1 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: Welcome to add Lots. I'm Tracy Alloway, Executive editor of 2 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Markets, and I'm Joey isn't All, Managing editor of 3 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Markets. Joe, I am so glad to have you back. 4 00:00:16,400 --> 00:00:18,920 Speaker 1: It's great to be back, Tracy. I'm so this is 5 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:23,240 Speaker 1: where I'm naturally most comfortable chatting with you about issues 6 00:00:23,400 --> 00:00:26,239 Speaker 1: and market nikon and finance. So glad to be back 7 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:30,320 Speaker 1: on on lot with you. Ah. Well, that's nice. Um, 8 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 1: I's gonna say, I'm glad that you're back today, specifically 9 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:34,920 Speaker 1: because I think we have a show that you're going 10 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:38,159 Speaker 1: to be really interested in. Yes, because I know that 11 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:42,880 Speaker 1: you like the intersection of markets and finance and politics 12 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 1: and sort of public mood, and boy are those the 13 00:00:46,640 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 1: topics of discussion for today. You know, you edit a 14 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 1: lot of the stuff I write, and I try to 15 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 1: try to bring in politics and public stories all the time. 16 00:00:57,880 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 1: So anything that hits at all those stuff, I like. 17 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:02,680 Speaker 1: So what are we gonna talk about? All? Right? Up 18 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 1: for today, we have two of Bloomberg's finest journalists. We've 19 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:11,200 Speaker 1: got Omar I'm going to mispronounce us Valdemarsson and Edward Robinson, 20 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 1: and they have just written a great story about Iceland, 21 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 1: which you might know as the tiny, sort of frozen 22 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:23,600 Speaker 1: island country in the Atlantic. But it's also special because 23 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 1: it's the only place that has actually sent any bankers, 24 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 1: high level bankers to prison. I've been to Iceland. It's 25 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: a beautiful country. They have the best hot dogs in 26 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:37,039 Speaker 1: the world. And as you know that, not only have 27 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 1: they did they send bankers to prison after the economic crisis. 28 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: It's one of these The icelandic financial story is one 29 00:01:44,280 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 1: of these stories that just kind of goes on forever 30 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 1: every once in a while, popping back into the news. 31 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 1: And as we you said in the beginning, it's fascinating 32 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,040 Speaker 1: because it, you know, it's this tiny country, just over 33 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 1: three thousand people. It's kind of it's an exaggeration, but 34 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,080 Speaker 1: not much. Everyone's of knows each other, and so it's 35 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 1: been fascinating to see this tiny country deal with the 36 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:09,680 Speaker 1: you know, they had to deal with the post crisis era, 37 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 1: and there's been a lot of interesting twists and turns 38 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:16,480 Speaker 1: along the way. So they had a massive banking crisis, 39 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 1: a massive financial crisis, and now they are still years 40 00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: later dealing with the aftermath. And to your point, Joe 41 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:26,920 Speaker 1: this week, and I should say we're recording this slightly early, 42 00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 1: so things could change. Um. But this week we saw 43 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:34,160 Speaker 1: Iceland kind of shooting to the headlines again because of 44 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 1: one thing, and that is the Panama papers. Right. It's 45 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 1: prime minister, according to these League documents, had connections to 46 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:46,280 Speaker 1: an offshore fund where he may have had investments in 47 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:50,120 Speaker 1: some of these collapsed banks, and that led to gigantic 48 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: protests in the country and ultimately led him to leave 49 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 1: his post and another turn in the political turmoil. They're right, 50 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:02,519 Speaker 1: and there is a thought here that you could make 51 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 1: or theory. I should say that a lot of the 52 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 1: anger we've seen this week at the Prime minister in 53 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 1: the Icelandic government is a sort of continuation of the 54 00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 1: outrage we saw in the aftermath of the crisis. Right. So, 55 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:17,880 Speaker 1: there's this gigantic banking bubble for a while everyone in 56 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:21,079 Speaker 1: Iceland seemed to get wildly rich off of it, and 57 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 1: then when everything collapsed, and we'll talk about that, there 58 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 1: was a lot of frustration at the elites, both in 59 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:32,359 Speaker 1: government and banking for essentially taking the country on this 60 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:37,160 Speaker 1: very risky ride that not only damage the economy but essentially, 61 