1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:04,560 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from house Stuff Works 2 00:00:04,600 --> 00:00:13,400 Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 3 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: There's Charles W Chuck Bryant, Jerry's over there, and there's 4 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: this stuff you should know. That's right. How all of 5 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: our wives and girlfriends are in the next room. Right, 6 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: How are you doing? Man? I'm good. I found this 7 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 1: topic to be super interesting. And um, I should say 8 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:34,240 Speaker 1: up front that our our joky nous that we always 9 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: include in every podcast almost um is not meant to 10 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 1: be disrespectful to anyone who is in a polyamorous relationship. Yeah, 11 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: and we're not here to like just kind of look 12 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 1: at your relationship from the outside and poke at it 13 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: and make fun of it or light of it. If 14 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 1: you're enjoying yourself and everybody's on board and no one's 15 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:58,800 Speaker 1: being hurt, then we always say to each his own, 16 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 1: that's right. But from the outside, uh, polyamory might seem 17 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:07,479 Speaker 1: like a very strange arrangement. Well, I think to most 18 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 1: people it seems like swinging, that's right. But it's not. No, 19 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:14,200 Speaker 1: it is not a lot of things. It's not cheating, right, 20 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 1: it's not swinging, right, it's not um, it's not polygamy. 21 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 1: It's not what was the other one. Well, it's not 22 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:28,319 Speaker 1: a lot of things. Um, it's not dentistry, right, Well, 23 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:32,319 Speaker 1: the point is that we should it's not promiscuous nous. 24 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:37,400 Speaker 1: So what it is actually from? And I had no idea. 25 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:40,039 Speaker 1: I think my conception of polyamory was that it was 26 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 1: basically kind of swinging and it was based on it 27 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 1: was I got the the root couple thing, but um 28 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 1: that it was mostly like a swinging kind of thing. 29 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 1: But from research, like I realized I was pretty far off. 30 00:01:55,680 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: Polyamory is in a very odd way of for of monogamy, 31 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:05,200 Speaker 1: but that it includes more than two people in this 32 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: monogamous relationship. Well not necessarily monogamous either though, so because 33 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 1: there can be arrangements where you're allowed to go out 34 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: and do what you want, kick ends with people. So 35 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:20,639 Speaker 1: I ran across something that that's technically considered monogamish, as 36 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: Dan Savage coined it. That sounds like a very new word, yeah, 37 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: I mean Dan Savage coined it. Yeah, But which means 38 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 1: that I'm probably not gonna put too much greens. But 39 00:02:30,600 --> 00:02:32,520 Speaker 1: in the from what I understand and this I got 40 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:38,519 Speaker 1: this from a polyamory site called um more than two 41 00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: more than two Franklin vow is how I'm pronouncing his 42 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 1: last name, vow. Yeah. And I'm not kidding when I 43 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 1: say it's a great side if you are interested in 44 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:52,640 Speaker 1: exploring polyamory. It's super thorough and very very helpful. I 45 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: would think, yeah, just by going through it. And the 46 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 1: impression that I got from him from his f a 47 00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 1: Q at least is that it is a It's like 48 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 1: the people in a polyamorous relationship are committed to one another, 49 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 1: and that like they're rather in the same way that 50 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:12,959 Speaker 1: two people a couple come together to form a monogamous relationship. 51 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:16,959 Speaker 1: If you if you take that bubble and add another 52 00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: person or two other people or something like that, but 53 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:25,000 Speaker 1: there's still that bubble of monogamy, of commitment, of affection um, 54 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:30,519 Speaker 1: that that is more close to the the the definition 55 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:34,240 Speaker 1: of polyamory. Now in real life, I'm sure it's different, um, 56 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:36,880 Speaker 1: and that there are different aspects to it or whatever. 57 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 1: But supposedly that's what I gathered. But I think, uh, 58 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 1: polyamorous couples say, why would you even use a word 59 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 1: like monogamy when it means means more than one committed? 60 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 1: Is the word I should. Yeah, I think that's that's 61 00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: the trip. And so Dan Savage come on monogamous. Yeah, yeah, Um, 62 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,360 Speaker 1: I knew more about this um just because there was 63 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: a show I don't know if it was HBO, it's 64 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 1: probably Cinemax that UM followed some polyamorous relationships, and so 65 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:17,359 Speaker 1: I knew that it was not just hey it's swinging, 66 00:04:17,520 --> 00:04:20,599 Speaker 1: or hey I just want an open relationship. It's you know, 67 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 1: I'm gonna tryad I've got a man and there's a 68 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 1: woman and there's another woman, or in another case, it 69 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:30,520 Speaker 1: was two couples all lived together, they were all in 70 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:34,760 Speaker 1: a committed relationship with one another. UM. I mean we'll 71 00:04:34,760 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 1: talk about there is no standard for a polyamorous relationship. 72 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 1: It can really be anything you want that works for you. 73 00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 1: Sometimes it's bisexual, sometimes it's not. Sometimes um the two 74 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: it's really I mean, we could go over a million scenarios. Really, 75 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:55,120 Speaker 1: I was starting to break him all down, but it's 76 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 1: like you really is whatever you can work out between 77 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 1: yourselves is polyann But the point is is ummm, to 78 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: maybe put it on less fine of a point, but 79 00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 1: to get a little closer potentially to a correct definition. 80 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: Polyamory is not monogamy because there's more than two people, right, 81 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: and it's not cheating because all of the people involved 82 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: are on the on the same page about what they're doing, 83 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:24,400 Speaker 1: what what they're doing, what their partners are doing, what 84 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 1: everybody's doing. Everyone's aware and consenting, that's right. So it's 85 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:30,839 Speaker 1: between those two things. So this is the opposite of 86 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:34,480 Speaker 1: the E s P podcast, where apparently we never even 87 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 1: said what ESP stood for. Yeah, a couple of people like, 88 00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 1: we're like, hey, I didn't catch a ESP stands for? 89 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:44,040 Speaker 1: Can you tell us? And I'm like, well, go listen again, 90 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:47,159 Speaker 1: and enough people said it that I was like, oh, 91 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 1: extrasensory perception, by the way, And then we have just 92 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 1: now defined polyamory for the last ten minutes, so I 93 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 1: think we're covered. I think we finally landed on it. Though. Uh, yeah, 94 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:04,520 Speaker 1: it's a very fascinating