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Speaker 1: Hey, what I welcome in. I'm Doug glib and this

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Speaker 1: is the all new All Fall, All Basketball, all of

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Speaker 1: the time. UM, I will tell you that, uh, we

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Speaker 1: have a special guest on this all bolt. Mike Martin

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Speaker 1: is the head coach of Brown and UM he's a

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Speaker 1: bit of a young fellow, right he got the job

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Speaker 1: at twenty nine years old. And Brown hasn't played basketball

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Speaker 1: this year. He joined me and it was right after

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Speaker 1: or in between double workout days, but the first day

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Speaker 1: they've been allowed back in the gym since early March

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Speaker 1: last year. Think about that kind of around his team

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Speaker 1: was he learned? How is he connected with his players?

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Speaker 1: How did you get this job? You know why? Brown?

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Speaker 1: He was actually offered offered to go to play at Harvard.

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Speaker 1: He chose Brown over them, amazing of course, launched his career,

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Speaker 1: his life, etcetera, etcetera. He'll he'll join this upcoming. I

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Speaker 1: think you'll really enjoy that. UM. Okay, there's a couple

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Speaker 1: of things I want to get to in college basketball

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Speaker 1: that I've I've seen and I I'm fascinated by. Got

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Speaker 1: a chance to see Illinois and Iowa last week in person,

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Speaker 1: and it's it's interesting to me because I love watching

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Speaker 1: uh Luca Garza play, and I really like watching Kofe

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Speaker 1: Coburn playing. Kofe. I got chance to coach in this

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Speaker 1: Pengos All American camp. It's not a ton of coaching,

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Speaker 1: but you could be around the kids and and um, Actually,

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Speaker 1: Posh Alexander was my point guard. Cope was my big guy.

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Speaker 1: They're both having really impactful times in college. But Kofe

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Speaker 1: was just he was just like a light bulb. He

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Speaker 1: just lit up the room. Man. He was such a

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Speaker 1: great kid to be around. What's fascinating is if you

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Speaker 1: went back twenty five years ago. Both those guys are

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Speaker 1: lottery picks. And Garza has an amazing touch. He knows

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Speaker 1: how a whole position, He knows angles you can score

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Speaker 1: in the post. He can shoot threes, do a little

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Speaker 1: bit of everything offensively with the basketball. But I I

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Speaker 1: don't know how he plays in the NBA meaningful starting minutes,

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Speaker 1: because you know, he's like he's just like a college

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Speaker 1: kind of Ennis Cantor. He's a bucket, but everybody that

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Speaker 1: goes at him is going to be a bucket to.

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Speaker 1: He just struggles in terms of lateral But if you

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Speaker 1: think about any thing about all the other parts of

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Speaker 1: his game which have improved. The defense is a little

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Speaker 1: bit better, and it could still continue to improve. I

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Speaker 1: do think he probably needs to drop some weight to

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Speaker 1: become a little bit more agile. And I'm guessing that

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Speaker 1: if you asked him, he would say, yeah, I need

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Speaker 1: that strength and wait the whole position. He's a tremendous

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Speaker 1: low post scorer just touch, has all the moves, incredible fluidity,

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Speaker 1: great hands, and they do a really good job of

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Speaker 1: getting him the basketball. There's good a post feeding team

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Speaker 1: as you're gonna find in college who really really good UM.

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Speaker 1: And I like when they play two bigs more than

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Speaker 1: when they play their kind of four out or sometimes

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Speaker 1: five out sort of look. I do think that they

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Speaker 1: lack the guy who can break you down, UM. But

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Speaker 1: because so many of them can play out of the post,

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Speaker 1: I think I think Connor McCaffrey can play out of

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Speaker 1: the posts some as well as Garza. I think they

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Speaker 1: can break down defenses in that way, but I would

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Speaker 1: and they just their problems stopping people, but they do

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Speaker 1: not have any problem scoring. Illinois. I owe Desima, you

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Speaker 1: know he played in He was so efficient in the

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Speaker 1: game that I saw and you watch him now. I

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Speaker 1: don't know how much game he has in terms of

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Speaker 1: creating his own off the dribble. So I don't know

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Speaker 1: if he'll be a star at the next level. But

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Speaker 1: to play for Brad, you've got a guard, so he

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Speaker 1: guards and he can. He can clearly has improved his shooting.

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Speaker 1: He's a tremendous layup maker, finisher. I think he's gonna

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Speaker 1: have a good career. I think playing for bred Underwood

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Speaker 1: is it's a very good mix of what he needed.

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Speaker 1: The discipline he needed, defense but he still needs in

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Speaker 1: his game, and and some of the some of the

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Speaker 1: way in which they're creating offense for him. But I

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Speaker 1: like the Illinois team. There's no reason to think they

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Speaker 1: can't compete in that second weekend to get to get

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Speaker 1: to a final four. They're they're they're good, they're deep. Um,

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Speaker 1: they change paces depending on who they come out the

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Speaker 1: bench with. Like that's a that's a good team, and

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Speaker 1: Brad has like quietly turned that thing around. Meanwhile, you

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Speaker 1: have the Michigan States of the world, which continue to struggle. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, I I don't know what happens in Michigan

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Speaker 1: State in the future. Obviously they need better point guard

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Speaker 1: play and better leadership. They did start to hit some

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Speaker 1: shots against Iowa, so maybe some of the stuff turns around.

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Speaker 1: But I saw those two teams and I was intrigued

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Speaker 1: by both big guys. But there was a little little

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Speaker 1: confirmation there and that I don't think either have great

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Speaker 1: NBA like Kofe Coburn. De Median reminds me of a

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Speaker 1: little bit better version of Jehidi White who played at

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Speaker 1: Georgetown did play in the NBA. Just a massive human being, massive,

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Speaker 1: but not really athletically lateral ladder, the athletic enough, not

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Speaker 1: really quick enough in terms of a rim runner, and

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Speaker 1: you know a guy who can roll and run to

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Speaker 1: the rim. I think that both make the league guards

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Speaker 1: a slightly more impact because he can score, but neither

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Speaker 1: are are perennial starters. I've also got a chance to

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Speaker 1: see a lot of Mountain West basketball, and the the

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Speaker 1: top four teams are far above UM, far above the

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Speaker 1: the bottom teams. In that I mean, I think Boyse

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Speaker 1: is really really good. I get a chance to see

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Speaker 1: them in person. Taking on Nevada. Nevada is a team

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Speaker 1: that I think has it's a it's young, a bunch

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Speaker 1: of potential for the future this year, there's they've still

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Speaker 1: been successful kind of they're in that that mix of

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Speaker 1: they're not one of the top four, but they are

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Speaker 1: closing and improving fast after sweeping U and o V

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Speaker 1: going back to last weekend, but now they were swept

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Speaker 1: at Wyoming showing their their youth before before we uh,

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Speaker 1: we have Mike Martin joined us. One of his former

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Speaker 1: players is one of the two stars for the Wolfpack,

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Speaker 1: Desmond Cambridge Jr. Stud originally from Nashville, Tennessee. Fifteen a game,

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Speaker 1: four and a half, rebounds, two and a half assist.

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Speaker 1: And then they have Grant Sheerfield who is a sophomore. Uh.

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Speaker 1: He grew up in Kansas, then moved to Fort Worth

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Speaker 1: with like sixth grade, was at Sunrise Christian Academy, that

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Speaker 1: was gonna go to u c l A played for

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Speaker 1: Alfred Alford, gets fired, he goes to Wichita, starts half

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Speaker 1: the year. Now in his sophomore year, he's playing for Nevada.

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Speaker 1: Eighteen and a half a game, five and a half, assist,

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Speaker 1: a game, stealing a half, a game four boards, shoots

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Speaker 1: forty thirty six and eighty seven And I mean this kid,

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Speaker 1: he's really good. He's he's tremendous. I don't think they

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Speaker 1: have this year, the overall older bodies it's gonna take

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Speaker 1: to compete. They got Zaye meets Um. They also have

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Speaker 1: Warren Washington, who's a transfer from Morgan State and he

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Speaker 1: barely played his first year, didn't play, sitting out, so

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Speaker 1: he's a redshirt sophomore, but just kind of coming into

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Speaker 1: his own. Like they're gonna be good. They're gonna be

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Speaker 1: really good in the future. Kamie him as a kid

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Speaker 1: from Arizona. Uh, he kind of splits time at the

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Speaker 1: center position as a shop blocker, can also step out

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Speaker 1: and make some threes with Warren Washington. Um. I you

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Speaker 1: know Alfred, some people didn't like Alfred at u c

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Speaker 1: l A. Obviously it didn't end, it didn't end crazy well.

