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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways is not brought to you by tricky dating sites. Instead,

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Speaker 1: I don't know stories of things we simply don't know

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Speaker 1: the answer to. Hey, guys, welcome to another episode of

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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways, the podcast. I am Devin, joined as usual

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Speaker 1: by Joe and Steve. We got another mystery for you

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Speaker 1: cool not quite to the cooking show phase yet. This

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Speaker 1: week we're going to talk about a mystery um that

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Speaker 1: we are calling officially the death of Mary Anderson, but

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Speaker 1: is actually Jane Doe one nine u f w A.

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Speaker 1: No one of those is her real name. Yeah, one

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Speaker 1: of them is not her real name. Both of them aren't.

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Speaker 1: Probably it's probably neither of them. Um, So quick overview

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Speaker 1: of the case as we do. On October nine, a

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Speaker 1: woman named Mary Anderson checked into room to fourteen of

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Speaker 1: the hotel Vintage Park in Seattle, Washington. She paid cash

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Speaker 1: for two nights day and it wasn't really a cheap hotel,

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Speaker 1: but she paid cash. And then on Friday morning, when

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Speaker 1: chuck out time had come and gone and she didn't

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Speaker 1: check out as expected, the hotel staff you know, tried

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Speaker 1: to gain access to her room and then couldn't, so

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Speaker 1: they it was it was dead bolted, so they had

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Speaker 1: the emergency override to get into her room and found

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Speaker 1: her dead on the bed. Electronic block. Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: they had some sort of a way. You have to

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Speaker 1: have some way to get into these rooms, right, and

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Speaker 1: there's always dead bodies, and it was a lot. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So they found her dead. She had left a note,

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Speaker 1: and then she when they tried to notify next of

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Speaker 1: kin or the police trained to notify next of kin

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Speaker 1: based on the information she had left, it turned out

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Speaker 1: that um, not only was Mary Anderson a fake name,

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Speaker 1: but the phone number and the address that she had UM,

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Speaker 1: the address was non existent and the phone number didn't

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Speaker 1: belong to her. UM, and she's still unidentified. Yeah, she

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Speaker 1: appears to have made the name Mary Anderson maybe up

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Speaker 1: on the spot. Apparently there's hesitation marks in her signature

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Speaker 1: or writing of the names in the note. No, no,

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Speaker 1: on the on the stuff of the hotel when she

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Speaker 1: signed in. And I canna say on the note there's

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Speaker 1: no hesitation, but you know you have to you have

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Speaker 1: to fill your paperwork out when you when you Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's where the hesitation marks were. And and just remember

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Speaker 1: this is pre nine eleven, So when we're talking about

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Speaker 1: trying to track her via flights or anything like that, Um,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't really happen. And then UM, I presume that

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Speaker 1: they since she paid cash upfront, they didn't really care

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Speaker 1: if she had a night record or anything. Yeah, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so let's back up a little bit, although there's not

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Speaker 1: much backing up to be done because we literally don't

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Speaker 1: know anything about where Mary was before she checked in,

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Speaker 1: and then once she checked in, she pretty much didn't

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Speaker 1: leave the room. She put the do not disturb sign

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Speaker 1: up on her door. As far as we can tell,

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Speaker 1: like as soon as she checked in dead bolted herself

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Speaker 1: in there and just never came out by the time

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Speaker 1: they found it. Was she kind of ripe or she like,

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Speaker 1: you know, she immediately committed suicide or no, I think

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Speaker 1: it was fairly recent. I mean, I don't the room

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Speaker 1: wasn't warm or anything like that, and there's no mention

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Speaker 1: of her being pungent composing, and it was only two

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Speaker 1: days a stable environment like that, I don't think that

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Speaker 1: she would have been experiencing any massive degradation, would assume. So, um,

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Speaker 1: let I have a copy of the note that she

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Speaker 1: left a copy. I have just the note that she left.

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Speaker 1: You don't have the actual note. I don't have the

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Speaker 1: copy of I just have the words that she wrote. Uh,

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Speaker 1: and her note said to whom it made concern, I

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Speaker 1: have decided to end my life and no one is

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Speaker 1: responsible for my death. Mary Anderson, PS, I have no relatives.

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Speaker 1: You can use my body as you choose. So what

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Speaker 1: they do with your body? Um, they held it, they

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Speaker 1: didn't sell it. No, they held it in the morgue

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Speaker 1: for eight months. I think. Well, they were trying to

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Speaker 1: identify her and then finally embalmed her and buried her

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Speaker 1: in an unmarked grave. But there's a grave number and

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Speaker 1: all of that stuff. So if you want to go

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Speaker 1: visit your grave, yeah, yeah, she's buried um at Seattle's

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Speaker 1: Crown Hill Cemetery and she's in grave number one nine

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Speaker 1: seven A. So if you want to go visit Mary Anderson,

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Speaker 1: Seattle listeners get on that, would you. Yeah? And also

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Speaker 1: Seattle listeners if you wouldn't mind swinging by the hotel

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Speaker 1: A vintage. I want to know if they still have

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Speaker 1: room to fourteen or if that's permanently closed off of time.

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Speaker 1: It's my it's actually um my understanding it is closed off.

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Speaker 1: Read an article from just a couple of years later,

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Speaker 1: and the the investigative reporter said he wasn't able to

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Speaker 1: gain access to it, although I'm not sure if that

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Speaker 1: means that he was just trying to break into the

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Speaker 1: room or if he was trying to rent it, but

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Speaker 1: the hotel won't talk about or maybe he was just

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Speaker 1: lazy and he wasn't able to gain access because he

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Speaker 1: never tried. No, I think he'd tried. Um. Well, this

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Speaker 1: is one of the ones that will post um. You

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Speaker 1: have to weigh back machine it. But it's an incredibly

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Speaker 1: thorough investigation of what happened, I guess. I mean that's

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Speaker 1: the frustrating. Yeah, that's the frustrating thing about this case.

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Speaker 1: And we'll just talk about everything that we know and

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Speaker 1: then we'll talk about everything else. So the note that

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Speaker 1: we're talking about that was handwritten, It was handwritten on

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Speaker 1: it was I'm sorry, it was quote unquote scribbled on

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Speaker 1: a piece of hotel stationary. You know they give you

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Speaker 1: those little notebooks or whatever and a pen. So Mary

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Speaker 1: was estimated to be between thirty three and forty five

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Speaker 1: years old. And we will talk about this later because

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Speaker 1: I presume you guys looked at the pictures that she

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Speaker 1: does look a little old than that. But we'll talk

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Speaker 1: about that in a second. She was about five eight

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Speaker 1: five ft eight inches I think it was five eight, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I didn't transfer that into international units. Sorry, that's

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Speaker 1: about That's about seventeen kilos and about half a kilometer

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Speaker 1: or something like that. Yeah, something like that. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: then she weighed two hundred and forty pounds, which I

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Speaker 1: think is like two stone maybe I don't know, like

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Speaker 1: five thoms. Yes, I'm pretty sure that's accurate. She had

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Speaker 1: reddish brown hair and brown eyes, and metric again, that

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Speaker 1: is what just kidding, reddish brown and brown. I think

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Speaker 1: I think it translates pretty pretty significantly accurately. Significantly, yeah, accurately.

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Speaker 1: She had a copper i U D inserted, which is

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Speaker 1: birth control for those of interuterine device. She had had

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Speaker 1: some sort of breast surgery at some point which produced

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Speaker 1: scars on both of her breasts um and then also

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Speaker 1: around the nipple area, so it was like from the

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Speaker 1: under side um. Her hair was combed, her nails were

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Speaker 1: neatly trimmed and painted like a white cream pearl color.

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Speaker 1: She had makeup on, she had a dental plate in

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Speaker 1: her mouth um, and she was wearing black leggings and

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Speaker 1: a black top wa dental plates, so that's basically dentures. Okay, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: making sure I understood what that, man, I suddenly realized

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Speaker 1: that it wasn't sure she was laying on top of

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Speaker 1: the bed. I guess. I don't know if there were

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Speaker 1: two beds or one bed in the room, but she

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Speaker 1: was laying on top of it. The sheets were turned

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Speaker 1: down neatly underneath her, so she had, you know, turned

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Speaker 1: the sheets down so that she wouldn't get them dirty,

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Speaker 1: and laid on top of them. She was propped up

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Speaker 1: against a you know, a bunch of pillows. The top

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Speaker 1: are ones, not the ones that you sleep on, the

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Speaker 1: decorative ones. They were like a dark print. Um, so

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Speaker 1: it seems like, you know, she was trying to be

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Speaker 1: as as convenient as possible. What was going to happen after? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: she had a large Bible open, face down on her

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Speaker 1: chest to Psalms twenty three, not the hotel Bible. I know.

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Speaker 1: I don't think it was the hotel. The impression that

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Speaker 1: it was her own bible, somebody's Bible, but it wasn't

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Speaker 1: the hotel one. Yeah, and you for those of us

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Speaker 1: who don't know, can one of you guys read this

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Speaker 1: this psalm? For us? It's pretty normal. This is one

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Speaker 1: you've heard. I mean, if you ever watched any TV

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Speaker 1: show or any movie where somebody gets killed and they

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Speaker 1: cut to the funeral scene, you're hearing one of two songs.

