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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways. The story is of things we simply don't

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Speaker 1: know the answer too. Hi, there, welcome once again to

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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways. That's the show that tackles all the stuff

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Speaker 1: mysteries and saulves him every time. I'm Joe, joined as

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Speaker 1: always by Steve and Devin inserts Scooby Doo music for

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Speaker 1: that intro. Alright, so we have a really hard hitting

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Speaker 1: mystery assault and a really fresh off the boat y.

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Speaker 1: So this is the story is called the Mad Tlapper

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Speaker 1: of Wet waver Yeah, okay, the Mad Trapper of Rat River.

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Speaker 1: And some of you may have heard of this. Actually,

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Speaker 1: before I forget, I want to mention give a little

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Speaker 1: shout out to our listener Jacob, who recommended this particular

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Speaker 1: little story to us. Yeah, thanks Jacob. Yeah, okay, let's

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Speaker 1: let's take him from the top. One day in July,

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Speaker 1: a man calling himself Albert Johnson arrived in Fort McPherson,

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Speaker 1: Northwest Territories, Canada, and according to some versions of this story,

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Speaker 1: he stayed there long enough to build a boat that

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Speaker 1: he was going to use to travel down the Mackenzie River.

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Speaker 1: Constable Edgar Millan talked to him but didn't get a

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Speaker 1: lot of information from him, I guess for my person

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Speaker 1: is probably a pretty small place. So when this one

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Speaker 1: and this is way up in the far far north

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Speaker 1: of the Northwest Territories, almost to the Beaufort Sea, which

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Speaker 1: is like, yeah, it's it's well above the Arctic Circle,

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Speaker 1: way up there. Not a lot of people live up there,

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Speaker 1: yeah not not probably a happening spot. Yeah. So anyway,

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Speaker 1: Constable Millen Uh said later that he thought that Johnson

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Speaker 1: had a Scandinavian accent. Yeah, and a coincidence here Johnson

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Speaker 1: eventually killed Milling. But we'll get to that little bit

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Speaker 1: later on. Yeah, I know exactly. Little did we know

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Speaker 1: at that moment he would see Lie Day like Lie

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Speaker 1: dying at the hands of Albert Johnson, not his real name. Okay.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, so Johnson got his boat and left and

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Speaker 1: went down the Mackenzie River and went up went up

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Speaker 1: the Rat River. I don't know why they named it

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Speaker 1: the Rat River because it had a lot of rats

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Speaker 1: up there, that's true. I don't know about that. Rats

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Speaker 1: live everywhere. Yeah, romans live everywhere. That's a good point.

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Speaker 1: They're pretty hardy little creatures. Okay. So anyway, he goes

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Speaker 1: uh on the banks of the rat River. He builds

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Speaker 1: himself in a cozy little eight by ten log cabin.

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Speaker 1: Uh and uh, yeah, it's just very cozy eight by ten,

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Speaker 1: Are you kidding me? So he builds this log cabin.

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Speaker 1: As it turns out, it had double log walls for

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Speaker 1: about the first two or three feet of the of

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Speaker 1: the of the wall. On the inside, there's an extra

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Speaker 1: layer of logs with earth jammed in between layers of logs. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and a nice and a nice little spot to like

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Speaker 1: hold hunker down behind with your gun if you're gonna

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Speaker 1: get into shoot out. Apparently this guy was looking was

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Speaker 1: expecting trouble from day one, so he not only had

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Speaker 1: these double log walls, but he had he had also

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Speaker 1: cut gun slits all the way around, so you could

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Speaker 1: basically cover you know, everywhere around his cabin through these

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Speaker 1: slits with his rifle. Yeah, paranoid guy, a little bit,

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Speaker 1: a little bit. Yeah. The local Indians noticed that somebody

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Speaker 1: was messing with their traps, you know, you know how

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Speaker 1: traps work. Put them out there, and some hapless animals

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Speaker 1: steps in him and clump, you know, and clamps onto

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Speaker 1: their leg and then they chewed their leg off and

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Speaker 1: run away and then you know, get eaten by some

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Speaker 1: of the animals because they can't run anymore. So that's

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Speaker 1: the way trapping works. So they put. Yeah, so they

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Speaker 1: noticed that somebody was tripping their traps and in some

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Speaker 1: cases moving them, hanging, hanging them from bushes, trees, whatever.

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Speaker 1: So somebody's messing with their livelihood. And since he was

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Speaker 1: the only new person around, he was the only thing

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Speaker 1: that they changed over the past year, they immediately decided

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Speaker 1: it probably was him. So they had complained to the

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Speaker 1: Royal Canadian Mounted Police. Yes, the Mounties in Aquavic. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if I'm pronouncing that town's name correctly. Which

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Speaker 1: is the nearest town, obviously, And so the day after

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Speaker 1: Christmas nineteen one, two constables left Aquavic and tracked the

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Speaker 1: sixty miles to his cabin. And I said, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I assuming they did, did the whole dogs led routine,

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Speaker 1: I'm not really sure, but yeah, I can't imagine they

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Speaker 1: walked there. I can't imagine they walked sixty miles on

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Speaker 1: Christmas after circle. Yeah, there's a lot of snow in there,

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Speaker 1: I know, I know, I think it's I think it's

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Speaker 1: dogs led time. Yeah, so they went to Johnson's cabin again,

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Speaker 1: did I did I mention it? Sixty miles? Yea to

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Speaker 1: question him. Johnson was home, but he refused to talk

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Speaker 1: to them or really even acknowledged them. They were knocking

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Speaker 1: on the door and and and stuff, and he just

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Speaker 1: was pretending like he didn't even hear them, so he

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Speaker 1: didn't let them in, and he wouldn't talk to them.

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Speaker 1: He didn't hear of them. Yeah, maybe he was deaf, No,

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Speaker 1: because I remember reading one of the accounts that he

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Speaker 1: had windows, and they went to peer in the windows,

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Speaker 1: and here he threw a grainsack in the window. He

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Speaker 1: covered the windows so they couldn't see it. Not a

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Speaker 1: very sociable fella, but you know, really, you know, he

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Speaker 1: probably should have just had a polite conversation with him,

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Speaker 1: because he could have avoided a lot of heartache down

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Speaker 1: the line. But the constables decided that they needed to

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Speaker 1: go get a search warrant, so they returned to Aklavic st.

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Speaker 1: Yeah sixty how did twenty miles for nothing? Yeah? They

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Speaker 1: made this round trip quite a few times. I think

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Speaker 1: it was miles to find out that he's kind of

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Speaker 1: a skis. Yeah, I know, he's kind of a sketchy character.

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Speaker 1: Five days later they returned with two warm men. Once again,

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Speaker 1: he wouldn't top, wouldn't answer the door or anything like that.

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Speaker 1: But so one of the constables decided to force the door.

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Speaker 1: So he's doing and while he's doing that, suddenly a

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Speaker 1: shot rings out. Johnson had fired around through the door,

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Speaker 1: which wounded the constable. There a bit of a shootout.

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Speaker 1: Nobody else got shot, fortunately, except what would have been

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Speaker 1: fortunate if Johnson had gutten shot. Uh. And so they

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Speaker 1: scraped up their wounded comrade and headed back to Aklavik

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Speaker 1: once again sixty miles And next time they came back

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Speaker 1: they had nine men. Where there were mounties, some native

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Speaker 1: guys and this is the third time. The third trip

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Speaker 1: out were three d sixty miles round trip are three

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Speaker 1: hundred miles round trips so far to bring a bunch

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Speaker 1: more guys. This is a lot of traveling in an

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Speaker 1: age where you can't travel quickly just to talk to

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Speaker 1: some dude ye about trap and it's like, you know,

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Speaker 1: you get a hand to these guys there for their

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Speaker 1: heartiness because not just the length of the trip, but

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Speaker 1: it's this is like December January above the Arctic Circle,

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Speaker 1: it's freezing cold. Oh yeah, it's cold. It's like so

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Speaker 1: I mean, I've never even experienced these kind of temperatures myself.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to. I don't want to either. I

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Speaker 1: don't need that. Besides the nine men, they also had

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Speaker 1: forty two dogs, and they brought just in case, twenty

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Speaker 1: pounds of dynamite. I love it. That's good planning. I

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Speaker 1: just I just need to blow his ass up, so jects,

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Speaker 1: we need to blow him up. I remember in the

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Speaker 1: account um, one of the ones that I read, it

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Speaker 1: said that they try they had to warm the dynamite up.

