Speaker 1: Hey there, everybody. Welcome to the Amy and TJ podcast
Speaker 1: make Up addition, where we make up as a couple
Speaker 1: for the fight we got into for the previous episode
Speaker 1: of this podcast. I'm kidding. Do we have making up
Speaker 1: to do after the last one?
Speaker 2: Well? I think here's what happened. We made up and
Speaker 2: then we because we were re listening to the podcast
Speaker 2: because we were debating whether or not to actually air it.
Speaker 2: Having to re listen to it brought up a lot
Speaker 2: of other emotions, I think for both of us, and
Speaker 2: we had to re examine the fight because maybe it
Speaker 2: hadn't been.
Speaker 1: Okay, So we haven't made up.
Speaker 3: We're in the process of it.
Speaker 1: Wow. Even on that, we're in two different places because
Speaker 1: I'm done and I'm over it. You know, I didn't
Speaker 1: know we were still working.
Speaker 3: You're over it.
Speaker 1: I'm over it because I would really like to be
Speaker 1: not how this was supposed to go. Welcome everybody, Yes,
Speaker 1: how about this? Did anything the reaction any of the
Speaker 1: reaction we got from the last podcast? What surprised you
Speaker 1: by the reaction?
Speaker 3: Okay, that's a really good question.
Speaker 2: What surprised me the most is that people were surprised
Speaker 2: because I think if anyone has been in a relationship
Speaker 2: in their life or are currently in a relationship. Don't
Speaker 2: y'all fight? Don't you have issues? I think I was
Speaker 2: surprised that people said it was too soon for us
Speaker 2: to have a fight. We've been together as a couple
Speaker 2: officially for almost almost exactly a year and a half.
Speaker 2: We're close to it, we're coming up on it. I
Speaker 2: feel like we should. If we didn't have a fight,
Speaker 2: if we didn't argue, that would be a red flag.
Speaker 1: Do you really think there's a general idea consensus for
Speaker 1: most level headed folks that are surprised that two people
Speaker 1: in a relationship might have a disagreement.
Speaker 2: And by the way, there was no yelling. I was
Speaker 2: actually really proud of So I was proud of us.
Speaker 2: Would I listen?
Speaker 3: And I don't think we ever yell. No, So I
Speaker 3: think we fight.
Speaker 2: I mean, fighting is not fun, It's not fun at all,
Speaker 2: But I don't. I actually feel pretty good about how
Speaker 2: we fought, and I think it was clear that we
Speaker 2: were not communicating great and that's what we're working on.
Speaker 2: But I guess that was my biggest surprise, that people
Speaker 2: really were taken aback.
Speaker 3: That we fought, or that we disagreed.
Speaker 2: I would love to see their relationships, wow, and take
Speaker 2: some notes because I would love to not fight.
Speaker 3: That'd be amazing.
Speaker 1: But don't they tell you, you know you're in trouble if
Speaker 1: you're in a relationship and.
Speaker 2: You don't fight, right, because the opposite of love is indifference,
Speaker 2: and in difference means yeah, you do you, I do
Speaker 2: me bye or whatever, like living alongside somebody and not
Speaker 2: with someone, And so yeah, I mean.
Speaker 3: I that was the biggest surprise.
Speaker 2: Did you have a something that stood out to you
Speaker 2: that surprised you that would have to be it?
Speaker 1: That that Yeah, it's the end of us because we
Speaker 1: told people that we've had a disagreement. Just that that
Speaker 1: part's fascinating. But I think a lot there are a
Speaker 1: lot of reasonable, level headed folks, folks who are in
Speaker 1: relationships who listen to it, and we got a lot
Speaker 1: of those responses and read them. They see themselves in
Speaker 1: that disagreement, They see themselves in the lack of communication,
Speaker 1: and sometimes people come down on what their own They
Speaker 1: bring their own junk into it as they listen. Your
Speaker 1: ears are filtering what you're hearing based on your own
Speaker 1: experience and sometimes yes, your own bias, but yeah, a
Speaker 1: lot of women will say yes TJ da da da,
Speaker 1: and a lot of men were going another way. And
Speaker 1: then Frank it went along racial lines as well, some
Speaker 1: black and white. It was that was fascinating. But yeah,
Speaker 1: I was surprised that we're not supposed to fight.
Speaker 2: I know, I always I think there were two things
Speaker 2: at play that men are is it Men are from
Speaker 2: are from Mars, from Venus, matter from Mars. Women are
Speaker 2: from Venus, and so that was absolutely and then you
Speaker 2: know the black white thing. It's it's interesting that there
Speaker 2: are different ways to look at it, and that's part
Speaker 2: of I think that's part of the reason why we
Speaker 2: wanted to put it out there. And I love what
Speaker 2: someone wrote. They talked about what we did in the
Speaker 2: podcast and they gave it a name that I had
Speaker 2: never heard before.
Speaker 1: Well, you told me, oh, oh, the value tainment. I
Speaker 1: wish I could give him credit. A guy that passed
Speaker 1: it along, and I, okay, if that's something you all
Speaker 1: are familiar with, I never heard it before. But he
Speaker 1: called it value tainment to where yes, we are listening
Speaker 1: to you and we are being we are engaged, and
Speaker 1: to some degree you have to be entertaining in all
Speaker 1: you do, but there there was some value in it,
Speaker 1: and he used that word, and I'll think, Wow, I
Speaker 1: guess that's really what we were going for. I don't
Speaker 1: think we were talking about entertaining anybody in doing so,
Speaker 1: but he found value in what we were doing.
Speaker 2: I love that, and I think that's something that it
Speaker 2: made me feel better about making the decision to go
Speaker 2: ahead and err, because that is what we were hoping
Speaker 2: to do, a just to say hey, here we are
Speaker 2: and we don't And we said this from the beginning.
Speaker 2: We didn't want to put out an Instagram all smiles
Speaker 2: type of podcast where hey, look at us, We're doing great,
Speaker 2: everything's rosy. We wanted to be real. So we figured,
Speaker 2: if we're going to put the good stuff, we should
Speaker 2: also put the stuff that's tough and hard and maybe
Speaker 2: people can A not feel so alone or B learn
Speaker 2: something from it. And we got a lot of really
Speaker 2: positive comments from people saying just that, oh my gosh,
Speaker 2: this made me feel validated. Oh my goodness, I feel heard. Wow,
Speaker 2: I have the same fight with my husband or my wife, And.
Speaker 3: That felt cool. That's what I was hoping for at
Speaker 3: the very least.
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, we talked about I wasn't thinking that at
Speaker 1: the time when we first set up the microphones, and
Speaker 1: again that disagreement, that back and forth happened. I guess
Speaker 1: we're talking to you now several days removed from it,
Speaker 1: but initially I didn't think about we went back and
Speaker 1: forth about the why. But we're have Tammy in South
Speaker 1: Dakota right now. Give you the why because Robot and
Speaker 1: we're going to talk a little more about why and
Speaker 1: what went into how the last episode actually got on
Speaker 1: the air. But we are going to read a statement
Speaker 1: not prepared by us, not prepared for us, but a
Speaker 1: statement word for word for somebody named Tammy from South Dakota.
