WEBVTT - How China Is Reshaping Hong Kong

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, Radio news Now.

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<v Speaker 2>Earlier this month, in a townhouse on the outskirts of London,

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<v Speaker 2>Jarita Wan was teaching a group from Hong Kong to

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<v Speaker 2>sing a song in Cantonese. The song is called Unfinished Ending.

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<v Speaker 2>The windows behind her were covered with paper decorations from

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<v Speaker 2>the Lunar New Year, including the Chinese character for fortune.

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<v Speaker 2>For years, she was a successful musical theater actress in

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<v Speaker 2>Hong Kong. She moved to the London suburbs with her husband,

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<v Speaker 2>her father, and two dogs in twenty twenty two. That

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<v Speaker 2>was three years after pro democracy protests rocked Hong Kong.

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<v Speaker 2>Teen demonstrations were the biggest political turmoil Hong Kong had

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<v Speaker 2>seen in decades, and in response, Beijing cracked down, imposing

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<v Speaker 2>a national security law for the city without public consultation.

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<v Speaker 2>Wen says she no longer felt comfortable in the city

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<v Speaker 2>that she grew up in.

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<v Speaker 3>What happened in Hong Kong in twenty nineteen was really

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<v Speaker 3>really upsetting to a lot of us, especially as an

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<v Speaker 3>artist's freedom of speech or freedom of writing, or freedom

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<v Speaker 3>of creation is a part of our nature, and I

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<v Speaker 3>start feeling suffocated.

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<v Speaker 2>When was among at least two hundred thousand local residents

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<v Speaker 2>who chose to leave Hong Kong after the National Security

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<v Speaker 2>Law came into effect. Many moved to places like the UK, Australia,

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<v Speaker 2>Taiwan and Canada.

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<v Speaker 3>It was quite hard because I lived basically my whole

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<v Speaker 3>life in Hong Kong and we've planned to start a

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<v Speaker 3>new life here in UK, away from fear and away

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<v Speaker 3>from this disheartening news.

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<v Speaker 2>Next week marks the twenty seventh anniversary of Great Britain

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<v Speaker 2>handing the city of Hong Kong back to China. In

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<v Speaker 2>many ways, the city still continues to serve as an

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<v Speaker 2>important financial hub in the region, but Bloomberg China editor

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<v Speaker 2>Alan Wong says we're seeing far reaching consequences from the

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<v Speaker 2>national security crackdown still playing out to this day.

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<v Speaker 4>So the National Security Law silenced China's loudest critics in

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<v Speaker 4>Hong Kong, and some people thought that would be it. Also,

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<v Speaker 4>they hoped both businesses and the government said they wanted

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<v Speaker 4>to move on from all this talk about security and

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<v Speaker 4>to focus on the urgent task of growing the economy.

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<v Speaker 4>But what happened in the last few months tell us

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<v Speaker 4>that Hong Kong's national security crusee doesn't end here, and

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<v Speaker 4>the city is unlikely to go back to what it was.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome to the Big Tech Asia from Bloomberg News. I'm wanh.

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<v Speaker 2>Every week we take you inside some of the world's

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<v Speaker 2>biggest and most powerful economies and the markets, tycoons and

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<v Speaker 2>businesses that drive this ever shifting region. Today on the show,

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<v Speaker 2>twenty seven years after Hong Kong was returned to China,

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<v Speaker 2>we look at how Beijing is reshaping the city's identity

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<v Speaker 2>and what that means for Hong Kong and its seven

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<v Speaker 2>million residents. Hong Kong was cedd to British control in

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<v Speaker 2>eighteen forty one after the First Opium War. This tiny

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<v Speaker 2>rocky island sitting at the southern tip of China became

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<v Speaker 2>a global center for trade and commerce between the East

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<v Speaker 2>and the West. In nineteen ninety seven, after more than

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<v Speaker 2>one hundred and fifty years of British rule, Hong Kong

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<v Speaker 2>was returned to China as part of an agreement. But

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<v Speaker 2>before the hand of the city back over, they agreed

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<v Speaker 2>on one important condition.

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<v Speaker 4>They agreed on a framework they call one entry to

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<v Speaker 4>systems to keep this city alive. Because people knew then

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<v Speaker 4>and China knew then that if they were just going

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<v Speaker 4>to turn Hong Kong into just like another mainland Chinese

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<v Speaker 4>city overnight, then all the things that made Hong Kong

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<v Speaker 4>special and useful to China would disappear overnight.

