WEBVTT - Ep. 182: The Donnie Baker Story - Dark Decade (Part 2) 0:00:05.440 --> 0:00:07.240 And she said, have you ever got a second opinion? 0:00:08.080 --> 0:00:11.000 And I said, no, I've considered it. At that time, 0:00:11.080 --> 0:00:13.000 I was trying to get them cut it off. I could 0:00:13.039 --> 0:00:14.520 get it round, and you cut it off. I cut 0:00:14.560 --> 0:00:16.800 your leg off. Yeah, it was blue. It wasn't getting circulation. 0:00:16.880 --> 0:00:19.560 It had staff in it and nobody knew it, and 0:00:19.960 --> 0:00:22.159 the hardware had the bone locked the wrong direction. My 0:00:22.160 --> 0:00:23.640 foot was pointing straight to the right. 0:00:24.640 --> 0:00:27.400 In Part one of the Donnie Baker story, we heard 0:00:27.480 --> 0:00:30.840 the first hand account of the poaching of a two 0:00:31.000 --> 0:00:34.440 hundred and four inch drop time Missouri whitetail on the 0:00:34.479 --> 0:00:38.360 Fort Leonardwood Military base in central Missouri. In Part two, 0:00:38.600 --> 0:00:41.839 we'll hear the rest of the story about the spring 0:00:42.040 --> 0:00:46.080 of the coiled jaws of justice that finds in punishment. 0:00:46.840 --> 0:00:49.680 I have no doubt that the severity of it will 0:00:49.720 --> 0:00:54.200 surprise you. But after that we'll expand our vision to 0:00:54.360 --> 0:00:58.720 a larger story of the decade following the event. Two 0:00:58.720 --> 0:01:03.240 thousand and nine to twenty nineteen were a downward cascade, 0:01:03.360 --> 0:01:07.880 rife with tragedy for Donnie and his family. Unrelated to wildlife, 0:01:07.920 --> 0:01:12.080 crime and punishment, every headline that involves a human life 0:01:12.160 --> 0:01:16.560 is easily minimized into a SoundBite or a myopic label 0:01:17.080 --> 0:01:21.640 absence of context. And don't worry. This isn't a justification 0:01:21.959 --> 0:01:25.200 of an egregious crime, but a zoom out to a 0:01:25.240 --> 0:01:30.160 bigger story. Honestly, if this podcast was just about hunting 0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:34.480 or history, we'd have stopped at episode one when Donnie 0:01:34.520 --> 0:01:38.560 confessed to the crime, end of story. But as I 0:01:38.680 --> 0:01:42.560 talked with him and saw his openness regarding his failure, 0:01:43.080 --> 0:01:47.800 a larger question arose. Why was he so willing to 0:01:47.840 --> 0:01:50.640 share a story That was a big question that I 0:01:50.720 --> 0:01:54.680 had and I would be surprised at his answer, and 0:01:54.760 --> 0:01:58.520 I think you will too. I hope this story helps 0:01:58.560 --> 0:02:02.280 solidify in our hunting culture a deeper respect for wildlife, 0:02:02.680 --> 0:02:06.760 wild places, and the law. I have zero tolerance for 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:11.640 deliberate law breaking, but this story really isn't about that. 0:02:12.520 --> 0:02:16.760 It's about the human life behind every headline, and I 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:19.119 really doubt that you're gonna want to miss this one. 0:02:19.720 --> 0:02:21.960 We get my truck on sixty three, coming from VISI. 0:02:22.080 --> 0:02:24.120 I've known the road. Angela hasn't said a word. 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:27.320 We get almost the vienna and she just looks over 0:02:27.360 --> 0:02:30.040 at me and says, I'll give my wedding dress money 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:32.160 and marry you on the Ballfield and Dixon if you'll 0:02:32.200 --> 0:02:33.080 go back and get that dough. 0:02:43.280 --> 0:02:45.960 My name is Clay Nukem, and this is the Bear 0:02:46.040 --> 0:02:51.000 Grease podcast where we'll explore things forgotten but relevant, search 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:54.720 for insight and unlikely places, and where we'll tell the 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:57.440 story of Americans who live their. 0:02:57.280 --> 0:02:58.840 Lives close to the land. 0:02:59.520 --> 0:03:04.639 Presented by f h F Gear, American made purpose built 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:08.280 hunting and fishing gear that's designed to be as rugged 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:09.080 as the place. 0:03:09.120 --> 0:03:19.720 As we explore on the last episode of. 0:03:19.639 --> 0:03:23.120 Bear Grease, through the rest of the summer, seen him, 0:03:23.200 --> 0:03:25.560 I think six times, always in the same place with 0:03:25.680 --> 0:03:28.320 that deer done. He lived in a little little block 0:03:28.360 --> 0:03:31.840 of brush behind the dining facility. I never seen it 0:03:31.880 --> 0:03:34.639 in a legal hunting area. The first time I seen him, 0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:37.040 I was one hundred p cent suries two hundred inch deer, 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:39.000 which I'd never seen a while deer with two hundred 0:03:39.040 --> 0:03:42.119 inch and still at that time wanted to kill this deer. 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:48.840 Right October fourth of nine, and as I'm driving down 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:52.240 Army Street, I looked to my left and he's standing 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:54.680 where I've seen him two or three times, and I thought, 0:03:54.720 --> 0:03:57.600 good grief, So I pulled down to those porta potties, 0:03:58.080 --> 0:03:59.480 and I thought, right, I thought I could kill it 0:03:59.480 --> 0:04:02.200 deer right there. So I draw my bow back and 0:04:02.280 --> 0:04:04.040 he's still just standing there. I mean, he's looking right 0:04:04.080 --> 0:04:05.920 at me. I know that if I can fall it 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:09.960 into his front end, high success rate killing him. And 0:04:10.240 --> 0:04:12.680 I put that pen right underneath his nose, just right 0:04:12.720 --> 0:04:13.920 about the top of his white. 0:04:13.720 --> 0:04:14.680 Patch and turn it loose. 0:04:15.680 --> 0:04:17.680 And like I said, it was just kind of I 0:04:17.720 --> 0:04:19.479 don't know if you ever when you was a kid 0:04:19.480 --> 0:04:22.240 shot at a bird on a tree, setting in a 0:04:22.240 --> 0:04:24.039 tree or something, just kind of and then when you 0:04:24.080 --> 0:04:26.240 do kill, you think, oh, man, that's kind of what I. 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:26.800 Went through there. 0:04:27.160 --> 0:04:30.400 And immediately I thought there's no way that I'm going 0:04:30.400 --> 0:04:31.039 to get away with this. 0:04:32.960 --> 0:04:35.839 Good evening. The crime was shocking, the verdict dramatic. The 0:04:35.920 --> 0:04:39.679 trial of O. J. Simpson is over. He is not guilty. 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:45.840 Correspondent Bill Whitaker begins our coverage of the day's events. Here, Simpson, 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:48.560 would you please stand and face the jury in a. 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:51.080 Matter of the people of the State of California versus 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:54.320 Oorenthal James Simpson, Case number B A zero nine seven 0:04:54.600 --> 0:04:57.280 two one one. We the jury and the embuffding title 0:04:57.360 --> 0:05:01.440 action find the defendant Orenthal Simpson not guilty of a 0:05:01.520 --> 0:05:04.359 crime of murder in violation of penal cult Section one 0:05:04.480 --> 0:05:07.880 eighty seven a a felony upon Nicole Brownson. 0:05:15.279 --> 0:05:18.520 As a society, we're very interested in the juncture of 0:05:18.560 --> 0:05:22.760 where crime and punishment meet. Were interested in the delivery 0:05:22.760 --> 0:05:28.279 of justice, whether extreme or lenient, were all ears. The 0:05:28.360 --> 0:05:31.520 oj Simpson verdict in nineteen ninety five was one of 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:35.480 the most watched television clips in American history, and at 0:05:35.520 --> 0:05:39.400 the end of episode one of the Donnie Baker story, 0:05:39.880 --> 0:05:43.880 Donnie was in a room on Fort Leonard Wood, surrounded 0:05:43.880 --> 0:05:48.200 by multiple game wardens, a polyograph man, and an expert 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:50.880 on determining the time of death who was brought in 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:53.200 to analyze a photo of the dead buck that was 0:05:53.200 --> 0:05:57.080 posted online. In a way, this was the jury who 0:05:57.120 --> 0:06:00.760 met to deliver Donnie his sentence if he was willing. 0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:02.200 To settle outside of court. 0:06:03.040 --> 0:06:07.080 We ended episode one with Donnie confessing to killing the 0:06:07.120 --> 0:06:11.039 buck in a contonement area not open to hunting, then 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:14.039 sneaking the buck off the base in Mary's County and 0:06:14.200 --> 0:06:17.680 falsifying that he'd killed the buck in Pulaski County. We're 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:21.840 going to go slightly backward to just before the confession. 0:06:22.640 --> 0:06:26.840 Let's jump right in with Donnie, and very quickly we'll 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:28.760 hear what the punishment was. 