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Speaker 1: Hello, Jackie Cohen.

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Speaker 2: In the last fifteen hours, you have sexty more than

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Speaker 2: you're sext me in the last six months.

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Speaker 3: What's going on?

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Speaker 1: Okay, So I got a whole bunch of headshots taken,

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Speaker 1: and I need to choose one.

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Speaker 4: We're lucky for you.

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Speaker 5: I'm doing nothing right now.

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Speaker 1: You're in front of your smartphone.

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Speaker 2: Right now, my smartphone?

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Speaker 4: Well then my smartphone.

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Speaker 1: Okay, here's the first one. Kind of a bearded bohemian. Look,

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Speaker 1: here we go. Just send it to your cell.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, it makes me look like a bum.

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Speaker 1: All right. Okay, how about this one beside a plant

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Speaker 1: no denim shirt and denim vest in a cagle cap

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Speaker 1: in a law library, sitting in a bean bag chair

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Speaker 1: eating a powdered doughnut.

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Speaker 4: Of course.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all I've got left is this one of me

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Speaker 1: in a turtleneck and a pair of overalls.

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Speaker 6: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: No, I like overalls from Ghimili Media. I'm Jonathan Goldstein

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Speaker 1: and this is Heavyweight Today's episode Mara right after the break.

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Speaker 1: Here are some things to know about Mara. She has

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Speaker 1: a clock in her bathroom, so even when she's in

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Speaker 1: the shower, she can make sure she's running on time.

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Speaker 1: When she meets up with friends, she brings along sparkling

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Speaker 1: water so everyone stays hydrated. And on her high school

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Speaker 1: rowing team, she was the coxin, the one who steers

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Speaker 1: the boat and keeps everyone on course. In other words,

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Speaker 1: Mara gets the job done, which is why the one

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Speaker 1: job she can't get done bothers her so much that

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Speaker 1: it pops up in her dreams.

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Speaker 7: You know how people have an anxiety dreams, and it's

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Speaker 7: like you're naked, or you're in a test room and

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Speaker 7: you've not studied.

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Speaker 2: I don't know what yours is, Jonathan.

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Speaker 1: I've had that stuff happen in real life. Well you're

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Speaker 1: talking about dreaming. Oh interesting, Okay.

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Speaker 7: So I have a reoccurring dream about driving that I'm

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Speaker 7: behind the wheel of a car, and then all of

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Speaker 7: a sudden, there's just like this creeping anxiety where I

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Speaker 7: realized that I can't drive.

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Speaker 1: Mara does not have a driver's license. Her fear of

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Speaker 1: driving began eleven years ago because of what happened to

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Speaker 1: one of her cousins, one of her many many cousins.

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Speaker 2: I have about forty first cousins.

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Speaker 1: Do you know all the names of your forty cousins?

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Speaker 2: Of course, I do.

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Speaker 1: Could you recite all forty.

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Speaker 7: Names Dominica, Michael and Catherine, Shana, Ben and Mary.

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Speaker 1: As Mara lists, I try to remember the names of

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Speaker 1: my cousins, of which there are two. There's Marty and

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Speaker 1: a man named Sence. I want to say Benjamin.

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Speaker 2: The twins Chris and Kevin, and Tina.

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Speaker 1: In my family, cousins are a coincidence a murder of

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Speaker 1: Rando's with the same grandparents. But in Mara's family, a

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Speaker 1: cousin is a friend. And of all Mara's forty cousins,

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Speaker 1: there was one who was her best friend, Shannon Shannon.

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Speaker 1: Mara was two years younger than Shannon and grew up

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Speaker 1: in Shannon's hand me downs. They celebrated Christmas and birthdays together,

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Speaker 1: spent whole summer days at the pool. Shannon was her cool,

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Speaker 1: big sister.

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Speaker 7: Someone that you always kind of wanted to have in

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Speaker 7: your corner, you know. She was the person that I

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Speaker 7: got most excited to have play dates with or sleepovers with.

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Speaker 1: As they grew older, Mara and Shannon would go on

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Speaker 1: long walks together, talking about their families and gossiping about boys.

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Speaker 1: In the fall of two thousand and eight, Shannon went

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Speaker 1: away to college, and that summer, Mara was looking forward

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Speaker 1: to seeing her again at an upcoming family party.

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Speaker 7: It was July third, It was a Friday afternoon, and

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Speaker 7: it was my brother's graduation party.

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Speaker 1: Mara's family was hosting. So the day of the party,

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Speaker 1: Mara helped her mom prepare for guests, tidying the laundry

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Speaker 1: room to make it into a bar area.

