1
00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:09,280
Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,

2
00:00:09,920 --> 00:00:12,280
Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big

3
00:00:12,520 --> 00:00:16,880
Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they

4
00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:25,639
Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello everybody, Welcome back to the show.

5
00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:29,520
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the podcast. New listeners, old listeners. Wherever

6
00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:31,680
Speaker 1: you are in the world, it is so great to

7
00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:34,440
Speaker 1: have you here back for another episode as we of

8
00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:38,680
Speaker 1: cause breakdown the Psychology of our twenties. Before we begin,

9
00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:40,479
Speaker 1: I wanted to let you guys know, those of you

10
00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:43,120
Speaker 1: who lived in the US, that we are going on

11
00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:46,760
Speaker 1: a mini podcast tour in the kind of middle to

12
00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:50,360
Speaker 1: end of August. I will be going to Seattle, Boston, Chicago,

13
00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:54,440
Speaker 1: and there are tickets still available. Each night slash afternoon,

14
00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:58,480
Speaker 1: we'll be doing a small live podcast recording, plus a

15
00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:00,600
Speaker 1: Q and A. Then they'll be a chance for you

16
00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:03,480
Speaker 1: to get your book signed if you have a copy

17
00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:06,399
Speaker 1: of my book Person in Progress, and then just really

18
00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:10,840
Speaker 1: mingle with me and other listeners of the show, make

19
00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,600
Speaker 1: new friends, have a glass of wine, have some snacks,

20
00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:15,800
Speaker 1: and just kind of get to know each other. So

21
00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:18,080
Speaker 1: if that is something that interests you, if you are

22
00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:21,399
Speaker 1: ready to meet some like minded people and myself. There

23
00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:25,840
Speaker 1: are a couple of tickets still available for some select cities.

24
00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:28,600
Speaker 1: I'm going to leave a link in this episode description.

25
00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:33,240
Speaker 1: Hopefully I can see as many of you there as possible. Okay,

26
00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:37,440
Speaker 1: let's get into the episode. Today. We are tackling a

27
00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:43,440
Speaker 1: topic that feels very personal to me, very recently personal

28
00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:47,800
Speaker 1: to me. We are talking about OCD. If you guys

29
00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:50,600
Speaker 1: don't know, and you probably don't because I've actually never

30
00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:53,400
Speaker 1: talked about it before, so this is probably new information

31
00:01:53,440 --> 00:01:58,120
Speaker 1: to everyone. I was recently diagnosed with OCD, and it

32
00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:02,440
Speaker 1: is a diagnosis that, in retrospect and in hindsight, has

33
00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:08,040
Speaker 1: been a long time coming. For so long, I thought

34
00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:10,280
Speaker 1: I just had anxiety, and I thought I had a

35
00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:12,880
Speaker 1: panic disorder. I thought I just have panic attacks. And

36
00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:17,919
Speaker 1: this is where all my issues with thoughts spiraling, repetitive thoughts, rumination,

37
00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:20,000
Speaker 1: this is where it all comes back to you. I'm

38
00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:23,160
Speaker 1: an anxious person. But at the end of last year,

39
00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:27,040
Speaker 1: I began to kind of realize, wait a second, I

40
00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,440
Speaker 1: actually don't really have panic attacks. You know, probably only

41
00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:33,959
Speaker 1: had like three or four in my lifetime, and I'm

42
00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:38,320
Speaker 1: actually not an anxious person. I don't get anxious meeting

43
00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:41,480
Speaker 1: new people. I don't get anxious trying new things. I

44
00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:44,440
Speaker 1: don't get randomly anxious throughout my day. I don't even

45
00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:47,800
Speaker 1: get anxious when my life is really busy. The only

46
00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:51,000
Speaker 1: time I'm really anxious or I would say, you know, distressed,

47
00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:54,320
Speaker 1: is when it comes to this very specific loop of

48
00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:58,000
Speaker 1: thoughts that I can't get out of about very specific

49
00:02:58,360 --> 00:03:03,440
Speaker 1: things for me, primarily my health and like this grand

50
00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:07,440
Speaker 1: philosophical concept of like death and existence. But other than that,

51
00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:11,720
Speaker 1: I don't really have anxiety. And at the end of

52
00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:13,720
Speaker 1: the end of last year, I kind of had a

53
00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:16,640
Speaker 1: mental health player up, which I talk about on the podcast,

54
00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:18,919
Speaker 1: and that kind of caused me to go and see

55
00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:21,840
Speaker 1: a new therapist, someone i'd never spoken to before. And

56
00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:23,320
Speaker 1: when I walked in, I was like, I'm not going

57
00:03:23,400 --> 00:03:28,240
Speaker 1: to put any label on my symptoms. I'm not gonna say, oh,

58
00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:32,000
Speaker 1: I have depression, I have anxiety. I'm just gonna describe

59
00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:34,280
Speaker 1: how I am feeling, and I'm gonna see what she

60
00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,840
Speaker 1: has to say. And after a while she kind of

61
00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,240
Speaker 1: said to me, have you considered the fact that you

62
00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,640
Speaker 1: may have OCD? And it just kind of clicked for me.

63
00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:49,600
Speaker 1: I definitely didn't go in thinking that, I was just like, Oh,

64
00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:52,120
Speaker 1: this is a theory I want to test out. Something

65
00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:56,840
Speaker 1: doesn't seem right around the diagnosiss I've been given. And

66
00:03:56,920 --> 00:04:00,640
Speaker 1: in that moment, I was like, Wow, do you know what, Yeah,

67
00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:04,200
Speaker 1: you're probably right. I've spent my whole life talking about psychology,

68
00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:07,160
Speaker 1: talking about mental health, and I kind of got it wrong.

69
00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:10,760
Speaker 1: How was this never apparent to me? How come I

70
00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:13,400
Speaker 1: didn't realize all along that this is what was really

71
00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,919
Speaker 1: going on? And throughout the episode you'll hear some things

72
00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:22,560
Speaker 1: around specific symptom patterns and obsessive obsessive patterns that were

73
00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:25,000
Speaker 1: very indicative from an early age that just kind of

74
00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:28,400
Speaker 1: were missed. And I think the reason that they were

75
00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,000
Speaker 1: never apparent to me or to anyone else, is that

76
00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:34,159
Speaker 1: no one ever talked to me about OCD in a

77
00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,280
Speaker 1: way that related to my experiences or that I could

78
00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:40,919
Speaker 1: understand when we talk about OCD. It was and it

79
00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:42,760
Speaker 1: has always been, even when I was at UNI and

80
00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:46,800
Speaker 1: I was studying psychology, it was so surface level. It

81
00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:49,440
Speaker 1: was so surface level, and I could never really see

82
00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:54,040
Speaker 1: myself in the descriptions, the descriptions of cleanliness and organization

83
00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:59,000
Speaker 1: and neatness and tardiness. But that is really just the

84
00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:05,560
Speaker 1: tip of the psychological iceberg here. OCD is so multi dimensional,

85
00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:08,880
Speaker 1: and the reality of it is far more intricate, far

86
00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:16,039
Speaker 1: more debilitating, and frankly, a lot more deep than the tidy, neat, clean,

87
00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:21,040
Speaker 1: freak stereotypes really suggest. Also, you know, for so long,

88
00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:25,800
Speaker 1: OCD has just been a punchline of so many jokes.

89
00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:29,760
Speaker 1: I don't think any mental health disorder has been as

90
00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:35,200
Speaker 1: trivialized as OCD. But if you're living with it, it's

91
00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:39,279
Speaker 1: so complex and it's pretty freaking relentless, if I do

92
00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:41,960
Speaker 1: say so myself, And I think our society is really

93
00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:46,760
Speaker 1: lacking in an understanding of this, and lacking in how

94
00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:50,839
Speaker 1: many people are actually walking around with thoughts, really serious

95
00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:52,839
Speaker 1: scary thoughts they can't get out of their head, and

96
00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:55,599
Speaker 1: how many people are suffering because of that. And it

97
00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,640
Speaker 1: really sometimes has nothing to do with the tidy with

98
00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:03,360
Speaker 1: the tidy kitchen or hand sanitizer or whatever like order

99
00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:06,960
Speaker 1: in their life. It goes so much deeper. So today,

100
00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:11,159
Speaker 1: you know, given my diagnosis was almost six months ago,

101
00:06:11,279 --> 00:06:14,440
Speaker 1: now I really want to do a bit of a

102
00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,039
Speaker 1: deep dive into what OCD actually is. Now that I

103
00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:19,960
Speaker 1: feel like I know more, I want to dissect some

104
00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:23,680
Speaker 1: of its core components, the obsessions, the repetitive behaviors, both

105
00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:29,560
Speaker 1: visible and hidden, and also the vast and very varied

106
00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:34,320
Speaker 1: ways that OCD can show up in our lives, why

107
00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:37,880
Speaker 1: it's often confused with other mental health disorders, why it's

108
00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:43,160
Speaker 1: made fun of, and also what is happening in our brains.

