1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:04,000 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Sportsman's Nation podcast network, brought to 2 00:00:04,040 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: you by Interstate Batteries. Interstate Batteries has been a proud 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 1: supporter of the Sportsman's Nation since day one. So if 4 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 1: you need batteries for your truck, batteries for your trail cameras, TV, 5 00:00:17,400 --> 00:00:22,120 Speaker 1: remote controls, flashlights, you name it, Interstate Batteries has what 6 00:00:22,200 --> 00:00:25,680 Speaker 1: you need. They have thousands of retail locations all over 7 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: the United States, so stop in talk to a battery specialist, 8 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:38,360 Speaker 1: or for more information, visit Interstate Batteries dot com. My 9 00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:40,680 Speaker 1: name is Clay Nukeleman. I'm the host of the Bear 10 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: Hunting Magazine podcast. I'll also be your host into the 11 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:49,840 Speaker 1: world of hunting the icon of the North American wilderness. Prepare. 12 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: We'll talk about tactics, gear, conservation, but will also bring 13 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: you into some of the wildest country on the planet, 14 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 1: chasing batters, h boys and girls. Spring bear season is 15 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:13,480 Speaker 1: upon us and despite despite the best efforts of a 16 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 1: global pandemic, most places that have bear seasons are still 17 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 1: having bear seasons. And it's it's go time. It's go time. 18 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:27,319 Speaker 1: May and June always compared to the months of October 19 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:30,399 Speaker 1: and November for white tails. So May and June are 20 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,960 Speaker 1: that for bears, and this is when we hunt them 21 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 1: in the spring. So what we're doing this week is 22 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 1: we're re releasing an episode called Judging Black Bears for Dummies. 23 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 1: And I think this is the most comprehensive conversation, for sure, 24 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 1: that I've ever had, where we talk about all different 25 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 1: methods of judging bears from sex and bears, aging bears, 26 00:01:56,880 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: well I'm not really aging bears, but trying to term 27 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 1: with their mature. But I'm joined by Klobe Moorehead and 28 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 1: Ryan Greb and we go through the nitty gritty nerd 29 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 1: out stuff about judging bears, some of the most tough 30 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: animals of all the big game animals to judge. So 31 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 1: this is a technical you learn the stuff in this podcast, 32 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: you're gonna you're gonna learn something and uh then you 33 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,639 Speaker 1: may be able to add something to this. But hey, 34 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:28,360 Speaker 1: it's also time for those of you guys and states 35 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: where you can bait bears to start baiting. Check out 36 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: our buddies at Northwood's Bear Products also du Hunting Supply. 37 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:40,960 Speaker 1: They started a new podcast their hound supply company, but 38 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: you can search for the w W podcast and lastly 39 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 1: Western Bear Foundation. They're putting out some good content these 40 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: days through social media on judging bears as well, and 41 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 1: they're a membership driven nonprofit hunting conservation organization standing up 42 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: for bear hunters out west. You're gonna enjoy this podcast 43 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 1: and hey we're bear hunting. I mean, when you're listening 44 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: to this podcast, I am somewhere in a wild place 45 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:16,839 Speaker 1: chasing a bear and you'll hear where that is at 46 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: some point and U but that's part of the reason 47 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 1: we're having to rerelease some stuff, um, just with the 48 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 1: timing and the COVID stuff. So man, I hope that 49 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:31,200 Speaker 1: you get into some wild places and find a bear 50 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 1: hunter bear and man, yeah, be safe, be careful, and 51 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 1: good hunting. We are going to have another one of 52 00:03:42,360 --> 00:03:50,880 Speaker 1: our technical, nitty gritty nerd out Bear sessions about judging 53 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 1: bears in the field. Judging bears, trying to tell if 54 00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:59,400 Speaker 1: a bear is a male or female, if it's a 55 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:02,000 Speaker 1: older man your male, or if it's a juvenile male. 56 00:04:02,880 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 1: Basically judging bears just like we would white tails, judging 57 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:09,400 Speaker 1: what you judge of whitetail by all these different characteristics. 58 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about bears bears are one of the 59 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 1: hardest animals to judge in the field, for sure. I 60 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:17,960 Speaker 1: mean I think you could talk to guys all over 61 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: the country that have hunted all over and they would say, 62 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 1: the hardest animal to judge in North America, it's a 63 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: black bear. I have with me again, Ryan Grab also 64 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 1: known as flint Face Grab flint Face. Yep, Ryan is Colby. 65 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 1: You wouldn't know this. Ryan is was notorious for taking 66 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:42,920 Speaker 1: pictures with animals and just having this like flint face, 67 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 1: just like just flint face. So I started calling flint Face. 68 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:52,479 Speaker 1: Now he's now he smiles more on these big trophy photos. 69 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:55,360 Speaker 1: We've got Ryan Grab here with me. Yeah, now he 70 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:59,359 Speaker 1: grins like a girl scout. I got so Ryan Grab 71 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 1: is here rides been on the last couple of podcasts, 72 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:03,359 Speaker 1: and I've got to say it just in case you 73 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: haven't listened to the podcast before, but Ryan is an 74 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: expert bear hunter. Troubled with me many places in Canada. 75 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 1: But you've you have done your bear business here in Arkansas. 76 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 1: And that's how I know you as being a expert 77 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 1: Arkansas bear hunter. Been hunting. I mean, you've killed a ton, 78 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:25,039 Speaker 1: you've killed a pile of bears here in Arkansas. And 79 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 1: as I've said in the last three podcasts, you were 80 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:29,080 Speaker 1: killing bears. Well, my mama was still wife of my nose. 81 00:05:32,200 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: Would you agree with us if you say so? All right? 82 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,360 Speaker 1: All right, So that's Ryan Grab. I've got Colby moorehead 83 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 1: with me. I've introduced Colby to Colby works for Bear 84 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,719 Speaker 1: Hunting magazine. So Kobe is you don't really even have 85 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: a job title, do you know? It's just like Kobe. 86 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: Koby does all kind of stuff for me, Bear Tech, 87 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 1: bear Tech. Colby is a bear hunting magazine, Bear Tech, 88 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:57,599 Speaker 1: Mr Ken do Attitude, can do. That's all right. Koby 89 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 1: is doing a ton of stuff for me, including getting 90 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 1: Bear Horizon on Amazon. I don't know when this podcast 91 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: is gonna be released, but you can be looking for it. 92 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:09,280 Speaker 1: We're gonna have our Bear Horizon show on Amazon. That's 93 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:11,560 Speaker 1: one thing that he's done for me. But anyway, he 94 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 1: does a whole lot of stuff. But that's neither here 95 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:16,320 Speaker 1: nor there. Let's talk about Judge and bears. We're gonna 96 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: try to just jump right into this thing. Toughest big 97 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 1: game animal in North America to judge by many standards, Um, 98 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 1: bears don't have antlers do they Have you ever killed 99 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 1: a bear with antlers? No, I've only seen a couple 100 00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: on trail Kim, But bears don't have antlers. And this 101 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,640 Speaker 1: is just the truth of it. A hundred pound bear 102 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 1: has this has a lot of fairly similar to characteristics 103 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 1: as a four hundred pound bear, and that again, we're 104 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:53,440 Speaker 1: gonna get into the nuances to disprove that. But I mean, 105 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:56,400 Speaker 1: if you were to see a hundred pound bear on 106 00:06:56,440 --> 00:07:01,799 Speaker 1: a hillside five yards away, you could be deceived into 107 00:07:01,800 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: thinking that that was a big one because of what 108 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:08,200 Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about scale. But what what we're looking 109 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 1: at is we're fine, We're we're we're nitpicking the nuanced 110 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:16,480 Speaker 1: features of a bear to try to understand what makes 111 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 1: a trophy bear. And we're gonna use that term. Let's 112 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 1: let's let's let's not use the term trophy. Let's use 113 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 1: the term mature, mature male. That's what we're after inside 114 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 1: a bear hunting. The target animal and almost any situation 115 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:33,720 Speaker 1: is going to be an older class, mature male animal. 116 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:38,720 Speaker 1: That's what we're after. Okay, traditional methods, what would you say, Ryan? 117 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 1: Are the traditional statements that people use to describe big males. 118 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 1: I'd say the most notorious would be small ears yep, 119 00:07:52,640 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 1: creased head yep, um, you know, bigger risk pads for sure. 120 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:07,560 Speaker 1: Probably the small ear myth. Yeah, that's that's what you 121 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: hear people say all the time, Like you could google 122 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 1: search small eared bear and it would be there being 123 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 1: articles all over the place. But let's go ahead and 124 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 1: just jump right into this. Is that I have seen 125 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: you have seen times when that didn't characterize the characterizing 126 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: older mature male at all. Um. Definitely, the classic big 127 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:33,280 Speaker 1: bore is gonna look like he has small ears that 128 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:35,600 Speaker 1: are on the side of his head, you know, because 129 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: his skulls so big, head so big that it's like 130 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 1: those ears as he gets older just kind of moves 131 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 1: down his head. But I've also killed some whop or 132 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 1: bears that to me had mickey mouse ears. For instance, 133 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: the bear I killed this year in Oklahoma, I called 134 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:53,959 Speaker 1: him Batman because of how big his ears were. He 135 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 1: had these big, curled ears. I have also found that 136 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: bears have different shapes and looks based upon what part 137 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: of the country they're in. I mean, I've never seen 138 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 1: in Arkansas, correct me if you think I'm wrong. I 139 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: personally have never hunted a really big giant bear in 140 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 1: Arkansas or Oklahoma that I would have categorized as having 141 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 