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:35.359 Brace yourself right out of the gate. Aaron said, I 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:37.479 don't believe you killed that deer anywhere, but right here, 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:40.800 you know, just straightforward, which I respect him to be 0:06:40.880 --> 0:06:44.200 that kind of person. In case he just kept turning none, 0:06:44.400 --> 0:06:46.440 you're caught. We got pictures of it on Fort Larner. 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:49.120 Would they knew exactly how many miles it was from 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:51.159 where that deer picture was to where I had claimed 0:06:51.200 --> 0:06:52.000 to have killed that deer. 0:06:52.400 --> 0:06:54.120 I mean, they had enough evidence. 0:06:53.800 --> 0:06:55.960 And they no way the deer could have traveled that far. 0:06:56.080 --> 0:06:59.000 No, it had to swim the Gasconade River in miles 0:06:59.000 --> 0:07:01.400 to different county. And I thought, I have to I 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:03.520 have to stick it. If somebody had been with me 0:07:03.640 --> 0:07:04.960 or seeing me, if a car would have pulled in 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:07.120 there and seen me eleven or something, I knew i'd 0:07:07.120 --> 0:07:09.119 have meant. But I don't think you body see anything 0:07:09.120 --> 0:07:11.000 other than the blood on the tail gate, and it 0:07:11.040 --> 0:07:13.080 hadn't come up, so I knew that that was or 0:07:13.160 --> 0:07:13.960 figured that that was in. 0:07:14.640 --> 0:07:16.600 So they write the ticket out. 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:18.080 They told me they was going to confiscate the deer 0:07:18.360 --> 0:07:20.760 and I would have to plead it in court, well, 0:07:21.280 --> 0:07:23.600 going through the gates of Fort Learn with federal installation. 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:26.320 When you're in question, you're more guilty than tell you're 0:07:26.320 --> 0:07:29.200 proven innocent. It's a privilege to work and hunt out there, 0:07:29.200 --> 0:07:31.760 it's not you know, they don't owe you. So they said, 0:07:31.800 --> 0:07:33.480 here's the deal. We know you killed that deer here, 0:07:33.880 --> 0:07:34.680 and we can tell you're. 0:07:34.560 --> 0:07:34.960 Going to fight. 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:38.360 What our ticket will be. It's one hundred and fourteen 0:07:38.440 --> 0:07:40.520 dollars falsifying TeleCheck ticket. 0:07:40.680 --> 0:07:41.880 That means that you. 0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:44.680 Didn't do anything wrong other than checking it into the 0:07:44.720 --> 0:07:48.160 wrong county, which means that we'll confiscate that deer. But Donnie, 0:07:48.160 --> 0:07:50.280 you can you can go to work tomorrow, you can 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:52.280 go hunt out here tomorrow. But we know that deer 0:07:52.360 --> 0:07:53.800 is illegal, and this is the ticket that we're going 0:07:53.880 --> 0:07:55.680 to give you and that'll be the end of it. 0:07:55.760 --> 0:07:58.880 We don't want to fight this forever. I said, So 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:01.720 if I played guilty this, it's one hundred and fourteen dollars, 0:08:01.920 --> 0:08:05.080 you're taking the deer. And they said yeah, And I said, 0:08:05.080 --> 0:08:08.160 I can hunt fish fort Land Woodn't bow Yes, And 0:08:08.480 --> 0:08:13.560 I said, I did, and I told them the whole story. 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:17.400 The antlers I'd put in my uncle's house. You know, 0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:19.640 I'd had some people tell me that they'll steal them 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:21.280 and everything and people find out where they're at. So, 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:22.840 knowing that I was going to be out of town, 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:25.880 it's late at night. It's ten thirty before I finally 0:08:25.880 --> 0:08:27.640 got out of there, and they said, all right, go. 0:08:27.600 --> 0:08:29.240 Get those antlers. And I said, those are. 0:08:29.080 --> 0:08:32.080 In my uncle will be in bed, They're in his basement. 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:35.360 And I hadn't he didn't know the real story either. 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:38.319 I said, I'm not going to do anything. They said, listen, 0:08:38.360 --> 0:08:40.440 if you break those antlers or do something with them, 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:44.240 we're going to charge you again for whatever. In Casey said, 0:08:44.240 --> 0:08:45.520 what time do you want to meet? And we set 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:47.360 up a date in the early afternoon, and he said 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:49.120 that's fine, and he told the other agents. He said, 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:51.040 he said he's going to do that, don't worry about it. 0:08:51.280 --> 0:08:53.960 And Casey showed up and then he just he took 0:08:54.000 --> 0:08:57.080 the antlers, and I felt like it was a relief, 0:08:57.120 --> 0:08:58.640 other than having to tell all the people in the 0:08:58.679 --> 0:09:01.720 area that I'd like to. Of course, news had already 0:09:01.720 --> 0:09:03.960 traveled in that day almost as fast as the deer. 0:09:04.360 --> 0:09:08.040 Of course, the stories were just out of control. They 0:09:08.120 --> 0:09:10.920 told that I'd spotlighted off the roof of the hospital 0:09:10.960 --> 0:09:14.040 with a rifle, and it was insane the stuff that 0:09:14.160 --> 0:09:17.560 was told. But behind the scenes, somebody took a picture 0:09:17.559 --> 0:09:19.720 of that deer and put it on the Internet, and 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:21.880 it was called Mary's County Monster, because that's the county 0:09:21.920 --> 0:09:22.520 that I checked it in. 0:09:22.559 --> 0:09:24.959 It was actually killing Blaska County for learning one. 0:09:25.000 --> 0:09:28.560 And that page had gained a lot of traction, especially 0:09:28.600 --> 0:09:31.160 since one of the agents put that they'd recovered the deer, 0:09:31.280 --> 0:09:33.640 what have you. They didn't bash me on there, but 0:09:33.720 --> 0:09:34.760 everybody else in the world. 0:09:34.840 --> 0:09:35.679 Did you know? 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:37.640 There was stuff on there saying that I was a 0:09:37.679 --> 0:09:40.640 prior convicted fella, and people claimed to see me have 0:09:40.679 --> 0:09:43.080 done stuff that I've never done, which was a lot 0:09:43.120 --> 0:09:47.240 of noise around the agents and Fort Lender would So 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:49.040 a week or so went by. 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:50.240 I went in one morning. 0:09:50.600 --> 0:09:53.000 When I opened up my email, the lead officer at 0:09:53.000 --> 0:09:56.000 Fortland woud Bill Force had emailed me the night before 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:58.319 and said, hey, when you get in, email me or 0:09:58.360 --> 0:09:59.280 call me at this number. 0:10:00.400 --> 0:10:03.720 Remember Donnie worked on Fort Leonard Wood as the archery 0:10:03.760 --> 0:10:06.920 pro at the fort owned bow shop, so he had 0:10:06.920 --> 0:10:08.360 to go on to the base every day. 0:10:09.160 --> 0:10:11.160 So I called him and so he come out there 0:10:11.720 --> 0:10:13.920 and I don't want to misspeak of where the paper 0:10:13.920 --> 0:10:16.240 were come from, but I paid one hundred and fourteen 0:10:16.280 --> 0:10:17.880 dollars fine, which is the finalization. 0:10:17.960 --> 0:10:20.000 I guess I've admitting the gil. And as soon as 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:21.319 I'd done that, the. 0:10:21.400 --> 0:10:25.000 MPs had barred me from Fort Leondarwood for life and 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:28.720 my hunting privileges were evoked. And I said, well, Bill, 0:10:28.760 --> 0:10:31.960 you said that I am. He said, well, this hasn't 0:10:32.080 --> 0:10:33.920 anything to do with the conservation. 