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<v Speaker 2>China agreed and made one country, two systems a constitutional principle.

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<v Speaker 2>It promised that Hong Kong would enjoy a high degree

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<v Speaker 2>of autonomy in its economic and political systems for fifty years,

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<v Speaker 2>freedoms of self rule, speech and press that aren't allowed

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<v Speaker 2>just across the border in mainland China. And despite the promise,

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<v Speaker 2>many worried that the handover would change Hong Kong, and

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<v Speaker 2>not for the better.

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<v Speaker 4>There was great anxiety in Hong Kong around the handover

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<v Speaker 4>because of what happened in Beijing in nineteen eighty nine,

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<v Speaker 4>when the Tenement Square massacre happened. That's when China's People's

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<v Speaker 4>Liberation Army killed civilian protesters in the crackdown on program

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<v Speaker 4>because they protest in Beijing, and that was the event

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<v Speaker 4>that loomed in people's mind. People feared what the new

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<v Speaker 4>government in China in Beijing would do to the city.

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<v Speaker 4>They had no idea what they were getting themselves into.

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<v Speaker 4>It not that they had to say.

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<v Speaker 2>Alan was born and raised in British Hong Kong. In

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<v Speaker 2>the years running up to the handover, he was just

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<v Speaker 2>a young boy in elementary school, and even though he

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<v Speaker 2>didn't understand it at the time, he remembers things out

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<v Speaker 2>of the ordinary were happening around him.

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<v Speaker 4>I remember distinctly that some classmates would mysteriously drop out

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<v Speaker 4>of school and I didn't know at the time, but

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<v Speaker 4>they left because their families were moving to places like

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<v Speaker 4>Canada and Australia. There were lots of people who did that,

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<v Speaker 4>and some of that fear was captured in newspaper coverage

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<v Speaker 4>of Hong Kong.

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<v Speaker 3>You know.

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<v Speaker 4>There was literally a magazine that put the words the

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<v Speaker 4>death of Hong Kong on its cover, and obviously Hong

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<v Speaker 4>Kong didn't die. In the first few years after the handover,

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<v Speaker 4>Hong Kong was actually business as usual.

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<v Speaker 2>At the time of the handover, Hong Kong accounted for

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<v Speaker 2>nearly one fifth of China's GDP, and in the decades

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<v Speaker 2>since nineteen ninety seven, Hong Kong has continued to thrive

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<v Speaker 2>as a financial hub, and politically it also remained vibrant.

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<v Speaker 2>People protested freely on the street, which wasn't allowed on

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<v Speaker 2>the mainland. In two thousand and three, Hong Kong's government

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<v Speaker 2>first attempted to pass a national security law that prompted

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<v Speaker 2>half a million residents to take to the streets in

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<v Speaker 2>the largest demonstration Hong Kong had seen since the handover.

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<v Speaker 2>That protest became an annual tradition on July first, the

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<v Speaker 2>anniversary of the handover. Hong Kong was also the only

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<v Speaker 2>place on Chinese soil where people could commemorate the anniversary

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<v Speaker 2>of the Teneman crackdown.

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<v Speaker 4>Every year since nineteen eighty nine, rain or shine, at

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<v Speaker 4>least thousands of people they would gather in Victoria Park

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<v Speaker 4>in downtown Hong Kong to commemorate those who died in

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<v Speaker 4>the crackdown. For journalists, it was an event that they

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<v Speaker 4>would just cover every year. They would take for granted

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<v Speaker 4>that this event could take place year after year, even

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<v Speaker 4>though it was completely impossible just across the border in

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<v Speaker 4>mainland China.

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<v Speaker 2>But this vibrant, free environment would soon come under attack

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<v Speaker 2>and the response would set the stage for Hong Kong's future.

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<v Speaker 2>That's after the break in twenty nineteen, hundreds of thousands

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<v Speaker 2>of people took to the streets in Hong Kong to

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<v Speaker 2>protest against the proposal of an extradition law.

