:09:48.960 --> 0:09:51.840 to pay for shipping when they're shopping online. Why is 0:09:51.840 --> 0:09:53.440 that because most people are man there angling for the 0:09:53.440 --> 0:09:56.640 free shipping. I know, and it drives me crazy every time, 0:09:56.679 --> 0:09:59.480 because I get up to forty eight dollars and you know, 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:03.079 twenty seven cents, and I'm like, great, what how can 0:10:03.120 --> 0:10:06.360 I spend another dollar fifty to get my free shipping? 0:10:06.760 --> 0:10:10.080 And then twenty seven dollars later, I'm finally checking out, 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:13.720 And it creates this whole cycle where I'm just overspending 0:10:13.760 --> 0:10:16.520 because I think I need to be able to get 0:10:16.640 --> 0:10:19.959 certain things for for free, like I should get shipping 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:22.520 for free, or I should get shipping in two or 0:10:22.559 --> 0:10:25.680 three days. Uh, that I should get that free gift 0:10:25.679 --> 0:10:28.360 of that discount. And so I say, if you're trying 0:10:28.400 --> 0:10:31.760 to spend less, especially if you're trying to spend less online, 0:10:32.520 --> 0:10:35.439 put up whatever roadblocks you can so that you are 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:41.000 less tempted to spend, whether that is unsaving your credit 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:44.160 card from your browser, whether it's sort of like the 0:10:44.160 --> 0:10:46.440 the old fashioned method of just putting your credit card 0:10:46.440 --> 0:10:50.160 in a block of ice in your feaser anymore with 0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:52.719 online shopping, does it, Yeah, don't put your devices in 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:59.480 ice because that's just sunk exactly exactly. But if you 0:10:59.520 --> 0:11:03.200 can think with that mentality and you know, like don't 0:11:03.240 --> 0:11:07.160 save your payment information into any you know, e commerce websites. 0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:11.319 And then especially with the shipping, if you are stuck 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:13.920 at a point where you know you're like, Okay, I've 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:16.520 picked out the things that I want. Free shipping doesn't 0:11:16.559 --> 0:11:20.680 kick in until this particular level, like just check out 0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:23.160 with what you have now, you're gonna end up spending 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:25.480 more than you would have paid on the shipping if 0:11:25.480 --> 0:11:27.760 you just keep adding items to your car for the 0:11:27.800 --> 0:11:31.280 promise of that free shipping. I think, y'all, I think 0:11:31.280 --> 0:11:32.880 we're going to see that go away in the next 0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:36.640 couple of years, oh after the holiday season we just 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.839 have with the postal service, I think, you know, if 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:44.679 they're right exactly, it's like you need to decide do 0:11:44.720 --> 0:11:46.600 you do you really want it now, like do you 0:11:46.600 --> 0:11:49.280 want it fast free or or you know, it's like 0:11:49.320 --> 0:11:52.880 that ven diagram of of design, but it's a fast 0:11:52.920 --> 0:11:56.440 for your fast, cheaper good. It's like with shipping, like 0:11:56.600 --> 0:11:59.000 you need to decide how do you want it chucked 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:02.240 from the truck on year lawn, Like we can do that. 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:05.480 That might be the free version. So definitely think about, 0:12:05.520 --> 0:12:09.480 you know, do you really need the free shipping or 0:12:09.520 --> 0:12:11.679 could you just check out with what you need right 0:12:11.720 --> 0:12:15.400 now spend a couple of bucks and I going back 0:12:15.440 --> 0:12:17.520 to how I think this is going to go away. 0:12:17.800 --> 0:12:20.600 Just remember that anyone who offers you free shipping works 0:12:20.640 --> 0:12:23.880 that into the prices somehow. That is true, so it's 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:27.760 it's never really free. Yeah, Anything to basically increase the 0:12:27.800 --> 0:12:29.640 friction here, you know, like anything that you can do 0:12:29.679 --> 0:12:31.640 to make it harder for you to spend money on 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:33.600 these sites, Like I mean, it used to be