109
00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:47,360
Speaker 1: I also really want to discuss some of the treatment options,

110
00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:50,400
Speaker 1: the ways in which you can find relief if you

111
00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:54,440
Speaker 1: are suffering from OCD. I feel like there will never

112
00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:58,200
Speaker 1: be a time on this podcast where we don't finish

113
00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:01,160
Speaker 1: on a high note. I try not to make it

114
00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:03,560
Speaker 1: or make it seem like it's toxic positivity, but I

115
00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:06,600
Speaker 1: do think with things like OCD, with any mental health disorder,

116
00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:09,479
Speaker 1: with anything that we're going through, there is actually a

117
00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:11,960
Speaker 1: lot more hope than there is despair. And there are

118
00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:15,040
Speaker 1: really smart people who have come up with really amazing

119
00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:19,040
Speaker 1: ways to deal with this and to address the things

120
00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:20,560
Speaker 1: that are going on in our brains and in our

121
00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,400
Speaker 1: minds and in our bodies. So that's really where I

122
00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:25,800
Speaker 1: want to leave the end of this episode with a

123
00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:28,320
Speaker 1: bit of a brightness on the horizon, a bit of

124
00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:32,320
Speaker 1: a silver lining, I will say before we begin small caveat.

125
00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:35,920
Speaker 1: This episode is not for diagnostic purposes. If you think

126
00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:38,880
Speaker 1: you may be suffering from OCD, please go and see

127
00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:42,160
Speaker 1: a registered psychologist or a psychiatrist in your local area

128
00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:45,400
Speaker 1: to get help. My real aim for this episode is

129
00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:47,840
Speaker 1: just to kind of provide a bit more information about

130
00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:51,360
Speaker 1: my own story, why it's actually not a rare story,

131
00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:55,120
Speaker 1: and also, yeah, just kind of provide you with some

132
00:07:55,200 --> 00:08:01,040
Speaker 1: information general information around what this disorder of really means

133
00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:03,760
Speaker 1: for people who are enduring it, because I think we

134
00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:07,200
Speaker 1: could all really benefit from knowing more about the lived

135
00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:09,760
Speaker 1: experience of people with OCD, whether you have it or

136
00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:13,280
Speaker 1: whether you don't. So, without further ado, I don't want

137
00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:17,120
Speaker 1: to say excited for this episode. I'm very invested in

138
00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:21,120
Speaker 1: this episode and it was a real pleasure and really personal,

139
00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:24,320
Speaker 1: personally motivating to research it. So I hope you get

140
00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:28,520
Speaker 1: something out of it. Let's go into the complex origins, symptoms,

141
00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:36,079
Speaker 1: and experience, but also treatments for OCD. Stay with us.

142
00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:41,160
Speaker 1: Let's kick things off by firstly just busting some myths,

143
00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:47,200
Speaker 1: because honestly, the popular image of OCD wildly off the mark.

144
00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,080
Speaker 1: It is not about being unique freak. It's not about

145
00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:55,120
Speaker 1: being particular about details. Whilst some individuals with OCD do

146
00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:59,080
Speaker 1: experience symptoms related to order and cleanliness, that is just

147
00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:03,360
Speaker 1: one faset and it doesn't do justice to what is

148
00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:07,040
Speaker 1: really happening under the surface. So what is OCD A

149
00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:12,040
Speaker 1: very basic perspective. At its core, OCD is actually one

150
00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:16,079
Speaker 1: of the most revalent mental health conditions in the world.

151
00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:19,160
Speaker 1: And every time I tell people that, they're always surprised,

152
00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:21,960
Speaker 1: but it's true. About one to three percent of the

153
00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:25,839
Speaker 1: population has OCD. And if that doesn't sound like a

154
00:09:25,840 --> 00:09:29,640
Speaker 1: big amount, I will say that makes it the fourth

155
00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:33,760
Speaker 1: most diagnosed mental health condition in the world, coming under depression,

156
00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:39,319
Speaker 1: generalized anxiety disorder, and panic disorder. And if we translate

157
00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:44,680
Speaker 1: one to three percent into a number, that's around seventy

158
00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:48,679
Speaker 1: eight to two hundred and thirty four million people worldwide.

159
00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:52,600
Speaker 1: And let's also be clear, that's just the number of

160
00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:56,400
Speaker 1: people who are diagnosed, so it's not including the people

161
00:09:56,440 --> 00:10:00,400
Speaker 1: that havn't yet been able to access a diagnosis for

162
00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:05,079
Speaker 1: various reasons because of health inequality, because they don't even

163
00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:09,400
Speaker 1: recognize the symptoms in themselves, because of stigma, any number

164
00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:13,959
Speaker 1: of reasons. So if you want to understand ocd's are more.

165
00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:17,000
Speaker 1: You basically have to understand as a starting point how

166
00:10:17,040 --> 00:10:20,520
Speaker 1: it is described in the DSM five. So the DSM

167
00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:25,160
Speaker 1: is basically the reference point for all mental health or

168
00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:29,440
Speaker 1: brain related conditions, OCD being one of those, and OCD

169
00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:34,640
Speaker 1: is characterized in this book by two main components, obsessions

170
00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:37,320
Speaker 1: and compulsions. You have to have both to have a

171
00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:42,000
Speaker 1: diagnosis of OCD. Let's break down these components. So obsessions

172
00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:48,120
Speaker 1: these unwanted, intrusive and often very distressing thoughts, images or

173
00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:52,040
Speaker 1: urgers that just pop into someone's head seemingly out of nowhere.

174
00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:59,000
Speaker 1: They are persistent, they typically cause a lot of anxiety

175
00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:03,920
Speaker 1: and stress, and they are frequent. They're frequent visitors in

176
00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:08,319
Speaker 1: our minds. Here's the key point. These aren't just excessive

177
00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:11,880
Speaker 1: worries about real life problems. If you are going broke

178
00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:14,720
Speaker 1: and you are worried about money, you are obviously going

179
00:11:14,760 --> 00:11:17,360
Speaker 1: to be thinking about money all the time because it

180
00:11:17,400 --> 00:11:20,679
Speaker 1: is a present day issue for you that is very,

181
00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:25,960
Speaker 1: very stressful. That doesn't make it an obsession in OCD terms.

182
00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:29,880
Speaker 1: Obsessions as a part of OCD are very different. They're

183
00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:34,600
Speaker 1: what we call ego dystonic, meaning they clash with a

184
00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:39,640
Speaker 1: person's true values, realities, beliefs, desires. They also are not

185
00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:43,880
Speaker 1: always particularly relevant to what that individual is experiencing in

186
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:48,840
Speaker 1: that moment. So, for example, you may have intrusive thoughts

187
00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,880
Speaker 1: about hurting someone even though you're not hurting someone at

188
00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:54,240
Speaker 1: that point. You can have intrusive thoughts that you're a

189
00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:57,520
Speaker 1: bad person, even though you know that doesn't match reality.

190
00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:00,360
Speaker 1: You're not a bad person. You can have intrusive thoughts

191
00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,680
Speaker 1: about the meaning of life that go against your beliefs

192
00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:06,480
Speaker 1: about your purpose. Here, you can have false beliefs that

193
00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:08,880
Speaker 1: someone in your family may be ill or that you

194
00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:15,240
Speaker 1: may get ill, that are totally unreasonable when we actually

195
00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:18,680
Speaker 1: pair them up with reality, but which your brain thinks

196
00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:24,360
Speaker 1: one hundred percent factual, true information. It's the fact that

197
00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:28,120
Speaker 1: these thoughts are so counter to who we are, what's

198
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:30,800
Speaker 1: going on in our lives, how we wish to see ourselves,

199
00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:36,679
Speaker 1: that they cause so much fear and such intense anxiety

200
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:40,400
Speaker 1: or stress at times. Here's the other crucial thing. We

201
00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,720
Speaker 1: can't help it. Of course, you know, if your life

202
00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:46,800
Speaker 1: is falling apart, if your world is crumbling like, you're

203
00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:50,320
Speaker 1: going to be anxious about what's happening in your environment

204
00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:54,480
Speaker 1: and your circumstances. But with obsessive thoughts, they just come

205
00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:58,720
Speaker 1: out of nowhere. There's no typically, there's no real reason

206
00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:01,800
Speaker 1: that they're there. They just are. How I like to

207
00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:03,679
Speaker 1: explain it is that these thoughts are kind of like

208
00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:06,320
Speaker 1: a smoke alarm going off on your head, and no

209
00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:08,440
Speaker 1: matter how many times you push the button, it won't

210
00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,360
Speaker 1: turn off. So you just have this alarm going on

211
00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,600
Speaker 1: and on and on. Someone without OCD can easily turn

212
00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:17,360
Speaker 1: off the button, but if you have OCD, you can't.

213
00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:21,560
Speaker 1: So that's the first component these obsessions. Then we have compulsions.