1: small ears. Would you have, no, You know, I think 142 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 1: there's almost to me a difference and the way they 143 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:29,520 Speaker 1: look in the Washingtaws here and you know, mid Arkansas 144 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 1: compared to the Yeah, it seems like they've got distinguished 145 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 1: facial features. Maybe even hide is a little different. Yeah. Well, 146 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,439 Speaker 1: then there are two separate populations. I mean they really are. 147 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 1: In Arkansas, we've got basically to what they call ala 148 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:50,280 Speaker 1: Patrick populations of bears, which means they're kind of independent 149 00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:53,640 Speaker 1: of one another based upon some geographic and man made 150 00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:56,560 Speaker 1: barriers of the Arkansas River which is not man made 151 00:09:56,600 --> 00:10:00,280 Speaker 1: to Kolbe, but the Interstate forty which runs by the 152 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 1: Arkansas River is man made, so that it separates these 153 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 1: two populations. And very few bear bears are crossing over 154 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: to breed into these different places, and so there's even 155 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 1: slight differences in between ninety miles. You know. Um, there's 156 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:21,840 Speaker 1: some generalizations like for instance, um, well these aren't generalizations, 157 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 1: these are true. Uh. Newfoundland is known for having big 158 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:29,960 Speaker 1: skulled bears. Uh. Prince of Wales Island is known for 159 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:34,360 Speaker 1: having large sculled bears. There's other places that are known 160 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 1: for not having big skulld bears. But you still might 161 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:41,280 Speaker 1: have a big bear that is huge body wise, but 162 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: his skull would be smaller. Um. There are definitely different 163 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:49,440 Speaker 1: characteristics of bears, just like white tails. I mean, you 164 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: have some places where white tails are gonna have express 165 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:56,679 Speaker 1: this big, massive, heavy horn deer, like Canada, and they 166 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:00,480 Speaker 1: have other places where they're not as much. UM. That 167 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 1: being said, bears are not affected by the um is 168 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 1: it Bergman's law that states that the further you get 169 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:14,079 Speaker 1: away from the equator, the larger body sized mammals are 170 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 1: to retain heat. That's why Canadian white tails are bigger 171 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:20,439 Speaker 1: than white tails. In the Florida Keys bears are exempt 172 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:24,640 Speaker 1: from that law that because they hibernate during the winter, 173 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:28,400 Speaker 1: they technically don't hibernate, they go into state of torpor, 174 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:34,560 Speaker 1: but they they are exempt from that law because they 175 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 1: are not enduring the cold temperatures, just taking it right 176 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 1: in the face like all these other animals. So bears 177 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:44,920 Speaker 1: in Florida, bears in Arkansas, bears in Oklahoma, bears in 178 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: North Carolina could be as big or even bigger than 179 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:52,160 Speaker 1: Canadian bears. Okay, let's just separate that out. There's just 180 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:57,440 Speaker 1: some bared knowledge, bare nerd technoledge. I wish we had 181 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: the buddy size of the Carolina bears. That's amazing, no doubt. 182 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 1: I mean, we've got big bears, but they've got some monsters. 183 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: They do they do. Some of the biggest bears in 184 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:12,280 Speaker 1: the world are on the Eastern Coast. Some of the 185 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:15,840 Speaker 1: biggest skull bears in the world, though, are also in Pennsylvania. 186 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:19,120 Speaker 1: Some of the top five bears skulls in the world 187 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:21,920 Speaker 1: have come come out of Pennsylvania. And part of that 188 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:24,840 Speaker 1: probably has to do with their age structure, because they've 189 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:26,559 Speaker 1: got a lot of older bears because they don't hunt 190 00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:29,080 Speaker 1: over bait or with hounds. They're just spotting stock or 191 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,840 Speaker 1: drive hunting these bears, so they're really not taken out 192 00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:38,280 Speaker 1: a big percentage of their bears every year. But so, okay, 193 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 1: we've established that there are bears in different places are 194 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:44,600 Speaker 1: going to be different, They're gonna look different. Um, we've 195 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 1: established that ears and a crease on the head are 196 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 1: sometimes that's what somebody might say small ears and a 197 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:54,280 Speaker 1: crease on the head. That's the only bear you shoot well, 198 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:56,120 Speaker 1: if that had been the way that I judged bears 199 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:59,040 Speaker 1: my whole life, i'd have very few bears. A lot 200 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:01,199 Speaker 1: of the big bears that I've killed. As a matter 201 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:03,400 Speaker 1: of fact, the only Boone and Crockett bear that I 202 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: have ever killed, Ryan, I would say, didn't have either. 203 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:09,440 Speaker 1: One of those didn't have a crease on his head, 204 00:13:09,559 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 1: and I would say he had big ears. Um and well, 205 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:16,679 Speaker 1: I don't want to get into body weight yet, but 206 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 1: let's just talk about those two things. Um. My good 207 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:23,560 Speaker 1: buddy Heath Martin, expert bear hunter here in Arkansas, has 208 00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 1: a story of going to Canada and shooting a color 209 00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:28,520 Speaker 1: face bear that had, I mean just a ripple crease 210 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 1: down its forehead. They were hunting the big color phase mail. 211 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 1: This color phase bear comes in. They think it's the 212 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: big male, has a big crease. He shoots it and 213 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:40,559 Speaker 1: it's a sal Sal with a crease. And I've been 214 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 1: noticing that more and more. The more I see bears, 215 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 1: the more I'm like, man, sALS will have a crease 216 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:49,600 Speaker 1: on their head too. Have you have you seen that before? Ryan? 217 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:54,080 Speaker 1: Not so much here in Arkansas probably no. Uh, I've 218 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 1: seen some big sales. I think a lot of The 219 00:13:57,000 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 1: determining factor on the sales is it seems like they're 220 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:04,559 Speaker 1: muzzle wants to blend in even where they have the 221 00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: blonde brows. Have you noticed that? And probably the total 222 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:13,920 Speaker 1: length of the bear. The boars will always have lankier, 223 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:18,720 Speaker 1: longer bodies versus a sale. They're more compact. Yes, yes, 224 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:22,120 Speaker 1: I've heard people describe it that a sal is pear 225 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:29,840 Speaker 1: shaped like a narrow front end, big back end. Uh. So, 226 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:31,880 Speaker 1: let's see where do I want to go? There's so 227 00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 1: many different places we could go here. Let's go Let's 228 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 1: go ahead and just describe the characteristics of older mature 229 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:41,680 Speaker 1: mail as we would just say it now. We're not 230 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:45,240 Speaker 1: saying that ears increase are not indicators of an older 231 00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 1: mature mail. For instance, one of the first years I 232 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 1: spring bear hunted, we went to Alberta. We killed six 233 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 1: poping young bears in five days in our camp. One 234 00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 1: of those bears I would have considered as a traditional 235 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:04,760 Speaker 1: style big older male who's straight up had small ears, 236 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:06,840 Speaker 1: straight up had ears on the side of his head, 237 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: straight up had a crease. One of of six. Well, 238 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:15,600 Speaker 1: I mean I said we killed six bears. The bears 239 00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 1: that the two bears that I killed which were nineteen 240 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 1: inch but nineteen inch plus bears, which are that's a 241 00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 1: big bear, well above the pope and young minimum Um 242 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: probably weighed in the three hundred three fifty pound range 243 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 1: in the spring, which is a big bear. These are 244 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 1: big bears. They all had what I would describe as 245 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,160 Speaker 1: mickey mouse ears, and they were tall and looked like 246 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: race horses. Okay, um, they but the the defining features 247 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 1: of them that made me know that they were older 248 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 1: mature males was that they were tall, they were very tall, 249 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 1: and that they were long, and that they had their 250 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:57,800 Speaker 1: front legs the front leg of a boar. A big boar, 251 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 1: he's gonna have like stove pipe, lay eggs like a bulldog, 252 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 1: Like a bulldog, big ankles, and big pads, as in 253 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: contrast to a sow, which is gonna have thinner legs, 254 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 1: thinner ankles, smaller pads. To me, almost every big bear 255 00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:19,320 Speaker 1: I've ever killed ryan I have noticed his feet. I mean, like, 256 00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:21,560 Speaker 1: if you were to show and I'd almost go to 257 00:16:21,600 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 1: that more than the head. Like I see some pictures 258 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: of sALS and get trail camera pictures of sALS, and 259 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:28,920 Speaker 1: I was like, if you just showed me the head 260 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: of that bear, I couldn't tell you. I mean, I 261 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 1: would assume it would just be a big boar, But 262 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:35,600 Speaker 1: to be a sal I would almost rather look at 263 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:40,000 Speaker 1: the bear's feet than anything. It seems like the back 264 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: feet also want to sail as not as long as 265 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: a boar's you know, in length, the pads just don't. 266 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:56,440 Speaker 1: A sal's a lot shorter. Yeah. So when I when 267 00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 1: I'm looking at a boar or they're looking to determine 268 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: if a boar as trophy size, looking at his feet, 269 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:05,680 Speaker 1: looking at his front shoulders, looking at his height, that's 270 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:09,800 Speaker 1: that is a massive factor. And when you're hitting over bait, 271 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:13,480 Speaker 1: typically you've got a fifty five gallon drum. This this 272 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 1: rule could be applied anywhere on the earth where there's 273 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:18,640 Speaker 1: black bears, which early in North America. But a bear 274 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:22,880 Speaker 1: that is as tall as a thirty six inch tall drum, 275 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:27,280 Speaker 1: if his shoulders, not his hairline, but his actual shoulders 276 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:30,200 Speaker 1: come up to the top of that barrel, that's a 277 00:17:30,359 --> 00:17:34,440 Speaker 1: that's a big bear, is it not? Run? Yeah? Usually shooter. Yeah, 278 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 1: I mean, you just don't see an immature bear or 279 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:40,880 Speaker 1: even a a salve that's gonna be as tall as 280 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:45,439 Speaker 1: a barrel. Do you every once in a while, like 281 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:49,360 Speaker 1: the say, the sal I had trouble with in Canada, 282 00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:53,639 Speaker 1: was it two years ago? You know, my first glance 283 00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:57,480 Speaker 1: of that, I thought, boy, there's a shooter. And she 284 00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:03,119 Speaker 1: was probably three hundred maybe bear, but big head, she 285 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:08,399 Speaker 1: just short. Yeah, I mean that would have been a 286 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:10,959 Speaker 1: tough one. Yeah. Yeah, she had a cup with her 287 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:13,000 Speaker 1: though she did. That's probably the only reason you knew 288 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:14,639 Speaker 1: it wasn't a born Yeah. I mean you might have 289 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:18,240 Speaker 1: figured it out after a while. Yeah, it takes you know, 290 00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 1: if you studied it for a minute or two, you 291 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:22,440 Speaker 1: could probably do you think she was truly as tall 292 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:28,560 Speaker 1: as a barrel like her shoulder, I don't know barrel. 