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Speaker 1: He thinks that he has the upper hand and he

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Speaker 1: has never met or been confronted with the collective group

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Speaker 1: of us now saying, Robert, You're not going to win.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to forgive me for I have followed. I'm

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Speaker 2: Jess Cassavetto, executive producer of the Netflix series Dancing for

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Speaker 2: the Devil. The seven M TikTok Cult. This documentary series

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Speaker 2: explored the story of Robert Shin, the La based Chakaina

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Speaker 2: Church and seven M Films. Shin founded Chakaina Church over

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Speaker 2: two decades ago before establishing seven M Films and is

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Speaker 2: named in a civil lawsuit alleging abuse and cult like behavior.

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Speaker 3: And I'm Kalia Gray, former member of Chakaina Church and

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Speaker 3: seven M Films.

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Speaker 2: In this episode, we sit down with some of the

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Speaker 2: social media accounts responsible for reporting on Chicaina in seven

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Speaker 2: M and ultimately keeping the story alive. We will chat

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Speaker 2: with the Hales, creators of Stop Culting and Exposing seven M,

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Speaker 2: and Katie Joy, creator of Without a Crystal Ball, to

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Speaker 2: explore the dark world of Chicina Church in seven M.

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Speaker 2: The Halees share their journey on uncovering the manipulative practices

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Speaker 2: of Robert Schin and his church, while Katie discusses her

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Speaker 2: personal connection to the Wilkings family story and the extensive

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Speaker 2: work exposing high controlled groups like Nexium. Despite facing legal threats, harassment,

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Speaker 2: and emotional tolls, all three remain dedicated to helping survivors

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Speaker 2: and fighting for justice. Tune in for their powerful insights

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Speaker 2: on the ongoing battle to expose cults and raise awareness

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Speaker 2: about the dangers of manipulation and exploitation, and now our

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Speaker 2: conversation with Katie. Katie's been covering high controlled groups like

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Speaker 2: NEXIM and the Dugger Family for years. In this podcast.

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Speaker 2: You may have heard her name a few times. Katie

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Speaker 2: Joy is creator of Without a Crystal Ball, and we're.

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Speaker 4: Super excited to have her.

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Speaker 2: Katie, thank you for joining us today.

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Speaker 4: Thanks for having me.

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Speaker 2: So what initially drew you to focus on Chakaina Church

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Speaker 2: and how did you first hear about this story?

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Speaker 1: This story was definitely not on my radar. I didn't

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Speaker 1: even know this church existed, and it wasn't until I

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Speaker 1: got a message in one of my dms on Instagram

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Speaker 1: that one of my followers, who was a fan of

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Speaker 1: the Wilking Sisters page, had let me know about a

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Speaker 1: live stream that Melanie had done, and she said, here's

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Speaker 1: the link, just watch this. I know you've covered all

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Speaker 1: these other cults. There's something going on here, and I

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Speaker 1: think they need your investigative skills. So I took a look,

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Speaker 1: and I was heartbroken when I saw them crying and

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Speaker 1: listening to what they were saying about losing access to

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Speaker 1: Miranda and just the overwhelming details of what was going

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Speaker 1: on with all of these dances. And it struck me

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Speaker 1: because it was like, wait a minute, you're telling me

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Speaker 1: there's this whole thing happening behind these faces that are

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Speaker 1: dancing that are like viral. And so I was compelled

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Speaker 1: to reach out because knowing a little bit more about them,

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Speaker 1: knowing they're from Michigan and sort of that like midwestern

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Speaker 1: tie as I'm from Minnesota, that fear they have of like,

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Speaker 1: you know, they sent their daughter out to the big

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Speaker 1: city to follow her dream and it's like every parent's

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Speaker 1: worst nightmare that a child would get like preyed upon.

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Speaker 1: And so I reached out to them and I was like,

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Speaker 1: we need to do some digging, and I offered them

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Speaker 1: my platform and let her know sort of what my

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Speaker 1: background was, what I covered, my connections, with the other

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Speaker 1: journalists and kind of started from there. It was like

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Speaker 1: peeling an onion one layer at a time, because the

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Speaker 1: initial story that I thought it was kept evolving and changing,

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Speaker 1: and it felt like it was an endless rabbit hole

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Speaker 1: of just traumatic, horrific stories.

