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Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five,

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Speaker 1: an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah Hartunger.

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Speaker 1: I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger.

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Speaker 1: On the side, we are two working parents who love

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Speaker 1: our careers and our families. Welcome to best of both worlds.

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Speaker 1: Here we talk about how real women manage work, family,

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Speaker 1: and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping

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Speaker 1: out long term career goals. We want you to get

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Speaker 1: the most out of life. Welcome to best of both worlds.

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Speaker 1: This is Laura. This is episode two hundred and seventy one,

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Speaker 1: airing in mid October of twenty twenty two. Sarah is

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Speaker 1: going to be interviewing Carla Numberg, who is the author

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Speaker 1: of How to Stop Losing Your Stuff with Your Kids

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Speaker 1: Not Stuff, but we have a clean rating here on

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Speaker 1: best of both Worlds, which we do not wish to lose.

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Speaker 1: So we will be not saying the entire titles of

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Speaker 1: Carlo's books, but I am sure you can check those

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Speaker 1: out if you're curious about them. She also has a

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Speaker 1: new one called You Are Not a Bad Parent. How

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Speaker 1: to practice self compassion and give yourself a break Again.

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Speaker 1: That is not the exact title, but you can go

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Speaker 1: look it up. And Carla is a great person to

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Speaker 1: talk to about how to enjoy parenting more, to feel

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Speaker 1: more calm about parenting. So we're really looking forward to that. Yes,

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Speaker 1: And speaking of books coming out, those of you who

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Speaker 1: listened to our episode last week, we talked all about

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Speaker 1: Tranquility by Tuesday and how exciting it is. But today

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Speaker 1: is actually the book's release date, So if you have

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Speaker 1: not placed a pre order, today would be a wonderful

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Speaker 1: day to show your support and check out this really

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Speaker 1: really fun read. I feel very confident that if you

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Speaker 1: enjoy best of both worlds, you will enjoy Tranquility by Tuesday.

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Speaker 1: You can send us a picture if you go to

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Speaker 1: a bookstore and see it, send me a picture. I'm

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Speaker 1: always excited to see copies of the book in the wild.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that has to be kind of so thrilling

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Speaker 1: it is, Yes, yeah, yeah, And I'm sure Carla is

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Speaker 1: feeling that way as well with her new book that

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Speaker 1: is out. So, Sarah, have you ever felt like a

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Speaker 1: bad parent? Oh? Yes, I mean I'm not saying I'm

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Speaker 1: not saying I necessarily feel like I deserve to have

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Speaker 1: felt like a bad parent, But there are certain scenarios

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Speaker 1: one might find themselves in where for me at least,

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Speaker 1: like there's some oh god, I feel like a bad

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Speaker 1: parent feelings. I thought of three such scenarios. The first

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Speaker 1: one is public tantrums. Now doesn't mean that I truly

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Speaker 1: am a bad parent because my child is having a

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Speaker 1: public tantrum, No, but it makes me feel like a

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Speaker 1: terrible parent and like everyone must be judging me for

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Speaker 1: not being able to, you know, keep my child happy. Interestingly,

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Speaker 1: the most memorable ones are from like Annabel's childhood, so

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Speaker 1: I don't know if it was because she was like

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Speaker 1: the worst tantrumer or because I've become less sensitive with time,

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Speaker 1: or maybe better at parenting now. I'm just kidding. I

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Speaker 1: don't think it's that, But really I have like some

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Speaker 1: like public pool tantrums that are just like epic and

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Speaker 1: I'll never forget them. And then one on like a

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Speaker 1: city street in Miami where like someone was lying down

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Speaker 1: on the street anyway, just felt like a terrible parent.

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Speaker 1: Were you the one who was lying down on the street.

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Speaker 1: I was not, Oh it's not, but I wanted to.

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Speaker 1: Number two would be ugh, and this is kind of silly,

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Speaker 1: but like you never, like, go to a birthday party

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Speaker 1: and all the kids are happy, and then like, your

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Speaker 1: kid refuses to participation. He's the one in the corner.

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Speaker 1: That's a trigger for me, and I instantly go to, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm a bad parent because my child doesn't want to

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Speaker 1: go down the slide. I don't know. And then number

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Speaker 1: three would be when someone seems to, oh, yeah, like

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Speaker 1: this is more of a social media and one of

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Speaker 1: the reasons I don't really consume much social media anymore.

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Speaker 1: But when I read about someone like Delighting and theirs

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Speaker 1: solo parenting weekend with six children and no screen time

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Speaker 1: and just having the most wonderful time and savoring every moment,

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Speaker 1: I guess I question my existence and why I can't

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Speaker 1: be like that. I question their veracity. But that's a

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Speaker 1: different matter, and you know what, that's probably much more appropriate.

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Speaker 1: But I'm just saying when I've felt this way, not

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Speaker 1: necessarily that I feel like I should have. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, I'm sure I've had moments for

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Speaker 1: sure of all of those. But what I've kind of

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Speaker 1: tried to adopt is my philosophy is that, I mean,

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Speaker 1: when you think of your life, Like right now, do

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Speaker 1: you think of yourself as totally a reflection of your parents?

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Speaker 1: And you didn't when you were younger either as well,

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Speaker 1: Like we are all our own people. We come with

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Speaker 1: our own wiring, we come with our own temperaments. You know.

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Speaker 1: Ideally we have a family and community that helps shape

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Speaker 1: us so that we can be the best versions of ourselves,

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Speaker 1: but we're still ourselves. And that's you know, kind of

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Speaker 1: how our kids are too. And so even when you

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Speaker 1: have a situation where like your kid isn't willing to

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Speaker 1: do what all the other kids are like for whatever reason,

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Speaker 1: all the other kids feel motivated to do it, whether

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Speaker 1: they enjoy the activity or they feel more motivated for

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Speaker 1: adult approval. And some kids are just not as motivated

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Speaker 1: by adult approval. And sometimes we have those children and

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Speaker 1: that is who they are, and so you kind of

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Speaker 1: have to do it not even be a negative thing

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Speaker 1: in the long run. I mean, if I'm not you

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Speaker 1: know that you don't care so much about what everyone

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Speaker 1: thinks of you. It can be helpful if you are

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Speaker 1: going to have a life where you then have you know,

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Speaker 1: six hundred angry comments on something saying how terrible you are,

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Speaker 1: so it's good to, you know, think about those things.

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Speaker 1: I will say one time, I do feel that if

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Speaker 1: I've gotten mad at a kid for something it turns

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Speaker 1: out they didn't actually do, then I feel a little

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Speaker 1: bit guilty about that. But you know, I'm sure they

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Speaker 1: probably did something else, so maybe we could just transfer that.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's some guilt that wasn't to discovered that

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Speaker 1: maybe we can we can think of that. So what

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Speaker 1: makes you feel like a good parent? I will say

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Speaker 1: when my kids like actively want to snuggle, like at night,

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Speaker 1: you know they want They're like, oh, I love you,

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Speaker 1: and they want me to lay there for ten minutes.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, they need me, they want me. I

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Speaker 1: must be a good parent. I'll say when they're playing

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Speaker 1: together really nicely, even if it's fleeting, I'll just like,

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Speaker 1: for a second congratulate myself, which again, you're right, it's

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Speaker 1: like totally not on me and just might just be

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Speaker 1: like the circumstances or they felt like it at that moment,

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Speaker 1: But it does feel good to see that. And then

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Speaker 1: if I like remember something that is important to them,

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Speaker 1: like oh right, I have to RSVP for this fundraiser

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Speaker 1: because they wanted this, like random thing, and it was hard,

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Speaker 1: but it like I did manage to like keep that

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Speaker 1: on my radar and follow through with it. Then that

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Speaker 1: makes me feel like a good parent. Yeah, the organization thing,

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Speaker 1: if you remember or something. We recently went to the

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Speaker 1: Wolf Sanctuary of Pennsylvania, which is something that had been

