1 00:00:10,039 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: Welcome to Crime Round Up, y'all. I'm Cheryl mccollumn. Y'all. 2 00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 1: I might sound a little different today because I am 3 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:21,079 Speaker 1: out in the field where Josh of course is with 4 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:24,479 Speaker 1: the speed up, having a nice cool drink in the 5 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,760 Speaker 1: air conditioning. I'm out here just you know, working like 6 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: a dog in this Georgia heat while he's stipping on lemonade. 7 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 2: I am just fantastic. I'm gonna touch hot. Let's just 8 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 2: let's just rip that band aid off. It's a little 9 00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:44,760 Speaker 2: spicy for people that have my specific physical existence. This 10 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:46,839 Speaker 2: is uh this warm. 11 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:47,600 Speaker 1: Listen. 12 00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 3: I'm nicely air conditioned, so it is. 13 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:53,840 Speaker 1: It is something. It is something. I have a I 14 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 1: have a friend, she's got a buddy in Rhode Island, 15 00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: and she called her and said, hey, how hot is 16 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 1: it down there? And my friend said, well, have you 17 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:07,680 Speaker 1: ever been cremated? 18 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:11,839 Speaker 2: It's like a brick wall walking outside. And here's people 19 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 2: that don't know about the South. Every afternoon it gets 20 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:17,400 Speaker 2: so hot that it squeezes a twenty or thirty minute 21 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 2: thundershower that just pops up and disappears. 22 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:21,520 Speaker 3: It's practically like clockwork. 23 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 2: But then everything's damp and hot and moist and that's 24 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 2: your afternoon, every day. 25 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 1: Every day. 26 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 3: It'll end soon, I promise. 27 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:33,400 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, listen, I got to talk to you about something. 28 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, we've had quite a week here with some headlines 29 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:37,680 Speaker 2: in the true crime universe. 30 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:38,399 Speaker 3: Let's round this. 31 00:01:38,480 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: Up quite a week. But I've got a pet peeve. 32 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:45,920 Speaker 1: I am one of those folks that if you are 33 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,720 Speaker 1: found not guilty, you should walk out rite that minute, 34 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 1: free as a bird. You know how. Sometimes they'll say, oh, 35 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:56,160 Speaker 1: you've got to go back through and get processed out 36 00:01:56,200 --> 00:02:01,600 Speaker 1: of the jail and all that. Oh I can't stand it, 37 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: but I gotta ask you, why has Karen Reid not 38 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:08,360 Speaker 1: gotten her car back? 39 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 2: We deal with this return of property issue somewhat reglar. 40 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 2: And remember, in most cases the property that gets taken 41 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:21,040 Speaker 2: from people is contraband or other kind of deminimous things. 42 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:23,800 Speaker 2: You've got maybe a beat up old cell phone or 43 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:29,120 Speaker 2: something that you want back, and of course you get 44 00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:33,240 Speaker 2: it back, especially if there's been an acquittal. But remember 45 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:37,800 Speaker 2: there's also the possibility of some crazy appeal happening some 46 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 2: out of time. Regardless, the state can make some sort 47 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 2: of request that hey, we're going to keep this, and 48 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:48,040 Speaker 2: there could be forfeitures happening now. Why they create a 49 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 2: battle with this, I don't know. I would think that 50 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:53,360 Speaker 2: the DA's office would want to get so far away 51 00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:58,400 Speaker 2: from Karen Reid and bury this embarrassing spectacle as quickly 52 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:02,960 Speaker 2: as possible. I don't see them having a legitimate use 53 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:07,240 Speaker 2: to retain something as large and expensive and difficult to 54 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:11,359 Speaker 2: store as an suv. Now the phones and stuff like that, 55 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 2: maybe I can see a little bit more, but they 56 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 2: have dumps of all that give Karen back her stuff. 57 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 2: Needless to say, this isn't the first time I've ever 58 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 2: had this issue, not just in a case we're covering, 59 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:27,639 Speaker 2: but in a case we have here in my office. 