Speaker 1: My name is Jeffrey Z Carreen and you're listening to
Speaker 1: four Courses with Jeffrey Z. Carrion from I Heart Radio.
Speaker 1: In four courses, I'll be taking you along for the
Speaker 1: ride while I talked with the top talent of our time.
Speaker 1: In each conversation, I focus on four different areas from
Speaker 1: my guest life and career. And during those four courses,
Speaker 1: I'm going to dig deep in and cover new insights
Speaker 1: and inspirations that we can all use to fuel ourselves
Speaker 1: to push forward. My guest for this episode is a
Speaker 1: world renowned chef. He built his career working for some
Speaker 1: of the oldest and best restaurants in France, and today
Speaker 1: his flagship restaurant in New York City ranks as one
Speaker 1: of the best in the world. Without further delay, let's
Speaker 1: get into my conversation with Eric Repair and jeff For
Speaker 1: our first course, I wanted to ask Eric what parts
Speaker 1: of his childhood drew him into the kitchen. He spent
Speaker 1: his early life gathering fresh fruits and vegetables from local
Speaker 1: markets and a part of the world most of us
Speaker 1: can only dream of vacation. I was born in on
Speaker 1: Teabe and then my parents live in um next to
Speaker 1: can and then to Saint Tropez, and so I was
Speaker 1: in the front review for about nine years here. So
Speaker 1: when you think of like those times when you visit
Speaker 1: back there, what smell or memory of smell or food
Speaker 1: when you walked into your house grabbed you. What do
Speaker 1: you remember walking into your house now that once in
Speaker 1: a while you walk by another restaurant, like you know
Speaker 1: that smells sort of like what was cooking in my
Speaker 1: house or what we did all the time. What I
Speaker 1: remember the most, it's the smell of the basil, the basil,
Speaker 1: because over there is so vibrant. You can be like
Speaker 1: fifty yards from the market and and from the stand
Speaker 1: and you can smell the basil or the sweetness of
Speaker 1: the melons or something like that. If at home I
Speaker 1: have basil from the garden, or I have some melons
Speaker 1: that I never put in a fridge by the way,
Speaker 1: so they don't lose their flavor, then it minds me
Speaker 1: the market. So how old were we about them when
Speaker 1: you realize that that smell was like intoxicating. I was
Speaker 1: very young. I was maybe four or five years old,
Speaker 1: because my grandmother was taking me to the market every day,
Speaker 1: you know, like in France, that the generation was going
Speaker 1: to buy the bread every morning and whatever they needed
Speaker 1: for the day, and the day after they were going
Speaker 1: back to the market again and visiting the butcher and
Speaker 1: stopping at the vegetable stand and some days going to
Speaker 1: the fishery and so on. So it was you know,
Speaker 1: they took but takes an hour or two to do
Speaker 1: that every day. I mean, it takes time and you
Speaker 1: have to do it, but you get the ability. First
Speaker 1: of all, I believe that buying more often you you
Speaker 1: spend less because you getting much smarter and you have
Speaker 1: an inventory in your head about what you have, so
Speaker 1: you don't you're not buying you know what, I'll just
Speaker 1: get it anyways in case I need it. You don't
Speaker 1: do that. That's not in case I need it. You know,
Speaker 1: you buy what's on sale or what's fresh or what's
Speaker 1: in season, and you buy a lot of it and
Speaker 1: you eat that for three or four days. Yes, it's
Speaker 1: fantastic because you are so connected with the season just
Speaker 1: by visiting the market, just by talking to the people
Speaker 1: who sell their products. And sometimes we talk about seasons
Speaker 1: like the spring and the summer and the fall, but
Speaker 1: the beginning of the spring is very different than the
Speaker 1: middle of the spring at the end of the spring,
Speaker 1: so we we were connected to the season. Just by
Speaker 1: doing that, we knew exactly when was the best tomatoes
Speaker 1: of the year, of the best strawberries, or the sherris
Speaker 1: when the season was starting and so on. I grew
Speaker 1: a vegetable garden this past year and never had done
Speaker 1: one for a long time, and it was so much work.
Speaker 1: And I had forgotten once zucchini comes, man, you're gonna
Speaker 1: be eating zucchini a lot because it all comes on.
Speaker 1: It's yes, it's the same for the salads. Right. This
Speaker 1: year I planted some salads, and what I forgot is
Speaker 1: that all the salads comes at the same time, and
Speaker 1: so you get the same romane or the same letters
Speaker 1: in huge quantities. What I like about it is that
Speaker 1: we eat a lot of it because there's delicious, But
Speaker 1: we are also connecting with the neighborhood because we give
Speaker 1: them some salads and they're happy and they give us
Speaker 1: something else and so on. There you go, and that's
Speaker 1: what it's all about. So, so your grandmother went to
Speaker 1: the market, did your mom monique r your mom's monique, right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: And my mother was her name is still Monique, yes,
Speaker 1: And did she go to market to or was she
Speaker 1: just doing preparation and her mother helping your buying and
Speaker 1: all that sort of stuff. So my mother was going
Speaker 1: to the market as well, but not the way my
Speaker 1: grandmothers were going to the market. So I had an
Speaker 1: Italian grandmother and a provincial grandmother and they were going
Speaker 1: there on the daily base, and it was like soul
Speaker 1: food from their region northern Italy and the region of
Speaker 1: province near Avignon. And my mother was going to the market,
Speaker 1: but she was buying slightly differently, and she was very
Speaker 1: inspired by nouvelle cuisine and by what chefs like Paul
Speaker 1: Bocuse and Michelle Gerrard and all the generation we're doing.