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Speaker 7: So I was sweeping the laundry room and I remember

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Speaker 7: the phone ringing and my mom picking up, and it

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Speaker 7: was my grandfather.

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Speaker 2: And I remember my mom.

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Speaker 7: Saying Shannon's name in this her You know the sound

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Speaker 7: that people get when they're stressed and their voice just

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Speaker 7: gets tight.

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Speaker 2: It was like Shannon.

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Speaker 7: And then she came into the room and she said,

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Speaker 7: Shannon's been an accident.

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Speaker 1: She's dead.

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Speaker 7: With the place still kind of decorated like a graduation

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Speaker 7: party with streamers and confetti, you know, my family just

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Speaker 7: started rolling in.

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Speaker 1: Already turned into an informal vigil, with the family consoling

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Speaker 1: each other in small, hushed groups. It was here that

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Speaker 1: Mara overheard an aunt sharing the graphic details of Shannon's death.

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Speaker 1: These were images that would stick with her for years

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Speaker 1: to come. Mara's aunt explained that while driving back from

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Speaker 1: the Jersey Shore for the graduation party, Shannon, her license

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Speaker 1: barely a few weeks old, accidentally swerved off the highway

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Speaker 1: and drove through a guardrail and into a tree. The

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Speaker 1: car spun around and hit another tree. It was the

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Speaker 1: second tree that crushed her.

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Speaker 7: You know, when news like that hits you, it doesn't

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Speaker 7: really hit you, you know. I cried a little bit, but

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Speaker 7: it was like this kind of sprint and then like normalcy.

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Speaker 1: It only began to sink in a few weeks later,

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Speaker 1: while MARAA was traveling for a race, she was staying

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Speaker 1: in a hotel room with her rowing team. It was

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Speaker 1: her birthday, and I.

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Speaker 7: Remember like at midnight into the bathroom and running the

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Speaker 7: shower and just like sobbing, I think for the first time,

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Speaker 7: like realizing that this older cousin who I admired so

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Speaker 7: much like I was going to get older than her.

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Speaker 2: She was always going to be the same age.

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Speaker 1: Crying in the hotel bathroom, Mara turned seventeen years old.

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Speaker 1: Turning seventeen in New Jersey meant who was time to

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Speaker 1: get her driver's license, and Mara had already begun the process.

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Speaker 1: She'd gotten her permit. She'd been practicing or driving, but

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Speaker 1: with Shannon's death, maraa couldn't bring herself to actually take

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Speaker 1: the final test.

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Speaker 7: My parents were pushing me to schedule the test, and

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Speaker 7: I was kind of like, oh, I don't know, you know,

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Speaker 7: excuse excuse, I'm busy.

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Speaker 2: I'm traveling for crew.

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Speaker 7: This image of the accident would come to mind at

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Speaker 7: even just the thought of getting behind the wheel, but.

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Speaker 1: Her parents kept insisting. The way Mara explains it, their

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Speaker 1: approach was throw the kid into the deep end and

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Speaker 1: they'll learn how to swim. They wanted Mara to stop

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Speaker 1: dwelling and push through. So one day after church, Mar's

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Speaker 1: father demanded she take the wheel.

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Speaker 7: My dad was basically like, you're driving home, and I

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Speaker 7: was like, I don't want to, but he made me,

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Speaker 7: and we were, I don't know, a mile and a

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Speaker 7: half from my parents, and I can remember just being

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Speaker 7: utterly terrified and feeling like my stomach was just dropping

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Speaker 7: through my body, and my dad being in the front

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Speaker 7: seat and like raising his voice and making gasps and

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Speaker 7: like pulling in and thinking to myself, I never want

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Speaker 7: to do that again. And that was literally the last

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Speaker 7: time I ever was behind the wheel of a car.

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Speaker 1: Eleven years later, and still Mara's parents see her inability

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Speaker 1: to get her license. In practical terms, adults just need

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Speaker 1: to drive. They've never been able to see it the

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Speaker 1: way Mara does. So at no point were you able

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Speaker 1: to say the reason why I don't want to drive

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Speaker 1: is just it connects too much to Shannon Oh.

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Speaker 2: I have been various rays over the years.

