Speaker 1: Welcome back to Notificent Another League, another episode. I am
Speaker 1: one of your hosts, Danny Fernandez, and sitting across for me,
Speaker 1: is your boy the one the only I couldn't think
Speaker 1: of anything that rhymes would only I thought that was
Speaker 1: I thought that was good enough. Yeah, are you literally
Speaker 1: the only if you wat way? Uh? Maybe there's a stride.
Speaker 1: I've done searches. I'm not the only if you shakuda,
Speaker 1: but I am the only if he way that I
Speaker 1: know of. And I was able to snag it before
Speaker 1: some dork, but if he I had to change my
Speaker 1: name to Danny M. Fernandez and it ruined my whole
Speaker 1: identity I was. Originally they wanted me to change it
Speaker 1: to Danny Murray um, and then I would have been
Speaker 1: a to name person, like all the too name freaks
Speaker 1: out there. Shout out to you guys. Jessica Michelle Singleton
Speaker 1: was all like an Aaron mal DeLong and Christopher Smith,
Speaker 1: Bryan and Ryan Leslie Fisher and Sarah Michelle Giller and
Speaker 1: all of the Yeah. But now you're like Michael B.
Speaker 1: George I know, and Michael J. Fox. Michael J. Fox.
Speaker 1: So it's a that's not a bad company to be
Speaker 1: a part of true True, True True. And it's because
Speaker 1: for y'all behind the scenes, your name can't even sound
Speaker 1: like someone else's name. So there wasn't even another Danny
Speaker 1: d A n I, which is mine because it's short
Speaker 1: for Danielle. It's that it sounded like the boy's name,
Speaker 1: which is d A n n Y. I just want
Speaker 1: to give people that didn't want to try and go
Speaker 1: for Danielle Fernandez. No, that's what my mom calls me. No. Um,
Speaker 1: I like my short it's my stage name. It's like
Speaker 1: my it's really short and easy. And I wish I
Speaker 1: could have at Danny. But um, congrats to the twelve
Speaker 1: year old girl that has at Danny that never tweets.
Speaker 1: That's the last thing I tweeted Jack about because when
Speaker 1: he was like, we're deleting all those locked to counts
Speaker 1: so they don't count for your followers. Um, and I
Speaker 1: think I dropped fifty all wards when that happened. And
Speaker 1: he's like, it's going live now, and I was like,
Speaker 1: all right, are you doing anything about the people squatting
Speaker 1: on accounts? Like if he like if he has not tweeted,
Speaker 1: and I'm waiting and I know there's other if he's
Speaker 1: out there waiting for it, we check it out. There's
Speaker 1: other es. Yeah, I wonder if I could like get
Speaker 1: a let's call Jamie Jamie loftus who's a hacker, um
Speaker 1: and see if she's not a real hack. I mean,
Speaker 1: she wouldn't want me to say that she is a
Speaker 1: real hacker, but like see not about hacking, but like
Speaker 1: if they know how to get someone's email and politely
Speaker 1: ask them if we can buy it. Anyways, welcome to Netificent.
Speaker 1: Today we are covering image comics. Yeah. Yeah, no. Image
Speaker 1: comics is very interesting because I think outside of the
Speaker 1: big two, which is Marvel in d C, I think
Speaker 1: I would I would say they're the next popular comic
Speaker 1: book publisher. I mean they they're known for Spawn, you know,
Speaker 1: and they that that's actually originally what the Walking Dead
Speaker 1: and and you a lot of sky Bounds comics kind
Speaker 1: of rooted in was image. So so yeah, i'd say
Speaker 1: they're they're the third. I would almost go on a
Speaker 1: limb and say third. Oh, they are the third, most
Speaker 1: of off top I knew it, you knew it. Yeah, So,
Speaker 1: speaking of they are best known for The Walking Dead, Kingsman,
Speaker 1: Wanted Spawn, Savage Dragon, which Blade the Darkness Invincible Saga.
Speaker 1: It's great and Chew Chew was great. Have you ever
Speaker 1: read it. It's basically about this detective who can like
Speaker 1: see the past if he eats it, so like he'll
Speaker 1: have to write chew on bodies to like see what
Speaker 1: happened in the crime scene. Last I heard they were
Speaker 1: trying to adapt that into a TV show. I think
Speaker 1: it would work. I feel like that's one of those
Speaker 1: that would be a fun procedural that we've lived on,
Speaker 1: like TBS or something. Yeah, for sure, we already have
Speaker 1: a zombie one people get an eat so so. In December,
Speaker 1: Cabal of Comic Creators Todd McFarlane, Rob Life build In,
Speaker 1: Jim Lee, Marvel's three biggest artists, informed Marvel President Terry
Speaker 1: Stewart that the company's policy towards talent were unfair, that
Speaker 1: creators were not being appropriately rewarded for their work, and
Speaker 1: that they were leaving effective immediately. They are also representing
Speaker 1: creators Eric Larson and Mark Sylvestry, who were not present
Speaker 1: but had met within the night before. This was so ballsy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they were the top the top creators and comic book artists,
Speaker 1: and I think they knew their power. It's really funny
Speaker 1: because later in an interview that Mark Sylvestry did, he
Speaker 1: said it wasn't actually that much of a risk because
Speaker 1: Marvel would take them back in a heartbeat. He knew
Speaker 1: that they needed them, Oh yeah, and so they just
Speaker 1: walked away, and they mainly walked away. Yeah, for those reasons.
