1 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 2: Well, Elon Musk is now the richest person on the planet. 3 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 3: More than half the satellites in space are owned and 4 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 3: controlled by one man. 5 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:24,640 Speaker 4: Well, he's a legitimate super genius. 6 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:27,960 Speaker 5: I mean legitimate. He says He's always voted for Democrats, 7 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 5: but this year it will be different. 8 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: He'll vote Republican. 9 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,159 Speaker 4: There is a reason the US government is so reliant 10 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:33,560 Speaker 4: on him. 11 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 3: Elon Musk is a scam artist and he's done nothing. 12 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 5: Anything he does, he's fascinating people. Welcome to Delan in 13 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 5: Bloomberg's weekly podcast about Elon Musk. It's Tuesday, May twenty eighth. 14 00:00:56,080 --> 00:01:01,000 Speaker 5: I'm your host, David Papadopolis. Today we'll be talkings, a 15 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:03,480 Speaker 5: topic that has come up a lot this year already 16 00:01:03,720 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 5: and will only continue to do so as we head 17 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 5: into election season. A poll came out recently that showed 18 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:12,560 Speaker 5: that Elon Musk is the celebrity most likely to sway 19 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:17,120 Speaker 5: young people away from his opinions, an anti influencer, if 20 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 5: you will. As other billionaires stake their positions like Blackstone, 21 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 5: Steve Schwartzman endorsing Donald Trump, will examine the role Elon 22 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 5: is playing himself. Also, we have a special treat for 23 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:34,679 Speaker 5: you later this week, a mapping of Elon's universe. Confused, intrigued, 24 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 5: tune back in for more. First up today, a little 25 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 5: news roundup. Xai raised an eye popping six million dollars 26 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 5: in a fundraising round, and campaigns are taking shape ahead 27 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 5: of the June shareholder vote on Musk's mega pay package. 28 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 5: We'll dig into all of this with Max Schafkin, senior 29 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:58,280 Speaker 5: reporter at BusinessWeek. Hello, Max, Hello, David, and Dana Hall 30 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 5: Elon Musk a p reporter Dana Hello, Hey hey. Later 31 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 5: on we're going to have Josh Green, national correspondent for 32 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:08,120 Speaker 5: Bloomberg business Week, join us as well to talk about 33 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 5: the politics. We start with x Ai. It has taken 34 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 5: in a large sum of money from investors. Max Chaffkin, 35 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:17,519 Speaker 5: give us the latest. 36 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,799 Speaker 2: Yeah, six billion dollars from a group of investors. That's 37 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 2: kind of like a you know, the Elon Supervan's you know, 38 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 2: unite together to help him. We've got Koya Capital, Koya 39 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:31,760 Speaker 2: being you know, basically the venture capital firm that's been 40 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:36,240 Speaker 2: with Elon the longest, I believe, going at least to PayPal. 41 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:38,799 Speaker 2: We've got Andreas and Horowitz. You know, Mark and Ries 42 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 2: of course, has been pretty vocal on social media kind 43 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:45,519 Speaker 2: of drifting in the same right word direction. We also 44 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 2: have a group of Saudi Arabian investors who you know, 45 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 2: were original backers of Twitter. They rolled their shares over 46 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:58,000 Speaker 2: into the new Twitter x. So it's really it's a 47 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:01,399 Speaker 2: group of people who essentially believe in Elon and who 48 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:04,840 Speaker 2: are joining him to ride this wave which is AI. 49 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 2: And so in certain ways it's a big number. In 50 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 2: other ways, it's not surprising at all, Like this is 51 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 2: a super hot market. We've reported previously rumors and little 52 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,240 Speaker 2: tidbits that suggested this deal was going to happen, and 53 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:21,360 Speaker 2: now XAI has in fact announced it happening. 54 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 5: Yeah, no, fair enough. Ai is about as hot as 55 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 5: hot gets right now. But still Dana when you take 56 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:29,359 Speaker 5: you know, if you go back to the moment that 57 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:32,679 Speaker 5: Xai was created and you go out, you go back 58 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:36,880 Speaker 5: to the rollout of the Great Rock and how there 59 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 5: was a fair amount of eye rolling and such at 60 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 5: that time to now where they're raising six billion dollars, 61 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:46,760 Speaker 5: you know, like this it's all kind of come together 62 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 5: pretty quickly. 63 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 1: Now Elon is an incredible fundraiser, he's an incredible financial 64 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,440 Speaker 1: engineer when it comes to raising money for himself. And 65 00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: I think what's super interesting is that now xtat ai 66 00:03:57,400 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: is valued higher than X itself. 67 00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 5: Right, So if they raise six billion, do we know 68 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 5: exactly what valuation it gives the whole company? 69 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 2: Elon Musk said, it's eighteen million pre money, which is 70 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 2: eighteen billion eighteen billion pre money, which equals twenty four 71 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:18,840 Speaker 2: billion or would imply twenty four billion dollar post money valuation. 72 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:23,600 Speaker 5: I see. So okay, right, so you're saying Danny he's 73 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 5: a fantastic fundraiser. This just proves that once again. Even 74 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,919 Speaker 5: by the way Danner after the flop that was the 75 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:35,239 Speaker 5: acquisition of Twitter. 76 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,240 Speaker 1: I mean, to be clear, you know, Musk grossly overpaid 77 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 1: for Twitter. Forty four billion dollars was a crazy amount 78 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 1: of money. He timed it, it was, It was terrible timing. 79 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 1: He has said as much. He's like, we overpaid. That's 80 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 1: why he tried to get out of the deal. He 81 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:52,039 Speaker 1: was forced to buy it. So yeah, he like did 82 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 1: a terrible I mean, that was a terrible like timing mistake. 83 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: But when it comes to working with Wall Street raising 84 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,039 Speaker 1: ca capital, fundraising for his visions, he has done this 85 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: over and over again. I mean, the guy runs six 86 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 1: companies now and his latest startup, which is his Darling, 87 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:13,440 Speaker 1: is now raising billions of dollars from investors old and new, 88 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 1: and you know, every like to Max's point, everyone from 89 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 1: Valor to the Saudis to Fidelity, like people want to 90 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:25,919 Speaker 1: be in with Elon. And I was noting this morning 91 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: that Gene Munster of deep Water posted thrilled to report 92 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:32,599 Speaker 1: that deep Water is an investor in Xai's recent round 93 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:36,280 Speaker 1: and he lists four reasons. One of them is the 94 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:39,919 Speaker 1: Elon factor quote his involvement es central to the success 95 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: of the company. Given his vision, he has a unique 96 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 1: power to attract world class talent and deep pockets to 97 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 1: fund what will be an incredibly capital intensive five year 98 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:53,719 Speaker 1: infrastructure build. So you know, people, I mean his track 99 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:57,720 Speaker 1: record of raising and deploying capital is kind of unparalleled. 