1
00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:11,039
Speaker 1: Hey, or hey, I got a question for you that

2
00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:13,399
Speaker 1: connects our two favorite things.

3
00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,279
Speaker 2: Ooh, is it about sleeping or taking a nap?

4
00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:19,840
Speaker 1: No, it's about physics and food.

5
00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:22,920
Speaker 2: H you mean are other two favorite things? All right?

6
00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:23,480
Speaker 2: What's the question?

7
00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:28,120
Speaker 1: Question? Is what astronomical object out there in the universe

8
00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:30,920
Speaker 1: would you most want to taste like?

9
00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:32,960
Speaker 2: Would I prefer to take a bite out of a

10
00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:34,720
Speaker 2: black hole or a yellow star?

11
00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:37,080
Speaker 1: Exactly? Chocolate versus banana?

12
00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:39,600
Speaker 2: Wait? A black holes made out of chocolate? Is that

13
00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:40,160
Speaker 2: what you're saying.

14
00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:41,560
Speaker 1: That's what we're trying to find out.

15
00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,320
Speaker 2: I see you're the mastermind in this evil scheme or

16
00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:48,880
Speaker 2: tasty scheme, one of the two. I guess in either case,

17
00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:49,920
Speaker 2: I'd rather just take a nap.

18
00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:05,319
Speaker 3: Hi.

19
00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:08,000
Speaker 2: I'm horim my cartoonists and the author of Oliver's Great

20
00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:08,760
Speaker 2: Big Universe.

21
00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,680
Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Daniel. I'm a particle physicist and a professor

22
00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,120
Speaker 1: at UC Irvine, and I do want to know what

23
00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:15,200
Speaker 1: a black hole tastes like?

24
00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:17,160
Speaker 2: Isn't that sort of a strange question to ask what

25
00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:19,280
Speaker 2: a whole tastes like? When did did you just leave

26
00:01:19,319 --> 00:01:20,480
Speaker 2: you with an empty stomach?

27
00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,039
Speaker 1: Maybe it actually be kind of a great diet you know, like,

28
00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:25,839
Speaker 1: take a bite of a black hole. It's like negative bites.

29
00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:29,080
Speaker 2: Oh, I see, we just suck out your ords and

30
00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:32,360
Speaker 2: you would weigh less. Yeah that works. I mean I

31
00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:33,880
Speaker 2: think that's all the rage in Hollywood.

32
00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:37,200
Speaker 1: Now this is the physics ozembic exactly.

33
00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:40,640
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I mean it's a philosophical question, like what

34
00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:41,920
Speaker 2: does nothingness taste like?

35
00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:44,600
Speaker 1: But a black hole isn't even nothing, right, it's super

36
00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:45,720
Speaker 1: dense something.

37
00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:48,200
Speaker 2: Well, there's things in the black hole, I guess, But

38
00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:51,040
Speaker 2: is in most of a black hole nothingness or I guess?

39
00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:51,480
Speaker 2: We don't know.

40
00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:52,040
Speaker 1: We don't know.

41
00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:52,600
Speaker 2: That's the point.

42
00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:55,480
Speaker 1: That's the deepest question in modern physics, which I want

43
00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:56,560
Speaker 1: you to take a bite out of.

44
00:01:56,840 --> 00:01:58,880
Speaker 2: You mean, the biggest question in modern physics. This is

45
00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:00,000
Speaker 2: what the black holes take?

46
00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:01,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly.

47
00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:05,160
Speaker 2: But then here's the problem. If you do get this data,

48
00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:08,840
Speaker 2: isn't it very subjective? Though? It's not really objective data,

49
00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:09,120
Speaker 2: is it?

50
00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:09,760
Speaker 1: It's still data?

51
00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:11,839
Speaker 2: Like I might be like, hey, it's delicious, but then

52
00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:14,280
Speaker 2: you know, other people might disagree.

53
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:16,720
Speaker 1: It's still data. We still want to know what's inside

54
00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:18,520
Speaker 1: a black hole. It's like when you look at an

55
00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:21,120
Speaker 1: amazing chocolate cake, it looks like chocolate on the outside,

56
00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:23,760
Speaker 1: But what if it's secretly vanilla on the inside. The

57
00:02:23,800 --> 00:02:25,360
Speaker 1: only way to know is to take a bite. So

58
00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:27,400
Speaker 1: we want to learn about what's inside a black hole,

59
00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:28,960
Speaker 1: maybe we just have to take a bite.

60
00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:31,840
Speaker 2: But I guess what I'm saying is like having a

61
00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:34,280
Speaker 2: person take a bite wouldn't really tell you what's inside.

62
00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:36,600
Speaker 2: What if it's something I've never tasted.

63
00:02:36,280 --> 00:02:38,160
Speaker 1: Before, But what if it's just vanilla?

64
00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:42,320
Speaker 2: That would be the most boring result there, like literally,

65
00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:45,840
Speaker 2: but anyways, welcome to our podcast, Daniel and Jorge Explain

66
00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:48,920
Speaker 2: the Universe, a production of iHeartRadio.

67
00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:51,359
Speaker 1: In which we encourage you to take a big, juicy

68
00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:54,440
Speaker 1: bite out of the universe. We hope the universe tastes

69
00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:56,680
Speaker 1: better than just vanilla. We hope that it's filled with

70
00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,679
Speaker 1: all sorts of weird stuff we never anticipated, things we've

71
00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:03,280
Speaker 1: never encountered before. That's just the way reality rolls. It's

72
00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,400
Speaker 1: filled with all sorts of amazing things for us to discover,

73
00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:08,639
Speaker 1: to understand, and to explain to you.

74
00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:11,519
Speaker 2: That's right. It is a tasty universe, full of interesting

75
00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:15,679
Speaker 2: and fascinating flavors and sometimes a lot of mysterious flavors.

76
00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:18,160
Speaker 2: Flavors that make you want to go, Uh, what is

77
00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:20,160
Speaker 2: this that I'm eating? What is it that I'm smelling?

78
00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:21,440
Speaker 2: What is this made out of?

79
00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:23,880
Speaker 1: And we know that listeners to the podcast are the

80
00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:26,720
Speaker 1: ones who are curious about the nature of the universe.

81
00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:29,760
Speaker 1: You listen because you have a deep itch to understand

82
00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:32,560
Speaker 1: how the universe works, and we want to reach out

83
00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:34,680
Speaker 1: and scratch that itch for you. And that same mitch

84
00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:37,600
Speaker 1: will lead you to ask questions about how everything works.

85
00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:40,280
Speaker 1: When ideas don't fit together in your mind, or when

86
00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:42,480
Speaker 1: you read something that just doesn't make sense to you,

87
00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:44,840
Speaker 1: you wonder, how does this all work? Is it possible

88
00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:47,920
Speaker 1: to understand xyz? And we encourage you to reach out

89
00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:51,360
Speaker 1: to us with your questions to questions At Danielandhorge dot

90
00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:53,520
Speaker 1: com we write back to everybody that's ray.

91
00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:55,560
Speaker 2: You can send in your questions and sometimes we'll pick

92
00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:58,480
Speaker 2: those questions to answer on the podcast or at least

93
00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:00,520
Speaker 2: talk about the question. Sometimes would you talk about the

94
00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:02,200
Speaker 2: questions without getting to an answer.

95
00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:04,160
Speaker 1: Well, sometimes we give an answer and you say that's

96
00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:06,200
Speaker 1: not really an answer, that's just a description, and then

97
00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:09,560
Speaker 1: we get into the philosophy.

98
00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:13,120
Speaker 2: I guess in either case, it's an answer technically.

99
00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:17,080
Speaker 1: Depends on what really is an answer anyway, man, there's

100
00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:18,320
Speaker 1: a deep question in philosophy.

101
00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:21,920
Speaker 2: But in either case, we talk about questions.

102
00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:24,800
Speaker 1: We do. We play your questions, we talk about them.

103
00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:26,960
Speaker 1: We hope to give you as much of an answer

104
00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:30,040
Speaker 1: as we can. Not every question in science has an answer,

105
00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:31,640
Speaker 1: but we want to take you at least to the

106
00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:35,200
Speaker 1: forefront of human understanding and ignorance so you can share

107
00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:36,240
Speaker 1: in our confusion.

108
00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:39,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, and sometimes the answer is choco lily smooth, and

109
00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:43,520
Speaker 2: sometimes the answer is a little spicy, little piquant.

110
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:46,320
Speaker 1: Either way, we love hearing your questions, we love answering them,

111
00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,080
Speaker 1: we love talking about them. Please do keep sending them in.

112
00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:50,880
Speaker 2: And also, I should say I'm a little offended at

113
00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:53,279
Speaker 2: your negative comments about vanilla. It is one of my

114
00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:54,040
Speaker 2: favorite flavor.

115
00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:55,680
Speaker 1: You're the one who said that would be the most

116
00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,599
Speaker 1: boring outcome to a black hole. I didn't say vanilla

117
00:04:58,640 --> 00:04:59,040
Speaker 1: was boring.