Speaker 1: They wanted to create something where comic creators could publish
Speaker 1: their own creation of materials without giving up the copyrights
Speaker 1: to those properties. And they still honor that till this day,
Speaker 1: which is why Image Comics is one of the kind
Speaker 1: of best comic book companies to work for if you
Speaker 1: have the power to kind of push your own brand
Speaker 1: and own it. And that's the sole reason that Robert Kirkland,
Speaker 1: Robert Kirkman sky Bound exists today because he he basically
Speaker 1: owns Walking Dead. He was able to then put it
Speaker 1: under his own umbrella company and do more with it,
Speaker 1: which like create the TV show and the video games,
Speaker 1: the Tailtale video games and other things like that. So
Speaker 1: you see the power in owning your own property versus
Speaker 1: having it sold off for pennies like Marvel did to
Speaker 1: the likes of Spider Man and and all the other
Speaker 1: ones that ended up sitting in a semi cinematic graveyard
Speaker 1: until the I guess about nineties. McFarland actually said there
Speaker 1: were no demands of Stuart or Marvel, but they merely
Speaker 1: informed him they were leaving. Can you imagine that, like
Speaker 1: didn't even like give him an opportunity, just you know
Speaker 1: they were leaving. They gave their reasons why and cautioned
Speaker 1: Stewart to heed those reasons unless they wanted more people
Speaker 1: to leave the company. I did want to say on
Speaker 1: an Image Comics Expo panel, which they did end up
Speaker 1: having an Image Comics Expo twenty years after they had
Speaker 1: formed Image Comics, Liefeld reiterated that again he wasn't upset
Speaker 1: about leaving Marvel, how he wasn't at all frustrated or
Speaker 1: disappointed with his tenure at Marvel, as much as the
Speaker 1: fact that he just more was looking forward to doing
Speaker 1: new stuff for the future. So I don't know, it
Speaker 1: sounds like they didn't necessarily have a It was kind
Speaker 1: of more of a business, maybe a passion type of thing.
Speaker 1: It felt. It feels like it was more like, Hey,
Speaker 1: we're doing this thing, and this is why we're doing it.
Speaker 1: But if you change your policies, you might be able
Speaker 1: to prevent other top artists from doing this in the future.
Speaker 1: But it didn't stop at Marvel See. The creators had
Speaker 1: the same meeting with d C Comics the next day.
Speaker 1: Jim Ley asked Whilst Potassio, who worked on The Punisher
Speaker 1: X Factor the Uncanny x And to join them as well,
Speaker 1: and then the team worked out a deal with a
Speaker 1: small publisher, Malibu Comics, for production and distribution, and then
Speaker 1: decided on the title for their new company, Recycling, a
Speaker 1: name that Lifeld had originally intended for an aborted self
Speaker 1: published venture. On February one, a press release was sent
Speaker 1: out announcing the formation of Image Comics. Yeah so it
Speaker 1: was originally a group of eight creators that founded it.
Speaker 1: That would include Todd McFarland, who was known for his
Speaker 1: work on Spider Man, Jim Lee for X Men, Rob
Speaker 1: Lifeld who worked on X Force, Mark Sylvestri worked on Wolverine,
Speaker 1: Eric Larson who did The Amazing Spider Man, Jim Valentino
Speaker 1: who did Guardians of the Galaxy, and Will's Potassio who
Speaker 1: did Uncunny X Men, and also longtime Uncanny X Men
Speaker 1: writer Chris Claremont, and this development was nicknamed the Exodus
Speaker 1: get it because of the people that worked on it.
Speaker 1: So Marvel stock fell three dollars in twenty five cents
Speaker 1: a share when the news became public. And Images Organizing
Speaker 1: charter had two key provisions. One Image would not own
Speaker 1: any creator's work. The creator would too. No Image partner
Speaker 1: would interfere creatively or financially with any other partners work,
Speaker 1: foreshadowing this would come back in this group. And Image
Speaker 1: itself would own no intellectual property except the company trademarks
Speaker 1: its name and its logo, which was designed by writer
Speaker 1: Hank Canals. Yeah. Each Image partner founded his own studio,
Speaker 1: which published under the Image banner, but was autonomous from
Speaker 1: central editorial control. Oh so, so that basically that's what
Speaker 1: Robert did with sky Bountain. Seems like Claremont was not
Speaker 1: part of the partnership and Portasio withdrew during the formative
Speaker 1: stages to deal with his sister's illness. So Image originally
Speaker 1: consisted of six studios. Todd McFarland Productions owned by Todd
Speaker 1: Farland obviously Wild Storm Productions owned by Jim Lee, Highbrow
Speaker 1: Entertainment owned by Eric Larson, Shadow Line owned by Jim Valentino.
Speaker 1: Top Cow, we know top Cow, that's they It seems
Speaker 1: like they kind of spawned out in their their own
Speaker 1: thing now top Cow Production owned by Mark Sylvestry and
Speaker 1: Extreme Studios owned by Rob Liefeld. So this is real
Speaker 1: cool because I didn't know top Cow came from Image
Speaker 1: because top Cow now just for the image in my
Speaker 1: head that popped up. They have their own booth at
Speaker 1: Comic Con now and sky Bound the same way, and
Speaker 1: it's crazy that and you just see the power of
Speaker 1: why that's such a good thing because it only helps
Speaker 1: Image because obviously they still have loyalty to Image because
Speaker 1: they gave them the opportunity. But now they're creating these
Speaker 1: smaller indie studios that can just blow up on their own,
Speaker 1: like top Cow and now sky Bound. Well. Also Todd
Speaker 1: McFarland's properties really blew up with Spawn and Wild Storm
Speaker 1: as well that Jim Lee did, which he ended up
Speaker 1: so lane actually, so we'll get into that. But the
Speaker 1: first Image comic books to arrive in stores were Lifefield's
Speaker 1: Young Blood, Larsen's The Savage Dragon, McFarland Spawn, and Lee's Wildcats.
Speaker 1: Did you ever watch the Wildcats animated series. I did not,
Speaker 1: actually I think I did. I'm I'm gonna look it
Speaker 1: up real quick, and it's funny. Out of this starting lineup,
Speaker 1: the only one I can't remember is Savage Dragon. I
Speaker 1: remember Young Blood, I remember Spawn, and Wildcat. When I
Speaker 1: look it up, I'm sure i'm gonna remember it. But
Speaker 1: Savage Dragon was also an animated show as well. Really, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's't that funny. But I think a lot of people,
Speaker 1: so we've said this before, but if you and I
Speaker 1: were born the same year, that's why we're so perfect together.
Speaker 1: If you and I were both born in eighty eight,
Speaker 1: and uh, we love all of our fans of all ages.
Speaker 1: But it's really funny because I think people forget that.
