1 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:05,920 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind from House stuff 2 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:14,239 Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, you're welcome to stuff to blow 3 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 1: your mind. My name is Robert Lam and my name 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 1: is Christian Sager. Which would preferred melee weapons in combat? Well, um, 5 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:26,280 Speaker 1: if I'm just around the house, I guess it would 6 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: be to grab like a stick or something, so I 7 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:34,560 Speaker 1: would be falling into like like pool fighting. Yeah you know, yeah, yeah, 8 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 1: I'm a I'm a glave fan. Yeah, like glaves. I 9 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 1: don't own one. I probably should get on that. But 10 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:46,760 Speaker 1: today's episode is about a very strange melee weapon, one 11 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:52,080 Speaker 1: that humans don't wield yet. There's still time, but that 12 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: apparently crabs. You not only use tools, but use weapons, 13 00:00:57,400 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 1: and they're alive. Yeah. The idea of crabs, specifically varieties 14 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:05,280 Speaker 1: of that are known as boxing crabs or pom pom 15 00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 1: crabs that not only the tool users, but they will 16 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 1: grab an enemy, particular types of s enemies, and wield 17 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: them as weapons, hold them like little cudgels, uh, you know, 18 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:20,040 Speaker 1: showing them off, letting everybody know that they're armed to 19 00:01:20,080 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 1: the teeth, using them to hunt food, using them to 20 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:29,360 Speaker 1: defend themselves like little bioweapons, stinging clubs, that are alive 21 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 1: that they have this mutualistic relationship with It's pretty clever. Yeah. 22 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:36,759 Speaker 1: I posted a chart from one of those studies we're 23 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:39,200 Speaker 1: gonna talk about today to our Facebook and Twitter feeds 24 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:42,000 Speaker 1: and asked people said, hey, this is a hint as 25 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:43,960 Speaker 1: to what we're studying, and most people said they thought 26 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 1: it was crab cheerleading, which is about right since they're 27 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:48,880 Speaker 1: called the pompomp Crab. Well, they are making a show 28 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 1: of things here, and they they do look like pom 29 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:54,120 Speaker 1: bombs too many people. But I think the I think 30 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: nun chucks would be a more appropriate uh scenario if 31 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 1: your nun chuck was a says and it could bite people. Yeah, 32 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:06,480 Speaker 1: like really. To get into um parallels to this, we 33 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 1: really have to look to science fiction and fantasy, where 34 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:14,399 Speaker 1: I think we see some some wonderful examples of one 35 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:18,359 Speaker 1: fictional species using another fictional species are using some sort 36 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: of living weapon, uh to defend themselves or to attack 37 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 1: their adversaries. So one example that comes to my mind 38 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 1: are the Tyrannids of the Warhammer forty thousand universe. I'm 39 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:33,720 Speaker 1: unfamiliar with us. Well, if you're familiar with with aliens 40 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:38,920 Speaker 1: or basically any property that has a a biological hive 41 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 1: mind species. Then you basically have the gist of the Tanage, 42 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:46,239 Speaker 1: so they come from another galaxy. They're all flesh, their 43 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 1: spaceships are flesh, and they also they also have all 44 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 1: these various forms, different morphological variants of the tyrannids depending 45 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 1: on you know, basically every level of an infantry army 46 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 1: that you would have in your tabletop game. But they 47 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:03,640 Speaker 1: utilize a number of what are called weapon biomorphs to 48 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:06,840 Speaker 1: gun down their adversaries. So these are living weapons, living 49 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:11,399 Speaker 1: things that include bioplasma canons. Uh. And another example would 50 00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 1: be the Impaler canon. It fires bony spines that are 51 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: as long as a man doesn't Halo have something like that, 52 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:21,440 Speaker 1: the Needler Probabler. Maybe the Needler isn't alive though, Like 53 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 1: I feel like there's some version of this in most 54 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:27,680 Speaker 1: science fiction properties, like the Necromorphs and Dead Space. You're 55 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: kind of similar. You have, of course, the creatures in 56 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: um in the novel and subsequent film Starship Troopers. Yeah, yeah, 57 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 1: that makes sense. Again, Aliens, anytime there is like an 58 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:45,400 Speaker 1: all flesh adversary, you encounter this type of thing, and 59 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:48,640 Speaker 1: sometimes they have spaceships and weapons the one that comes 60 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:51,400 Speaker 1: to mind for me. And I'm not a big expert 61 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:54,880 Speaker 1: on this. Our our colleague Holly Fry might destroy me 62 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 1: if I pronounced this wrong. But those in the expanded 63 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 1: noncnon called Star Wars universe, there's this species called I 64 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 1: think it's the Yusen Vong. I've only read it. Um. 65 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 1: And they utilize biotechnology for everything, including their weapons and 66 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 1: armor and ships, so all their stuff is alive. They 67 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:18,160 Speaker 1: actually have like total disdain for any kind of mechanical technology. Yeah, 68 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: and these guys. Had remember seeing lots of art depicting 69 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:23,960 Speaker 1: these guys, and they they're kind of like white skinned, 70 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:27,320 Speaker 1: cling on type creatures thinks. So yeah, and they wore 71 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:31,840 Speaker 1: like like chitten for armor, and their weapons were like 72 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: similar to the race you were just describing, like sort 73 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:37,120 Speaker 1: of bioplasma and stuff. Like. They're really cool looking. I 74 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,719 Speaker 1: always love the idea of them. Yeah. Um, and you've 75 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 1: got here labyrinth. I forgot about this. So there's a 76 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,040 Speaker 1: wonderful moment in Jim Hinson's Labyrinth where you have some 77 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:51,960 Speaker 1: of the goblins that are tormenting Ludo and if you remember, 78 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 1: they're running around, they had these these long poles, these 79 00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 1: long sticks, and on the end they have these biting creatures. 