WEBVTT - Part One: The Second American Civil War You Never Learned About 0:00:02.200 --> 0:00:06.120 Hello America, and welcome to the Internet. I'm Robert Evans 0:00:06.519 --> 0:00:09.680 and this is a podcast. It's called Behind the Bastards 0:00:10.000 --> 0:00:14.240 and it's about bad people. That's the introduction that I 0:00:14.280 --> 0:00:16.440 have for you today and I hope you all enjoyed it. 0:00:16.720 --> 0:00:20.239 My guest today Spencer Grtindon. Spencer, how are you doing today? Oh? 0:00:20.280 --> 0:00:22.600 I'm great. Should I match that energy because I don't 0:00:22.640 --> 0:00:26.560 think that's possible. No, no, but you nailed it. That 0:00:26.680 --> 0:00:28.840 was perfect. That was that was the energy I brought 0:00:28.840 --> 0:00:34.040 you in to provide perfect. Spencer. Uh, you are um, 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:36.600 I mean, among other things, you're kind of the reason 0:00:37.080 --> 0:00:39.680 uh that that that D and D A big part 0:00:39.680 --> 0:00:41.880 of the reason that D and D went from something 0:00:41.960 --> 0:00:45.600 that I shamefully hid from bullies when I was in 0:00:45.680 --> 0:00:49.800 high school. Uh, to something that is I don't know, 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:52.320 I'll call it cool. I'm gonna say it's cool now 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:55.240 to play Dungeons and Dragons and it's it's all on you, buddy. 0:00:55.360 --> 0:00:58.000 So thank you for that. This is my my opportunity 0:00:58.080 --> 0:01:00.880 to say that. Oh yeah, thank you for saying that. 0:01:00.920 --> 0:01:03.040 I mean I keep telling people that, but no one 0:01:03.080 --> 0:01:07.400 believes me. So that's validation I need. Now, you and 0:01:07.440 --> 0:01:09.680 I have casted a couple of pods together in the 0:01:09.760 --> 0:01:12.680 in the past, have we not? Yeah, you went on 0:01:12.760 --> 0:01:21.160 Harmon Town. It was twice twice, Yeah, twice, And it 0:01:21.200 --> 0:01:23.600 was fun. I mean, I don't know a lot of 0:01:23.600 --> 0:01:26.480 times we have people on that don't know much, Like 0:01:26.600 --> 0:01:29.000 it's not like they're not experts in their field or whatever, 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:31.000 but they're just not on to talk about stuff that 0:01:31.080 --> 0:01:35.920 they have a real perspective on, or information or things 0:01:35.920 --> 0:01:38.080 that aren't pulled out of their ass. So it was 0:01:38.160 --> 0:01:42.039 really refreshing for that reason. Yeah, I mean I pull 0:01:42.080 --> 0:01:43.800 a lot of stuff out of my ass, but rarely 0:01:43.840 --> 0:01:48.120 on camera or a stage. So, how has your how's 0:01:48.160 --> 0:01:50.240 your quarantine? Ben Spencer? How are you? How are you 0:01:50.320 --> 0:01:53.840 holding up in the in the plague? Um? So it's 0:01:53.880 --> 0:01:56.360 it's it's kind of funny because I'm getting a bit 0:01:56.400 --> 0:01:58.480 too much of my roommate. We're kind of getting in 0:01:58.520 --> 0:02:01.200 each other's way, and um, I was like, man, it 0:02:01.240 --> 0:02:03.360 would be nice to be living alone. And then the 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:05.720 other day we were doing errands together and she's like, man, 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:08.640 it's so great that we're not living alone. And I 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:11.840 was like, oh, okay, that's that's your your version of this. 0:02:11.919 --> 0:02:15.040 Then huh um, but I'm I'm getting a little stir crazy. 0:02:15.080 --> 0:02:17.119 I would like more space. In the past, I would 0:02:17.440 --> 0:02:20.200 just go for car rides to kind of just get 0:02:20.240 --> 0:02:23.600 myself some space. And I can't really do that. I mean, technically, 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:25.440 maybe it just seems like a risk. I don't know. 0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:29.000 I don't think it's really I don't know how California 0:02:29.080 --> 0:02:32.280 is handling it law wise. I think it's driving alone 0:02:32.320 --> 0:02:35.000 in your car is a pretty safe thing. Um, I 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:38.960 would say, yeah, yeah, I'm I'm you know, It's one 0:02:38.960 --> 0:02:42.200 of those things I think everybody. I think everybody who's 0:02:42.280 --> 0:02:45.720 quarantined with like roommates or romantic partners, is like, oh 0:02:45.760 --> 0:02:48.400 my god, I wish I was alone right now. This 