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Speaker 1: Originals. This is an iHeart original.

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Speaker 2: Hi everyone, I'm so excited to share episode one of

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Speaker 2: the new season of What Happened to I wanted to

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Speaker 2: let you know. You can listen to this episode ad

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Speaker 2: free with iHeart True Crime Plus, available exclusively on Apple Podcasts.

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Speaker 2: You'll also get instant access to episode two right now,

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Speaker 2: a whole week ahead of everyone else, and early access

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Speaker 2: to future episodes and exclusive bonus content. So head to

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Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, search for iHeart True Crime Plus and subscribe today.

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Speaker 2: This story can be hard to hear. There's detailed talk

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Speaker 2: of suicide and violence, but we think it's important not

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Speaker 2: to gloss over the reality of what happened to Libby Caswell.

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Speaker 2: Please take care while listening.

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Speaker 1: You know, he asked me would I tell him this

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Speaker 1: story about his mother dying? That's how he said it.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know how to even handle that, And when

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Speaker 1: I talked to a psychologist, I was like, how do

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Speaker 1: you even tell a child this story when they ask

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Speaker 1: what happened to my mother?

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Speaker 2: So far, Cindy Caswell has been able to avoid telling

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Speaker 2: her grandson Xavier this story. The story you're about to

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Speaker 2: hear the details of what happened to Libby Caswell are

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Speaker 2: not suitable for a ten year old like Xavier, so instead,

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Speaker 2: Cindy tries to focus on the good memories Xavier still

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Speaker 2: has of his mother. He was only four when Libby died.

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Speaker 3: He remembers episodes of Sesame Street that he watched with

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Speaker 3: his mother, and this certain song, you know at the

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Speaker 3: beginning that's like I'm stronger, faster, you know, and smarter.

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Speaker 3: And he'll start crying and he wants to talk about her.

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Speaker 3: So we look at pictures, and you know, I try

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Speaker 3: to tell him it's okay to cry and grieve.

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Speaker 2: When he asks Sue how she died, what do you

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Speaker 2: tell him?

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Speaker 1: I tell him that I don't.

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Speaker 3: I don't know any effects about his mother, and I'm

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Speaker 3: still waiting until then. I say, you know, when you're

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Speaker 3: older and later on, maybe we'll all know exactly how

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Speaker 3: your mom died. And when I know, I can tell

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Speaker 3: him more.

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Speaker 2: My name is Melissa Jelson. I'm an investigative reporter who

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Speaker 2: covers violence against women. In the first season of this show,

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Speaker 2: What Happened to Sandy Beal, I dug into the story

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Speaker 2: of a young woman who wanted to be a cop

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Speaker 2: back in the nineteen seventies, but ended up fatally shot.

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Speaker 2: She was found alone in her car, parked in a

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Speaker 2: secluded location known as a cop hangout. It was a

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Speaker 2: story about a family search for truth and a police

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Speaker 2: culture that refused accountability, a story where the official version

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Speaker 2: just didn't make sense. And ever since that show aired,

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Speaker 2: my inbox has been flooded with tips from listeners with

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Speaker 2: unresolved stories of their own. Among the tips from strangers

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Speaker 2: was an email from a source I've known for years,

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Speaker 2: someone who has a reputation for searching for truth and

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Speaker 2: police accountability.

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Speaker 4: I received a call from Cindy Caswell and I actually

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Speaker 4: was a voicemail left at the police department. It's not

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Speaker 4: unusual for me to receive calls from family members wanting

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Speaker 4: me to look into the death of their loved one.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Bill Smock is the director of the Clinical Forensic

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Speaker 2: Medicine Program for the Louisville Metro Police Department. It comes

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Speaker 2: somewhat of a household name ever since the trial of

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Speaker 2: Derek Chauvin, where he provided expert testimony about George Floyd's death.

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Speaker 5: When the body is deprived of oxygen.

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Speaker 2: Explaining in medical terms how kneeling on someone's neck for

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Speaker 2: nine minutes can kill.

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Speaker 5: Them gradually succumbed to lower and lower levels of oxygen,

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Speaker 5: and he died.

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Speaker 2: Smock is a national expert in cases where a person

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Speaker 2: died from asphyxia a lack of oxygen, and he spent

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Speaker 2: his entire career in forensics, evaluating autopsies, exploring crime scenes,

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Speaker 2: and analyzing case files, which is exactly why Cindy reached

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Speaker 2: out to him. Libby Caswell, like George Floyd, died of

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Speaker 2: asphyxia in December twenty seventeen. She was found in a

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Speaker 2: motel bathroom with a belt wrapped around her neck. She

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Speaker 2: was just twenty one years old.