80 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 1: They look kind of like an embryonic chicken, like they 81 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,839 Speaker 1: look kind of blind, and they have enormous teeth in 82 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 1: their little mouth, and they just go and they'll take 83 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: the stick with the biter on it and hold it 84 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: up to Ludo so that they could bite him. And 85 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,239 Speaker 1: this really reminds me a lot of the crabs scenario 86 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 1: we're talking about here, where one little creature is using 87 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:22,719 Speaker 1: another little creature as a as a as a cudgel, 88 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 1: as a as a as a melee weapon against another being. 89 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 1: Every time Labyrinth comes up or I rewatch it, I 90 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: just I always think to myself, like, no, like you 91 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:35,279 Speaker 1: would want to stay there and hang out with the 92 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 1: goblins and David Bowie, Like that is way more fun 93 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,279 Speaker 1: than running away. I don't know why. I don't know, 94 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 1: Like if I was the baby, I would want to say, 95 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:46,279 Speaker 1: if I was what's her face, Sarah? The name of 96 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,000 Speaker 1: the character? What region of the labyrinth would you like 97 00:05:49,080 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 1: to put down roots in? Oh? Just the dance party one, 98 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: the dance Magic dance one, of course. Um. But this 99 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 1: also reminded me of two comic books which I brought 100 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 1: in and I let you borrow um. James Stoko does 101 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: a book called orc Stain, and Brandon Graham used to 102 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:08,960 Speaker 1: do a book called King's City. And these guys are 103 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 1: buddies actually, so it makes sense that both their sort 104 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:15,840 Speaker 1: of fantasy worlds will it involve using animals as weapons. 105 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:20,120 Speaker 1: In King's City, cats are used as weapons, and I 106 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: think they're like called cat masters or something like that. 107 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:25,360 Speaker 1: And if you're if you're trained in such a way 108 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:27,719 Speaker 1: you have a cat that's like you're familiar and you 109 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:30,039 Speaker 1: can use it as a weapon. You can and it 110 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,440 Speaker 1: and it works together with you. So these people like 111 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 1: use them as melee weapons or they throw them up 112 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:36,760 Speaker 1: in the air and the cat like throws shrunkin's or 113 00:06:36,800 --> 00:06:41,000 Speaker 1: something or sharkns sorry uh. And what's the other things? 114 00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 1: Like sometimes the cat can like bend its tail to 115 00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 1: pick locks and stuff like that. So so there's that, 116 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: But in orc Stain, it's very much like what we're 117 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,760 Speaker 1: gonna talk about today, where they have actual living but 118 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:55,040 Speaker 1: more like kind of anemony type things that function as weapons, 119 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:59,120 Speaker 1: like their axes have like eyes and mouths or or um. 120 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: Like there's a pacific creature that's called the zazoo. That 121 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,719 Speaker 1: they one person wears as like a cloak and it 122 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:08,480 Speaker 1: has eyeballs and like you can just take zazoo often 123 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 1: throw it at people and it'll attack them. I glanced 124 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 1: at this book and I think I'll probably give it 125 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: a read. It has a very visceral art style like it. 126 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 1: It looks like it's just like NonStop blood and perhaps 127 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:26,880 Speaker 1: like work. Scrotums. Work, scrotum and genitalia are very important 128 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 1: to orc Stain. In fact, their entire economy revolves around 129 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 1: dried and cut up orc reproductive organ Yes, yeah, it's fascinating. 130 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: Uh they're called chits, but it also last one. Do 131 00:07:43,560 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 1: you remember Cronenberg's Existence? Did you ever watch that movie? 132 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 1: There's that scene where Jude Laws like eating soup and 133 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:54,600 Speaker 1: he just keeps pulling organic pieces out of the soup 134 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:57,040 Speaker 1: and like gnawing on them a little bit and then 135 00:07:57,080 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: like putting them all together until he has a gun 136 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,000 Speaker 1: that's made out of the organic like I don't know 137 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: what it's supposed to be, like an amphibian or a 138 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: fish or something. And then for bullets, he yanks his 139 00:08:08,280 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 1: teeth out of his mouth and he slopped those into 140 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: this gun thing. I forgot about that part of it. Yeah, yeah, 141 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: so that's that. Those are just a few of our 142 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: examples of what's going on with the boxer crab. All Right, 143 00:08:20,840 --> 00:08:22,840 Speaker 1: we're gonna take a quick break and when we come back, 144 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:26,600 Speaker 1: we will get into the boxer crab, this fabulous real 145 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: world organism that employs some of these, uh, some of 146 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 1: these ideas about how to weaponize your fellow creature. All right, 147 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:41,600 Speaker 1: so we're back, and yeah, you have this genus of 148 00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: small crabs known as Libya l y b I A. 149 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 1: And this is in the family Zanti Day. So again 150 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 1: you might know them as boxer crabs, boxing crabs, pom 151 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 1: pom crabs. They these are small little guys. They tend 152 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 1: to be barely two centimeters wide, and there there are 153 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,600 Speaker 1: several different varieties of them, some of which are very 154 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 1: popular in aquarium So some of you listening out there 155 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 1: right now might be in a room with a boxer crab. 156 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 1: And yes, we do want to hear your take on 157 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:14,560 Speaker 1: everything involved here and for the purposes of the research 158 00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 1: that we're looking at today. I'm pretty sure most of 159 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 1: these specific specimens were drawn somewhere near Israel, right Yeah, 160 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 1: in particularly that the ones that we looked at in 161 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: these studies were from the south shore of the Red 162 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 1: Sea in Elt, so there are a few different varieties. 