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:49.880 would be so much easier if I was alone. And 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:52.200 I think everyone who's quarantined alone is like, oh my god, 0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:53.920 I wish I had a roommate or I wish my 0:02:53.919 --> 0:02:56.920 boyfriend a girlfriend was here. It's terrible being alone. And 0:02:56.960 --> 0:02:58.720 I think the answer is that it just sucks to 0:02:58.760 --> 0:03:05.079 be quarantined. Um. Yeah, that's that's the less that I'm 0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:07.000 taking out of this, is that it's not great to 0:03:07.040 --> 0:03:10.239 be locked in in your house. Well, no matter who 0:03:10.240 --> 0:03:12.480 it's with. I feel like I love being locked in 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:15.200 my house, so it would just be interesting. I wish 0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:18.079 I had like a good control group to really make 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:21.600 this experiment pop. Now, Spencer, let me ask you. The 0:03:21.919 --> 0:03:25.480 President has recently stated that people should liberate a series 0:03:25.520 --> 0:03:29.119 of of Midwestern states. Have you have you jumped onto 0:03:29.120 --> 0:03:31.120 the call to start the boogaloo? Are you? Are you 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:33.600 grabbing your go bag and your a R fifteen to 0:03:33.600 --> 0:03:37.000 to to liberate the sparrow in your neighborhood. Yeah, I'm 0:03:37.000 --> 0:03:39.520 gonna have to come back up at force. It all 0:03:39.560 --> 0:03:43.400 sounds present liberation, you know, like who can get Who 0:03:43.400 --> 0:03:47.480 could stand opposed to that? That is a great question, 0:03:47.640 --> 0:03:50.680 and it actually ties in a little bit to our 0:03:50.760 --> 0:03:55.520 episode today because obviously everyone in America is thinking about, um, 0:03:55.560 --> 0:04:00.240 a civil war, like like a new one, right um, 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:02.840 And you know we're also there's a lot of thoughts 0:04:02.880 --> 0:04:05.320 back to the old Civil War. You know. It's some 0:04:05.360 --> 0:04:07.760 of those protests in Michigan and whatnot. People are waving 0:04:07.760 --> 0:04:10.200 Confederate flags, which doesn't really make a lot of sense 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:15.160 in Michigan, but that's just remember the Confederate state of Michigan. Yes, 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:23.120 the great Jefferson Davis, famed detroitter. Yeah, so we're all 0:04:23.160 --> 0:04:25.680 thinking about civil wars. And you know, when people in 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:28.200 America think about the civil wars, we have to think about, 0:04:28.279 --> 0:04:30.320 you know, the big civil war, which is civil wars 0:04:30.320 --> 0:04:34.000 go worldwide in the top three or seven something somewhere 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:37.479 around there definitely a great civil war. Um or they're 0:04:37.480 --> 0:04:40.040 thinking about like the possibility of a new civil war, 0:04:40.080 --> 0:04:42.719 and people will often call that the Second American Civil War. 0:04:43.480 --> 0:04:46.000 But what if, Spencer, what if I were to tell 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:49.719 you that this country actually already had a second civil war, 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:53.880 one with machine guns and aerial bombardment and trenches and 0:04:53.920 --> 0:04:55.880 blood and guts. What if I were to tell you 0:04:55.920 --> 0:04:58.560 that already happened. Well, I would have to laugh you 0:04:58.600 --> 0:05:01.760 out of the room. Well that would be hard because 0:05:01.800 --> 0:05:04.560 we are quarantined in separate states, So I would have 0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:08.920 to laugh. Yeah, laugh me off of the internet. Well, 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:13.200 don't start laughing yet, Spencer, because it turns out there 0:05:13.480 --> 0:05:16.840 was a second American Civil War and it happened in 0:05:16.960 --> 0:05:22.000 West Virginia. Now, most US history textbooks have a painful 0:05:22.040 --> 0:05:25.159 allergy to talking about it because it all hinges on 0:05:25.240 --> 0:05:28.080 the labor movement, and for whatever reason, the people who 0:05:28.120 --> 0:05:30.640 write our textbooks don't like to talk about the reason 0:05:30.680 --> 0:05:35.760 that weekends exist. Uh, but today, in this two part episode, 0:05:35.800 --> 0:05:38.359 we're going to talk about the Battle of Blair Mountain. 