100 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 2: You know, you might be time to to say, like, 101 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 2: haven't these investors learned their lesson? I mean, like they 102 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:07,240 Speaker 2: put billions of dollars into the buyout of Twitter. It's 103 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 2: worked out in very poorly. The value value of Twitter's 104 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,159 Speaker 2: fallen and I think the answer is no. And it's 105 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:16,400 Speaker 2: no because well, for two reasons. One is it's not 106 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:20,840 Speaker 2: totally clear that Twitter and Xai are entirely separate. I mean, 107 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 2: there are supparate companies, the equity structure are separate. 108 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 4: But as we talked about. 109 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:28,239 Speaker 2: On this podcast, Twitter is being used to train Xai. 110 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 2: It is the main distribution platform for Grock, Xai's main product, 111 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:36,600 Speaker 2: and it appears, although we don't know exactly what's going on, 112 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 2: that Twitter investors were given allocations in this startup. So 113 00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 2: in certain ways, you back Twitter, you've gotten this other thing. 114 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,600 Speaker 2: And remember back in twenty twenty two, you know, people 115 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 2: were talking about this. Our colleague Matt Levine was writing 116 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:54,600 Speaker 2: about it. But basically people were saying, well, why are 117 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 2: these bankers, you know, why are people putting money in 118 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 2: this company? And the answer was, it's not that they 119 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:01,240 Speaker 2: think it's a good deal. It's that they want access 120 00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:04,280 Speaker 2: to Elon Musk's next deal. And this is it, right, Like, 121 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:08,240 Speaker 2: this is why you roll if you're the Saudi's or whatever. 122 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:10,440 Speaker 2: This is why you rolled your shares over because you 123 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:12,200 Speaker 2: wanted to stay on his good side. So when he 124 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 2: goes and does something hot like this Xai thing, you. 125 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 4: Can get in. 126 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 5: You've got access, and I guess that is the broader 127 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 5: point when you talk about did they not learn their 128 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 5: lesson from from giving money to Elon? The broader lesson 129 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:27,400 Speaker 5: from giving money to Elon, whether it's Tesla or SpaceX 130 00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 5: or some of these others is that it goes up, up, 131 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:32,080 Speaker 5: up and up. And so yes, it's true. Twitter was 132 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 5: the most recent of these, and it blew up in 133 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 5: spectacular fashion. But I guess they see it to a 134 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 5: certain degree as a one off. Plus as you're saying 135 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 5: it's an entry into this Xai investment, I mean. 136 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 2: There's another story you could tell, which is that Elon is, 137 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 2: you know, becoming more erratic. We've seen, you know, Tesla's 138 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 2: stock is down. There are a lot of warning signs here, 139 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 2: and if this Ai bubble or what appears to be 140 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:57,640 Speaker 2: an AI bubble is deflated or bursts or whatever, then 141 00:07:57,880 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 2: Xai is going to be like one of the first casualty. 142 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 2: So it's not like it's totally clear that this is 143 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 2: like a good move, but it is. It's not like 144 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 2: these people are way outside of kind of like the 145 00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:13,280 Speaker 2: normal investor consensus in investing in this company. I mean 146 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:17,040 Speaker 2: investors are investing in lots and lots of dumb AI 147 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:20,320 Speaker 2: things right now, this is like not even close to 148 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 2: the most dumb thing that Silicon Valley investors have put 149 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:25,720 Speaker 2: like a billion dollars into in the last couple of years. 150 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 5: Okay, Dana Hall. The shareholder vote on Musk's mega pay package, 151 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 5: the one that was approved by shareholders years ago for 152 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:38,680 Speaker 5: fifty six billion dollars, then a judge struck down a 153 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 5: couple months ago. There is a new pay package now 154 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:49,120 Speaker 5: back in front of shareholders. The vote is on June thirteenth. 155 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:50,080 Speaker 5: Where do things stand? 156 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:53,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, so June thirteenth is the annual shareholder meeting. They're 157 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 1: going to be voting on several things. The big one 158 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:59,320 Speaker 1: is the pay package. And to be clear, like this 159 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:02,880 Speaker 1: is part of Tesla's legal strategy, right so you know, 160 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 1: shareholders approve this pay package in twenty eighteen, the Delaware 161 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 1: Chancery judge struck it down. Tesla has yet to appeal 162 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 1: to the Delaware Supreme Court. They're putting it before shareholders 163 00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:15,720 Speaker 1: again and they want to be able to say, listen, 164 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: shareholders voted again. Elon still has all of the support. 165 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:22,040 Speaker 1: This will help them with their appeal, but it doesn't 166 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: actually like ultimately, the judge she'll has to do her 167 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 1: findings and this legal process has to continue. So it's 168 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:33,560 Speaker 1: largely symbolic. What's fascinating is that the Tesla board is 169 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:36,080 Speaker 1: all out with this full on campaign. There's a vote 170 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: Tesla website. All these retail shareholders are being urged to vote. 171 00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:44,840 Speaker 1: There is Tesla this morning actually posted that if you 172 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:47,960 Speaker 1: vote your Tesla shares, you have a chance to win 173 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:53,120 Speaker 1: a tour of Jigaexas with Elon and France on holds houses. 