118
00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,720
Speaker 2: Well, what I mean is like, if the flavor of

119
00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:06,640
Speaker 2: something as complex and mysterious as a black hole, it

120
00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:09,200
Speaker 2: just came down to one flavor. I mean, I think

121
00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:14,479
Speaker 2: vanilla would be the best case scenario, but it's not

122
00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:16,560
Speaker 2: the most complex as so you could.

123
00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:19,760
Speaker 1: Get it'd be pretty fascinating though. If black holes tasted familiar,

124
00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:21,640
Speaker 1: you took a bite of a black hole, you're like, hmm,

125
00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:23,880
Speaker 1: tastes like pineapple, that would be very surprising.

126
00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:26,200
Speaker 2: Let's break this down, Daniel, how would you even taste

127
00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:27,960
Speaker 2: a black hole because you can't take a scoop of

128
00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:29,640
Speaker 2: it out of the black hole, right, it's the whole

129
00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:31,040
Speaker 2: point of a black hole. Well, you'd have to go

130
00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:33,160
Speaker 2: It's the only way to taste a black hole, is, Yeah,

131
00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:34,880
Speaker 2: is to go inside of a black hole. That's the

132
00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:37,640
Speaker 2: only way to sample what's inside of a black hole. Yeah,

133
00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:39,680
Speaker 2: But then you could never get out. You can never

134
00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:41,719
Speaker 2: even if you find out what it tastes like, you

135
00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,360
Speaker 2: could never tell anyone unless the other person is there

136
00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:44,800
Speaker 2: with you.

137
00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:47,440
Speaker 1: You could take a bite of a cosmic pineapple. Maybe

138
00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,599
Speaker 1: singularities taste like cherries, who knows, But yeah, you'd have

139
00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:54,120
Speaker 1: to be inside the black hole to even take that bite, and.

140
00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:56,040
Speaker 2: You could only tell people who are in the black

141
00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:56,840
Speaker 2: hole with you.

142
00:05:56,960 --> 00:05:59,080
Speaker 1: Right, the first real black hole club is you don't

143
00:05:59,080 --> 00:05:59,960
Speaker 1: talk about black hole.

144
00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:02,960
Speaker 2: No, you could, but then only people in the club

145
00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:03,640
Speaker 2: can find out.

146
00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:04,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right, very secret.

147
00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:07,560
Speaker 2: There's like a warmhole in the middle. I guess you

148
00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:10,040
Speaker 2: could yes, transmit that information, or.

149
00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:12,400
Speaker 1: If it's possible to encode the information in the pattern

150
00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:15,560
Speaker 1: of hawking radiation, like some theories of quantum gravity suggest,

151
00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:17,600
Speaker 1: then maybe you could tell everybody else what black holes

152
00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:18,040
Speaker 1: taste like.

153
00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:20,120
Speaker 2: Oh so wait, the first rule of a black hole

154
00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:22,000
Speaker 2: is not that you can't ever get out of the

155
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:22,440
Speaker 2: black hole.

156
00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,560
Speaker 1: You already broke the rules quantum mechanics. Less you break

157
00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:27,760
Speaker 1: all sorts of rules. Man, it's wonderful. But anyway, we're

158
00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:29,680
Speaker 1: here to answer other people's questions, not talk about the

159
00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:30,880
Speaker 1: flavor of black holes.

160
00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:33,760
Speaker 2: I don't know. I imagine this is a question for a

161
00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:35,560
Speaker 2: lot of people. I mean, you brought it up.

162
00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:37,360
Speaker 1: I did, Yes, I did bring it up.

163
00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:38,520
Speaker 2: You're curious about it.

164
00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:40,240
Speaker 1: But I'm still not taking about that black hole. I'm

165
00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:40,800
Speaker 1: sending you up.

166
00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:43,680
Speaker 2: Maybe I'll take more of it like a slurp. That's

167
00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:44,520
Speaker 2: these more cautious.

168
00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:47,160
Speaker 1: Well, I was inspired to think about tasting things by

169
00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:48,760
Speaker 1: the phrasing of our first question.

170
00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:51,159
Speaker 2: Yes, that's right, because today on the podcast we'll be

171
00:06:51,200 --> 00:07:00,800
Speaker 2: tackling listener questions. Number fifty six Taste Edition. Is this

172
00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:04,720
Speaker 2: the extra Spicy Edition, Extra Heavy Meal Edition? These are

173
00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,800
Speaker 2: pretty heavy questions. We have a question here about a

174
00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:13,000
Speaker 2: neutron star, about gravitational pressure, and about orbital dynamics. These

175
00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:16,120
Speaker 2: are not light subjects you would have these appetizers.

176
00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:18,520
Speaker 1: Know this is all heavy duty stuff.

177
00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:23,560
Speaker 2: This is main course material here. Yeah, we like to

178
00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:26,480
Speaker 2: answer questions here from our listeners, and so let's get

179
00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:28,880
Speaker 2: down to our first question, and this one is from

180
00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:30,520
Speaker 2: Drew Hi Daniel Jorge.

181
00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:33,160
Speaker 3: I was listening to some of the older episodes and

182
00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:36,200
Speaker 3: neutron stars kept coming up, and it seems like we

183
00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:39,440
Speaker 3: always talk about a tablespoon or teaspoon of a neutron

184
00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:42,240
Speaker 3: star material and how heavy and massive.

185
00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:42,600
Speaker 2: That would be.

186
00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:45,960
Speaker 4: And it got me to thinking, what would happen if

187
00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:50,640
Speaker 4: we actually took that tablespoon or teaspoon of neutron star

188
00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:54,680
Speaker 4: and dumped it into one of our oceans, And what

189
00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:57,280
Speaker 4: would happen if we did it on land. I assume

190
00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:01,560
Speaker 4: heat would be a major factor, but either way, that's

191
00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:02,239
Speaker 4: my question.

192
00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:02,840
Speaker 1: Let me know.

193
00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:08,880
Speaker 2: Thanks. All right, this sounds like a terrible idea, which

194
00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:11,760
Speaker 2: is why I'm glad you're asked us first. I'm glad

195
00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:16,040
Speaker 2: he's not an experimental physicist who decided to try this

196
00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:17,680
Speaker 2: out before asking anyone.

197
00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,080
Speaker 1: And I love the impossible visual of this, you know,

198
00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:23,760
Speaker 1: a teaspoon of neutron star dumping into the oceans. As

199
00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,320
Speaker 1: if you could like hold a teaspoon of neutron star,

200
00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:28,560
Speaker 1: like the spoon would be strong enough, or if you

201
00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:30,400
Speaker 1: were holding it you might be like tempted to lick

202
00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:31,080
Speaker 1: it or something.

203
00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:33,440
Speaker 2: Well, I think that's what the question is all abouts.

204
00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:35,200
Speaker 2: If you want to know what would happen could you

205
00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:37,760
Speaker 2: take a teaspoon of a neutron star and what would

206
00:08:37,800 --> 00:08:39,439
Speaker 2: happen if you brought it here to Earth.

207
00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:41,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a great question, and it really guessed at

208
00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:44,280
Speaker 1: the heart of some mysteries of modern physics.

209
00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:47,280
Speaker 2: All right, well break it down, Daniel. What is a

210
00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:47,960
Speaker 2: neutron star?

211
00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,240
Speaker 1: First of all, a neutron star is one of the

212
00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:54,080
Speaker 1: possible end states of stars. Stars are big balls of

213
00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:56,600
Speaker 1: gas that are compressed by gravity to a state where

214
00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,960
Speaker 1: they can perform fusion at their core, creating heavier elements

215
00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:02,880
Speaker 1: and also a lot of heat and radiation. But eventually

216
00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:06,800
Speaker 1: that fusion runs out of fuel and gravity wins, collapsing

217
00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:08,760
Speaker 1: the star. You can either get a white dwarf, which

218
00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:11,040
Speaker 1: is like a really heavy lump of stuff, or you

219
00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:13,520
Speaker 1: can get a neutron star if it's even heavier where

220
00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,719
Speaker 1: it overcomes some of the degeneracy pressure and squeezes the

221
00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,880
Speaker 1: electrons and protons down into neutrons, or if you have

222
00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:23,320
Speaker 1: even more mass than gravity, totally wins and creates a

223
00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:27,000
Speaker 1: black hole. So a neutron star is incredibly dense remnant

224
00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:27,679
Speaker 1: of a star?

225
00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:30,200
Speaker 2: Does it have to be the remnant of a star?

226
00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:32,200
Speaker 2: You can make a neutron star potentially.

227
00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:34,240
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, you can make a neutron star. Step one

228
00:09:34,280 --> 00:09:34,880
Speaker 1: is make a star.