Speaker 1: And I think Robe she sums up better than you
Speaker 1: and I ever could, and she got it. She got
Speaker 1: it exactly like we wanted people to get it.
Speaker 2: So go ahead, all right, this is from Tammy. Yes,
Speaker 2: we love this, she said.
Speaker 3: She writes.
Speaker 2: Relationships are hard enough, let alone having to do it
Speaker 2: under the public eye. And then some remember that these
Speaker 2: two are human beings, just like all of us. They
Speaker 2: are choosing love, and love is not easy. It's something
Speaker 2: you have to work at every day. They could choose
Speaker 2: to be fake and lie to us all and not
Speaker 2: share their genuine feelings, making the public feel more alone
Speaker 2: than ever. But no, they are choosing to be vulnerable
Speaker 2: and talking through that They don't have everything figured out.
Speaker 2: They are sharing their triumphs and struggles, joy, laughter, pain,
Speaker 2: my gosh, they have shared some deep stuff and feelings.
Speaker 2: All these things they are sharing should make you all
Speaker 2: feel not alone. Just stop being judgmental and let them
Speaker 2: work through things and maybe help a whole lot of
Speaker 2: others be honest with each other and themselves. They are
Speaker 2: both human. Thank you, Roboc and TJ for sharing your
Speaker 2: lives and helping others figure things out along the way.
Speaker 1: Tam Me from South Dakota, thank you for that message
Speaker 1: and thank you for putting it in the best of ways.
Speaker 1: I was surprised, also rose by some people were so
Speaker 1: it took time to be so thoughtful in the responses
Speaker 1: that they did given. I absolutely appreciated that, But I
Speaker 1: thought she put it in a way that we never could.
Speaker 1: And I appreciated it, but that wasn't I didn't think
Speaker 1: about it when we put it out or decided to
Speaker 1: the like helping someone. I didn't think about it as
Speaker 1: a man of anyone else looking at it in feeling
Speaker 1: heard or seen or not alone.
Speaker 2: But that was a lot of that there was, And
Speaker 2: I don't know that that's what our intention was necessarily.
Speaker 3: I think we just had set out.
Speaker 2: When we started to do this that we weren't going
Speaker 2: to fake our way through anything or put on a
Speaker 2: strong face if we didn't feel it. And we also
Speaker 2: knew that there might be times working together like this
Speaker 2: in a relationship that we wouldn't be great, that we
Speaker 2: wouldn't be in a good space, and how are we
Speaker 2: going to deal with that? And I think we decided
Speaker 2: in that moment that we were going to deal with
Speaker 2: it by being real about it, and.
Speaker 3: I was me.
Speaker 2: I was definitely I think hopeful that by putting it
Speaker 2: out people would relate. I don't know that we were
Speaker 2: setting out to help anyone, but just maybe even feel
Speaker 2: connected to people saying, hey, we're all in this together.
Speaker 2: These relationship things ain't easy, and nobody is immune from
Speaker 2: those types of difficulties. And I think, especially early on
Speaker 2: in a relationship, regardless of how long we had known
Speaker 2: each other and how long we had been friends, and
Speaker 2: how long we had leaned on each other about other relationships,
Speaker 2: it's still different when it's the two of you, and
Speaker 2: it's just you and you have to figure it out.
Speaker 1: In all honesty, I didn't want to put it out
Speaker 1: to let folks know. We recorded this several again several
Speaker 1: days ago, but then you and I listened to it,
Speaker 1: and we didn't let anybody else know. We listened to
Speaker 1: it first, and then we let our iHeart team, in
Speaker 1: particular Amy sugarm and you over hear her name a lot,
Speaker 1: so just let you know who she is. When you
Speaker 1: think iHeart, just think Amy Sugar. Okay, just do that.
Speaker 1: But she's the one we collaborate with, and she's the
Speaker 1: reason really why we're on board here I'm having this podcast.
Speaker 1: So we reached out. We sent it to her and
Speaker 1: let her listen to it, and then we had to
Speaker 1: talk it out with her about whether or not we
Speaker 1: should put this out there. We had the option. We
Speaker 1: could have said no, and we did say no.
Speaker 2: There was at least I think maybe a twelve hour
Speaker 2: stretch where we I did not think we were going
Speaker 2: to release it.
Speaker 1: But that was on me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well I was nervous, I would you know. Look,
Speaker 2: I was nervous about Yes, I knew what our intentions
Speaker 2: were and I knew everything was real and raw, but
Speaker 2: I was and I continued to be. And I don't
Speaker 2: want to make decisions based on being afraid of what
Speaker 2: other people will say, what the headlines will say, what
Speaker 2: the comments will be. I mean, that is something I
Speaker 2: struggle with, and so that was a part of my equation.
Speaker 2: I was nervous, but you were even more.
Speaker 3: Nervous than I was.
Speaker 1: On would you say after we listened to it the
Speaker 1: first time we both came out of this on the fence,
Speaker 1: I would say, but I think you were I don't
Speaker 1: want to put these words in your mouth. I think
Speaker 1: you were more so leaning, like okay, I'm good to go.
Speaker 1: This was before we talked to Sugarman the first time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you remember, okay, So I am on the fence solidly
Speaker 1: and you're leaning. And then one thirty in the morning
Speaker 1: the day we at in the morning, the night we
Speaker 1: recorded this, we had sent it to Sugarman and we
Speaker 1: wanted to get her response. And me, I'm up all
Speaker 1: the time anyway, So no, no, no, was that for one?
Speaker 1: So it was four thirty for me and I'm all
Speaker 1: everybody knows I don't sleep.
Speaker 3: You've already been up.
Speaker 1: I've been up at this point for a while, and
Speaker 1: you know, I said, you know, she's out on the
Speaker 1: West coast. She's probably way just center her text. She'd
Speaker 1: messaged right.
Speaker 3: Back and then called.
Speaker 1: And we were on the phone. Robot was passed out
Speaker 1: in the bed. I woke up.
Speaker 3: When she started.
Speaker 1: On speaker. Yeah, yeah, yeah, She's not really a voice
Speaker 1: you can sleep through.
Speaker 3: She has so much positive energy.
Speaker 2: It just it wakes you up in a good mood,
Speaker 2: even if it's a tough subject.
Speaker 1: So here we are one third in the morning out
Speaker 1: there for her, four thirty for us. Robes is passed out,
Speaker 1: just out of it. I'm bouncing off the walls. I
Speaker 1: lean over you. I physically lean over you and laying
Speaker 1: across your back, put the phone in your face, and
Speaker 1: I have it on speaker.
