WEBVTT - Keys to Preventing Future School Attacks 0:00:00.040 --> 0:00:03.600 You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and 0:00:03.680 --> 0:00:08.000 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Among the 0:00:08.000 --> 0:00:10.000 most read on the Bloomberg today is a story in 0:00:10.000 --> 0:00:12.400 the New York Times about and I'm reading from the 0:00:12.440 --> 0:00:15.320 story parents of students who are trapped inside rob Elementary 0:00:15.320 --> 0:00:18.079 School furiously argued with the police for not storming the 0:00:18.120 --> 0:00:22.240 school sooner, according to interviews with witnesses who was there 0:00:22.239 --> 0:00:25.599 on the day of the shooting. And so, of course 0:00:25.600 --> 0:00:29.280 we're talking about what happened earlier this week. We're trying 0:00:29.320 --> 0:00:31.360 not just to make sense of the tragedy but also 0:00:31.520 --> 0:00:34.599 understand where the United States can go from here. We've 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:37.640 got a great voice on this. Dr Marissa Randazzo is 0:00:37.760 --> 0:00:41.560 executive director of Threat Management at on Tick. She joins 0:00:41.600 --> 0:00:44.720 us this afternoon from Washington, d C. She's got a 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:47.360 great background serving with the U. S. Secret Service for 0:00:47.400 --> 0:00:51.240 a decade. She was the agency's chief Research psychologist assigned 0:00:51.240 --> 0:00:55.000 to the National Threat Assessment Center. Also co directed the 0:00:55.040 --> 0:00:57.760 Safe School Initiative, conducted jointly by the U. S. Secret 0:00:57.800 --> 0:01:01.320 Service in the US Department of Education. Dr Randazzo, it's 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:02.720 good to have you with us. I wish it were 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:07.920 under different circumstances. Um, we we're trying to understand how 0:01:08.360 --> 0:01:10.600 this type of thing can can be prevented. And we 0:01:11.280 --> 0:01:14.440 know what is happening politically right now. That's not what 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:16.560 we're going to talk about. But what we're gonna talk 0:01:16.600 --> 0:01:20.119 about is is real solutions here. And and you say 0:01:20.200 --> 0:01:24.680 it's possible to prevent school shootings, how well, it's absolutely 0:01:24.760 --> 0:01:27.360 possible to prevent school shootings. That I was part of 0:01:27.360 --> 0:01:30.880 a team that has been studying school shootings since the 0:01:30.959 --> 0:01:33.759 Columbine attack happened, and we actually went back twenty five 0:01:33.840 --> 0:01:36.680 years and the Secret Service has continued this research. And 0:01:36.880 --> 0:01:41.039 I just want to emphasize school shootings are preventable. We 0:01:41.080 --> 0:01:44.880 can prevent them because they are sought out and plan 0:01:45.000 --> 0:01:47.920 out in advance, and because the person who engages in 0:01:48.000 --> 0:01:51.960 that violence typically tells other people beforehand, so we stand 0:01:51.960 --> 0:01:54.560 a chance at hearing about someone who's planning for this 0:01:54.680 --> 0:01:58.400 type of horrific violence before they actually get to that point. 0:01:58.680 --> 0:02:02.600 And one other important pieces that people who carry out 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:06.480 and students who carry out school shootings in particular, typically 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:08.919 do it when they're at a point of feeling desperation. 0:02:09.000 --> 0:02:11.440 There at the end of their rope, that they may 0:02:11.520 --> 0:02:15.320 even be actively suicidal and they see no other way 0:02:15.360 --> 0:02:18.640 out of their problems. Um and and maybe really just 0:02:19.360 --> 0:02:22.400 looking to violence as the last solution or the best 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:26.840 solution to to to solve their problems and commit suicide 0:02:26.880 --> 0:02:31.200 at the same time. Often is the case. So the 0:02:31.240 --> 0:02:34.400 way we prevent this is typically by setting up threat 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:39.920 assessment teams and training lawn personal personnel, school personnel, and 0:02:40.000 --> 0:02:44.760 mental health professionals. In This process, known as behavioral threat assessment, 0:02:45.560 --> 0:02:47.400 was first of all by the Secret Service. It's been 0:02:47.440 --> 0:02:51.320 adapted for K twelve, it's been