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Speaker 4: So I said, Sidney, please send me everything you asker,

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Speaker 4: autopsy photos, autopsy report, seeing photos, whatever you have, and

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Speaker 4: I'll take a quick look.

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Speaker 2: It ended up being more than a quick look. After

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Speaker 2: Smock saw the material Cindy sent him, he went deep.

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Speaker 2: Then he got angry.

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Speaker 4: Libby's case stands out in my mind and keeps me

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Speaker 4: awake at night. There were multiple injuries that were not documented.

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Speaker 4: There is evidence that was myssed.

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Speaker 2: Libby's story gripped me too and sent me down a

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Speaker 2: long road full of intense conversations and uncomfortable questions. Did

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Speaker 2: you not believe that he's telling the truth.

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Speaker 6: No, no, I'm telling you.

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Speaker 2: I've interviewed him and his story is very credible and

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Speaker 2: captivated the town of inde Hennance, Missouri.

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Speaker 7: Three years after her daughter's body was found in a

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Speaker 7: motel bathroom, Sinny Kaswell believes her daughter, Libby was murdered.

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Speaker 8: As forty one Action News reporder Sarah Planke shows us,

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Speaker 8: Libby's mom has a team of experts on her side

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Speaker 8: who say the crucial questions in the case remain unanswered.

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Speaker 2: What happened to Libby Caswell isn't just a story about

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Speaker 2: a young woman's death. It's about how Libby lived and

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Speaker 2: loved you know. I think she held onto a little

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Speaker 2: bit of too much hope, and that's a good trait

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Speaker 2: to have and tell you're in a situation like this,

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Speaker 2: and how she was failed by local police.

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Speaker 5: I'd say, if one is a really poor investigation and

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Speaker 5: ten is a perfect investigation, I'd give them a point five.

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Speaker 2: It's also about the systems that were supposed to help

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Speaker 2: Libby and didn't.

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Speaker 1: I think the law is set up to punish families

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Speaker 1: in this situation.

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Speaker 2: And how far you'd go to find justice for a

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Speaker 2: loved one.

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Speaker 1: What happened to her is unknown, and it's something that

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Speaker 1: I need to know.

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Speaker 2: What God second from iHeart Podcasts, I'm Melissa Jelson, and

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Speaker 2: this is what happened to Libby Caswell, Chapter one, The

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Speaker 2: girl in Room three nineteen.

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Speaker 9: Second again.

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Speaker 10: Wanting again to the emergency hotel if you're aware Studio motel.

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Speaker 10: I'm gone on that id Bok cover. She heard yourselfing

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Speaker 10: about the whilk coming. I don't want to do freaking out.

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Speaker 2: It's a Monday night in Independence, Missouri, December eleventh, twenty seventeen,

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Speaker 2: at eight o four pm, A nine to one one

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Speaker 2: call comes in from the sports stadium in a rundown motel,

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Speaker 2: just a couple of miles from where the Kansas City

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Speaker 2: Chiefs play. This call lasts about five minutes before ending abruptly.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to play parts of it now.

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Speaker 11: What that real happened?

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Speaker 10: I don't know what happened to go to the bathroom

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Speaker 10: open the door like I don't know. My my my

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Speaker 10: note was she had put a belt around your neck,

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Speaker 10: and I seen the belt outside of the door. Would

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Speaker 10: open the door and be fell night. Oh this is

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Speaker 10: twenty one her hand again again. Elizabeth Caswell.

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Speaker 2: Elizabeth Caswell Libby. The caller says he just woke up

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Speaker 2: and found her with his belt around her neck. He

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Speaker 2: thinks she hanged herself.

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Speaker 10: Conscious at all, No, I don't know you want to be.

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Speaker 11: Counter breeding at all?

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Speaker 10: Love and little bit bloody, but like like like blue.

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Speaker 10: I don't think it's Glad.

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Speaker 1: I think it's.

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Speaker 10: Someone open.

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Speaker 1: Okay, we're getting help turned that way.

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Speaker 6: We're getting help turned that way.

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Speaker 2: Okay, what do I do?

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Speaker 10: What do I do? Okay, Okay, Kenny County's breeding at all? No, No,

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Speaker 10: there's no I wasn't going from them. I would rope

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Speaker 10: up and crowned or like, I don't know how long.

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Speaker 10: Oh my god. Right.

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Speaker 2: The dispatcher asked the caller to loosen the belt around

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Speaker 2: Libby's neck.

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Speaker 11: Okay, are you able to undo the belt at all?

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Speaker 8: Because if he hasn't been unconscious for too long, you're

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Speaker 8: gonna do the belt.