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Speaker 1: You're hearing this one or the other one that goes

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Speaker 1: ashes to ashes, dust to dust. So this one goes three.

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Speaker 1: The Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want He

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Speaker 1: maketh me to lie down the green pastures. He leads

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Speaker 1: me beside the still water. She restores my soul. He

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Speaker 1: leads me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: though I walked through the valley of the shadow of death,

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Speaker 1: I will fear no evil, for thou art with me.

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Speaker 1: I Rod and the staff, they comfort me, that prepare

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Speaker 1: state table before me, the president us of mine enemies.

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Speaker 1: And this is totally channeling Shatner. Uh. That annoys just

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Speaker 1: my head with oil. My cup runneth over uh shore.

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Speaker 1: The goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days

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Speaker 1: of my life, and I will doll in the house

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Speaker 1: of the Lord forever. Okay, and Shatner Uh. The one

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Speaker 1: thing about everybody talks about Psalm twenty three, which may

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Speaker 1: or may not mean anything. If you're looking at any

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Speaker 1: standard Bible, there's a number of psalms on each Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So if she could have been reading Salm twenty two,

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Speaker 1: I mean, which you know immediately precedes it. Sal twenty

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Speaker 1: two is a little bit darker. But you know, actually,

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Speaker 1: if you got Joe has a Bible in the studio,

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Speaker 1: it's a smaller Bible than the ones that I haven't.

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Speaker 1: Well that's not true. I have a couple at my house.

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Speaker 1: But you know there's the study Bibles, which are usually

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Speaker 1: those like really big ones, and often they just have

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Speaker 1: like one or two psalms on a page. And actually

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Speaker 1: the copy that I have just has one full psalm

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Speaker 1: on a page. Um and sometimes you know, a couple

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Speaker 1: of lines from the previous one make it onto the page.

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Speaker 1: But I think it's possible. It just depends. There's so

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Speaker 1: many different Bibles, you don't know, there's so many different

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Speaker 1: but it is possible to get a copy of the

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Speaker 1: Bible where it's basically just one full text of one

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Speaker 1: full psalm on a page and then you know a

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Speaker 1: couple before and after of others. Yeah, on this on

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Speaker 1: this one, essentially they all run, you know, page, they'll

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Speaker 1: run back to back, so that the tenor of the

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Speaker 1: song twenty two is a little different. Starts out like this,

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Speaker 1: my God, my God, why hast forsaken me? Why arn't

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Speaker 1: thou so far from helping me? From the words of

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Speaker 1: Mike groaning, Oh my god, I cry by day but

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Speaker 1: that dost not answer? And by night but find no rest,

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Speaker 1: not that, and on and not from there, A little darker,

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Speaker 1: much darker. Yeah, but some who knows, not that it

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Speaker 1: means much of anything, but it is a little bit

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Speaker 1: more despairing than Psalm twenty three, where she was maybe

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Speaker 1: at I don't know. It's hard to tell. Everything seems

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Speaker 1: really meticulous with her. It seems very prepared, almost like

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Speaker 1: the KGB and like laid the whole table out a

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Speaker 1: little bit, and we talk about that, and there's actually

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Speaker 1: let's talk about the things she had in the room

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Speaker 1: and kind of the overall everything, and then you know,

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Speaker 1: when we get into theories, I guess we can talk

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Speaker 1: a little more about how we feel about her. You know.

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Speaker 1: The problem with this case, and I'm sure I know

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Speaker 1: that Steve and I talked a little bit about this,

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Speaker 1: and I know he'll talk probably a little bit more

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Speaker 1: about this later, is that this case has like there's

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Speaker 1: almost no information. I think, you know, I bulked out

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Speaker 1: a page on this of like actual known facts on

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Speaker 1: this case, and that's with a heat with an entire

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Speaker 1: psalm in it up. Yeah, I'm just like totally like

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Speaker 1: sound half that day. I do. Yeah. But there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of a lot of talk about this, and a

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Speaker 1: lot of people have seemed to infer a lot of things,

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Speaker 1: a lot of stuff stuff sculus. There's like a forty

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Speaker 1: four page long web sleuth thread dedicated to this case

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Speaker 1: and sist, yeah, I know it is. That's why you

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Speaker 1: don't do these guys. Okay. So she did have a

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Speaker 1: number of miscellaneous items with her in the hotel room.

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Speaker 1: She had, um the lord jumpsuits plural, but I don't

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Speaker 1: know how many. I think maybe two would be my guest,

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Speaker 1: but I don't actually know they actually I think they.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, the track suits not jumpsuits, sorry,

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Speaker 1: track suits is the word that I meant. The tops

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Speaker 1: in the bottoms of the zippa putty um and either

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Speaker 1: depending on the account that you read, even they were

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Speaker 1: packed neatly in her luggage or hung neatly in the closet.

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Speaker 1: But it's always like neatly and orderly. She had a

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Speaker 1: pair of shoes. She had a pair of size ten slippers,

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Speaker 1: which is what she was. She had a nice pair

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Speaker 1: of black leather gloves, which I understand were maybe from Nordstrum's,

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Speaker 1: but I don't know where people may have picked that

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Speaker 1: up from. I think it was a brand. Um. She

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Speaker 1: had a nice leather purse. She had some I stay

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Speaker 1: Lauder cosmetics, toothpaste, perfume, meta mucil, packs of dry crystal

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Speaker 1: lite pantyhose, and iron and a kitchen bowl. Not totally

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Speaker 1: clear on the bowl or I guess I would. I

256
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Speaker 1: guess add the iron in there too. But everything else

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Speaker 1: seems totally normal for a trip. Actually, you know, it

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Speaker 1: sounds to me like if you're a regular hotel goer. Um,

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Speaker 1: most hotels have a fridge and things like that, and

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Speaker 1: they usually have like little plastic disposable captain glasses. They

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Speaker 1: usually don't have bowls. So so if you like to

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Speaker 1: save money and just eat a little cereal for breakfast

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Speaker 1: in your room, for example, having a bowl is a

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Speaker 1: handy thing. It's the iron is the same thing. You

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Speaker 1: can get an iron from the front desk. Typically, all

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Speaker 1: I've ever stayed in has a has a. I've been

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Speaker 1: in many hotel rooms where you have to go to

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Speaker 1: the front desk to get the iron. Really, yes, you

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Speaker 1: must be staying in a crappy hotel. Hotel, I mean

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Speaker 1: there in the room. Yeah, this is a nice ho tell.

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Speaker 1: So they would have had an iron. I wouldn't make

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Speaker 1: that presumption. But the point is, I'm following what Joe saying,

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Speaker 1: is that if you're if you're traveling frequently, that's something

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Speaker 1: you would have just in case you don't have to

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Speaker 1: try and find somebody at the office at five am

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Speaker 1: when you need to iron something. I guess I'll just

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Speaker 1: point out, however, that um leggings, uh T shirt and

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Speaker 1: blower jumpsuits are not exactly do not support the need

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Speaker 1: to iron. Yeah, I will agree. Yeah, maybe it was

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Speaker 1: an interrogation device. Maybe yeah. And I'll just mention that

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Speaker 1: the lead investor on this case, I've read a couple

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Speaker 1: of interviews with him, and he has said over the

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Speaker 1: years that there was a newspaper that was open that

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Speaker 1: had a couple of maple leaves on it, and said

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Speaker 1: that he and the other investigators at the time just

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Speaker 1: saw it, and I think they just assumed that they

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Speaker 1: would find out. I mean, you know, by all accounts,

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Speaker 1: this should have been an open and shut case. They

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Speaker 1: had her name, they had her address, they had her

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Speaker 1: phone number, they should have been able to figure out

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Speaker 1: who she was. Um. And so they didn't really pay

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Speaker 1: attention to these things. UM and he thinks there may

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Speaker 1: have been some significance in that, or that she left

294
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Speaker 1: a clue or something like that in that that arrangement,

295
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Speaker 1: but that they never actually paid much attention to it.

296
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Speaker 1: So I will mention that, and that is that maybe

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Speaker 1: the clue that's lost to the ages. But on the

298
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Speaker 1: other hand, I don't necessarily think so, you know, it

299
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Speaker 1: could be as simple as it's October in Seattle, or

300
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Speaker 1: and and she saw some good looking leaves, or it

301
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Speaker 1: could mean she was a Canadian secret agent or something

302
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Speaker 1: else or just Canadian. Yeah, or it could be nothing.

