Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Strictly Business, the podcast in
Speaker 1: which we speak with some of the brightest minds working
Speaker 1: in the media business today. I'm Andrew Wallenstein with Variety.
Speaker 1: This week, we are talking about the Emmy Awards that
Speaker 1: aired just a few days ago and registered record low
Speaker 1: ratings and why that is. Well, we'll get into that
Speaker 1: right after the break, and we are back with the
Speaker 1: Strictly Business podcast. It's just me for this episode, no guest,
Speaker 1: but there's plenty to talk about with regard to Monday's
Speaker 1: Emmy Awards. Why well, let's start with record low ratings
Speaker 1: four point three million viewers to be exact. But before
Speaker 1: you ring the alarm for the TV industry, let's not
Speaker 1: panic just yet. There's a lot of reasons we'll get
Speaker 1: into that. There's actually nothing to panic about for the
Speaker 1: Emmys on its seventy fifth anniversary night. And I'm not
Speaker 1: saying they should be popping bottles over at the TV
Speaker 1: Academy either. Bad ratings are bad ratings, but there's a
Speaker 1: whole bunch of extenuating factors we're going to explore that
Speaker 1: should put Monday's ratings into context. I'm not saying it's
Speaker 1: an aberration. I wouldn't predict we're going to see those
Speaker 1: audience figures bounce back up too high in the coming years,
Speaker 1: but let's hope four point three million is the floor. First,
Speaker 1: let's talk about the show itself. I thought it was
Speaker 1: actually quite good, and most of the reviews I've read agreed.
Speaker 1: Particularly smart was the way the telecast leaned into nostalgia,
Speaker 1: bringing together reunited casts from old TV favorites from Cheers
Speaker 1: to Martin. This was not some poorly produced, sloppy train
Speaker 1: that deserved mass viewer turnout. It wasn't like the TV
Speaker 1: shows that were nominated lack drawing power. Now, there was
Speaker 1: no giant Game of Thrones type hit that lorded high
Speaker 1: above them all, but I'm not even sure that's necessary
Speaker 1: to bring viewers in. The same goes for the choice
Speaker 1: of host, which, let's be honest, Anthony Anderson is not
Speaker 1: exactly an A list name, and there was some share
Speaker 1: of controversy due to some scandals in his past, but
Speaker 1: he was actually quite good, beginning to end. The recurring
Speaker 1: bit with his mother in the audience was comedy gold
Speaker 1: all night long, which is really hard to pull off,
Speaker 1: So let's give him some extra credit. On that one.
Speaker 1: All in all, though nothing intrinsically wrong with the Emmy
Speaker 1: production on that I really don't think there's an argument
Speaker 1: to be made otherwise. So what went wrong, Well, I
Speaker 1: think you could argue practically everything else. For starters, Let's
Speaker 1: not forget that the show was airing three months later
Speaker 1: than it actually does thanks to the writers and actors strikes.
Speaker 1: I was actually wondering whether the ems might actually find
Speaker 1: out that airing outside of September might turn out to
Speaker 1: its advantage, but that was not to be. No to
Speaker 1: the contrary, I think what really hurt was that it
Speaker 1: aired just a week after the Golden Globes aired, and
Speaker 1: on that note, the Emmys felt very repetitive, at least
Speaker 1: the Globes, which disclaimer time this podcast is owned by
Speaker 1: Penske Media, which has an ownership stake in that awards franchise.
Speaker 1: The Globes saw a healthy fifty percent ratings uptick year
Speaker 1: over year. But it's not just that it was one
Speaker 1: award show right after the next, or that they both
Speaker 1: award a lot of the same TV categories, but that
Speaker 1: they awarded many of the same TV shows in the
Speaker 1: same TV categories repeatedly succession Beef the Bear. They dominated.
Speaker 1: I think dominated is actually kind of an understatement really
Speaker 1: in all the key categories. I was sick of all
Speaker 1: these shows winning again and again on Globes night. To
Speaker 1: see it happen yet again on any night was really boring,
Speaker 1: even though these shows were actually quite deserving of their honors.
Speaker 1: But to be honest, Succession's final season has been off
Speaker 1: the air for a very long time. To see it
Speaker 1: take a victory lap yet again after all this time, well,
Speaker 1: let's just say it only added to a feeling of
Speaker 1: staldness for both of those award shows. Not so much
Speaker 1: for The Bear, though, which just came off another critically
Speaker 1: acclaimed season more recently, if anything, with star Jeremy Allen
Speaker 1: White enjoying quite a moment for himself these days, with
Speaker 1: a scantily clad Calvin kleinad and heavy rotation and a
Speaker 1: relatively new movie making the rounds during Award season, that
Speaker 1: show at least gave the Emmys an adjult of some timeliness,
Speaker 1: maybe some hipness. I'm actually curious to see if the
Speaker 1: combination of the Emmys and the Globes or giving both
Speaker 1: The Bear and Beef quite a sampling boost on their
Speaker 1: respecting streaming services right now, But I digress also not
Speaker 1: helping the Emmy ratings on Monday night. Besides well, airing
Speaker 1: on Monday night as opposed to a Sunday was the competition.