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Speaker 1: Has just never been heard, Mara says. Any conversation with

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Speaker 1: her parents about driving devolves into a fight. Her parents

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Speaker 1: push her to move past her fear. Mara says she can't,

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Speaker 1: but they never really talk about what's behind the fear. Instead,

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Speaker 1: they talk in circles and everyone leaves resentful. This happened

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Speaker 1: most recently last Thanksgiving. Because of the pandemic. Mara didn't

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Speaker 1: want to take the train from DC to Jersey. Her

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Speaker 1: mother didn't want to make the long drive to pick

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Speaker 1: her up. Things grew heated. Mara remembers her mom eventually saying, well,

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Speaker 1: you're the one who decided not to get your license.

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Speaker 1: It felt like the same argument they've been having since

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Speaker 1: she was seventeen, and so now you're twenty eight years

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Speaker 1: old and you don't have your license.

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Speaker 2: I'm twenty eight years old and I don't have my license.

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Speaker 2: Say it out loud. It makes you on a car.

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Speaker 1: MARAA is desperate to change the conversation with her parents,

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Speaker 1: and the solution she thinks is to get her license.

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Speaker 1: That way, they can stop fighting about the license and

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Speaker 1: finally talk about why it's been so hard for her,

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Speaker 1: about what's behind her fear. The only problem. Mara is

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Speaker 1: still terrified of driving, so she's come to me for

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Speaker 1: help getting on the road and eventually passing the driver's test.

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Speaker 1: I believe I failed the written part a couple times,

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Speaker 1: and I wasn't a good driver, and I'm still not

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Speaker 1: a great driver, and I don't really like driving. Okay,

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Speaker 1: when I play grand theft auto, I can barely steal

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Speaker 1: a single auto. But I remind Mara that even so,

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Speaker 1: they still gave me a license. I don't have any

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Speaker 1: special skill, any great hand eye coordination, and yet I'm

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Speaker 1: street legal. Right. I'm just basically like, yeah, any any

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Speaker 1: asshole can do it, and I'm that asshole, and I'm

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Speaker 1: confident that Mara can be that asshole too. So this

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Speaker 1: is what I want to hear. You say, you ready,

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Speaker 1: I'm ready. I'm twenty eight years old. I'm twenty eight

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Speaker 1: years old and I'm going to get my driver's license.

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Speaker 1: And I'm going to get my driver's license. How does

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Speaker 1: that feel? It feels good.

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Speaker 2: I feel like I wanna cry again.

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Speaker 1: Ah after the break, I cox in Mara to the

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Speaker 1: finish line. Check this out.

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Speaker 3: Port side.

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Speaker 1: Raise your arms, stroke stroke, I mean drive, drive tune.

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Speaker 1: That radio pumps that as NKO. Get your head out

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Speaker 1: of it. You need like your twin brothers. With her

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Speaker 1: road test a few months away, Mara will need someone

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Speaker 1: to practice her driving with. It's still the height of

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Speaker 1: the pandemic, so I can't fly to DC. I'll need

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Speaker 1: to offer my tutelage over video. This means recruiting a

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Speaker 1: local proxy, some DC based Patsy to fill the passenger seat.

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Speaker 1: While holding me aloft on their phone, Mara suggests I

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Speaker 1: speak with her friend Joe. Joe describes Mara as the

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Speaker 1: kind of person who's always there to help, stepping up

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Speaker 1: before you even ask. So she's happy to help mar

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Speaker 1: learn to drive. But there's just one problem.

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Speaker 8: I hate podcasts. I don't think I could.

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Speaker 1: Connect with them. Well, she's inside of one now. Although

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Speaker 1: she's known Mara for years, says MARAA only recently told

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Speaker 1: her she doesn't know how to drive. Mara's shame about

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Speaker 1: not having a license is something she's kept hidden, even

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Speaker 1: from her closest friends.

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Speaker 8: I was very surprised by it. Burney and a friends

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Speaker 8: have gone on tons of trips together, and it had

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Speaker 8: never crossed my mind that she couldn't drive the car

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Speaker 8: at any point.

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Speaker 1: Is it sort of like when you find out that

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Speaker 1: a friend is Canadian, like you just thought you just

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Speaker 1: thought she was people? What about this lot lesson? One

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Speaker 1: the basics? Is it open for her first driving lesson?

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Speaker 1: Joe brings Mara to an empty stadium parking lot. My

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Speaker 1: virtual self or best self rides along in a phone

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Speaker 1: holder fastened above the glove compartment, not unlike one of

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Speaker 1: those dashboard hula dancers. Get yourself comfortable so that you

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Speaker 1: could reach the gas as well as the break I've

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Speaker 1: always feared I lacked any but taking on the aspect

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Speaker 1: of a talking car air freshener is a new low. Okay,

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Speaker 1: there you go. Mar's hands are visibly shaking. This is

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Speaker 1: her very first time behind the wheel of a car

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Speaker 1: since her father had her drive home from church eleven

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Speaker 1: years ago foot reaches the various petals down there.