thing, and um, here's how it works. Well, Uh, 95 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 1: I think that the let's talk about why people are polyamorous, right, 96 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:12,840 Speaker 1: So people who are polyamorous probably tend to think that 97 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:17,680 Speaker 1: monogamy is not for them. And if you're speaking from 98 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:23,599 Speaker 1: a um like a evolutionary perspective, monogamy is kind of 99 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:28,160 Speaker 1: a puzzlement should we talk about that. Yeah, so monogamy 100 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 1: looking through the lens of natural selection, doesn't make sense 101 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:37,800 Speaker 1: evolutionarily because it lowers a male's ability to um, It 102 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,600 Speaker 1: lowers his number of opportunities to carry on his genetic 103 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 1: line and there for the species, right exactly. Yeah, and 104 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,920 Speaker 1: it was long thought by some that UM it was 105 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 1: monogamy came about so males could assist in the raising 106 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:57,600 Speaker 1: of the young UM. But there are some new theories 107 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 1: now that UM make that seem a little less likely 108 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: are actually a lot less likely. UM. And ironically, well 109 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:09,000 Speaker 1: not ironically but coincidentally they were both published. They were 110 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:13,440 Speaker 1: both published around the same time, these two new theories, 111 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: they came out and at the and enough time to 112 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:19,880 Speaker 1: really kind of compete with one another. Yeah, because you know, 113 00:07:19,880 --> 00:07:23,600 Speaker 1: when you look around the the animal kingdom, among non 114 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 1: avian there are more birds that are supposedly cockroaches that 115 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 1: are monogamous. But if you if you rule out the 116 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 1: birds and the cockroaches, well specifically mammals too. Yeah, about 117 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 1: five percent of the four thousand mammal species give or 118 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:43,280 Speaker 1: take UM, only about five percent are monogamous or mate 119 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 1: for life. And so again, if you are strictly looking 120 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 1: at it from the selfish gene theory, like the whole 121 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: point would be to run around and copulate with as 122 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: many females as you possibly can so that you can 123 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 1: have more and more chances of spreading your genetic line 124 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 1: and then, like you said, hence carry on the species. 125 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,520 Speaker 1: So did not do that to just couple with one 126 00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 1: other person and and have maybe a few kids rather 127 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 1: than thirty with a bunch of different males and females. 128 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 1: Right again, it doesn't really kind of make sense. So 129 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 1: they've tried to explain this, and there are some theories, 130 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: like you were saying, one of them is that, um, 131 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:28,680 Speaker 1: if you are a rival male, one of the things 132 00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:33,680 Speaker 1: you have to do to get with another female. I 133 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:36,440 Speaker 1: think that's what biologists call it getting with um you 134 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:39,839 Speaker 1: have to kill her offspring, because while she's nursing, she 135 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 1: can't ovulate, and therefore you can't reproduce with her. But 136 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 1: kill her kids. She's gonna stop nursing, she'll be sad, 137 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 1: But then you guys can have your own offspring. If 138 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:56,880 Speaker 1: you are a male that's staying behind after you reproduce 139 00:08:56,960 --> 00:08:59,960 Speaker 1: with a female, then you have the chance to defend 140 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 1: your offspring from being killed by arrival males. Explanation from 141 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 1: monogamy yep, and that was in the proceedings of the 142 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 1: National Academy of Sciences and um. They found that out 143 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:14,640 Speaker 1: by studying behaviors of two d and thirty primate species. Uh. 144 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,560 Speaker 1: And they felt so good about it that the guy 145 00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 1: who ran the study said, this is it. We now 146 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: finally know for sure. But that's not necessarily true because 147 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:30,000 Speaker 1: there's another really great theory where they actually published in 148 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: the journal Science and Studied Mammals, which is way more 149 00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 1: than the other study. H. D. H. Lucas and Tim 150 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:44,320 Speaker 1: Klutenbrock of Cambridge University, and they said, Uh, it's really 151 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:51,520 Speaker 1: about low density and females. It's that simple. Like when 152 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,800 Speaker 1: there aren't many females, that's where monogamy happens, right when 153 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 1: they're spread out, because they beat up on each other 154 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: when they're in the same place female. Um, so they 155 00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: have to spread out geographically. Well, if you're a guy 156 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:07,200 Speaker 1: who's just running from female the female, the female, you 157 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 1: don't know what she's doing while you're not around, so 158 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:12,480 Speaker 1: you don't know whether those kids are yours or not. 159 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 1: So the best way to make sure that they're your kids, 160 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 1: is to hang around and be monogamous. So it's it's 161 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 1: really similar to the other theory, the you're staying around 162 00:10:25,920 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: to defend the kids, and this one it's a little 163 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:31,960 Speaker 1: less magnanimous. You're staying around to make sure that the 164 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: female doesn't run around on you. Right. But then I 165 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: saw a third theory that also makes sense to um, 166 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: and that is that the idea of males staying around 167 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 1: to help raise kids was a strategy developed by lesser 168 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 1: males in the primate kingdom. So like the alpha male, 169 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 1: the top guys, they're having no trouble, they can go 170 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:58,520 Speaker 1: wherever they want. They're getting plenty of action. Right, Hey, 171 00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 1: I can care for the kids exactly. And that that's 172 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:04,840 Speaker 1: a strategy that caught the attention of females who otherwise 173 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: wouldn't have made it with these guys because they're less 174 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 1: nestment and uh instead said, yeah, he's a dork, I 175 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: can't stand his bowtie in a short sleeve shirt, but 176 00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 1: he does do a pretty good job with the kids, 177 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 1: So I'm going to be monogamous with this guy. So 178 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:24,719 Speaker 1: three pretty good theories to explain monogamy. None of them 179 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: hold water for polyamorous. No, and and everyone under the 180 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:31,680 Speaker 1: age of thirty five is now looking up. Who less 181 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: nestment is it was? That was a great reference, man. Thanks, 182 00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:40,440 Speaker 1: it just popped up. Um alright. So the benefits, I believe, 183 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 1: is what we were talking about before we delved into 184 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:45,560 Speaker 1: the theory. And I've always said monogamy too, is not 185 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 1: a natural thing, and that the reward of saying with 186 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 1: one person is partly because