0:05:38.440 --> 0:05:41.560 Have you ever heard of the Battle of Blair Mountain? No? Literally, no, 0:05:41.720 --> 0:05:46.200 I'm not a big history awesome even that sounds wild. Yeah, 0:05:46.279 --> 0:05:51.440 it's a fucking cool story. Um, it's like, it's like, uh, 0:05:51.480 --> 0:05:55.039 it's a cyberpunk story in a steampunk setting. That's that's 0:05:55.040 --> 0:05:56.839 how I would if I was if I was trying 0:05:56.839 --> 0:05:59.520 to like, if I was trying to sell the Netflix 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:01.960 TV show version of this, That's how I would package it. 0:06:02.000 --> 0:06:06.360 In a fucking elevator pitch. Um, it's pretty cool. I mean, 0:06:06.400 --> 0:06:08.479 a lot of people die horribly and a lot of 0:06:08.480 --> 0:06:11.560 people get right. But it's like, just I don't know 0:06:11.680 --> 0:06:17.480 what point I was making. It's interesting. That is very cyberpunk. Yeah, 0:06:17.680 --> 0:06:20.560 So it all starts with coal Spencer. In the late 0:06:20.560 --> 0:06:24.560 eighteen hundreds, coal became increasingly critical to the economic productivity 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:27.200 and the infrastructure of the United States, and the richest 0:06:27.279 --> 0:06:31.200 veins of coal were underground, So this necessitated large groups 0:06:31.200 --> 0:06:33.960 of men writing down to those veins through vast holes 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:36.479 in the earth and hacking out big chunks of coal. 0:06:36.720 --> 0:06:39.600 The structural supports that like kept them alive and kept 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:43.600 the world from collapsing on them were often also made 0:06:43.600 --> 0:06:46.839 of coal. Um. It was extraordinarily dangerous. There was like 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:50.760 trapped gas, sulfur gas and ship everywhere, or methane gas everywhere, 0:06:50.800 --> 0:06:54.160 and like explosions happened all the time. Mine collapses were 0:06:54.279 --> 0:06:57.760 very common. Um, It's one of the most dangerous jobs 0:06:57.760 --> 0:07:00.840 people ever had, to the extent that like, like, like, 0:07:00.920 --> 0:07:04.480 more Americans died from coal collapses over the decades than 0:07:04.560 --> 0:07:08.560 died fighting in Vietnam. Um, I wanted a lot of Minecraft, 0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:13.200 and that does not track with my experience. Minecraft. Um 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:17.800 has benefited a lot from the decades of mind safety reforms. 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:22.520 So thank you, Thank you Minecraft, Thank you Notch famed 0:07:22.600 --> 0:07:28.400 Q and honor and fascist for yeah. So UM for 0:07:28.440 --> 0:07:31.040 an example of some soul fucking the terrible cold disasters, 0:07:31.040 --> 0:07:32.600 because I know everybody comes to the show for that 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:35.880 sort of thing. Um, there was the Ecoles mind disaster 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:38.920 in West Virginia in April of nineteen fourteen. This was 0:07:39.040 --> 0:07:42.120 a methane explosion that occurred while two hundred and forty 0:07:42.160 --> 0:07:44.560 six miners were underground and a hundred and eighty of 0:07:44.600 --> 0:07:47.640 them died instantly. Uh. In nineteen o nine, there was 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:51.119 a mine explosion in Cherry, Illinois, which destroyed the entire 0:07:51.200 --> 0:07:54.200 town and killed two hundred and fifty nine men and boys. 0:07:54.280 --> 0:07:57.240 Because an awful lot of boys worked in mind their 0:07:57.280 --> 0:08:01.040 little hands could reach the coal better. Um, so that's cool. 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:06.040 It's terrifying. Yeah, it sucks. Between eighteen ninety and nineteen seventeen, 0:08:06.080 --> 0:08:09.440 at least twenty six thousand American miners were killed on 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:13.640 the job, mostly in explosion. Twelve thousand miners were maimed 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:18.480 every year, often permanently disabled. So not a great job. 