1 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:06,840 Speaker 1: Welcome to Unaddiction the Podcast. My name is doctor Zinga Harrison. 2 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:10,680 Speaker 1: I'm a board certified psychiatrist with a specialty in addiction 3 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: medicine and co founder and chief medical officer of Eleanor Health. 4 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: On this podcast, we explore the paths that can lead 5 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: to addiction and the infinite paths that can lead to recovery. 6 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: Our guests are sharing their own experiences, the tools that 7 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 1: have helped them along the way, and the formulas that 8 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 1: allow them to thrive in recovery one day at a time. 9 00:00:39,240 --> 00:00:41,960 Speaker 1: This week, shamik Wo Holtz Claude joins us on the pod. 10 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 1: I loved this conversation so much, not just because she's amazing, 11 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 1: because she is, but also because she takes us deep 12 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 1: on how high performing kids can actually really be suffering 13 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: and how we often don't recognize it. And so we 14 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 1: talk about the question how do we recognize and how 15 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:04,319 Speaker 1: do we help our kids before the crisis happens. So 16 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 1: let me tell you a little bit about her and 17 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:09,920 Speaker 1: then we'll jump into the show. Shamiquah Holds Clau was 18 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: born and raised in Queens, New York. She first made 19 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:15,760 Speaker 1: her mark as a high school basketball star at Christ 20 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:18,839 Speaker 1: the King High School and went on to play collegiately 21 00:01:18,920 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: for the women's basketball powerhouse University of Tennessee Lady Valls 22 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:27,200 Speaker 1: under the coaching of Hall of Fame coach Pat Summit. 23 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 1: Shamiqua's professional career included being the number one pick in 24 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 1: the w NBA Draft by the Washington Mystics and winning 25 00:01:36,040 --> 00:01:39,039 Speaker 1: the Olympic gold medal with Team USA at the two 26 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: thousand Sydney Olympic Games. So why is she joining the pod? 27 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: Both of Shamika's birth parents struggle with alcoholism, which ultimately 28 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:52,480 Speaker 1: led her parents to losing custody of her. After experiencing 29 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 1: her own mental health crisis as an adult, Shamiqua dedicated 30 00:01:56,640 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 1: her life's work to mental health and wellness activism. Shamikua, 31 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: so glad to have you on the show. And also 32 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:08,240 Speaker 1: just I think having conversations is the way we will 33 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: make a change. And I know that we have so 34 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:15,240 Speaker 1: much stigma, which I hate. You can hear it in 35 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: my voice that it can be hard to have this conversation. 36 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 1: So I appreciate you giving yourself in this way for 37 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:25,080 Speaker 1: the next whatever we're going to do. 38 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 2: Thirty minutes ish. 39 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:28,520 Speaker 3: All right, thank you, Thank you. For having me. 40 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 2: Thank you. 41 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 1: So okay, I'm going to give you a heads up 42 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: to the final exam. It's the last question. Everybody scores 43 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: one hundred percent because they're all no wrong answers. The 44 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 1: podcast is meant to raise awareness of the book n Addiction. 45 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: So this is Unaddictioned the podcast the book thank you 46 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:49,000 Speaker 1: for writing a blurb on the back of it is Unaddictioned. 47 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 1: Six mind changing conversations that could save a life. And 48 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:55,079 Speaker 1: when we were coming up with the title, we made 49 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:58,240 Speaker 1: up the word on addiction with the idea that we 50 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:03,200 Speaker 1: would be helping people unlearn the unhelpful things they think 51 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 1: they know about addiction, undo the stigma that surrounds addiction, 52 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 1: and uncover the conversations that we need to make it 53 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:16,639 Speaker 1: safe to have if we really want to make a difference. 54 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:22,320 Speaker 1: And so the final exam question is what is one 55 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:27,760 Speaker 1: thing you would hope our listeners from your experience and 56 00:03:27,800 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 1: from sharing your story, one thing you would hope they 57 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: would unlearn, or one stigma they would be proactively trying 58 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:40,200 Speaker 1: to undo, or one conversation they would be trying to uncover. 59 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 2: You'll have to have three, just one. That's why I 60 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:45,480 Speaker 2: give it to you. 61 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 1: In the beginning so it can be percolating as we talk, 62 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: and then we'll come back to it at the end. Okay, alrighty, 63 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 1: so let's just open up. Tell us about Shamikua. Who 64 00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: are you? How did you come to be who you are? 65 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 1: What has your ex experience with addiction in your life? 66 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 2: Then? 67 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 3: Well, I was born to Willie Johnson and Benita Holtzklaw 68 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:12,720 Speaker 3: in New York City, and I grew up in a 69 00:04:12,760 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 3: household with my mom and dad. So I was about 70 00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:19,920 Speaker 3: age eleven. My situation was both my parents struggled with alcoholism. 71 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 3: And now that I'm older, I can see, you know, 72 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 3: my mom was I think she graduated high school with 73 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 3: me and her stomach. And I later found out that 74 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 3: my dad when I was in college, that my dad 75 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 3: had schizophrenic disorder. So now I can see how my 76 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 3: parents really were like going through a lot, you know, 77 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 3: trying to manage and unfortunately things kind of got out 78 00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 3: of hand and me and my brother were like taken away. 79 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 3: We were like literally taken away by the State of 80 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 3: New York after a situation, and we went to go 81 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 3: live with my grandmother, my mom's mom. 82 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 2: And this is your older brother or your baby. 83 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 3: My younger brother, my baby brother three years younger. I 84 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 3: was probably the age of eleven, So a lot was 85 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,919 Speaker 3: happening for me, you know, just because that household, people 86 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:09,960 Speaker 3: look at it, they said, it's dysfunctional, right, it still 87 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:12,280 Speaker 3: like was a comfort for me. That's my mom and dad, 88 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:17,159 Speaker 3: you know. Like so being taken away, I left like 89 00:05:17,200 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 3: a middle class area to go live with my grandmother 90 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,279 Speaker 3: who was like at a story of housing projects in 91 00:05:22,279 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 3: New York City. So it was a big adjustment for me. 92 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:28,880 Speaker 3: And I was basically like in the morning, I was 93 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 3: going through a really difficult time missing mom and dad, 94 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 3: not really understanding that they have like an illness, you know. 95 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,760 Speaker 3: So I was the kid I always tell people, like 96 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 3: the kid that was you know you watch on television 97 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:46,040 Speaker 3: that has the backpack waiting for the parents to come, 98 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:48,359 Speaker 3: you know, to come to visit, and then they wouldn't 99 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:51,720 Speaker 3: show up, and I would have these outbursts or temper 100 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 3: tantrums as my grandmother used. 101 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 2: To call them. 102 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,919 Speaker 3: And she realized that I needed help, right, that I 103 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:01,920 Speaker 3: need to talk to somebody. But you gotta understand. Also 104 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,919 Speaker 3: on the flip side, here's my grandmother saying, what happens 105 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,360 Speaker 3: in your household stays in your household, you know, that 106 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:12,040 Speaker 3: whole conversation and these streets because now I'm in a 107 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,159 Speaker 3: different area. All that anger frustration that you feel, you 108 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:18,320 Speaker 3: can't let that out, let that out out there because 