0:10:34.080 --> 0:10:35.360 This is the MPs. 0:10:35.920 --> 0:10:38.240 So I had through Christmas, my job through Christmas, and 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:43.360 it's right out of November now, and truthfully, me being 0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:45.560 a civilian, they didn't want to see me. They didn't 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:46.040 care about it. 0:10:46.080 --> 0:10:46.320 Deer. 0:10:46.480 --> 0:10:48.079 You know, if I'd done something enough to getting that 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:51.520 much trouble over deer and good luck pretty well. I 0:10:51.559 --> 0:10:54.480 talked to multiple people, tried to talk to state representatives, 0:10:54.559 --> 0:10:56.920 and I wasn't trying to get my hunting privileges back 0:10:56.920 --> 0:10:58.960 at all. I just wanted to keep the job. He's 0:10:58.960 --> 0:11:01.600 a phenomenal job. I didn't realize that until I realized 0:11:01.600 --> 0:11:04.679 it's going to be taken away. So I was contacted 0:11:05.320 --> 0:11:07.840 by somebody in the military and said, you can't lose 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:09.720 your job over this because you weren't at work and 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:11.840 it didn't put another person's life in danger. So I 0:11:11.840 --> 0:11:14.440 tried to go that direction and they said, well, no, 0:11:14.559 --> 0:11:17.160 you don't have to lose your job, but when MP's 0:11:17.200 --> 0:11:19.600 borrow you from Fort Lenderwood you can't come to work, 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:20.840 then you do. 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:27.600 It's pretty easy to see what happened here, as multiple 0:11:27.640 --> 0:11:32.040 agencies overlapped in jurisdiction. A person could be torn because 0:11:32.040 --> 0:11:34.960 it sounds like he was misled to get the confession. 0:11:35.600 --> 0:11:38.760 But you can't justify a feeling bad for someone being 0:11:38.880 --> 0:11:42.920 misled when they themselves were the ones who started the line. 0:11:43.559 --> 0:11:47.120 He fought the law and the law won. But it's 0:11:47.160 --> 0:11:48.679 just interesting to see how it. 0:11:48.640 --> 0:11:49.320 All went down. 0:11:50.200 --> 0:11:53.560 But what we haven't talked about yet is the giant 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:58.200 white mast don in the room. Mastadons are even more 0:11:58.200 --> 0:12:02.800 glaring than elephants, and that's the one hundred and fourteen dollars. Fine, 0:12:03.640 --> 0:12:05.959 I'm hearing this story for the first time. As I'm 0:12:06.000 --> 0:12:09.600 sitting across from Donnie in his home. I figured he 0:12:09.679 --> 0:12:11.720 was going to tell me they find him twenty grand, 0:12:11.800 --> 0:12:14.040 took away his truck and put him in jail for 0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:17.800 thirty days. I had to ask Donnie what he thought 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:21.920 about the fine, the punishment that you got being one 0:12:21.960 --> 0:12:23.280 hundred and fourteen dollars ticket. 0:12:23.400 --> 0:12:24.720 If that's what the world would see. 0:12:24.720 --> 0:12:27.040 They wouldn't see that you lost your job and affected 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:28.720 your life and all this stuff down the road. They 0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:31.760 would see you killed this tutorach deer and got a 0:12:31.760 --> 0:12:33.640 one hundred and fourteen dollars ticket and would say that 0:12:33.679 --> 0:12:38.120 it was like massively unjust. I would agree, Why did 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:41.439 you get off so easy in terms of actual fines 0:12:41.520 --> 0:12:42.559 and jail. 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:45.000 And all that. I think I got off that easy. 0:12:45.720 --> 0:12:48.160 I'm sure that if I'd shot it with again in 0:12:48.240 --> 0:12:52.080 bo season, or spotlighted and shot it or anything like that, 0:12:52.120 --> 0:12:53.720 it would have been completely different. 0:12:54.600 --> 0:12:56.000 So you think the fact that you killed it with 0:12:56.040 --> 0:12:59.440 a bow during an open season in the state like 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:00.920 there was some factors. 0:13:00.600 --> 0:13:02.800 That made it. I think that made a huge difference. 0:13:03.000 --> 0:13:04.920 If you heard of a guy killing a tutor ince 0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:07.280 deer like that, would you want them to get a 0:13:07.280 --> 0:13:08.840 bigger punishment other than. 0:13:08.720 --> 0:13:11.280 One hundred and fourteen dollars ticket. Oh, if it was 0:13:11.320 --> 0:13:12.400 somewhere I was hunting, I'd. 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:14.720 Be frustrated as heck, yeah, no doubt. 0:13:14.720 --> 0:13:18.080 I mean you couldn't say, yeah, if I was hunting 0:13:18.280 --> 0:13:20.920 a world class deer and somebody shot it. 0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:22.840 Illegally, I would be fit to be tight. 0:13:23.200 --> 0:13:24.840 And then if they got one hundred and fourteen dollars 0:13:24.840 --> 0:13:26.480 ticket and that was it, I really would have been Matt. 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:32.160 This took place fourteen years ago, and I'm convinced in 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:35.200 modern times the punishment would have been much more severe. 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:39.080 In most states today, there is a poacher's trophy fee, 0:13:39.360 --> 0:13:43.319 where larger animals bring higher fines, often charged by the 0:13:43.360 --> 0:13:48.600 inch of antler. I had someone in law enforcement contact me, 0:13:49.120 --> 0:13:54.440 completely unconnected from Donnie's case, just a listener, speculating that 0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:58.440 they really didn't have that much hard evidence against Donnie 0:13:58.600 --> 0:14:01.160 and wanted to make it easy for him to confess 0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:05.240 because they might have a difficult time convicting him in court. 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:09.120 Hard evidence could be video of a bloody tailgate as 0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:12.240 Donnie left the base that night, or an eyewitnessed who 0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:15.920 saw him load the deer in his truck. To my knowledge, 0:14:15.960 --> 0:14:18.840 the only evidence they had was the picture of the 0:14:18.880 --> 0:14:22.920 buck on Fort Leonard Wood, But I'm completely speculating. I 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:26.760 don't know what evidence they had, and for transparency's sake, 0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:29.240 i'll let you know that I did contact the Missouri 0:14:29.320 --> 0:14:32.960 Department of Conservation hoping to talk with the officers who 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:36.280 worked the case, but it just wasn't possible, which I 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:40.600 completely respect. I was graciously contacted by a high level 0:14:40.600 --> 0:14:44.520 official in the department who answered multiple questions for me, 0:14:44.960 --> 0:14:47.840 and I was very grateful for that. I've always been 0:14:47.880 --> 0:14:52.280 impressed by the Missouri Department of Conservation. The trend of 0:14:52.320 --> 0:14:57.120 the hunting world is moving away from culturally glamorizing wildlife violators. 0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:01.040 I'm not talking about hunting media glad glamorizing them. 0:15:01.400 --> 0:15:03.760 That would be rare. I'm talking about. 0:15:03.600 --> 0:15:08.280 Behind closed doors, around campfires and in family circles. 0:15:08.960 --> 0:15:10.600 I am exposed to a lot. 0:15:10.400 --> 0:15:12.880 Of the hunting community in a ton of different places, 0:15:13.080 --> 0:15:17.080 and I'm amazed in twenty twenty four what my ears 0:15:17.160 --> 0:15:20.680 here and how laxed people can be towards adherence to 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:24.000 the law and how they handle it even in conversations, 0:15:24.280 --> 0:15:27.280 and those are the things that build culture, and I 0:15:27.320 --> 0:15:29.600 hope that in no way the work that I'm doing 0:15:29.720 --> 0:15:32.640 here could be portrayed as such. And I think it 0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:35.240 would be a stretch to say it was. I'm telling 0:15:35.280 --> 0:15:37.720 this story because we can learn a lot from it. 0:15:38.160 --> 0:15:42.640 I'm interested in human stories that overlap wild places. Some 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:46.000 are positive, some are negative. I'm interested too, in the 0:15:46.080 --> 0:15:50.120 hunting community banding together to preserve wildlife, wild places and 0:15:50.160 --> 0:15:53.080 our right to hunt, and this demand strict adherence to 0:15:53.160 --> 0:15:57.760 the law. I'm also for stricter punishment for wildlife violators, 0:15:58.200 --> 0:16:03.000 especially repeat offenders. Let's get back into our story. Here's 0:16:03.040 --> 0:16:07.240 more from Donnie on the aftermath of the confession. And 0:16:07.320 --> 0:16:11.800 remember we're getting to the question of why was Donnie 0:16:11.800 --> 0:16:12.800 willing to talk to me? 0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:17.600 And people everything you could imagine. I had people come 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:19.080 in to work at that time telling me how no 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:21.680 good I was, and they hoped that I'd never get back. 0:16:22.000 --> 0:16:23.480 And then other guys come and say, Manny and by 0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:25.880 shot that deer. You know, So it was all over 0:16:25.880 --> 0:16:26.280 the place. 