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:23.000 I would say, yeah, less, I think less people are 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:25.960 named podcasting every year. So if he is, are less 0:08:25.960 --> 0:08:29.040 than twelve thousand people nimed while podcasting every year? I 0:08:29.120 --> 0:08:32.920 cannot confirm it, Tony. I'm trying to get those numbers 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:35.559 up with the machetes, but we still I don't. I mean, 0:08:35.600 --> 0:08:37.720 I may be maimed a thousand people in a year, 0:08:37.760 --> 0:08:40.160 you know, if I'm really, if I'm really getting the 0:08:40.240 --> 0:08:42.520 let out. So it sucked to be a coal miner. 0:08:42.600 --> 0:08:46.120 It was not a great job, right. Uh. Men took 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:48.720 the gig because they needed money, and mining often paid 0:08:48.760 --> 0:08:51.079 well um or at least the pay that the boss 0:08:51.160 --> 0:08:54.960 is advertised was generally good. Capitalism being what it was, 0:08:55.240 --> 0:08:57.360 the people who owned the minds had a variety of 0:08:57.360 --> 0:08:59.440 fun tactics that they used to funk over the human 0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:02.439 beings who may their business profitable. One of these tactics 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:05.679 was called cribbing. See, miners were paid based on the 0:09:05.720 --> 0:09:08.400 tonnage of coal that they mind. Every car that left 0:09:08.440 --> 0:09:11.040 the mines was supposed to hold a specific payload of 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:15.160 one ton or two thousand pounds. However, the mine operator 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:17.640 got to actually purchase and set up the cars, and 0:09:17.679 --> 0:09:20.240 they would regularly rig them to hold more cold than 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:23.000 they were supposed to hold. The wooden contraptions that they 0:09:23.040 --> 0:09:24.880 added to the sides of the cart to enable this 0:09:25.160 --> 0:09:27.679 were called cribs, and hence the name cribbing. It was 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:30.000 not uncommon for miners to be paid for digging out 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:33.679 two thousand pounds when they had actually dug out twenty pounds. 0:09:33.720 --> 0:09:36.000 So that's stealing five pounds of coal from a minor. 0:09:36.040 --> 0:09:39.320 That's a lot of of bullshit. So like they put 0:09:39.360 --> 0:09:42.800 like a wooden basket around it, so they add more coal, 0:09:42.880 --> 0:09:45.320 and then they essentially said that was one load of 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:47.240 coal when it was more like two or one and 0:09:47.240 --> 0:09:49.480 a half. Yeah, it was more like one in a quarter, 0:09:49.520 --> 0:09:51.680 but like, yeah, yeah, they would. They would get extra 0:09:51.720 --> 0:09:56.680 coal for free. Basically, yeah, so that's cool. Mine operators 0:09:56.679 --> 0:09:59.080 would also, Yeah, it's not great. It's not great. Mine 0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:01.560 operators would all so often docked the pay of their 0:10:01.559 --> 0:10:03.880 miners when they found slate and rock mixed in with 0:10:03.920 --> 0:10:06.120 the coal. The man who did the weighing was the 0:10:06.200 --> 0:10:08.040 judge of this, and since he was paid directly by 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:10.040 the mine owner, it was not uncommon for him to 0:10:10.040 --> 0:10:12.319 just cheat the miners and lie about how much non 0:10:12.320 --> 0:10:16.000 coal wound up in the coal. Um, so that's cool too. 0:10:17.000 --> 0:10:20.640 And then of course your skin is crawling. Yeah, that's horrible. 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:26.959 It's just oh man, it gets so much worse. I mean, 0:10:27.080 --> 0:10:29.120 just as a spoiler, we're about to talk about something 0:10:29.160 --> 0:10:34.559 called burecraticized rape. So strap in man on a great episode. 0:10:35.240 --> 0:10:38.400 But first let's talk about company stores. Um, have you 0:10:38.400 --> 0:10:41.160 even heard that song that goes you work sixteen tons 0:10:41.240 --> 0:10:44.400 and what do you get another day? Older and deeper 0:10:44.440 --> 0:10:46.840 in it? St Peter, don't you call me because I 0:10:46.880 --> 0:10:54.640 can't go own my soul to the company store that song. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, 0:10:54.720 --> 0:10:56.920 Well it's it's a song about coal mining back in 0:10:56.960 --> 0:11:00.800 these days, and the company's store, um is a thing 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:03.320 that like a lot of mining towns or mines would have, 0:11:03.360 --> 0:11:06.120 and they didn't start out as necessarily exploitative. So like 0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:07.839 a lot of mines in the late eighteen hundreds in 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:09.839 early nineteen hundreds were in the middle of nowhere, and 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:11.640 there would be like no town near the mine, and 0:11:11.640 --> 0:11:13.599 the miners would have to live nearby because it was 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:15.720 just the only way for the work to happen. So 0:11:15.760 --> 0:11:17.600 the company would have to set up a store where 0:11:17.640 --> 0:11:22.400 they could buy food and necessities. So like not inherently exploitative, 0:11:22.720 --> 0:11:25.440 but having the only place where miners can shop be 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:30.800 owned by their employer also is super prone to exploitation, right, 0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:33.480 Like you can see how an asshole who would do 0:11:33.520 --> 0:11:37.960 something like Cribbin could also take advantage of that bullshit. Um. So, 0:11:38.040 --> 0:11:39.959 there's been a lot of research done in company stores 0:11:40.040 --> 0:11:42.680 and a surprising amount of them actually don't seem to 0:11:42.720 --> 0:11:44.960 have been abusive, and prices were in line with prices 0:11:44.960 --> 0:11:48.319 at independent businesses, uh, But a lot of them were 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:51.400 horrifically abusive and would like jack up prices to wagh 0:11:51.400 --> 0:11:53.720 above what they would cost, and some companies would actually 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:56.880 make it would ban or fire miners from going into 0:11:56.920 --> 0:11:59.240 other towns to shop at stores that weren't owned by 0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:03.480 the company. Yeah, and West Virginia was a place where 0:12:03.480 --> 0:12:06.520 this was particularly common because West Virginia then and now 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:09.120 was out in the middle of fucking nowhere. Um like 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:14.640 it's it is just nowhere stand um, So you could 0:12:14.679 --> 0:12:17.000 really get away with a lot of fucking over miners 0:12:17.120 --> 0:12:19.679 out there. Um. And another way they would suck over 0:12:19.720 --> 0:12:24.120 miners was debt peonage. So pay for miners at this 0:12:24.160 --> 0:12:26.400 period happened like once a month, and you also had 0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:28.240 to have been working for a full month to get 0:12:28.240 --> 0:12:30.560 any pay um. And obviously I don't know if you're 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:32.320 aware of this, but if people don't get food and 0:12:32.320 --> 0:12:35.240 water for a month, they die. Uh yeah, I've heard 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:39.080 such things. Yeah. Yeah, So companies would have to offer 0:12:39.240 --> 0:12:42.360 script to workers who hadn't gotten paid yet, and this 0:12:42.440 --> 0:12:46.640 was like basically an advance on their salary um. And 0:12:46.800 --> 0:12:49.160 if you know, workers didn't make quite as much as 0:12:49.200 --> 0:12:50.920 they thought they were going to make and they'd already 0:12:50.920 --> 0:12:52.640 spent the company's script, they could wind up in a 0:12:52.640 --> 0:12:54.960 situation where they were indebted to the company for long 0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:57.719 periods of time and basically just kept having to take 0:12:57.760 --> 0:12:59.960 script to keep their family fed and never quite got 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:02.400 out of debts. So it's like you, some really bad 0:13:02.480 --> 0:13:06.520 situations happened in this ship, um, and company stores came 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:08.200 along with a lot of other things, because in a 0:13:08.200 --> 0:13:10.600 lot of cases you had company town. So like the 0:13:10.640 --> 0:13:13.480 company would be responsible for like the school, and be 0:13:13.520 --> 0:13:16.640 responsible for the store, would be the responsible for housing 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:19.760 all of their workers. That doesn't necessarily sound bad. Um. 