Speaker 1: Sometimes they'll be like, you didn't watch it in its
Speaker 1: original run. I was like, no, actually, my parents had
Speaker 1: not conceived me yet. Um, so I didn't watch Star
Speaker 1: Wars originally in theaters on Fortunately. Oh I remember Wildcats
Speaker 1: because I remember the dude with the Deadpool esque mask
Speaker 1: hanging off, but but but the top his hair was blonde,
Speaker 1: so you knew he had blonde hair. I was like,
Speaker 1: that's the cool guy. That was my favorite of course,
Speaker 1: because any guy in the nineties, but also like the
Speaker 1: main character, like or the hero, he had his hair
Speaker 1: coming up. That was like the nineties were the time
Speaker 1: where you had those masks where your hair would poof
Speaker 1: out the tops. And yes, that was very popular for that.
Speaker 1: That was his jam and popped up a lot in
Speaker 1: a lot of the Image comics. So but because of
Speaker 1: they were so passionate, these creators were so passionate behind
Speaker 1: this project and it was their project that they really
Speaker 1: put their heart and soul into it, and their series
Speaker 1: sold in numbers that no publisher other than Marvel, d
Speaker 1: C or Valiant Comics had achieved in since the markets
Speaker 1: declined back in the nineteen seventies. So within a few months,
Speaker 1: the Image title success led to Malibu having almost ten
Speaker 1: percent of the North American comics market share a few months.
Speaker 1: That's how powerful they were that they could leave and
Speaker 1: start their own comic book company and take off. Also,
Speaker 1: we want to say that this is the nineties coming
Speaker 1: off of the seventies, which had a huge boom in
Speaker 1: like the value of comics from that era, and so
Speaker 1: you had people who were trying to always get like
Speaker 1: what would be the new thing that's going to be
Speaker 1: valuable in the future. So you had that on your
Speaker 1: side to um, which actually led to the overproduction of
Speaker 1: comics and the the the unnecessary deaths of certain characters
Speaker 1: to really drive people to the stains to try and
Speaker 1: buy it. Actually, I was going to talk about when
Speaker 1: Johnny Storm died a few a few years back, that
Speaker 1: was just over over marketed. It was black bagged, and
Speaker 1: then he came back later. So the only person who's
Speaker 1: died for a long period of time, even and I
Speaker 1: think I mentioned this in the early episode, was Jean Gray,
Speaker 1: and it was because they realized they made a broken character.
Speaker 1: When you make someone like the Phoenix God, you're like,
Speaker 1: we gotta get rid of this. Because part of me
Speaker 1: was like, oh man, that sucks that Jean Gray is
Speaker 1: the like is the only one. But then when you
Speaker 1: thought about you're like, oh, yeah, they made her broken.
Speaker 1: She can bring people back to life, she can end
Speaker 1: life with a snap. They they're like, oh man, but
Speaker 1: you could have just pulled that out of her and
Speaker 1: had another female character. But you know, comics. But you
Speaker 1: made a good point if that this was a time
Speaker 1: when people were starting to collect first edition like they
Speaker 1: were collecting comic books for financial reasons. They were kind
Speaker 1: of shifting from trading cards because I was the thing
Speaker 1: that was really popular with trading cards now to comics.
Speaker 1: So by the beginning of Images, Financial Situation was secure
Speaker 1: enough to publish its titles independently, and they left Malibu.
Speaker 1: They're telling all these people, we don't need you anymore. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, that's it seems like that's the whole business
Speaker 1: model was like, get good enough to be on your
Speaker 1: feet and run on your own and do your thing.
Speaker 1: Go go, go top Cal run, run for the hills,
Speaker 1: you go sky bound, you could do it. Todd McFarland Productions,
Speaker 1: go go wait, wait, why are you making that movie
Speaker 1: with Michael g I White. I know he's great, but somehow, how,
Speaker 1: how did you make a crappy You know what I
Speaker 1: was gonna I was gonna walk that back and say,
Speaker 1: I actually really enjoyed the Spawn and the HBO animated series,
Speaker 1: which was too hot for me to watch, but you
Speaker 1: know who snuck up and watched it put it on
Speaker 1: a VHS. You boy, it was. It was good, But
Speaker 1: I wanted to put an asterisk next to uh, trading cards.
Speaker 1: We're not coming for baseball cards. But don't think we're
Speaker 1: sleeping on trading card games were coming for your Magic
Speaker 1: the Gatherings. I spent too much money on Magic the
Speaker 1: Gathering for me not to talk about it on this
Speaker 1: And we're talking about you, and we're talking about Pokemon,
Speaker 1: which you know in the Nerdficent discord, people were asking,
Speaker 1: you know, what is the second popular trading card game,
Speaker 1: and like people were like jokingly like, oh, Pokemon. You
Speaker 1: actually Pokemon and Ugo still have very active tournaments to
Speaker 1: this day. But we'll save that for that episode. If
Speaker 1: I need to tell you that Mark mark ellis another
Speaker 1: He has a pack. He just looked his pack of
Speaker 1: Magic the Gathering cards and were thirty thousand or something.
Speaker 1: I was like, Hi, but he is so you know Mark,
Speaker 1: He's so like chill. Yeah, I'll just sometimes I'm like, no,
Speaker 1: you gotta do it now, Mark, please, because um, it
Speaker 1: is worth more unopened than open, because if you open
Speaker 1: it and it's a dud, you get nothing. Somebody will
Speaker 1: spend that money and hope they get a black lotus. Yeah.
Speaker 1: All right. So with all of this happening, of course,
Speaker 1: Marvel suffered greatly. The sudden death of Talent would eventually
Speaker 1: lead up to the company's famous bankruptcy. In Jim Vlentino said,
Speaker 1: although Image got blamed for it, the decline in bankruptcy
Speaker 1: actually started back when they were at Marvel, which I
Speaker 1: would agree with. Like I was saying, they're just in
Speaker 1: and like we said before this, they were on a
Speaker 1: decline to begin with. It wasn't necessarily Image. Image was
Speaker 1: just the new hotness at the same time, and Image
Speaker 1: Comics became one of the most popular imprints of the
Speaker 1: mid nineties. Yeah, nothing to me, says ninety comics like Image.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't say Marvel, I wouldn't say I'm sorry, I
Speaker 1: won't say Marvelous to you, nineties comics were Image because
Speaker 1: you saw that spawn, you saw the buckles, young Bloods,
Speaker 1: blood Shot at the time, Valiant in the picture, Like,
Speaker 1: those were nineties comics to me, I wasn't thinking about
Speaker 1: those guys yet. I mean, they were still on the
Speaker 1: stands because their mainstay. But if if I had to
Speaker 1: scream out one, it probably would be Image. And every
Speaker 1: single book that came out of Images First Error was
Speaker 1: covered in visors and blood and claws and boob. Yeah,
Speaker 1: intended for kids nurtured on nerd rage with desperate Matt
Speaker 1: Macheesmo would would yeah, that's nineties. There was Which Blade,
Speaker 1: a comic about a gauntlet that pairs onto a female host,
Speaker 1: giving them superpowers and tearing off their clothes till till
Speaker 1: they were basically just if you don't know what Which
Speaker 1: Blade is, I would suggest googling it. Not at work,
Speaker 1: but a live action TV show. But it was very
Speaker 1: toned down because I remember tuning in to be like,
Speaker 1: are they gonna are they gonna Which Blade? Which Blade?