of that. You know, you 187 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,679 Speaker 1: it's not a natural thing. You sacrifice something in some 188 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:58,560 Speaker 1: way by being with someone, but the payoff is rich. 189 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 1: That is eyes words, Chuck. So we'll see if I 190 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: end up married in twenty years, I'll confirm all this. 191 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,480 Speaker 1: Just kidding, of course, I will be UM. All right, 192 00:12:09,520 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: So let's talk about the benefits. It is not just 193 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:17,200 Speaker 1: about UM having sex with more than one person. Now, 194 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:19,680 Speaker 1: that's definitely part of it. It is part of it, Um, 195 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:25,120 Speaker 1: But it is also about UM support in a greater 196 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: you know, it takes a village, they say, So if 197 00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:30,199 Speaker 1: you have a larger village, then you're gonna have more 198 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:34,480 Speaker 1: support and care and love and emotional support. UM. All 199 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 1: that stuff right, exactly. And it's not polyamorous relationship or 200 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 1: group doesn't necessarily have sex with one another everybody. Um. 201 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: Sex is a big component of it, but you also 202 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 1: have what are called polly effective relationships where like, let's 203 00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:56,560 Speaker 1: say you have what you call it a tryad. Is 204 00:12:56,559 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 1: that a polly um is three people? Yeah, but that's 205 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 1: what polyamorous call it. UM. So let's say you have 206 00:13:03,240 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: a triad where neither of the of two women and 207 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:10,080 Speaker 1: a guy, and neither of the women are bisexual, but 208 00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: they're still in a polyamorous relationship. They would be poly effective, 209 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: like they have an emotional connection to one another like 210 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 1: a couple would, but they're not sexually involved with one another. 211 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:26,000 Speaker 1: They're poly effective. That's another component of a polyamorous relationship. 212 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:29,319 Speaker 1: So the whole thing is not just satisfying your every 213 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:33,320 Speaker 1: sexual need with a bunch of different people. UM. It's 214 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: also that I think they believe that you have a 215 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 1: lot of different needs that one person can't necessarily satisfy 216 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:45,320 Speaker 1: beyond sex as well. It could be cultural interests, it 217 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: can be past times, it can be what have you. 218 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 1: And so the idea behind polyamory is you find those 219 00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:55,800 Speaker 1: people in your life who combined make that single ideal 220 00:13:55,880 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: person rather than placing all that on one single person 221 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 1: for better for worse. Yeah, I looked at an example 222 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 1: on the what was it two for one, no two 223 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:12,880 Speaker 1: or more more than more than two more more more 224 00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:14,920 Speaker 1: than two dot com? I looked at one. They had 225 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: a lot of just stories and examples of people, like 226 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 1: real stories. And this one lady UM was married to 227 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:25,120 Speaker 1: a guy who quite simply was not into a lot 228 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 1: of the things she was into. Um, she was big 229 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 1: into the theater, I think in museums. Her husband didn't 230 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 1: like that. Uh. They developed into a polyamorous relationship, and 231 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 1: she had another man that was really into that stuff, 232 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: an old high school boyfriend I think, and he uh 233 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:44,440 Speaker 1: took up with another woman who had similar interests as him, 234 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: and they all worked it out. And you know, people say, well, 235 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 1: why don't you just leave the husband then, who you 236 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: don't have these things in common with, and go with 237 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:52,880 Speaker 1: the old high school boyfriend. That's a neat story. She 238 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: was like, well, because he's really needy and my husband 239 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:58,840 Speaker 1: isn't and we have a lot of great stuff. Uh 240 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 1: So it is literally, like you said, satisfying all my 241 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 1: needs through multiple people, because who can expect one person 242 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:09,480 Speaker 1: to be that soul mate that gives you everything you need, 243 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 1: and these suckers who are in monogamous marriages are just uh, 244 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 1: sacrificing certain parts of their life, like going to museums 245 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:19,880 Speaker 1: or whatever. If it was this lady. So everybody, we're 246 00:15:19,920 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 1: about to satisfy all of your needs with this commercial break. 247 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:50,760 Speaker 1: He now all right and we're back. So chuck um. 248 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 1: We were talking about why people do polyamory, Right, do polyamory. 249 00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:02,280 Speaker 1: Let's talk about how polyamory actually works. Yeah, I mean, 250 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:06,800 Speaker 1: anyone in a marriage that's you know, things get more 251 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 1: complicated as you get older. So I don't mean to 252 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 1: talk down to people in the twenties, but relationships get 253 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 1: a little more complicated as you get older and you 254 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,400 Speaker 1: get more responsibilities. So if you're married and you're in 255 00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 1: your thirties or forties or fifties, you know it is 256 00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:23,040 Speaker 1: or any kind of committed relationship, you know, it's logistically 257 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: tough sometimes well yeah, because you're like I want this, 258 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 1: and this other person who you share half of your 259 00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:31,400 Speaker 1: estate with says no, I want this, or I want 260 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:32,840 Speaker 1: to do this, or I want to do that, or 261 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: I want a vacation here there exactly, just in keeping 262 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: up with schedules. It's all very complicated. It's all compromise. 263 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 1: There's one big, complicent compromise, and you're compromising between two 264 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,800 Speaker 1: people's opinions. Imagine just throwing in one extra opinion that 265 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 1: differs from the other two equal weight exactly. So that's 266 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:56,120 Speaker 1: basically what we're getting at is, if you think your 267 00:16:56,120 --> 00:17:00,120 Speaker 1: marriage is complicated, polyamory can be even more complicated it 268 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,160 Speaker 1: And they admit that it can be more complicated, but 269 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 1: they say that, Uh. And this is really what I 270 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: gathered from reading that site in a bunch of articles, 271 00:17:08,720 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 1: is that one to one you want to meet a 272 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 1: great communicator, go talk to someone in a polyamorous relationship. Yeah. 273 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: So that's one of the chief requirements of polyamory, be 274 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 1: able to talk about all this stuff I've seen it 275 00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 1: put as you have highly evolved communication skills. I would 276 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:34,200 Speaker 1: not a good polyamora man like I wouldn't last two days. 277 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 1: You know, I stink. I stink at communicating. I think 278 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 