Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: Marakoza lives nearly thirty miles outside of Johannesburg in South
Speaker 2: Africa's third largest township, Katlohong. She's thirty eight years old
Speaker 2: and pregnant. She lives in a community of more than
Speaker 2: four hundred thousand people, almost all of whom are black.
Speaker 2: Just over a quarter of them, including Mara, live in
Speaker 2: homes constructed out of corrugated iron sheets with no access
Speaker 2: to electricity.
Speaker 1: Oh Mara, cause.
Speaker 2: That's Mara speaking with Intando Thupuana, who covers economic and
Speaker 2: government affairs in South Africa for Bloomberg. She told in
Speaker 2: Tondo that for most of her life she's been a
Speaker 2: steady supporter of the African National Congress Party, the party
Speaker 2: of Nelson Mandela, which has led her country since nineteen
Speaker 2: ninety four. Mendela took power after a peaceful toppling of
Speaker 2: apartheid in South Africa when Mara was just eight years old.
Speaker 2: NaNs Mendela promised a better life under the ANC, access
Speaker 2: to healthcare, education and employment opportunities with.
Speaker 3: Blood ourselves to live people from the quantilian bounds of
Speaker 3: pavl deprivation.
Speaker 1: Jander and Art a discredation.
Speaker 2: Mara has the ANC party colors hanging in her window.
Speaker 2: Like so many South Africans, She's believed in the party
Speaker 2: for decades. It's won every election in South Africa since
Speaker 2: Mendela's initial victory. Its consistent majority has meant it could
Speaker 2: enact many of its reforms without much pushback. But that
Speaker 2: decades long majority for the ANC could be coming to
Speaker 2: an end now. Even voters like Mara are unsure. Next week,
Speaker 2: South Africans head into an election where the ANC's current leader,
Speaker 2: Cyril Ramaposa, is facing some stiff competition, which.
Speaker 1: Shows you the kind of dynamic and the kind of
Speaker 1: despondency that people have about the ANC's rule over the
Speaker 1: last there's.
Speaker 2: He is Intando says there's growing disappointment with the party,
Speaker 2: especially among black South Africans, who feel that its promises
Speaker 2: haven't fully come true. South Africa has the most industrialized
Speaker 2: economy in Africa, but for years economic growth has been stagnant.
Speaker 2: Its official unemployment rate of thirty three percent is among
Speaker 2: the worst in the world, and there are huge racial disparities.
Speaker 2: The unemployment rate for black South Africans is more than
Speaker 2: three times higher than it is for white South Africans
Speaker 2: today on the show. South Africa is at a turning point.
Speaker 2: Thirty years after Nelson Mandela rose to power on a
Speaker 2: platform of equality, peace and prosperity, the party he headed
Speaker 2: is facing serious challengers as the people head to the
Speaker 2: polls next week, they'll be casting their votes for the
Speaker 2: party they hope can best tackle the severe problems the
Speaker 2: country is facing, and the ANC looks poised to lose
Speaker 2: its outright majority, something once unthink for the party that
Speaker 2: saved the country from apartheid. This is the big take
Speaker 2: from Bloomberg News. I'm Sarah Holder. South Africa's African National
Speaker 2: Congress Party has been elected over and over again for
Speaker 2: the past three decades. That thinks in large part to
Speaker 2: its association with Nelson Mandela and Bloomberg's in Tondo. Thuquana
Speaker 2: says life is better for South Africans now than it
Speaker 2: was during apartheid, but that doesn't mean things have turned
Speaker 2: out exactly as the ANC promised.
Speaker 1: The NC is the party that liberated South Africa out
Speaker 1: of white minority rule in nineteen ninety four, and it's
Speaker 1: the reason why so many people believed in the party
Speaker 1: then and when it ran its campaigns in nineteen ninety four.
Speaker 1: It basically promised a beta life for all, and it
Speaker 1: promised to widen access to healthcare, education, employment opportunities and
Speaker 1: also make South Africa's economy more inclusive. And some of
Speaker 1: those promises have materialized, but not fully.
Speaker 2: Today, nearly two thirds of the population live in poverty,
Speaker 2: and despite the ANC's efforts, South Africa's stark racial divides remain.
Speaker 2: When the party first took over, as many as seven
Speaker 2: million South Africans were either homeless or living in informal settlements.