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Speaker 1: They had to put it inside their cones and warm

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Speaker 1: it up to make it even kind of useful, and

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Speaker 1: they got like one usable stick out of however many

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Speaker 1: they had stuck in their jackets. Imagine that, just, I mean,

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Speaker 1: dynamite in that day and age, it's it's nitroglycerin in

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Speaker 1: sawdust essentially, is all it is. So yeah, it freezes, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah I could. I I personally would not be the

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Speaker 1: one who would want to get to do. Hey Kowalski,

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Speaker 1: stick this stick of dynamite in your armpit and hold

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Speaker 1: it there for five minutes. Did this is a frozen

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Speaker 1: stick of dynamite, So it's like your jacket. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: don't know. Yeah, these guys are these guys are hardy fellows.

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Speaker 1: So they succeed in throwing the dynamite into the cabin

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Speaker 1: and blowing it up. So did they throw it into

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Speaker 1: it or in the front of it? I was never

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Speaker 1: clear on that. Yeah, I was never entirely clear either.

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Speaker 1: It sounded it seemed to me like they either jimmy

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Speaker 1: the door and threw it in or threw it in

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Speaker 1: through the window. But it might have just like set

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Speaker 1: it on the front because his window was probably open

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Speaker 1: at this point. Yeah, it's such a ball afternoon. Yeah, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I could never tell him because I'm thinking that a

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Speaker 1: stick of dynamite, because we're going to get into what happens,

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Speaker 1: But stick of dynamite in an enclosed space like that,

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Speaker 1: he's a pretty concussive blast. Yeah, yeah, that's that's a

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Speaker 1: good point. So it might be that it might be

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Speaker 1: that they just set it at the front door and

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Speaker 1: it just blew the crap out of the whole cabin. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: worse knock knock joke ever, Yeah, that reminds me of

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Speaker 1: a joke. Was just kidding, but it turns out that

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Speaker 1: he was even more paranoid than thought because he had

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Speaker 1: dug like a foxhole in the middle of his living

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Speaker 1: room I guess, yeah, or living room or bedroom or kitchen,

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Speaker 1: I guess it was all. Yeah, so he dug itself

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Speaker 1: a foxhole. So he he was uninjured. After they blew

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Speaker 1: the crap out of the cabin and they started approaching it,

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Speaker 1: and he started he opened fire again and another firefight

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Speaker 1: took place, this time no casualties. So eventually the posse decides, well,

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Speaker 1: it was about a fifteen hour standoff, and then they

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Speaker 1: just said, well, you know what, it's really cold out here.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, they left and they went back to Aklavic again,

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Speaker 1: and they came back on January fourteenth, nineteen thirty two.

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Speaker 1: This time they hadn't even bigger posse. I love that

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Speaker 1: this possely just keeps growing and growing. Uh. And this,

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Speaker 1: by the way that I mentioned that this was the

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Speaker 1: biggest man hunt in Canadian history, it would become that. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: eventually turned into that. When they got back this time,

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Speaker 1: they found maybe their relief. I'm not sure he'd left

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Speaker 1: the cabin shockingly, I mean they blew it up, he

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Speaker 1: had I was just gonna, you know, take the sticks

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Speaker 1: of logs and just make it into a little lean to.

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Speaker 1: It'll be fine. They're definitely I've got a hole in

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Speaker 1: the ground, so I'm safe. They haven't proven that they're

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Speaker 1: going to come back over and over again. No, very

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Speaker 1: good points. Yeah, I think I think it's a pretty

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Speaker 1: fair about your shoot a cop. They're probably gonna keep coming,

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Speaker 1: coming and coming and coming until they get you. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: They found when they were turning with that big, huge

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Speaker 1: post that he had left the cabin. So they started

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Speaker 1: tracking him, and they found by the way along the

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Speaker 1: way that he had left a couple of caches of

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Speaker 1: food along his trail. He seemed to be really well

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Speaker 1: prepared for all this stuff. So the route that he

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Speaker 1: used to escape, he was hiding food along that route. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they found Check out this map. I found food caches

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Speaker 1: and in these two spots here. Pulled that up to

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Speaker 1: the microphone, would you. Yeah, so as you guys can

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Speaker 1: clearly see, because I mean I I looked at some

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Speaker 1: of the maps of his track. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: anybody who has at this point you need to stop

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Speaker 1: and take a look at this region. This is we've

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Speaker 1: already talked about this a little bit, but it is

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Speaker 1: barren and not a place you want to go to

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Speaker 1: have a vacation. It is not hospitable. Yeah, that's probably

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Speaker 1: one of those places that you know, just freeze in

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Speaker 1: the wintertime and then summertime comes around and mosquitoes the

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Speaker 1: size of Robbin's come out and suck your plot out

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Speaker 1: of your body. I'm sure it's just not a pleasant

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Speaker 1: place to live. Oh, I don't think so. Yeah, but apparently, yeah,

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Speaker 1: this guy was. This guy was prepared for the apocalypse

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Speaker 1: because again he left those food stashes there. They followed him,

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Speaker 1: They followed, and they tracked him, and they caught up

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Speaker 1: with him. In January thirtieth ninety two, there was another

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Speaker 1: shot shootout and this is one Constable Edgar Millen, who

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Speaker 1: I mentioned before, was shot and killed. He got shot

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Speaker 1: through the heart, so the posse he can mount you

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Speaker 1: got shot. So anyway, the posse retreated again and and

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Speaker 1: they decided to start recruiting more people. So they got more.

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Speaker 1: They especially wanted to get natives since they're very familiar

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Speaker 1: with the area. So they got well, and they recruited

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Speaker 1: people from two different tribes. Yeah. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: tribes is the right, but yeah too. Yeah, but they

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Speaker 1: did two different groups. Yeah, and also like just it

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Speaker 1: was just a militia at this point, right practice they

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Speaker 1: referred to it as I think the local militia just

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Speaker 1: coming out and yeah, coming out to go out to

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Speaker 1: this Albert Johnson Villa his real name. Uh. So it

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Speaker 1: looked like from his tracks that he was headed west

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Speaker 1: to the Yukon territories. So one of the first things

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Speaker 1: that Matis did is they blocked the passes over the

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Speaker 1: Richardson Mountains, which lay between Albert Johnson and the Yukon.

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Speaker 1: So there were two passes there. And which way is

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Speaker 1: is that mean he's going He's going west west? Okay?

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Speaker 1: So he's heading west. Yeah, so headed west kind of

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Speaker 1: southwest actually in too Alaska, kind of towards Alaska. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: into the Yukon. And then if he kept going at

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Speaker 1: the rate that he was going, he would have reached

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Speaker 1: Alaska and about another two days. Yeah, the guy traveled fast.