where 0:12:33.600 --> 0:12:35.040 you had to actually drive to a store and then 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:37.200 you had to drive to another store. It was hard 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:39.520 to spend your money. But it is so easy and 0:12:39.520 --> 0:12:41.120 in some ways it is good, right, Like being able 0:12:41.120 --> 0:12:43.480 to hop from retailer to retailer, from site to site 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:46.560 online gives you the ability to yeah, comparison shop and 0:12:46.559 --> 0:12:48.360 get the best deal, but it also makes it way 0:12:48.360 --> 0:12:50.880 too easy to spend all that money. Lisa, you know 0:12:50.920 --> 0:12:52.679 you you you talk about in your book To the 0:12:52.720 --> 0:12:55.280 Power of Positive framing. You know, how can that change 0:12:55.280 --> 0:12:58.520 our perspective on I guess why it is, like, why 0:12:58.559 --> 0:13:02.520 does the you know, the different reasons why we're cutting back. Yeah, 0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:04.880 you know, it's a lot of times when we set 0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:07.040 a goal, you know, especially when we're trying to cut 0:13:07.040 --> 0:13:09.079 back or when we're trying to pay off debt, the 0:13:09.520 --> 0:13:12.280 goal is something that we did that's negative, that we're 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:16.400 trying to make up for, and that doesn't really help 0:13:16.480 --> 0:13:19.080 motivate you to make change. Right, if you're constantly thinking 0:13:19.120 --> 0:13:21.800 about the thing that you think you did wrong or 0:13:21.840 --> 0:13:24.880 that you know really tripped you up, how hard is 0:13:24.880 --> 0:13:26.520 it going to be to wake up every morning and 0:13:26.559 --> 0:13:29.800 be psyched to make change to your finances? Right? So, instead, 0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:31.760 if you know, for example, if you're trying to cut 0:13:31.760 --> 0:13:34.800 back on your spending, if you can think about the 0:13:34.840 --> 0:13:38.079 real reason you want to do it. Maybe it's right 0:13:38.120 --> 0:13:40.720 now because you're in the hole by a couple hundred dollars, 0:13:40.760 --> 0:13:43.160 but maybe in the future you want to save money 0:13:43.200 --> 0:13:45.480 because you want to take a trip, or you want 0:13:45.480 --> 0:13:48.000 to healthy emergency fund so you have better peace of mind, 0:13:48.440 --> 0:13:50.760 or you want to be able to, you know, splurge 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:53.440 on birthday gifts for your nieces and nephews. You know, 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:56.880 by thinking about the outcome and thinking about the positive 0:13:56.920 --> 0:13:59.679 impact of changing your money, you can think beyond like 0:13:59.760 --> 0:14:03.040 that temptation right now, Like if you're thinking, like should 0:14:03.080 --> 0:14:05.640 I buy one more six pack of craft beer? Like 0:14:06.040 --> 0:14:09.160 you're like, do I really want this now? Or do 0:14:09.200 --> 0:14:11.199 I want to be able to do this other thing later? 0:14:11.400 --> 0:14:14.160 Just like just think about those priorities and sometimes you're 0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:16.920 gonna say, yes, I would like a delicious craft beer 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:20.320 right now, and my nieces and nephews can wait for 0:14:20.400 --> 0:14:23.560 their birthday gifts. But if you if you try to 0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:26.720 think less about the things you've done wrong and the 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:29.520 places that you've had challenges and instead think about like 0:14:29.600 --> 0:14:32.480 how great you're doing by just striving to do better 0:14:32.520 --> 0:14:35.240 with your finances, that goes a long way and keeping 0:14:35.240 --> 0:14:37.680 you motivated for long stretches of time when you're working 0:14:37.680 --> 0:14:40.520 on this stuff. All right. Another interesting hack that you 0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:43.200 mentioned in the book is the stranger test. Can you 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:46.120 explain what that means? This is one where you have 0:14:46.200 --> 0:14:48.320 to envision in your mind's eye that you're in a store, 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:51.200 You've gone to a store, you're inside the store, and 0:14:51.280 --> 0:14:54.360 you're within spitting distance of a stranger, which I know 0:14:54.440 --> 0:14:56.160 for a lot of people as hard. Right now, you're like, 0:14:56.320 --> 0:14:58.160 I don't want to be in the same zip code 0:14:58.200 --> 0:15:01.560 as any other people. But just imagine in your mind's eye. 0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:04.320 So this is a test to make sure you really 0:15:04.360 --> 0:15:07.120 want to spend that money on an item to stay. 0:15:07.120 --> 0:15:10.120 You're browsing and you pick up something and you're like, oh, 0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:12.440 I want this thing. You didn't plan to buy that thing, 0:15:12.560 --> 0:15:14.720 but it caught your eye and you're like, maybe I'll 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:18.200 get it. So imagine that somebody in the store, a 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:20.560 complete stranger, is standing in front of you and they're 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:23.120 holding up that item, and then their other hand they 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:26.800 have cash for the same amount of the price tag 0:15:26.840 --> 0:15:29.960 on the thing you're thinking of buying, and think to yourself, 0:15:30.160 --> 0:15:32.080 don't imagine that this is your best friend, because this 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:34.680 will value you up. Imagine it is a true stranger. 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:38.600 Maybe it's like an employee at the store. You gotta think, like, 0:15:38.720 --> 0:15:41.080 what's going to make you like what would you take 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:44.280 if this stranger gave you both options? Would you take 0:15:44.320 --> 0:15:47.840 the item or would you take the cash? And just 0:15:47.920 --> 0:15:52.680 thinking about it in physical form like that, because so 0:15:52.720 --> 0:15:55.000 often we pay, you know, with card or with Apple 0:15:55.000 --> 0:15:57.760 pay or whatever anyway, Like, think of it in physical cash. 0:15:57.960 --> 0:15:59.920 Would you love physical cash in your hand or would 0:15:59.920 --> 0:16:02.840 you love this physical object in your hand? And whatever 0:16:02.880 --> 0:16:04.840 the answer is, that'll guide you like maybe you do 0:16:04.960 --> 0:16:09.000 want that thing, maybe it would benefit your life, but 0:16:09.120 --> 0:16:12.120 maybe you know, thirty six bucks or whatever it is 0:16:12.160 --> 0:16:14.560 could go a lot further in your life and help 0:16:14.600 --> 0:16:17.200 you stick to those you know, positive priorities that you're 0:16:17.240 --> 0:16:21.160 thinking about. So imagine that next time you're like maybe 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:23.520 at the grocery store and you're, you know, maybe in 0:16:23.560 --> 0:16:26.040 the candy aisle, Like start small at that, be like 0:16:26.080 --> 0:16:28.960 do I want these a reci peanut butter cups? Or 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:32.840 do I want four dollars? Start small thing about it 0:16:32.880 --> 0:16:35.160 that way. I love that It's a great way to 0:16:35.240 --> 0:16:37.280 rethink how it as we spend our money. And at 0:16:37.320 --> 0:16:39.480 least all of these sort of tips, all these different 0:16:39.480 --> 0:16:41.040 hacks that we've gone through so far have to do 0:16:41.080 --> 0:16:43.400 a spending. We're gonna take a quick break, but after 0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:44.880 that we're gonna talk about some of the hacks you 0:16:44.880 --> 0:16:46.840 have when it comes to our savings, and so we'll 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:58.720 get to those right after this break. Are we're back 0:16:58.760 --> 0:17:01.800 from the break, We're talking practical money hacks. With Lisa 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:04.399 Rowan today on the show, and Lisa, let's talk about 0:17:04.400 --> 0:17:08.719 money hacks for saving money. One that seems counterintuitive is 0:17:08.840 --> 0:17:11.879 having fewer savings goals. This one that you mentioned, I 0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:14.760 believe that's money hacked forty eight. So explain why you 0:17:14.760 --> 0:17:18.119 think it's important actually a fewer goals. Yeah, it's absolutely 0:17:18.160 --> 0:17:21.080 counterintuitive because we hear all the time that we should 0:17:21.320 --> 0:17:24.520 give our savings accounts names and have separate saving accounts 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:27.640 for different goals. Right, maybe it's your emergency fund, your 0:17:27.680 --> 0:17:31.760 travel fund, your tuition fund. But if you have too 0:17:31.800 --> 0:17:35.200 many goals and too many separate little buckets for those 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:38.439 savings goals, you're not going to see fast progress in 0:17:38.480 --> 0:17:41.359 any of them because you're dividing your money up into 0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:45.040 too many buckets. So instead, I really recommend having fewer 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:48.480 savings goals. Limiting yourself to two or three. Three might 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:50.520 even be too much, depending on how much you are 0:17:50.560 --> 0:17:54.159 able to save, but just focusing on one or two things. 