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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discuss the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds. And President Joe Biden said Trump didn't

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Speaker 1: build a damn thing. Even though it's Infrastructure Week. We

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Speaker 1: have such a fantastic show today. Congressman Maxwell Frost joins

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Speaker 1: us to talk about.

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Speaker 2: How Republicans want to shut down the government.

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Speaker 1: Then we'll talk to tpm's Josh Marshall about President Biden's

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Speaker 1: lowering of drug prices. But first we have the host

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Speaker 1: of the Time of Monsters the Nations, Jeet here. Welcome

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Speaker 1: to Fast Politics, Geet here, good to be here. So

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Speaker 1: let's talk about we're back. The holiday is over, the

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Speaker 1: summer is over, Congress is coming back, and they have

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Speaker 1: a very ambitious agenda which involves doing everything they can.

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Speaker 2: To danger they're endangered. Republican Congress people discuss.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it is sort of strange that it looks like

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Speaker 3: they're going ahead with impeaching Biden, And on one level,

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Speaker 3: kind of makes sense that if you don't really have

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Speaker 3: an agenda you can pass, and you have a fractured caucus,

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Speaker 3: maybe one way to hold it together is to unify

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Speaker 3: against an enemy. On another level, it doesn't make sense

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Speaker 3: because there is like roughly eighteen or so seats where

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Speaker 3: Biden won, and I don't think there are people who

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Speaker 3: are whating in those seats who are Biden one end,

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Speaker 3: they have a Republican representative. But I don't think in

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Speaker 3: those seats they're going to like cutting up to the

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Speaker 3: idea that that Biden should be impeached because his son

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Speaker 3: Hunter has a giant hog. Then it seems like I

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Speaker 3: don't think anything in the Constitution that justifies I mean.

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Speaker 1: I'm excited about this impeachment because I mean you ask

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Speaker 1: them like, well, why do you guys want to impeach Biden?

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Speaker 1: And they're like the border fent and all Hunter something

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Speaker 1: I saw on Fox News.

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Speaker 3: That's it. That's it, right, Yeah, I mean it is

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Speaker 3: a sort of a politics theater. And I mean in

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Speaker 3: some ways, the Congress has become a sort of branch

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Speaker 3: of Fox News. I mean, has a sort of symbiotic

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Speaker 3: relationship of right.

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Speaker 2: I think that's really true.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, where the hosts and the parasite have become one.

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Speaker 3: I mean basically, like every Republican congressman like they're dream,

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Speaker 3: they're fantasy. What they live for is to go on Fox,

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Speaker 3: and they're also watching Fox all the time and getting

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Speaker 3: their perception and reality from Fox, and so yeah, it

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Speaker 3: leads to the kind of absurdity that we're seeing now.

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Speaker 2: It is true.

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Speaker 1: I want to get back to this idea that like

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Speaker 1: the Republican Party now is just the congressional Republicans are

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Speaker 1: so Fox News, ad Jason, that they are actually like

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Speaker 1: part of Fox News. And I think about your friend

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Speaker 1: of mine, Trey Gowdie, who is neither your friend nor mine,

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Speaker 1: but who is on Fox News and who sort of

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Speaker 1: shot to prominence using Benghazi to get himself a job

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Speaker 1: at Fox News, And like, I think about that because

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Speaker 1: when you watch Fox News, you know, it's sort of

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Speaker 1: a revolving door of the craziest. And what I think

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Speaker 1: is interesting about Fox News, which I think is also

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Speaker 1: something we've seen with small dollar donations in the Republican Party,

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Speaker 1: is that they incentivize crazy discuss.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. No, absolutely, I mean I think one way to

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Speaker 3: maybe think about this is the lack of any sort

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Speaker 3: of like governing agenda. And I mean they have things

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Speaker 3: that they want which are wildly unpopular, not to privatize medicare,

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Speaker 3: it's social security. Whereas I think that if they if

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Speaker 3: you do sort of Benghazi type politics poll tics of

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Speaker 3: pseudo scandal, like it's a way of riling up the

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Speaker 3: base without actually having to make the kind of difficult

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Speaker 3: decisions that you need to make about like taxes and spending.

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Speaker 3: I sort of see this as partially a flight from responsibility.

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Speaker 3: It's also, oh, I think sort of tied in with

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Speaker 3: the sort of gerrymandering or the regional sorting that like

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Speaker 3: Fox is on a grand scheme of things, a niche network,

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Speaker 3: like at the best of times getting three four million viewers,

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Speaker 3: but the niche that watches it is the hardcore Republican

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Speaker 3: base people. You need to get out there to win primaries,

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Speaker 3: and you need to be sending you like twenty bucks

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Speaker 3: a month if you want to be viable. And just

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Speaker 3: as like sort of Reroblicans have become a minority party,

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Speaker 3: like they're trying to game the system so they can

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Speaker 3: govern both in Congress, the Senate and the presidency with

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Speaker 3: a minority of the vote. They sort of made this

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Speaker 3: alliance with a kind of like you know, minority network, right,

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Speaker 3: They're not like they're not like cv AS or ABC,

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Speaker 3: which themselves are kind of not what they once were

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Speaker 3: like when we were kids in the seventies and eighties,

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Speaker 3: where everyone watches those networks. So it is a sort

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Speaker 3: of politics of niche casting.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a really good point. I would

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Speaker 1: also add that it's partially this sort of knee she thing.

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Speaker 1: But I do think like this idea that they have

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Speaker 1: these wildly unpopular ideas and that the Republican Party has

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Speaker 1: really run out of ideas, I think is really important.

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Speaker 1: And when we talk about this Republican Party and the

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Speaker 1: sort of like way they've gotten themselves into this, it

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Speaker 1: was like one of the reasons why Trump won. If

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Speaker 1: we have to go back I would love to never

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Speaker 1: say that sentence again. One of the reasons why Trump won.

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Speaker 1: But one of the reasons why Trump won was because

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Speaker 1: he introduced some popular ideas, right, Like he said, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna punish China for taking away your jobs, right because

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Speaker 1: there were places where people had lost jobs because of

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Speaker 1: factories had moved to Asia or wherever, and so he

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Speaker 1: was sort of like, I'm going to be your vengeance, right,

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Speaker 1: He's I'm going to.

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Speaker 2: Get back at globalization for whatever.

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Speaker 1: And so I do think like those few ideas that

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Speaker 1: were at least pop you list were in some ways

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Speaker 1: like the first time that party has ever offered anything,

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Speaker 1: not the first, but one of the very few times

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Speaker 1: when that party has offered it, because I mean think

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Speaker 1: about like lower taxes for businesses, I mean, who is

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Speaker 1: that for besides rich people?

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Speaker 3: Absolutely? And then one side in like your twenty sixty

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Speaker 3: nine years service seeing it now where like Trump was

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Speaker 3: the guy who was saying like I'm not going to

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Speaker 3: cut Medicare and Social Security? Who wants to do that?

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Speaker 3: And even his critique ab Obamacare is kind of interesting

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Speaker 3: that he lied, right, Like he basically to say something

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Speaker 3: that's extremely popular, like well, Obamacare is out working, and

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Speaker 3: I'll get you what Obamacare has but better, right, and

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Speaker 3: how will you do that? I'll make a deal right now.

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Speaker 3: On the one level, obviously a grift care at a

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Speaker 3: combat But that's very different than the standard Republican message,

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Speaker 3: which is like you get nothing right, We're gonna think

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Speaker 3: this these things away from you. And it's interesting, I

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Speaker 3: mean at the other remocns. I mean, this is there's

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Speaker 3: many reasons why he's gonna be the nominee, but one

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Speaker 3: of them is that, like if you look at the

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Speaker 3: other people the alternative that they're offering is like sort

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Speaker 3: of a return to austerity, right, like both like you know,

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Speaker 3: Nicki Haley and the sad as, they're all saying like

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Speaker 3: we gotta raise right, and that's really striking, Like Nicki

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Speaker 3: Haley is the reasonable saying Republican. She says, well, people

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Speaker 3: are living longer, that's.

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Speaker 2: Not we got to pay for this.

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Speaker 1: Well, luckily for Trump because of his incredible COVID response

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Speaker 1: and the anti vax stuff, people are actually.

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Speaker 2: Not living longer the good news. Yeah yeah, and at

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Speaker 2: least in America.