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Speaker 1: on our radar for a while that a previous trip

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Speaker 1: had gotten canceled, that they hadn't been able to go to,

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Speaker 1: and so then I managed to score a private tour

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Speaker 1: there and so I was like, wooho, go me. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think mostly it's when as an actual like parent,

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Speaker 1: when the parenting aspect feels like it has been a

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Speaker 1: good choice. I would say this happens if I have

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Speaker 1: waited something out, was just sort of gentle encouragement and

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Speaker 1: acting chill about something, and a kid finally comes around

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Speaker 1: to what I think was the right choice, but I

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Speaker 1: haven't shoved it, because that is almost universally with my

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Speaker 1: kids going to mean they won't do it. But to

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Speaker 1: have that patience, which you know, patience is not necessarily

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Speaker 1: my primary virtue, But if I have exhibited that patience

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Speaker 1: and waited for them to come around and then they do,

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Speaker 1: I'm always like, yeah, Okay, I want to give myself

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Speaker 1: a little high five here. I totally get that, and

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Speaker 1: patience is also not my virtue, so I understand exactly

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Speaker 1: what you're talking about. I love it. Well, I'm super

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Speaker 1: excited for this conversation with Carla and talking about her

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Speaker 1: books and maybe feeling a little bit better about ourselves

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Speaker 1: by the end of this episode. Sounds good, I go,

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Speaker 1: let's do it all right. Well, I am so excited

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Speaker 1: to welcome Carla Naumburg to the podcast today. I have

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Speaker 1: been enjoying her writing ever since How Not to Lose

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Speaker 1: Your Blank with Your Kids, which I really enjoyed a

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Speaker 1: couple of years ago and was very, very timely for me.

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Speaker 1: I definitely needed a big dose of that when it

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Speaker 1: came out. And now she has written a new book

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Speaker 1: was was just released a couple weeks ago. When this airs,

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Speaker 1: called you Are Not a Blank Parent. For the purposes

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Speaker 1: of this podcast, we're gonna call it you Are Not

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Speaker 1: a Bad Parent. But Carla does love to use more

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Speaker 1: colorful language, so we are just going to keep our

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Speaker 1: clean rating. But it's a really, really fun and saucy book,

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Speaker 1: So go ahead and introduce yourself, Arlette. I'm so glad

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Speaker 1: to be here and thank you for having me on

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Speaker 1: the show. Yeah, I'm a clinical social worker, I'm a

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Speaker 1: mother of two daughters, and I apparently write profanity laden

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Speaker 1: parenting books. And you know the reason I do that is, well,

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Speaker 1: I want parents to know first of all, that I'm

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Speaker 1: not the person who's going to show up and lecture

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Speaker 1: them about parenting. Like that's not my style. And nobody

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Speaker 1: likes feeling talked down to or lectured. And for me,

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Speaker 1: the best way I can show up with my authentic

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Speaker 1: voice is to make it a little spicy, which we

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Speaker 1: won't do on the podcast, but certainly it's in my books.

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Speaker 1: So if that works for you, if that makes you

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Speaker 1: feel like you're sitting across from someone at a coffee

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Speaker 1: shop chillin and talking about parenting, and I'm your gal. Yes,

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Speaker 1: I definitely felt like I gave it a friendly, kind

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Speaker 1: of more casual tone in a way, less preachy. So

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Speaker 1: let's start with, you know, the title you are not

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Speaker 1: a bad parent, or the alternate title like why do

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Speaker 1: you parents feel they are bad? What do you see

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Speaker 1: parents beating themselves up about most frequently? Yeah, so I've

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Speaker 1: been experiencing this. My daughters are now twelve and thirteen

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Speaker 1: years old, and I myself experienced what I label in

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Speaker 1: the book. We'll call it b be parent syndrome, right

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Speaker 1: or bad parents syndrome. It's the syndrome I sort of

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Speaker 1: made up for the purposes of the book to describe

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Speaker 1: what I experienced for a long time, and what I

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Speaker 1: see many parents experiencing this, which I define is the thought, belief,

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Speaker 1: or perception that you're a terrible parent when in fact

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Speaker 1: you're not. And I just think this is something that's

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Speaker 1: happening to our generation of parents in ways that I

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Speaker 1: don't think it happened in previous generations. And I see

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Speaker 1: parents beating themselves up for all of their mistakes steps,

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Speaker 1: missed moments, both real and perceived, because sometimes we think

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Speaker 1: we've done something wrong when in fact, A we haven't

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Speaker 1: or B there's just no way to know because we

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Speaker 1: don't know how our kids are turning out yet. And

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Speaker 1: also I think I should say that even if your

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Speaker 1: kids don't grow up to be everything you or society

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Speaker 1: thinks they should be, that's not necessarily because you failed

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Speaker 1: or did wrong as a parent. That's just a reality

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Speaker 1: of life. But I do see parents really struggling with

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Speaker 1: holding on to a huge amount of blame and shame

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Speaker 1: and really thinking of themselves as terrible parents when in

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Speaker 1: fact they're not. Do you feel like and you mentioned

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Speaker 1: that this is kind of a relatively new phenomenon compared

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Speaker 1: to previously. Why do you think that is? Is it

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Speaker 1: social media? Is it just cultural zeitgeist? Where do you

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Speaker 1: think this is coming from? Yeah, I think it's all

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Speaker 1: the above. And look, I don't want to say that

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Speaker 1: there has never been a parent in the history of

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Speaker 1: time who didn't think of themselves as a bad parent

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Speaker 1: or didn't feel like they were failing their children. I'm

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Speaker 1: sure that has always existed, but I see it happening

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Speaker 1: more and more pervasively now. And I think there are

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Speaker 1: a couple of reasons why it's worse now. One is, yeah,

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Speaker 1: absolutely social media and reality TV and your listeners can't see.

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Speaker 1: But I'm using my air quotes around reality are promulgating

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Speaker 1: this idea that there are parents out there who have

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Speaker 1: figured this out. There are parents out there for whom

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Speaker 1: parenting is easy and graceful, and they have strategies and

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Speaker 1: tricks for everything, and their kids never melt down in

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Speaker 1: the middle of the grocery store and that's baloney, It

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Speaker 1: just doesn't exist, it's not true. But when the vast

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Speaker 1: majority of input you're getting about parenting is that it's

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Speaker 1: really hard to remember that parenting is actually hard for everyone.

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Speaker 1: So part of it is social media. Part of it,

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Speaker 1: I actually think has to do with the way parents

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Speaker 1: are thinking about parenting. You know, it used to be

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Speaker 1: that women, let's acknowledge it was women who didn't go

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Speaker 1: to work outside the home and stayed at home. We

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Speaker 1: were called what were we called in the fifties housewives? Oh,

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Speaker 1: housewiveusewives right, because our job was to take care of

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Speaker 1: the house and make sure that like everything was ready

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Speaker 1: for our husband. Because back then we didn't acknowledge a

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Speaker 1: gay couples or be the you know, single parents. We

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Speaker 1: didn't acknowledge them either. And now women who don't work

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Speaker 1: outside the home and have chosen to stand with their

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Speaker 1: kids are called stay at home moms a right, right,

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Speaker 1: And our job is to take care of the children,

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Speaker 1: and it's okay if the house is a mess, as

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Speaker 1: long as the kids are okay. And I think that

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Speaker 1: so not only is parenting like our full time job now,

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Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, whether or not you have a job

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Speaker 1: outside the house. Parenting is like supposed to be your

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Speaker 1: full time job. But also there is this sense that

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Speaker 1: we need to be succeeding at it, and if we're

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Speaker 1: not succeeding as measured by our children's behavior and their successes,

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Speaker 1: then there's something wrong with us, when in fact, parenting

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Speaker 1: is this crazy thing where you never really know of

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Speaker 1: you're succeeding or not. And that's just kind of the

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Speaker 1: harsh reality of it. And what is success anyway? Is

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Speaker 1: it all of your kids in matches outfits on a beach,

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Speaker 1: smiling perfectly. I mean, oh yeah, obviously, yes, No, I

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Speaker 1: don't know. Like, so if my kid is happy and

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Speaker 1: laughing on the moment, so let's mag this is such

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Speaker 1: a great I love this question. Nobody's asked me this.