303
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Speaker 1: Yet she paid, as I mentioned, in cash for both

304
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Speaker 1: nights ended up being about three and fifty dollars. It

305
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:57,160
Speaker 1: was a hundred and seventy five dollars a night cash,

306
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Speaker 1: which is not significantly less than it is out. But

307
00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:04,159
Speaker 1: it's like five hundred and fifty dollars in cash, and

308
00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:08,200
Speaker 1: that's not that's nothing. That's not nothing. And she didn't

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Speaker 1: have a whole lot of money with her. I think

310
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Speaker 1: she maybe had like thirty four dollars in her wallet,

311
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Speaker 1: but no idea or anything like that. Um. She reportedly

312
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Speaker 1: when she checked in, she didn't speak with an accent

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Speaker 1: or anything like that. The police, you know, when they

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Speaker 1: were called and they were searching the room, they did

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Speaker 1: find uh empty glass on the nightstand next to her

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Speaker 1: that was found to have traces of cyanide in it um,

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Speaker 1: which is the way that that was her cause of

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Speaker 1: death is she killed herself by cyanide poisoning. And that's it.

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Speaker 1: That's literally everything we know about Mary Anderson. Much has

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Speaker 1: been written about her, but nobody knows what the hell.

321
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Speaker 1: Nobody knows anything. Yeah, they did. I think they did

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Speaker 1: check out like East Coast, just to see if she

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Speaker 1: was from New York, which is where the address was.

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Speaker 1: But the address was non existent, and actually it does,

325
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Speaker 1: it's not non existent, exists, but it just it's just

326
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Speaker 1: the street address exists in New York. But she gave

327
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Speaker 1: the wrong ZIP code to go with it. Yeah, and

328
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Speaker 1: she just wrote new York, New York, which a lot

329
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Speaker 1: of people from New York have mentioned. You don't say

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Speaker 1: New York New York, you say like Queens New York. Right. Well,

331
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Speaker 1: if you're if you're from one of those places and

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Speaker 1: then the area code of the of the phone number

333
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Speaker 1: that she gave was also totally the wrong area code

334
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Speaker 1: for that area, but apparently it was a fairly limited

335
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Speaker 1: areas like New York number though it is, but I

336
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Speaker 1: think it was like upstate New York or something. Um.

337
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Speaker 1: I probably could have googled this and found out, but

338
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Speaker 1: it's all just kind of it's all wrong. So I

339
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Speaker 1: guess for me, I don't put a lot of stock

340
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Speaker 1: and interest into oh, this address, she like thought a

341
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Speaker 1: lot about it. I don't think she did. And then

342
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Speaker 1: in terms of Mary and actually indicates something though it might, yeah,

343
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Speaker 1: might it indicates to me she's not from New York.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I would agree with that, Yeah, totally. I

345
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Speaker 1: would also say that if she were from the East Coast,

346
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Speaker 1: most people from the East Coast speak with an accent,

347
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Speaker 1: and a hotel clerk in Seattle would have said, yeah,

348
00:19:07,119 --> 00:19:09,919
Speaker 1: she spoke with a I don't think no accent doesn't

349
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Speaker 1: pertain just to no heavy European or you know, English

350
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Speaker 1: wasn't her first language accent. I think it equates to

351
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Speaker 1: no no accent whatsoever. Yeah, But I mean there's also

352
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Speaker 1: she could have had a very slight accent. I have

353
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Speaker 1: a friend who's from New York, and I don't ever

354
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Speaker 1: notice an accent until she takes a trip back to

355
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Speaker 1: New York and she shows up at the office and

356
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Speaker 1: suddenly she sounds like she's from like she's from New York.

357
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Speaker 1: It comes and then it bleeds away slowly over time.

358
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Speaker 1: Maybe that's what accents do. Yeah, yeah, go ahead. Did

359
00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:48,440
Speaker 1: you want to talk about we gotta we gotta talk

360
00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:50,560
Speaker 1: about the New York stuff at any time? Or should

361
00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:52,440
Speaker 1: we talk about it now? We talk about it now? Well,

362
00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:54,760
Speaker 1: you got the thing about New York is that's great

363
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Speaker 1: if you're on the West coast. Is it's like clear

364
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Speaker 1: across the continent. It's a really huge city. So if

365
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Speaker 1: you run into somebody it was from New York, you

366
00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:03,040
Speaker 1: need to say, oh great. But everybody's from New York,

367
00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:05,639
Speaker 1: so not surprising. We don't know each other obviously. And

368
00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:07,879
Speaker 1: but what is kind of clever? I don't know if

369
00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,160
Speaker 1: she was clever at that's just purely accidental. The address

370
00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:15,200
Speaker 1: was like one thirty two weeks Third Street and there there.

371
00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:17,760
Speaker 1: That address is in two places. It's in Lower Manhattan

372
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Speaker 1: and it's in Brooklyn. And so she was that clever

373
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Speaker 1: in picking her alias in her legend. Then that's really awesome.

374
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Speaker 1: She can stay from me a third Street and they say,

375
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Speaker 1: oh my god, I used to live right around the corner.

376
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Speaker 1: And then she said, oh, well, I lived on the

377
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Speaker 1: one in Brooklyn, or vice versa. I mean, maybe she

378
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Speaker 1: did that, she was that clever. I mean, I guess

379
00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:40,000
Speaker 1: I don't think she, to be honest, I don't think

380
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:42,639
Speaker 1: she put that much thought into I mean, right, what

381
00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:49,119
Speaker 1: it's it's one second. I mean like it's just like

382
00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:53,239
Speaker 1: one to three Northwest Third Avenue. I mean, like if

383
00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:56,359
Speaker 1: there's not a that's not a made up address, I

384
00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:59,200
Speaker 1: really don't. I don't know what it is, you know. Yeah,

385
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:01,440
Speaker 1: but think, well, the other thing about New York is

386
00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:04,520
Speaker 1: that um and you can't appreciate it this if you're

387
00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:07,119
Speaker 1: not from the Northeast, you can't really appreciate this. But

388
00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:10,040
Speaker 1: everybody in the rest of American knows all about New York,

389
00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:13,119
Speaker 1: and so it's a natural pick if you're from If

390
00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:15,680
Speaker 1: you're not from the Northeast and you're looking for just

391
00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 1: a fake city to throw out there, this big well

392
00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:20,240
Speaker 1: in New York, it obviously comes to mind for everybody

393
00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:23,719
Speaker 1: in America. Yeah, yeah, pretty much that New York of course. Yeah, obviously,

394
00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:26,200
Speaker 1: that's why I think she's probably from the West. Yeah,

395
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:29,720
Speaker 1: I think New York is a I mean, yeah, totally

396
00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:32,040
Speaker 1: it is. Um and then, uh. The other thing that

397
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:37,320
Speaker 1: people have mentioned, which is actually probably true, is that

398
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 1: at the time, there are two major soap operas that

399
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:43,800
Speaker 1: were on Both of them had leading characters who were

400
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:47,680
Speaker 1: named Mary Anderson. On them, there were um and So

401
00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:53,040
Speaker 1: I think Days of Our Lives and that other one,

402
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:56,280
Speaker 1: which is the one that has the it doesn't matter

403
00:21:56,600 --> 00:22:01,600
Speaker 1: too popular. I was looking at you like you're you're

404
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:09,720
Speaker 1: asking me, I know my children? Yeah, been, um so,

405
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:13,000
Speaker 1: there were there were some major characters that were, you know,

406
00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:15,639
Speaker 1: popular at the time that were named Mary Anderson. Not

407
00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,120
Speaker 1: that Mary Anderson is like a hard name to pull

408
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:19,960
Speaker 1: out of a hat anyway. But on top of that,

409
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:25,720
Speaker 1: there's really after the whole Luke and Laura thing. Oh,

410
00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:28,720
Speaker 1: it's time for Steve to making references that Devon doesn't

411
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:32,240
Speaker 1: get perfect. I'm trying to remember Luke and Laura. I

412
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:35,240
Speaker 1: don't remember that either, but you can google it. I

413
00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:37,399
Speaker 1: remember Jack and Jennifer from Days of Our Lives. I

414
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:40,560
Speaker 1: got kind of tedious after a while. I have never

415
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:43,280
Speaker 1: ever watched soap opera, though I don't know what either

416
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:45,480
Speaker 1: of you are talking about. So here's a couple of

417
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,719
Speaker 1: we'll do the bullet point things and then we'll get

418
00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 1: into theories that work for you guys. Okay, So, people

419
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 1: a lot of times mentioned that she looked like she

420
00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:00,720
Speaker 1: was European, which is accurate. I would. She's a very

421
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 1: distinct kind of like Greek look to her. What you're

422
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,399
Speaker 1: looking at me like, I'm insane? I mean, I didn't.

423
00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,480
Speaker 1: I didn't pick up that. That's all. She looks European

424
00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:11,720
Speaker 1: to me. But again, she didn't speak with an accent,

425
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:14,600
Speaker 1: so I think she was American or maybe Canadian, but

426
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,600
Speaker 1: maybe the accent or something the middle of European. Is

427
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:21,359
Speaker 1: that what you're thinking? I'm sorry? Was it maybe the hairstyle?