Speaker 3: What is that?
Speaker 1: But yeah, we gotta talk with this podcast. Wake up.
Speaker 1: And after the conversation with her, I came out of it.
Speaker 1: How you doubled down with hell, no, we are not
Speaker 1: airing this. Absolutely. After I talked to her, I said
Speaker 1: there is no way and I was sure that we
Speaker 1: should not do it. And my reasoning was that listening
Speaker 1: to her, sure you and I any are you? I
Speaker 1: keep calling with a fight, but that's if that's a fight,
Speaker 1: We're doing great because that that wasn't a nasty thing,
Speaker 1: and that's how we go back and forth in private
Speaker 1: as well. So that was authentic. But her listening to
Speaker 1: it and was concerned. She said, well, this part, want
Speaker 1: to make sure TJ you don't sound like you're being
Speaker 1: a total asshole, and want to make sure this and
Speaker 1: so we're plucking out like little things that could be
Speaker 1: misconstrued or this might be a problem area, just the
Speaker 1: little little things in her saying that the first response
Speaker 1: and you all you didn't expect this, so I'll let
Speaker 1: you tell it. What was my immediate response when she
Speaker 1: stopped talking about her opinion of the podcast.
Speaker 2: And now I know this can never air, but why
Speaker 2: because the way it's viewed. I mean, the truth is,
Speaker 2: I'll back up, and I hate that. I cry when
Speaker 2: I get mad or I'm upset or I'm defensive. But
Speaker 2: when you have someone crying, that creates a certain dynamic
Speaker 2: where people feel like they have to come to the
Speaker 2: rescue of me, versus actually looking at it from a
Speaker 2: more balanced perspective, I think tears can appear to be
Speaker 2: manipulaid that wasn't my intention, but it could come off
Speaker 2: that way, and I just think the concern was that
Speaker 2: it wouldn't be something that people could be objective about
Speaker 2: listening to.
Speaker 1: Okay, you were I was wondering where you were going.
Speaker 1: I could tell looking at you you're being very careful
Speaker 1: with your words. Just then, because this is the truth
Speaker 1: of the matter, I flat out said to both of
Speaker 1: you right there on the phone at fourth third in
Speaker 1: the morning, East Coast time, that I don't want to
Speaker 1: put this out because this is going to I fear
Speaker 1: be viewed as a black man beating up on a
Speaker 1: white woman. Now, if anybody took their time and listened
Speaker 1: to that podcast, obviously I was not yelling, screaming. I
Speaker 1: wasn't doing anything. Now we are a couple who's having
Speaker 1: a disagreement, so obviously neither one of us are having
Speaker 1: our best moments. But my immediate concern was that, and
Speaker 1: you and Sugarman both like, wait what.
Speaker 2: I was shocked, and this has been There's been a
Speaker 2: lot of things that I have learned personally from not
Speaker 2: only doing this podcast, but listening to it back and
Speaker 2: then hearing your reaction and then seeing the response that
Speaker 2: would never have crossed my mind.
Speaker 3: Race.
Speaker 2: The fact that you're black and I'm white would never
Speaker 2: have crossed my mind.
Speaker 3: And that's kind of to your point.
Speaker 2: You have to think about things that I don't think about,
Speaker 2: And honestly, it took me a second to actually get
Speaker 2: my head around it. And once you explained it, and
Speaker 2: then once we've seen some of the reaction, a light
Speaker 2: bulb went off for me in a way. And it's
Speaker 2: just a constant learning curve. But and I've said this
Speaker 2: the whole time, I don't know what I don't know,
Speaker 2: and every day I learn more about what I don't know.
Speaker 1: I have known throughout my career in certain situations in
Speaker 1: board rooms, in in newsrooms that when you are going
Speaker 1: face to face with a colleague or a white woman
Speaker 1: and things get heated, I know that there's only so
Speaker 1: much base I can put in my voice. I know
Speaker 1: there's only so much flailing of my hands I can do.
Speaker 1: I know there's only so much movement I can put
Speaker 1: in my body. I have made conscious decisions not to
Speaker 1: even stand up when I am being confronted or taken
Speaker 1: on by a white woman who might be screaming at
Speaker 1: the top of her lungs. And disrespectful to me. But
Speaker 1: I know as soon as I make any move it
Speaker 1: is going to be now seen as a threat. That
Speaker 1: thing is there, and I didn't want to put myself
Speaker 1: in a position, or or us, because we are in
Speaker 1: this together, in a position to where someone could take
Speaker 1: that and begin to Nobody in any articles written said
Speaker 1: black and white. But there are things we start to
Speaker 1: notice in coverage and in comments that absolutely brought to
Speaker 1: fruition exactly what my fear was.
Speaker 2: All of the headlines and we didn't I didn't read
Speaker 2: any of the articles, and it was actually just this
Speaker 2: morning that I braced myself to just go through the
Speaker 2: headlines and not actually click on the articles. But every
Speaker 2: single headline was what I said, how I felt that
Speaker 2: I was crying, and you predicted it. And that's exactly
Speaker 2: how it was covered. And that is eye opening to me,
Speaker 2: and I hope it's eye opening to a lot of people,
Speaker 2: because again, when we were recording this and going through
Speaker 2: this authentic moment we were having that we've had before,
Speaker 2: and we wanted to, you know, for all the reasons,
Speaker 2: put it out there. It never crossed my mind that
Speaker 2: there would be any racial element to this. Now when
Speaker 2: we're actually just having our own private moments. Do you
Speaker 2: I'm curious, do you edit yourself as a black man
Speaker 2: knowing that your girlfriend's a white woman?
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, I was actually curious about that.
Speaker 1: And even when we recorded, to your point just then,
Speaker 1: even when we recorded this, that wasn't on my mind
Speaker 1: about how this is going to be viewed. I need
Speaker 1: to be careful how I'm talking. We just really the
Speaker 1: MIC's were just there. We just talked, so that wasn't
Speaker 1: a thing. But to hear it was more so hearing
Speaker 1: our Amy Sugarman's response. To hear what she was saying
Speaker 1: is the thing that got me off the fence and
Speaker 1: solidly in that camp of well, oh this can we
Speaker 1: cannot let this go out. And I even told you
Speaker 1: I was talking to too many white people in preparation
Speaker 1: of this podcast going out. I started calling back to
Speaker 1: Alabama and Arkansas. I was like, yo, to my people,
Speaker 1: and you were in the room when I was having
Speaker 1: conversations with my folks, and they were going in in
Speaker 1: a much different way and concerned about me and concerned
Speaker 1: about even doing a follow up, and the concern I
Speaker 1: everybody knows. If you listen to this I don't read comments.
