WEBVTT - Biden Plans to Warn Putin in Talks 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.440 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Carol Masser and I'm 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:07.280 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanovk. We're here every day bringing 0:00:07.320 --> 0:00:09.840 you the latest news from the world to business and finance, 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.680 plus technology, politics, economics, all partnising the power of Business 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:17.160 Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:19.640 analyst in more than one and twenty countries. You can 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:23.239 download Bloomberg Business Week and iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:25.200 You can also listen to our radio show at two 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:27.880 pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on 0:00:27.920 --> 0:00:32.840 YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. So Russian President Vladimir Putin 0:00:32.880 --> 0:00:36.000 will bring a long laundry list of issues to talk 0:00:36.040 --> 0:00:38.879 about at his first summit with the US leader. We're 0:00:38.880 --> 0:00:42.200 talking about President Joe Biden that is happening in Geneva tomorrow, 0:00:42.320 --> 0:00:44.200 even as the Kremlin says there is a little chance 0:00:44.240 --> 0:00:47.000 for a breakthrough in relations. So we are expecting it, though, 0:00:47.040 --> 0:00:49.480 tim to be a long meeting. Yeah to the tune 0:00:49.520 --> 0:00:52.280 of four to five hours long. It is long, especially 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:55.120 at the tail end of the European trips such as this. Well, 0:00:55.240 --> 0:00:59.080 joining now is Jordan Fabian White House correspondent at Bloomberg News, 0:00:59.160 --> 0:01:02.280 Jordan joins us on a phone from Washington, d C. 0:01:02.640 --> 0:01:07.120 Jordan's set expectations for us going into this For the 0:01:07.240 --> 0:01:10.600 United States, What is a win for Joe Biden, the 0:01:10.600 --> 0:01:16.040 Biden administration in the US. Well, I think the Biden 0:01:16.040 --> 0:01:19.839 administration is hoping for the President to send a tough 0:01:19.920 --> 0:01:23.080 message for Vladimir Putin That might not be enough to 0:01:23.120 --> 0:01:28.440 deter Putent from continuing his malign activities from you know, 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:31.880 cyber hacking to less inter parens, but it might have 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:35.280 a political benefit for Joe Biden here at home. He 0:01:35.440 --> 0:01:39.240 ran on taking a tougher line against the Kremlin, contrasting 0:01:39.280 --> 0:01:42.120 to Donald Trump's approach of trying to form a personal 0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:46.080 relationship and getting concessions out of the Russians that clearly 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:49.960 didn't work. And so this meeting might just be entirely 0:01:50.000 --> 0:01:53.400 for domestic political consumption, because it seems hard to see 0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:57.080 any kind of breakthrough or or even any kind of 0:01:57.120 --> 0:01:59.760 concrete agreements coming out of this meeting Tomorrow. Hey, Jordan, 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:02.680 understanding is there is no joint press conference after it, 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:05.280 So that also kind of speaks to the idea that 0:02:05.400 --> 0:02:08.639 they're not expecting any big revelations or changes in this relationship. 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:12.960 That's right, And each leader is going to do their 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:15.880 own step for press conference. And what White House specials 0:02:15.919 --> 0:02:18.679 have told us is that they wanted to minimize the 0:02:18.760 --> 0:02:22.400 chances of some kind of surprise that Vladimir Putin somehow 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:25.360 pulls cut some kind of stunt, or find some way 0:02:25.680 --> 0:02:28.720 to step on President Biden's message. How do you read 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:31.119 into the length of this meeting four to five hours. 