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Speaker 2: Release, this is the brig and the gas.

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Speaker 1: Did you have them confused?

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Speaker 5: Yes?

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Speaker 1: With the pedals all sorted, Mara takes hold of Joe's

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Speaker 1: hand and let's take it.

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Speaker 2: Eat breath. Okay, let's jack Oh shit, I'm underverse.

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Speaker 1: Mars starts slow, taking a lap around the empty parking lot.

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Speaker 1: At first, she coasts too scared to even accelerate, but

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Speaker 1: then she's.

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Speaker 9: Using the gas. I use.

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Speaker 1: Okay, But in spite of her anxiety, Mara takes the

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Speaker 1: driving quickly.

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Speaker 10: At that when I hit that fifteen miles per hour,

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Speaker 10: I was like, I'm capable of anything.

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Speaker 1: When she has a feel for the car, she even

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Speaker 1: decides to tackle parallel parking with some abandoned cones.

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Speaker 8: And between that cone is gonna be where you have

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Speaker 8: to parallel park.

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Speaker 1: Okay, you can call it Jackie Cone JACKI co But

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Speaker 1: unlike Jackie Cohen, this cone doesn't laugh at you or

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Speaker 1: bang down the phone when you call it stands tall

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Speaker 1: and tribute to safety. And also unlike Jackie Cohen, hits

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Speaker 1: orange with a white stripe, though Jackie does have that

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Speaker 1: orange sweater vest she wears with a white turtleneck makes

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Speaker 1: her look like a creamsicle. But although Jackie Cone is icy,

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Speaker 1: she's no treat what she doesn't.

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Speaker 7: I'm gonna turn off the car and put my emergency

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Speaker 7: brake on with.

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Speaker 1: The less an over we said in the parking lot, Joe,

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Speaker 1: how do you feel? How do you feel? Mar's done?

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Speaker 2: Master level one?

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Speaker 1: That's amazing. You've done it all at this.

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Speaker 7: Point, except actually like driven on a road.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, lesson two the road.

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Speaker 11: These quiet neighborhoods are a welcome respite from the normal

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Speaker 11: DC bustle.

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Speaker 1: This is Mara's cousin, Mike, who's taking her driving on

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Speaker 1: an actual street. Mike and Mara grew up together. When

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Speaker 1: Mike was overseas and homesick, Mara was the only family

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Speaker 1: member who came to visit him. But in spite of

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Speaker 1: their closeness, it turns out that, like Joe, Mike never

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Speaker 1: knew about Mara's lack of a license. Now that he does,

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Speaker 1: though he's offering his full support.

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Speaker 3: That's perfect.

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Speaker 1: Mike is a staff sergeant in the Army and has

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Speaker 1: the kind of can do attitude that must come in

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Speaker 1: handy when motivating a cadet off a plane with the

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Speaker 1: gentle poke of a bay.

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Speaker 11: That driving is possible. Driving is for everyone, So.

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Speaker 1: Mara is at ease driving through the streets of DC.

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00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,000
Speaker 1: His mic offers helpful tips.

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Speaker 11: Turn signals are a crutch, you don't need them.

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Speaker 2: Blinkers are not for you, though they're for other people.

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Speaker 11: First of all, it's nobody's business where I'm going. Instead,

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Speaker 11: you had to operate in a parking garage.

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Speaker 1: Yet, Mara and Mike make a bathroom stop at a

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Speaker 1: grocery store, which affords Mara a chance to practice parking

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Speaker 1: in a parking garage and Mike a chance to practice

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Speaker 1: sharing his heart.

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Speaker 11: I think parking was one of the hardest things for me.

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Speaker 11: Probably it's hard for me to admit. But after all,

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Speaker 11: masculinity is just a cage, not break out of it.

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00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:11,520
Speaker 1: Wow, what is that noise? Mike's keen military ear senses

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Speaker 1: danger in the underground parking garage. That was terrifying.

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Speaker 3: It's terrifying.

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Speaker 1: Are you getting that?

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Speaker 2: It's terrifying?

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Speaker 11: No, Maybe she's get out of here.

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00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:30,000
Speaker 7: In the corner run.

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00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:37,479
Speaker 1: Creeping around parking garages, laughing with a partner in crime.

