1
00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:07,480
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

2
00:00:08,880 --> 00:00:12,600
Speaker 2: Marakoza lives nearly thirty miles outside of Johannesburg in South

3
00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:17,239
Speaker 2: Africa's third largest township, Katlohong. She's thirty eight years old

4
00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:20,080
Speaker 2: and pregnant. She lives in a community of more than

5
00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:22,800
Speaker 2: four hundred thousand people, almost all of whom are black.

6
00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:26,119
Speaker 2: Just over a quarter of them, including Mara, live in

7
00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:30,120
Speaker 2: homes constructed out of corrugated iron sheets with no access

8
00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:32,440
Speaker 2: to electricity.

9
00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:35,520
Speaker 1: Oh Mara, cause.

10
00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:40,320
Speaker 2: That's Mara speaking with Intando Thupuana, who covers economic and

11
00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:43,720
Speaker 2: government affairs in South Africa for Bloomberg. She told in

12
00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:45,920
Speaker 2: Tondo that for most of her life she's been a

13
00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:49,520
Speaker 2: steady supporter of the African National Congress Party, the party

14
00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:52,480
Speaker 2: of Nelson Mandela, which has led her country since nineteen

15
00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:56,120
Speaker 2: ninety four. Mendela took power after a peaceful toppling of

16
00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:59,280
Speaker 2: apartheid in South Africa when Mara was just eight years old.

17
00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:07,840
Speaker 2: NaNs Mendela promised a better life under the ANC, access

18
00:01:07,880 --> 00:01:11,280
Speaker 2: to healthcare, education and employment opportunities with.

19
00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:17,200
Speaker 3: Blood ourselves to live people from the quantilian bounds of

20
00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:19,080
Speaker 3: pavl deprivation.

21
00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:23,240
Speaker 1: Jander and Art a discredation.

22
00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:27,480
Speaker 2: Mara has the ANC party colors hanging in her window.

23
00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,639
Speaker 2: Like so many South Africans, She's believed in the party

24
00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:34,080
Speaker 2: for decades. It's won every election in South Africa since

25
00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:37,600
Speaker 2: Mendela's initial victory. Its consistent majority has meant it could

26
00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:40,959
Speaker 2: enact many of its reforms without much pushback. But that

27
00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:44,200
Speaker 2: decades long majority for the ANC could be coming to

28
00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:49,120
Speaker 2: an end now. Even voters like Mara are unsure. Next week,

29
00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:52,720
Speaker 2: South Africans head into an election where the ANC's current leader,

30
00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:57,120
Speaker 2: Cyril Ramaposa, is facing some stiff competition, which.

31
00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:00,160
Speaker 1: Shows you the kind of dynamic and the kind of

32
00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:04,080
Speaker 1: despondency that people have about the ANC's rule over the

33
00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:05,280
Speaker 1: last there's.

34
00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:08,440
Speaker 2: He is Intando says there's growing disappointment with the party,

35
00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:11,880
Speaker 2: especially among black South Africans, who feel that its promises

36
00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:15,880
Speaker 2: haven't fully come true. South Africa has the most industrialized

37
00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:20,400
Speaker 2: economy in Africa, but for years economic growth has been stagnant.

38
00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:23,560
Speaker 2: Its official unemployment rate of thirty three percent is among

39
00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:27,080
Speaker 2: the worst in the world, and there are huge racial disparities.

40
00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:29,880
Speaker 2: The unemployment rate for black South Africans is more than

41
00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,520
Speaker 2: three times higher than it is for white South Africans

42
00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:37,880
Speaker 2: today on the show. South Africa is at a turning point.