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Speaker 2: You may start breathing yet, but the caller has already

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Speaker 2: left the motel room and shut the door behind him.

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Speaker 2: I can hear another person talking in the background, but

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Speaker 2: can't make out what they're saying.

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Speaker 10: Do you want.

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Speaker 12: Don't knock?

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Speaker 10: Do it, I was removing I WoT my legs.

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Speaker 1: Up.

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Speaker 2: The call drops At this point the dispatcher tries to

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Speaker 2: call back but can't get through. The police are already

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Speaker 2: on their way.

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Speaker 6: Pray Emula's called Sportsbium and she twenty seven, who calls

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Speaker 6: advisator woke up on to the bathroom and found her

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Speaker 6: and unconscious and a belt wrapped around her neck. Our

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Speaker 6: collor is hysterical and still trying to decipher as the

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Speaker 6: female breathing or not, but the collar does not think

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Speaker 6: she is. Color was apparently very panicked right out of

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Speaker 6: the room and is now walked until home. I'm gonna

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Speaker 6: ahead and respond on overthe ever twenty I being.

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Speaker 2: The room three nineteen three one.

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Speaker 6: Ninety heavy Room three nineteen.

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Speaker 2: Within a few minutes, three officers are on scene. They

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Speaker 2: discover that the nine one one collar is gone, like

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Speaker 2: completely gone, not at the motel, nowhere to be found,

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Speaker 2: and the room who was staying in Room three nineteen

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Speaker 2: is locked. The officers try to get a key from

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Speaker 2: someone at the front desk, but can't find anyone, so

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Speaker 2: they break down the door.

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Speaker 11: Twenty two make an entry force the door.

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Speaker 2: Ever inside room three nineteen, it's dark. The lights are off,

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Speaker 2: the TV is on, and from what little the officers

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Speaker 2: can see, the room is in chaos. There are piles

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Speaker 2: of clothing all over the floor. A bedside drawer has

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Speaker 2: been flung wide open. There's an empty vodka bottle and

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Speaker 2: what looks like a diamond ring on the ground. In

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Speaker 2: the open drawer of the bedside table, there's a photo

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Speaker 2: of a man's face that seems to be printed from

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Speaker 2: a database of some kind. On top of the bed

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Speaker 2: is a man's watch with a broken strap. A woman's

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Speaker 2: purse has been tipped over, its contents spilled across the carpet.

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Speaker 2: On first scan of the small motel room, it appears

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Speaker 2: no one's there, but then the officer's notice the bathroom

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Speaker 2: door is closed. Once they open the door, they see

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Speaker 2: a body, the body of a young woman with long

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Speaker 2: brown hair, wearing sweatpants and a pink sweatshirt. She's lying

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Speaker 2: on the floor on her side, in the cramped space

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Speaker 2: between the toilet and the bathtub. There's a belt wrapped

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Speaker 2: loosely around her neck. One officer approaches the body and

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Speaker 2: notes that it's cold. It seems clear she's been dead

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Speaker 2: for a while. The bathroom is too small for her

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Speaker 2: to lie fully extended on the ground, and so her

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Speaker 2: feet are propped up on the opposite wall. Her position

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Speaker 2: it doesn't look natural. One of the officers notes this

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Speaker 2: in his report, writing quote her feet appeared to have

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Speaker 2: been placed against the wall so the door would open

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Speaker 2: and close. And these facts, the position of her body,

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Speaker 2: the belt around her neck, the caller who fled. It

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Speaker 2: isn't clear what happened, so the officers call for more help.

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Speaker 4: You go to the front esc who registered this room,

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Speaker 4: hit copies of any IDs or anything they were used.

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Speaker 11: To print this room.

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Speaker 2: At around eight thirty pm, a crime scene investigator arrives

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Speaker 2: at the motel and begins to photograph the scene. He's

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Speaker 2: followed soon afterwards by four detectives and a sergeant. After

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Speaker 2: surveying the scene, the sergeant calls his captain, Mike Anka.

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Speaker 11: I was actually I was off duty, but I got

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Speaker 11: a call from one of my sergeants that he had

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Speaker 11: been called out with his squad on a death investigation,

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Speaker 11: with nobody on seeing telling what happened, and a female laying,

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Speaker 11: you know, in the bathroom with a belt wraptor in henet.

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Speaker 11: Obviously his first inclination. It was homicide with something like

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Speaker 11: that or that significance I responded.

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Speaker 2: In At the time, Mike Anka was the captain of

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Speaker 2: the Criminal Investigations Unit for the Independence Police Department or IPD.

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Speaker 2: He's since been promoted to major Anca gets to the

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Speaker 2: sports stadium in around ten pm. By then, the motel

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Speaker 2: is swarming with cops.