60 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 2: I've been fighting over a cell phone that was involved 61 00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 2: in a case that was admittedly a sex related case 62 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 2: but got dismissed three years ago. And I believe that 63 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 2: the prosecutors kind of sour about it, and they're very 64 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 2: much ignoring me. And it's one of the things that 65 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 2: the client cares about but really doesn't care about. And 66 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:54,440 Speaker 2: it's just frustrating and dumb to see easy requests get ignored, 67 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:57,360 Speaker 2: Like so much of this world would be easier if 68 00:03:57,440 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 2: it just worked the way it was set up to 69 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 2: my example of that today is I'm supposed to be 70 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 2: turning a lady in. We know about the warrant. We 71 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:09,720 Speaker 2: spoke to the detective. We told them to yeah, we'll 72 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:12,520 Speaker 2: go turn them in. We've got a copy of the warrant. 73 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 2: But detectives can't set bonds. And the jail that this 74 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:20,719 Speaker 2: woman's gonna go to is notorious, it is dangerous, it 75 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:22,280 Speaker 2: is under federal monitoring. 76 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 3: It is the Fulton County Rice Street Jail. 77 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 2: It's one of the worst places in America you can 78 00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 2: get locked up in, and it's slow and inefficient. So 79 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 2: Josh says, hey, I'll just get the bond arranged in advance. 80 00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:38,599 Speaker 2: This is a never arrested before, middle aged, white collar case. 81 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 2: This should be easy, And in most jurisdictions it is. 82 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 2: You call prosecutors, you get through, you have a conversation, 83 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:51,920 Speaker 2: you give them your clients info, they confirm it, You 84 00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 2: figure out a bond, them out, You get the bond 85 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:55,800 Speaker 2: set up, and then you do what's the slow walk 86 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 2: into the jail. Hey, here's my client, Please book them 87 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:02,160 Speaker 2: take the finger prince, here's the bond, let's get him out. 88 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 2: Should be easy. Oh my lord, these organizations are so underfunded. 89 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:13,719 Speaker 2: And I'll just be kind not well organized, and it 90 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 2: is just impossible at times to get the easiest stuff done. 91 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 2: And I'm a lawyer, I'm getting paid. I do this professionally. 92 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 2: If it's this dang hard, how is somebody who's not 93 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:30,280 Speaker 2: shelling out big bucks for a lawyer supposed to facilitate 94 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 2: with what should be a fairly straightforward process. 95 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 1: I agree with you, and I was. I was shocked 96 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: for the same reason. I thought, they don't want anything 97 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 1: to do with her ever. Again, here's all your stuff, 98 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:43,640 Speaker 1: get that car out of here. 99 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:45,559 Speaker 3: Again. 100 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, it seems like Karen Reid is 101 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 1: never going away, and it seems like Sean Combs is 102 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 1: never going away because Diddy has a new request. What 103 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 1: in the world is that about? 104 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:01,479 Speaker 2: So he just to catch people up? Not that you 105 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 2: could have missed this one. 106 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:03,280 Speaker 1: So did? 107 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:06,840 Speaker 2: He gets locked up, huge search. They put him through 108 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 2: the federal ringer, which I don't care how much you 109 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 2: love or dislike someone, a federal prosecution just ain't fair. 110 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:17,159 Speaker 2: There is nothing as intimidating in one sided as the 111 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:20,279 Speaker 2: entirety of the federal government the United States, trying to 112 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:24,599 Speaker 2: prosecute you and miraculously and due to some just let's 113 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 2: just say it, some self own errors by the federal government. 114 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 2: Did he was able to escape the most serious charges, 115 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:36,239 Speaker 2: and he did get convicted of transporting women or sex 116 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 2: people across state lines for the purposes of sex or 117 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 2: imperial issues. But that's really not that kind of I 118 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 2: don't want to say serious, but it's not a crime 119 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:52,040 Speaker 2: that very often requires a lot of prison time, especially 120 00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 2: depending on the circumstances in the lack of a prior record. 