Speaker 1: They did not, But do you remember j Lo's famous
Speaker 1: VMA's outfit that that kind of split down the middle
Speaker 1: that imagine that, but like cool nineties semi metal tentacles
Speaker 1: type looking things. That's Which Blade? Yeah, yeah, also a
Speaker 1: good cause play. So by the mid Image series such
Speaker 1: a spawn in The Savage Dragon had proven themselves as
Speaker 1: lasting successes, the former frequently topping the sales charts for
Speaker 1: months in which new issues came out. Well. New series
Speaker 1: such as Wild Storms, Jen and Top Cows, Which Blade
Speaker 1: and The Darkness were also successful. Image had become the
Speaker 1: third largest comics publisher in North America that quickly, that quickly.
Speaker 1: In the Darkness too, I remember lasted because this is
Speaker 1: like the mid nineties, and I think on the midts
Speaker 1: the two thousand's they had that Darkness game came out,
Speaker 1: and that was like everyone was like freaking out about it.
Speaker 1: At the time, I was was unaware of the comics
Speaker 1: and I didn't know why people were so hyped on it,
Speaker 1: but it was because people were like, Oh, this comic
Speaker 1: book video game is coming out and it's like super
Speaker 1: broody and dark. I mean it's literally called the Darkness. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So during this time they were still in this like
Speaker 1: honeymoon phase for them. They also kind of were celebrities.
Speaker 1: Now it's so weird, like we see this now with
Speaker 1: a but typically it's not necessarily the comic book creators
Speaker 1: or even like the vo actors or whatever of the series.
Speaker 1: It's normally you know, Hugh Jackman or whoever you know.
Speaker 1: Not for this time, but like whoever was playing the
Speaker 1: character wasn't necessarily the behind the scenes people, but they
Speaker 1: became like celebrities. They actually had a book signing appearance
Speaker 1: at Golden Apple Comics in Los Angeles as the first
Speaker 1: Image comics were coming out, and life Field appeared on
Speaker 1: the front page of the l A Times. There were
Speaker 1: TV cameras there were helicopters, there were police brought in
Speaker 1: for crowd control. They said as many as two thousand fans.
Speaker 1: Lifefield said, by the time we got to the Chicago
Speaker 1: Comic Con, we were just riding the wave of it.
Speaker 1: They actually, Yeah, this, this, I would say, is very
Speaker 1: much there. Their honeymoon phase before the drama. If someone
Speaker 1: ever uses the honeymoon phase, you know that it has
Speaker 1: to end and when the drama comes, he gets quite spiced.
Speaker 1: Let's get to the drama. After these messages back everyone,
Speaker 1: I'm trying that out and it did not like it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that might be the new thing. Producers are like trying.
Speaker 1: One of them is very disappointed, the other one's giggling,
Speaker 1: so so they just split split reaction. But let's get
Speaker 1: into this drama that popped off. See, I am a
Speaker 1: messy boy who loves the drama pettiness that is involved
Speaker 1: with these men petty as hell. I love it. I
Speaker 1: forgot what I was doing, but I was doing something
Speaker 1: petty to a friend and I was with one of
Speaker 1: my female friends and she remarks is like, see, people
Speaker 1: say women are petty, but man, I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: you don't you have a clue. You have no clue.
Speaker 1: You have no clue. Did you see how someone financed
Speaker 1: tolk Holgan's case against Gawker? Because that that is the
Speaker 1: pettiness that only comes from Richmond. Let's not even get
Speaker 1: started on what might be coming in the future from
Speaker 1: such the likes of Elon musk Uh. He has too
Speaker 1: much money and too much male pettiness, and he could
Speaker 1: only go bad. But let's get into the drama. The
Speaker 1: partners had little business or management experience, and mini series
Speaker 1: quickly fell behind their intended publishing schedule. As the issue
Speaker 1: shipped weeks and even several months late, fans interests tended
Speaker 1: to wayne and left retailers with inventory they couldn't sell
Speaker 1: when it arrived. In response, retailers cut orders to reduce
Speaker 1: the risk. This significantly hurt the studios, which were each
Speaker 1: responsible for their own cash flow and profitability. Some issues
Speaker 1: of Lifefeld's Young Bloods arrived nine months late. Yeah, someone
Speaker 1: straight up was like, I can't read this. I have
Speaker 1: to take care of my baby. I thought I was
Speaker 1: gonna jam out on my laps. Yeah. Here's the thing.
Speaker 1: These men were so great and talented and powerful that
Speaker 1: they could leave their respective one. They could leave their
Speaker 1: respective studios like Marvel in d C and know that
Speaker 1: they would still take them back. But to they were
Speaker 1: at the heart of it artists. They weren't businessmen, so
Speaker 1: they weren't trained on the business side. That has to
Speaker 1: do with printing, shipping logistics, and then counting. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: then on top of that do have Yeah, the deadlines
Speaker 1: are the hardest thing. Like I mean, if you if
Speaker 1: if if you want to know how hard deadlines are?
Speaker 1: Asked Kevin Smith, I love you, but man, can you
Speaker 1: not drop a comic on time? Like it's it's just
Speaker 1: it seems so simple, but when you really think about it,
Speaker 1: if you think about the time it takes to complete
Speaker 1: a comic, writing up the script, getting a pencil inked
Speaker 1: and colored, you have to do that in the span
Speaker 1: of a month. If you, if you, if you get
Speaker 1: ahead start normally you you could buffer that. But most times,
Speaker 1: I imagine guys like Image the rising popularity, you're doing it.