Speaker 2: So the ANC made housing access a key part of
Speaker 2: its platform. They enshrined adequate housing as a right in
Speaker 2: South Africa's new constitution and pledged to build about a
Speaker 2: million subsidized homes and electrify even more. But Maracoza, the
Speaker 2: woman from Katlahong, is one of many South Africans who
Speaker 2: have waited years for housing under a government led program,
Speaker 2: and when her turn finally came, all she was allocated
Speaker 2: was a vacant plot of land. Does she feel like
Speaker 2: the government has failed her.
Speaker 1: In some ways? She does, because she has been given
Speaker 1: a plot of land which she can one day build
Speaker 1: a house for herself and her children and to her,
Speaker 1: she would not have been able to do that for
Speaker 1: herself and she feels appreciative and grateful that the ANC
Speaker 1: government was at least able to do that for her
Speaker 1: and also her community members also depend on the social
Speaker 1: welfare grants. But on the other hand, she says that
Speaker 1: they have been promised electricity, for instance, and it's not
Speaker 1: been connected yet, which basically means that they are in
Speaker 1: the dark.
Speaker 2: But housing for all isn't the only campaign promise the
Speaker 2: ANC has struggled to fulfill, and Tondo says educational opportunities
Speaker 2: are lacking too.
Speaker 1: If you look at the education sector, most of the
Speaker 1: public schools in township areas, and those are very densely
Speaker 1: populated areas, we'll find that schools are overcrowded to appoints
Speaker 1: that it affects the learning outcomes of children in township
Speaker 1: areas or previously disadvantaged areas.
Speaker 2: According to the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, only
Speaker 2: seven percent of South African adults have received in education
Speaker 2: beyond the high school level, and those gaps in the
Speaker 2: school system have helped contribute to a mounting unemployment crisis
Speaker 2: in South Africa. Why are these unemployment rates so high?
Speaker 2: And what does that look like for families in South Africa.
Speaker 1: The basis of the reason why South Africa is struggling
Speaker 1: with unemployments is because there isn't enough economic growth to
Speaker 1: begin with. And what that does is creates a need
Speaker 1: for social welfare and it's not sustainable because it means
Speaker 1: that the country is actually spending more consumption and isn't
Speaker 1: spending enough on productive areas of the economy, and that
Speaker 1: is really a huge problem.
Speaker 2: The government has also struggled to provide basic services like electricity.
Speaker 2: The state owned electricity Company s COM was tasked with
Speaker 2: fixing the crisis, but its budget has been depleted and
Speaker 2: it has faced accusations of corruption, mismanagement and even sabotage.
Speaker 2: As a result, blackouts have been a fact of life
Speaker 2: in the country for more than a decade.
Speaker 1: ESCOM has not been able to supply power. It hasn't
Speaker 1: been able to fill the demand coming from households and businesses.
Speaker 1: And if you think about it, there's historical context that
Speaker 1: comes with it because when the NC did come into power,
Speaker 1: they inherited a power system that only serviced a select
Speaker 1: few and as time went by, obviously they promised to
Speaker 1: provide housing and electrify those houses, which means that the
Speaker 1: demand had increased, but they had not invested enough to
Speaker 1: make sure that they expand their network of equipment.
Speaker 2: The combination of these challenges housing, education, unemployment, and power
Speaker 2: create major drags on the country's entire economy, and finding
Speaker 2: the money to fix those things is not easy. Could
Speaker 2: you just give us a sense of the country's economic
Speaker 2: temperature given all of these problems.
Speaker 1: If you look at South Africa's debt levels, they throttle
Speaker 1: South Africa's capability to spend on productive sectors of the economy.
Speaker 1: And that's the reason why it can't actually do important
Speaker 1: stuff like growth economy and create employments because it's spending
Speaker 1: on interest payments and that's a hefty amount that you
Speaker 1: could be redirecting to other parts of South Africa's spending needs.
Speaker 1: So yeah, South Africa's public finances are sitting at a
Speaker 1: basically a precarious position.
Speaker 2: And Toando says, this has all led many voters to
Speaker 2: become disillusioned with the ANC. Paul suggests that the party
Speaker 2: could get less than fifty percent of the vote next week.
