WEBVTT - Miguel 0:00:15.476 --> 0:00:23.156 Pushkin. Miguel, the Grammy winning ALTS R and B pioneer, 0:00:23.356 --> 0:00:26.676 is back with a new album, Chaos, his first full 0:00:26.756 --> 0:00:29.436 length in eight years. It's the latest step in a 0:00:29.516 --> 0:00:31.796 career that's always pushed the boundaries of R and B, 0:00:31.996 --> 0:00:35.516 from his twenty ten debut, through albums that dabbled in psychedelia, 0:00:35.716 --> 0:00:40.076 dance music, and now touches of eighties industrial and even rancherrhythms. 0:00:40.836 --> 0:00:43.396 On today's episode, Miguel talks with Lea Rose about his 0:00:43.476 --> 0:00:46.916 unreleased twenty twenty three album Viscera, and how suspending himself 0:00:46.956 --> 0:00:49.436 from piercings in his back during its rollout helped him 0:00:49.436 --> 0:00:53.636 surrender control. He also shares a story behind the controversial 0:00:53.676 --> 0:00:57.756 imagery for his single New Martyrs, and despite collaborations with 0:00:57.796 --> 0:01:01.636 Travis Scott, Mariah Carey, and Tamimpala, Miguel explains why he's 0:01:01.676 --> 0:01:08.156 happiest just making music with his friends. This is broken record, 0:01:08.556 --> 0:01:18.676 real musicians, real conversations. Here's Lea Rose in conversation with Miguel. 0:01:19.636 --> 0:01:22.156 Okay, so I want to ask you about the song 0:01:22.236 --> 0:01:26.676 New Martyrs. I'm curious how you came upon the artwork 0:01:27.276 --> 0:01:30.196 for the song and tell me what the artwork is 0:01:30.276 --> 0:01:31.996 how you came up with the idea and what the 0:01:32.036 --> 0:01:33.116 thinking is behind it. 0:01:35.156 --> 0:01:36.476 So the artwork is. 0:01:38.036 --> 0:01:42.156 Almost like a meme because you know, this year, I 0:01:42.196 --> 0:01:49.236 think seeing Luigi Mangioni, you know, carry out what he 0:01:49.356 --> 0:01:54.196 felt was right, regardless of what it meant in terms 0:01:54.196 --> 0:01:58.916 of the law, and morally, seeing how that played out 0:01:58.956 --> 0:02:01.636 and how that resonated with so many people with their 0:02:01.756 --> 0:02:05.316 anger and their angst. And I'm going to go out 0:02:05.316 --> 0:02:10.596 on a limb here and say the disenfranchised and powerless 0:02:10.636 --> 0:02:16.116 feeling of watching a political system sort of cannibalize itself 0:02:16.476 --> 0:02:19.316 right in front of you, and see how corporate interest 0:02:19.436 --> 0:02:24.596 is really infiltrated and manipulated what is meant to be 0:02:24.996 --> 0:02:29.876 an equitable process and all inclusive process. 0:02:30.596 --> 0:02:31.876 It really is infuriating. 0:02:32.196 --> 0:02:34.996 And to see people really get behind an action that 0:02:35.036 --> 0:02:38.436 feels like vigilanteism in any other case would be considered 0:02:38.516 --> 0:02:44.636 absolutely wrong, unjust, but having that context and then also 0:02:44.836 --> 0:02:51.516 understanding the story behind the personal injustice that behind the execution, 0:02:52.636 --> 0:02:54.796 you know, seeing how people respond to that is like 0:02:55.276 --> 0:02:59.436 even I'm like, nah, yeah, I mean, you're really putting 0:03:00.116 --> 0:03:06.396 your money before people's health, You're overlooking your humanity for 0:03:06.516 --> 0:03:10.916 your own greed, and I feel this is a something 0:03:10.956 --> 0:03:13.076 that hit me so hard that I had to really 0:03:13.116 --> 0:03:16.356 look at myself and go, I mean, am I wrong 0:03:16.436 --> 0:03:18.116 for a kind of being in agreement? 