Speaker 1: And she was cooking for us very elaborate food. So
Speaker 1: it was slightly different in terms of preparation and shopping. However,
Speaker 1: for me it was a blessing because I was exposed
Speaker 1: to salt food and I was exposed at the same
Speaker 1: time to something that it was very refined. And I
Speaker 1: didn't know that I was privileged. I thought every kid
Speaker 1: in the world was eating exactly like me, and so
Speaker 1: didn't really you like you wanted to do something in
Speaker 1: the food world, or did you have college on mine
Speaker 1: on your mind, or did you want to, you know,
Speaker 1: learn a trade. Well, I was obsessed with eating because
Speaker 1: I was so spoiled and my experience were so powerful,
Speaker 1: and I was always trying to get inside the kitchen.
Speaker 1: But nobody led me because they claim I would thrash
Speaker 1: the kitchen or leave some disaster there. But I was
Speaker 1: very young. I was five, six seven years old, obsessed
Speaker 1: with the kitchen. Not necessarily to really work hard in
Speaker 1: that kitchen. I wanted just to play a little bit,
Speaker 1: but I wanted to eat well, and that's why I
Speaker 1: was there. And then when I became older, instead of
Speaker 1: studying in high school, I was reading cookbooks and I
Speaker 1: remember Paul bocus Are like within the Marche and and
Speaker 1: so on, and I was reading recipes. Therefore I had
Speaker 1: bad grades, right, And because I had bad grades, at
Speaker 1: one point they called my mother and said, your son
Speaker 1: is really, really bad in school. He has to find
Speaker 1: what they call in friends, vocational college. And I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm going to culinary school. That's what I want to do.
Speaker 1: I want to cook and I want to eat well.
Speaker 1: And I no no idea how hard it would be
Speaker 1: to go to a clinary school and study because as
Speaker 1: you know, we are not born with knife skills and
Speaker 1: all those those important details. Right, yes, but you're you're
Speaker 1: into at this time or you still on the side
Speaker 1: of France. So I was living in a principal of Andorra,
Speaker 1: but the school was in Perpinion, which is the south
Speaker 1: of France, which was about three hours by cal from
Speaker 1: where I was living. So I was in that school
Speaker 1: and they had a reputation of being tough. All the
Speaker 1: teachers were coming from the the yacht Le France, and
Speaker 1: that boat was very iconic in the seventies and eighties,
Speaker 1: and those guys were very well trained and very tough.
Speaker 1: So they were training the cooks in the in the
Speaker 1: school with a lot of rigor, which is of course
Speaker 1: beneficial at the end, right, And they knew their craft
Speaker 1: very well. I had very good teachers, but I was
Speaker 1: not the best cook in the class. There was a
Speaker 1: lot of kids that were really excelling. I was doing
Speaker 1: a good job. I was really bored in culinary school
Speaker 1: because my parents were taking me to the best restaurants
Speaker 1: in France, and I was exposed to grid cuisine and
Speaker 1: then in culinary school, we were learning the basics, which
Speaker 1: is normal obviously, and so the basics a mayonnaise and
Speaker 1: vinegar it and sas beshamal and and things like that,
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god, this is so boring.
Speaker 1: So I was not that excited, but I was cooking
Speaker 1: pretty well. So then they decided that I was a
Speaker 1: great waiter because the first year in cleanery school you
Speaker 1: had to be a waiter a little bit for part
Speaker 1: of the weekend in the kitchen for about It's a
Speaker 1: business in the business. So they tried to push me
Speaker 1: to become a waiter, and I didn't want to do that.
Speaker 1: And a big accident happened at the end of the year,
Speaker 1: just before they took their decision. I basically dumped on
Speaker 1: top of a general from the French army a trail
Speaker 1: of cocktails, and and then it was not enough. I
Speaker 1: had to go back to the table because the teacher
Speaker 1: told me I had to go back. And then I
Speaker 1: served the table, and when it was time to serve
Speaker 1: his wife, the trail tilted and the glass fell on
Speaker 1: the neck of his wife. And that was not over again.
Speaker 1: They told me to go back to the bar and
Speaker 1: come back so I I came back and I slid
Speaker 1: on the ice cube that was on the floor, and
Speaker 1: the trail went back on the table and that was
Speaker 1: sent forever in the kitchen for the second year, and
Speaker 1: in between, they send me in training to work in
Speaker 1: a very tough kitchen to make sure that I had
Speaker 1: a passion and the fire for cooking, which I had,
Speaker 1: and I started to really enjoy being an in those
Speaker 1: kitchen and then I graduated and moved to Paris. In
Speaker 1: our second course, I had to understand how Eric's career
Speaker 1: as a chef took off when he arrived in Paris, because,
Speaker 1: unlike most people straight out of Connory School, Eric cut
Speaker 1: his teeth at one of the most renowned restaurants in France,
Speaker 1: latur Jon. In fact, the institution celebrated it's four d
Speaker 1: anniversary the very year Eric started. They were basically the
Speaker 1: first restaurant that introduced the fork in rents because the
Speaker 1: King didn't want to eat with his fingers anymore, and
Speaker 1: they created the fork, and uh, he was going there,
Speaker 1: the restaurant of the King. I never knew that. That's incredible.
Speaker 1: So four years or so, two six D something, I mean,
Speaker 1: that's just unbelievable. Yeah. During the French Revolution, because it
Speaker 1: was a sign of royalty, they basically burned the restaurant
Speaker 1: and destroy it, but they rebuilt it again on top
Speaker 1: of the ashes of the old restaurant. And then in
Speaker 1: the beginning of the twentieth century the name changed from
Speaker 1: Latin became Cafe only so Jan. So what's Tota Jan
Speaker 1: is known for other than it's incredible seller. It's like
Speaker 1: located on top of like I think it looks over
Speaker 1: Notre Dame. I think I haven't been in a long time.