109 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:21,560 Speaker 3: you could get hurt. So I'm just, you know, trying 110 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 3: to find myself. You know, I wanted to wear my grandma, 111 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:26,680 Speaker 3: what color you want to paint your room black? She 112 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 3: took me, took me shopping, so she knew something was wrong, 113 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 3: so she gets me help. Right, my grandmother, I felt 114 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 3: like was ahead of her time when it comes to 115 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 3: our family and realizing that some people need therapy, you know, 116 00:06:39,440 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 3: and I win. But you know, you tell a young 117 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:44,560 Speaker 3: kid this, and now I'm in at the community center 118 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:48,599 Speaker 3: getting therapy. I'm living in an inner city environment, so 119 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:52,080 Speaker 3: it's a lot of minorities. And I go into therapy 120 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 3: and I don't identify with the guy that's there. You know, 121 00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 3: he's a younger, white male or whatever. But he wants 122 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:00,839 Speaker 3: to connect with me through back. So he has a 123 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:04,280 Speaker 3: little nerve group up and I found myself okay listening 124 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:06,039 Speaker 3: to him. You're shooting around and he's like, can you 125 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:08,400 Speaker 3: please talk about your family? I'm like, hold up, Wait 126 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 3: a minute, hold up, Like sorry, I just took your 127 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:16,440 Speaker 3: nerve basketball Okay, right, Like I don't know you, and 128 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:19,240 Speaker 3: I think for me at a young age, because of 129 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 3: that feeling uncomfortable, not feeling a connection, I learned to 130 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 3: mask my feelings in my emotions and you know, it 131 00:07:27,440 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 3: was it's been like a game for me, you know, 132 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 3: into my adulthood. It's like I figured out just what 133 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 3: to say to offer that relief to my grandmother or 134 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 3: whoever was the authority figure, you know, coaches or whatever. 135 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 3: And so the thing that taught me what love was 136 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:47,080 Speaker 3: I've sort of sort of opened my eyes was the 137 00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 3: Ala Team program. My grandmother took me there. Now that 138 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:53,679 Speaker 3: was a great call because I learned that my parents, 139 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 3: you know, at a young age and superheroes. Right, So 140 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 3: I'm thinking they hate me? Why did they do this 141 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 3: to our family? And I realize that they're sick, you know, 142 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 3: they're sick. They're trying to figure it out, but they 143 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 3: love me. They're going to get better. So that's sort 144 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 3: of like my youth and what I went through, and 145 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 3: you know, we could dive deeper into like later in 146 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 3: life as we go. All. 147 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:20,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, No, that was such a beautiful walking us through 148 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:23,960 Speaker 1: your childhood, and I hear so many things in there 149 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:28,680 Speaker 1: that I want to pull out. One shout out to Grandma, 150 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:31,240 Speaker 1: like you said, for being ahead of her time. Yes, 151 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: shout out to Alatine, so Jada, if we can drop 152 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:39,439 Speaker 1: in the show notes. Alatine is a specific program fourteens 153 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:45,280 Speaker 1: who have parental figures with alcoholism and provides that support because, 154 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:48,360 Speaker 1: like you said, Shamika, as cool as I think I am, 155 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:49,280 Speaker 1: I am now. 156 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,319 Speaker 2: An old lady in the eyes of. 157 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:53,520 Speaker 1: An eleven year old or a twelve year old, right, 158 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:57,959 Speaker 1: And being able to be with people your own age 159 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:01,960 Speaker 1: who are sharing a similar experience gives you that connection 160 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:05,240 Speaker 1: to be able to share without feeling like you're going 161 00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: to be judged because they can understand. 162 00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 2: And then also we. 163 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 1: Often see kids acting out when they need help. Eleven 164 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:17,080 Speaker 1: is such a tender time, even if you hadn't been 165 00:09:17,120 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 1: removed from your parents home with the systems think they're 166 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 1: doing the best thing for kids, right. But we talk 167 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 1: about this concept of aces in the book Adverse Childhood Experiences, 168 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,319 Speaker 1: and one of those is being taken from your home, 169 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:33,319 Speaker 1: and I tell the story about how disruptive that is 170 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:37,200 Speaker 1: for kids emotionally in terms of having patterns that you're 171 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,280 Speaker 1: used to. Yep, this narrative that you build for yourself. 172 00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 1: My parents didn't want me, when really your parents had 173 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 1: an illness. Your parents do want you, and the illness 174 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 1: prevents them from being able to have you. 175 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 2: Right. And so like all of. 176 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:52,920 Speaker 1: Those things you just shared, I think so many people 177 00:09:53,520 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 1: will be able to grab on to. And I wanted 178 00:09:57,000 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: this last thing. I want to emphasize that you said 179 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:02,680 Speaker 1: we often hear about kids acting out. You figured out 180 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: how to not act out, how to make the adults 181 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:09,439 Speaker 1: all around you feel safe even though you didn't feel 182 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: better inside. 183 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:12,840 Speaker 2: And there are so many kids. 184 00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 1: This is a ticking time bomb, right, It's an effective 185 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 1: strategy for all of the adults to feel better, so 186 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:22,880 Speaker 1: you can get some space, and then that time bomb 187 00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 1: is ticking inside. 188 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:25,680 Speaker 2: So can you keep walking us forward? 189 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 3: Yeah? So for me making and making my grandmother feel 190 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:31,240 Speaker 3: better because I looked at my grandmother that I had 191 00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 3: so much respect for her, Like, you know, she raised 192 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 3: her kids, they all went to college and stuff, and 193 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 3: so she had blond faith to take me and my 194 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:41,520 Speaker 3: brother owned. So I didn't want to be a problem, right, 195 00:10:41,559 --> 00:10:43,840 Speaker 3: I just wanted you know everything to be okay. So 196 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 3: while I'm having these emotional issues, it was around a 197 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:50,079 Speaker 3: time that like I found a game of basketball, and 198 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 3: for me, my grandmother was so strict. I mean, to 199 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:55,880 Speaker 3: this day, people laugh, you know when they think about 200 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:57,840 Speaker 3: my grandmother coming on a court, wear a shoe to 201 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:02,080 Speaker 3: pop me. Oh, my grandmother did not play. It was 202 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:04,720 Speaker 3: like it was like church, boys and girls club. Everything. 203 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 3: She was just about constructive things and structure. It was 204 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,080 Speaker 3: just like so important. We're Lutheran, so she made sure 205 00:11:12,080 --> 00:11:14,560 Speaker 3: we like she was the head of feeding the homeless people. 