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Speaker 2: Katie, as you started to begin investigating Chakaina, what were

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Speaker 2: some of those first red flags you noticed that indicated

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Speaker 2: it might be a high controlled group and how did

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Speaker 2: your experience with Nexium inform your approach.

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Speaker 1: So I remember when I saw Kelly and Dean and

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Speaker 1: Melanie Live and the way that they were talking about Miranda.

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Speaker 1: I immediately clicked and I was like, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: this reminds me of Katherine Oxenburg and her interviews that

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Speaker 1: she did on her daughter India, and how desperate Catherine

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Speaker 1: was to get her daughter away from Keith Ranieri.

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Speaker 4: And I was like, Okay, there's something here.

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Speaker 1: So I kind of understood the way that Keith Ranieri

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Speaker 1: set up his system, and when Melanie and them were

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Speaker 1: talking about how it's a church but it's also a

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Speaker 1: management company, I wanted to verify that that's how it

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Speaker 1: looked on paper, and what I found was that there

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Speaker 1: was a church Chikaia Church that he had formed a

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Speaker 1: ninety four, but it didn't appear that he had ever

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Speaker 1: been ordained as a pastor.

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Speaker 4: So I was like, this is weird, okay.

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Speaker 1: And then I've went to the various sources that I

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Speaker 1: look at, you know, I go to the Secretary of State,

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Speaker 1: I'm looking at the court records. I'm trying to figure

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Speaker 1: out where he's located, and it starts to paint this

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Speaker 1: picture to me of a man that has I mean,

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Speaker 1: the list of businesses alone was shocking, and they all

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Speaker 1: had him on it with various members of whoever connected

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Speaker 1: to things, you know, like on Chicaina it was I think,

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Speaker 1: he and Daniel, Joseph and Hannah, I think, But then

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Speaker 1: on seven M it was like him, Hannah and Shirley.

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Speaker 1: And then he has all these other businesses that have

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Speaker 1: been voluntarily dissolved or revoked, and I was like, revoked.

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Speaker 4: Interesting, what could have caused that?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, So the revocations that I've found in the addresses

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Speaker 1: of the various businesses is how I started researching the

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Speaker 1: court records, which was like a whole other thing. And

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Speaker 1: when I got to Orange County and I found the

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Speaker 1: lawsuit that Lydia Chung filed in two thousand and nine.

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Speaker 1: That is when I hit Petert and I was like,

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Speaker 1: this is it. This sounds exactly like what the Wilkins

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Speaker 1: are accusing him of. And I certainly didn't start reporting

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Speaker 1: on things until I had a clear picture. And Robert's

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Speaker 1: favorite thing, especially with him suing me, is that I'm

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Speaker 1: not sourcing things if he really understood how well this

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Speaker 1: is sourced.

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Speaker 3: The legal troubles, especially surrounding cult like environments and surrounding Robert,

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Speaker 3: have been extensive. And I know you've faced a lot

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Speaker 3: of challenges with this, including harassment and smear campaigns. How

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Speaker 3: did you cope with these attacks and did they ever

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Speaker 3: make you question your investigation?

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Speaker 1: I always feel like, and it's my opinion that if

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Speaker 1: you're going to cover cults and high control groups, or

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Speaker 1: if you start discussing someone's faith system, there's going to

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Speaker 1: be a reaction. But what Robert unleashed was I've never

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Speaker 1: experienced the amount of harassment I've gone through, and particularly

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Speaker 1: after the series came out, was insane. After Miranda made

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Speaker 1: her video where she said that she was getting threats

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Speaker 1: and her life was in danger and she was mad,

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Speaker 1: Why did her parents participate in the documentary. I had

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Speaker 1: a swat call and a report to the FBI, and

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Speaker 1: they were here at four o'clock in the morning.