Speaker 1: And they have the famous Tacolo range or the duck
Speaker 1: per se correct which the giant doctor gets smashed. Did
Speaker 1: you do that? Did you learn that process? Were you
Speaker 1: there long enough to go to the entire station? Yes?
Speaker 1: I was. I was, so I started and I was
Speaker 1: seventeen years old. I was the youngest coup in the kitchen,
Speaker 1: not the most brilliant one, I have to tell you,
Speaker 1: because coming from culinary school, going to a brigade like
Speaker 1: that is a definitely a culture whole change and the challenge.
Speaker 1: But I did all the stations except past three because
Speaker 1: they put me in pastry and one afternoon while everybody
Speaker 1: was away I ate twenty five raspberry tartlets and I
Speaker 1: didn't know they were counting them, and they kicked me
Speaker 1: out of the past three. I never went back, but
Speaker 1: I did all the station from from the fish station
Speaker 1: to the duck station. Don't they have a number system?
Speaker 1: I remember back then they had how many ducks they sold,
Speaker 1: and then they had like a prize. I believe at
Speaker 1: one point, not too many years ago, that there was
Speaker 1: the one million duck or something like that. Yes, they
Speaker 1: reached the one million. So each time that someone eats
Speaker 1: a duck, they gave him a postcard with a number.
Speaker 1: I have to tell you don't believe that story because
Speaker 1: I burned so many ducks and they didn't issue numbers
Speaker 1: for them. One day, I went for the family meal
Speaker 1: and when I came back, it was flames coming out
Speaker 1: of the hood. It was twenty four ducks burning in
Speaker 1: the oven. Oh my god, I mean duck. People understand,
Speaker 1: duck is a dangerous animal. I mean, there's so much
Speaker 1: fat on them. They're very You've got to really understand
Speaker 1: how to coca duck. It's easy to overcook it, but
Speaker 1: probably cooked ducks so the leg and the thigh is
Speaker 1: almost impossible. Probably if you haven't been to a lot,
Speaker 1: Toldo Young, I would put it on anybody's bucket list.
Speaker 1: I don't care how many stars it has now. It's
Speaker 1: just such a spectacular place to go. And it's just
Speaker 1: it's like you feel like the movie rather too. You
Speaker 1: know that when they sit down and you look it
Speaker 1: over the Paris. That's what it's like. It's that magical.
Speaker 1: It really is. Yes, it's one of the most dining
Speaker 1: room in the world. Actually, I mean you have a
Speaker 1: view of Notre Dame de Paris. It feels like it's
Speaker 1: it's in the dining room basically made of gigantic windows,
Speaker 1: and it's amazing. On inside, you see the lascent, which
Speaker 1: is the river and and Paris and Notre Dame. And
Speaker 1: on the other side you have those kind of what
Speaker 1: they called duck theaters, which are like small areas that
Speaker 1: look like a mini theater where the waiters are cutting
Speaker 1: the ducks and they are preparing the ducks and making
Speaker 1: the sauce with the press and so on. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's it's one of those very unique experience. And then
Speaker 1: they have one of the most beautiful wines set over
Speaker 1: in the world. I mean, it's i was very young
Speaker 1: when I saw it and I understood it. I would
Speaker 1: love to go back again, and just taking it as
Speaker 1: someone who just wants the experience. And I remember what
Speaker 1: I remember was going up to the window and seeing
Speaker 1: the barges going by all lit up and people are
Speaker 1: having dinner on the barges as they were going down
Speaker 1: the scene. I'm like, this is just magnificent. And that
Speaker 1: was like I thought, it was like, wow, it was
Speaker 1: a show that we was just doing it. No, that's
Speaker 1: how it's every day like that. It's just it's a lifestyle.
Speaker 1: Back then, I think it was three stars. Yes, if
Speaker 1: I'm not it was. So you went from you know,
Speaker 1: Colninary school to a couple of places three stars. That's
Speaker 1: a big leap. A lot of people work a long
Speaker 1: long time before they gave recruited for a three star restaurant. Yes,
Speaker 1: but in my mind there was no other way. I
Speaker 1: wanted to work in a three star restaurant. I didn't
Speaker 1: want to work in anything else. So when I graduated,
Speaker 1: I went to buy the Michelin Guide and it was
Speaker 1: eighteen restaurants in France that at three stars, and I
Speaker 1: sent I wrote by end of course, at the time
Speaker 1: it was no computers. I wrote eighteen letters saying, hey,
Speaker 1: I'm a re repair I just graduated, blah blah blah,
Speaker 1: I'm seventeen years old. I wanted to work in your kitchen,
Speaker 1: and nobody answered and and finally a month and a
Speaker 1: half later, I received a call and it was a
Speaker 1: suche from lad Brand who said are you repair? And
Speaker 1: I said, yes, I am repaired. While we got your
Speaker 1: letter and we have a job for you. And I
Speaker 1: said when, Yeah, great, okay, when can I start? And
Speaker 1: it was a Friday afternoon and I remember because I
Speaker 1: was coming back from ranging in the forest for Portugue.
Speaker 1: And the guy said, well, I need you on Monday.