Speaker 1: The combination of an NFL wild Card game and coverage
Speaker 1: of the Iowa Caucuses that certainly wasn't gonna help. Even
Speaker 1: just one of those alternatives was bound to wreak havoc
Speaker 1: on the ratings. Two of them together, well that's like
Speaker 1: a death sentence. Which isn't to say there's a great
Speaker 1: deal of over life between awards show watchers, football fans,
Speaker 1: and political junkies, but there's certainly enough to cause problems.
Speaker 1: And let's not forget it's not like the Emmys were
Speaker 1: flying high coming into twenty twenty four. Anyway. To the contrary,
Speaker 1: this franchise has been a fairly steady tail spin for
Speaker 1: quite some time. The last show registered a five point
Speaker 1: nine million, which makes the drop to four point three
Speaker 1: million pretty sizable, but it's sobering to think back to
Speaker 1: like twenty sixteen and twenty seventeen, there was eleven point
Speaker 1: four million total viewers, and it's been ticking down ever since,
Speaker 1: except for a nice recovery in twenty twenty one, when
Speaker 1: after dropping to six point four million in twenty twenty,
Speaker 1: it bounced back up to seven point eight million. Now,
Speaker 1: could we see yet another bounce back in twenty twenty five?
Speaker 1: You know, I would bet so. You're not going to
Speaker 1: see another perfect storm of contributing calamities like twenty twenty
Speaker 1: four delivered anytime soon, you know, I'd say the only
Speaker 1: thing that could really hurt the Emmys is the continuing
Speaker 1: fragmentation of the TV universe, the fact that what we
Speaker 1: called a hit five to ten years ago, the kind
Speaker 1: of show that brought together tens of millions, is becoming
Speaker 1: rarer and rarer. But even that isn't necessarily a death
Speaker 1: warrant for the Emmys, you know, I think there's also
Speaker 1: just a broader issue with award shows in general. Others
Speaker 1: are feeling this as well, The Grammys, the Oscars. They
Speaker 1: all have problems of their own, but in general, award shows,
Speaker 1: they're all facing existential issues. They're all facing calls for
Speaker 1: how do we reinvent the format. The Globes in particular,
Speaker 1: I think, face this notion of after going through a
Speaker 1: real sense of going through a break in the action
Speaker 1: for a year. Are they going to come back? Are
Speaker 1: they going to try something completely different? And people, to
Speaker 1: some degree were disappointed, Well, they came back with a
Speaker 1: very traditional show. There was this notion of, well, why
Speaker 1: not shake things up? A lot of these shows don't
Speaker 1: really end up doing that kind of thing. I would
Speaker 1: be very surprised to see the Emmys do that kind
Speaker 1: of thing, and we have not seen any of these
Speaker 1: franchises really deviate from the tried and true. It takes
Speaker 1: a lot of guts to do that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: When you think about the kinds of academies attached to
Speaker 1: these shows that by and large don't want to really gamble.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of traditionalists attached to these shows. Now,
Speaker 1: if you really did try to shake things up and
Speaker 1: try to very different format, would that necessarily put butts
Speaker 1: in seats or butts and couches? Is more to the point,
Speaker 1: I'm dubious that that is the case. I don't necessarily
Speaker 1: know that that is really going to be the thing
Speaker 1: that would juice the ratings for the Emmys or anyone else.
Speaker 1: I do think that award shows in general, it really
Speaker 1: comes down to some very basic things like people wanting
Speaker 1: to tune in for stars making appearances, and maybe stars
Speaker 1: need to do very different things than just get up
Speaker 1: in front of microphones and make the traditional speeches. It
Speaker 1: also is about the kinds of shows or movies that
Speaker 1: are being awarded. But beyond those kind of traditional things,
Speaker 1: I'm not so sure that shaking up traditional formats, as
Speaker 1: many critics point out, really will amount to much. We're
Speaker 1: going to take a break, but when we get back,
Speaker 1: we're going to talk talk more about the Emmys. So
Speaker 1: stick around and we are back with more on the
Speaker 1: Emmy ratings. Look, wherever there are great shows, there are
Speaker 1: fans that are getting behind them, rooting for them in
Speaker 1: competition with other shows, and the fans that love them.