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Speaker 11: In any situation where your caller fleas before the police

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Speaker 11: gets there, that is a red flag for us. Obviously,

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Speaker 11: people grieve different, people deal with things different, but that's

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Speaker 11: a little bit outside the normoust people you know, are

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Speaker 11: standing outside waiting on us when we show up without.

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Speaker 2: The nine one one caller to talk to IPD gets

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Speaker 2: to work documenting the scene at the motel. One officer

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Speaker 2: puts up crime scene tape. Another tries to hunt down

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Speaker 2: security footage from the cameras in the parking lot.

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Speaker 11: Obviously that motel has got recordings the person that was

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Speaker 11: running the hotel in the office or whatever, they were

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Speaker 11: not able to access that film, so he was instructed

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Speaker 11: to go back and get that later.

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Speaker 2: A group from the Medical Examiner's office is also called

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Speaker 2: to the scene, an investigator and a transport team who

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Speaker 2: will take the body to the Morgue for an autopsy.

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Speaker 2: The investigator notes the rigidity of the woman's body and

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Speaker 2: determines she has been deceased for an extended period of time.

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Speaker 2: IPD also tries to track down any witnesses, and they

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Speaker 2: find one, the man who is staying next door to

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Speaker 2: room three nineteen. He tells officers that twenty minutes prior

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Speaker 2: to their arrival, he heard a woman getting beat and

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Speaker 2: a female voice saying, don't hurt me. But he seems

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Speaker 2: intoxicated and his timeline doesn't make much sense, as the

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Speaker 2: body was cold by the time police showed up. By midnight,

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Speaker 2: IPD has gone from the sports stadium in but their

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Speaker 2: work is not done. It's around this time that two

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Speaker 2: officers are sent to Cindy Caswell's house.

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Speaker 1: I was off Mondays, so I was up later than usual.

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Speaker 1: I always just sat in that recliner right by the

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Speaker 1: front window, and I would watch first.

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Speaker 3: The news and then late night TV. And I was

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Speaker 3: sitting there thinking about going to bed, you know. And

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Speaker 3: I got up and was just locking doors and checking everything,

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Speaker 3: and I noticed some flashlights outside. So I walked over

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Speaker 3: and kind of peeked out the window, and I realized

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Speaker 3: it was police officers and they knocked on the door.

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Speaker 2: Cindy let the officers in and went to wake up

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Speaker 2: her husband.

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Speaker 3: Bob came in and he was like just confused, like

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Speaker 3: I was. And they asked him to sit down and

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Speaker 3: asked if we were the parents of Elizabeth Caswell, and

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Speaker 3: you know, we're just kind of nodding her heads.

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Speaker 1: And I believe his words were sorry to tell you

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Speaker 1: that she is deceased.

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Speaker 3: I believe.

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Speaker 1: I said how, and they said she hung herself. It

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Speaker 1: was said apparent suicide. I don't remember a lot after that.

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Speaker 1: My heart just started pounding really hard.

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Speaker 13: And I was.

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Speaker 1: Just it was hazy, and I felt like time just

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Speaker 1: kind of just stopped.

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Speaker 2: Cindy sits on her living room couch, frozen in a

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Speaker 2: nightmare state, trying to wrap her head around the fact

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Speaker 2: that her twenty one year old daughter, her oldest child,

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Speaker 2: Elizabeth Caswell, known to everyone who loved her as Libby,

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Speaker 2: is dead. What Cindy didn't know is that mere hours

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Speaker 2: before IPD delivered this news, Libby's death was being investigated

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Speaker 2: as a homicide. And yet, standing in front of Cindy

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Speaker 2: as December eleventh becomes December twelfth, the officers have only

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Speaker 2: one question for her.

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Speaker 1: They asked, was she suicidal? I said, no, she was not.

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Speaker 2: But Cindy has a question for them.

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Speaker 1: I said, where is Devin? Where's he at?

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Speaker 2: One of the hardest things about my job as a

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Speaker 2: journalist who covers women's violent deaths is that I never

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Speaker 2: get to meet the women I spend months and years

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Speaker 2: reporting on. By the time I entered the picture, they're

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Speaker 2: already gone. Instead, I have to fill in the blanks

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Speaker 2: with the stories of the people who loved them, like Cindy,

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Speaker 2: who holds on tight to every memory of her twenty

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Speaker 2: one years with her daughter Libby.

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Speaker 1: I had a rough time getting pregnant and staying pregnant,

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Speaker 1: so it was a hard time that I carried her

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Speaker 1: to term, and I think I was two weeks overdue

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Speaker 1: and being induced on a March twenty fifth snowstorm here

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Speaker 1: in Missouri. So it's exciting, you know. She was tiny,

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Speaker 1: seven pounds and three ounces in just the light of

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Speaker 1: our lives.