428
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:23,960
Speaker 1: I don't know what it is about her. She just

429
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,600
Speaker 1: has that kind of look about her. But but I mean,

430
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:31,040
Speaker 1: people look like I look Italian and I'm not actually

431
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:33,879
Speaker 1: from Italy. It's just my heritage. So it's not unheard

432
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:37,119
Speaker 1: of too. We should make a quick note here for

433
00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:40,359
Speaker 1: everybody is as far as I'm aware, all we have

434
00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 1: is drawings of her face. You know, I've seen references

435
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:49,159
Speaker 1: to Morgue photos, but I have not been able to

436
00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:51,479
Speaker 1: I didn't see it either. Yeah, they were. They were

437
00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:55,879
Speaker 1: all either photoshops or pencil sketches by you know, the police,

438
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,919
Speaker 1: artists or somebody, and you know, an attempt to identify her.

439
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:04,480
Speaker 1: But I haven't ever seen an actual verifiable photograph of

440
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 1: this woman. So yeah, might bring a little bit on

441
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:11,120
Speaker 1: soft information. It might have been that her her work

442
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:12,800
Speaker 1: photo was kind of gruesome. I mean, I don't know

443
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 1: what dying from sinide is like, but I imagine it

444
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 1: could be nasty, you know. Actually that's the thing is

445
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 1: um When the hotel staff initially came in, they literally

446
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 1: thought she was just taking an app They thought she

447
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:26,240
Speaker 1: was just a really heavy sleeper. They thought she was

448
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:27,840
Speaker 1: just asleep, and then they tried to wake her up,

449
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 1: and they were like, oh, oh, I thought she was

450
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:31,240
Speaker 1: just asleep. And then she did normally slept with this

451
00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 1: horror hideous grimace on her face. No, I think she

452
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:37,600
Speaker 1: I think she literally just felt. I think that's maybe

453
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,080
Speaker 1: how sanide does it. Is you just you fall asleep

454
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:41,920
Speaker 1: and you never wake up. I don't know, but that's

455
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,120
Speaker 1: what it looks like apparently, is she was just asleep

456
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:47,280
Speaker 1: peacefully asleep. All I know about sinides what have learned

457
00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:49,680
Speaker 1: in movies, and I don't trust that. Yeah, that's probably

458
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 1: h Yeah, so she had those scars on her breasts,

459
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:56,879
Speaker 1: and uh, I've read a lot of stuff that people

460
00:24:57,119 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 1: online have said where they're like, well, obviously it was

461
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,520
Speaker 1: a boob job. No, there was nothing in there. Yeah,

462
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:04,600
Speaker 1: there was no implant, There were no implants or anything.

463
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 1: It could have been a lift. It could have been

464
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,800
Speaker 1: a reduction. A lift is kind of well, I mean

465
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:12,560
Speaker 1: all of them are kind of boobed. I mean, you

466
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:16,000
Speaker 1: get your accept your deviated septum in your nose fixed,

467
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:18,000
Speaker 1: and it's still a nose job, right, even though like

468
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 1: you're it's just so you can breathe. I mean, any So,

469
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, it was a boob job technically, but

470
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:26,680
Speaker 1: she it wasn't an augmentation. I've heard a lot of

471
00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 1: people say that they thought that it was a reduction,

472
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,440
Speaker 1: and that's certainly possible. Although the couple of people that

473
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 1: I know who have gotten reductions, and this I mean

474
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 1: no offense by this at all. The people who I

475
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:41,520
Speaker 1: know who have had reductions have had to have been

476
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:46,480
Speaker 1: on um like really strict weight loss regimes. For whatever reason.

477
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,840
Speaker 1: I don't know why, but they've had to be maintain

478
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 1: their weight within a certain amount of weight. Typically it's

479
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:56,920
Speaker 1: because reductions are done because it's a strain on the

480
00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,600
Speaker 1: lower back based on the side of the breast higher back,

481
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:01,920
Speaker 1: but well it's on the it's a backstraight and so

482
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:05,639
Speaker 1: if you're able to reduce your weight, there is the

483
00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,879
Speaker 1: potential that the rest will not be as large. Therefore

484
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 1: were reduced the strain. But I will say is that

485
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,960
Speaker 1: when I read the description of the scarring, it matches

486
00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:20,719
Speaker 1: up with this what I have. I have friends who

487
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 1: have had had reductions, and it matches the style, especially

488
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 1: from kind of that day and age, and then in

489
00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 1: the nineties. I don't know if they well, I don't

490
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: know if they leave the same kind of scarring today

491
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:37,160
Speaker 1: because have advanced. I don't think they do. I don't

492
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 1: they do pinholes right, and I think they do something

493
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 1: that's much less invasive. My point is is that scarring

494
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,359
Speaker 1: match up with what I am aware of is the

495
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 1: aftermath of a reduction in that era. I would agree

496
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:51,680
Speaker 1: with that might have reduced your way and then just

497
00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:56,120
Speaker 1: like started like towards the end of your life. Yeah.

498
00:26:56,520 --> 00:26:59,440
Speaker 1: The other thing that I saw, I threw you, Jenny Gregg.

499
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:01,879
Speaker 1: I mean the other thing that I saw that I

500
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:06,720
Speaker 1: thought was a really interesting suggestion was that um that

501
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 1: maybe she had breast cancer and that there were some

502
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 1: lump removal things. I think that the Emmy would have known,

503
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: like would have been other signs in her body. That

504
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:19,320
Speaker 1: doesn't that doesn't add up. I don't, I agree, but

505
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 1: I thought it was an interesting theory. It is interesting.

506
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:24,920
Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't think they do both sides. I've

507
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,000
Speaker 1: never heard of them trying to balance him out, like

508
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,160
Speaker 1: you know, like like cutting up in one taking out

509
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,320
Speaker 1: a certain amount of material. Well, I mean if if

510
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,120
Speaker 1: she had tumors in both, I mean that's certainly possible.

511
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 1: I mean a double most sect to me is a thing. Yeah,

512
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 1: they weren't trying to balance her, Joel, they were just

513
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,880
Speaker 1: taking stuff out of both of them. Yeah, the whole

514
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,400
Speaker 1: thing is screwy. Yeah. And then one of the other

515
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 1: things is she did have that copper I U D

516
00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:55,040
Speaker 1: and so UM the serial number was partially off, which

517
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:57,480
Speaker 1: doesn't surprise me at all, having had I U D

518
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 1: s like they're in you for ten years. Um, stuff

519
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 1: just degrades while it's in your body. That just happens,

520
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 1: so they were unable to track it that way, which

521
00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 1: again isn't surprising at all. But also, you know, a

522
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 1: copper i U D it's good for ten years, so

523
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 1: situations change. But your doctor usually isn't going to give

524
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:17,920
Speaker 1: you a copper i U D unless you have a

525
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:22,960
Speaker 1: stable partner and you're still in your child bearing years,

526
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:27,840
Speaker 1: which she was if she was thirty three to five,

527
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: which is why I think. Also they did a cross

528
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 1: section of her rib to find her age, which I

529
00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 1: think is probably fairly accurate, but I she does look

530
00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: much older than that, so I think people get a

531
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 1: lot really caught up in that. But I I think

532
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: that the fact that she had an i U D

533
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: does speak more towards she was the age that the

534
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 1: Emmy said she was. The One of the things about

535
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 1: it is that her hairstyle definitely makes her look older, yeah,

536
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: And her makeup yeah makes her look older, but that

537
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,320
Speaker 1: hair really definitely yeah. I mean, I think those and

538
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: she's running around in Juicy Cotur. Well, I don't think

539
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 1: it was Juicy Cotur. I mean I think they would

540
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,160
Speaker 1: have mentioned maybe if it was Juicy Tour. I don't know,

541
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:14,920
Speaker 1: maybe they wouldn't have if I. I don't know, but

542
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:18,680
Speaker 1: I think you know that's that's the age, particularly when

543
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 1: some women are used to wearing makeup the way that

544
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: they did in their twenties and it just ends up

545
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 1: aging them more than making them look younger, you know,

546
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 1: and you're like late thirties, early forties if you haven't

547
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 1: evolved your makeup process and your hairstyle. And I am

548
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 1: yep ye. So you know. The funny thing that I

549
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:41,960
Speaker 1: find about this and there's several points in this story

550
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:46,120
Speaker 1: where this could pop up, but people make very large

551
00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:51,280
Speaker 1: presumptions his story. And one of the things that sparks

552
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 1: that is the fact that she has the U D.

553
00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 1: It's going to call it you I D, which isn't

554
00:29:56,120 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 1: a thing. Well it is, but it's an unidentified I'll

555
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:04,720
Speaker 1: tell you, okay, but no. The point is is that,

556
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 1: as you said, they're good for ten to twelve years.

557
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 1: It's old technology ten years. Take it out at the

558
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: ten year mark. It's not as if the thing starts

559
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 1: ticking inside of you and an alarm goes off. That says,

560
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 1: a board, a board, a board that you know, like

561
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 1: people can keep them. It has happened. Well, I suppose

562
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:28,960
Speaker 1: that's true. But but you know, I mean, who knows.

563
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: But you know, the important thing is is why did

564
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 1: Why the hell didn't they look at the serial numbers?

565
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 1: Anyway I would have taken a little bit of work.

566
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 1: But you know, they didn't have a full serial number

567
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 1: they looked up they had half them. That's you know

568
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 1: that they still should they still should have been able

569
00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 1: to find something. No, not at all, Are you kidding me?