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 1: you know, damage the fabric of society as a whole. Okay, well, 62 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 1: let's catch up with Bloomberg's Omar Valdemarson first. Uh, he's 63 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:48,640 Speaker 1: actually in Iceland, although I think he's driving in his 64 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: car at the moment, so the sound quality might not 65 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: be that great, but I'll leave that to our producers 66 00:03:54,440 --> 00:04:02,520 Speaker 1: to fix. You've obviously been on the ground in Iceland 67 00:04:02,560 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: for a long time. Tell us exactly what happened here, 68 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: I guess. I guess it all begins with the privatization 69 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 1: of Iceland's banks in the early two thousands in the Natings, 70 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 1: I guess the Iceland the government decided to privatize two 71 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 1: of its of its state run banks and basically at 72 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 1: the time it was sold to political friends of the 73 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:36,760 Speaker 1: two coalition parties, which coincidentally are the same coalition parties 74 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 1: that are in government today. Those banks then utilized the 75 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:46,320 Speaker 1: good credit rating of Iceland because these were primary previously 76 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:49,719 Speaker 1: state down bank and then they still had triple A 77 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 1: rating with all the rating companies when they became privately 78 00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 1: held and went on a borrowing spree all over the world. 79 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 1: And what they eventually did is cumulated so much that 80 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 1: that their balanced seats were ten times the size of 81 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: Iceland's economy. That's an yeah. And a lot of the uh, 82 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 1: you know, a lot of the money that they bottled 83 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,800 Speaker 1: were you know, short term loans which were then lent 84 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 1: to their clients over the long term. More than anything, 85 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:26,600 Speaker 1: what happened to these banks when they finally collapsed. The 86 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 1: short explanation is that they ran out of short term funting. 87 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,360 Speaker 1: But the long term, long term explanation is obviously that 88 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 1: there have been so much cross landing with these banks 89 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:40,800 Speaker 1: that they wouldn't have been able to survive, although they 90 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:44,840 Speaker 1: would have maybe passed this hurdle that they came across 91 00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 1: in October two eight. So it's sounds, you know, the 92 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:51,720 Speaker 1: story sounds pretty typical. Bank goes out with it has 93 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:54,720 Speaker 1: a good credit rating, borrows like crazy, does a lot 94 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: of aggressive lending. Did they did? People convinced themselves that 95 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 1: there was something expec show going on here that Iceland 96 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,240 Speaker 1: had like cracked the code to better banking, Like why 97 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: didn't people realize that it was? The story was this simple? No, 98 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:13,280 Speaker 1: it was quite extraordinary to you know, in hindsight. Obviously 99 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 1: I was suckered into it as well, just like pretty 100 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: much all the all of the Icelantic population into believing 101 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: that there was something special in the way that Icelandic 102 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 1: people did business, that we weren't too concerned about the 103 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:30,680 Speaker 1: red tape, that decisions were taken at a faster pace, 104 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:33,920 Speaker 1: they were here than in other countries, or or or 105 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 1: like our surrounding countries, or the countries that we often 106 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 1: compare ourselves with, like the Scandinavian countries, and this made 107 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: us better enough to make business decisions and seize opportunities 108 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:52,480 Speaker 1: when other people might be caught up in you know, 109 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:56,839 Speaker 1: trying to calculate the deal towards the end before before 110 00:06:56,880 --> 00:07:00,680 Speaker 1: actually jumping in. And there were there were even you know, 111 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:04,400 Speaker 1: the Icelandic president, who was still the president at the time, 112 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 1: was still the president now held speeches that with investors 113 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:14,280 Speaker 1: all over the world, telling them that this was a 114 00:07:14,320 --> 00:07:17,760 Speaker 1: part of the Icelandic liking spirit. Then all that kind 115 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 1: of hyped up language that basically facilitate that belief here 116 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 1: that there was something special about us. Let's dwell on 117 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 1: the Icelandic exceptionalism for a moment, because it was truly 118 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 1: amazing how different Icelandic banks were perceived at the time 119 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 1: and what they did actually. So if you look for instance, 120 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:46,840 