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<v Speaker 4>The law would allow the transfer of fugitives in Hong

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<v Speaker 4>Kong to mainland China to face trial there, and the

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<v Speaker 4>government insisted it would only apply to a very few

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<v Speaker 4>people and it would have no bearing on political freedoms

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<v Speaker 4>in Hong Kong. People feared it could be used against

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<v Speaker 4>dissidents China's critics.

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<v Speaker 2>When the UK handed Hong Kong back to China, there

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<v Speaker 2>were no agreements put in place for extraditing individuals from

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<v Speaker 2>the city to the mainland. That was part of the

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<v Speaker 2>infrastructure that kept Hong Kong different from China. The protests

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<v Speaker 2>soon morphed into a broader anti China movement that went

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<v Speaker 2>on for months. Protesters regularly blocked highways, vandalized subway stations,

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<v Speaker 2>and sometimes it escalated into violence, with full on confrontations

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<v Speaker 2>against Hong Kong riot police. The protests started to tail

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<v Speaker 2>off after the COVID nineteen outbreak limited public activities, and

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<v Speaker 2>on top of.

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<v Speaker 4>That, Beijing thought enough is enough. Beijing being imposed a

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<v Speaker 4>new national security law in Hong Kong that made a

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<v Speaker 4>lot of the protests that were lawful illegal that made

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<v Speaker 4>a lot of expressions of dissent previously accept tolerated maybe

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<v Speaker 4>no longer acceptable, and it allowed the authorities to almost

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<v Speaker 4>completely wipe out the political opposition in Hong Kong.

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<v Speaker 2>This National Security Law, or the NSL, criminalized promoting Hong

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<v Speaker 2>Kong secession from China, along with subverting the Communist Party,

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<v Speaker 2>acts of terrorism, and collusion with foreigners. Violators could face

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<v Speaker 2>life imprisonment. Beijing said the law was needed for national security,

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<v Speaker 2>while critics said it was intended to shut down dissent

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<v Speaker 2>and silence activist groups. The law has since been used

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<v Speaker 2>to try and imprison dozens of pro democracy activists. Police

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<v Speaker 2>arrested a group called the Hong Kong forty seven, which

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<v Speaker 2>included high profile activists such as Joshua Wong, seasoned politicians,

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<v Speaker 2>elected lawmakers, social workers, as well as an academic, a

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<v Speaker 2>union leader and a journalist. Last month, fourteen of the

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<v Speaker 2>forty seven activists were found guilty of subversion charges, and

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<v Speaker 2>the Hong Kong government didn't stop there. In a surprise move,

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<v Speaker 2>the police put bounties on those accused of violating the

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<v Speaker 2>NSL and had left Hong Kong and Jimmy Lai, a

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<v Speaker 2>tycoon and the founder of a pro democracy newspaper that

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<v Speaker 2>were shut down by the government now faces trial on

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<v Speaker 2>his role in the twenty nineteen pro democracy protests. He

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<v Speaker 2>also faces a separate trial with more severe charges of

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<v Speaker 2>collusion with foreign forces. All that puts the future of

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<v Speaker 2>a free press in Hong Kong in the crosshairs.

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<v Speaker 4>The biggest, most vocal leaders of Hong Kong's pro democracy

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<v Speaker 4>movements having either jailed or exiled those main voices calling

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<v Speaker 4>for greater democracy freedoms in Hong Kong, they have been

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<v Speaker 4>effectively silenced.

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<v Speaker 2>In March, the Hong Kong government passed a new security

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<v Speaker 2>law known as Article twenty three. It cracks down even

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<v Speaker 2>further with new offenses covering civil disturbances and foreign interference.

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<v Speaker 4>This new law is expected to coexist and work in

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<v Speaker 4>tendem with the two thousand and twenty National Security Law.

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<v Speaker 4>It is still fresh out of the oven, but we

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<v Speaker 4>started to get a sentence of how the government wants

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<v Speaker 4>to use this law.

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<v Speaker 2>Last month, Hong Kong made its first arrest under the

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<v Speaker 2>new Article twenty three, arresting an activist who was already

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<v Speaker 2>behind bars.

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<v Speaker 4>This activist, whose name is Chowhantung, a barrister and an

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<v Speaker 4>organizer of the Tenement Square vigil. She was accused of

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<v Speaker 4>making seditious posts on Facebook with the help of others.