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Speaker 3: At a time where like life expected to see in

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Speaker 3: America is going down. She wants to raise retirement age,

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Speaker 3: which means like literally like youn have like just a

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Speaker 3: butch smaller period of retimerity if she gets her way,

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Speaker 3: and like I'm looking at them, like if the alternative

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Speaker 3: is between that and Trump, who says he wants to

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Speaker 3: want yeah, yeah, yeah, I have you ice cream and

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Speaker 3: that won't make you bad, Like could have all the

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Speaker 3: sex you want without venereal disease, like just gonna like

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Speaker 3: apaily like high in the sky. But that's still more

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Speaker 3: attractive than saying like you gotta work till you die.

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Speaker 2: Right, right, right, which might be soon.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the thing I feel like the greatest trick

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Speaker 1: the Republican Party ever played was not somehow being blamed

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Speaker 1: for lowering the life expectancy in America. I mean, you

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Speaker 1: have a party of anti vaxxers, right who have basically

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Speaker 1: said that all public health messaging is wrong and that

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Speaker 1: people should be taking or Steve warmers, and those people

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Speaker 1: are not blamed for lowering and then like, surprise, surprise,

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Speaker 1: the American life expectancy goes down, and it's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: we can't blame those guys. I mean I think you should.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, no, absolutely, I'd get to some more vigorous

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Speaker 3: opposition party that would do that. But I mean there's

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Speaker 3: obviously not what we have, but still, yeah, I have

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Speaker 3: the policies that they have, like the actual policies up

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Speaker 3: like Trump's pilots guy stuff. Actual policies that they have

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Speaker 3: are just like wildly unpopular because they're basically like, let's

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Speaker 3: give more money to Uncle Scrooge and Richie Rich and

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Speaker 3: Tiburn's and everyone else. All you Homer Simpsons out there,

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Speaker 3: you gotta work till you die. Like I would think

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Speaker 3: that's a hard sell. So what's the alternative, Like it's like, oh, well,

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Speaker 3: like Hunter Bidens, he's doing shady stuff, and the immigrants

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Speaker 3: are crossing the border. There's a border crisis. These scandals

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Speaker 3: at least have moret at least they have the appeal

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Speaker 3: that you're not telling people that work till they die. Right,

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Speaker 3: that's a better message all things considered.

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Speaker 1: Right, I mean, that's the work till you die message.

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Speaker 1: Seems like not a winner. But again, I mean, I

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Speaker 1: just this Republican Party. I mean, I don't want to

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Speaker 1: talk about the GOP debate again because I think we

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Speaker 1: have another one coming up and it's just going to

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Speaker 1: be we're in this, like, I mean, the debate without

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Speaker 1: the front runner.

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Speaker 2: I just think is kind of a meaningless matrix.

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Speaker 1: But I do I think it's ultimately kind of like

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Speaker 1: we are finding ourselves with the Republican Party that has

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Speaker 1: no ideas, right, it has these unpopular ideas, or it

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Speaker 1: has these trumpy ideas. I think the thing that I'm

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Speaker 1: a little bit interested in besides this Republican Party's problem

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Speaker 1: is that there is a pretty interesting moment in American

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Speaker 1: media right now which is a sort of underreported story,

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Speaker 1: which is this idea that like a lot of us

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Speaker 1: are pre depressed about the idea of having to do

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty over again discuss.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not great. I mean it looks like it's

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Speaker 3: shaping up to be Biden and Trump. Having said that

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Speaker 3: anything could happen, right, especially out of Trump and all

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Speaker 3: these criminal cases, you got to think his health is

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Speaker 3: not that great. But if it is Trump versus Biden,

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Speaker 3: you feel like you're trumped in an endless loop, right,

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Speaker 3: Like this is groundhog Day, but not fun at least

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Speaker 3: Bill Verry in grandagg Day, you got to improve himself

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Speaker 3: and he came better and escaped the loop. But like

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Speaker 3: I imagine a groundhog Day where it's actually like actually

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Speaker 3: things are getting worse and where you're reading yourself and

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Speaker 3: it's getting worse and worse, and like in terms of psychology,

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Speaker 3: I mean that is actually a bad mental health state

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Speaker 3: to be in that sort of repetition compulsion, right, like

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Speaker 3: where you have to do yet another I get speak

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Speaker 3: for myself. I tried not to write about Trump because

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Speaker 3: I just feel like I've sort of had my say

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Speaker 3: and don't occupy the mental space where you have to

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Speaker 3: be thinking about Trump and thinking about this like really monster,

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Speaker 3: not just monstrous. Like he's not an interesting monster like Dracula, Right,

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Speaker 3: He's just like this mean, petty, nasty little man. And

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Speaker 3: like the fact that we have to be thinking about

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Speaker 3: him is very depressing. And conversely, like, I mean, I

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Speaker 3: think Biden has done a lot of good stuff. I mean,

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Speaker 3: I think there's a serious argument if you've made that

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Speaker 3: Biden is the best Democratic president on domestic policy, says

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Speaker 3: like Linda Johnson, And he doesn't have the Vietnam War,

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Speaker 3: which just makes it even better.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, I'll go along with you on this.

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Speaker 1: Like one of the things that I think is really

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Speaker 1: important to talk about is like last week Biden started

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Speaker 1: this prescription drug negotiation, which is the first time any

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Speaker 1: president has done it since Medicare part dy right number one.

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Speaker 1: Then we had this bilateral South Korea Japan meeting at

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Speaker 1: Camp David the week before. I mean, the man is

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Speaker 1: doing a lot of stuff. It's just that all we

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Speaker 1: hear about is Desantus refusing to meet with him in Florida.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, that's right. I don't know like how Biden

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Speaker 3: can overcome that sort of grip hold. I mean, it's

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Speaker 3: part of the same story we're talking about how like

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Speaker 3: Fox News and the GOP of breached as what and

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Speaker 3: if that's the case, then Fox News is also setting

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Speaker 3: the agenda for the rest of the media because if

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Speaker 3: he has to pay attention to what the GOP's doing,

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Speaker 3: he's one of the major parties. It is a real problem.

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Speaker 3: I would say Biden has done a lot of great stuff.

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Speaker 3: Whether I don't know, it's really his decision, and the

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Speaker 3: party has decided like there's no one serious that's running

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Speaker 3: against him, so there's nothing really no one could do.

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Speaker 3: I would have actually thought that they could have gone

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Speaker 3: a different way and just said by I was the

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Speaker 3: guy who came in to defeat Trump, and now that

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Speaker 3: I've done that, you know, the party can move on

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Speaker 3: and we have to go in new direction because I

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Speaker 3: actually think that the party has a lot of really

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Speaker 3: good people. People are more kind of able to engage

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Speaker 3: with the times.

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Speaker 1: I mean, okay, so let's talk about this, because I

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Speaker 1: feel like this is a very common conversation that I

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Speaker 1: hear a lot with Democrats is like Biden is old,

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Speaker 1: we should have someone else, and like, I want to

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Speaker 1: talk about this because I feel like, again, if you

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Speaker 1: were running against Ron de Santis, you could say for sure,

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Speaker 1: Ron De Santis is forty four years old. Biden is eighty.

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Speaker 1: Not cool, but Biden is eighty. Trump is seventy seven.

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Speaker 1: Biden defeated Trump before and again, like, yes, I agree,

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Speaker 1: there is certainly a case to be made that he's

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Speaker 1: too old. But from what I understand, right, he thought

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Speaker 1: and again this is not sort of my sense of

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Speaker 1: the case, and this is sort of my own suppositions,

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Speaker 1: but my sense is that he felt that he was

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Speaker 1: the most likely to be able to defeat another old

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Speaker 1: white guy again. And remember the power of incumbency is humongous.

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Speaker 3: It is true, that's true.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it is incalculable.

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Speaker 1: And then the other thing is that we have these

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Speaker 1: polls like this poll today, this Washington Post poll, fifteen

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Speaker 1: hundred people, six hundred of those polled were registered Republicans.

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Speaker 2: It is a poll by Trump's favorite polster, Fabrizio. And again,

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Speaker 2: is it an accurate poll? I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's a poll that asks is Biden too old?

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Speaker 1: And that poll which is more than a third registered Republicans,

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Speaker 1: which is Trump's base, and they're not even registered Republicans.

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Speaker 1: They are primary voting Republicans, right, so they are the

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Speaker 1: real Trumpey base. They you say Biden is too old,

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Speaker 1: but Trump is not too old, So.