Speaker 1: A lot of these people are actually conflicted. If you
Speaker 1: talk to them, they're at odds about how they feel
Speaker 1: about the ANC. It's like the ANC has put them
Speaker 1: in a very hard spot where they are now being
Speaker 1: forced to choose between the ANC and someone else, and
Speaker 1: many of them actually don't feel like voting for someone else.
Speaker 1: I mean, I spoke to someone else who basically said
Speaker 1: to him there's no other party.
Speaker 2: But other parties have emerged to challenge the ANC's majority
Speaker 2: this year and what has become the most hotly contested
Speaker 2: election in South Africa since apartheid ended. After the break,
Speaker 2: who are the challengers and what are they promising for
Speaker 2: the future of South Africa. In South Africa, voters elect parties,
Speaker 2: not politicians, and the parties choose their own leaders. When
Speaker 2: South African voters head to the polls on May twenty ninth,
Speaker 2: they'll face a difficult choice whether to re elect the
Speaker 2: African National Congress led by President Cyril Ramaposa or put
Speaker 2: their support behind one of several other political parties. In
Speaker 2: Tando Tujuana, who covers South Africa's economy and government for Bloomberg,
Speaker 2: says there have never been so many competitive candidates.
Speaker 1: What you're seeing now for the first time is a
Speaker 1: long list of new entrants coming to the foe.
Speaker 2: There are three main parties challenging the ANC, the Democratic Alliance,
Speaker 2: the Economic Freedom Fighters and the Unkonto with Seeswear Party.
Speaker 2: What are the different directions for South Africa's future that
Speaker 2: these different candidates and parties are promising.
Speaker 1: Currently is promising things that it has promised before, to
Speaker 1: make the economy more inclusive, to increase employment levels in
Speaker 1: the country. And if you look at a party like
Speaker 1: the Economic Freedom Fighters that is a left leaning party,
Speaker 1: it stants is really one of extremism and radicalism.
Speaker 2: The Economic Freedom Fighters are led by Julius Malema.
Speaker 1: These are province where a lot of people don't have
Speaker 1: lends and they leave like sardines in the squad a camps.
Speaker 2: He's only forty three and used to lead the ANC's
Speaker 2: youth wing. He's long focused on the ANC's failure to
Speaker 2: address the country's stark racial inequality, with headline grabbing moves
Speaker 2: like calling for wide scale land redistribution from the white
Speaker 2: minority to the black majority.
Speaker 1: And then there's a new entrance on the block, the
Speaker 1: cont Overseas Party, whose party leader is former Presidents of
Speaker 1: the South African governments Jacob Zuma.
Speaker 2: Zuma is eighty two. He served as South Africa's president
Speaker 2: for years under the ANC before being jailed on contempt
Speaker 2: of court charges amid a massive corruption probe. But Zuma
Speaker 2: managed to get out of jail early and is running
Speaker 2: under the umbrella of a new political party. He's technically
Speaker 2: disqualified from holding a position in Parliament, but he remains
Speaker 2: popular with his followers and so his candidacy could prove
Speaker 2: a spoiler for the ANC. The main opposition is a
Speaker 2: more conservative party, the Democratic Alliance.
Speaker 1: The Democratic Alliance, which is led by John Stan Haysen.
Speaker 1: The policies are more similar to the ANC's policies, but
Speaker 1: there are certain variants.
Speaker 2: The Democratic Alliance is the country's official opposition party. It's
Speaker 2: historically been popular with white South Africans. The party emphasizes
Speaker 2: reducing violent crime and the country's crippling debt. Its leader
Speaker 2: is John Stean Hazen. Here he is responding to President
Speaker 2: Ramoposa's State of the Nation address in twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3: We cannot sit through another year of your fool while
Speaker 3: our country slaves further and further backwards, and millions more
Speaker 3: of our citizens fall into poverty and unemployment.
Speaker 2: Ramaposa, for his part, has said he's confident about the
Speaker 2: ANC's chances. The AFC is going to win this election.
Speaker 1: Outright you, and with a very clear and decisive majority.
Speaker 1: So the notion of coalition is not part of the equation.
Speaker 2: The possibility of a coalition government would be a situation
Speaker 2: where no one party had majority control, so to pass reforms,
Speaker 2: there would likely be lots of negotiation and compromise. If
Speaker 2: re elected, Ramaposa has promised new job creation efforts, a
Speaker 2: national health insurance plan, and a monthly welfare program to
Speaker 2: support the country's poorest, but his polling is not looking
Speaker 2: very good. I asked Intando, what are the odds of
Speaker 2: the ANC maintaining their majority.