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Speaker 1: He covered a lot of ground. That's amazing, especially with

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Speaker 1: snow shoes, although they were he figured out a way

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Speaker 1: to not use his snow shoes. We'll talk about that

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Speaker 1: in a minute. So he's heading for the Yukon. They

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Speaker 1: blocked the passes. So in order to get around that,

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Speaker 1: Johnson just climbs over a seven thousand foot mountain. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: no special gear and it's January above the Arctic Circle

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Speaker 1: and you're at seven thousand feet of altitude. Everything aside

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Speaker 1: of what Johnson did, he was tough. He was super

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Speaker 1: tough dude, you know he and I was just I

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Speaker 1: recently had read about this is he makes me think

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Speaker 1: of there's the what are they call him the uk

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Speaker 1: or the Utah Killer, the Utah mountain Man. Have you

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Speaker 1: heard of this guy? His name is Troy James Knapp,

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Speaker 1: and he avoided the authorities for six years, living off

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Speaker 1: the land in Utah. I mean he would break into

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Speaker 1: cabins and steal food and booze and stuff. But he

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Speaker 1: just and they were that kid in Washington, just like

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Speaker 1: a couple of years ago, Washington State. Do you guys

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Speaker 1: remember this. I can't remember what they called him, the

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Speaker 1: Barefoot bandit maybe, And he was like stealing people's planes

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Speaker 1: and stuff, and like it took him like three or

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Speaker 1: four years to find him. And he was just like

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Speaker 1: was living up in the forests in Washington, chilling out

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Speaker 1: in the woods. Yeah, and he was laid out eighteen

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Speaker 1: or nineteen at the oldest. So yeah, I think there

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Speaker 1: are some people like this in history that it takes

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Speaker 1: quite the constitution. Yeah, it really does. But none of

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Speaker 1: them have climbed over a seven thousand foot mountain. I'm

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Speaker 1: assuming he didn't climb seven thousand feet. He just went

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Speaker 1: over a mountain that was seven thousand feet tall. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he might not have actually summited. The mountain has probably

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Speaker 1: a couple of thousand feet, but still that's a couple

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Speaker 1: of thousand feet in the middle. And I don't know

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Speaker 1: if you know this is in the wintertime or not,

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Speaker 1: when you're sort of up in the mountains and stuff.

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Speaker 1: And he had on an uphill road you'll start I

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Speaker 1: remember this up at Mount Saint Helens some some years

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Speaker 1: back when caving at night with some princes. Don't ask

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Speaker 1: me why. So we had we the road was gated,

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Speaker 1: so we had to park our cars and start walk

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Speaker 1: hiking up this road. So where we parked our cars

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Speaker 1: and snow was about two inches deep and there was

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Speaker 1: a gentle rise in the in the road. By the

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Speaker 1: time we got to our objective, which was maybe a

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Speaker 1: mile off the road, the snow was a foot deep

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Speaker 1: and we're not talking to changing altitude here, so yeah,

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Speaker 1: I can't imagine how deep the snow must have been

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Speaker 1: up in the in that mountain side. Well, so anyway,

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Speaker 1: you have to to reiterate he was badass. He was

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Speaker 1: like the nineteen thirties equivalent of the honey badger, because

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Speaker 1: they didn't have honey badgers I think not in the

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Speaker 1: UK the UK. Yeah, okay, one the way back to

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Speaker 1: our tail. So the Mounties hired a pilot named Wop

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Speaker 1: me and I don't know why he was called Whopp.

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Speaker 1: That was a nickname obviously that he had hippies for parents.

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Speaker 1: It was a name. It was a nickname. Was w

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Speaker 1: P May I think? Yeah, we're his initials. Yeah. So anyway,

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Speaker 1: so WAP was was detailed to scout for tracks and

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Speaker 1: such things from the air. He spotted Johnson's tracks on

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Speaker 1: the far side of the Richardson Mountains, which alerted the

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Speaker 1: Mounties that he had escaped and gotten past the past

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Speaker 1: their guys in the passes and it was in the Yukon.

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Speaker 1: Another thing that May figured out is that the reason

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Speaker 1: they couldn't find tracks for Johnson is that he was

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Speaker 1: traveling on the on the Eagle River, which is of

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Speaker 1: course frozen solid. And so apparently Cariboo carrible herds like

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Speaker 1: to like to travel on frozen rivers because that gives

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Speaker 1: them a little bit more space from the trees, so

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Speaker 1: they can see predators from a little further away. So

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Speaker 1: I'll travel up and down the river. And so he

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Speaker 1: was just walking in their tracks, and you couldn't spot

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Speaker 1: his tracks and from because all these Cariboo tracks, very

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Speaker 1: clever and not using his to be able to not

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Speaker 1: use his snowshoes, because those those are very obvious, definite tracks. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and so yeah, because it's and and so that sped

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Speaker 1: him up of course, because you guys are snowshooting before, right,

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Speaker 1: that's not speedy. The way that what May was able

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Speaker 1: to spot this is he was he was traveling up

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Speaker 1: the river in his plane, and he spotted some tracks

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Speaker 1: leading from the river up the bank. And so there

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Speaker 1: were some obvious tracks in the snow, so you could travel,

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Speaker 1: but as sooner, you know, he'd have to stop and urinate,

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Speaker 1: or maybe stop and make camp for the night, that

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Speaker 1: kind of thing. I think, yeah, it was for camping. Actually,

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Speaker 1: I don't know why you I mean, you know, if

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Speaker 1: it's if you're the only one out there and you're

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Speaker 1: trying to like hide yourself, you would just like pe

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Speaker 1: on the trail, right, I mean, you would just stop.

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Speaker 1: You wouldn't. I would probably just wet myself because you're

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Speaker 1: you're as warm. It's warm util that starts evaporating freezes

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Speaker 1: and then get rid of your legs. So what may

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Speaker 1: figured this out, And so the mounties started following him

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Speaker 1: up the Eagle River, and he was he was a

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Speaker 1: crafty guy. He to do stuff like backtrack to throw

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Speaker 1: them off and throw them off the trail, and he

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00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:05,639
Speaker 1: was he was. He was all over the place. They

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00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:07,080
Speaker 1: calculated at the end of this whole thing, and he

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00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:10,399
Speaker 1: traveled like, I forget, what, a hundred plus miles in

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Speaker 1: three days something. We're diating some huge yeah, an amazing

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00:18:14,840 --> 00:18:18,280
Speaker 1: amount of yeah, and over a mountain and over a

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Speaker 1: mountain and up frozen rivers. They were following off the

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Speaker 1: river for quite a while, and then they caught up

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Speaker 1: with him on February seventeenth, nineto. It came around a

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Speaker 1: bend in the river and there he was. One of

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Speaker 1: the one of the constable spotted him first, grabbed his

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Speaker 1: rifle and the other ones eventually figured out where he was,

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Speaker 1: where he was hiding. There was a big firefight. Uh,

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Speaker 1: one of the Mounteins was wounded, but luckily not fatally,

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Speaker 1: and then Johnson got killed. And did you did you

349
00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:50,639
Speaker 1: read the accounts of how the how the guy actually

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Speaker 1: managed to get the lucky shot, the shot that killed him.

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Speaker 1: Is they when they came around the bend and everybody's

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Speaker 1: there and Johnson, I guess what he did is he

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Speaker 1: just laid flattened the snow, make you know, smaller target obviously,

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Speaker 1: and he's shooting back and everybody's shooting at him from

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Speaker 1: the edge of the river so that they're not as

356
00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:11,920
Speaker 1: easy to get. But they dispatched one guy to go

357
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:16,840
Speaker 1: around him in the woods and he and he basically

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00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,800
Speaker 1: got you know, where Johnson's laying in the snow, got

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Speaker 1: at about a forty five degree or a ninety degree

360
00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:25,560
Speaker 1: angle away from him, came over a small rise and

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Speaker 1: saw him and just took a shot. And that's what

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00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:31,119
Speaker 1: ended up being the shot that killed him. But it

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00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:33,960
Speaker 1: was just one guy that somebody had the fourth foresight

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00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,800
Speaker 1: say go flank him, just try and flank him, and

365
00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:40,959
Speaker 1: it worked obviously enough. Yeah, that's actually, when you think

366
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:43,040
Speaker 1: about it, kind of an obvious thing to do. Yeah,

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00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:45,719
Speaker 1: but either way, they so they finally bagged their man,

368
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:51,440
Speaker 1: because amounts he's always bagged there man. So they searched

369
00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:54,680
Speaker 1: his body and they found a little over in currency

370
00:19:55,080 --> 00:19:59,959
Speaker 1: US and Canadian, which is the equivalent of about sixty too.