570
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 1: It's like, so it's a part I mean, it's like

571
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:51,680
Speaker 1: a part number. It's like a batch number. Say it's

572
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:53,840
Speaker 1: an eight digit number, and you only have four of

573
00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:57,320
Speaker 1: the digits, Well, that just cuts the stock that they

574
00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,240
Speaker 1: have sold in the least ten years and half. That's

575
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 1: still a giant pie. Well but but the point that

576
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 1: I was getting out about that is that people say, well,

577
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: she had to be a lady of means to have

578
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 1: had that or two have afforded that. I her the

579
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 1: scars on her breasts and the belief that it is

580
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:21,880
Speaker 1: a reduction that she had to have some means and

581
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,760
Speaker 1: good insurance. They say that about the I U D.

582
00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:27,960
Speaker 1: But my point is the iu D has been around forever.

583
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 1: It is cheap technology, and it is readily available everywhere,

584
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 1: so just it. I find it funny that that is

585
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 1: one of those things that people leap frog from. She

586
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,040
Speaker 1: had an I U D too, she must have been

587
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 1: at least someone's not. It's not cheap technology, first of all,

588
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: especially if you're paying for it out of pocket to

589
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 1: actually get one. It's not. It's not cheap, but there

590
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 1: are clinics that do it for free if you need it,

591
00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:01,120
Speaker 1: so it can be cheap. That's that. And then and

592
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 1: then I think to your point, I think I see

593
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 1: people if they say it was a lift, they say

594
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 1: it was she's a woman of means who cared about

595
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 1: her appearance, and he did make up blah blah blah.

596
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:13,840
Speaker 1: But a reduction, like your insurance will cover that if

597
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: if you mean, because it's right, I don't think your insurance.

598
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 1: I don't think your insurance pays for a lift, But

599
00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: I think your insurance will pay for a reduction. So again,

600
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,280
Speaker 1: you don't you Yeah, you probably have to be insured,

601
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 1: but you don't have to be of great means. No,

602
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:30,280
Speaker 1: it's not that fantastically expensive. But the thing about it

603
00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 1: is is you're not going to pay ten grand to

604
00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:35,640
Speaker 1: get a hangnail fixed. But when it comes to the boobs.

605
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of people place huge importance on

606
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 1: the boobs. Well that's been good coin on it. But

607
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: you have to have But that's the point is you

608
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 1: have to have that extra ten grand laying around. Well yeah,

609
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 1: but when you say someone of means, what does that mean?

610
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:50,080
Speaker 1: I mean ten grand is a lot of money to me.

611
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:51,960
Speaker 1: Well yeah, but I mean some of the somebody means,

612
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,360
Speaker 1: I mean that's I'm thinking, like somebody's upper middle class.

613
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 1: I'm just got you know, kind of yes, yeah, yeah,

614
00:32:58,160 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: that's what means. But but I mean there are people

615
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 1: who are far below the upper middle class who get

616
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 1: this kind of worked out. Well okay, but there's always outliers.

617
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 1: And I mean I've been to I've been to Argentina

618
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 1: where everybody gets it. Every woman gets it, and you

619
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 1: know there's lots of people who really can't afford it

620
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 1: and they do it anyway. And so yeah, people will

621
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 1: get it. You don't have to be a means. So, Um,

622
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: what I'm learning from this is that we need to

623
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: start a Kickstarter for Joe's boob job. Yeah you So

624
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,960
Speaker 1: the other point about this I U D thing is, um,

625
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 1: the Emmy also was able to conclude from her autopsy

626
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 1: that Mary had never had children, so that is also

627
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: an important fact. Um. Okay, so I heard I'm not

628
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 1: sure if this is true or not. Actually I've heard

629
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 1: both ways. But I've heard that she mixed the metal

630
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 1: mucil with her cyanide. Well that's good, I mean, she's

631
00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 1: going to have, you know, regular poops. Yeah, but I

632
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:58,440
Speaker 1: also heard that she had mixed crystal light with her

633
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 1: metal mucil, and that she had mixed just the crystal

634
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:08,040
Speaker 1: light with the cyanide or maybe all three. There was

635
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 1: something to cut the flavor essentially, but we don't know

636
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:14,880
Speaker 1: us sure. Yeah, I can imagine that metamusel would make

637
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 1: sanide go down much easier. And I have heard that

638
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:21,759
Speaker 1: crystal light makes meta musel go down even easier. So

639
00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:26,920
Speaker 1: I wonder I wonder she was older it memusel and

640
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 1: crystal do kind of associate with like kind of older people. Yeah,

641
00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:32,280
Speaker 1: but you have to remember this is ninety six crystal

642
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: Like everybody drink crystal light, you know, like we're talking

643
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,880
Speaker 1: like right now. Yeah, that's like old people behavior because

644
00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 1: it's the behavior of people when they were in there,

645
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 1: like late thirties, early forties, and you know, twenty years ago,

646
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:51,759
Speaker 1: so old people looking at you, Joe, I mean that

647
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,200
Speaker 1: So for me, that's again you know it is yeah

648
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:57,520
Speaker 1: right now I'm like, that's an old person behavior. But

649
00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 1: I'm trying to remember back to the midnight panties and

650
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,560
Speaker 1: think like, oh no that was MEO is still around

651
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:09,239
Speaker 1: using MEO in my water? Was ever really the in thing?

652
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,439
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no, crystal light the crystal light part

653
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,480
Speaker 1: of it. But hey, Meta Musel, sometimes you just gotta you,

654
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:18,520
Speaker 1: you know, especially if you're traveling, you kind of want to.

655
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:22,800
Speaker 1: She could have had intessal issues. She could have like ibs.

656
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: Some people who have ibs they back up very easy,

657
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: and so it's kind of a general regiment. You're always

658
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 1: taking something that's going to keep the floor. But I

659
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,440
Speaker 1: will tell you seriously, you know, when I travel, you

660
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 1: get so dehydrt on airplanes that like sometimes you just

661
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 1: once you're there, you gotta like take a little some

662
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:41,200
Speaker 1: to please tell me when we go to crime Con,

663
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 1: I'm going to see that in your carry on pointed

664
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:49,920
Speaker 1: out you will not know, I think, just kidding. Um okay.

665
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:54,760
Speaker 1: So also cyanide, how did she get the cyanide? Good question,

666
00:35:55,760 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 1: jewelers can get cyanide. They use it. That's how his

667
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 1: name got it, you know that's his name. Who famous

668
00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:07,560
Speaker 1: guy who poisoned people with cyanide. Well, they're not the

669
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,719
Speaker 1: only ones that have access to cyanide. They're not the

670
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,960
Speaker 1: only ones. It's just like a pretty easy jump. Apparently

671
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 1: nail text sometimes have access to cyanide. Miners have access

672
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:20,920
Speaker 1: to cyanide, though I don't think she was a miner.

673
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,319
Speaker 1: Process uses cyanide. You can also make it. I heard

674
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,960
Speaker 1: you can make it from like apricot seeds, so that

675
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 1: takes a long time. I would say she probably bought it. Yeah,

676
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: it would be much easier to just go acquired through

677
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:38,280
Speaker 1: an industrial means. I think it actually at one point

678
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:43,919
Speaker 1: though it was Amazon around in Google wasn't even around there.

679
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 1: You could up until I think around two thousand or

680
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:51,800
Speaker 1: two thousand five, there were some ways to buy it

681
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,040
Speaker 1: on the internet. Okay, let's be fair. There are still

682
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: ways to buy it on the internet. You through Amazon

683
00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,359
Speaker 1: one point until Amazon cotton dawn and stopped the whole

684
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:09,480
Speaker 1: thing and it got much more, much more rigorous. Um.

685
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,640
Speaker 1: She also had a prescription pill bottle that the label

686
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:18,080
Speaker 1: had been torn off of so there was no name there,

687
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:21,759
Speaker 1: but she did have a prescription. I figured that I

688
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:23,640
Speaker 1: don't know, I don't know it was in there. They

689
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:26,320
Speaker 1: just talked about it, but maybe it was the cyanide.

690
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,240
Speaker 1: And also the other thing is that we uh don't

691
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 1: I haven't seen anywhere what kind of form the cyanide

692
00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: was in, because I think that would have given us

693
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 1: some more clues into liquid yeah, or potassium cyanide or

694
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:45,800
Speaker 1: you know, like stuff like that. And then last, but

695
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:49,800
Speaker 1: not least, is that people have suggested that she returned

696
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 1: to this specific hotel in this specific room because it

697
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:56,759
Speaker 1: had sentimental value to her. But she didn't make a

698
00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 1: reservation or anything. She's walked off the street. People said

699
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 1: the room might have had significant she didn't request the room.

700
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:06,600
Speaker 1: Did She didn't request the room, She didn't make a reservation.

701
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:08,879
Speaker 1: She just walked in off the street and got a room.

702
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 1: So I don't think that's That's not one of those

703
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,239
Speaker 1: things that people make up people. Yeah, a lot a

704
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,240
Speaker 1: lot of people on the on the inner webs, etcetera,

705
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 1: like to turn these into big set and soap opera stories. Yeah.