121 00:06:55,360 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 2: So did he asked immediately upon winning most of his trial, Hey, 122 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:04,359 Speaker 2: let me out, judge. I'll come back for sentencing. I 123 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 2: ain't going anywhere. I'm one of the most recognized celebrities 124 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:11,320 Speaker 2: in the world, especially after getting NonStop twenty four hour 125 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 2: Walldwell news coverage for eight weeks of trial, six weeks 126 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 2: a trial judge declined. Judge said, nope, you've done this 127 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 2: time already. Let's wrap this up. And we all thought 128 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 2: that that was going to give the judge time to 129 00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 2: get him sentenced, and we were expecting a relatively modest 130 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 2: sentence and still are considering how much mister Colmes was 131 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 2: put through in this process. And what recently happened is 132 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 2: he wrote the judge and said, hey, Judge, I'll put 133 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:44,160 Speaker 2: up fifty million bucks and we've got to court date. 134 00:07:44,520 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 2: It's like a month away, so please let me out 135 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 2: of one of the worst pre trial holding facilities in 136 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 2: the nation. That it's one where people die. It's when 137 00:07:55,720 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 2: we've heard it is a disaster. Let's let him out. 138 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 2: And he's coming back. He ain't disappearing. And for whatever reason, 139 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:08,560 Speaker 2: the judge gave this, the Feds a very short time 140 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 2: to respond, and I think the letter response is due tomorrow. 141 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 2: So Diddy's got his fingers crossed that the judge sees 142 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 2: some kindness, sees some grace and levity and says, all right, 143 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 2: mister Combs comes back for his sentencing. As my grandmother 144 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 2: would say, that's folding money. He ain't walking away from 145 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 2: fifty million, not when he has a recognizable face, not 146 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 2: when he has an entourage fifty hundred, two hundred people 147 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 2: deep that depend on him every day. Not when he 148 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 2: has all these kids and his mama and everybody else 149 00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 2: that showed up and gave up lots of love for 150 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 2: Ditty during a unbelievably traumatic and wacky federal trial. You 151 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 2: know that the tabloid media is gonna have dogs on 152 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 2: him the moment he walks out of jail. 153 00:08:57,720 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 3: He won't eat. 154 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 2: He's probably the most watched man out there, So I 155 00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 2: don't see the utility in keeping him despite the fact 156 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 2: that he committed some crimes and there was lots of 157 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:14,440 Speaker 2: testimony about other stuff that would have been criminal had 158 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 2: it been prosecuted properly. And that's again what we're really seeing. 159 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:23,560 Speaker 2: And now that sometimes elapsed and we've kind of calmed down, 160 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 2: we watched miss Maureen Comy get absolutely can by the 161 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 2: government and what for all intensive purposes is one hundred 162 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 2: percent political action, which I'm you know, leaves us our 163 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 2: taste in my mouth. How do we retain our best 164 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:43,719 Speaker 2: prosecutors if they are going to be subject to political 165 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 2: whims in the way that apparently miss Komy has been. 166 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 2: But she was the lead prosecutor and is off the case. 167 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:55,319 Speaker 2: I just want to see the system work efficiently when 168 00:09:55,360 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 2: it's something so high profile, and we'll be done. I 169 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:06,320 Speaker 2: don't think he gets any real time. I think that 170 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 2: the judge is going to look at the fact that 171 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 2: he will have done about a year and he certainly 172 00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:22,560 Speaker 2: had a lot of negative externalities attached to him. 173 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: You know, we asked for bond over and over and 174 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:27,960 Speaker 1: over and was denied, and now it looks like they're 175 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 1: still not trying to let him out. I almost felt 176 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 1: the opposite might be true, that this judge was already 177 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 1: sending a message of how serious he thought this was, you. 178 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 2: Know, And that's always out there. There are certainly judges 179 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 