371
00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:03,760
Speaker 1: It's a lot of cash. Yeah. They found miscellaneous said

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00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:05,800
Speaker 1: of stuff too, like a dead bird, a dead squirrel.

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Speaker 1: And the food. Yeah that's food. Yeah, sure, that's definitely food. Yeah,

374
00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:13,919
Speaker 1: or maybe just lucky charms. I don't know. He had

375
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:15,800
Speaker 1: some gold and he also had a small jar that

376
00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:18,280
Speaker 1: had gold teeth in it, which led some people don't

377
00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:20,879
Speaker 1: wonder if maybe perhaps he wasn't a serial killer on

378
00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:24,040
Speaker 1: the top of being all around nice. So they were

379
00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,680
Speaker 1: his Yeah, I wasna that they thought it was his teeth.

380
00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:29,680
Speaker 1: Maybe his teeth were falling out. He probably living in

381
00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,360
Speaker 1: that cabin. He probably got scurvy and his teeth fell out. Well.

382
00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:35,399
Speaker 1: And the other thing that I heard is that, Okay,

383
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Speaker 1: in this how long was he on the round? A month? Yeah,

384
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Speaker 1: a little over a month, a little over a month.

385
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Speaker 1: And at times he's he was burning The estimate the

386
00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:48,160
Speaker 1: equivalent of about ten tho calories a day with all

387
00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,840
Speaker 1: the exertion, and if he's not eating right, and the

388
00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:56,600
Speaker 1: photos that they have of him, he's obviously emaciated. Yeah, seriously,

389
00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:58,560
Speaker 1: not a pounce of fat on him. So I just

390
00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,280
Speaker 1: wonder if his tea started falling out. I mean, the

391
00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:04,000
Speaker 1: other thing that they talk about is that you know

392
00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,720
Speaker 1: he had guns, but obviously he's on the lamb. He

393
00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:12,080
Speaker 1: can't shoot guns to hunt because it'll give away his location.

394
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,359
Speaker 1: So he like either hand kill or with a knife

395
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:22,040
Speaker 1: or trap everything that he got. And I don't know

396
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 1: that he was in particularly fertile land. Yeah, there's not

397
00:21:26,200 --> 00:21:28,679
Speaker 1: that many critters. And you know, you can't really tackle

398
00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:32,520
Speaker 1: a caribou because they're big. They're really big. They're big.

399
00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:34,760
Speaker 1: This guy was. This guy was tough. But you know

400
00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:36,359
Speaker 1: the other thing about it is at least kind of

401
00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 1: an obvious sign because caribou ways so much. Even if

402
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:40,640
Speaker 1: he succeeded in bringing it down and slitting its throat

403
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:42,560
Speaker 1: and you get some nice cuts of meat, you have

404
00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:44,600
Speaker 1: to leave it sitting right there in the open where

405
00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:46,720
Speaker 1: it would be found by your trap. With the other

406
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:50,560
Speaker 1: problem is, of course he wasn't lighting fires. He couldn't

407
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:52,840
Speaker 1: light a fire at night to warm himself up or

408
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,760
Speaker 1: cook his food, because that would again give aways that

409
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:59,359
Speaker 1: not brings some of the mystery about this whole thing, right,

410
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 1: is that how to he survived? How long? And whether

411
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,399
Speaker 1: that cold? I mean, you can make a snow fort

412
00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 1: and that'll keep you kind of warm, but you'll survive.

413
00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:15,640
Speaker 1: You will not be comfortable. It's gonna take its toll. Yeah,

414
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:17,840
Speaker 1: I'm sure he probably did hold up in snowcaves, but

415
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:21,480
Speaker 1: snow castly. He just didn't sleep. I mean, he traveled

416
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:25,160
Speaker 1: enough that it's totally possible that, Yeah, he just didn't sleep.

417
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,560
Speaker 1: It's nothing about this guy that's a little bit superhuman,

418
00:22:27,720 --> 00:22:31,920
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, it's a lot of weirdness. Yeah. I

419
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:33,800
Speaker 1: think you're probably going to cover some of that stuff.

420
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,680
Speaker 1: I don't want to disturb our listeners. Yeah, so I'll

421
00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 1: let you cover that. About his physical stuff that was

422
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,600
Speaker 1: going on with him. Were talking about, well, he has scoliosis,

423
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,359
Speaker 1: like severe scoliosis, and like weird feet. Yeah, one ft

424
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:52,480
Speaker 1: was bigger than the other one, stuff like that, so

425
00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,359
Speaker 1: he was a little bit deformed. Yeah, which again, okay,

426
00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,280
Speaker 1: if if i'm me and I'm in I'm in fit

427
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:01,720
Speaker 1: or shape than any of today, because I'm not that fit.

428
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:04,720
Speaker 1: But if I have scoliosis in one foot that's bigger

429
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,440
Speaker 1: than the other, that would make it so hard to

430
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,399
Speaker 1: be trooping through the snow and doing all of that.

431
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:13,600
Speaker 1: I mean, as a normal person that's not easy. But

432
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:18,080
Speaker 1: then to have these uh, these handicaps lack of a

433
00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 1: better phrase, how did he do that? I don't know.

434
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:28,040
Speaker 1: It's like he was just tough. Just don't make him

435
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:31,960
Speaker 1: like that. No more fat mystery. Yeah, okay, Well, speaking

436
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:35,880
Speaker 1: of mysteries, there there actually is a longstanding mystery about

437
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:38,480
Speaker 1: this guy because nobody ever was able to figure out

438
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 1: who he really was. They found his body and they

439
00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:47,960
Speaker 1: fingerprinted it, that didn't turn up anything, and they this

440
00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:50,639
Speaker 1: this thing got quite a bit publicity, and so there

441
00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:53,920
Speaker 1: were a few people who came up with with theory

442
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 1: is there was a family in Nova Scotia, for example,

443
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:58,760
Speaker 1: who believed that he might have been a relative of theirs.

444
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,600
Speaker 1: The family was the name was Johnson. Hey go figure, Uh,

445
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 1: they had a relative named Owen Albert Johnston, and they

446
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 1: thought it might have been him because he had he

447
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,240
Speaker 1: had reportedly gone west, gone to British Columbia, and the

448
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:14,960
Speaker 1: last they heard from him was a letter they got

449
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:18,160
Speaker 1: in early nineteen thirty one from a town called rebel

450
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:21,760
Speaker 1: Stoke in British Columbia, which is always south, but it's

451
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,560
Speaker 1: it's about in the middle of British Columbia. Um, so

452
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,720
Speaker 1: there was there were those guys. An author named Richard

453
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:31,119
Speaker 1: North came up with the theory saying that that Albert

454
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:35,439
Speaker 1: Johnson and another guy named Arthur Nelson, and you had

455
00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:42,119
Speaker 1: another guy named John Johnson. We're all one of the same. Yeah, yeah, uh,

456
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:47,280
Speaker 1: he said. And so Arthur Nelson apparently traveled from Lower

457
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 1: BC up into the Yukon in n ninety one. He

458
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:57,040
Speaker 1: owned similar guns, Savage M thirty caliber lever action rifle

459
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,320
Speaker 1: and also twenty two although those were really common guns,

460
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:02,400
Speaker 1: so I don't know that that really means that much,

461
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 1: but so, yeah, it's similar guns. And uh so he

462
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:08,160
Speaker 1: thinks they were the same guy. And there was another

463
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:12,159
Speaker 1: guy named John Johnson from North Dakota, and he believes

464
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,040
Speaker 1: that John Johnson, Arthur Nelson, and Albert Johnson were all

465
00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:18,879
Speaker 1: the same person. John Johnson did time in prison. Um,

466
00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 1: Sam Quentin and Fulson, right, yeah, yeah, luxurious places especially

467
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:26,159
Speaker 1: that here is just a really really wonderful play well,

468
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,879
Speaker 1: Johnny Cash liked it. Yeah. So this author, Richard North

469
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:34,159
Speaker 1: North trace john Johnson's or some people call him Johnny Johnson,

470
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,600
Speaker 1: traced him back to Norway. He was born Johan Codrad

471
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 1: Johnson in in northern Norway, also north of the Arctic Circle,

472
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:46,880
Speaker 1: which would explain why he's so easily able to Yeah,

473
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:48,919
Speaker 1: it's then able to deal with this kind of stuff.