Speaker 1: I don't read headlines and tabloids, not at all. I
Speaker 1: stay away from it. I had to in preparation for
Speaker 1: this podcast, at least, I had to read through comments
Speaker 1: on the show's page on Instagram. Got it this morning,
Speaker 1: bounced up five am, went right to the computer, just
Speaker 1: looked at our The very first comment I wasn't looking
Speaker 1: for one, but the very first one when I started
Speaker 1: reading was from my guy named Sam, who wasn't on
Speaker 1: our side. He wasn't like he was being supportive of us.
Speaker 1: Preface that, but then he said this, but let's all
Speaker 1: agree he's the problem because he's black.
Speaker 3: WHOA.
Speaker 1: All these comments are saying everything but that shake my head.
Speaker 1: The first comment IRA was from Sam, and he noticed
Speaker 1: that thing before I even got a chance to read Sam.
Speaker 3: White or black. I'm okay, okay, got it.
Speaker 1: That's just a part of it. And people bring their
Speaker 1: own experiences and biases yes to a conversation like that.
Speaker 3: It's it.
Speaker 2: This has been, like I said, incredibly eye opening. I
Speaker 2: will say, when you got to a place where you
Speaker 2: were kind of I don't know, you just said, you
Speaker 2: know what, just let's just Eric and I don't I'm
Speaker 2: not doing it to say I told you so, But
Speaker 2: you basically said I know what's going to happen, and
Speaker 2: I was I was like, really, you think that's going
Speaker 2: to happen? I mean, I knew we were both gonna
Speaker 2: take hits, and they people were gonna say whatever they
Speaker 2: were gonna say. We're very used to negative comments and
Speaker 2: negative publicity and negative headlines.
Speaker 3: That's nothing new for us right now.
Speaker 2: But you called it and it absolutely played out the
Speaker 2: way you thought it would. How do you feel now
Speaker 2: about airing it? I know we I think we're both
Speaker 2: glad we did it, But what are your feelings now
Speaker 2: after reading all the comments and seeing the headlines.
Speaker 1: I don't want to do that again, right it's you.
Speaker 1: That's an honest answer, and I hate to be that
Speaker 1: kind of honest because what I'm saying is I am
Speaker 1: now scared to speak my mind because of what the
Speaker 1: potential fallout is going to be anyone who took to us.
Speaker 1: So many of the comments were just people who listened
Speaker 1: to a forty five second teaser, a promo, or they
Speaker 1: read a headline. Obviously many people were just jumping on.
Speaker 1: I get that, but it makes you hesitate to put
Speaker 1: yourself out there and as be and be as And
Speaker 1: again we had every opportunity to say no, we listened
Speaker 1: to this thing we had so it it does, and
Speaker 1: you know this, we talk about it. It just like, Wow,
Speaker 1: you've always been strong like I do not. I am
Speaker 1: not going to let the fear of somebody saying something
Speaker 1: negative about me keep me from but man, after an
Speaker 1: experience like this, and I hate to say I told
Speaker 1: you so, but you and I talked about this. I said,
Speaker 1: watch what's going to happen?
Speaker 2: You literally said that exact thing to me, And sure enough,
Speaker 2: we were monitoring throughout the day yesterday and then this
Speaker 2: morning before we came here to record this, really did
Speaker 2: a full sweep about what the coverage was, what the
Speaker 2: comments were, and it was as you said. And you
Speaker 2: know what, I know, I could never ask you to
Speaker 2: put yourself in that position. And I honestly didn't even
Speaker 2: realize you were putting yourself in a position until you
Speaker 2: mentioned it. And it's something I think we have to
Speaker 2: talk about in order for things to get better. But
Speaker 2: you shouldn't have to be the person who puts yourself
Speaker 2: out there, So I would never ask that of you.
Speaker 2: I do want to say this to anyone who who
Speaker 2: did actually listen to it, or maybe people who who
Speaker 2: just think they know what was said based on clips
Speaker 2: and headlines. But I am not proud of the fact
Speaker 2: that I cry easily.
Speaker 3: I cry all the time.
Speaker 2: And so I want to say, as your girlfriend, arguing
Speaker 2: with you has been the most peaceful, respectful, even though
Speaker 2: it's frustrating, because all arguments are I think because you're
Speaker 2: not seeing it the way I want you to see it,
Speaker 2: and I'm not seeing it the way you want me
Speaker 2: to see it. But I have never had more respectful
Speaker 2: disagreements with anyone in my life than I have with you.
Speaker 3: You are so it's a pleasure to argue. It is
Speaker 3: not a pleasure. I don't like arguing.
Speaker 2: I don't like it, but I you. You are very
Speaker 2: measured and calm and logical, and I tend to be
Speaker 2: more emotional. And i'd like to think that I make
Speaker 2: some points. But to what everyone is saying, I actually
Speaker 2: am shocked because I'm thinking to myself, were you and
Speaker 2: the same Did you hear the same conversation I heard?
Speaker 2: Because I heard somebody who actually never raised his voice
Speaker 2: and even though he was frustrated, never lost his cool
Speaker 2: or his temper, and frankly, I was impressed. I have
Speaker 2: been impressed with how you've handled arguments.
Speaker 3: You're welcome, let's argue more, Let's argue you more.
Speaker 2: Kidding No, And it's funny because you asked me what
Speaker 2: I was surprised by. So all of these things have
Speaker 2: all been surprising and hopefully a little bit enlightening where
Speaker 2: we can have a conversation and talk and maybe unpack
Speaker 2: what happened or how people have reacted. But something else
Speaker 2: that surprised me is how surprised people were that I
Speaker 2: was insecure. I think some people actually said, you're too
Speaker 2: old to be insecure, Like, really, there's an age at
Speaker 2: which you stop worrying or thinking that maybe you aren't enough.
Speaker 2: I don't know, And look, it's not something that feels.
Speaker 3: Good to say.
Speaker 2: Yes, I have insecurities. Yes I am insecure at times,
Speaker 2: And that also was surprising to me. It's not easy
Speaker 2: to admit, but I feel like, if we're all being honest,
Speaker 2: all of us have different degrees of insecurity. Maybe mine's
Speaker 2: just glaring, but in a fight, I think it definitely
Speaker 2: came out, and when I listened to it back, I
Speaker 2: heard it even more I've never denied it, but I
Speaker 2: actually was a little surprised that at how I sounded,
Speaker 2: and I learned from that, but I was surprised that
Speaker 2: people thought it was outrageous that I was insecure at
Speaker 2: the age of fifty.
Speaker 1: Well, you're not supposed to. Uh, That's what we all
Speaker 1: try to keep from people, all right, our insecurities. I
Speaker 1: think you have spent so much time throughout your or
Speaker 1: life and career making sure you never appear to have
Speaker 1: any weakness, and I think it the only thing that
Speaker 1: drives you crazier about being weak is for somebody to
Speaker 1: think you're weak. Yeah, and I don't think you're not
Speaker 1: a weak person at all. But we are all human beings.