2: that take the failures of prosecutors to prove cases into 180 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:51,920 Speaker 2: account when it comes to sentencing and sentencing. Even though 181 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:54,960 Speaker 2: it's in the federal system, so there's guidelines, there's this 182 00:10:55,120 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 2: math equation that is on another level of complexity. The 183 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:05,400 Speaker 2: judges still have enormous discretion, and this judge has the 184 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 2: right and ability, as an Article three judge who can 185 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 2: never basically be fired from the job got job for life, 186 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 2: to say, hey, I know that you only got popped 187 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 2: on these two and that the guidelines and the recommendations 188 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 2: and the mitigation suggests a sentence of X, Y and Z, 189 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 2: but having been exposed to the other behavior that was 190 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 2: associated with the charges you were convicted of, I want 191 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:32,679 Speaker 2: to depart an upward manner, and there's a mechanism for 192 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 2: the judge to go well beyond what the Feds are 193 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:39,599 Speaker 2: asking for even and he can sentence extensively. 194 00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:41,720 Speaker 3: I don't know. 195 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:47,079 Speaker 2: How that looks. I've spoken with judges and experienced this myself. 196 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:50,800 Speaker 2: When you're in charge of someone getting out of jail 197 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 2: or being incarcerated prior to the system doing its job, 198 00:11:56,240 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 2: prior to a jury hearing the facts from the state, 199 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 2: and the state being given opportunity to do their job, 200 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 2: that's a heavy request. And you know it's easy when 201 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:10,120 Speaker 2: you got a dead person or a shot person, or 202 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,040 Speaker 2: you know, giant pile of bads to this, that and 203 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 2: the other. You say, no, there's a lot of likelihood 204 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 2: you're getting convicted on this. I've measured you on the 205 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:22,880 Speaker 2: IALA and other bond factors. You're going to run, You're 206 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 2: going to intimidate people, You're going to commit additional crimes, 207 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 2: you don't have ties to the community. These are the 208 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 2: things that judges think about when deciding whether to set 209 00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 2: bond or not. But when the jury comes back, it says, no, 210 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 2: don't hold him on those allegations. Don't hold him on 211 00:12:37,559 --> 00:12:42,520 Speaker 2: those accusations. Don't hold them on that now libelous statement 212 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:46,720 Speaker 2: from the government that this person violated the law. Because 213 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 2: a jury came back and decided that they didn't. I 214 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 2: think that the court should and does take into account 215 00:12:57,160 --> 00:13:01,840 Speaker 2: over prosecutions when it comes to say in determination. And 216 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:06,240 Speaker 2: that's a pretty clear example where the government swung hard. 217 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 2: They wanted life, and they failed and they dropped it. 218 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 2: And if I'm a judge, I'm gonna go hold on. 219 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 2: You told me how much you were going to win 220 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 2: this case, how he was dead to rights. You told 221 00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 2: me all the awfulness that was gonna happen if he 222 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:24,320 Speaker 2: got one second a free Jerry didn't buy it. So 223 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 2: how do I feel about keeping him locked up when 224 00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 2: when he wasn't guilty of the bad stuff you accused 225 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 2: him of. 226 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: You know, it's just this whole week, it seems like 227 00:13:37,559 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 1: Karen Reid's never going away. Sean Combs is never going away, 228 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:45,960 Speaker 1: And honey, now we have coburger. They have released yet 229 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:49,319 Speaker 1: another video when he was stopped in the middle of 230 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:50,000 Speaker 1: the night. 