214
00:13:21,880 --> 00:13:25,480
Speaker 1: These are the repetitive behaviors or mental acts that an

215
00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:29,480
Speaker 1: individual feels driven kind of to perform in response to

216
00:13:29,520 --> 00:13:34,440
Speaker 1: the obsessive thought. So you think something that's scarer, you

217
00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,559
Speaker 1: think something that's causing you panic, you think something that

218
00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:41,400
Speaker 1: feels terrible in your body, and so the only way

219
00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:43,760
Speaker 1: to stop that thought is to go and do a

220
00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:49,040
Speaker 1: repetitive behavior, to perform a compulsion that makes that thought

221
00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:54,520
Speaker 1: feel less sharp. The goal of the compulsion is to

222
00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:58,360
Speaker 1: prevent or reduce the feeling of distress that is caused

223
00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:02,880
Speaker 1: by the obsession or it's kind of this weird, this

224
00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:04,880
Speaker 1: weird thing that we do that we think is going

225
00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:08,240
Speaker 1: to stop something terrible from happening. We think that it's

226
00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,320
Speaker 1: like protective either way, we kind of do see it

227
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:13,760
Speaker 1: as a good thing that we are doing these and

228
00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:17,160
Speaker 1: that we are performing these compulsions because they are somehow

229
00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:21,480
Speaker 1: neutralizing a threat or somehow saving us. You know, for example,

230
00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,440
Speaker 1: you may have this fear that something's going to happen

231
00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:27,040
Speaker 1: to your family, But if you flick a light switch

232
00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:31,480
Speaker 1: on and off twelve times arbitrary number, well then it's

233
00:14:31,480 --> 00:14:34,720
Speaker 1: not gonna happen. How could you not do that if

234
00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,920
Speaker 1: you genuinely think that your family will perish in a

235
00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:40,720
Speaker 1: car accident if you don't flick the light switch on

236
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:44,360
Speaker 1: twelve times exactly, Like, of course you're going to do that.

237
00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:47,440
Speaker 1: Of course you're going to perform the compulsion. It's the

238
00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:50,760
Speaker 1: only thing that in your mind is preventing this terrible

239
00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:53,960
Speaker 1: thing from happening. It's the only thing that is cooling

240
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:58,600
Speaker 1: off the obsessive thought. It's not about pleasure, it's not

241
00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:03,760
Speaker 1: about avoiding reality. It's about escaping the terror of the

242
00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:08,720
Speaker 1: thought in your mind. It's about escaping what you think

243
00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:11,720
Speaker 1: is going to happen if you don't address this thought

244
00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:15,000
Speaker 1: with this compulsion just to nail this home. Think about

245
00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:18,640
Speaker 1: it like this. An obsession is screaming at you something

246
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,000
Speaker 1: terrible is going to happen if you don't do X,

247
00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:25,320
Speaker 1: and the compulsion is the desperate, often illogical attempt to

248
00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:32,280
Speaker 1: silence that scream and avert the perceived disaster by performing X.

249
00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:35,600
Speaker 1: And both of these components, like I said before, are essential.

250
00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:39,760
Speaker 1: There is actually something called purely obsessional OCD. They call

251
00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:44,760
Speaker 1: it pure o OCD, where the obsession is obviously the

252
00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:48,000
Speaker 1: distressing thought, but the compulsion is just to think about

253
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:51,400
Speaker 1: that distressing thought more. And sometimes people can look at

254
00:15:51,440 --> 00:15:53,840
Speaker 1: that and think, well, that's not OCD. There's no compulsion.

255
00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:56,640
Speaker 1: This person isn't acting in a certain way to prevent

256
00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:00,480
Speaker 1: the negative, distressing thought. It is still OCD because the

257
00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,960
Speaker 1: act of thinking is actually the compulsion is actually the compulsion.

258
00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:09,120
Speaker 1: You can understand how frickin' frustrating that can be, but

259
00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:12,720
Speaker 1: in some ways it is soothing. Thinking about something constantly

260
00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,080
Speaker 1: over and over again until it feels safe is actually,

261
00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,800
Speaker 1: in some ways a form of OCD. It's a way

262
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:22,680
Speaker 1: that we try and try to turn the smoke alarm off,

263
00:16:23,280 --> 00:16:25,880
Speaker 1: and that brings us to the OCD cycle, which is

264
00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,000
Speaker 1: really what defines this disorder. So the OCD cycle starts

265
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:32,080
Speaker 1: with an intrusive thought. Now here's a crucial piece of

266
00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:35,240
Speaker 1: understanding that we can't miss out on. Intrusive thoughts are

267
00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,720
Speaker 1: actually really common. Around eighty to ninety percent of the

268
00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:43,640
Speaker 1: general population experiences intrusive thoughts on a regular basis. That's

269
00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:47,880
Speaker 1: why intrusive thoughts alone are not enough to be diagnosed

270
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:52,160
Speaker 1: with OCD. Intrusive thoughts are basically just like random, unwanted,

271
00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:55,480
Speaker 1: bizarre things, sometimes disturbing that just like pop into your head.

272
00:16:55,640 --> 00:16:58,480
Speaker 1: You know. The best example, you're standing on the train

273
00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:01,640
Speaker 1: platform and you're like if I just jumped, Or you're

274
00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:03,120
Speaker 1: driving your car and you're like, what if I just

275
00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:06,639
Speaker 1: crash my car? You're holding a baby, You're like, you

276
00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:08,800
Speaker 1: just have this image of yourself like throwing the baby

277
00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:11,359
Speaker 1: on the ground, and then it disappears. You know, for

278
00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:15,360
Speaker 1: most people, those thoughts are quickly dismissed. You might think

279
00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:18,439
Speaker 1: that's really weird. Obviously I'm not going to do that,

280
00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:21,560
Speaker 1: like that's crazy, and your brain just filters it out,

281
00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:25,840
Speaker 1: recognizes it as just like a random brain blip. But

282
00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:29,560
Speaker 1: for someone with OCD, those thoughts don't just pass by,

283
00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:34,919
Speaker 1: They become sticky. Their brain doesn't filter it out. It

284
00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:39,600
Speaker 1: flags it as really important, really important information. It flags

285
00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,960
Speaker 1: those thoughts as dangerous. It flags those thoughts as something

286
00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,680
Speaker 1: that they have to pay attention to. And so when

287
00:17:45,680 --> 00:17:49,200
Speaker 1: that thought enters the part of our brain that filters

288
00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:51,520
Speaker 1: our thoughts that are are useful in those that aren't,

289
00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,199
Speaker 1: grabs onto it and holds onto it tight. So like,

290
00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:57,439
Speaker 1: let's say you are spending time with your family and

291
00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:00,080
Speaker 1: for like a split second, you think, what if I

292
00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:02,679
Speaker 1: end up hurting my family member? What if I stab

293
00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:09,000
Speaker 1: my family something bizarre like that. Someone without OCD might think, like,

294
00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:11,359
Speaker 1: think that, and be like, that is so weird that

295
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,960
Speaker 1: I just thought that. What a random thought, What a

296
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:17,920
Speaker 1: horrible thought. I'd obviously never do that when you could refocus.

297
00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:21,800
Speaker 1: For someone with OCD, though, instead of just being able

298
00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:26,200
Speaker 1: to dismiss it, the brain immediately interprets this thought as

299
00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:30,080
Speaker 1: highly significant and threatening, thinking, oh my god, but why

300
00:18:30,119 --> 00:18:32,399
Speaker 1: did I think that? Obviously, if I thought that, it

301
00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:34,600
Speaker 1: means some part of me really wants to do that,

302
00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:36,520
Speaker 1: And if some part of me really wants to do

303
00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:38,240
Speaker 1: that, that I'm a monster. And if I'm a monster, I

304
00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:41,040
Speaker 1: shouldn't be around my family because if I'm having those

305
00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:43,639
Speaker 1: thoughts and obviously I'm going to act on them. You

306
00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:46,240
Speaker 1: can see how this creates a lot of anxiety a

307
00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:51,800
Speaker 1: lot of dread. Individuals with OCD often have an inflated

308
00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:56,320
Speaker 1: sense of responsibility. Inflated responsibility basically means that they have

309
00:18:56,440 --> 00:19:01,480
Speaker 1: this exaggerated belief that they as individuals, have the power

310
00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:07,200
Speaker 1: to cause or prevent negative outcomes, even when objectively they don't.

311
00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:11,639
Speaker 1: This feeling of being excessively responsible for preventing bad things

312
00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,359
Speaker 1: from happening, even if it sounds delusional to people who

313
00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:18,840
Speaker 1: don't have OCD, what it means is that the thoughts

314
00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:22,440
Speaker 1: that they're having around family members being hurt, them hurting

315
00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:27,800
Speaker 1: family members, terrible things happening really difficult to shake. But

316
00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,159
Speaker 1: this is where the compulsion comes in. The compulsion is

317
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,560
Speaker 1: introduced as this behavior that can make all of that

318
00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:38,560
Speaker 1: go away. There is some behavior they believe they can

319
00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:41,520
Speaker 1: do that will shield them from the bad thing happening,

320
00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:45,040
Speaker 1: that will shield the people they love from bad things happening,

321
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:47,160
Speaker 1: And so of course they're gonna do it. They're gonna

322
00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,480
Speaker 1: wash their hands as many times as they need, They're

323
00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:52,280
Speaker 1: going to ask for reassurance until the cows come home.

324
00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:55,560
Speaker 1: They're going to check every single lock twelve times, because

325
00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:57,960
Speaker 1: that's how many times they need to do it to

326
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:02,040
Speaker 1: assure ensure that they haven't been anything. You can kind

327
00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:05,439
Speaker 1: of see where this is going. One of my compulsions

328
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:07,800
Speaker 1: when I was a child, And again I don't know

329
00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:10,960
Speaker 1: how anyone freaking missed this, but I guess I never

330
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:13,720
Speaker 1: told anyone. But when I was a kid, every single night,

331
00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,639
Speaker 1: before I went to bed, I would pray, and I

332
00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:21,840
Speaker 1: would have to pray for exactly one minute and forty

333
00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:25,400
Speaker 1: five seconds, and my prayer would have to be very

334
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:28,320
Speaker 1: very specific. I would have to mention every single member

335
00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:30,720
Speaker 1: of my family. I'd have to say all of these

336
00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:33,800
Speaker 1: certain things. I'd have to thank God for five different

337
00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,240
Speaker 1: things every single night, although something bad was going to happen.