1: I'm just doing fine, and it turns out, oh wait, 279 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:43,280 Speaker 1: I didn't say that, Chuck. Is this bothering? You know? 280 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:46,840 Speaker 1: But it's really bothering. Well that's another thing too. Not 281 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:48,959 Speaker 1: only do you have to be a great communicator and 282 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:51,639 Speaker 1: get your point across and read other people and listen 283 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:53,600 Speaker 1: in that kind of thing. But you also have to 284 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: be honest about your feelings. One of the things that 285 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:01,960 Speaker 1: polyamorous face, just like anybody else's jealousy. We did a 286 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:07,439 Speaker 1: pretty good episode on jealousy a while back, Jealousy with 287 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 1: a question mark um, and so they deal with jealousy 288 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:15,960 Speaker 1: and and and they deal with it apparently ideally. Again 289 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,720 Speaker 1: this is from more than two dot com in a 290 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:23,360 Speaker 1: way where it would take a pretty intelligent, calm person 291 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:27,199 Speaker 1: to approach the feelings of jealousy like this, which is 292 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 1: basically deconstructing it. So the guy at more than two 293 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 1: dot com I kind of gave a good example where 294 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:39,200 Speaker 1: he was saying, um, you're in a polyamorous relationship and 295 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:44,520 Speaker 1: it bugs you when your spouse kisses. There are other 296 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 1: spouse in front of you, right, And he says the 297 00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 1: correct thing to do basically here is to stop and say, Okay, 298 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,600 Speaker 1: why does that make me jealous? And if you are 299 00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 1: honest with yourself, you'll say, well, it makes me jealous 300 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:01,240 Speaker 1: because I worried that the your spouse. And by the way, 301 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:05,920 Speaker 1: in a polyamorous relationship, the plural of spouse is spice. Yes, 302 00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:10,840 Speaker 1: so if you're married to two people, you have two spice. Um, 303 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:13,000 Speaker 1: which is kind of funny. Sure you got spicy. I 304 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 1: love life anyway. When the other spouse, if if you're 305 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:18,920 Speaker 1: worried that your spouse is kissing his other spouse, he's 306 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 1: going to think that that spouse is a better kisser 307 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: than you and think, well, that spouses, if he's better 308 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:28,640 Speaker 1: kisser then you he wants to be with him more 309 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:30,360 Speaker 1: than me. And if he wants to be with him 310 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:35,280 Speaker 1: more than me, then uh, he's gonna leave me. Is 311 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: often rooted in your own insecurities. So what this guy 312 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:40,560 Speaker 1: was saying is if you spell us out, you realize 313 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,159 Speaker 1: that there's a lot of hidden assumptions and your jealous feelings, 314 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:47,120 Speaker 1: and that when you confront them, you will probably discard 315 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:49,440 Speaker 1: a lot of them. If you find that, no, this 316 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 1: is correct, this person really would leave me because that 317 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:56,040 Speaker 1: person is a better kisser. Um, then you would ask yourself, 318 00:19:56,160 --> 00:19:57,800 Speaker 1: do I want to be with somebody who would leave 319 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 1: me because somebody else is a better kisser? Yeah? Um. 320 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,479 Speaker 1: So if you can approach this kind of stuff in 321 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:08,639 Speaker 1: this manner, that maybe you'd be a decent polyamorous. Yeah, 322 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 1: there's a lady named Terry Connelly, a professor of psychology 323 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: and women's Studies at University of Michigan. Uh go Wolverines, 324 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:18,879 Speaker 1: and she's she's one of the well, not one of 325 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:22,440 Speaker 1: the only people. But there haven't been many studies on polyamory. Um. 326 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:25,679 Speaker 1: One reason is because it's underreported in a lot of 327 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:28,679 Speaker 1: cases because people some people may not like to be 328 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,919 Speaker 1: uh really out front with it for reasons. Yeah, for 329 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: very good reasons. But she did some studies and polls 330 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:38,160 Speaker 1: and things, and she found that jealousy is, in fact, 331 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:42,359 Speaker 1: she said, quote much higher end quote among monogamous pairs 332 00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:45,439 Speaker 1: than non monogamous ones. And I think for the reasons 333 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:48,440 Speaker 1: you just said, um, she also found um. She interviewed 334 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:53,520 Speaker 1: seventeen hundred individuals Polly, I'm sorry, monogamous individuals, hundred and 335 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: fifty swingers, hundred and seventy people in an open relationship, 336 00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:01,680 Speaker 1: and three hundred polyamorous individuals and said that polyamorous tended 337 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:06,200 Speaker 1: to have equal or higher levels of sexual satisfaction. Uh 338 00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 1: and people in open relationships tended to have lower sexual 339 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:13,280 Speaker 1: satisfaction than their monogamous piers and polyamorous peers so, and 340 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:16,679 Speaker 1: we should say open is not the same as polyamorous. Again, 341 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: in a polyamorous group, the people in the group form 342 00:21:20,359 --> 00:21:25,160 Speaker 1: a closed hole. In an open relationship, it's like there's 343 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 1: two people who are connected, but they're also facing outward 344 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,159 Speaker 1: and the whole world up for grabs, basically right, in 345 00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: an open relationship, you know, it's not so in polyamorous 346 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: is not an open relationship, and open relationship is not polyamorous. 347 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:46,240 Speaker 1: But a polyamorous relationship could include swinging, from what I understand, Yes, 348 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:51,800 Speaker 1: and did you know that swinging apparently started among World 349 00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:56,160 Speaker 1: War two Air Force pilots. You knew that, yeah, because 350 00:21:56,200 --> 00:22:01,040 Speaker 1: you supposedly if your husband died in battle, it was 351 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:03,160 Speaker 1: just sort of understood that that woman would then take 352 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 1: up with another serviceman. Correct, I guess, but with another 353 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:10,720 Speaker 1: married serviceman or what? I don't know about that. Well, 354 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 1: apparently it started out with like we called it, wife 355 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:16,199 Speaker 1: swapping in World War two in the Air Force, like 356 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: specifically the Air Force, not like oh, American servicemen, like 357 00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:23,440 Speaker 1: the Air Force. So I guess they know who it was. Um. 358 00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 1: I think I told the story about the Atlantis Swingers 359 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,239 Speaker 1: Club was very close to my phone number growing up, 360 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:30,960 Speaker 1: and we used to I was a kid. I had 361 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:32,439 Speaker 1: no idea what it meant, of course, and I used 362 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:34,119 Speaker 1: to answer the phone and people would be like just 363 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 1: the Atlanti singers, they'd just be like my mom would 364 00:22:38,359 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 1: just remember it was so like troublesome to her, and 365 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,359 Speaker 1: how she kept the whistle next to the phone and 366 00:22:43,400 --> 00:22:47,159 Speaker 1: would blow a whistle into it. It's so funny to 367 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 1: think about, man, very