0:02:31.800 --> 0:02:34.320 I mean, in some cases it, you know, made some 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:38.600 reporters here harken back to when Putin met Chancellor mercle 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:42.640 and she brought her his dog, knowing that she was 0:02:42.680 --> 0:02:47.320 afraid of dogs. That's right. I mean there's a high problem, 0:02:47.600 --> 0:02:50.400 high possibility of some kind of stunt here. I mean 0:02:50.440 --> 0:02:53.280 Putin is a former catered key, should be operative, is 0:02:53.320 --> 0:02:56.520 known to kind of play mind games with this counterparts. 0:02:56.639 --> 0:02:58.799 And I also note that this is a four to 0:02:58.880 --> 0:03:01.400 five hour meeting with out any food. Apparently there's not 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:06.560 gonna be any meals on the agenda, so possibility. Second, 0:03:07.160 --> 0:03:09.000 by the end of that, I'm just gonna say, if 0:03:09.040 --> 0:03:11.320 I'm president, I'm gonna put in my rider that I wanted, 0:03:13.960 --> 0:03:15.840 at least if I have a four to five hour meeting. 0:03:18.600 --> 0:03:23.000 So okay, So is it just a case of let's 0:03:23.000 --> 0:03:25.720 hope we walk away and things aren't worse than what 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:28.799 they've been. What? What's the goal? What? You know? And 0:03:28.880 --> 0:03:31.800 I think about our Bloomberg audience who are making investments 0:03:31.800 --> 0:03:36.360 watching geopolitical discussions, intensions or lack thereof. I mean, what 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:40.520 is it that an investment global investment audience maybe should 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:43.920 be listening out for. Is it potentially reviving the Iran 0:03:44.400 --> 0:03:48.480 nuclear deal? What is it? Jordan's I think it's a 0:03:48.520 --> 0:03:51.280 couple of things. I mean, One, if I'm an investment perspective, 0:03:51.360 --> 0:03:54.119 I think the US and the buy administration in particular, 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:59.040 wants some more predictability in the US Russia relationship. So 0:03:59.600 --> 0:04:02.400 you know, they want more open lines of communication. They want, 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:05.200 you know, fewer dust stops, and they're gonna lay out 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:08.160 where the President by is gonna lay out some areas 0:04:08.160 --> 0:04:10.200 where he says it's going to be a red line 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:12.720 where the US might respond. And then also they're going 0:04:12.760 --> 0:04:15.680 to talk about ways they can work together. You name 0:04:15.720 --> 0:04:19.080 the I Ran a nuclear agreement is one. Officials have 0:04:19.160 --> 0:04:21.880 said that they're going to start talking about renewing this 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.680 nuclear arms treaty called news Start, which is due to 0:04:24.720 --> 0:04:28.640 expire in So they're gonna try to find some areas 0:04:28.680 --> 0:04:32.599 for agreement, but those are obviously overshadowed by these big, 0:04:32.680 --> 0:04:35.640 huge areas where they're just vast disagreements. And what about 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:38.920 when it comes to human rights and specifically dissent within 0:04:39.160 --> 0:04:41.599 the country of Russia and I speak, you know with 0:04:41.720 --> 0:04:46.640 the background of Alexei Navalni. He's in prison there, that's right. 0:04:46.640 --> 0:04:48.880 You know what best officials have told us that they 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:51.160 view that as an issue that's on the table. So 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:54.640 Biden has said repeatedly that he's gonna raise those kind 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:57.479 of issues directly with Bladimir Putin. Uh. You know that's 0:04:57.520 --> 0:05:00.480 something that you know, Donald Trump said that he didn't 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:04.320 directly raise a Putin. He was sort of putting those 0:05:04.320 --> 0:05:06.719 issues to the side in an effort to have some 0:05:06.800 --> 0:05:09.400 kind of grand bargain with Putain. Biden is thinking the 0:05:09.440 --> 0:05:13.200 opposite approach, confronting him over these issues. But again, you know, 0:05:13.360 --> 0:05:16.360 multiple presidents of try this approach. Your Barack Obama's works 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.680 of you Bush, Bill