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Speaker 4: And then in.

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Speaker 1: The span of three days, we had police at my

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Speaker 1: house four times. Oh my gosh, and we still don't

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Speaker 1: know who was doing these threats. And the threats were

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Speaker 1: like not even true. It was like Katie's husband is

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Speaker 1: holding a gun to her head, or Katie's going to

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Speaker 1: hurt her child. Someone even filed a false report to

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Speaker 1: CPS in my attorney's name. They filed reports with the city.

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Speaker 1: They used different people's names while filing these reports. I

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Speaker 1: had to have a meeting with the FBI, I met

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Speaker 1: with local law enforcement. They still could not to this

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Speaker 1: day figure out who's doing this. And at the same time,

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Speaker 1: I'm receiving emails that are like, if you don't stop

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Speaker 1: talking about Robert Shin, we're going to keep doing.

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Speaker 4: This to you. I am so sorry. That is so difficult,

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Speaker 4: oll Katie.

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Speaker 2: I'm so sorry You've been through a whole lot in

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Speaker 2: this process, and so I just need to say thank

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Speaker 2: you because it's not been easy. And I know that

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Speaker 2: you've been dealing with this legal battle for now two

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Speaker 2: years almost three and we've seen people settle rightfully. So

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Speaker 2: whatever works best for you. But you refuse to back down, Katie,

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Speaker 2: you're a tough cookie. Oh you go, Katie.

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Speaker 1: You know when he filed his lawsuit against me, and

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Speaker 1: I'll say that hearing him say in the documentary, We're

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Speaker 1: going to silence every single critic.

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Speaker 4: That's what he's doing. That's all he's doing here.

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Speaker 1: You know, I've had other lawsuits where we've settled, and

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Speaker 1: it's as simple as like, all right, I'll take my

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Speaker 1: stuff down even if it was true. We had done

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Speaker 1: a couple settlings and my attorneys just like looked at

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Speaker 1: me and they said, if you keep settling, it's just

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Speaker 1: going to provoke more people to sue you, because they're

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Speaker 1: going to think, if you keep settling, all we have

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Speaker 1: to do is file a lawsuit and she'll take down

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Speaker 1: the content and.

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Speaker 4: We'll move on.

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Speaker 1: They said, if you don't settle, you will not get

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Speaker 1: as many lawsuits because it'll show people that this isn't

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Speaker 1: going to be an easy.

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Speaker 4: Fight, right, that you're willing to fight.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And so I was like, you know what, I'm

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Speaker 1: committed no matter how much this costs, I don't care.

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Speaker 4: And it's cost me a lot.

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Speaker 1: And every time I write out a check, I'm like, Robert,

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Speaker 1: you're not going to win.

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Speaker 4: I don't care.

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Speaker 1: I don't care if you think you're going to bankrupt me,

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Speaker 1: You're not going to bankrupt me. I'm going to be fine.

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Speaker 1: I'll just work extra hard. But you're not even getting

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Speaker 1: a dent in this Robert, and he thinks that he

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Speaker 1: has the upper hand, and he has never met or

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Speaker 1: been confronted with the colective group of us now saying

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Speaker 1: you're not going to win, right, and having been on

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Speaker 1: the receiving end of the lawsuit, I can wholeheartedly understand,

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Speaker 1: like how he weaponizes things against people, how he makes

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Speaker 1: people second guests themselves. He tries to hurt you where

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Speaker 1: he thinks it can hurt, you know, And leading up

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Speaker 1: to the release of the documentary, his narrative was starting

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Speaker 1: to win, right, Like people had kind of forgotten. They're like, Oh,

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Speaker 1: Miranda's fine, Look she's dancing, everything's good. Oh those other

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Speaker 1: people left. We haven't you know, you're dom Katie, that's

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Speaker 1: all a lie.

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Speaker 2: So despite the emotional toll, You've continued advocating for survivors

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Speaker 2: and shedding light on the exploitation within Chicina. What keeps

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Speaker 2: you motivated, Katie, to push forward despite all these obstacles.