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Speaker 1: Last night, my child was happy and laughing and smiling

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Speaker 1: on the couch next to her sister. So you might say,

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Speaker 1: based on that information that I was being a good

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Speaker 1: mother in that moment. Okay, but now let me tell

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Speaker 1: you that they both had iPads in their hands and

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Speaker 1: headphones on. Does that all of a sudden switch to

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Speaker 1: like bad mothering because I let them do that? Like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know what a successful mother

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Speaker 1: or parent is, and I know for sure that we

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Speaker 1: can't base it on a our children's behavior or happiness

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Speaker 1: in any one moment and be their long term success

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Speaker 1: because we have may have done everything quote wrong whatever

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Speaker 1: that means, and they still might be super successful, right, happy,

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Speaker 1: good job, partnered, whatever, or we could do everything right

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Speaker 1: whenever that means, and they still like really really struggle.

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Speaker 1: So I don't know. I don't know what's success. I

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Speaker 1: love it all right. Well, one thing I want to

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Speaker 1: talk about there was definitely like a zen Buddhist flavor,

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Speaker 1: like you're into mindfulness, even though you do address it

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Speaker 1: in a snarky, profanity laden way, No, I say that

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Speaker 1: in a loving way. It works, and you talk about

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Speaker 1: a concept that I had heard about before, but honestly

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Speaker 1: it never stuck or made sense to me until your book,

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Speaker 1: which is The Three Arrows, And can you tell our

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Speaker 1: listeners about what that is? Yeah, So first of all,

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Speaker 1: you should just know that I'm actually the Dolly Mama. No,

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Speaker 1: I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Sorry, sorry, Okay, So yes, look,

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Speaker 1: even though I write about sort of mindfulness and I

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Speaker 1: share some Buddhist teachings in a sort of snarky, my

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Speaker 1: own voice kind of way. I have such a tremendous

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Speaker 1: amount of respect. And while I myself am not Buddhist,

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Speaker 1: I think Buddhist philosophy and Buddhist psychology is some of

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Speaker 1: the most brilliant stuff out there. It's just amazing. And

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Speaker 1: so the story of the it's initially story of the

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Speaker 1: two arrows, and then later on other more recent folks

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Speaker 1: added on a third arrow. But the idea is that

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Speaker 1: things happen in life, unpleasant, unwanted, unpredicted, undesirable. Things happen

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Speaker 1: in life. We you know, our kid gets diagnosed with ADHD,

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Speaker 1: we get a flat tire, our house gets flooded, whatever

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Speaker 1: it may be. Things just happen. And it's like we've

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Speaker 1: been struck by a first arrow. And this is something

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Speaker 1: that the the Buddha. Buddha talked about arrows, because that back then,

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Speaker 1: that was the bad thing that came flying at you

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Speaker 1: out of the blue. So this first arrow comes at

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Speaker 1: us and it's painful and it's unavoidable, and it's just

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Speaker 1: a thing we need to deal with. And more often

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Speaker 1: than not, so many of us like follow up that

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Speaker 1: first arrow by flinging another arrow at ourselves, a second

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Speaker 1: arrow of shame and blame, and oh, if I had

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Speaker 1: only dealt with things differently, this wouldn't have happened. Why

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Speaker 1: didn't I prevent this? I screwed things up, I forgot something,

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Speaker 1: I did the wrong thing, and that's why the pandemic happened.

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Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, nobody's I hope out they're blaming themselves

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Speaker 1: for the pandemic. But certainly, I think many of us

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Speaker 1: are blaming ourselves for the choices we made during the

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Speaker 1: pandemic because now we're seeing our children struggle, and we're thinking, oh,

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Speaker 1: I should have sent them to school when I kept

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Speaker 1: them home, or I should have kept them home when

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Speaker 1: I sent them to school, when the reality is none

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Speaker 1: of us knew what we were doing. We still don't

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Speaker 1: know what we're doing, and that's okay. But instead of

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Speaker 1: responding to that moment of pain and suffering with compassion,

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Speaker 1: which is what my book's all about, it's about self compassion,

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Speaker 1: we blame ourselves. We stick ourselves with the second arrow,

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Speaker 1: and that's so painful. And then more recently people have

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Speaker 1: been talking about this third arrow, which is the arrow

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Speaker 1: of denial and distraction, and so too many first arrows

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Speaker 1: is bad enough, and man, there's a lot of first

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Speaker 1: arrows flying these days for so many of us. The

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Speaker 1: second arrows in many cases make the pain, the psychic pain,

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Speaker 1: the physical pain, whatever pain you're in, relational pain, parenting pain,

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Speaker 1: almost just intolerable. It's more than any of us can handle.

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Speaker 1: So then we jump to the third arrow, which is

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Speaker 1: this earw of like denial and distraction. And for many

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Speaker 1: of us, what that looks like is our phones right

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Speaker 1: hanging out on our smartphones. I'm mind read here, I'm

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Speaker 1: just as guilty. And the problem is that doesn't really

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Speaker 1: address anything. It doesn't help us figure out a the

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Speaker 1: most skillful way to handle whatever's going on, and b

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Speaker 1: it doesn't give us the chance to sort of heal,

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Speaker 1: to write, to treat ourselves with compassion and kindness and

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Speaker 1: take care of ourselves so we can then face the

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Speaker 1: situation with more clarity, more creativity, more confidence. Yeah, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: like hit me and I had read about it before,

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Speaker 1: but I think the application to parenting was just I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's repeated in the book, but it like finally actually

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Speaker 1: made sense to me. And yes, the phone is probably

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Speaker 1: many people's third arrow, although you also mentioned like substance

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Speaker 1: abuse and other things that people struggle with, so good, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: and oh go ahead. I just want to say here

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Speaker 1: that I think that one of the ways in which

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Speaker 1: this book is different from so many other parenting books

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Speaker 1: is many many parenting books out there address what I

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Speaker 1: call first arrow problems. You know, getting a baby who

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Speaker 1: doesn't sleep, that's a first erro problem. And maybe the

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Speaker 1: advice in one of those books will help you, and

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Speaker 1: that's amazing. But for so many of us, when the

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Speaker 1: advice doesn't help, we blame ourselves. Oh, I didn't do

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Speaker 1: the right thing. I haven't find the right specialist, I

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Speaker 1: haven't found the right strategy. And what I really want

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Speaker 1: to do is give parents some tips and tools for

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Speaker 1: not shooting themselves with that second arrow. Ooh. And then

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Speaker 1: sometimes there's that variation where you try to read the

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Speaker 1: first arrow advice but it actually gives you a second

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Speaker 1: arrow because the book makes it sound like that advice

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Speaker 1: worked for everybody else and you must be horrible because

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Speaker 1: it doesn't work for you. Yes, been there, done that,

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Speaker 1: wrote that book. I actually had a friend who told me,

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Speaker 1: after reading my first parenting book, not how to stop

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Speaker 1: losing your beep with your kids, but a much earlier one.

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Speaker 1: She said, this made me feel worse as a parent,

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Speaker 1: and I said, thank you so much for telling me that.

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Speaker 1: Please go set the book on fire and never read

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Speaker 1: it again, because there is no amount of advice out

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Speaker 1: there that's worth ever resulting in another parent feeling that way.