0:03:18.396 --> 0:03:18.636 You know? 0:03:19.316 --> 0:03:21.836 Am I wrong for feeling like he kind of did 0:03:22.196 --> 0:03:24.916 the right thing on behalf of a lot of people 0:03:24.956 --> 0:03:29.036 who've been shitted on, you know, and more importantly, like, 0:03:29.076 --> 0:03:32.916 who have you know, had their loved ones at the 0:03:32.956 --> 0:03:35.156 cost of their loved ones, of their own lives of 0:03:35.676 --> 0:03:38.996 you know, so real humanity, you know, at the cost 0:03:38.996 --> 0:03:42.276 of humanity. I think this is something we're going to 0:03:42.356 --> 0:03:45.596 see more and more as we continue. I think that's 0:03:45.636 --> 0:03:50.476 a domino until there's some real correction, you know, until 0:03:50.476 --> 0:03:55.236 there's some real justice established and awaited to make right 0:03:55.316 --> 0:03:58.956 on things moving forward. I think that's why I have 0:03:59.036 --> 0:04:03.836 this dream where I'm like kind of like just doing 0:04:03.876 --> 0:04:06.116 what I feel is right, even though it may seem wrong. 0:04:06.836 --> 0:04:11.356 It's very much inspired by seeing that happen, seeing their response, 0:04:11.396 --> 0:04:14.556 and also addressing my own angst, my own anger and 0:04:14.596 --> 0:04:21.036 dissatisfaction with the world as it is not just this country, 0:04:21.076 --> 0:04:24.956 and so New Martyrs is about that line towards the 0:04:25.116 --> 0:04:29.676 end where it's like, yeah, give me what's mine. I 0:04:29.716 --> 0:04:32.356 think a lot of people feel that way, and more 0:04:32.396 --> 0:04:35.636 and more people are going to feel that way more so. 0:04:35.916 --> 0:04:37.156 What's behind that is like. 0:04:37.156 --> 0:04:41.556 Do right by me and right by us, right by 0:04:41.596 --> 0:04:45.676 the world, do the right thing because right now there's 0:04:45.716 --> 0:04:47.156 a lot of wrong being done. 0:04:47.316 --> 0:04:49.676 It's a lot of wrong and it's not. 0:04:49.556 --> 0:04:52.636 Like it hasn't been that way and what we know 0:04:52.716 --> 0:04:55.716 to be human history and our but it certainly feels 0:04:55.876 --> 0:05:02.076 as if it is insurmountable or is Yeah, maybe because 0:05:02.116 --> 0:05:04.556 we can tune in on everything at all times, whenever 0:05:04.596 --> 0:05:07.716 we want. But that feeling, I think a lot of 0:05:07.716 --> 0:05:10.316 people feel that way, and that's what inspired That's how 0:05:10.356 --> 0:05:12.036 I feel, and that's what inspired the song. 0:05:12.636 --> 0:05:16.356 How do you toe the line between bringing in these 0:05:16.396 --> 0:05:20.716 bigger issues like I know you've been active in issues 0:05:20.756 --> 0:05:25.556 around immigration and mass incarceration, but you're also known for 0:05:25.796 --> 0:05:31.156 making sensual, sexy baby making music, Like, how do you 0:05:31.276 --> 0:05:34.236 toe the line and talk about both of these things 0:05:35.116 --> 0:05:35.996 at the same time? 0:05:37.876 --> 0:05:41.276 I remind myself that as a human experience and people 0:05:41.276 --> 0:05:44.996 who only focus on are who primarily focus on, you know, 0:05:45.676 --> 0:05:51.596 speaking out about injustice, activism. Artists and musicians who who 0:05:51.636 --> 0:05:54.916 do those things are also human beings, and they also, 0:05:56.156 --> 0:05:58.676 you know, they have their own sexual life, they have 0:05:58.756 --> 0:06:02.076 their own romantic relationships and their experience with those things, 0:06:02.116 --> 0:06:05.036 and it's their prerogative to talk about those things when 0:06:05.036 --> 0:06:08.316 they want, and it's their choice not too or to. 0:06:09.516 --> 0:06:11.676 And this, for me, I think is probably top of 0:06:11.716 --> 0:06:15.876 mind because this is the world that I'm inheriting, that 0:06:15.916 --> 0:06:19.836 I've inherited, and I'm also in a position in my 0:06:20.036 --> 0:06:24.076 age and my experience to hold myself accountable and I 0:06:24.116 --> 0:06:28.756 can't not do that. I'm not twenty one or eighteen 0:06:28.876 --> 0:06:32.276 when I wrote Quickie. It's a different thing, you know. 0:06:32.356 --> 0:06:36.196 And so yeah, these things have become increasingly important in 0:06:36.236 --> 0:06:39.676 my mind, and I think naturally that that is why 0:06:39.716 --> 0:06:42.476 it's becoming more important to in my music. 