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Speaker 2: Like do with that what you will?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know. I mean I think that Trump's

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Speaker 3: baggage is so much greater than anything Biden has. I

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Speaker 3: think that, like if it does come down to a

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Speaker 3: Biden Trump thing, I think like aside from that GOP base,

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Speaker 3: I don't think Trump gets the independence. I don't think

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Speaker 3: anyone wants to go back who's not a hardcore Republican

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Speaker 3: wants to go back to those Trump years. So I'm

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Speaker 3: not that worried about Biden. And to be honest, like

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Speaker 3: I know you're very sort of do me pessimistic. I

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Speaker 3: think the Democrats are in good shape. More broadly, like

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Speaker 3: I keep seeing all these special elections, and like you know,

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Speaker 3: Democrats keep overperforming, like you know, what their base should be,

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Speaker 3: and especially they're overperforming what they're doing like with a

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Speaker 3: Democrat as a president. Right, but we should normally like

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Speaker 3: bring out the root against and Democrats would be complacent

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Speaker 3: to stay. Oh, but that's not happening, and it's not

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Speaker 3: happening even like in Iowa. Right, So I think we

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Speaker 3: would make a mistake to under some how motivated the

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Speaker 3: Democrats are, And I think they're motivated in a very

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Speaker 3: good way. They're not motivated a cultu personality way like

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Speaker 3: Trump or death. Nobody's saying Biden or death. They're motivated

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Speaker 3: by like an actual political agenda and buy an awareness

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Speaker 3: that their party is what stands between America and the abyss.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's true.

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Speaker 1: Again, there are a lot of things to happen in

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Speaker 1: these four hundred days, and I think that we have

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Speaker 1: what's four hundred days.

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Speaker 2: November will be a year until this fucking election, So I.

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Speaker 1: Mean, we do know that, like this is very early

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Speaker 1: to sort of get quarterbacking. But it does certainly seem

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Speaker 1: like since this trumpy Supreme Court overturned Row, they really

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Speaker 1: have caught the car and made Americans very mad at

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Speaker 1: them in ways I don't think they thought would happen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, No, absolutely, Yeah. And that's the other thing at

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Speaker 3: Dobbs effect. And then more broadly, I mean, I think

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Speaker 3: that dobs have back is interestingly interacting with the fact

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Speaker 3: that the GOP has decided to react to the fact

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Speaker 3: that they've enraged fifty percent of the population by saying, like, well,

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Speaker 3: we're just going to keep like pushing their buttons and

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Speaker 3: going even farther. So if you look at like all

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Speaker 3: the stuff, like the Republican media types are saying, like

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Speaker 3: so much of it is sort of baiting single women, right,

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Speaker 3: saying that like single women, these cat ladies, these losers,

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Speaker 3: they're bad for America. I shouldn't even have the vote,

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Speaker 3: and like I'm thinking, like, okay, okay, we took away

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Speaker 3: their fundamental constitution, right, and we're going to keep badgering them.

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Speaker 3: Like that's a pretty good formula, bir like getting out

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Speaker 3: the voters that hate you the most and making sure

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Speaker 3: that they will show up. So thank you, right wing media,

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Speaker 3: I salute your service.

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Speaker 1: Well it is, and it's funny because it's like one

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Speaker 1: of the sort of over reported tropes of this summer

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Speaker 1: was this idea that single women or younger women actually

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Speaker 1: saved the economy this summer because you had this block

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Speaker 1: combuster feminist movie, Barbie. If you don't think it was feminist,

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Speaker 1: don't send me a message telling me you don't think

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Speaker 1: it was feminist. I think it was feminist period paragraph

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Speaker 1: And I'm sorry if you don't think it was feminist.

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Speaker 1: I'm speaking to the people who are gonna yell at

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Speaker 1: me about this. This was the summer of women saving

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Speaker 1: the economy. These three young women, Beyonce, Taylor Swift and

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Speaker 1: Greta Garwegg are responsible for keeping America out of recession.

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Speaker 1: So there is a sense in which do you target

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Speaker 1: these women at your own peril?

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Speaker 4: No?

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, Yeah, yeah, I'm like again, this sort of strategy

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Speaker 3: of badgering and harassing the people that hate you the most,

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Speaker 3: and Vicky sure that they understand everything that they could

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Speaker 3: lose if you stay in power. Like to me, that

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Speaker 3: doesn't seem like the smartest thing. But oh, I'm the

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Speaker 3: guy who also thought that it's a bad idea to

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Speaker 3: have like policies that kill off your base. Like, I'm

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Speaker 3: just the very simple person. I don't have the strategic genius.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a simple Canadian man. Geet here. I hope you

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Speaker 2: will come back.

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Speaker 3: I will always come back. I will never leave. You

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Speaker 3: will just stuck with me for life.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 5: Good.

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Speaker 1: Congressman Maxwell Frost represents Florida's tenth district. Welcome back to

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Speaker 1: Fast Politics, Congressman Maxwell.

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Speaker 3: Frost, thank you so much for having me on.

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Speaker 1: We're so excited to have you on, because first I

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Speaker 1: want to talk to you about being back in Congress

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Speaker 1: now with what we know Republicans are planning.

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Speaker 2: What is happening?

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Speaker 4: Well, that's a really good question. It seems like not

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Speaker 4: many people have the answer. It's interesting because ever since

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Speaker 4: I before I got sworn in, find myself going to

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Speaker 4: members who have been there for a while, who have experience,

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Speaker 4: ask them questions, Hey, what the hell is going on?

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Speaker 3: And most of the time I met with I don't know.

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Speaker 4: This hasn't never happened before, from when we couldn't elect

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Speaker 4: a speaker to when the government was held hostage with

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Speaker 4: the debt ceiling to now we're about to get into

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Speaker 4: the budget season here and we have members of the

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Speaker 4: ass representatives who are saying, hey, you know what, we're

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Speaker 4: not going to vote on the budget of this country,

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Speaker 4: the paramount job of Congress unless we can vote to

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Speaker 4: impeach Joe Biden for winning the presidency. And that's what

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Speaker 4: we're up again. So I don't really know what's going on. Well,

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Speaker 4: I mean it's we'll see, you know. The It's really unfortunate.

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Speaker 4: It's hard because it's not just like, oh, we're dealing

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Speaker 4: with people we disagree with. We're dealing with conservatives kind

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Speaker 4: of thing. That's part of it. The biggest part here

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Speaker 4: is we're dealing with people who want to see chaos,

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Speaker 4: like they will manufacture a bomb threatened to detonate it

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Speaker 4: unless we do what they say. And oh also half

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Speaker 4: of them actually kind of want to push the button,

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Speaker 4: like they're curious to see what would happen.

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Speaker 3: And that's what we're dealing with.

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Speaker 2: It's interesting.

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Speaker 1: I'm really glad you talked about this sort of unprecedentedness

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Speaker 1: because it really is. This marthy Congress is really sort

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Speaker 1: of the lunatics for running the asylum and every time

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Speaker 1: McCarthy is able to I mean a lot of this

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Speaker 1: is meant to be payback for the debt ceiling.

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Speaker 2: Right, So the.

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Speaker 1: Far right had decided they were going to use the

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Speaker 1: dead ceiling to ruin the full faith and credit of

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Speaker 1: the United States in the hopes of destroying the Biden presidency.

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Speaker 1: That didn't happen, and now they have blamed Kevin McCarthy.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, no, exactly. And the other thing too is Kevin

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Speaker 4: McCarthy is the weakest speaker probably in.

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Speaker 3: The history of our right.

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Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, personally like him, I would argue him

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Speaker 4: as a leader he's weak, but also just he's given

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Speaker 4: up a lot of the institutional power that the speaker

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Speaker 4: usually has because he was held hostage by members of

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Speaker 4: his own caucus. And so these folks, I would argue

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Speaker 4: to say, they're not bluffing a lot of the time.

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Speaker 3: I mean they hold the.