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<v Speaker 4>The government didn't say what worth the offense posts, but

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<v Speaker 4>they said those posts were in connection with a quote

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<v Speaker 4>unquote sensitive date, and the government was referring to June fourth,

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<v Speaker 4>the anniversary of the Tenement Square crackdown, and the the

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<v Speaker 4>fact that the government refused to name the event and

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<v Speaker 4>refer to it as a sensitive date says a lot

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<v Speaker 4>about how sensitive it has become and how the government

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<v Speaker 4>is trying to make it a taboo.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but you can't even say June fourth.

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<v Speaker 4>He's like Votimore.

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<v Speaker 2>It was clear that Hong Kong's autonomy, the basic political

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<v Speaker 2>freedoms it enjoyed after nineteen ninety seven, are now all

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<v Speaker 2>but gone. The notion of one country, two systems now

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<v Speaker 2>applies primarily to the economy, and Allen says that has

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<v Speaker 2>created a sense of hopelessness for many of the people

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<v Speaker 2>of Hong Kong.

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<v Speaker 4>They don't think what they say could change the system anymore.

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<v Speaker 4>They fear getting caught up by the NSL. Some of

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<v Speaker 4>those people chose to leave Hong Kong.

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<v Speaker 2>In response to the crackdown, Countries like the UK, Australia

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<v Speaker 2>and Canada have offered pathways for Hong Kong residents to

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<v Speaker 2>obtain citizenship, and for their part, Hong Kongers have been

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<v Speaker 2>leaving in droves.

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<v Speaker 4>So the Hong Kong government doesn't publish official data on

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<v Speaker 4>how many people left Hong Kong for good or how

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<v Speaker 4>many people left for political reasons. We looked at immigration

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<v Speaker 4>data from the UK, Australia and Taiwan and came to

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<v Speaker 4>a rough estimate that at least two hundred thousand Hong

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<v Speaker 4>Kongers had moved to those places after the NSL was

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<v Speaker 4>implemented in twenty twenty.

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<v Speaker 2>But despite some people's disillusionment with Hong Kong and China's

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<v Speaker 2>efforts to control the city, there are residents who are

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<v Speaker 2>now taking advantage of Hong Kong's closer ties to China

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<v Speaker 2>with much cheaper prices on the mainland. Some have even

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<v Speaker 2>embraced a new cross border lifestyle.

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<v Speaker 4>After Hong Kong emerged from its pandemic isolation, and when

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<v Speaker 4>people restarted their travels, they realized that so much has

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<v Speaker 4>changed about Shuzen or other Chinese cities, and now they

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<v Speaker 4>have so many more public transport options to go into China.

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<v Speaker 4>The more seamless traffic experience has encouraged people to spend

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<v Speaker 4>their weekends in China to shop, to eat, because they're

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<v Speaker 4>just getting a lot more banned for the buck.

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<v Speaker 2>Just a few weeks ago, during the Dragon Boat Festival,

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<v Speaker 2>Hong Kong residents made more than a million trips across

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<v Speaker 2>the border to China for the long holiday weekend. That's

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<v Speaker 2>an increase from twenty nineteen before the pandemic hit, and

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<v Speaker 2>it's also more than three times the number of visitors

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<v Speaker 2>who came from mainland China into Hong Kong. Bloomberg also

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<v Speaker 2>recently interviewed young Hong Kong residents who used to protest China.

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<v Speaker 2>These days, they're now making regular trips to Shenzhen for

0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:54.880
<v Speaker 2>cheap food, massages and even grocery runs.

0:14:55.280 --> 0:15:00.400
<v Speaker 4>They wouldn't say that they now love the Chinese Comments Party.

0:15:01.120 --> 0:15:05.360
<v Speaker 4>They wouldn't say they endorsed China's political system, and they

0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:11.120
<v Speaker 4>certainly wouldn't want those systems adopted in Hong Kong, but

0:15:11.200 --> 0:15:15.280
<v Speaker 4>they become more agnostic about going to mainland China for leisure.

0:15:15.800 --> 0:15:18.640
<v Speaker 4>I think they feel hopeless when it comes to changing

0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:23.000
<v Speaker 4>the political system here, so they just see the shopping

0:15:23.040 --> 0:15:27.000
<v Speaker 4>as a purely economic activity.