163 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:34,559 Speaker 1: This is the one that we're gonna be talking about 164 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:37,559 Speaker 1: more today. And this one in particular is interesting because 165 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 1: from the pictures I looked at it, it has a 166 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:43,040 Speaker 1: skin that looks like tempura, or the texture of on 167 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:46,480 Speaker 1: the shell looks like tempura. So they look delicious. They 168 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 1: already look like they've been fried. They've been battered and 169 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 1: fried for you're eating pledge before you even get to them. 170 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 1: They look like they're and there's they're small, but they 171 00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 1: have these little sea an enemies. Now, the big question 172 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:01,520 Speaker 1: and when the we're gonna talk about, especially in the 173 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:03,760 Speaker 1: second study, is where do they get them? Where do 174 00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:06,160 Speaker 1: they come from? How does the crab go about obtaining 175 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:08,760 Speaker 1: little sea an enemies to run around with and use 176 00:10:08,800 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 1: as weapons, to use as a means to to feed. Um, 177 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 1: we'll get into that. It's it's important to to drive 178 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: home here for everyone that sea an enemies are predatory 179 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 1: animals of the order acting area. So they may look 180 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: like weirdly animated flowers. The name even alludes to terrestrial flowers, 181 00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,800 Speaker 1: but they are not plants. They are predatory animals. So 182 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:36,200 Speaker 1: you have a predator utilizing predators as tools. And I 183 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 1: think they're sometimes referred to as bonds eyes, right, because 184 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 1: the idea is that the crabs cultivate them the same 185 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:45,439 Speaker 1: way people cultivate bond's eye trees. Now, I do want 186 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: to note too, that the boxer crab isn't the only 187 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,320 Speaker 1: crab to have a mutualistic relationship with sea enemies. Certain 188 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:53,840 Speaker 1: larger hermit crabs tend to have one or two on 189 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:57,319 Speaker 1: their shell which benefit from the crabs table scraps of 190 00:10:57,360 --> 00:10:59,679 Speaker 1: the crabs tearing apart some sort of organism that it's 191 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 1: found and that's eating them. Some of that drifts back 192 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:05,520 Speaker 1: and this snemies get to feast, and then then enemies 193 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 1: serve as protection for the crab. So this, this hermit 194 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:11,360 Speaker 1: crab would be kind of like one of these World 195 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:13,680 Speaker 1: War One tanks. We have a couple of cannons on 196 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 1: the side. The enemies are its cannons. They're providing support 197 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: and both organisms benefit from this relationship. But yes, you 198 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: mentioned the bonds Ie tree. Yeah, so this is uh, 199 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:28,560 Speaker 1: this is studied in particular by these these these two 200 00:11:29,160 --> 00:11:32,959 Speaker 1: bar Alon University graduate students in Israel, there's j Israel 201 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:38,720 Speaker 1: Schneitzer and Yon iv Demon and uh. They have conducted 202 00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 1: at least two studies here that we're gonna look at 203 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:43,680 Speaker 1: where they've looked at this at a particular variety of 204 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:47,079 Speaker 1: boxing crab and tried to get down to exactly what 205 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 1: they're doing, how they're working. So they previously worked on 206 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:54,439 Speaker 1: a two thousand thirteen study published in the journal Experimental 207 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 1: Marine Biology and Ecology, and here they revealed the boxer 208 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,960 Speaker 1: crabs bonds I like treatment of the bond of they're bioweapons, 209 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: so they use them to catch food and defend themselves, 210 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,959 Speaker 1: but they also essentially starve the and its star of 211 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 1: the anemony or regulate their they're diet enough to keep 212 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 1: them a small size. Yeah, this alone is fascinating, but 213 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 1: it gets even weirder. Okay, So the study identifies that 214 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 1: boxer crabs they not only commit what's referred to as 215 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: klepto parasitism to steal food from these anemonies, but they 216 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 1: also regulate the anemone's size through this process. So if 217 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 1: you take the anemone away from the boxer crab and 218 00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 1: it's allowed to grow, they have a totally different morphology 219 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 1: color and size. In fact, they grow up to two 220 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:44,199 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty larger in size. They're actually larger than 221 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:47,679 Speaker 1: the crabs at that point from which they're taken. So 222 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:51,640 Speaker 1: these crabs are just like basically keeping these like poor 223 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: starved enemies, uh, but using them as weapons in a 224 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: sort of clever way. The free anemonies that were studied 225 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: assume eight times more food than their captive counterparts, So 226 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: I think it's safe to assume that the crabs are 227 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 1: scarfing most of that stuff down now. Klepto parasitism. This 228 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 1: happens in all different kinds of animals. We see it 229 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 1: in birds and fish, mammals, a wide range of invertebrates. 