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00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,520
Speaker 1: After years of fear and avoidance, Mara is finally catching

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Speaker 1: up on what she missed as a teenager, first learning

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Speaker 1: to drive from where I said in a cup holder,

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Speaker 1: It's nice to hear her having fun. Mara's handling everything

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Speaker 1: so well that I'm tempted to suggest we skip the

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Speaker 1: rest of our lessons and just go to the movies.

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00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,720
Speaker 1: Theaters have cup holders two, after all, and I hear

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00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,480
Speaker 1: Boss Baby Too is getting good reviews. But there's still

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00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,520
Speaker 1: one lesson Mara needs, which brings us to lesson three,

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00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:20,359
Speaker 1: The Highway. Mar's road test is only a few weeks away,

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00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:23,520
Speaker 1: and she still hasn't driven on the highway, so while

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Speaker 1: visiting Austin, Texas, Mara calls upon her friend Nora to

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Speaker 1: take her driving on a real Texas interstate. Mara's always

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Speaker 1: been there for Nora. When Nora's grandmother died, Maras stayed

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Speaker 1: up all night with her so she wouldn't be alone.

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Speaker 1: Nora's glad to help.

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Speaker 5: My hands are sweating mine or two, my hands are

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00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:49,119
Speaker 5: also sweating, I'll say, just like watching Nora is holding

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Speaker 5: the phone up so I can see the highway from

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00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:55,800
Speaker 5: Mara's perspective, Semi's whiz by making Nora's Mini Cooper seem

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Speaker 5: even tinier.

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Speaker 1: We're on I thirty five, Austin's only major free way.

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Speaker 2: It's chaotic, all right, and you've got the green arrows.

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Speaker 6: So ship man, y'all, there's people coming up behind you,

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Speaker 6: but you'll get in the cars last to get on,

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00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:21,800
Speaker 6: so you have to like get over fairly quickly here

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Speaker 6: to get onto the highways.

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Speaker 2: So all right, we're getting on.

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Speaker 1: Mara emerges onto the highway, tentatively a little too slow

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Speaker 1: for the flow of traffic.

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Speaker 3: Ship Man, I.

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Speaker 2: Don't know if I'm ready for this.

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Speaker 6: You stand the then stay in the far this right

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Speaker 6: lane if we.

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Speaker 7: Can get right off this an accent immediately after, I

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Speaker 7: have to look, what do I do?

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Speaker 6: No? Just stay in the right lane. Oh do you

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Speaker 6: want to stay in this? Yes? That's let's I said, okay,

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Speaker 6: cant's just say where you are and we're just gonna

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Speaker 6: get off at the second.

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Speaker 2: Okay, right, okay, all right?

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Speaker 1: At okay?

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Speaker 9: Right?

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00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:02,560
Speaker 1: Can you get to the right lane? I don't know.

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00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:06,320
Speaker 6: If you get into the right.

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00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:09,000
Speaker 9: Can't go one more?

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00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:11,320
Speaker 6: There's no one behind you.

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00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:13,080
Speaker 2: We can go all the way over.

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00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,280
Speaker 1: Once off the highway, Mara finds a parking lot and

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Speaker 1: comes to a stop, all told her first ever highway

347
00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:23,080
Speaker 1: drive was less than two minutes long.

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Speaker 4: Can you hold my hands?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm gonna put you down, John, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yes, take a break.

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Speaker 2: I don't know why I'm crying. I mean, I know

352
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Speaker 2: why I'm crying. No, even regardless of the other stuff.

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Speaker 10: That was my first time getting in the highway since

354
00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:01,359
Speaker 10: she died, you know, and like it's like knowing, like

355
00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:03,480
Speaker 10: feeling the like at the speed and which like in

356
00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:07,880
Speaker 10: a moment, like something could happened. Just I felt out

357
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Speaker 10: of control, even though I know I was in control.

358
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Speaker 2: I'm glad it was with you. Okay, I want to

359
00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:40,240
Speaker 2: try it again.

360
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Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, there a.

361
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,520
Speaker 2: Goat, that's just stuff.

362
00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:48,280
Speaker 1: In spite of her anxiety, Mara gets back on the highway.

363
00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:51,440
Speaker 6: Okay, go straight and go kind of left, and we'll

364
00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:53,239
Speaker 6: stay in this lane the whole time until we get out.

365
00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:58,000
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, now go go this time.

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00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:01,000
Speaker 1: Mara stays on the highway for a few exits before

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00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 1: getting off. When I asked her why she felt so

368
00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,640
Speaker 1: strongly about getting back on, she says she didn't want

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Speaker 1: to let the fear build into something bigger the way

370
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:26,480
Speaker 1: it has for years. Marra wants to get the job done. Mara, yes,

371
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:27,840
Speaker 1: how you feeling.