229
00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:36,880
Speaker 2: I mean, not necessarily star. I mean you could just

230
00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:39,560
Speaker 2: take material and squeeze it down enough, and you potentially

231
00:09:39,679 --> 00:09:40,920
Speaker 2: might make a neutron star.

232
00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,760
Speaker 1: Right if you had like civilization HARDISHEV level three type

233
00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:48,320
Speaker 1: abilities to do stellar engineering or something, then in principle, yeah,

234
00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:50,400
Speaker 1: you can make one without making a star. But I

235
00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:53,080
Speaker 1: think the recipe would be gather a star amount of

236
00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:56,360
Speaker 1: material and let gravity squeeze it down into a neutron star.

237
00:09:56,559 --> 00:09:58,600
Speaker 1: Maybe you could speed up the process by applying some

238
00:09:58,720 --> 00:09:59,600
Speaker 1: external pressure.

239
00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:03,520
Speaker 2: And why do we need the Kardashians for this, because

240
00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:04,360
Speaker 2: they're so dense.

241
00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:06,839
Speaker 1: So many jokes I'm not going to make there about

242
00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:10,360
Speaker 1: the masses of various Kardashians. No Kardashev level of three.

243
00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:11,560
Speaker 1: Oh Kardashev.

244
00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:15,680
Speaker 2: Yes, I see, yes, you said that kind of fast,

245
00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:17,840
Speaker 2: all right, So then a neutrons are is basically like

246
00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,080
Speaker 2: kind of the heaviest or the densest thing you can

247
00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,120
Speaker 2: have potentially in the universe before it turns into a

248
00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:23,720
Speaker 2: black hole.

249
00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:26,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Remember that gravity is very powerful, but

250
00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:29,160
Speaker 1: it's also super duper weak, so it's possible to overcome

251
00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:31,560
Speaker 1: the effects of gravity, like you can overcome the effects

252
00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:34,120
Speaker 1: of Earth's gravity is just by jumping. Your muscles are

253
00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:36,720
Speaker 1: stronger than all the gravity on the Earth, And so

254
00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,440
Speaker 1: the reason everything in the universe doesn't collapse into a

255
00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:43,080
Speaker 1: black hole is because its structural strength can overcome gravity.

256
00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:45,120
Speaker 1: So the Earth doesn't collapse into a black hole the

257
00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:47,880
Speaker 1: size of a peanut because the strength of its material

258
00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:49,960
Speaker 1: is more powerful than Earth's gravity.

259
00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:52,880
Speaker 2: I mean, like the individual particles are repelling each other

260
00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,640
Speaker 2: enough to fight the squeezing.

261
00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:58,000
Speaker 1: Of gravity exactly. But as things get more mass, if

262
00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:01,160
Speaker 1: you overcome the ability of those four resist So if

263
00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:03,400
Speaker 1: you added enough mass to the Earth, for example, then

264
00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:05,800
Speaker 1: it would overcome its structural strength and it would get

265
00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:09,240
Speaker 1: squeeze down into something like a white dwarf. If you

266
00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:12,120
Speaker 1: add even more mass than you overcome the next barrier

267
00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:14,440
Speaker 1: and you get a neutron star. So each of these

268
00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:17,760
Speaker 1: kinds of states represents overcoming one of these barriers in

269
00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:20,680
Speaker 1: the battle against gravity, which it eventually will win and

270
00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:21,960
Speaker 1: turn things into black holes.

271
00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,920
Speaker 2: Now, wait, are you saying a neutron star is not stable,

272
00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:28,839
Speaker 2: like it'll eventually collapse or can you have a neutron

273
00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:30,400
Speaker 2: star lasting for a long time?

274
00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:32,640
Speaker 1: Now, we think neutron stars are stable, but there are

275
00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:34,679
Speaker 1: black holes out there, and eventually the black holes will

276
00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:35,400
Speaker 1: just eat everything.

277
00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:37,280
Speaker 2: Now, when you have a neutron star, did you just

278
00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:39,880
Speaker 2: have the neutron star or is it like a giant

279
00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,560
Speaker 2: cloud or blob of stuff with the neutron star in

280
00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:43,280
Speaker 2: the center.

281
00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:45,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of the material from the star is

282
00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:47,840
Speaker 1: blown out. So often you have like a nebula with

283
00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:50,000
Speaker 1: a neutron star at its heart, and.

284
00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:52,200
Speaker 2: It's called a neutron star because basically all of the

285
00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:57,160
Speaker 2: material in it has basically kind of degenerated to be neutrons.

286
00:11:57,240 --> 00:11:59,520
Speaker 1: Yeah. You start out basically with protons and electrons and

287
00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:04,240
Speaker 1: weaze them together and they do inverse beta decay into neutrons.

288
00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:06,960
Speaker 2: You mean the electrons just disappear or they merge with protons.

289
00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:09,600
Speaker 1: They merge with protons to make a neutron, So like

290
00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:12,560
Speaker 1: a neutron will decay into a proton and an electron,

291
00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:14,480
Speaker 1: and there's some neutrino accounting you've got to take care

292
00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:16,840
Speaker 1: of also. But if you squeeze things down, the inverse

293
00:12:16,880 --> 00:12:19,240
Speaker 1: can happen, and you can convert a proton and an

294
00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:21,720
Speaker 1: electron into a neutron. But we don't actually know the

295
00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,880
Speaker 1: state of matter inside a neutron star because it's so intense.

296
00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:28,079
Speaker 1: The pressure is so great that gravity is powerful and

297
00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:30,840
Speaker 1: the quantum forces are powerful, so both of those things

298
00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:32,760
Speaker 1: are at play, and that's not something we know how

299
00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:35,360
Speaker 1: to reconcile. So the heart of neutron stars really are

300
00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,480
Speaker 1: getting at questions of like quantum gravity situations where you

301
00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:40,760
Speaker 1: need to understand quantum mechanics and gravity.

302
00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:42,480
Speaker 2: Wait, wait, are you saying that we don't know if

303
00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:44,319
Speaker 2: neutron stars are made out of neutrons.

304
00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:46,120
Speaker 1: We know there's a lot of neutrons in there, but

305
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:48,280
Speaker 1: as you get towards the center and the pressure gets

306
00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:50,520
Speaker 1: really really high, we don't really know. If you can

307
00:12:50,559 --> 00:12:53,320
Speaker 1: call them neutrons anymore because the neutrons get squeezed so

308
00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:56,040
Speaker 1: closely together that like the difference between the quarks and

309
00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:59,440
Speaker 1: one neutron and another neutron becomes artificial, and it might

310
00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:02,160
Speaker 1: become like a cork gluon plasma. We talked about it

311
00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:04,520
Speaker 1: in another episode. You might even get things like nuclear

312
00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:07,840
Speaker 1: pasta weird new forms of matter that quarks and gluons

313
00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:09,439
Speaker 1: can form under extreme pressure.

314
00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:13,760
Speaker 2: And what would that pass the taste like very dense

315
00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:15,439
Speaker 2: vanilla mint.

316
00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:18,400
Speaker 1: Pineapple, I hope not squidd ink maybe.

317
00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:20,720
Speaker 2: Or nothing or nothing because it's a neutron star.

318
00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:23,079
Speaker 1: One of the fascinating things that matter can do is

319
00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:25,719
Speaker 1: under high pressures, it can form new states. Like if

320
00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:28,320
Speaker 1: you take carbon and you squeeze it with really high pressure,

321
00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:30,520
Speaker 1: you get a diamond. But it doesn't always revert when

322
00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:32,520
Speaker 1: you lower the pressure, Like you make a diamond, you

323
00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:33,880
Speaker 1: bring it up to the surface of the Earth, it

324
00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:37,400
Speaker 1: doesn't explode back into carbon. It retains that pressure. What

325
00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:39,400
Speaker 1: we don't really know is what happens when you make

326
00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:41,800
Speaker 1: neutron star stuff and then you take it out of

327
00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:44,440
Speaker 1: the neutron star and put it somewhere else, like on

328
00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:47,200
Speaker 1: Drew's teaspoon. Is it like a diamond of neutrons star

329
00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:50,120
Speaker 1: material or does it explode back into a bunch of

330
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:51,280
Speaker 1: protons and electrons?

331
00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:54,080
Speaker 2: Mmm, I feel like we skip the step there. So

332
00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:56,520
Speaker 2: I guess first of all, the scenario drew withstinol was

333
00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:59,839
Speaker 2: staying a teaspoon of a neutron star. So, since this

334
00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:01,920
Speaker 2: is almost the densest stuff in the universe, how much

335
00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:03,240
Speaker 2: does that teaspoon weight?

336
00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,280
Speaker 1: So a teaspoon of neutron star material has the mass

337
00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:09,720
Speaker 1: of like ten to the twelve kilograms. That's like a

338
00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:13,840
Speaker 1: trillion kilograms. It's like a thousand times the mass of

339
00:14:13,880 --> 00:14:15,280
Speaker 1: the Great Pyramid of Giza.