Clinton and your lander recruiting has 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:22.640 never changed his behavior. Uh, in the way that the 0:05:22.720 --> 0:05:25.039 US and the West would like so it's hard to 0:05:25.080 --> 0:05:27.520 see what would come of it, even though Biden is 0:05:27.560 --> 0:05:31.520 going to be delivering this message tomorrow. What's the China 0:05:31.600 --> 0:05:35.919 role in all of this? Well, it's interesting. You know, 0:05:36.200 --> 0:05:38.640 I think Russia has always had a bit of a 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:42.120 contentious relationship with China, but I do think they're also 0:05:42.200 --> 0:05:46.640 wary of the US. Is their effort to kind of 0:05:46.720 --> 0:05:49.560 rally NATO and it's a good front China. I mean, 0:05:49.640 --> 0:05:52.920 I think they would they Russia is a place, Russia 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:55.279 is a government that wants to kind of disrupt the West, 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:58.040 and you know, maybe they view China as a useful 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:00.599 foil in that regard. So you know, Is made some 0:06:00.640 --> 0:06:03.000 comments leading up for this meeting that he views this 0:06:03.480 --> 0:06:06.400 US that effort to try to get topper on China warily, 0:06:06.760 --> 0:06:09.760 and so I mean that could be something that he 0:06:09.760 --> 0:06:11.520 could raise the Biden. Of course, you have four or 0:06:11.560 --> 0:06:13.200 five hours is a lot of time. They could cover 0:06:13.279 --> 0:06:15.800 a lot of ground. Hey, twenty seconds left here is 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:18.719 putting in touch with the former president Donald Trump. Do 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:22.000 we know anything? Yeah, we haven't heard that at all, 0:06:22.120 --> 0:06:26.000 but I mean, and nothing with Donald Trump with surprises though, 0:06:26.080 --> 0:06:29.719 but possibly all right, Well, listen, great preview of the 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:33.120 upcoming meeting. Really appreciate it. Jordan Fabian, Bloomberg News. White 0:06:33.120 --> 0:06:35.400 has correspondent on the phone from Washington, d C. What 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:37.719 I'm not expecting a soccer ball to be gifted this 0:06:37.800 --> 0:06:41.240 time around, like we saw in Helsinki, Carrol, I wonder 0:06:41.240 --> 0:06:43.920 if he'll have like a thermos of coffee, Joe Biden, 0:06:44.000 --> 0:06:48.159 just in case, at least a bathroom break ours. This 0:06:48.480 --> 0:06:52.240 is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:56.800 Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. So Tim, nice to 0:06:56.800 --> 0:06:58.960 know things can change. We got some evidence of that today. 0:06:59.080 --> 0:07:01.480 You mentioned earlier the EU in the US agreeing to 0:07:01.520 --> 0:07:04.160 a five year trade truths involving the big aircraft manufacturers 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:06.839 of the wealth. We're talking Bowing and Airbus, Brooks otherland 0:07:06.920 --> 0:07:09.880 Is deals in industrial columnists for Bloomberg Opinion. She joins 0:07:09.960 --> 0:07:11.920 us on the phone from New York City. Brook It's 0:07:11.920 --> 0:07:14.120 great to have you back on the show. Take us 0:07:14.120 --> 0:07:16.400 into the details here and and how big of a 0:07:16.400 --> 0:07:19.440 winness is not just for Boeing but for Airbus as well. 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:22.760 It's really a win for both companies. I mean this 0:07:22.800 --> 0:07:25.480 has been going on for quite some time. I mean 0:07:25.520 --> 0:07:28.120 nearly twenty years at this point, and you know, it 0:07:28.200 --> 0:07:30.800 really put sort of kidding to the point where the 0:07:30.880 --> 0:07:34.200 fight was not helping anybody. UM. And you know, the 0:07:34.200 --> 0:07:37.160 the EU had made the same argument that the US 0:07:37.240 --> 0:07:40.239 had made against Airbus, against Boeing. UM. You know, both 0:07:40.280 --> 0:07:43.840 companies relied on some sort of state support to get 0:07:43.880 --> 0:07:46.280 these uh some of their planes developed. I mean, these 0:07:46.280 --> 0:07:50.240 are very expensive programs, they're very complicated, they take a 0:07:50.760 --> 0:07:53.720 very long time, UM, and so you know, it wasn't 0:07:53.760 --> 0:07:57.280 really helping anybody to keep pointing fingers when when you 0:07:57.360 --> 0:08:00.160 were doing some of the same things yourself essentially UM. 