206 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 3: It was just like a lot of community, you know. 207 00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 3: And what happened was I found this game and it 208 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 3: was started like giving me confidence, right, And the only 209 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 3: reason I was able to play so much is because 210 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 3: my grandmother could wash me from the basketball. Like the 211 00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:31,360 Speaker 3: window of her apartment was right at the court. So 212 00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 3: she actually let me go because she wasn't just gonna 213 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:34,959 Speaker 3: let me hang out outside, you know. 214 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:37,680 Speaker 2: Sure, because outside it's not entirely safe. 215 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:41,760 Speaker 3: Right We're talking New York City and the late eighties 216 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:45,280 Speaker 3: early nineties. No you're not not a young girl, right, 217 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:47,840 Speaker 3: So she could watch me. And then I started making 218 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 3: friends in the New neighborhood, and my confidence became, you know, 219 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:54,079 Speaker 3: more and more. You know, I was the only girl 220 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 3: out there playing with the guys. And at first they 221 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:58,040 Speaker 3: were like, we don't want a girl playing, but that 222 00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:01,040 Speaker 3: girl became, you know, better than them. So it was 223 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 3: like hello, I was accepting that right, and with that 224 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:08,439 Speaker 3: I found something that was my own right, Like I 225 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 3: felt like empowered this this. You know, sports empowers young ladies, 226 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 3: young men to young boys and girls, but for a 227 00:12:15,640 --> 00:12:17,840 Speaker 3: young lady during this time, it was just like a 228 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:21,920 Speaker 3: confident booster, you know, and I'm like, oh my god, 229 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:24,880 Speaker 3: no one's gonna gonna take this. So I'm out there 230 00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 3: playing with the guys. I get better and better, and 231 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:30,360 Speaker 3: years past and I'm playing on all boys teams with 232 00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:34,120 Speaker 3: you know, playing against like Ron Artest, former NBA player. 233 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:37,000 Speaker 3: I had a world peace and met a world piece, 234 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:39,200 Speaker 3: you know, getting down with all the guys. And it 235 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:42,120 Speaker 3: comes time, you know, to go to high school. And 236 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 3: I was gonna go to Saint John's Prep, which would 237 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:47,400 Speaker 3: have been probably like fifteen minute ride from my house. 238 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:50,920 Speaker 3: And on the flip side, this coach comes mister Kennazarro 239 00:12:51,120 --> 00:12:54,200 Speaker 3: Christ the King High School. He's a retired new York 240 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:57,200 Speaker 3: City detective and he coaches there and he comes down 241 00:12:57,200 --> 00:12:59,160 Speaker 3: to watch me play and he talks to my youth 242 00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:02,080 Speaker 3: coach and my grandmother's like, hey, we want her to 243 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:05,520 Speaker 3: come to Christy King. And my grandmother was like, no. 244 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 2: Way, not happening. 245 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 3: No, it's not it's not happening because if people, in 246 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 3: her mind, if people want to do something for you, 247 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 3: there's a there's an expectation, you know that no one's 248 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:19,480 Speaker 3: doing anything for free. And I begged her and begged her. 249 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 3: I'm like, Grandma, they sent all these players to college. 250 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 3: They were like the number one team in New York. 251 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:26,360 Speaker 3: You know, they say, these players to college. It's a 252 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 3: good academic school, like please, please, please, And after a 253 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:32,559 Speaker 3: month of me begging her every day, she's like, you're 254 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:34,720 Speaker 3: gonna get up because I had to travel hour to 255 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 3: high school on the public transportation hour there our home, 256 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,440 Speaker 3: and she let me go. It was it was worth it. 257 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:44,400 Speaker 3: And so now you know, I'm just coming into my 258 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 3: own you know, I'm all I'm confident. And the thing 259 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 3: about it was the confidence was just like this this topper. 260 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 3: It was still a fragile young lady that didn't really 261 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 3: want to talk about the things she'd been through. I just, 262 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 3: you know, when things were just going so well and 263 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:03,400 Speaker 3: I'm feeling good and opportunities that, you know, I just 264 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 3: kind of sped through to the next day. I went 265 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 3: three out of four, sorry, four out of four championships 266 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 3: at Christy King High School. I become top rated player 267 00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 3: of my class, and I had good grades. I was 268 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 3: a baller. So now it's like I could go to 269 00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 3: any college, Like all the colleges are recruiting me, Like 270 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:23,440 Speaker 3: where's shmik Wiholskna want to go? Now you think about 271 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:25,840 Speaker 3: all this exposure I was getting. I was in I 272 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:28,920 Speaker 3: was uncovered TV Guide in high school. I wrote an 273 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 3: article for like USA Today and still dealing with my 274 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 3: mother gets out of rehab, comes to my darn game 275 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 3: and she got o a rehab at Smithers, which is 276 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 3: a big rehabilitation here in New York for alcoholism. And 277 00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 3: she gets out and I'm walking up the block with 278 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 3: her because I met her. I'm excited, right, my mom's 279 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 3: getting out, and I promise you I heard her and 280 00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 3: this lady say, I can't wait to have a drink. 281 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 3: Three days later, my mom was back drinking, you know, 282 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 3: And I just remember her coming to my game. Imagine 283 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 3: you start right, so you're on the court and I look, 284 00:15:02,600 --> 00:15:05,520 Speaker 3: you always want to hear your mother's voice, right, And 285 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:07,440 Speaker 3: I heard it and I'm like, oh my god. Look, 286 00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 3: I'm like she's drunk. And I just look and I 287 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 3: walk off the court. I walk off the court over 288 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:14,680 Speaker 3: to the locker room. And I'm telling this story to 289 00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 3: say these were moments I learned how to drive because 290 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 3: my dad would pick me up drunk from practice, like 291 00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 3: he would be. I would come outside of practice. He 292 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 3: would be sometimes late, passed out behind it. I'll be like, 293 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 3: all right, move over, drive myself the back way home 294 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 3: on the highway. And so it's just no adult. I 295 00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:37,360 Speaker 3: know my high school coach. I talked to him a 296 00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 3: couple months ago, and I always wondered, like, why didn't 297 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 3: any adults ask me, like how am I doing? 298 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 2: You know, like nobody could see it, no one, no 299 00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 2: one asked me. 300 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:50,800 Speaker 3: He's like, I always check with your grandmother. And then 301 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 3: you seem like everything was okay. 302 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: Because TV Guide four point oh scholarships, right. 303 00:15:58,240 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 3: Since I don't know if it's a four point zero, 304 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 3: it was like it was like a point. 305 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 1: No, right, you're doing you're doing great, right, But those 306 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 1: external things we look at to say, like, the kids 307 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:15,680 Speaker 1: are doing okay, and we have to ask right, right, 308 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: But it's scary to ask because then you get no, 309 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:20,600 Speaker 1: and you're like, I don't even know what to do 310 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:21,240 Speaker 1: with no. 311 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:27,000 Speaker 3: Right right? And you become like whether you're good at sports, academics, whatever, 312 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 3: a music, talent, dancing, when people see greatness in you, right, 313 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:34,120 Speaker 3: it's a term that I use. You become coached. You know, 314 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:37,360 Speaker 3: everybody wanted to make sure to a degree, I'm okay. 315 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:39,400 Speaker 3: So when I would have a blow up in practice, 316 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:41,560 Speaker 3: oh are you a racial meet with the whole teens 317 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:44,760 Speaker 3: rushing to me, you know, everything was to make sure 318 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:47,320 Speaker 3: that I was okay and I was comfortable, but the 319 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 3: emotional issues were never addressed. 320 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. 321 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, And so you said you talked to your coach 322 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 1: a couple of months ago and asked, why didn't you 323 00:16:57,760 --> 00:16:59,000 Speaker 1: ask me how I was doing? 324 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 2: Like you looked like you were fine? Yes, right? 