funny. I still remember that number two. 368 00:22:54,320 --> 00:23:00,639 Speaker 1: Do you remember your original phone number? Nine? Isn't that crazy? UM, 369 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: I'm sorry for anyone who has those numbers today, or 370 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 1: to the Atlantic Swingers Club, which is still operational, I'm sure. UM. 371 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:11,200 Speaker 1: All right, Another thing we need to talk about are 372 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 1: s t I s UM sexually transmitted infection. You would 373 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 1: think that UM, it would be higher in a polyamorous relationship, 374 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 1: and they don't have statistics that may or may not 375 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: be the case. But what they are adamant about is 376 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:32,119 Speaker 1: lots of testing and lots of access to those results 377 00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 1: and being super open about those results. UM apparently much 378 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:41,160 Speaker 1: more so than UM. People in monogumous relationships like new 379 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:45,959 Speaker 1: new relationships. They found that people in new monogamous relationships 380 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:50,159 Speaker 1: are often very shy about talking about their sexual history 381 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,639 Speaker 1: and potential UM infections and things, whereas they're really up 382 00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,120 Speaker 1: front about it in polyamory. Yeah, and and they kind 383 00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: of have to be, and they kind of just make 384 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,679 Speaker 1: it a normal, open thing. But that's part of that open, 385 00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: honest communication. That's that's kind of a hallmark of polyamory. 386 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,440 Speaker 1: And even it has a practical application and defending against 387 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:13,560 Speaker 1: s t I S. Yeah, they did. There was one 388 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,639 Speaker 1: study in twelve in the Journal of Sexual Medicine that 389 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 1: found that um unfaithful like cheaters, not like uh, like 390 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 1: a cheater, you're in a monogous relationship. In your cheating, 391 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,439 Speaker 1: they're much more likely to engage in risky sexual behavior 392 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,639 Speaker 1: and to keep it a secret than someone in a 393 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 1: polyamorous relationship. You go off and your cheat and you 394 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 1: keep quiet and you do something super risky, you know, 395 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,800 Speaker 1: hook up with someone randomly that you don't know. And 396 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 1: that's just that's kind of like the opposite of polyamory 397 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 1: from what it sounds like. Right, with polyamory, it's like, Okay, 398 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,480 Speaker 1: it's you, it's time for your weekly STD test, right, 399 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 1: I want to see the paper, and we're not hooking 400 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:57,440 Speaker 1: up with some random person there. If there are one 401 00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 1: thing that there's a lot of and a polyamorous for 402 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,919 Speaker 1: relationships are rules. Yeah, if you haven't picked up on 403 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 1: that yet, Yeah, you gotta have the ground rules laid down. Um, 404 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 1: how much time are you going to spend with this 405 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: person versus that person? Um? All the way down to 406 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,479 Speaker 1: rules in the bedroom. Um. It sounds a little gross, 407 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:19,840 Speaker 1: but fluid swapping. Well, it's so there's a thing. One 408 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 1: of the ways they protect against um STDs is uh, well, 409 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:27,240 Speaker 1: let's talk about some of the arrangements. Okay, alright, because 410 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,399 Speaker 1: I think we need to because these different rules that 411 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,440 Speaker 1: we're talking about here will apply differently to different types 412 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:36,440 Speaker 1: of relationships. So obviously there's a triad. You can also 413 00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:38,919 Speaker 1: have a quad. I can imagine that you could go 414 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,760 Speaker 1: up to six eight. Whatever the point is is, um, 415 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:46,959 Speaker 1: when you have a group that are equal to one another, 416 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:50,640 Speaker 1: where everybody's equal to one another, that's one. That's one 417 00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:56,760 Speaker 1: form of the polyamorous relationship. Right. There's another form that's hierarchical, 418 00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:01,800 Speaker 1: which is based on a core couple that are Yeah, 419 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,879 Speaker 1: they would be the primary and then say each of 420 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:09,120 Speaker 1: them has a significant other like a boyfriend or girlfriend. 421 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:12,359 Speaker 1: Those would be the secondaries. And then maybe they have 422 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:16,119 Speaker 1: another person that they're they're close to, they see once 423 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 1: in a while, maybe they live out of town, something 424 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:22,920 Speaker 1: like that. That would be potentially a tertiary um relationship, right, 425 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:25,360 Speaker 1: like you break the twister game out and they show up, right. 426 00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,679 Speaker 1: So the the the the difference between the two is 427 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: with the hierarchical relationship, with the hierarchical format, the the 428 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: person that your spouse, the core group, the core couple 429 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 1: of people. They're the ones who are gonna get the 430 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,879 Speaker 1: most time, the most attention. They're gonna have more power 431 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 1: to say veto the others. Yeah, Um in a and 432 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,399 Speaker 1: the other relationship that forms like a try it or 433 00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 1: a quad or six people or something like that, where 434 00:26:55,600 --> 00:27:01,200 Speaker 1: everybody is equally weighted. That's that that that you wouldn't 435 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:04,359 Speaker 1: have like a higher there's no hierarchical structure of that. Yeah, 436 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:06,640 Speaker 1: And it depends on how you want to structure things. 437 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: They're both completely valid as polyamorous relationships. Um, it's just 438 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 1: you know, up to you basically. And so you said 439 00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:16,720 Speaker 1: the veto power is a big deal. Yeah, I think 440 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,680 Speaker 1: it's always to be honored. Right. So with if um, 441 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:23,919 Speaker 1: somebody is is is meeting somebody new and wants to 442 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 1: date them. They basically have to go to the rest 443 00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 1: of the group that they're committed to in this committed 444 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,639 Speaker 1: relationship with and say I got this person, I'd like 445 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:34,560 Speaker 1: to bring them unto the group. I don't know this, 446 00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:38,840 Speaker 1: but I can imagine that is a huge thing, especially 447 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:44,960 Speaker 1: in a long established um polyamorous relationship, you know, like 448 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:46,960 Speaker 1: bringing a new person in all but that would be 449 00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: really big deal. I can imagine being that dude and 450 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,119 Speaker 1: showing up right, It's like the worst job interview of 451 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,919 Speaker 1: all time, especially if you don't know what's going on. 452 00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:01,359 Speaker 1: Plus in the hierarchical structure, then I can imagine the 453 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: veto power probably just rests with the two core people, 454 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: maybe slightly in the secondary people, probably not at all. 455 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 1: In the tertiary people, they're just there for twister. But 456 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:16,120 Speaker 1: with the um the s t I