Speaker 1: Well, it's a very difficult question to answer. We've had
Speaker 1: like a lot of polls come out. The over arching
Speaker 1: line that we've been hearing is that his party all
Speaker 1: yet you know, less than fifty percent. It's very very
Speaker 1: difficult to actually pin a figure in terms of whether
Speaker 1: you know or how much he will get. But the
Speaker 1: consensus is that his party will still remain the main
Speaker 1: party and will still remain the main policy driver, and
Speaker 1: that if there are any significant shifts or maybe he
Speaker 1: has to tap other political parties to help the NC
Speaker 1: former government. That is not going to actually you know,
Speaker 1: translate into major shifts and governments and how government has
Speaker 1: run and you know, all the policies that they have
Speaker 1: in place. You know, it won't really have a big
Speaker 1: effect on policy. So it is a bit of a concern.
Speaker 1: If the NC doesn't manage to get enough electoral support,
Speaker 1: if it for maybe let's say to forty two percent
Speaker 1: or forty percent, which is what some polls are suggesting,
Speaker 1: then it is in real trouble.
Speaker 2: And what that could mean, says in Tondo, is that
Speaker 2: South Africa might not be able to act swiftly and
Speaker 2: decisively to change as policies.
Speaker 1: What that does is that it's a problem for growing
Speaker 1: the economy and creating employments and fixing the power crisis.
Speaker 1: And it will also put a burden on public finances
Speaker 1: because now you've got diversion views about how public finances
Speaker 1: should be managed.
Speaker 2: But Nintando says that for some South Africans, voting for
Speaker 2: the ants may still be too tough a pill to swallow.
Speaker 2: In Tando talked to Maracosa about how she feels about
Speaker 2: her choices.
Speaker 1: She said, for the first time she will actually abstain
Speaker 1: from voting, and there are a lot of people who
Speaker 1: actually share her thoughts.
Speaker 2: And what could that mean for the election if so
Speaker 2: many people set this one out.
Speaker 1: I think it's a very complex issue because if a
Speaker 1: lot of people are saying that they are not coming
Speaker 1: out to vote, that tells you something about what they
Speaker 1: think about the other political parties that exist in the country.
Speaker 1: They're not voting because they have been disappointed. They're not
Speaker 1: voting because they aren't seeing a viable other option for them.
Speaker 1: Yet at the same time, the A and C it
Speaker 1: can be a headache to them. So that's the sort
Speaker 1: of dissonance that you find in a lot of people.
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to The Big Take podcast from Bloomberg News.
Speaker 2: I'm Sarah Holder. South Africa is only one of many
Speaker 2: important elections in twenty twenty four. This year, voters all
Speaker 2: around the world will have the ability to affect markets, countries,
Speaker 2: and economies like never before. To make sense of it all,
Speaker 2: Bloomberg's created a new podcast series, voter Nomics, where politics
Speaker 2: and markets collide. Each week listening as Stephanie Flanders, Bloomberg's
Speaker 2: head of Government and Economics coverage, Allegra Stratton, author of
Speaker 2: Bloomberg The Readout newsletter and Bloomberg opinion columnist Adrian Wooldridge
Speaker 2: helped make sense of this consequential election season. Find it
Speaker 2: in The In the City and Stephanomic's feeds. This episode
Speaker 2: was produced by Jessica Beck and David Fox. It was
Speaker 2: edited by Stacy Vannicksmith, Mark, Daniel Davies, Jessica Laudis, and
Speaker 2: Neil Munchi. It was mixed by Veronica Rodriguez. It was
Speaker 2: fact checked by Thomas lou and Audriana Tapia. Naomi Shaven
Speaker 2: and Kim Gidtleson are our senior producers. Our senior editor
Speaker 2: is Elizabeth Ponso. Nicole beiemsterbor is our executive producer. Sage
Speaker 2: Bauman is Bloomberg's head of podcasts. Special thanks to Stembu
Speaker 2: lay Selee. If you like this episode, make sure to
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Speaker 2: It helps people find the show. Thanks so much for listening.
Speaker 2: We'll be back next week.