340
00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:18,280
Speaker 2: Whoa, And this is like from the surface of the

341
00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:20,600
Speaker 2: neutron star the center or is this just kind of

342
00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:21,840
Speaker 2: like an average scoop.

343
00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:24,280
Speaker 1: This is like an average scoop. It gets more dense

344
00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:26,560
Speaker 1: at the core and less dense at the edge. But

345
00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,080
Speaker 1: this is like roughly in the middle. But this stuff

346
00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:32,880
Speaker 1: is like ten to the fifteen times denser than the Sun.

347
00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:36,360
Speaker 1: It's really incredible. It's like ten to the seventeen kilograms

348
00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:37,360
Speaker 1: per cubic meter.

349
00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,280
Speaker 2: So the one teaspoon of neutron star you said weighs

350
00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:41,960
Speaker 2: how many pyramids.

351
00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:44,480
Speaker 1: Like about a thousand times the Great Pyramid of Giza.

352
00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:47,160
Speaker 2: Wow, in one little tiny teaspoon. So first of all,

353
00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:48,880
Speaker 2: I mean, let's forget the fact that it might be

354
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:51,160
Speaker 2: hard to take a scoop of a neutron star. But

355
00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:53,760
Speaker 2: just bringing it to Earth, I mean you'd be carrying

356
00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:56,960
Speaker 2: a huge amount of weight in this very small space, right, Like,

357
00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:59,440
Speaker 2: it would probably be really hard to just like hold it.

358
00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:02,120
Speaker 1: Up, very hard to accelerate it and to bring it

359
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,400
Speaker 1: to Earth and to gradually lower it down.

360
00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:07,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, because it'd be sort of like balancing a

361
00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,320
Speaker 2: thousand pyramids onto a little tiny point, right. It would

362
00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:12,640
Speaker 2: probably break or crush anything you try to set it.

363
00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:15,480
Speaker 1: On exactly, and if you accidentally dropped it while you

364
00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:17,760
Speaker 1: were in orbit, it would plumb it towards the surface

365
00:15:17,760 --> 00:15:19,600
Speaker 1: of the Earth and cause a lot of destruction.

366
00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,640
Speaker 2: M because it has a lot of mass, right.

367
00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:23,840
Speaker 1: It's very strong gravity.

368
00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:27,080
Speaker 2: Okay, So let's say Drew brought a teaspoon of this stuff,

369
00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:29,600
Speaker 2: brought it to Earth, and I think maybe the biggest question,

370
00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:31,800
Speaker 2: as you said, is what would happen to that teaspoon

371
00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:33,880
Speaker 2: when you first take it out of the nutron star?

372
00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:37,320
Speaker 2: Because it was it's super dense because the forces in

373
00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:40,080
Speaker 2: the neutron star are squeezing it together. When you take

374
00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:42,280
Speaker 2: it out of the nutron star and nothing is squeezing

375
00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:45,440
Speaker 2: that together, does it just explode or expand the.

376
00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,560
Speaker 1: Short answer is that we don't know, because we don't

377
00:15:47,640 --> 00:15:50,320
Speaker 1: understand the dynamics inside a neutron star. They are all

378
00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:52,440
Speaker 1: sorts of theories for what's going on inside of it,

379
00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:56,360
Speaker 1: nuclear pasta quarklow and plasma, other weird forms of matter.

380
00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:59,040
Speaker 1: People are writing papers about this every day. Actually do

381
00:15:59,080 --> 00:16:01,360
Speaker 1: a little bit of research on this topic myself, and

382
00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,920
Speaker 1: there's just a lot of question marks because it's combining

383
00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:06,960
Speaker 1: two of the hardest things in physics, general relativity, which

384
00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,400
Speaker 1: is very difficult to do any calculations with, and the

385
00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:11,840
Speaker 1: strong nuclear force, which is a huge headache to do

386
00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:14,080
Speaker 1: any calculations with. So now you want to understand what's

387
00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:16,800
Speaker 1: happening when these two things are both doing their thing,

388
00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,680
Speaker 1: it's almost impossible. So we really just don't know. But

389
00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:22,080
Speaker 1: I suspect that whatever is formed there is not stable,

390
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:24,440
Speaker 1: that if you suddenly transport it to Earth, you like

391
00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:27,120
Speaker 1: build a wormhole between the center of the neutron star

392
00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,040
Speaker 1: and Drew's kitchen and you got a tea spoons worth

393
00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:33,560
Speaker 1: of material, they would not be stable that it would explode.

394
00:16:33,240 --> 00:16:35,200
Speaker 2: Right, because there's all this stuff squeezing it together and

395
00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,520
Speaker 2: suddenly nothing squeezing it together. So potentially it might explode.

396
00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:40,280
Speaker 2: But as you said, it could also maybe be like

397
00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,560
Speaker 2: a diamond, where it is super squeeze carbon, but it's

398
00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:46,840
Speaker 2: somehow clicked into place, and diamonds don't explode.

399
00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:48,600
Speaker 1: Diamonds do not explode.

400
00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:50,760
Speaker 2: Yes, that's true, and so how bad would it be

401
00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:52,480
Speaker 2: for this thing to explode here on Earth?

402
00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:56,360
Speaker 1: It would be really really bad. Material with that density

403
00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,880
Speaker 1: has really high kinetic energy, like the particles inside of

404
00:16:59,880 --> 00:17:03,800
Speaker 1: it are whizzing around with incredible velocity kinetic energy.

405
00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:05,879
Speaker 2: Why does it necessarily have kinetic energy?

406
00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:07,720
Speaker 1: Well, think about how it was formed. You took a

407
00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:11,600
Speaker 1: thousand pyramids of gizo's worth of hydrogen, for example, as

408
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:14,320
Speaker 1: a big diffuse gas, and you squeeze it down to

409
00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:16,840
Speaker 1: a t spoon. To do that, you're pushing on it.

410
00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:19,160
Speaker 1: If you have walls, for example, every time you're pushing

411
00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,280
Speaker 1: those walls closer and closer, you're pushing on those particles.

412
00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:25,040
Speaker 1: So applying that pressure to squeeze this down pushes on

413
00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:27,679
Speaker 1: all the particles and now they have very very high energy.

414
00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,199
Speaker 2: Right, that's find you maybe form a neutron star. But

415
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:32,080
Speaker 2: what if I take my a neutron star and I

416
00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:34,760
Speaker 2: freeze it before taking a scoop out of it? Did

417
00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:35,680
Speaker 2: I just blow your mind?

418
00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:40,720
Speaker 1: Hm? I love the idea of like deep freezing a

419
00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:42,880
Speaker 1: bit of neutron star, and then you could like deep

420
00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:44,639
Speaker 1: fry it, and then you could take a bite out of.

421
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:47,400
Speaker 2: It, deep freeze the neutron star, yet the whole star,

422
00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:48,760
Speaker 2: and then you take a scoop.

423
00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:51,840
Speaker 1: I think it's impossible to cool down a neutron star

424
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:55,080
Speaker 1: because of the quantum mechanics of neutrons. The issue is

425
00:17:55,119 --> 00:17:58,679
Speaker 1: that neutrons are fermions like electrons and other particles. You

426
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:00,840
Speaker 1: can't have two of them in the same state, and

427
00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:04,320
Speaker 1: so that creates a minimum temperature for neutron stars because basically,

428
00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:06,359
Speaker 1: if you have one neutron in like a really low

429
00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:08,760
Speaker 1: energy state, then you can't have another one. The next

430
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:11,080
Speaker 1: one has to get into the next high energy state,

431
00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:12,840
Speaker 1: so there's like a minimum energy.

432
00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:15,440
Speaker 2: What would happen if you tried to freeze a neutron star.

433
00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:17,760
Speaker 1: You just couldn't get that neutron into a lower state, like,

434
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:20,040
Speaker 1: they just don't go into that lower state if it's

435
00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,800
Speaker 1: already occupied. It's like trying to get two electrons into

436
00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:25,920
Speaker 1: the same state of hydrogen. No amount of cooling will

437
00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,320
Speaker 1: get them that low. The electrons will just refuse to

438
00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:30,080
Speaker 1: do that. They won't give up the energy.

439
00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:34,159
Speaker 2: They can't sort of like maybe how you can't freeze

440
00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:37,720
Speaker 2: an atom technically, right, at some point the electrons are

441
00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:39,560
Speaker 2: still orbiting around the nucleus.

442
00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:42,800
Speaker 1: And this actually touches on the topic of our next question.

443
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:45,440
Speaker 2: All right, So, continuing with the scoop of a neutron star,

444
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:48,040
Speaker 2: you're saying it would have a lot of compressed energy

445
00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:50,640
Speaker 2: in there, and so when you take away the gravity,

446
00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:52,560
Speaker 2: maybe all that energy would be released.

447
00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:55,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And the amount of energy is really incredible.

448
00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:58,800
Speaker 1: It's a little bit of calculation. It's more energy than

449
00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:03,040
Speaker 1: the sun emits of second. It's about equivalent to one

450
00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:04,960
Speaker 1: billion atomic bombs.