adapted for higher ED 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:55.160 and and even the Department of Defense is concluded this 0:02:55.240 --> 0:02:58.079 is exactly the tool that works best. It's our best 0:02:58.280 --> 0:03:01.000 hope going forward. I mean this else like being kind 0:03:01.040 --> 0:03:04.160 of an offensive offensive like being on the offense right 0:03:04.200 --> 0:03:08.560 looking for the problem areas are problem individuals. Why aren't 0:03:08.600 --> 0:03:10.560 we set up better? Is it just we still are 0:03:10.560 --> 0:03:13.480 in a society, even though in the pandemic we talk 0:03:13.600 --> 0:03:17.000 so much about well being, in mental wellness and you know, 0:03:17.240 --> 0:03:20.440 employers being more sympathetic the whole world kind of getting 0:03:20.480 --> 0:03:23.760 a better understanding of how it can impact everybody, or 0:03:23.800 --> 0:03:28.359 anyone um is it's just still society's lack of expertise 0:03:28.360 --> 0:03:30.440 and knowledge when it comes to mental well being and 0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:33.640 willing to kind of identify it, like, what is it 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:36.960 that we're not better about this? Well? I think I 0:03:37.000 --> 0:03:38.840 think that that's a big piece of it. And I 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:43.160 think the other thing that distracts us is that depression 0:03:43.560 --> 0:03:46.760 in in girls and women look different than a typically 0:03:46.760 --> 0:03:48.600 dozen boys and men were used to kind of a 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:52.480 Hollywood script of you're just withdrawing from activities, you're sleeping 0:03:52.520 --> 0:03:55.440 all day, you're eating a tub of ice cream. For 0:03:55.760 --> 0:04:00.640 boys and for men, clinical depression actually looks very active anger, 0:04:00.760 --> 0:04:05.000 it's trigger temper, it's rage, and we miss that. We 0:04:05.080 --> 0:04:09.360 miss it a school personnel, as law enforcement, pediatricians missed 0:04:09.440 --> 0:04:13.560 that as a possible symptom of clinical depression. It's part 0:04:13.560 --> 0:04:16.080 of what attracts some people to extremist ideas in the 0:04:16.120 --> 0:04:20.440 first place is feeling like the only legitimate expression of 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:23.440 their emotions is hatred. If they were to cry that 0:04:23.640 --> 0:04:25.760 we made fun of, But if they are angry and 0:04:25.960 --> 0:04:29.719 seizing and full of hate, then they're not made fun of. 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:32.200 So part of it is we have an opportunity if 0:04:32.200 --> 0:04:34.960 we know what to look for, especially employed young men. 0:04:35.160 --> 0:04:40.360 Miss I can't help but think that if these kids 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:43.719 did not have access to guns, these things wouldn't happen. 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:46.880 Because we have mental health issues in countries outside of 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:48.719 the United States where it is harder to get a gun, 0:04:48.920 --> 0:04:52.839 and we do not see mass shootings like this. That's 0:04:52.839 --> 0:04:54.760 absolutely the case. We can't deny the fact that the 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:57.200 US has really cornered the market on mass shootings. We 0:04:57.279 --> 0:05:01.440 have so many more than any other similar country with 0:05:01.560 --> 0:05:06.360 similar mental health problems, stressors, etcetera. Um. But I will 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:08.680 tell you, at the same time, I have been working 0:05:08.680 --> 0:05:12.320 in the field of threat assessment for over twenty five years. 0:05:12.680 --> 0:05:16.440 I've been doing research in different types of gun control 0:05:16.600 --> 0:05:20.200 for even longer than that, and and the sides haven't changed, 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:23.800 and the and the divisionness has has only worsened. So 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:25.560 what I want us to look at it what can 0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:28.800 we do right now? And what one thing we can 0:05:28.920 --> 0:05:33.720 do is state legislatures can actually enact these extreme risk 0:05:33.800 --> 0:05:36.920 protection orders. So I can't remember nineteen or twenty three 0:05:36.920 --> 0:05:41.680 states have them. It's a temporary order, a temporary restraining order, 0:05:41.760 --> 0:05:45.400 separating someone who is planning violence or maybe a risk 0:05:45.480 --> 0:05:49.840 to themselves from their weapons until they can be stabilized. 