372
00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:30,000
Speaker 2: I'm feeling pretty anxious right now.

373
00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:33,320
Speaker 1: It's finally the day of Mara's road test. She's brought

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Speaker 1: along a support group to help distract from her stress,

375
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:40,600
Speaker 1: her friend Jenna, her cousin Dominica, and of course cousin Mike.

376
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:46,240
Speaker 1: I'm extremely hung over. Hearing this, Maras springs into action,

377
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: not unlike a thoughtful, nurturing version of the kool Aid

378
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,360
Speaker 1: Man sparkling water.

379
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:56,919
Speaker 2: Yes, I love you someone, Yes, different flavors like.

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00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 1: Do you want to back it in? Or I'm gonna go.

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00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,919
Speaker 2: It's fifteen twenty os, so I'm gonna go check in.

382
00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:13,480
Speaker 11: Okay, great?

383
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 1: Are you here?

384
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:14,600
Speaker 6: Yeah?

385
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 9: Here.

386
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:20,120
Speaker 1: While her friends wait in the car, Maraa heads off

387
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,800
Speaker 1: to the test, where she will adjust mirrors and check

388
00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:26,480
Speaker 1: blind spots. She will signal right, and she will signal left,

389
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:30,760
Speaker 1: making it everybody's business where she's going. When she approaches

390
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,480
Speaker 1: stop signs, she will slow down one hundred and fifty

391
00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:36,640
Speaker 1: feet before the corner. She'll even deal with a lane

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00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:39,480
Speaker 1: hopping drunkard on an e bike that feels like an

393
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:43,640
Speaker 1: obstacle out of a video game, and fifty three minutes later,

394
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Speaker 1: she will emerge, oh my.

395
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:53,800
Speaker 2: God, look your own Thank you, my gentlemen. Still going

396
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:55,240
Speaker 2: I still cotton now? Oh god.

397
00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:59,800
Speaker 1: Maara is twenty eight years old and finally she has

398
00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:08,359
Speaker 1: driver's license, like hot mouth. That's for years, Mara felt

399
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:10,919
Speaker 1: so much shame about not driving that she hid it

400
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,000
Speaker 1: from the people she loved. But now they're all here

401
00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:17,200
Speaker 1: celebrating with her. She says she'd never have been able

402
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,119
Speaker 1: to do any of this without having asked for their help.

403
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:23,200
Speaker 2: Let me see, Wow, you were so beautiful?

404
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:35,080
Speaker 3: What like no one ever gets.

405
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:40,440
Speaker 1: In the weeks after getting her license, Mara tells everyone.

406
00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:44,199
Speaker 1: She calls her sister, she texts her friends, but there

407
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,520
Speaker 1: are still two people. She can't bring herself to tell

408
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:50,560
Speaker 1: her parents. The driver's license was meant to clear the

409
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 1: way for a conversation about Shannon's death. But as hard

410
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,720
Speaker 1: as getting her license was, the idea of talking with

411
00:24:56,760 --> 00:25:00,119
Speaker 1: her parents seems even harder. She's worried that she'll try

412
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 1: to bring up her big feelings and her parents will

413
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,720
Speaker 1: make their here we go again faces and there let's

414
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 1: put all of this behind us sounds. Then her dad

415
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,639
Speaker 1: will grow quiet and her mom will start to cry.

416
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 1: Everyone will get upset, and once again Marrow will feel unheard.

417
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 1: And so she procrastinates for three months, but then one evening,

418
00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:27,200
Speaker 1: around midnight, she sends her parents, Andy and Sue an email.

419
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 1: In it, she says she finally got her license and

420
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 1: wants to tell them all about it.

421
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:35,919
Speaker 3: So we need to hear more detail. How did this

422
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 3: all come about?

423
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:39,159
Speaker 2: I don't know where do you want me to start?

424
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,840
Speaker 1: Well, firstly, initially, I mean, how did you feel when

425
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:45,439
Speaker 1: you when you received Mara's email?

426
00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 3: I was crying, really very excited for you fan you

427
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 3: were admitting it.

428
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 1: I'm just so happy for her.

429
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:59,159
Speaker 3: It was a huge obstacle for her, just emotionally.

430
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:03,520
Speaker 4: It's a not to be too dramatic, but a demon

431
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 4: if you will.

432
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,520
Speaker 1: Sue nods, Yeah, I'm sure she probably told you.