0:16:26.320 --> 0:16:29.800 But I'm still watching this page, and that's what that 0:16:29.960 --> 0:16:31.880 wasn't a good thing for me to do. It started 0:16:31.880 --> 0:16:34.160 getting depressed already, and I mean I hadn't even lost 0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:36.400 my job quite yet, but there was a lot of 0:16:36.440 --> 0:16:39.320 hate out there. I mean, people can really really say 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:42.160 some mean stuff. I'm sure you being what you are there. 0:16:42.560 --> 0:16:46.680 It's amazing What people say, what did you learn from this? Well, 0:16:47.800 --> 0:16:50.080 it's a I'll always say, and I said before and 0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:53.880 I'll say after. I really believe that that hunters are 0:16:53.920 --> 0:16:56.720 the most greedy group of people there is. If it's 0:16:56.720 --> 0:16:59.560 a goblin turkey, or a good buck, or just even 0:16:59.560 --> 0:17:03.840 a a good loaded white oak acren tree. I learned 0:17:04.200 --> 0:17:09.400 not to claim, you know those deer, those those aren't ours, 0:17:10.000 --> 0:17:12.760 and just to do it. What I learned was and 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:16.399 what if I didn't kill that deer like that? What 0:17:16.520 --> 0:17:18.720 if November first that that buck run a dough but 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:21.560 I mean I killed it right, you know, or anybody else? 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:24.360 You know, what if a thirteen year old kid killed 0:17:24.359 --> 0:17:26.840 that deer with both you know, that'd been pretty amazing. 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:29.520 Or if nobody killed it? What was that buck bred 0:17:29.560 --> 0:17:32.119 fifteen dough in his life? You know, good high quality 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:33.200 do and what would be there now? 0:17:33.760 --> 0:17:34.600 And it was? 0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:36.600 It was a black guy that I still carry today. 0:17:37.240 --> 0:17:39.240 I mean, you can talk to three people in Fort 0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:41.359 Lendwood right now. Somebody tell you some type of story 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:42.000 about that deer. 0:17:42.600 --> 0:17:42.800 You know. 0:17:44.000 --> 0:17:47.520 The issue is the main issue is I knew better 0:17:47.760 --> 0:17:50.159 but not only did I know better. I explained to 0:17:50.200 --> 0:17:52.280 people that come on Fort Leonard would where you can 0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:55.320 and can't hunt? I knew and almost still do today. 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:57.639 Some of that stuff changed, but I knew to the 0:17:57.720 --> 0:17:59.840 foot of where you were allowed to hunt. There was 0:17:59.880 --> 0:18:02.240 no excuse about any of that. I knew for a 0:18:02.280 --> 0:18:04.880 fact that that deer not only couldn't be killed there, 0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:06.040 he was going to have to be a quarter of 0:18:06.040 --> 0:18:07.600 a mile from there before you could hunt him. Right, 0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:11.680 something about just actually know when he was a two 0:18:11.760 --> 0:18:14.560 hundred inch deer, and just thinking for some reason that 0:18:14.560 --> 0:18:16.159 that was going to be my right of passage to 0:18:16.200 --> 0:18:18.280 be the guy known as a as a good hunter. 0:18:19.119 --> 0:18:21.760 So, I mean, I guess that would just be ego? 0:18:22.240 --> 0:18:22.760 Is that right? 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:24.760 It happened, I mean, that's to be the only thing 0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:27.439 good men. Yeah, had to be me thinking about me, 0:18:28.000 --> 0:18:30.880 and not that I was not wanting anybody yet. 0:18:30.880 --> 0:18:31.679 Well, I guess I was. 0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:34.120 I was worried that somebody else was gonna kill that deer. Yeah, 0:18:34.240 --> 0:18:37.200 you know, And and that was a rough way to 0:18:37.280 --> 0:18:39.960 learn something like that. But I'm one of the least 0:18:40.040 --> 0:18:44.719 jealous people about deer that I know. You know today, yes, today, 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:47.439 At that time, I didn't realize how jealous I was 0:18:47.480 --> 0:18:50.080 about that until it hit me in the face. 0:18:50.160 --> 0:18:53.920 You know, let's just take a minute and let all 0:18:53.960 --> 0:18:57.760 that settle in. Donnie paid the fine, lost his job, 0:18:58.160 --> 0:19:02.240 and his reputation was tarnished by the crime. Donnie's saying 0:19:02.320 --> 0:19:05.399 that hunters are the most jealous people on planet Earth 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:08.600 hurts me down deep in the gizzard. I view the 0:19:08.640 --> 0:19:13.440 hunting community through rose colored glasses. Sometimes not all are jealous. 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:14.840 The people can be. 0:19:15.200 --> 0:19:17.919 It's our job in modern times to change that in 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:21.960 our culture. In the last episode, we explored what as 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:25.480 a society that we expect or demand of people who 0:19:25.520 --> 0:19:29.360 mess up, and in short, we learned that a sincere apology, 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:33.440 rife with remorse and compelling evidence that the person wouldn't 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:38.320 do it again, goes a long way justifying actions. Blame 0:19:38.400 --> 0:19:42.919 shifting or lack of humility are sniffed out quickly like 0:19:42.960 --> 0:19:47.800 an unseen but potent pheromone. I have another question for Donnie. 0:19:49.960 --> 0:19:53.679 So in the Hunt, you're familiar enough with the hunting community. 0:19:54.040 --> 0:19:58.200 We've all heard you've heard stories of guy's killing an 0:19:58.200 --> 0:20:02.840 animal illegally. Yeah, what's the first thing you think when 0:20:02.880 --> 0:20:06.040 you hear about a guy killing a deer, And I 0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:07.639 mean this goes without saying. 0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:09.760 I mean what you did was more than just like. 0:20:09.840 --> 0:20:13.600 It wasn't like you messed up and did something on accident, 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:16.040 like this was an egregious thing. 0:20:16.119 --> 0:20:18.440 You made a choice to do. It was blatant. I mean, 0:20:18.480 --> 0:20:19.560 there was no question. 0:20:19.920 --> 0:20:23.960 So when you hear a story of such and such 0:20:23.960 --> 0:20:27.080 a guy killing the deer illegally, what do you think? 0:20:28.160 --> 0:20:29.639 I probably look at it a little different than a 0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:32.320 lot of people. I'm the last one to bash them. 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:35.920 I would think there's always two sides to something. And 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:37.440 like the buck that I kill, if I wanted to 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:39.520 proach it, I could have killed it many times before that. 0:20:39.800 --> 0:20:42.359 I'd been way better off to have went full out 0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:46.000 illegal and staged a place, prepared myself to kill it 0:20:46.040 --> 0:20:51.000 illegal instead of it just happening. But I still still 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:54.520 despise somebody killing fifteen turkeys in a season. I'm not 0:20:54.560 --> 0:20:57.800 gonna lie it makes me mad, or or everybody in 0:20:58.160 --> 0:21:00.520 their household getting a buck tag and then feel one 0:21:00.600 --> 0:21:03.520 guy feeling his whole family's deer tax. I'm still a 0:21:03.520 --> 0:21:06.600 hardcore against that. Noise have been and I'll be vocal 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:08.600 about being against killing a bunch of deer a bunch, 0:21:08.720 --> 0:21:10.960 and I got kids that like to hunt, and nieces 0:21:10.960 --> 0:21:14.720 and nephews, and I'm against that one hundred percent. But 0:21:15.280 --> 0:21:18.520 sometimes when when you see where somebody's got a deer 0:21:18.600 --> 0:21:21.680 removed and they find out that they shot it in 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:24.640 national force with rifle out the window, most people would 0:21:24.640 --> 0:21:25.760 say that that no good. 0:21:25.800 --> 0:21:26.119 Whatever. 0:21:26.640 --> 0:21:29.600 The first thing I think of was was he planning? 0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:32.000 Did he go out there with intent on driving around 0:21:32.080 --> 0:21:33.640 killing that deer? Or did it walk across the road 0:21:33.680 --> 0:21:36.159 and he'd hunted six days and hadn't seen anything and 0:21:36.240 --> 0:21:38.359 jumped and shot it. Do you think do you think 0:21:38.440 --> 0:21:41.000 that makes a difference from what I went You mean 0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:42.040 it being illegal? 