451
00:19:05,359 --> 00:19:09,240
Speaker 2: WHOA, that would be bad news for all of us.

452
00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:13,280
Speaker 1: Yes, very very bad news for everybody. Neutrons are very dangerous.

453
00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:15,480
Speaker 1: They are hadronic particles and if they go through you,

454
00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:17,560
Speaker 1: they don't have electric charge. But they're basically just like

455
00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:20,200
Speaker 1: tiny bullets and they can really do a lot of damage.

456
00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:22,280
Speaker 1: And if you have a bunch of neutrons really high

457
00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:25,040
Speaker 1: compressed and then they explode with high speed, you have

458
00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:28,199
Speaker 1: like ten to the thirty eight neutrons traveling at some

459
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,200
Speaker 1: significant fraction of the speed of light. It's an enormous

460
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,240
Speaker 1: amount of energy deposited everywhere. And so you might wonder like, oh,

461
00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:36,280
Speaker 1: is it going to drop through the Earth or whatever. No,

462
00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:39,000
Speaker 1: it's just going to explode and basically vaporize a huge

463
00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:39,800
Speaker 1: chunk of the Earth.

464
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:42,960
Speaker 2: Well, I guess you know, if you are able to

465
00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:45,119
Speaker 2: get it front the neutron star to the Earth, it

466
00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:46,920
Speaker 2: must be sort of stable though, right.

467
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:50,760
Speaker 1: It depends like maybe you used a wormhole. So you

468
00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:52,920
Speaker 1: just like open up a wormhole between the center of

469
00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:55,600
Speaker 1: the neutron star and Drew's kitchen and then a little

470
00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:56,320
Speaker 1: bit leak through.

471
00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:58,359
Speaker 2: Oh I see if you just use magic is what

472
00:19:58,400 --> 00:19:59,200
Speaker 2: you're saying.

473
00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:02,080
Speaker 1: Wormhold or not magic. I think it's probably impossible to

474
00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,680
Speaker 1: take a spoonfull of neutron star and transport it through

475
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:08,600
Speaker 1: space to Drew's kitchen. I think that's probably impossible.

476
00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:11,720
Speaker 2: Well, I guess either way, it's bad news.

477
00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:14,080
Speaker 1: It's bad news and the rest of us. It would

478
00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:17,240
Speaker 1: be like a huge asteroid hitting the Earth, something like

479
00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:21,119
Speaker 1: several thousand times the devastation of the dinosaur killer that

480
00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:24,879
Speaker 1: hit sixty five million years ago. So definitely bad news.

481
00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:27,960
Speaker 2: Like maybe at the scale of the asteroid or rock

482
00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:30,040
Speaker 2: that created the Moon perhaps.

483
00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:33,160
Speaker 1: Or more maybe not that dramatic, but almost that scale. Yes,

484
00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:35,720
Speaker 1: Like the Earth would look different. You could see it

485
00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:38,879
Speaker 1: from space for sure, bad news for Drew and all

486
00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:40,720
Speaker 1: of his neighbors and the rest of us on Earth.

487
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,280
Speaker 2: I see, all right, well, I guess the answer for drewis, Hey, Drew,

488
00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:46,480
Speaker 2: maybe you should eat the teaspoon before you bring it

489
00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:46,880
Speaker 2: to Earth.

490
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:51,960
Speaker 1: Don't order a teaspoon of neutron star on Instacart please.

491
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:55,280
Speaker 2: That's right on wormhold card. Exact age would not be good.

492
00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:57,560
Speaker 2: All right, thanks Drew for that question. Let's get to

493
00:20:57,600 --> 00:20:59,960
Speaker 2: our other questions here today. We have questions about gravity

494
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:04,640
Speaker 2: pressure and about orbital dynamics, say said heavy stuff. We'll

495
00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:06,600
Speaker 2: get to that, but first let's take a quick break.

496
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:21,879
Speaker 2: We're taking listener questions here today, and our next question

497
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:23,879
Speaker 2: comes from Nol from Perth.

498
00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:27,959
Speaker 5: Good day, Daniel, and Hi, this is Noel from Perth, Australia.

499
00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:31,000
Speaker 5: I was sitting here thinking one day I wonder if

500
00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:35,520
Speaker 5: matter under extreme pressure can ever be stopped. What I

501
00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:38,680
Speaker 5: mean by that is, is there ever a point where

502
00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:43,280
Speaker 5: we have so much gravitational pressure that all movement of

503
00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:48,560
Speaker 5: matter can be frozen in time? Is that possible? Would

504
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:50,679
Speaker 5: love to hear your answer on this one. Thank you

505
00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,760
Speaker 5: very much and love hearing your podcast. Cheers mate.

506
00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,280
Speaker 2: See all right, gooday to two nol or good eight.

507
00:21:57,400 --> 00:21:59,800
Speaker 2: I guess technically I'm not quite sure I understood this question.

508
00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:02,800
Speaker 2: What do you think nol here is asking.

509
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:04,920
Speaker 1: I think Noel has heard that you can't cool matter

510
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:08,480
Speaker 1: down so that things actually stop forever, like absolute zero

511
00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:11,880
Speaker 1: is impossible in quantum mechanics. But he's wondering if instead

512
00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 1: you can use pressure. You could just like squeeze stuff

513
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:16,359
Speaker 1: down so that it stops moving.

514
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:17,000
Speaker 3: Oh.

515
00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 2: I see, so we're talking kind of about the same

516
00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,640
Speaker 2: question we talked about just now in the other question, Yeah,

517
00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:25,080
Speaker 2: which is like, what's the coldest that you can get something,

518
00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,080
Speaker 2: especially if it's super dense like a neutron star.

519
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's probably also wondering, like is matter moving

520
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:34,440
Speaker 1: inside a singularity inside a black hole? Oh?

521
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:38,200
Speaker 2: Really? That's in here also it's a very dense question.

522
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:42,160
Speaker 1: He's wondering about the extremes of gravitational pressure, are you I.

523
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,399
Speaker 2: See, I see. Well, I guess I wouldn't necessarily associate

524
00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:49,800
Speaker 2: extreme pressure with things stopping. In fact, I kind of associate,

525
00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:51,760
Speaker 2: you know, the intense gravity inside of the sun to

526
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:54,600
Speaker 2: like fusion and things just getting hotter and hotter, or

527
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:56,760
Speaker 2: like we talked about the neutron star, just gets hotter

528
00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:57,720
Speaker 2: the more you compress it.

529
00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:00,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. It's like if your toddler is going crazy

530
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 1: and you lock them in the room, They're not necessarily

531
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 1: just going to calm down. They might just bounce off

532
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:06,800
Speaker 1: the walls. Same thing happens if you take an electron

533
00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:08,960
Speaker 1: and try to squeeze it down to a smaller and

534
00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:09,800
Speaker 1: smaller space.

535
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:12,880
Speaker 2: Well, let's maybe start with the concept that he talks about,

536
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:15,399
Speaker 2: which is getting things to stop. And I guess what

537
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:18,080
Speaker 2: he means is like cooling things down or squeezing them

538
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 2: so much where they don't have any kinetic energy or

539
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 2: they're not moving.

540
00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:23,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, he talks about it being frozen in time, so

541
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,600
Speaker 1: no kinetic energy. So you want to simultaneously squeeze stuff

542
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,359
Speaker 1: down plus pull out that kinetic energy. Somehow cool it

543
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:33,080
Speaker 1: and squeeze it at the same time.

544
00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:35,919
Speaker 2: What do you think frozen in time means doesn't change

545
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:36,760
Speaker 2: over time at all?

546
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,800
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly, that's just not moving. I think he's interested

547
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 1: in absolute zero essentially, like finding a path to getting

548
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:44,800
Speaker 1: things completely frozen.

549
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:45,200
Speaker 3: Mmm.

550
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,000
Speaker 2: I see, But absolute zero does exist right in the universe.

551
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 1: Absolute zero does exist, But quantum mechanics tells us it's

552
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:55,320
Speaker 1: impossible for anything to actually be stopped because that would

553
00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:58,119
Speaker 1: violate some basic principles. There's a minimum amount of energy

554
00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 1: everything has to have in the universe according to quantum mechanics.

555
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,359
Speaker 1: So you can't actually ever get material to absolute zero.

556
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 2: Like anything that has matter or substance to it, you

557
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:10,399
Speaker 2: can't freeze it down to zero. Is that things that

558
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 2: are always going to be jiggling a little bit or

559
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:15,600
Speaker 2: moving or having some sort of minimum energy just from

560
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,200
Speaker 2: having the minimum quantum property.

561
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And there's a few ways to think about that.

562
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,680
Speaker 1: One is in terms of the uncertainty principle, Like if

563
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,120
Speaker 1: something has zero energy, then you know its location and

564
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:29,720
Speaker 1: you know it's momentum both zero and you know both

565
00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:32,680
Speaker 1: of those perfectly well, and that violates the uncertainty principle.