Speaker 1: You're going month to month and that's a lot of
Speaker 1: moving parts to get something done on the deadline. So yeah,
Speaker 1: it's gonna be rough. And uh, what's also rough too,
Speaker 1: is since everyone has their own business, some people might
Speaker 1: be filling the hurt while others aren't. And if you're
Speaker 1: all under the same banner, you might be wondering what
Speaker 1: the heck is going on. So basically, Larry Martyr, who
Speaker 1: was a cartoonist and writer, was brought on to literally
Speaker 1: manage the artist so they can finish on time, and
Speaker 1: became images executive director. So that's that's their solution. They're like,
Speaker 1: and you know what, I respect that sometimes you just
Speaker 1: need to bring somebody and to read it all in.
Speaker 1: And I think that's the downfall of a lot of people,
Speaker 1: Like when you're already on top, you have a wave,
Speaker 1: you're like, I don't need no boss. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: If he tangent to this, did you read the This
Speaker 1: came out months ago, but did you read the Johnny
Speaker 1: Depp Rolling Stone. We would talk about I'll say this,
Speaker 1: I'll say what, And I always have to give credit
Speaker 1: to Kurt because he brought it up on the episode.
Speaker 1: But you just saw the effect of because his sister
Speaker 1: used to take care of all his finances and everything
Speaker 1: like that, and they had a falling out when he
Speaker 1: refused to get a pre nup before he married her.
Speaker 1: And you can see what happens when he does not
Speaker 1: have that control. You see that she really was the
Speaker 1: one keeping it all together for him, and now he's
Speaker 1: just on this downward spiral. Anyways, read that if you
Speaker 1: want to see how people throw their lives away, So
Speaker 1: then they Image comics. They kind of had a semi breakup,
Speaker 1: and everybody tells the story differently. Life Field in the
Speaker 1: So Much Damage documentary, which I highly recommend. It's on
Speaker 1: Sci Fi Why I think you can actually YouTube it
Speaker 1: and watch it. It's a documentary on the history of
Speaker 1: Image comics, he said, and I quote that they were
Speaker 1: ruthlessly competitive. That the men were ruthlessly competitive makes sense.
Speaker 1: I mean, they're all in their own ways, these great creators.
Speaker 1: And on the subject of how life Field went from
Speaker 1: being the unifying force that brought the Image Partners together
Speaker 1: to launch a comic line to being the unifying force
Speaker 1: that brought the Image Partners together to kick him out
Speaker 1: of the company, Larry Martyrs said, there is a Rashman
Speaker 1: aspect to all of this. Everybody perceives what happened from
Speaker 1: their own point of view, though we probably all share
Speaker 1: bits and pieces in our perspectives, are very emotional disagreements
Speaker 1: between the partners began to develop. Several of the partners
Speaker 1: complained that Lifefield was using his position as CEO of
Speaker 1: Image to promote and perhaps even to financially support, Maximum Press,
Speaker 1: a publishing company that life Field operated separately from Image.
Speaker 1: So Vestry withdrew top Cow from Image in June, although
Speaker 1: he retained his partnership in the company, protesting that life
Speaker 1: Field was recruiting artists from his studio, including the highly
Speaker 1: popular Michael Turner, who was doing the art on which Blade,
Speaker 1: which Yeah, I mean it's funny because I can see
Speaker 1: how that can be a total different POV thing where
Speaker 1: life Fields like, look, we're all Image, I could take
Speaker 1: your art, you know, and it's we're just supporting the
Speaker 1: button And he's like, nah, you're doing whack and you're
Speaker 1: taking my hotness. That is what Lifefield said. He said,
Speaker 1: quote people were grabbing other people's talent at this time. Yeah.
Speaker 1: He was like, I don't see what, but this is
Speaker 1: what we were all doing. Yeah. So Larry Martyrs said
Speaker 1: Lifefield was making an increasing number of business decisions that
Speaker 1: were counterproductive to being a business partner. The other five
Speaker 1: partners discussed ousting Lifefield from the company in early September,
Speaker 1: Lyfefield issued a press release stating he was resigning his
Speaker 1: position at Image and leaving the group. Nearly simultaneously, the
Speaker 1: Image Partners issue that place press release stating that they
Speaker 1: had fired Rob part This is the Betty part. His
Speaker 1: resignation came only minutes before the second meeting that would
Speaker 1: have forced him out anyways, Oh my gosh, and the spiciness.
Speaker 1: And then so Lifefeld gave up his share of the
Speaker 1: company and moved all his publishing ventures into a new company,
Speaker 1: Awesome Comics, and Silvestry subsequently returned Top Cow to Image. Wow.
Speaker 1: So that that move right there is really the icing
Speaker 1: on Top two where it's like, all right, top Cow
Speaker 1: is not a part of this. As long as life
Speaker 1: felt here, he's gone, We're bringing top Cow back. Yeah.
Speaker 1: You know, it's really fascinating when I was watching this
Speaker 1: documentary that they do seem, you know, they've gotten over it.
Speaker 1: It's it's kind of I mean, I can't fully speak
Speaker 1: for them. From what I could tell when they were
Speaker 1: asked about and when Leyefield was asked about it, it
Speaker 1: seems that they were all just like, yeah, that was
Speaker 1: a thing that happened. Oh, I mean, I feel like
Speaker 1: it's one of those things where if you're still successful
Speaker 1: and you moved past it, it doesn't bug you as much.
Speaker 1: I feel like slights bug you more if you feel
Speaker 1: like that might have been your downfall if you fall behind. Like,
Speaker 1: for example, when that story that, uh, what was it
Speaker 1: Ari Shaffier beating up Bobby Lee because oh, you haven't
Speaker 1: heard it. So Ari Shafier was dating someone who was
Speaker 1: on Matt TV with Bobby Lee, and when they broke up,
Speaker 1: Ari thought that Bobby like introduced her to this guy
Speaker 1: that she ended up leaving him for. So Ari drives
Speaker 1: to the comedy store and beats up Bobby Lee at
Speaker 1: the comedist store and they were like when that story
Speaker 1: was told, there next to each other, laughing about it.