Speaker 1: In between Friday afternoon and Monday, we were able to
Speaker 1: find an airline ticket. I made my suitcase and I
Speaker 1: was in Paris in a subway on Monday morning on
Speaker 1: my way to rang. I just hearing that, I get
Speaker 1: chills because when you get to the door, you know,
Speaker 1: the hallway to the kitchen is always fluorescent, like it's
Speaker 1: not pretty, it's always the feeling is like you're out
Speaker 1: of body feeling. It's like where am I? What's that
Speaker 1: so foreign? You're not in any comfort zone. Whatsoever, and
Speaker 1: you're like, at the same time, you're like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: this is amazing. Yes, it was amazing and fascinating. But
Speaker 1: I was so scared because I was pretty protected in
Speaker 1: my lifestyle because Andorra is a very small country. Everybody
Speaker 1: is happy. I have never seen professional kitchens. It was
Speaker 1: all about reading in books and dreaming about it and
Speaker 1: so on. And suddenly you are in that kitchen with
Speaker 1: thirty or forty cooks. And when I walk in that kitchen,
Speaker 1: they were already like in full speed. It was eight
Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning, but the stocks were boiling and
Speaker 1: the guys were working and running and so on and
Speaker 1: and actually I was very surprised. Nobody was my age.
Speaker 1: They were all like twenty five thirty years old, and
Speaker 1: they look at me like I was someone coming from
Speaker 1: a UFO. And uh, it was very intimidating. But I
Speaker 1: mean after a couple of days, I mean, was it
Speaker 1: just like You're like, oh my god, it's pinched me
Speaker 1: because you know you're at some place that's extraordinary. Yes,
Speaker 1: I was extremely happy and challenge at the same time,
Speaker 1: because when you come out of a culinary school, as
Speaker 1: much as you believe that with your graduation. You are
Speaker 1: a great cook. When you work in those restaurants, you
Speaker 1: realize you know so little and you make so many
Speaker 1: mistakes and so on, and you the challenges are enormous.
Speaker 1: It was a very intense experience for me, but I
Speaker 1: have no regret at all. I will do it in
Speaker 1: a heartbit. Yeah. I So what's the first station that
Speaker 1: you worked? Where did they put you first? Obviously didn't
Speaker 1: work a station. And then what was the first time
Speaker 1: when someone noticed that you were really very capable and
Speaker 1: they're like said, okay, let's you know, the world got
Speaker 1: around that, you know what you were doing so specialized
Speaker 1: in ducks. However, they put me in a fish station.
Speaker 1: H And the fish station it was not so easy.
Speaker 1: I mean you had to take care of yourself of
Speaker 1: filting your fish and taking care of the shellfish and
Speaker 1: making your sauce and garnishchees and so on. So I
Speaker 1: was helping the main chief in that station, and I
Speaker 1: had a lot to learn. I mean from making an
Speaker 1: lands with thirty two yolks that became scrambled eggs after
Speaker 1: on my first day, after an hour in that kitchen,
Speaker 1: to cutting my fingers, slicing shallotte again on the first
Speaker 1: day was the beginning was a bit rough. But after
Speaker 1: I would say three or four months, finally that came
Speaker 1: to me and they said, you know, we believe. Now
Speaker 1: now it's time for you to move to the next station.
Speaker 1: And that was a big deal. When they were moving you,
Speaker 1: it was like a very big compliment. You were accomplished
Speaker 1: in one station, you could go to the next and
Speaker 1: learn something else, and then you were moving again and
Speaker 1: again and again. So the fish station. So you're at
Speaker 1: the fish station, is there anything now knowing fish like
Speaker 1: you know now? Was there anything there that stood out
Speaker 1: knowing what it was then as being exemplary since they
Speaker 1: weren't known for fish. Yeah, I thought that the way
Speaker 1: they were preparing fish was extremely light and very original. Actually,
Speaker 1: the chef Dominick Bush at the time was trying to
Speaker 1: change a little bit the reputation of Latron and get
Speaker 1: away from the ducks and have a reputation for a
Speaker 1: broader cuisine. So it was really putting a lot of
Speaker 1: efforts into the fish station, which was my luck because
Speaker 1: we we're using a lot of different techniques. It was
Speaker 1: a blessing because I really really started my love for
Speaker 1: cooking fish in there. It seems like like looking back
Speaker 1: at your career, like told Jean, could have been a
Speaker 1: place that really cemented fish for you, even though it's
Speaker 1: not known for fish. I mean I never ate fishy
Speaker 1: to Jean, No, because nobody, I mean, if everybody hits
Speaker 1: the duck. However, again, the fish was really delicious, and
Speaker 1: I really started to enjoy very much cooking fish because
Speaker 1: when you cook meat, and I love I don't have
Speaker 1: a preference in between meat and fish or vegetables. When
Speaker 1: I cook, I cook with my heart and with my
Speaker 1: knowledge and and so on and my instinct. But when
Speaker 1: you cook meat is a very sensual way of cooking, right,
Speaker 1: But when you cook fish, it's a very sensual way.
Speaker 1: But also it's a very technical way. And I love
Speaker 1: the fact that you have to be so focused because
Speaker 1: ten seconds could be the biggest mistake and the fish
Speaker 1: becomes are cooked and he has no flavor and so on.
Speaker 1: The meat is much more forgiven you cooked meat an
Speaker 1: extra minute, you don't have consequences for the fish. You
Speaker 1: have to be so cautious, and you have to be
Speaker 1: so cautious also with whatever goes in the plate, because
Speaker 1: the fish is so delicate. That any ingredients could overwhelm
Speaker 1: the qualities of that filly of fish in the plate.