474
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,399
Speaker 1: Uh So that was a that was a long standing theory,

475
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:55,439
Speaker 1: and that was that was a nice theory. But did

476
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 1: I mention No, I know I didn't. But in two

477
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:02,359
Speaker 1: thousand and seven they exhumed Albert Johnson's corpse and did

478
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 1: some DNA test. Was the Discovery Channel, right, Yeah, that

479
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,119
Speaker 1: it was sponsored by I think they paid for the

480
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,480
Speaker 1: whole thing. And so they dug him up and everything,

481
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 1: did a bunch of lab tests and DNA and stuff

482
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 1: and stuff. And so if anybody has the time for

483
00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:17,720
Speaker 1: any of our listeners, that this is available on the

484
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:19,960
Speaker 1: internet to watch, and it's about a fifty minute video

485
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 1: and it gets a reenactment of the whole chase and

486
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 1: all of that's very dramatic. Oh and he took a shot.

487
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 1: But what's really interesting is how hard it was to

488
00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 1: dig him up, like this guy was so hard to

489
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 1: catch and kill, and he and after he died and

490
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:44,399
Speaker 1: they buried him and they went to digging back up.

491
00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 1: He was so hard to dig up. It was like

492
00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 1: he was fighting though everything that people did well because

493
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 1: were they didn't know. They had a marker for his grave,

494
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:58,480
Speaker 1: but they weren't sure that that was exactly the right spot,

495
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,119
Speaker 1: and it was within fly feet, but we're talking in

496
00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 1: the Arctic circle, so we got permafros. It's frozen, and

497
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,400
Speaker 1: they had a bacco in there, and they I think

498
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:10,640
Speaker 1: they broke the bucket on the back of like first

499
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 1: of doing it with shovels and picks and axes, and

500
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,919
Speaker 1: then they get a bacco in there, and the bacco

501
00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:18,800
Speaker 1: is having trouble it. I think they were allotted let's

502
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:21,280
Speaker 1: say three days. It's been a while since I watched

503
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 1: the video. There were a lot of a couple of days.

504
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,159
Speaker 1: And they only got in there because they said, we

505
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,120
Speaker 1: will dig him up and then we will bury him again.

506
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,399
Speaker 1: Everything will be respectful and according to traditions of the

507
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:35,720
Speaker 1: local people, so we will. We won't disturb anymore than

508
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:39,040
Speaker 1: we have to. But they had this very small window.

509
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:40,760
Speaker 1: I think it actually was twenty four hours now that

510
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: they think about it, and they were freaking out because

511
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,680
Speaker 1: they couldn't get to the body did deep enough and

512
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,200
Speaker 1: they couldn't find him. He was just y, I just

513
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 1: see that, you know this, this guy's goes to be

514
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:59,440
Speaker 1: like No. Yeah, I think they used they used ground

515
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:02,159
Speaker 1: pen and trading radar to actually actually make pinpoint the

516
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 1: location of his body before they started digging. Not what

517
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:08,480
Speaker 1: I saw, but I mean it's hard to say. I

518
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:10,480
Speaker 1: mean I watched it, but again it's been a little

519
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,080
Speaker 1: bit since I've seen it, but I just remember them

520
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 1: frantically trying to find it. Yeah, I believe I can't

521
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:17,639
Speaker 1: remember the precise date when they did that, but I

522
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: believe it was summer, like July something like that. But yeah.

523
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:26,639
Speaker 1: Still still yeah, and what crossed by definition is always frozen. Yeah,

524
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 1: so in wintertime you can just forget about it. The

525
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 1: PERMA stands for permanently. Yeah, in case somebody was unclear

526
00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:35,439
Speaker 1: about that. You know, it took me a long time

527
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 1: to figure it out. Yeah. So yeah. So anyway, so

528
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: so they exhumed him, and that gave that gave everybody

529
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,760
Speaker 1: a chance to retire a lot of these theories because

530
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:47,960
Speaker 1: they took DNA because I took DNA from the body.

531
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 1: And then so they were able to find relatives of

532
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:55,480
Speaker 1: Johan Conrad Johnson, and well it turns out no, no

533
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 1: DNA match. Same for the Johnston family in Nova Scotia. Uh,

534
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 1: there was another writer named Mark fremer LYD. Sorry Mark,

535
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 1: if I mispronouncing your name. Is that Johnson was actually

536
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:12,320
Speaker 1: a guy named Sigvald Petterson Hans Hanks Jold. I think

537
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 1: something like that. I mispronounced that. I'm sure now, yeah,

538
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 1: And and that was he. He had a lot of

539
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: interesting reasons to back the theory up. So he was

540
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: kind of a paranoid person who debates innovaded service in

541
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,480
Speaker 1: World War One. He was worried he was still gonna

542
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:29,240
Speaker 1: be capped, going to be caught and punished for that.

543
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 1: He apparently did take up residents in British Columbia, built

544
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 1: himself a little fortress cabin just like the kind of

545
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 1: cabin that Albert Johnson built, and some somewhat further south

546
00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 1: in British Columbia, and then and then left and disappeared.

547
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 1: And so you know, that's an attractive theory that there

548
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:49,160
Speaker 1: could have been this guy. But now, uh, ha. The

549
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:53,000
Speaker 1: DNA defeated that theory too. And the other thing that

550
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,720
Speaker 1: I remember, correct me if I'm wrong, Joe, is that

551
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 1: when they exhumed the body and they examined his teeth,

552
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,120
Speaker 1: they figured out that he grew up somewhere where they

553
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: corn all the time. Is that right? Apparently? Yeah, So

554
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 1: they decided that they found isotopes in his teeth that

555
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 1: led them to believe that he couldn't be of Canadian origin,

556
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 1: and he either was from the midwest of the US,

557
00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 1: the corn belt, or from Scandinavia. Now, I don't remember

558
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: a lot of corn being grown in Scandinavia. That's what

559
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 1: I never understood. I have no idea what either there.

560
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: But uh, I mean it might be pickled fish or

561
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 1: something filthy fish or something like that. Yeah, and potatoes lots, Yeah,

562
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,920
Speaker 1: But it's the corn thing is when I couldn't. I couldn't.

563
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: I couldn't put a bead on that because, Okay, I

564
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:41,640
Speaker 1: can see the Midwest, the girl our corn there, but Candindia,

565
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: maybe they imported a lot of corn. I don't know,

566
00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:46,400
Speaker 1: maybe I and I don't know, I know, I don't

567
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 1: know that exactly as the corn. It might be that

568
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,000
Speaker 1: they said they believe he might be from the corn belt.