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Speaker 1: They didn't get to the final four the way that

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Speaker 1: Brad Holland did. Let me see Brad Holland, that Ben

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Speaker 1: Howland did. Brad Holland of course from the U c

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Speaker 1: l A, Guy USD. But but there's there's something about

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Speaker 1: all Fords ability in the Mountain West just dominate. And

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Speaker 1: I think we're like a year away from seeing Nevada

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Speaker 1: as the top twenty five team, and I don't think

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Speaker 1: any of these guys are pros. Surefield might be a

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Speaker 1: pro eventually, but it's like not. He's building a program

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Speaker 1: that has some sustainability, so it's gonna be pretty cool

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Speaker 1: to see exactly what what they can do. Speaking of

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Speaker 1: Desmond Cambridge Jr. He began his career playing for Our Guest.

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Speaker 1: Our Guests is a talented head coach at Brown. Of course,

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Speaker 1: Brown part of the Ivy League. They have not played

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Speaker 1: a game and will not play a game this season

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Speaker 1: during his time at Brown. Remember, the IVY League has

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Speaker 1: really cranked up in terms of the level of talent

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Speaker 1: in the league. You go back to two thousand, two

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Speaker 1: twenty games for the first time, they got to the

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Speaker 1: cb I quarterfinals. Last year they were eight and six

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Speaker 1: in conference play before of course, it was shut down

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Speaker 1: due to COVID concerns and they they have not obviously played.

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Speaker 1: He only had really one tough year's fourth year there,

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Speaker 1: but as a performer Brown player. He got the job

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Speaker 1: at twenty nine years old. How did he get it?

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Speaker 1: What's he learned? How would he change all these different things?

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Speaker 1: Let's welcome in. He's head coach of the Brown Bears

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Speaker 1: Mike Martin. Be sure to catch the live edition of

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Speaker 1: The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at three pm Easter noon

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Speaker 1: Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio

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Speaker 1: a app. So you grew up in Warre in Massachusetts, Like,

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Speaker 1: how do I how do I pronounce it Agonwa? But

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Speaker 1: say it? Say it? When you were growing up in Agawam,

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Speaker 1: how would you say it? I don't have the Boston accent,

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Speaker 1: I know, but everybody does. Everybody everybody else have the

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Speaker 1: Agawam the Boston accent, not in the western part of

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Speaker 1: the state. Really, you know, it's interesting. It's interesting. I

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Speaker 1: think people having spent a bunch of time in the Northeast,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if people understand, like there's a perception

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Speaker 1: of like Boston, like, well everybody in Boston is you know, like, um,

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Speaker 1: it's like, you know, all the incredible colleges there, it's

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Speaker 1: very sophisticated. Like you go to western mass and the

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Speaker 1: percentage of Rednecks there is just as high as it

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Speaker 1: is in any other rural part of the countries that

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Speaker 1: it's at a fair fair parallel. So the people in

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Speaker 1: the folks in Boston, Eastern mass would say there's nothing

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Speaker 1: west of fives, like an interstate twenty miles west of Boston.

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Speaker 1: So like for me, yeah, I'm out in the middle

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Speaker 1: of nowhere. If you're from Boston, they probably even know

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Speaker 1: what Aguham is other than and we border Springfield, which

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Speaker 1: is where the Hall of Fame is and we have

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Speaker 1: a six Flags, So I think that's fair. Yeah, yes,

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Speaker 1: six fights. It's big, but it's definitely they definitely kind

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Speaker 1: of get your red neck on, Like I I've always

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Speaker 1: been to that, like Kenny Chesney concert at fox in Foxboro,

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Speaker 1: and like you go right and you're like, dude, there

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Speaker 1: are a lot of rednecks here. They're like yea, Like

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Speaker 1: Massachusetts is not all Boston anyway. Um, growing up, what

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Speaker 1: was how did you fall in love with basketball? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: My father was a high school coach for twenty plus years,

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Speaker 1: and you know when I was young, he had had

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Speaker 1: some great teams at Commerce High School before I was

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Speaker 1: born in Springfield, mass he sent Mark Hall to Minnesota. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, Nate Blunt played the Temple. He had some

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Speaker 1: great players at Commerce UM and then he took the

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Speaker 1: job at ad one On High School, which is where

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Speaker 1: I grew up. UM and you know, I grew up

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Speaker 1: going to his practices, going to his games. I was

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Speaker 1: the ball boy. I loved it. I rode the bus

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Speaker 1: and and that's how I fell in love with with

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Speaker 1: the sport. And uh, you know, just fortunate that. Uh

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Speaker 1: you know, my father was a coach, much like yours.

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Speaker 1: How did you fall in love with basketball? So my

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Speaker 1: father was a long time high school coach twenty plus years.

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Speaker 1: He had some great players at Commerce High School in Springfield,

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Speaker 1: mass Mark Hall who played uh Minnesota with Kevin McHale,

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Speaker 1: Nate Blunt who went down to Temple in Philly. Uh.

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Speaker 1: But then you know what I remembers when he was

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Speaker 1: the coach at Agwham High School, which is in the

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Speaker 1: suburb and right outside Springfield, and uh, you know, just

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Speaker 1: grew up as a ball boy three or four years old,

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Speaker 1: going every practice, right in the bus, going every game.

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Speaker 1: And uh fortunate that my father was a coach and

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Speaker 1: fell in love with the sport through that. Uh. Probably

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Speaker 1: very similar to you, you know, growing up the son

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Speaker 1: of a coach. Yeah, it's interesting because you know, my

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Speaker 1: my dad was when he was the head coach until

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Speaker 1: I was six, and he was an assistant coach at

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Speaker 1: Long Beach State until I was nine or ten, and

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Speaker 1: then he was an assistant coach at Oregon State for

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Speaker 1: a year. But he went up there and we stayed

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Speaker 1: in southern California, and then he was you know, he

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Speaker 1: kind of bounced around doing stuff and started as an

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Speaker 1: auth coach. So I didn't have necessary like a high

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Speaker 1: school team um to to to like being to be

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Speaker 1: drawn to like it became my brother's teams, my brother's

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Speaker 1: high school team. I was a ball boy for when

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Speaker 1: your when your dad was a coach. Every I found

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Speaker 1: every coach's kid has a guy who when they grew

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Speaker 1: up they idolized, like that was their guy? Who was

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Speaker 1: your guy? Who is the guy? Like that's who I

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Speaker 1: want to be. Yes. So his best player at Aguam

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Speaker 1: was a guy by the name of Jeff Peterson who

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Speaker 1: won uh, you know, the Lahovich Award, which is like

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Speaker 1: the top player in Hampton County, Western Massachusetts, Berkshire and

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Speaker 1: h Hampshire counties as well. But he brought my father's

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Speaker 1: team the district finals they where they lost to a

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Speaker 1: good chick be comp team. But that was probably I

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Speaker 1: was six seven years old and like I wanted to

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Speaker 1: be Jeff Peterson. Yeah. Um, what was your dad like

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Speaker 1: he's a coach? Yeah? Intense? Uh you know, Um he was.

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Speaker 1: He played football, baseball, basketball in high school. He ended

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Speaker 1: up playing basketball in college at North Adams State because

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Speaker 1: he U he blew out his knees so he couldn't

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Speaker 1: play football. But very you know, we're gonna play hard. Uh,

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Speaker 1: We're gonna outwork you, We're gonna defend you intense. Uh.

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Speaker 1: You know. He demanded a lot of his players and um,

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Speaker 1: you know coached him hart. Yeah. It's it's interesting, Um

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Speaker 1: that now of his style, What of his style is

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Speaker 1: how you coach? What of his style is the opposite

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Speaker 1: of how you coach? So we're gonna coach you hard,

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Speaker 1: We're gonna demand an awful lot, We're gonna care about you.

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Speaker 1: We're gonna love you off the court, just like my

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Speaker 1: father did with all his players. Um. You know, I

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Speaker 1: think I was really influenced from Glenn Miller, who was

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Speaker 1: my college coach at Brown. He recruited me to Brown.

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Speaker 1: He got me into the profession of coaching. Uh and uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think I picked up a lot of

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Speaker 1: you know, coach Miller's attention to you know, detail, how

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Speaker 1: to run offense, How to you know, prepare a team? Um,

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Speaker 1: so I think I would. I would say I'm a

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Speaker 1: blend of both. Um. It's interesting, right because that generation,

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Speaker 1: like my dad, I'll never forget we ran like little

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Speaker 1: Ralph Miller one four high right, maybe a little highball screen,

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Speaker 1: but like the old school, like just put the big

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Speaker 1: out the top of the key, right, um, you know,

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Speaker 1: and dribbling space off of it, and like that was

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Speaker 1: kind of it. Like my son's my son asked me

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Speaker 1: like that, what was what was grandpa Us practice? Like

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Speaker 1: I was like, well, you know, he did fundamentals, you know,

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Speaker 1: a ton of passing every day, and then did transition

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Speaker 1: stuff and then press break you know, because like Gray,

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Speaker 1: you everything's press break and then just a little half

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Speaker 1: court offensive stuff. He's like, wow, you run a lot

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Speaker 1: of plays and sets. And I was like, well, I

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Speaker 1: feel like basketball is a lot more technical now, like

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Speaker 1: it's just coached, like you said, coach differently. You know.