Speaker 1: So I learned that from La Daran and moving to
Speaker 1: Robbie Shaw and to other restaurants, I learned that respect
Speaker 1: for the techniques and for the ingredients, and especially for
Speaker 1: cooking fish for our third course. I wasn't just gonna
Speaker 1: let Eric class all the time working with world class
Speaker 1: chef Joan robber Shan at his restaurant jam Robbishan ran
Speaker 1: one of the strictest kitchens in the business, and I
Speaker 1: wanted to know how these extremely high standard shaped Eric's
Speaker 1: style as a chef. Tell me about Jamain. I mean
Speaker 1: I remember eating a Jamin and then I remember the
Speaker 1: next time I had his. This cuisine was the Latalier
Speaker 1: and he did a very big deal. But tell me
Speaker 1: about the working as German, Like what, you were assistant
Speaker 1: chef the party, which is a big deal. Yes, So
Speaker 1: he hired me um as the chef the party. So
Speaker 1: after a chef the Party, which is like, it's a
Speaker 1: pretty good title. I mean, chef the party means you're
Speaker 1: responsible for a station. And I was actually in garde manger,
Speaker 1: which is the cold pitier section, and I was in
Speaker 1: charge of Garde Manger. With him, Joel Robbie Jamain was
Speaker 1: doing miracles every day. And he's the most rigorous, knowledgeable,
Speaker 1: precise and demanding chef that I have ever seen in
Speaker 1: the world. To this day, he's no longer with us,
Speaker 1: but he was considered God at the time and his
Speaker 1: his entire career, he was extremely respected for the fact
Speaker 1: that he was probably with Freddy Rillard Gerardin in Switzerland,
Speaker 1: considered the best chef of the planet. So I walk
Speaker 1: in Jamin and I come. I'm coming from lat Dar ground.
Speaker 1: We are about thirty cooks in La round. We do
Speaker 1: and read and something cover the night. I go at
Speaker 1: rubbish round. We are about thirty cooks and we do
Speaker 1: fourty covers. And everybody start at six o'clock in the
Speaker 1: morning as a break of half hour in afternoon and
Speaker 1: we end up at midnight at the earliest, or sometimes
Speaker 1: one or two o'clock in the morning. And that is
Speaker 1: five days a week, so you basically have four hours
Speaker 1: to go to your house, take a shower, have breakfast,
Speaker 1: brought your teeth, put some clothes, come back. So tell
Speaker 1: me why, tell me what you saw that was remarkable
Speaker 1: that stayed with you. Robbi Shawn was caring so much
Speaker 1: about the attention to the detail, and he was the
Speaker 1: first and I think the only chef that I know
Speaker 1: who was able to bring the precision and the stat
Speaker 1: of the cuisine that they do in competitions. But usually
Speaker 1: that cuisine in competition is not really delicious. It looks
Speaker 1: beautiful and it takes three days to make, so three
Speaker 1: days later your fish is fishy, obviously. But Robi Shaw
Speaker 1: was able to bring that exercise of making competitions and
Speaker 1: he won all of them, and he was bringing that
Speaker 1: in the plate, and it was done in a timely
Speaker 1: manner for the clients, and everything was super freshy, and
Speaker 1: we had the best thing radiants and so on. So
Speaker 1: it was basically mission impossible. You were going to robbish
Speaker 1: On knowing that you will not be capable to make
Speaker 1: him happy and to meet the standards. However, you will
Speaker 1: try to get as close as you can, and it
Speaker 1: will take you hours and hours and hours of work
Speaker 1: to try. And at the same time you knew he
Speaker 1: would never be happy. Just amazing. So I remember I
Speaker 1: remember distinctly the ravioli languesstea u. This is amazing. Jeffrey
Speaker 1: that's ravioli of langostein. You know, we were making the
Speaker 1: ravioli when you were ordering. So you were saying, I
Speaker 1: want an order of ravioli, which was on the bed
Speaker 1: of cabbage with flua grad trafle sauce. Right, you had
Speaker 1: some guy running with some lingos tein's, going to the
Speaker 1: pasta machine, making the door, putting the langosteins in it,
Speaker 1: poaching the langosteins in a broth. And while someone was
Speaker 1: doing all that, we were preparing the cabbage, and we
Speaker 1: were preparing the flag. Oh my god. That was the
Speaker 1: way Roby Shron was cooking for his clients. So imagine
Speaker 1: we were, yes, thirdly cooks for four recovers, but you
Speaker 1: were ordering one order of langostein and you had three
Speaker 1: or four guys involved for fifteen minutes just for you.
Speaker 1: And then he was touching the revoli with his finger
Speaker 1: and sometimes the langostins wouldn't be as firm as he likes,
Speaker 1: so we will have to read the dish. It was
Speaker 1: an interesting time. How long did you stay there? So
Speaker 1: I stayed one year and then I was struggling because
Speaker 1: it was really really challenging, and I was called to
Speaker 1: go to do my military duties because it was mandatory
Speaker 1: at the time in France. So I went to see
Speaker 1: him and I told him that I had to live
Speaker 1: because I was called. And he said, don't worry about it.
Speaker 1: I'm going to send you to the Eliza. You will
Speaker 1: cook for the President of France, but you're staying with
Speaker 1: me for now. And I said, very flattering. It was
Speaker 1: very flattering, but I said, no, I cannot do that
Speaker 1: because I really have to go back to the south
Speaker 1: of France. So anyway, let me go. And on my
Speaker 1: last day of my military duties, I thought it was
Speaker 1: a joke. I received a call at the office of
Speaker 1: the sergeant and the sergeant said, you have a call.
Speaker 1: Is Joel Robby Shaw on the phone? And I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: sure of course, and I grabbed the phone and it
Speaker 1: seemed and he says to me, he says, I hear
Speaker 1: that you're finishing your duties and so on. I have
Speaker 1: a positive for you. Would you like to come back
Speaker 1: at jama and you will be the chef person in
Speaker 1: charge of the fish station. And I said to him,
Speaker 1: thank you so much. I have to think about it.