293 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:30,600 Speaker 1: There was a barrel there, but it was laying down, 294 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:33,440 Speaker 1: you know, it was chained a tree. But it was 295 00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:36,879 Speaker 1: a tall bear. Yeah, it was so. Yeah, that's a 296 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 1: tricky one because inside the barre world there's different variants 297 00:18:41,720 --> 00:18:44,320 Speaker 1: of height and well there's different there's all these different 298 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 1: shapes like you could here in Arkansas have a sal 299 00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: bear that way hundred and eighty five pounds and she 300 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:58,679 Speaker 1: might be eighteen years old and be fully mature, and 301 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:03,200 Speaker 1: maybe she weighs a hundred pounds. Heath Martin four or 302 00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:07,680 Speaker 1: five years ago shot a bear here in Arkansas. Turned 303 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,280 Speaker 1: out it was a soal weighed three hundred and forty 304 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 1: pounds on scale in the fall, And there's just all 305 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 1: this variation, just like in humans that ere a bit. Nope, 306 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:23,160 Speaker 1: she didn't. She was a big dry sow and uh, 307 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: she didn't have a cub with her. I mean, they've 308 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 1: been getting pictures of this bear and uh, and she 309 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:32,479 Speaker 1: was a prime animal to take out older female and 310 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:35,280 Speaker 1: but it was just a big bear and uh, and 311 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 1: he kind of thought maybe it was a sal but 312 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,919 Speaker 1: it was just you know, he took her. Um weighed 313 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:45,360 Speaker 1: three pounds on a scale. That being said, there's all 314 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,679 Speaker 1: this variation, So you can't just always say that a 315 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 1: sow is just gonna be a whole lot smaller, because 316 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:55,080 Speaker 1: you could very well have a older age class male 317 00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:57,360 Speaker 1: board that weighed three and forty pounds. And I'd take 318 00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:00,199 Speaker 1: that bear anywhere in the world. I really would. If 319 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:03,359 Speaker 1: I went to Canada. I mean, most most of the time, 320 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:09,119 Speaker 1: I'm gonna shoot that animal. Um so the boars, but 321 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,680 Speaker 1: the one place, and and your deal would be an exception, 322 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:14,840 Speaker 1: I would say, I would say the one place that 323 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 1: you could almost always tell a boar is his height 324 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:22,399 Speaker 1: and lengthy. I mean, you're just never gonna have a 325 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:28,200 Speaker 1: sou bear that is just this freight train long, tall, 326 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 1: big animal. You're just not gonna see it. And the 327 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 1: first time bear hunter might not distinguish that. You know, yes, 328 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:42,000 Speaker 1: the more time you've spent bear hunting and get to 329 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 1: see tens upon hundreds of bears, it'll be easier for 330 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 1: a guy. And so that goes to the second thing 331 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 1: here we want to talk about is determining the sex 332 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:58,359 Speaker 1: of a bear. When I was in Saskatchewan last year, 333 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,840 Speaker 1: we watched bears for eight hours a day for five days. 334 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 1: We were just watching bears like crazy, and I realized 335 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:11,320 Speaker 1: that these older seals were sometimes hard to distinguish from boars. 336 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:14,040 Speaker 1: The first thing I looked at, though, was ankle size 337 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 1: and pad size. Second, it was the first thing. The 338 00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 1: second thing once they came in is some And the 339 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 1: reason I'm saying this is these seals were really mature, 340 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,320 Speaker 1: Like I mean, you totally would have said that these 341 00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:30,720 Speaker 1: cells had small ears down the side of their head. 342 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 1: I mean really they were like like if you had 343 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 1: just taken a picture, I think you could have almost 344 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 1: convinced anyone that it was a mature male. So this 345 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:42,040 Speaker 1: animals coming in, there's not really anything to scale the 346 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 1: bear by trying to determine is this is this a 347 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 1: nice male? Because in the spring, the males are smaller 348 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 1: I mean not physical, not the bone structure obviously, but 349 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,640 Speaker 1: I mean they're they're less weight. They've been a then 350 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:57,520 Speaker 1: for six months, they're thinner, So in the spring a 351 00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:01,199 Speaker 1: male and a female might be harder to distinguish. And 352 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:05,520 Speaker 1: the second thing I look for was a penal sheath. Yeah, 353 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,359 Speaker 1: Like I mean, a boar is gonna have these these 354 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 1: sheath hairs that hang down and they're four or five 355 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:15,159 Speaker 1: inches long, sometimes hanging down right in the middle of 356 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 1: the belly. You can't see there. You can't see the sheath. Really, 357 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: it's not like something big hanging down, you know, but 358 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:25,640 Speaker 1: you can see those sheath hairs hanging down. And when 359 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:27,639 Speaker 1: you see that, all of a sudden, part of your 360 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:30,439 Speaker 1: equation is solved. This is a male. I mean, that's 361 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: the first thing that I do anytime i'm bear hunt anywhere, 362 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:36,080 Speaker 1: is that a boar or sow and that that sal's 363 00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:38,880 Speaker 1: gonna be pear shaped, she's gonna be smaller. She's gonna 364 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 1: be shorter, she's gonna have thinner ankles, she's gonna have 365 00:22:40,920 --> 00:22:44,240 Speaker 1: smaller pads, she's gonna have a more feminine face. And 366 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: that's kind of a hard thing to describe, but just 367 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,080 Speaker 1: like in a dog, like a big old male, right 368 00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:54,120 Speaker 1: while there's gonna have this boxy, beefy nose and head 369 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: and a female, a sow bear kind of has a 370 00:22:57,320 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 1: more feminine feel to the face and head most of 371 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 1: the time. Agree with that, Ryan, I agree. You agree 372 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:08,480 Speaker 1: with that, Kolbe. From what I've seen, I think you're 373 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:12,880 Speaker 1: older bears too, And you know this works with sales. 374 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:17,439 Speaker 1: Also is the scruff the beard under the chin. As 375 00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:21,040 Speaker 1: a bear gets older, it seems to have that little guiltee. Yeah, 376 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:25,919 Speaker 1: you see that with Arkansas bears sometimes, Yeah, kind of 377 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: that do lap like kind of yeah, like you got 378 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 1: going on? Yeah, yeah, kind of like me now that 379 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 1: it is their behavior change, like the way they come 380 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: in on a date, the salve versus the boar. That's 381 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:46,440 Speaker 1: a that's a good one. Yes, I mean I have seen. 382 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: I wrote an article and this last issue Bear Any 383 00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 1: Magazine that was called five thoughts on judging Black Bear. 384 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: One thing that I have noticed is that the mature 385 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:02,200 Speaker 1: boar that's coming into a bait site, and we're talking 386 00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:06,560 Speaker 1: about a bait site here, you can't always predict what 387 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,479 Speaker 1: he's gonna do. You can't just say, well, the mature 388 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,440 Speaker 1: board is gonna just barrel in and run everything off 389 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:16,680 Speaker 1: the barrel, or you can't say, the mature boar is 390 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:19,840 Speaker 1: gonna be the one that's hanging back, and it's really cautious. 391 00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:22,560 Speaker 1: You don't know what they're gonna do. But one thing 392 00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:25,920 Speaker 1: I have noticed is that they almost always act different 393 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 1: than every animal at debate site. That's not gonna play 394 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:34,400 Speaker 1: true in every situation. But either he's gonna be like 395 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,000 Speaker 1: the bull of the woods and it's just gonna roll 396 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:39,440 Speaker 1: in there, and you're just gonna be like that animal 397 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 1: is the king. I would use my example of when 398 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,960 Speaker 1: I shot that color face bear in Canada that came 399 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 1: in and touched into my earraw. He was the boss 400 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,520 Speaker 1: of those woods and he just barreled in there and 401 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 1: was the king. The next well, in the same in 402 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,959 Speaker 1: the same hunt, a bear that was actually bigger than 403 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 1: him was the most timid bear. You remember the one 404 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 1: I missed, right, man, He just tiptoed around, and he 405 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:12,120 Speaker 1: was a monster bear. So those two mature animals, they 406 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 1: acted different than every other, and all the other ones 407 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:16,200 Speaker 1: just kind of came in, I mean, like a sal 408 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:18,639 Speaker 1: And this is why I don't understand even a mature 409 00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:21,919 Speaker 1: salve that's been around the planet and knows the system, 410 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: she might just walk in and just go right over 411 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:27,240 Speaker 1: to the bait and just start eating. You know, She's 412 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 1: So they're just gonna act different. So you can't say 413 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:33,480 Speaker 1: that they're always gonna be dominant. You can't say that 414 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 1: they're always gonna be super skittish. It could be either one. 415 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:41,840 Speaker 1: But when I see a bear that is acting different 416 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,040 