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Speaker 1: I played for Very Sutton and he never drove a

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Speaker 1: play like, no one time. I never, not a single time.

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Speaker 1: Now Sean his son would drop the plays and he

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Speaker 1: would some you know, he'd grab it and show somebody's

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Speaker 1: specific in terms of spacing, but he never like, hey,

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Speaker 1: we need a bucket, like let's run this at the

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Speaker 1: end of the game. And I was just amazing when

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Speaker 1: I coach, I situational coaching to me is really important.

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Speaker 1: You know. I tried like we had a bounced places

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Speaker 1: that were that were good, and we scored on we

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Speaker 1: frankly scored on him because I was passing the ball um.

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Speaker 1: But but I spend like that's an easy place to

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Speaker 1: not just show off. But the deal points right, and

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Speaker 1: I think that is important. Whereas it does feel like

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Speaker 1: there's that that old school of coaches was just like,

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Speaker 1: how can we get you to play hard? How can

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Speaker 1: we get you to play unselfish? And then can you

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Speaker 1: play a little bit harder and a little bit more unselfish?

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Speaker 1: And then and then like they also would kind of

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Speaker 1: adjust to the which kids, which kids could they mf

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Speaker 1: and which kids that had needed the pat in the back.

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Speaker 1: Other than that, there wasn't a lot of a lot

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Speaker 1: of magic to it, right, I am, I am I

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Speaker 1: crazy to think that's a little bit of the old

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Speaker 1: school mental mentality coaches. I think it's so true, and

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Speaker 1: I think the best coaches now have a great blend

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Speaker 1: of of of both, Doug Right, I mean, that's that's

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Speaker 1: fascinating to hear about. Coach Sutton never drawn up a

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Speaker 1: play and obviously, you know who had more success than him,

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Speaker 1: hardly anyone. Right. He recruited really good players, he coached,

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Speaker 1: he loves you, and he demanded an awful lot and uh,

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Speaker 1: you know you think about him and his his career

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Speaker 1: and it's it's it was so incredibly successful. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think like we're like a school fundamentals values, play hard, play, unselfishly,

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Speaker 1: share the ball, uh with you know some new school

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Speaker 1: new aged uh, you know, spacing on offense, defensive concepts. Uh.

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Speaker 1: I think that, you know, gosh, I'd love to hopefully

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Speaker 1: one day be a great blend of both. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: it's a I think the best are I think I

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Speaker 1: think the absolute the best are. Um, why why did

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Speaker 1: you pick Brown? Like you're growing up Western mass Because

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Speaker 1: back then the Ivy League was Penn and Princeton and

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Speaker 1: that's it, like those are the everybody else playing for

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Speaker 1: third and they didn't recruit me. So the current pen

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Speaker 1: coach right now, Steve dunhe was on staff and coach

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Speaker 1: Dumphy obviously they had incredible teams. I joked with Steve.

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Speaker 1: You know, we're good friends. Now. Uh, they didn't think

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Speaker 1: I was good enough and and and they're right. They

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Speaker 1: won a lot IVY championships. Uh. I was recruited by

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Speaker 1: Brown and Harvard. You know, quite a few Patriot legue schools. Um.

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Speaker 1: You know, so you've turned down Harvard? I did. I

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Speaker 1: did Frank Sell and so Frank Sullivan. I was a

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Speaker 1: coach at Harvard before Tommy Amaker, great guy, good and

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Speaker 1: uh you know, I just you know, I clicked with

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Speaker 1: coach Miller and his staff. Call me crazy. I love

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Speaker 1: the state of Rhode Island, my family and Rhode Island. Uh.

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Speaker 1: You know, here's the deal. My father was a coach

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Speaker 1: and a teacher. My you know, became an a d

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Speaker 1: My mother was a longtime middle school teacher. UM. Academics

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Speaker 1: were always important. It was like, all right, I got

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Speaker 1: Brown and Harvard the IVY League. It's really good. You know,

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Speaker 1: you can't do better than the IVY League from an

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Speaker 1: educational academic standpoint. I want to go where I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: be happiest, where I felt like I'd fit in better.

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Speaker 1: And I just you know what it was a gut decision. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Coach Sullivan was shocked when I told him I'm choosing Brown.

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Speaker 1: He had me on the phone and he was so

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Speaker 1: gracious about it, but he's like, really, like your western

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Speaker 1: Massachusetts coming to Harvard. That's not and and and they

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Speaker 1: did a good job recruiting me. I just maybe I

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Speaker 1: was naive. I don't regret it for a minute. It

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Speaker 1: was the best decision for me. I met my wife,

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Speaker 1: your unbelievable teammates who are lifelong friends, and um, I'm

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Speaker 1: probably not the coach at Brown if I didn't play here,

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Speaker 1: no question, no question. And it's it's always interesting on

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Speaker 1: how I don't know if high school kids understand how

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Speaker 1: big a decision that is and how it's aid. I

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Speaker 1: remember as a kid, choose your own adventure books. No, okay,

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Speaker 1: there's like a lot about dragons, and I hated to read.

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Speaker 1: And I remember, like in fourth grade or fifth grade

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Speaker 1: or something, it took me to a reading specialist and

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Speaker 1: they turned me onto these choose your own adventure books

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Speaker 1: and it was basically, you get to the end of

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Speaker 1: the page and you had to make one of three

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Speaker 1: decisions and the book would be turned to page ten.

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Speaker 1: If you want this at age fifteen, you want this right,

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Speaker 1: and it would the book would change based upon what

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Speaker 1: decision you made. And that's kind of how life is,

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Speaker 1: especially picking a college, right, It's where your best friends,

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Speaker 1: probably your spouse when you need a job. Those are

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Speaker 1: the people that lums that you're going to count on.

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Speaker 1: Wherever that is, that's where you're probably gonna live. You know,

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Speaker 1: Brown is a fascinating place because it's in the IVY League.

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Speaker 1: But I guarantee it's like the it's still probably the

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Speaker 1: least known, right, It's it really is. It's said, and

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Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not in any way trying to be

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Speaker 1: disrespectful like I but like you said, like what are

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Speaker 1: the ivylis goes like, oh, Princeton, Harvard Yale, you know,

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Speaker 1: like Princeton, Harvard, Yale, and then oh yeah, Pen's in

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Speaker 1: the IVYLA man who else? You know, Court Court Cornell.

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Speaker 1: I know it's beautiful. They get the Bridge. They've got

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Speaker 1: some other issues there, Okay, they got Dartmouth, which is

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Speaker 1: like the big party school out the middle of nowhere, right,

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Speaker 1: and they're like, who am I forgetting? Who am I forgetting?

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Speaker 1: Who am I forgetting? Forgetting Brown? Um, you're so you

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Speaker 1: show up a Brown, you're a freshman. What's Brown like

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Speaker 1: as a university? Yeah, it's it's an awesome place. I

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Speaker 1: mean we always every year, Doug. We always are you know,

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Speaker 1: either one or two or three. And these all these

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Speaker 1: surveys of who has the happiest students, who are the

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Speaker 1: happiest college students? A lot of it is because we

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Speaker 1: have an open curriculum. There's no required courses at Brown.

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Speaker 1: You there are zero core classes, zero requirements. So like

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Speaker 1: my thing in recruits is this, you never be in

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Speaker 1: a class you don't want to be in at Brown. Uh.

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Speaker 1: No one's gonna tell you have to take this class

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Speaker 1: to fill fulfilled requirement. Uh. It's it's an awesome place. Uh.

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Speaker 1: Unbelievable faculty. Um and really focused on the undergraduate experience.

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Speaker 1: We have a few men. Uh you know, we have

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Speaker 1: a big medical school. We have a few graduate programs,

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Speaker 1: but much more focused on undergrad When I was a freshman,

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Speaker 1: my eyes were literally opened. I had no I didn't

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Speaker 1: know what Wall Street was, I didn't know what Goldman

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Speaker 1: Sachs was. I didn't know any of those things. And

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Speaker 1: now the guys and girls I'm going to school with

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Speaker 1: are getting these jobs, these internships and all these amazing opportunities.

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Speaker 1: But I was focused on playing hoops. Uh, Coach Miller.

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Speaker 1: I was part of his first recruiting class. He took

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Speaker 1: over a program that didn't have a ton of success.