43
00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:40,919
Speaker 2: Thirty years after Nelson Mandela rose to power on a

44
00:02:40,960 --> 00:02:45,040
Speaker 2: platform of equality, peace and prosperity, the party he headed

45
00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:48,400
Speaker 2: is facing serious challengers as the people head to the

46
00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:50,760
Speaker 2: polls next week, they'll be casting their votes for the

47
00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:53,880
Speaker 2: party they hope can best tackle the severe problems the

48
00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:57,280
Speaker 2: country is facing, and the ANC looks poised to lose

49
00:02:57,360 --> 00:03:00,960
Speaker 2: its outright majority, something once unthink for the party that

50
00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:04,399
Speaker 2: saved the country from apartheid. This is the big take

51
00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:13,360
Speaker 2: from Bloomberg News. I'm Sarah Holder. South Africa's African National

52
00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:16,160
Speaker 2: Congress Party has been elected over and over again for

53
00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,040
Speaker 2: the past three decades. That thinks in large part to

54
00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:23,000
Speaker 2: its association with Nelson Mandela and Bloomberg's in Tondo. Thuquana

55
00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:26,240
Speaker 2: says life is better for South Africans now than it

56
00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,320
Speaker 2: was during apartheid, but that doesn't mean things have turned

57
00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,519
Speaker 2: out exactly as the ANC promised.

58
00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:35,200
Speaker 1: The NC is the party that liberated South Africa out

59
00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:39,000
Speaker 1: of white minority rule in nineteen ninety four, and it's

60
00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:42,400
Speaker 1: the reason why so many people believed in the party

61
00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:45,920
Speaker 1: then and when it ran its campaigns in nineteen ninety four.

62
00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:49,360
Speaker 1: It basically promised a beta life for all, and it

63
00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:56,400
Speaker 1: promised to widen access to healthcare, education, employment opportunities and

64
00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:01,680
Speaker 1: also make South Africa's economy more inclusive. And some of

65
00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:04,680
Speaker 1: those promises have materialized, but not fully.

66
00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:08,360
Speaker 2: Today, nearly two thirds of the population live in poverty,

67
00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:13,000
Speaker 2: and despite the ANC's efforts, South Africa's stark racial divides remain.

68
00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:16,279
Speaker 2: When the party first took over, as many as seven

69
00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:20,000
Speaker 2: million South Africans were either homeless or living in informal settlements.

70
00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:23,080
Speaker 2: So the ANC made housing access a key part of

71
00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:26,440
Speaker 2: its platform. They enshrined adequate housing as a right in

72
00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:29,680
Speaker 2: South Africa's new constitution and pledged to build about a

73
00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:35,080
Speaker 2: million subsidized homes and electrify even more. But Maracoza, the

74
00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:38,200
Speaker 2: woman from Katlahong, is one of many South Africans who

75
00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:41,200
Speaker 2: have waited years for housing under a government led program,

76
00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:44,880
Speaker 2: and when her turn finally came, all she was allocated

77
00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,120
Speaker 2: was a vacant plot of land. Does she feel like

78
00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:49,800
Speaker 2: the government has failed her.

79
00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:52,960
Speaker 1: In some ways? She does, because she has been given

80
00:04:53,160 --> 00:04:55,360
Speaker 1: a plot of land which she can one day build

81
00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:59,360
Speaker 1: a house for herself and her children and to her,

82
00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:01,560
Speaker 1: she would not have been able to do that for

83
00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:05,279
Speaker 1: herself and she feels appreciative and grateful that the ANC

84
00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:07,560
Speaker 1: government was at least able to do that for her

85
00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:12,120
Speaker 1: and also her community members also depend on the social

86
00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:15,240
Speaker 1: welfare grants. But on the other hand, she says that

87
00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,520
Speaker 1: they have been promised electricity, for instance, and it's not

88
00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:22,520
Speaker 1: been connected yet, which basically means that they are in

89
00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:22,960
Speaker 1: the dark.

90
00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,039
Speaker 2: But housing for all isn't the only campaign promise the

91
00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:30,520
Speaker 2: ANC has struggled to fulfill, and Tondo says educational opportunities

92
00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:31,320
Speaker 2: are lacking too.

93
00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,480
Speaker 1: If you look at the education sector, most of the

94
00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:39,160
Speaker 1: public schools in township areas, and those are very densely

95
00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:42,839
Speaker 1: populated areas, we'll find that schools are overcrowded to appoints

96
00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:46,560
Speaker 1: that it affects the learning outcomes of children in township

97
00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,440
Speaker 1: areas or previously disadvantaged areas.