Speaker 1: than all the other bears that I'm saying, that's what 417 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 1: I'm like, he's special. I mean like he's he's probably 418 00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 1: a target animal. Would you agree with that? Yeah, it 419 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 1: seems like you know, they're the ones that's gonna sit 420 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,760 Speaker 1: out there on their button sixty yards from the bait 421 00:25:55,840 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 1: and check the wind. That's these Arkansas bears for sure. Yeah. 422 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: Or he could be the one that you know, you 423 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 1: could have other bears on the bat and all of 424 00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:08,320 Speaker 1: a sudden they wolf and take off running and you 425 00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:11,440 Speaker 1: see one coming, you know that's going to be more 426 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 1: mature bear, right. I mean, there's no way that that 427 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,680 Speaker 1: bear I got last year in Minute Toba didn't smell us. 428 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,320 Speaker 1: He just didn't care, That's right. He came right under 429 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: our stand and just ran everything off, and he he 430 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 1: didn't care. It's a different ball game, I think, and 431 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: Canadian provinces where they don't get pressured as like we do. 432 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:36,800 Speaker 1: You know down here, I think Saskatch, Like when we're 433 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:42,160 Speaker 1: at Saskatchewan. I mean, then bears don't know you from 434 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 1: any other animal. They don't have any fear. Then they're 435 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:51,320 Speaker 1: not trying to be dangerous. They're curious. But down here 436 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:54,679 Speaker 1: the bear usually don't do that unless it's them like 437 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,400 Speaker 1: white tails down here. Yeah, yeah, there's there's spooky. They're skittish. 438 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,320 Speaker 1: I think Canada they're typically less skinniesh There's an inverse 439 00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: relationship between the amount of exposure to humans and there 440 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:10,479 Speaker 1: fear of humans. So in places where they never encounter humans, 441 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 1: there's less fear. In places where they encounter humans all 442 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,440 Speaker 1: the time, there's more fear. It seems like I would 443 00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,480 Speaker 1: be the opposite. You'd think they just get used to 444 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:19,479 Speaker 1: you down here, and so they would be different, but 445 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 1: it's it's inverse. Yeah, So that's something that's confusing to 446 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,919 Speaker 1: people because most people don't have the view of bears 447 00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 1: like somebody would have that has hunted down here, but 448 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: it's also hunted a lot up there. So a lot 449 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,680 Speaker 1: of guys, you know, you write an article about using 450 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 1: sent control for bears, and the guys in Canada are 451 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 1: like you, guys, don't know what you're talking about. Sin 452 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,440 Speaker 1: control doesn't mean a thing. And I'll be honest with you. 453 00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 1: In Canada, I believe sent control basically means nothing. Now, 454 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 1: if I had the choice of being clean and having 455 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,400 Speaker 1: the wind in my favor, for sure, you're better off 456 00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,360 Speaker 1: if they don't know you're there. But every big bear 457 00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:02,400 Speaker 1: I've ever killed Canada knew I was there and didn't care. 458 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 1: But in Arkansas, and Ryan, you're an expert here in 459 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:11,160 Speaker 1: Arkansas at pulling these big bears out of the out 460 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:14,119 Speaker 1: of the haystack. You gotta do a lot of things 461 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,440 Speaker 1: right down here to kill big bear. I think I've 462 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:22,280 Speaker 1: been fortunate though, with locations being you know, I've been 463 00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:27,720 Speaker 1: lucky to have places where bears already living, you know, uh, 464 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,359 Speaker 1: they don't have to travel far to get to me. 465 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 1: I'm actually in places that have water, have shade, they're 466 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 1: thick and don't have any human disturbance. So that's probably 467 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:45,960 Speaker 1: been my key, you know, to harvesting being picky on 468 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:52,160 Speaker 1: you're also you're I mean, most of these big bears 469 00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:54,800 Speaker 1: that you've killed, if they would have straight up smelled you, 470 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: they wouldn't come in during daylight. I wouldn't think so 471 00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:01,640 Speaker 1: very few that's spend. What I've seen here in Arkansas 472 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 1: is that if you were hunting, let's say eight years 473 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 1: hunting big bears, maybe one maybe two of those eight years, 474 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,200 Speaker 1: you would get lucky and if a bear knew you 475 00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 1: were there, he would come in anyway. I keep going 476 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:20,360 Speaker 1: back to my friend Heath Martin, who's a great bear 477 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 1: hunter in Arkansas. He killed a big bear, one of 478 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: his biggest bears ever, Boot and Crock a bear, uh 479 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,320 Speaker 1: several years ago, and that bear knew they were there. 480 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 1: It had just set out there for a long time 481 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: winding them, and it just kind of about dark. It 482 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:36,960 Speaker 1: just it's like, well, I'm just gonna ease in there, 483 00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 1: and that bear just eased in. I would look up 484 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: at him and he kills a bear that's an exception. 485 00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 1: Most of the time you're not gonna kill that animal. 486 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 1: But again two and eight or two and ten, you're 487 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 1: gonna if a bear knows you're there. Now, what you've 488 00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 1: been able to do is you know these locations, well, 489 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:57,719 Speaker 1: you're hunting, these stands, you're getting up and so these 490 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:01,000 Speaker 1: bears you're killing just don't know you're there. Got good setups, 491 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,280 Speaker 1: You're in places where the bears want to be. I 492 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:08,400 Speaker 1: don't mess around in the woods either. You know, when 493 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,760 Speaker 1: I go in and bait, I'm not walking across the fence. 494 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:15,200 Speaker 1: I'm not walking out bear trails. You know. I'll go in, 495 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:20,040 Speaker 1: bait quick, get out, you know. And I think a 496 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: lot of people too, are hanging their stands or two 497 00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,840 Speaker 1: days before season. I do that in summer. You know, 498 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,880 Speaker 1: some of these older bears will come in and before 499 00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:32,400 Speaker 1: they get to the bait, they want to send check 500 00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:35,479 Speaker 1: that tree that has stand in it to see if 501 00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:40,160 Speaker 1: you've climbed it. So and over the years it's kind 502 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: of crazy. I've piled dead brush around the actual tree. 503 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:47,760 Speaker 1: I have a stand in kind of as as a barrier. 504 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:50,560 Speaker 1: I mean, a bear could go through it, and but 505 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 1: it looks like a rat's nest around the base of 506 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,640 Speaker 1: this tree. They can't get to that tree and really 507 00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:02,240 Speaker 1: sent check whether I've climbed up not. Yeah, yeah, but 508 00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 1: I'm a little crazy. But just man, you've got every 509 00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:08,520 Speaker 1: right to be crazy because, like I said, and a 510 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 1: couple of other podcasts, I think you've killed You've killed 511 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,680 Speaker 1: a ton of big bears in Arkansas seem to keep 512 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:16,719 Speaker 1: pulling them out. What would you say if you were 513 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:21,800 Speaker 1: judging bears in Arkansas? What are you looking for? We're 514 00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:24,360 Speaker 1: hunting bar bears in the fall, which we've We've also 515 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 1: said there's a difference between judging spring bears up north 516 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:32,400 Speaker 1: or in Montana versus hunting a fall bear here in Arkansas. 517 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 1: And I mean, and we're when we're hunting around here, 518 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:38,760 Speaker 1: we're really after an older age classman. What would what 519 00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: were the defining characteristics? You know, they don't have thick 520 00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 1: fur up in that time of the year, you know, 521 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:50,240 Speaker 1: late summer, but you know frame length. Uh, you know, 522 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:51,880 Speaker 1: like I said, you want to look at their pads, 523 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 1: the risks characteristics as how they respond a lot of 524 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: times to the bait. But I think you'll you'll know, 525 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 1: I mean, especially if if a person is running trail cams, 526 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 1: which you know, I guess everybody does. Uh. You'll give 527 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 1: you a general idea on what to look for distinct markings, 528 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:17,160 Speaker 1: maybe a crest on the chest or a notched deer, 529 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:20,040 Speaker 1: you know, something that you have a target bear that 530 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: you've evaluated on trail camera and then you just got 531 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 1: to make sure that's the bear you're shooting and he's 532 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 1: coming in. Yeah. Yeah. Well, for these big, big fall 533 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 1: bears that we're hunting here in Arkansas, a lot of 534 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:35,400 Speaker 1: times what we're looking for is weight, you know, I mean, 535 00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:38,800 Speaker 1: that's what you're looking for in these big bears here 536 00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:45,800 Speaker 1: are gonna have not always but sometimes sagging bellies, sometimes 537 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 1: flat bellies, but they're gonna not have a lot of 538 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 1: air in between the ground and their belly. They're gonna 539 00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:55,920 Speaker 1: be tall. They're gonna look like an angus bull. I mean, 540 00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 1: but even even in big bears, right, if you have 541 00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:01,560 Speaker 1: two five pound bears, they look different. Like you could 542 00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: have a short, fat bear that was a little bit 543 00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,400 Speaker 1: shorter squatti or fatter, or you could have a huge 544 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:11,440 Speaker 1: frame bear like Batman who squared eight foot and was 545 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 1: seven ft something from nose to tail, I mean, he 546 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:19,160 Speaker 1: was he had a frame man um, but you could 547 00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:21,560 Speaker 1: also have a five hundred pound bear like rock slide 548 00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 1: the spear that they've gotten out in the office. He 549 00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,200 Speaker 1: was only six ft six from nose to tail really, 550 00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:29,720 Speaker 1: so I mean he was six inches shorter from those 551 00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:32,520 Speaker 1: to tail. But I believe that he would have weighed 552 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 1: in the same class as that other killed him late 553 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:36,640 