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:23.559 Although company houses were often squalid hovels, they also sometimes 0:13:23.640 --> 0:13:26.640 were houses of decent quality. But the fact that you 0:13:26.679 --> 0:13:29.520 were living in a house owned by your company meant 0:13:29.559 --> 0:13:32.160 that you had no real security. If you got fired 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:34.680 for any reason, the company would kick you out of 0:13:34.679 --> 0:13:36.719 your home the same day because you didn't have any 0:13:36.800 --> 0:13:39.480 kind of lease or legal protections, so they had the 0:13:39.520 --> 0:13:41.719 ability to kick you out of your home and make 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:43.960 you homeless in the middle of the fucking mountains at 0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:47.440 the drop of a hat. Um. So that's in a 0:13:47.520 --> 0:13:50.480 great situation. I don't know, does does your industry work 0:13:50.520 --> 0:13:54.160 that way? Spencer? Mine does not? Yeah? No, uh, well, 0:13:54.360 --> 0:13:57.200 I don't know. It's the parallels to like your what 0:13:57.240 --> 0:14:00.280 do you call it? Medical insurance coverage is very it 0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:05.040 is it is to me, but it's similarly, Yes, yes, 0:14:05.120 --> 0:14:08.200 there are definitely modern day parallels, but we should also 0:14:08.200 --> 0:14:10.839 acknowledge it was way worse back then, even though it 0:14:10.920 --> 0:14:13.400 still sucks now. But like, yeah, it's that's actually a 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:14.880 very good point you make that, Like it's kind of 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:18.600 like health insurance where you can be fucked immediately if 0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:23.840 your company kicks you off mountains in the metaphorical mountains 0:14:23.840 --> 0:14:26.320 and the mountains of not being able to get your insulin, 0:14:27.840 --> 0:14:30.480 which I guess is I don't know, let's say mount Hood. 0:14:30.640 --> 0:14:35.000 Mount Hood is the mountain of insulin. I've always said, um, okay, 0:14:35.600 --> 0:14:38.400 So yeah, there's a song called Company Town by Carl 0:14:38.440 --> 0:14:41.200 Sandberg that I think confys how many miners felt about 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:43.400 their situation. I'm just going to read out the lyrics. Um, 0:14:43.480 --> 0:14:45.200 you live in a company house, you go to a 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:48.840 company school, you work for this company. According to company rules, 0:14:49.160 --> 0:14:52.000 you all drink company water, and all use company lights. 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:55.680 The company preacher teaches us what the company thinks is right. 0:14:56.800 --> 0:14:59.920 So there's like that video game, right that just can 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:02.560 amount about like you're in space, but it's kind of 0:15:02.600 --> 0:15:05.480 like this, Uh what the fund is that game? Um 0:15:05.600 --> 0:15:10.320 Animal cross No, no, no, no no, although that has 0:15:10.360 --> 0:15:13.120 its own there's a lot, a lot of lessons about 0:15:13.160 --> 0:15:15.880 capitalism and animal crossing. Are you talking about the one 0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:18.160 where you have to like junk a space hulk and 0:15:18.240 --> 0:15:21.400 that's your job for like in the outer worlds, the 0:15:21.440 --> 0:15:24.040 outer worlds? Yeah, and it's got like town you're in 0:15:24.080 --> 0:15:26.600 like a planet that's owned by the company, and they've 0:15:26.640 --> 0:15:28.760 got a preacher I think, and like yeah, that's what 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:31.720 they're this is like this is all based on actual 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:34.080 labor history, like that some of the ship in that 0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:37.160 game they just have laser pistols, which they did not 0:15:37.600 --> 0:15:40.600 back then. As a heads up, Yeah, which is lame. 0:15:40.640 --> 0:15:42.480 They should have had laser pistols. This would be a 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:48.840 funner