Speaker 1: at the growth rate of Icelandic banks between two thousand 121 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:49,239 Speaker 1: four and two thousand five, they were growing at something 122 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 1: like fifty one to thirty six percent a year, far 123 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 1: outpacing any other Nordic bank. Why didn't that raise flags 124 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 1: for anyone? Well, it for for the average joe in Iceland, 125 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 1: it obviously didn't didn't raist a lot of flags. But 126 00:08:08,200 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 1: we we started seeing some criticism. The most vocal one 127 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 1: came from an economist named Las Christmas and who was 128 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 1: then the head of emerging markets that they had the 129 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 1: economist that for emerging markets at dance Kbank, and he 130 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 1: was pretty much just executed in Iceland in the public 131 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:32,480 Speaker 1: debate for being uh for being jealous of the successes 132 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:36,160 Speaker 1: of of of Icelandic business people and the Icelantic banks. 133 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:41,080 Speaker 1: And we all wrote it down to, you know, the 134 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 1: former colonial rulers being envious of iceland successes now that 135 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:50,360 Speaker 1: it was an independent country. Iceland banks were growing at 136 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 1: a phenomenal pace in the sort of early mid two 137 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: thousand's and that growth ended up having a lot of 138 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 1: impact on countries other than Iceland. And for those of 139 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:02,200 Speaker 1: us who are living in the UK at the time, 140 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:06,680 Speaker 1: you know, we can remember all the ads from banks 141 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:13,479 Speaker 1: like helpting about high rate deposit accounts. Lots of councils 142 00:09:13,559 --> 00:09:17,320 Speaker 1: in the UK, put money in Iceland, lots of depositors 143 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:20,000 Speaker 1: and they were all affected by the collapse of the banks. 144 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:29,120 Speaker 1: Would in bureaucracy by moving faster, being flexible, building clients, 145 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:34,839 Speaker 1: businesses and their own and have fun doing it. Where 146 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: what is help thinking? It's help thinking is beyond normal thinking. 147 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:54,319 Speaker 1: To show up their to show up their portfolios. These 148 00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 1: banks went on a on a on a borrowing spree 149 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 1: from depositors in the UK and in the Netherlands and 150 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:04,520 Speaker 1: in more countries. Cope Thing set up accounts they called 151 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:07,880 Speaker 1: Edge and land spunkies Lands set up accounts called ice safe. 152 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:13,239 Speaker 1: When these banks failed, the crypt Think was more successful 153 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 1: and and and recompensating the depositors, while land Sparking found 154 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: itself in a bit of a pickle. Land wasn't able 155 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 1: to do that immediately, which resulted in the UK using 156 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:30,520 Speaker 1: legislation was which was meant to be used to tackle 157 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: terrorist activities and put land Sparking on a list of 158 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 1: terrorist organizations, froze the assets of both land Sparky hand 159 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: cuype Think. In the UK, and this resulted in a 160 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:48,280 Speaker 1: huge international dispute between Iceland and the Netherlands and the UK. UM. 161 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 1: That dispute eventually found its way to the after courts. 162 00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 1: The UK and the Netherlands maintained that Iceland was was 163 00:10:57,720 --> 00:10:59,800 Speaker 1: meant to cover the shortfall of the bank to the 164 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:04,599 Speaker 1: psitors up to the minimum guarantee, which was euros in 165 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: in the U in both cases. But the fter court 166 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 1: then finally found that that Iceland was right. It didn't 167 00:11:12,080 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: have to show up the accounts of Lance Punky, that 168 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:21,440 Speaker 1: only the bank itself was aliable for recompensating depositors, and 169 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,880 Speaker 1: through the liquidation of ascets that has finally happened, so 170 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: only depositors were eventually paid in full. Um. So let's 171 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 1: fast forward a little bit the economy. The banks collapsed 172 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 1: as people probably should have seen coming um because they 173 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:42,199 Speaker 1: borrowed so much. How did the aftermath like, what did 174 00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 1: Iceland do in the wake of the bank collapse? Um? 175 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 1: It was, Well, what we did was basically what we 176 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: were forced to do. The the trushery wasn't wasn't Andy 177 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 1: were close to being an understanding that could have salvaged 178 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 1: the bank or or or or assisted them like in 179 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 1: some of the other countries like Ireland. So what way, 180 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 1: what the government did was, you know, a frantic move 181 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:14,560 Speaker 1: which took out all the domestic assets of the failed 182 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 1: lenders and siphoned them into new new banks, which they created, 183 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:24,319 Speaker 1: new state created banks. And this was just on overnight, 184 00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 1: so the payment system was up and running. You have 185 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:31,800 Speaker 1: to understand it. In Iceland, almost nobody uses cash here. 186 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: People use payment cards would either a bit or credit cards. 