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:02.280 And then especially you know, as you get into the pandemic, 0:08:02.720 --> 0:08:05.600 this stat really started to look like a pointless relic. 0:08:05.680 --> 0:08:08.120 I mean, you had government spending over backwards to really 0:08:08.160 --> 0:08:11.760 support both the airline and the aerospace manufacturing industry through 0:08:11.840 --> 0:08:14.200 the pandemic. And so you know, I just think that 0:08:14.240 --> 0:08:17.400 it's a good positive step forward for all involved. So, Broke, 0:08:17.440 --> 0:08:18.840 I want to kind of do a Blueberg cricket take 0:08:18.920 --> 0:08:22.560 with you. So the problem was there was this disagreement 0:08:22.680 --> 0:08:24.360 and this spat that went on, as you said, for 0:08:24.400 --> 0:08:28.240 twenty years, and it really was cumbersome in terms of 0:08:28.520 --> 0:08:32.040 the global aircraft market. I guess you could say, so, 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:34.559 what first of all, why was it put in place 0:08:34.600 --> 0:08:39.120 to begin with? Well, it's sort of evolved in different 0:08:39.400 --> 0:08:42.760 um phases, I suppose over the course of the twenty years. 0:08:42.800 --> 0:08:45.840 So sort of at the heart of the US complaint 0:08:45.880 --> 0:08:48.040 had to do with the Airbus A three fifty and 0:08:48.120 --> 0:08:51.960 the now shuttered program for the AH three A d UM. 0:08:52.000 --> 0:08:57.160 The US accused the EU of essentially giving Airbus significant 0:08:57.200 --> 0:08:59.760 subsidies that allowed it to develop a their crash and 0:08:59.800 --> 0:09:03.199 really sort of break Boeing lock on the market. Um. 0:09:03.240 --> 0:09:05.760 So there was some thinking that the US just couldn't 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:08.960 let this go because it just couldn't believe that it 0:09:09.040 --> 0:09:12.439 was no longer the only planemaker in the game. Um. 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:14.959 The you of course countered that the US has done 0:09:14.960 --> 0:09:17.880 it's part to support Boeing over the years. Uh, and 0:09:18.120 --> 0:09:20.160 you know that they didn't really feel like the US 0:09:20.200 --> 0:09:21.839 had a ground to stand on here, and and it 0:09:22.000 --> 0:09:25.320 just sort of became very political and very drawn out. Um. 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:27.880 And you know, when that is the nature of these things, 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:30.320 they take a very long time to solve. But um, 0:09:30.480 --> 0:09:32.840 you know, in the end, I think probably the lawyers 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:39.200 benefited the most from they always do. Um Brook China. 0:09:39.360 --> 0:09:42.440 Where does China come into this, because Airbus and Boeing 0:09:42.440 --> 0:09:44.840 have it do apperly when it comes to airplanes like this, 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:46.719 at least for right now. I don't never forget. A 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:48.400 few years ago, I was in Shanghai and I was 0:09:48.480 --> 0:09:51.440 driving to the airport in a taxi and I passed 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:54.800 what looked like an airplane manufacturing facility similar to what 0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:57.760 you see if you fly into Seattle and you you know, 0:09:57.840 --> 0:09:59.880 drive into the city and you passed what Bowing is doing, 0:10:00.559 --> 0:10:02.960 and I realized this was for for COMAC, the Commercial 0:10:02.960 --> 0:10:07.120 Aircraft Corporation of China, essentially China's version of Bowing an airbus. 0:10:07.280 --> 0:10:09.240 How does this play into the agreement that was struck? 0:10:10.400 --> 0:10:13.760 So China is uh. There has been very clear that 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:16.320 Komak is the priority, that they would like to have 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:20.240 a commercial aerospace competitor to Boeing an airbus. They are 0:10:20.320 --> 0:10:23.640 not there yet. Um there, there's not really a plane 0:10:23.720 --> 0:10:26.040 that can rival um you know the seven thirty seven 0:10:26.120 --> 0:10:28.120 Max or you know the E three twenty. Those are 0:10:28.160 --> 0:10:32.319 really the marquee jets for Boeing and Airbus, and China 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:35.480 can't do that yet. But they are clearly making this priority. 