0:06:43.316 --> 0:06:47.116 Do you ever question, like, if there's someone you're working with, 0:06:47.156 --> 0:06:49.796 like a producer, whoever's in the studio with you, do 0:06:49.876 --> 0:06:52.396 you ever turn to them and say like, oh, is this? 0:06:52.596 --> 0:06:53.996 Am I going too far with this? 0:06:54.636 --> 0:06:55.116 Definitely? 0:06:55.236 --> 0:06:57.276 Is this a downer? Yeah? 0:06:57.516 --> 0:07:03.676 How does that work? I mean it's pretty much like that. 0:07:03.716 --> 0:07:04.676 I'm like, is this too much? 0:07:05.276 --> 0:07:09.516 The great thing about I work with my friends, I 0:07:09.556 --> 0:07:12.076 think I've learned that that's the best way to maintain 0:07:12.156 --> 0:07:17.596 like that sense of play, the permission to explore. 0:07:18.516 --> 0:07:19.956 I just want to work with my friends. 0:07:19.996 --> 0:07:24.156 Man, I've done the transactional thing, and that shit sucks 0:07:24.196 --> 0:07:29.756 all the time. One, it's rarely a collaboration because it's 0:07:29.796 --> 0:07:32.916 easy to do shit, you know, remotely, so it's not 0:07:32.956 --> 0:07:35.716 like we're getting in a room and we're really collaborating, 0:07:36.196 --> 0:07:39.076 at least not in my experience. And when it's no 0:07:39.196 --> 0:07:42.596 friendship in the middle. If that's not the thing, then 0:07:42.636 --> 0:07:45.516 you got to go do some wax shit like promote 0:07:45.516 --> 0:07:47.636 a song that you that you would never ever do 0:07:47.756 --> 0:07:50.036 on your own. It would never come from your expression. 0:07:50.356 --> 0:07:53.076 It's not your point of view. And I to a degree, 0:07:53.116 --> 0:07:57.316 I can appreciate stepping into stepping into someone else's world 0:07:57.356 --> 0:08:00.356 and remaining in your point of view and in your 0:08:00.436 --> 0:08:04.556 style and you know, having a presence in a new way. 0:08:04.596 --> 0:08:07.956 I think there's beautiful times when that's happened, but most 0:08:08.036 --> 0:08:11.036 times it I think in the past when I've seen that, 0:08:11.076 --> 0:08:13.196 it's been like people who really fuck with each other, 0:08:13.276 --> 0:08:15.516 like they can go have they can go have a drink, 0:08:15.996 --> 0:08:18.436 they like the same kind of movies, or have something 0:08:18.796 --> 0:08:21.596 at the core that's like, oh no, like, I really 0:08:21.636 --> 0:08:24.076 fuck with you. What happens when it's not like that? 0:08:24.156 --> 0:08:26.836 It's like, now you got to go support not just 0:08:26.876 --> 0:08:30.036 the song, but like the video and then the promo 0:08:30.196 --> 0:08:32.316 behind it that turns out to be mad corny, and 0:08:32.316 --> 0:08:36.156 then you find out the person is really just a politician, 0:08:36.356 --> 0:08:38.356 and then you know what I mean, They're like, you 0:08:38.396 --> 0:08:41.196 don't you could care less, Like it's easy to become 0:08:41.796 --> 0:08:44.956 just some shit you don't want to do. So I 0:08:44.996 --> 0:08:47.196 work with my friends and in a room when I'm 0:08:47.236 --> 0:08:50.076 feeling like is this too much, they just be like 0:08:50.156 --> 0:08:52.596 do that, No, just do your shit, like just do it, 0:08:53.036 --> 0:08:57.036 do it, do it all. And most times the things 0:08:57.036 --> 0:09:00.956 that don't fit naturally will sort of kind of like 0:09:01.396 --> 0:09:02.796 they just get pushed to the side. 0:09:03.996 --> 0:09:09.596 How do you get in the proper headspace to cord 0:09:09.716 --> 0:09:13.756 and to express yourself and to be vulnerable or to 0:09:13.836 --> 0:09:17.036 be open. Have you found anything over the course of 0:09:17.076 --> 0:09:20.356 your career that really gets you there? Like whether it's 0:09:20.396 --> 0:09:24.196 like having a drink or like push ups or whatever 0:09:24.276 --> 0:09:26.796 it is like a certain time of night, have you 0:09:26.876 --> 0:09:28.356 found anything that gets you there? 