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00:20:56,320 --> 00:21:00,280
Speaker 2: Libby Caswell was born and raised in Independence, Missouri, a

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Speaker 2: town of about one hundred and twenty thousand people right

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Speaker 2: outside of Kansas City. Cindy tells me her early years

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Speaker 2: were typical for a little girl growing up in the

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Speaker 2: suburbs of the Midwest, lots of running around outside, playing

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Speaker 2: hide and seek, going to church, hanging out with her

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Speaker 2: two younger siblings. Libby and her sister Natalie were especially close.

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Speaker 12: I was born February nineteen ninety nine. She was born

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Speaker 12: March of nineteen ninety six. We'd play outside together all time.

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Speaker 12: We'd be down at our creek every day, just like

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Speaker 12: looking for crawdads and weird rocks and just stuff. We

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Speaker 12: were always really close. We were almost kind of like twins,

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Speaker 12: I always say, because when you look back at pictures,

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Speaker 12: we were always in like similar outfits with the same hairstyles.

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Speaker 2: Natalie is now twenty four older than Libby was when

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Speaker 2: she died, but she still talks about her with the

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Speaker 2: reverence of a younger sibling. It's clear how much she

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Speaker 2: misses her big sister.

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Speaker 12: We were together all the time, every single day, for

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Speaker 12: you know, pretty much all of our entire lives. We

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Speaker 12: used to talk about when we get older, we were

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Speaker 12: going to buy a house together, and we made like

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Speaker 12: drawings of like these huge houses of this half would

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Speaker 12: be her house and this half would be my house.

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Speaker 12: She was just my built in best friend.

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Speaker 2: Libby had boundless energy as a child, and so Cindy

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Speaker 2: enrolled her in dance and cheerleading, which Libby took to instantly.

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Speaker 2: In ninth grade, her high school varsity cheerleading team was

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Speaker 2: invited to perform at Disney World. Cindy bought her a

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Speaker 2: cell phone, her first, so Libby could communicate with her

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Speaker 2: family while she was away.

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Speaker 1: She called me at the entrance of Disney World, and

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Speaker 1: she was like, Mom, you know how at the beginning

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Speaker 1: of all my Disney movies there's the castle and the

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Speaker 1: sparkles and the light. She said, it's just like that

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Speaker 1: in real life. And she was just beside herself, and

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Speaker 1: I was wishing I could be there, you know. But

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Speaker 1: we just got the money for her to go, you know,

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Speaker 1: because it was quite expensive to send someone there.

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Speaker 2: Growing up, Libby's family was solidly working class. Her dad

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Speaker 2: was in construction and her mom put in part time

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Speaker 2: hours at the local grocery store.

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Speaker 1: Well, I've worked for Price Chopper Bakery on and off

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Speaker 1: for a long time. Oh my gosh, I think my twenties.

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Speaker 2: Cindy was eventually promoted to head cake decorator at the

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Speaker 2: grocery store, A job she still held when I met her.

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Speaker 1: It's very rewarding to have someone come back and say,

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Speaker 1: you know that cake you did for my mom or

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Speaker 1: this cupcakes you did, Oh my gosh, they were so pretty,

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Speaker 1: and she was so excited, and I'm like, heyy, that's.

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Speaker 11: Why I do it, you know.

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Speaker 2: Even though money was tight, Cindy was eager to support

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Speaker 2: Libby's extracurriculars, ille charding her to and front practices, ordering uniforms,

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Speaker 2: and cheering her on from the sidelines. Cindy remembered being

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Speaker 2: that age herself and having different priorities. At fifteen, she

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00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:15,960
Speaker 2: dropped out of school and ran away with her boyfriend,

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Speaker 2: who later became her husband, Libby's dad. They got divorced

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Speaker 2: after Libby's death.

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Speaker 3: Being as young as I was, I thought I was

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Speaker 3: totally in love, you know, and couldn't live without em.

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Speaker 1: I was too young to know what I wanted.

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Speaker 3: I think between you know, thirteen and twenty two, you

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Speaker 3: still really are just kind of searching of.

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Speaker 1: Who you are and who you want to be. And

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Speaker 1: I don't think it's a good time to try to

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Speaker 1: settle down.

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Speaker 2: Cindy hoped that Libby would forge a different, more independent

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Speaker 2: life for herself, one where a husband and kids came later.

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Speaker 3: If at all I knew she would have boyfriends, you know,

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Speaker 3: I'm not that in saying, because, for one, she was

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Speaker 3: so beautiful, you know, and that attracts.