325 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:05,200 Speaker 1: And so how did it get to the point who 326 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:07,360 Speaker 1: asked how old were you? 327 00:17:08,080 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 2: And who wasn't? And then what came from that? 328 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:15,399 Speaker 3: Honestly, I was probably like sophomore year in college and 329 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 3: I was playing at the University of Tennessee for a 330 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 3: legendary Hall of Shame Coach Pat Summit and. 331 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:23,400 Speaker 1: Sorry, I'm going to jump in. Sophomore year of college 332 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:25,160 Speaker 1: is like twenty years old. 333 00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:27,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, I was. I was late in as far as age, 334 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,879 Speaker 3: so yeah, yeah, like nineteen I started. Yeah, nineteen for me, 335 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:32,080 Speaker 3: nineteen twenty, so. 336 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,960 Speaker 2: We're a full decade in from eleven years old. 337 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:38,679 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, and now now I'm getting I'm on a 338 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 3: big stage. Now. We won a championship my freshman year 339 00:17:42,359 --> 00:17:45,480 Speaker 3: in college. It's like, first of all, when I got 340 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:49,800 Speaker 3: to college, I was struggling with feeling like finding my tribe. 341 00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:53,200 Speaker 3: I felt out of place, out of pocket. I didn't realize, 342 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:56,960 Speaker 3: you know, leaving New York City, which is very diverse 343 00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:01,360 Speaker 3: as far as culturally, and moving to Knockville, Tennessee. Back 344 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 3: back in that time, I didn't. I was like, where's 345 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:06,679 Speaker 3: the Hispanic people. We're the aged people, Like it was 346 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:10,720 Speaker 3: very different. So I felt I was really homesick. I'm 347 00:18:10,760 --> 00:18:13,480 Speaker 3: looking for my tribe and my family, and I was 348 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:17,639 Speaker 3: just really like wanted to go back home. But you know, 349 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:21,000 Speaker 3: Coach Summer said, listen, once the season starts, you're gonna 350 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:24,639 Speaker 3: find out what the sisterhood is about and so I 351 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:26,800 Speaker 3: stuck it out and she was right. I have my 352 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:30,280 Speaker 3: sisters and my family, right, we're all here to get 353 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 3: an education. These twelve people on the team, we're all 354 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 3: here to play for coach pat Summit and his university. 355 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:38,639 Speaker 3: So we're like a family. Sports is like a building family. 356 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:41,399 Speaker 3: So things are great. I mean, we're winning, and we 357 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 3: were just want to cover I think a sports illustrator 358 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 3: or something, and all of a sudden, man, I just 359 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:51,760 Speaker 3: I just started feeling really down. And this was like 360 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 3: the heightest success. Started feeling down and like academically my 361 00:18:56,400 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 3: grades started sliding back a little bit. And I remember 362 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:03,040 Speaker 3: telling my friend Antonio. I'm like, something's not right. I said, 363 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 3: I just know all this success and things aren't Things 364 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:09,080 Speaker 3: aren't good. He's like, man, you need to talk to somebody. 365 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,680 Speaker 3: So you know, my mom away from home is the coach. 366 00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 3: I go to coach Summit and I'm like, Coach, something's 367 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:17,000 Speaker 3: not right. Well, I call her on the phone. Let's 368 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:19,160 Speaker 3: talk about this from my dorm because this is before 369 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 3: cell phones, right, So I call her and she's like, 370 00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 3: meet me by the office. I'm like, oh no, no, no, no, stigma, 371 00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 3: because I'm afraid I'm a captain, I'm a leader or 372 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:31,400 Speaker 3: a team. I'm afraid that someone's gonna know that I'm 373 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:34,680 Speaker 3: talking about something so sensitive, you know, like your mind, 374 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:38,200 Speaker 3: because typically people think, oh, like your mind, you're crazy, 375 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:41,359 Speaker 3: you're mentally weak, all these things. So I got to 376 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 3: keep up the show, right, So I said, I know, 377 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:46,800 Speaker 3: can we meet outside the office? And she said fine. 378 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 3: And I remember sitting there and I said, Coach, I 379 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:52,159 Speaker 3: don't know. I just I don't feel like myself. And 380 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,440 Speaker 3: she looks at me and she's like, okay. I said, 381 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 3: I don't feel happy. She's like, okay, we got to 382 00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 3: figure out what makes you happy. And at that age, 383 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 3: I'm like thinking when she said it, I was like, 384 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 3: is it playing video games? I'm like at the time, 385 00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 3: is it hanging with boyfriend or hanging with my friends? 386 00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:09,000 Speaker 3: Like I'm really combing through my mind to try to 387 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,760 Speaker 3: like figure this out. And she said to me, Hey, 388 00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 3: do you want to speak to the sports We had 389 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 3: a sports psychologist on staff. Oh no, because if my 390 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 3: teammates see me were her, they're gonna know something's wrong. 391 00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:26,160 Speaker 3: So stigma was really impacting me. And it wasn't until 392 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:29,160 Speaker 3: coach summit, you know, being ahead of her time said okay, 393 00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 3: you can see somebody off campus. And I'll tell you 394 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:36,120 Speaker 3: that's when things for me, like the colors started coming back. 395 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 3: I started having a better understanding. I would meet with 396 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 3: this woman, you know, like once a week, and we 397 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 3: would just talk about things, and I'm getting you know, 398 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,880 Speaker 3: I'm starting to feel good about myself. I could see 399 00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:49,600 Speaker 3: a shift as far as socially, I can see a shift. 400 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 3: I'm back on my business academically. But it was that 401 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:55,919 Speaker 3: six to seventh visit when I walked in and she 402 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:58,480 Speaker 3: had this window seat and it had like dolls on it, 403 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 3: and she said, all right, day, you know, we all 404 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:04,840 Speaker 3: have like a childlike person inside of us. We're all childlike. 405 00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 3: All right, let's talk about your mom and dad. And 406 00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 3: I shut down and I never went back. And at 407 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 3: that moment, I said, all right, I said, shoumik. But 408 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:16,280 Speaker 3: if I get twenty and ten, that's twenty points, twenty rebounds, 409 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:18,720 Speaker 3: and my grades are good. Nobody's going to think that 410 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:22,040 Speaker 3: anything else is wrong. So I'm just gonna focus on that. 411 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:25,560 Speaker 3: And that was the problem. You know, that's not sustainable. 412 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 3: That's not sustainable, and so you never went back, never 413 00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,160 Speaker 3: never went back, and it was too scary, too too scary, 414 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 3: and I was I just couldn't. I couldn't. I couldn't 415 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,879 Speaker 3: unpack that. I wasn't. I wasn't ready. I wish I was, 416 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 3: because now you know, you're older and the place that 417 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:43,520 Speaker 3: I am now, I look at the younger me, and 418 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 3: I just I you know, you think when you're thrown, 419 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 3: I was young, thrown into the spotlight, you know, like 420 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 3: a game changer. So it was like, you know, you 421 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:55,480 Speaker 3: got to be protective of your environment, you got to 422 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,720 Speaker 3: make good decisions and whatever. And I wish I would 423 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:01,960 Speaker 3: have known their strength and power and being vulnable and 424 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,639 Speaker 3: getting to help you need because a lot of people 425 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:07,040 Speaker 3: I talk to a lot of people on different backgrounds, 426 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:11,000 Speaker 3: but a lot of high performing people, this is their journey. 427 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:14,800 Speaker 3: Maybe not that parents, you know, being alcoholics. 