0:09:29.356 --> 0:09:31.796 I mean in different stages, has been different things. For sure, 0:09:31.876 --> 0:09:34.916 alcohol was a big one, I mean a little tequila 0:09:34.956 --> 0:09:37.156 in the past. Was it before it was whiskey like 0:09:37.636 --> 0:09:42.756 Kaleidoscope dream is like whiskey and weed forties Nope, It's 0:09:42.756 --> 0:09:44.636 like I don't know why I was drinking forties. 0:09:45.596 --> 0:09:48.316 I was like like pounding forties. 0:09:47.836 --> 0:09:53.476 And yeah the aquila and wild Heart actually is the 0:09:53.556 --> 0:09:56.596 quila into mescot. So I was like finding, Wow, I 0:09:56.636 --> 0:10:01.196 was finding like mescov and smoking for sure Wildheart. 0:10:01.236 --> 0:10:02.436 I'm like smoking a lot of weed. 0:10:03.276 --> 0:10:06.276 I also like, I think it's really it's really interesting 0:10:06.316 --> 0:10:10.596 how drugs have influenced music along in these different periods 0:10:10.636 --> 0:10:13.476 of time. I mean, like jazz, it's like speed, you 0:10:13.556 --> 0:10:16.596 know what I mean, Like when jazz heroin right, it's 0:10:16.636 --> 0:10:20.356 like ending right. Or you listen to grunge music and 0:10:20.356 --> 0:10:22.996 you're like, yeah, heroin is this it's a heroin time. 0:10:23.556 --> 0:10:27.676 You're listening to how crack and cocaine influenced you know, 0:10:27.796 --> 0:10:31.276 hip hop, and it's it's play in that timeframe and 0:10:31.316 --> 0:10:34.596 the emerging artists. Drugs and alcohol and all kinds of 0:10:34.596 --> 0:10:38.236 illicit activity have always been a part of music and creativity, 0:10:38.516 --> 0:10:41.116 whether it be fine art or music and fine art. 0:10:41.436 --> 0:10:43.716 For me, getting in that headspace has been different in 0:10:43.756 --> 0:10:47.916 each era. This time, this album. I mean, I still 0:10:47.956 --> 0:10:51.356 love to drink. I hate to even say this, but like, 0:10:52.636 --> 0:10:55.236 if I'm out and there's a photo of me, I 0:10:55.276 --> 0:10:57.716 will guarantee you nine times out of ten I have 0:11:00.036 --> 0:11:04.156 I love I love this guys social lubricat and I'm 0:11:04.276 --> 0:11:07.596 very much a like introvert. Extrovert is like, I'm yeah, same, 0:11:07.676 --> 0:11:11.316 I can do that extroverted thing. I very much like 0:11:11.396 --> 0:11:13.756 to be for a time, for a time. The social 0:11:13.756 --> 0:11:17.796 meter is not it's not a large social media, but 0:11:18.476 --> 0:11:21.276 it exists. And I do think that you know, a 0:11:21.276 --> 0:11:24.956 little mescal with uh with sparkling water and the lime 0:11:25.636 --> 0:11:27.436 kind of extends the battery a little bit. 0:11:28.036 --> 0:11:30.396 That sounds nice, It sounds incredible right now. 0:11:32.436 --> 0:11:34.196 But yeah, you can go out for a period, but 0:11:34.236 --> 0:11:36.116 then you want to like rush home and get into 0:11:36.116 --> 0:11:37.756 the bean bag and just chill and just. 0:11:38.316 --> 0:11:41.836 Right in this room with a record, you know what 0:11:41.836 --> 0:11:44.676 I mean, in a conversation with a couple handful of 0:11:44.716 --> 0:11:47.036 like really fun interesting people, and. 0:11:47.036 --> 0:11:51.116 I'm good, yeah, yeah, no, I feel that very deeply. 