230 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:20,240 Speaker 1: I mean, technically, this is what we're doing when we 231 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:22,720 Speaker 1: take milk from cows, right Like it gets back to 232 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:26,680 Speaker 1: our episode on butter. We're we're stealing the food source 233 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 1: from another animal. But in the animal kingdom, it's more 234 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:36,680 Speaker 1: advantageous than foraging or predation, and so you find this 235 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:39,560 Speaker 1: in some snails and some spiders. It's the practice that's 236 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:42,520 Speaker 1: known to affect the growth of the hosts that they're 237 00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 1: stealing from. The closest example that these researchers site in 238 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:49,520 Speaker 1: their study. There's a type of snail called the trick 239 00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 1: o Tropis cancelata that eats the food of a worm 240 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:56,680 Speaker 1: host and they steal up to a hundred percent of 241 00:13:56,720 --> 00:14:00,200 Speaker 1: its food. So presumably these worms die from starve and 242 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:03,679 Speaker 1: I guess. Uh. The other one is the orb weaving spider, 243 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 1: which is Nephelia plum apez and that steals fifty percent 244 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 1: of its food from another spider called the Argo Rhodes 245 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:19,600 Speaker 1: antipodeanist spider. You know, there's also the human equivalent of 246 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,600 Speaker 1: of stealing part of alliance kill that I believe is 247 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:28,920 Speaker 1: still practiced among like you know, very one or two 248 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 1: tribes in Africa. But this having been that this would 249 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,520 Speaker 1: have been like an older practice where if you wanted 250 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 1: to get the meat of a kill, while all you 251 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 1: have to do is have the the bravery and and 252 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:43,560 Speaker 1: or desperation to run in after lions have made their kill, 253 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 1: cut away some of the meat and get out of 254 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,600 Speaker 1: there before the lions can really regroup. That sounds a 255 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: bit like scavenging um, And so yeah, I wonder like 256 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: how close scavenging falls under kleptoparasitism. Well, when a vulture 257 00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:00,760 Speaker 1: eats like I don't know road kill. Well, yeah, I 258 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:03,200 Speaker 1: think the thing is with all these different modes of 259 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 1: obtaining the sustenance, you do see that gray area of 260 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 1: one meets the other. When like where symbia meets parasite, 261 00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 1: you know, there's often that gray area like or or 262 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: for instance. So I think we've talked about this before 263 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:19,880 Speaker 1: when you have certain birds that are feeding on on 264 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 1: ticks not an animal, Like, at what point then is 265 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: it not you're eating the tick that has the blood 266 00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 1: of the animal, and in some cases you cross that 267 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: line and you're actually drinking the blood from the animal, 268 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 1: so you're you're close proximity to this other mode of behavior. 269 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:39,720 Speaker 1: It's interesting, but we should make no mistake about these anemones. 270 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,320 Speaker 1: They're not parasites that are living off of the crabs. 271 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:48,480 Speaker 1: The crabs are using them symbiotically and they specifically do 272 00:15:48,520 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 1: it to release the toxin nemoto assists that are part 273 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:56,560 Speaker 1: of the anemonies. They use these as a living deterrent 274 00:15:56,720 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 1: for predators as well as a tool for hating food. 275 00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:03,560 Speaker 1: So we we often talk about like, oh, tool use 276 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 1: among animals, that's like a really significant thing, right, Like 277 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:09,240 Speaker 1: we humans are one of the few that actually use tools. 278 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: But these crabs are using other living beings as tools. Uh. 279 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: When the anemony itself is presented with food, the crab 280 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: literally robs it from the enemite's mouth. Uh. And but 281 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:23,080 Speaker 1: what does the enemity get out of all of this, Well, 282 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: it actually gets access to oxygen and it's transported around 283 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 1: to more food sources, so it is slightly beneficial. Yeah, 284 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:35,640 Speaker 1: the crab is kind of a mobile platform for the anenemy. Subsequently, 285 00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 1: the anemony has no resemblance to its free living form. 286 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 1: That's the fascinating thing. Now the crabs claws. This is 287 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 1: crazy too. The crabs don't have what we think of 288 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 1: as normally functioning claws. They're totally ill suited for defense. 289 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 1: So they're not like pincers, right, They've they've evolved so 290 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:00,320 Speaker 1: that they're mainly used for holding these anemonies. And there's 291 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:05,240 Speaker 1: no known instances of these crabs without a pair of 292 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 1: anemones in their claws in nature. We're gonna get to 293 00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:11,479 Speaker 1: it in a minute, what happens when you take them away. 294 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,480 Speaker 1: As part of this study, the researchers used a control 295 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:19,960 Speaker 1: group of starved anemonies to see how much nutrition the 296 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 1: anemonies themselves were deriving in turn from algae that's on 297 00:17:25,080 --> 00:17:30,440 Speaker 1: them that they're using symbiotically, possibly through photosynthesis. So think 298 00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:32,720 Speaker 1: of it this way, like the algae is getting energy 299 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:36,800 Speaker 1: from photosynthesis, and then the anemone is taking energy away 300 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,480 Speaker 1: from these algae, and then the crabs are holding on 301 00:17:39,800 --> 00:17:42,520 Speaker 1: the to the anemone and they're using them to gather 302 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:47,679 Speaker 1: up bits of food nuts. It is also noted in 303 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:51,560 