98
00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:53,320
Speaker 2: According to the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, only

99
00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:56,280
Speaker 2: seven percent of South African adults have received in education

100
00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,919
Speaker 2: beyond the high school level, and those gaps in the

101
00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:02,200
Speaker 2: school system have helped contribute to a mounting unemployment crisis

102
00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:05,320
Speaker 2: in South Africa. Why are these unemployment rates so high?

103
00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,240
Speaker 2: And what does that look like for families in South Africa.

104
00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:11,680
Speaker 1: The basis of the reason why South Africa is struggling

105
00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:16,120
Speaker 1: with unemployments is because there isn't enough economic growth to

106
00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:20,320
Speaker 1: begin with. And what that does is creates a need

107
00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:23,920
Speaker 1: for social welfare and it's not sustainable because it means

108
00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:27,720
Speaker 1: that the country is actually spending more consumption and isn't

109
00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:31,000
Speaker 1: spending enough on productive areas of the economy, and that

110
00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:32,960
Speaker 1: is really a huge problem.

111
00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:36,920
Speaker 2: The government has also struggled to provide basic services like electricity.

112
00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:40,760
Speaker 2: The state owned electricity Company s COM was tasked with

113
00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:43,920
Speaker 2: fixing the crisis, but its budget has been depleted and

114
00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:48,520
Speaker 2: it has faced accusations of corruption, mismanagement and even sabotage.

115
00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:51,240
Speaker 2: As a result, blackouts have been a fact of life

116
00:06:51,279 --> 00:06:54,080
Speaker 2: in the country for more than a decade.

117
00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:58,280
Speaker 1: ESCOM has not been able to supply power. It hasn't

118
00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:02,160
Speaker 1: been able to fill the demand coming from households and businesses.

119
00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,640
Speaker 1: And if you think about it, there's historical context that

120
00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:08,640
Speaker 1: comes with it because when the NC did come into power,

121
00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:12,560
Speaker 1: they inherited a power system that only serviced a select

122
00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:17,760
Speaker 1: few and as time went by, obviously they promised to

123
00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:21,280
Speaker 1: provide housing and electrify those houses, which means that the

124
00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:25,360
Speaker 1: demand had increased, but they had not invested enough to

125
00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:29,040
Speaker 1: make sure that they expand their network of equipment.

126
00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:33,720
Speaker 2: The combination of these challenges housing, education, unemployment, and power

127
00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:38,080
Speaker 2: create major drags on the country's entire economy, and finding

128
00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:40,960
Speaker 2: the money to fix those things is not easy. Could

129
00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,520
Speaker 2: you just give us a sense of the country's economic

130
00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,480
Speaker 2: temperature given all of these problems.

131
00:07:46,760 --> 00:07:49,920
Speaker 1: If you look at South Africa's debt levels, they throttle

132
00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:55,240
Speaker 1: South Africa's capability to spend on productive sectors of the economy.

133
00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:57,679
Speaker 1: And that's the reason why it can't actually do important

134
00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,679
Speaker 1: stuff like growth economy and create employments because it's spending

135
00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,840
Speaker 1: on interest payments and that's a hefty amount that you

136
00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:08,920
Speaker 1: could be redirecting to other parts of South Africa's spending needs.

137
00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:12,920
Speaker 1: So yeah, South Africa's public finances are sitting at a

138
00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:15,200
Speaker 1: basically a precarious position.

139
00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:18,720
Speaker 2: And Toando says, this has all led many voters to

140
00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:22,160
Speaker 2: become disillusioned with the ANC. Paul suggests that the party

141
00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:24,840
Speaker 2: could get less than fifty percent of the vote next week.