428 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:19,199 Speaker 1: But you're dealing with a lot, right, Yeah, And as 429 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 1: long as I get twenty and ten, nobody'll know. Everybody'll 430 00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 1: think I'm fine, right, nobody will ask And so okay, 431 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 1: we kind of talked about I'll call it like your 432 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:32,600 Speaker 1: first epic, which was like zero to eleven, and then 433 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 1: your second epic was kind of like eleven and going 434 00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: off to college. 435 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:37,680 Speaker 2: And now we're in college. 436 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:42,439 Speaker 1: You have this beautiful experience with the sports psychologists or 437 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:46,040 Speaker 1: the psychologists off campus. But then when we get start 438 00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:48,680 Speaker 1: to get to the route, it's too scary. You step away, 439 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 1: You go back to the twenty ten strategy. Yep, there's 440 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: this concept we always think about the adversity that kids 441 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,040 Speaker 1: have ass people may have heard of it. I mentioned 442 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: one getting taken and going to foster custody. The other 443 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 1: side of that is pieces positive childhood experiences. And what 444 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 1: you really described in that college period was participating in 445 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:19,440 Speaker 1: community traditions, a sense of belonging, feeling supported, having your 446 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,879 Speaker 1: coach who was a parent, who genuinely cared about you. Right, Like, 447 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 1: all of these add up yes to increasing the resilience 448 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 1: that those negative childhood experiences try to erode. But still 449 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 1: until you can get to and I'm going to use 450 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker 1: your words, and let's use this as a jumping point 451 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:43,439 Speaker 1: to the next part of your life, the vulnerability. Having 452 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:48,160 Speaker 1: it be safe to be vulnerable, to have someone else 453 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: know you're not okay, so you can start looking at 454 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 1: what that is bring us into the next part of 455 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:54,879 Speaker 1: your life. 456 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,359 Speaker 3: Well, you know, so when you're people understand when you 457 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:01,240 Speaker 3: were at a high you know, once you tastes a success, 458 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,720 Speaker 3: you constantly like, okay, I'm on this. Since you're young, 459 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,280 Speaker 3: you know, it's like this path is laid out for you, right, 460 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:08,719 Speaker 3: especially in sports, it's like, okay, you play, you go 461 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,720 Speaker 3: to college, you play pro. So now you know, I'm 462 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 3: number one pick in the w NBA draft and consider 463 00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:18,880 Speaker 3: a game changer, you know, I signed you know, big 464 00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:22,399 Speaker 3: deals with Nike, gatorays on my faces, places and stuff. 465 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 3: And I get to go. Now I'm drafted, I get 466 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:26,560 Speaker 3: to leave the South. I'm back on the East coast 467 00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:30,280 Speaker 3: in d C for the Washington Mystics. So light life 468 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:33,880 Speaker 3: is good. But here I am now leaving that protective 469 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:38,119 Speaker 3: environment of my grandmother, right, leaving that protective environment of 470 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,280 Speaker 3: coach Pat Summit to now being you know, twenty one 471 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:45,640 Speaker 3: years old. You know what means in DC by myself 472 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 3: pretty much, you know, and trying to figure figure life out. 473 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:51,679 Speaker 3: You know, here I have my own house, I have 474 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:56,040 Speaker 3: material things, and you know, after a while, I'm just like, 475 00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:58,159 Speaker 3: all right, someone needs to live with me. And I 476 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,160 Speaker 3: have one of my cousins, you know, come stay with me, Sharon, 477 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,719 Speaker 3: and things are going great, like you know, The season 478 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:06,760 Speaker 3: wasn't the best because when you're number one, you go 479 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 3: to the worst team. But I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying 480 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:12,040 Speaker 3: the people and coming into my own trying to figure 481 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 3: this out. And then it was the Olympic year, so 482 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 3: another high. You know, we win gold. That's two thousand 483 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:22,440 Speaker 3: and then my grandmother passes, probably like my third season, 484 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 3: and my world was like shattered. I always tell people 485 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:30,360 Speaker 3: I buried my grandmother and I buried my emotions, so 486 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:34,159 Speaker 3: it went to where I was feeling after like my 487 00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 3: grandmother passed. It was like I was on autopilot. I 488 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:39,520 Speaker 3: had one of my best seasons of my career, I think, 489 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 3: leading the league and scoring and rebounding, but mentally I 490 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:45,600 Speaker 3: was just trying to push through to day. You know. 491 00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,240 Speaker 3: I would try to have dreams about her. I'm like, 492 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,680 Speaker 3: if I dream about her tonight. I was just really suffering, grieving, 493 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:56,199 Speaker 3: you know, and I constantly just pushed through because you 494 00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 3: can't be sad, right, I'm pushing through and pushing through, and. 495 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,800 Speaker 1: Well that's the strategy. That's the twenty ten strategy, right right, 496 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 1: just push through. 497 00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,679 Speaker 3: Yes, And then my grandfather the following year, and let 498 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,720 Speaker 3: me tell you my grandfather. You know, God rest is 499 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,560 Speaker 3: so but we weren't close like that. You know, he 500 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 3: was in my life, so he passed away. But my 501 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:17,800 Speaker 3: therapist was saying it was like a trigger, and I 502 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,520 Speaker 3: guess like I was headed to see my teammates to 503 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 3: hang out, and I pulled over and I was just 504 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 3: overcome with all these emotions and I just remember going 505 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:31,520 Speaker 3: to my place in like days past. I guess I had. 506 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,120 Speaker 3: The doctor said it was like an episode, And next 507 00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 3: thing you know, I'm on ESPN the ticker that people 508 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,880 Speaker 3: told me, and everybody's wondering where I'm at because it's 509 00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 3: the middle of my season and I'm in my place, 510 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 3: you know, really struggling with suicidal ideation. I'm wushing that 511 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 3: my grandmother. I'm just I just didn't want to be 512 00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 3: here any anymore. I just remember I'm laughing even though 513 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,879 Speaker 3: it's like serious. But I just remember like eating fruity 514 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:02,679 Speaker 3: that was like my favorite little cereal, and I do 515 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 3: remember eating those. But I was just like a zombie. 516 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:11,480 Speaker 3: And I know Coach Summit came to town, and you know, 517 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:15,359 Speaker 3: people it came, but it's just like nobody could could 518 00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 3: connect with me. 519 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:20,200 Speaker 1: You were so deep in what sounds like a major 520 00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:26,200 Speaker 1: depressive episode triggered by the grief of really losing your grandmother, 521 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 1: triggered by your granddad. 522 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 2: But this is your how old by this time? Twenty three? 523 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 3: Am? I'm yeah, probably twenty three to twenty four. 524 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:40,239 Speaker 1: Yes, this is twenty four years worth of all of 525 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,639 Speaker 1: that hurt and pain in emotion and always working the 526 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:45,720 Speaker 1: twenty ten formula, right, like being. 527 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:50,440 Speaker 2: A high performer and looking great while suffering on the inside. 528 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:52,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it. 529 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:57,160 Speaker 1: Hits the peak. And so how did you recover from 530 00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:59,920 Speaker 1: that episode? And what have things been like since? 