706
00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, this is again another example of

707
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 1: people just reaching for anything and then that being parodied

708
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:31,760
Speaker 1: and becoming part of the real story quote unquote real story.

709
00:38:33,920 --> 00:38:36,000
Speaker 1: So you guys want to talk about theories about whom

710
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: Mary Anderson might be really quickly. So let's take a

711
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 1: break first. Oh yeah, I want a sandwich. Yeah, Henry

712
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 1: doesn't like his neighbors. It wouldn't be going too far

713
00:38:49,080 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 1: to say that his neighbors hate him as well. And uh, yeah,

714
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,000
Speaker 1: he hates his neighbors. So Henry is not a very

715
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:58,240
Speaker 1: happy guy. He says, they're always making way too much noise,

716
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 1: and he just knows one of these days they're gonna

717
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 1: come into his den and take it all away from him.

718
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:07,440
Speaker 1: This not so little Taxi day at Texas sits out

719
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:09,799
Speaker 1: at his house for hours on end, just in case

720
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 1: someone tries to come along and take it from him. Yeah,

721
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 1: Henry has a bad attitude and it shows. Sitting there

722
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:19,200
Speaker 1: all day long really doesn't help. Protecting your home should

723
00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:22,160
Speaker 1: be a heck of a lot easier, right, and you

724
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:25,080
Speaker 1: shouldn't have to sit out there all day long. I mean,

725
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 1: do you want to have more of a life than

726
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:30,840
Speaker 1: Henry the Badger? Yeah? I thought so. Well, we'd simply safe.

727
00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:33,520
Speaker 1: Your home is safe and That's why simply Safe is

728
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 1: making it simpler than ever to protect it. Would simply say,

729
00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 1: if you can get comprehensive, professionally monitored home security right online,

730
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 1: you can connect your security system to your smartphone and

731
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:47,439
Speaker 1: see everything that's going on at your home while you're

732
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 1: out at about not sitting at home like Henry. Order

733
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: today and get protected by the end of the week

734
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,040
Speaker 1: and get an exclusive tem percent discount when you go

735
00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:01,799
Speaker 1: to simply safe dot com slash criminal and order your

736
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 1: simply safe system. That's right, simply safe dot com slash criminal.

737
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:14,240
Speaker 1: Protecting your home means you no longer have to badger anyone. Okay,

738
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 1: we're back that ham sandwhich was awesome? Yeah was it? Yeah?

739
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 1: I wouldn't. I wouldn't either, So first up, just because

740
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 1: I didn't bring it up to share. So you've got

741
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,720
Speaker 1: a few people that I have a couple of people

742
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:36,360
Speaker 1: that have been that have been suggested as potential suspects

743
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:42,279
Speaker 1: suggested by who the internet? Um, but we yeah him, Um,

744
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,080
Speaker 1: but we're going to breeze right through these because there's

745
00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:47,719
Speaker 1: lots of problems with every single one of them. Um.

746
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:53,839
Speaker 1: So the first one is Sandra and Suley. She went

747
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: missing in May from New York. She was last seen

748
00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:01,959
Speaker 1: at a shopping plaza and then she was reported missing

749
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:06,360
Speaker 1: a week later after she was seen. She had a

750
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 1: black poodle like that, you know that was remember that

751
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 1: was popular in the nineties in the early two thousand's

752
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 1: to have little dogs. I guess it's still kind of

753
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 1: little dogs. She's a black poodle that went missing with

754
00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:20,200
Speaker 1: her um and I. As far as I know, they

755
00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:23,439
Speaker 1: didn't ever find anything. They found a couple of people

756
00:41:23,560 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 1: using her credit cards a little later, but uh, nobody

757
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:32,080
Speaker 1: really knows anything about her. Apparently she probably left with

758
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:34,480
Speaker 1: somebody she knew or of her own volition, and she

759
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:37,840
Speaker 1: was reported missing after she missed a couple of doctor's appointments.

760
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 1: That's kind of went through the red flag. Yeah, because

761
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,080
Speaker 1: she just lived alone in her apartment. She didn't have

762
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:48,359
Speaker 1: a significant other or anything like that. Yeah, murdered. Well,

763
00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:50,520
Speaker 1: so she was only five five, so she was a

764
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:54,879
Speaker 1: little short. She had dark brown hair, not reddish brown hair,

765
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:57,960
Speaker 1: and it didn't die. Die is a thing, but but

766
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:01,000
Speaker 1: you can tell when people die there, like in an autopsy,

767
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:02,920
Speaker 1: you can tell if that hair's died or not. She

768
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:05,320
Speaker 1: had a birthmark on her abdomen and a scar on

769
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:09,360
Speaker 1: her upper lip are our Mary Anderson had no birthmarks

770
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:13,479
Speaker 1: or scars, and then um, Sandra was like seven months

771
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 1: pregnant when she disappeared, and our Mary had never had

772
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:20,560
Speaker 1: a kid, had a little kid. She did not know.

773
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: So I mean, the way that this goes, people are

774
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:27,680
Speaker 1: willfully ignoring that she's too short and had no scars

775
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:30,880
Speaker 1: and didn't ever have a kid, and saying, oh, Mary

776
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:33,440
Speaker 1: is Sandra, and she had to give the kid up

777
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 1: for adoption, and then she was sad and every and alone,

778
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 1: every Yeah, I think it could have been one of

779
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,479
Speaker 1: the rhymes sisters. They picked their own desks and yeah,

780
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: maybe that wasn't well, you know, and people are going

781
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:49,239
Speaker 1: to say, okay, so we have to talk about this

782
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 1: at least briefly. People are saying, well, she never had

783
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:54,040
Speaker 1: a child, she was seven months pregnant. She may have

784
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:58,200
Speaker 1: never actually given birth to a live child. But if

785
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 1: there had been some kind of sea section or something

786
00:43:01,080 --> 00:43:04,320
Speaker 1: like that, we should have known about a scar. And

787
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know enough, but I would imagine

788
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 1: that even if it hadn't been a live birth, there

789
00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:15,440
Speaker 1: would have been the same evidence in you know, in

790
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 1: the is it. What's the it's your hips hips, thank you,

791
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 1: and I'm pretty sure that your hips at like and

792
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: this is different, like by seven months, her whole body

793
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:36,080
Speaker 1: should have already gone through. Yes, okay, so that one's dumb. Okay,

794
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:39,439
Speaker 1: that doesn't work. She had a baby and much too short.

795
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:43,880
Speaker 1: Next up is Elizabeth Mary Allen. She's got marrying her name,

796
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:48,839
Speaker 1: so maybe the last name star. She went missing from

797
00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:56,320
Speaker 1: Oak Harbor, Washington in UM three. She was five and

798
00:43:56,400 --> 00:44:00,520
Speaker 1: a d fifty pounds. She had blue eyes. Mary Anderson

799
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:03,640
Speaker 1: had brown eyes. She had a scar on her left elbow.

800
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:08,760
Speaker 1: Mary Anderson had no scars. I don't know why people

801
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:10,920
Speaker 1: think that it was her, except for that her picture

802
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:15,960
Speaker 1: kind of does resemble an age progressed potentially what Mary

803
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:19,800
Speaker 1: Anderson looked like. Carb Washington is not too far from Seattle.

804
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 1: It's not but it's I mean, it's not her. It's

805
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 1: not her. Kind of doubt it. It's not her. Yeah,

806
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:29,759
Speaker 1: there's serious issues there, unless like somehow they figured out

807
00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 1: how to change eye color and make her tallerant without scarring.

808
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 1: They think, yes, you right, just not her. This isn't Gattica, Yeah,

809
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:42,120
Speaker 1: exactly right. And he used contacts in that anyway, So

810
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:45,160
Speaker 1: and a lot of other really good tricks. Yeah, lots

811
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:52,080
Speaker 1: of them. Okay. So next is Mary Karin Amos again,

812
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:58,239
Speaker 1: another Mary with an aim. So she went missing in

813
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:04,200
Speaker 1: UH seven in from her home in San Bernardino, California.

814
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 1: And she was fifty four years old when she disappeared.