story different, Yeah, maybe not. Um So. Company stores 0:15:48.920 --> 0:15:51.200 also gave the company a way to increase profits. When 0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:53.400 the value of cold dropped, they could just soak their 0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:56.200 employees by raising the price of goods, and company houses 0:15:56.240 --> 0:15:58.760 gave them a strong lever to raise up if employees 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:01.240 ever complained about working conditions. If you don't like that 0:16:01.280 --> 0:16:03.200 the boss is one ton, cart is actually one and 0:16:03.200 --> 0:16:07.080 a half tons. Well, now, you're homeless, so like, yeah, 0:16:07.160 --> 0:16:09.480 if this sounds a little bit like slavery to you, 0:16:09.840 --> 0:16:12.280 it actually did to a number of black miners who 0:16:12.280 --> 0:16:15.280 were former slaves themselves. So as a result of a 0:16:15.320 --> 0:16:17.040 lot of the stuff we're gonna talk about in this episode, 0:16:17.040 --> 0:16:19.680 there were a number of Senate inquiries, and in one 0:16:19.720 --> 0:16:22.240 of the Senate inquiries, the Senate wound up talking to 0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:25.320 a black miner named Mr. Eccles, and he asked about 0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:28.280 like what he thought was the problem with the mining industry. 0:16:28.800 --> 0:16:31.840 So here's what he said in the Senate quote. I 0:16:31.880 --> 0:16:34.720 will tell you the miners asked the contractors or operators 0:16:34.720 --> 0:16:36.560 to give them an opportunity to weigh the coal, and 0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:39.240 they announced that they will not weigh it. They promised 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:40.760 to pay us by the ton, but they don't do it. 0:16:40.760 --> 0:16:42.560 They promised, according to whatever the coal is, to pay 0:16:42.640 --> 0:16:43.920 us by the ton, and we want them to put 0:16:43.920 --> 0:16:45.560 it on the scales. All they do is say that 0:16:45.640 --> 0:16:47.360 so and so much, and we have to take it. 0:16:47.760 --> 0:16:49.960 There are some things that we cannot stand for. I 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:52.440 was raised a slave. My master and mistress called me 0:16:52.440 --> 0:16:54.040 and I answered, and I know the time when I 0:16:54.080 --> 0:16:56.680 was a slave, and I felt just like I feel now. 0:16:57.760 --> 0:17:02.040 So it is not, um devaluing the suffering of slavery 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:04.879 to compare what these miners went through with slavery, because 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:07.359 some of them were former slaves and they specifically said, 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:10.440 this is actually not all that different. It wasn't there 0:17:10.480 --> 0:17:13.800 like in it farming or something which seems very similar 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:16.639 share share cropping. Yeah, there's a lot of similarities with 0:17:16.680 --> 0:17:19.760 share cropping, but that is that is a story for 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:24.360 another day. Um. And this is you know miners where 0:17:24.359 --> 0:17:26.160 there were a lot of black miners and white miners, 0:17:26.160 --> 0:17:27.960 and there were times when they worked together, in times 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:30.280 when they would like wind up, like white miners would 0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:32.480 throw black miners under the bus to get a better deal. 0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:35.359 Like both of those things happened. Um. We're not going 0:17:35.400 --> 0:17:37.960 to get into the kind of racial history of of 0:17:38.000 --> 0:17:41.480 the coal labor strikes and stuff as much as maybe 0:17:41.480 --> 0:17:43.919 we ought to, because there's just a lot these are 0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:47.280 all all labor history is very complicated and nuanced. So 0:17:47.440 --> 0:17:50.040 I'm doing my best to tell a discreete story, and 0:17:50.080 --> 0:17:52.240 I apologize for some things that will not be covered 0:17:52.240 --> 0:17:56.320 in as much detail as they should. Um. So yeah, 0:17:56.520 --> 0:18:00.639 coal miners sucked. Coal mining sucked. Coal miners were the 0:18:00.640 --> 0:18:03.840 same as everybody else. Podcast