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Speaker 1: And if you're feeling that way, you can't make the

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Speaker 1: changes you want to make. It's just not possible. So

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Speaker 1: if you parenting are reading any book out there, including

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Speaker 1: one of mine, that makes you in any way feel

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Speaker 1: less than or stuck or scared or confused, put that

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Speaker 1: book away and go pick up something you love that's

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Speaker 1: going to make you laugh. I love it. We are

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Speaker 1: going to take a very brief ad break and we

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Speaker 1: will be right back with how to fight back against

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Speaker 1: some of these arrows. All right, we are back, and

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Speaker 1: we now understand what the three arrows are. Maybe the

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Speaker 1: first arrow is not something we're going to be focusing

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Speaker 1: on fixing, because that's just not the kind of book

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Speaker 1: that Carla wrote. But let's focus on those other arrows.

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Speaker 1: What are some of the antidotes, What are some concrete

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Speaker 1: ways that we can bring what you describe as self

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Speaker 1: compassion to our parenting lives. Yeah, so look, the first

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Speaker 1: arrows are unavoidable generally speaking, They're going to happen in

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Speaker 1: some way or another. That's just life. So instead of

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Speaker 1: shooting ourselves with the set and arrow, let's talk about

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Speaker 1: self compassion. And in the book, I get very concrete

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Speaker 1: about what this is. And I have three categories we

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Speaker 1: can say of practices that parents can use. Connection, curiosity,

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Speaker 1: and kindness. So connection isn't just about connecting to our

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Speaker 1: support system, to our friends and family and loved ones

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Speaker 1: who are going to listen to us and respond to

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Speaker 1: us with kindness and support and acceptance and not judge us,

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Speaker 1: because thank you, we're already judging ourselves. But they're going

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Speaker 1: to say, you know what, it's okay. We all have

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Speaker 1: a hard time as parents. Let me tell you the

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Speaker 1: story about the time my kid fell off the couch

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Speaker 1: and blah blah blah whatever. They're not going to come

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Speaker 1: at us with advice. And when we get off the

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Speaker 1: phone or when we are done hanging out with our

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Speaker 1: true support system, we feel better. Life feels a little easier,

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Speaker 1: We feel like we can handle things. And in addition

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Speaker 1: to connecting with actual people, I also talk about connecting

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Speaker 1: to common humanity is what we call it in this

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Speaker 1: I would like to give props to doctor Christen eff

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Speaker 1: Out of Texas, who first popular this idea. Connecting to

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Speaker 1: common humanity is just kind of a fancy way of

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Speaker 1: saying that you can remember you're not alone in any

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Speaker 1: of it. And let me give you an example, Sarah,

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Speaker 1: real quick of how this works for me. You know,

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Speaker 1: it used to be when I would lose my temper

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Speaker 1: with my daughters, I would go in the kitchen, head

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Speaker 1: to the pantry, grab the chocolate chip, shove them in

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Speaker 1: my face, feel horrible about myself, and be like, I

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Speaker 1: am totally screwing this up. I'm the only parent on

428
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:27,520
Speaker 1: the planet who's totally screwing this up everybody else. I

429
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:31,080
Speaker 1: literally somehow convinced myself that I was the only parent

430
00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:34,040
Speaker 1: screaming at her kids. I truly believed it. I felt

431
00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:37,439
Speaker 1: so isolated. And now that I've started my practice of

432
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,280
Speaker 1: self compassion, I've had it for a few years now.

433
00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,679
Speaker 1: The thought that instantly comes to my mind after a

434
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 1: rough parenting moment, and yes I absolutely still have them

435
00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:47,679
Speaker 1: one hundred percent, is I say to myself, you know

436
00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:51,640
Speaker 1: what parenting is hard. Parenting is hard for everyone. It's

437
00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:54,240
Speaker 1: okay that I'm not perfect at this, and you don't

438
00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:56,040
Speaker 1: have to be a perfect parent to be a great parent.

439
00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:59,000
Speaker 1: And those are the thoughts that are running through my

440
00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,280
Speaker 1: mind now. And you can feel the difference between I

441
00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:07,639
Speaker 1: am totally screwing this up versus parenting is hard for everyone, right,

442
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,200
Speaker 1: And so that's the connection piece, connecting to people who

443
00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:13,040
Speaker 1: love you and support you and connecting to common humanity.

444
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:15,760
Speaker 1: Should we go on to curiosity is the same? Yes, yes,

445
00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,320
Speaker 1: I had curiosity on my list, So keep going. Let's

446
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,520
Speaker 1: do it. Let's do it. So so many of ourselves instantly,

447
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:24,720
Speaker 1: so many of uscuse me, instantly judge ourselves. In a

448
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,640
Speaker 1: rough moment, you know something goes wrong, and I don't

449
00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:29,600
Speaker 1: know about you, but my brain can instantly go to,

450
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:32,040
Speaker 1: here are the twenty seven reasons why I'm terrible, and

451
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:33,679
Speaker 1: all the reasons why my kid is terrible, and it's

452
00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:36,560
Speaker 1: because I screwed it up, and like judge, jury boom,

453
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:39,399
Speaker 1: done guilty and I have worked so hard to step

454
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,520
Speaker 1: back from that and in a bad moment, rather than

455
00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:43,440
Speaker 1: thinking I'm a mess and my kid is a mess,

456
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:45,640
Speaker 1: and we're all going to be a mess fraternity. I think,

457
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:50,119
Speaker 1: what's going on, what's actually going on? You know, what

458
00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:53,240
Speaker 1: is happening here? What do I need? And what does

459
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:55,679
Speaker 1: my kid need? And so the example I like to

460
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,560
Speaker 1: use is, you know, taking my girls out to a

461
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,000
Speaker 1: town fair when they were like two and three years

462
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,120
Speaker 1: old and riding the bouncy houses and getting the toys,

463
00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:05,840
Speaker 1: you know when you pay like eight dollars and then

464
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:07,880
Speaker 1: you get the thirty cent toy that you win, and

465
00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:09,919
Speaker 1: you know, all the fun things, going to see the

466
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 1: little booths and all. You know, we had a great time,

467
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,040
Speaker 1: and then a couple hours later, my kid had this

468
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 1: total meltdown, and I just remember thinking, oh my gosh,

469
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:19,480
Speaker 1: we have given this child everything she wants. We bought

470
00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,679
Speaker 1: her all the things. We totally went on the bouncy

471
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:23,879
Speaker 1: house twenty seven times, even though I hate it. And

472
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,159
Speaker 1: now she's melting down. What a little jerk. She's going

473
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 1: to grow up to be the most spoiled, self entitled

474
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:30,960
Speaker 1: blah blah blah, and it's all because I'm a terrible parent.

475
00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 1: And then I somehow, I don't know what happened because

476
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:36,439
Speaker 1: I wasn't so deep in myself compassion practice as I

477
00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,199
Speaker 1: am now I just paused for a moment and I

478
00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:42,159
Speaker 1: got curious, and I was like, Oh, we forgot to

479
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,080
Speaker 1: feed her lunch. We didn't feed the child, and she's

480
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,040
Speaker 1: a mess because she's three years old and not yet

481
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,480
Speaker 1: capable of telling me when she's hungry. And all of

482
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:51,520
Speaker 1: a sudden, in that moment, it was like, Oh, my

483
00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:53,399
Speaker 1: kid's not going to grow up to be a sociopath.

484
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,920
Speaker 1: She just needs a sandwich, right, And so that's where

485
00:23:56,920 --> 00:24:00,959
Speaker 1: the curiosity can be so powerful. Curious is also an

486
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:05,159
Speaker 1: inherently kind approach because when you are curious about yourself

487
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,880
Speaker 1: or someone else, what you're saying is you matter. I

488
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,440
Speaker 1: care about what's going on for you, And no matter

489
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,000
Speaker 1: what you say, I'm not going to be scared. I'm

490
00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:18,880
Speaker 1: not going to be horrified by what I find. Curiosity

491
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:22,359
Speaker 1: comes off as like very neutral, positive and not judge.

492
00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:26,439
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, curiosity is the opposite of judgment. And I

493
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:29,200
Speaker 1: will say that since I've stopped judging myself so harshly,

494
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,119
Speaker 1: I've actually stopped judging other parents so harshly because I

495
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,399
Speaker 1: got to be honest, Sarah. Before myself compassion practice, I

496
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 1: was judging other parents at the drop of a hat.