338
00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:39,120
Speaker 1: My family was not religious at this stage. I had

339
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,800
Speaker 1: never stepped foot in a church. I think I started

340
00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:45,359
Speaker 1: doing this when I was like four. I had I'd

341
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:48,760
Speaker 1: like I had no. I didn't go to a religious school.

342
00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,919
Speaker 1: I lived in like a part of Australia where, you know,

343
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,639
Speaker 1: religion wasn't really a huge thing. But I'd gotten in

344
00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:58,840
Speaker 1: my mind that you know if I didn't do this,

345
00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:02,080
Speaker 1: people would be hurt. Here's the cruel irony of that.

346
00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:07,399
Speaker 1: Though performing the compulsion only provides a very temporary brief

347
00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:10,639
Speaker 1: sense of relief before the anxiety comes racing back, but

348
00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:14,959
Speaker 1: this just momentary relief actually reinforces the compulsion. Of course,

349
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:19,000
Speaker 1: you're so distressed by these thoughts you're having. Any sense

350
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:21,960
Speaker 1: of calm is one that you are going to pursue.

351
00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:25,400
Speaker 1: But what that means is that your brain learns, Okay,

352
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:27,880
Speaker 1: when I have the scary thought that a family member

353
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:29,439
Speaker 1: is going to die, I'm going to get a disease,

354
00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:31,800
Speaker 1: something terrible is going to happen. If I do X,

355
00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:34,520
Speaker 1: the bad feeling goes away. Well, then of course I'm

356
00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:38,200
Speaker 1: going to keep doing X. And this really strengthens the

357
00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:41,440
Speaker 1: link between the obsession and the compulsion, making it more

358
00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:44,439
Speaker 1: likely that the cycle will repeat the next time the

359
00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:48,119
Speaker 1: obsession appears. The child will continue to pray, the person

360
00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:50,840
Speaker 1: will continue to wash their hands, they will continue to

361
00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:55,560
Speaker 1: check the lock twelve times. And because the compulsion momentarily

362
00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,480
Speaker 1: feels like it prevents the feared outcome, probably because the

363
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:03,720
Speaker 1: feared outcome was never going to happen anyway, You never

364
00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 1: get to test whether the fear was realistic in the

365
00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:10,159
Speaker 1: first place. The cycle gets stronger, the anxiety returns, the

366
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:14,680
Speaker 1: compulsion becomes more rigid and frequent. I think something that's

367
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:17,920
Speaker 1: really key to highlight when talking about OCD is actually

368
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:22,639
Speaker 1: how vast this condition really is. Like we said at

369
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:25,280
Speaker 1: the beginning, it's not just tidiness. There are all these

370
00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:28,440
Speaker 1: different categories of OCD symptoms that I think is really

371
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 1: important that we know of. So we are going to

372
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:33,159
Speaker 1: take a short break here, but when we return, I

373
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:36,680
Speaker 1: want to talk through these very important categories and how

374
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:43,680
Speaker 1: they are very very distinctive and different. Stay with us.

375
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:50,840
Speaker 1: So researchers and people in the clinical mental health space

376
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:55,160
Speaker 1: often categorize OCD symptoms into various common themes or dimensions,

377
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:57,679
Speaker 1: just to kind of make it easier to label people

378
00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:59,920
Speaker 1: and to choose what treatment would work best for them.

379
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,760
Speaker 1: I'm going to share some of these with you guys. Now,

380
00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:05,480
Speaker 1: this is actually, by no means an exhaustive list. It's

381
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 1: just the most common ones. So the first is the classic,

382
00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:13,680
Speaker 1: it's the most recognized type of OCD. Contamination and cleaning

383
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:19,679
Speaker 1: obsessions to do with this might involve intense fears of germs, dirt,

384
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:25,880
Speaker 1: bodily fluids, chemicals, chemicals in your food, or even mental contamination,

385
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 1: feeling dirty from a negative thought or an interaction. The

386
00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:34,920
Speaker 1: underlying fear is not of the dirt, not of the germs.

387
00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:38,600
Speaker 1: It's of illness. It's of death, it's of moral impurity.

388
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 1: It's of something being in your body that you can't control.

389
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:48,120
Speaker 1: Compulsions around this might involve excessive hand washing, showering, cleaning objects,

390
00:23:48,119 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 1: avoiding perceived contaminants, or asking others to clean things because

391
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:56,240
Speaker 1: you trust them more, all driven by that desperate need

392
00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:59,240
Speaker 1: to alleviate that fear. I actually read a really fascinating

393
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:02,960
Speaker 1: article about a group of people, well, there weren't really

394
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:06,439
Speaker 1: a group, but people individually who would not get the

395
00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:11,240
Speaker 1: COVID vaccine because they were so scared of obviously, of

396
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 1: having something in their body that they couldn't control. It's

397
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 1: not that they thought the vaccine was bad, it's not

398
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 1: that they didn't even believe in vaccines. They were just

399
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:24,719
Speaker 1: so fearful of chemicals or things they didn't understand being

400
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,320
Speaker 1: in their body. And so you can see how this

401
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:31,200
Speaker 1: goes very very deep and has a real societal impact.

402
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:37,119
Speaker 1: The next kind of category is around symmetry around symmetry, ordering,

403
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:42,880
Speaker 1: and feeling that things need to be just right, perfectly aligned, balanced, exact.

404
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:48,120
Speaker 1: This fear can be rather vague, but it can also

405
00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:50,840
Speaker 1: be really intense, and really what it's coming down to

406
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 1: is this sense that something bad might happen if the

407
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,920
Speaker 1: world doesn't have order, and that there is an impending

408
00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,400
Speaker 1: sense of doom or terror that will afflict the person

409
00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:07,400
Speaker 1: if their environment isn't ordered just so. Compulsions around this

410
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: might involve arranging objects repeatedly, repeating actions until they feel perfect,

411
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,120
Speaker 1: so reentering a doorway until it feels just right, because

412
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 1: if it doesn't feel right, maybe that's a sign that

413
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:24,959
Speaker 1: something's off. Doing counting rituals is another one. The sheer

414
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:29,520
Speaker 1: distress and fear comes from things feeling out of place,

415
00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:34,360
Speaker 1: and this like very unbearable internal tension that doesn't settle

416
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 1: on its own. It needs to be settled by things

417
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: in the environment or certain sensations. Another really common dimension

418
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 1: of osity centers around harm and responsibility, something that we've

419
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 1: kind of alluded to already in today's episode. This is

420
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:54,160
Speaker 1: where it can get quite dark and distressing for the individual.

421
00:25:54,720 --> 00:26:01,240
Speaker 1: These obsessions often involve really terrifying fears of harming oneself,

422
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 1: harming others accidentally harming them, or being violent or aggressive

423
00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 1: towards people without really wanting to be. For example, a

424
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,479
Speaker 1: new parent might have a terrifying, intrusive image in their

425
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:19,160
Speaker 1: brain of harming their child, even though they have absolutely

426
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 1: no desire to do that, and that creates really immense

427
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,440
Speaker 1: guilt and shame, and some psychologists and researchers have even

428
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 1: suggested that it's the very fact that they know they

429
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,080
Speaker 1: won't do it, and that it is so terrible that

430
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:38,480
Speaker 1: their brain feels like continuously drawn to it like a magnet, like, wow,

431
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 1: this thing is so intense and so dark. When we

432
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 1: have to sit with this even longer to store really

433
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,760
Speaker 1: make sure, but in sitting with it, the lines kind

434
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 1: of get blurry. You don't actually want to do it.

435
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 1: That's something we really have to be clear of here.

436
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 1: You don't want to hurt someone, you don't want to

437
00:26:57,119 --> 00:26:59,800
Speaker 1: hurt yourself. But the fact that the thought is there

438
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: confusing to you because you think, well, why would I

439
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,520
Speaker 1: be thinking of it if I didn't want to do it.

440
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:09,560
Speaker 1: Compulsions to do with this involve extreme avoidance of sharp

441
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:14,959
Speaker 1: objects of children of certain people, but also constantly seeking

442
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 1: reassurance that you haven't harmed anyone, constantly confessing perceived bad thoughts,

443
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:25,679
Speaker 1: or just constantly mentally reviewing past events to check for

444
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,640
Speaker 1: any wrongdoing. You can see why this is sometimes confused

445
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,679
Speaker 1: with anxiety. Right. This overthinking element, this rumination element, is

446
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:39,080
Speaker 1: something that OCD and anxiety have in common. There's also

447
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 1: religious or moral OCD. This is sometimes referred to as scrupulosity.