Speaker 1: We all have these moments and insecurities. But I do
Speaker 1: I think that it drives you crazy. I think people
Speaker 1: are shocked given how much I think I've talked to
Speaker 1: you about it during our relationship with sometimes like wow,
Speaker 1: you're such a little girl, or because I'm surprised because
Speaker 1: you always want to exude you always always always have
Speaker 1: that thing, So I can see where why someone now
Speaker 1: it shouldn't be insulted, like oh, caw dare you have insecurity?
Speaker 1: Not that but I think people who know you tangentially
Speaker 1: would go, well, she's secure. Yeah, I never saw that.
Speaker 2: I have always tried to put on that show, and
Speaker 2: obviously I'm not always okay, and so yes in our
Speaker 2: conversations that are uncomfortable and difficult, and yeah, I do
Speaker 2: so that whole I'm scared thing. I also wanted to
Speaker 2: talk a little bit about that because I think some
Speaker 2: women related to that, and some people might have misunderstood that,
Speaker 2: because the scared thing was I have finally I am
Speaker 2: with somebody now who I am deeply invested in in
Speaker 2: a way where I feel like there's a real balance,
Speaker 2: like we're in this together. And I don't feel in control.
Speaker 2: And I'm not saying that you should feel in control,
Speaker 2: that that's the sign of a good or a bad relationship,
Speaker 2: But all of a sudden, when you decide to go
Speaker 2: into a relationship and you're like, yeah, I don't, I
Speaker 2: have no control over what's going to happen. And I
Speaker 2: think if you think you have control, it's a false
Speaker 2: sense of security, perhaps even but that's what I'm just saying.
Speaker 2: And so in those moments, if things aren't going well
Speaker 2: or things aren't going right, all of a sudden, you
Speaker 2: start to worry and you go into worst case scenario mode,
Speaker 2: and that's on me. That has nothing to do with you,
Speaker 2: and that has.
Speaker 3: Only to do with me.
Speaker 1: You see where that comes from. People think, well, if
Speaker 1: this person here is not feeling safe and secure in
Speaker 1: their relationship, but they feel scared to day, to more
Speaker 1: or at any point, then it must be something about
Speaker 1: their partner, right, that's not making them feel secure or
Speaker 1: making them feel scared. I think that's a natural jump
Speaker 1: that people make, well, and I.
Speaker 2: Want to clarify that that is, but I do, but
Speaker 2: because that isn't something that should be on you, That
Speaker 2: should be something that's on me. And that was something
Speaker 2: that stood out to me that I look, I'm always
Speaker 2: trying to work on myself and I'll probably be doing that,
Speaker 2: hopefully I'll be doing that until the day I die.
Speaker 2: Because I'm somebody who believes we're here to learn, We're
Speaker 2: here to connect and to love and to learn. And
Speaker 2: so I'm god, I'm learning so much about myself too much,
Speaker 2: Like I'd like another subject, please.
Speaker 1: What did you learn about yourself in this whole exercise?
Speaker 3: I learned that I need to.
Speaker 2: Learn how to satisfy whatever need I have within myself
Speaker 2: and not look outward to expect someone else to make
Speaker 2: me feel okay. That is the healthy way forward, and
Speaker 2: so you come into a relationship as a fully functional being.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that I don't have needs from you,
Speaker 2: of course I do. But if I base my mood
Speaker 2: or my feeling or my day on what I'm not
Speaker 2: getting from you that I think I should, that is
Speaker 2: a recipe for suffering and a recipe for.
Speaker 3: Problems that I'm creating. That I'm creating.
Speaker 2: So I need to do better at satisfying my own
Speaker 2: needs and then looking to you for yes, companionship and
Speaker 2: camaraderie and support and security and all of that stuff.
Speaker 2: But I can't say this is what you're not giving me,
Speaker 2: and that's why I'm upset. No, I really do want
Speaker 2: to do better at What I like to say is
Speaker 2: it's not what you're not getting, it's what you're not giving.
Speaker 2: And so I want to focus on what I can do.
Speaker 2: And if you really focus on your own power as
Speaker 2: a human being to not only soothe yourself, but to
Speaker 2: then give in a situation instead of complaining about what
Speaker 2: you're not getting, that is the way forward for a peaceful,
Speaker 2: joyful life, and so you're that way, you are in control.
Speaker 2: It's not about someone else, and so I don't want
Speaker 2: to be somebody who points the finger and blame someone.
Speaker 1: I have to.
Speaker 2: Accept and surrender more. That's what I learned from listening
Speaker 2: to it.
Speaker 1: Back that fight we had spawned at least one and
Speaker 1: maybe two others, because at this point now you're in
Speaker 1: a position to where we don't have to fight about
Speaker 1: well you said, and well you said, no, no, no, no.
Speaker 1: What you really said was, oh I had to do
Speaker 1: is roll the tape.
Speaker 2: And let me go back to timecode twenty three four
Speaker 2: when you said, well, let me just play it.
Speaker 1: Yep. But if you go to time code fifteen twenty two,
Speaker 1: you were breathing really hard there, and that sent the message, Look.
Speaker 2: Hey, would you would you recommend Hell No, I was
Speaker 2: just gonna say couples to record their arguments, because if
Speaker 2: you're not in a good place already, that sets up
Speaker 2: someone perfectly to be an even bigger asshole than they
Speaker 2: were during the actual fight.
Speaker 1: Because no one wants that person to say, aha, I
Speaker 1: told you or I was right. Nobody wants that. We
Speaker 1: weren't listening to it back to try to call each
Speaker 1: other something. We were listening to it as producers essentially
Speaker 1: and listening through it, and I absolutely I found myself
Speaker 1: more upset with you by listening back to it than
Speaker 1: I was when we were actually in it.
Speaker 3: I didn't like it.
Speaker 1: I didn't like it. We didn't set up, we didn't
Speaker 1: set up the mics and records that conversation afterwards, because
Speaker 1: that was a tough one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think I ever want to record our
Speaker 2: fight again, because if I made you mad the first time,
Speaker 2: it's like with time and space, you get even re angered.
Speaker 3: Or if we were angry, if.
Speaker 1: We didn't have to listen to it again, I think
Speaker 1: we would have floated on and been fine. It's true,
Speaker 1: but we were reliving in a trauma essentially, and I'm
Speaker 1: listening to it back and listening to myself and listening.
Speaker 1: But then I'm hearing you again, like wow, she really said,
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 2: You caught things that you didn't like that I said
Speaker 2: that you didn't catch we were having the actual argument,
Speaker 2: so then there were more problems to do with.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's true.
Speaker 3: That is absolutely true.
Speaker 1: So no, people do not record your fights.
Speaker 2: You know. What they say was that ignorance is bliss. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and I'm grateful for my forgetful mind.
Speaker 1: But it was fascinating to listen back to it, and look,
Speaker 1: we had to do it at least five times, I bet.