174 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 1: And you know, some of the large proxy advisory firms, 175 00:09:57,280 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 1: the two big ones are Glass Lewis and Iss. Over 176 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:02,199 Speaker 1: the moment Morialty weekend, Glass Lewis came out and they 177 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 1: were like no, no on the pay package. So it's 178 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 1: going to be a really close vote. And I think 179 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 1: the board is extremely worried because it's it's fundamentally a vote. 180 00:10:11,559 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: It's like a referendum on Elon's leadership as CEO, and uh, 181 00:10:16,160 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 1: you know, if it's a squeaker or if he only 182 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 1: gets fifty point one percent of the vote, that's like 183 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:25,160 Speaker 1: a huge sign that like not everyone is happy. And 184 00:10:25,200 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 1: so you know, the big the big voting blocks are 185 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 1: the big shareholders. Retail is significant but you need retail 186 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,959 Speaker 1: to actually vote. So there's this unprecedented campaign where they're 187 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: shaking the trees trying to get every retail voter out 188 00:10:38,920 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 1: there to vote their shares. 189 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:43,680 Speaker 2: And this is partly a reflection the fact that, like 190 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:47,839 Speaker 2: Tesla's stockholder base is different from many other companies, Like 191 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 2: there are a lot of they're more retail shareholders in 192 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 2: this company than in a normal company. 193 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:55,120 Speaker 4: And so like these votes are more like this, this campaign, 194 00:10:55,280 --> 00:10:57,440 Speaker 4: the Musk fanboys more significant. 195 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:00,840 Speaker 2: You know, Normally Glass Lewis, like the big asset managers 196 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 2: just kind of do whatever Lewis recommends and that's that. 197 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:06,600 Speaker 2: And so that would be to vote against this. But 198 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 2: because you have this substantial contingent of retail investors, because 199 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 2: you have Tesla, you know, and Elon Musk, you know, 200 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 2: despite the ways in which he's polarizing, like, there's still 201 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,320 Speaker 2: a lot of people, particularly Tesla's shareholders, who. 202 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:19,720 Speaker 4: Really believe in him. 203 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 2: So him, you know, going out there and campaigning, you know, 204 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:25,360 Speaker 2: I mean, I think it has the potential to be 205 00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:26,679 Speaker 2: a factor. I think Dan is right, it's going to 206 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: be close vote. 207 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 5: And it is also interesting that, as Dana is saying, 208 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 5: it's ultimately something of a bank shot in the sense 209 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 5: that it's not it's not binding in and of itself. 210 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 5: Even if the vote goes his way, they can't immediately 211 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:41,200 Speaker 5: turn around and give them the pay package. They then 212 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 5: have to turn back to the judge in Delaware and say, look, look, 213 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 5: you see that people are still with us. But if 214 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,439 Speaker 5: I remember correctly what our reporter in Delaware told is 215 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,560 Speaker 5: Jeff Feely, the judges in Delaware and the courses in 216 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:56,840 Speaker 5: Delaware tends to be unmoved by such appeals. 217 00:11:56,960 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 2: You do wonder the announcement of this XAI deal, right like, 218 00:12:00,920 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 2: that's not news that was leaked. That is news that 219 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:07,080 Speaker 2: was announced, right we for you know, months have been 220 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 2: and other news outlets have been reporting on the possibility 221 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:12,319 Speaker 2: of this. Elon had previously denied that it was even 222 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 2: a thing, and him announcing this just in front of 223 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:17,839 Speaker 2: this vote, it does make you wonder if part of 224 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 2: the goal here is to signal to TESLA board members 225 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 2: and shareholders and so on that there is this risk 226 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:26,120 Speaker 2: that if we don't pay you on what he's worth, 227 00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:27,960 Speaker 2: or at least as far as he sees it, there's 228 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:30,920 Speaker 2: a chance he walks away and does his AI thing. Elsewhere. 229 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 5: More to come on this as we get closer to 230 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:41,960 Speaker 5: that vote. Okay, We're now joined by Josh Green, a 231 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:47,200 Speaker 5: national correspondent for Bloomberg Business Week. Hello, Josh, gonna be 232 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:51,600 Speaker 5: with you. Hey, Okay, Josh, So you come bearing gifts 233 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:56,319 Speaker 5: of sorts. There's a new pull out. What exactly does 234 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:58,280 Speaker 5: it say? 235 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 3: It's kind of a weird stunt poll from a Democratic 236 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:05,320 Speaker 3: firm called Blueprint that does a lot of messaging advice 237 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:09,359 Speaker 3: to President Biden into Democrats, and because he's been struggling 238 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 3: with younger voters in particular, the polsters went out and 239 00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 3: asked younger voters, people eighteen to thirty, who were the 240 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:22,200 Speaker 3: most influential endorsers that Democrats and Republicans could come up 241 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 3: with to sway their votes. The winners for men not 242 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 3: super surprising. Lebron James was the most influential endorser for 243 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:33,719 Speaker 3: young men. For young women, it was the actress and 244 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 3: Daya who actually beat out Taylor Swift, somewhat to the 245 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:42,320 Speaker 3: surprise of political insiders. But the name that jumped out 246 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 3: to me was who they described as the least influential endorser, 247 00:13:47,360 --> 00:13:50,480 Speaker 3: who by a two to one margin, voters said his 248 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:54,560 Speaker 3: endorsement would make them less likely to support the candidate 249 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:57,640 Speaker 3: that he endorsed, and that was, of course Elon Musk. 250 00:13:57,760 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 1: What's the margin of error in this poll? 251 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 4: What exactly. 252 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,240 Speaker 1: What was the sample size? I'm very curious about what 253 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: a stunt pole is. 254 00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:09,760 Speaker 3: Sample well, what I call it a stunt pole? What 255 00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:12,840 Speaker 3: I mean it's not that it isn't statistically valid, it 256 00:14:12,920 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 3: is sample size. I think it was about a thousand 257 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:18,160 Speaker 3: registered voters, margin of error with something like four or five. 258 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 3: So it's about what you get for kind of public 259 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 3: facing polls. Stunt more in the sense of, you know, 260 00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 3: the campaigns aren't out there focusing super hard on my gosh, 261 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:32,280 Speaker 3: can we just get Lebron to endorse us? As much 262 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 3: as both candidates would like that, there are more important 263 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 3: things for campaigns to be doing. But it's sort of 264 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:40,480 Speaker 3: a catnit for political insiders and political reporters. Everybody likes 265 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 3: to see how everybody else ranks. That being said, I 266 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 3: don't think Lebron, or Tailor or Zendia, or probably even 267 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 3: Elon Musk is going to tilt the election one way 268 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 3: or another. But it is interesting to see just how 269 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:57,640 Speaker 3: phenomenally unpopular Elon Musk has become, especially with younger people. 