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Speaker 1: It really comes down to a promise I made to

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Speaker 1: Kelly Wilkin in the first conversation that I ever had

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Speaker 1: with Kelly. I was very emotional, obviously she was emotional,

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Speaker 1: and I just said to her, I don't know how

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Speaker 1: long this is going to take. I don't know what

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Speaker 1: we can do here, but we will get your daughter back.

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Speaker 1: We will get her home. And I don't know if

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Speaker 1: it means like we will get her home back to

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Speaker 1: Detroit or you know, back to Michigan, but rather like

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Speaker 1: out of this, you know free.

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Speaker 2: Well, Katie, thank you for continuing to stand up for

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Speaker 2: what you believe in, for diving deep and doing these

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Speaker 2: paper trail investigations and standing your ground. I know it's

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Speaker 2: not easy, but we do appreciate you taking the time

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Speaker 2: to talk with us today and for continuing to speak out.

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Speaker 4: Thank you both for having me on here.

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Speaker 1: And I just want to say that, like, maybe it's

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Speaker 1: my own naivete, right, that Midwestern naivete when, like I said,

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Speaker 1: I wasn't expecting this, But maybe that also makes me

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Speaker 1: fearless in a way. Because I don't care, and like

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Speaker 1: you can say whatever you want, but like I'm just

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Speaker 1: you know, Katie, and I'm a mom and I have

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Speaker 1: a job, and this is what I do and don't

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Speaker 1: hurt people. And if I could say to any of

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Speaker 1: the people that have come out and that have gone

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Speaker 1: through this, especially Khalia, to you, like there's no shame

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Speaker 1: at all. We often, way too often shame the victims

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Speaker 1: of these high control groups. And I even heard Kevin

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Speaker 1: say that, you know, like he felt almost ashamed. And

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Speaker 1: it's like, how about we reframe the narrative and be

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Speaker 1: why does Robert choose to hurt people? It's not your

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Speaker 1: fault that he's doing this. You guys were hungry, hungry

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Speaker 1: for like spirituality, hungry for work, and he made a

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Speaker 1: lot of promises.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for sharing that, because that is true. I

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Speaker 3: think that reframing does need to happen. And you know,

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Speaker 3: the more conversations I get into with people like you

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Speaker 3: and the people that we've had on the more I

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Speaker 3: feel like I'm starting to refrain my feelings towards the

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Speaker 3: situation that I've gone through personally.

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Speaker 4: This is forgive me for I have followed. We'll be

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Speaker 4: right back.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to forgive me for I have followed. Now

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Speaker 2: back to our conversation, now switching gears to the Halees

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Speaker 2: creators have stopped coulting and exposing seven M, who have

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Speaker 2: dedicated themselves to uncovering the truth about Robert Schin and

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Speaker 2: the allegations of manipulation in his church. They share their

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Speaker 2: unique journeys from growing up exposed to high controlled environments

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Speaker 2: to investigating Chakaina Church in seven M films. Despite facing

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Speaker 2: legal threats, intense backlash, and emotional tolls, the Halees remained

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Speaker 2: committed to exposing the harmful practices of cult like environments

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Speaker 2: and helping its survivors. Listen to hear their powerful insight

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Speaker 2: on the ongoing fight for justice and the need for

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Speaker 2: greater awareness around cult dynamics. Now our interview with the Halees.

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Speaker 2: Haley's thank you so much for joining us today.

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Speaker 4: Of course, hello, thank you for having us.

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Speaker 2: Haley HP as I like to call you. You mentioned having

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Speaker 2: family members who grew up in high controlled dynamics. How

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Speaker 2: did that prior knowledge exposure influence your interest in approaching

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Speaker 2: and investigating groups like Chicaina and seven M.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, so my family they are Mormon, and anyone that

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Speaker 5: I've had contact with is not Mormon. And it was

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Speaker 5: specifically for that reason, because they basically excommunicated people who

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Speaker 5: weren't with their religion. So that kind of just made

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Speaker 5: me interested in the whole high control religions in general,

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Speaker 5: and I started just researching. It was like FLDS Mormonism,

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Speaker 5: and then it just like branched off into cold and yeah,

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Speaker 5: that's pretty much.