433
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:12,159
Speaker 12: The story of week of her test driving test was

434
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:13,400
Speaker 12: her cousin's.

435
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:15,119
Speaker 4: Funeral, who died in a car crash.

436
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:15,440
Speaker 6: Right.

437
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:19,120
Speaker 1: Mara had told me that raising the topic of Shannon

438
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:22,320
Speaker 1: would be a struggle. I wasn't expecting Sue and Andy

439
00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:24,760
Speaker 1: to be the ones to bring it up first, and

440
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,359
Speaker 1: neither was Mara. At the mention of Shannon, she freezes

441
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:28,719
Speaker 1: us up.

442
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:37,920
Speaker 7: I am like, very surprised that you have always made

443
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:44,120
Speaker 7: that association because of the way that me not driving

444
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:47,480
Speaker 7: has been frequently brought up in our family. It's been

445
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:53,439
Speaker 7: talked about as this very intentional choice and feeling like,

446
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 7: in some ways, like not entitled to grieve.

447
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 2: We even talked about Shannon in years truly.

448
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:06,960
Speaker 3: I'm sorry that you felt like we were avoiding the conversation.

449
00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:13,080
Speaker 4: Yeah. I think during the experience the following years, my

450
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 4: recollection is was that that it's something that we we

451
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:25,360
Speaker 4: tried to acknowledge verbally, but without you know, creating a

452
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 4: crutch if you will.

453
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:31,480
Speaker 1: Andy and Sue feared too much sympathy might provide Mara

454
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: with an excuse to give up on driving altogether. But

455
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:37,959
Speaker 1: Mara didn't want a license to drive so much as

456
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: she wanted license to feel whatever she was feeling.

457
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:45,159
Speaker 7: This wasn't just a mental block, This wasn't something I

458
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 7: was overthinking, But this was trauma.

459
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,280
Speaker 4: Yeah. We knew it. Yeah, that's what I was saying.

460
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,880
Speaker 4: Something we do that we didn't maybe do a great

461
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:54,960
Speaker 4: job of communicating it, but we knew it. We knew

462
00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:56,880
Speaker 4: it all along. We knew it right from that day.

463
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:08,479
Speaker 4: You know, we heard and this is the roughest thing

464
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,880
Speaker 4: about being a parent. There's no playbook I mean, we're

465
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 4: at a complete loss.

466
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 1: No parent wants to watch their kids suffer in the

467
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:21,280
Speaker 1: aftermath of Shannon's death. They'd wanted to say something important

468
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,479
Speaker 1: and wise, something that might put an end to mars grief,

469
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 1: But what can one really say? So in the face

470
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:31,400
Speaker 1: of an unsolvable problem, they focused on a solvable one,

471
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:35,480
Speaker 1: the driver's license, and talking about the license might have

472
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 1: also been a distraction for Andy and Seue from their

473
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 1: own grief. They'd love Shannon. Two, how do you guys

474
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:45,880
Speaker 1: remember that time?

475
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 12: If I can ask, I remember it in great detail.

476
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:55,200
Speaker 12: We were having about eighty people coming to our house

477
00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 12: for my son's high school graduation party, and Maria was

478
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 12: busy sweeping through the lawn ready.

479
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: Even though Mara and her parents have never discussed that day,

480
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 1: Sue raises all the same things Mara did. She remembers

481
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: Mars sweeping the phone call, walking into the laundry room

482
00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: to tell Mara what had happened. For Mara, hearing Sue

483
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:18,480
Speaker 1: described that day the same way she always has makes

484
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 1: Mara feel seen. Sue also brings up things Marara wasn't

485
00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 1: there for, like the day after the funeral, when she

486
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:28,440
Speaker 1: drove Shannon's mom and brother to the tow yard to

487
00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 1: collect Shannon's personal effects from the crushed car. Sue remembers

488
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,160
Speaker 1: Shannon's purse on the floor of the back seat, her

489
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 1: phone and flip flops lying amid the shards of broken windshield,

490
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 1: like Marra's night crying in the hotel room. That was

491
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 1: when for Sue it all sank in.

492
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 3: Understanding what grief I was battling, and we were all battling.

493
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean by the time, you know, by the

494
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 4: time we even digested it, that year went by, you know,

495
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:59,120
Speaker 4: still stuck in our throats, and everybody dealt with it

496
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 4: own way, just to try to protect themselves, try to

497
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 4: protect their own heart.

498
00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 7: And then I left for college, and like, I haven't

499
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 7: lived at home really since.