Speaker 1: And he said to me, of course, you have thirty
Speaker 1: seconds and you can imagine in thirty seconds how many
Speaker 1: things goes in your head. And of course I had
Speaker 1: to say, yes, I had no choice. So therefore I
Speaker 1: was back with him again for two more years in
Speaker 1: a fish station. So tell me how he cooked fishback then?
Speaker 1: How did he use his poal? What did he do
Speaker 1: about he roast palet jose? What did he do? So
Speaker 1: he was identifying the qualities of the fish in his mind.
Speaker 1: He knew that some fish are better when they are
Speaker 1: poach or steam. Some fish are better when they are
Speaker 1: soute and the skin is crispy. Some fish needs to
Speaker 1: be backed and hauled and then potentially of the boat,
Speaker 1: and so on. We were using all those different techniques
Speaker 1: we had about I was six different recipes of fish
Speaker 1: on the menu as main course. They had, of course
Speaker 1: different source and different techniques and different garnishes that were
Speaker 1: all meant to elevate the qualities of the fish. And
Speaker 1: that is what I learned with him before I came
Speaker 1: to America. It's how to elevate the qualities of every
Speaker 1: individual shellfish and and fish that we are cooking. So
Speaker 1: I mean, you came to us eighty nine, what the
Speaker 1: hell was on your my New has been the Second Revolution.
Speaker 1: I remember eighty nine. It was it was crazy. New
Speaker 1: York City was crazy to eighty nine. I was in Washington.
Speaker 1: Disease it was not the word at all because politicians
Speaker 1: and lawyers are pretty boring at night. However, I was
Speaker 1: with Georgean Riparadan, great great Jean Riparada was an extremely
Speaker 1: creative chef. It was kind of a hipy gypsy, crazy, fun,
Speaker 1: creative guy. And I learned so much from him because
Speaker 1: he said to me said, look, you come from Robbish,
Speaker 1: from kitchen, and he he made you a great technician.
Speaker 1: But basically you cannot create anything. You can only duplicate.
Speaker 1: So he said, I'm going to take care of you
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna make you creative. You have to open
Speaker 1: your mind. So Jean Louis was on a mission to
Speaker 1: make me creative with all the techniques that I had
Speaker 1: to related from La. That's a deadly assassin, right you have,
Speaker 1: knowing Judo and carrying an M sixteen. So anyway, if
Speaker 1: I can make a comparison its own analogies like coming
Speaker 1: from Catholic school and going to Woodstock directly. Anyway, I
Speaker 1: was having fun in the kitchen with Jean Riparada, but
Speaker 1: I didn't want to stay in Washington. I was very young,
Speaker 1: and I was very attracted by New York because it
Speaker 1: was a lot of things happening in New York in
Speaker 1: every industry, and and the city is always very active,
Speaker 1: as we know, so I wanted to party as well.
Speaker 1: So I came to the city and worked for David Boule.
Speaker 1: I worked with him for eight or nine months, and
Speaker 1: then Sheberlocas offered me the position of being his chef
Speaker 1: the cuisine, and I came to Lebernarda. How did he
Speaker 1: know about you? Did he know that you worked in Robberation?
Speaker 1: Did they have a hotline into all these new guys friends?
Speaker 1: So Shelberlacaus wanted to replace Elbera Miller, who opened Lebernardan
Speaker 1: with him in nine six, So it was one and
Speaker 1: he called Jean Upaada in Washington. They were good friends,
Speaker 1: and Jean Louis said, I had this kid in my
Speaker 1: kitchen now is at Boule, but I think he can
Speaker 1: do the job. Try to get in touch with him
Speaker 1: and we will see if he can go to lebernard
Speaker 1: And and become the chef. I started actually Junie leven
Speaker 1: at seven for the am of and I remember because
Speaker 1: I look at my watch, the energy was very strange.
Speaker 1: I felt it was something very special. My sixth cents said,
Speaker 1: this restaurant's going to be very important for you. Do
Speaker 1: not forget when you arriving here at and and then
Speaker 1: I never forgot. So you have the technician, and you
Speaker 1: had Happy and now you have Yourbert. Where is he stand?
Speaker 1: Where is he lie? So Gilbert knows how to cook fish,
Speaker 1: and his fish is delicious, and I'm learning from him.
Speaker 1: But I have learned already a lot from my previous
Speaker 1: chefs and mentors, and I muster pretty well all the
Speaker 1: techniques that are used at Lebernardre. So Gilbert basically says
Speaker 1: to me, look, I want you to be the chef here.
Speaker 1: You're going to be in charge of managing the team.
Speaker 1: For me, it's something very new, because until then I
Speaker 1: was managing very small teams, like two guys with me
Speaker 1: in my station. Suddenly I'm I'm basically in charge of
Speaker 1: a kitchen of forty five cooks or something like that.
Speaker 1: At the time, it's something that was completely new. And
Speaker 1: Gilbert was very kind and very patient and very supportive,
Speaker 1: and he let me make all the mistakes. Always always
Speaker 1: defended me and and stood up for me, knowing that
Speaker 1: I was wrong anyway, It meant her meaning like that,
Speaker 1: and it was my luck. And I worked with him
Speaker 1: for three full years until he passed away. Very sad day.
