Speaker 1: Push it. Hey, everyone out there in podcast land, We're
Speaker 1: gonna be back next week with a whole new episode,
Speaker 1: an incredible episode, but we wanted to introduce you right now.
Speaker 1: Some of our other best friends are that's right. You know,
Speaker 1: we have lots of friends. I mean we are best friends,
Speaker 1: but we have other best friends. We know tons of
Speaker 1: interesting people. Yeah, some of our other best friends are
Speaker 1: is bonus content where we interview friends who do really
Speaker 1: cool and interesting things. I mean they are on the
Speaker 1: front lines of making things happen in the world and
Speaker 1: we are learning from them every single day, and now
Speaker 1: we get to share them with the rest of the world.
Speaker 1: That's right. And in this sneak peek, we have Jacqueline Stewart,
Speaker 1: whom we know as Jackie. I mean we know that
Speaker 1: together we bring the heat every week, right, you know,
Speaker 1: lots of smart, timely, in depth commentary. But we're like,
Speaker 1: we're like tepid compared to her, is what you're saying. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're like on low, low, medium and she's on high heat.
Speaker 1: That's right. So we spoke to her not too long ago,
Speaker 1: but since then she has won the MacArthur Genius Award.
Speaker 1: We are super amazing yep, yep. It's incredible, just life
Speaker 1: changing and so well deserved. In her other job besides
Speaker 1: just being a general genius, she's now the chief Artistic
Speaker 1: and Programming director of the Academy Museum of Motion Pictures,
Speaker 1: which is like this movie museum out in Los Angeles
Speaker 1: had just opened up, and it actually opened officially opened
Speaker 1: since we last saw her. That's right. So we talked
Speaker 1: to Jackie on this episode of Pushnik about a show
Speaker 1: that we already did, our first show about interracial buddy films. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I mean it's my favorite. I got in it.
Speaker 1: I mean, we have had some incredible episodes this season,
Speaker 1: but it's just so magical to be talking about Eddie
Speaker 1: Murphy in his first film and so many surprises that
Speaker 1: looking back now, what is it thirty years later, no,
Speaker 1: forty years later? Just incredible. So everyone should go back
Speaker 1: and listen to that episode of our show about interracial
Speaker 1: buddy films. But in the meantime, you get to hear
Speaker 1: Jackie and she is a brilliant film scholar. She knows
Speaker 1: more about movies, and not just movies, but who watches
Speaker 1: movies and what the movies mean culturally than really anybody
Speaker 1: out there, that's right, and that makes her all the
Speaker 1: more important for being one of our other best friends,
Speaker 1: because this is a show about drawing on relationships, about
Speaker 1: having honest and authentic conversations, and sometimes we need help,
Speaker 1: and Jackie comes through big time. Trumps. Check it out.
Speaker 1: She's she's now officially a genius. But we already knew
Speaker 1: back let's go. I mean, it was always really clear
Speaker 1: that your friendship was more than just a buddy ship, right,
Speaker 1: that that you felt like family, and that your families
Speaker 1: saw us family. So, um, you know, the Austin's just always,
Speaker 1: you know, from what I saw, treated you like another son,
Speaker 1: Khalil and uh mom, you know, Kali, I love your
Speaker 1: mother to death and um, and you know the way
Speaker 1: she would talk to Ben was like she would talk
Speaker 1: to you. It wasn't just like this was her son's friend,
Speaker 1: but she could set him straight. She might pop him
Speaker 1: in the head like or at least scross at the board. Yes, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: so there's there's an intimacy there that's really meaningful. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you've known us as long as we've been friends, really
Speaker 1: thirty thirty five years. All right, So so you're an
Speaker 1: expert on film and you're opening this amazing museum. Um,
Speaker 1: and so I have a question specifically about the topic
Speaker 1: of our show, which was interracial buddy films. So imagine
Speaker 1: that at the Academy Museum you're putting on a big
Speaker 1: exhibition about interracial buddy films. Okay, So what goes in
Speaker 1: what goes into that exhibit and what's the bigger meaning
Speaker 1: that you would want it to convin? Wonderful territorial question,
Speaker 1: great question, yes today. Yes, actually, I actually don't even
Speaker 1: want an answer. I just wanted you to got it.
Speaker 1: I was genuine, you know. Um. I guess I would
Speaker 1: trace it back to the Cindy Potier films, especially the
Speaker 1: Defiant ones, although it's hard to say that they became
Speaker 1: buddies in that film, but I guess it launched a
Speaker 1: few of the important things that come up across the
Speaker 1: history of these films, primarily that they are male focused.
Speaker 1: So the idea that you can isolate questions of race
Speaker 1: by keeping other things steady, and the steady thing has
Speaker 1: to do with masculinity. So so much of the conversation
Speaker 1: about race relations in this country, and you can even
Speaker 1: look at the language right, the Negro question, the Negro problem,
Speaker 1: was always masculinized, and so that would be an important
Speaker 1: starting point for understanding how it is that our notions
Speaker 1: about how racial reconciliation needs to happen, or understanding you
Speaker 1: have to hold everything else still in a way, so
Speaker 1: you can't really explore what that means. In terms of gender,
Speaker 1: there has to be this kind of shared outsiderism that happens,
Speaker 1: that is through what it means to be a man
Speaker 1: in this society. Yeah. Yeah, the Lethal Weapon films are
Speaker 1: really important. I think that when you ask the question, like,
Speaker 1: what would the larger kind of you know, argument be
Speaker 1: about the meaning of these films, I guess one important
Speaker 1: through line is that these films are trying to get
Speaker 1: us to think about what it takes to see humanity
Speaker 1: across racial lines. So those films are interesting because the
Speaker 1: roles are reversed in a way, and so with Danny
Speaker 1: Glover playing the kind of straight man, it invites audiences
Speaker 1: to identify more with him general audiences meaning white audiences
Speaker 1: in some ways to identify more with him as the
Speaker 1: as the center, and that's a pretty radical thing to do.
Speaker 1: So it's not just happening at the level of the story,
Speaker 1: but in the casting inviting that kind of identification with
Speaker 1: the central black male character is a pretty extraordinary thing
Speaker 1: to do. But then, you know, knowing my curatorial team
Speaker 1: at the Academy Museum, you have to mix it up
Speaker 1: when you start looking toward the you know, more contemporary moments.
Speaker 1: There are other probably obvious examples that you can use
Speaker 1: with men. But then the question is do women ever
Speaker 1: come into play or does it ever? Are the buddies
Speaker 1: ever like men and women? So I wouldn't throw in
Speaker 1: something like driving Miss Daisy because that's also about a
Speaker 1: kind of unlikely black white relationship, and it is completely
Speaker 1: has that same kind of like, you know, dependence narrative.
Speaker 1: You're the only one who really understands me. This is
Speaker 1: typically the black person is the only person who really
Speaker 1: understands the white person. And not at all to say
Speaker 1: that it's a positive example, but at the very least
Speaker 1: it's one that begins to sort of like get at
Speaker 1: some of these intersectional questions around I did that race
Speaker 1: is always inflected by lots of other vectors. If you'd
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