0:10:35.640 --> 0:10:40.600 They are investing a lot um. They clearly enjoyed being 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:42.920 able to be the first ones to ground the Bowing 0:10:42.960 --> 0:10:45.120 seven thirty seven Max. Because you know, one of the 0:10:45.200 --> 0:10:48.040 big questions about Comac is whether it will be a 0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:51.000 space is what Boeing and Airbus can offer UM, and 0:10:51.280 --> 0:10:54.839 you know whether China has the reputation for safety and 0:10:54.920 --> 0:10:58.160 quality control necessary to you know, sell airplanes to the West, 0:10:58.240 --> 0:10:59.880 and so for them to stake that stand to be 0:11:00.040 --> 0:11:02.319 the first one to do so, I think was sort 0:11:02.360 --> 0:11:06.679 of a pivotal moment in their aerospace journey, if you will, UM. 0:11:06.760 --> 0:11:08.640 But like I said, they don't have a plane just yet. 0:11:09.000 --> 0:11:11.000 I think what you're worried about was Bowing an airbus. 0:11:11.120 --> 0:11:14.920 Is not necessarily whether Komak will start flying or will 0:11:14.960 --> 0:11:17.800 be sold to to Delta UM. But you know whether 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:22.360 the Chinese airlines will predominantly choose Comac airplanes. And if 0:11:22.400 --> 0:11:26.000 you look at the future growth trajectory for planes, a 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:29.240 significant chunk of that future demand is coming from China, 0:11:29.679 --> 0:11:32.640 UH and from other parts of Southeast Asia. So you know, 0:11:32.840 --> 0:11:36.000 Comac doesn't really need to win over Europe in the US, 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:38.920 they need to be able to win over these these 0:11:39.000 --> 0:11:41.880 Chinese airlines. Um. And you know, especially if those airlines 0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:45.319 fly domestically, that that is an easy or hurdle to 0:11:45.480 --> 0:11:47.199 clear pay. Does it make sense that we're seeing a 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.360 little bit of a pop in bowing today it's up 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:51.679 about one percent airbus a d r s or just 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:55.600 up about half a percent. But does it give some clarity, 0:11:55.720 --> 0:11:58.240 some ease if you know you're an investor in Boeing 0:11:58.280 --> 0:12:01.520 shares to some extent. I think it's helpful. I mean 0:12:01.600 --> 0:12:05.120 we've been trending in this direction for a while now. 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:07.679 So in March, you know, the two sides agreed to 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:10.520 suspend the terrorists that were put in place as a 0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:14.520 result of this UH dispute over aircraft subsidies. Um. While 0:12:14.559 --> 0:12:16.520 they've worked to an agreement, and so it's definitely a 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:18.800 positive to get this cleared. I mean, the last thing 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:21.920 Boeing needs right now is another reason not to buy 0:12:21.960 --> 0:12:26.160 airplanes from it. So, um, you know, it's it's certainly helpful. 0:12:26.800 --> 0:12:30.000 What about when it comes to resolving lingering trade wars 0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:32.360 that the United States has with many different areas of 0:12:32.400 --> 0:12:34.920 the world, and we only about thirty seconds broke sure, 0:12:35.040 --> 0:12:37.120 I mean I think it's definitely a positive step, and 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:38.640 I think just the mere fact that we came to 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:40.520 some sort of an agreement, and it is certainly a 0:12:40.640 --> 0:12:43.440 change from the Trump administration, where you know, they actually 0:12:43.520 --> 0:12:46.880 were raising the stakes and it's going an airbus dispute, 0:12:46.920 --> 0:12:48.640 and so to be sort of I guess taking a 0:12:48.720 --> 0:12:51.439 setbacks from the battle line and and focusing on cooperation 0:12:51.520 --> 0:12:54.040 and coming to agreements, I think only has to be 0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:56.520 interpreted as a positive sign. Now the steel and the 0:12:56.600 --> 0:12:59.840 womenum terrorists issues a little bit stickier, but we'll see. 