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Speaker 4: Tools that they were able to get. And so you're right,

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Speaker 4: the speakers at a very tough spot. We can get

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Speaker 4: into this and we'll see how many more Freedom Caucus

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Speaker 4: members come up and say, hey, it's either a featured

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Speaker 4: voter or no budget. And the Speaker will have well

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Speaker 4: three options. One, he'll have to come to Leader Hawk

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Speaker 4: Kim Jeffries and ask for Democratic votes. If that happens,

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Speaker 4: Hakim Jefferies isn't just going to say, all right, here's

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Speaker 4: some modern members, right, I mean, we're going to need

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Speaker 4: some concessions in this budget and we're gonna get some

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Speaker 4: stuff out of it. But the problem is if the

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Speaker 4: Speaker does that, the next day, he'll probably wake up

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Speaker 4: with a motion to vacate the chair out there and

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Speaker 4: Democrats will vote with the Freedom Caucus on that. The

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Speaker 4: other option is he moves forward and impeachment vote an inquiry,

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Speaker 4: which I personally believe in many people would believe would

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Speaker 4: really politically harm their Republican Party as we get into

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty four. Or he can get his people in

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Speaker 4: line and we can and they can pass it. I

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Speaker 4: think that's the least likely thing to happen.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's like we shouldn't be laughing because these

434
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,199
Speaker 1: people really do want to destroy the federal government, Like

435
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:07,720
Speaker 1: that is the goal, Like make it so that retirees

436
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:11,320
Speaker 1: don't get their checks, make it so that your roads

437
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,000
Speaker 1: don't get paved, and your public schools don't get books.

438
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:17,360
Speaker 1: And I mean this is a very dark vision they

439
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:21,160
Speaker 1: have for this country. But they are morons, thank god.

440
00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:22,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.

441
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 4: I mean it's I go between laughing about it, crying

442
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:28,199
Speaker 4: about it, and feeling them about it.

443
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 3: And I'm sure everybody has a similar thing. It's just

444
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:33,320
Speaker 3: hard to figure out how to respond to it.

445
00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:36,760
Speaker 4: Because you're right, I mean, they have no problem with

446
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 4: blowing everything up in the federal government because they don't

447
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,200
Speaker 4: believe that government can be a force for good. They

448
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:45,280
Speaker 4: are in it to destroy it. And I'm not making

449
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:47,159
Speaker 4: this up. I'm not just like saying this for the

450
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:50,160
Speaker 4: podcast giggles and laughs, like they literally say this all

451
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 4: the time. And so it's hard to figure out how

452
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:55,160
Speaker 4: to deal with folks like that when there isn't really

453
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,560
Speaker 4: a north star, right, there's not like a policy goal here.

454
00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:01,240
Speaker 4: It's just let's blow it up and resist for the

455
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,119
Speaker 4: sake of resistance. And it makes it difficult to speculate

456
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 4: all what can happen. It makes it difficult to strategize

457
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 4: on how to deal with it. You kind of have

458
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:11,399
Speaker 4: to just do your best and hope and pray that

459
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,000
Speaker 4: they don't actually use the tools that they were able

460
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:17,120
Speaker 4: to get to really destroy a lot of the hard

461
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 4: work that so many people have done for generations. And

462
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:21,880
Speaker 4: we have to work at these elections to get these

463
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:22,920
Speaker 4: people out of office.

464
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:26,120
Speaker 1: So history, if we were to look back at history,

465
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 1: says that the party that shuts down the government for

466
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:33,679
Speaker 1: no reason tends to get punished. Kevin McCarthy the United

467
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:36,960
Speaker 1: States of amnesia. He has not seen history. So in

468
00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 1: some ways, I mean, they have a five seat majority.

469
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:45,840
Speaker 1: There are numerous Republicans sitting in Biden districts. I mean,

470
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:50,800
Speaker 1: this does seem like Kevin McCarthy's last best plan to

471
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:52,520
Speaker 1: give the House to Democrats.

472
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, I one hundred percent agree with you on this,

473
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:57,639
Speaker 4: and I mean, I think it's twofold. I think at

474
00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:01,199
Speaker 4: number one, it does have consequence for the next election.

475
00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:05,359
Speaker 4: I will say I do believe that it's important we

476
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:08,560
Speaker 4: always remember that not just voters, but just people have

477
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:11,480
Speaker 4: kind of short attention spans. We tend to forget things

478
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:15,040
Speaker 4: and move on pretty quickly. And a government shutdown is

479
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:18,159
Speaker 4: interesting because it is very bad and it impacts a

480
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,560
Speaker 4: lot of people. For the average person, though a lot

481
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:25,520
Speaker 4: of times they won't feel like a material chain. And

482
00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 4: I think because of that, and because it's it just

483
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 4: happens all the time now and it's always hyped up,

484
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:33,760
Speaker 4: I think a lot of people are becoming a little

485
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 4: bit more known to what a government shutdown.

486
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:35,959
Speaker 3: I think.

487
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:37,920
Speaker 4: I think that's part of the reason why when we

488
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:41,120
Speaker 4: were knocking doors during the debt ceiling debate, we'd hear

489
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 4: a lot of outrage of concern from our prime voters.

490
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:46,320
Speaker 4: Right like I could look in van, I could look

491
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:47,960
Speaker 4: on minivan and be like, all right, this is an

492
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:51,719
Speaker 4: MSNBC voter, right like they care about the debt ceiling.

493
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:54,479
Speaker 4: And then when we do our canvases that we do

494
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,399
Speaker 4: oftentimes off van canvas thing where it's kind of like

495
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 4: we're not really knocking prime voter doors, or we're just

496
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:03,919
Speaker 4: out doing regular things. Like people will talk about it

497
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:05,960
Speaker 4: but they're not sure what it is, or they'll say, oh, yeah,

498
00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 4: this happens all the time. Then explain to that, well,

499
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,520
Speaker 4: this actually doesn't happen all the time. A government shutdown

500
00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:12,720
Speaker 4: happens all the time. This is much worse and different.

501
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:15,840
Speaker 4: And so I feel like it's becoming the norm for

502
00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 4: the government to shut down and all this where people

503
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:19,679
Speaker 4: are feeling like, oh, well, I guess this is how

504
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,119
Speaker 4: this is just how it is, and it's very unfortunate.

505
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,919
Speaker 4: This is part of the reason why so many people

506
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,240
Speaker 4: have lost faith in government. And it's not like, oh,

507
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 4: they've lost faith in Joe Biden. It's just they've lost

508
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:33,159
Speaker 4: faith in the institution, no matter who's in it. And

509
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 4: part of it is because it's now.

510
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 3: Normal, you know.

511
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 4: I mean, if you like at the past twenty years,

512
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 4: it's become a normal thing for the government to shut

513
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:45,160
Speaker 4: down and for it to be used as a political tool,

514
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,120
Speaker 4: and it's really unfortunate, right.

515
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:51,560
Speaker 1: And more like dysfunction is sort of something that people

516
00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:53,840
Speaker 1: have gotten really used to in this country.

517
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,119
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's the perfect way to put it. It's the

518
00:26:56,160 --> 00:27:00,360
Speaker 4: normalization of dysfunction. And it's hard to because look, I mean,

519
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 4: I think that when you're back's against the wall and

520
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 4: you don't have many opportunities to implement the change that

521
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:08,680
Speaker 4: you want, a lot of times you'll look at the

522
00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:10,959
Speaker 4: tools or I even say, all right, I mean the

523
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 4: budget is what I have. How can we use the

524
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 4: budget to further our beliefs. But the problem here is

525
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 4: it's not like, oh, this is a group of people

526
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 4: fighting for We're.

527
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:22,680
Speaker 3: Going to use this tool because we need to ensure.

528
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,639
Speaker 4: More people get healthcare, more people get food stands, more

529
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 4: people get this. It's to say we want to use

530
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 4: this tool to ensure less people get benefits, less people

531
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:33,080
Speaker 4: get this, and that the government is worse off. And

532
00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 4: I think there's just a fundamental difference there between those

533
00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 4: two things. I think oftentimes we try to draw parallel.

534
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 4: You know, it's extremes on both sides and et cetera.

535
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,439
Speaker 4: And that's true, but when we talk about the people

536
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 4: in government, nothing can be further from the truth. To

537
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,560
Speaker 4: draw a parallel between me saying like we need healthcare

538
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:55,199
Speaker 4: for everybody and someone from the other side saying we

539
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 4: need to abolish the Department of education. I just like

540
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,960
Speaker 4: don't see that being the same side of it personally.

541
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:07,359
Speaker 1: So I want to talk to you about Florida, because

542
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:13,560
Speaker 1: Florida is really a state that is like experiencing a

543
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:18,359
Speaker 1: lot of the climate change things that we saw coming

544
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: very quickly, and you have a Republican governor with a

545
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:29,919
Speaker 1: lot of political aspirations who is very rejected the money

546
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: from the Inflation Reduction Act for the state because he's

547
00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 1: auditioning to be the Trumpiest. So talk to me about

548
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:41,479
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like there's so much happening in

549
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:44,480
Speaker 1: your state. But you've got flooding, you've got hurricanes, you've

550
00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 1: got just climate, climate, climate, talk to me about and

551
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 1: then you can't get flood insurance.