Speaker 2: Fascinating and excruciating. Yeah, I think those are the two
Speaker 2: things I would put to it. And you know, I'm
Speaker 2: I now know I never need to do that again.
Speaker 1: I don't know, do we, right, I don't. That was
Speaker 1: and folks don't remember where that came from. It was
Speaker 1: just an experiment we had. This was not a plan
Speaker 1: or we need a podcast, we need an extra one.
Speaker 1: We were fine and something was going on. I just yeah,
Speaker 1: let me set up because it wasn't if we were
Speaker 1: having a kickdown fight. There's no way I would have
Speaker 1: set up Mike's. Then.
Speaker 3: We haven't had one, have we?
Speaker 1: There was one?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, there was one right now, But that's pretty amazing,
Speaker 2: I think to say I can only recall one in
Speaker 2: a year and a half.
Speaker 1: But that was that one was anger and that I
Speaker 1: was fear. Yeah, and that was earlier. Now, that's being scared,
Speaker 1: I understood, because I was scared at the time, like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, like I was seeing something I wasn't
Speaker 1: seeing before and I make a mistake that kind of
Speaker 1: fear crept in. But that was a long time ago. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was a while back.
Speaker 3: But that's the only one I got a kick out of.
Speaker 2: You know, more than one person saying that that we
Speaker 2: have an unhealthy relationship because we're arguing.
Speaker 3: I just the honeymoon is over. I saw a lot
Speaker 3: of that. Do you think our honeymoon is over?
Speaker 1: How long our honeymoon?
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: No, Seriously, what's generally considered honeymoon time for a relationship?
Speaker 1: You get married on this day, then you got how
Speaker 1: long that's considered the mother honeymoon per Is it a year?
Speaker 1: Is a two years?
Speaker 2: I think some people I've actually looked it up. I
Speaker 2: think people argue that it's between three months and three years,
Speaker 2: and it just wow. And I've seen that kind of
Speaker 2: spread as to what defines the honeymoon period in any
Speaker 2: relations and hip, and I think ours is extra complicated
Speaker 2: because we've.
Speaker 3: Been friends for so long.
Speaker 2: We've kind of been in a friend zone honeymoon period
Speaker 2: for a very long time where we just we didn't
Speaker 2: have to deal with much of the ick of each other,
Speaker 2: but we just got to enjoy the best of each other,
Speaker 2: and so we kind of had a honeymoon friend zone.
Speaker 1: See I see it. I say it a little bit
Speaker 1: different in that we we did enjoy the ick of
Speaker 1: each other or got to experience the ich, but we
Speaker 1: didn't care because I don't she's not my problem.
Speaker 3: That's right. I don't have to go home with him.
Speaker 1: So he did not.
Speaker 3: You can go work that other stuff out on his
Speaker 3: own and I'll see him in the morning.
Speaker 1: It work, it work. But it was entertaining as hell
Speaker 1: that you were, Oh, that's weird, she does that, see
Speaker 1: you in the morning, not my problem, So that was
Speaker 1: interesting to me. But yeah, it's it is. That is
Speaker 1: if we talk about a honeymoon, If a honeymoon is
Speaker 1: when you finally start to see the real person, If
Speaker 1: the honey moon is when you start to get annoyed
Speaker 1: by the little things that didn't annoy you before that,
Speaker 1: if the honeymoon is when that stuff ends, then why
Speaker 1: honeymoon is going as strong as hell?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, this to me, you're like, wow, when all
Speaker 2: those little things that you do that right now seem
Speaker 2: cute to me, aren't I worry?
Speaker 1: So we're honeymoon and like crazy, No, we are good
Speaker 1: at this point, and I don't know what to do
Speaker 1: about this podcast being that place, for being that honest.
Speaker 1: I we have to make the best call we can.
Speaker 1: But I after my first instinct was to say no,
Speaker 1: we shouldn't er it, and then after we aired it,
Speaker 1: my first instinct is again to go, well, yeah, I
Speaker 1: shouldn't do that again. And I, for myself, I hate
Speaker 1: being ruled by outside forces.
Speaker 2: And I'm the same way. I don't like, as you
Speaker 2: put it, the fear of something negative happening stop me
Speaker 2: from doing something that I know has value to it.
Speaker 2: But I do think there was value. Do you think
Speaker 2: there was some value in that, at least exposure for Also,
Speaker 2: you're talking about the audience, and then I mean hopefully
Speaker 2: through this conversation, maybe for the audience.
Speaker 1: I think I'm making a mistake in thinking that that
Speaker 1: vocal minority is really the majority opinion. And we obviously
Speaker 1: we know better than to take every social media comment
Speaker 1: as true or bond or whatever. We know better. But
Speaker 1: I am hesitant, and I think there are plenty of
Speaker 1: people who listened to that previous episode and they didn't call,
Speaker 1: and they didn't write in, they didn't say they didn't
Speaker 1: do any of that stuff, who listened and applied it
Speaker 1: or didn't feel alone, or I think it helped folks
Speaker 1: we don't know it helped or made people feel better
Speaker 1: that we don't know feel better because we didn't hear
Speaker 1: from them. I think that's the overwhelming majority. But again,
Speaker 1: when you're hearing so much of it going the other way,
Speaker 1: and you know, I said this as well, and on
Speaker 1: the way in, don't want to be polarizing. I don't
Speaker 1: want folks to take the guy side or the woman's side.
Speaker 1: I don't want to split people. But we also, and
Speaker 1: it was evident today there's this split between white and black,
Speaker 1: and I don't want that either.
Speaker 2: This wasn't about I'm right, he's wrong, I'm right she's wrong.
Speaker 2: This wasn't about who was right. It was about sharing
Speaker 2: the fact that communication is really hard, that relationships are
Speaker 2: tough but they're worth fighting for when you're at this
Speaker 2: place where you have so many shared experiences and so
Speaker 2: much love, but even the best of relationships, it still
Speaker 2: is so tough. I think a lot of time for
Speaker 2: men and women to communicate with each other. So it's
Speaker 2: not about taking sides at all. And I definitely want
Speaker 2: to make sure that was nothing that we were looking
Speaker 2: to do. And I found I saw the ugly sides
Speaker 2: of myself that I.
Speaker 3: Could only have seen or heard listening.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that I can see that at times, And this
Speaker 2: is not easy to admit that I'm more focused on
Speaker 2: my own emotional needs and I'm so focused on my
Speaker 2: own emotional needs that are real and I'm not poo
Speaker 2: pooing how I feel. How I feel is how I feel.
Speaker 2: But I'm clouded by that. I'm blinded by that, so
Speaker 2: that I don't see yours, I don't hear yours. And
Speaker 2: I heard myself doing that, bringing it back to me
Speaker 2: instead of following up with what you just said to me.