0:11:51.676 --> 0:11:53.716 What are you listening to these days? Like, is there 0:11:53.796 --> 0:11:58.436 any new old music you've discovered or what have you 0:11:58.516 --> 0:11:59.476 been reaching for. 0:12:00.196 --> 0:12:03.116 New old Well, this album in this period, I've been 0:12:03.156 --> 0:12:06.716 really going back and like leaning into all all my 0:12:06.796 --> 0:12:11.916 like more alternative tastes and then fluences, going back to 0:12:11.956 --> 0:12:15.316 Pixie's records, going back to that whole grunge era, so 0:12:15.916 --> 0:12:20.556 all of Nirvana, all of Sound Garden, all of that 0:12:20.716 --> 0:12:23.836 sort of like you know Seattle area, Yeah yeah. Then 0:12:23.996 --> 0:12:27.156 jumping into some of like jungle stuff has been a 0:12:27.156 --> 0:12:31.116 big one. I've been like trying to find ways to 0:12:32.396 --> 0:12:38.396 infuse rhythms and chord progressions that just are nostalgic or 0:12:38.476 --> 0:12:40.916 styles that are nostalgic. 0:12:40.396 --> 0:12:41.556 To my to my youth. 0:12:42.476 --> 0:12:42.956 Mm hmmm. 0:12:43.356 --> 0:12:46.196 So kum Yah is one of those ones where you'll 0:12:46.236 --> 0:12:49.476 hear a little bit of that, and like Francea, you'll 0:12:49.476 --> 0:12:52.716 get a little bit of that in Chaos. I think overall, 0:12:52.756 --> 0:12:55.756 what I was searching for in listening to music and 0:12:56.196 --> 0:13:00.316 influences like anything that felt dissonant. I felt like there's 0:13:00.356 --> 0:13:02.796 a rub there that that created the tension that I 0:13:02.916 --> 0:13:03.596 was looking for. 0:13:04.676 --> 0:13:08.476 Do you still feel in a place where you're recognizing 0:13:08.476 --> 0:13:11.236 and thinking about chaos or has that all been exercised 0:13:11.276 --> 0:13:13.196 out through the album? 0:13:13.676 --> 0:13:13.756 No. 0:13:14.036 --> 0:13:15.036 On the contrary, I. 0:13:16.716 --> 0:13:21.836 Want to wield it more effectively. I mean my my 0:13:21.916 --> 0:13:24.956 thinking on it is this like it's just about conditions 0:13:24.956 --> 0:13:28.836 to grow are conditions in general? If it's not growing, 0:13:28.956 --> 0:13:32.596 it's dead. Shout out to Lauren Hill. I mean, one 0:13:32.596 --> 0:13:34.396 of the most poignant things that she said in an 0:13:34.396 --> 0:13:36.236 interview is like, if it's not growing, it's dead. And 0:13:36.276 --> 0:13:40.956 it's the truth. And for me, what I've realized is 0:13:40.996 --> 0:13:45.516 that in many ways, I think I've I believe in 0:13:45.556 --> 0:13:48.116 my core that we all need a little chaos to grow. 0:13:48.836 --> 0:13:51.996 Maybe I'm wrong, I know for me that's the outside 0:13:52.036 --> 0:13:54.596 of my depth that Bowie talks about is the place 0:13:54.636 --> 0:13:59.996 where an artist really can thrive. It's the unknowing, it's 0:14:00.076 --> 0:14:05.636 the uncertainty that pushes it outside of that comfort zone 0:14:05.676 --> 0:14:10.036 that that means we need to stretch in not ways 0:14:10.036 --> 0:14:14.716 that we necessarily know, but that we need. And so chaos, 0:14:14.716 --> 0:14:19.636 I think in my life this album represents my acknowledgment 0:14:19.836 --> 0:14:23.396 of the chaos that I've created in my life and 0:14:23.516 --> 0:14:26.356 making peace with it in a lot of ways in 0:14:26.516 --> 0:14:30.956 order to better utilize it for my purpose. And while 0:14:30.996 --> 0:14:34.076 I'm here and I want to continue to curate chaos 0:14:34.076 --> 0:14:37.836 in my life. 0:14:36.516 --> 0:14:38.196 How are you going to do that? How do you 0:14:38.236 --> 0:14:41.836 curate chaos in your life right now, like intentionally like 0:14:41.956 --> 0:14:45.716 mess up a situation just to get the feel that 0:14:45.756 --> 0:14:49.236 feeling and kind of like use that for growth. Is 0:14:49.276 --> 0:14:50.036 that what that means? 0:14:50.396 --> 0:14:54.956 Not toxic chasts. We don't want any more toxic chaos though. 