497
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:40,240
Speaker 1: I could judge them for anything, how their kids were dressed,

498
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,159
Speaker 1: how their kids behaved, how they fed their kids, like what.

499
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter what decision they made. I was fully

500
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:49,760
Speaker 1: capable of judging them one hundred percent, and that, of course,

501
00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 1: was absolutely reflective of the extent to which I was

502
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 1: judging myself. And now that things have shifted so much

503
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 1: from me, when I'm out in public and I see

504
00:24:57,680 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 1: a parent struggling, or I hear a story about it,

505
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: child who's struggling, or something that's gone off the rails,

506
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 1: I am much more likely to think, huh, I wonder

507
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 1: what's going on there, or to offer a more generous perspective, Oh,

508
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,200
Speaker 1: that parent must be really struggling. Oh they must have

509
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,480
Speaker 1: a lot going on, which is so much kinder than

510
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:19,119
Speaker 1: oh they're just a terrible parent. Yeah, which is what

511
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 1: I used to think because that's what I thought about

512
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:25,280
Speaker 1: myself and it don't makes sense. And in the not judging,

513
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: you're probably more likely to make a connection because you're

514
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 1: probably more likely to maybe see if that mom needs

515
00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:32,879
Speaker 1: some help because you're not busy thinking she's terrible. So

516
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 1: it might feedback on number one. And now you've found

517
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 1: someone that you can confide oh completely, Yes, it's all.

518
00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:42,199
Speaker 1: At the risk of sounding cheesy, it's like this beautiful

519
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 1: inner woven web, say, inner woven web. Yes, I'm like.

520
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 1: It all just makes everything easier and feel better, and

521
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:53,919
Speaker 1: just makes parenting so much less of a struggle and

522
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:56,120
Speaker 1: life life less of a struggle when you're not constantly

523
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: beating yourself up. Well, that leads us right into kindness. Right,

524
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 1: that was the third one you mentioned, the connection curiosity

525
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:05,400
Speaker 1: and then kindness. Yeah, look, and there are a lot

526
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 1: of ways to treat yourself with kindness, And the one

527
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:10,400
Speaker 1: that I really focus on the book is about how

528
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:13,760
Speaker 1: we talk to ourselves, because if you or any of

529
00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 1: your listeners are anything like me, which at this point

530
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:19,120
Speaker 1: I'm willing to say you probably are. Whereas ten years

531
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 1: ago I would have been like, nope, I'm the only

532
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,960
Speaker 1: crazy person on the show, but now I'm like, we

533
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:26,479
Speaker 1: are all in this together. My guess is, if you

534
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 1: stop and notice how you talk to yourself in the

535
00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:32,960
Speaker 1: wake of a difficult parenting moment, it's probably horrible. You

536
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,919
Speaker 1: probably say things to yourself that you wouldn't say to

537
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:38,719
Speaker 1: like your least favorite person on the planet. Right, And

538
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,399
Speaker 1: yet somehow we've gotten in this mindset of talking to

539
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:45,920
Speaker 1: ourselves in this really nasty, contemptuous language. So what I

540
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,440
Speaker 1: have been working on over the years is changing myself talk,

541
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,480
Speaker 1: changing the way the thoughts that I have. And it's

542
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,240
Speaker 1: a practice. It's a practice by which I mean when

543
00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:58,679
Speaker 1: I first started, it felt hard and weird, and I

544
00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:00,560
Speaker 1: wasn't very good at it. But I owed up on

545
00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 1: a regular basis, and I kept trying to change those thoughts.

546
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 1: I was essentially learning to speak the language of self compassion.

547
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 1: And so instead of I'm a terrible mother, now, what

548
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 1: I have is, oh, so I had a rough moment.

549
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: What do I need? This is ties into the curiosity piece, right,

550
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,320
Speaker 1: because there's a lot of curiosity in myself talk now,

551
00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:22,120
Speaker 1: and how can I reconnect with my kids? Or it's okay,

552
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 1: it's okay that I'm struggling, It's okay. This is really hard,

553
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 1: because parenting is just a hard thing to do even

554
00:27:27,040 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 1: when it's going well. Right. I think a lot of us,

555
00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 1: and this goes back, Sarah to your earlier question about

556
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 1: why do we think so poorly of ourselves? I think

557
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,080
Speaker 1: a lot of us are walking around with this idea

558
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:40,600
Speaker 1: that parenting should be relatively easy and kind of graceful,

559
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:43,120
Speaker 1: and that if we're doing everything right, our kids will

560
00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 1: put on their shoes the instant we asked them to,

561
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:47,960
Speaker 1: and you know, they'll want to play soccer, and they'll

562
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:49,720
Speaker 1: want to do this instrument, and they'll want to go

563
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:52,160
Speaker 1: to math club, and they'll just kind of if there's

564
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 1: a problem, we'll just sort of hire the right specialist

565
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,159
Speaker 1: or read the right book and the kid will be okay.

566
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 1: And that's just not how parenting works. I mean, when

567
00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: it works out way amazing. Hold on to that because

568
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: you got lucky, right, But for the most part, parenting

569
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:06,959
Speaker 1: is hard and it's a struggle and none of us

570
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 1: really know what we're doing. And I don't know about you,

571
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:13,159
Speaker 1: but I actually don't like feeling that way. Well, it

572
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 1: sounds like you've been in my house starting with the

573
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:17,960
Speaker 1: putting on your shoes thing. It's the shoe thing. It's

574
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 1: the shoe thing. The shoes are awful. And I don't

575
00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 1: have like I mean, I have one little kid, but

576
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 1: the other two like you would think. And yet my

577
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,199
Speaker 1: kids have been putting on their shoes or needing to

578
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:30,879
Speaker 1: put on their shoes almost every day for like thirteen years.

579
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:32,720
Speaker 1: And it's still a bit of a struggle, so you

580
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:35,679
Speaker 1: know you're not alone, parents, But the whole point of

581
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: the kindness piece is to really learn this new language

582
00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: of self compassion so we can talk to ourselves in

583
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: a really different way after hard moments. I love it well.

584
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:46,720
Speaker 1: I want to take a moment to talk about the

585
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:50,479
Speaker 1: last section, which is all about compassion, but instead of

586
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 1: towards ourselves, which is incredibly important and don't lose sight

587
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 1: of that, but also to our kids. I thought that

588
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 1: you did a really wonderful job explaining how there are

589
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 1: certain patterns which might need to be broken and kind

590
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 1: of how to go about doing that. Can you talk

591
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 1: a little bit about compassion for kids. Yeah, So the

592
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 1: more we practice compassion for ourselves, our self compassion, the

593
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 1: more we'll just show up with this connection and curiosity

594
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 1: and kindness to our children in their difficult moments, which

595
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 1: is a very hard thing to do because I don't

596
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 1: know about you, but when my kid is in physical

597
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 1: pain or emotional pain or having a giant meltdown, my

598
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 1: gut reaction is just stop, just feel better, just be okay.

599
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 1: I just like that is my instinctual reaction, especially when

600
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 1: I'm tired or overwhelmed. It's like I can't handle this.

601
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 1: Whatever it is just needs to go away, and you

602
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:43,920
Speaker 1: need to be all right. And that's not actually how

603
00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:46,200
Speaker 1: I want to show up for my kids, right. And

604
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: so the psychologist and writer Wayne Dyer, who was just brilliant,

605
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:51,920
Speaker 1: talked about this idea of an orange. You know, what

606
00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 1: do you get, Sarah, when you squeeze an orange? Orange juice? Yes,

607
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 1: you get orange juice. Don't get apple juice. You don't

608
00:29:57,720 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 1: get lemon juice, you don't get grape juice. You get

609
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 1: orange juice. And the same is true for humans. Whatever

610
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 1: is inside us is what you get when you're squeezed.