Speaker 1: I remember that, how did you reconcile with that where
Speaker 1: you then became the person? How do you replace someone
Speaker 1: that's such a dynamic person. What did you think to
Speaker 1: yourself at that time? If you can remember, It was
Speaker 1: very difficult. But Magilos called me a few days later
Speaker 1: and she said, look, my brother always told me that
Speaker 1: he trusted you to run his kitchen, and I would
Speaker 1: like for you to to now run the kitchen on
Speaker 1: your own. And I don't want to create a museum
Speaker 1: to the memory of my brother. I want you to
Speaker 1: continue to create and find your style and your voice,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to support you, and we are going
Speaker 1: to keep it down out there, open, and we are
Speaker 1: going to make it better than ever. Wow, what a
Speaker 1: remarkable lady to see that. That's a big leap. But
Speaker 1: obviously she's a very smart lady, because look what happened
Speaker 1: top fifty in the world, and you've taken it from
Speaker 1: that pressure laden restaurant in Paris, and you moved through
Speaker 1: the ranks and you just came up with your own
Speaker 1: style and actually happened the way it was actually supposed
Speaker 1: to happen. Yeah, sometimes you know, destiny is full of mystery, right.
Speaker 1: But I am very grateful to be at lebernarda. I'm
Speaker 1: having fun. Of course, we have been challenged throughout the years,
Speaker 1: in between nine eleven and a good recession and lately
Speaker 1: the COVID and so on, but I still have tremendous
Speaker 1: joy in being in Le Bernard and working with the team,
Speaker 1: and it's extremely motivating, rewarding. Of course, the ultimate goal
Speaker 1: is to create an experience and the delicious meal to
Speaker 1: our clients, and that makes me happy. But you also
Speaker 1: you've given that if you let your staff shine. I
Speaker 1: think you've let what Maggie do to you to your
Speaker 1: other people with Aldo and it's such a fun place
Speaker 1: to be and it's you've made it very unpretentious, I
Speaker 1: must say. And that's you feel. I think you said
Speaker 1: you were grateful. You feel the gratitude, you really do.
Speaker 1: Your staff loves you, and you feel the gratitude they
Speaker 1: have for what they what they're doing. They're able to
Speaker 1: have this incredible experience and work there. Thank you. Yes,
Speaker 1: I mean I really try to create an experience that
Speaker 1: is warm and friendly, and restaurants, fine dining or not,
Speaker 1: should be always very welcoming, and it should be always
Speaker 1: we are here to please, right, I mean, they don't
Speaker 1: come to the better then to be miserable. They come
Speaker 1: to to have good food and to have a good time,
Speaker 1: and that makes it interesting. For our fourth and final course,
Speaker 1: I got to ask Eric about how he finds contentment
Speaker 1: and the way he keeps himself anchored in a fast
Speaker 1: paced world. But first I wanted to hear more about
Speaker 1: his inspiration behind his latest cookbook, Vegetable Simple. I've read
Speaker 1: a lot about you, your books two Yolks, and this
Speaker 1: wonderful book, this best seller, Vegetable Simple, which is it's
Speaker 1: actually so simple, it's almost I'm like, I'm looking in
Speaker 1: the recipe, I'm like, that's all there is. Let me
Speaker 1: like clicks that again. There's only four ingredients, and like, yes,
Speaker 1: treated with respect for ingredients is absolutely enough if you
Speaker 1: have a really good product, and so that that thank
Speaker 1: you for doing that, because it really is vegetable Simple.
Speaker 1: You really restrain yourself. Yeah, thank you. It's inspired really
Speaker 1: by my lifestyle outside the restaurant and by my childhood.
Speaker 1: And when I entertained in Hampton's in the summer, I
Speaker 1: go to the farm stand and I get inspired by
Speaker 1: the vegetables that I see. And then I entertained and
Speaker 1: I put a lot of different dishes on the table
Speaker 1: that are very easy to make and and that pay
Speaker 1: respected to the ingredients of great quality. And then I said,
Speaker 1: why not make a book like that? Well, it is amazing,
Speaker 1: and I you know, I was watching your Instagram during
Speaker 1: the pandemic, but you're putting out things like rat TWI
Speaker 1: you made like uh, mozzarella dish and uh. It was
Speaker 1: just so inspiring to see you cook things like with
Speaker 1: such simplicity and elegance. It was like wow, Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: overnight I became the private chef of the family. The
Speaker 1: restase was closing, and I was in charge of breakfast, lunch,
Speaker 1: and dinner, and and therefore I had to go shopping
Speaker 1: and and then I was creating food for the family
Speaker 1: that was nutritional and well balanced and at the same
Speaker 1: time that was delicious, because I cannot have my family
Speaker 1: saying that my food is not delicious, So I was
Speaker 1: putting a lot of passion in it. So you've had five,
Speaker 1: i think five or six books. You know, you've won
Speaker 1: so many accolades, and you really love just doing one
Speaker 1: one restaurant. You really love this, and I still respect
Speaker 1: that about you. There's very few people that are very like,
Speaker 1: just you really love doing this thing. What is it
Speaker 1: that makes you want to say? You know what? This
Speaker 1: is great? I love this. I want to continue this.
Speaker 1: I just want to keep getting better and better because
Speaker 1: it's such a stressful environment. Yes, of course it's stressful,
Speaker 1: but as you know, Jeffrey, we'll learn how to manage
Speaker 1: to the stress, and we'll learn how to strive on
Speaker 1: the stress, and and so on. For me, I came
Speaker 1: in this industry because I love eating, I love cooking.
Speaker 1: I love to be with my team, and I love
Speaker 1: to create an experience. I never came in in our
Speaker 1: industry because I wanted to become a model, and I
Speaker 1: didn't think that I was coming in this industry to
Speaker 1: open fifty restaurants. Not like it's wrong. Obviously, I admire
Speaker 1: where as fifty restaurants, and if they are happy, I'm
Speaker 1: I'm super happy for them as well. And for me,
Speaker 1: it doesn't do it, it doesn't make me happy. I tried, actually,
Speaker 1: and I didn't like to be in a plane. I
Speaker 1: didn't like to be in a train. I didn't like
Speaker 1: to be away from my house. I didn't like to
Speaker 1: be away from the kitchen of le Bernard. And I
Speaker 1: didn't like to lose not the control, but basically the
Speaker 1: influence that I have in the kitchen or in a
Speaker 1: team when I am here. I didn't like the distance
Speaker 1: and so on. So they afore I decided that Lebernard
Speaker 1: and was sufficient. And I think I have learned over
Speaker 1: the years how to recognize contentment. And I am content.