0:14:55.516 --> 0:15:01.116 Old habits die hard, And I think me stepping into 0:15:01.516 --> 0:15:04.436 my adulthood and my responsibility is one way that I 0:15:04.556 --> 0:15:07.956 ensure that the chaos that I do curate in my 0:15:08.076 --> 0:15:12.476 life is really intentional. So I look at ways of 0:15:12.556 --> 0:15:16.476 like how do I infuse something that is not obvious 0:15:17.156 --> 0:15:21.756 and it's not normal or natural? So taking, I mean 0:15:21.876 --> 0:15:24.716 what a simple way is like like I love that 0:15:24.836 --> 0:15:27.276 port his head on three, Like switch up their whole 0:15:27.436 --> 0:15:30.716 all of their their instruments instead of everyone is playing 0:15:30.716 --> 0:15:31.516 a different instrument. 0:15:31.676 --> 0:15:32.236 You know what I mean? 0:15:32.716 --> 0:15:35.476 Every that's chaos to me because no one is in 0:15:35.516 --> 0:15:37.836 a comfort zone when it's not. 0:15:37.956 --> 0:15:39.476 No, I understand that, you know what I mean. 0:15:39.556 --> 0:15:42.516 So I think of chaos in my life in that way. 0:15:43.276 --> 0:15:46.596 We definitely don't want any any more toxicity. Yes, we 0:15:46.676 --> 0:15:48.996 don't need it. It's I don't think that's necessary. 0:15:50.356 --> 0:15:54.356 No, especially not when you're approaching forty. 0:15:55.716 --> 0:15:57.916 I want look, and that's it, isn't it. It's a 0:15:57.956 --> 0:15:59.236 crazy thing because I know. 0:15:59.236 --> 0:16:01.236 For me, I wanted I want all stability. 0:16:01.476 --> 0:16:01.676 Bruh. 0:16:01.756 --> 0:16:04.036 I'm like, like I said, it is like I want 0:16:04.036 --> 0:16:08.196 to I want peace in my life in general, but again, 0:16:08.356 --> 0:16:11.876 controlled chaos in the right places, whether it's like shaking 0:16:11.956 --> 0:16:15.996 up my team and infusing someone who's not in the 0:16:16.196 --> 0:16:20.916 music business in a role that maybe is adjacent in 0:16:20.956 --> 0:16:24.116 a different field, you know, in a different yeah field, 0:16:24.436 --> 0:16:26.836 so that we have fresh thinking that we're we're not 0:16:26.956 --> 0:16:31.636 approaching things in yeah with the constructs of the status 0:16:31.716 --> 0:16:35.716 quo in mind. You know, it's like the chaos that 0:16:35.796 --> 0:16:38.596 means we're breaking rules, but for with a purpose. 0:16:39.516 --> 0:16:39.756 Yes. 0:16:40.516 --> 0:16:46.356 So did you realizing your place in the chaos or 0:16:46.996 --> 0:16:49.916 maybe creating it in some way where you weren't completely 0:16:49.956 --> 0:16:54.756 aware of it. Did you realize that through just natural 0:16:55.276 --> 0:16:59.156 aging or was it through like therapy work. I know 0:16:59.196 --> 0:17:01.516 you're about to turn forty and this album's coming out 0:17:01.636 --> 0:17:04.676 on your fortieth birthday. Yeah, that seems like a really 0:17:04.676 --> 0:17:07.996 big milestone, Like, how are you thinking about turning forty? 0:17:09.316 --> 0:17:12.276 I mean, I think for whatever reason, I've I wrote 0:17:12.276 --> 0:17:13.756 this song when I was much younger that I that 0:17:13.796 --> 0:17:17.396 we never put out called Hardway, which is like I 0:17:17.436 --> 0:17:19.556 always learned the hard way. Actually, no, it's on it's 0:17:19.556 --> 0:17:21.356 on the first album. What am I talking about? It's 0:17:21.396 --> 0:17:26.116 on the first album. See my brain is oxidizing as 0:17:26.116 --> 0:17:31.636 we speak. There's a song on the first album called 0:17:32.156 --> 0:17:34.076 hard Way, and it's like I always learned the hard way, 0:17:34.116 --> 0:17:35.276 and and I. 0:17:35.236 --> 0:17:36.076 Hate to have like. 0:17:37.556 --> 0:17:40.276 Maybe put that out in the that energy out there, 0:17:40.316 --> 0:17:45.236 or I've accepted that. But in some ways I've been 0:17:45.276 --> 0:17:47.916 able to see things before they happen and change course. 