takes a hard stance against 0:18:04.440 --> 0:18:07.919 Suck you coal miners. We just pivot right to just 0:18:08.000 --> 0:18:11.959 tearing a hole through coal miners, and the companies were 0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:17.760 right because these people were motherfucker's Yet. Um, yeah, this 0:18:17.800 --> 0:18:20.359 has been building to me just attacking coal miners for 0:18:20.440 --> 0:18:23.719 six episodes. No, okay, So yeah, all the problems I've 0:18:23.760 --> 0:18:26.840 talked about existed for coal miners everywhere in the United States, 0:18:26.840 --> 0:18:31.640 from New Mexico to Michigan. But one particular piece of fury, 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:33.960 and maybe the most abusive thing that ever happened to 0:18:34.040 --> 0:18:37.640 American coal miners, was unique to West Virginia, which also 0:18:37.720 --> 0:18:40.679 had a lot of the richest coal veins in the country. 0:18:40.840 --> 0:18:44.760 So back in the Old Testament and the Book of Genesis, 0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:47.240 there's this guy named Esau, right, and Esau was a 0:18:47.240 --> 0:18:50.359 starving hunter who stumbled into his brother's tent begging for food, 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:54.240 and his his younger brother, Jacob, agreed defeat Esau, but 0:18:54.320 --> 0:18:57.000 only in exchange for Esau giving up his birthright as 0:18:57.000 --> 0:18:59.320 the firstborn son in the family. A bunch of other 0:18:59.320 --> 0:19:01.600 stuff happens in biblical story, but it's not important. I 0:19:01.600 --> 0:19:03.399 just needed to tell you who Esau is so we 0:19:03.440 --> 0:19:06.119 can get to the rest of this. So, mine operators 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:09.439 had a problem, Spencer, and that problem was that sometimes 0:19:09.480 --> 0:19:11.520 their miners would get sick or would be injured and 0:19:11.520 --> 0:19:13.440 would not be able to work for a period of time. 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:16.040 And since there was no social safety and at all, 0:19:16.160 --> 0:19:18.320 this meant that they and their family would probably starve 0:19:18.359 --> 0:19:21.840 to death. Now, the company didn't necessarily want these people 0:19:21.960 --> 0:19:23.440 just to kick them out, because a lot of times 0:19:23.480 --> 0:19:25.359 they'd get better. And you know, coal miners who were 0:19:25.359 --> 0:19:27.760 good at their job are valuable um. So they found 0:19:27.800 --> 0:19:30.160 a way to deal with this that was still profitable 0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:32.159 to them. And the way that they dealt with this 0:19:32.320 --> 0:19:34.600 was to take usually to take the next oldest male 0:19:34.680 --> 0:19:36.960 member of the family and make them take their father's place. 0:19:37.280 --> 0:19:39.879 But some children were too small to effectively work a 0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:43.159 coal mine, and in these cases the company provided the 0:19:43.200 --> 0:19:45.920 wife of a stricken miner with what was known as 0:19:46.080 --> 0:19:49.240 esau script. Now this was a special type of script 0:19:49.280 --> 0:19:52.760 currency only usable for food and other necessities. And I'm 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:54.720 going to quote now from an article I found on 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:57.560 CounterPunch based on the book Truth Be Told. Perspectives on 0:19:57.560 --> 0:20:00.359 the Great West Virginia Mine War by Labor his storyan 0:20:00.359 --> 0:20:04.480 Wes Harris quote. ESA was issued only two women, and 0:20:04.520 --> 0:20:06.040 it was a form of script that would enable a 0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:08.160 woman to purchase food for her children during the time 0:20:08.200 --> 0:20:10.720 that her husband could not work. The ESAU was only 0:20:10.760 --> 0:20:12.840 good for thirty days, and if her husband went back 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:15.200 to work within those thirty days, then the company would 0:20:15.240 --> 0:20:17.080 forgive the debt, and if he did not go back 0:20:17.119 --> 0:20:18.520 to work at the end of thirty days, then the 0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:20.760 script became a loan that was due in payable and 0:20:20.800 --> 0:20:23.840 full on day thirty. At the time, most coal miners 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:26.240