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<v Speaker 2>Alan, hundreds of thousands of Hong Kongers have left the city,

0:15:31.160 --> 0:15:34.040
<v Speaker 2>but you have those who've stayed here. You have people

0:15:34.040 --> 0:15:37.880
<v Speaker 2>who are now getting comfortable with the closer connections with China.

0:15:38.080 --> 0:15:40.240
<v Speaker 2>Is that surprising in a way?

0:15:40.320 --> 0:15:43.600
<v Speaker 4>I mean, I'm not surprised because they're always immigrants coming

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<v Speaker 4>and going before or after ninety ninety seven. That's just

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<v Speaker 4>the nature of Hong Kong as a very international city,

0:15:51.520 --> 0:15:55.200
<v Speaker 4>which is why, you know, the question of what makes

0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:58.440
<v Speaker 4>someone in Hong Kong, or the question of identity in

0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:02.480
<v Speaker 4>Hong Kong is so tricky. What China's leader before the

0:16:02.520 --> 0:16:07.920
<v Speaker 4>handover said it wanted was for Hong Kongers to return

0:16:08.280 --> 0:16:13.720
<v Speaker 4>to China in their hearts and difference. That's a big

0:16:13.720 --> 0:16:17.600
<v Speaker 4>difference here, and it's it's not easy to tell when

0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:23.480
<v Speaker 4>or whether people will fully see themselves as part of

0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:26.800
<v Speaker 4>this country. Like when they identify themselves, do they call

0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:30.080
<v Speaker 4>themselves Hong Kongers or do they call themselves Chinese? And

0:16:30.160 --> 0:16:44.160
<v Speaker 4>you know what do those words mean anyway? Ya don't so?

0:16:44.600 --> 0:16:44.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

0:16:45.800 --> 0:16:46.080
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:16:46.360 --> 0:16:46.600
<v Speaker 4>Mad.

0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:51.160
<v Speaker 2>As for Jerita, when the music teacher in London, she

0:16:51.240 --> 0:16:54.520
<v Speaker 2>doesn't see herself back home anytime soon.

0:16:54.920 --> 0:16:59.400
<v Speaker 3>Since I left Hong Kong, I witnessed my friends from

0:16:59.440 --> 0:17:04.479
<v Speaker 3>my industry, including theater actors, they got arrested or they

0:17:04.520 --> 0:17:11.359
<v Speaker 3>got charged. I felt really scared, and I felt this

0:17:11.640 --> 0:17:18.560
<v Speaker 3>place is trying to expel its own people. In order

0:17:18.600 --> 0:17:24.840
<v Speaker 3>to survive in that city, I will transform into someone

0:17:25.680 --> 0:17:29.600
<v Speaker 3>that I hate. I have to feel safe in the

0:17:29.680 --> 0:17:33.320
<v Speaker 3>place that would let me to create or say anything

0:17:33.359 --> 0:17:36.959
<v Speaker 3>that I want to say, or even sing anything that

0:17:37.000 --> 0:17:39.720
<v Speaker 3>I want to sing. Maybe there will be a future

0:17:39.840 --> 0:17:43.840
<v Speaker 3>for me in Hong Kong, but I don't see a

0:17:43.920 --> 0:17:49.720
<v Speaker 3>future that I like for me in Hong Kong.

0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:59.200
<v Speaker 2>Thanks for listening to The Big Take Asia podcast from

0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:03.119
<v Speaker 2>Bloomberg News. I'm wan Ha. This episode was produced by

0:18:03.200 --> 0:18:07.399
<v Speaker 2>Naomi Um, Young Young, Jessica Beck, and Alexander Suguiera. It

0:18:07.440 --> 0:18:09.840
<v Speaker 2>was mixed by alex and fact checked by Jessica and

0:18:09.960 --> 0:18:13.399
<v Speaker 2>alex And. It was edited by Aaron Edwards, Stacy Smith,

0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:17.200
<v Speaker 2>Daniel ten Kate, and John Leu. Additional reporting by Aria

0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:21.199
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0:18:21.280 --> 0:18:24.800
<v Speaker 2>Kim Gettelson are our senior producers. Elizabeth Ponso Is our

0:18:24.840 --> 0:18:28.919
<v Speaker 2>senior editor. Nicole Beamster Bower is our executive producer. Sage

0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:33.000
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<v Speaker 2>The Big Take Asia wherever you listen to podcasts. It

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