187 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:38,439 Speaker 1: For everything they buy, even something that's at a cost 188 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:40,760 Speaker 1: of less than a dollar, they used their payment cards. 189 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:45,840 Speaker 1: So maintaining the payment system was absolutely crucial. There were 190 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:48,559 Speaker 1: obviously riots in the streets that at the time when 191 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:51,600 Speaker 1: the banks were collapsing, and if people wouldn't have had 192 00:12:51,679 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 1: access to their bank accounts via their payment cards, that 193 00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:59,679 Speaker 1: that could have gone pretty nasty, pretty pretty fast. So 194 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: they that they created these new state created banks and 195 00:13:02,360 --> 00:13:05,319 Speaker 1: they put the the the the old banks with the 196 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 1: foreign assets into administration um. So basically it was in 197 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 1: a natural it was a separation into good bank, a 198 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: good bank, bad bank. What happened to the people who 199 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:20,160 Speaker 1: actually were in charge of the banks, a lot of them, 200 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:24,600 Speaker 1: a lot of them actually found themselves being prosecuted. A 201 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: lot of the deals that they made, especially in the 202 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:33,559 Speaker 1: in the in the last moments of of of and 203 00:13:33,679 --> 00:13:36,840 Speaker 1: the life of the of the failed Landers, were deals 204 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:39,360 Speaker 1: that didn't stand up to the scrutiny of the law, 205 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:44,960 Speaker 1: and they were prosecuted and then they found themselves in prison. 206 00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:48,959 Speaker 1: The former head of the Icelandic Bank lands Bankie, has 207 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:53,640 Speaker 1: been sentenced to a twelve month jail term. Ziggur John Onison, 208 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:55,880 Speaker 1: was on trial for his role in the collapse of 209 00:13:55,920 --> 00:13:59,440 Speaker 1: the financial sector in two thousand and eight. To other 210 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:03,679 Speaker 1: of the banks executives received nine months sentences. The lands 211 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:07,200 Speaker 1: BANKI three were accused of manipulating the bank's share price 212 00:14:07,559 --> 00:14:11,280 Speaker 1: by lending cash to investors on condition they purchased stock. 213 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 1: The global financial crisis in two thousand and eight frozen 214 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:19,840 Speaker 1: credit markets and Iceland's banks quickly collapsed. All right, Tracy, 215 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:23,080 Speaker 1: So we just heard the story of the Icelandic boom 216 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: and bust of the banking sector and that the bankers, ultimately, 217 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 1: unlike in other countries, went to jail. So let's chat 218 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: with Bloomberg's Edward Robinson about the aftermath, why those bankers 219 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:38,240 Speaker 1: went to jail and what happened after that and thank 220 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 1: you so much for joining us, my pleasure. So we 221 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 1: were just talking about pretty much everything that happened with 222 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,560 Speaker 1: Iceland's banks and the financial crisis they had there. But 223 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:52,080 Speaker 1: the one thing that really sets Iceland apart from a 224 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 1: lot of countries is that bankers involved in this crisis 225 00:14:57,080 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 1: actually went to jail. Tell us how that happened it, Yes, 226 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:04,920 Speaker 1: it's Uh, it's a striking story because it is the 227 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: only country where the top bankers CEO's chairman, as well 228 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: as the top investors, the top stockholders in many of 229 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 1: these banks also were prosecuted, convicted and ultimately incarcerated. And uh, 230 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 1: and they got some pretty serious time. I mean, top 231 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:25,400 Speaker 1: bankers at coup Thing, which was the number one bank 232 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 1: in Iceland when the crash it in two thousand and eight, 233 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:30,200 Speaker 1: got between four and a half and five and a 234 00:15:30,280 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 1: half year prison sentences. And so was this a matter 235 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:38,640 Speaker 1: of they broke a specific law in Iceland? Was it 236 00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:44,160 Speaker 1: something culturally that Iceland was more inclined to prosecuted bankers. 