552
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 2: So talk to me about all that stuff.

553
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 3: Yeah.

554
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 4: So, I mean, this is the result, like you said,

555
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 4: this is the result of a governor who is more

556
00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 4: interested in running for president than running the state of Florida.

557
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 3: And he is his campaign strategies to out Trump Trump.

558
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 4: It's not working, and a lot of us here in

559
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 4: Florida especially have been enjoying in front row seats the

560
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 4: major flop of his presidential candidacy. But someone brought something

561
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,000
Speaker 4: up to me a few weeks ago. That really had

562
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 4: me thinking, and he said, yeah, it's all funny and stuff,

563
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,080
Speaker 4: but I'm worried about what he's going to do when

564
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 4: he gets back, because he's still governor for three more years.

565
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,280
Speaker 4: And that's very true. It's very true. And the fact

566
00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 4: of the matter is, even if he loses this race,

567
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:34,440
Speaker 4: which it looks like he's gonna not win the primary,

568
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 4: but anything could happen.

569
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,360
Speaker 3: He's not an old guy, I mean, and even.

570
00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 4: Though his voters get to know him, they dislike him

571
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 4: and they like other people more. If you look at

572
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 4: the numbers, it's not like his favorability is super low.

573
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 4: I mean, if Donald Trump weren't a factor be the

574
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:53,000
Speaker 4: front runner. I say this to say that we shouldn't

575
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 4: just revel in the funniness and just kind of dismiss

576
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 4: him as a threat, because this is it's more than

577
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 4: just oh, twenty twenty four. We got to think about

578
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 4: four years after that and the four years after that.

579
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:06,840
Speaker 4: And that's something that Republicans are really good at. They're

580
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,600
Speaker 4: good at looking at the landscape and looking at the

581
00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 4: next twenty years versus Democrats. We tend to look at

582
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 4: things cycle by cycle. And I've noticed that from being

583
00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 4: a field organizer to now like being in a lot

584
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:22,240
Speaker 4: of the rooms, these conversations are not really based on

585
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 4: long term power building, and I think it's to our detriment.

586
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 4: So a word of caution here to everybody to laugh.

587
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 4: I mean, it's hilarious, the putting all of it.

588
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 3: I love it. But let's keep in mind that Let's think.

589
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 4: About what happens after President Biden, right, And I mean,

590
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:39,960
Speaker 4: like after we win this reelection, because we're going to win,

591
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 4: after we take back the House, after we retain the

592
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 4: Senate and we have four years of great work, that's

593
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 4: the goal. What happens after that, And I think we

594
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:49,800
Speaker 4: have to talk about it. I think it's it should

595
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 4: deeply influence how we organize now. And this is the

596
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:55,320
Speaker 4: drum I've been beating on the youth vote, the youth

597
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:57,600
Speaker 4: vote and the way we interact with young people. It's

598
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:01,520
Speaker 4: really important because yes, it's about out the votes today,

599
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 4: it's about winning now, but it's also about the realization

600
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,880
Speaker 4: that in eight years, like GENC, millennials make up a

601
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:11,880
Speaker 4: third of the electorate right now, one third of the

602
00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 4: electorate right now, in eight years, it will be much

603
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:21,520
Speaker 4: much much more than that. So when we pour our

604
00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:25,280
Speaker 4: messaging and love and resources into young voters now, it

605
00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 4: helps us create lifelong voters. We might speak to a

606
00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 4: ton of young people who just won't vote in twenty

607
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:33,280
Speaker 4: twenty four, and it doesn't mean it's money wasted, because

608
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 4: that messaging and that love and those resources will yield

609
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 4: results two years later, four years later. And that's really important,

610
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:42,480
Speaker 4: and that's how we can really we have an opportunity

611
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 4: to change this country forever from an electoral point of view.

612
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:47,960
Speaker 4: But that work starts now, I mean, and it has

613
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:51,200
Speaker 4: to influence the work now. So either way, I kind

614
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 4: of went on a tangent there outside of Florida, but

615
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 4: it's important.

616
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:56,520
Speaker 1: It's a really but I think it's a really important

617
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 1: point and something that Democrats do a lot of handering

618
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 1: you about. And they happen to have in you someone

619
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 1: who is young and also a person of color, and

620
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: also someone who grew up in Florida, which is theoretically

621
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: at least a swing state. I mean, you actually speak

622
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 1: from really a place of knowing such things, if that

623
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: makes any sense. You're not some like elderly white pollster

624
00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 1: telling me this. So I do think it's important. It

625
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 1: is something that the Democratic Party. Really, I think both

626
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 1: parties are really struggling with.

627
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:33,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly, and it's less to do. I mean, we

628
00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 4: know for a fact that gen Z it's the most

629
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 4: progressive generation in the history of our country, even when

630
00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 4: you look at gen z Ers who consider themselves to

631
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 4: be conservative. And so that's great and it's good for us. Now,

632
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:48,360
Speaker 4: seventy percent of gen Zers voted for Democrats last cycle.

633
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 4: Amazing good statistics and polling shows that, unlike a lot

634
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,960
Speaker 4: of other generations, it looks like we won't grow as

635
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 4: conservative as we get older. There's still going to be

636
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:00,959
Speaker 4: some of that, but there won't be as much. So

637
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 4: the question is how do we keep those numbers where

638
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:05,520
Speaker 4: they're at. And the way you do that is by

639
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,560
Speaker 4: continuing to put resources to not taking people for granted.

640
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 4: If you want a story about taking people for granted,

641
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 4: you don't have to look any further than South Florida

642
00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 4: and see that for the first time in a long time,

643
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 4: even though it was close, Republicans won Miami date last year.

644
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 4: Crazy And it's not like one year Democrats wanted by

645
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 4: a ton and then this year Republicans want to buy

646
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 4: a ton. No, it's little by little it's steady. It's

647
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 4: a thirty year plan that is starting. We're starting to

648
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:34,280
Speaker 4: see the benefits.

649
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,240
Speaker 1: Of it, right, And I mean I do think like

650
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: that is a really good point about how and I

651
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 1: mean part of that is because the Democratic Party infrastructure

652
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 1: in Florida has really had problems, right, Will you talk

653
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:46,239
Speaker 1: about that?

654
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,840
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, yeah, the Democratic Party in Florida's had

655
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 4: problems for a long time. I think oftentimes we try

656
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 4: to pin it on one person, and people exacerbate problems,

657
00:33:55,440 --> 00:34:00,120
Speaker 4: people especially who have a more like dogmatic way of thinking, well,

658
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:03,080
Speaker 4: continue the status quo. And that's the reason we're in

659
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,520
Speaker 4: this situation. I think our new chair, Nikki Freed, is

660
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 4: showing a new path that has a lot of promise

661
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:11,720
Speaker 4: for people here. And the grassroots folks here in Florida

662
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:13,960
Speaker 4: are really excited about that new path. And I think

663
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,560
Speaker 4: we're seeing a new crop of electeds too, a lot

664
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:19,040
Speaker 4: of new people being elected.

665
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,719
Speaker 2: Who are like Anna who I interview the.

666
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 4: Podcast exactly, Yeah, representative honest Kamani. Actually yeah, later today

667
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 4: I'm going to her kickoff for her re election campaign,

668
00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:30,880
Speaker 4: which is exciting. And so we have a lot of

669
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:33,320
Speaker 4: new people all across the state, not just in Central Florida,

670
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:37,319
Speaker 4: and we are all very active all the time on

671
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,359
Speaker 4: the campaign side, year round. And that's really what it's

672
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 4: going to take. I mean, it can't just be up

673
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 4: to the Florida Democratic Party. It has to be up

674
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 4: to everybody, all the organizations, all the electeds thinking about this.

675
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 4: And when we do that, it's how we build power.

676
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm starting to do it here locally. I

677
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 4: was looking. I'm a nerd, and I'll just read ballot

678
00:34:57,480 --> 00:34:59,520
Speaker 4: Pedia for like an hour or two. So I was

679
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,440
Speaker 4: looking at PIA and I made the spreadsheet of all

680
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 4: the city council and county commission elections here in Orlando

681
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 4: and Central Florida. I realize, Wow, over the next eight years,

682
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:12,800
Speaker 4: the local government here will just completely change because of

683
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,319
Speaker 4: term limits, just and that will happen in two to

684
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:17,360
Speaker 4: three years. There'll be a two to three year period

685
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:20,640
Speaker 4: in my area where just everything changes. And then I

686
00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:22,319
Speaker 4: took a step back and I was like, as a

687
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 4: progressive movement, are we ready for that?