231 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:52,720 Speaker 3: Like two years ago something like that. 232 00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:57,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know what when they first talked about 233 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: that ticket that he got for no seat belt, the 234 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 1: location and the time of day, I didn't have the video, 235 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:09,559 Speaker 1: but here's what I said. I myself, sometimes if I'm 236 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: running like several errands, I'm just gonna pop it here 237 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:14,560 Speaker 1: real quick. Then I've got to go, you know, to CBS. 238 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:16,040 Speaker 1: Now I've got to go to launch a mat. Then 239 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:18,599 Speaker 1: I got another liquor store or whatever it is. I 240 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 1: won't re engage that seat belt because it's two seconds 241 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,480 Speaker 1: and I'm out again. It made me think he was 242 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: in out of that car stalking. He was getting his 243 00:14:29,080 --> 00:14:32,320 Speaker 1: you know, visual of how he could see into the home, 244 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:36,040 Speaker 1: how he might could get a better field division from 245 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:40,320 Speaker 1: another parking spot. That's what I literally thought, and that's 246 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 1: what I said on Nancy Grace. 247 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you make the absolutely incredible point that connects 248 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 2: with people because that's what I think most people are like, 249 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 2: and they go, hold on, we're religious in modern society 250 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 2: with putting on the seatbelt like it has been ingrained 251 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 2: in us. If it's not, I don't know where you've been. 252 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 2: But at the same time, like you're saying, everybody kind 253 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 2: of jumps in and jumps out if you're getting in 254 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 2: and out of the car and running a quick err 255 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 2: and this that and the other, and what it really does, 256 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:14,520 Speaker 2: especially after hearing not necessarily from him, but the admission 257 00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 2: and acceptance of guilt for these crimes, we now get 258 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:22,520 Speaker 2: to say, all right, let's change the judgment, our own 259 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 2: personal judgment on the Brian Coburgers of the world, because 260 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 2: guess what, he's guilty. He no longer gets my theoretical 261 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 2: presumption of innocence. He admitted to committing some of the worst, 262 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 2: most violent, reprehensible, horrific crimes that are out there, and 263 00:15:38,720 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 2: he stole these children from their families and their communities 264 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:48,479 Speaker 2: and does not deserve grace and lenity and consideration from society. 265 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 2: And I can say, now, dude's creep. Something was wrong. 266 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 2: Why didn't we figure this out a little bit earlier? 267 00:15:55,400 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 2: Was this guy really just existing in this this isolated universe? 268 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 2: Where come on, you can't tell me other people weren't like, Nope, 269 00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:08,920 Speaker 2: he's a little bit of a weird guy. Because we've 270 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 2: heard it, we've seen it, we've had other people due 271 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 2: to this investigation, and should something have been done? Man? 272 00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 2: I wish something had But then I turn around at 273 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 2: the other side, and considering all the crazed phone calls, 274 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:27,239 Speaker 2: I get how sensitive are we gonna be as a community, 275 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 2: as a nation with people and places and situations that 276 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 2: are a little bit out of place that send up 277 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 2: that red flag. Are we gonna wander through life going 278 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 2: all right? I have to be constantly vigilant and afraid 279 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 2: and on top, or are we gonna go guess what 280 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 2: creation has? These abnormalities, these horrific and I'm not gonna 281 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:58,760 Speaker 2: call them a mistake, but these deviant existences. We've got 282 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:02,240 Speaker 2: three hundred million people formed a million people in this country. 283 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 2: A couple of them are gonna be busted, and this 284 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 2: guy was busted. I suspect he has a strong connection 285 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:16,280 Speaker 2: to one of the victims. 286 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 3: I expect that he. 287 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:26,440 Speaker 2: Has an active fantasy, pretend solo interior dialogue and life 288 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:31,720 Speaker 2: that is way out of bounds when it comes to normalcy. 289 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:35,639 Speaker 2: Because this is six stuff. This is the This is 290 00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:39,080 Speaker 2: right out of a horror novel of sneaking around and 291 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:43,760 Speaker 2: killing college co eds with k bar knife and in 292 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:49,639 Speaker 2: a way that is inherently not just vile, vicious cruel. 293 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:54,359 Speaker 2: The broken teeth, the number of wounds. This was not 294 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 2: I'm sliding in like a ninja and doing an assessed No, 295 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:03,640 Speaker 2: this was a flagrantly violent and loud encounter. 