0:21:42.320 --> 0:21:43.800 Well, I think. 0:21:43.720 --> 0:21:46.520 Because you're you're I see exactly what you're saying is 0:21:46.560 --> 0:21:51.720 that intent is important or it's not important, Like if 0:21:51.720 --> 0:21:53.439 you break the law, you break the law. But intent 0:21:53.840 --> 0:21:57.439 shows motivation. And what I'm hearing you say is that 0:21:57.560 --> 0:22:00.880 you didn't really have an intent to kill this deer, 0:22:01.040 --> 0:22:05.600 just an opportunity happened and somehow you cross that line 0:22:05.640 --> 0:22:09.919 real quick. Yeah, knowingly though, yeah, no, only I always 0:22:09.960 --> 0:22:12.280 look at it thinking that he or she go out 0:22:12.320 --> 0:22:14.720 there with one hundred percent intent of. 0:22:14.880 --> 0:22:18.200 Spotlighting that deer. I feel like that's worse as far 0:22:18.200 --> 0:22:21.000 as the law is concerned. It isn't illegal, is illegal. 0:22:21.800 --> 0:22:24.560 Sometimes we can get excited, man, it's something we all love. 0:22:24.760 --> 0:22:28.919 That's why you're here. We're passionate about hunting and the outdoors, 0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:34.000 and sometimes sometimes our passion makes us do some stupid stuff. 0:22:35.880 --> 0:22:40.760 Donnie isn't using legal terminology, but he's right. Intent does 0:22:40.880 --> 0:22:44.919 matter in the law and sentencing, and the research data 0:22:45.359 --> 0:22:51.400 intent is correlated with recidivism, meaning a person who commits 0:22:51.440 --> 0:22:54.840 a premeditated crime is more likely to do it again 0:22:55.440 --> 0:22:58.240 as compared to someone who acted on impulse. 0:22:58.920 --> 0:23:00.480 Now that doesn't give some I want a. 0:23:00.440 --> 0:23:04.080 License or justification to be weak and vulnerable to temptation. 0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:07.199 You may be able to cheat the law, but you 0:23:07.400 --> 0:23:11.919 can't cheat the system. Things earned the right way, beget 0:23:12.200 --> 0:23:16.280 the intangible things that comprise our character. I think there's 0:23:16.440 --> 0:23:20.920 incredible honor in doing the right thing when nobody's watching. 0:23:21.760 --> 0:23:23.159 Incredible honor. 0:23:28.920 --> 0:23:32.320 Now we're going to transition out of crime and punishment, 0:23:32.880 --> 0:23:35.359 and I'm going to ask the question I've been wanting 0:23:35.560 --> 0:23:39.440 answered this whole time. Why are you so open to 0:23:39.600 --> 0:23:41.119 telling this story to the world. 0:23:41.440 --> 0:23:44.680 Well, a few things that put a I skipped a 0:23:44.680 --> 0:23:47.359 lot that was pretty financially hard on my family. I 0:23:47.400 --> 0:23:49.360 had a lot of family step in and then I've 0:23:49.400 --> 0:23:53.520 been through way worse than that deer. I thought that 0:23:53.600 --> 0:23:55.720 was as bad as it could get that deer, having 0:23:55.760 --> 0:23:59.000 this world class deer taken away, just thought that I 0:23:59.160 --> 0:24:00.280 was as down as. 0:24:00.160 --> 0:24:03.960 A person can get. Right. I lost that John. 0:24:04.400 --> 0:24:07.360 I was known as a as an outlaw, still am 0:24:07.440 --> 0:24:09.240 a little bit today. 0:24:10.520 --> 0:24:13.359 I was surprised by his answer of why he was 0:24:13.359 --> 0:24:17.720 willing to talk. He'd been through way worse, he said, 0:24:18.480 --> 0:24:21.280 But I didn't really understand what he meant by that. 0:24:22.480 --> 0:24:26.400 Life is calibrated by a perspective, and perspective comes from 0:24:26.400 --> 0:24:30.760 our past. What we've lived through helps us respond to difficulty. 0:24:31.480 --> 0:24:35.200 The rest of his story isn't connected to him killing 0:24:35.240 --> 0:24:38.960 the deer, at least in any rational or natural pathway. 0:24:39.680 --> 0:24:42.879 But in Donnie's first correspondence with me, he told me 0:24:43.040 --> 0:24:46.080 his life began to unravel after he killed the buck. 0:24:46.800 --> 0:24:51.520 But strangely, it seemed that he viewed the unraveling as connected. 0:24:52.280 --> 0:24:56.280 In a person's life, it's hard to separate out isolated incidents. 0:24:56.800 --> 0:25:00.199 Events and time congeal into a glob for me, a 0:25:00.200 --> 0:25:06.479 singular journey, a coherent, unparsable, connected scene with incidents linked 0:25:06.520 --> 0:25:11.040 by cause and effect. If you do this, then this 0:25:11.080 --> 0:25:15.959 will happen. We feel safe by having a philosophy that 0:25:16.080 --> 0:25:20.720 garners guaranteed and predictable flow of events if certain rules 0:25:20.760 --> 0:25:25.240 are followed. However, the older I've gotten, I've learned that 0:25:25.359 --> 0:25:30.239 this isn't always true. Life often throws wild cards that 0:25:30.359 --> 0:25:33.760 are not earned by merit. When my wife and I 0:25:33.840 --> 0:25:36.920 got married, we jokingly said the mission of our marriage 0:25:36.960 --> 0:25:39.680 was to answer the question of why do bad things 0:25:39.720 --> 0:25:43.000 happen to good people. It was a joke, but it 0:25:43.040 --> 0:25:47.040 revealed a deep held philosophical position of many Americans and 0:25:47.119 --> 0:25:50.600 probably people across the world. Good things happen to good people, 0:25:50.920 --> 0:25:52.840 and bad things happen to bad people. 0:25:53.560 --> 0:25:55.560 It's complex because. 0:25:55.280 --> 0:25:59.120 Some things in life do elicit immediate recompense of good 0:25:59.160 --> 0:25:59.879 or bad fruit. 0:26:00.080 --> 0:26:01.000 That seems just. 0:26:01.640 --> 0:26:05.000 But other times life seems unfair, either in the direction 0:26:05.320 --> 0:26:08.919 of the prosperity of the wicked or the punishment of 0:26:08.960 --> 0:26:12.159 the righteous. It's one of the great mysteries of life. 0:26:13.240 --> 0:26:16.359 These things are on my mind as I hear the 0:26:16.400 --> 0:26:21.080 rest of Donnie's story on December twenty ninth, two thousand 0:26:21.119 --> 0:26:25.880 and nine, just two months after his confession, something terrible happened. 0:26:26.480 --> 0:26:27.959 Here's Donnie. 0:26:28.240 --> 0:26:32.360 Twenty ninth of December, A cousin of mine, Luke Fritchie, 0:26:32.359 --> 0:26:34.520 and my wife, which she was choosing as my fiance 0:26:34.640 --> 0:26:37.520 at the time, went rabbit hunting up towards Tipton Up 0:26:37.560 --> 0:26:39.960 and there we hunted the morning. Was on our way 0:26:39.960 --> 0:26:43.640 back and a guy I know that owns an excavator 0:26:43.920 --> 0:26:45.040 company called and. 0:26:44.960 --> 0:26:47.040 Said, Hey, are you looking for work? And I said, 0:26:47.080 --> 0:26:48.040 I definitely am right now. 0:26:48.080 --> 0:26:49.639 I don't know if I'll get back out there, but 0:26:50.119 --> 0:26:53.480 I need to do something like starting Monday. So I 0:26:53.560 --> 0:26:55.639 put them dogs up and dropped my wife and my 0:26:55.720 --> 0:26:59.359 cousin Lucas off. I headed to towards that guy's place, 0:26:59.359 --> 0:27:03.040 which was in Hey, Missouri, and I hit a slick 0:27:03.040 --> 0:27:06.280 spot right past the MM Highway on twenty eight. Wasn't 0:27:06.359 --> 0:27:09.520 running very fast driving an old jeep and lost it 0:27:09.560 --> 0:27:13.480 will run off in the gravel, and about the time 0:27:13.520 --> 0:27:15.440 I got it straightened up, I hit an oak tree 0:27:15.480 --> 0:27:17.520 head on by running forty five mile an hour and 0:27:17.560 --> 0:27:20.959 not didn't slow down any And when I hit that 0:27:21.040 --> 0:27:23.520 tree and just the ringing in the car and the 0:27:23.560 --> 0:27:26.560 steam rolling. I thought, good grief at first, zero pain, 0:27:27.280 --> 0:27:30.000 and I still had my overalls and hunting boots and 0:27:30.000 --> 0:27:33.080 stuff on. And it was the actual hood light from 0:27:33.119 --> 0:27:35.520 the hood being smashed in had come on and the 0:27:35.560 --> 0:27:37.399 steam rolling from the radiotor. I thought that thing was 0:27:37.440 --> 0:27:39.280 catching on fire. It looking flames, so I started to 0:27:39.280 --> 0:27:40.840 get out of it. When I stepped out on the ground, 0:27:40.840 --> 0:27:43.080 I just fell in the snow and I had a 0:27:43.160 --> 0:27:46.440 cordion fractured. My femur or butterfly broke a big chunk 0:27:46.480 --> 0:27:48.959 of it in the middle come out, and it was 0:27:49.160 --> 0:27:51.199 it was way off to the side of me in 0:27:51.280 --> 0:27:54.680 those overalls, and I grabbed that leg and slid back 0:27:54.680 --> 0:27:55.360 over straight. 