270 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:00,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think the key thing here is 271 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 2: younger people, right eighteen to thirty. You know, Elon Musk 272 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:09,680 Speaker 2: doesn't necessarily play to that demographic. You don't normally think 273 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 2: of the typical cyber truck driver as being a zoomer. 274 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:16,520 Speaker 2: It's more like a father or a grandfather of a zoomer. 275 00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 2: I'd say that said. You know, we've talked about this 276 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 2: a lot. Like Elon Musk, there have been a lot 277 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 2: of attempts to sort of put some kind of like 278 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 2: galaxy brain gloss on Elon musk political moves and when 279 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 2: you're like embracing, you know, extreme political positions, extreme right 280 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 2: wing political positions like newsflash. That does not play well 281 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 2: with voters of any kind, and even less well with 282 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 2: young voters. 283 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:42,640 Speaker 5: The poll is interesting in it, but it is also 284 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 5: interesting to me that they really just highlight younger voters 285 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 5: and not let's say, middle aged voters, who who who 286 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 5: might view Musk more favorably than the youth of America do? 287 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 5: Is there a sense of why they chose that age group? 288 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 5: Is that because perhaps they are more malleable and easier 289 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:01,720 Speaker 5: to sway? 290 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 3: No, I don't think so I mean, you know, the 291 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 3: youth vote is going to be pivotal in this election. 292 00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 3: Biden won it last time. Democrats traditionally do. But if 293 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 3: you look at all sorts of polsters beyond these ones, 294 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,920 Speaker 3: including both campaigns pollsters, young people are more down on 295 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:20,560 Speaker 3: Joe Biden and more open to Donald Trump than they 296 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:24,040 Speaker 3: were four years ago. So it is an important subject. 297 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:26,240 Speaker 3: I don't think that the youth voters any more malleable 298 00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 3: than than older voters. What we do know is that 299 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 3: the older the voters are, the more likely they are 300 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,360 Speaker 3: to show up the polls and pull the lever, and 301 00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 3: a lot of younger people just don't. So, you know, 302 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 3: I don't think it invalidates the results at all. I 303 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:40,880 Speaker 3: think what stands out to me, though, is the idea 304 00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 3: that Elon is sort of the typhoid Mary of celebrity endorsers, 305 00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:47,960 Speaker 3: at least when it comes to younger voters, Like he 306 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 3: actually makes you less likely to vote for somebody he's endorsed, 307 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 3: and like, there I'm looking at the list of celebrities. 308 00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 3: You know, there were a couple dozen of them, from 309 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 3: Cardi b to Billie Isle to Beyonce, the Lil Wayne, 310 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:05,679 Speaker 3: Kevin Hart, lil Yati. I'm sure you guys are all 311 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 3: fans cute. None of these voters actually push young people 312 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:15,480 Speaker 3: against their chosen candidates. The ones, it's really the ones 313 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 3: who are who do that are are Elon Musk, Jake 314 00:17:18,760 --> 00:17:23,239 Speaker 3: Paul and Kanye West, who, much like Elon Musk, has 315 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 3: kind of run into some trouble in the Culture Wars lately. 316 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:29,960 Speaker 2: A couple other names in there too, Gwyneth Paltrow, Joe Rogan. 317 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,359 Speaker 2: I mean, these are all people who I think, like 318 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:35,120 Speaker 2: a young person might describe as cringe in one way 319 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 2: or another, like even because they have big followings among 320 00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 2: older folks like you are not if you're a young person, 321 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:44,720 Speaker 2: you are not going for Gwyneths like chosen, you know 322 00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 2: what I mean. 323 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 5: So Josh, even for those like the Zendayas, like the 324 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:52,840 Speaker 5: Lebron But people who are indeed apparently will have you know, 325 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 5: young voters say hey, yeah, I would be influenced by 326 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:57,960 Speaker 5: this person to a certain extent. Does that actually even 327 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:01,959 Speaker 5: what is history show? Does that even translate into a 328 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 5: meaningful movement of the needle in terms of the way 329 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 5: people vote? Or No, yeah, I mean I. 330 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,960 Speaker 3: Think it does among you know, particular subgroups. 331 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:09,399 Speaker 5: I mean. 332 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:13,639 Speaker 3: Both candidates, you know, Trump just because he's sort of 333 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:17,439 Speaker 3: generally needy and Democrats, because their candidates tend to be 334 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:21,080 Speaker 3: older and lamer, have really prized celebrity endorsements over the 335 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 3: last couple of cycles. You know, Obama was thought of 336 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 3: as a particularly cool candidate, a lot of people want 337 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:29,040 Speaker 3: to endorse him. But even Donald Trump back in the 338 00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 3: twenty sixteen Republican National Convention had a couple of like, 339 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 3: kind of B list actors there, and he was so 340 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 3: excited because Trump cares about celebrity more than more than 341 00:18:38,160 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 3: just about anybody. And like I said, it's tough to 342 00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:43,200 Speaker 3: get young people to turn out to vote if it's 343 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:45,600 Speaker 3: not like an Obama on the ticket, or a Bernie 344 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:48,920 Speaker 3: Sanders on the ticket, or somebody who they would naturally 345 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 3: be enthused to turn out for, And especially when you 346 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:55,080 Speaker 3: have an election shaping up like the one that we 347 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:57,480 Speaker 3: have between Joe Biden and Donald Trump. These are two 348 00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 3: of the most unpopular candidates with age groups across the board, 349 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:05,400 Speaker 3: but particularly so with younger people. So you could actually 350 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:09,440 Speaker 3: make an argument that celebrity endorsers for these two particular 351 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:11,879 Speaker 3: candidates are more important this cycle than they would be 352 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:13,000 Speaker 3: in an ordinary cycle. 