0:17:48.636 --> 0:17:51.756 But in a lot of ways, you know, I have 0:17:51.956 --> 0:17:53.916 learned the hard way, and I've been lucky to not 0:17:53.996 --> 0:17:58.556 learn the hardest way. But I've got a few bruises 0:17:58.556 --> 0:18:02.156 and scars, you know that that you know are reminders, 0:18:02.396 --> 0:18:07.316 And I think that's the that's the journey of life. 0:18:07.516 --> 0:18:07.956 Anyways. 0:18:07.956 --> 0:18:11.396 It's like Unterests Thompson, like not wanting to reach the 0:18:11.556 --> 0:18:16.196 end pristine and clean, but with fire shooting out of 0:18:16.236 --> 0:18:19.356 the back and screeching barely crossing the threshold. I think 0:18:19.876 --> 0:18:24.156 something about that has always been the way that I imagine 0:18:24.036 --> 0:18:27.596 my life kind of going. And thankfully it hasn't meant 0:18:28.036 --> 0:18:33.556 that I have reached the finish line prematurely, and I've 0:18:33.556 --> 0:18:36.076 been here at this point, I want to make sure 0:18:36.076 --> 0:18:39.036 it doesn't happen prematurely. But I do know of its 0:18:39.316 --> 0:18:42.156 seem like a healthy guy like or that's the key, 0:18:42.556 --> 0:18:44.956 seem nah yeah, yeah, yeah, like. 0:18:44.916 --> 0:18:47.556 You seem like healthy mind and body, like you're thinking 0:18:47.596 --> 0:18:48.116 about it. 0:18:48.516 --> 0:18:53.276 I mean, having the opportunity to do this every day, 0:18:53.636 --> 0:18:58.156 you know, and to express one's selves and one's emotions, 0:18:59.036 --> 0:19:01.956 I think is a key. And for me it's been 0:19:01.996 --> 0:19:05.836 the true meditation of my life. And I found you know, 0:19:05.876 --> 0:19:11.316 there's other tools that are super helpful. I think musicians 0:19:11.356 --> 0:19:14.436 and artists and of all me, through through all mediums 0:19:14.556 --> 0:19:18.876 do find real solace and peace when they're able to 0:19:18.916 --> 0:19:21.036 create and they find that connection. 0:19:20.836 --> 0:19:22.516 To the higher thing. 0:19:23.276 --> 0:19:25.876 But overall, I don't want to paint I don't want 0:19:25.916 --> 0:19:27.916 to paint myself into any corner where like I'm like 0:19:27.996 --> 0:19:32.636 out here just causing havoc or anything like that. But 0:19:32.676 --> 0:19:34.436 I do know that, you know, I've had to learn 0:19:34.476 --> 0:19:38.516 some hard lessons like anyone in the world, and I 0:19:38.556 --> 0:19:41.396 think I'm at a place in my life where I 0:19:41.476 --> 0:19:46.236 want to be real intentional about you know, the past. 0:19:46.316 --> 0:19:48.396 Let's taken that I really want to take, you know, 0:19:48.676 --> 0:19:51.116 and ones that actually are worth my time, are worthy 0:19:51.156 --> 0:19:54.716 of the effort, worthy of the risk, as opposed to 0:19:54.796 --> 0:19:58.036 kind of going into things too haphazardly. 0:19:59.116 --> 0:20:01.436 We'll be back with more from Miguel after the break. 0:20:05.876 --> 0:20:09.836 Was you getting into the suspension thing where you were 0:20:09.836 --> 0:20:12.916 hanging from your piercings? That seems very chaotic to me? 0:20:13.716 --> 0:20:17.436 Is that along the same lines of thinking for you? 0:20:17.436 --> 0:20:17.636 You know? 0:20:17.676 --> 0:20:21.116 The Tribby part about that is that even physiologically what 0:20:21.156 --> 0:20:25.116 that does is it actually well, first and foremost, it's 0:20:25.116 --> 0:20:28.916 like an adrenaline rush, right, and something about that is 0:20:29.036 --> 0:20:33.916 very calming. I found it to be really meditative and 0:20:34.996 --> 0:20:40.796 not chaotic. I mean, doing suspension has a different purpose 0:20:40.876 --> 0:20:43.596 and meaning for every person that has ever done it 0:20:43.676 --> 0:20:47.516 or that practices it. I wouldn't say that I practice suspension. 