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Speaker 1: I had a chance to play early. I started as

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Speaker 1: a freshman, and you know I had great teammates. Earl

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Speaker 1: Hunts are all time leading scorer. He was a year

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Speaker 1: ahead of me. He's now a partner at Goldman Sachs,

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Speaker 1: the trustee of the university. Um, you know, just when

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Speaker 1: to school with unbelievable people. Uh, with my closest friends

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Speaker 1: to this day. And um, you know we uh we

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Speaker 1: had some success. We had four straight winning seasons, the

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Speaker 1: first time that ever happened in school history. We went

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Speaker 1: to the n i T my junior year, we went

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Speaker 1: twelve and two. Brand Dumphy's team at Penn went fourteen

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Speaker 1: and oh we lost a two close games to them.

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00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:24,879
Speaker 1: The second was that when they had when they had Jerome,

425
00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:26,919
Speaker 1: No so Jerome's a little bit older me. They had

426
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:29,399
Speaker 1: you got on Nick Way coach Archer Bond, Andy Toole,

427
00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 1: the head coach at Robert Morris. They were they were

428
00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:35,000
Speaker 1: really good. Um was a good player and a good

429
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,400
Speaker 1: key and a good coach. And then I think that

430
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:41,640
Speaker 1: team lost to Oklahoma State. They did in OH three

431
00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:45,040
Speaker 1: exactly right in Boston. So that team at Penn won

432
00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:46,480
Speaker 1: the Big Five. There were four and no in the

433
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,600
Speaker 1: Philadelphia Big Five. They went fourteen and know in our

434
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 1: league we lost to him by three in a game

435
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 1: here at Brown, Chris Berman came in and introduced the

436
00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:56,760
Speaker 1: starting line ups from the balcony he had a place

437
00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:00,560
Speaker 1: electric and I still say we were ten and one.

438
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:02,920
Speaker 1: They were eleven and all or whatever it was. They

439
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:05,120
Speaker 1: had zero losses. We had one going into the game.

440
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:07,919
Speaker 1: I tore my a c L the week before, uh

441
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:09,680
Speaker 1: and I still say if I had played, we would

442
00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,000
Speaker 1: have at least tied for the title thirteen and one

443
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 1: for one game playoff. And I'll argue that with anybody,

444
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,480
Speaker 1: But unfortunately can't go back and untear my a c O.

445
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:24,720
Speaker 1: What for somebody who experienced it at its peak? What

446
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,119
Speaker 1: was the poluster like to play? And as a visiting player.

447
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,439
Speaker 1: So I went through my first game ever as not

448
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:32,280
Speaker 1: my first game, but my first time ever being in

449
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,320
Speaker 1: the plus row. Was my freshman year. Again, they didn't

450
00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,040
Speaker 1: recruit me. So I went there and played them, and

451
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,960
Speaker 1: we had just lost the tight win the Princeton the

452
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,640
Speaker 1: Friday night, and we came out there and played them,

453
00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:44,360
Speaker 1: and I fell in love with It's an awesome place.

454
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:48,119
Speaker 1: I was fortunately coached there for six years. UM my

455
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:50,119
Speaker 1: junior year, we went down there and we were on

456
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:52,040
Speaker 1: defeeded in the league. They were undefeeding in the league.

457
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 1: The place was sold out. It was what was what

458
00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 1: was on the rollout side? That's the big question. What

459
00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:58,440
Speaker 1: was on the rollout side when you guys came down there.

460
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,679
Speaker 1: All I've remember is I had a little goatee and

461
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:06,160
Speaker 1: they were killing me from my gotee. And I don't

462
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: remember the rollout, but I remember them being all over

463
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 1: me from my goateee. And I don't think I've ever

464
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:16,240
Speaker 1: grown facial hair since because of um have we lost

465
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:20,359
Speaker 1: some of that? It feels like like, look, you and

466
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:22,919
Speaker 1: I we we love the sport, and we love the

467
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 1: college sport. And I have my own thoughts on on

468
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 1: the negative influences of that sport of the sport. But

469
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 1: I do feel like and I hate being that guy

470
00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:39,360
Speaker 1: like back in my day, but and maybe even previous

471
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,639
Speaker 1: to me, but in that area, like it was better,

472
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:46,080
Speaker 1: the fan interaction was better because the games weren't all

473
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:49,520
Speaker 1: on TV. I would say it's part of it. Um.

474
00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:52,200
Speaker 1: The transferring I think really hurts it because you don't

475
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:57,359
Speaker 1: know like they who I have no emotional investment in

476
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:01,200
Speaker 1: uh in a lot of these players, um, And I

477
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,359
Speaker 1: think that not just the transfer, but guys so many

478
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 1: have have come and gone to the NBA or two

479
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:09,679
Speaker 1: what they think is greener pastures. But even for the

480
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:15,080
Speaker 1: IVY League, which um, the talent I believe is better

481
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:20,120
Speaker 1: now or over the last ten years, Harvard changing what

482
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:22,960
Speaker 1: they changed in order to and Tommy getting in there

483
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:26,520
Speaker 1: and recruiting a higher level has raised everybody like you've

484
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 1: had you had Desmond Cambers. I guess a big time

485
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:32,120
Speaker 1: that kid can play for instance, that kids can play,

486
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,359
Speaker 1: you know, like it's the whole level of the league

487
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 1: is great. But I don't feel like there's the same

488
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:43,400
Speaker 1: passion at a pen at a princeton Um that there

489
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:45,800
Speaker 1: used to be. And of course that's the trickle down

490
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:47,879
Speaker 1: from the It's not the same at the big boys.

491
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:50,560
Speaker 1: Am I wrong? You experience it obviously this year I

492
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 1: want to get into But do you feel like the

493
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:57,399
Speaker 1: the fandom the home court environments has has changed for

494
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,480
Speaker 1: the worst over the past five years or so. That's

495
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 1: a great question, and I have to give it more thought.

496
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: I mean, everyone has so many other options to do

497
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 1: with their you know, with their time now. I mean,

498
00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:08,960
Speaker 1: like it's when we played in the late nineties, early

499
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:11,600
Speaker 1: two thousands, there was no not as many options for

500
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 1: college students. So like I think there's still a big

501
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:16,600
Speaker 1: game on a college campus. I still don't think there's

502
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:20,200
Speaker 1: anything like it, but the consistency of uh, sellout crowds

503
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 1: and passion, um, you know, in our league. Um, yeah,

504
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:26,200
Speaker 1: it's probably a little different. I'm I can't say you're

505
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 1: wrong for sure, but like you know, we've had you know,

506
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 1: we've had some great crowds here. We've averaged more people

507
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 1: in the last couple of years because we've been good

508
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 1: than ever before. So um, you know, we've got to

509
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:38,399
Speaker 1: make it an event. Like I think, as a coach

510
00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:40,800
Speaker 1: at a college program, if you want, like you got

511
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 1: to make it an event on your campus, and you

512
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:45,080
Speaker 1: have to get everyone involved. And we say all the time.

513
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,000
Speaker 1: When we went our next IVY title and we only

514
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,480
Speaker 1: have one in our program history, and that was six

515
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 1: but when we do it, it's gonna be everyone. It's

516
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:54,360
Speaker 1: gonna be the community, it's gonna be the students, it's

517
00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:57,119
Speaker 1: gonna be the president, the a D, the donors, that fans, everyone,

518
00:26:57,119 --> 00:26:59,879
Speaker 1: because that's what it's gonna take, and we want everyone

519
00:26:59,880 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 1: to kind of be feel that ownership. And since that,

520
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 1: Doug so like, come on, it's an event. We're gonna

521
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 1: You know, we've got Yale, they won the league last year,

522
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:11,639
Speaker 1: and we we've done a fairly good job of creating

523
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,679
Speaker 1: some momentum and some excitement here at Brown. Um, but

524
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 1: I I can't tell you. I can't say you're wrong. Um.

525
00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:24,439
Speaker 1: You you get done playing and now you're like, okay,

526
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 1: now what do I do? Right? Obviously you have a

527
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:30,120
Speaker 1: Brown degree. Um, you got a scar in your needed

528
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,040
Speaker 1: to show for your time there, became a very good

529
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 1: starting point guard. You went and played in Ireland for

530
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,600
Speaker 1: a year. Right, what was that experience? What was that experience? Like,

531
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: so I was a two guard. I wasn't. I didn't

532
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:43,960
Speaker 1: handle it well enough to play point But uh yeah,

533
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 1: so I I interviewed you know I did, like, you know,

534
00:27:46,640 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 1: my my best I just told you my one of

535
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: my best friends and former teammates is now a partner

536
00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:53,440
Speaker 1: of Goldman Sachs. You know, I see him and all

537
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 1: these other folks getting these great internships, these great jobs.