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Speaker 2: How I went, Hailey, Stop Culting? Haley, how did you

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Speaker 2: an HP meet? And can you walk us through the

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Speaker 2: moment when you first decided to start your own pages?

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Speaker 2: Stop Culting and exposing seven.

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Speaker 6: M So very weirdly, we just bumped into each other

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Speaker 6: on social media. I found out about the cult because

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Speaker 6: I followed Miranda on Instagram and I had saw her

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Speaker 6: story posted about Dean and how he like blocked them

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Speaker 6: in the driveway, and I was like, Okay, what is

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Speaker 6: going on. I've never seen her even post about her family.

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Speaker 6: And then I went to her husband's page and I

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Speaker 6: saw him post about Dean and Kelly, saying that they're

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Speaker 6: racist and just all these allegations against them, and I

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Speaker 6: was beyond confused what was going on? And so I

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Speaker 6: started deep diving just on my own and then Haley

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Speaker 6: had already made Exposing seven M, and I messaged her

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Speaker 6: on my personal account and I was like, girl, what.

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Speaker 4: Is your name? Who are you?

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Speaker 5: What are you doing?

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Speaker 6: Like, we have to resource this together, like I would

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Speaker 6: send her stuff I would find, and then it just

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Speaker 6: kind of turned into like this little bond of working

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Speaker 6: to find out what this was because we didn't know

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Speaker 6: what cult or what group or what religious leader she

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Speaker 6: was following or anything. So we were going off of

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Speaker 6: just looking at their social media accounts.

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Speaker 2: HP, when did you realize the impact that your pages

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Speaker 2: were having and how it was reaching those inside Chakaina

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Speaker 2: and seven M?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, So when I started exposing seven M, I just

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Speaker 5: wanted to raise awareness. I had no idea that my

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Speaker 5: account would become basically like a discussion board for the

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Speaker 5: public to like share info they found let alone in

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Speaker 5: a space for like former members to feel safe and

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Speaker 5: comfortable and be like, yeah, this happened to me. So

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Speaker 5: I don't know, we created the accounts like we had

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Speaker 5: that much of a gut feeling, and then it was

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Speaker 5: like hundreds of people were following us and sending us

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Speaker 5: info and I think, what really really solidified.

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Speaker 4: It is when the.

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Speaker 5: Actual former members of the church reached out like, yeah,

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Speaker 5: this is the history of the church and this is

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Speaker 5: my actual experience inside the church. We were like shocked

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Speaker 5: that it went that far back.

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Speaker 2: Can you tell us a little bit about the relationship

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Speaker 2: with some of the ex members that you had and

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Speaker 2: how that helped shape the story and your reporting.

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Speaker 6: It was hard to navigate what these relationships were supposed

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Speaker 6: to look like. And me and Haley are trying to

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Speaker 6: navigate relationships plus posting about Robert Shin, plus not making

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Speaker 6: this person mad, plus not making that person mad, you know,

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Speaker 6: and so there's all of these things to balance when

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Speaker 6: it comes to people that have been through something like this.

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Speaker 6: And I will say, you know, I personally got the

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Speaker 6: closest with Melanie. I mean, me and Melanie and Haley

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Speaker 6: talked pretty much every day. I'm so appreciative of that relationship.

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Speaker 6: And I'm appreciative that Alicia got out because that opened

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Speaker 6: another relationship for us. And Alicia automatically trusted us because

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Speaker 6: Melanie trusted us, And so you know, I am forever

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Speaker 6: grateful that Melanie even talked to us, that she liked us,

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Speaker 6: that she trusted us enough with her story that you

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Speaker 6: know Andrew and Concrete, I mean anybody in this entire

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Speaker 6: and you're talking Khalia and Kylie and Aubrey and every

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Speaker 6: single person and all of the ex members that came

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Speaker 6: and talked to us, Like, I just felt all of

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Speaker 6: this bull crap and all of this drama and all

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Speaker 6: this stuff like literally didn't matter to me at the

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Speaker 6: end of the day because of these relationships.