566
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,080
Speaker 1: So the uncertainty principle tells you if you locate something

567
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 1: in one position, you squeeze it down super well, then

568
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:40,640
Speaker 1: the uncertainly on its momentum is infinite. Right, So essentially,

569
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,359
Speaker 1: squeezing something down to just one location you give it

570
00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:46,360
Speaker 1: infinite temperature. So that tells you you can't. Another way

571
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 1: to think about it is just in terms of the

572
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 1: solutions of quantum fields, like what are quantum fields? These

573
00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:53,919
Speaker 1: things that fill space and they vibrate, but if you

574
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:55,919
Speaker 1: look at the mathematics of them, they can vibrate in

575
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: various ways, but they can never have zero energy. That

576
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:01,800
Speaker 1: configuration with the field has zero energy is not a

577
00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:04,760
Speaker 1: solution to the wave equations. The wave equations require a

578
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:07,960
Speaker 1: minimum amount of buzzing in these fields at all times.

579
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 2: But then no, I guess is imagining a scenario where

580
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:15,359
Speaker 2: maybe you squeeze things so much that they can't move anymore. Like,

581
00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:18,080
Speaker 2: for example, if you take a gas and you squeeze it.

582
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 2: As a gas, it's moving, all the particles in it

583
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:22,480
Speaker 2: are moving a lot, but as you squeeze it, maybe

584
00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 2: it turns first into I guess, liquid hydrogen, which makes

585
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:29,399
Speaker 2: the molecules there moveless, and then you keep squeezing it,

586
00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,439
Speaker 2: you'll actually get like hydrogen ice, right, and then the

587
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 2: atoms are almost not moving at all, maybe they're still vibrating.

588
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:37,960
Speaker 2: And so the question is, maybe if you keep squeezing

589
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:40,680
Speaker 2: beyond solid, can you actually make the molecules and the

590
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:42,119
Speaker 2: atoms in there stop?

591
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. It's sort of a fund mental question. And

592
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,119
Speaker 1: you know, if you put quantum mechanics aside and just

593
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:49,840
Speaker 1: think about like the classical universe, where everything has like

594
00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 1: a location and path through space and time, then there's

595
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:56,440
Speaker 1: no issue. You could take something, you could squeeze it down,

596
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 1: you could give it zero energy, not a problem at all.

597
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:02,119
Speaker 1: If you think of tiny particles, is just like little

598
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:05,280
Speaker 1: grains of sand. Right. The issue really is with quantum

599
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:08,160
Speaker 1: mechanics that these particles are not little grains of sand.

600
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 1: They follow different rules, so they do all have minimum energy,

601
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:14,200
Speaker 1: and they have uncertainty on them, and they also follow

602
00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:16,800
Speaker 1: these other rules like the poly exclusion principle. If you

603
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: have a big pile of electrons, you can't squeeze them

604
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: all down to zero energy because they won't be in

605
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: the same energy level. Fermions will not allow another fermion

606
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 1: in the same energy level, the same quantum state. So

607
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: there's a minimum energy to all those electrons. That's sometimes

608
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,639
Speaker 1: called electron degeneracy pressure. It's one of the things that

609
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:35,960
Speaker 1: keeps a white dwarf from collapsing, for example.

610
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,280
Speaker 2: But I guess maybe, just as a matter of exercise,

611
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 2: let's maybe follow Knowle's reasoning here and let's just keep

612
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 2: squeezing things, right, So if you squeeze things more, they'll

613
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 2: get solid. Then eventually they'll turn into neutron stars, right,

614
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:51,120
Speaker 2: which is what we talked about in the previous question.

615
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, Then be neutron stars. And now we're already

616
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 1: beyond level of knowledge because we don't know what's going

617
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 1: on inside a neutron star. Maybe there's nuclear pasta, maybe

618
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 1: there's weird new kinds of crystals, maybe weird neutron diamonds.

619
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:05,919
Speaker 2: We just don't know, right, So is it possible that

620
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:09,240
Speaker 2: inside of an entrance star things stop, like things click

621
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 2: into place in such a way that they kind of

622
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:12,479
Speaker 2: have zero energy.

623
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:14,920
Speaker 1: I think the most correct answer is to just say

624
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,320
Speaker 1: we don't know, because it depends on the details of

625
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 1: quantum gravity, like what happens to particles when you're under

626
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:24,400
Speaker 1: really intense pressure and really intense gravity. We just don't

627
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:25,920
Speaker 1: know the answer to that. We need a theory of

628
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 1: quantum gravity that tells us how to do gravitational calculations

629
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 1: for particles. So we're just speculating, and it might be

630
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:33,679
Speaker 1: that there are some theories of quantum gravity that reveal

631
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:35,960
Speaker 1: the universe is very different from the way that we expect.

632
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:38,879
Speaker 1: That we can't just extrapolate our quantum rules down to

633
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,400
Speaker 1: very very high pressures and very high densities.

634
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 2: Any like, if we keep squeezing something, maybe at some

635
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 2: point the Heisenberg uncertainty principle doesn't work. M m like

636
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 2: extreme gravity is maybe Heisenberg takesification.

637
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:53,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, let me say it this way. General relativity says, yes,

638
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: that's no problem. You can squeeze things down to infinite

639
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: density and zero velocity. That's the singularity at the heart

640
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 1: of a black hole, for example. CIS says No, as

641
00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:03,880
Speaker 1: you squeeze things down, they get higher and higher energy,

642
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,119
Speaker 1: and so it's impossible to get things down to zero velocity.

643
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,880
Speaker 1: But the crux is which wins at these very high

644
00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,520
Speaker 1: I densities. What's actually going on inside a black hole?

645
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 1: As you've pointed out, many times. I'm biased towards quantum mechanics,

646
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,600
Speaker 1: and I suspect that we can extrapolate from quantum mechanics

647
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:19,640
Speaker 1: and think that whatever is going on at the heart

648
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 1: of black holes or in neutron stars or in Nole's

649
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 1: kitchen is going to be more like quantum mechanics than

650
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,080
Speaker 1: like general relativity. But I could be wrong, and it

651
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 1: could be very surprising, and it could be more gravitational,

652
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:31,719
Speaker 1: more classical than we expect.

653
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:34,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, I'm definitely in the vanilla camp. I

654
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:38,240
Speaker 2: think vanilla wins at the end, meaning like maybe general

655
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 2: relativity wins at the end, and maybe things do freeze

656
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,360
Speaker 2: and then stop moving, right, yeah, or you know, at

657
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,600
Speaker 2: some point you make a black hole if you squeeze

658
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:49,200
Speaker 2: things enough, which technically does freeze time. Right, isn't time

659
00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 2: frozen on the surface of a black hole? And definitely

660
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 2: just inside of a black hole, is in time technically frozen.

661
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,640
Speaker 1: M Yes. Absolutely. Then again, we have all sorts of

662
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: reasons why we think general relativity must to be wrong

663
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,600
Speaker 1: and can't be an accurate description of what's going on

664
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 1: in the universe. But again, it's a big open question.

665
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:07,720
Speaker 1: We don't know the answer to these things. And we

666
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: could certainly be wrong. All we can do right now

667
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 1: is extrapolate from quantum mechanics, or extrapolate from general relativity,

668
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,320
Speaker 1: or wait until some genius combines the two and gives

669
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 1: us a picture of quantum gravity.

670
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 2: Mmm, so somebody makes neopolitan ice cream out of a

671
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 2: black hole? No, but with the black hole, don't we

672
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,040
Speaker 2: know they look like that. Time stops on the surface

673
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:29,920
Speaker 2: of a black hole, so it wouldn't that technically freeze things?

674
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 2: As Noel suggests.

675
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 1: Time stops at the event horizon for a distant observer.

676
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 1: For somebody falling into a black hole, time doesn't stop,

677
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 1: and you can continue to do your dance, or eat

678
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 1: your ice cream, or take a bite out of whatever

679
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 1: else you see inside the black hole.

680
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, but to us, they would appear frozen.

681
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,720
Speaker 1: To us, they would appear frozen. Yes, but again that

682
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: violates quantum mechanics. So who knows if it's really true?

683
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:52,680
Speaker 1: But yes, general relativity allows things to freeze to zero velocity.

684
00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 2: All right, Well, no, I guess that's the answer for you.

685
00:29:56,320 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 2: Daniel doesn't know. Nobody knows on that angel question of

686
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 2: what's going on inside of a black hole, because that's

687
00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 2: the ultimate I guess a squeezing of things due to

688
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 2: gravitational pressure.

689
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 1: I feel like as this podcast goes along, more and

690
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 1: more the questions have the same answer, which is, we

691
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:14,960
Speaker 1: don't know because we don't know quantum gravity.