0:27:55.800 --> 0:27:57.480 But I didn't feel the pain at all. 0:27:58.000 --> 0:28:00.960 Ambulance gets there and the first thing they did was 0:28:01.080 --> 0:28:03.159 go to cut these new overalls off of me, and 0:28:03.200 --> 0:28:05.760 I said, don't cut them overalls. So I fought with 0:28:05.800 --> 0:28:07.240 them for a while. When they went to try to 0:28:07.240 --> 0:28:09.520 take them off, I said, no, go ahead and cut them. 0:28:09.560 --> 0:28:12.399 So they trimmed all my overalls and my boots and 0:28:12.440 --> 0:28:15.280 stuff off of me. They rushed me to Rawla. I 0:28:15.359 --> 0:28:17.680 lost nine units of that. I guess that bone had 0:28:17.680 --> 0:28:20.480 cut a major artery in there. I passed out multiple 0:28:20.520 --> 0:28:22.600 times going to the hospital. They tied something on the 0:28:22.640 --> 0:28:25.040 end of my foot to keep that bone from moving 0:28:25.080 --> 0:28:28.080 cutting around there, so it's almost like a kettlebell tight 0:28:28.119 --> 0:28:29.840 on the end of your toes. With that, that was 0:28:29.840 --> 0:28:31.880 the most pain I've ever felt my life. Go around 0:28:31.880 --> 0:28:33.600 a corner that they could swing to one side then 0:28:33.640 --> 0:28:36.199 the other, and I mean I'd wake back up it. 0:28:36.240 --> 0:28:39.080 I was passing out. So when we get there, it was. 0:28:39.000 --> 0:28:42.520 Emergency surgery and they go in and I guess it 0:28:42.560 --> 0:28:43.680 was more dangerous than I realized. 0:28:43.680 --> 0:28:46.280 I was just thinking it was a broke leg. Anyway, 0:28:46.320 --> 0:28:46.880 they set. 0:28:46.720 --> 0:28:50.920 That bone back and it didn't set right. That started 0:28:50.920 --> 0:28:54.400 a whole new battle. It took thirteen surgeries to get 0:28:54.400 --> 0:28:58.400 that thing back right, with tearing acl redoing the meniscus, 0:28:58.400 --> 0:29:00.719 and all my tendons in my navy busted a time 0:29:00.840 --> 0:29:03.840 or two. How long is this after you were convicted 0:29:03.880 --> 0:29:06.080 of killing this deer right at the first of November? 0:29:06.200 --> 0:29:09.240 Was when I was just weeks after. Yeah, he killed 0:29:09.240 --> 0:29:10.880 this deer, yet this terrible car rock. 0:29:11.080 --> 0:29:14.000 Yeah, so I'm getting pretty down and out by now, 0:29:14.240 --> 0:29:16.560 and here I am in a wheelchair now can't walk. 0:29:16.840 --> 0:29:19.200 Every time I get a minute alone, I open up 0:29:19.240 --> 0:29:21.880 that stupid web page and read about how terrible a 0:29:21.880 --> 0:29:24.400 person I am, and uh, it got me in a 0:29:24.480 --> 0:29:27.760 dark spot. And did I had good family around me, 0:29:27.920 --> 0:29:30.760 you know, most of them forgave me, coming in, checking 0:29:30.800 --> 0:29:33.000 on me and what have you. But it was mentally 0:29:33.040 --> 0:29:37.200 a very, very tough time. One guy wrote on there 0:29:37.240 --> 0:29:38.920 that when they put it, I'd been a a I mean, 0:29:39.160 --> 0:29:41.000 they were putting my life on this on this web 0:29:41.000 --> 0:29:44.880 page of Mary's County monster couple. One guy on there 0:29:44.920 --> 0:29:48.640 said he gets everything he deserves. And you know, and 0:29:48.680 --> 0:29:50.560 those guys, some of them, some of them knew who 0:29:50.560 --> 0:29:52.000 they were, but some of them didn't know me. They're 0:29:52.080 --> 0:29:54.240 just just aggravated at me for killing this deer that 0:29:54.240 --> 0:29:56.120 they probably had a chance of kill her they were watching. 0:29:56.640 --> 0:29:59.000 You know, that deer got a lot of traction. 0:29:59.600 --> 0:30:01.000 You know, if it had been one hundred and ten 0:30:01.040 --> 0:30:04.040 inch eight point well I wouldn't have done that, but 0:30:04.040 --> 0:30:07.000 but it wouldn't have got that traction. Everybody in the 0:30:07.040 --> 0:30:10.120 state was all about that deer and other states. One 0:30:10.160 --> 0:30:13.520 of my nurses in Columbia knew who I was, said 0:30:13.560 --> 0:30:15.520 her kid had a picture of me and that deer, 0:30:16.040 --> 0:30:18.400 you know. And then she didn't know the rest of 0:30:18.440 --> 0:30:18.840 the story. 0:30:18.880 --> 0:30:25.120 I told her I had family bring We had only 0:30:25.160 --> 0:30:27.760 wood heat in that house. I had. I had multiple 0:30:27.800 --> 0:30:29.160 family members bringing loads of wood. 0:30:29.160 --> 0:30:29.240 You know. 0:30:29.280 --> 0:30:31.800 I couldn't cut anything. My dad was trying to work 0:30:31.800 --> 0:30:33.600 in his old shop, his coldest winter we'd had in 0:30:33.600 --> 0:30:35.600 a long time. And it was just it just getting 0:30:35.640 --> 0:30:39.640 me down. I mean it really was. And about six 0:30:39.680 --> 0:30:42.800 months in I got murcia infection in that bone and 0:30:42.960 --> 0:30:45.960 all kinds of issues. And that doctor told me he said, 0:30:46.600 --> 0:30:49.320 probably never walk again without an aid. And I was like, 0:30:49.360 --> 0:30:52.000 this isn't broken the lake. People break their legs every day, huh. 0:30:52.600 --> 0:30:57.120 And it was actually set wrong and just by coincidence. 0:30:58.160 --> 0:31:02.120 August seventh, we had a a softball tournament and a 0:31:02.160 --> 0:31:04.800 guy I went to school with wife comes walking up 0:31:04.800 --> 0:31:05.080 to me. 0:31:05.200 --> 0:31:06.000 I didn't know her. 0:31:06.320 --> 0:31:09.080 Her name's Kelly Alexander and she said, how long have 0:31:09.120 --> 0:31:12.040 you been fighting that leg? And I had been over 0:31:12.040 --> 0:31:14.040 a year, and she said, have you ever got a 0:31:14.080 --> 0:31:18.239 second opinion? And I said, no, I've considered it. At 0:31:18.280 --> 0:31:19.720 that time, I was trying to get him cut it off. 0:31:20.280 --> 0:31:21.640 I could get a run and you cut it off. 0:31:21.680 --> 0:31:22.520 I backed your leg off. 0:31:22.560 --> 0:31:24.720 Yeah, it was blue, it wasn't getting circulation, it had 0:31:24.760 --> 0:31:28.080 staff in it and nobody knew it, and the hardware 0:31:28.120 --> 0:31:29.560 had the bone locked around direction. 0:31:29.640 --> 0:31:31.200 My foot was pointed straight to the right. 0:31:32.360 --> 0:31:36.000 And she said, I worked for a doctor in Columbia orthopedics, 0:31:36.040 --> 0:31:37.840 and she said, I would love if you'd come have 0:31:37.960 --> 0:31:40.760 him look at that leg. And like the following Monday, 0:31:40.800 --> 0:31:42.680 she had me appointment a very hard doctor to get 0:31:42.720 --> 0:31:45.040 into and I mean, he's super intelligent guy. 0:31:45.480 --> 0:31:48.040 And I brought my paperwork with me. 0:31:48.440 --> 0:31:50.560 Was leaned up against crutches standing there because it hurt 0:31:50.600 --> 0:31:53.280 bad to sit down and write anywhere. And I'll never forget. 0:31:53.280 --> 0:31:54.800 They'd done a few X rays and went out and 0:31:54.800 --> 0:31:56.520 he came back in. He said sit down. I said, oh, 0:31:56.600 --> 0:31:58.200 I feel bettering. He said, I need you to sit down. 0:31:58.280 --> 0:32:01.800 That bone's not even touching and he said we're gonna 0:32:01.800 --> 0:32:06.040 have surgery this afternoon, and he started redoing the leg. 0:32:06.120 --> 0:32:07.920 I mean, I play a little ball now like Hunds 0:32:07.920 --> 0:32:11.280 hoar as I want to, and the fixed you he did. Yeah, 0:32:11.480 --> 0:32:13.960 just just blessing of you know this girl. I didn't 0:32:13.960 --> 0:32:14.480 even really know. 0:32:14.640 --> 0:32:14.880 Kelly. 0:32:14.880 --> 0:32:18.440 Alexander just said, I know where a good doctor is, 0:32:18.480 --> 0:32:21.640 you know, And I'm not blaming the first doctor. I 0:32:21.640 --> 0:32:24.040 think I was bleeding out when they put it together. 0:32:24.040 --> 0:32:24.640 I'm sure it was. 0:32:24.880 --> 0:32:28.040 A chaotic spot. Yeah, it's just just how it goes. 0:32:28.160 --> 0:32:30.840 But then when I got back on my feet, that 0:32:31.000 --> 0:32:34.280 started the happening to go start apologizing to people, and 0:32:34.320 --> 0:32:36.240 that was almost as hard as lying to him, knowing 0:32:36.240 --> 0:32:37.960 that you've done wrong and having to face them. 0:32:38.360 --> 0:32:44.040 You know, it's hard to imagine in Middle America in 0:32:44.160 --> 0:32:48.040 modern times, that fixing a broken leg could go so wrong. 0:32:48.840 --> 0:32:50.920 Did you hear him say that he was trying to 0:32:50.960 --> 0:32:54.719 get them to cut his leg off? A dark cloud 0:32:54.960 --> 0:32:59.440 seemed to descend over Donnie's life. He became depressed. Times 0:32:59.440 --> 0:33:03.760 were hard. It's wild that the boldness and concern of 0:33:03.800 --> 0:33:08.080 a stranger at a ballgame would change Donnie's life, as 0:33:08.120 --> 0:33:11.000 this lady helped him get an appointment with the doctor 0:33:11.160 --> 0:33:16.080 that fixed him the very afternoon of the appointment. But 0:33:16.200 --> 0:33:21.320 this was just the beginning. This next section will introduce 0:33:21.480 --> 0:33:24.720 us to a name we've heard a few times, Angela, 0:33:25.000 --> 0:33:28.840 who was at the time Donnie's fiance. This next story 0:33:28.880 --> 0:33:32.520 does a great job of painting a picture of their relationship, 0:33:33.400 --> 0:33:36.800 but don't forget that dark cloud. 