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Speaker 2: When we return the conclusion to our conversation, this is

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Speaker 2: forgive me for I have followed.

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Speaker 4: Welcome back to forgive me for I have followed. Here's

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Speaker 4: the conclusion of our conversation.

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Speaker 2: Hayley, Can you take us into what it was like

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Speaker 2: when you first found out that you were being brought

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Speaker 2: into the lawsuit with Robert Well.

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Speaker 5: They had hired a process server to come to my state.

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Speaker 5: And I don't know if this is not true, but

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Speaker 5: I think that they were watching me for a few

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Speaker 5: days to see when I left for work, because I

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Speaker 5: was at my door to open it to walk out

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Speaker 5: to work in my full work uniform and they were

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Speaker 5: standing there. They said, you've been served, like the traumatic

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Speaker 5: line and everything, and he had his phone out recording me,

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Speaker 5: and I picked my phone up and just immediately recorded

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Speaker 5: him back, and he was like wearing flip flaps and

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Speaker 5: like a relaxed outfit. It was bizarre.

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Speaker 4: I was just shocked.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I also thought that I was completely anonymous, Like

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Speaker 5: I don't know. I still have no idea how they

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Speaker 5: got my name or address or any of that.

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Speaker 2: Oh, that's so scary. I'm sorry they had to go

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Speaker 2: through that, because that would just be absolutely terrifying.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, it was crazy.

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Speaker 2: Can you share with us a little bit about what

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Speaker 2: he's suing you for?

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Speaker 5: It's defamation, and then he's accused me and like five

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Speaker 5: other people of hanging up flyers in LA, which I

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Speaker 5: don't live in La, and then like a few other things.

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Speaker 5: I don't even know exactly everything that he's accused me

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Speaker 5: of because it's like extra, like he doesn't need to

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Speaker 5: be doing all of that.

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Speaker 3: I really do appreciate the work that you guys have

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Speaker 3: done on your platforms, and I know you've emphasized the

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Speaker 3: importance of education on cults and manipulative relationships. What are

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Speaker 3: some things you think need to be done to raise

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Speaker 3: awareness and to better protect people from falling victim to

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Speaker 3: groups like Chicaina.

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Speaker 5: I think there needs to be more laws or regulations

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Speaker 5: when it comes to like coercive control, like if someone

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Speaker 5: is in control of your housing, finances, food, all of that,

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Speaker 5: then consent for a lot of things doesn't really exist anymore.

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Speaker 5: And also a lot more educational content on like narcissistic abuse,

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Speaker 5: because that can apply to cults, abusive relationships, and anything

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Speaker 5: that's similar to that.

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Speaker 2: You know, one thing that I've always appreciated about you,

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Speaker 2: ladies is that you just stand your ground and that

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Speaker 2: you use your voices to stand up for people for good.

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Speaker 2: And with that comes a lot of backlash threats, and

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Speaker 2: that's coming in from other people but also from allegedly

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Speaker 2: inside the church. How do you get the strength to

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Speaker 2: just keep posting and keep standing your ground?

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Speaker 6: Really, I mean, we definitely received a lot of hate

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Speaker 6: at first, Like people did not believe that this was

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Speaker 6: a cult. They did not think, you know, anything we

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Speaker 6: were saying was true. They thought we were, you know,

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Speaker 6: making a bunch of stuff up. Obviously, we couldn't name

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Speaker 6: our sources and tell everyone the world about everything that

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Speaker 6: was going on because we wanted him to get in trouble,

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Speaker 6: you know, we wanted to keep certain information to ourselves,

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Speaker 6: so that way it is something he can be sued for,

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Speaker 6: or we can tell the police or whatever we needed

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Speaker 6: to do. Right, Robert coming after us was a little scary.

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Speaker 6: I'm not gonna lie because we didn't know who he was,

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Speaker 6: what he was capable of, and then come to find out,

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Speaker 6: you know, he's like tracking us down, trying to like

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Speaker 6: serve us these lallpapers and we're messing with like fire here.