thing. Um, if 457 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 1: you are what's called body fluid, uh monogamous, yeah, which 458 00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: I was kind of joking about that it sounds gross, 459 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:26,199 Speaker 1: it's really not at all. That's basically saying that we 460 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:29,680 Speaker 1: can have sex with each other without condoms. And I'm sorry, 461 00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:32,639 Speaker 1: I'm saying you and me. I thought you were talking 462 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 1: to somebody behind. But um, maybe the secondary and I 463 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 1: have to wear condoms and we don't exchange those fluids 464 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 1: so intimately and freely. Or um, if you're in a group, 465 00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: like everybody in the group might be body fluid monogamous, 466 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,000 Speaker 1: but that if they are agreed that they can go 467 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,760 Speaker 1: outside of the group, they would not be. Or if 468 00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,040 Speaker 1: it's a hierarchical structure, yeah, that primary couple would just 469 00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,880 Speaker 1: be body flu monogamous and everybody else would be right, 470 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 1: you'd have to worry conovering. Yeah, Or it may not 471 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 1: even involve sex. Maybe your your secondaries or you go 472 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 1: on dates with and you can um, you know, go 473 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,040 Speaker 1: to first and second base and that's where it ends. 474 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: Like it's really all about the people in the relationship 475 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 1: working out what works best for them. All right, So 476 00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 1: let's take a break here and talk more about the 477 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:49,280 Speaker 1: polyamory right after this. Okay, Chuck, we're back. Um. It's 478 00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:52,160 Speaker 1: one of the things that I found interesting about polyamory 479 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 1: um was that they had to coin some terms because 480 00:29:56,200 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 1: they were really breaking new ground here and trying things 481 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 1: with relation. There's a whole glossary two or more. Spice 482 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 1: is the plural of spouse. Um. And then there's a 483 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:11,880 Speaker 1: word called compersion that's very much associated with polyamory, and 484 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: it is basically the mirror image of jealousy. Yeah, it's 485 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 1: being super happy that you're primary has found someone else 486 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,960 Speaker 1: that they really love and are satisfied with. Yeah, and 487 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:27,560 Speaker 1: not just your primary, anybody your polyamorous relationship with. Yeah, 488 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:31,160 Speaker 1: that they've found happiness with somebody else. You're happy for 489 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,800 Speaker 1: them because of that. So yeah, that's not a normal 490 00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:40,480 Speaker 1: thing for most people, especially people in traditional monogamous relationships. 491 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,680 Speaker 1: So polyamorous people kind of, I guess stumbled upon this 492 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 1: thing and had to come up with the name for it, 493 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 1: and they call it compersion. Yeah. And if you know, 494 00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 1: if you think to yourself as a monogamous person, well, 495 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:53,719 Speaker 1: what you know, this person goes off your wife all 496 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:57,040 Speaker 1: of a sudden is sleeping with another man. What's to 497 00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,280 Speaker 1: keep her from really falling in love with them to 498 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 1: the extent that she no longer wants to be with you. 499 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,080 Speaker 1: Of course, that can happen, but that can happen in 500 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: your regular marriage as well. And if the only thing 501 00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:15,040 Speaker 1: that's binding your marriage is that, um, you've got bigger 502 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,280 Speaker 1: problems in your marriage. If the only thing binding you do. 503 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:21,440 Speaker 1: That marriage is like the marital contract that you feel 504 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:26,360 Speaker 1: like you have to stay you know, true too, you know, 505 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,520 Speaker 1: like in a regular marriage, you should want to be 506 00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 1: with your husband your wife, like it doesn't matter what 507 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:34,200 Speaker 1: the piece of paper says. Um. I would guess, and 508 00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 1: again I don't know. I would guess that polyamorousts have 509 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 1: some sort of structure or mechanism to deal with that, 510 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:47,360 Speaker 1: Like if, especially if there is a if that happens 511 00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 1: where somebody starts out as a married couple, but then 512 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:54,479 Speaker 1: they include a third person and become a triad. If 513 00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 1: one of them really starts to fall for the other one, 514 00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:00,080 Speaker 1: that that doesn't mean that the the initial couple is 515 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,040 Speaker 1: going to break up and that couple is going to 516 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 1: split off. That's not polyamory. That's not how it works. 517 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:07,840 Speaker 1: So I wonder what kind of mechanism they have to 518 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: deal with checks and balances. Yeah, there's got to be 519 00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:13,520 Speaker 1: something they did do. There was one study in the 520 00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:16,360 Speaker 1: Electronic Journal of Human Sexuality in two thousand five that 521 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 1: said um polyamorous couples who had been together more than 522 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:23,320 Speaker 1: ten years listed love and connection as the most important 523 00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:27,480 Speaker 1: factors in their longevity and monogamous couples listed religion and 524 00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 1: family as the most important reasons. Uh, and that's what 525 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 1: I was sort of clumsily trying to say. The only 526 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 1: thing keeping you together is the fact that your husband 527 00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 1: or wife hasn't slept with someone else. Are your parents 528 00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:40,800 Speaker 1: are going to be disappointed? Yeah, it's I mean, those 529 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,680 Speaker 1: aren't reasons to stay married, you know. So, UM we 530 00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:47,320 Speaker 1: already touched on also the idea that if you are 531 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 1: in a polyamorous relationship, you you know, you might not 532 00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:53,000 Speaker 1: share a lot of interests with your primary, but you've 533 00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 1: got the ones that your primary is not interested in 534 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:58,240 Speaker 1: you get to share with your secondary or your tertiary 535 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: or whatever. Right. Um. So just having more people to 536 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:05,680 Speaker 1: spend life with, that's another benefit of it. There's a 537 00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:10,320 Speaker 1: lot of drawbacks to being in a polyamorous relationship that 538 00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 1: I think any polyamorous would readily admit as well. Um 539 00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:18,360 Speaker 1: to be in in a quote fringe sexual sexuality, I 540 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 1: think living your romantic and reproductive life, as we'll talk 541 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:31,200 Speaker 1: about a minute, um in complete contrast to societal values 542 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,000 Speaker 1: is um. That's gotta be tough. Yeah, And you know, 543 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:40,560 Speaker 1: over the years, acceptance of this is um been zilch too, 544 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:45,280 Speaker 1: better be saying peaked now zilts to confusion to UM 545 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,760 Speaker 1: these days a little more open minded about things. I 546 00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:51,480 