Speaker 1: this first paper the crabs use the anemonies in what 304 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:54,840 Speaker 1: they call a mopping action, uh. And this is how 305 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:56,920 Speaker 1: they gather food. So they basically kind of swing them 306 00:17:56,920 --> 00:18:00,440 Speaker 1: around and mop up food in the sticky endrolls of 307 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:03,159 Speaker 1: the anemones, and then they let them grasp it, and 308 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 1: then they bring the anemony up to their mouth and 309 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:08,479 Speaker 1: they remove it themselves. The anemonies are also used as 310 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 1: a weapon, uh, and it's mainly to deflect attacks, so 311 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:17,800 Speaker 1: hence crab boxing. Alright, we're gonna take another quick break, 312 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: and when we come back, we're gonna get into the 313 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 1: second study that was connected by this this pair of 314 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:26,399 Speaker 1: Israeli researchers, and it's gonna it's gonna get into the 315 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:34,400 Speaker 1: idea they're not only using weapons they're using clone weapons. 316 00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 1: All right, so we're back. Uh. So that was the 317 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:41,440 Speaker 1: first study. The latest study to come out from Schnitzer 318 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 1: and Gamon came out just this week. Yeah, and we 319 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: should say, as we're recording this, Robert has just published 320 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:52,199 Speaker 1: an article on how Stuff Works about this very topic. 321 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:56,119 Speaker 1: This podcast is our extension of that. So if you 322 00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 1: want to read it, we can go find it there. 323 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 1: It will obviously be in our show notes. But also 324 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 1: we're going to embed the podcast in that article. Yeah, 325 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:06,520 Speaker 1: the article didn't allow us to do like fifteen minutes 326 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:13,320 Speaker 1: of talk about tyrannids and so so Schnitzer in Gamon 327 00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:15,680 Speaker 1: had some some basic questions about this, and this new 328 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:19,359 Speaker 1: study was published in the journal Pure j Uh looks 329 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 1: into specifically where do they get these sea an enemy 330 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:26,440 Speaker 1: and and how do they what happens if they're missing one. 331 00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:29,679 Speaker 1: So this is what they did. They went back, they 332 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 1: went out to the Red Sea again, this area in Eliott, Israel, 333 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:39,120 Speaker 1: and they identified the weaponized an enemies of this particular 334 00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:42,960 Speaker 1: variety of boxer crab as belonging to the genus Elysia. 335 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,840 Speaker 1: And this was likely a newly recorded species of an enemy. 336 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:50,240 Speaker 1: So bonus there. But when they looked around for wild 337 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:55,200 Speaker 1: examples of Alicia's see an Enemy, nothing turned up. Now, 338 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 1: I want to say that this is not a situation 339 00:19:57,760 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 1: with all varieties of boxer crabs. There are others spe 340 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 1: seas that have been shown to utilize an enemies that 341 00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: also exist in a wild state. But since they in 342 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: this experiment, since they couldn't find any wild examples, it 343 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:14,560 Speaker 1: did raise some interesting questions. Are there are there wild 344 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:18,359 Speaker 1: and enemies anymore? Is it possible that and these are 345 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,200 Speaker 1: the two sort of outside possibilities here that the researchers present. 346 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,880 Speaker 1: One possibility being that these things are extinct in the wild, 347 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:29,119 Speaker 1: that these crabs have been passing them back and forth 348 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:33,320 Speaker 1: so long that they are only available on crabs. Yeah, 349 00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 1: they've basically just completely enslaved this race of anemones. Yeah. 350 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 1: And the other idea is that they do exist, they 351 00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 1: exist far away and there was like a like a 352 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:47,439 Speaker 1: grandfather crab that brought these things into the area. And 353 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:50,600 Speaker 1: so in this area of the Red Sea, the an 354 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:55,920 Speaker 1: enemy only exist in an enslaved state. Now this gets 355 00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,480 Speaker 1: down to the question, Well, you're saying, well, well, it's 356 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,120 Speaker 1: not like they how they passed them back and forth 357 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 1: if you're a crab without a sea an enemy, how 358 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:05,960 Speaker 1: do you even get one to begin with? Yeah, that 359 00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: was my big question is like, how do newborn crabs 360 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 1: get their anemonies right? If there's if they're nowhere to 361 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 1: be found except for what these other crabs, how do 362 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:18,200 Speaker 1: they get them? Well, I would ask you this counter question, 363 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 1: what does Bruce Lee do when he has no weapons 364 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:26,359 Speaker 1: and a bunch of nun chuck armed individuals are attacking him? Well, 365 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 1: first he breaks a chair and he uses that chair 366 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 1: to beat them up, and then he takes their nunchuck exactly, 367 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: And that's what happens here, they take the nun chucks. 368 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:38,679 Speaker 1: So uh, Schnitzer and Gimon discovered in a pair of 369 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 1: experiments that if you have you have a one weapon 370 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 1: boxer crab. Okay, so this boxer crab only has the 371 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 1: one an enemy. What they'll do is they will split 372 00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: it into two pieces, and these two remaining fragments will 373 00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:56,640 Speaker 1: then regenerate over a couple of days into two distinct clones. 