Speaker 1: in the year or two, probably when he had been 554 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:39,600 Speaker 1: feeding on masts, so he was blown up from way 555 00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,800 Speaker 1: I think on a baited hunt. Also, you could say 556 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 1: if you've been baiting for a month and you've got 557 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:48,840 Speaker 1: a mature bear that's been eating doughnuts taken in thousands 558 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:53,160 Speaker 1: and thousands of calories for a month, versus a bear 559 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,280 Speaker 1: that just showed up four days before season, which is 560 00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:59,200 Speaker 1: gonna be lank here may have a big head, be 561 00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,360 Speaker 1: a boone and crocking, but he won't have the belly sake, 562 00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:06,000 Speaker 1: you know, as the one that's been camped out there 563 00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: for a month. Well, the largest skull bear that I've 564 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:14,000 Speaker 1: ever taken was a boar bear that only weigh three 565 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 1: or sixty pounds. Yeah, the bear that I killed this 566 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:19,840 Speaker 1: year wade five dred and fifty pounds and had a 567 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:22,239 Speaker 1: smaller skull than a three and or sixty pound bear. 568 00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:26,520 Speaker 1: That's a good segue into the different ways different people 569 00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:29,600 Speaker 1: in the country gauge the size of a bear. There's 570 00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:34,160 Speaker 1: three ways pretty much. The people gauge bear skull size, weight, 571 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:40,360 Speaker 1: and square all very very different. You it's hard to 572 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:45,759 Speaker 1: determine skull size by any characteristic. I mean, like, I 573 00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:48,440 Speaker 1: keep going back to this bear. Five fifty pound bear 574 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,399 Speaker 1: that killed this year in Oklahoma is going to score 575 00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:53,680 Speaker 1: on the high nineteens. Yeah, he's not gonna make twenty. 576 00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:56,440 Speaker 1: The biggest bear I've killed was over five hundred and 577 00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: it was only nineteen. The biggest weight bear, the bigges bear, 578 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,799 Speaker 1: weighed over five hundred pounds and had under a twenty 579 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,680 Speaker 1: skull that I killed a four four or forty bear 580 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:14,600 Speaker 1: that actually made booner twenty five eighths sixteens excuse me six. 581 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 1: So that's a great example I want people to hear 582 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 1: that is that body weight has very little to do 583 00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:25,520 Speaker 1: with skull size. The biggest skulled bear that I've ever 584 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:30,120 Speaker 1: taken was a six year old bear. My big bear 585 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:36,360 Speaker 1: was six years older. The no name six years old. Um. 586 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,040 Speaker 1: The this bear right here, this rock slide bear that 587 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,560 Speaker 1: I believe Wade five hundred pounds um he was nine 588 00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:47,040 Speaker 1: years old. Now in in Batman, the five fifty pound 589 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:49,160 Speaker 1: bear this year, that's not gonna score twenty inches, that's 590 00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:51,960 Speaker 1: right there, Ryan, We hadn't tooth aged him, but I 591 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:54,479 Speaker 1: would be shocked if that bear wasn't over ten years old. 592 00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:58,560 Speaker 1: What did he score? Well, I've green scored him under 593 00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:03,960 Speaker 1: twenty I mean like nineteen and fourteen, sixteens, I mean 594 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:07,719 Speaker 1: just right there. You know, he green scored right at twenty, 595 00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:11,000 Speaker 1: I mean twenty and zero sixteen. Well, he had the 596 00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,160 Speaker 1: body to make up for it. Yeah. And and see 597 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,280 Speaker 1: that's the thing. And as we're talking about trophy side, 598 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:19,040 Speaker 1: you know, judging the sparits, I could care less with 599 00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:20,759 Speaker 1: that bear scored twenty. It would have been cool if 600 00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:23,240 Speaker 1: he'd scored one. I mean I would have been thrilled. 601 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:26,360 Speaker 1: But in my mind, and for the way we're hunting 602 00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:29,840 Speaker 1: down here, Ryan, we're just after we're after a big, older, 603 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 1: heavy bear. On top of that, you had history with 604 00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:37,200 Speaker 1: him for what three four years? Yeah, about five years? 605 00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:39,520 Speaker 1: We had it probably for five years, and he was 606 00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:42,880 Speaker 1: one of the first bears that was over there. You know, 607 00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:45,880 Speaker 1: he had been tagged at some time in his life, 608 00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:47,839 Speaker 1: but was missing the tags. You know, he had holes 609 00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:50,239 Speaker 1: in his ears and that's been really found. That, didn't you. Yeah, 610 00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:54,280 Speaker 1: that had been interesting to little no no more about 611 00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:57,160 Speaker 1: his story. Yeah, he had a hole in his ear, Kobe, 612 00:36:57,280 --> 00:36:59,359 Speaker 1: I wouldn't have never known it. Ron was just looking 613 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:01,360 Speaker 1: at the bear and he's, okay, this thing has been tagged. 614 00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,840 Speaker 1: There was just a perfect hole. Rutting Zeer Tagger pulled 615 00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:06,480 Speaker 1: out the game of fish, asked me if he had 616 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,560 Speaker 1: a lip tattoo. And I could not discern a lip tattoo. No, 617 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:12,879 Speaker 1: I look myself, didn't didn't see anything. Yeah, but there's 618 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:21,040 Speaker 1: another another bear that's out there that Oh go ahead, 619 00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:25,360 Speaker 1: go ahead, it's in the video. Man, I'm busted now, 620 00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:30,040 Speaker 1: go ahead. Yeah. The other bear has two tags, right, yeah, 621 00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:33,279 Speaker 1: Yet we got the same history with the yellow Tag 622 00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:40,880 Speaker 1: and Brian without my influence, was yellow Tag bigger than Batman? 623 00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:48,839 Speaker 1: I think so. I'd say at least pounds probably, yeah, 624 00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:53,680 Speaker 1: at least forty pounds yeah, probably six pound bear for real. 625 00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:58,799 Speaker 1: I mean, when I saw Batman coming in, I recognized 626 00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:02,160 Speaker 1: that it was Batman. My heart kind of went, oh, man, 627 00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:05,400 Speaker 1: it's not Yellow Tag, which is ridiculous. Because this is 628 00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:07,640 Speaker 1: a but that just shows you how big the other 629 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:12,440 Speaker 1: bear was. He he was visibly fatter and heavier, how 630 00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:15,239 Speaker 1: much how much he made you think he was a 631 00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,879 Speaker 1: hundred pounds more. And that's the thing that really we're 632 00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:22,720 Speaker 1: not I don't think we're even qualified to yes, because 633 00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:27,840 Speaker 1: if you just looked at like body volume and mass, 634 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:31,640 Speaker 1: me and Dad believed that he weighed a hundred more pounds. 635 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:37,680 Speaker 1: But it could be scale though, because maybe Batman had 636 00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:42,000 Speaker 1: a frame like a bull elk, and maybe Yellow Tag 637 00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,920 Speaker 1: was just a little bit more compact, so he just 638 00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:48,080 Speaker 1: looked fatter, So maybe he was the same weight, but 639 00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:52,440 Speaker 1: just kind of like a heavy guy that a short, 640 00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:56,120 Speaker 1: fat guy that weighs a hundred ninety pounds versus a tall, 641 00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:58,680 Speaker 1: skinny guy that weighs a hundred pounds, you know what 642 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:04,160 Speaker 1: I'm saying. Um, So, I don't know, but what we're 643 00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 1: looking for in Arkansas is these big, heavy bears. That's 644 00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:10,000 Speaker 1: what we're after. Um, but let's let's go to a 645 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,080 Speaker 1: spotting stock hunt out west Man. You're not gonna kill 646 00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:18,200 Speaker 1: a five pound spring black bear in Montana. You're probably 647 00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:22,600 Speaker 1: not gonna kill a five pound bear in Montana. Ever. Uh, 648 00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:27,919 Speaker 1: those bears out western arid regions with less nutrients, they're 649 00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:30,439 Speaker 1: just not as big. That being said, you can still 650 00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:32,799 Speaker 1: kill a boone and crocket bear. You could still kill 651 00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:38,040 Speaker 1: a bear with a great big frame. But what I 652 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:41,399 Speaker 1: have this goes back to on a spot stock hunt, 653 00:39:41,400 --> 00:39:43,480 Speaker 1: when you're judging a bear from a long distance. You're 654 00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:45,400 Speaker 1: not getting to watch this bear from traill camera. You 655 00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:49,839 Speaker 1: have no experience with this bear. You're looking for. You're 656 00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,640 Speaker 1: looking for all these characteristics, you know, big front shoulders, 657 00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:58,279 Speaker 1: stove pipe legs, big pads, um, flat belly. Typically a 658 00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:01,520 Speaker 1: big spring bear is gonna have a flat barrel belly, 659 00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:03,520 Speaker 1: where a sow is gonna have more of a pear 660 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:07,480 Speaker 1: shaped like an angled belly that drops down from a 661 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:12,399 Speaker 1: smaller chest down into a bigger butt. Okay, a boar 662 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:14,800 Speaker 1: is often gonna look like a big bull. You know. 663 00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:18,680 Speaker 1: A good way, a good practice test for somebody that's 664 00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:20,960 Speaker 1: trying to understand how to judge bears. I would say, 665 00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:23,840 Speaker 1: when you're driving past cattle fields. Now we're in a 666 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:25,320 Speaker 1: part of the world we have a lot of cattle. 667 00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:30,200 Speaker 1: Your eyes scan a whole pasture of cattle, and you 668 00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:35,080 Speaker 1: can immediately pick out the bull based upon his length 669 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,840 Speaker 1: and just his square, boxy shape. It's almost like that 670 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,920 Speaker 1: with bears. Would you agree he's a good analogy. But 671 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:44,799 Speaker 1: you could tell. I mean, like you could teach your 672 00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:46,680 Speaker 1: five year old son what the bull is not just 673 00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:50,359 Speaker 1: by looking at his gear. It's rigging, as James Lawrence says, 674 00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:55,239 Speaker 1: uh but uh, but you're just his body shape, you know. 675 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:56,480 Speaker 1: I mean you can teach your kids to do that. 676 00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:59,760 Speaker 1: It's almost like the same thing. And it's much easier 677 00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:04,320 Speaker 1: to determine the trophy class of a bear if it's older. 