688
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 2: No.

689
00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:26,920
Speaker 4: I could think of maybe like a couple people that

690
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:29,279
Speaker 4: might run for something, but I can't think of like

691
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 4: a whole apparatus. And so now I'm working on that

692
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 4: and I think it's important that we do that across

693
00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 4: the country.

694
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 3: It's really important.

695
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,399
Speaker 1: Maxwell Frost, I would love to run over, but Jesse

696
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,279
Speaker 1: is now sending me the dragon emoji, so I have

697
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:41,680
Speaker 1: to end.

698
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:43,799
Speaker 2: But I hope you will come back and talk more

699
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:44,160
Speaker 2: about this.

700
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:46,560
Speaker 3: Of course, of course, thank you for having me on.

701
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 2: Thank you.

702
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:53,840
Speaker 1: Josh Marshall is the editor of Talking Points memo Welcome

703
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:55,800
Speaker 1: Too Fast Pump Tics.

704
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:57,319
Speaker 2: Josh Marshall, how are you?

705
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:02,240
Speaker 1: I am surviving to talk to you about last week?

706
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:07,799
Speaker 1: Biden did this blockbuster drug negotiation. Basically, no president has

707
00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:10,680
Speaker 1: been able to do it since Medicare Party, since there

708
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: was this sort of thing written into Medicare Party, which

709
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:18,760
Speaker 1: was that you can't negotiate drug prices. Now here we are,

710
00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 1: Biden has done this. We spent the whole weekend reading

711
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 1: about DeSantis.

712
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:25,800
Speaker 6: Right, well, I don't have an answer for that exactly.

713
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 6: These things don't play necessarily for the intended constituencies the

714
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 6: way that we see them play out, right. I mean, yes,

715
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 6: they've been trying to do this for about twenty years.

716
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 6: What is it Medica Party I think was in two

717
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 6: thousand and three, so this has been going on for

718
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 6: twenty years. And it's been blocked for all this time.

719
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 6: But that's not as exciting or impulse driving as what

720
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:57,560
Speaker 6: the latest descientists crash and burn stuff, or what Elon

721
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 6: Musk is doing on Twitter. An extent, that doesn't surprise

722
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:03,799
Speaker 6: me that much. But yeah, I don't think we know

723
00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:08,440
Speaker 6: necessarily how these things are playing politically. I know that

724
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 6: there's a lot of people who say it's the press's fault.

725
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:12,920
Speaker 6: I do think there's a limited truth to that. Half

726
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:15,320
Speaker 6: the people in the country just listen to Fox News.

727
00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 6: I mean half are in the maybe thirty five or

728
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 6: forty percent, or in the information stream that is generated

729
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 6: by Fox News, even if they're not directly listening to

730
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 6: Fox News.

731
00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think we need to talk about Elan.

732
00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:33,280
Speaker 1: He's not not an anti semi discuss.

733
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:37,600
Speaker 6: Yeah, I don't really know what to say about him.

734
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:40,279
Speaker 6: I mean, people are really what they do, not what

735
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 6: they think in their heart of hearts. There's this guy

736
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:46,759
Speaker 6: John Gantz who was reading something by him.

737
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 2: Well, I love John Gants, He's really smart.

738
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:49,560
Speaker 3: Yeah.

739
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:51,880
Speaker 6: So he was saying something and he said he had

740
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 6: this kind of good turn of phrase or way of

741
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 6: turning a standard discussion. We get into that there's just

742
00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:00,839
Speaker 6: not that much to be gained for thinking about what

743
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 6: people really think.

744
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 2: Right in their hearts.

745
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 5: Well, most people are not thinking that much at all.

746
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 6: And that was a very elegant way of saying something

747
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 6: that I think a lot of us sense, even if

748
00:38:13,480 --> 00:38:17,399
Speaker 6: we're not able to quite articulate it. That we live

749
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 6: in an information world where people are picking up chunks

750
00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 6: of words and chunks of thought and repeating them back

751
00:38:27,160 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 6: depending on what team they feel they are on, and

752
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 6: so most people are not actually thinking that much at all.

753
00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:38,280
Speaker 6: But kind of to go back to that famous onion story,

754
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:42,200
Speaker 6: some people end up always going in one direction. And

755
00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:45,279
Speaker 6: with Elon Musk, you don't see him happening on to

756
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:51,680
Speaker 6: getting really excited about Medicare price negotiations or any number

757
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 6: of other things. He always seems to get ginned up

758
00:38:55,719 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 6: in the direction of the rights of very hateful and

759
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 6: evil people. And yeah, things are very hard for them,

760
00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 6: and it's the company he keeps, and at some level

761
00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 6: it's obviously his sort of core drives the kind of

762
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 6: thing thinks are unfair, the kind of people he thinks

763
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:21,359
Speaker 6: are bad and good, And that's just who he is.

764
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:24,080
Speaker 5: And if you see how he operates he largely.

765
00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:27,000
Speaker 6: I think we can call him an influencer, right, a

766
00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 6: kind of a prominent person. He has one hundred and

767
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,319
Speaker 6: fifty five million followers on Twitter. He's the richest man

768
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:36,439
Speaker 6: in the world still despite having some shed some net worth.

769
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 2: He'said some bad investment, Yeah.

770
00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:41,880
Speaker 6: Made some bad investments, but he still has the dominant

771
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:47,319
Speaker 6: position in spaceflight and electric cars and even in its

772
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:50,399
Speaker 6: sort of degraded state Twitter or whatever. I don't really

773
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:52,880
Speaker 6: care what he calls it, but he he acts like

774
00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 6: any number of other middle aged guys who are kind

775
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:58,920
Speaker 6: of cranky and hateful. It's just that he has a

776
00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:01,640
Speaker 6: rather larger mega phone, so it matters a lot more

777
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:03,839
Speaker 6: in a way what he's saying his whole shick isn't

778
00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:05,759
Speaker 6: that surprising he is.

779
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 1: I think there's this sort of interesting phenomenon which is

780
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:15,839
Speaker 1: discussed sometimes, which is this sort of idea that you

781
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:18,440
Speaker 1: have billions of dollars, You have more money than you

782
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:23,319
Speaker 1: or your heirs could ever spend. Right, you have incalculatable wealth. Right,

783
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:27,880
Speaker 1: you have fame, but you still all you really want

784
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 1: is to be as powerful as a member of the

785
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:34,680
Speaker 1: New York Times editorial board. Like, what you really want

786
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,040
Speaker 1: is to be taken seriously as a thought leader, which

787
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:40,319
Speaker 1: I think is like a little bit. I mean, this

788
00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:42,880
Speaker 1: is clearly what a lot of these guys want. And

789
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 1: it's sort of like you think about David Rubinstein, like

790
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 1: he has a Bloomberg show, Like, these guys want to

791
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,799
Speaker 1: not just be wildly and calculatively wealthy, but they also

792
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:56,279
Speaker 1: want to be famous. And they don't even just want

793
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 1: to be famous. They don't want to be famous the

794
00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 1: way like a reality television stars famous.

795
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:02,759
Speaker 2: They want to be famous the.

796
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,839
Speaker 1: Way that And again I use this example with all

797
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:10,240
Speaker 1: the needed caveats, Henry Kissinger is famous.

798
00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:10,800
Speaker 5: Yeah.

799
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 6: The way I would put that is they want respect.

800
00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:15,319
Speaker 6: They want to be respected, and they want to be

801
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:19,400
Speaker 6: respected by people who they think have a lot of

802
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:23,399
Speaker 6: cultural capital to use the sort of the fancy way

803
00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 6: people put it, the people who have I don't know, yeah,

804
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:28,200
Speaker 6: cultural capital, whatever that means.

805
00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:29,840
Speaker 5: And you see it with Musk.

806
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 6: In some ways, it's been in a slightly different vein

807
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:38,440
Speaker 6: that this has been the story of Donald Trump. Right, Trump,

808
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:43,319
Speaker 6: despite his overstating his wealth, obviously a pretty wealthy guy. Right,

809
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:47,319
Speaker 6: He's a pretty powerful guy. But he's been driven in

810
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:49,880
Speaker 6: a lot of ways by not people always thought Donald

811
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 6: Trump was a joke. They used to think he was

812
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:54,240
Speaker 6: more benign joke, kind of just a kind of clown

813
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:58,960
Speaker 6: character as opposed to a really dangerous or malevolent person.