500
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,800
Speaker 12: You know, It's funny more, I never really put it

501
00:30:14,840 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 12: together till you're just talking now that you're the only

502
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,920
Speaker 12: one of the siblings that was here full time in

503
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 12: the aftermath of her death.

504
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, Mara was the youngest of three siblings. It was

505
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:30,760
Speaker 1: just her and her parents alone in the house, the

506
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 1: air thick with the weight of all that was unspoken.

507
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 3: I meanwhile, you were trying to figure out where you're

508
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:38,400
Speaker 3: going to go to college. I mean all your senior

509
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 3: EVENTU rough.

510
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 2: That was a rough year.

511
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:53,800
Speaker 1: It's a small conversation as far as conversations go, but

512
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: after not talking about it for over a decade, it's something.

513
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 12: Maura, think about this. Ten years ago, we would not

514
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 12: be having the conversation like we're even having right now.

515
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 7: Yeah, and I just really appreciate you both having this conversation.

516
00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:11,120
Speaker 4: There's so much room for improvement, and I think that's

517
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 4: the and we're open to that. Yeah, and we're open

518
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 4: to that. The book isn't written just a series of chapters.

519
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 7: It's the beginning.

520
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 3: Absolutely, we're proud of you more.

521
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 1: Do you want to show them your driver's license? Mar

522
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: holds up her license for her parents to see.

523
00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:38,480
Speaker 7: Ooh, pretty picture, thank you, very nice, and that's me

524
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 7: in hologram form.

525
00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 2: Ooh, what's a little ghosts like? Ooh, it's a show.

526
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:48,880
Speaker 1: The license no longer needs to be weighted down with

527
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,080
Speaker 1: implication and meaning. It can finally be a piece of

528
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 1: plastic with a nice picture on it that gets you

529
00:31:55,160 --> 00:32:13,840
Speaker 1: from point A to point B. One fall Saturday, Mara

530
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 1: borrows a friend's car a miles She needs it to

531
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: run some errands. No, absolutely, not. It's the kind of

532
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:26,680
Speaker 1: afternoon people have all the time. Really, what's Chicago like?

533
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,720
Speaker 1: But for Mara, it's an afternoon of first first time

534
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:35,080
Speaker 1: driving around DC alone, first time hitting a pothole, shit,

535
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 1: first time driving through a drive through. Mara m a

536
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:42,840
Speaker 1: U R A where she orders a chicken sandwich and

537
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 1: a strawberry milkshake.

538
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 9: You.

539
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 1: She fits her milkshake into the cup holder and heads

540
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 1: to her next stop, The Sun's Bold. Mara started this

541
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: trek because of her family, and she finished it because

542
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: of her friends. But today she's enjoying the drive all

543
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: by yourself. Does think.

544
00:33:53,360 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 9: Now that the fernitures returning to its goodwill home, Now

545
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 9: that the last Monsrand is scheming with the damage, the

546
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 9: Bob take this moment to des.

547
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 2: If we imagine I.

548
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: Flee to series.

549
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:19,920
Speaker 9: Felt around Far.

550
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:24,719
Speaker 1: From Things, Accident.

551
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:26,799
Speaker 6: Zero.

552
00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:32,880
Speaker 1: This episode of Heavyweight was produced by Khalila Holtz, Mohemy mcgauker,

553
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:36,840
Speaker 1: Stevie Lane, and me Jonathan Goldstein. Special thanks to Emily Condon,

554
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:41,280
Speaker 1: Aggie Goldstein, Alex Bloomberg, Bethel hoptay Anna Foley, Lynn Levy,

555
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:45,319
Speaker 1: Paul Bowman, Zach Schmidt, and Jackie Cohen. Bobby Lord mixed

556
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,720
Speaker 1: the episode with original music by Christine Fellows, John K. Sampson,

557
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 1: Sean Jacoby, and Bobby Lord. Additional music credits can be

558
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 1: found on our website Gimletmedia dot com slash Heavyweight. Our

559
00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,480
Speaker 1: theme song is by the Weaker Than's courtesy of Epitaph Records.

560
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,359
Speaker 1: Follow up us on Twitter at Heavyweight. This is our

561
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 1: last episode of the season, but we're already looking for

562
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:07,240
Speaker 1: stories for next year. So if you have a moment

563
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:09,439
Speaker 1: from your own past that you need some help with,

564
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:13,880
Speaker 1: email us at Heavyweight at gimbletmedia dot com. Happy holidays

565
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 1: to wall and we'll see you next fall. See I

566
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:17,799
Speaker 1: made a little rhyme there.