237 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 1: What do you think distinguished Iceland basically from the other 238 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:50,480 Speaker 1: countries where top bankers didn't go to prison. I think 239 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:53,560 Speaker 1: there's a couple of things. The first is political, and 240 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:56,200 Speaker 1: I mean Iceland is small. It's three d and thirty 241 00:15:56,240 --> 00:16:00,080 Speaker 1: three thousand people. That's about the same population as the 242 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 1: neighborhood of Flatbush in Brooklyn. So so it impacted when 243 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: the crisis hit, When the banks crashed, it impacted every 244 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:12,400 Speaker 1: Icelander and that's not hyperbole, it actually did so. Purchasing 245 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 1: power dropped by a fifth, stock market crashed, lots of 246 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:19,840 Speaker 1: Icelanders had debts that in foreign currencies that they couldn't pay, 247 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: So the political repercussions were serious. Icelanders, we're throwing eggs 248 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: and yogurt, which is like this weird Nordic thing at 249 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: the Parliamentary building. So the politicians they're directly felt the anger. 250 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 1: So politically they felt they had to address this problem 251 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:43,480 Speaker 1: and it wasn't going to be enough to issue big 252 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:46,640 Speaker 1: fines or kind of go after the bank's institutionally, which 253 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:49,040 Speaker 1: is what we saw in the U S and the UK. 254 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 1: So that's the political dimension. But the legal dimension is 255 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:57,160 Speaker 1: that in Iceland, and in fact in Nordic kind of 256 00:16:57,200 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 1: Scandinavian jurisprudence, they don't use jury, so the prosecutors never 257 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 1: had to really put together cases that could take complex 258 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:11,879 Speaker 1: financial machinations and simplify and present to a jury. And 259 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:15,440 Speaker 1: that's been one of the impediments. What was the specific 260 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:19,680 Speaker 1: crime that they went to jail for, because the USA, Yeah, 261 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: it was really awful what they did, but you know, 262 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:24,240 Speaker 1: there really isn't a crime against failure. So what was 263 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 1: the crime? And what happened with the Icelandic banks was 264 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:30,080 Speaker 1: essentially en Ron, So all of the big banks were 265 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,239 Speaker 1: collateralizing their loans with their own stock and then they 266 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:37,320 Speaker 1: were providing those loans to their number one investors and 267 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:40,159 Speaker 1: number one stockholders. So the whole thing was predicated on 268 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:42,480 Speaker 1: the stock not going down, and of course when it did, 269 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 1: it's like game over. So you're able to use time 270 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 1: honored statutes to attack that. That's market manipulation and that's fraud. 271 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:55,720 Speaker 1: I have a technical devil's advocate type question, which Joe 272 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:58,760 Speaker 1: is probably going to kill me for asking. But you 273 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:04,159 Speaker 1: have basically the government going after the bankers. You know, 274 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: there's no jury trial. Uh. And in the same context, 275 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:11,560 Speaker 1: the government was setting a lot of the rules and 276 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:16,640 Speaker 1: regulations that allowed Icelandic banks to do this. Right. For instance, 277 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:19,680 Speaker 1: Icelandic banks issued a whole bunch of hybrid capital far 278 00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:23,199 Speaker 1: more than was allowed elsewhere in Europe or in the 279 00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:27,439 Speaker 1: Nordic countries. Was there any blowback for the government or 280 00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:31,240 Speaker 1: the regulators for letting that happen. Yes, there was a 281 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:33,160 Speaker 1: lot of anger for that. I mean, I think that's 282 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:35,679 Speaker 1: a really good point. I mean, basically, what the government 283 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: did is they deregulated. They took this kind of state owned, 284 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:42,240 Speaker 1: very conservative banking culture, and in the space of a 285 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:45,879 Speaker 1: few years, they they deregulated them allowed them to go private, 286 00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:47,399 Speaker 1: and that's what kind of set in motion all of 287 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:50,960 Speaker 1: the explosive growth. Uh So, yes, you're absolutely right. There 288 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: was a lot of anger on the part of people 289 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:56,600 Speaker 1: directed toward the government for permitting this to happen. And 290 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 1: in the prosecutions that have taken place, there have been 291 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:03,439 Speaker 1: a few government officials who have been implicated. So you 292 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,399 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier that even though these bankers have gone to jail, 293 00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 1: there is still collective outrage in