Speaker 1: And it's one of those things where it's like they're
Speaker 1: both still good in their careers and so they can
Speaker 1: look back on it a laugh. Whereas if you know
Speaker 1: that would have led to Bobby like not being on
Speaker 1: Matt TV and then being like just this unemployed comic
Speaker 1: and yeah, yeaah, he probably would have still been salty
Speaker 1: about it. I think you can look back on the
Speaker 1: junk when you're still good. Yeah, maybe because they came
Speaker 1: out on top. Because that's also what happened with them
Speaker 1: with Marvel Is they left, but they were like, oh no,
Speaker 1: we're still cool with them. We're just not gonna do
Speaker 1: We're gonna do our own thing. We're big enough now,
Speaker 1: So I think that I agree. Jim Lee sold Wild
Speaker 1: Storm and its characters to d C Comics, citing a desire.
Speaker 1: This makes sense though he cited cited a desire to
Speaker 1: exchange his responsibilities as a publisher for the opportunity to
Speaker 1: do more creative work. I think that's what all of
Speaker 1: them wanted to do in general. They just wanted to
Speaker 1: do it on their terms because I think it was
Speaker 1: frustrating for them that now they had to control every
Speaker 1: asp the business side of it, when all they really
Speaker 1: want to do was just create. So Lee, though, was
Speaker 1: the biggest market share for Image Comics, wild Storm had
Speaker 1: the most books, so this was a big deal. Wow
Speaker 1: at the time, probably wasn't too about that and Lee
Speaker 1: both left, So yeah, that's that's that. That's two big
Speaker 1: chunks leaving. But they were flourishing in other mediums because
Speaker 1: Wildcats had an animated show, Savage Dragon had one as well.
Speaker 1: Spawn had its movie with Todd McFarlane and then the
Speaker 1: HBO animated series I was talking about that was mad spicy. Then,
Speaker 1: like you mentioned, Which Blade had its live action show
Speaker 1: on T and T. So Lee and Leifeld were gone.
Speaker 1: Jim Valatino became a publisher and started bringing in things
Speaker 1: that weren't superhero oriented. Uh. And I think that's a
Speaker 1: cool It's a breath of fresh air. I think it
Speaker 1: was in perfect time too, because I feel like by
Speaker 1: the end of the nineties people were a little burnt
Speaker 1: out on capes. Yeah, and so we'll talk about some
Speaker 1: of those comics that he brought in right after the
Speaker 1: break and we're back. So yes, So things were changing
Speaker 1: at Image Comics. In fact, actually Image Comics like their
Speaker 1: focus was changing. They were trying to move with Jim
Speaker 1: Valentino now being on top of kind of helping decide
Speaker 1: what was going to be made there. He wanted to
Speaker 1: move away from superhero oriented comics which was heavily saturated,
Speaker 1: still heavily saturated, but not as much. And he actually
Speaker 1: brought on Powers, which is a very popular comic that
Speaker 1: was by Brian Michael Bendis. Brian Michael Bindis is a
Speaker 1: big name Brian Michael bndes is who created Miles Morales.
Speaker 1: It was because of him, and he said he did
Speaker 1: it specifically because of the Donald Glover interview where he
Speaker 1: said he wanted to be Spider Man and then he
Speaker 1: got a ton of real fascinating yeah, like like it's
Speaker 1: I mean, not the racist thing now, isn't it. I mean,
Speaker 1: isn't it fascinating that that interview we now have Miles
Speaker 1: Morales and he now has a movie. Oh yeah, it's
Speaker 1: crazy and it's crazy too, because that's why I'll always
Speaker 1: have a respect for Brian Michael business. Because he saw
Speaker 1: a person of color speak out about something that he
Speaker 1: wanted and he just did it. He was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: why not, You're right? And I think so much good
Speaker 1: just comes from that of someone having the power to
Speaker 1: make the change that. You know, some people might be like,
Speaker 1: why why do you need to make Spiderman black? Cool? Uh? Well, um,
Speaker 1: I don't know. Actually I do know, because the reason
Speaker 1: Spider Man is the biggest hero hands down, is because
Speaker 1: he his face is completely covered, so anyone can be Spiderman.
Speaker 1: Spider Man was every man. That is why across cultures
Speaker 1: everyone liked Spider Man because anyone could have been Spiderman
Speaker 1: because there was a mass covering. You don't get that
Speaker 1: with Batman because enough of his face is shown that
Speaker 1: you know that he is Caucasian. Same thing for Superman
Speaker 1: everything else. So that's why Spider Man pin popular. So
Speaker 1: to make it seem like as if like his the
Speaker 1: fact that he's white is this huge thing, It's not
Speaker 1: true because his biggest moments are when he's wearing that mask,
Speaker 1: and when he's wearing that mask, you don't know who
Speaker 1: he is. So for just one issue, one in one
Speaker 1: universe or one line, to know that someone under that
Speaker 1: mask looks like you as a big moment, and you've
Speaker 1: seen a lot of change in a lot of excitement
Speaker 1: and kids. When Brian Michael Bindis did create that character,
Speaker 1: that's so fascinating. I was on a panel with jan
Speaker 1: Manuel Roca, who does comics on Comics and I've been
Speaker 1: on several panels with him, and he was talking about
Speaker 1: in Star Wars that he we had to say our
Speaker 1: favorite characters, and he said Darth Vader and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: you're like, you know bad, you got some evil in you.
Speaker 1: He was like, no, that was the only character that
Speaker 1: I could pretend to be because I could. You know,
Speaker 1: he wore a mask, so I could be under that mask.
Speaker 1: I didn't really relate to the other characters. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: just so fascinating. Also, like who gets to pass on
Speaker 1: that mantle. That's the thing about Spider Man is that
Speaker 1: when you're in a costume, anyone could be on to it.
Speaker 1: Anyone could be could have that mantle passed on to them.
Speaker 1: And these characters are not immortal, so they do have
Speaker 1: other other young people picking up picking up the mantle.
Speaker 1: But yeah, so Brian Michael bends created Powers. It helped ship.
Speaker 1: So that's just a complete tangent on Brian Michael business.