692
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,520
Speaker 2: Gosh, why did you just fix that? Daniel, let's figure

693
00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:20,040
Speaker 2: it out. What are you doing spending time on this

694
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:23,240
Speaker 2: podcast when you can be solving the biggest question we have?

695
00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, just before we recorded this, I was eating

696
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: some pineapple cake and trying to think deeply about the

697
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:31,880
Speaker 1: nature of condensed matter. But I didn't quite figure it out.

698
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 2: It didn't work. Huh. Just gonna have to keep on trying. Yeah,

699
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,120
Speaker 2: I'm sure your doctor will have something to say about that.

700
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 2: All right, well, thanks for that question. Now, now let's

701
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,960
Speaker 2: get to our last question. This one is about orbital

702
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 2: dynamics and shared atmosphere, so let's explore that out there

703
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 2: in space. But first let's take another quick break.

704
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 5: All right.

705
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 2: We're askering listener questions here today, and our last question

706
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 2: here comes from Joe Hey.

707
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 6: Daniel, and Jorge. I had a question about something I

708
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:14,520
Speaker 6: saw on the show Foundation, where a planet and its

709
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 6: moon shared an atmosphere, and I was wondering if that's

710
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 6: actually possible. I look forward to hearing what you guys

711
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 6: have to say.

712
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 2: All right, cool question. That's a fun show. Do you

713
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 2: watch that show, Daniel?

714
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I read all these books and I watched the show.

715
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 1: It's a lot of fun and I love that scene

716
00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:30,480
Speaker 1: that he's talking about.

717
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 2: So I read all the books several times when I

718
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 2: was younger, and I was very excited about the show.

719
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 2: Loved the first season. Second season, I was like, I'm out.

720
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:42,160
Speaker 2: It just deviated a little bit too much from the

721
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 2: books for my day. So I guess this is thank

722
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 2: be a spoiler, but I'm probably not gonna watch it,

723
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 2: so I guess we can talk about it.

724
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, this doesn't really spoil any of the plot. It's

725
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:52,080
Speaker 1: just a really cool, clever scene. One of the things

726
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 1: I liked about the show is that it did dv

727
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:55,720
Speaker 1: from the books. It sort of lives in the same

728
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 1: universe as the books, but doesn't just take those storylines,

729
00:31:59,080 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: which I thought.

730
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 2: Was creety, You mean it has the same foundation exactly.

731
00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 1: It's fundamentally the same universe.

732
00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 2: Except people have crazy superpowers.

733
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,440
Speaker 1: Right. Yeah, But here Joe's talking about a really striking

734
00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 1: scene where there's a herd of some kind of animal

735
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: and they take a running leap off of a hill

736
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 1: and they land on a moon that's orbiting very very

737
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 1: close by. So there's like continuous atmosphere between the planet

738
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 1: and its moon, so that you can jump from one

739
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 1: to the other.

740
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 2: What how big is this moon in this planet, like

741
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 2: sort of Earth size or what.

742
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great question. I don't remember the details.

743
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 1: It was definitely pretty big in the sky. So this

744
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: is a real size planet and a real size moon,

745
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 1: I mean big enough to have an atmosphere.

746
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 2: So it's more like a dual planet, kind of like

747
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:42,959
Speaker 2: a twin planet sort of.

748
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: One of them was definitely smaller than the other, so

749
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 1: I'm sure astronomers would have a fun time arguing about

750
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 1: whether one was the moon or they were binary planets.

751
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 2: To be like, that's not a moon. So then in

752
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,840
Speaker 2: the show, there's a planet with a large sized moon

753
00:32:56,000 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 2: that is orbiting around the planet, but it's so close

754
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 2: that you can sort of jump between them.

755
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly.

756
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 2: Now there's two things here, like one is this technically possible?

757
00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,200
Speaker 2: Like can you have a moon that big orbiting that

758
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 2: close to a planet? And the other question, I guess

759
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 2: is would they share an atmosphere.

760
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:17,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. So the first question has to do basically

761
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,600
Speaker 1: with gravitational tidal forces, because if you just think about

762
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 1: the planets as points, there's no reason why they can't

763
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 1: orbit super duper close to each other. Like gravity works

764
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: really far away, gravity works really close together. You can

765
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 1: get two things close together and orbiting. The reason it

766
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: might not work is because of the tidal forces.

767
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 2: Wait, wait, you're saying, technically it's possible, like our Moon

768
00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 2: could orbit really close to us enough for us to

769
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:41,680
Speaker 2: jump to it potentially.

770
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 1: Potentially if you ignore the tidal forces. The tidal forces

771
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 1: are the crux of the issue.

772
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 2: But something that big orbiting wouldn't it have to be

773
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 2: going super duper fast, Like what are the orbital dynamics there?

774
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, the closer you get, the smaller the radio

775
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 1: is the higher of the velocity. So if you were

776
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 1: like orbiting the Earth one meter above its surface, you'd

777
00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:01,160
Speaker 1: have to go very very fast, where you could be

778
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,000
Speaker 1: moving more slowly if you were further away.

779
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 2: I feel like I've seen a YouTube video about this,

780
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:08,440
Speaker 2: which I know is not the most reliable source, but

781
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 2: I think at some point like you wouldn't get a

782
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,239
Speaker 2: stable orbit like at some point the Moon would start

783
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,759
Speaker 2: to spiral in and fall to the Earth. Maybe there's

784
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 2: no actual orbit that could make that work.

785
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:20,800
Speaker 1: Well, the equations are pretty simple if you're talking about

786
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:23,400
Speaker 1: just two points, and if you're ignoring things like drag

787
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:27,120
Speaker 1: and tidle forces, then you can have orbits at any stage,

788
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:29,160
Speaker 1: Like you could have two grains of sand orbiting each

789
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 1: other in deep space very close together.

790
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 2: But wouldn't they be going super duper fast or wouldn't

791
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,960
Speaker 2: the orbits be like super stretched out.

792
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, they certainly could. But if again, if it's just

793
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:42,280
Speaker 1: two points with no drag, no friction, no tidle forces,

794
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:43,520
Speaker 1: then the math is pretty simple.

795
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 2: All right, so it sounds like it's possible, but you're

796
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:48,320
Speaker 2: saying tidle forces would make this impossible exactly.

797
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 1: You can calculate the gravity between two points. That's pretty simple.

798
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:53,239
Speaker 1: But now take one of those things and say what

799
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:54,799
Speaker 1: if it's not a point, what if it has real

800
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 1: size to it? You know, inflate it from a point

801
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 1: to like a basketball or a moon or whatever. Now,

802
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 1: part of that thing is closer to the object that's orbiting,

803
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:03,360
Speaker 1: and part of it's further away. You have like the

804
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 1: near side and the far side. Because gravity depends on distance,

805
00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:10,040
Speaker 1: those two pieces are now feeling different amounts of gravity.

806
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 1: The closer side of the Moon feels Earth's gravity more

807
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:14,920
Speaker 1: than the far side of the Moon, for example, and

808
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:17,319
Speaker 1: that's the tidal force. The difference between the strength of

809
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 1: gravity on one side and the other is effectively a

810
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:21,400
Speaker 1: force pulling that object apart.

811
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 2: So there would be a force on the Moon splitting

812
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 2: it into two.

813
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,799
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. And that's why as you approach a black hole,

814
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:32,040
Speaker 1: for example, the tidal forces can pull you apart because

815
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 1: in really intense gravity, the difference between the force on

816
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 1: your feet and the force on your head can be

817
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:39,680
Speaker 1: enough to overcome the structural integrity of your body. And

818
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 1: this is why, for example, some planets have rings and

819
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 1: some planets have moons, because if the stuff is too

820
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,920
Speaker 1: close to the planet, it's within some limit called the

821
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:50,799
Speaker 1: Roche limit, then the tidal forces of the planet would

822
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,200
Speaker 1: tear apart any moon and turn it into rings.

823
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:56,359
Speaker 2: M So I guess if this moon is not you know,

824
00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:58,759
Speaker 2: stick enough or dense enough or strong enough, it would

825
00:35:58,800 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 2: break apart.

826
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:01,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And so it depends on the structural strength

827
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: of the moon. Like if you have a moon made

828
00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:05,799
Speaker 1: of water. It's much easier to tear apart than if

829
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 1: you had a moon made of diamond, for example. So

830
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:09,960
Speaker 1: it's not just like a hard and fast limit around

831
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:12,359
Speaker 1: any object. You have to take intoccount lots of different things.

832
00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 1: It's a rough guide, so it depends on the masses

833
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:16,640
Speaker 1: of the planets and the rigidity the satellite. But I

834
00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:19,360
Speaker 1: looked into a few calculations, and if you had two earths,

835
00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: for example, and estimating what their structural integrity are, the

836
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: two earths could orbit each other as long as the

837
00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:28,040
Speaker 1: surfaces were more than one thousand kilometers apart.

838
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 2: What which is very little, right.