142
00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,080
Speaker 1: A lot of these people are actually conflicted. If you

143
00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:29,679
Speaker 1: talk to them, they're at odds about how they feel

144
00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:33,240
Speaker 1: about the ANC. It's like the ANC has put them

145
00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:36,360
Speaker 1: in a very hard spot where they are now being

146
00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:39,640
Speaker 1: forced to choose between the ANC and someone else, and

147
00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:43,520
Speaker 1: many of them actually don't feel like voting for someone else.

148
00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:46,080
Speaker 1: I mean, I spoke to someone else who basically said

149
00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:48,480
Speaker 1: to him there's no other party.

150
00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:52,360
Speaker 2: But other parties have emerged to challenge the ANC's majority

151
00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:55,280
Speaker 2: this year and what has become the most hotly contested

152
00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:59,320
Speaker 2: election in South Africa since apartheid ended. After the break,

153
00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,480
Speaker 2: who are the challengers and what are they promising for

154
00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:12,000
Speaker 2: the future of South Africa. In South Africa, voters elect parties,

155
00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,959
Speaker 2: not politicians, and the parties choose their own leaders. When

156
00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:18,720
Speaker 2: South African voters head to the polls on May twenty ninth,

157
00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:21,960
Speaker 2: they'll face a difficult choice whether to re elect the

158
00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:26,440
Speaker 2: African National Congress led by President Cyril Ramaposa or put

159
00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:30,160
Speaker 2: their support behind one of several other political parties. In

160
00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:34,199
Speaker 2: Tando Tujuana, who covers South Africa's economy and government for Bloomberg,

161
00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:37,959
Speaker 2: says there have never been so many competitive candidates.

162
00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:41,200
Speaker 1: What you're seeing now for the first time is a

163
00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:44,240
Speaker 1: long list of new entrants coming to the foe.

164
00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:49,000
Speaker 2: There are three main parties challenging the ANC, the Democratic Alliance,

165
00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:52,920
Speaker 2: the Economic Freedom Fighters and the Unkonto with Seeswear Party.

166
00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:56,360
Speaker 2: What are the different directions for South Africa's future that

167
00:09:56,440 --> 00:10:00,000
Speaker 2: these different candidates and parties are promising.

168
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:05,400
Speaker 1: Currently is promising things that it has promised before, to

169
00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:09,920
Speaker 1: make the economy more inclusive, to increase employment levels in

170
00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:12,200
Speaker 1: the country. And if you look at a party like

171
00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:16,320
Speaker 1: the Economic Freedom Fighters that is a left leaning party,

172
00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:21,960
Speaker 1: it stants is really one of extremism and radicalism.

173
00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:25,800
Speaker 2: The Economic Freedom Fighters are led by Julius Malema.

174
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:28,600
Speaker 1: These are province where a lot of people don't have

175
00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:32,640
Speaker 1: lends and they leave like sardines in the squad a camps.

176
00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:35,840
Speaker 2: He's only forty three and used to lead the ANC's

177
00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:38,960
Speaker 2: youth wing. He's long focused on the ANC's failure to

178
00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:43,160
Speaker 2: address the country's stark racial inequality, with headline grabbing moves

179
00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,120
Speaker 2: like calling for wide scale land redistribution from the white

180
00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:48,079
Speaker 2: minority to the black majority.

181
00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,120
Speaker 1: And then there's a new entrance on the block, the

182
00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:54,960
Speaker 1: cont Overseas Party, whose party leader is former Presidents of

183
00:10:55,000 --> 00:11:02,320
Speaker 1: the South African governments Jacob Zuma.

184
00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,800
Speaker 2: Zuma is eighty two. He served as South Africa's president

185
00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:09,440
Speaker 2: for years under the ANC before being jailed on contempt

186
00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:13,600
Speaker 2: of court charges amid a massive corruption probe. But Zuma

187
00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:15,839
Speaker 2: managed to get out of jail early and is running

188
00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:19,120
Speaker 2: under the umbrella of a new political party. He's technically

189
00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:22,280
Speaker 2: disqualified from holding a position in Parliament, but he remains

190
00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,600
Speaker 2: popular with his followers and so his candidacy could prove

191
00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:28,960
Speaker 2: a spoiler for the ANC. The main opposition is a

192
00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:31,840
Speaker 2: more conservative party, the Democratic Alliance.