538
00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 1: Uh So I interviewed and I accepted a job with

539
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 1: a bootie investment bank called Adams Harkness and Hill. I

540
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: was gonna go work for them in Boston. I got

541
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 1: the job offering like November December of my senior year,

542
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,840
Speaker 1: which I was, you know, really excited about. And then

543
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 1: the season ended. We had another good year my senior year,

544
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:15,400
Speaker 1: not quite as good as my junior year were when

545
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:17,119
Speaker 1: we were twelve and two, but we finished ten and

546
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 1: four in the league's second place. And I'm like, you know,

547
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,200
Speaker 1: I know I'm not gonna make a lot of money playing,

548
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 1: but I gotta keep playing. I just I wanted to

549
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:28,920
Speaker 1: keep playing. I did it, had a great experience, and um,

550
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,600
Speaker 1: you know, turned down the job in investment banking. I

551
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 1: never forget calling the firm. It was a couple of

552
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,400
Speaker 1: Brown former Brown football players who you know, we're partners

553
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:38,520
Speaker 1: at the firm, and helped me get the opportunity, and

554
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,000
Speaker 1: I thank them, but told him I had to pursue this,

555
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 1: and and uh then I came back and coach Millard

556
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: offered me a job to be an assistant coach at

557
00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,440
Speaker 1: Brown volunteer assistant coach. But I was gonna be an

558
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,000
Speaker 1: assistant coach. I was gonna be on the court. I

559
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: was gonna be on the road recruiting twenty two years old,

560
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 1: about to turn twenty three, and I didn't need to

561
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 1: make any money and it was the best. You know,

562
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 1: so many people started as gas or administrative. I started

563
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,360
Speaker 1: as an assistant coach at the Division one level, recruiting

564
00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 1: nationally and uh it got me a great start into

565
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:10,720
Speaker 1: the coaching professional. Where did you live making no money?

566
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 1: I lived in a little apartment on the east side

567
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 1: of Providence, like on the third floor of UH. A

568
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:20,480
Speaker 1: donor at an alumni house. He let me live up there.

569
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 1: But my my girlfriend at the time was in Boston,

570
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,120
Speaker 1: so I probably she's now my wife. I probably spent

571
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:27,840
Speaker 1: more time up there than I did down in Province. Uh.

572
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: Providence is a really cool and kind of unique, underrated

573
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:37,440
Speaker 1: city for somebody who hasn't been, Like, you come to town,

574
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 1: go here to eat. Where's the place? Gosh, there's so

575
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 1: many I know. I would tell you, Sienna, you have

576
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 1: to go to Federal Hill, Federal Hills like you know,

577
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: little little really um, but like you can get it all.

578
00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 1: Seafood Italian Um, you can get a great steak downtown.

579
00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 1: I'd go to Sienna and Federal Hill. Um. There's there's

580
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 1: so many good options. The city of Providence. It's big

581
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:03,120
Speaker 1: and off that you know, you can have a great food,

582
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,360
Speaker 1: great theater, great um. You know, places to go out

583
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 1: and shop and have fun. But like every almost every

584
00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: town in the state, and you can get within him

585
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 1: with you can get anywhere in the state within an hour.

586
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,440
Speaker 1: There's no two points in our state that are more

587
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:21,200
Speaker 1: than one hour away. But there's so many unbelievable beach

588
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,880
Speaker 1: communities here. It's two doug And in summertime, Newport and

589
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:27,440
Speaker 1: Arrogance it Westerly. Uh. It's an awesome place to live

590
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 1: and it's a really under underrated part of our country. Um. Okay,

591
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 1: so ah, how did you get the job? Well? Uh,

592
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 1: our r A D. Jack Hayes, who has actually just

593
00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 1: uh you know, left to pursue uh other professional opportunities.

594
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:50,800
Speaker 1: He was just hired. He was the a D at

595
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:54,480
Speaker 1: Hofstra before coming to Brown two thousand twelve. I coached

596
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 1: a guy you know well, Zach Rosen, who was an

597
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:58,600
Speaker 1: awesome point guard at Penn and he was Big five

598
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:00,040
Speaker 1: and Ivy League Player of the Year and he he

599
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 1: helped us have a great season. He led us to

600
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 1: a great season. Jerome Allen was our head coach at

601
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 1: Penn and Dan Lee Vivitz was on the staff. We had.

602
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 1: We had a great staff staff. Right, Dan becomes ahead,

603
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: Dan becomes a head coach. I mean, Jerome is a

604
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,080
Speaker 1: legend the league. And you become a head coach off

605
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:19,640
Speaker 1: that staff. And we know anybody was that uh any

606
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 1: Zack knows he had an incredible career. Um, okay, so good,

607
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Prior to that. John Gallagher who's the head

608
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:30,400
Speaker 1: coach at Hartford was Harvard. Yeah, so crazy. Um and

609
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 1: uh so anyways to Hartford on one staff, that's right,

610
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 1: that's right. Uh well, so they were never on the

611
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,239
Speaker 1: staff at the same time. But it is interesting, right

612
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 1: Harvard hired two guys essentially have the same staff, one

613
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:46,720
Speaker 1: to replaced the other. When when Dan, when when Dan

614
00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 1: decided I've had enough. It was amazing And the and

615
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 1: the funny thing is so Steve Donny, who after the

616
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,080
Speaker 1: Sweet sixteen at Cornell got to Boston College job. John

617
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:56,200
Speaker 1: Gallagher was gonna leave Penn to become an assistant at

618
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 1: Boston College. When John left Penn, then Dan was interested

619
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: coming back to Philadelphia and you know helping Jerome and

620
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 1: our staff, and that opened the vacancy at Hartford. But yeah,

621
00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 1: small world, crazy uh crazy story. Um, the job was

622
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: when I was twenty nine years old. We had had success,

623
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: like I said, at Penn the last couple of years,

624
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: and uh, you know I was along. I knew pretty much.

625
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: You know, I had a little bit of a relationship

626
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 1: with Jack Hayes. Not much you had just come from Hofstra,

627
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:24,760
Speaker 1: but we knew a lot of mutual people and uh,

628
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:26,720
Speaker 1: you know, there was a lot of people involved. I

629
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 1: think you know, Jack listened to that, knew me, and

630
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 1: you know, knew the type of person I was, uh

631
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,479
Speaker 1: you know, my acumen as a coach and hopefully ability

632
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: to lead. And here we are eight and a half

633
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 1: years later. Okay, so eight and a half years ago,

634
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 1: Like taking over an IVY league is not like taking

635
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,680
Speaker 1: over anywhere else, right, It's not just you know, like

636
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 1: you can't go like I'm gonna get really these sucking

637
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:51,400
Speaker 1: dudes and I'm gonna get some new dudes, and we're

638
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 1: gonna get some juicos and some transfers and let's roll

639
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 1: right you kinda this is what you got, and then

640
00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:59,560
Speaker 1: you gotta go recruit, and you know, you go back

641
00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 1: and eight and years ago, Um, you know, the landscape

642
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 1: of the league was dramatically different. Um okay, so what

643
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,600
Speaker 1: do you remember about your first year in terms of Okay,

644
00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 1: now you're setting your own practice plans, you're setting your

645
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 1: own recruiting. Um, you're telling your you have to hire

646
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 1: a stop but the budget budget constraints. You also have

647
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 1: to be realistic, not not just with grades for the

648
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 1: IBY League, but there are kids in the IVY League

649
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: who is They're not going to consider brown, right, They're

650
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,120
Speaker 1: just not. So there's the it's not an easy job

651
00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 1: when you first take it over and you have your

652
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 1: current players that are there before that you're not running

653
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 1: off like you don't run off dudes in the idea, right,

654
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:45,720
Speaker 1: what what what's that first year? Like? Yes, so I

655
00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 1: was hired June one, So like you can't even get

656
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 1: recruits in late because admissions timelines and even transfers couldn't

657
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:54,640
Speaker 1: come because the emissions transferre admission deadline in the past.

658
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:56,760
Speaker 1: So it was like I was hired. My press conference

659
00:33:56,760 --> 00:34:00,080
Speaker 1: was June one, and the guys that were left that

660
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 1: that was my team. And I was so fortunate. I

661
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 1: inherited great kids, good talent, um, just not a ton

662
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: of depth. We had ten guys on our roster the

663
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:11,839
Speaker 1: first year. Um, you know, just through through you know,

664
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 1: a couple of different reasons. We had ten guys on

665
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:18,239
Speaker 1: the roster. Once we started getting going, and um, we

666
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 1: we we we thought we had a good year, would

667
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 1: beat Providence College at home. We went seven and seven

668
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:23,839
Speaker 1: in the IVY League. We finished in fourth. We beat

669
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:26,880
Speaker 1: Princeton at the end of the season. If Princeton had won,

670
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 1: they would have tied with Harvard for the IVY title,

671
00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:30,520
Speaker 1: and we ended up beating him. So you know, Harvard

672
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,359
Speaker 1: wanted out right. Uh, those guys, I had no idea

673
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,200
Speaker 1: what I was doing. Um, I you know, thought I

674
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 1: knew everything like all assistants do. And you know what

675
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,759
Speaker 1: I asked those guys to do, they did it. They

676
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 1: did it with unbelievable passion and spirit, and they did

677
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 1: it with great chemistry. And uh, you know, we we