678 00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:07,120 Speaker 1: Like when you get a juvenile male and a juvenile female, 679 00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,800 Speaker 1: that's a hard one to determine, Am I right? I 680 00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:16,200 Speaker 1: mean that's that's like splitting hairs sometimes, Like if you 681 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:18,040 Speaker 1: got a hundred and eighty pound bear out there on 682 00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:19,400 Speaker 1: the side of the mountain, You're like, is that a 683 00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:22,839 Speaker 1: male or female? Boy? Would be hard to tell. When 684 00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:25,759 Speaker 1: you really can tell the difference is is just when 685 00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:29,640 Speaker 1: you get a big, guerrilla like black bear. Like when 686 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:31,640 Speaker 1: we were in Montana two years ago, we did see 687 00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:36,160 Speaker 1: two big boards that like a thousand yards and they 688 00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,080 Speaker 1: were trailing a sow, And I mean almost with your 689 00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:43,160 Speaker 1: naked eye, you could tell that the animal behind that 690 00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:46,520 Speaker 1: was trailing this animal. It was either a cub that 691 00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,319 Speaker 1: was leading in a big fat south following a cub, 692 00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:53,680 Speaker 1: or it was a sow with a big, heavy boar fall. 693 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:55,960 Speaker 1: And so it's like when you put the scope up 694 00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:58,680 Speaker 1: and you're like, that's not a cub, that's a board. 695 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:00,680 Speaker 1: Like it was easy to tell that board kind of 696 00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:02,480 Speaker 1: had a sway walk. I hear a lot of people 697 00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:05,719 Speaker 1: talk about the way they walk, which that's a That 698 00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:09,120 Speaker 1: is one of the factors. Before I forget it, though, 699 00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:12,480 Speaker 1: let me say this, which is probably the most important 700 00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:16,640 Speaker 1: factor in UH judging bears, is that you've got to 701 00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:21,400 Speaker 1: use multiple factors to determine this bearer. You if you 702 00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:23,640 Speaker 1: use one thing, you'll mess up. And that was the 703 00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:25,360 Speaker 1: whole point of this article that I wrote in the 704 00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:28,279 Speaker 1: March April issue Barony magazine, is that if you just 705 00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:31,040 Speaker 1: use ear size, you're gonna let a whole lot of 706 00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:34,280 Speaker 1: big bears walk off that we're probably shoot your bears 707 00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:39,400 Speaker 1: if you just use um sagging belly. Like if you 708 00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,080 Speaker 1: just say I'm not shooting a bear unless there's only 709 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:45,440 Speaker 1: eight inches of daylight between the ground and the bottom 710 00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:49,760 Speaker 1: is belly, you might end up shooting a sow because 711 00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:52,840 Speaker 1: you know, some of these sALS have pot bellies and 712 00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:56,799 Speaker 1: are short, and if you don't understand scale, you might 713 00:42:56,880 --> 00:42:59,200 Speaker 1: shoot her. So you gotta do multiple things. Look at 714 00:42:59,239 --> 00:43:01,920 Speaker 1: his pads, look at his box, he head, look at 715 00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:04,319 Speaker 1: his length, look at his height. And when you get 716 00:43:04,560 --> 00:43:07,160 Speaker 1: three two to three things that are pointing your two 717 00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:09,960 Speaker 1: towards older mature mail, that's when I can say, Yep, 718 00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:12,000 Speaker 1: that's an animal that I want to take. I think 719 00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:14,640 Speaker 1: that's the best piece of advice that's ever been said 720 00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:18,600 Speaker 1: about black bears. The pads on that bear you killed 721 00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,719 Speaker 1: in Ontario, you remember them front pads, was that it 722 00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:25,719 Speaker 1: was like it was like he was made to like 723 00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,680 Speaker 1: swim like huge pads and some polar bear whatever or something. Yeah, 724 00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:33,640 Speaker 1: I do. I don't think I kill the bear with 725 00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:38,040 Speaker 1: pads that big sense, I don't think so. I think, 726 00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:41,600 Speaker 1: y'allow tech, it's probably God, you know what, the these 727 00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:43,960 Speaker 1: these bears around here, I just don't see him. Even 728 00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:46,800 Speaker 1: the big ones have feet like that. Though. It was 729 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:49,600 Speaker 1: like it was just yeah, it really was. It's almost 730 00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:53,040 Speaker 1: like a grizzly bear. And that would be just like 731 00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:55,279 Speaker 1: a human. Somebody might have big hands, somebody might have 732 00:43:55,400 --> 00:44:01,000 Speaker 1: average sized hands. Okay, so we've talked about Uh wait, square, 733 00:44:01,040 --> 00:44:03,960 Speaker 1: let's talk about square real quick. Square is the most 734 00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,839 Speaker 1: to me, like inaccurate way to judge bears between people, 735 00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:12,759 Speaker 1: because everybody kind of does it different. You hear outfitters 736 00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:16,279 Speaker 1: all the time talking about seven foot bears, and in 737 00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:20,560 Speaker 1: my Canadian hunting career, which is not I've not been 738 00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:23,120 Speaker 1: doing this for twenty years. Don't get me wrong, but 739 00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:24,839 Speaker 1: I've been in quite a few bear camps the last 740 00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:28,600 Speaker 1: six years. I have yet to see a seven foot 741 00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:32,200 Speaker 1: square bear come out of Canada in a camp that 742 00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:34,239 Speaker 1: I have been in. And I have been in some 743 00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:40,520 Speaker 1: camps with some fantastic bears that were killed. Um dog 744 00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:44,120 Speaker 1: on it. I'm gonna have to recount what I just said. No, no, no, no. 745 00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:48,120 Speaker 1: My big bear that weighed four and thirty five pounds 746 00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:52,640 Speaker 1: from Ontario. Uh, I squared him after he was skin 747 00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:55,440 Speaker 1: though in tan and he only squared six ft eight 748 00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:59,279 Speaker 1: but green, I have a feeling he would have been 749 00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:02,000 Speaker 1: pushing seven. Yeah, he would have had another four inches. 750 00:45:02,360 --> 00:45:04,719 Speaker 1: I think you would. I think you would. That's my 751 00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:08,160 Speaker 1: point is is that everybody always says that, I mean, 752 00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:12,080 Speaker 1: you'll hear outfitters and not to knock my my good outfitters. 753 00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:14,040 Speaker 1: And I'm not knocking my good ones because the good 754 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:16,919 Speaker 1: ones are doing it right. But like everybody's like seven 755 00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:19,920 Speaker 1: foot bear, seven footbear man, seven foot bears are hard 756 00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:23,560 Speaker 1: to come by, and that's not the standard of what 757 00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:27,600 Speaker 1: is in my book a trophy quality animal. I mean, 758 00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:31,359 Speaker 1: in my book, if I if I've learned this, if 759 00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,759 Speaker 1: I see a bear that is six and a half 760 00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:36,560 Speaker 1: foot square, and I'm not determining this in my mind 761 00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:40,000 Speaker 1: before I shoot it, I've just learned when Clay Newcom 762 00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:42,719 Speaker 1: sees a bear and shoots it a lot of times 763 00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:46,120 Speaker 1: it's about six ft six, you know, I mean that's 764 00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:48,879 Speaker 1: a big bear. Uh In. A six ft six bear 765 00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:50,640 Speaker 1: might have a ton of weight on him. He might 766 00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:55,280 Speaker 1: be boot and crock an animal. Um, But anyway, square 767 00:45:55,320 --> 00:45:58,560 Speaker 1: size is the distance between the base of the tail 768 00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:01,520 Speaker 1: to the tip of the nose on a green hide, 769 00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:08,480 Speaker 1: combined with the distance between claw to claw measurement. Then 770 00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:13,080 Speaker 1: the average of those two numbers. Okay, Um, Lots of 771 00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:15,000 Speaker 1: the Canadian bears I've killed have been in that six 772 00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:17,319 Speaker 1: and a half to six ft eight range, And that's 773 00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:20,839 Speaker 1: a monster bear, monster bear. A lot of guys say 774 00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:23,560 Speaker 1: a six ft bear is a shooter bear. I mean 775 00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:25,920 Speaker 1: that's kind of a number that's stunning around as a 776 00:46:26,040 --> 00:46:29,560 Speaker 1: nice six ftbear, you know. Um, you get into the 777 00:46:29,600 --> 00:46:32,759 Speaker 1: five foot bears and you're you're you're you're looking at 778 00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:39,800 Speaker 1: a smaller animal. Um, but so square weight, skull size 779 00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:46,000 Speaker 1: spring bears are typically going to be lean lean. I mean, 780 00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:50,120 Speaker 1: you might kill a whopper spring bear that weighs three pounds. Man. 781 00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:51,719 Speaker 1: I hear it all the time on the phone. Rund 782 00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:54,720 Speaker 1: guys call and they're asking me about spring bear hunting 783 00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:56,560 Speaker 1: and they're like, you know what I mean, Like they 784 00:46:56,640 --> 00:47:01,000 Speaker 1: kind of build up like they're they're willing to take 785 00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:02,839 Speaker 1: any you know. It's like I'd just like to kill 786 00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:05,719 Speaker 1: a decent bear. You know, I'd probably even shoot a 787 00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:09,239 Speaker 1: three hundred pound bear if I went up there. And 788 00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:11,920 Speaker 1: when they say that, I realized they don't really know 789 00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:16,240 Speaker 1: what they're talking about, because like they're like the minimum 790 00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:18,399 Speaker 1: I would shoot would be about a three hundred pound bear, 791 00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:22,279 Speaker 1: as if that were a small bear. But what I 792 00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:25,440 Speaker 1: want to say to him is, man, three hund pounds 793 00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:28,439 Speaker 1: spring bear is a pretty big bear. He may look 794 00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:31,760 Speaker 1: three hundred pounds when he's got four or five inches 795 00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:35,279 Speaker 1: the hair, you know, winter coat on him. But once 796 00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:37,080 Speaker 1: you get that hide off of him, there's not gonna 797 00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:41,520 Speaker 1: be much fat, not in the spring. Yeah. Yeah, well 798 00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:43,920 Speaker 1: and all these things do that Is it relevant to 799 00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:48,120 Speaker 1: the region you're hunting? For sure? Yeah? For sure. I mean, 800 00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:51,800 Speaker 1: but spring bears all, let's just say, all over Canada. 