448
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,200
Speaker 1: Scrupulosity you know when you see a word written down

449
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:53,200
Speaker 1: but you've never like actually said it before. Like scrupulosity, Yeah,

450
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:58,639
Speaker 1: basically involves obsessions and compulsions centered around religious, moral, or

451
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,160
Speaker 1: ethical beliefs. I was actually listening to a podcast about

452
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:05,040
Speaker 1: this the other day that was interviewing priests, new priests

453
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,879
Speaker 1: who were dealing with these people who just like wouldn't

454
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,520
Speaker 1: stop calling them members of their church, who would confess

455
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,479
Speaker 1: every single little thing that they'd done, even when it

456
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,199
Speaker 1: wasn't bad. And the priests were having to deal with

457
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:20,920
Speaker 1: this fact that they were like this. One guy was like, oh,

458
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 1: you know, I went to vacuum my carpet and I

459
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:25,920
Speaker 1: missed a bit, and is God going to be mad

460
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 1: at me about that? And the priest had to be like,

461
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:30,439
Speaker 1: oh no, and this woman who was like, oh, you know,

462
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:32,800
Speaker 1: I cooked dinner for my husband, but I was gonna

463
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:36,320
Speaker 1: cook something else. But what if he wanted the other

464
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: thing more than he wanted the thing that I gave him,

465
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,840
Speaker 1: I've displeased him. I'm evil? Does this mean I'm going

466
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 1: to Hell? And the priests had to be like no,

467
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 1: it's these fears of sinning, of being immoral, and really

468
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,760
Speaker 1: it's a deeper fear of divine punishment, of hell, of

469
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 1: eternal damnation. So these people might pray excessively, repeat religious rituals, obviously,

470
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:02,280
Speaker 1: seek constant forgiveness from members of the church, or really

471
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:06,520
Speaker 1: avoid situations that they think could lead to immoral thoughts.

472
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 1: The final one I want to mention is relationship OCDA.

473
00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 1: I feel like some of you probably saw this coming.

474
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: We actually have an entire episode on this from earlier

475
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 1: this year with an expert. All she does is talk

476
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:22,480
Speaker 1: about relationship Osiday. She is amazing. She knows every single

477
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 1: dimension on this. If this is something that you feel

478
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 1: particularly drawn to understanding more, you can go and listen

479
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: to that episode. But relationship OCDY really involves intrusive doubts

480
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 1: and obsessions about your romantic or close personal relationships. These

481
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 1: obsessions might really focus on a partner's flaws, the rightness

482
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 1: of the relationship, any doubts you have in your mind

483
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,640
Speaker 1: about how much you love them, about your attraction to them,

484
00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:53,680
Speaker 1: whether other people feel this way about their partner, whether

485
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 1: your relationship is wrong, whether it's right, whether you're doing

486
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 1: the right things. The core fear here is off and

487
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 1: around making the wrong decision, around hurting someone by not

488
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,360
Speaker 1: loving them enough and leaving them, of wasting your time,

489
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 1: of wasting their time. Compulsions really often include excessive comparison,

490
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 1: constantly comparing your relationship to others, mentally reviewing the relationship history,

491
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: constantly seeking reassurance about the relationship's validity, constantly asking other

492
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 1: people about their relationship, what was their timeline, how were

493
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,360
Speaker 1: they feeling at this point in their relationship, to kind

494
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:37,760
Speaker 1: of compare your own. This intense doubt and fear can

495
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 1: really damage almost every single relationship that you're in, even

496
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:45,400
Speaker 1: the ones that are almost perfect, even the ones that

497
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 1: there is absolutely nothing wrong. If you look for something

498
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 1: wrong in a relationship, you will find You will find it.

499
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:54,920
Speaker 1: You will absolutely find it, because no relationship is perfect, right,

500
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 1: So if you have OCD and your brain is real

501
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 1: hell bent on hunting for that hunting for that thing

502
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 1: that's wrong, you are going to find at least something

503
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:08,520
Speaker 1: that you can cling onto. So with these categories, it

504
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:11,880
Speaker 1: might be that someone has just one type of OCD,

505
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: but it is also possible for OCD to change and

506
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 1: attach itself onto different themes because the core underlying mechanism

507
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 1: is the same, it just might have a different expression.

508
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 1: The sheer variety of themes as well, means that true

509
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 1: people with OCD might present completely differently, yet they will

510
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 1: both be battling the same underlying mechanisms of intrusive thoughts

511
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 1: and compulsive responses. The issue that comes with this is

512
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,800
Speaker 1: that sometimes they don't get the proper treatment or diagnosis

513
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:49,640
Speaker 1: because people don't understand where OCD came from, even some

514
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,520
Speaker 1: you know, professionals, even some people who are meant to

515
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 1: specialize in mental health disorders, because this disorder is so varied,

516
00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:01,200
Speaker 1: they just might not recognize a new permitation. So before

517
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,239
Speaker 1: we get into that part of this story and that

518
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 1: part of why this happens, let's actually talk about what

519
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:12,800
Speaker 1: causes OCD. Where does this come from? Obviously, our brains

520
00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:16,400
Speaker 1: play a very significant, if not the most important role,

521
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 1: hence why this is called a mental health disorder. But

522
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: it's not that you have a broken brain by no means.

523
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: It's that it's that there are just specific differences in

524
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:32,480
Speaker 1: how certain brain circuits function versus how they function in

525
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:37,440
Speaker 1: someone else. And these differences, which no one can really control,

526
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 1: no one's in charge of, they do predispose someone to

527
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: developing OCD compared to someone else, and they contribute to

528
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 1: profound feelings of being trapped by thoughts and compulsions. The

529
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 1: crucial structure we need to understand and bear with me.

530
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:54,440
Speaker 1: It's a long name, but it's called the cordico striato

531
00:32:54,600 --> 00:33:01,480
Speaker 1: thalamo cortical loop CSTC loop. I know you're probably thinking,

532
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:03,720
Speaker 1: what the heck is that? That sounds like you just

533
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 1: made that up. I didn't. It's a real thing. It's

534
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 1: a real structure. It's basically a brain circuit that acts

535
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 1: like the best way I can describe it is like

536
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 1: it's a busy highway in your brain for information and

537
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 1: it connects all these areas that are involved in decision making,

538
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:24,959
Speaker 1: error detection, habit formation, reassurance, checking, observation, all these things.

539
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 1: It's a very important structure, and when part of this

540
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 1: highway doesn't work or it's closed down, the loop obviously

541
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:35,960
Speaker 1: can't function, and that is where a disorder like OCD emerges.

542
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 1: So the first area that we need to understand as

543
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 1: part of this loop is the part that's responsible for

544
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:48,320
Speaker 1: decision making. It's called the orbitofrontal cortex. In OCD, research

545
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 1: has shown that that cortex, that part of the cortex

546
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 1: I should say, is hyperactive. It's like an overly sensitive

547
00:33:54,880 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: alarm bell, constantly flagging thoughts as critical threats, feeding that

548
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 1: fear that something terrible is going to happen even when

549
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:04,960
Speaker 1: it's not. The way I describe it as like a

550
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,319
Speaker 1: really anxious parent who sees everything as something that's going

551
00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:11,239
Speaker 1: to harm their child. So that is the first part

552
00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,720
Speaker 1: of the brain that's quite hyperactive or something's going wrong.

553
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,120
Speaker 1: The second area is the area responsible for error detection.

554
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:23,080
Speaker 1: It's called the anterior singulate cortex. It's located very deep

555
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:26,600
Speaker 1: inside the brain. When it's not working right, it keeps

556
00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:31,879
Speaker 1: again sending this something is wrong signals. So that orbitofrontal

557
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,920
Speaker 1: part of your brain is saying that it's wrong, as

558
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,160
Speaker 1: saying that something is wrong. And then the second part

559
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:39,720
Speaker 1: of your brain is interpreting that and sending these alarm

560
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: bells that it doesn't really need to. That is what's

561
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:45,479
Speaker 1: creating this fear response or this distress that you can't

562
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:48,080
Speaker 1: turn off. And then we also have the basal ganglia,

563
00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:52,120
Speaker 1: which is responsible for habit formation. So errors or issues

564
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 1: with this area mean that you are going to start

565
00:34:56,400 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 1: performing these compulsive, ritualistic actions and falsely associating those actions

566
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 1: with a positive outcome. So you know, you think something

567
00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 1: bad's gonna happen, you perform an action, the bad thing

568
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,759
Speaker 1: doesn't happen. You know that. Logically you can kind of

569
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 1: see that, well dah, like maybe the bad thing wasn't

570
00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:17,279
Speaker 1: gonna happen anyways, But this part of your brain thinks,

571
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,879
Speaker 1: oh no, like, actually this action has been reinforced by

572
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:27,120
Speaker 1: something bad not happening. Obviously I saved myself. Obviously I

573
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:30,839
Speaker 1: did something right. This is the cure. So basically, when

574
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 1: this part isn't working, it makes it really hard to

575
00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:38,840
Speaker 1: stop performing your competitive action in response to an unwanted thought.

576
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,640
Speaker 1: So you can kind of see when the communication between

577
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 1: these brain areas is a little bit off. This is

578
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:48,840
Speaker 1: what creates that loop that we were describing before. Basically,

579
00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:51,279
Speaker 1: what I'm trying to say is it's not you, it's

580
00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 1: your brain. So let's talk about when these symptoms first

581
00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 1: begin to emerge. So OCD can actually emerge at any age,

582
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:02,920
Speaker 1: kind of scary when you think about it, But there

583
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 1: are two primary ages where it is most likely to begin,

584
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 1: or occur or first be noticed, and that is between

585
00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 1: the ages of nine to eleven and then again around

586
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,719
Speaker 1: twenty to twenty one years of age. If we think

587
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: about those years, they are really significant periods in our lives.