678
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:50,719
Speaker 1: They made me look like I knew what I was

679
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:56,640
Speaker 1: doing and uh, you know, recruiting God so offensively. Okay,

680
00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,200
Speaker 1: every assistant who sits there is like, man, I get

681
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:01,399
Speaker 1: my shot, Like we're gonna we're gonna do this. We're

682
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:03,719
Speaker 1: gonna you know, we're gonna play. Everybody wants to play fast, right,

683
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 1: whoever sits, no matter who I guess. I'm guessing whoever

684
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,040
Speaker 1: sat in the little Mirrymounts bench. You know, I was thinking,

685
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 1: we're gonna play even faster, like everybody wants to play

686
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: faster than you get in charge, Like, holy ship, we

687
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,359
Speaker 1: play fast, we might just get just get run out

688
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:19,600
Speaker 1: of this gym. And again, you had you had played,

689
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,279
Speaker 1: and you'd played a certain style you've been assistant, which

690
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 1: is a little bit different style with with Drone specifically obviously,

691
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:29,200
Speaker 1: and then you've grown up with your dad who had

692
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: his specific style. How did you your first year? What'd

693
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:34,359
Speaker 1: your run? Did you say, hey, let's run the same

694
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 1: ship you guys have been running. Did you putting your

695
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 1: own stuff? What you do? Yeah? No, I I put

696
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,240
Speaker 1: I put in my stuff. We did play. We played

697
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: slow though, because we had ten guys, and I was like,

698
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:48,680
Speaker 1: we gotta if we're gonna win, which we want to win.

699
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: We don't you know, we want to build good habits

700
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:53,640
Speaker 1: and we want to start winning right away. I thought

701
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:55,799
Speaker 1: we had to play low possession games like no matter

702
00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 1: who we were playing against. And I think we were

703
00:35:57,239 --> 00:35:59,399
Speaker 1: one of the slowest temple teams in the country that year.

704
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: And we defended you really well, you know, man to man,

705
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: we we we were very good defensively, and we were

706
00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:07,960
Speaker 1: good enough offensively. We had a couple of really good guards,

707
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:09,880
Speaker 1: the first team all ivy guard and then a second

708
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:12,560
Speaker 1: team all Ivy two guard and you know, we we

709
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:15,279
Speaker 1: just ran a lot of sets that flowed into like

710
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 1: a four hour one in motion, and guys shared it. Um.

711
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:21,359
Speaker 1: You know, we played through the low posts quite a bit.

712
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:24,120
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, but we played slow. It was

713
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: like the opposite of what every new coach says. And

714
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:28,279
Speaker 1: I probably said it my press conferents, we're gonna play fact. Sure,

715
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 1: I'm sure what you recruiting like, we want to play fast.

716
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: I never forget. So Kevin O'Neil was at Tennessee right

717
00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:38,319
Speaker 1: and and Lawrence Frank was his assistant. And I don't

718
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:39,359
Speaker 1: know if you, I don't know if you ever got

719
00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:41,320
Speaker 1: recruited by those guys, but they used to just carpet

720
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:45,239
Speaker 1: bombing with and so I'm sitting out after playing Utre Dame.

721
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 1: And one of my frustrations in playing for coach McLeod

722
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 1: was we didn't have an organized secondary break. He just

723
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: didn't which most people don't have now they just run,

724
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 1: you know, transition drag screens whenever. But even that we

725
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:58,960
Speaker 1: didn't really do. And you know, like I was much

726
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:00,560
Speaker 1: better than that open court it that I was in

727
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 1: the half court. And so I was committed to whoever

728
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:05,840
Speaker 1: I wherever I go, like I gotta we gotta be

729
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:07,880
Speaker 1: able to play faster because I just I'm not that

730
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:10,200
Speaker 1: good in half court. I'll never forget there. Send me

731
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:12,479
Speaker 1: like every day, like we want you and we're gonna

732
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 1: do this. And we got Vincent Yark, you know, we

733
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 1: got Yarboro. We got these guys. And I turned and

734
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:19,080
Speaker 1: it was like this first year maybe at Tennessee and

735
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 1: I turn on the TV and they're playing Kentucky and

736
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:27,000
Speaker 1: they had like eleven points at the half right and

737
00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:30,759
Speaker 1: they're just holding the ball and playing slow. Now, the

738
00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:33,520
Speaker 1: all you had to say in reality was like, hey,

739
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:35,480
Speaker 1: these guys are very good. I need good players to

740
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:38,399
Speaker 1: play fast. You know, we gotta shorten this thing, but

741
00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:40,239
Speaker 1: it was it was in the sale that was I

742
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:42,759
Speaker 1: was just I was blown away, like it was one

743
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,000
Speaker 1: of the It's like in football you have this as

744
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:49,279
Speaker 1: a broadcast. Every defensive coordinator that's ever been higher at

745
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 1: the press conference says, we're gonna be aggressive, We're gonna

746
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:53,920
Speaker 1: we're gonna blitz more. Right. If that was the case,

747
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: by two one, he will be blitzing every down. Right,

748
00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 1: there was just eleven guys the last scriments. It's not

749
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:00,919
Speaker 1: the reality of it, but that's what people want to hear.

750
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:04,000
Speaker 1: What did you learn? What did you What did you learn?

751
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 1: Like you really smart coaches learn from things, learn from

752
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,560
Speaker 1: personal experience. But remember learning from your first year, Well

753
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,720
Speaker 1: so I probably learned it more so the last, uh,

754
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 1: you know, over the next of course, the next few years.

755
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 1: It's just how how fortunate I was like to inherit

756
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:22,840
Speaker 1: the group that I had, and I made so many mistakes. Um,

757
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:27,920
Speaker 1: you know as a young coach. Um, you know, I

758
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 1: think I learned, you know, I've I've definitely learned over

759
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 1: the last eight years who's right for us and the

760
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:34,479
Speaker 1: right type of kids that are going to thrive under

761
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 1: the way we want to play. Right, are kind of

762
00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 1: guys exactly right, say it again. I like that I'm

763
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 1: gonna use that kind of guy. But yeah, you know,

764
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 1: I think we you know, we've we've definitely involved and

765
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:50,520
Speaker 1: we figured out you know how we wanna, you know

766
00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,080
Speaker 1: how we wanna. You know what our values are, you

767
00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,000
Speaker 1: know what we want to You know, you can't stand

768
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 1: for everything. Like early on, I thought we're gonna do

769
00:38:57,480 --> 00:39:00,080
Speaker 1: you know, all these different things offensively, defensively, Doug, and

770
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: you know you get to maybe one third of it,

771
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like you you have a

772
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:05,600
Speaker 1: great plan going in and you probably can only put

773
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:07,560
Speaker 1: in one third of the things you you expect to

774
00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 1: put in. So uh learned that I want to be

775
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:12,840
Speaker 1: really good at a few things that really matter. And

776
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:16,319
Speaker 1: you know the other thing, Yeah, we're gonna play play hard,

777
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 1: like like we're gonna compete, and we want guys who

778
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:23,000
Speaker 1: are willing to battle through some adversity. We want to, uh,

779
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 1: you know, be very good defensively. Our last couple of

780
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: years we've been either one or two in the IVY

781
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 1: League and defensive efficiency. And you know that that's kind

782
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:35,439
Speaker 1: of been through through experience, Like we've learned through having

783
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:38,440
Speaker 1: some bad defensive teams here Brown, We've learned through having

784
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,680
Speaker 1: some guys that maybe as hard as they worked, weren't

785
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: ever going to be the best defenders for us. So

786
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:45,719
Speaker 1: we're gonna play hard, we're gonna share the ball, we're

787
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 1: gonna defend, and you know, I want to I want

788
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:50,120
Speaker 1: to coach guys who are willing to battle through. Uh.

789
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 1: You know it's not you. You know how it is.

790
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 1: And you know, in our league or the Big Twelve

791
00:39:54,520 --> 00:39:57,000
Speaker 1: or the Pact, whatever league you're playing, you're gonna face

792
00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:58,920
Speaker 1: some tough moments and you know, you get to have

793
00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:02,360
Speaker 1: a certain type of uh values and standards that if

794
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:06,399
Speaker 1: you're gonna pull through. I want to ask you more

795
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 1: off off recording. But I do think like the Desmond

796
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:12,439
Speaker 1: Cambridge story is the perfect embodiment of the battle at

797
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 1: your level of basketball. Like you found a kid, super talented,

798
00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:19,759
Speaker 1: good grades, you play him right away, the averages went

799
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:21,560
Speaker 1: eighteen a game for you as a sophomores and All

800
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:25,239
Speaker 1: Ivy League kid, and then he leaves in transfers. I

801
00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: guess upper level, Uh, if you will, what's that like

802
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 1: to experience? Like it? It's the lad I found you,

803
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,680
Speaker 1: fostered your growth, built the thing around you. Things were

804
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:40,880
Speaker 1: going good and now you're gone. I like, everybody has

805
00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:42,360
Speaker 1: you have the ability and he's you know, you have

806
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 1: the ability to do so, but what is that like

807
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 1: from your perspective? Yes, so we how about this? So

808
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 1: we found out about dez uh who's from Nashville, Tennessee.