Iceland, which we've seen 294 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:14,280 Speaker 1: this week. And I should just mention here that we 295 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 1: are recording this podcast slightly early. We're talking days before 296 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,560 Speaker 1: it's due to be published, so a lot could be changed, 297 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:25,920 Speaker 1: could change, But we have seen people, as you put it, 298 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:30,560 Speaker 1: throwing yogurt and government officials and government buildings. What's going 299 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 1: on there? Uh. It really goes to this um feeling, 300 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:38,880 Speaker 1: the suspicion that the game is still fixed and they 301 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 1: want a new government, that that there's twenty thousand protesters 302 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 1: in the square who are basically saying we want a 303 00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:47,480 Speaker 1: snap election. This government doesn't deserve to continue to be 304 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:50,840 Speaker 1: in power, and that it's a coalition government and they're 305 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 1: trying to hold it together. Uh. And what's really fascinating 306 00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:58,280 Speaker 1: about that, tracy is that the the insurgent Party, the 307 00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:00,760 Speaker 1: party that is now polling an has been doing so 308 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:02,920 Speaker 1: for the last year. It is polling at the top. 309 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: They're called the Pirates. I'm really fascinated by this. I 310 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:10,720 Speaker 1: want to I want to join. Well maybe, but I 311 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,199 Speaker 1: want to learn more the polling number one right now. 312 00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 1: I love the idea that perhaps the Pirate Party could 313 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 1: leave the next government. One thing is striking you say 314 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 1: twenty people have showed up to protest. Just for context, 315 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:27,680 Speaker 1: that's about twenty million equivalent in the United States. Given 316 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:31,920 Speaker 1: how tiny Iceland is, what is it That's just an 317 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 1: extraordinary number. How is it as a country that so 318 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,280 Speaker 1: many people get mobilized for something like this, is it 319 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 1: a cultural thing? How how do you get those kind 320 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:44,720 Speaker 1: of it is it is? It's like, um, I mean, imagine, 321 00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:48,640 Speaker 1: imagine if the entire United States was the size of Louisiana, 322 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 1: just Louisiana and Katrina Hits. That's what the banking crisis 323 00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:58,280 Speaker 1: was for Iceland. I mean, it was just this seismic catastrophe. 324 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: It's like the biggest thing ever to happen in country 325 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:03,160 Speaker 1: since it broke away from Denmark, you know, fifty sixty 326 00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:07,760 Speaker 1: years ago. And so it's personal. It's deeply, deeply personal 327 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:11,560 Speaker 1: for them, and that's why you see these protests and 328 00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:14,479 Speaker 1: and the protests that have happened this week in response 329 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:18,480 Speaker 1: to Panama papers. The numbers are actually greater than the 330 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:22,399 Speaker 1: protests during the crash. So I think what that conveys 331 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:25,600 Speaker 1: is this sense of, you know, we're tired of the 332 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 1: old system. And it's really interesting when you put it 333 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 1: in the larger context of what's happening with political regimes 334 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:34,439 Speaker 1: elsewhere in Europe, even in the United States, and like, 335 00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:38,159 Speaker 1: there's something something really interesting happening with this idea that 336 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:41,600 Speaker 1: the old regimes are no longer useful, and that's why 337 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: this pirate Party is really starting to reap the benefits 338 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:48,159 Speaker 1: of that, and it will be fascinating if somehow they 339 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 1: have a snap election and it wins the majority of 340 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 1: seats in parliament, that will be quite an experiment. Right So, 341 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:56,080 Speaker 1: and I was going to ask, in some respects Iceland 342 00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 1: is ahead of other countries in terms of prosecuting the 343 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 1: people responsible for the financial crisis. But even on that basis, 344 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:07,639 Speaker 1: people are outraged, perhaps more outraged than they were just 345 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:11,280 Speaker 1: a couple of years ago. Does that bode well or sorry, 346 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 1: bode ill for the rest of the world. That's a 347 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:18,240 Speaker 1: great question. I think it speaks to this kind of 348 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 1: just I don't know how to put it, but it's 349 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 1: like it's like this deep seated feel like something is broken. 