0:05:49.880 --> 0:05:52.160 So that's something we could actually take action on. Right 0:05:52.160 --> 0:05:55.280 we're talking about these red flag right um types of 0:05:55.520 --> 0:05:59.719 legislations or moves if you will, Hey, um, Dr Randaza 0:05:59.760 --> 0:06:00.960 will come back to you just a mount We're gonna 0:06:00.960 --> 0:06:02.080 do a little bit of news, but we're going to 0:06:02.120 --> 0:06:05.360 come back to Dr Marissa Randazzo. She's executive director of 0:06:05.400 --> 0:06:08.159 Threat Management at on Tick, joining us on the phone 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:11.200 from Washington, d C. You are listening to Bloomberg Business 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:14.280 Week Carl Master, Tim Stanovic, and this is Bloomberg Radio. 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:23.599 We're talking with Dr Marissa Randazzo. She is executive director 0:06:23.600 --> 0:06:25.560 of Threat Management and on Tick. They are a threat 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:28.880 assessment and management services company. She also served with the U. S. 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:32.000 Secret Service for a decade, most recently as the agency's 0:06:32.040 --> 0:06:35.320 chief Research Psychologist assigned to the National Threat Assessment Center. 0:06:35.520 --> 0:06:37.520 She's still with us on the phone from Washington, d C. 0:06:37.960 --> 0:06:41.880 Dr Randazzo, I am curious, first of all, after this 0:06:42.560 --> 0:06:44.680 shooting that we just got this week, and we've had 0:06:45.360 --> 0:06:49.360 a couple of shootings right in just a short time. Um, 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:52.560 you know, I am curious. Is your phone ringing off 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:54.719 the hook? Are people calling saying how do we deal 0:06:54.760 --> 0:06:58.560 with this? What do we do? What's our first step? Yeah, 0:06:58.600 --> 0:07:01.880 and actually, for anyone that has a threatening situation that 0:07:02.040 --> 0:07:03.520 there are a number of things that you can do. 0:07:03.600 --> 0:07:05.960 First and foremost, go ahead and call local law enforcement. 0:07:06.040 --> 0:07:08.520 Let them be aware of it. UM, if it is 0:07:08.520 --> 0:07:11.960 occurring in a school, from a student, from a parent, 0:07:12.040 --> 0:07:15.000 wherever it's occurring, you can find out if that school 0:07:15.040 --> 0:07:17.960 has a threat assessment team. If your workplace may well 0:07:18.000 --> 0:07:22.320 have a threat assessment team or a workplace violence prevention team. 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:24.960 These are teams that are trained to handle these situations 0:07:25.160 --> 0:07:28.280 or to call in outside experts who have the ability 0:07:28.280 --> 0:07:31.360 to handle those situations. But something that's important to know 0:07:31.480 --> 0:07:35.320 is when we get a series of these news grabbing, 0:07:35.520 --> 0:07:42.080 high profile events, these horrific acts, it oftentimes prompts an 0:07:42.080 --> 0:07:45.680 influx of more more threats coming in. For for a 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:48.960 couple of different reasons. One, sometimes hearing something like this 0:07:49.840 --> 0:07:52.760 news about it destabilizes people who are kind of barely 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:55.920 keeping things together and may feel like, well, now that's 0:07:55.920 --> 0:07:58.520 a way out for me. I'm also suicidal and I 0:07:58.560 --> 0:08:01.240 could I could get some variety at the same time. 