Speaker 1: And also why he's a get I think that's what
Speaker 1: I originally started with and then just went to the
Speaker 1: things I like about him. But yes, he made powers. Sorry, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: he he helped shift the image of image. Really, so
Speaker 1: Powers was a police procedural, It's not like anything they
Speaker 1: had done before. The series followed the lives of two
Speaker 1: homicide detectives that were assigned to investigate cases involving people
Speaker 1: with superhuman abilities or powers. Yeah, and it eventually got
Speaker 1: adapted into a TV show that was on the PlayStation
Speaker 1: Now network, and it was doing pretty well for it
Speaker 1: to be like on a hard network like that. And
Speaker 1: then we have the O G Triple O G guy,
Speaker 1: who I you know, really brought image back on the
Speaker 1: map in a big way. Robert Kirkman, Rob Kirkman who
Speaker 1: he pitched Valentino a zombie comic, black and white zombie
Speaker 1: comic at that and uh, and that comic turned out
Speaker 1: to be The Walking Dead and basically UH. Robert Kirkman
Speaker 1: was said that people would ask him what the highest
Speaker 1: selling issue of The Walking Dead was and he'd say
Speaker 1: the current issue because each issue out sold the previous
Speaker 1: as it climbed every month in sales. And I remember
Speaker 1: when it started out and it blew people's minds because
Speaker 1: it was just right on the I know, now we're
Speaker 1: like in zombie overkill, but when The Walking Dead came out,
Speaker 1: it was just there. We weren't at critical mask and
Speaker 1: zombie stories. And to have this story that just has
Speaker 1: such a high turnover rate where anyone can go. You
Speaker 1: just also didn't see that in comics. To jump back
Speaker 1: to something I said previously, or in comic books, people die,
Speaker 1: they come back. Death isn't It's almost like Dragon ball
Speaker 1: Z like if they die, they're like, You're like, oh,
Speaker 1: they can come back. Where you now have this new
Speaker 1: comic that not only makes you get attached to these characters,
Speaker 1: but we'll take them from you. And that's it. I mean,
Speaker 1: we don't even want to get started on issue one hundred.
Speaker 1: That one really rocked people's socks. And then uh then
Speaker 1: they went and did it in the TV show, and
Speaker 1: which I thought they I thought they wouldn't because TV
Speaker 1: is different. People treat TV differently. So I got a
Speaker 1: huge props when they just repeated it on TV. And
Speaker 1: it was funny because there was that level of people
Speaker 1: like what I was like. But it happened in the comics.
Speaker 1: It was it happened so much that it overflowed and
Speaker 1: TV fans were like, we still got them here. It's
Speaker 1: like all right, all right. They are some of the
Speaker 1: most loyal fansh their fan bases ravenous and exciting. Yeah. So,
Speaker 1: starting in two thousand nine, Image began to really grayly
Speaker 1: expand the types of comics that it published, and good
Speaker 1: for them, to be honest, that's exciting. It is nice
Speaker 1: to have something like Saga or you know, which is
Speaker 1: like you know, the sci fi fantasy doesn't necessarily have
Speaker 1: to be superhero at like completely have these really flawed
Speaker 1: and characters and verily adult stories very much so that
Speaker 1: just explore just everything. So I just wanted to say.
Speaker 1: Saga creator Brian Cavan said of of Image, I love
Speaker 1: all the companies I've worked with, but I think Image
Speaker 1: might be the only publisher left that can still offer
Speaker 1: a contract I would consider fully creator owned. Saga is
Speaker 1: really important story to me, So I wanted a guarantee
Speaker 1: of no content restrictions or other creative interference, and I
Speaker 1: needed to maintain one control and ownership of all non
Speaker 1: publishing rights with the artists, including the right to never
Speaker 1: have our comic turned into a movie or television show
Speaker 1: or whatever. So fascinating. Yeah, it's so good because that
Speaker 1: is a thing, the other side of it, because there's
Speaker 1: the one side of it where like when it is
Speaker 1: turned into a TV show or something, you you have
Speaker 1: the ownership of it. But sometimes you may not want
Speaker 1: that path teenage meeting Nina Turtles. Yeah, you may want
Speaker 1: it to just live on the page and uh and yeah,
Speaker 1: I think you know. Image has allowed some weird comics
Speaker 1: that I think would never exist without the brand existing,
Speaker 1: or maybe it would just under another banner. But like
Speaker 1: sex Criminals, which is by Chips Adarski and uh Matt Fraction,
Speaker 1: the concept of it are two people that when they
Speaker 1: have sex and orgasm, they stop time. So it's a
Speaker 1: it's a it's a mature comic, but just the concept
Speaker 1: of that is just so weird, and like how they
Speaker 1: find each other is such a weird, and it's like
Speaker 1: a very human love story on top of that with
Speaker 1: also the stuff that they have to deal with having
Speaker 1: this weird power. I don't think you would see its
Speaker 1: sex Criminal a Marvel pages. I don't think Marvel would
Speaker 1: even go that deep. I mean they do have Marvel Max,
Speaker 1: which I feel like the only Marvel Max, which if
Speaker 1: you don't know Marvel Max is they're kind of mature
Speaker 1: comics where anything can happen. There's only two series that
Speaker 1: I felt really worked for Max that didn't felt force,
Speaker 1: and it was Wolverine, which like seeing that go full
Speaker 1: explicit was fun, and Nick Fury and it was like
Speaker 1: his kind of like side missions and that was like
Speaker 1: just straight up James Bond. I think everything else put
Speaker 1: under Max title just almost forces it because you're like,
Speaker 1: this person isn't that violent. I don't think they would
Speaker 1: just but Wolverine, he will just disembowel someone. And you're
Speaker 1: seeing that and you're like, oh, yeah, this is everything
Speaker 1: that you've written in Wolverine and kind of stopped the
Speaker 1: brakes at I wanted to say for those that don't
Speaker 1: know Saga, which I highly wrote, that I know you
Speaker 1: read Saga as well if he definitely check it out.
Speaker 1: It is adult, so heads up for parents out there.
Speaker 1: But I mean also I read stuff in the sense
Speaker 1: that like Game of Thrones as adult with not even
Speaker 1: being that that that much. Like it's not like it's
Speaker 1: not going to say it's not like sex Criminals, where
Speaker 1: if you hear sex from as you're like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: but like something like Saga's like it just has you know,
Speaker 1: nudity here and there when yeah that now I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: it has a boob am I allowed to say boob Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: it has a boob out. But yeah. It's about these
Speaker 1: two parents that are in love and they're both from
Speaker 1: warring races and they're in a galactic war where they
Speaker 1: struggle to care for their daughter, who sometimes narrates the
Speaker 1: series as well. It's highly recommend. Yeah, it's very beautiful.