296 00:18:04,560 --> 00:18:07,680 Speaker 1: And you know to your point, because a lot of 297 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:10,639 Speaker 1: people have asked me, do I think he's killed before 298 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 1: and my answer from day one has been no, because 299 00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 1: he was so bad at it, meaning he used his 300 00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 1: own car, he was called on tape, he got a 301 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:28,399 Speaker 1: ticket that put him in that vicinity at an odd 302 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:32,520 Speaker 1: time of day, alone with no seatbelt. He turned his 303 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 1: phone off, which only made him look more guilty. When 304 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,560 Speaker 1: his phone wasn't on airplane mode, it hit he had 305 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 1: no alibi. I mean, it goes on and on much less, 306 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 1: leaving the sheath behind. I mean, these are mistakes you 307 00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:50,000 Speaker 1: and I work with a clientaile with a population, and 308 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:52,400 Speaker 1: I've told people this and they always laugh, but it's 309 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,560 Speaker 1: the truth. I dealt with an eight year old drug 310 00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 1: dealer that knew not to use his own bike. 311 00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 2: Oh smart, Oh my goodness, they're smart. Their mind to 312 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:08,159 Speaker 2: care and cancer we'd have at you, guys would not 313 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 2: imagine the brilliance and American ethic of hard work and 314 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 2: hustle that. 315 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,360 Speaker 1: We see every day. Hustle, And it's why. 316 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 2: I feel so engendered with especially when they're coming out 317 00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:25,120 Speaker 2: of these situations with no opportunity, and I go, hey, 318 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 2: don't crack on that kid for selling dope. It's the 319 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 2: best way he's got to support his family. It's the 320 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 2: only thing he knows. And man, some of those guys 321 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:36,639 Speaker 2: run a business that would put Walmart to shame how 322 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 2: efficient they are. It's the hubris that came into that 323 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 2: incompetency because he knew the tools that were gonna be 324 00:19:45,880 --> 00:19:49,320 Speaker 2: used to investigate him, and he just chose to not 325 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 2: care or to think that they weren't gonna apply to him, 326 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 2: or that he was too smart to get away. Because 327 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 2: it's like you're saying, if you're a suspect, they're gonna 328 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 2: run your phone. Your phone generates more information. I don't 329 00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:04,320 Speaker 2: care if he's a VPN, and like it's the absence 330 00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:08,359 Speaker 2: of information, like you're saying, CHERL becomes information. Your phone 331 00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 2: was off during this one very specific time. Man. 332 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,199 Speaker 3: That tends to show you were involved and had knowledge 333 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 3: about it. 334 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 1: Just does. 335 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:22,119 Speaker 2: And it shows that Brian Coberger was either that incompetent 336 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:29,800 Speaker 2: or that cocky and that it had such a superiority 337 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,919 Speaker 2: complex that he was going to be able to commit 338 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 2: a huge scene, multi party murder with a knife and 339 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:41,680 Speaker 2: be able to get away. Because I don't think for 340 00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:44,320 Speaker 2: a second this was a crime of opportunity or a 341 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:48,200 Speaker 2: crime of patn No, this and this was thought about 342 00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 2: this was a penultimate event that he had deep attachment to, 343 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:59,720 Speaker 2: and just showing and seeing his incompetence does make me 344 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 2: get a little bit because he's going to be hanging 345 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,879 Speaker 2: out with some people way better at being criminals. 346 00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 1: Than he is. He's not ready, he's not ready for 347 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,359 Speaker 1: what's coming. He's not ready for who's going to holler 348 00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:17,400 Speaker 1: at him from sale to sale, who's going to bump 349 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:20,520 Speaker 1: into him, who's going to threaten him, who's going to 350 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:25,120 Speaker 1: control his very existence? And again, it ain't the warden 351 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:26,760 Speaker 1: h it is. 352 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:29,680 Speaker 2: And I know people are like, oh, it's too kind 353 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 2: for him to y'all go to a nice prison for 354 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 2: a minute, and it gives you the he be GBI's 355 00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:39,879 Speaker 2: and the first time you've ever had your movement restricted, 356 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:41,920 Speaker 2: that's bad. 357 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:46,639 Speaker 1: You know, Josh. I have given this example to people 358 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:51,680 Speaker 1: that say that you selected your car, you bought it, 359 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:56,440 Speaker 1: you wanted that specific vehicle. But if you have ever 360 00:21:56,600 --> 00:22:00,240 Speaker 1: broken down and had to sit in that car sick, 361 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:01,680 Speaker 1: are you of that car pretty quick? 