815
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 1: So no, Also she had green eyes. Also, she had

816
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 1: a vertical scar on her abdomen um, so she's way

817
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:25,600
Speaker 1: too old. She did have, she did have, she did

818
00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 1: have the upper dental plate. She's also five seven, so

819
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:34,719
Speaker 1: about the same height, but way too old. Not necessarily,

820
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 1: she would have been like sixty three, Amery could have

821
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:39,239
Speaker 1: been sixties, Marie, and could have been sixties. Why would

822
00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:41,800
Speaker 1: she have an I E D. Maybe she got to

823
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,400
Speaker 1: put in way back? Why don't she just forgot? I

824
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: think they would have noticed if it was like really old,

825
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:49,719
Speaker 1: because it's copper, so it's degrading in your body. And

826
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:52,040
Speaker 1: I think if it had been like a twenty year

827
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 1: old I U D. They would have known. It was

828
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:56,680
Speaker 1: also the brand. It was actually the brand Paraguard that

829
00:45:56,800 --> 00:45:59,400
Speaker 1: came out in the like early nineties, because you know,

830
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:02,040
Speaker 1: the ones in the eighties were like kind of dangerous

831
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:05,640
Speaker 1: and like ruined some women's systems, and so they pulled

832
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:07,680
Speaker 1: them from the market. And then in the nineties they

833
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:12,000
Speaker 1: released the Paraguards. Were those the copper ones, were those

834
00:46:12,080 --> 00:46:16,040
Speaker 1: the ones that had the hormone. They were the copper ones,

835
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:18,280
Speaker 1: and they were the ones that were called the copper Cross,

836
00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 1: that's what they called them. And then they rereleased this

837
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:23,680
Speaker 1: one called paragraph. It doesn't really matter, but I think

838
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:26,000
Speaker 1: they would have noticed if it was a much older

839
00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:31,800
Speaker 1: I think so too. Although the one sad thing about

840
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 1: poor Mary Amos is there was a twelve year delay

841
00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:38,840
Speaker 1: in her being reported. How does that happen? That happens

842
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:42,480
Speaker 1: a lot. Actually, yeah, I think it probably has some

843
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:45,640
Speaker 1: willful stuff going on in there. That's a case for

844
00:46:45,680 --> 00:46:48,719
Speaker 1: a different story. Yeah, all right, next week, okay, next

845
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:55,399
Speaker 1: week covers. Yeah, and it's going to be married months. Yeah.

846
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:57,760
Speaker 1: I should have held off on my Mary. You should

847
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:04,160
Speaker 1: have yeah, um, okay, so we're done with the named. Yeah.

848
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,600
Speaker 1: So some ideas of who she could have been is

849
00:47:07,960 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 1: like the wife of a jeweler. And I saw I

850
00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:13,239
Speaker 1: saw this one story that somebody had created on web

851
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:15,520
Speaker 1: slues and it was just like, oh my god, how

852
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:19,719
Speaker 1: did you get there? It was crazy Yeah. This person

853
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:23,960
Speaker 1: said that she was obviously the ex wife of a

854
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:28,480
Speaker 1: wealthy jeweler who was well kept, was used to caring

855
00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:32,719
Speaker 1: about herself. Um, but I mean she was like she

856
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:37,880
Speaker 1: was on the bigger side, and her hairstyle certainly didn't

857
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:39,960
Speaker 1: make me think that she cared a whole lot about

858
00:47:40,160 --> 00:47:44,200
Speaker 1: the way that she looked at Remember twenty years ago too, Yeah,

859
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:46,839
Speaker 1: but were a little different. Have you seen hairstyles from

860
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:50,800
Speaker 1: the nies, by the way. Yeah, But so the theory

861
00:47:50,960 --> 00:47:53,440
Speaker 1: was that, you know, she she was a kept wife

862
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:55,480
Speaker 1: and she was used to this life of luxury, and

863
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 1: she had gotten a breast lift. There we go, thank you,

864
00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:03,719
Speaker 1: that's her figured the handlett to signify the word list.

865
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:07,120
Speaker 1: She'd gotten a lift, and um, she you know, was

866
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: she was well kept. And then she had found out

867
00:48:09,719 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 1: that her jeweler husband was actually having an affair, so

868
00:48:13,239 --> 00:48:15,320
Speaker 1: she decided she didn't want to live anymore, so she

869
00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:17,680
Speaker 1: stole some cyanide from his jewelry shop and went and

870
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:19,719
Speaker 1: killed herself. I think this is right out of a

871
00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:24,719
Speaker 1: Daniel Steel novel, but changed the ending. Yeah, it's crazy. Well,

872
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:27,759
Speaker 1: you know, life does imitate art. Yeah, but yeah, that

873
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:29,440
Speaker 1: sets again, that's a bit of a stretch. I mean,

874
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:32,040
Speaker 1: the whole wife of the jeweler things hilarious and why

875
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:34,040
Speaker 1: wy couldn't she have been a jeweler. Well, she could

876
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:36,960
Speaker 1: have been a jeweler, yeah, or again, a nail tech. Apparently,

877
00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:40,279
Speaker 1: she could have been a pharmacist. She could have been Yeah,

878
00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:44,000
Speaker 1: she could have been married to a pharmacist, or a photographer.

879
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:47,239
Speaker 1: She could not have been a photographer doing that kind

880
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:49,879
Speaker 1: of work based on the way her hands looked. Yeah,

881
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: but otherwise, well, but that's actually why people suggest and

882
00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 1: I actually think it's not the worst suggestion ever, is

883
00:48:55,440 --> 00:48:57,799
Speaker 1: that she was a nail technician because her nails were

884
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:00,439
Speaker 1: very well kept and she seemed to really care about

885
00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:06,200
Speaker 1: her appearance, though it wasn't like on a Yeah, I mean,

886
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:08,919
Speaker 1: it's like the way that a working woman cares about

887
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:11,560
Speaker 1: her appearance. She her nails were done really really well,

888
00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 1: and then she would have had the access to the cyanide.

889
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:16,520
Speaker 1: I'm not really sure the one of the other questions,

890
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:19,560
Speaker 1: the whole cyanide nail tech thing, but I don't really know.

891
00:49:19,719 --> 00:49:22,640
Speaker 1: I know somebody will email us and they'll they'll write

892
00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 1: a dissertation on it, So I'm not going to go

893
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:28,120
Speaker 1: just great, I the other thought, and I think this

894
00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 1: is probably true, is that I mean, I at least

895
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:33,800
Speaker 1: I think it's a pretty solid theory. And the theory

896
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:37,239
Speaker 1: is that her husband had recently passed away and so

897
00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:40,680
Speaker 1: they had no kids. She probably didn't have any you know, family,

898
00:49:40,800 --> 00:49:44,680
Speaker 1: which is would be why nobody ever identified her. Or

899
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 1: that's where it's not outlandish, and that she just decided,

900
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:50,840
Speaker 1: you know what, I don't really want to be here anymore.

901
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:53,399
Speaker 1: I the love of my life is gone. I don't

902
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 1: have really anything keeping me going. And the picture that

903
00:49:56,840 --> 00:49:59,560
Speaker 1: the people painted for this one was, you know, it

904
00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:01,319
Speaker 1: kind of fit. When you look at her, you can

905
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:03,520
Speaker 1: hear like I understood this story totally. It was, you know,

906
00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:05,920
Speaker 1: the kind of woman who sells the house and closes

907
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 1: all the accounts and you know, leaves everything neat and

908
00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:11,560
Speaker 1: orderly and then goes away to somewhere where nobody will

909
00:50:11,640 --> 00:50:13,760
Speaker 1: know who she is, and you know, just very neatly

910
00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:16,560
Speaker 1: and quietly takes her own life, and then you know,

911
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:20,240
Speaker 1: hopes that her body will be used in some science

912
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:23,480
Speaker 1: some way, although she should have probably explicitly said like

913
00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:26,200
Speaker 1: I would like my organs to be donated, not do

914
00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:28,600
Speaker 1: with my body what you will. And also I'm pretty

915
00:50:28,600 --> 00:50:31,120
Speaker 1: sure that if you kill yourself with cyanide, that probably

916
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:33,480
Speaker 1: ruins a lot of the stuff in your body. She

917
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 1: probably could have gone to a body farm. And that

918
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:38,840
Speaker 1: was about it. Yeah. Yeah, med school, Yeah, no, couldn't

919
00:50:38,840 --> 00:50:41,359
Speaker 1: go to med school. Things would have been messed up. Well,

920
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,120
Speaker 1: maybe she could have gone to med school for like dissection.

921
00:50:44,239 --> 00:50:47,880
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know what they do ye

922
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:52,239
Speaker 1: section yeah. Um oh. And the other thing that I

923
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:56,279
Speaker 1: did see when they were talking about whatever her name

924
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:59,120
Speaker 1: was that um had the pet that was that went

925
00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:01,919
Speaker 1: missing was that somebody suggested that maybe the kitchen bowl.

926
00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 1: Because nobody's seen any pictures of the kitchen bowl, somebody

927
00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:07,640
Speaker 1: suggested that it was maybe a small yeah, yeah, that

928
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:10,560
Speaker 1: it was maybe a small bowl that like she carried

929
00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:13,000
Speaker 1: with her because she had been used to traveling with

930
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:18,600
Speaker 1: a pet, like a small dog or something. Yeah. She

931
00:51:18,680 --> 00:51:21,920
Speaker 1: could have also just mixed everything together in that bowl.