0:17:54.400 --> 0:17:57.320 Maybe it's going to be a general savings funder and 0:17:57.400 --> 0:18:01.240 emergency savings fund, and one up or bucket whether it 0:18:01.320 --> 0:18:06.440 be travel or gifts or charity donations. But being able 0:18:06.520 --> 0:18:09.000 to focus on just a few goals is going to 0:18:09.080 --> 0:18:12.560 let you see your progress a lot faster because instead 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:14.679 of having five or six places that you're divvying up 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:17.320 your money whenever you get paid and you go to 0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:19.800 put money into savings, you can put bigger chunks of 0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:22.120 money in those goals. You'll hit them faster, and then 0:18:22.160 --> 0:18:23.720 you can move on to the next goal that you're 0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:26.439 trying to build towards. Yeah. So, so at the's one 0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:28.880 thing too that you mentioned. You talk about earning rebates 0:18:29.160 --> 0:18:31.480 of you know, for doing the different shopping that you're 0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:33.960 already doing. I'm aware of some of these programs, I 0:18:34.040 --> 0:18:36.359 just haven't checked them out myself. But which one should 0:18:36.400 --> 0:18:39.760 people consider using and how much cash back, you know, 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:42.760 can you actually get. Yeah. So, two of my favorites 0:18:42.840 --> 0:18:45.359 that I've been using for a long time or racket In, 0:18:45.480 --> 0:18:48.200 which used to be ebates and I bought us. So 0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:52.480 Racketin is primarily for online shopping through your phone or 0:18:52.560 --> 0:18:55.720 your computer browser. I bought. Uh. I don't I'm not 0:18:55.760 --> 0:18:57.560 sure if it has like a browser interface, but I 0:18:57.640 --> 0:18:59.920 use it as an app and I use it main 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:03.200 when I go grocery shopping. So I'm going to start 0:19:03.240 --> 0:19:05.159 by saying, look, there's a trade off here, and so 0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:10.160 by letting these companies pay you for shopping at certain stores, 0:19:10.280 --> 0:19:14.000 you're giving over your consumer data. It gets anonymized, but 0:19:14.040 --> 0:19:17.160 you're basically you need to be willing to show people 0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:20.760 what else is on your grocery receipt besides the you know, 0:19:20.800 --> 0:19:22.600 a pack of chicken that you're going to get a 0:19:22.640 --> 0:19:25.439 cash back rebate on. Right, So that's that's my disclaimer 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:27.800 on that. But if you don't really have any like 0:19:27.840 --> 0:19:30.639 state secrets that you're hiding, um, you're not in the 0:19:30.680 --> 0:19:34.560 witness protection program or anything, you can use these programs 0:19:34.600 --> 0:19:38.320 to get some money back. And it's various rates at 0:19:38.359 --> 0:19:41.280 certain retailers or on certain products. So I'll give you 0:19:41.320 --> 0:19:44.639 some you know examples. If you go through racketing and 0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:47.960 you're shopping online, you can do a little uh extension 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:50.160 in your browser that will show you what the cash 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:52.800 back rebate is and it could be anywhere between one 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.600 percent and twelve of your purchase that you can get 0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:59.919 back on that purchase. It goes into your racketing account 0:19:59.920 --> 0:20:02.000 with in a couple of days of you shopping, and 0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:04.280 they pay out quarterly, so you're not going to see 0:20:04.320 --> 0:20:06.320