362 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 2: Dah? Yeah? 363 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: And that is nothing compared to where he's sitting. 364 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:14,879 Speaker 2: Literally, it go to a cell for twenty minutes. So 365 00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,960 Speaker 2: when you're a baby lawyer, you go practice law, and 366 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:21,800 Speaker 2: sometimes it's in some uncomfortable spots. In Fulton County, every 367 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:24,439 Speaker 2: baby lawyer that went through there set in those holding 368 00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 2: cells on the first floor that are the big group 369 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:31,200 Speaker 2: holding cells, and you're surrounded by inmates all talking, or 370 00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:34,520 Speaker 2: you're in the hallway there's yelling, screaming, clanking, and you're 371 00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:39,040 Speaker 2: sitting there trying to go do work, trying to represent somebody. 372 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,440 Speaker 2: But you get put in that holding cell so that 373 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:45,800 Speaker 2: you can get some quiet, and you are in your 374 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:50,360 Speaker 2: twenties and you're a baby, excited lawyer out there practicing law, 375 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:53,760 Speaker 2: and you get put into a cinder block room with 376 00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:58,160 Speaker 2: a metal door with a little glass reinforced wired windows 377 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,720 Speaker 2: so they can see if you're dead or not. And 378 00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 2: then they put a person in there and ask you, hey, 379 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:06,920 Speaker 2: do you want them cuffed? And you know this is 380 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:09,560 Speaker 2: your client, so you're trying to be gets so uncufforable 381 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:14,360 Speaker 2: the moment that door closes, because it's not a light door. 382 00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:17,760 Speaker 2: We're not talking about something that just clicked. No, these 383 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 2: doors weigh three four, five, six hundred pounds when it closes, 384 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 2: when that big metal latch locks, that click that anybody 385 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:33,919 Speaker 2: that has been in prison or jail knows. It shoots 386 00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 2: a bolt of lightning straight to your core and you 387 00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:38,720 Speaker 2: know you're getting out. 388 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:39,480 Speaker 3: This is your job. 389 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:41,359 Speaker 2: You need to go home and cook dinner that night. 390 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 2: But that moment the door closes and you feel how 391 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 2: permanent it is. You can't bust out and you're in 392 00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 2: there in that room with somebody knowing you're going to 393 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:58,399 Speaker 2: get out. That's terrifying imagining that that door shuts and 394 00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,240 Speaker 2: I'm gonna stay there for ever. 395 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:06,000 Speaker 3: Oh it's horrifu. It is absolutely horrifu. 396 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 1: Well, honey, how do we do that? 397 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 3: That com gee? 398 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:16,480 Speaker 1: I mean, there's so much we can talk and talk 399 00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:17,880 Speaker 1: and talking to touch. 400 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 2: Epstein because that's blowing up yet again. Epstein's coming back 401 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,360 Speaker 2: up into the university. We've got that honor killing that's 402 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 2: still on Verdict watch right. Uh, there is so much 403 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:34,399 Speaker 2: going on we can talk about this orever. 404 00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 1: What does Nathan Grace say, job security? Honey? 405 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,640 Speaker 3: Oh lord, yes, it's it is something. 406 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,320 Speaker 1: Well, you need to go finish celebrating your birthday because 407 00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,720 Speaker 1: you need to celebrate all month. That's how it's done. Yeah, 408 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 1: a little bit happy happy birthday, and I love you 409 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: and I'll talk to you soon. 410 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,840 Speaker 2: Absolutely love you too, Love you audience, thank you so 411 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:00,240 Speaker 2: much for listening and we will see you next week 412 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:01,879 Speaker 2: on the Crime Round It 413 00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:10,320 Speaker 1: MHM