814
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:04,239
Speaker 6: But he didn't get respect. And that with Musk is

815
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:06,000
Speaker 6: kind of the story too.

816
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:06,879
Speaker 5: So there's a.

817
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 6: Huge amount of our public culture in this country that

818
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:17,839
Speaker 6: is about people's grievance about that, and it sort of

819
00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:22,120
Speaker 6: it expresses itself as this kind of faux populism, and

820
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:26,560
Speaker 6: that has traction because there is some truth in that,

821
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:30,880
Speaker 6: in the sense of people with fancy degrees and fancy

822
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 6: titles and who get published by fancy publishing houses have

823
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:36,799
Speaker 6: a lot of clout, and there's a lot of other

824
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:39,640
Speaker 6: people in this country who don't have that and who

825
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:42,920
Speaker 6: feel some like Ben Shapinia, our resentment about it.

826
00:42:43,239 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 2: Well that's where I'm as.

827
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:48,840
Speaker 1: You're talking, I'm like, oh, you mean Ben Shapiro. I

828
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 1: mean my favorite moment was that Barbie movie. He's like,

829
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:53,440
Speaker 1: it's gonna sink like a stone.

830
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:56,839
Speaker 6: Yeah, yes, But I would say that what I think

831
00:42:56,880 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 6: of more is just everyday people, right who aren't particularly powerful, celebrities, wealthy,

832
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:06,279
Speaker 6: et cetera. But you have this weird Eddy in the

833
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:10,120
Speaker 6: public culture that someone like Ben Shapiro, who is must

834
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:14,319
Speaker 6: be a very wealthy man, is kind of ubiquitous in

835
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 6: social media. He's everywhere, he's a celebrity, he's wealthy, he's powerful,

836
00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:23,160
Speaker 6: and yet that kind of grievance essential to his whole shtick.

837
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:23,919
Speaker 3: Yeah.

838
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 2: No, he just wants to be published.

839
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,520
Speaker 1: By kanop Yeah. I mean, clearly what Elon wants is

840
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:34,160
Speaker 1: that same kind of acceptance of polite society. But I

841
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:36,960
Speaker 1: think what is so silly about it is like you

842
00:43:37,080 --> 00:43:40,320
Speaker 1: have billions of dollars just build a new polite society,

843
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:45,560
Speaker 1: which actually they're doing outside of San Francisco, where billionaires

844
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:49,839
Speaker 1: are buying up land to start their own city because

845
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:53,399
Speaker 1: they don't need San Francisco. That is an incredible bit

846
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 1: of sorcery.

847
00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's funny because the people who are involved in

848
00:43:57,280 --> 00:44:00,839
Speaker 6: that are not all right, Elon must time. So you've

849
00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:02,080
Speaker 6: got a lot of people.

850
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:03,560
Speaker 2: The quote unquote good guys.

851
00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:06,600
Speaker 6: Yeah, it kind of you know, yeah, Riet Hoffman, the

852
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:11,440
Speaker 6: progressive billionaires, and in some ways kind of on its surface,

853
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:12,799
Speaker 6: a lot of it is it's going to be a

854
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:15,320
Speaker 6: walking based place and there's a light, it's going to

855
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,440
Speaker 6: be carbon neutral and Yeah, there's going to be solar

856
00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:20,719
Speaker 6: panels and everything. So it's not just a kind of

857
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:22,960
Speaker 6: what is that thing they have whatever in coal where

858
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 6: these guys soup up their pips and you know, all

859
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:26,520
Speaker 6: that kind of stuff.

860
00:44:26,600 --> 00:44:29,920
Speaker 1: But it is this idea which billionaires seem to be

861
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:33,319
Speaker 1: very hot on. And again I'm not saying they're wrong,

862
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:36,160
Speaker 1: though I think they're wrong that they can do government

863
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 1: better than the little people. And I do think you'd

864
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 1: be hard pressed to find a billionaire who doesn't think

865
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:45,080
Speaker 1: they can do government better than the government.

866
00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:46,799
Speaker 5: I think that's unquestionably true.

867
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:52,400
Speaker 6: You have some exceptions, but billionaires are obviously very powerful.

868
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 6: That's one of the issues with billionaire edom in our society,

869
00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:01,640
Speaker 6: and particularly with Musk, who obviously it's not just that

870
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 6: he's You've got various billionaires. You've got George Soros, You've

871
00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 6: got Rieed Hoffman, you've got Zuckerberg, and these people at

872
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 6: least at some level, range across the political spectrum. But

873
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:15,719
Speaker 6: in Musk's case, I'm sure many of your listeners saw

874
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:19,600
Speaker 6: or saw that article, that big article very impressively put

875
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 6: together in the Times. Oh that one too, But the

876
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:24,920
Speaker 6: one in the Times was about that, like something like

877
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:27,760
Speaker 6: more than half the act of satellites in the skies

878
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 6: are controlled by Elon Musk.

879
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:30,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's kind of bad.

880
00:45:31,480 --> 00:45:35,440
Speaker 6: Yeah, and that actually has played into when the US

881
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:38,759
Speaker 6: is dealing with the Ukraine War, they needed to get

882
00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:42,359
Speaker 6: Elon Musk sign off for the communications stuff to So

883
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:45,600
Speaker 6: there comes a question in any democratic society, or in

884
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 6: a sort of a global society, when when are you

885
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:53,560
Speaker 6: just too powerful that an individual billionaire becomes so powerful

886
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:58,840
Speaker 6: everyone else's civic democratic freedom comes into question. And that

887
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:02,160
Speaker 6: is definitely something that is part of the sort of

888
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 6: the issue of billionaireedom in our society today. But Musk

889
00:46:06,200 --> 00:46:09,960
Speaker 6: is in a special category because he, for various reasons,

890
00:46:10,080 --> 00:46:13,400
Speaker 6: kind of holds the commanding heights in several critical parts

891
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:18,040
Speaker 6: of the global economy. But yeah, it's sort of natural

892
00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:22,240
Speaker 6: for billionaires to think they could do it better because

893
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 6: they've look at every certainly every billionaire who didn't inherit

894
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:30,960
Speaker 6: their billions, and probably a lot of who yes, yeah,

895
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 6: they've had a great run of luck. Now they wouldn't say, look,

896
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,799
Speaker 6: they would say it's skill and they're doing but sort

897
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:40,399
Speaker 6: of whichever it is, your rolling the dice, and they're

898
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 6: always coming up in your favor and you sort of

899
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,600
Speaker 6: think you've got a knack for it. So again, it's

900
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 6: sort of it would be surprising if it weren't the case.

901
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:52,839
Speaker 1: The one thing I want to sort of get back

902
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:57,400
Speaker 1: to here is there is a kind of like the

903
00:46:57,440 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: federal government seeded these things to Musk, right, Like this

904
00:47:02,680 --> 00:47:07,160
Speaker 1: musk has had so many advantages from tax rebates to

905
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:11,240
Speaker 1: I mean, to research that was funded by the government.

906
00:47:11,280 --> 00:47:13,399
Speaker 2: I mean, and I'm not saying he's the only one.

907
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,160
Speaker 2: I mean. A great example is this drug negotiation right

908
00:47:16,160 --> 00:47:18,399
Speaker 2: now that Biden is doing. So the pharma companies are

909
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:21,360
Speaker 2: pushing back and saying, if you negotiate the drug prices,

910
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:24,200
Speaker 2: you won't be able to get cancer drugs right, we

911
00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:26,839
Speaker 2: won't be able to use this money that we need.

912
00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:30,759
Speaker 2: That seven hundred and sixty four dollars a month it

913
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:34,520
Speaker 2: costs for your heart medicine, for your elderol or whatever

914
00:47:34,560 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 2: it's called, for your heart medicine that you have to

915
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 2: take for heart failure. If you don't pay seven hundred

916
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:42,000
Speaker 2: and sixty four dollars a month, we can't do the

917
00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:46,080
Speaker 2: research we need to do to secure cancer. Now.

918
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:48,440
Speaker 6: A lot of this research, so the biggest thing is

919
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:53,440
Speaker 6: they're clearly underinvesting in drug names, right, exactly right, because

920
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:56,279
Speaker 6: if they're calling your heart failure drug elderoll, I mean,

921
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:56,839
Speaker 6: what the fuck?

922
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:57,160
Speaker 3: Right?