374 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:01,240 Speaker 1: And if they have no anenemies all, then they will 375 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,160 Speaker 1: go and wrestle with another boxer crab and steal one 376 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 1: of theirs, and then each one is left with one, 377 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,959 Speaker 1: and they do the splits, the splitting maneuver, and then 378 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: they each have too. So maybe it's like a rite 379 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:16,719 Speaker 1: of passage. Uh, that's the article itself says. It's presumed 380 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,119 Speaker 1: that they acquire them sometime after their larval stage. I 381 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: don't know if it's like, you know, like a a 382 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:27,440 Speaker 1: daddy crab hands his child crab one of his anemonies 383 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:29,520 Speaker 1: and then rips it in half. Right, I don't think 384 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:33,080 Speaker 1: that's what happens. It sounds like once you pass the 385 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:35,760 Speaker 1: larval stage, you gotta go find somebody to fight and 386 00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 1: take one of their anemonies. It's interesting. This reminds me 387 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 1: of some studies that have looked into the economics of 388 00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,800 Speaker 1: hermit crabs and their shells. Just to remind everyone, hermit 389 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:48,399 Speaker 1: ship crab, of course, lives in the shell of another creature. 390 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:50,919 Speaker 1: But as a hermit crab grows, it has to abandon 391 00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:54,959 Speaker 1: ill fitting shells and and acquire new shells. And Uh. 392 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 1: Some researchers have done like really fascinating economic spins on 393 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:02,680 Speaker 1: this that tie up nicely with with human economics, with 394 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:06,320 Speaker 1: with particularly as it as it relates to home ownership. 395 00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 1: And you see a similar thing with crabs abandoning, stealing shells. 396 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:15,960 Speaker 1: This constant musical chairs. So I wonder if there's a 397 00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:19,840 Speaker 1: similar scenario going on here with this constant tussle among 398 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,480 Speaker 1: the crabs for their weapons, and then of course they're 399 00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:25,240 Speaker 1: using these weapons to defend themselves into acquire food. Well, 400 00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:30,720 Speaker 1: this is specifically crazy because when the scientists analyze the 401 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,399 Speaker 1: pair of anemones for any given crab, they found that 402 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:38,960 Speaker 1: they're genetically identical, so they are literal clones. This is 403 00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:42,119 Speaker 1: an attack of the clones in the purest sense, even 404 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: when they've been ripped in half. Uh. And this is 405 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:50,720 Speaker 1: unique in that one animal is inducing a sexual reproduction 406 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 1: in another animal and that's affecting its genetic diversity. So 407 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 1: that could be why we're not finding these anemones in 408 00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 1: the wild either. That's right now. I had to reach 409 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,679 Speaker 1: out to Schnitzer on this one because just it was 410 00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:06,720 Speaker 1: just too fascinating a question. I wanted to make sure 411 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:09,879 Speaker 1: that I wasn't jumped to conclusions, uh, you know, as 412 00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:12,639 Speaker 1: sometimes one does. And I said, well, does this mean 413 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: there they might be extinct in the wild? And he said, yes, 414 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,800 Speaker 1: there's one outside possibility. And then there's the uh, the 415 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,159 Speaker 1: founding father crab outside possibility, but he told me the following. 416 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:26,400 Speaker 1: He said, quote bottom line, my guess is they exist, 417 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 1: but are probably very rare. I think this because one 418 00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,119 Speaker 1: of the findings in our current paper was that every 419 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,440 Speaker 1: crab found in the wild is holding clones supporting the 420 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:38,239 Speaker 1: theft and splitting behavior we saw in the lab, and 421 00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: that there are a very limited number of holotypes, especially 422 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:45,640 Speaker 1: with genetic fingerprinting analysis, thus giving credence to the assumption 423 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:48,199 Speaker 1: that most of the an enemy reproduction going on is 424 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,120 Speaker 1: a sexual from the crabs of splitting them in half, 425 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: but not all of it. Yeah, this is important to note. 426 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 1: So these cnmons in general, well just cn M, it 427 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: is not these specific ones. In general, they can reproduce 428 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:04,360 Speaker 1: either sexually or a sexually, and in the a sexual 429 00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 1: cases it can be through butting, it can be through fission. 430 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 1: It can three be through something called pedal laceration or 431 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 1: something called a pop mictic parthenogenesis. Okay, so there's all 432 00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:19,479 Speaker 1: kinds of ways that these things can reproduce, but in 433 00:25:19,520 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: this case it's forced there being forced to reproduce. When 434 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:29,080 Speaker 1: this team analyzed the anemone's genetics, they use something called 435 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:34,920 Speaker 1: amplified fragment length polymorphism or a f l P for short. 436 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,479 Speaker 1: And this is an efficient, fast and low cost DNA 437 00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:42,560 Speaker 1: fingerprinting method. So that's how they figured out, Oh wow, 438 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:46,119 Speaker 1: these are all clones, right, This is what I immediately 439 00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:49,159 Speaker 1: thought of. You remember our Hydra episode. I wonder if 440 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:51,879 Speaker 1: it's a similar kind of thing, because the hydro was 441 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 1: sort of splitting itself as well. Yeah, and hydra is 442 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:59,120 Speaker 1: also a creature that can reproduce sexually or a sexually, 443 00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:02,240 Speaker 1: depending on what the environmental constraints are. But no one's 444 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: coming along and holding onto a hydra for its entire 445 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 1: life and then saying, you know what, I need another 446 00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: one of you strip. It is such a crazy scenario, 447 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:15,359 Speaker 1: the idea that this creature exists, It lives its life 448 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:17,919 Speaker 1: in the claw of another creature, in the hand of 449 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:21,439 Speaker 1: another creature. It's like King Kong holding Jessica Lane. And 450 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: on top of that, if King Kong can