801 00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:57,080 Speaker 1: I mean, no doubt every year there are outliers. There's 802 00:47:57,160 --> 00:48:00,120 Speaker 1: always outliers and anything. So you could kill a ring 803 00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:02,680 Speaker 1: brothers five pounds. I never have done it. I've never 804 00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:04,440 Speaker 1: seen it done in the camp that I've been in. 805 00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:07,200 Speaker 1: The Biggest spring bears I've ever seen killed were probably 806 00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:09,359 Speaker 1: something that you've killed Ryan, that weighed in the three 807 00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:13,279 Speaker 1: to three fifty range. Biggest spring bears I've ever seen. 808 00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:19,120 Speaker 1: I mean, I've never seen one any bigger than probably 809 00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:22,439 Speaker 1: uh well, I'm I'm thinking of that bear you killed 810 00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:25,919 Speaker 1: in Saskatchewan two years ago. I mean, they just don't 811 00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:32,279 Speaker 1: get that much bigger Jared Summers killed was Okay, that 812 00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:33,920 Speaker 1: was a big one. That was Yeah, that was a 813 00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:36,560 Speaker 1: nice bear, very nice bear. What would you say that 814 00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:40,880 Speaker 1: having a way, man, I don't know. Probably in the threes, 815 00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:47,520 Speaker 1: so you know, I think I remember you saying between 816 00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:50,560 Speaker 1: three fifty and three seventy five or something, And I 817 00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:53,600 Speaker 1: mean that's a whopper spring bear. So point being, don't 818 00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:57,320 Speaker 1: go to don't go into the spring really with weight 819 00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:01,279 Speaker 1: as your way to qualify whether bears and shooter, You'll 820 00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:05,160 Speaker 1: be disappointed. Um I would go into a spring hunt 821 00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:08,600 Speaker 1: just looking for an older, mature male, you know. And 822 00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:11,919 Speaker 1: so three things skull size, wade, square scus. Talk about 823 00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:13,880 Speaker 1: skull size just a minute. We we've already touched on it. 824 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:19,200 Speaker 1: You can't determine skull size by almost anything. Five hundred 825 00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:21,200 Speaker 1: fifty pound bear that doesn't make Boone and Crockett, and 826 00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:24,399 Speaker 1: the three hundred and sixty pound bear that does. Um, 827 00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:29,080 Speaker 1: eighteen inches is the minimum for Pope and Young. So 828 00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:31,440 Speaker 1: once I made a graph and put it in Bear 829 00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:35,799 Speaker 1: Hunting magazine that did like a comparative scale between using 830 00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,080 Speaker 1: Pope Young minimums for white tail, which people are really 831 00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:41,279 Speaker 1: familiar with. Like if you say hundred white tail, people 832 00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:43,560 Speaker 1: are like, okay, I know what kind of deal that is. 833 00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:45,799 Speaker 1: And then when you say hundred seventy inch white til, 834 00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:50,239 Speaker 1: they go, oh, that's a big one. Um. So if 835 00:49:50,320 --> 00:49:52,960 Speaker 1: eighteen inches was equivalent to a hundred twenty five inch 836 00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,400 Speaker 1: white tail and twenty one inches was equivalent to a 837 00:49:56,520 --> 00:50:00,359 Speaker 1: hundred and seventy inch white tail. A nineteen in bear 838 00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:03,120 Speaker 1: would be equivalent to a hundred and forty two hundred 839 00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:05,480 Speaker 1: and fifty inch whitetail. So if you think of it 840 00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:08,520 Speaker 1: like that, I mean a hundred not many people are 841 00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:11,080 Speaker 1: gonna be passing a hundred forty hundred fifty inch white tails. 842 00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:15,440 Speaker 1: Drop that down into bears and you see that a 843 00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:20,600 Speaker 1: nineteen inch bear is a nice animal. Um. I mean, 844 00:50:20,840 --> 00:50:23,440 Speaker 1: like you said, you've killed five hundred pound bears that 845 00:50:23,560 --> 00:50:28,200 Speaker 1: scored in the nineteens, as have I. Uh, Kobe, what 846 00:50:28,280 --> 00:50:31,279 Speaker 1: did your bear score in the fall in Manitoba? We 847 00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:35,000 Speaker 1: refted out of eighteen and something. I think. Okay, So 848 00:50:35,160 --> 00:50:38,480 Speaker 1: Colby killed a bear that was in the three or 849 00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:41,239 Speaker 1: fifty pound range in the fall. In the spring, that 850 00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:45,360 Speaker 1: bear would have weighed under three and pounds most likely, so, 851 00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:48,719 Speaker 1: I mean, but by August and put on some weight 852 00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:51,239 Speaker 1: was probably the three fifty pound ran three and fifty 853 00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:54,479 Speaker 1: pound range. Um. I actually thought the bear would probably 854 00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:56,360 Speaker 1: have scored more. To me, it looked like it would be. 855 00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:58,960 Speaker 1: I I probably would have said, man, that's got to 856 00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:02,239 Speaker 1: be a nineteen inch square. But it scored just over 857 00:51:02,320 --> 00:51:05,360 Speaker 1: the pope young minimum. Yeah. I think Corey said that 858 00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:09,040 Speaker 1: his bears don't typically have a larger skull in that 859 00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:11,720 Speaker 1: in that area. I mean like they have good schools, 860 00:51:11,760 --> 00:51:16,439 Speaker 1: but compared to their body weight, like that ratio is big. 861 00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:19,040 Speaker 1: They do, and they do have some big body bears 862 00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:20,920 Speaker 1: up there in the fall. I mean they're killing some 863 00:51:21,080 --> 00:51:27,200 Speaker 1: four pound bears Saskatchewan with it two years ago. Head 864 00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:29,160 Speaker 1: looked big, but once we got the hide off of it, 865 00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:33,920 Speaker 1: he didn't have a occipital protruded back. It's like it 866 00:51:34,040 --> 00:51:37,439 Speaker 1: was just gone. Man, I'll never forget that one, because 867 00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:39,880 Speaker 1: that taught me a lot. Ryan, when I recovered that bear, 868 00:51:39,960 --> 00:51:42,040 Speaker 1: I was with you when you we recovered the bear. 869 00:51:42,520 --> 00:51:45,960 Speaker 1: The bear had canines that were war I mean, it 870 00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:50,080 Speaker 1: had every indication of it being an older male. I 871 00:51:50,120 --> 00:51:54,000 Speaker 1: mean an old warrior, big head, big feet, big body, 872 00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:58,279 Speaker 1: I mean, square head. And I told Ryan, I said, 873 00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:01,240 Speaker 1: I'll bet you my tri uck that that bear scores 874 00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:03,839 Speaker 1: over twenty Do you remember me saying that. I mean, 875 00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:06,440 Speaker 1: it was like that bear is going to score over 876 00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:09,560 Speaker 1: twenty inches. And when we got back and I brought 877 00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:13,359 Speaker 1: my calipers and we scored your bear and my bear Ryan, 878 00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:18,919 Speaker 1: my color bear was a much It was a lesser bear, 879 00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:23,279 Speaker 1: I mean big time, body, size, length, everything, but that 880 00:52:23,440 --> 00:52:26,880 Speaker 1: color bear had a bigger skull than yours. And and 881 00:52:27,040 --> 00:52:30,399 Speaker 1: it was because you know, you measure bear skull based 882 00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:33,240 Speaker 1: on the length and the width of the dried skull. 883 00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:37,160 Speaker 1: And uh, the occipital bone is this wing bone that 884 00:52:37,320 --> 00:52:40,120 Speaker 1: sticks off the back of the skull. In Ryan's bear, 885 00:52:40,239 --> 00:52:43,320 Speaker 1: it was just like flat back there. And most of 886 00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:45,880 Speaker 1: these bears that score good have this big wing that 887 00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:50,160 Speaker 1: flows off the back like a pterodactyl head or you 888 00:52:50,239 --> 00:52:53,319 Speaker 1: know how many tarodactyls if you killed and I mean 889 00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:56,520 Speaker 1: you scared to score those, Yeah, that's a good way. 890 00:52:56,880 --> 00:52:59,879 Speaker 1: I mean it's yeah, it's it's just like point off 891 00:52:59,880 --> 00:53:02,480 Speaker 1: the back of the head. So that's a good example. 892 00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:05,200 Speaker 1: So bear skulls are all over the place. A lot 893 00:53:05,239 --> 00:53:08,040 Speaker 1: of it all has to do with genetics. I've asked 894 00:53:08,120 --> 00:53:10,200 Speaker 1: some of the best bear biologists in the country their 895 00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:14,000 Speaker 1: thoughts on whether a bear skull actually grows over time, 896 00:53:15,080 --> 00:53:18,160 Speaker 1: and the best answer there, to my knowledge, there's been 897 00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:21,640 Speaker 1: no real scientific studies because does a ten year old 898 00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:26,000 Speaker 1: bear like batman, would he have kept growing? Let's just 899 00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:28,480 Speaker 1: say he's ten years old. If I had killed him 900 00:53:28,520 --> 00:53:30,640 Speaker 1: when he was twenty years old, would he have scored more? 901 00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:37,640 Speaker 1: Here's my philosophy, maybe a little bit. I think these 902 00:53:37,680 --> 00:53:43,000 Speaker 1: older bears add some bone mass to to to the skull. 903 00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:45,359 Speaker 1: But I do not believe that he would have ever 904 00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,040 Speaker 1: been a twenty one in bear. I just don't think 905 00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:51,000 Speaker 1: he was gonna add an inch. It seems like they 906 00:53:51,040 --> 00:53:54,520 Speaker 1: get them little calcified growths. You know a lot of 907 00:53:55,080 --> 00:53:59,840 Speaker 1: these little ridges. And have you noticed that an older 908 00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,480 Speaker 1: air is gonna have a lot of calcification on the 909 00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:05,719 Speaker 1: skull where where a young bear is just smooth like butter, 910 00:54:06,120 --> 00:54:09,200 Speaker 1: just smooth all over the skull, old bear is gonna 911 00:54:09,239 --> 00:54:12,719 Speaker 1: have ridges and fissures and little bumps. And that's where 912 00:54:12,719 --> 00:54:15,360 Speaker 1: I think that they might add some bone mass that 913 00:54:15,719 --> 00:54:21,160 Speaker 1: may account for some growth. But I keep going back 914 00:54:21,239 --> 00:54:23,319 Speaker 1: to my the one Boone and crocketbear I've ever killed 915 00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:28,160 Speaker 1: that had a he was six years old and had 916 00:54:28,200 --> 00:54:31,360 Speaker 1: a twenty and eight sixteenth centch skull like he he 917 00:54:31,760 --> 00:54:33,440 Speaker 1: He may have been Boone and Crockett when he was 918 00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:38,080 Speaker 1: four years old, but he had a smooth skull. I mean, 919 00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:41,279 Speaker 1: maybe he would have grown a litit over time. But 920 00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:44,239 Speaker 1: it's genetics, just like, is a seventeen year old boy 921 00:54:44,719 --> 00:54:47,439 Speaker 1: all right, let's say eighteen nineteen year old boy, he's 922 00:54:47,440 --> 00:54:50,319 Speaker 1: got the frame that he's gonna carry his whole life. 923 00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:54,839 Speaker 1: He's not growing still, you know. So I've never really 924 00:54:54,920 --> 00:54:58,760 Speaker 1: been able to find a real concrete scientific answer about 925 00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:02,400 Speaker 1: that because they've just never is not something that they're studying, Uh, 926 00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:04,920 Speaker 1: that I found yet. Maybe somebody's got a better answer. 927 00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:06,759 Speaker 1: But I'd like to find a bear that had a 928 00:55:07,600 --> 00:55:14,919 Speaker 1: a skull like Brent Reeves has Scott's Man. Brent Reeves, Yeah, 929 00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:22,600 Speaker 1: I agree, Brent would be like, uh, he would be 930 00:55:22,680 --> 00:55:27,360 Speaker 1: like one of those like big wristed, big hand meaty 931 00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:32,720 Speaker 1: kind of squatty bears. Yeah. He's even got the small 932 00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:38,319 Speaker 1: ears too. He's got small ears. Yeah. Oh, Brent Reeves. 933 00:55:38,320 --> 00:55:42,239 Speaker 1: I'm glad he's not here right now. Me too. Brent 934 00:55:42,800 --> 00:55:48,200 Speaker 1: Reeves never listens to the Bear Honey Magazine podcast. That joker, Brent. 935 00:55:48,480 --> 00:55:57,480 Speaker 1: When you hear this text me, Oh okay, guys, difference 936 00:55:57,480 --> 00:56:00,600 Speaker 1: between spring and spring and fall scale. Let's hit one 937 00:56:00,640 --> 00:56:03,839 Speaker 1: more thing. Scale is everything. Guys make this mistake all 938 00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:06,400 Speaker 1: the time, is that they see a bear, they shoot it. 939 00:56:06,640 --> 00:56:08,200 Speaker 1: They go up to it. They think it's a big bear, 940 00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:10,680 Speaker 1: but it's a small bear. Scale So if you're spotting 941 00:56:10,719 --> 00:56:13,400 Speaker 1: style hunting out out in Montana, you need to have 942 00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:17,360 Speaker 1: a general understanding of the plants around that. And I 943 00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:19,960 Speaker 1: mean like, when I was in Montana, I knew that 944 00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:23,359 Speaker 1: there were these certain bushes they were about thirty inches tall. 945 00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:26,080 Speaker 1: And if I was looking at the bear a thousand 946 00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:29,000 Speaker 1: yards away and those bushes were everywhere, you know, and 947 00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:31,719 Speaker 1: he was walking through that, I was like, dang, his 948 00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:36,000 Speaker 1: shoulders are way up above those bushes, or if they 949 00:56:36,040 --> 00:56:39,000 Speaker 1: were below it. And man, if that bear was just 950 00:56:39,160 --> 00:56:42,280 Speaker 1: out on a barren hillside, it would have been almost 951 00:56:42,320 --> 00:56:46,520 Speaker 1: impossible quickly to determine. But so you gotta have scale. 