Speaker 1: Even when the very definition of what you call TV
Speaker 1: shows migrates to places like I don't know, TikTok and
Speaker 1: sure laugh now, But I don't think those days are
Speaker 1: that far away. I think places like the Emmys will
Speaker 1: bring us all together to celebrate what success is. Time
Speaker 1: will tell. But while we're talking about award shows, it's
Speaker 1: never too early to look ahead at what's coming next.
Speaker 1: And next month will bring the Grammy Awards. That's going
Speaker 1: to be the next big one coming to CBS on
Speaker 1: February fourth, And I think that's going to be a
Speaker 1: very different story than the one that we just saw
Speaker 1: for the Emmy Awards, which while that one of course
Speaker 1: hit a record low, the Grammys are coming off a
Speaker 1: great performance in twenty twenty three, their best TV ratings
Speaker 1: in three years. Of course, that of course sets up
Speaker 1: a tough comparison. Can they keep it going and continue
Speaker 1: to rise for yet another year? Well, never too early
Speaker 1: to see the drumbeat start for the award show season,
Speaker 1: and the Grammys have already begun to announce performers that
Speaker 1: are going to be appearing on the Grammy Stage on CBS.
Speaker 1: Billie Eilish, Dualipa, Olivia Rodrigo. You know, right there probably
Speaker 1: three among the top ten biggest artists in the game.
Speaker 1: No Taylor Swift, there, no Beyonce. Never mind, these are
Speaker 1: still real big chart toppers. And when it comes to
Speaker 1: the Grammys, and this is of course a huge advantage
Speaker 1: they have over things like the Emmys or the Oscars.
Speaker 1: It is who performs, not who's necessarily up in the
Speaker 1: biggest categories or who's sitting in the audience. Who performs
Speaker 1: that really dictates audience and so when you have three
Speaker 1: heavy hitters like that that are going to be performing,
Speaker 1: that's going to tell you a lot about who's going
Speaker 1: to be showing up to watch for the sixty six
Speaker 1: and you will Grammy Awards, and we're just getting started.
Speaker 1: You're going to obviously see a lot of other performers
Speaker 1: that are going to be joining that stage. And my
Speaker 1: guess is you're also going to see performers that are
Speaker 1: probably from previous generation. Grammys are always good at getting
Speaker 1: people from not just who are the current chart toppers,
Speaker 1: but also the performers of old and so that is
Speaker 1: really a very good sign for the Grammys. Will it
Speaker 1: be good enough for them to continue a growth story
Speaker 1: that from a ratings perspective has been in a really
Speaker 1: good place for the past three where I should say
Speaker 1: in a good place since twenty twenty three very well
Speaker 1: could be. That number in twenty three, to be more precise,
Speaker 1: was twelve point five million viewers. That was up from
Speaker 1: nine point two in twenty twenty one nine point six
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty two, a very far cry from the
Speaker 1: heights of say twenty sixteen or twenty seventeen, when it
Speaker 1: was as high as twenty five million, twenty six point
Speaker 1: one million. Still, this is really quite a comeback story.
Speaker 1: And that's of course also to speak nothing of the
Speaker 1: demo numbers, what they get in the eighteen to forty
Speaker 1: nine range, where it used to be as high as
Speaker 1: seven point seven million, seven point eight it's now dipped
Speaker 1: below the three million number. But still, the Grammys is
Speaker 1: quite a success story at CBS, and I don't think
Speaker 1: it's necessarily about the nominations there. It really is about
Speaker 1: who shows up on that stage, and so I think
Speaker 1: the Grammys is something that is poised to be a
Speaker 1: big story. The Academy Awards is a little farther out,
Speaker 1: but it is also a similar story there, where after
Speaker 1: bottoming out, say and around twenty twenty one, down to
Speaker 1: ten point four million, after climbing way way high to
Speaker 1: thirty four million north of that in twenty sixteen, it
Speaker 1: has slowly gone back up in twenty two and twenty three,
Speaker 1: going to sixteen point six million eighteen point eight million.
Speaker 1: It's going to be interesting to see if, just like
Speaker 1: with the Grammys, whether that growth story continues. Awards shows
Speaker 1: are a very tough business to be in, but we've
Speaker 1: seen in recent years from the oscars from the Grammys
Speaker 1: that when you do it right, when you put the
Speaker 1: right energy, the right production values, and you make smart choices,
Speaker 1: you can do the right things. And I think v
Speaker 1: Emmys are now at a place where they're going to
Speaker 1: have to make some hard choices, and once they get
Speaker 1: rid of all the mitigating factors that made twenty twenty
Speaker 1: four such a disaster, they will probably find their way
Speaker 1: back to success in twenty twenty five. I know I'm
Speaker 1: certainly rooting for them, and so we'll have to check
Speaker 1: back then. Anyway, that's enough for me this week. We'll
Speaker 1: be back with another episode of Strictly Business next week.
Speaker 1: Thank you for tuning in. M