588
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,760
Speaker 1: The first is basically when puberty begins, and then the second,

589
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:27,640
Speaker 1: when we reach out twenties, is where we have this

590
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 1: second huge shift in our lives in terms of gaining independence,

591
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:35,360
Speaker 1: maybe moving away from home, forming new relationships, this added

592
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:39,040
Speaker 1: sense of responsibility, which we know people with OCD really

593
00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 1: struggle with. It's even what some people call second puberty,

594
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 1: that first those first two years of your twenties, like

595
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 1: so much is changing. There are monumental shifts, and this

596
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,840
Speaker 1: can you know, cause a massive impact on our stress

597
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:56,000
Speaker 1: levels and our mental health. So some researchers will say

598
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:59,480
Speaker 1: that it's not that OCD is more likely to occur

599
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 1: that these time periods are significant, is probably what I

600
00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:05,240
Speaker 1: should say. It's not that these periods of these years

601
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:09,120
Speaker 1: are special in any way, like that number doesn't mean anything.

602
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:13,600
Speaker 1: Is actually what's happening developmentally, and it's actually what's happening

603
00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: in terms of life stress. So much is changing during

604
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 1: those periods of our life. It's the change, and it's

605
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 1: the stress that is triggering OCD. Another really critical time

606
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,560
Speaker 1: when people are more likely to be diagnosed with OCD

607
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 1: is right after a child has been born, right after

608
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 1: they've given birth, because obviously that's like, that's a huge

609
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 1: life change. Your whole center of orbit shifts to be

610
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 1: that child. And often when someone develops OCD around this

611
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:49,920
Speaker 1: period in their life, the symptoms often focus around the child,

612
00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:54,520
Speaker 1: around accidentally accidentally harming the child, contaminating the child in

613
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,360
Speaker 1: some way. So it is really tied to the context,

614
00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 1: and it really does highlight how stressful significant life changes

615
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 1: can act as a trigger, especially if you already have

616
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:10,680
Speaker 1: a biological predisposition, especially if a family member, a parent,

617
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 1: a sibling has OCD, it's likely that you have some

618
00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:19,920
Speaker 1: of the same elements of your DNA blueprint that make

619
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:22,920
Speaker 1: you more predisposed. Doesn't mean that it's going to happen.

620
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:26,480
Speaker 1: Doesn't mean that you are determined to develop OCD. It

621
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: just means that it may be more likely and that

622
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:34,480
Speaker 1: you are more susceptible to triggers. Another explanation also comes

623
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 1: down to the role of serotonin. A lot of people

624
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:41,840
Speaker 1: think of serotonin as purely like the happy chemical alongside dopamine,

625
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 1: but we do know that they are really involved more

626
00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 1: deeply in motivation and in emotional regulation, being able to

627
00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 1: have a feeling, have a thought, and not invest in

628
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:59,440
Speaker 1: it entirely. So people who are more predisposed to developing

629
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 1: OCD might also have some differences in terms of how

630
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:10,960
Speaker 1: their brain processes, interprets, stores, releases serotonin, which is why

631
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:14,160
Speaker 1: if you go to a doctor, if you're to a psychiatrist,

632
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 1: one of the first things that they will often offer

633
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:22,799
Speaker 1: you as a solution is SSRIs selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors

634
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:27,120
Speaker 1: complicated name, basically just means that there's more serotonin in

635
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:31,080
Speaker 1: your brain for your neurons and your synapses to use,

636
00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:33,880
Speaker 1: so you are less likely to suffer from a deficit

637
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 1: in that neurotransmitter that could contribute to OCDA symptoms. Actually,

638
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: just recently, a really big paper came out talking about

639
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:47,839
Speaker 1: whether SSRIs are actually even effective at all. I'm not

640
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:50,080
Speaker 1: even going to get into it because I don't even

641
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,480
Speaker 1: think that I have formed my own opinion about the research,

642
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:55,920
Speaker 1: but it's something on the horizon. People are kind of

643
00:39:55,920 --> 00:40:00,800
Speaker 1: starting to rethink this purely biological approach to mental health

644
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: out aside. Basically, what we want to understand is that

645
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:06,680
Speaker 1: OCD really isn't just caused by one thing. It is

646
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 1: a complex interplay of various factors, kind of like a

647
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:17,160
Speaker 1: perfect storm of psychological vulnerabilities or patterns to do with biology, predisposition,

648
00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:20,520
Speaker 1: environmental triggers that all kind of come together and mean

649
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:26,600
Speaker 1: that someone ends up in this terrible obsessive compulsive loop. Okay,

650
00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:29,760
Speaker 1: we're going to take another short break, but when we return,

651
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:31,799
Speaker 1: I want to talk about the light at the end

652
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:34,640
Speaker 1: of the tunnel. I guess, some of the treatment options,

653
00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:37,839
Speaker 1: some of the ways that we can better understand our

654
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: OCD and also just advocate for ourselves in a system

655
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:44,400
Speaker 1: that doesn't really understand it. So stay with us. We

656
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:52,399
Speaker 1: will be right back after this short break. So, as

657
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,080
Speaker 1: my story kind of explained at the very beginning, getting

658
00:40:55,120 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 1: an accurate OCD diagnosis isn't always straightforward. In fact, significant

659
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:05,440
Speaker 1: delays are incredibly common. You know, I was looking into this,

660
00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 1: I was like, I cannot be the only one whose

661
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 1: experiences and it's not like I'm blaming anyone or saying

662
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: you know, yeah, I'm not blaming anyone. I'm not blaming

663
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:16,480
Speaker 1: my family, I'm not blaming previous mental health professionals. I

664
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:19,719
Speaker 1: think it's just because of like the inherent invisibility of

665
00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 1: many symptoms, the fact that sometimes people don't see the

666
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:28,160
Speaker 1: nuances between symptoms, that anxiety and o city are different

667
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 1: because of like there's like a five percent difference, but

668
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,920
Speaker 1: that five percent means everything. And also the shame the

669
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 1: fact that sometimes a lot of the compulsions or the

670
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 1: obsessions are things we don't really want to admit, and

671
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:44,880
Speaker 1: that leads to more severe symptoms and more prolonged suffering.

672
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,360
Speaker 1: Like I said, I was researching this, I found this

673
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 1: study from twenty twenty one from the University of Leipzig

674
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:56,480
Speaker 1: which actually found that the average time between the age

675
00:41:56,920 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: that symptoms appear in the age that people get diagnosed

676
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:06,840
Speaker 1: OCD is on average thirteen years. Thirteen years over a decade.

677
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:09,920
Speaker 1: That's the average, the average, and that was just like

678
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,080
Speaker 1: absolutely shocking, and to break down some of those factors,

679
00:42:13,080 --> 00:42:16,080
Speaker 1: I think firstly, a lot of people do hide their

680
00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:23,239
Speaker 1: OCD symptoms. Obsessions can contain really disturbing content, thoughts about violence, sexuality, blasphemy.

681
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 1: That's deeply upsetting. And we have been taught to believe

682
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,520
Speaker 1: that our thoughts reflect who we are and that we

683
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:34,280
Speaker 1: have control over our thoughts. So if we think bad things,

684
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:37,319
Speaker 1: we must be a bad person. That's actually not how

685
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 1: our brains work. A lot of our thoughts occur unconsciously

686
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:47,520
Speaker 1: and then flowed up into our conscious mind, and it's

687
00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:51,840
Speaker 1: not because we genuinely believe them. It's because our brain

688
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:55,360
Speaker 1: is just shooting out electricity and seeing where it lands.

689
00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,359
Speaker 1: People are often really terrifying, Like if I reveal these thoughts,

690
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:02,040
Speaker 1: people are going to think I'm crazy, which, by the way,

691
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:04,319
Speaker 1: I hate that word, but that's what they think. People

692
00:43:04,320 --> 00:43:06,360
Speaker 1: are going to think I'm crazy. People are going to

693
00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:08,960
Speaker 1: think I'm dangerous. People are going to think that I

694
00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:13,759
Speaker 1: should be institutionalized. And this immense shame and fear of

695
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:18,839
Speaker 1: misunderstanding really huge barriers. Unfortunately. You know, there have been

696
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:23,279
Speaker 1: documented cases where individuals, especially parents, struggling with intrusive thoughts

697
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:26,160
Speaker 1: about harming their children, have sought help, have said I

698
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:29,200
Speaker 1: don't want to do these things, but I am thinking

699
00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:32,320
Speaker 1: about them, and I can't control the thought, not the action,

700
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 1: the thought. They've disclosed those to a healthcare professional, and

701
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:41,959
Speaker 1: they face devastating consequences. Instead of receiving appropriate mental health

702
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:44,799
Speaker 1: support for OCD, they have sometimes been met with suspicion,

703
00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:48,200
Speaker 1: They've faced investigations, they've had their children removed from them.

704
00:43:48,520 --> 00:43:52,720
Speaker 1: This really deep rooted, I think misunderstanding, this cultural misunderstanding.