611
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: And so for a person and for a parent, being

612
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: squeezed looks like you know, a kid who shows up

613
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,440
Speaker 1: at eight pm the night before the science fair project

614
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 1: is due and needs all the supplies, or the kid

615
00:30:17,480 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 1: who calls from school because they've forgotten their lunch and

616
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:21,400
Speaker 1: we're at work and we don't know if we should

617
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 1: like take them the lunch. Are we enabling them or

618
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 1: do we not take them to lunch? And then we're

619
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:27,480
Speaker 1: bad parents because they're hungry. I don't know. Some of

620
00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 1: us are just feeling squeezed all day, every day, because

621
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 1: that's how life feels right now. And if we are

622
00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 1: constantly walking around feeling isolated, judgmental, and contemptuous towards ourselves

623
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 1: when we get squeezed, that's what's going to come out

624
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,760
Speaker 1: at our kids. But if we can find a way

625
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 1: into this compassionate place where we are practicing connection, curiosity,

626
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:50,120
Speaker 1: and kindness every single day, We're not going to be

627
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 1: perfect for our kids. I would never say that because

628
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: it's not true, but will be a whole lot better.

629
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,479
Speaker 1: It'll be a lot more likely that we show up

630
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,240
Speaker 1: for them with an interest in what's going on on,

631
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,440
Speaker 1: an ability to pause for a moment, and instead of

632
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:04,640
Speaker 1: judging them and saying like, oh, you screwed that up,

633
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:07,959
Speaker 1: we can say, oh, well, what happened there? Right? We

634
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 1: can show up with that curiosity and kindness for our kids.

635
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 1: And one of the points I want to make really quickly,

636
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:15,719
Speaker 1: as long as I mentioned curiosity is hopefully you may

637
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 1: or may not have noticed that in all my examples

638
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 1: of curiosity questions, I actually haven't said why. I don't

639
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 1: generally say to myself why did I do that? I

640
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 1: don't I try not to say to my kids, why

641
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 1: did you do that because that's a hard question man. Often,

642
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: especially kids, but really so many of us we don't

643
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,840
Speaker 1: know why we do stuff, and then we make up

644
00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 1: a story. And for us parents, the story so often

645
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 1: is oh, I did that because I'm a bad parent,

646
00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:42,360
Speaker 1: or you did that because you're a bad kid, and

647
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 1: I love that. So a better choice, or a more

648
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: skillful choice, might be what happened? How did that happen?

649
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 1: And then you can start to say, well, I did

650
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 1: this and I did that, and that's how I ended

651
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:57,240
Speaker 1: up in this place, which is much more kind of workable. Oh,

652
00:31:57,280 --> 00:31:59,000
Speaker 1: this is the steps of events that took to this,

653
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 1: So let's change some habits here or whatever it is.

654
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:05,000
Speaker 1: So I don't love why, but anyways, when you squeeze

655
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 1: me now, hopefully we get a little bit like more

656
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:09,960
Speaker 1: sweet orange juice and not the bitter stuff that was

657
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 1: coming out before. I love it. I love it. Can

658
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: you go into There's one algorithm that's particularly I felt helpful,

659
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:19,840
Speaker 1: Like I want to put it up next to my desk.

660
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,600
Speaker 1: In when you are presented with a maybe challenging moment

661
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 1: with your kid or they've done something or whatever the

662
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:30,480
Speaker 1: moment is, you came up with an algorithm entitled snacks,

663
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,360
Speaker 1: which is fun just as it is. Can you just

664
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:37,120
Speaker 1: go through briefly kind of what snack stands for? Yeah,

665
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 1: so this is something an academic came up with a

666
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:42,520
Speaker 1: few years ago, and it's really sort of a quick

667
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 1: series of steps we can take any time we're having

668
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 1: a hard moment or our kids are. And I like

669
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 1: the idea of snacks because snacks are quick and easy

670
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 1: and yummy. Right, you don't have to make a whole meal,

671
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 1: just a little snack. So the first S in snack

672
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:57,920
Speaker 1: stands for stop. So what we need to do first

673
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 1: is just stop whatever we're doing. I'm not saying you

674
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: have to do this every time your child wants your attention,

675
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 1: because sometimes you need to say, hey, buddy, put a

676
00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 1: pin in it and I'll be with you in five minutes.

677
00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:08,840
Speaker 1: But if they're really having a big moment, or if

678
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 1: the moment is right, just stop. Put down your phone,

679
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 1: walk away from your computer, whatever it is, stop for

680
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,880
Speaker 1: a moment. The N in snacks is for notice. Notice

681
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,280
Speaker 1: what's going on with you? Take a moment, take a breath,

682
00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 1: just tune in. How are you like, what's your headspace,

683
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: what's going on with your body? Are you exhausted and pained?

684
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: Do you need to go to the bathroom? Like are

685
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 1: you overwhelmed by work stuff? And try to get yourself

686
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: If you can into a space where you can be

687
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: present with your child, you can also say, hold on,

688
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 1: I need to finish this email and then I need

689
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:41,120
Speaker 1: to take a quick walk around the house and take

690
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:44,480
Speaker 1: three deep breaths before I am like present with you.

691
00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 1: And that's the thing I can say because I have

692
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 1: older kids. If you have younger kids who can't tolerate that,

693
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 1: then just being aware of what's going on with you

694
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 1: is going to inform your next moment. And maybe your

695
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 1: next moment is I can stop and be really present

696
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 1: comfort my child. And maybe your next moment is like

697
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:02,680
Speaker 1: screaming for your parenting partner if you have one, because

698
00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 1: you can't manage this moment because you're about to lose

699
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:08,359
Speaker 1: it yourself. Right, So noticing is a really important part

700
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:10,919
Speaker 1: of just kind of getting a grip on what's going

701
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 1: on for you. The next piece is to sort of

702
00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 1: just accept whatever's happening acknowledge. Some people like the word

703
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,719
Speaker 1: acknowledge better. Either a word will work, But there are

704
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:22,960
Speaker 1: so many moments in parenting when I just want to

705
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 1: be like, no, this isn't happening, and I want to

706
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:26,960
Speaker 1: do like the mammy equivalent of sticking my fingers in

707
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 1: my ears and being like la la la, la la,

708
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 1: I can't hear you. And we do a lot of

709
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,600
Speaker 1: chronic ear infections in my house, and my kids will

710
00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:34,960
Speaker 1: look at me and be like, my ear hurts and

711
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:37,759
Speaker 1: h and immediately my mind goes to okay, and there's

712
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 1: another trip to the doctor and the antibiotics and the tubes,

713
00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 1: and I sometimes I'll just look at them and be like, no,

714
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 1: they don't. And of course this is not for all

715
00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:47,120
Speaker 1: you parents out there. That's not actually a very effective

716
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 1: parenting technique, but like, there is this part of me

717
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 1: that just wants to be like, no, your ears don't hurt,

718
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 1: And so it does take a moment of shift to

719
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 1: be like, Okay, this is what's happening right now, and

720
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:59,520
Speaker 1: it doesn't mean we can't change it. It doesn't mean

721
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 1: we can't work on it and like try to get

722
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:05,239
Speaker 1: things to a different place. But unless we acknowledge this

723
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:07,040
Speaker 1: is where I am and this is what's going on,

724
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:10,760
Speaker 1: we don't have a chance. So we have stop notice.

725
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: Except her acknowledge and then the sea is for curiosity,

726
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,400
Speaker 1: which we've talked about right, getting curious about yourself and

727
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:18,160
Speaker 1: about your kids. And I have a lot of examples

728
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 1: of how to do that in the book. The K

729
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:22,920
Speaker 1: is for kindness. We can always treat with them with kindness.