Speaker 1: Um but Fiona Staples, her art is gorgeous, like just
Speaker 1: some of those spreads that you get to, you're just
Speaker 1: like you just want to go back and read it,
Speaker 1: just to look at some of these spreads, and it's
Speaker 1: very beautiful and romantic, and her and Brian cae Von
Speaker 1: are creating something extremely beautiful. I do highly recommend, and
Speaker 1: I'd say just go for the what I like to do.
Speaker 1: For here's a quick comic guide for all my new
Speaker 1: beast of comics. You can buy single issues, which come
Speaker 1: out on a monthly basis, or if you have the patients,
Speaker 1: you can buy trade paperbacks which collect about things about
Speaker 1: five issues, and they're really quick with Saga to drop
Speaker 1: the trades. So I would highly suggest doing that because
Speaker 1: a story like Saga, I cannot read single issue. I
Speaker 1: have to get a lot of it at once, like
Speaker 1: wait in a month with Yeah, I remember, I forgot
Speaker 1: we were like at l a comic con or something.
Speaker 1: Your backpack was full of Saga books. Yeah, it was
Speaker 1: because I let someone borrow one and two, three, And
Speaker 1: it's one of those things where just like books, comics
Speaker 1: are the same you let someone borrow some trades, you
Speaker 1: may never see it again. So I just bought the
Speaker 1: hardcover back and then everything after that. I was just
Speaker 1: organizing my trades today. So that's also why I'm like
Speaker 1: on top of my game with calling comics. I did
Speaker 1: want to stay just closing us out that Image sales
Speaker 1: groups and sgnificantly during this period, especially with Saga to
Speaker 1: a market share of around ten and an influx of
Speaker 1: Marvel and DC associated creators began to publish their work
Speaker 1: with them, and Yeah, as of sixteen, McFarland Spawn and
Speaker 1: Larsen Savage Dragon continue as the longest running creator owned
Speaker 1: titles by Image Partners, with over two hundred fifty two
Speaker 1: issues respectively, and at this point that was we do know.
Speaker 1: At this point in time, Jamie Fox is confirmed to
Speaker 1: be Yeah, they cast at him. We'll see how it goes.
Speaker 1: Jamie Fox is an OSCAR awarded actor, so I don't
Speaker 1: want to us pretend like he can't step up to
Speaker 1: the role. I just I don't know, do you feel like,
Speaker 1: see this is what I see? Because it possibly might
Speaker 1: be r rated. They haven't said that, but I'm just yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure Todd Todd is a very like he
Speaker 1: wants to be on that. I mean, especially because they
Speaker 1: already had that h like there, they had an animated
Speaker 1: show that was spicy. So but I feel like, okay,
Speaker 1: if it's R rated, we have Jamie FOXX, we have
Speaker 1: someone that has a comedy background. I feel like this
Speaker 1: might be partly also because of Deadpool, like just that
Speaker 1: fan base of it being like not necessarily him, but
Speaker 1: I'm saying the R rated comedy esque superhero possibly not
Speaker 1: saying that that's what Spawn is because he's kind of
Speaker 1: much darker than that's super dark, Like this is the
Speaker 1: one where like the freaking Zack Snyder Gloom would work,
Speaker 1: Like this is the like to be honest, So yeah,
Speaker 1: he should be doing that. Like if I had to
Speaker 1: pick a superhero movie for Zack Snyder to do, it
Speaker 1: would be Spawn. But do you think that maybe they
Speaker 1: want a different I know that Jamie Fox can play
Speaker 1: really serious roles, but I feel like his comedic background
Speaker 1: has to probably come into play. I like his drama
Speaker 1: more than comedy, so I may him when he was
Speaker 1: like goofy shocker. Yeah, then maybe it'll be a mixture.
Speaker 1: Who knows, Well, where where can people find you? Danny,
Speaker 1: you have anything to plug right here in the studio. Well,
Speaker 1: let's see this is we've already gone to Comic Con,
Speaker 1: so you and I are probably sick, So sure, Danny, Yes,
Speaker 1: So catch me at Miss Danny Fernance M S D
Speaker 1: A N I F E r n N d E
Speaker 1: Z and you can definitely hit up our t public page.
Speaker 1: We handed out some shirts at Comic Con, our Stay
Speaker 1: Nerdy shirts. I love them. There are logo, Uh, definitely
Speaker 1: hit up some. Get some Nerdificent gear, get a laptop.
Speaker 1: I have stickers all over my laptop and now I'm
Speaker 1: excited to add our Stay Nerdy on there. And remember too,
Speaker 1: if you like this podcast want us to keep doing it,
Speaker 1: please give us five stars on iTunes. It really helps.
Speaker 1: And we're on the front page. Yeah, we were on
Speaker 1: the Comic Con. They were promoting for everybody going to
Speaker 1: Comic Con and there was Nerdificent. We got a lot
Speaker 1: of texts and pictures and screenshots and to us, so
Speaker 1: thank you. That would not have happened without y'all. Thank
Speaker 1: you so much. Yeah, you know me. If I F
Speaker 1: Y N W A d I W E on Twitter
Speaker 1: and Instagram, if D's on Twitch, lots of nerd fan
Speaker 1: coming through, and we do have the discord, so uh
Speaker 1: definitely come in there if you want to chat about EPs.
Speaker 1: In August August eleven, I'll be in Portland with white
Speaker 1: women from a formerly culture kings Carl Tart uh doing
Speaker 1: the stump Town improv fess. So definitely if you are
Speaker 1: in the p Town p d X area, come through
Speaker 1: and UH see me do some make um ups. Maybe
Speaker 1: shout out of suggestion. We may just ignore it. But
Speaker 1: besides that, I want to give a shout out to
Speaker 1: you know z Daddy and the booth young Zach McKeever. Uh,
Speaker 1: you know Anna our producer, uh sitting in with none
Speaker 1: only the Dan what's your last name? Dan Goodman because
Speaker 1: he's a good man and of course he's Jeff Coten
Speaker 1: Christopher hasci otis doing that sweet research for us, getting
Speaker 1: us uh super correct with all the INFOCT we need
Speaker 1: to give it to your ers. So thank you once
Speaker 1: again coming through and as always, stay learning