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:04.240 So why don't she's safe though, I hope for now. Okay, 0:13:04.880 --> 0:13:06.840 just getting priorities straight here, at least mine, I've been 0:13:06.840 --> 0:13:08.480 worried about stealing a luminium. I don't know where your 0:13:08.520 --> 0:13:11.760 head is, Tim Stanovic, good stuff, brook Thank you so much, 0:13:11.800 --> 0:13:14.360 Brooks Sutherland. She is deal with an industrial's columnist at 0:13:14.360 --> 0:13:16.439 Bloomberg Opinion on the phone in New York City. Check 0:13:16.440 --> 0:13:19.320 her out at b L s U T H on Twitter. 0:13:20.080 --> 0:13:23.640 You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and 0:13:23.800 --> 0:13:28.120 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Well, the 0:13:28.160 --> 0:13:30.560 cover story this week. It's also Today's Bloomberg big take 0:13:31.000 --> 0:13:33.160 the story though, in the upcoming issue of Bloomberg business 0:13:33.200 --> 0:13:37.679 Week magazine, Airbnb spending millions of dollars tim to make 0:13:37.760 --> 0:13:40.480 nightmares go away. Joining us now is Joel Webber, editor 0:13:40.480 --> 0:13:42.360 of Bloomberg Business Week. He's here with us in the 0:13:42.400 --> 0:13:46.640 Bloomberg Interactive Broker's studio. Also, Olivia Carville, technology reporter at 0:13:46.679 --> 0:13:48.920 Bloomberg News, joins us from here in our Bloomberg New 0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:52.040 York City bureau. Joel, as soon as I started reading 0:13:52.080 --> 0:13:55.040 this story early this morning, I could not put it down. 0:13:55.800 --> 0:13:59.600 What who is on the safety team and the sort 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:03.400 of first responders at Airbnb, and and what do they 0:14:03.480 --> 0:14:05.640 do when it comes to crisis management. I believe it's 0:14:05.640 --> 0:14:09.600 called the black box. So Olivia's story uh brought many 0:14:09.640 --> 0:14:13.800 things to light, um, one being that the real bedrock 0:14:13.960 --> 0:14:18.760 of Airbnb's business model is trust. You check into someone 0:14:18.840 --> 0:14:25.360 else's apartment sometimes or house, sometimes that person maybe occupying 0:14:25.560 --> 0:14:28.680 that same space or in a different room. Um. And 0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:31.320 the whole thing that makes the business work is is 0:14:31.400 --> 0:14:35.359 that you have trusted in this system. And what Olivia's 0:14:35.400 --> 0:14:41.040 reporting revealed was that oftentimes stays don't go well, and 0:14:41.360 --> 0:14:45.120 that could be uh more run of the mill things 0:14:45.240 --> 0:14:47.920 of like just a trash department, or it could go very, 0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:52.040 very very bad. And there have been cases a rape 0:14:52.120 --> 0:14:56.560 that was previously unreported that Olivia found out about, murders, 0:14:57.520 --> 0:15:01.400 violent crimes, and when that happens. There's a safety team 0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:06.520 that Airbnb has assembled around the world, um one hundred 0:15:06.560 --> 0:15:10.080 agents that basically the worst of the worst situations end 0:15:10.200 --> 0:15:15.840 up going to that group of people. And Olivia basically 0:15:16.000 --> 0:15:19.480 was the one that has revealed that this team exists, 0:15:19.560 --> 0:15:23.120 that they're under mental dress for all the different types 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:25.960 of cases that they have to deal with, and that 0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:28.640 you know, this is the thing that for investors this 0:15:28.760 --> 0:15:32.200 company is now publicly traded, people haven't known that this 0:15:32.480 --> 0:15:35.440 is a dark side of this company in quite this way. 