932
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 1: She could have. This was so planned out to actually

933
00:51:27,280 --> 00:51:30,800
Speaker 1: grind up to see a cyanide pillar or or the

934
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:35,840
Speaker 1: water in the crystal w Yeah, and then washed the

935
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:38,760
Speaker 1: bowl too, because she was that kind of person. Totally,

936
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:42,640
Speaker 1: people who just automatically do I am not one of them,

937
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:46,839
Speaker 1: but I live with one, and the world will end

938
00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:49,399
Speaker 1: before they will not get that bowl washed right away. Yeah,

939
00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:53,520
Speaker 1: oh yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Another theory that people had, and

940
00:51:53,600 --> 00:51:56,520
Speaker 1: I'm just throwing this out here. I'm not gonna expand

941
00:51:56,640 --> 00:52:00,319
Speaker 1: on it at all, really, is that she was there

942
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:03,360
Speaker 1: to be a witness, a witness to what is that

943
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:07,719
Speaker 1: like in a criminal Yeah, and she didn't want to

944
00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 1: do that, or she had because she was afraid to testify,

945
00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:13,200
Speaker 1: so she killed herself instead. Yeah, but it seems like

946
00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:15,480
Speaker 1: they would notice if the witness didn't show up. Yeah.

947
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:16,920
Speaker 1: I think that that would have put somebody would have

948
00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,360
Speaker 1: put two and two together. Yeah. That was that a

949
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:22,640
Speaker 1: web special there. That sounds more like webs louse and

950
00:52:22,680 --> 00:52:25,160
Speaker 1: read it. Yeah. And then the last theory was that

951
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:29,279
Speaker 1: maybe really do have ane think it's a little different. Yeah. Yeah.

952
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:32,239
Speaker 1: And then the last theory is that maybe um Mary

953
00:52:32,280 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 1: Anderson was a spy. Of course, she had been as

954
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:37,640
Speaker 1: by her whole life, and then you know, her usefulness

955
00:52:37,719 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 1: had had withered and she just decided was not long

956
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 1: after the Soviet Union folded. Yeah. Did you get that

957
00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 1: from an email Joe sent you? Because it sounds it

958
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:50,480
Speaker 1: sounds a lot like they don't. Yeah, actually, it's not

959
00:52:50,560 --> 00:52:53,160
Speaker 1: my theory at all, I think, I mean, the only

960
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:55,279
Speaker 1: reason I think people associate this with her being a

961
00:52:55,360 --> 00:52:57,840
Speaker 1: spy because of the cyanide, and so it's really for

962
00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 1: that reason, really absurd. I think it's a cyanide and

963
00:53:00,680 --> 00:53:05,000
Speaker 1: the unidentifiability of her. I mean, she's she has covered

964
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:07,719
Speaker 1: her tracks pretty dang. Well, man, how did he he

965
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 1: died from cyanide? Didn't he you? Okay, but just this

966
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:20,360
Speaker 1: is but other people have I mean, there's some connections recently,

967
00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 1: there are some connections to other cases where other people

968
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:28,440
Speaker 1: have killed themselves under pseudonymes with cyanide. So I mean overall,

969
00:53:28,560 --> 00:53:31,719
Speaker 1: we literally don't know. We literally don't know anything about

970
00:53:31,760 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 1: this case. We don't know anything about Mary Anderson. We

971
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:38,040
Speaker 1: don't have any leads whatsoever. Um, so you've just wasted

972
00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:40,720
Speaker 1: like an hour of our time. I have nothing about

973
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 1: I feel like that's like literally every single episode of ours.

974
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:46,920
Speaker 1: Well you know, actually, you know it might be we're

975
00:53:46,920 --> 00:53:48,480
Speaker 1: putting the word out there might be one of our

976
00:53:48,560 --> 00:53:51,480
Speaker 1: listeners knows that Mary Anderson will crack the case, you know,

977
00:53:51,600 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 1: so it might not have been a complete waste of

978
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:57,279
Speaker 1: your time. Yeah, okay, yeah, but on the spying thing,

979
00:53:57,320 --> 00:53:59,920
Speaker 1: I think I do think though that say, if she

980
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:02,160
Speaker 1: had been some sort of a sleeper agent, she probably

981
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:04,320
Speaker 1: just would have gone back to the Soviet Union or

982
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:10,239
Speaker 1: Hungry or wherever she came from, probably family back. There

983
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:12,520
Speaker 1: no reason to kill yourself just because the Soviet Union

984
00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:15,320
Speaker 1: went away. Um, and and to point out because I

985
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:17,520
Speaker 1: know somebody will say, well, maybe she was too sick

986
00:54:17,600 --> 00:54:22,160
Speaker 1: to travel. She, according to her autopsy, was perfectly good health.

987
00:54:22,239 --> 00:54:24,840
Speaker 1: She didn't think she was overweight. But yeah, but no cancer,

988
00:54:25,040 --> 00:54:32,279
Speaker 1: no like massive obvious things going wrong, like she was fine. Yeah. Yeah,

989
00:54:32,920 --> 00:54:35,719
Speaker 1: she might have just realized that, well, you know, I'm

990
00:54:35,800 --> 00:54:38,239
Speaker 1: just kind of in middle age right now. It's only

991
00:54:38,280 --> 00:54:40,319
Speaker 1: gonna be downhill from here. It's not gonna get any better.

992
00:54:40,400 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 1: What the hell her own terms? Yeah, going out in

993
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:45,680
Speaker 1: the high note, I guess, But that's what I mean.

994
00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:47,839
Speaker 1: There there are people in that situation. I mean there are,

995
00:54:48,160 --> 00:54:50,960
Speaker 1: it's on my terms or not, and I prefer my terms.

996
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:53,759
Speaker 1: There are. I just would hope that at forty five

997
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:56,600
Speaker 1: that's not the case. But there you gom. Yeah, I

998
00:54:56,960 --> 00:54:58,560
Speaker 1: don't think we need to go any deeper in that

999
00:54:58,680 --> 00:55:01,800
Speaker 1: because this whole subject there is a deep well of

1000
00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:05,640
Speaker 1: information about it and we don't need to rehash that. Okay,

1001
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:13,800
Speaker 1: well that's unsatisfying. We're gonna put some links um and

1002
00:55:14,040 --> 00:55:17,880
Speaker 1: obviously her picture um up on our website and if

1003
00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:20,040
Speaker 1: you want to see those links or the picture, or

1004
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:23,320
Speaker 1: listen to this episode because you haven't just listened to

1005
00:55:23,360 --> 00:55:27,799
Speaker 1: this episode. Yeah. Um. We also have an episode list

1006
00:55:28,360 --> 00:55:30,799
Speaker 1: so you can see every single episode that we've ever done,

1007
00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:33,040
Speaker 1: which can be helpful because we're starting to get some

1008
00:55:33,160 --> 00:55:35,759
Speaker 1: suggestions of things we've covered because we covered them like

1009
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:38,839
Speaker 1: four years ago. Yeah. I update that about once a month. Yeah,

1010
00:55:39,120 --> 00:55:41,520
Speaker 1: so um. That can be found on our website, which

1011
00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:46,000
Speaker 1: is Thinking Sideways podcast dot com dot com. You can

1012
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:50,080
Speaker 1: download and listen to us you know where, I mean

1013
00:55:50,320 --> 00:55:53,680
Speaker 1: pretty much everywhere. If you're doing that on iTunes or

1014
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:56,759
Speaker 1: you're doing it on Stitcher or someplace where you can

1015
00:55:57,000 --> 00:56:00,000
Speaker 1: subscribe and leave a comment or um, leave a review,

1016
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:02,399
Speaker 1: you in a rating. Please do that. It helps other

1017
00:56:02,440 --> 00:56:05,800
Speaker 1: people find us. You can also stream us anywhere again,

1018
00:56:06,000 --> 00:56:07,960
Speaker 1: you know how you're finding us. I don't know why

1019
00:56:08,040 --> 00:56:10,560
Speaker 1: we do this, but we do. UM. You can find

1020
00:56:10,640 --> 00:56:13,520
Speaker 1: us on social media. I've got a Facebook page and

1021
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:17,000
Speaker 1: a group, so like the page and join the group.

1022
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:21,680
Speaker 1: You can find us on Twitter We're thinking sideways. Um.

1023
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:23,759
Speaker 1: And then we've also got a subreddit which is just

1024
00:56:23,880 --> 00:56:27,520
Speaker 1: thinking sideways. You can email us if you would like

1025
00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:32,080
Speaker 1: our email addresses Thinking Sideways Podcast at gmail dot com.

1026
00:56:32,960 --> 00:56:35,920
Speaker 1: And then if you want to buy merch there's a

1027
00:56:36,040 --> 00:56:39,239
Speaker 1: link on the website. We do that through Zazzle and

1028
00:56:39,400 --> 00:56:44,320
Speaker 1: red Bubble both stuff. Um, really cool new shirt that

1029
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:52,240
Speaker 1: Steve designed. Yeah. Yeah, they suggested a lot of different

1030
00:56:53,160 --> 00:56:56,440
Speaker 1: things forward Yeah. Yeah, so go ahead and check those out.

1031
00:56:57,160 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 1: Um yeah, and I think that's it. All of that

1032
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:02,560
Speaker 1: having been said, we're gonna go ahead and get on

1033
00:57:02,680 --> 00:57:05,400
Speaker 1: out of here. Let's say something funny. Well, but this

1034
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:08,800
Speaker 1: just isn't funny. Okay, I'm gonna say bye bye instead.

1035
00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:10,759
Speaker 1: We'll talk to you guys next week. A