569
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,880
Speaker 1: Oh okay, So I was thinking when they said corn,

570
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: it was based on like, you know, people who corn

571
00:30:57,960 --> 00:30:59,920
Speaker 1: a lot like the I think was was the asd

572
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:01,719
Speaker 1: actually knew the corn all the time because the way

573
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 1: their teeth were worn down, and so I I presumed

574
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:08,360
Speaker 1: that it was that same. But if it's an isotope,

575
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 1: that's very isotopes. Yeah, and so it might be that

576
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:17,560
Speaker 1: certain minerals in the ground. I don't know. That explains

577
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 1: why I was completely wrong. And that's you know, I mean,

578
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: it could be right. I don't know that with water

579
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,200
Speaker 1: usually because less with the ground, because I guess in

580
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:27,920
Speaker 1: the thirties it was less though, but now we can

581
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 1: tell from the water because you don't import water from anywhere,

582
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,360
Speaker 1: whereas our food comes from everywhere. Good point. But I

583
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 1: think in the thirties that was probably not so much

584
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:41,200
Speaker 1: of a thing. Yeah, not nearly as much food swapping

585
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,800
Speaker 1: as we had today. Well so anyway, Yes, So after

586
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: his exhumation, all all the so far known candidates were

587
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:49,920
Speaker 1: ruled out, and again they did. They did figure out

588
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,520
Speaker 1: that little bit about his origins from his teeth. That's

589
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: the mystery. We still don't know who Albert Johnson really was.

590
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 1: And they released some pictures, right, released pictures, but he

591
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,000
Speaker 1: didn't look that hot. Yeah, you guys should go look

592
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 1: at the pictures of that are because it's it's just

593
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:12,160
Speaker 1: so interesting. Honestly, I don't know. If somebody were like, hey,

594
00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:15,120
Speaker 1: can you idea this person, I would say it's a human.

595
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 1: I think I the human man probably, But the pictures

596
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 1: aren't a great quality, and he's not looking so great.

597
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:29,120
Speaker 1: And I'm guessing that they carried his body for weeks. Yeah,

598
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:31,239
Speaker 1: I don't know how long he was dead before they

599
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,560
Speaker 1: managed to get pictures of him, so that might have

600
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 1: been part of it too. Well. I was I was

601
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:37,840
Speaker 1: earlier saying to you guys that, you know, I thought

602
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 1: he just kind of looked like a demon or something

603
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 1: some kind. And you know, we've looked at death pictures before,

604
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 1: um specifically with the Tom and Shrewd case, but with others.

605
00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:52,160
Speaker 1: We've looked at pictures of people who are dead, and

606
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 1: they do look different than they do when they're alive.

607
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:59,040
Speaker 1: But this guy creepy. Yeah, now he is creepy. Creepy,

608
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:01,160
Speaker 1: and that's why it was anti socially got tired of

609
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:04,200
Speaker 1: being rejected. Maybe he actually was that creepy. Yeah, maybe

610
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:08,360
Speaker 1: it wasn't. He didn't talk to anybody. Yeah, you know

611
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:13,080
Speaker 1: what he talked to me people? Oh didn't they say

612
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: at one point, sorry that that nobody in the Mounties

613
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,840
Speaker 1: actually heard him speak throughout the entire time. The only time.

614
00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:24,720
Speaker 1: The only noise they heard him make was when he

615
00:33:24,840 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: laughed when he shot somebody. Yeah, and he shot Constable

616
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 1: Miller and he ely laughed. Yeah, and that's what they

617
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 1: heard from him. Yeah, that's so weird. Yeah, it's for creepy. Yeah.

618
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: He didn't yell anything like come and get me coppers

619
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 1: if you can, or nothing like that. I just wantn't

620
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:45,560
Speaker 1: be left alone. Yeah, you know it kind of it

621
00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:52,600
Speaker 1: makes me wonder if he wasn't mentally handicapped. Yeah, well

622
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:55,760
Speaker 1: here this is a terrible example. But I just recently

623
00:33:55,840 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 1: watched again sling Blade, and if you've ever watched that movie, okay, well,

624
00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 1: in that movie, Billy Bob Thornton plays guy who's mentally handicapped,

625
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:08,080
Speaker 1: and he doesn't talk a lot, and it's very short,

626
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 1: it's very simple, and he talks kind of funny, but

627
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:13,680
Speaker 1: he didn't talk a lot, and so I it I

628
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,279
Speaker 1: as I was watching that after having read about this,

629
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:20,240
Speaker 1: It's like, I wonder if maybe he had a mental

630
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,279
Speaker 1: condition and so he was very bad with language, so

631
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:27,520
Speaker 1: he just didn't talk or just some people just don't respond.

632
00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:31,280
Speaker 1: Talking is not their way to communicate. They just don't

633
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:35,920
Speaker 1: don't talk to people. And that would explain why nobody

634
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 1: liked him. The locals who were saying it was him

635
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:40,279
Speaker 1: because they came up to him and they said, hey,

636
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,640
Speaker 1: did you mess with my trap? And he just stared

637
00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,800
Speaker 1: at him, didn't say a word, tries to you know,

638
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 1: the guy that was Willis? Is that who tried to

639
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:53,359
Speaker 1: talk to him? Is that the guy when Millan tried

640
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:55,480
Speaker 1: to talk to him. Yeah, when Millan, when he tried

641
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 1: to talk to him he first came to town, got

642
00:34:57,200 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: almost nothing out of him because he just didn't talk

643
00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,200
Speaker 1: to him him. I just looked at him and probably

644
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:05,200
Speaker 1: didn't understand what was going on. He said. Nolan said

645
00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 1: that he spoke that that that that they spoke, and

646
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:08,960
Speaker 1: then he he said that he had a slight He

647
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:11,359
Speaker 1: appeared to have a skin in the Avian accent. He thought,

648
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 1: but it doesn't sound like they really communicated a lot.

649
00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 1: But that sounds like he was able to talk well,

650
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,520
Speaker 1: but he might have, you know, finally gave in and

651
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,880
Speaker 1: and said five words and it was done. Yeah, it

652
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 1: could have been. It's hard to say. Yeah. But there

653
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 1: was also the the guy when he stayed in Fort

654
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:33,959
Speaker 1: McPherson to build to build that boat, that he hired

655
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 1: a local to help him, and so there was some

656
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 1: talking going on. So apparently he wasn't totally sociable. But

657
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 1: because it was capable of Okay, yeah, I know that,

658
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 1: then that kills my theory. I completely forgot about that part.

659
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:47,600
Speaker 1: But here's there's one of the things that puzzles me

660
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:49,719
Speaker 1: is that this was very much publicized. It was that

661
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:51,759
Speaker 1: that was back in the days of radio and not TV,

662
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: but the word got out and it was this was

663
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 1: a huge media spectacle, at least by the standards of

664
00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: that day. And so you would think that if he

665
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 1: had any family, then you know, they they would have

666
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 1: heard about this and they're saying that sounds like uncle Fred,

667
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:09,960
Speaker 1: it's a little a little screwy and you know, very

668
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:13,080
Speaker 1: very good in the woods and just voted most likely

669
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,560
Speaker 1: to murder somebody. And so you think more of these

670
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 1: families we would be coming forward to saying Hey, I

671
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 1: would think that might be one of our relatives. So

672
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:23,800
Speaker 1: but the problem is this is this is in the

673
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:27,359
Speaker 1: time of right around the Great Depression, so there are

674
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 1: all kinds of people who were on the move, scattering,

675
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:35,040
Speaker 1: just trying to find work and to live. So I

676
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:37,480
Speaker 1: can I mean, there's there's so many families that just

677
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:41,680
Speaker 1: broke apart. They went in every direction under the sun

678
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 1: just to try to find something in lost contact. Yeah.

679
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 1: I mean, it's also possibly didn't have any family because

680
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: you know, people die and all that. Yeah, I supposing

681
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:50,799
Speaker 1: he was an only child and his parents were both

682
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:52,839
Speaker 1: or something like that. Did they did they ever figure

683
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:57,080
Speaker 1: out how old he thought he was? I thought, okay,

684
00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 1: and then they that was like people identified him as

685
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,400
Speaker 1: being at that age at the time, and then when

686
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:03,719
Speaker 1: they when they exhumed his body, they tested it for

687
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,280
Speaker 1: for age too, and then they were guessing about mid thirties.