0:33:37.600 --> 0:33:40.360 While I was crippled up. We've raised field Trout beagles 0:33:40.360 --> 0:33:43.400 for a long time UKC Beagles, and we've had a 0:33:43.400 --> 0:33:45.800 couple of good ones. My wife and I were playing 0:33:45.840 --> 0:33:49.760 on getting married in August, and she'd saved up money 0:33:49.760 --> 0:33:53.040 for a dress, and I mean we rubbing pennies raising 0:33:53.120 --> 0:33:56.680 two boys. It was tough, and she'd saved money for 0:33:56.760 --> 0:33:59.680 a year for a dress, and we had pretty well 0:33:59.680 --> 0:34:01.640 everything picked up. Of course, I wasn't helping it all. 0:34:01.640 --> 0:34:03.920 I'm sitting in a chair with my with my leg 0:34:03.920 --> 0:34:06.240 all wrapped up. I'm one hundred and thirty pounds. I 0:34:06.280 --> 0:34:08.000 was two hundred and ten pound, a pretty big guy 0:34:08.160 --> 0:34:10.400 when I had this accident. She had to carry me 0:34:10.440 --> 0:34:13.320 to the bathtub and back out. I mean, it was 0:34:13.719 --> 0:34:16.239 just like take care of a feeld little man. And 0:34:16.960 --> 0:34:18.960 Angela and my dad were still running kind of in 0:34:18.960 --> 0:34:22.360 the Points serieses of these UKC hunts. We were going 0:34:22.600 --> 0:34:24.160 and I would show a dog once in a while, 0:34:24.160 --> 0:34:25.640 but me and the boys would stay in the clubhouse 0:34:25.680 --> 0:34:28.960 and hang out. We were at a hunt down South 0:34:29.200 --> 0:34:31.279 and Amona come walking and she said, did you see 0:34:31.280 --> 0:34:34.319 this dog tied up out here and I said no, 0:34:34.760 --> 0:34:36.560 and she said, come look at this dogs. I'd get 0:34:36.640 --> 0:34:38.560 up and cripple out there, and it was the prettiest 0:34:38.560 --> 0:34:41.840 biggel I've ever seen, big old bold muscled up, I mean, 0:34:41.920 --> 0:34:42.719 had more muscle. 0:34:42.520 --> 0:34:45.000 Than being livers in your life. And she said, I 0:34:45.239 --> 0:34:47.480 want that dog, and I said, we can't afford that dog. 0:34:47.520 --> 0:34:48.279 There's no telling it. 0:34:48.960 --> 0:34:51.400 So when he gets in and she makes him go 0:34:51.480 --> 0:34:53.080 out there and show her the dog, and they talk 0:34:53.120 --> 0:34:53.400 about you. 0:34:53.520 --> 0:34:55.320 My wife's was crazy over beagles. 0:34:55.600 --> 0:34:57.759 Some people. I've heard more than one person say when 0:34:57.760 --> 0:34:59.000 I die, I wanted to come back as one of 0:34:59.000 --> 0:35:01.920 Angela Vicker's biggles. I mean, you know, they got dessert 0:35:01.960 --> 0:35:05.880 and everything. So she told him we were interested in 0:35:05.880 --> 0:35:08.040 getting that dog, and I had an idea what that 0:35:08.080 --> 0:35:10.319 dog it costs, and we couldn't afford it no way. 0:35:11.200 --> 0:35:12.759 A month or so goes by and he calls me 0:35:12.800 --> 0:35:14.879 at my house. He goes, hey, I'm thinking about selling 0:35:14.880 --> 0:35:15.279 that dog. 0:35:16.480 --> 0:35:17.960 So we went over there Sunday even and hit a 0:35:17.960 --> 0:35:18.640 little side beside. 0:35:18.680 --> 0:35:20.279 He got me in, we went out, he cut I 0:35:20.680 --> 0:35:22.839 brought a couple of dogs with me and he cut 0:35:22.880 --> 0:35:24.279 them out and there was nothing. 0:35:24.320 --> 0:35:26.120 The dog done that was wrong and had him a 0:35:26.200 --> 0:35:26.719 huge mouth. 0:35:26.760 --> 0:35:29.239 It sounded like a person screaming what when he ran it, 0:35:29.719 --> 0:35:31.040 which is kind of something. You want to be able 0:35:31.040 --> 0:35:33.160 to strike your dog, if it's a good dog, you 0:35:33.200 --> 0:35:34.759 want it to be distinct from the other one so 0:35:34.880 --> 0:35:38.359 other people can't strike their dog on yours. We ran 0:35:38.400 --> 0:35:40.239 for a couple hours and we get back and load 0:35:40.280 --> 0:35:43.200 everything up, getting ready to leave, and he priced. 0:35:42.840 --> 0:35:44.280 The dog, and I thought, good grief. 0:35:44.640 --> 0:35:47.319 So we get my truck on sixty three coming from 0:35:47.360 --> 0:35:48.319 Visu and I've done the road. 0:35:48.480 --> 0:35:49.759 Angela has in said a word. 0:35:50.400 --> 0:35:52.799 So we get almost the vienna and she just looks 0:35:52.840 --> 0:35:55.360 over at me and says, I'll give my wedding dress 0:35:55.400 --> 0:35:57.440 money and marry you on the ball field and Dixon 0:35:57.520 --> 0:36:00.440 if you'll go back and get that dog. Turned that 0:36:00.480 --> 0:36:03.040 truck over, turned around sixty three, went back and bought 0:36:03.040 --> 0:36:07.120 the dog. And he was a huge blessing, just that himself. 0:36:07.200 --> 0:36:09.839 So she won Nationals a couple of times with him, 0:36:10.120 --> 0:36:13.520 multiple state hunts and shows. We just lost him last year. 0:36:13.560 --> 0:36:17.640 He was fifteen years old. That dog brought us really close. 0:36:17.960 --> 0:36:20.279 Comparing it on when we were young. You know, I 0:36:20.280 --> 0:36:21.040 had a couple of boys. 0:36:21.080 --> 0:36:22.960 Everything was fine, we loved hunt and fish, but that 0:36:23.040 --> 0:36:26.440 dog give us something to do big time together. So 0:36:26.560 --> 0:36:29.719 after him we end up purchasing another pup that turned 0:36:29.760 --> 0:36:31.600 out to be amazing, and at one time we had 0:36:31.640 --> 0:36:34.920 the top two dogs in this area points and hunt wise, 0:36:35.280 --> 0:36:37.880 field trial is what she loved. She loves competition. We 0:36:37.960 --> 0:36:40.759 played a lot of softball together. She just you could 0:36:40.760 --> 0:36:43.640 feel trial with the boys, take them with you. We Ohio, 0:36:43.800 --> 0:36:48.200 Indiana all over. That was something that was such a 0:36:48.239 --> 0:36:56.960 blessing to us. So, like I said, I thought that 0:36:56.960 --> 0:37:00.400 that really beat me down. So with the field trial island, 0:37:00.640 --> 0:37:02.919 Angela and I had done everything together. I still bow 0:37:02.960 --> 0:37:06.839 hunted a lot, done things like that, but we ran 0:37:06.920 --> 0:37:09.160 dogs two or three days a week and every weekend 0:37:09.560 --> 0:37:14.200 for a few years. And then in May May of 0:37:14.239 --> 0:37:17.399 twenty eleven, we were building this running pin up here 0:37:18.000 --> 0:37:20.440 and my dad got to have in pain and he 0:37:20.480 --> 0:37:24.439 had massive heart attack right above the wheelmaker. His heart 0:37:24.480 --> 0:37:28.920 still works today just over thirty percent. So already that 0:37:28.960 --> 0:37:32.000 deer that the issues of that deer didn't mean as much. 0:37:32.239 --> 0:37:36.600 But at the end of twenty fifteen, Angela started having 0:37:36.800 --> 0:37:40.279 issues with their stomach and not feeling good, losing weight 0:37:40.800 --> 0:37:43.600 and in March of sixteen, she was diagnosed with stage 0:37:43.600 --> 0:37:51.560 four cancer. But honestly, I mean it was scary. If 0:37:51.560 --> 0:37:53.239 you knew her, you'd understand. She was in the middle 0:37:53.239 --> 0:37:54.880 of CrossFit. They were trying to get her to compete 0:37:54.880 --> 0:38:00.360 at the time. Strong not female strong strong is anybody 0:38:00.440 --> 0:38:03.080 her size tough as she could be. I mean she 0:38:03.200 --> 0:38:05.560 packed water buckets with me. I mean we were just 0:38:05.600 --> 0:38:08.600 like two buddies. Really, that's what That's what made us close. 0:38:08.880 --> 0:38:10.760 She could be and she was a beautiful person. 0:38:10.840 --> 0:38:13.640 But she could wear car heart jeans and ston't brush 0:38:13.680 --> 0:38:18.080 pologies like anybody, and which is probably what attracted me 0:38:18.160 --> 0:38:20.879 her most. You know, she played on my men's softball team, 0:38:21.120 --> 0:38:24.520 you know, just But in sixteen, twenty sixteen, they give 0:38:24.560 --> 0:38:28.520 her eighteen months to live with treatment twelve to eighteen months. 0:38:28.560 --> 0:38:32.440 And honestly, it was scary, but it didn't It just 0:38:33.040 --> 0:38:34.840 she just wanted them. I thought, man, if he mightn't be, 0:38:34.880 --> 0:38:35.560 to be her. 0:38:36.680 --> 0:38:38.320 And she took. 0:38:39.120 --> 0:38:43.640 Yeah, she took twenty chemo treatments and forty eight radiation treatments. 0:38:45.400 --> 0:38:49.960 Angela's stage four cancer came as a complete surprise. The 0:38:50.080 --> 0:38:55.840 dark cloud had materialized overhead again, only in her late twenties. 0:38:56.239 --> 0:38:59.680 She was a beautiful lady, the picture of health and fitness. 0:39:00.280 --> 0:39:03.080 It's hard to imagine the shock of such a diagnosis. 0:39:03.560 --> 0:39:08.160 After she received the maximum amount of radiation and chemotherapy treatments, 0:39:08.560 --> 0:39:11.799 the doctors sent her home saying there was nothing more 0:39:11.840 --> 0:39:14.880 they could do and gave her twelve to eighteen months 0:39:14.920 --> 0:39:19.200 to live. At this point, Donnie and Angela began to 0:39:19.280 --> 0:39:23.839 research non traditional methods of cancer treatment. I struggled from 0:39:23.840 --> 0:39:27.520 an editorial perspective whether to include this, as it's just 0:39:27.719 --> 0:39:31.200 really personal, But in the end, it's Donnie and his 0:39:31.320 --> 0:39:34.920 family's story that's part of their journey through this dark 0:39:35.040 --> 0:39:38.759 decade from two thousand and nine to twenty nineteen. And 0:39:38.800 --> 0:39:42.000 Donnie included this in his story, so I did in 0:39:42.080 --> 0:39:43.440 this one too. 0:39:44.280 --> 0:39:47.959 So she found a show called Cancer Can Be Killed, 0:39:47.960 --> 0:39:51.880 and it was about natural you know, and not. He 0:39:52.000 --> 0:39:55.360 was actually explaining not to blame the doctors. That's Western medicine, 0:39:55.400 --> 0:39:59.359 how they're taught. But cancer the United States goes round 0:39:59.400 --> 0:40:01.520 because of cancer all the way to our newspapers and 0:40:01.560 --> 0:40:06.560 everything all trickled down money from Camp Street, and so 0:40:06.640 --> 0:40:07.480 we went to Florida. 