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:38.520 UM So, so, Olivia, how about you bring us up 0:15:38.560 --> 0:15:41.360 to speed on on you know, how how you went 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:44.960 about reporting such a remarkable story. It's sure, thanks so 0:15:45.080 --> 0:15:48.960 much for having me on. I feel like the story 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:51.720 really the crux of it was to understand, you know, 0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:54.760 to get inside the safety team and to really get 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:57.640 to the bottom of what happens inside to a B 0:15:57.800 --> 0:16:01.400 n B when things go wrong. Initially, when I started 0:16:01.440 --> 0:16:04.760 reporting this piece, it was about trying to find insiders 0:16:04.840 --> 0:16:06.560 at the company who would be willing to talk to 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:09.240 me about the stress of the job and just the 0:16:09.560 --> 0:16:13.440 process of when something happens inside a listing, like a 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:16.560 violent crime, and a call comes through to the Airbnb 0:16:16.760 --> 0:16:20.200 customer service rep, what actually happens, how does the company 0:16:20.280 --> 0:16:23.120 handle it, who does it get transferred through to, and 0:16:23.360 --> 0:16:26.920 what do they do about handling? You know, public image, 0:16:27.040 --> 0:16:31.800 reputational risk, brand risk. Given that Airbnb's entire business model 0:16:31.960 --> 0:16:36.040 really risks on that idea of trust between strangers to them, 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:43.280 public image is just so crucially important too gross and revenue. So, Olivia, 0:16:43.360 --> 0:16:46.000 how does it work when things go wrong? And often 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:50.840 issuell mentioned horribly wrong? Right, Well, it's it's a call 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:55.360 is to come through to Airbnb related to anything concerning safety. 0:16:55.560 --> 0:16:59.080 So when I say that, I mean anything involving a child, 0:17:00.000 --> 0:17:06.679 ass of, human trafficking, drug trafficking, kidnappings, hostage scenarios, sexual assaults, 0:17:06.960 --> 0:17:10.879 rape cases, murder, anything that enters that kind of like 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:16.359 significance of a real safety crisis. It will immediately be 0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:19.920 transferred through to an internal safety team of agents. And 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:23.119 as Joel mentioned, the BnB has about a hundred of 0:17:23.200 --> 0:17:26.840 these agents based all around the world who are trained 0:17:26.960 --> 0:17:31.959 in trauma. You know, they specify and specialize in how 0:17:32.040 --> 0:17:34.720 to handle cases of trauma. Be a taught how to 0:17:34.840 --> 0:17:38.840 deal with suicidal ideation. Be are taught to know how 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:41.880 to how to help talk with a sexual assault survivor 0:17:41.960 --> 0:17:44.040 and the best way to support her in that moment. 0:17:44.800 --> 0:17:49.000 And UM, for these safety agents, it's all about doing 0:17:49.119 --> 0:17:52.480 what they can to protect the individual in crisis, and 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:55.080 also they do have a dual role to protect the 0:17:55.160 --> 0:17:58.760 company's public image. At the same time, Joel referred to 0:17:59.280 --> 0:18:04.399 the arrest that these safety agents experience. What is the 0:18:04.440 --> 0:18:06.320 toll it takes on them and how do they deal 0:18:06.400 --> 0:18:09.200 with it. A lot of the safety agents I talked 0:18:09.240 --> 0:18:14.200 to UM expressed vicarious trauma. They say that they suffer 0:18:14.280 --> 0:18:17.560 from PTSD from the job. I mean they willingly walk 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:20.240 into it. They want to do this kind of trauma work, 0:18:20.359 --> 0:18:22.600 and I think it takes a certain person who's attracted 0:18:22.680 --> 0:18:25.800 to this particular role. A lot of them comes from 0:18:26.160 --> 0:18:30.000 backgrounds of emergency services work or even from the military. 0:18:30.600 --> 0:18:32.480 They've you know, as I see, had gone through a 0:18:32.520 --> 0:18:35.760 lot of trauma based care training. They have counselors on 0:18:35.920 --> 0:18:39.160 site to help this team. They have specialized call down 0:18:39.280 --> 0:18:42.520 rooms with dimmed lighting to help them answer those really 0:18:42.600 --> 0:18:46.119 tough calls. And for these agents, you know, when you 0:18:46.240 --> 0:18:51.240 handle a case of an individual who has been assaulted, raped, 0:18:51.280 --> 0:18:54.040 who has lost a loved one, maybe lost a child 0:18:54.240 --> 0:18:57.160 in a listing, you form a bond with the individual 0:18:57.320 --> 0:18:59.840 over the phone, and a lot of these safety agents 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:03.000 walked about cases