353 00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 5: Now Dan has Elon endorse anyone yet. 354 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:20,880 Speaker 1: No, he has an endorsed and he said that he's 355 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:25,679 Speaker 1: not donating to any political candidates, but he sort of 356 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:29,440 Speaker 1: left open the possibility of a pack or donating via 357 00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:32,920 Speaker 1: a pack or you know, dark money works in mysterious ways. 358 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:36,399 Speaker 1: And if you just look at his tweets on X 359 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:39,400 Speaker 1: his platform, I mean, he's all, I mean, he's he's 360 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 1: just slamming Joe Biden left and right all the time, 361 00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:44,640 Speaker 1: and so you know, it's like a de facto endorsement 362 00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 1: of Trump. But he hasn't come out and said like, 363 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:48,560 Speaker 1: I am voting for Donald Trump. 364 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 5: And a lot of. 365 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 1: People always ask the question, like, well, why doesn't Elon 366 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:55,160 Speaker 1: Musk run for president? He cannot run for president himself 367 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 1: because he was born in South Africa, but he is 368 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,600 Speaker 1: registered to vote in Texas. He registered to vote in 369 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:03,880 Speaker 1: July of twenty twenty and in the Brownsville area. And 370 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:07,920 Speaker 1: you know, he has increasingly like encouraged his employees to vote. 371 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: So pretty recently he sent this like staff white email 372 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:13,600 Speaker 1: out to everybody at TESLA saying like, hey, if you 373 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:15,680 Speaker 1: live in the Austin area, please be sure to vote 374 00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:16,600 Speaker 1: in the DA's race. 375 00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:19,399 Speaker 5: A lot of employees were Yeah, but that didn't go 376 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:20,480 Speaker 5: particularly well. 377 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:22,560 Speaker 1: For me because it was like he was telling people 378 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,760 Speaker 1: how to vote on the day of the election, and 379 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:28,560 Speaker 1: you know, like it was sort of a very late 380 00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:30,360 Speaker 1: and late to the party kind of thing. But also 381 00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:33,359 Speaker 1: like employees don't really want their boss telling them how 382 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 1: to vote. So that's and the candidate lost. So I 383 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:39,719 Speaker 1: think that like a big question for this campaign cycle 384 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:43,760 Speaker 1: is what exactly is Elon doing with his money if anything? 385 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 1: Or is he putting his thumb on the scales just 386 00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 1: in terms of what he amplifies on X or is 387 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:53,679 Speaker 1: he really, like you know, going around to fundraisers with 388 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:56,399 Speaker 1: Trump and doing kind of stuff behind the scenes. Like 389 00:20:56,400 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: we haven't really seen exactly what his role is going 390 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: to be this cycle yet. 391 00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:05,960 Speaker 5: Right, And we do know that like Schwartzman at Blackstone 392 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 5: are starting to line up, billionaires like him are starting 393 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 5: to line up behind Trump and send more money his way. 394 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:16,680 Speaker 5: On that question of giving out money, is there any 395 00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 5: movement there? I know you said he has said his 396 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:22,639 Speaker 5: public postures that he will not donate, but is there 397 00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:26,119 Speaker 5: any do we have any indications that beneath the surface 398 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:27,240 Speaker 5: there may be movement there. 399 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:32,440 Speaker 1: I mean, there's no record of Musk donating to any candidates, 400 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:34,719 Speaker 1: Like if you look at FEC filings and there's no 401 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:37,639 Speaker 1: record of a pact. But that's not to say that 402 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:39,880 Speaker 1: one doesn't exist, like you know, I mean, I mean 403 00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,960 Speaker 1: there's no you know, if you look up Elon Musk 404 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,280 Speaker 1: and campaign donations, you're not going to find anything to 405 00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:46,879 Speaker 1: presidential candidates this cycle. 406 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:52,239 Speaker 2: Elon's David Sachs is hosting a fundraiser for Trump in 407 00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:55,479 Speaker 2: early June, and so there is you know, like he 408 00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:57,919 Speaker 2: does have some friends who are starting to line up 409 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 2: behind Trump. I think the conventional wisdom when you talk 410 00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 2: to people like in Silicon Valley been around Elon is 411 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 2: that he's too. 412 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 4: Cheap to to donate to Trump. 413 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 2: He's not gonna wanna, you know, write a massive check 414 00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 2: that will be used to pay Trump's legal bills or whatever, 415 00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 2: which I think is like generally a good bet. Elon 416 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:18,880 Speaker 2: Musk is a person who uses capital in a very 417 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 2: efficient way. And like, and I brought this up before, 418 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 2: like you know, you go tomorrow lago, and like it's 419 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:26,560 Speaker 2: not this is not going to look like an efficient 420 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:27,280 Speaker 2: use of capital. 421 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 5: What's the actual net present value right now of me 422 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:34,680 Speaker 5: giving Donald Trump tk amount of dollars. But if Trump 423 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 5: is in the White House come January, it's suddenly going 424 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 5: to feel like you. 425 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:41,480 Speaker 2: Know, oh yeah, right, and and you know, given this 426 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,679 Speaker 2: is a guy who's you know, we've talked about this 427 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,920 Speaker 2: earlier on the podcast. He's spending you know, billions of 428 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 2: dollars on you know, in Nvidia, GPUs and so on, 429 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 2: Like you know, what's a couple of million dollars for 430 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:55,160 Speaker 2: some for for like a significant amount of influence, especially 431 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 2: when you're talking about the prospect of you know, we're 432 00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:01,280 Speaker 2: talking about ev tariffs, We're talking about like lots of policies, 433 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:04,639 Speaker 2: The Defense Department has a massive procurement budgement, lots of 434 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 2: ways that. 435 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:06,879 Speaker 5: That the next administration will very. 436 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 4: Be very helpful to. 437 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,080 Speaker 2: Elon Musk that said, like Dan has talked about this, 438 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 2: I mean we've talked. It's like it is a little 439 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 2: bit outside of his comfort zone. Like I don't know 440 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,959 Speaker 2: that he would definitely do it, although I'm sure, and 441 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,240 Speaker 2: I think Josh can comment on this too, I'm sure 442 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 2: Trump would would love it. 443 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 5: Yeah, Josh, you've done some reporting on this recently, on 444 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 5: the dance between these two men. Any any fresh intel 445 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 5: on your end, I. 446 00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:34,760 Speaker 3: Mean, the fresh intel is kind of the same as 447 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:38,320 Speaker 3: as like the longtime intel on Elon and Washington. He's 448 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:41,040 Speaker 3: eve in Washington as a chief skate too. Is essentially 449 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:43,960 Speaker 3: somebody who talks a big game and wants a lot 450 00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:46,800 Speaker 3: of attention, but, as one Trump advisor put it to me, 451 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 3: won't stroke a check. There's a lot of bad feelings 452 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:54,240 Speaker 3: toward Elon, especially among people in the RHN DeSantis orbit. 