say, actually 451 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,359 Speaker 1: I need to Jessica langs and you just rich and 452 00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:30,520 Speaker 1: then he uses Jessica Lank to hit plane to do 453 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,920 Speaker 1: you have to hit planes and like beat Godzilla with 454 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,320 Speaker 1: I like it. Huh. Now I know what some of 455 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 1: you might be wondering, well, this idea of one creature 456 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:43,679 Speaker 1: just enslaving another to the point that it goes extinct 457 00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 1: in the wild, do we see any examples of that 458 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:48,959 Speaker 1: happening elsewhere? Well, mean, certainly you can look at some 459 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 1: human varieties, you know, animals that we've completely domesticated, be 460 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,280 Speaker 1: it um, you know, be at a you know, a cow, 461 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,679 Speaker 1: or even like a silkworm. Right. But one of the 462 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:02,119 Speaker 1: more curious examples we see in the animal world, in 463 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:05,400 Speaker 1: the invertebrate world as well, is that a various leaf 464 00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 1: counter cutter ant species in the Americas. So they cut 465 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:11,320 Speaker 1: leaves and drag them to an underground growth chamber, and 466 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:13,879 Speaker 1: they keep it moist enough there to cultivate fungi on 467 00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:17,360 Speaker 1: the leaves. Uh. And this is a fascinating process. I'm 468 00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:19,119 Speaker 1: not going to walk you through every step of it, 469 00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:20,800 Speaker 1: but essentially they have a little farm down there to 470 00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:24,520 Speaker 1: grow this for this fungus, and the ants themselves gave 471 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 1: up hunting and gathering fifty million years ago, everyone believes, 472 00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:32,479 Speaker 1: for them, so they could become farmers essentially. But this, 473 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:37,679 Speaker 1: this precious fungus crop that they grow is uh, apparently 474 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 1: a million years extinct in the natural world. They've completely domesticated. 475 00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:46,200 Speaker 1: So this would be an actual example of an invertebrate 476 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 1: species that's taken another species as its own and in 477 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,080 Speaker 1: doing so completely domesticated it. Now, granted, in this scenario, 478 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 1: the ants are eating the creature that they have domesticated, 479 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 1: the boxing crab even more elaborate because they're not eating 480 00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:06,600 Speaker 1: they're using them as as weapons. I wonder if it's 481 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 1: like they think of this is silly. This is like 482 00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:14,199 Speaker 1: some Disney animation movie thinking right here that like the 483 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:17,320 Speaker 1: crab like thinks of its anemonies. It's like it's pets 484 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:23,240 Speaker 1: and gives the little names. This is like, this is exactly. Yeah, 485 00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:26,439 Speaker 1: well I would like to see that little Mermaid character 486 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,600 Speaker 1: if we had, that would be great. Sebastian Sebastian the crab, 487 00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:31,960 Speaker 1: except he's a boxing crab. Well, you know, the thing 488 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:34,720 Speaker 1: is is that this is they're not the only crabs 489 00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 1: that use anemonies like this, but these associations almost always 490 00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 1: it's a smaller crab and they're using larger anemonies. But 491 00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,360 Speaker 1: in this case that's why they're called pom poms, because 492 00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:49,360 Speaker 1: they're smaller, and it's specifically because this crab is stealing 493 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,760 Speaker 1: all the food away from these anemones. Yeah, it's a 494 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:56,320 Speaker 1: fantastic example of mutualism. Mutualism was the term that was 495 00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: first introduced in eighteen seventy six, by the way, from 496 00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: Pierre Joseph of van Beneden. And but again, the crazy 497 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,000 Speaker 1: thing is that we have many examples of mutualism, but 498 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 1: most of them are significantly less hands on or claws on. Literally, 499 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 1: that's where we encounter here. Well, the crabs themselves, like 500 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:17,719 Speaker 1: if you take their anemony is away from them, they 501 00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:21,120 Speaker 1: can still eat, but they don't use their little baby 502 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,239 Speaker 1: claws because they're too delicate. What they do is they 503 00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 1: use their walking legs, and they start with their first 504 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 1: walking legs and they use them to like pin things 505 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:31,280 Speaker 1: down and then kind of bring it up to their mouths. 506 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,160 Speaker 1: Sometimes they end up using their second and third walking legs. 507 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 1: During this study, they also found that following the theft 508 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: of a cnemony or an attempt, the fight between the 509 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:46,440 Speaker 1: different crabs was followed by mating if they were different sex. 510 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 1: So if there was a male and a female crab 511 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 1: and one of them took the other ones c an emmy, 512 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 1: then they had sex. Wow, it's even more like an 513 00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,560 Speaker 1: eighties action films. Yeah, it's so bizarre. So when they 514 00:29:57,560 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: did this study, they had to break them up by 515 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 1: gender because they were like, we can't we can't figure 516 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 1: out what actually happens. We've got to keep them. Have 517 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 1: the males fight the males, and the females fight the females, 518 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 1: and they did. Um. They also found that seventeen out 519 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: of twenty two crabs with only one anemone will split 520 00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:21,880 Speaker 1: it within six days. So they don't wait around. They 521 00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:25,280 Speaker 1: need to. They have their their dual weapon fighters. That's right. 