688
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 1: I guess. You know. My thing would be if he

689
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:12,320
Speaker 1: had a Scandinavian accent of any kind, that means he

690
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:14,800
Speaker 1: had to have lived there for a fair portion of

691
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 1: his childhood at least. It's totally possible that he emigrated

692
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:22,919
Speaker 1: as a teenager or as a kid on his own

693
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 1: and that this story maybe never made it really to

694
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 1: Scandinavia and therefore they didn't come forward and say, yeah,

695
00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,440
Speaker 1: that's our kid. It made it to Scandinavia, but it

696
00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: was in Canadian, so they weren't able to understand because

697
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 1: nobody else speaks Canadian. Yeah story, yeah yeah yeah. So anyway,

698
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 1: so yeah, it could be that his family was back

699
00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:52,239
Speaker 1: in Scandinavia and they never really got word of This

700
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:55,720
Speaker 1: could be an orphan yeah, probably wasn't more North America

701
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:59,600
Speaker 1: and phenomenon in Church of dis coverage. Yeah, uh so

702
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: it could in our phone or or maybe maybe his

703
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:05,200
Speaker 1: family is kind of like him and they don't really

704
00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: want to have contact with the authorities. So anyway, here's

705
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 1: my action plan for solving this mystery. Oh boy, Yeah,

706
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,720
Speaker 1: let's all get out our phone books and call everybody

707
00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 1: with the last name Johnson. Everybody wait, well wait, no,

708
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,920
Speaker 1: we we've talked about this. Yeah, nobody but you has

709
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 1: phone books, I know, so nobody else is going to

710
00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 1: do that. It's all on your shoulders. I'm gonna go

711
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:33,680
Speaker 1: out on a limit for your and predict, by the way,

712
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:36,400
Speaker 1: that the phone book is going to come back into style.

713
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:38,600
Speaker 1: And you know why, have you ever tried to look

714
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 1: at somebody's phone number online? Yeah? Yeah, and you know

715
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 1: how they won't give it to you unless you pay them. No,

716
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:46,279
Speaker 1: everybody has a Facebook page and nobody knows how to

717
00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 1: secure it, so you always get that stuff. Yeah, but

718
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:51,480
Speaker 1: you know, but seriously, if you're trying to find if

719
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 1: you're not Facebook friends with somebody and then they're not

720
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 1: on Facebook, try finding their phone number anymore. With what

721
00:38:57,040 --> 00:39:00,359
Speaker 1: the internet, it drives me nuts. Really, page is dot

722
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:06,360
Speaker 1: com white pages not come? They still totally do it? Yeah, okay, yeah, No,

723
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's sites out there, it's just unfortunately the

724
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 1: a lot of people figure out how to game Google,

725
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:13,640
Speaker 1: and so when you do a search for anything like that,

726
00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 1: their stuff always comes up first. Because he's never going

727
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:20,520
Speaker 1: to give up on the phone book. Ever, I actually

728
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:22,239
Speaker 1: don't use the phone book very much at all. It's

729
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: because he needs to sit on it to reach things.

730
00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:31,760
Speaker 1: That's right. If I'm gonna reach that top cupboard, change

731
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 1: the light bulb, I needs seventeen phone books. Yeah, so

732
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:41,200
Speaker 1: you guys have any other theories. No, I tried to.

733
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 1: I tried to find any kind of record of the

734
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:49,839
Speaker 1: whole Johnny Johnson which was the fugitive that that had

735
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:52,760
Speaker 1: made his way to the Yukon or the northern area.

736
00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:56,480
Speaker 1: I tried to look up other people like that, and

737
00:39:56,560 --> 00:40:00,520
Speaker 1: I could never I mean, it's really hard to find

738
00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:04,640
Speaker 1: people that would fit that bill, let alone record of them.

739
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:08,359
Speaker 1: Sometimes when they disappeared, they just disappeared. You didn't Yeah,

740
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: and unless it was that day and age and you

741
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 1: could talk to the people who are around, it just

742
00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:15,560
Speaker 1: didn't get recorded. I tried to look up stuff like that,

743
00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 1: and I just dead end after dead end. I just

744
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:21,319
Speaker 1: started giving up. So these guys don't These guys don't

745
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:22,879
Speaker 1: go out in the don't go out in the web

746
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:25,399
Speaker 1: and just sign up for that that that that user group.

747
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:30,080
Speaker 1: That's like in a solitary movie. Loanersize don't have a

748
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 1: special group out there. No, No, they don't do that.

749
00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:38,040
Speaker 1: I guess in the wood sucks kind of like a

750
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:42,120
Speaker 1: special ops officer of some kind from some country or another,

751
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:47,800
Speaker 1: maybe the US, maybe the Royal Canadian Mounted Police or

752
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:52,160
Speaker 1: whatever they have that is equivalent to special forces or something.

753
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:56,239
Speaker 1: You know, his skill, his drive to like flee, his

754
00:40:56,480 --> 00:41:00,839
Speaker 1: talent and surviving those are things that usually I think

755
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:05,160
Speaker 1: of as somebody who has some training, and I guess

756
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: it's it's totally plausible to me that somebody, you know,

757
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 1: was in the war and then it was discharged and

758
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:14,480
Speaker 1: they were like, I just want to go do nothing

759
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 1: for a really long time kind of stuff. Yeah, and

760
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 1: that that would explain why they didn't want to talk.

761
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 1: Maybe they were on the lamb. Maybe he was just

762
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:25,439
Speaker 1: didn't really want to talk to anybody. Maybe he thought

763
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:28,200
Speaker 1: he would kill somebody if he talked to them. Maybe

764
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 1: he thought he'd hulk out, you know, I mean he did,

765
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:35,360
Speaker 1: he hulked out, like that's exactly what happened. Um. So

766
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:38,520
Speaker 1: for me, you know a little bit wonder if there's

767
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:41,719
Speaker 1: some kind of armed forces background in the mix there.

768
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: But again, there's just no evidence. There's no good anything,

769
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:49,080
Speaker 1: and it doesn't really explain why somebody didn't see that

770
00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:52,960
Speaker 1: and think, oh, yeah, that's Johnson from you know, the

771
00:41:53,040 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 1: Seals or whatever. Yeah, they didn't have seals, whatever they have,

772
00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:00,960
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter Green berets. Yeah. Yeah, but you know,

773
00:42:01,239 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 1: it would think that somebody out there would have made

774
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:07,000
Speaker 1: the connection, you know, some families, friends, whatever, But it

775
00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 1: sounds like this guy didn't have a lot of friends. Yeah.

776
00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:12,839
Speaker 1: I think the other thing though, is that we all

777
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:16,879
Speaker 1: we I mean, this was highly publicized. But I think

778
00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:19,840
Speaker 1: that we've got to also remember that our frame of

779
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:24,759
Speaker 1: reference for the phrase highly publicized is much different than

780
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 1: what it was in nine one, which was radio broadcasts

781
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:33,800
Speaker 1: and newspapers. And the radio would cover a story and

782
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:37,160
Speaker 1: then they would run it again an hour or two later.