453 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:57,200 Speaker 3: They were led to believe that Elon was going to 454 00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 3: be coming in with a big check to support a 455 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:04,080 Speaker 3: Dessanda's super pac and that check never materialized. I don't 456 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:06,560 Speaker 3: think he ended up giving a dollar. And of course 457 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 3: Desanda's kind of flamed out and is out of the race. 458 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:11,560 Speaker 3: And I think what that did was just sort of 459 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:14,680 Speaker 3: reinforce the idea that this guy is all about himself 460 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:19,120 Speaker 3: and getting attention and cares about politics to the extent 461 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 3: that it intersects with his own life, either in a 462 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:25,760 Speaker 3: culture war sense or getting government contract sense, but doesn't 463 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 3: think of himself as being like a political player who 464 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,679 Speaker 3: needs to be donating millions of dollars along the lines 465 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 3: of like a more traditional rich person who wants to 466 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 3: influence a White House like somebody like a Steve Schwartzman. 467 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:43,240 Speaker 5: So Max Elon is load to quote stroke the check. 468 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,439 Speaker 5: Are other tech billionaires doing this at this point for 469 00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:48,080 Speaker 5: Donald Trump? 470 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 4: I mean there is this. 471 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:51,439 Speaker 2: First of all, there's always been like kind of a 472 00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:56,199 Speaker 2: right wing a contingent in Silicon Valley, and during the 473 00:24:56,240 --> 00:25:00,960 Speaker 2: primary that group was kind of hesitant and kind of 474 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 2: the same way like Elon to. 475 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:03,720 Speaker 4: Get behind Trump. 476 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 2: But we have seen some signs so that the two 477 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:12,440 Speaker 2: co hosts of the All In podcast, Shamoth poly Abbatilla 478 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 2: and David Sachs, these guys are both venture capitalist. Sacks 479 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 2: is very close to Elon. They're they're hosting a fundraiser 480 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:23,520 Speaker 2: in early June. I think the contribution is like five 481 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars per couple or something along those lines. 482 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:31,159 Speaker 2: So this is like a big ticket fundraiser in San Francisco. 483 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 2: I assume there will be a lot of big names 484 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:37,440 Speaker 2: in tech, you know at this event. Also probably a podcast. 485 00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:41,359 Speaker 2: So so there is there is some movement towards Trump 486 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 2: from the kind of like I mean, these are like 487 00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 2: trumpy Silicon Valley right wingers, Like none of this is 488 00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:50,119 Speaker 2: a huge surprise. On the other hand, it does signal 489 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:51,840 Speaker 2: a bit of a shift and could be a way 490 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 2: for like Elon to maybe find his way into into 491 00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 2: making a donation. 492 00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:01,159 Speaker 3: I think, look, Trump Ne's I mean, Joe Biden has 493 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,160 Speaker 3: a lot more money than Donald Trump does. So if 494 00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:07,639 Speaker 3: non Elon tech billionaires or high centa whatever they are 495 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:09,640 Speaker 3: is are willing to step up and write him five 496 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,000 Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars check, that is a big deal. It 497 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:16,199 Speaker 3: matters to Trump. It's going to help his campaign. You know, 498 00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:18,959 Speaker 3: Elon specifically, as we can see from the poll, is 499 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:20,960 Speaker 3: not going to kind of move the needle with younger people. 500 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:23,640 Speaker 3: But if Elon were to kind of get excited by 501 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 3: by David Sachs or the momentum in Silicon Valley for Trump, 502 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:29,920 Speaker 3: and we're willing to start writing checks along with those 503 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:31,919 Speaker 3: other guys, then I think that really would add up 504 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:35,879 Speaker 3: to a meaningful factor for the Trump campaign and in 505 00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 3: the presidential race, which which Trump is leading right now. 506 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 2: There are reasons that Elon might be more motivated to 507 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,119 Speaker 2: donate in the context of like a general election than 508 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:48,040 Speaker 2: he was in the Republican primary, where you know, he 509 00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:52,920 Speaker 2: clearly feels that Biden has has it out for Tesla 510 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,680 Speaker 2: has it out for him, where like the differences might 511 00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:00,560 Speaker 2: seem more extreme or more pronounced in the general election 512 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 2: versus like compared to the Santa's with Trump, where there's 513 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,119 Speaker 2: like a lot of risk, there's some actual risk to 514 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,479 Speaker 2: like going big on pro DeSantis. When you've got this 515 00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 2: like huge contingent of Trump, voters are going to be mad. 516 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:18,760 Speaker 2: Whereas now like Elon is completely ideologically aligned with with 517 00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 2: Donald Trump, that's a barrier that isn't there, Like, I 518 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 2: don't think donating to Trump is going to cost him 519 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 2: many many Tesla reservations. 520 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:28,720 Speaker 1: And it all goes back to this kind of like 521 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 1: big narcissistic injury where Biden made a big show of 522 00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:35,679 Speaker 1: having like EV companies come to the White House and 523 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: Tesla wasn't invited. 524 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 5: You know. 525 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:41,399 Speaker 1: Biden has heap praise on General Motors, which is based 526 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 1: in Michigan, and kind of left Tesla out of the narrative. 527 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:46,520 Speaker 1: At one point, Biden said that like Mary Bara led 528 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,560 Speaker 1: the EV revolution, and Elon was really upset about that. 529 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,600 Speaker 1: He felt like, wait, Tesla, you know is the company 530 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:56,520 Speaker 1: that dragged everyone kicking and screaming into electrification. And Biden, 531 00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:01,600 Speaker 1: because of his pro union stance just always ignored Tesla's contributions, 532 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:04,200 Speaker 1: and that has that's like the original sin that has 533 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:06,879 Speaker 1: led to this huge rift between the two guys, and 534 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:08,960 Speaker 1: then on and on. Elon has called him a damp 535 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:12,480 Speaker 1: sock puppet that, like the teleprompter, is the real president. 