522 00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,160 Speaker 1: That their their entire martial art is built upon having 523 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 1: having a double attack. Yeah, and it's referred to the 524 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 1: splitting is referred to as a surgical tear uh, and 525 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 1: it lasts between one minute and two hours. The average 526 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 1: time is twenty minutes. But they very precisely take the 527 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 1: anemone and just slowly rip it in half and then 528 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:52,040 Speaker 1: they've got to uh. And what's really interesting is when 529 00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 1: the crabs fight over the anemone is sometimes little fragments 530 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:58,240 Speaker 1: will get stolen, like maybe a crab will lose, but 531 00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 1: it's got like a chunk of anemone and claw. Uh. 532 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:04,320 Speaker 1: That does not result in splitting or cloning, So they 533 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:08,760 Speaker 1: have to very specifically tear these anemonies in half. You 534 00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,120 Speaker 1: can't just take a chunk of anemone and it grows 535 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 1: into another anemone. That really it sheds more light on 536 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,000 Speaker 1: it because in the same way that their their claws 537 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:21,000 Speaker 1: have evolved just for the specific handling of these these specimens, 538 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: then they've also clearly evolved to for the conduct this 539 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,840 Speaker 1: specialized surgery. It is not just oh, rip a piece 540 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 1: off of this and use it as a weapon, but 541 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 1: you have to rip it just right. How do you 542 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: learn that? Must is a sense memory? Or is it? 543 00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,720 Speaker 1: Daddy Crab? Okay, so again I'm going with like the 544 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: Disney version of this. Right, it's like the Daddy Crab 545 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:45,760 Speaker 1: and he's got his two and he's like, okay, it's 546 00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 1: time for you to learn how the style of crab boxing, 547 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 1: and like he takes one of his anemonies, gives it 548 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 1: to his younger crab and then teaches him very slowly 549 00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 1: how to rip them in a half so that they 550 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:03,959 Speaker 1: both have too. M it's strange. Yeah, I guess it's, 551 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:06,479 Speaker 1: you know, the dark gift of strange crab. And then 552 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:12,680 Speaker 1: what do you name the clones? Uh, Thrashi and bashi 553 00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:16,200 Speaker 1: I think I think that's trashy too. And yeah, yeah, 554 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:17,640 Speaker 1: each one as you split them off, they get a 555 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,520 Speaker 1: different number. Uh. Well, it's uh. I think it's one 556 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:23,959 Speaker 1: of the more we get. We get press releases all 557 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:29,040 Speaker 1: the time about various cool biological scenarios that that researchers 558 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:31,520 Speaker 1: are studying, and this one, this one really caught my 559 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: attention just because it's it was it's just a little 560 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 1: different from everything else. So I was originally just gonna 561 00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:39,760 Speaker 1: write it up for for now, and then I thought, well, 562 00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 1: this is I think this is stuff to blow your 563 00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:45,479 Speaker 1: mind worthy content here certainly. Yeah. Now I want to 564 00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:50,560 Speaker 1: see crab wheel the hydra like like use they use 565 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:55,360 Speaker 1: like various animals as the different fighting styles. Bring a crab, 566 00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:58,080 Speaker 1: I mean no, bring a hydra to uh an an 567 00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 1: enemy find exactly there he go. Now, as we mentioned earlier, 568 00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 1: these are popular aquarium crabs, so I know some of 569 00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 1: you out there have some boxing crabs, so I would 570 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,479 Speaker 1: love to hear your thoughts on their behavior. Uh And 571 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:15,840 Speaker 1: also when you get them at the pet store or 572 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 1: through the mail, do they come with little sea enemies 573 00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,720 Speaker 1: or do you end up raising them sands An enemy. Huh, 574 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,080 Speaker 1: I would I would love to hear about that. Yeah. 575 00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:26,440 Speaker 1: I wonder if they get like depressed if they don't 576 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: have the anemony because they have to use their legs 577 00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:30,280 Speaker 1: to eat everything. I don't know. I don't know I've 578 00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 1: ever seen a depressed crab or tasted one. More research 579 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:38,040 Speaker 1: is required. I actually let my son watch the video 580 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,240 Speaker 1: that came with the press release. You get super excited 581 00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:42,360 Speaker 1: about so he keeps talking about, I think we need 582 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,920 Speaker 1: to get boxing crabs for our quick we do. We 583 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:46,880 Speaker 1: do not have a saltwater aquary. I wonder if they'll 584 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,600 Speaker 1: fight each other. Well, it depends on if it take 585 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:53,320 Speaker 1: pemony away, yeah, yeah, or if they're male female? Right, 586 00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:56,840 Speaker 1: So hey, let us know if you were out there, 587 00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:59,760 Speaker 1: if you were a boxing boxing crab owner, we would 588 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:01,880 Speaker 1: love to hear your thoughts on this. You can find 589 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:05,000 Speaker 1: this podcast all the other podcasts links out to some 590 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 1: of the material we discussed here at stuff to Blow 591 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 1: your Mind dot com. That's where you'll find the podcast, 592 00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:11,640 Speaker 1: the blog, the videos, and links out to our various 593 00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:15,439 Speaker 1: social media accounts. And maybe you know about some other 594 00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:19,800 Speaker 1: bio weapons that are used in the natural animal kingdom 595 00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:24,360 Speaker 1: that we're unaware of Let us know about those on Facebook, Twitter, Tumbler, 596 00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:27,719 Speaker 1: or Instagram, or you can write to us about them 597 00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 1: at blow the Mind at how stuff works dot com. 598 00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 1: For more on this and thousands of other topics, is 599 00:34:42,160 --> 00:35:03,520 Speaker 1: that how stuff works dot com. Tis Times by b