193
00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:36,000
Speaker 1: The Democratic Alliance, which is led by John Stan Haysen.

194
00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:40,480
Speaker 1: The policies are more similar to the ANC's policies, but

195
00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:42,199
Speaker 1: there are certain variants.

196
00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:46,440
Speaker 2: The Democratic Alliance is the country's official opposition party. It's

197
00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:50,720
Speaker 2: historically been popular with white South Africans. The party emphasizes

198
00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:54,960
Speaker 2: reducing violent crime and the country's crippling debt. Its leader

199
00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:58,480
Speaker 2: is John Stean Hazen. Here he is responding to President

200
00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:01,360
Speaker 2: Ramoposa's State of the Nation address in twenty twenty two.

201
00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,960
Speaker 3: We cannot sit through another year of your fool while

202
00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:09,320
Speaker 3: our country slaves further and further backwards, and millions more

203
00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:12,559
Speaker 3: of our citizens fall into poverty and unemployment.

204
00:12:13,200 --> 00:12:16,240
Speaker 2: Ramaposa, for his part, has said he's confident about the

205
00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:20,359
Speaker 2: ANC's chances. The AFC is going to win this election.

206
00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:25,920
Speaker 1: Outright you, and with a very clear and decisive majority.

207
00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:31,360
Speaker 1: So the notion of coalition is not part of the equation.

208
00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:35,199
Speaker 2: The possibility of a coalition government would be a situation

209
00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:39,240
Speaker 2: where no one party had majority control, so to pass reforms,

210
00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:42,800
Speaker 2: there would likely be lots of negotiation and compromise. If

211
00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:46,640
Speaker 2: re elected, Ramaposa has promised new job creation efforts, a

212
00:12:46,760 --> 00:12:50,319
Speaker 2: national health insurance plan, and a monthly welfare program to

213
00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:54,680
Speaker 2: support the country's poorest, but his polling is not looking

214
00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:57,960
Speaker 2: very good. I asked Intando, what are the odds of

215
00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,280
Speaker 2: the ANC maintaining their majority.

216
00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:05,079
Speaker 1: Well, it's a very difficult question to answer. We've had

217
00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:08,600
Speaker 1: like a lot of polls come out. The over arching

218
00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:10,600
Speaker 1: line that we've been hearing is that his party all

219
00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:14,440
Speaker 1: yet you know, less than fifty percent. It's very very

220
00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:19,560
Speaker 1: difficult to actually pin a figure in terms of whether

221
00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:22,440
Speaker 1: you know or how much he will get. But the

222
00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:25,840
Speaker 1: consensus is that his party will still remain the main

223
00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:31,000
Speaker 1: party and will still remain the main policy driver, and

224
00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:34,679
Speaker 1: that if there are any significant shifts or maybe he

225
00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:38,520
Speaker 1: has to tap other political parties to help the NC

226
00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:41,880
Speaker 1: former government. That is not going to actually you know,

227
00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:46,520
Speaker 1: translate into major shifts and governments and how government has

228
00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:48,760
Speaker 1: run and you know, all the policies that they have

229
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,040
Speaker 1: in place. You know, it won't really have a big

230
00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:55,760
Speaker 1: effect on policy. So it is a bit of a concern.

231
00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:58,800
Speaker 1: If the NC doesn't manage to get enough electoral support,

232
00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:03,200
Speaker 1: if it for maybe let's say to forty two percent

233
00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,440
Speaker 1: or forty percent, which is what some polls are suggesting,

234
00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:08,440
Speaker 1: then it is in real trouble.

235
00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:10,720
Speaker 2: And what that could mean, says in Tondo, is that

236
00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:13,480
Speaker 2: South Africa might not be able to act swiftly and

237
00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:15,520
Speaker 2: decisively to change as policies.