Speaker 2: And so I learned something about myself that I can
Speaker 2: do better the next time we have a conversation like this,
Speaker 2: or the next time you open up to me, or
Speaker 2: the next time I'm telling you I want you to
Speaker 2: let me in. I'm telling you that I want you
Speaker 2: to turn to me. But if I don't give you
Speaker 2: that safe space or that response acknowledging your needs, then
Speaker 2: why would you turn to me? So I did hear that,
Speaker 2: and that was an AHA moment for me listening back, I.
Speaker 1: Agree to it. So it's not just and this wasn't
Speaker 1: a I kind of was just resigned to it. Look
Speaker 1: just put out there and see what happens, even though
Speaker 1: I might've had a good indication of what might happen.
Speaker 1: But it's hey, we are where we are, and we
Speaker 1: live in the public, public eye, so we have to
Speaker 1: understand that we're supposed to have a little thicker skin.
Speaker 1: But it's just it could get really really frustrating when
Speaker 1: what you want to come across, or what you actually
Speaker 1: feel is not just not understood but actually plucked and
Speaker 1: taken and twisted for someone else's gain or entertainment that stuff.
Speaker 2: It does feel good to have this platform, and I
Speaker 2: hope that people who are listening really look at the
Speaker 2: whole picture and hear you and hear me, and hear
Speaker 2: what this is really all about. Do you regret airing it?
Speaker 1: Kenna? I'm not into the regret business.
Speaker 3: No smile, you have a smile on your face.
Speaker 1: I no regret doing anybody. If you gave me another
Speaker 1: crack at it, You know what, if you gave me
Speaker 1: another crack at it, I probably this is a damn shame.
Speaker 1: Would be more careful in the initial conversation and fight
Speaker 1: we had so not even getting to the point of
Speaker 1: deciding to air it or not. But if I knew
Speaker 1: it was going to air, and I knew all of
Speaker 1: course all this was coming, I might have and this
Speaker 1: is not a good way to be put on for
Speaker 1: the sake of the audience. To the right way, and
Speaker 1: that was I was on the phone with my boy
Speaker 1: Montel down in Alabama this morning, and this was something
Speaker 1: he was all over. He's coming from a place of
Speaker 1: protecting me, He's coming from a place of looking out
Speaker 1: for me. It's just difficult to talk about race.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Always. Everybody knows that I've loved talking about it with
Speaker 1: you behind the scenes, and I've been great.
Speaker 2: I've loved those conversations because and you know, after talking
Speaker 2: to me about it, it doesn't mean that many of
Speaker 2: us are coming from it from a bad place. It's
Speaker 2: just from an uninformed place and in a place that
Speaker 2: we couldn't know. And so I think that's just for me,
Speaker 2: the place to start is to say I don't know
Speaker 2: and tell me about it, and I know it's that's
Speaker 2: the whole thing, like, let me learn from you. But
Speaker 2: it's just about trying to bridge a gap that is
Speaker 2: clearly there, and to not acknowledge it is the worst
Speaker 2: thing you can do. To say it doesn't exist is
Speaker 2: the worst thing you can do, because how could you
Speaker 2: possibly say that if you've never had that experience.
Speaker 1: You can always look you, you can always ask me.
Speaker 1: You know this behind the scenes. But there are some
Speaker 1: things I would I would die in front of the
Speaker 1: microphone before I let you say some things because of
Speaker 1: how somebody else would take it. Not because you're coming
Speaker 1: from a bad place, but because I know you and
Speaker 1: love you and know where you're coming from and you're
Speaker 1: just trying to learn. If you don't ask the question,
Speaker 1: how can you learn? But then the question too often
Speaker 1: is then twist it and someone wants to call yeah,
Speaker 1: you're a racist or you're ignorant because of at it,
Speaker 1: And that's we're scared to speak yeah.
Speaker 2: And I think that's something I've always loved about us,
Speaker 2: is that I haven't been scared to speak to you
Speaker 2: and you haven't been scared to speak to me. But
Speaker 2: we both said no one could ever hear us have
Speaker 2: this conversation ever.
Speaker 3: I mean, how many times have we said that?
Speaker 1: A lot? And I hope we don't get away from
Speaker 1: what I think is certainly can be and even should
Speaker 1: be our lane. I was ultimately proud that we put
Speaker 1: that last episode. I like that took a lot. We
Speaker 1: were so deliberate in our back and forth, and it
Speaker 1: came at a It's some expense to us behind the
Speaker 1: scenes in getting it prepared, and there were a lot
Speaker 1: more conversations, very difficult ones. But I ultimately was proud
Speaker 1: we put it out, and I am they talking about
Speaker 1: lessons you took from that. I learned them in the
Speaker 1: moment with you, like every time I taught every fight
Speaker 1: we've ever had. The only time I am upset about
Speaker 1: it or disappointed is if we didn't get something out
Speaker 1: of it, if I feel like we're just having the
Speaker 1: same fight we had before. I like new fights.
Speaker 3: We kind of have the same fight though.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't like that.
Speaker 3: It's boring.
Speaker 1: I don't like it. But when it's the same thing
Speaker 1: coming up over and over again, No, No, do some
Speaker 1: new for me, Do some crazy. I would love for
Speaker 1: you too. I want to find about something new.
Speaker 3: All right, all right, I'll give it a whirl.
Speaker 1: Then I can learn.
Speaker 2: But I I.
Speaker 1: Am and I have to learn to do. I've said it,
Speaker 1: but this is another example, I have to do better
Speaker 1: about when it's someone as close to me as you are,
Speaker 1: about letting folks in when I'm shutting down to when
Speaker 1: I'm struggling. That is hard to do. By my sister.
Speaker 1: I was on the phone with her. I told you
Speaker 1: I was, I had my black tribunal going this morning, like,
Speaker 1: I gotta call my black folks today to find out
Speaker 1: their reaction to this. I am not your sounding board, obviously.
Speaker 1: Can you tell as soon as I got on you
Speaker 1: can just hear my tone change.
Speaker 3: Oh, you were laughing, you felt comfortable again, The expression
Speaker 3: was gone. I was like, Wow, what am I doing wrong?
Speaker 3: He's not like that with me. Damn.
Speaker 1: It's also all of my sister all morning. And she
Speaker 1: said it, He said, you take shutting down to a
Speaker 1: whole other level. Like she was frustrated by listening to
Speaker 1: the podcast the last episode and she had all her comments,
Speaker 1: but she came back, dude, you are you shutting down?
Speaker 1: You take it to a whole other level. And she
Speaker 1: knows me better than anybody. She's seen me do it
Speaker 1: in the room across the hall from her. Since you
Speaker 1: and I talked about it. Actually, when we were in Arkansas,
Speaker 1: she was like, I know, trust me, So I am
Speaker 1: trying to do better about that. And I am in
Speaker 1: this situation as well. Could have saved us some issues.