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Speaker 6: You know, we're messing with someone who doesn't want to

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Speaker 6: be messed with, right, and so, you know, man Haley

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Speaker 6: make fun of things to get through things, and so

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Speaker 6: we laugh about all of it. But you know, times

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Speaker 6: I was worried, but at the same time, it's like,

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Speaker 6: I know what Robert's doing. I believe in the good

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Speaker 6: of justice, and there's nothing that Robert can say or

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Speaker 6: do to make me stop fighting for these people that

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Speaker 6: he has hurt. And the fight for these people is

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Speaker 6: way bigger than Robert trying to scare me or some

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Speaker 6: people online or social media stands and bullcrap. That doesn't

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Speaker 6: affect me at night, you know what I'm saying.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The dynamic that you and HP have, you both compliment

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Speaker 2: each other really well.

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Speaker 4: HP. You are calm and you.

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Speaker 2: Are a little more gentle and Haley, you are just

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Speaker 2: a like you're a bulldog. You get in there and

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Speaker 2: you just like say what you need to say. You're

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Speaker 2: not afraid to back down. And I think you ladies

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Speaker 2: compliment each other really well. And Haley, it makes sense

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Speaker 2: on why you and Melanie were so close because I

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Speaker 2: love mel and I think it's because she's a no

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Speaker 2: bullshit kind of person and she's going to stand up

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Speaker 2: for what she believes in. She's going to speak her mind,

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Speaker 2: and that's very much you as well, and then you

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Speaker 2: have the tenderness of HP Haley's thank you so much

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Speaker 2: for joining us on this episode of Forgive Me for

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Speaker 2: I have followed.

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Speaker 3: I do appreciate getting to hear all the different angles

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Speaker 3: and sides because I only was able to see it

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Speaker 3: from one point of view for so long. So this

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Speaker 3: has been such an eye opening experience and such a

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Speaker 3: healing experience for me.

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Speaker 2: We appreciate you both, and is there anything that you

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Speaker 2: want to say before we wrap this up?

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Speaker 6: The only thing I want to say is that Miranda Beatas,

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Speaker 6: Slavic Reino, Kindra, and Titus are still all in there

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Speaker 6: and also other members, So just keep spreading the word,

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Speaker 6: put it on social media, tell your friends, have people

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Speaker 6: watch the documentaries so we can get these cults gone, Get.

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Speaker 4: Out of here, no mass.

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Speaker 2: We'd like to thank Katie Joi and the Halees for

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Speaker 2: joining us today and sharing their incredib insight into the

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Speaker 2: powerful journey of exposing the truth about Robert Schin and

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Speaker 2: the allegations of manipulation in his church. Their in wavering

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Speaker 2: commitment to helping survivors and uncovering the truth despite facing

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Speaker 2: significant challenges is truly inspiring. We wish them continued success

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Speaker 2: in their mission and in their fight for justice. Don't

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Speaker 2: forget to follow, stop culting, exposing seven m and without

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Speaker 2: a Crystal Ball to stay updated on their important work.

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Speaker 4: This is Forgive Me For I Have Followed. We'll be

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Speaker 4: back soon.

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Speaker 7: Forgive Me For I Have Followed is a production from

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Speaker 7: wv Sound, Dirty Robert and iHeartMedia's Michael Tore podcast Network,

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Speaker 7: hosted by me Kalia Gray and me Jess Cossovetto. Forgive

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Speaker 7: Me For I Have Followed is produced by Aaron Burlson

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Speaker 7: and Sophie Spencer Zavos.

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Speaker 2: Our executive producers are Khalia Gray, Myself Warmer Balderama, Leo

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Speaker 2: Klem and Aaron Burlison at WV Sound.

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Speaker 7: This episode was edited by Sean Tracy and features original

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Speaker 7: music by Madison Davenport and Halo Boy. For more podcasts

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Speaker 7: from iHeart, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

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Speaker 7: you listen to your favorite shows.

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Speaker 2: See you next week, See you next week,