Speaker 1: did see one pole here from I think it was 547 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,560 Speaker 1: in April of this year actually, where they pulled about 548 00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:58,160 Speaker 1: heterosexuals on how willing they would be on a scale 549 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:02,640 Speaker 1: of one to seven to commit non monogamous acts like 550 00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 1: adding a third party to the relationship, and depending on 551 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:09,720 Speaker 1: the scenario, sixtent of women and of men chose four 552 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 1: or higher on that scale, would ask if they'd be 553 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,400 Speaker 1: willing to pursue and like try something like that out basically, 554 00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:22,440 Speaker 1: So it's I wonder before I don't know lower did you? 555 00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:25,280 Speaker 1: Did you say before that there was this two thousand 556 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:29,319 Speaker 1: two survey that found that UM that predicted as much 557 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,600 Speaker 1: as ten percent. Yeah, people, that's high compared to other 558 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,720 Speaker 1: studies I've seen. I saw like it the most, maybe 559 00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 1: four percent. Yeah, I can't imagine ten percent. There's just 560 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:42,680 Speaker 1: no way, UM, because I mean I'm pretty hip, you know, 561 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,799 Speaker 1: I know what's going on, and I would just be 562 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:47,759 Speaker 1: blown away if it turned out that one in ten 563 00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:51,200 Speaker 1: people were in a polyamorous relationship and and just managed 564 00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:55,640 Speaker 1: to keep it secret that much secrecy is a big 565 00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:57,560 Speaker 1: part of this. And that's not to say that shame 566 00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:01,400 Speaker 1: is a part of a polyamorous relationship, but secrecy is 567 00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:06,880 Speaker 1: just out of necessity a um, a pretty big aspect 568 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: of polyamorous relationships, mainly because, like we said, it's in 569 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 1: stark contrast to social values, and if you've got a kid, 570 00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:19,160 Speaker 1: you're at risk of having your kid taken away. Yeah. Plus, 571 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,640 Speaker 1: I mean you'd spend half your life explaining this to everybody, 572 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,200 Speaker 1: you know. Um, there was the one case and uh, 573 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: and I couldn't find up any follow up about this 574 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:32,759 Speaker 1: young woman, but April what's her last name? Yeah, she 575 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,279 Speaker 1: was on the MTV show in the late nineties and 576 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,920 Speaker 1: had a child and had two men in her life, 577 00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:43,360 Speaker 1: a triad, and everyone was happy. The kid was healthy 578 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:48,520 Speaker 1: and happy and everything was great. And the grandmother sued 579 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:51,919 Speaker 1: for custody and one it because the court basically made 580 00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 1: a moral judgment. So this is a depraved lifestyle. And 581 00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:58,400 Speaker 1: this is in spite of the fact that the court 582 00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:02,000 Speaker 1: sent its own shrinks to go evaluate the home and 583 00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:05,319 Speaker 1: the family and didn't find that the kids were any 584 00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:08,880 Speaker 1: in anything but a loving, supporting home and we're happy 585 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,759 Speaker 1: and healthy. Uh. Still it didn't matter because it was 586 00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:15,800 Speaker 1: she was living a depraved lifestyle. So she lost her kid. Um. 587 00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:19,480 Speaker 1: I can imagine that in almost any state in the Union, 588 00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:22,960 Speaker 1: you would be at great risk of losing your kid 589 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,920 Speaker 1: if you came out as a polyamorous family. It's one 590 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:30,560 Speaker 1: thing I think as far as society goes to be like, Okay, 591 00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:33,800 Speaker 1: you guys, just go do your own thing. Whatever floats 592 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,720 Speaker 1: your boat, that's fine, keep it out of our faces, 593 00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:40,840 Speaker 1: keep your your little polyamorous lifestyle quiet. But if it 594 00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:43,879 Speaker 1: turns out that there's kids that are being brought into that, 595 00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,600 Speaker 1: like either they already existed or you're having kids with 596 00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:52,440 Speaker 1: multiple partners in this polyamorous relationship, I think society's threshold 597 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 1: for understanding and looking the other way really reaches an 598 00:36:56,200 --> 00:36:59,919 Speaker 1: end for better for worse. Right. Um, So, I think 599 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,960 Speaker 1: there is a real threat, and there's there's a real 600 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:06,160 Speaker 1: threat still in part because there's very little scholarship on 601 00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:11,680 Speaker 1: the impact that a polyamorous upbringing has on children. No 602 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:15,359 Speaker 1: no one knows. Polyamorous will say, look, dude, you have 603 00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 1: no idea how much our child is loved. My wife 604 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:23,320 Speaker 1: loves our kid. I love our kid. Our wife loves 605 00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: our kid. So not only does our kid get to 606 00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:28,319 Speaker 1: like be raised by two loving parents, our kid gets 607 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 1: to be raised by three loving parents equally. Um, there's 608 00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,719 Speaker 1: more of a division of labor. Uh it's it's just 609 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:38,720 Speaker 1: the kids great. And on the other side you'll find 610 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,759 Speaker 1: blog posts by people who are authorities on the other 611 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:46,040 Speaker 1: side saying no, there's just no way because you're you're 612 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,960 Speaker 1: at risk of a divorce. But it's a nontraditional divorce, 613 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,600 Speaker 1: whereas under a normal divorce we have a social structure 614 00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:54,400 Speaker 1: to support kids who are going through that. With this, 615 00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:56,640 Speaker 1: it's like that doesn't make any sense, and the kid's 616 00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:59,399 Speaker 1: gonna be have all sorts of issues. And then if 617 00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:01,520 Speaker 1: you don't your kid while you're raising them, when they 618 00:38:01,640 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 1: get to college and figure out what was going on, 619 00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:06,680 Speaker 1: they're not gonna trust you any longer. Like, but none 620 00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:10,080 Speaker 1: of this, almost none of it is based on studies. 621 00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:14,200 Speaker 1: It's all just moral judgments one way or the other. Yeah, 622 00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:16,680 Speaker 1: I think it's pretty funny. That's I bet the same 623 00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:19,719 Speaker 1: people that I don't think a child should be raised 624 00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:23,480 Speaker 1: by a single parent also probably think three or more. 625 00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:27,439 Speaker 1: They're like just two, not one, not three or four? Five? 626 00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:33,360 Speaker 1: Two is perfect? Uh So, who are polyamorous um. Elizabeth 627 00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:36,320 Speaker 1: Chef as a sociologist who's done a lot of interviewing, 628 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:39,640 Speaker 1: and she finds generally they are in their thirties, forties 629 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:45,279 Speaker 1: and fifties, generally white and liberal and educated, many of 630 00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:49,160 Speaker 1: them highly educated master's degrees to the tune of like 631 00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,960 Speaker 1: compared to eight percent forty percent master's degrees. Yeah, that's 632 00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:57,240 Speaker 1: what I saw, compared to eight percent in the general population. 