923
00:47:57,200 --> 00:47:58,560
Speaker 5: I don't know if I can say that. I probably

924
00:47:58,560 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 5: can't say no.

925
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:01,399
Speaker 2: You can absolutely say weakurse here all the time.

926
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:04,000
Speaker 1: But I think like, so, I mean, they're saying that,

927
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:06,320
Speaker 1: and then we look over and we see that actually

928
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:08,480
Speaker 1: the federal government is very involved in R and.

929
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 2: D drug development.

930
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:12,759
Speaker 1: Not always, but certainly a lot of this money is

931
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:16,160
Speaker 1: actually just going to paying their executives and thinking about

932
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:21,000
Speaker 1: marketing and television ads. So I do think like there

933
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:23,640
Speaker 1: are many many people in this country who have gotten

934
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:27,239
Speaker 1: rich off tax money that should not be going to them.

935
00:48:27,520 --> 00:48:27,759
Speaker 5: Yeah.

936
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:30,279
Speaker 6: Well, there's a lot of very interesting, funny, you know,

937
00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 6: kind of quizzical things about Elon Musk. One of them

938
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 6: is that, you know, tech is built on software. Most

939
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:39,840
Speaker 6: much of tech, a lot of the tech that we

940
00:48:39,920 --> 00:48:44,160
Speaker 6: know of is built on software and network effects. The

941
00:48:44,200 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 6: one case where Musk has gotten involved in that is Twitter,

942
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:51,279
Speaker 6: and it's been a catastrophic failure in economic terms. And

943
00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:55,160
Speaker 6: the irony is what Musk is really as a pretty

944
00:48:55,160 --> 00:49:00,319
Speaker 6: strong record on is heavy industry, building cars, building spacecraft, right,

945
00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:02,960
Speaker 6: that is not usually the thing. You know, Apple is

946
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:05,520
Speaker 6: sort of in some ways the exception of the in

947
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:09,080
Speaker 6: the big tech players being largely hardware based, as opposed

948
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 6: to Facebook, Google, Amazon blabblah. Obviously Amazon has some footing

949
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:17,200
Speaker 6: in hardware. And with the electric cars thing, I mean, yes,

950
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 6: he built that on public money, but we put public

951
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:26,480
Speaker 6: money there to help start an electric vehicle industry, so

952
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:31,360
Speaker 6: that was kind of the idea. And with certainly with SpaceX,

953
00:49:31,719 --> 00:49:36,759
Speaker 6: he's built that entirely on government contracts, right that he

954
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:39,600
Speaker 6: got the NASA contract basically, that's how he built it.

955
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:42,920
Speaker 6: He beat out, rightly or wrongly, Jeff Bezos, who also

956
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:46,759
Speaker 6: has his own little space company that so certainly the

957
00:49:46,840 --> 00:49:51,480
Speaker 6: point is that Elon Musk's money is entirely based on

958
00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 6: navigating the policies of the federal government and the money

959
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,040
Speaker 6: it puts behind things. Sort of the most generous thing

960
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:03,000
Speaker 6: you can say is that we're now able to send

961
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 6: a lot more stuff into space because he's been successful

962
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:08,120
Speaker 6: at that, and how he's being able to get the

963
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:10,960
Speaker 6: price down for a freight to neuroth orbit and all

964
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:12,839
Speaker 6: that kind of stuff. But at the end of the day,

965
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:16,160
Speaker 6: it is not a libertarian vision. It all comes from

966
00:50:16,239 --> 00:50:20,560
Speaker 6: piggybacking on federal government spending. He's a product, ironically, he

967
00:50:20,719 --> 00:50:25,360
Speaker 6: is a product of the Obama and Biden administrations.

968
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:28,880
Speaker 1: Right, So one last question exactly is a product of

969
00:50:28,920 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 1: the administrations he's now trying to remove.

970
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:35,280
Speaker 2: One last question is Elon mus R Henry Ford.

971
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:36,799
Speaker 5: He really seems like to me.

972
00:50:36,920 --> 00:50:38,880
Speaker 6: I just mentioned that in a post I did like

973
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:42,040
Speaker 6: earlier this morning, that Ford was a true innovator in

974
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:43,680
Speaker 6: this sort of the assembly you know, we don't think

975
00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:46,120
Speaker 6: of that as high tech now, but the assembly line

976
00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:49,040
Speaker 6: and all the different sort of management stuff that goes

977
00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:52,880
Speaker 6: into it. And then he became kind of a virulent

978
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:55,480
Speaker 6: anti Semitic crank and he had his own little newspaper

979
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 6: up there in Michigan and everything, and so yes, he

980
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:03,880
Speaker 6: really does seem like that. And his Shenanigans didn't seem

981
00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 6: to heard Ford Motor Company. They're still chugging along, so

982
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:09,040
Speaker 6: maybe it'll be the same. I don't know, but he

983
00:51:09,120 --> 00:51:12,839
Speaker 6: really does seem similar, because that's the thing with it's

984
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:16,680
Speaker 6: not just luck with Musk. And I'm about as anti

985
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:19,560
Speaker 6: Musk as you can be. I don't think you manage

986
00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 6: SpaceX and Tesla without bringing some element to the equation

987
00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:29,879
Speaker 6: that has enabled his success. And I say that as

988
00:51:29,920 --> 00:51:34,840
Speaker 6: someone who really reviles the guy. But even when you

989
00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:38,120
Speaker 6: make economic decisions that work out well for you great

990
00:51:38,200 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 6: in our system, you make a ton of money, but

991
00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:43,600
Speaker 6: you get the money you don't. It's it's always important

992
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 6: for the republic, the state, the public to say you

993
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:50,120
Speaker 6: can get all your money, but you don't necessarily get

994
00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:53,560
Speaker 6: to make all the decisions because you can't be more powerful.

995
00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:57,040
Speaker 6: You can't become so powerful that everyone else's power becomes

996
00:51:57,040 --> 00:51:59,439
Speaker 6: a footnote. And that's kind of in some ways where

997
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:01,280
Speaker 6: we are with us on some of these fronts.

998
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:04,239
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. I hope he'll come back.

999
00:52:04,360 --> 00:52:05,920
Speaker 5: Well, thanks for having Me'd love to come back.

1000
00:52:08,239 --> 00:52:15,680
Speaker 2: No, Jesse Cannon, Malli Jong Fast that Ken Pexton. He's

1001
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:19,560
Speaker 2: a real wallless guy, real model Trump mega guy. And

1002
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:21,320
Speaker 2: what are you seeing here today?

1003
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:24,799
Speaker 1: Is an incredible day. It is the beginning of Ken

1004
00:52:24,880 --> 00:52:30,759
Speaker 1: Paxton's impeachment trial. Ken Paxton is the attorney general. He's

1005
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:33,400
Speaker 1: the most he considers himself to be the most conservative

1006
00:52:34,080 --> 00:52:35,800
Speaker 1: attorney general ever.

1007
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:39,279
Speaker 2: He is. He's going to be impeached.

1008
00:52:39,440 --> 00:52:43,160
Speaker 1: He's being impeached again by a jury of his peers,

1009
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:47,200
Speaker 1: a lot of very conservative Republicans. The netnet of this

1010
00:52:47,400 --> 00:52:51,320
Speaker 1: is he tried to hide his affair from his wife

1011
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:54,759
Speaker 1: on his voters, and one of his one of his

1012
00:52:54,800 --> 00:53:01,160
Speaker 1: biggest donors, gave his mistress or his alleged mistress a job.

1013
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:04,040
Speaker 1: I want to say that one of the really fun

1014
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:08,120
Speaker 1: things about this trial is that Ken Paxton's lawyer is

1015
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:13,000
Speaker 1: a guy called Tony Busby and he is completely orange

1016
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:16,879
Speaker 1: a la Donald Trump, and he is totally hilarious and

1017
00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:21,440
Speaker 1: you can watch it live streamed and it's pretty great.

1018
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:25,399
Speaker 1: So go to the Texas Senate and watch the guy

1019
00:53:25,440 --> 00:53:29,880
Speaker 1: who had the multiple indictments get impeached. That's it for

1020
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:33,760
Speaker 1: this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday

1021
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:36,719
Speaker 1: and Friday to hear the best minds in politics makes

1022
00:53:36,719 --> 00:53:40,040
Speaker 1: sense of all this chaos. If you enjoyed what you've heard,

1023
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:43,320
Speaker 1: please send it to a friend and keep the conversation going.

1024
00:53:43,719 --> 00:53:45,400
Speaker 1: And again, thanks for listening.