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Speaker 1: People. But I had a plan.

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Speaker 3: I was going to keep her in sports and dance

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Speaker 3: and cheer, and she was going to be too busy

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Speaker 3: for all that.

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Speaker 1: I kept trying to just tell her to be careful.

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Speaker 3: And teenagers make big mistakes that are life changing when

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Speaker 3: you can't take it back or go back and redo

387
00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 3: your childhood. And so she would always say, I know, Mom,

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Speaker 3: I can take care of myself, and you've always told

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Speaker 3: me that.

390
00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:37,480
Speaker 2: As Cindy anticipated, Libby got a lot of attention from boys.

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Speaker 2: By her freshman year of high school, she had a

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Speaker 2: serious boyfriend. I've seen a photo of the couple from

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00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:48,239
Speaker 2: this time period. Libby is kissing her boyfriend's cheek, her

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00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 2: dark hair spilled across his chest while he makes eye

395
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Speaker 2: contact with the camera, a soft, almost bashful smile spread

396
00:25:55,840 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 2: across his face. They look young, fresh faced, and blissfully

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Speaker 2: in love. So despite all those heart to heart conversations,

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Speaker 2: Cindy found herself trying to convince Libby to slow down.

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00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 1: It became a struggle because she didn't want to hear

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00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 1: what I had to say about things. She said, well,

401
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 1: you met dad at fourteen and you did this, And

402
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:26,119
Speaker 1: I say, yeah, but you know, I can save you

403
00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:29,160
Speaker 1: some struggles if you just listen and take to heart

404
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 1: what I say. But she just thought she was in

405
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,399
Speaker 1: love with this kid, and I believe that's the summer

406
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:37,400
Speaker 1: she became pregnant.

407
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,320
Speaker 2: Libby gave birth to her son, Xavier, in twenty thirteen,

408
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,000
Speaker 2: when she was just seventeen years old. As it does,

409
00:26:45,359 --> 00:26:49,400
Speaker 2: life changed drastically after she became a mom, and despite

410
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 2: how challenging it was, her special bond with Xavier was undeniable.

411
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:57,480
Speaker 2: She loved to make him giggle and they often goofed

412
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 2: off together, like in this video we have of the

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00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:04,000
Speaker 2: two of them facetiming with her sister Natalie. In it,

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00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:06,919
Speaker 2: Libby is holding her toddler son up to the camera.

415
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:10,160
Speaker 2: A filter adds a space helmet on top of his head.

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00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:12,720
Speaker 1: Come on, come on, you can't look.

417
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 14: You're downloading Natalie's handsome anat.

418
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Speaker 1: He loved his mom. She was the only one he

419
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,560
Speaker 1: would kiss like. He wouldn't give no one else kisses,

420
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:34,119
Speaker 1: but he would only give her kisses.

421
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 2: Libby was an attentive and observant mother despite her age.

422
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 2: When Xavier was still quite young, she recognized that he

423
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 2: wasn't hitting some of his developmental markers.

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00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 1: She just noticed a lot of different little things that

425
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 1: I didn't notice, you know. I was like, well, some

426
00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:55,200
Speaker 1: kids developed later in others. But she just determined and

427
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,120
Speaker 1: had him evaluated and they said, yeah, he has autism.

428
00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 1: She was just really on that and gott even the

429
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: helping need and early, like three years old.

430
00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 2: I've spoken with a bunch of Libby's friends and they

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00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 2: all said the same thing, how much she loved her son,

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00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 2: how dedicated she was as a mother.

433
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:22,080
Speaker 6: From the mommy from the mommy, Oh God.

434
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:27,880
Speaker 2: But they also wanted me to know how much fun

435
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 2: she was to be around. Libby was silly, a bit

436
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 2: of a prankster. She liked to dance around to music

437
00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:37,920
Speaker 2: in the kitchen, make funny faces. She prided herself on

438
00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:38,680
Speaker 2: getting a laugh.

439
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 13: She had a mouth on her, not in a bad way,

440
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:44,640
Speaker 13: but like in a funny way, like she's a comedian.

441
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 8: It was freshman year of high school and we were

442
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:52,280
Speaker 8: running laughs in gyms and she came running past me

443
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 8: and she said, I just want to let you know

444
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 8: you're really pretty, and then she just kept running and

445
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:58,280
Speaker 8: I was like, wait a minute, hold on, I want

446
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:02,360
Speaker 8: to be friends, man. And we became friends like that,

447
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 8: and then we just became inseparable.