Speaker 1: I could have saved us some time by being better
Speaker 1: in those moments. So that's that's that is a constant
Speaker 1: working prodgress. And I said to you privately, I'll say
Speaker 1: you well, I said it in the last podcast. I
Speaker 1: can't say it enough that I am sorry for that frustration.
Speaker 1: I am sorry for my active role in putting us
Speaker 1: in those positions. I am, but it was I love
Speaker 1: you and I'm going to be with you. Whatever fight
Speaker 1: comes next. That's going to be the result of said
Speaker 1: fight is that we are still then be going strong.
Speaker 2: And I told you this privately as well. I am sorry,
Speaker 2: I said in the last in the actual fight, I
Speaker 2: wasn't sure what I did wrong. I said to you,
Speaker 2: I don't know what I did wrong, and listening to
Speaker 2: it back, I did figure out what I did wrong.
Speaker 2: And it's what I said a few moments ago that
Speaker 2: I have not been as good about and I haven't
Speaker 2: been good at all in times in responding to your
Speaker 2: emotional needs to not shifting straight to me or going
Speaker 2: straight to a defense about why I did what I did.
Speaker 2: So I want to be focused less on the explaining
Speaker 2: and the defense and the wise and just more on
Speaker 2: board with acknowledging how you're feeling, validating how you're feeling,
Speaker 2: and apologizing for contributing.
Speaker 3: To the mess we're in.
Speaker 2: So that's my work, my work. I have a twofold thing.
Speaker 1: Well, you have homework.
Speaker 2: I do.
Speaker 3: Well, it's just kind of.
Speaker 2: Putting it into practice. I intellectually know all of this,
Speaker 2: but it is first of all to make sure that
Speaker 2: I'm in control of my own needs and that I
Speaker 2: take responsibility for how I'm feeling. No one can make
Speaker 2: you feel a certain way. You love to say that,
Speaker 2: and it's absolutely true. Number two being more of being
Speaker 2: a better listener and being a better supporter.
Speaker 1: You know, some therapists could come in and damn it,
Speaker 1: I was about to say unpacked, but I was.
Speaker 3: Looking for another we have this thing, we have this word.
Speaker 2: Maybe in our former career, it was a very go
Speaker 2: to way to describe something. We're going to unpack this
Speaker 2: for you coming up next. And it got to the
Speaker 2: point where it was silly, like it was in every
Speaker 2: script at least like twice during the show we're going
Speaker 2: to unpack this for you. So we kind of made
Speaker 2: a point to.
Speaker 3: Never say it. But now I've I just actually said it, So.
Speaker 1: Okay, I got so I'm gonna find another word. Thesauris
Speaker 1: dot com right, I look, some therapists could help us
Speaker 1: with this and figure this out from our past. But
Speaker 1: if they were to sit down and figure this out
Speaker 1: with me, I am. I am a guy who grew
Speaker 1: up around very strong southern black men, and there was
Speaker 1: no I didn't hear the word mental health. I didn't
Speaker 1: hear that phrase until I was well into my professional career.
Speaker 1: There was never a time there was just for black
Speaker 1: men generally. And I was raised this way, not taught
Speaker 1: by sitting down and teaching a lesson by by examples
Speaker 1: that were around me. You do not have time, and
Speaker 1: nobody gives a damn about how you feel. Why are
Speaker 1: you talking about your feelings? Your feelings don't matter. I
Speaker 1: don't count here. You get it done, and I sometimes
Speaker 1: am guilty of not even you were saying it here
Speaker 1: with TJ. What I need to do. I need to
Speaker 1: be more mindful of your feelings. Even I got uncomfortable
Speaker 1: like my feelings, my feelings, but that's still something we
Speaker 1: all got to get over. And again, like you say, intellectually,
Speaker 1: I know better, but it's not something that is that
Speaker 1: easy for me. But then when it does become something
Speaker 1: that is I'm getting more comfortable with, and then it's
Speaker 1: slightly rejected or not received, then I go back into
Speaker 1: that shutdown mode. And as you know, I take shutting
Speaker 1: down to a whole other level. It's like deaf cone five. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So I.
Speaker 1: Got that work to do, and it starts with just
Speaker 1: an awareness of it, and I am aware that I
Speaker 1: did I do that. So I'm working on it. Baby.
Speaker 1: But even if we get into another fight, as you
Speaker 1: heard earlier, I am a pleasure to fighter.
Speaker 2: It just never gets heated. It just it gets frustrating.
Speaker 2: But I'll take that any day. And so I guess
Speaker 2: we both have our homework assignments and our next fight
Speaker 2: will we'll probably just keep to ourselves.
Speaker 1: Okay, Actually I'm okay with that. We yeah, and that's
Speaker 1: just we were honest and then we didn't know how
Speaker 1: this was going to go. But that I just hate
Speaker 1: saying that, but it is the truth. I hate being
Speaker 1: fearful of being honest. Yeah, that's tough.
Speaker 2: Well, that's why most people aren't. I mean some of
Speaker 2: the other podcasts we've had where we've been like brutally honest.
Speaker 2: Oh people love throwing those barbes back.
Speaker 3: In our face. But you know what, it's okay, we
Speaker 3: get it.
Speaker 2: We get we're public figures and we're we're creating the
Speaker 2: content and everyone's allowed to have an opinion. And that's
Speaker 2: just the way it is. But I will say this,
Speaker 2: I want to thank many of you who did We
Speaker 2: pointed out our friend from Dakota, but so many of
Speaker 2: you wrote so many thoughtful, beautiful, wonderful, kind, supportive, amazing
Speaker 2: things to us, And for all of you who took
Speaker 2: the time to do that, I just want to say
Speaker 2: thank you, because we did read them all this time,
Speaker 2: and it did make a difference to see the support,
Speaker 2: and it did feel good to know that at least
Speaker 2: some people and hopefully many of you got something, got
Speaker 2: some sort of takeaway from it, even if it was
Speaker 2: to feel heard or to not feel so alone. So
Speaker 2: thank you for those of you who did take the
Speaker 2: time to say something kind.
Speaker 1: And if you would please, it does mean a lot.
Speaker 1: You don't have to send in a note of support
Speaker 1: for the two of us but it does help for
Speaker 1: you all out there to take the time to actually
Speaker 1: write in about maybe how you deal with conflict in
Speaker 1: your own relationship, how you have, what's worked for you,
Speaker 1: what hasn't worked for you, what you heard in our
Speaker 1: conversation our relationship that is like youppreciate hearing that stuff.
Speaker 1: So you can find us the podcast. The Instagram page
Speaker 1: is at Amy and t J Podcast. You can find
Speaker 1: us both personally on TikTok and on Instagram. Baby, thank
Speaker 1: you for the chat. Now let's go listen to this
Speaker 1: back and fight about it.
Speaker 3: Oh, I think this is going to be a good
Speaker 3: one to listen back to. Yeah, I do. I love you.
Speaker 1: I love you, Betty