531 00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 3: Oh, recovering from that? So you guys stand in this 532 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:05,680 Speaker 3: the middle of the season, so having to deal with 533 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 3: like the media and whatever, and you know, I'm used 534 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:10,560 Speaker 3: to you know, people can motivate me, people are close 535 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:12,080 Speaker 3: to me. All right, you could get through this. And 536 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:16,800 Speaker 3: my coach gave me the book this called Unquiet Mind 537 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:20,760 Speaker 3: by Kate Kay Jamison, doctor k Jamison from John Hopkins, 538 00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:24,320 Speaker 3: and she lives with bipolar disorder. So I like read 539 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,399 Speaker 3: the book, like one day, I read the book and 540 00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:29,639 Speaker 3: I'm like, Okay, I can do this because that's an 541 00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 3: athlete's mentality, right, And I remember when I when it 542 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,600 Speaker 3: was an emergency the team and then everybody sent me 543 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,160 Speaker 3: to this psychiatrist and a gold Coast in DC. And 544 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:43,239 Speaker 3: I'm in the room. She's telling me I'm suicidal. My 545 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 3: mom's there, and my mom will tell you. She's like 546 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,520 Speaker 3: she didn't recognized me. I'm never They said they had 547 00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 3: to put me on like medication. I want to go 548 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 3: to hospital. I'm going to the hospital, you know. And 549 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 3: then I'm looking like you don't even know me. I 550 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 3: remember being soul like I popped up. I said, how 551 00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,240 Speaker 3: are you giving me medication? And so they get me 552 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,440 Speaker 3: a medication and I'm like, all right, I got this. 553 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,880 Speaker 3: Now you know you you come down. I'm like I 554 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 3: got this. I can go play because I'm a people pleaser, right, 555 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 3: I hop back on the on the court. I never 556 00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:13,400 Speaker 3: forget I'm playing against the Detroit shot. It felt like 557 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:17,280 Speaker 3: really poetry in motion. It was like I'm on this medication. 558 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 3: Everything was like so the slow motion. And I played 559 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 3: that game and that was the last game I ever 560 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 3: played for that team. I grabbed my stuff normally you shower. 561 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 3: I left. I just left and I never returned, and 562 00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:34,760 Speaker 3: I found myself just like trying to run away from 563 00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:38,720 Speaker 3: the intervention. So I went over to Spain. I was 564 00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:43,120 Speaker 3: there in Barcelona by your team. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 565 00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,680 Speaker 3: you know, because I need for me, I just need 566 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 3: to be away from everyone. That's what I think. 567 00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:51,280 Speaker 2: Sure, that's what you thought, So. 568 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:55,080 Speaker 3: That's what I thought. So I'm running. I'm running because 569 00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:57,240 Speaker 3: I don't want to deal with the with the issues, 570 00:29:57,280 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 3: and the press was the media was not so kind 571 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:03,960 Speaker 3: because you know, people can't you know, it's like a 572 00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 3: visible illness, right if people see that you can put 573 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 3: your words together and they see you and they don't 574 00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 3: know what's like going on inside. Sometimes you know, we 575 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 3: judge people. So you know, people wrote like harsh things 576 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,800 Speaker 3: about me, and it was a lot of rulers that sheet. 577 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 3: They said I had like New Gary disease, I was pregnant. 578 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 3: Just a lot of things are starting to come out. 579 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,720 Speaker 3: So I went away. And then for a lot of women, 580 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 3: we played internationally, so I was over there. The Spanish 581 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 3: team found out. I ended up playing over there. Then 582 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 3: I started, you know, getting a little calmer and figuring 583 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 3: this out. And then some media came over from the US. 584 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 3: Andrew Nicholas came, a big reporter came over and did 585 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:47,440 Speaker 3: a piece for like ESPN, and I think it was 586 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:49,520 Speaker 3: probably like one of the first times where like I 587 00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 3: talked about like mental health issues, you know, and I 588 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:56,840 Speaker 3: was afraid, I'm not gonna lie. It took a lot, 589 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:00,280 Speaker 3: and next thing, you know, I go back. I quest 590 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 3: of the trade, DC, don one trade me. So now 591 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 3: I'm going to LA. But I got so much support, 592 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 3: That's what I want to say. Like when I finally 593 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 3: got the courage to talk about my issues, you know, 594 00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:15,920 Speaker 3: people understood, people rally behind me. I just wish I've. 595 00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,640 Speaker 1: Been there, man, But when you're young, you don't know 596 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 1: that because we won't talk about it. And that is 597 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,440 Speaker 1: like I think the number one thing we can do 598 00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 1: for our young people, this is suicide prevention. 599 00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 2: What's the number one message? You are not alone? 600 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, it take. It takes a hard, hard time. 601 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 3: And like for myself, just trying to erase like those 602 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:41,880 Speaker 3: generational curses. Like my son is three, and we talk 603 00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:46,200 Speaker 3: about emotions yes, and feelings. Yes, okay if you feel 604 00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:49,320 Speaker 3: this way, because I don't want to have him because 605 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 3: for me, it's like my life is as a bag. 606 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:56,480 Speaker 3: I'm just packing, packing, pack and packing, and ultimately it exploded. 607 00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,520 Speaker 3: And then when I explode. Everybody just caught off guard, 608 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:02,640 Speaker 3: you know, they're like, what, what is happening? Whatever? But 609 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 3: if I would have did the work, you know, really say, hey, 610 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,360 Speaker 3: you're a top level athlete person, like you're perfectionist to 611 00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:13,440 Speaker 3: a degree, like those people, you need support, You need 612 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:16,600 Speaker 3: to know how to process your thoughts in your mind. 613 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:19,280 Speaker 3: If I was given that tool set, I would have 614 00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:20,920 Speaker 3: been in a much better place. You know. 615 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I'm so glad you said that last sentence 616 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:26,760 Speaker 1: because I heard you say if I just would have 617 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:28,840 Speaker 1: done the work, and I was like, oh, as soon 618 00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:30,760 Speaker 1: as she finishes this sentence, I'm going to be like 619 00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 1: if someone had just done that work for you, like 620 00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: as a child, giving you the tools to know that 621 00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:38,040 Speaker 1: that's the kind of work, And then you said it 622 00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:41,080 Speaker 1: so my therapist, My therapist would have been like, in Zinger, 623 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:42,360 Speaker 1: you're just supposed to be listening. 624 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:46,320 Speaker 2: You're not supposed to be formulating your response. You said 625 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:47,719 Speaker 2: you said it before I said it. 626 00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:53,560 Speaker 1: Yes, if we could just be making it safe, not 627 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,400 Speaker 1: just making it safe letting people know they're not the 628 00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:59,920 Speaker 1: only one, like early from childhood, but also like making 629 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:03,880 Speaker 1: we didn't known that this is necessary, Like you said, 630 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:05,160 Speaker 1: just packing that bag. 631 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:06,200 Speaker 2: That bag is. 632 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:11,000 Speaker 1: Going to explode my my son's Thankfully, I am out 633 00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 1: of the one year old three year old range. God 634 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:17,560 Speaker 1: bless you and your wife. So I have two boys 635 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 1: sixteen and eighteen. So we just took ten year old 636 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:25,000 Speaker 1: off the college. Congratat ban, thank you, and so you know, 637 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,520 Speaker 1: we have our check in. Even as we were choosing college, 638 00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,240 Speaker 1: I loved you said it earlier. I was like, don't 639 00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:33,040 Speaker 1: worry about the academic prowess of the college. Go there 640 00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:35,320 Speaker 1: and see if you feel like you're going to find 641 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,600 Speaker 1: your people. Like are you going to find your people? 