633 00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:00,400 Speaker 1: And she says, rarely are they religious. When they do, 634 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:04,920 Speaker 1: it's usually paganism or Unitarian universalism. Apparently there's a lot 635 00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:08,080 Speaker 1: of overlap with the b D s M and cosplay communities. 636 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,040 Speaker 1: And here's another term, hunting the unicorn. Did you come 637 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 1: across that? No, I didn't. I'm disappointed in myself. That 638 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:18,319 Speaker 1: is um. She said that a lot of couples are 639 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:24,240 Speaker 1: introduced or interested in polyamory by start looking for a 640 00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:29,120 Speaker 1: woman bisexual women to enter their relationship. So I want 641 00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:31,799 Speaker 1: to try ad, I want two women. The woman's like 642 00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:34,560 Speaker 1: I would like a woman as well, and so let's 643 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,920 Speaker 1: go out and find that. That's that's called hunting the unicorn. 644 00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:42,080 Speaker 1: What else I got nothing else? I mean, I did 645 00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:44,200 Speaker 1: look up a little bit of the history of this 646 00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:47,480 Speaker 1: kind of thing, and it's there was Have you ever 647 00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:51,480 Speaker 1: heard of the Oneida Commune? Yeah, I think we touched 648 00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:57,239 Speaker 1: upon the communism. Oh really, I think so? Well they were. 649 00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:01,440 Speaker 1: It sounds like a cult, but um, it's super interesting 650 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:04,480 Speaker 1: because it was in the eighteen forties in upstate New 651 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:07,239 Speaker 1: York and not in New York where you usually don't 652 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:11,040 Speaker 1: in the eighteen forties here about things like um, free 653 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:14,640 Speaker 1: sex and polyamory. But that's exactly what was going on there. 654 00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:19,680 Speaker 1: A lawyer named John Humphrey noise Uh basically started a 655 00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:22,239 Speaker 1: free love commune in the eighteen forties in New York, 656 00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:26,719 Speaker 1: and by some accounts, it was a very um feminist 657 00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:30,799 Speaker 1: group because women were encouraged to only have sex when 658 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,360 Speaker 1: they wanted to, which you know, in the eighteen forties 659 00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:36,920 Speaker 1: that wasn't the norm um. But it was also, as 660 00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:39,560 Speaker 1: it turned out, not so great in many ways because 661 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:42,960 Speaker 1: they like had sex with teenagers. And the more I 662 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:45,400 Speaker 1: read about it, at first it sounded like this commune, 663 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,880 Speaker 1: and then ten minutes later I was like, no, this 664 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:51,080 Speaker 1: was a cult and it had religious undertones. And the 665 00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:54,400 Speaker 1: weirdest thing out of all is Oneita silverware that is 666 00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:58,279 Speaker 1: still popular today. It was formed from that commune. I 667 00:40:58,360 --> 00:41:01,200 Speaker 1: remember hearing it as like some sort of cautionary tail 668 00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,240 Speaker 1: or whatever. Yeah, and there was only like three hundred 669 00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:06,480 Speaker 1: of them, but apparently they I think it was all 670 00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:11,280 Speaker 1: about having lots of kids to keep that commune going 671 00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:16,400 Speaker 1: was the main reason. But they did not encourage monogamy 672 00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:18,839 Speaker 1: at all. They they shunned it. If you were caught, 673 00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:22,640 Speaker 1: like really rooting down with one person, they were like, no, no, no, no, no, 674 00:41:22,640 --> 00:41:25,880 Speaker 1: no no, you can't do that. Go off and have 675 00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:30,120 Speaker 1: sex with someone else right now. Pities in order basically 676 00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,640 Speaker 1: get your head together. Yeah, I'm sure there's a documentary 677 00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:37,239 Speaker 1: on that clan. They'll be interesting. Uh. If you want 678 00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:41,360 Speaker 1: to know more about polyamory and other alternative lifestyles, you 679 00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:43,919 Speaker 1: can search those in the search part how stuff works 680 00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:47,319 Speaker 1: dot com. And uh, since I said search parts, time 681 00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:53,160 Speaker 1: for a listener mail. Here's more on T. Hey guys, 682 00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:55,160 Speaker 1: listen to T and a massive tea connoisseur for the 683 00:41:55,239 --> 00:41:57,920 Speaker 1: last seven years. I was really impressed. I expected to 684 00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,120 Speaker 1: listen and pick out a bunch of little mistakes, but 685 00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:03,439 Speaker 1: I was pleasantly surprised. However, you guys did leave out 686 00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:08,600 Speaker 1: but one, No, I don't think so. Aaron, sounds like 687 00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:11,120 Speaker 1: a nice dude. Um, you left out one major category 688 00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:14,000 Speaker 1: of T though, and it's spelled pu dash e r 689 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:18,120 Speaker 1: h pu air. That's what I'm gonna say, he said. 690 00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:20,240 Speaker 1: It's probably the most unique t out of the six types. 691 00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:24,920 Speaker 1: Home to the Union Province of China. There's only t 692 00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:28,920 Speaker 1: to be fermented, not oxidized. What this means is that 693 00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:33,320 Speaker 1: pe air is and I know that's wrong, is able 694 00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:36,280 Speaker 1: to be aged for years and years and taste better 695 00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:39,080 Speaker 1: as it ages, just like wine. And some pure air 696 00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,080 Speaker 1: on the market that several decades old goes for thousands 697 00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:46,880 Speaker 1: of dollars per disc disc. Yes disc. Traditionally, purere is 698 00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:50,600 Speaker 1: stone pressed into a disc form called a being cha 699 00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,120 Speaker 1: and is sold um in that disc form, and it 700 00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:58,040 Speaker 1: has a forced floor flavor and has brooded about two 701 00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:01,200 Speaker 1: five to two and ten degrees fahrenheit. I gotta try 702 00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:03,400 Speaker 1: that stuff. Yeah, it sounds good. Um, he said. I 703 00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:05,680 Speaker 1: could go on and on, but that suggests a great 704 00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:07,600 Speaker 1: job overall, guys, And now it's tough to fit it all. 705 00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:11,279 Speaker 1: One episode could easily be its own college class with 706 00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:14,160 Speaker 1: all the cultural history behind it. Take care. And that 707 00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:19,560 Speaker 1: is from Aaron Krauss, who's developer at the Society dot org. 708 00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:22,440 Speaker 1: That is t h E S O c I E 709 00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:26,239 Speaker 1: t e A dot org. Thanks a lot, Aaron and 710 00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:31,040 Speaker 1: your cohorts at the Society. Sounds neat. Uh. It sounds 711 00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:35,719 Speaker 1: like the one needed call mm hmm yeah like it? 712 00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:38,640 Speaker 1: Okay uh. If you want to get in touch with us, 713 00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:41,720 Speaker 1: you can let's see what can you do? Chuck tweet 714 00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:44,880 Speaker 1: to us yeah s y s K podcast. You can 715 00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:47,239 Speaker 1: join us on Facebook dot com, slash stuff you Should Know. 716 00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:49,719 Speaker 1: You can send us an email to stuff Podcast at 717 00:43:49,719 --> 00:43:52,319 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com, and as always, join us 718 00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:54,200 Speaker 1: at our home on the web, Stuff you should Know 719 00:43:54,280 --> 00:44:01,680 Speaker 1: dot com. For more on this and thousands of other topics, 720 00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:10,400 Speaker 1: visit how stuff Works dot com. Hm hm