705
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:56,799
Speaker 1: It creates a really chilling effect where those most in

706
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:00,439
Speaker 1: need of help are terrified to seek it, fearing these

707
00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 1: catastrophic consequences, and so you just suffer in silence, and

708
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 1: that actually reinforces the hidden nature of OTDY, especially some

709
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:14,799
Speaker 1: of its more taboo subtypes. It's the fact that our

710
00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:19,320
Speaker 1: society hasn't doesn't understand this, doesn't understand the difference between

711
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 1: a thought, a desire, and an action, and so it

712
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: clumps them all together and shames people who have any

713
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:28,200
Speaker 1: of them. Nowadays, clinical guidelines do really strongly advocate for

714
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:34,040
Speaker 1: professionals to be trained in differentiating these egodostonic intrusive thoughts

715
00:44:34,040 --> 00:44:37,879
Speaker 1: from actual intent or risk of harm because there has

716
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 1: been a lack of specialized knowledge in the past that

717
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:44,200
Speaker 1: has created really severe and damaging misjudgments. You know, the

718
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:49,359
Speaker 1: International OCD Foundation explicitly states that thoughts are not indicators

719
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:53,560
Speaker 1: of a person's true desire. Someone's actions are more indicative

720
00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:56,840
Speaker 1: of their desire, their desire to hurt or harm people.

721
00:44:57,520 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 1: And they've really tried to say, like, people are not

722
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,880
Speaker 1: their thoughts, and if they are infessing their thoughts, they

723
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:07,960
Speaker 1: obviously don't want to act on them. So please treat them.

724
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 1: Please treat them, not just in general in terms of

725
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 1: give them help, but give them respect. But unfortunately, not

726
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:17,760
Speaker 1: all practitioners or even mental health clinicians are fully trained

727
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:22,120
Speaker 1: in recognizing those many diverse presentations of OCD. And it's

728
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 1: not all their fault, you know. They might just be

729
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 1: less familiar with certain symptoms. They may just have previous

730
00:45:29,120 --> 00:45:32,840
Speaker 1: misconceptions or their own beliefs about what kind of person

731
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:35,879
Speaker 1: would have these thoughts. It does just end up though,

732
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 1: perpetuating suffering due to missed opportunities for health. Another study

733
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:44,520
Speaker 1: that I found looked at GP physician like family doctors,

734
00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:48,760
Speaker 1: their ability to diagnose OCD, and it found that cases

735
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:53,839
Speaker 1: were misdiagnosed. Around fifty percent of the time someone comes

736
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:57,400
Speaker 1: in with OCD, there's a one and two chance half

737
00:45:57,680 --> 00:45:59,400
Speaker 1: like a one and two chance that they're going to

738
00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:03,920
Speaker 1: get the right diagnosis, which is really really scary, and

739
00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:06,680
Speaker 1: it's really crucial that they know what to look for

740
00:46:06,840 --> 00:46:10,879
Speaker 1: because they're often the only entry into receive they are

741
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 1: the only entry into receiving treatment. So if they miss

742
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:18,319
Speaker 1: the ball, if they miss certain symptoms, like, that's it.

743
00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:21,880
Speaker 1: That's the end of the line. Sometimes it's not all

744
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,440
Speaker 1: doom and gloom, though, I really want to make that clear.

745
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:28,800
Speaker 1: Although the road to accessing support may be tricky, OCD

746
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,879
Speaker 1: is highly treatable. It is one of the actually one

747
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 1: of the easiest disorders to treat. The absolute gold standard

748
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:40,640
Speaker 1: actually for OCD treatment is something called exposure and response prevention.

749
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,320
Speaker 1: It's it's a type of cognitive behavioral therapy, which is

750
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,200
Speaker 1: a very common type of therapy that is used all

751
00:46:47,239 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 1: over the world. So ERP basically involves gradually exposing people

752
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:58,239
Speaker 1: to their biggest fears, their biggest obsessions, whilst preventing the

753
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,879
Speaker 1: accompanying compulsive behavior. Yeah, they would they would usually kind

754
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:06,480
Speaker 1: of turn to reduce anxiety, so response prevention. They're preventing

755
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:09,600
Speaker 1: a certain response. And basically, what they're trying to do,

756
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:11,719
Speaker 1: and what this technique is trying to do, is give

757
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:15,320
Speaker 1: them evidence that the worst case scenario won't happen. Because

758
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:17,720
Speaker 1: once they can see that what they're doing isn't actually

759
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:20,680
Speaker 1: doing anything, it's not the reason that they're safe, it's

760
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 1: not the reason that their family is protected, it's not

761
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 1: the reason that something doesn't happen, then they don't have

762
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:27,440
Speaker 1: to perform it as often and they can kind of

763
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:30,960
Speaker 1: just sit with the discomfort of the thought without the

764
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:33,440
Speaker 1: compulsion and see that nothing bad it's going to happen.

765
00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:38,040
Speaker 1: A thought is not reality, A thought is not an action. Basically,

766
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:43,799
Speaker 1: you call your OCDS bluff. I heard an amazing analogy

767
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:47,000
Speaker 1: to sum up what this treatment really does and what

768
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 1: it teaches people to do. Imagine you have like a

769
00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:53,000
Speaker 1: snowball in your hand, right and at first the ice

770
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:56,120
Speaker 1: is pretty painful, like it's cold, it kind of burns,

771
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:58,560
Speaker 1: and you think, what if I get frostbited? What if

772
00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:02,319
Speaker 1: something my hand falls off? What's gonna happen? So you

773
00:48:02,600 --> 00:48:04,799
Speaker 1: instinctively want to let go and you want to throw

774
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:06,719
Speaker 1: it on the floor. You want to throw it away,

775
00:48:06,719 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: maybe throw it at someone. But if you just wait

776
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:13,200
Speaker 1: with the snowball in your hand, the ice will gradually

777
00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:16,680
Speaker 1: start to melt and it will drip away, and eventually

778
00:48:16,719 --> 00:48:18,440
Speaker 1: it will be gone and your hand can start to

779
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:22,279
Speaker 1: warm up again. It's gonna suck having this cold thing

780
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:26,279
Speaker 1: in your hand that's freezing, But then you kind of realize, wait,

781
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:31,320
Speaker 1: this actually can't hurt me beyond the initial the initial

782
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 1: feeling when I first have the thought, when I first

783
00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:37,320
Speaker 1: hold the snowball, that's when it's gonna hurt the most.

784
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:39,960
Speaker 1: But if I can just wait it out, if I

785
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:43,080
Speaker 1: can just have a little bit of courage and training

786
00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:46,279
Speaker 1: mental health training, there is another side to this that

787
00:48:46,600 --> 00:48:50,920
Speaker 1: perhaps my anxiety and my distress is never let me see.

788
00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:53,880
Speaker 1: The goal is basically to learn that the feared outcome

789
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:59,400
Speaker 1: doesn't happen, and this process really gradually rewires the brain's

790
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:04,120
Speaker 1: fear response. It realwires basal ganglia, It rewires parts of

791
00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 1: your frontal lobe, parts of your interior, parts of your

792
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:12,840
Speaker 1: brain that are assessing situations the wrong way. Given the

793
00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:16,560
Speaker 1: challenges in diagnosis and the misunderstandings we've talked about, I

794
00:49:16,600 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 1: think being your own informed advocate is really crucial here.

795
00:49:19,719 --> 00:49:22,759
Speaker 1: If this is something you're going through, this means that

796
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:25,640
Speaker 1: listening to things like this, gaining more information about your

797
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 1: specific OCD subtype is so valuable so that when you

798
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:34,240
Speaker 1: do step into the system, you freaking know your stuff.

799
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:36,719
Speaker 1: You know what you need. You know how to get

800
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:38,799
Speaker 1: to someone who knows more than you, but who will

801
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:42,400
Speaker 1: treat you with respect. And this might sound kind of harsh,

802
00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:44,799
Speaker 1: but the only way to do that is kind of

803
00:49:44,800 --> 00:49:47,600
Speaker 1: bypass people who actually don't know that much about your OCD,

804
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:51,799
Speaker 1: don't know much about OCD in general. So this might

805
00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 1: include getting to the appointment and just telling your GP

806
00:49:55,360 --> 00:49:58,000
Speaker 1: exactly what you need and what treatment you think is helpful,

807
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 1: even if they might dismiss it. Advocate for your desire

808
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 1: to try that. It could mean asking for a second

809
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:08,120
Speaker 1: opinion or a referral to a specialist when you can

810
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:12,400
Speaker 1: tell someone maybe isn't specialized enough. Also keeping up to

811
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:15,799
Speaker 1: date with emerging research that an average GP wouldn't have

812
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:19,319
Speaker 1: time to look at. It's not that these people are uneducated,

813
00:50:19,360 --> 00:50:21,400
Speaker 1: it's not that they're cruel, it's not that they're malicious.

814
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:24,600
Speaker 1: It's that they see thousands of people a year, with

815
00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:28,120
Speaker 1: each of them having very specific health problems, very specific

816
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:31,600
Speaker 1: maybe even mental health problems. There are hundreds of thousands

817
00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 1: of articles coming out each year about all those specific conditions.