448
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 7: She was just a bright, happy person. She was one

449
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 7: of those people who, no matter what she had or

450
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 7: didn't have, she was always willing to give to other people,

451
00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:18,760
Speaker 7: always looked on the bright side and saw the best

452
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 7: in everybody.

453
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 2: But to some of her friends, Libby's tendency to see

454
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 2: the good in others wasn't always a positive. I think

455
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 2: she held on to a little bit of too much hope.

456
00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 2: And that's just what Libby did, though, and she would

457
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 2: find the best in anybody, and that's a good trait

458
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 2: to have.

459
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 1: And tell you're in a situation like this.

460
00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 3: This is a reference to case your four number seventeen

461
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 3: eighty nine two point four. Today's date is December eleventh, twenty.

462
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,800
Speaker 11: Seventeen, and the time is twenty two thirty two.

463
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 1: And tell me your last name, sir uh Fristo fr Stoe.

464
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 4: Okay, Well, the reason why you're here, I guess apparently

465
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 4: you witnessed some activity over there at the sports stadium in.

466
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 2: It's December eleventh, twenty seventeen, around ten thirty pm. IPD

467
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 2: has been on the case for about two hours. There's

468
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 2: still no sign of the nine one one caller, but

469
00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:41,760
Speaker 2: they did identify a key witness, David Fristo. Fristo was

470
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 2: a guest at the sports stadium in who happened to

471
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:47,360
Speaker 2: meet Libby when she checked in, and, as he tells

472
00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,719
Speaker 2: the detective at the police station, she wasn't alone.

473
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 11: I'm met know these.

474
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 2: Individual No, I met him last night.

475
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:56,760
Speaker 5: You know. They parked him front of went over.

476
00:30:57,320 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 11: What kind of equal were there?

477
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:01,360
Speaker 2: Fristo says, Libby was with two men, one of whom

478
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,200
Speaker 2: appeared to be her boyfriend, and as far as he

479
00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 2: could tell, they seemed like a normal couple.

480
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 13: So I go outside and you know, they was like, man,

481
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 13: we got a kid. We're just getting away, you know,

482
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,920
Speaker 13: some quality time. I said, hey, that's one. Then they

483
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 13: went that way and I went my way.

484
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:21,000
Speaker 7: And this was last night.

485
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I didn't see him no more until the.

486
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 15: Night when I seen him.

487
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 2: Fristo saw the boyfriend again alone around eight pm. The

488
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,120
Speaker 2: detective asked Fristo to describe him.

489
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:35,960
Speaker 9: It was white.

490
00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 2: It's kind of medium mill so white.

491
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 11: Me and Bill.

492
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, height, weight probably about.

493
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:49,200
Speaker 15: One fifty Hi probably about bobb eight, maybe a little taller.

494
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:55,200
Speaker 5: Anything else, identif hanging out her or him, tattoos or I.

495
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 2: Didn't pay attention.

496
00:31:56,760 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 11: Yeah, I'm trying to picture. Do you think you could

497
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 11: pick you out of a photo? Liar possible?

498
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 5: You know, well, I've.

499
00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 1: Constructed a photo liar possible suspect.

500
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,760
Speaker 2: At this point, the detective slides a piece of paper

501
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:18,720
Speaker 2: over to Fristo. On it other mugshots of six men.

502
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:21,160
Speaker 2: They all stare straight into the camera.

503
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:25,440
Speaker 11: Okay, why don't you go ahead put circle.

504
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 2: Around him without hesitation, Fristo marks the photo in the

505
00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 2: bottom left corner. I recognize the face in the mugshot.

506
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,000
Speaker 2: It is Libby's boyfriend and the father of their child,

507
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 2: and the man who called nine one one your hand,

508
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 2: Devin Martin. He's the guy Cindy asked about when the

509
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,920
Speaker 2: cops showed up at her door to tell her that

510
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 2: Libby was dead.

511
00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 1: I said, where's Devin? Where's he at?

512
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 2: And it's a good question where was Devin? Because even

513
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:07,080
Speaker 2: though he'd called nine one one, he didn't stick around

514
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:09,960
Speaker 2: for the police to arrive, and if it wasn't for

515
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,000
Speaker 2: David Fristo, he might not have called nine one one

516
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 2: at all. I was standing out in front of.

517
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 15: The motel try okay, yeah, so I couldn't see what

518
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:21,040
Speaker 15: I was going on around the back and I was

519
00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 15: just standing there, and all of a sudden he.

520
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:26,360
Speaker 2: Came around the corner. Devon was driving through the motel

521
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:32,120
Speaker 2: parking lot when Fristo spotted him. He was crying and upset,

522
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 2: and I was like, man, what happened?