730
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 1: And just to be clear, treating a kid with kindness

731
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:30,680
Speaker 1: doesn't mean bending the rules, doesn't mean flexing your boundaries,

732
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:33,040
Speaker 1: doesn't mean giving them whatever they want. And there have

733
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,080
Speaker 1: been times when I have like sat, this is one

734
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 1: of my better parenting moments, when I've sat with my

735
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:40,799
Speaker 1: daughter in my lap and she is crying because I've

736
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:43,320
Speaker 1: said no to her, right, No, you can't have that cookie.

737
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:45,800
Speaker 1: No you can't go on that outing with your friend,

738
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:47,759
Speaker 1: like whatever it is, we just can't do it. And

739
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:51,520
Speaker 1: I am treating her with kindness. I'm snuggling her, I'm

740
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:54,279
Speaker 1: rubbing her back, I'm acknowledging what a bummer it is.

741
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 1: Even though I'm the person who said no, right, I

742
00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: totally have the power to say yeah us, But for

743
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 1: whatever reason in that moment, that's not the right choice

744
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 1: for her or for our family. And so treating a

745
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:10,279
Speaker 1: kid with kindness doesn't necessarily mean giving them what they want.

746
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:13,960
Speaker 1: You can still really hold that line right, you can

747
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 1: still really hold a kid accountable if that's what needs

748
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:19,080
Speaker 1: to happen. But coming from that place of connection, that

749
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:22,400
Speaker 1: kind connection is always an option. But it really calls

750
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:24,560
Speaker 1: on us to be able to do it. And I

751
00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:26,879
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying to parents is hard. I don't

752
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:28,680
Speaker 1: do it all the time. I don't expect you to

753
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:30,840
Speaker 1: do it all the time. None of us do. But

754
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,600
Speaker 1: it's a thing to shoot for. And then the s

755
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 1: at the end of snacks, because we all need more

756
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:39,360
Speaker 1: than one snack, obviously, is to start again, start over.

757
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:43,239
Speaker 1: We can always begin again. This is a big thing

758
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:45,440
Speaker 1: we talk about in the world of mindfulness that at

759
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 1: any moment we come into the present moment, we notice

760
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,360
Speaker 1: what's happening, and we've got a shot to start again.

761
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 1: And that's just it's a gift. It's such a gift

762
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:57,080
Speaker 1: right to have that possibility that we can have a

763
00:36:57,160 --> 00:36:59,920
Speaker 1: rough moment, we can reconnect with ourselves and our chi

764
00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: and begin again. I love it. I love the beginning again.

765
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,360
Speaker 1: I think that's why I started a new planner like

766
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:10,640
Speaker 1: every month anyway, So I love this. We're gonna remind

767
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:13,040
Speaker 1: everybody where they can find your book and all of

768
00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:16,359
Speaker 1: your resources. But first we are going to share one

769
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:19,839
Speaker 1: love of the week. And I recognize I don't think

770
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,680
Speaker 1: I reminded you about this, but that's okay, because love

771
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,000
Speaker 1: of the Week can be anything. It can be a

772
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:28,120
Speaker 1: sunset you saw, it can be your current weather. It

773
00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 1: could be a book you read, a TV show you watched,

774
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:32,680
Speaker 1: it could be anything. And I will go first to

775
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 1: give you a moment to think about yours. So mine is,

776
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:38,680
Speaker 1: oh my gosh. I might have already said this, but

777
00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 1: I don't really care. I'm still deep in it. I'm

778
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 1: watching The Handmaid's Tale and I'm like five years too late,

779
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: but it's so good. It's just so good. I don't

780
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,920
Speaker 1: think I've watched anything so absorbing in years, and I

781
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 1: just look forward to every single episode. And I'm only

782
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 1: midway through season two, so I have so many fun

783
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 1: episodes ahead of me. And you're shaking your head because

784
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:58,799
Speaker 1: you're shocked. I hadn't watched it yet, I think, But

785
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:02,200
Speaker 1: it's really really good, Sarah. I am shocked and impressed

786
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 1: for a very different reason. I read that book in

787
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:06,879
Speaker 1: college years ago, and it totally freaked me out then,

788
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:08,839
Speaker 1: and so when I heard that movie, that TV show

789
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:11,239
Speaker 1: is coming out. I was like, nope, And so to

790
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:15,719
Speaker 1: show all your listeners where my headspace is right now.

791
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:18,759
Speaker 1: My love of the week is that four nights a week,

792
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:20,680
Speaker 1: my family and I sit down and at the end

793
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,920
Speaker 1: of the day we watch two episodes of blue together.

794
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 1: And my daughters, remember are twelve and thirteen. We do

795
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 1: not have a toddler or preschooler in the house, and

796
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 1: we are like so hardcore committed to Bluey, all four

797
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 1: of us, my husband, myself, both of our girls. We

798
00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:37,520
Speaker 1: love it and we're the ones late to the show.

799
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 1: We only discovered Bluey like six weeks ago and we're

800
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 1: still working our way through the first season. You guys,

801
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:45,560
Speaker 1: I don't care if you're a grown up who never

802
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,960
Speaker 1: watches animated cartoons. I don't care if your kids are

803
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:49,200
Speaker 1: in high school. I don't care if you don't have

804
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,480
Speaker 1: kids in the house. This is like a little injection

805
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 1: of joy. Since the pandemic started, I have been deeply

806
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:59,319
Speaker 1: committed to ending that every day laughing. And we love

807
00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:03,160
Speaker 1: blue And so I got your Handmaid's Tale and then

808
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,319
Speaker 1: over here I'm like, well, the Blue character you can

809
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:10,400
Speaker 1: watch cartoons. I feel like they're very compassionate, kind character

810
00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:13,360
Speaker 1: is in Bluey, so it goes right along with your work.

811
00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:15,399
Speaker 1: And now I have the Bluey music in my head

812
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 1: and it will never leave. So thank I'm sorry. I'm

813
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:21,439
Speaker 1: I'm not sorry at all. I am sorry. Oh my gosh,

814
00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:24,759
Speaker 1: this has been so fun. Please tell our listeners where

815
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 1: they can find you, and remind everybody exactly not with

816
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:30,080
Speaker 1: the bad word, but but the title of your book

817
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,080
Speaker 1: is so they can buy it and read it and

818
00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:34,520
Speaker 1: enjoy it like I did. Yes, my book is called

819
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,480
Speaker 1: you Are Not a beebe beepy, You're not a beepy

820
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 1: parent self, compassion and give yourself a break. It's available

821
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 1: in paperback and audio and ebook, and you can find

822
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:50,360
Speaker 1: it at your favorite bookseller, independent bookseller online. I'm also

823
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:52,920
Speaker 1: on carlonnomburg dot com and you can follow me on

824
00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 1: Instagram and Facebook. Awesome, Well, thank you so much for

825
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:58,680
Speaker 1: coming on. This has been a blast. Thank you so much.

826
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,480
Speaker 1: I've had a great time. All right, we are back.

827
00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 1: That was so much fun speaking with Carla and I

828
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 1: have a question that came in. It was they said

829
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:09,600
Speaker 1: it was for best of both worlds or best laid plans,

830
00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:12,600
Speaker 1: so it is planning adjacent but both Laura and I

831
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:14,359
Speaker 1: have some takes on this one, so I'll go ahead

832
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:17,160
Speaker 1: and read it. She writes, you have assuaged my baby

833
00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:19,760
Speaker 1: related angs before, but I'm back with a new question

834
00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:22,480
Speaker 1: about baby angst. Did she write it like two years

835
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 1: ago and had another baby and then now she's writing back?