818
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:39,480
Speaker 1: They can't necessarily keep up. But because this is impacting

819
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:44,280
Speaker 1: you and it's individual, you can and you can hopefully

820
00:50:44,280 --> 00:50:47,080
Speaker 1: be able to come into those appointments knowing a little

821
00:50:47,080 --> 00:50:49,960
Speaker 1: bit more, and not only can this lead the doctor

822
00:50:49,960 --> 00:50:51,560
Speaker 1: in the right direction, but also it can be really

823
00:50:51,560 --> 00:50:55,640
Speaker 1: empowering for you to be educated and having psycho education

824
00:50:55,800 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 1: around your symptoms and around what's happening in your brain

825
00:50:59,040 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 1: is actually research has shown a really powerful contributor to

826
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:08,000
Speaker 1: healing and to finding relief from OCD. Also, remember, if

827
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 1: you do access support and the first professional isn't the

828
00:51:11,200 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 1: right fit, you are actually totally allowed to say this

829
00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:17,200
Speaker 1: isn't working, and you are allowed to request or find

830
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:20,240
Speaker 1: someone new. You know, I did this my first person,

831
00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:24,719
Speaker 1: my first couple of people when I first got my diagnosis.

832
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:28,120
Speaker 1: They didn't really understand what was happening, and they kept

833
00:51:28,320 --> 00:51:30,880
Speaker 1: trying to guide me back to solutions for someone with

834
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:33,719
Speaker 1: a different type of OCD that wouldn't work for me.

835
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:36,600
Speaker 1: So I just asked to see someone else. It was

836
00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:39,160
Speaker 1: really uncomfortable, felt awkward, but I'm glad I did it

837
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,400
Speaker 1: because my mental health is more important than someone else's feelings,

838
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:46,640
Speaker 1: and about someone else's feelings about their job performance. You know,

839
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:50,360
Speaker 1: self advocacy it isn't about being confrontational. It's about not

840
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:53,200
Speaker 1: wasting your own time. It's about not putting your mental

841
00:51:53,239 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 1: health on the line for someone else to learn from

842
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:58,720
Speaker 1: or experiment with if they don't know what they're doing.

843
00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 1: And it's also about recognizing that you are the expert

844
00:52:02,600 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 1: of your own experience. You literally live with these thoughts

845
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:08,600
Speaker 1: every day. You have the right to informed, effective care

846
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:12,600
Speaker 1: and taking an active role I think really allows you

847
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:15,480
Speaker 1: to say this isn't right, this isn't working for me,

848
00:52:15,600 --> 00:52:18,799
Speaker 1: and ask for something better because you deserve it. I

849
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 1: think something else to say is that OCD is not

850
00:52:22,920 --> 00:52:26,920
Speaker 1: a one and done condition. Unfortunately, it is something that

851
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:31,440
Speaker 1: you have to continue managing and working with. Obviously it

852
00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:34,239
Speaker 1: gets easier over time, but this might be a long

853
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:37,480
Speaker 1: journey for you, So don't settle in with someone who

854
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:40,280
Speaker 1: isn't going to be a good companion on that journey.

855
00:52:40,520 --> 00:52:43,080
Speaker 1: Find someone who's going to be able to really meet

856
00:52:43,120 --> 00:52:44,960
Speaker 1: you where you're out in terms of a mental health professional,

857
00:52:45,040 --> 00:52:46,880
Speaker 1: it's going to be able to keep up to date

858
00:52:46,960 --> 00:52:49,480
Speaker 1: and really care about you and know what's going on

859
00:52:50,080 --> 00:52:55,279
Speaker 1: so that things do feel less sticky, things do feel easier. Okay,

860
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:58,520
Speaker 1: I'm going to quickly finish with some resources that I

861
00:52:58,600 --> 00:53:02,240
Speaker 1: personally think of really really helpful if you have OCD.

862
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:05,600
Speaker 1: These are resources that I have engaged with people that

863
00:53:05,640 --> 00:53:08,880
Speaker 1: I follow who I think really reduce some of the

864
00:53:08,920 --> 00:53:11,880
Speaker 1: stigma and just give you more information and help you

865
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:15,400
Speaker 1: be informed in like a medical context. The first is

866
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,960
Speaker 1: Zachary James. He is a UK creator. He runs the

867
00:53:19,560 --> 00:53:25,360
Speaker 1: I guess handle OCD Stigmatized on Instagram. I really really

868
00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:27,680
Speaker 1: love what this man does. I love how he talks

869
00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:30,040
Speaker 1: about his own experience. I love how he talks about

870
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:35,880
Speaker 1: upcoming research, about news story mentions of OCD, about elements

871
00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:39,080
Speaker 1: of it that people don't understand. So would really recommend him.

872
00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:43,120
Speaker 1: There's also another Instagram handles sush I guess service provider

873
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:47,120
Speaker 1: called Treat My OCD. I personally have never used their service,

874
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:51,000
Speaker 1: but I really like how they share information in a

875
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:54,000
Speaker 1: really succinct way. I also really like how they occasionally

876
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:58,160
Speaker 1: share stories of celebrities or public figures who have OCD,

877
00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:00,959
Speaker 1: who talk about it in interviews, use or talk about

878
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:04,320
Speaker 1: it on podcasts because I find hearing what other people

879
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:07,440
Speaker 1: are going through with this is such like an Oh,

880
00:54:07,560 --> 00:54:10,080
Speaker 1: it's so soothing when you're like, oh, thank god, I'm

881
00:54:10,080 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 1: not the only one. And often, you know, celebrities are

882
00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:14,960
Speaker 1: the ones who have the platform to talk about it.

883
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:19,719
Speaker 1: They recently shared some clips from Benny Blanco Pink Panthers

884
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:23,600
Speaker 1: about OCD. I did not know Pink Panthers has pure,

885
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 1: pure OCD, purely obsessional, and she was talking about it

886
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:29,719
Speaker 1: and I was like wow, Wow. It was this weird

887
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:31,120
Speaker 1: thing where I was like wow, I've never heard someone

888
00:54:31,120 --> 00:54:33,680
Speaker 1: talk about it that way. So that was like quite empowering.

889
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:36,520
Speaker 1: I never thought Pink Panthers would help me with my

890
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:40,440
Speaker 1: mental health, but there we go. And then a podcast,

891
00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:43,000
Speaker 1: a podcast that I think is exceptional called It's Not

892
00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:46,600
Speaker 1: What You Think. They share so many stories, they specialize

893
00:54:46,600 --> 00:54:49,360
Speaker 1: in only talking about OCD. They have such a brilliant

894
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:52,680
Speaker 1: approach to it. So I'll link all of these things

895
00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:55,160
Speaker 1: in the description below. I just think if you're looking

896
00:54:55,480 --> 00:54:58,600
Speaker 1: for some informed people and some cool stuff, that is

897
00:54:58,719 --> 00:55:01,520
Speaker 1: where you should go. But thank you so much. For listening.

898
00:55:01,880 --> 00:55:04,080
Speaker 1: If you have made it this far, leave a little

899
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:07,319
Speaker 1: yellow heart below. I don't know, I feel like it's

900
00:55:07,360 --> 00:55:10,440
Speaker 1: a nice I feel like that's a nice little symbol of

901
00:55:10,520 --> 00:55:15,319
Speaker 1: OCD awareness. Note that I'm really with you in this.

902
00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:18,920
Speaker 1: I imagine how hard it is for you to be

903
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:22,440
Speaker 1: dealing with this alone. But I have also dealt with

904
00:55:22,520 --> 00:55:27,799
Speaker 1: it alone, and it's gotten easier. And it's the more

905
00:55:27,840 --> 00:55:30,480
Speaker 1: I've learned, the more relief I feel. And so I

906
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:33,640
Speaker 1: really hope that you find that kind of calmness and

907
00:55:33,680 --> 00:55:36,560
Speaker 1: that peace and that stillness, and I believe you can.

908
00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:39,759
Speaker 1: So I'm sending you a lot of love in every

909
00:55:39,760 --> 00:55:44,080
Speaker 1: single one of your journeys with this very difficult disorder. Oh,

910
00:55:44,120 --> 00:55:46,439
Speaker 1: I know it's so cliche. No, you're not alone, though

911
00:55:46,480 --> 00:55:48,839
Speaker 1: it's gonna get better for you. There are people who

912
00:55:48,880 --> 00:55:52,359
Speaker 1: know a lot out there about this illness and can

913
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:55,040
Speaker 1: help you even if the first couple of people don't

914
00:55:55,040 --> 00:55:59,360
Speaker 1: know anything. Just be your own advocate, be brave, be courageous,

915
00:56:00,080 --> 00:56:02,000
Speaker 1: and I really am wishing you all the best. I

916
00:56:02,080 --> 00:56:04,680
Speaker 1: hope this episode has helped share it with someone that

917
00:56:04,719 --> 00:56:06,799
Speaker 1: you know who might also benefit from it. If you

918
00:56:06,840 --> 00:56:09,560
Speaker 1: think this was a good resource, make sure you're following

919
00:56:09,600 --> 00:56:12,839
Speaker 1: me on Instagram as well at that psychology podcast. I'd

920
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:16,320
Speaker 1: love to hear your stories or your own experiences with OCD,

921
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:19,600
Speaker 1: as I am still a little young and when it

922
00:56:19,640 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 1: comes to this condition and this disorder, and until next time,

923
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:25,960
Speaker 1: stay safe, be kind, be gentle to yourself, and sending

924
00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:28,719
Speaker 1: you so much love. Stay tuned for another episode. We

925
00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:29,959
Speaker 1: will talk very very soon.