642 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:41,160 Speaker 1: That's the most important thing. And so we recently had 643 00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 1: a call me and Zaire, my freshman in college, and 644 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 1: I was like, college transition can be super tricky. You're 645 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 1: away from home. I'm like, how are you feeling emotionally? 646 00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 1: How are you feeling psychologically? How are you feeling socially? 647 00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,960 Speaker 1: Do you have support in place? And he said he's 648 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:02,600 Speaker 1: doing great. 649 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 2: And he was like, and. 650 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 1: Also I have my three friends and every Sunday we 651 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: just get in to check on each other's emotions. 652 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 3: I was like, oh, that's dope, see see see see 653 00:34:15,160 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 3: that's also I was like. 654 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:21,680 Speaker 1: I legitimately and anybody who knows will tell you I'm 655 00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:23,520 Speaker 1: not exaggerating, like bursting into tears. 656 00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:25,880 Speaker 2: I was like, this is what I want. 657 00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,560 Speaker 1: Right, And so we're getting first of all, this is beautiful. 658 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 1: Tell us about today because we're getting close to our 659 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:38,080 Speaker 1: time together. So tell us about Shamikua's life and purpose. 660 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,560 Speaker 1: Oh my god, today today. 661 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:46,080 Speaker 3: So you know, after you know, having setbacks, right, setbacks 662 00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:48,279 Speaker 3: and setups, and but you gotta be willing to do 663 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:50,640 Speaker 3: the work. And I had to really just I almost say, 664 00:34:50,640 --> 00:34:53,839 Speaker 3: clean out that closet. And I had to really like 665 00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,840 Speaker 3: get in therapy. I was diagnosed with different things throughout 666 00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:02,640 Speaker 3: my life, but mainly the bipolar. It was really affecting me. 667 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:07,440 Speaker 3: And I found a dot. I found the psychiatrist counselor 668 00:35:07,560 --> 00:35:10,640 Speaker 3: duo right, so it was great. That's what helped me, 669 00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:14,000 Speaker 3: Like they could talk to each other. And and my 670 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,560 Speaker 3: my therapist got in Atlanta. I loved her, she got 671 00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,600 Speaker 3: her in my life. She I don't want to say 672 00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:21,759 Speaker 3: her name, she would kill me. 673 00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:23,239 Speaker 2: We're not gonna say your name. 674 00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:27,120 Speaker 3: But I always tell people you have to pick your 675 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 3: therapists like you the person you're gonna date, you know, 676 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:33,480 Speaker 3: like the person like if it don't fit, like I 677 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:35,359 Speaker 3: went to a lot there and I'm like, I don't 678 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 3: feel connection this woman. I judged her. I judged her 679 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 3: because at first I was like, this is not gonna work. 680 00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,000 Speaker 3: She's not gonna understand me. You know, white woman from 681 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 3: the country, you know, Kentucky. And I was like, man, 682 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:48,600 Speaker 3: she was she was queer. But it was just like, 683 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,720 Speaker 3: it was like, it's not gonna work. And it worked. 684 00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,400 Speaker 3: She was meeting me where I was at. She she was, 685 00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:58,239 Speaker 3: she was giving it to me straight man. She was 686 00:35:58,280 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 3: like you every time you come in here, you have 687 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:02,759 Speaker 3: to your seat. She goes, you have you know some 688 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,440 Speaker 3: some I'm telling you it's bipolar. And she says, I'm 689 00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:09,800 Speaker 3: talking to the psychiatrists. You were like this and she 690 00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 3: ain't say nothing for a while. I was got on 691 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:16,200 Speaker 3: the medication. I started like leveling out. Once down the road. 692 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:18,680 Speaker 3: Once down the road, She's like, do you realize you're 693 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:21,840 Speaker 3: coming here now you're so calm and you're sitting and 694 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:24,960 Speaker 3: we're having a conversation because I did. I used to 695 00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:28,400 Speaker 3: be rapid, rapid, rap it and then I was just 696 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:31,000 Speaker 3: like calm. Life started really slowing down, and she goes, 697 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:33,600 Speaker 3: I think this is what it what it is. But 698 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:36,400 Speaker 3: you know, she she worked with me and I you know, 699 00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:38,520 Speaker 3: like in college when I first went to Tennessee, how 700 00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:40,759 Speaker 3: I was ready to go home, but the coach told me, like, 701 00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:44,040 Speaker 3: you know, stick with it. You're gonna find your your sisterhood, 702 00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 3: your family. I feared the unknown, right, and I did 703 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:51,319 Speaker 3: that again later in life with my therapy. You know, 704 00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 3: I said, all right, I'm in this, I'm going to 705 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:56,200 Speaker 3: do it. And since then, I want to say, like 706 00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:58,719 Speaker 3: when I moved, I talked to her on the phone. 707 00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:00,520 Speaker 3: We check in if I need to time of time 708 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:03,440 Speaker 3: because I love her. But that that was probably like 709 00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:09,319 Speaker 3: two thousand and twenty thirteen, twenty and fourteen. And I've 710 00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:12,600 Speaker 3: been doing I've been doing great, Like I found a 711 00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:15,319 Speaker 3: regiment that works for me. I understand, I have to 712 00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:19,239 Speaker 3: connect with nature. I have to take my medication. I 713 00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:24,759 Speaker 3: have to have like some time for Shamikua. I got balanced, 714 00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:29,239 Speaker 3: like I said, stable my mental health and in recovery. 715 00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 3: You know, but I'm aware, I'm I woke now right, 716 00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:33,120 Speaker 3: that's right. 717 00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:34,839 Speaker 2: Your ses are open. 718 00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:37,960 Speaker 3: Right, so I know like my feelings and I know 719 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:40,160 Speaker 3: how I'm just you know, I just have a different 720 00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:42,919 Speaker 3: tool tools, you know, tools right now that I can use. 721 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:47,120 Speaker 3: So you know, I got married in twenty sixteen cadulations. 722 00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:52,920 Speaker 3: We have two beautiful children, three and one, and I 723 00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:54,759 Speaker 3: feel like the color is back in my life. And 724 00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:59,239 Speaker 3: so I really loved sports, right, I loved it. I 725 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 3: always thought I was going to be a coach. You know, 726 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 3: I said, Oh, I want to coach, you want to 727 00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,480 Speaker 3: give back to the game, And everybody always asks me 728 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:09,920 Speaker 3: twenty four sent why are you not a coaching And 729 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,800 Speaker 3: then I'm like this kid when they heard this, right, 730 00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:14,640 Speaker 3: I was at one in universities and the kids like, 731 00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:16,480 Speaker 3: you are a coach. You're a coach in a game 732 00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:20,640 Speaker 3: of life. And that empowered me. It was like I 733 00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:24,600 Speaker 3: was like, you're right. So being being an advocate, being 734 00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,960 Speaker 3: a mentor, it's just like you're you have an amazing 735 00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:31,120 Speaker 3: you're you're educated. You got to learn this at a 736 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:34,720 Speaker 3: high level, so you do your work. But I also 737 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:36,840 Speaker 3: like just being able to connect. These kids want to 738 00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:39,879 Speaker 3: talk to someone that that's kind of like been through 739 00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:43,399 Speaker 3: it or whatever, so it's like a different relatability. And 740 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:47,680 Speaker 3: all amazing psychiatrists at the schools or whatever, they're like, yeah, 741 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:49,920 Speaker 3: I can only do so much, but you know they 742 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:52,440 Speaker 3: get hyped off of sports and different things, and I 743 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:54,560 Speaker 3: come in, I connect with them, you know, I'm like, 744 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:57,160 Speaker 3: what's up, Like what's going on? And they just like 745 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,880 Speaker 3: open up. They're like, man, some of the parents are like, 746 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:02,920 Speaker 3: my kid would not talk and then they met you, 747 00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:04,759 Speaker 3: the parents that hit me in DM ME and be 748 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:08,120 Speaker 3: like they can identify with you, you know, and it connect. 