536 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:16,200 Speaker 1: He's really made fun of Biden's age. He's railed against 537 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,160 Speaker 1: the gerontocracy. I mean, you could argue Trump is also 538 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:22,840 Speaker 1: part of the gerontocracy. But this has been going on 539 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:27,280 Speaker 1: for several months now, and it's probably only going to escalate, 540 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:29,200 Speaker 1: you know, as we get closer to November. 541 00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 5: Now, Josh note, does the Trump camp look at a 542 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 5: pole like this and say, hey, we need to run away, 543 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 5: at least publicly run away from Elon? 544 00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 3: No, I don't think so. They only care about Elon 545 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 3: to the extent that they like the fact that he's 546 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:54,240 Speaker 3: criticizing Joe Biden. It helps spread those criticisms in the culture. 547 00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 3: What they would really like is for him to stroke 548 00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,760 Speaker 3: that big, you know, eight eight figure check to Trump's 549 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 3: super I don't think anybody expects that to happen. But 550 00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 3: beyond that, him kind of running his mouth on x 551 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,680 Speaker 3: or on Twitter and starting these controversies, even if they're 552 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:12,240 Speaker 3: kind of hostile toward Joe Biden, it really doesn't do 553 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 3: much for Trump one way or the other, and so 554 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:18,239 Speaker 3: he's not viewed as a particularly important factor, and in 555 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 3: order for him to become one, he would kind of 556 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:21,920 Speaker 3: have to step up and do what he doesn't really 557 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 3: want to do, and that start pouring real money into 558 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,440 Speaker 3: the presidential race behind behind a big time candidate. 559 00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:33,600 Speaker 2: I just want to flag a post on cybertruck owners 560 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 2: club dot com. This is a forum for, as you 561 00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:39,920 Speaker 2: might guess, owners of cyber trucks. There's a lengthy thread, 562 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 2: a seven page thread subject what are teenagers problems with 563 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:44,840 Speaker 2: cyber truck? 564 00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 4: What are they? 565 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:49,320 Speaker 2: And it is an owner of cyber truck commenting that, 566 00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:51,960 Speaker 2: you know, everyone he meets seems to like it, except 567 00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:55,120 Speaker 2: I've had several teenagers flip me off, yell I hate 568 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,760 Speaker 2: your truck, and just today a girl rolled down her 569 00:29:57,760 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 2: window and. 570 00:29:58,640 --> 00:29:59,680 Speaker 4: Just yelled FU. 571 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 2: Perhaps it's the storyline that they're dangerous or bad for 572 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 2: the environment, something on TikTok saying they're evil. I think, 573 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 2: folks that we've figured it out. Elon musk might be 574 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 2: a little bit polarizing with the youth, Josh. 575 00:30:11,480 --> 00:30:18,920 Speaker 5: Thank you very much for joining us fun. Okay, Max, 576 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,200 Speaker 5: so I was away last week. You were away last week, 577 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 5: which means you know, America has gone a couple weeks 578 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 5: now without a feud. Watch update Elon and all the 579 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:35,720 Speaker 5: folks he's feuding with. Surely there must be an update 580 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:36,000 Speaker 5: out there. 581 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,360 Speaker 4: Okay, First of all, David, I was not away last week. 582 00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:42,120 Speaker 2: I was working hard watching these feuds so that I 583 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 2: could come here and report back to him. And the 584 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:48,080 Speaker 2: one I want to call everyone's attention to, which is 585 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 2: related to the AI discussion, is a feud between Elon 586 00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:54,920 Speaker 2: Musk and Yon Lacuon. Yon Lacun is like the top 587 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 2: AI guy at Facebook. He has been beefing with Elon 588 00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:02,200 Speaker 2: Musk on and off, and I'd say the feud reached 589 00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:02,960 Speaker 2: a new height. 590 00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:04,680 Speaker 4: I think they've they've made it to the board. 591 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 2: Yon mccun referred to his his background as a scientist, 592 00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:12,120 Speaker 2: and Elon responded in kind of his favorite put down 593 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,920 Speaker 2: with what quote unquote science have you done in the 594 00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 2: past five years? 595 00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,520 Speaker 4: Essentially, which he's he of course used on two years. 596 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:23,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, and so we've seen, you know, a bunch of 597 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 2: Elon stands go after this guy, although you do have 598 00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 2: Yan mccuhn as a fairly respected AI expert, so there's 599 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 2: some people jumping to his defense. So there's there's a 600 00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:34,720 Speaker 2: bit of a beef in AI land. Again, this is 601 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 2: not a top five feud, but perhaps a bottom half 602 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:39,400 Speaker 2: of the top ten kind of situation. 603 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 5: And I suppose it's it's of the moment with XAI 604 00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,520 Speaker 5: being ascend in and you know, announcing the fundraising. It's 605 00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:47,640 Speaker 5: it's it's top of mind. 606 00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 2: Yes, So so Jan Lacun's employer is Meta Platforms. You know, 607 00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:53,959 Speaker 2: Meta is one of the main players in AI. They 608 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 2: have their own chat gybt like model. But I mean, 609 00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:58,760 Speaker 2: really we cannot talk about this. I mean, it's really 610 00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:01,560 Speaker 2: all that's aside because of course the real feud, what's 611 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,560 Speaker 2: the real as you know, is Elon and Zuckerberg in 612 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:09,200 Speaker 2: the cage, and we're just seeing these proxy wars play 613 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,880 Speaker 2: out all over social media, all in different ways, and 614 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:16,000 Speaker 2: it's all leading up to that. 615 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,920 Speaker 5: Moment, Yeah, big moment. Now, you're right, you were working 616 00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,840 Speaker 5: and including you were searching and and and you know 617 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,920 Speaker 5: the world for feuds high and low while I was 618 00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:29,880 Speaker 5: frolicking in Europe. Did you find any other a couple 619 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:30,240 Speaker 5: of other. 620 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:33,120 Speaker 2: Feuds that are worth talking about. One is so The 621 00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:36,880 Speaker 2: New York Times published a really excellent profile of some 622 00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 2: of the lawyers who are leading the who are working 623 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:44,920 Speaker 2: on the litigation against Twitter slash X in relation to 624 00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 2: severance payments that former employees say are due to them. 625 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,120 Speaker 2: This is a kind of ragtag group of plaintive's attorneys 626 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,560 Speaker 2: who met and formed kind of a bond on Twitter. 