839
00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:33,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like a sixth of the radius of the Earth. Wow,

840
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 1: so you couldn't jump a thousand kilometers, but a thousand

841
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,720
Speaker 1: kilometers is not that far. The Earth would be really

842
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: big in the sky.

843
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 2: Well, you would only need to jump five hundred kilometers

844
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:44,680
Speaker 2: because then you would get sucked into the gravity of

845
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:45,440
Speaker 2: the other planet.

846
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 1: That's true. But if you jump five hundred kilometers and

847
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 1: you got stuck there, you'd be like right between the

848
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,000
Speaker 1: gravity of the two I guess that would be kind

849
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:52,279
Speaker 1: of cool.

850
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 2: Also, well, it would be kind of unstable, Like how

851
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:56,719
Speaker 2: fast would these two earths be orbiting around each other.

852
00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 2: Did you calculate that?

853
00:36:57,640 --> 00:36:59,799
Speaker 1: I didn't calculate that, But it would be very very.

854
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 2: Fast, super duper fast.

855
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:04,640
Speaker 1: Right, We're duper fast exactly because they have to avoid

856
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:05,759
Speaker 1: falling into each other.

857
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:07,480
Speaker 2: Right, That's what I was trying to say earlier, Like,

858
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:10,200
Speaker 2: at some point these orbits get unreasonably fast.

859
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:11,959
Speaker 1: I guess there could be a limit at the speed

860
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,160
Speaker 1: of light, right, So there might be some radius at

861
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:17,040
Speaker 1: which things need to go faster than the speed of

862
00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 1: light to avoid falling in and then there's no orbit.

863
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:20,760
Speaker 1: Maybe that's what you're referring to earlier.

864
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,959
Speaker 2: Or you know, at some point you're just spinning too fast,

865
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:25,680
Speaker 2: everything would fly off the surface of the Earth.

866
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:26,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true.

867
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 2: Or that you wouldn't be able to hold an atmosphere maybe, Yeah.

868
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,600
Speaker 1: The atmosphere is definitely an issue also because an atmosphere

869
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,560
Speaker 1: provides drag, right, And so if the Earth has an

870
00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: atmosphere and the other Earth has an atmosphere and they're

871
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:39,400
Speaker 1: that close together, then they're going to be dragging on

872
00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,200
Speaker 1: each other. They're not just flying through empty space conserving

873
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 1: their kinetic energy. They're losing energy the same way that

874
00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:47,640
Speaker 1: like the Iss loses energy as it goes around the

875
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:49,960
Speaker 1: Earth because it's not in very high orbit, and so

876
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of drag there and has to

877
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,400
Speaker 1: constantly like bump itself up to avoid falling into the Earth.

878
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 1: We have an atmosphere and the other Earth has an atmosphere.

879
00:37:57,600 --> 00:37:59,400
Speaker 1: We're orbiting each other that close, we're going to be

880
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:00,799
Speaker 1: dragging on you each other a little bit.

881
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:03,719
Speaker 2: Okay, but it sounds like you're saying it is kind

882
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:06,160
Speaker 2: of possible if this Moon is made out of diamonds

883
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:08,560
Speaker 2: and it's okay that it's going so fast. Yeah, maybe

884
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:11,480
Speaker 2: we don't have such a need for an atmosphere between

885
00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 2: these two planets.

886
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 1: But there's also maybe a solution there, like if you

887
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:17,839
Speaker 1: could end up in like a geosynchronous orbit and get

888
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,320
Speaker 1: tidal locking, like imagine the Moon is basically always above

889
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:23,960
Speaker 1: the same spot on the Earth, you're not actually dragging

890
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 1: through the atmosphere. And if you get tidal locking, so

891
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:28,719
Speaker 1: they're not spinning a relative to each other, the two

892
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:32,160
Speaker 1: faces of the objects are facing each other constantly, then

893
00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:34,760
Speaker 1: you could imagine having an atmosphere. You wouldn't be dragging

894
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,759
Speaker 1: through that atmosphere. The atmosphere would be spinning with the

895
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 1: combined Earth Moon system.

896
00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:42,359
Speaker 2: So if the Moon is made out of diamonds and

897
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:45,880
Speaker 2: we're tidally logged, meaning that the atmosphere is spinning around

898
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 2: with the Moon, then you're saying it's possible. But even

899
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 2: if you're going super super fast like I said earlier,

900
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 2: wouldn't that blow away the atmosphere.

901
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,319
Speaker 1: If you want to be really close, then you can't

902
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:56,400
Speaker 1: be in geosynchronous orbit at the same time. But if

903
00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 1: you were willing to get a little bit further away,

904
00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:01,480
Speaker 1: so the Moon was always above the same location in

905
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 1: the atmosphere, then it wouldn't be moving through our atmosphere,

906
00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:08,120
Speaker 1: so it wouldn't be blowing away all right.

907
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:10,480
Speaker 2: So it sounds like the answer is, yes, it's possible.

908
00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 1: I think it is possible. I think it's very unlikely

909
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,320
Speaker 1: for it to happen, though. I think this wouldn't form naturally.

910
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 1: You'd have to like capture a moon that would have

911
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:20,040
Speaker 1: to come at exactly the right orbit because it need

912
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:22,880
Speaker 1: be perfectly circular. You know, if it goes like elliptical

913
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 1: at all, then it's going like in and out of

914
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:27,800
Speaker 1: the atmosphere. It's going to be dragging. So this seems

915
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:30,760
Speaker 1: very very unlikely to ever see in the universe, even

916
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:32,839
Speaker 1: if you could make all the equations work.

917
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 2: Oh, I see you were saying another possibilities that maybe

918
00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:37,840
Speaker 2: this moon is more like a visitor every once in

919
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 2: a while, Like it's in a very elliptical orbit, and

920
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:42,759
Speaker 2: sometimes it's really far away, and sometimes it comes really

921
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:44,920
Speaker 2: close enough for you to maybe jump from one to

922
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:45,200
Speaker 2: the other.

923
00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:48,239
Speaker 1: Now I was actually saying the opposite. I was saying

924
00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:49,800
Speaker 1: that in order for this to be stable, it have

925
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,160
Speaker 1: to be almost perfectly circular orbit, because if it's elliptical

926
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:54,920
Speaker 1: and it comes that close, then it's going to be

927
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:57,239
Speaker 1: dragging through the atmosphere. What you want is a really

928
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,279
Speaker 1: stable setup that never changes, and to get a the

929
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:03,520
Speaker 1: circular orbit is very challenging. You basically have to capture

930
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 1: a moon in exactly the right situation.

931
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 2: Well, I guess you mean by like having a constant

932
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 2: bridge between the two planets, But maybe I mean I

933
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:13,560
Speaker 2: haven't seen the show, but maybe this only happened once

934
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:13,959
Speaker 2: in a while.

935
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, Like again, if you had a Kardashev

936
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 1: level three civilization, you might be able to engineer this,

937
00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 1: But I wouldn't expect to find this naturally happening in

938
00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 1: the universe.

939
00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:25,640
Speaker 2: What if you're a Kardashian level seven planet.

940
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 1: And your whole planet is made of chocolate cake.

941
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 2: You can have a lot of hot air perhaps, all right, well,

942
00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 2: I guess he asked for Joe is Yeah, the show

943
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,719
Speaker 2: got something that is plausible, right, Yeah.

944
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,440
Speaker 1: If you are a Kardashian level seven civilization and you

945
00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 1: have moons made of diamonds, if you got that much bling,

946
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:42,919
Speaker 1: then yeah, you might be able to pull it off.

947
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:46,600
Speaker 2: And things are kind of perfectly locked in and spinning

948
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 2: slow enough, and it's not spinning fast enough to blow

949
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:51,440
Speaker 2: away your atmosphere. It's potentially possible.

950
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 1: It is potentially possible. Yeah, good luck, Joe.

951
00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 2: Well, I guess the problem is he would have to

952
00:40:55,640 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 2: jump up a lot. All right, Well, that answers all

953
00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 2: of our questions here today. Thanks to everyone who asks questions.

954
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,319
Speaker 1: Thanks very much to everybody who shares your curiosity. It's

955
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:06,400
Speaker 1: the reason why we do this podcast, and it's the

956
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 1: reason why science moves forward. It's our combined curiosity as

957
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:13,319
Speaker 1: a human species that lets us explore the universe. So

958
00:41:13,400 --> 00:41:15,000
Speaker 1: thanks everyone for your support.

959
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:17,959
Speaker 2: We hope you enjoyed that. Thanks for joining us. See

960
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:18,279
Speaker 2: you next.

961
00:41:18,320 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: Time for more science and curiosity. Come find us on

962
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:29,239
Speaker 1: social media, where we answer questions and post videos. We're

963
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:33,440
Speaker 1: on Twitter, Discorg, Insta, and now TikTok. Thanks for listening

964
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 1: and remember that Daniel and Jorge Explain the Universe is

965
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:40,839
Speaker 1: a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit

966
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to

967
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: your favorite shows.