350 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: That's I think that's the way that the sociologists we 351 00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 1: talked to an Iceland, we were talking about that, and 352 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,360 Speaker 1: he's like, look what happened in a wait for all 353 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 1: of the remedies that have been put out, and Iceland 354 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: deserves a lot of credit for being swift and taking 355 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:39,359 Speaker 1: decisive action on implementing these remedies. I mean, let's not 356 00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:41,800 Speaker 1: forget when Iceland's economy is going to grow four percent 357 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:44,600 Speaker 1: this year. Unemployment is less than you know, two point 358 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,320 Speaker 1: eight percent, So I'm on a macro basis, they're doing 359 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 1: pretty good. Um, but something broke in two thousand and 360 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:54,640 Speaker 1: eight in Iceland and in other countries, and that that's 361 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:56,640 Speaker 1: what the sociologist saying is like, that's what we're really 362 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 1: seeing is that you just you just it's broke. Something 363 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 1: is there's this feeling that it's broken. And that's why 364 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,480 Speaker 1: Brigitta John's daughter, who was a co founder of the 365 00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 1: Pirate Party and their leader in parliament right now, she's 366 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 1: she's a poet, she's like friends with Julian Assange. She's 367 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:15,320 Speaker 1: one of her first things that she'd love to do 368 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:17,880 Speaker 1: if she ever became leader in Iceland is grant Edward Snowden, 369 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:21,879 Speaker 1: you know, citizenship. I think that's really fascinating what you 370 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:25,879 Speaker 1: point out about how solid the economy is, low unemployment, 371 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:28,679 Speaker 1: high growth. I mean, I remember thinking in the US 372 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 1: after our crisis and then in two there was the 373 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:35,639 Speaker 1: Tea Party wave, and it seemed like, Okay, this is 374 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:40,639 Speaker 1: a very natural reaction to massive unemployment and still so 375 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 1: many people underwater on their homes. Now we fast forward 376 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:47,119 Speaker 1: several years be we're close to full employment. In the 377 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 1: US and now obviously in the U S we have 378 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 1: Donald Trump. So it's sort of the same thing. Even 379 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,720 Speaker 1: with the on the service healing of the economy, something 380 00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:00,920 Speaker 1: seems to be, as you say, sort of broken and society. 381 00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:03,000 Speaker 1: I think, you know, obviously you're seeing it across Europe 382 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:06,320 Speaker 1: as well. Just the improvement in raw economic numbers don't 383 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: necessarily translate to people having confidence in their institutions and government. 384 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: What do you think the next step is for Iceland? 385 00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:19,280 Speaker 1: What does the future actually hold? Well, they've got too big, 386 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: two big events to come on the economic slash financial side. Uh, 387 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:29,720 Speaker 1: they've been under capital control since the crash. And even 388 00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: though Iceland can sell its bonds overseas, and even though 389 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:36,919 Speaker 1: um if an Icelander you know, flies from Kia Vic 390 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,959 Speaker 1: for a holiday in Italy, they can withdraw you know, 391 00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 1: euros and Italian a t m s and kind of 392 00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,000 Speaker 1: move money that way. You can't you can't drain your 393 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:48,120 Speaker 1: bank account in Iceland, put it in a suitcase and 394 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: you know, moved to the UK. Those controls are going 395 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 1: to be lifted now they haven't said an exact date, 396 00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:57,400 Speaker 1: but it will be very important for the country because 397 00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:01,120 Speaker 1: it truly will mark like they're rejoining of the international community. 398 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 1: They're going to let the Croner float. That's a big event. 399 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,399 Speaker 1: The second one is the two largest banks in the 400 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 1: country right now, Lens Banking and East Lens Bankie, which 401 00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,080 Speaker 1: are successors to the failed banks from two thousand eight. 