627 00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,080 Speaker 2: People should check it out because it's it's just kind 628 00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:59,719 Speaker 2: of a funny way in which, you know, we talk 629 00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:02,960 Speaker 2: about all the ways that X slash Twitter is kind 630 00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:04,920 Speaker 2: of a shell of itself. It isn't isn't what it was. 631 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:07,840 Speaker 2: And he reads stories like this, it's X is still 632 00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:09,560 Speaker 2: good at certain things. And one of them is like 633 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 2: getting groups of people together in this. 634 00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:12,360 Speaker 5: Case to talk trash. 635 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 2: In this case, this is a group of trash talking 636 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:18,680 Speaker 2: lawyers who have you know, joined up avengers assembled to 637 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,520 Speaker 2: try to win a major lawsuit against Elon Musk. 638 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:23,520 Speaker 4: Now there's one other sorry. 639 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,400 Speaker 5: Sorry, So he's obviously, of course battling them in court. 640 00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 5: But is he engaging with them? Is he talking trash 641 00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:28,440 Speaker 5: back at them? 642 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:30,840 Speaker 4: They I do, I am not aware. 643 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 5: I can't be allow you then it can't come on. 644 00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:34,440 Speaker 5: It's literally. 645 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 1: It's like has Matt's has many feuds? I want to 646 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:40,840 Speaker 1: I want to see his leaderboard. 647 00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:44,400 Speaker 2: There's one other feud and I'm hesitanted to bring this up, 648 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:46,720 Speaker 2: but you know there is Elon Musk has as we've 649 00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:51,680 Speaker 2: discussed a long running feud with the Google guys. Now, uh, 650 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:55,960 Speaker 2: some aspect of this feud, I suppose is uh the 651 00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:59,800 Speaker 2: divorce of Sergey Brinn from his ex wife, Nicole Shanahan. 652 00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 2: She is now a vice presidential candidate. She's running, She's 653 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 2: RFK Junior's running mate. And there was a profile that 654 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:09,040 Speaker 2: came out in The New York Times in which we 655 00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:12,839 Speaker 2: learned via a group of anonymous sources, all of whom 656 00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:15,080 Speaker 2: seem to be more or less connected to Nicole Shanahan. 657 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:18,320 Speaker 2: Elon Musk and Sergey Brin have denied this, but essentially 658 00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:22,520 Speaker 2: that the marriage between Nicole Shanahan and Sergey Brin broke 659 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:26,880 Speaker 2: up when she and Elon took ketamine and disappeared together 660 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 2: at a party, and the divorce, of course that that 661 00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:36,359 Speaker 2: followed this purported breakup left her with a giant sum 662 00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 2: of money because she was married to Sergey Brin who's 663 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 2: very wealthy, and that money is now playing a role 664 00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:46,239 Speaker 2: in the presidential election, and it's possible, just possible, that 665 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:48,040 Speaker 2: this feud could have an impact in Nova. 666 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 5: So this is essentially still part of the Elon Musk 667 00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:54,400 Speaker 5: versus the Google Mafia feud. 668 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:57,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, like I said, this is you really 669 00:34:57,120 --> 00:34:57,879 Speaker 4: have to this. 670 00:34:57,840 --> 00:34:59,560 Speaker 5: Guy really does see feuds everywhere. 671 00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:03,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess this is. But you know, the Musk 672 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,799 Speaker 1: brind feud, right, even though didn't Elon like posts some 673 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:09,120 Speaker 1: picture of them supposedly at a party or it was 674 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,520 Speaker 1: like a photo bomb where he was like we get along. 675 00:35:11,560 --> 00:35:12,759 Speaker 4: See, yeah, that's right. 676 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:15,880 Speaker 2: So the thing is like, yeah, the Wall Street Journal 677 00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 2: report a version of this story like in twenty twenty two, 678 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:21,840 Speaker 2: and Musk's response was to post this photo that Danna said. 679 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:25,560 Speaker 2: Now the photo, it really does not totally look like 680 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:29,320 Speaker 2: Sergey Brinn knew that the photo was necessarily being taken. 681 00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,799 Speaker 2: It kind of seemed like Elon Musk just sort of 682 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,879 Speaker 2: did one of those like get behind serge and take 683 00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:37,880 Speaker 2: a selfie and kind of you know, arc the camera 684 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:41,160 Speaker 2: a little bit. On the other hand, he has denied it. 685 00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:44,879 Speaker 2: Sergei Brinn has denied it, so you know, we don't 686 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:49,120 Speaker 2: whatever happened, you know, at this supposed ketamine party, it 687 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,680 Speaker 2: may remain a secret to the attendees. 688 00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 5: That's good stuff. What you're gonna do though, going forward, 689 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:59,319 Speaker 5: whether or not the leaderboard is actually released publicly or not, 690 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:02,319 Speaker 5: when you announce a feud going forward, you bring one 691 00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 5: going forward to you, got it? You also, you're going 692 00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:05,759 Speaker 5: to start to hit us with the ranking. It's got 693 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:10,160 Speaker 5: like it could be thirty seventh six fourth. Okay. 694 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:13,400 Speaker 2: The challenge here is you have Elon and Google, and 695 00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:15,920 Speaker 2: then you have Elon and Larry Page and Elon and 696 00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:16,520 Speaker 2: Sergey Brin. 697 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:17,960 Speaker 4: So it's like, do you is that one? 698 00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,840 Speaker 5: I don't know? Don't ask me, Max. That really is 699 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,000 Speaker 5: for you to figure out on your own. You come 700 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 5: all to me that, But thank you for joining me. 701 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:29,720 Speaker 5: Thank you for the assignment, Dana. Thanks as always, always 702 00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:40,800 Speaker 5: a pleasure. This episode was produced by Stacey Wong. Naomi 703 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:45,160 Speaker 5: Shavin and Rayhan Harmanci are senior editors. The idea for 704 00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:50,280 Speaker 5: this very show also came from Rayhan Blake Maples handles engineering, 705 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 5: and we get special editing assistants from Jeff Grocott and 706 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:58,480 Speaker 5: Antonio mufaett Our supervising producers Magnus Hendrickson. The Elon Inc. 707 00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 5: Theme is written and performed by Taka Yasuzawa and Alex Sudiera. 708 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,720 Speaker 5: Brendan Francis Newnham is our executive producer, and Sage Bauman 709 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:10,000 Speaker 5: is the head of Bloomberg Podcasts. If you have a minute, 710 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:13,239 Speaker 5: rate and review our show, it'll help other listeners find us. 711 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 5: See you later this week.