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:05.640 For example, UM, it also tends to lower people's threshold 0:08:05.720 --> 0:08:09.280 for reporting. So a coworker who may have been worried 0:08:09.320 --> 0:08:12.160 about some behavior they've seen in the workplace may now 0:08:12.200 --> 0:08:14.560 be much more inclined to bring that forward to their 0:08:14.680 --> 0:08:17.720 HR department, to their corporate security department to let them 0:08:17.720 --> 0:08:20.520 know about their concerns. So people on the receiving end 0:08:20.560 --> 0:08:24.840 THREAD Assessment team security law enforcement are likely going to 0:08:24.880 --> 0:08:28.000 see an uptick in those threats coming in, both because 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:31.400 maybe more threatening behavior is occurrent, but coast so largely 0:08:31.440 --> 0:08:33.719 because people who are much more inclined. I don't want 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:35.679 this to happen to me. I've been worried about this 0:08:35.760 --> 0:08:37.600 situation for a while, and now I'm going to tell 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:40.880 someone the doctor random I'm wondering, what you know. I 0:08:40.920 --> 0:08:42.640 think a lot of people are turning to lawmakers right 0:08:42.679 --> 0:08:44.960 now to see what Congress can do to try to 0:08:45.280 --> 0:08:47.240 create laws that will prevent this. What would you like 0:08:47.320 --> 0:08:51.760 lawmakers to do so? On my wish list, first and foremost, 0:08:51.920 --> 0:08:54.839 I want to get THREAD Assessment training training on how 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:58.840 to do these threat investigations. Every local police department and 0:08:58.960 --> 0:09:03.280 shariff's office in the country. Federal law enforcement typically gets 0:09:03.360 --> 0:09:06.960 this training, local law enforcement often does not, and yet 0:09:07.040 --> 0:09:10.200 this is where the threats are being reported. We heard 0:09:11.040 --> 0:09:14.360 years after the Sandy Hook shooting, when the FBI finally 0:09:14.400 --> 0:09:18.640 released their full analysis, we heard that the shooter in 0:09:18.679 --> 0:09:21.480 the in the at Sandy Hook Elementary had threatened to 0:09:21.480 --> 0:09:23.920 do exactly what he ends up doing. It was reported 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:26.280 to local law enforcement, and they didn't think there was 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:29.480 anything they could do. They didn't have this type of training. 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:32.959 So first and foremost, I want to start yesterday and 0:09:33.040 --> 0:09:37.400 get threat assessment training, threat investigations training to every police 0:09:37.440 --> 0:09:40.760 department and sheriff's office in the country. Congress can make 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:44.200 that happen. Just got about a minute or so left here. 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:46.840 We are curious about the time you spent in the 0:09:46.920 --> 0:09:51.000 Secret Service and what that was like and how that 0:09:51.120 --> 0:09:53.880 kind of makes you think about what threats are, what 0:09:53.960 --> 0:09:57.280 realistic threats are, um how that kind of has affected 0:09:57.280 --> 0:09:59.080 your thinking. And again, just got about a minute or so. 0:10:00.640 --> 0:10:03.240 It was a wonderful experience, in large part because it 0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:07.200 showed me firsthand how much we can prevent acts of violence, 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:09.760 and often in ways that we don't expect. The Secret 0:10:09.760 --> 0:10:13.599 Service agents handling active threat cases people threatening to assassinate 0:10:13.960 --> 0:10:17.199 often worked more like social workers to connect with that 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:20.640 would be assassin to find out what the underlying problem is, 0:10:20.880 --> 0:10:23.440 to give them off that pathway to violence and and 0:10:23.480 --> 0:10:27.160 really establish a relationships to get them into care and support. 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:30.080 Was fascinating to watch an incredible mission that they are 0:10:30.120 --> 0:10:34.280 part of. Well so enlightening to have you joined us 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:36.199 and talk about what we can do and what can 0:10:36.240 --> 0:10:38.880 be done to really prevent school shooting, something that unfortunately 0:10:38.880 --> 0:10:41.760 just seems to be a lot more frequent, uh than 0:10:41.800 --> 0:10:44.800 we then should be. It shouldn't be happening at all 0:10:44.840 --> 0:10:47.760 in our society, um, Dr Randazzo, thank you so much. 0:10:47.840 --> 0:10:50.920 Dr Marissa Randazzo, Executive director of Threat Management and ANTICK. 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:54.000 As I mentioned, they are a threat assessment and management 0:10:54.080 --> 0:10:56.200 services company and she was joining us on the phone 0:10:56.200 --> 0:10:57.079 from Washington, d C.