749 00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:11,279 Speaker 3: So I look at it as nothing but God, you know, 750 00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:13,920 Speaker 3: just kind of like took me on his journey and 751 00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:16,360 Speaker 3: impart me. But I like the character that it built. 752 00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,400 Speaker 3: I like the person that I am today. And you know, 753 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,799 Speaker 3: this is just the beginning. Like I can't wait for 754 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,799 Speaker 3: the things that are to come, and I just I'm 755 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:26,560 Speaker 3: just glad to be at peace with my health. 756 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:29,760 Speaker 2: Beautiful. It's beautiful. I love it so much. 757 00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:32,160 Speaker 3: Thank you. You're about to get me. You're about to 758 00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:34,160 Speaker 3: You're about to stunt me with this question. 759 00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:38,879 Speaker 2: I'm gonna bring it back right up to the top 760 00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:39,239 Speaker 2: for you. 761 00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:42,880 Speaker 1: All Right, you have to answer you only have to 762 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:45,640 Speaker 1: answer one, but you have answered all three of these 763 00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:51,520 Speaker 1: questions so many times in this conversation already. So just 764 00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:55,000 Speaker 1: whatever comes to your gut, say the first thing that comes. Okay, 765 00:39:55,320 --> 00:40:01,480 Speaker 1: what's one thing you want people to unlearn, one stigma 766 00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 1: you want them to undo, or one conversation you want 767 00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:09,920 Speaker 1: them to uncover to help more people on this journey 768 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:10,719 Speaker 1: called recovery. 769 00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:15,640 Speaker 3: Man, I think like this applies to any any person 770 00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:19,000 Speaker 3: you know, ethnicity, race, you know, gender, all that stuff. 771 00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:21,200 Speaker 3: But I'm gonna say more for like, because I am 772 00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 3: a black woman. I get tired of us, you know, 773 00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:27,360 Speaker 3: in our community having to push through that word Like 774 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:29,840 Speaker 3: I mean, I just put my head down and I'm 775 00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:33,800 Speaker 3: pushing through. Throw that away, Like why why do you 776 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,480 Speaker 3: always have to feel that weight? That weight is heavy? 777 00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:40,000 Speaker 3: Like you know, you know, I told one of my homegirls, 778 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,840 Speaker 3: like back when I was in Atlanta and I'm like, 779 00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,840 Speaker 3: you know, going through therapy and stuff like that. I'm like, y'all, 780 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:50,440 Speaker 3: we gotta be better. My my white friends, they're like 781 00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:54,480 Speaker 3: talking at Cottails girl, have my therapy appointment at you see. 782 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:57,560 Speaker 3: And as soon as I mentioned therapy is like in 783 00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:01,280 Speaker 3: our community, it's like you know, you she crazy or whatever, 784 00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:04,080 Speaker 3: And I'm like, yo, we gotta change that. So I'm thankful. 785 00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,200 Speaker 3: Like again, I feel the universe is using me because 786 00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:11,120 Speaker 3: now my friends, who you know, not talk about these things. 787 00:41:11,120 --> 00:41:13,680 Speaker 3: My family members that will not talk about these things. 788 00:41:14,160 --> 00:41:17,640 Speaker 3: Now discuss these things, you know, therapy and you know, 789 00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:21,680 Speaker 3: being ballast because I mean, you know, you're you're an educator, 790 00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:25,240 Speaker 3: educated woman, you have a husband, family and all this stuff. 791 00:41:25,280 --> 00:41:28,440 Speaker 3: That's you got a lot to carry it. Career, family, 792 00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:32,200 Speaker 3: that's a lot, all of us, we're dealing with stuff, 793 00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:35,880 Speaker 3: you know. So yeah, just take care of yourselves. 794 00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:41,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, beautiful, you said, unlearn the idea that you have 795 00:41:41,480 --> 00:41:47,120 Speaker 1: to push through, undo the stigma of getting a therapist, 796 00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,200 Speaker 1: and uncover the conversation at the party. 797 00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:52,719 Speaker 2: Talk about your therapists, please and thank you. 798 00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:56,600 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, definitely. You know it's interesting. I was. I 799 00:41:56,680 --> 00:41:59,120 Speaker 3: was somewhere years ago, right, it was like a big 800 00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:02,520 Speaker 3: mental health and I'll never forget. It was a guy 801 00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:05,440 Speaker 3: from the military. I think it might might have been 802 00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:09,120 Speaker 3: on my documentary, and a gentleman and he's talking to 803 00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:11,400 Speaker 3: me and he's like going deep, you know, he's a 804 00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:14,759 Speaker 3: military PTSD. He's like he put like it's thirty eight 805 00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:17,279 Speaker 3: up to his head or whatever, and he's sharing his 806 00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:19,919 Speaker 3: story and we're hugging with crying and another woman comes 807 00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,560 Speaker 3: up after and we're in a mental health conference and 808 00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:27,719 Speaker 3: she starts whispering and like and it's like now the 809 00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:30,440 Speaker 3: gentleman has moved on, and like we wiped out tears 810 00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:33,319 Speaker 3: and she's whispering. I look at her. I said, why 811 00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,240 Speaker 3: are we whispering? This is this is about mental health 812 00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:38,520 Speaker 3: and we're all here, we're all a failure in community. 813 00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:41,239 Speaker 3: And she hit me with a gem. She was like, 814 00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,879 Speaker 3: you don't realize I'm from a small town because I'm 815 00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:46,759 Speaker 3: looking at things. Sometimes I've been well traveled and I'm 816 00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:50,040 Speaker 3: all environments, but you know, I see things like big 817 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:52,920 Speaker 3: being from New York, right, And she's like, She's like, 818 00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:56,040 Speaker 3: I'm from a small town and everybody's in each other's 819 00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:59,120 Speaker 3: business and you can't you can't talk about things like this. 820 00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:02,040 Speaker 3: And so she says, I roll over and I just 821 00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:04,080 Speaker 3: want to meet you and be able to share. But 822 00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:06,440 Speaker 3: this is how I'm used to talking because it's so 823 00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:10,040 Speaker 3: like she's so small that she's like, you can't share 824 00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:14,160 Speaker 3: your business. And so I was like, wow, that makes sense. 825 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:18,960 Speaker 2: It makes sense. It makes sense. Well, listen, I loved 826 00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:20,960 Speaker 2: this conversation so much. 827 00:43:21,360 --> 00:43:24,239 Speaker 3: Oh, thank you, this has been great. I'm excited for you. 828 00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:26,480 Speaker 3: In the book, I've just been caught up with some 829 00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:31,760 Speaker 3: baby books because the baby who's she's growing like crazy 830 00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,640 Speaker 3: and they want to get stuck on eating one thing. 831 00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:36,920 Speaker 3: So I've been trying to, like to get these recipes. 832 00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:40,160 Speaker 3: I'm tired of these chicken nuggets and mac and cheese 833 00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:41,840 Speaker 3: and then they throwing the food. 834 00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:44,440 Speaker 2: So I'm just trying to thank you so much for 835 00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:45,040 Speaker 2: tuning in. 836 00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:49,640 Speaker 1: My book on Addiction, Six mind Changing Conversations That Could 837 00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:52,839 Speaker 1: Save a Life is now available for pre order at 838 00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:57,920 Speaker 1: bookshop dot org, Union Squaring Company, Barns and Noble, Amazon, 839 00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,680 Speaker 1: and wherever books are sold. If you liked this episode, 840 00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:04,560 Speaker 1: please share it with someone you think may need to 841 00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:08,640 Speaker 1: hear it. Also, please subscribe to this podcast and leave 842 00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:11,480 Speaker 1: a five star review that helps us reach any and 843 00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:14,239 Speaker 1: everyone who may be looking for support in the face 844 00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:14,760 Speaker 1: of addiction.