783
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 1: But it wasn't like I could just go on to

784
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:43,239
Speaker 1: Google and look it up or it was easy to

785
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 1: get this. Yeah, it wasn't. It wasn't easy to get

786
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:51,600
Speaker 1: that information. So if I'm you know, I see it

787
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 1: and then I leave town and I'm up in the

788
00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 1: woods where I'm out in the field doing whatever I'm

789
00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 1: doing for work, and then I come back from the

790
00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:02,920
Speaker 1: apple orchard and oh, well the story's gone, But hey,

791
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:06,000
Speaker 1: what happened? Oh yeah, I don't really remember. I mean,

792
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 1: I think it's it's much harder to for those things

793
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,279
Speaker 1: to be as widely known, and I think that frame

794
00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:15,279
Speaker 1: of reference is something that we can easily forget. And

795
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:18,080
Speaker 1: that's and then it's you know, in the thirties too,

796
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:19,680
Speaker 1: there were still people who lived in the wo was

797
00:43:19,719 --> 00:43:23,960
Speaker 1: no electricity, we were plumbing, and you know, wasn't everywhere

798
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:27,239
Speaker 1: no it really wasn't. It was like not in a

799
00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:30,319
Speaker 1: lot of places. So yeah, so you might have had

800
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:32,239
Speaker 1: family who knows, But I don't think. I think we're

801
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:35,080
Speaker 1: probably never going to find out unless we round up

802
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 1: every Johnson in the phone book. Yeah, if his name

803
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 1: was truly I think you have a fatal flaw in

804
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:46,000
Speaker 1: your theory. Well maybe we should like to expand our

805
00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:50,400
Speaker 1: search to Johnson, not just Johnson's, but Johnston's and jo Hansen's.

806
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:52,400
Speaker 1: I don't know, man, if I were going to go

807
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:55,640
Speaker 1: into hiding, I would pick Johnson or Smith my name,

808
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:59,279
Speaker 1: you know, like something super john Johnson. How generic can

809
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: you make it? Yeah, Albert Johnson is pretty generic too,

810
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that it's just a flaw to

811
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:11,239
Speaker 1: believe he abbreviated his name when he had it put

812
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 1: in the phone book, so he'd be the first Johnson

813
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 1: in the book. He was a Johnson, That's why h

814
00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 1: chose Albert. Okay, well, if we're going to go with

815
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:23,719
Speaker 1: Joe's phone book theory, why not Yeah? Yeah, anyway, I

816
00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:26,320
Speaker 1: don't know. The whole thing is still kind of a

817
00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:28,480
Speaker 1: head scratcher. You know, why he didn't just talk to

818
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:31,040
Speaker 1: the cops and just say, hey, no, don't don't know

819
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 1: what you're talking about, sir, you know, or yeah, I

820
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:36,839
Speaker 1: didn't realize that was against the rules. Also, yeah, yeah

821
00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:39,279
Speaker 1: it was. It was on my property. I thought I

822
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:41,919
Speaker 1: could do what I wanted on my property. Yeah, yeah,

823
00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:44,920
Speaker 1: So yeah, he could have avoid a lot of heartburn

824
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:47,000
Speaker 1: if you've just been a little more cooperative and not

825
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 1: shot at him. Well that's famous last words for a

826
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:53,400
Speaker 1: lot of people. Unfortunately. I guess I just don't like

827
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: the man and don't want to cooperate because they don't

828
00:44:57,080 --> 00:44:59,880
Speaker 1: think they should have to. And I'm kind of getting

829
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 1: that's what his mind set. Yeah, well, you never know.

830
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:04,600
Speaker 1: I mean I'm kind of going back and forth on

831
00:45:04,680 --> 00:45:06,719
Speaker 1: this and whether he wanted to commit suicide by cop,

832
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 1: because I mean, you have to know that if you shoot,

833
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:11,759
Speaker 1: if you shooting't win the policeman, sooner or later, they're

834
00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:13,840
Speaker 1: going to come back with more guns and more people

835
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:16,560
Speaker 1: and finish the job. Let's be honest, though, if you

836
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 1: want to commit suicide by cop, you don't climb over

837
00:45:19,080 --> 00:45:21,040
Speaker 1: a seven thousand foot mountain in the middle of the

838
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:25,440
Speaker 1: winter in the circle to escape. Said. Yeah, that's that's

839
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:27,239
Speaker 1: the part that's sort of conscious. But when you think

840
00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:30,800
Speaker 1: about it. His his shooting of the constable in the

841
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: beginning of this whole story, it really made no sense.

842
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:35,439
Speaker 1: It wasn't necessary at all. They were trying to break

843
00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 1: into his house, make sense, you know, they were trying

844
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 1: to force their way in. Yeah, he probably freaked out,

845
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:42,759
Speaker 1: shot through the door. Yeah. Maybe he was taking a

846
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:46,640
Speaker 1: nap and suddenly, oh my god, sleeping through all the

847
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:49,520
Speaker 1: ruckets outside of everybody yelling at him and knocking on

848
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:52,680
Speaker 1: the door. Yeah, he was a deep sleeper. Yeah, that's

849
00:45:52,719 --> 00:45:59,480
Speaker 1: what was going on. Okay, another mystery solved, solved. Solved.

850
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,960
Speaker 1: So you folks are probably wanting to know more more

851
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 1: cool stuff about how to find us, how to get

852
00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 1: hold of us and everything like that. Well, you can

853
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 1: find us on Facebook, and of course you can like us.

854
00:46:09,800 --> 00:46:13,239
Speaker 1: You really should like us. Like us, yeah, you really

855
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:17,040
Speaker 1: like me. Yes. You can also find us, of course,

856
00:46:17,280 --> 00:46:20,359
Speaker 1: on on Stitcher. If you want to stream this live

857
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:22,360
Speaker 1: or if you want to just download and put it

858
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:24,560
Speaker 1: in your on your iPod, then you can go to iTunes.

859
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,640
Speaker 1: You'll find us out there. Send us a message. You

860
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:30,840
Speaker 1: can use our email account, which is Thinking Sideways Podcast

861
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,839
Speaker 1: at gmail dot com. And let's see that I leave

862
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:38,719
Speaker 1: anything out website. Oh yeah, we have a website. Yeah, okay, yeah,

863
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:43,080
Speaker 1: our website is thinking Sideways podcast dot com. And we'll

864
00:46:43,120 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 1: have all the links to the story. I think we'll

865
00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:50,160
Speaker 1: probably have the picture, the post boredom picture there. Yeah,

866
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:52,759
Speaker 1: we're gonna have gone so you can find all the

867
00:46:52,840 --> 00:46:55,560
Speaker 1: links to this story and more you'll find we'll probably

868
00:46:55,640 --> 00:46:58,120
Speaker 1: have the links of the video. And there's a website

869
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 1: that I found that has a very very detailed rundown

870
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:03,880
Speaker 1: of the entire man hunt, a lot of details that

871
00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 1: I left out. I kind of gave you the glossy

872
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:09,600
Speaker 1: overview here. Uh and uh's see maybe yeah, well that

873
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:13,439
Speaker 1: disgusting picture of him dead and maybe it is disgusting. Yeah,

874
00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:15,440
Speaker 1: maybe a kind of a cool little map that shows

875
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:17,399
Speaker 1: his little trick that the rout of his little trick

876
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:19,520
Speaker 1: that he took. And h I don't know what else

877
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:21,080
Speaker 1: are we gonna put out there? Maybe a picture of

878
00:47:21,120 --> 00:47:24,000
Speaker 1: a kitten? Oh my gosh, yeah, apparently we're just putting

879
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:28,479
Speaker 1: out everything. We are. So many pictures this week, so many? Yeah,

880
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:32,479
Speaker 1: can I put a unicorn y? How about a unit kitten?

881
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:38,360
Speaker 1: I think that's perfect. Yeah, that's better than the death photo.

882
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:42,120
Speaker 1: How about a Uni Avocado Soldier. I haven't seen that. Well,

883
00:47:42,200 --> 00:47:44,040
Speaker 1: you'll have to show that, Okay, okay, I want to

884
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:47,239
Speaker 1: see that one alright. Well anyway, that's it. Like I said,

885
00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:50,520
Speaker 1: another mystery salt and uh you know, tune in next

886
00:47:50,600 --> 00:47:54,320
Speaker 1: week when we saw another mystery So for Thinking Sideways podcast,

887
00:47:54,480 --> 00:47:59,120
Speaker 1: I just want to say ta ta by everybody.