238
00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:19,080
Speaker 1: What that does is that it's a problem for growing

239
00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:23,720
Speaker 1: the economy and creating employments and fixing the power crisis.

240
00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:27,200
Speaker 1: And it will also put a burden on public finances

241
00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:30,360
Speaker 1: because now you've got diversion views about how public finances

242
00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:31,640
Speaker 1: should be managed.

243
00:14:31,960 --> 00:14:34,920
Speaker 2: But Nintando says that for some South Africans, voting for

244
00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:38,120
Speaker 2: the ants may still be too tough a pill to swallow.

245
00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:41,880
Speaker 2: In Tando talked to Maracosa about how she feels about

246
00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:42,520
Speaker 2: her choices.

247
00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:46,080
Speaker 1: She said, for the first time she will actually abstain

248
00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:49,320
Speaker 1: from voting, and there are a lot of people who

249
00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:51,280
Speaker 1: actually share her thoughts.

250
00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:52,960
Speaker 2: And what could that mean for the election if so

251
00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,000
Speaker 2: many people set this one out.

252
00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,760
Speaker 1: I think it's a very complex issue because if a

253
00:14:57,760 --> 00:14:59,720
Speaker 1: lot of people are saying that they are not coming

254
00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:04,280
Speaker 1: out to vote, that tells you something about what they

255
00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:09,320
Speaker 1: think about the other political parties that exist in the country.

256
00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:14,000
Speaker 1: They're not voting because they have been disappointed. They're not

257
00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:18,760
Speaker 1: voting because they aren't seeing a viable other option for them.

258
00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,280
Speaker 1: Yet at the same time, the A and C it

259
00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:25,080
Speaker 1: can be a headache to them. So that's the sort

260
00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:27,440
Speaker 1: of dissonance that you find in a lot of people.

261
00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:33,320
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to The Big Take podcast from Bloomberg News.

262
00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:36,920
Speaker 2: I'm Sarah Holder. South Africa is only one of many

263
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:40,360
Speaker 2: important elections in twenty twenty four. This year, voters all

264
00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:43,840
Speaker 2: around the world will have the ability to affect markets, countries,

265
00:15:43,880 --> 00:15:47,240
Speaker 2: and economies like never before. To make sense of it all,

266
00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:51,440
Speaker 2: Bloomberg's created a new podcast series, voter Nomics, where politics

267
00:15:51,440 --> 00:15:55,920
Speaker 2: and markets collide. Each week listening as Stephanie Flanders, Bloomberg's

268
00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:59,560
Speaker 2: head of Government and Economics coverage, Allegra Stratton, author of

269
00:15:59,600 --> 00:16:04,560
Speaker 2: Bloomberg The Readout newsletter and Bloomberg opinion columnist Adrian Wooldridge

270
00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:08,600
Speaker 2: helped make sense of this consequential election season. Find it

271
00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:12,360
Speaker 2: in The In the City and Stephanomic's feeds. This episode

272
00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:15,000
Speaker 2: was produced by Jessica Beck and David Fox. It was

273
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:19,000
Speaker 2: edited by Stacy Vannicksmith, Mark, Daniel Davies, Jessica Laudis, and

274
00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,040
Speaker 2: Neil Munchi. It was mixed by Veronica Rodriguez. It was

275
00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:26,880
Speaker 2: fact checked by Thomas lou and Audriana Tapia. Naomi Shaven

276
00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:30,240
Speaker 2: and Kim Gidtleson are our senior producers. Our senior editor

277
00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:34,720
Speaker 2: is Elizabeth Ponso. Nicole beiemsterbor is our executive producer. Sage

278
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,280
Speaker 2: Bauman is Bloomberg's head of podcasts. Special thanks to Stembu

279
00:16:38,360 --> 00:16:41,280
Speaker 2: lay Selee. If you like this episode, make sure to

280
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:44,240
Speaker 2: subscribe and review The Big Take wherever you listen to podcasts.

281
00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,680
Speaker 2: It helps people find the show. Thanks so much for listening.

282
00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:49,560
Speaker 2: We'll be back next week.