809
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:53,000
Speaker 1: And there's a guy who played not for my father

810
00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:56,759
Speaker 1: but against my father from Springfield, mass who called my

811
00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:58,640
Speaker 1: father and said are you going in relation to the

812
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:01,520
Speaker 1: coach at Brown, Mike Martin Brown. And so anyways, long

813
00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:04,319
Speaker 1: story short, they send the video. You know, my father says,

814
00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 1: I'm sure the kids not any good. But you know,

815
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: the guy wants me to send the video. I said

816
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,040
Speaker 1: send it. We looked at it and we're like, yeah,

817
00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:13,440
Speaker 1: he's really good. And so we recruited him. We're so

818
00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:16,360
Speaker 1: fortunate that that we got him. Uh And you know,

819
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:19,800
Speaker 1: I'm I'm grateful. Like Desmond was a very good players

820
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:21,920
Speaker 1: rookie year in our league. He was an All ivy player.

821
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:23,920
Speaker 1: He helped us win twenty games. That was the first

822
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:26,799
Speaker 1: time in two thousand and eighteen nineteen that Brown had

823
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 1: ever won twenty games in the season. Doug, I think

824
00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: we were the last Vision one program to ever win

825
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:34,359
Speaker 1: twenty games, So he helped us, uh you know, create

826
00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:36,440
Speaker 1: some of the momentum. We still feel really good about.

827
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:38,719
Speaker 1: He made a decision that he felt was best for him,

828
00:41:38,719 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 1: and we support him and you know, I've been watching

829
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 1: him and following him, and he's playing great for Nevada

830
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,480
Speaker 1: right now. But he was part of the you know,

831
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,239
Speaker 1: like the last two years, we've won more games that

832
00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 1: than has ever been one in school history, thirty five games.

833
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,080
Speaker 1: Uh des was a huge part of that. And you

834
00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:57,320
Speaker 1: know what, he also helped with us getting other recruits

835
00:41:57,360 --> 00:41:59,560
Speaker 1: because they saw him and how good he was. And

836
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:00,879
Speaker 1: I was like, I want to go play a round

837
00:42:00,920 --> 00:42:03,640
Speaker 1: two because if that guy thinks Brown is the right place,

838
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 1: then I can do that. So um, you know, like

839
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:08,239
Speaker 1: I thought this year, if we played, would have been

840
00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:10,880
Speaker 1: the best team I've ever coached. Uh In Desmond is

841
00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:13,560
Speaker 1: a huge part of building that. Um okay, last thing,

842
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:15,759
Speaker 1: so you didn't have you finally have an IVY League

843
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 1: tournament only that got canceled last year, right and now

844
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:22,200
Speaker 1: you haven't had a season, and at the time of

845
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 1: this recording, you just got your first chance to work

846
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:30,520
Speaker 1: guys out, first chance all years since last March, right.

847
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:32,879
Speaker 1: I know you you gotta go. You got other things.

848
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,320
Speaker 1: I respect that. It's great to be back at the gym.

849
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:40,239
Speaker 1: First question, what you've been doing. Man, I've spent a

850
00:42:40,239 --> 00:42:42,200
Speaker 1: ton of time in my family, my wife, Kristen. I

851
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:45,919
Speaker 1: have three daughters, Kira's nine, Avery's eight, Tea and six. Uh,

852
00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:48,160
Speaker 1: you know, been coaching them in the street, you know,

853
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:50,719
Speaker 1: when the weather is good. I've been doing drop off

854
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:53,040
Speaker 1: and pick up every day at school. Uh. It's just

855
00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:54,719
Speaker 1: trying to stay connected to our players, you know. I

856
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:56,440
Speaker 1: think that's your biggest role as a coach, you know.

857
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:57,800
Speaker 1: And the hardest thing is when you're not in the

858
00:42:57,840 --> 00:42:59,960
Speaker 1: gym with him every day. You can't take him to lunch,

859
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:02,759
Speaker 1: you can't you know, just go, you know, hang out

860
00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 1: with him in the locker room. That's the hardest thing.

861
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:06,759
Speaker 1: So try to stay connected with them however we can.

862
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:09,520
Speaker 1: With the technology we have now, I've been watching more

863
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: basketball than ever before, you know, NBA, College, some European things,

864
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,200
Speaker 1: and you know, like I joked with some donors on

865
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:18,600
Speaker 1: a call the other night, I was like, we're gonna

866
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 1: be the most over coached team in the history of

867
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:23,880
Speaker 1: basketball next year because I have all these great ideas. Obviously,

868
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 1: we gotta figure out what's good for us and what

869
00:43:25,600 --> 00:43:28,600
Speaker 1: fits our personnel. Um, but that's some of it. And

870
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 1: but today, like you said February four, it's the best.

871
00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 1: I mean, just to be able to drive in this morning.

872
00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:36,520
Speaker 1: We had an eight am workout. We're in there all morning,

873
00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:39,879
Speaker 1: we're getting ready to go back out there. Uh, it's

874
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:42,480
Speaker 1: it's it was just such a great feeling. And you know,

875
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 1: I'll never take for granted again, you know, just being

876
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:46,840
Speaker 1: in the gym, here in the sneaker squeak, here in

877
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:49,560
Speaker 1: the ball bounce, because uh, like you said, we weren't

878
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:53,160
Speaker 1: in there since March seven. That's that's amazing. Okay, I

879
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:55,880
Speaker 1: know you gotta go, but I got one more for you.

880
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 1: Give me something to learn. You're watching a ton of

881
00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:02,120
Speaker 1: ball something that like because so much. Tom Brandon is

882
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:04,600
Speaker 1: a dear friend of mine, right and TB was, of

883
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 1: course eighteen years a head coached Vermont, and I'll never

884
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:11,360
Speaker 1: forget when he was working with us at ESPN. You

885
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:13,759
Speaker 1: know he would pull you aside, go my boy, when

886
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 1: you're coaching the team, you don't worry about any of

887
00:44:16,280 --> 00:44:19,280
Speaker 1: these other teams. You worried about your team. And maybe

888
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:21,520
Speaker 1: even your league, like I don't, I don't know shit

889
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:23,520
Speaker 1: about it, Like you gotta help me out, Like you

890
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: want to talk about ball, about what it's like, like

891
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 1: I can, but you know, I'm solely focused on my guys.

892
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 1: So now you're focused on your guys, but also these

893
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:34,879
Speaker 1: other things, and it's just kind of an eye opening experience. Right.

894
00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 1: What's one thing that that you've learned that you really

895
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:41,359
Speaker 1: want to try and implement that you like. It can

896
00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:45,480
Speaker 1: be style of play, it can be anything, like I

897
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:47,719
Speaker 1: I that's one of the things that we do is

898
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:50,439
Speaker 1: we process things and try and implement them and things

899
00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:52,319
Speaker 1: we do like me even talking to you, I'm I

900
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:53,600
Speaker 1: know what I want to do with my kids when

901
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 1: I gotta practice tonight. One thing that you're going to

902
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:58,680
Speaker 1: try and implement that you've learned. So as in a

903
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:00,800
Speaker 1: quick aside, you know who are so of your head coaches?

904
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:07,839
Speaker 1: Right Brown, Yes, TJ, coach Brennan and T I mean

905
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 1: so coach Brennan is a dear friend of mine as well. Uh.

906
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 1: T J and I actually played on the same AU

907
00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:14,840
Speaker 1: team and Vermont was a school that recruited me. I

908
00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:18,359
Speaker 1: took a visit there, but I chose brown. Anyways, Uh,

909
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:21,760
Speaker 1: you know what, the biggest thing I've learned is um

910
00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 1: but by the way, by the way in best human

911
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:31,480
Speaker 1: beings on the planet. No, no, I gotta I know,

912
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:33,440
Speaker 1: you gotta go, and I want this, I want this answer.

913
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 1: But this is my this is my first TV story.

914
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:39,960
Speaker 1: So I hadn't I hadn't covered him before, and they

915
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:42,759
Speaker 1: had the year before they lost to be You in

916
00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:46,840
Speaker 1: the conference Tournament championship at bu so Dave Revson and

917
00:45:46,920 --> 00:45:49,920
Speaker 1: I are covering. It's like the first college basketball televised

918
00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:53,080
Speaker 1: game whatever. Uh cop and Wrath is coming off like

919
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:54,759
Speaker 1: a broken wrist or something. We don't know if he

920
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:58,399
Speaker 1: was gonna play. And we roll into We roll into

921
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 1: Burlington and like the day before their biggest game ever

922
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:08,560
Speaker 1: on ESPN, he canceled practice, canceled practice, no practice. We

923
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:12,239
Speaker 1: get there, we're like, first practice, like TB canceled. So

924
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:15,440
Speaker 1: the next day we show up at the game and

925
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:18,040
Speaker 1: he's like, where were you? And I go, what do

926
00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:19,480
Speaker 1: you mean? It's like that was there. I don't know

927
00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:21,840
Speaker 1: what the restaurant is in town that he always Yeah,

928
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,359
Speaker 1: he was just we were like, well you didn't invite us?