836
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:27,759
Speaker 1: How does this work? I think? So okay. She has

837
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:30,880
Speaker 1: two little boys, and she says a biological clock that

838
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: is ticking. She'd like to have a third and final one,

839
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:37,480
Speaker 1: so her husband and she have been talking about starting

840
00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 1: to try again in the next few months. She writes,

841
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:43,839
Speaker 1: My question is about planning for the baby year. I

842
00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:45,719
Speaker 1: know by now that that year can be right off

843
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:48,280
Speaker 1: from the point of view of amazing productivity and sticking

844
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:51,640
Speaker 1: to elaborate planning routines. But is there nothing that I

845
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,520
Speaker 1: can aspire to in the planning realm? Must I just

846
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:56,759
Speaker 1: throw away my planner and let every day pass as

847
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: it will. I have near planner, piece of the moment,

848
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 1: and the one thing I feel most anxious about losing

849
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,279
Speaker 1: again if I have another baby is those energizing and

850
00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:09,440
Speaker 1: calming planning moments at my desk, which I totally understand

851
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:11,759
Speaker 1: Laura may not as much I was like, wait, I mean,

852
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:13,719
Speaker 1: would I would be kind of more concerned about like

853
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:16,600
Speaker 1: the sleep, but maybe that's just me. Well that too,

854
00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:20,920
Speaker 1: this the lack of sleep interferes with the ability to plan. Well, okay,

855
00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 1: so my thoughts were, yes, during the baby year, you

856
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:28,000
Speaker 1: will absolutely have less sleep, less time, less ability for

857
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:30,399
Speaker 1: that executive function that I think is what you're kind

858
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 1: of talking about that makes things like planning more difficult.

859
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:39,799
Speaker 1: But less is not zero, so it's temporary and it's

860
00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:42,399
Speaker 1: not going to be quote unquote planner piece, but you'll

861
00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:44,720
Speaker 1: be able to achieve the satisfaction of getting to planner

862
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:47,319
Speaker 1: piece again at the end of it. And I think

863
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,560
Speaker 1: that lowering your stakes is going to be necessary but

864
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:52,839
Speaker 1: very much worth it if you want to add a

865
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 1: third baby to your planner. From a logistical standpoint, I

866
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:59,799
Speaker 1: do very much prefer a paper weekly planner rather than

867
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:02,120
Speaker 1: a daily when I have a baby, and I've done

868
00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:04,759
Speaker 1: this for at least two, if not all three of

869
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 1: my kids, Like I switch from a daily to a

870
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:08,719
Speaker 1: weekly because it just felt like too much pressure, too

871
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:10,960
Speaker 1: many things to think about, and the number of things

872
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:13,759
Speaker 1: I could accomplish when I had that baby brain could

873
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:15,920
Speaker 1: easily fit in that you know, one seventh of the

874
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,480
Speaker 1: page and a weekly planner rather than a full page,

875
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:20,960
Speaker 1: so you might want to think about just making mistakes

876
00:42:21,040 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: a lot lot lower. But you know, your mileage may vary.

877
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:26,919
Speaker 1: If it's really important to you, you might be able

878
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:28,719
Speaker 1: to also carve out time like in the beginning of

879
00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:31,600
Speaker 1: your workday, or just be really imperfect about it and

880
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,400
Speaker 1: like scribble tiny baby milestones on some pages and not

881
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 1: others and call it a day. Yeah, I would say

882
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 1: when I heard this question, I was like, I think

883
00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:42,439
Speaker 1: we have very different ideas of what planning routines mean,

884
00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 1: because the bulk of my planning routine is twenty minutes

885
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 1: on Friday where I sit down and think about what

886
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:50,800
Speaker 1: do I want to have happen over the next week,

887
00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 1: what has to happen over the next week, Where roughly

888
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 1: do I think those things will go? Are there any

889
00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:01,200
Speaker 1: problems I foresee? And can we do with the logistics

890
00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 1: of those So twenty minutes on Friday feels like it

891
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 1: can happen whether you have a newborn or not. So

892
00:43:09,520 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 1: my suggestion would be to just try thinking of planning

893
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 1: more as functional that planning is about how we think

894
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:18,799
Speaker 1: about what we would like our time to look like

895
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:22,040
Speaker 1: understanding that some of it is without our outside of

896
00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:26,320
Speaker 1: our control, but some of it still is within our control.

897
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:28,680
Speaker 1: And if we have limited goals for any given week,

898
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:31,880
Speaker 1: we are often likely to get through them. We can't

899
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:33,959
Speaker 1: say what we want to do every minute if we're

900
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:36,759
Speaker 1: caring for a newborn, because that's going to determine a

901
00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:39,359
Speaker 1: lot of those minutes. But certainly in the course of

902
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,959
Speaker 1: any given week, if you have like three to five

903
00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:45,239
Speaker 1: things you're trying to get done, you will probably find

904
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 1: a time over one hundred and sixty eight hours to

905
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 1: get to those three to five things. So I thought

906
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 1: this woman was possibly giving a little bit much all

907
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,719
Speaker 1: or nothing thinking vibe going here, that her thought that

908
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 1: must I just throw away my planner and let every

909
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:04,839
Speaker 1: day pass as it will? No, of course not. There's

910
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:09,640
Speaker 1: a huge difference between nothing and something. So I'm not

911
00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: sure exactly what you are planning right now that is

912
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:16,400
Speaker 1: incompatible in your mind with doing this with a newborn.

913
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 1: But maybe you can think about what are the core

914
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:20,319
Speaker 1: elements of planning that matter to you, which to me

915
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: is about having a functional and orderly life, and that

916
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:26,640
Speaker 1: can happen in just the equivalent of a few minutes

917
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:30,800
Speaker 1: a day, and so no, you're not going to create

918
00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 1: a gorgeous spread that you're going to post on Instagram

919
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: every day. I mean, if that's your job, go for it, right, Like,

920
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:39,799
Speaker 1: you could probably still do that, but that would be

921
00:44:39,840 --> 00:44:43,920
Speaker 1: then your primary priority for the day versus something else

922
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:46,000
Speaker 1: that might be your priority if you're in a different

923
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 1: line of work, And so you just have to choose

924
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:50,640
Speaker 1: what you wish to put your time on. And most

925
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 1: likely when you have a newborn, and if posting pretty

926
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:56,720
Speaker 1: planner spreads on Instagram is not your full time job,

927
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 1: you will be doing a couple professional priorities taking care

928
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:02,480
Speaker 1: of the newborn and your other kids, and maybe like

929
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 1: going for a walk that's great. Yeah, you can probably

930
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:08,280
Speaker 1: handle all of those. So make sure it's more functional

931
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:13,319
Speaker 1: oriented than anything that's more elaborate. I equate this to

932
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:15,760
Speaker 1: the fact that like, right now, my kids being bigger,

933
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 1: I'm getting back into more serious running and I'm thinking

934
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:21,239
Speaker 1: about longer races and like more elaborate training plans. But

935
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:23,080
Speaker 1: right after I had my babies, it was like, you

936
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:24,520
Speaker 1: know what, if I get out and move a few

937
00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:27,719
Speaker 1: days a week, I'm winning. I think again, it's not

938
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:30,080
Speaker 1: the all or nothing, but like, hey, something is actually

939
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:32,360
Speaker 1: great during these harder periods, and you can always go

940
00:45:32,440 --> 00:45:35,160
Speaker 1: back to the more elaborate stuff later and it's worth

941
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:37,399
Speaker 1: it because babies are awesome. Babies are awesome. We love

942
00:45:37,400 --> 00:45:40,120
Speaker 1: babies at best of both worlds, so this has been

943
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 1: best of both worlds. Sarah has been interviewing Carla Naumberg

944
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:46,080
Speaker 1: about how to stop losing your stuff with your kids,

945
00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:49,600
Speaker 1: how to stop feeling like a bad parent. We will

946
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:51,759
Speaker 1: be back next week with more on making work and

947
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: life fit together. Thanks for listening. You can find me

948
00:45:56,800 --> 00:46:00,080
Speaker 1: Sarah at the shoe box dot com or at the

949
00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:03,279
Speaker 1: Underscore shoe Box on Instagram, and you can find me

950
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:07,560
Speaker 1: Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has been the

951
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 1: best of both worlds podcasts. Please join us next time

952
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,920
Speaker 1: for more on making work and life work together.