where they're still in touch with those 0:19:03.080 --> 0:19:06.560 families years after the crime has happened. You know, it 0:19:06.640 --> 0:19:10.040 stays with them. One safety agent I talked to handled 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:12.920 a case of a missing person who just disappeared from 0:19:12.920 --> 0:19:16.440 a listing, and three years after that occurred, he was 0:19:16.520 --> 0:19:19.480 still googling that individual's name to see if there was, 0:19:19.840 --> 0:19:23.520 you know, if they were either found. So you can 0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:26.520 you can feel when you're talking to these individuals just 0:19:26.680 --> 0:19:30.000 a heavy personal toll it has on them, and you 0:19:30.040 --> 0:19:32.680 know how much they they care for the people that 0:19:32.800 --> 0:19:35.320 they're trying to help, but also how they were so 0:19:35.560 --> 0:19:39.560 torn when it came to their role in trying to 0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:42.239 keep these cases quiet or trying to do what they 0:19:42.280 --> 0:19:44.920 could to protect the company's public image at the same time. 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:48.639 They really had to wrestle with that difficulty. And you know, 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:52.920 the opening of The story is rooted in New York 0:19:53.040 --> 0:20:00.200 City in near Times Square on New Year's Eve, and 0:20:00.640 --> 0:20:04.360 there's a case that Olivia found in her reporting um 0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:09.120 that the company Airbnb, following this um uh, this rape, 0:20:09.640 --> 0:20:14.040 the survivor was paid seven million dollars um, which was 0:20:14.400 --> 0:20:17.000 you know, a huge number when you think about it, right, 0:20:17.119 --> 0:20:20.480 like a clearly very bad thing, but a huge number. Olivia. 0:20:20.720 --> 0:20:24.520 There's also a policy element to this because that case 0:20:24.680 --> 0:20:29.159 basically happened at almost the worst possible time for Airbnb, 0:20:29.320 --> 0:20:31.399 because of its battle with New York City. Can you 0:20:31.480 --> 0:20:34.960 talk about why New York has always been so important 0:20:35.240 --> 0:20:38.800 for Airbnb and why that case was so significant and 0:20:38.880 --> 0:20:40.439 forgive me, Olivia, you have to be quick. Just got 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:43.520 about twenty seconds here, sure, I mean New York is 0:20:43.560 --> 0:20:47.480 one of airbnba's biggest market. The regulatory recipe was huge 0:20:47.600 --> 0:20:49.760 because it could lead to a Domino feat for the 0:20:49.840 --> 0:20:52.760 company needed to do what it could could to try 0:20:52.840 --> 0:20:55.320 and keep this case. Um, you know, to try and 0:20:55.400 --> 0:20:57.119 do what they could to handle this case is as 0:20:57.160 --> 0:21:00.800 well as they possibly could, knowing the potential regulatory rest 0:21:00.840 --> 0:21:04.760 of the incredible story. It's out on Twitter, it's at 0:21:04.760 --> 0:21:07.440 Bloomberg dot com and it's in the magazine the upcoming issue. 0:21:07.800 --> 0:21:10.320 Olivia Carvil who wrote it. Joe Webber, the editor of 0:21:10.359 --> 0:21:18.040 the magazine. Thank you. This is Bloomberg Business Week with 0:21:18.240 --> 0:21:22.880 Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovik on Bloomberg Radio. 0:21:24.000 --> 0:21:26.920 So TikTok everyone, the policy setting arm of the US 0:21:26.960 --> 0:21:29.040 Federal Reserve. We're talking about the FMC. They're kicking off 0:21:29.040 --> 0:21:33.119 their two day meeting today. We are expected some changes. 0:21:33.440 --> 0:21:38.879 We are I'm we don't ye projections, but you know 0:21:38.960 --> 0:21:41.600 we're still waiting on headlines for tomorrow exactly. So let's 0:21:41.600 --> 0:21:44.920 see what Steven Skanky is expecting, his chief economic advisor 0:21:44.960 --> 0:21:46.840 at kill Point, former U S Treasury and White House 0:21:46.920 --> 0:21:50.480 National Security Council staff member based in Washington, D C. 0:21:50.760 --> 0:21:52.640 And that's exactly where we find him on this Tuesday. 0:21:52.680 --> 0:21:55.760 How are you. I'm great. Thanks, it's always going to 0:21:55.840 --> 0:21:58.080 be back to you. Well, it's great to have you here, Steve. 0:21:58.200 --> 0:22:01.920 So what are you expecting? We are, at least to 0:22:02.000 --> 0:22:05.360 our economics team and others are forecasting that that dot 0:22:05.440 --> 0:22:08.200