0:40:07.880 --> 0:40:09.320 She went to Florida for six weeks. 0:40:09.719 --> 0:40:11.759 We didn't tell her doctor because he said, if you go, 0:40:11.800 --> 0:40:13.840 don't don't come back here because by the time you 0:40:13.880 --> 0:40:15.080 get back, he'll be out of control. 0:40:16.239 --> 0:40:17.120 And he's good dude. I'm not. 0:40:17.200 --> 0:40:19.120 I'm not saying, but he really believed it would be 0:40:20.040 --> 0:40:23.320 and we went to She went to Florida for six weeks. 0:40:23.320 --> 0:40:29.080 My sister set up I tenerate for every like five days. 0:40:29.200 --> 0:40:31.520 She would have some family member fly down there to 0:40:31.520 --> 0:40:32.719 hang out with her for three or four days and 0:40:32.800 --> 0:40:36.320 come back. Flew the boys myself down there, and I 0:40:36.360 --> 0:40:38.040 could tell when I got there, Clay, it was like 0:40:38.080 --> 0:40:39.840 on week four, I believe we hadn't seen her from of. 0:40:39.840 --> 0:40:41.040 Course, the boys were excited to see them. 0:40:43.320 --> 0:40:45.680 She had just settled into this place like she'd lived 0:40:45.719 --> 0:40:47.440 there a whole life, knew all the side streets, and 0:40:47.440 --> 0:40:51.480 we went to the beach, but she was laughing, running 0:40:51.520 --> 0:40:55.680 playing with kids. I could tell something was different. And 0:40:55.800 --> 0:40:58.000 when we got back, when she got back after six 0:40:58.040 --> 0:40:59.520 weeks of that, she was cancer free. 0:41:00.600 --> 0:41:03.560 I mean, well, I take that we didn't tell him. 0:41:03.920 --> 0:41:06.719 They went in to do her bi monthly cat scan 0:41:06.960 --> 0:41:08.839 and the last time she had outspots all in her 0:41:08.840 --> 0:41:11.640 bone and everything, and it'd spread, and of course she'd 0:41:11.880 --> 0:41:13.919 lived a long time after they said that she would. 0:41:14.600 --> 0:41:17.279 And when they got done with the cat scan, they 0:41:17.280 --> 0:41:19.000 come in they said, something's not rabber. We have to 0:41:19.040 --> 0:41:21.719 do that again, and she said, how come, he said, 0:41:21.719 --> 0:41:24.799 I it just it didn't show anything. So they took 0:41:24.800 --> 0:41:28.319 her back again and cat's canned her again. And when 0:41:28.360 --> 0:41:30.920 they come back out, he said, whatever you're doing, continue 0:41:30.920 --> 0:41:34.120 on it. And she was cancer free. It was a 0:41:34.280 --> 0:41:37.000 very strict diet. She could eat like three things, zero 0:41:37.080 --> 0:41:40.600 sugar ever again. And it was hard to do, you know, 0:41:40.640 --> 0:41:43.560 I mean not couldn't eat anything on the road, had 0:41:43.560 --> 0:41:46.920 to pack your mills for everything, and it was almost unfeasible, 0:41:47.040 --> 0:41:50.000 it was, it was. And then heat tank every day. 0:41:50.040 --> 0:41:51.360 You got to get your body cor up to I 0:41:51.400 --> 0:41:53.480 think over one hundred and three degrees. Cancer can't live 0:41:54.800 --> 0:41:57.600 it's so high. And it was just and she she 0:41:57.640 --> 0:41:59.960 stayed on track with that for for a long time. 0:42:01.920 --> 0:42:05.200 Angela would stay cancer free for just under one year, 0:42:05.880 --> 0:42:10.000 and during that time she had no chemo irradiation and 0:42:10.200 --> 0:42:14.760 was already alive past the original projected time. The doctors 0:42:14.800 --> 0:42:19.319 told her she'd live, but the remission didn't last. 0:42:20.360 --> 0:42:25.920 And then August of nineteen it come back, and that 0:42:25.960 --> 0:42:29.000 time it come back with a vengeance. And I could 0:42:29.000 --> 0:42:30.680 tell when it come back it was a different thing, 0:42:32.880 --> 0:42:36.640 and it was stage lived stage four both times. But 0:42:36.680 --> 0:42:38.960 when it come back, you could see it sapped the 0:42:39.000 --> 0:42:41.399 power out of her and she fought it a long time. 0:42:41.480 --> 0:42:43.520 But you know, we had these two boys, and my dad, 0:42:43.960 --> 0:42:47.120 my sister and mom. Everybody done what they could. But 0:42:47.800 --> 0:42:50.480 our little town, like a lot of little towns, has 0:42:50.560 --> 0:42:54.000 drug problems, and it has issues like all towns do, 0:42:54.080 --> 0:42:57.440 I'm sure, but Clay, this community was unbelievable. How they 0:42:57.440 --> 0:43:00.479 come together for us when it come back second time. 0:43:00.719 --> 0:43:03.719 I was still trying to work the boys multiple sports, 0:43:03.719 --> 0:43:06.560 and my sister stayed with us quite a bit through 0:43:06.600 --> 0:43:07.920 the night so I could try to sleep at night. 0:43:07.920 --> 0:43:09.839 I don't know how where she was sleeping that ever, 0:43:09.920 --> 0:43:12.960 But day after day for months longer than that, for 0:43:13.239 --> 0:43:15.799 over a year, we had dinner delivered here from just 0:43:15.800 --> 0:43:19.400 somebody else, I mean, just our community and my family's 0:43:19.440 --> 0:43:24.360 amazing and uh going through that and uh watching watching 0:43:24.360 --> 0:43:27.320 how it affected with myself, my dad and sister and 0:43:27.360 --> 0:43:30.480 my boys, especially that deer kind of started taking a 0:43:30.520 --> 0:43:35.239 back burner on me. Feeling pity for myself. It just, 0:43:35.440 --> 0:43:37.919 uh what I thought when I thought I was down 0:43:37.960 --> 0:43:40.759 and out and everything was gloomy, it was over a deer. 0:43:41.719 --> 0:43:44.399 And but watching her fight for her life like that 0:43:44.760 --> 0:43:47.839 made me realize it was just a deer. But that's 0:43:47.840 --> 0:43:51.160 why I'm open about it. Clay to say, in that 0:43:51.320 --> 0:43:53.480 second round of cancer, I was playing a lot of 0:43:53.520 --> 0:43:55.600 ball and stuff when I killed that deer. And I 0:43:55.719 --> 0:43:58.759 wasn't a drug riddled alcoholic or anything. But I was 0:43:58.840 --> 0:44:01.120 raised in church and I knew when I was doing 0:44:01.200 --> 0:44:03.920 right and when I was doing wrong and playing a 0:44:03.960 --> 0:44:06.720 lot of ball, drying a lot of beer, being routy 0:44:06.800 --> 0:44:09.880 with kids at home, you know, and doing things that 0:44:09.880 --> 0:44:10.640 that I shouldn't. 0:44:11.120 --> 0:44:11.239 Uh. 0:44:11.600 --> 0:44:17.360 My wife's faith never wavered one ounce. And as the 0:44:17.400 --> 0:44:20.840 man of the house, I should be the leader, and 0:44:20.920 --> 0:44:21.520 I wasn't. 0:44:21.719 --> 0:44:22.400 My wife was. 0:44:23.640 --> 0:44:27.120 And as she faded, I started realizing that's that's what 0:44:27.160 --> 0:44:27.880 I'm gonna have to be. 0:44:30.160 --> 0:44:31.600 But she could. 0:44:31.840 --> 0:44:35.040 She passed the twenty fifth of May of twenty twenty 0:44:36.200 --> 0:44:41.239 after a terrible fight, and the last thing she said 0:44:41.280 --> 0:44:42.520 to me was I'm ready to go home. 0:44:44.920 --> 0:44:49.319 Yeah. It was tough, but the time I had with her, 0:44:49.320 --> 0:44:50.120 I really cherished. 0:45:01.280 --> 0:45:03.960 I can't thank you enough for listening to Bear Grease. 0:45:04.600 --> 0:45:07.920 I hope you've enjoyed and learned something from the Donnie 0:45:07.920 --> 0:45:12.680 Baker story. None of us are without fault, including Donnie, 0:45:12.840 --> 0:45:15.960 but he's one of us, an American woodsman and hunter, 0:45:16.280 --> 0:45:19.000 and a derned good one at that. Just the story 0:45:19.080 --> 0:45:22.200 we chose to tell of his overlap with the wild 0:45:22.560 --> 0:45:26.160 was one of his worst moments. After episode one, I 0:45:26.320 --> 0:45:29.600 was concerned that the world would make Donnie pay again 0:45:29.800 --> 0:45:33.080 for killing that buck, and I compensated for that by 0:45:33.120 --> 0:45:37.440 asking the listener to be sympathetic. And after the episode, 0:45:37.440 --> 0:45:41.000 Donnie reported back to me that he'd received almost one 0:45:41.120 --> 0:45:45.239 hundred percent positive feedback, which I was really glad to hear. 0:45:45.880 --> 0:45:49.160 But most importantly, I think now he can fully just 0:45:49.239 --> 0:45:53.960 put all this behind him. I'm grateful for compelling stories, 0:45:54.600 --> 0:45:57.960 positive and negative, and I look forward to telling many 0:45:58.000 --> 0:46:01.120 more in twenty twenty four. It means the world to 0:46:01.160 --> 0:46:03.600 Brent and I that you guys listen to our podcasts, 0:46:03.880 --> 0:46:06.120 and I really look forward to talking to everybody on 0:46:06.239 --> 0:46:10.200 the Render next week about this episode two. And Hey, 0:46:10.239 --> 0:46:12.560 I want to thank you all for the support of 0:46:12.640 --> 0:46:16.440 the launch of Steve Ranella and I's audio original, The 0:46:16.560 --> 0:46:20.040 Long Hunters. So far it has been a big success 0:46:20.560 --> 0:46:23.880 as it stood number one on the Apple Audio Books 0:46:24.239 --> 0:46:27.440 and reach number four on Audible, which is big for 0:46:27.560 --> 0:46:32.480 us and Hey. As another announcement, on March ninth, twenty 0:46:32.520 --> 0:46:34.880 twenty four, if you want to come say hi to 0:46:34.920 --> 0:46:37.800 Brent and I all day will be at the Black 0:46:37.840 --> 0:46:43.320 Bear Bonanza in Bentonville, Arkansas. It's an incredible event, big time, 0:46:43.440 --> 0:46:45.759 big day. Google it and hope to see you there. 0:46:46.280 --> 0:46:47.080 Have a great week.