0:20:49.516 --> 0:20:53.036 But the purpose of doing suspension at the time was 0:20:53.076 --> 0:20:56.436 to open up a conversation that is relevant to this album, 0:20:57.156 --> 0:21:00.476 and that is like, what is my relation to pain? 0:21:01.676 --> 0:21:05.516 Why do I carry pain with pride? What pain am 0:21:05.556 --> 0:21:10.596 I carrying that I'm not really addressing or acknowledging? And 0:21:10.636 --> 0:21:14.716 how is that a part of the story I've written 0:21:15.236 --> 0:21:22.356 about myself? How does that enabling? How is it fueling? 0:21:23.796 --> 0:21:26.316 And how is it like holding me back. It was 0:21:26.396 --> 0:21:29.396 about having that conversation and kind of like giving it 0:21:29.676 --> 0:21:33.516 a visceral reference, but it was all about understanding pain 0:21:33.596 --> 0:21:37.396 and wanting to talk about talk about it publicly, which 0:21:37.436 --> 0:21:39.676 I believe we carried over into this album. 0:21:40.476 --> 0:21:44.276 What happened with that album it evolved. 0:21:44.676 --> 0:21:50.116 It definitely evolved. Viscera was initially it was initially meant 0:21:50.156 --> 0:21:52.356 to be bad Habits sad Anthems, which I still think 0:21:52.436 --> 0:21:58.796 is a fucking ill ast title. And then it became 0:22:00.236 --> 0:22:02.956 not just me wanting to just do an album of 0:22:03.036 --> 0:22:05.716 like kind of like the antithesis of what people know 0:22:06.596 --> 0:22:08.636 most about my music, and I think that it's like 0:22:09.316 --> 0:22:15.356 feel good, romantic, sensual dreamy to kind of go like, 0:22:15.396 --> 0:22:19.076 all right, how do I shake this up and make 0:22:19.116 --> 0:22:21.316 space for the other side of the coin, which is 0:22:21.316 --> 0:22:23.676 like that I do have bad habits, that there are 0:22:23.756 --> 0:22:27.316 sad anthems, and I wanted to do a whole album 0:22:27.396 --> 0:22:31.796 about that, and I think I in that process it 0:22:31.836 --> 0:22:34.916 was getting real heavy. It was like two even for me, 0:22:35.036 --> 0:22:38.196 I was like, maybe some of this stays in the vault. 0:22:38.996 --> 0:22:42.476 Yeah. Did anything from that album carry out over to 0:22:42.596 --> 0:22:43.196 the new album? 0:22:43.756 --> 0:22:48.236 Yeah, I would say a good quarter of that record. 0:22:48.756 --> 0:22:52.156 It was actually kind of like became what is chaos? 0:22:52.276 --> 0:22:54.796 Yeah, the album is so good, by the way, or 0:22:54.836 --> 0:22:56.636 what I've heard of the album is so great. 0:22:57.036 --> 0:22:58.876 That's really kind. Thank you so much, Thank you. 0:22:59.436 --> 0:23:01.796 I love the title track. Tell me about just the 0:23:01.836 --> 0:23:04.996 overall sound for it and what your vision was for it, 0:23:05.076 --> 0:23:05.876 how it came together. 0:23:07.116 --> 0:23:10.956 It started out I'd come up across a children's choir 0:23:11.316 --> 0:23:15.996 on Instagram and they had done do you remember that 0:23:16.476 --> 0:23:20.836 the THHXU? It was a crescendo, But it was kind 0:23:20.836 --> 0:23:22.756 of like, yes, you go to the movies for those 0:23:22.796 --> 0:23:25.556 of for those of you who aren't, you know who 0:23:25.596 --> 0:23:27.836 don't haven't been to the movies back in like the 0:23:27.956 --> 0:23:31.236 nineties or before that. You know, as you intro a movie, 0:23:31.236 --> 0:23:33.796 they wanted to flex the sound in the room, and 0:23:34.196 --> 0:23:37.796 very often the companies would have an audio kind of 0:23:37.876 --> 0:23:40.636 intro to give you a sense of like the ability 0:23:40.756 --> 0:23:44.396 and you know how incredible the sound system was and 0:23:45.356 --> 0:23:47.836 I think it's thx Please correct me. I'm sure someone 0:23:47.876 --> 0:23:51.196 will afterwards. But it was one of those companies that 0:23:51.756 --> 0:23:55.156