952 00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:48,520 Speaker 1: So if you're hunting over a bait site, you've got 953 00:56:48,640 --> 00:56:51,239 Speaker 1: to understand what size barrels there are. I've got a 954 00:56:51,280 --> 00:56:54,040 Speaker 1: story when I was in Saskatchewan the first year, I 955 00:56:54,160 --> 00:56:56,600 Speaker 1: had in my mind that you could you would shoot 956 00:56:56,600 --> 00:56:58,719 Speaker 1: a bear if his if he was as tall as 957 00:56:58,760 --> 00:57:00,880 Speaker 1: the barrel. That was the one factor that I was 958 00:57:00,920 --> 00:57:03,359 Speaker 1: looking for. Well, a bear came in the first day 959 00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:04,920 Speaker 1: that was as tall as a barrel. I shot him 960 00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:07,680 Speaker 1: and it was a lesser bear, and it was because 961 00:57:08,239 --> 00:57:11,759 Speaker 1: the barrel had been dug into the ground by the 962 00:57:11,800 --> 00:57:14,280 Speaker 1: bears digging grease out from underneath it. So the barrel 963 00:57:14,360 --> 00:57:16,800 Speaker 1: was sitting in a six inch hole, and so this 964 00:57:17,080 --> 00:57:19,120 Speaker 1: average bear looked like a bear that was big. And 965 00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:21,560 Speaker 1: that goes back to you gotta have more than one factor, 966 00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:26,240 Speaker 1: but you gotta understand scale. So whether it's trees, whether 967 00:57:26,280 --> 00:57:28,360 Speaker 1: it's bushes, whether it's a bait barrel, whether it's a 968 00:57:28,440 --> 00:57:31,440 Speaker 1: mark on a tree that indicates you know, a thirty 969 00:57:31,520 --> 00:57:34,800 Speaker 1: six inch tall bear, you gotta have scale because a 970 00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:38,240 Speaker 1: hundred pound bear walking through the woods can look real 971 00:57:38,360 --> 00:57:42,120 Speaker 1: similar to a two fifty pound bear. It's all about scale. 972 00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:45,920 Speaker 1: We talked about, Uh, Paul's to me, the biggest thing 973 00:57:46,240 --> 00:57:49,040 Speaker 1: of a of a big boar is height. I can't 974 00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:52,520 Speaker 1: get away from that height and Paul shape. That's the 975 00:57:52,560 --> 00:57:55,240 Speaker 1: way I personally determined. There's gonna be things that different 976 00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:59,200 Speaker 1: people probably pick up on. Uh. We talked about determining 977 00:57:59,280 --> 00:58:02,440 Speaker 1: the sex of bears, which is an important part, and 978 00:58:02,560 --> 00:58:07,760 Speaker 1: we talked about the they're not necessarily myths, but they're 979 00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:11,479 Speaker 1: not the whole truth. So small ears is not a myth. 980 00:58:12,080 --> 00:58:14,800 Speaker 1: A crease on the head is not a myth when 981 00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:17,680 Speaker 1: you're determining a big bear, but it's not the whole story. 982 00:58:18,160 --> 00:58:21,880 Speaker 1: If that's all, you know, you're gonna make a mistake 983 00:58:22,120 --> 00:58:26,240 Speaker 1: a few times out of ten, you know. And uh again. 984 00:58:26,560 --> 00:58:28,360 Speaker 1: As we close down the podcast, I go back to 985 00:58:28,440 --> 00:58:31,040 Speaker 1: this thing about we're not just talking about trophy hunting 986 00:58:31,120 --> 00:58:33,320 Speaker 1: from an aspect of we just want to bring home 987 00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:37,280 Speaker 1: the biggest animal possible. Trophy hunting is pretty cool because 988 00:58:37,560 --> 00:58:39,720 Speaker 1: we're after older mature males. That's the best thing to 989 00:58:39,800 --> 00:58:42,200 Speaker 1: take out of the population. It's the best thing for 990 00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:44,960 Speaker 1: the population to extract older mature males that have already 991 00:58:44,960 --> 00:58:48,040 Speaker 1: contributed to the gene pool. And trophy hunting, my friends, 992 00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:50,479 Speaker 1: is actually what saved North American big game by taking 993 00:58:50,520 --> 00:58:52,920 Speaker 1: the emphasis off the young and the females and putting 994 00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:55,720 Speaker 1: it on the older mature males. So man, I will 995 00:58:55,760 --> 00:58:58,560 Speaker 1: take zero flat from anyone on the planet saying that 996 00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:00,720 Speaker 1: we're trophy hunters because we want to kill big bears 997 00:59:00,760 --> 00:59:04,240 Speaker 1: and not little ones. Who is the conservation hero my brothers, 998 00:59:04,520 --> 00:59:06,960 Speaker 1: the guy that shoots the first juvenile bear to the 999 00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:10,120 Speaker 1: barrel and post a picture on Facebook and brags about 1000 00:59:10,160 --> 00:59:12,520 Speaker 1: how he's not a trophy hunter, and he's extracted this 1001 00:59:12,600 --> 00:59:15,000 Speaker 1: animal out of the population before it could contribute to 1002 00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:21,480 Speaker 1: the gene pool or the brethren like in this room. Wait, 1003 00:59:22,320 --> 00:59:26,080 Speaker 1: but the big ones take out the big, older mature male, 1004 00:59:26,120 --> 00:59:28,640 Speaker 1: it's already contributed to the gene pool, and we hang 1005 00:59:28,720 --> 00:59:31,320 Speaker 1: his high on our walls. We eat his flesh, and 1006 00:59:31,440 --> 00:59:33,880 Speaker 1: we revel in the glory that he had while he 1007 00:59:33,960 --> 00:59:35,760 Speaker 1: was on the earth for such a long time because 1008 00:59:35,800 --> 00:59:42,360 Speaker 1: he was an older butture male. Are you with me? Yeah? Uh? 1009 00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:46,600 Speaker 1: Is it not true though? Yeah? I mean guys that 1010 00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:50,080 Speaker 1: like sometimes people feel like they there's some honor in 1011 00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:52,760 Speaker 1: shooting smaller animals and claiming not to be a trophy 1012 00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:56,760 Speaker 1: hunter and get it. Like, like trophy hunting as it's 1013 00:59:56,880 --> 01:00:00,720 Speaker 1: understood in the general hunting populace, it's bad. I mean, 1014 01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:03,960 Speaker 1: like somebody that would, for just ego purposes, want to 1015 01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:07,240 Speaker 1: shoot a big bear. I mean, do I want to 1016 01:00:07,280 --> 01:00:10,080 Speaker 1: shoot a big bear? Yes, sir, I do. Why because 1017 01:00:10,120 --> 01:00:12,680 Speaker 1: I like big bear bear hides on my wall. I 1018 01:00:12,800 --> 01:00:15,480 Speaker 1: like more bear meat rather than less bear meat. But 1019 01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:19,720 Speaker 1: I also understand the macro goals of bear hunting, and 1020 01:00:19,800 --> 01:00:21,919 Speaker 1: it is better to take out an older mature male 1021 01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:24,280 Speaker 1: than it is to take out a juvenile female. You've 1022 01:00:24,280 --> 01:00:27,480 Speaker 1: got your weekend warriors though that you know, don't bear 1023 01:00:27,600 --> 01:00:30,320 Speaker 1: hunt much, and they're happy just to kill a bear 1024 01:00:30,800 --> 01:00:33,520 Speaker 1: and there's nothing wrong with them. And I don't want 1025 01:00:33,560 --> 01:00:36,439 Speaker 1: to you. I appreciate you saying that because I don't 1026 01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:42,560 Speaker 1: want to trash that guy, which I'm not. But where 1027 01:00:42,560 --> 01:00:44,600 Speaker 1: are we going with that? I want to kill the 1028 01:00:44,640 --> 01:00:48,920 Speaker 1: next hundred pound bears. There's a fine lote. Let me. 1029 01:00:49,040 --> 01:00:51,960 Speaker 1: Like with youth hunters or everybody does have to evaluate 1030 01:00:52,040 --> 01:00:54,040 Speaker 1: their opportunity. And I'll be the first to say that 1031 01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:57,840 Speaker 1: for the I mean, I have opportunity to hunt bears, 1032 01:00:57,920 --> 01:01:02,080 Speaker 1: and so I would hope that I'm select. But you 1033 01:01:02,200 --> 01:01:03,840 Speaker 1: may go on one bear hunt in your life and 1034 01:01:03,880 --> 01:01:05,760 Speaker 1: on the final day of the hunt of juvenile bear 1035 01:01:05,880 --> 01:01:08,880 Speaker 1: comes in shoot it. So I really I appreciate you 1036 01:01:08,920 --> 01:01:10,400 Speaker 1: saying that, right, because I don't want to have an 1037 01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:14,680 Speaker 1: elitist mentality. But I also don't want to give somebody 1038 01:01:14,800 --> 01:01:19,280 Speaker 1: too much credit. Who is dogging somebody that kills a 1039 01:01:19,320 --> 01:01:22,680 Speaker 1: bunch of big bears because they don't have that opportunity. 1040 01:01:23,440 --> 01:01:27,480 Speaker 1: Is that is that fair? Yeah? Yeah? But well, I 1041 01:01:27,560 --> 01:01:32,680 Speaker 1: mean starting out, we killed smaller bears and after so 1042 01:01:32,840 --> 01:01:36,120 Speaker 1: many years, you don't want to kill, you know, a 1043 01:01:36,200 --> 01:01:39,560 Speaker 1: smaller bear. Just just like deer hunting. I guess here 1044 01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:44,480 Speaker 1: guys looking for that next big deer and you don't. 1045 01:01:44,600 --> 01:01:47,280 Speaker 1: You don't want to make the standards so high that 1046 01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:50,280 Speaker 1: you take the joy and fun out of hunting. I mean, like, 1047 01:01:50,440 --> 01:01:53,320 Speaker 1: if you don't have big bears, then there's no sense 1048 01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:56,040 Speaker 1: and setting your goals that high. I mean really here 1049 01:01:56,080 --> 01:01:58,760 Speaker 1: in Arkansas, I mean there are places where you're just 1050 01:01:58,880 --> 01:02:00,840 Speaker 1: not gonna kill a big bear. So if you're trying 1051 01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:02,720 Speaker 1: to kill five hundred pound bear, you're just not everyone 1052 01:02:02,880 --> 01:02:05,880 Speaker 1: kill one. So I mean, you know, put that standard down. Laura, Man, 1053 01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:08,840 Speaker 1: that's cool. You go to Canada on a once in 1054 01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:12,840 Speaker 1: a lifetime trip, Uh, you you just want to evaluate 1055 01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:15,880 Speaker 1: the situation and not kill a hunter pound bear on 1056 01:02:15,920 --> 01:02:18,320 Speaker 1: the first day, when if you'd wait until day three, 1057 01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:21,880 Speaker 1: you could have taken a a nicer, older, mature male. Yeah. 1058 01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:24,120 Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's kind of where I fit inside 1059 01:02:24,120 --> 01:02:26,640 Speaker 1: of it. When I take my kids hunting, it's different 1060 01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:30,160 Speaker 1: when I take I mean everything, everything is different. But 1061 01:02:30,280 --> 01:02:34,240 Speaker 1: I feel like bear hunters need to have the knowledge 1062 01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:38,040 Speaker 1: in the ability to articulate even what I just said 1063 01:02:38,080 --> 01:02:42,840 Speaker 1: about older mature males and not being picked on by 1064 01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:45,120 Speaker 1: people who say you're a trophy hunter because you kill 1065 01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:48,960 Speaker 1: big animals. I mean, I won't take it for a second. 1066 01:02:49,600 --> 01:02:51,919 Speaker 1: Um so that there's this, But at the same time, 1067 01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:56,760 Speaker 1: hunting is about enjoyment. It is about I mean, a 1068 01:02:56,840 --> 01:03:02,240 Speaker 1: young bear. It's arguable, Batman, his meat tastes incredible, but 1069 01:03:02,280 --> 01:03:04,520 Speaker 1: it's arguable that a young bear might taste better than 1070 01:03:04,520 --> 01:03:07,280 Speaker 1: an old bear. Not always the case, but could be. So. 1071 01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:10,560 Speaker 1: I mean, maybe your goals are different. The main thing is, 1072 01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:12,800 Speaker 1: whatever your goal is, just stick to it. The guy 1073 01:03:12,920 --> 01:03:17,320 Speaker 1: that I kind of, you know that I feel the 1074 01:03:17,440 --> 01:03:20,960 Speaker 1: liberty to rib would be the guy that claims to 1075 01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:23,320 Speaker 1: be wanting to wait for an older bear but then 1076 01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:25,680 Speaker 1: just shoots one the first day just because he's impatient, 1077 01:03:26,560 --> 01:03:29,640 Speaker 1: when he had all this opportunity for another one, you know. 1078 01:03:29,960 --> 01:03:31,840 Speaker 1: But anyway, I don't want to I don't want to 1079 01:03:32,240 --> 01:03:34,919 Speaker 1: hit on anybody. But these things are true that we say. 1080 01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:41,160 Speaker 1: Do you guys agree? Sir? What closing comments flint face Grib? 1081 01:03:42,680 --> 01:03:47,600 Speaker 1: I don't know, man, you've kind of covered everything. We've 1082 01:03:47,640 --> 01:03:51,880 Speaker 1: covered it. Kobe. Well, I was just thinking about whenever 1083 01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:54,600 Speaker 1: I got the bear last year and man, it's old. 1084 01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:57,400 Speaker 1: But how we couldn't measure his height because the barrel 1085 01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:00,600 Speaker 1: was on the side, And so the thing we used 1086 01:04:00,800 --> 01:04:03,760 Speaker 1: was to, uh, it's like, will he fit in the barrel? No, 1087 01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:06,960 Speaker 1: he's a good one. You know that's true. Yeah, yeah, 1088 01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:11,400 Speaker 1: I've heard it. Fitter told me that as as he said, 1089 01:04:11,480 --> 01:04:14,560 Speaker 1: one thing he used to tell his clients was would 1090 01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:18,600 Speaker 1: that bear fit into a gallon drum? I've used that 1091 01:04:18,680 --> 01:04:24,200 Speaker 1: analogy myself while bear has been on the site. Yeah, looking, man, 1092 01:04:24,240 --> 01:04:25,880 Speaker 1: if I pop the top off that barrel with that 1093 01:04:26,160 --> 01:04:29,400 Speaker 1: bear fit in there, yeah, and a and a bear 1094 01:04:30,040 --> 01:04:34,120 Speaker 1: over three hundred pounds, it's gonna you're gonna be like, man, 1095 01:04:34,200 --> 01:04:37,120 Speaker 1: if you fit, he'd barely fit, right, I mean, if 1096 01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:39,960 Speaker 1: if it's just like for sure, yeah, it's probably under 1097 01:04:40,000 --> 01:04:43,120 Speaker 1: a three inner pound bear. But now, every part of 1098 01:04:43,120 --> 01:04:46,000 Speaker 1: the country is different, everybody has different standards, and and again, 1099 01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:48,600 Speaker 1: the hunt is all about the experience and the adventure 1100 01:04:48,960 --> 01:04:51,800 Speaker 1: and the goals that you've set for yourself. So but these, hey, guys, 1101 01:04:51,880 --> 01:04:57,520 Speaker 1: these principles will help somebody judge bear and uh, hey, awesome, 1102 01:04:57,960 --> 01:04:59,760 Speaker 1: this is this has been I think a lot of 1103 01:04:59,800 --> 01:05:03,760 Speaker 1: in formation inside of this podcast, and thank you guys 1104 01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:07,480 Speaker 1: for being here, and thank you Ryan, appreciate it coming up. Man, Kobe, 1105 01:05:08,560 --> 01:05:11,520 Speaker 1: you were here and we'll be here when this podcast 1106 01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:13,560 Speaker 1: is over, so you didn't really have to go anywhere, 1107 01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:18,760 Speaker 1: but thanks for being here at Kolby. All right, Keep 1108 01:05:18,800 --> 01:05:21,520 Speaker 1: the wild places wild because that's where the bears live.