523
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 13: And they tuck him a minute to get it out

524
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 13: of him, and he said, my wife hung herself, but

525
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:42,800
Speaker 13: he did. He just kind of kept going and I'm

526
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 13: trying to talk him down, and I'm like, man, he

527
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 13: settled down, just called police.

528
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 2: Thet him know, man, that something happens. Man, if you run,

529
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:51,280
Speaker 2: it's gonna be bad on here.

530
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 13: And I finally talked him down and then he what

531
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:56,760
Speaker 13: they called him police?

532
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 11: And did you ever hear that conversation?

533
00:33:58,640 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 7: Yes?

534
00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 11: Was there any other question of the askes that you

535
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 11: ever heard? Was she alive? Was your breathing?

536
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:08,600
Speaker 13: And he said he don't know, and they wanted him

537
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 13: to go into room and they didn't want to.

538
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 2: And I'm like, I don't blame you, but you.

539
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:15,200
Speaker 15: Got to stay here and until Felice get here. And

540
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 15: then you say he took off. Yeah, and from there

541
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 15: it was the last time I see him. I couldn't

542
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:23,200
Speaker 15: even tell you which direction he went.

543
00:34:30,480 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 2: Just as IPD is finishing up with Fristo, they received

544
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:37,839
Speaker 2: another nine one one call. It's Devin, three hours after

545
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 2: his initial call. He says he's ready to talk and

546
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:46,400
Speaker 2: he's on his way to the station. I want you

547
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 2: to be detail.

548
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:48,399
Speaker 11: I want you to be honest.

549
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 2: This season on what happened to Libby Caswell.

550
00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:00,640
Speaker 9: I was like, promise when you're to call me back?

551
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:02,440
Speaker 11: And she said, I promise and click and that was it.

552
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 11: And that was the last I spoke to her.

553
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 9: She told me like she was dying. She's finally going

554
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:06,719
Speaker 9: to do what she.

555
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:07,680
Speaker 14: Needed to do for her.

556
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 4: Let me, Den said Nathan, I don't think I feel

557
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:12,720
Speaker 4: safe with Devin anymore.

558
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 1: Something seems off right now.

559
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,160
Speaker 12: I was like, did he just hit her?

560
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 11: The medical examiner ruled Libby's death undetermined. I go, what

561
00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:24,760
Speaker 11: do you mean they undetermined?

562
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 3: It wasn't until much later and I thought, why would

563
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:29,399
Speaker 3: they not search the car?

564
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:33,799
Speaker 4: Those three agencies are failing to do the right thing.

565
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:36,200
Speaker 7: Sooner or later, somebody talks.

566
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:38,640
Speaker 12: Sooner or later, somebody can fap you.

567
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 9: I think I did from the ring and keep it

568
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 9: in the ground, don't make.

569
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:05,080
Speaker 2: What Happened To Libby Caswell is written, reported, and hosted

570
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,839
Speaker 2: by me Melissa Jelson, with writing and story editing by

571
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:13,400
Speaker 2: Marisa Brown and Lauren Hanson. Episodes are edited by Jeremy

572
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:18,040
Speaker 2: Thal and Carl Catle. Our executive producer is Ryan Murdoch.

573
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:23,840
Speaker 2: For iHeart Podcasts, executive producers are Jason English and Katrina Norvel,

574
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:29,360
Speaker 2: with our supervising producer Carl Catele. Fact checking by Maya Shukree.

575
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 2: Archival material courtesy of KSHB forty one News. Our theme

576
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,840
Speaker 2: song is written by Aaron Kaufman and performed by Aaron

577
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 2: Kaufman and Elizabeth Wolfe. Original music by Aaron Kaufman with

578
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 2: additional music by Jeremy Thal. Our episodes are mixed and

579
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 2: mastered by Carl Catle. To find out more about my

580
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:54,200
Speaker 2: investigation or to send a tip, please email me at

581
00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 2: what Happened To Libby at gmail dot com. Thanks so

582
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 2: much for listening until.

583
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:12,400
Speaker 9: One way five eyes so in pieces and pieces and

584
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:14,719
Speaker 9: then do you.

585
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:16,880
Speaker 10: Follow you.

586
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 9: Until until one way five Eyes, So in pieces and

587
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:33,799
Speaker 9: pieces in the.

588
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,759
Speaker 2: Remember you can get episode two right now at free

589
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 2: and a whole week early with an iHeart True Crime

590
00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:08,640
Speaker 2: Plus subscription available exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Subscribers also get

591
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 2: early access to future episodes and exclusive bonus content, completely

592
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:16,719
Speaker 2: ad free. So open your Apple podcast app, search for

593
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,560
Speaker 2: iHeart True Crime Plus and subscribe today