929
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:27,759
Speaker 1: Who a bte you? Everybody knows I'm down there, Like,

930
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,879
Speaker 1: just ask anybody that's where I am. Right, Um, there

931
00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:34,920
Speaker 1: wasn't there wasn't a bill that he didn't pick up.

932
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:38,920
Speaker 1: There wasn't a time in which he had a bad day.

933
00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:42,239
Speaker 1: Like of the top ten human beings I've come into

934
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:44,920
Speaker 1: contact with in my life, Tom Brendon is absolutely on

935
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 1: that list. We could talk about him forever. T used

936
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:48,759
Speaker 1: to have his radio show every morning and it was

937
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:50,960
Speaker 1: like the highest rated radio show in Vermont, and he

938
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:53,040
Speaker 1: would call t J would tell stories. He'd call the

939
00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 1: guys at like six in the morning in their dorm

940
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 1: rooms and wake him up and you know, get him on,

941
00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:01,480
Speaker 1: get him on the show. But yeah, awesome, awesome guy. Um.

942
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:03,360
Speaker 1: But anyways, I would tell you this, I already hinted

943
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:05,480
Speaker 1: at it. The biggest thing I've learned, Like, We're not

944
00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 1: gonna I'm never gonna like, I'm never gonna take for

945
00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:11,439
Speaker 1: granted the opportunity to be with my guys like and

946
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:13,760
Speaker 1: and be in the gym and uh, you know, support

947
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:16,600
Speaker 1: them however I can. Obviously, we've seen so many awful

948
00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:18,960
Speaker 1: things happened in the last eleven months since we were

949
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:21,239
Speaker 1: on the court, right, and how can we support uh

950
00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:25,439
Speaker 1: these guys um as as their coaches. Technically, I would

951
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 1: tell you I've watched a lot of the spacing around

952
00:47:27,960 --> 00:47:31,600
Speaker 1: European uh, you know, especially in Spain. Uh, some of

953
00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:34,080
Speaker 1: the spacing they use in ball screens. And there's a

954
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:38,200
Speaker 1: guy Mancho Fernandez who coaches ober Dorio, and he runs

955
00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 1: like a four corner pick and roll offense, and you know,

956
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:42,720
Speaker 1: we're trying to look at that a little bit maybe

957
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:45,799
Speaker 1: add you know, some type of dribble drive aspects while

958
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:48,399
Speaker 1: still being able to get to some of the good

959
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:50,759
Speaker 1: off ball cutting and screening actions that we've always tried

960
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:53,920
Speaker 1: to do. Like Coach Miller was a motion offense, uh,

961
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:57,120
Speaker 1: you know type of guy, and you know we've tried

962
00:47:57,160 --> 00:47:59,680
Speaker 1: to do that. Played through the big at the low post,

963
00:47:59,680 --> 00:48:01,799
Speaker 1: play are big at the high closed pay, played through

964
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:02,840
Speaker 1: our big at the top of the key in a

965
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,600
Speaker 1: five out situation. Can we kind of fuse all that?

966
00:48:05,600 --> 00:48:08,359
Speaker 1: That's my that's kind of been my biggest project. And

967
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:10,640
Speaker 1: I think with our personnel, what we'll have next year

968
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:13,000
Speaker 1: if we can we confuse like a dribble drive with

969
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:15,399
Speaker 1: some spread pack and roll and you know, playing through

970
00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 1: our our big a different areas of the floor. Maybe

971
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:20,279
Speaker 1: we'll have a chance because our offense needs to get

972
00:48:20,320 --> 00:48:23,080
Speaker 1: a lot better. Well, listen, I'd like to get back

973
00:48:23,080 --> 00:48:25,000
Speaker 1: in the gym. I know how happy you are. I

974
00:48:25,040 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 1: do want at some point, if you have a moment,

975
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:30,840
Speaker 1: to do a pod on on some of those European

976
00:48:30,880 --> 00:48:32,920
Speaker 1: coaches and on some of the different aspects that it

977
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 1: might be a little technical to do in an audio conversation,

978
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,400
Speaker 1: but I don't know. I I dig it, and I

979
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: think if I dig it and you do, then there'll

980
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:44,279
Speaker 1: be enough. This pod is design for people who give

981
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:46,520
Speaker 1: a shit about hoop, right, And that's the whole idea

982
00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 1: about it. All right, that's all ball, all ball, all

983
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:53,399
Speaker 1: I could. I could talk ball any any time of day.

984
00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:55,320
Speaker 1: So you just let me know. I'm gonna tell you

985
00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:58,320
Speaker 1: this before you go. I gotta so. My My son's eleven.

986
00:48:58,400 --> 00:49:00,680
Speaker 1: He plays eleven U twelve year case plased thirteen. I

987
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:04,200
Speaker 1: got a thirteen YOUW team, and I sent out a

988
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:07,680
Speaker 1: text to the parents and I said, I got I

989
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 1: finally have a good team. I said, look, I don't

990
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:13,799
Speaker 1: think we'll win one of those elite level We're playing

991
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:15,840
Speaker 1: in a big tournament this weekend, the big one next weekend,

992
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:19,000
Speaker 1: like the gold level stuff I want to tournament. I

993
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:21,840
Speaker 1: was like, but what I want your kids to experience

994
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,759
Speaker 1: on the micro is what in the macro you experience

995
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:27,960
Speaker 1: in college ball, which is being a part of the team,

996
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:31,120
Speaker 1: being better as one than you are individually, right, sharing

997
00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:34,280
Speaker 1: the ball, sharing the success, even sharing the losses together

998
00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:37,480
Speaker 1: like that. Those kind of things are what what this

999
00:49:37,560 --> 00:49:40,120
Speaker 1: deal is about, you know, and we make it about

1000
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:42,080
Speaker 1: I think so many times the wrong things. To me,

1001
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:45,960
Speaker 1: that's the that's the right things. And I love how

1002
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:48,520
Speaker 1: I have seen your teams play, and I I like

1003
00:49:48,600 --> 00:49:52,399
Speaker 1: how your teams play, and I agree like evolving offensively.

1004
00:49:53,360 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 1: We expect players to evolve. Coaches got to evolve too.

1005
00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:57,120
Speaker 1: You can't just keep doing the same ship over and

1006
00:49:57,160 --> 00:50:00,359
Speaker 1: over again expecting a different result, no doubt out, Doug,

1007
00:50:00,360 --> 00:50:02,440
Speaker 1: thanks so much, great to be with you. Get back

1008
00:50:02,440 --> 00:50:05,120
Speaker 1: in the gym. Thanks man. Be sure to catch the

1009
00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:08,359
Speaker 1: live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at three

1010
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:12,120
Speaker 1: pm Easter noon Pacific. That was awesome. That was really

1011
00:50:12,160 --> 00:50:14,839
Speaker 1: interesting stuff. We'll have to have coach Martin back on.

1012
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,680
Speaker 1: We'll talk some XS and ose and some coaching a

1013
00:50:17,719 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 1: little more detailed things, but I thought that was just

1014
00:50:20,680 --> 00:50:23,560
Speaker 1: a fascinating talk. Hope you enjoyed it. Remember my show,

1015
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:26,120
Speaker 1: The Doug Gotlip Show three six Eastern twelve, three Pacific

1016
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:28,000
Speaker 1: on Fox Sport Tradio, Fox Sport Trade dot Com. You

1017
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:30,880
Speaker 1: can also download the pot if you want. In the meantime,

1018
00:50:31,040 --> 00:50:34,280
Speaker 1: if you have college basketball NBA questions, feel free tweet

1019
00:50:34,320 --> 00:50:36,920
Speaker 1: at me at Gottlieb Show. There's a guest you want on,

1020
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:41,280
Speaker 1: same thing, Same thing we got. We're backed up on people.

1021
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:44,680
Speaker 1: You're gonna love some of our upcoming episodes. Remember to subscribe,

1022
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 1: download and uh review and and write one of those comments,

1023
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:51,920
Speaker 1: hopefully a good one. There's a chance I get a

1024
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 1: little bit more money if it's a good comment. I

1025
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:56,720
Speaker 1: hope you enjoyed it. Thanks to Coach Martin. I'm Doug Gottlieb.

1026
00:50:56,760 --> 00:50:57,440
Speaker 1: This is all