402 00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:21,359 Speaker 1: They are now state controlled and the current ruling government, 403 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 1: along with the Central Bank, have plans to eventually privatize 404 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:32,679 Speaker 1: those banks. That will be an epic story because that 405 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,760 Speaker 1: process has to be transparent, it has to be fair, 406 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:41,800 Speaker 1: it has to realize value. And given what's happened just 407 00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: in the last couple of weeks with Panama papers the 408 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:47,960 Speaker 1: trust issue with government, that's going to be interesting. And 409 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 1: just to finish up, I mean Brigitte to John's daughter 410 00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:53,280 Speaker 1: if she if the Pirate Party do take power, they 411 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:57,880 Speaker 1: have vowed to stop the privatization process. I have to say, 412 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:01,480 Speaker 1: I just really just from a pure New US fascination sample, 413 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:03,360 Speaker 1: and I really want them to win. I know I'm 414 00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:06,720 Speaker 1: not supposed to take sides on these things, but we 415 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:08,800 Speaker 1: all have to be rooting to see what happens when 416 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 1: the Pirate Party takes when the pirates come to power. 417 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:15,159 Speaker 1: Pirates come to power, Yeah, it's just for that Heine story. 418 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 1: All right, thank you so much for joining us. Thank 419 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:31,440 Speaker 1: you my pleasure. So, Joe, did you like that story 420 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:33,720 Speaker 1: as much as I thought you would. Yeah, I love 421 00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:36,320 Speaker 1: the story. I think my favorite aspect of the story 422 00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:41,240 Speaker 1: is just this idea that Iceland is just this tiny 423 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,280 Speaker 1: country on an island and hardly anybody lives there, and 424 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,679 Speaker 1: the idea of um, you know, essentially what in the U. 425 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 1: S would be medium sized city, all going through these 426 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:58,160 Speaker 1: gigantic economic and political convulsions altogether. The thing that amazes 427 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 1: me is, you know, it's now seven or eight year 428 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,359 Speaker 1: is on from the two thousand financial crisis, and we 429 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:07,720 Speaker 1: are still seeing the ripple effects throughout society. And I 430 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,760 Speaker 1: always feel like you and I were financial journalists, so 431 00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 1: we naturally think about it all the time, and sometimes 432 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,920 Speaker 1: I feel like we're biased and there's possibly other things 433 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,160 Speaker 1: to be thinking about. But then a story like this 434 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,040 Speaker 1: comes up and I think, no, this actually is a 435 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,240 Speaker 1: big deal, and we are still seeing the ripple effects 436 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,440 Speaker 1: in the wider society, not just in Iceland but around 437 00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,280 Speaker 1: the world. Yeah, and I think there's a point that 438 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,680 Speaker 1: the economy has covered to quite an extent, I mean 439 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: almost anyone in the world would be thrilled with an 440 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,840 Speaker 1: unemployment rate of below three percent. Growth of four percent 441 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: per year is the envy of basically every developed country 442 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 1: you can think of, and the fact that we have 443 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:52,280 Speaker 1: the Iceland has these strong numbers yet still has this 444 00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:57,159 Speaker 1: very deep frustration and anger mistrust with the elites. I 445 00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:00,879 Speaker 1: just think, you know, there's incredibly important from a broader 446 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: perspective to understanding what's going on, you know, the UK 447 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 1: and the rest of the EU and obviously the EU 448 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:10,439 Speaker 1: the US. You made the point that it may bee 449 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: is sort of like a bell weather for what could 450 00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:17,359 Speaker 1: happen elsewhere, and I think that's certainly in itself a 451 00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,960 Speaker 1: compelling reason for people to care about what happens in Iceland. 452 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,400 Speaker 1: Promise me, Joe that if the Pirate Party does come 453 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 1: to power, we will do an Odd Lots episode on 454 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: the economics of piracy. Yeah. I absolutely we're going to 455 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:32,199 Speaker 1: do that, But I really hope we could do an 456 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,080 Speaker 1: Odd Lots in Iceland talking to them, because, as I said, 457 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,479 Speaker 1: I really want this to happen, because I think just 458 00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:41,320 Speaker 1: from a journalistic standpoint, it will be fascinating to see 459 00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 1: what happens. I think that's it for Today. The article 460 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,400 Speaker 1: is called This Is Where Bad Bankers Go to Prison. 461 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:51,120 Speaker 1: It's by Edward Robinson and Omar Valdemarson. You can find 462 00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:53,760 Speaker 1: it on Bloomberg dot com or in the latest issue 463 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:57,360 Speaker 1: of Bloomberg Markets Magazine. I'm Tracy Alloway. I'm on Twitter 464 00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 1: at Tracy Alloway, and I'm Joe wi Isn't All Managing 465 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 1: editor at Bloomberg Markets. You can follow me on Twitter 466 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 1: at the Stalwart and thanks for listening to Oddline.