Speaker 1: And when you are content, why do something else? So
Speaker 1: where are you moving to? What? What is your your
Speaker 1: mental state, in your spiritual state? Saying about where the
Speaker 1: restaurant has to go, where you have to go, and
Speaker 1: where you have to lead your team, because you have
Speaker 1: to be going somewhere. Right, You can't just stay still, Yes,
Speaker 1: especially in New York, if you stay still, everything moves
Speaker 1: forwarth so fast suddenly you are going backwards. So you
Speaker 1: have to always evolve. But evolving, for me, it's instinctive.
Speaker 1: It's a reaction to what's happening in fashion, to what's
Speaker 1: happening in technology, to what's happening in the world around us,
Speaker 1: and I respond to it in a creative way, in
Speaker 1: an artistic way, by changing lebernardance slowly but surely, and
Speaker 1: changing the way we hook, the way we deliver the
Speaker 1: experience to the client, by renovating the dining room. By
Speaker 1: all of that text a lot of time, and then
Speaker 1: I have a lot of pleasure doing books. I did
Speaker 1: a bit of TV at one point, and I loved it.
Speaker 1: It was fun. It's always something going on. I am
Speaker 1: very busy, just evolving and learning and and so on.
Speaker 1: And also I have the luck to basically divide my
Speaker 1: my time to find balance. I dedicate a third of
Speaker 1: my time to the business and le Bernard and and
Speaker 1: so on, a third of my time to my family,
Speaker 1: and a third of my time for myself. And by
Speaker 1: doing that, I find balance. And I believe that if
Speaker 1: you have time for yourself, like just being selfish, you
Speaker 1: will be a better family member. Family support you. Therefore
Speaker 1: you will be a better boss, and the team support you,
Speaker 1: and therefore you can again support your family better. And
Speaker 1: it's a circle, is a cycle, and all of that
Speaker 1: it's a blessing for me to feel like that and
Speaker 1: to be able to play with an instrument, which is
Speaker 1: the restaurant, the way I want to play. It's like
Speaker 1: almost like a miracle. So therefore, I'm never board. I'm
Speaker 1: always motivated. I always have projects and visions and I
Speaker 1: accomplished them. I have challenges, of course, a lot of it,
Speaker 1: and you can see that in my white hair. But
Speaker 1: it's fantastic. It's life. I mean, I just love the
Speaker 1: way you said that. I think, honestly, some balance is hard.
Speaker 1: The recipe of balance, I tell people it's very hard.
Speaker 1: You're always putting out fires and you're always there's three
Speaker 1: balls in the here all the time, so you really
Speaker 1: it is juggling. But the way you put it is
Speaker 1: more spiritual than juggling. So it's sort of a spiritual juggling,
Speaker 1: you would say. But I really believe that when you
Speaker 1: do bring energy to your family, you have a better family.
Speaker 1: You're able to support and make your partner better. If
Speaker 1: she can be better, your family can be better. You
Speaker 1: you you got their back, And that's really what I
Speaker 1: hear a lot of people talking about. They say, well,
Speaker 1: what's the what's the hardest thing to do is just
Speaker 1: the really make everybody around you better, and it's probably
Speaker 1: why you're so content because you're always doing that. Yes,
Speaker 1: and and again it's not easy every day. Obviously, it's
Speaker 1: challenging in a way, right, but it's fantastic to try
Speaker 1: and to succeed and to see the results, to try
Speaker 1: to find systems for your employees for them to have
Speaker 1: happiness and have also some balance because in our industry,
Speaker 1: as you know, Jeffrey, it's a lot of people who burn,
Speaker 1: and they burn because they don't have that balance. So
Speaker 1: we we have to create that to protect ourselves and
Speaker 1: to protect the people that support us, and that may
Speaker 1: make us successful because our families and team are our success.
Speaker 1: Without them, we are nothing. As you know. The thing
Speaker 1: for me we're just listening to is it's extraordinary. I
Speaker 1: think that endure, that remote little place in the south
Speaker 1: of France and the smell of Basil, I think it
Speaker 1: affected you deeply, and I think that you try to
Speaker 1: recreate that, and you have recreated that, and you're you're
Speaker 1: very fortunate, but you've not gone through all the things
Speaker 1: you've gone through. So my hat's off to you, and uh,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for spending time with me on
Speaker 1: Four Courses. I appreciate it. Thank you so much, Jeffrey
Speaker 1: for having me, and thank you thanks very much for
Speaker 1: listening to Four Courses with Jeffrey Zcrian, A production of
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio and Corner Table Entertainment. Four Courses is
Speaker 1: created by Jeffrey Zcarrion, Margaret Zecarrion, Jared Keller, and Tara Helper.
Speaker 1: Our executive producer is Christopher Hasiotis. Four Courses is produced
Speaker 1: by Jonathan Habs Dressler. Our research is conducted by Jesselyn Shields.
Speaker 1: Our talent booking is by Pamela Bauer at Dogtown Talent.
Speaker 1: This episode was edited and written by Priya Maha Davon
Speaker 1: and mixed by Joe Tistle. Special thanks to Katie Fellman
Speaker 1: for help as recording engineer. For more podcasts from I
Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.