1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,680
Speaker 1: This episode contains discussion of sexual abuse, sex trafficking, and

2
00:00:03,760 --> 00:00:08,000
Speaker 1: allegations involving miners and connection with Jeffrey Epstein. Listener discretion

3
00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:11,680
Speaker 1: is strongly advised as some content may be disturbing or triggering.

4
00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:13,480
Speaker 2: Please take care while listening.

5
00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:19,599
Speaker 1: Hi, Amber Hilala, Welcome to An Unlikely Affair.

6
00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:25,960
Speaker 3: Hello everybody, Welcome back to another episode of An Unlikely Affair.

7
00:00:26,079 --> 00:00:30,400
Speaker 3: Hi Lala, Hi babe. How are we? We are doing dandy?

8
00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:31,440
Speaker 3: This fine?

9
00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:32,320
Speaker 2: What is today?

10
00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:32,839
Speaker 4: Monday?

11
00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:35,519
Speaker 2: Tuesday? I don't even know what day it is. The

12
00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:36,920
Speaker 2: day is just run together.

13
00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,599
Speaker 1: I have been thinking about this interview that we have

14
00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:47,159
Speaker 1: today NonStop, and you put it so perfectly, and obviously

15
00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:50,879
Speaker 1: I won't share exactly what you said, but today we

16
00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:56,640
Speaker 1: have on an Epstein survivor, Marina Lacerda, and I said,

17
00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:58,320
Speaker 1: you know, I want to create an environment for her

18
00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:03,160
Speaker 1: where she feels and heard and I am just feeling

19
00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,320
Speaker 1: the pressure. And you saying, you know, it's not about

20
00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:09,720
Speaker 1: it's not about you. Imagine going through what they've been

21
00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:12,600
Speaker 1: through and not being able to talk about it, and

22
00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:15,399
Speaker 1: then you're finally able to talk about it, how would

23
00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:19,760
Speaker 1: you feel? And I'm like, I feel amazing let's fucking go,

24
00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:20,959
Speaker 1: let's get her on.

25
00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:27,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think for me, you know, conversations like

26
00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,520
Speaker 3: this really matter because they remind us that behind every file,

27
00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:35,119
Speaker 3: every headline, every news story, every tabloid, there's a human being.

28
00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:39,520
Speaker 3: And these women that had to deal with this, men

29
00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:46,119
Speaker 3: and women, they deserve dignity, right And for me, I

30
00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:49,120
Speaker 3: deeply care about women, and I care about them being

31
00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:51,640
Speaker 3: able to tell their stories and being able to hold

32
00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:52,880
Speaker 3: space for them to tell their truth.

33
00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:53,360
Speaker 1: So this is.

34
00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:57,280
Speaker 3: So freeing, I feel like for these women, and I'm

35
00:01:57,320 --> 00:01:58,400
Speaker 3: so excited to have her on.

36
00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:02,640
Speaker 2: So I am too. Let's get her here. Hi. Oh

37
00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:04,400
Speaker 2: my god, we're so good.

38
00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:08,600
Speaker 1: I don't know if the word excited is the right word,

39
00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:11,360
Speaker 1: but I am very much looking forward to having you

40
00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:15,720
Speaker 1: on today. I find you incredibly inspiring and I just

41
00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:19,359
Speaker 1: I want to know what you went through and all

42
00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:22,520
Speaker 1: of the things I amber brought this up today. I

43
00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:25,559
Speaker 1: cannot imagine not being able to talk about your experience

44
00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:29,600
Speaker 1: and then you're finally able to. I just can't imagine

45
00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:30,639
Speaker 1: what that feeling is like.

46
00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:31,640
Speaker 2: What is that like?

47
00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:34,680
Speaker 4: I feel like it's a great feeling. It took a

48
00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:36,600
Speaker 4: while for me to break my silence, right so I

49
00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:39,640
Speaker 4: feel like all the other survivors who have been doing

50
00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:42,160
Speaker 4: this for a very long time, I think for them

51
00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,760
Speaker 4: it's you know, a little bit more emotional because they

52
00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:47,919
Speaker 4: have been doing this for a very very long time.

53
00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:50,480
Speaker 4: And after I broke my silence in September, I really

54
00:02:50,520 --> 00:02:54,520
Speaker 4: have to say, like everyone has been reaching out to

55
00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:58,040
Speaker 4: hear my story. So I've been very grateful and thankful

56
00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:00,400
Speaker 4: for that, you know, So it hasn't you know, it's

57
00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:03,520
Speaker 4: like Hailey Robinson says to me, like change doesn't happen overnight,

58
00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:07,320
Speaker 4: but it's been so quick for me to spread my

59
00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:12,240
Speaker 4: story and to bring awareness and to uplift women to

60
00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,960
Speaker 4: always use their voice and never to stay silent, to

61
00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:18,640
Speaker 4: stay silent. So I think I've been actually very you know,

62
00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:22,239
Speaker 4: I've been very grateful, I have to say, so a

63
00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:24,480
Speaker 4: little bit different for me, a little bit different for.

64
00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:27,760
Speaker 3: Me, thank you so much for your vulnerability, because I

65
00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:29,560
Speaker 3: know at the same time it's you know.

66
00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:34,040
Speaker 2: Your experience has a lot of people can't understand it.

67
00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:36,920
Speaker 3: Right, There's only probably a very small group of women

68
00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:41,440
Speaker 3: which are the survivors who've been able to be vulnerable

69
00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:44,440
Speaker 3: and not times you guys have gone through probably so

70
00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:47,080
Speaker 3: much healing behind the scenes that the world doesn't know about.

71
00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:49,560
Speaker 3: Where would you say that you are now do you

72
00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:54,520
Speaker 3: find that this process has been even more healing for you?

73
00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,200
Speaker 4: You know, I think, like what you said, everyone's healing

74
00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:00,720
Speaker 4: process is definitely different, you know. And I think my

75
00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:05,400
Speaker 4: healing process was really focused on my mother. I think

76
00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:10,520
Speaker 4: she really lacked and you know, didn't take responsibility of

77
00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:13,320
Speaker 4: being a mother. And I think that's where it went wrong.

78
00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:16,880
Speaker 4: So I really had to heal and accept that this

79
00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:20,240
Speaker 4: is the mother I have and not only is she

80
00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:22,760
Speaker 4: my mom, but she's also human, right, And that's how

81
00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:25,200
Speaker 4: we have to look at people first, because people are

82
00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:27,640
Speaker 4: always like, well, she's your mom, she has like she

83
00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:30,640
Speaker 4: loves you, she's there for you, and not all moms

84
00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:33,440
Speaker 4: are like that, unfortunately. To say, you know, it's something

85
00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,920
Speaker 4: that I always say. It's like we take everything in life.

86
00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,119
Speaker 4: We have a test. We have a test to pass school,

87
00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:41,040
Speaker 4: we have a test to become doctors, we have a

88
00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,400
Speaker 4: test to drive a car, But there is no test

89
00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:46,440
Speaker 4: out there to be a mother. And it's not to

90
00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:48,200
Speaker 4: say that we need to have a test to be

91
00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:51,560
Speaker 4: a mother. It's more are you capable to be because

92
00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:54,479
Speaker 4: anyone can pop out a baby anytime, right, Like most

93
00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:57,320
Speaker 4: women are fertile, they're able to do that. But are

94
00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:01,280
Speaker 4: you capable to have those mothers duties and to have

95
00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,200
Speaker 4: that responsibility. That's something that we need to start questioning,

96
00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,159
Speaker 4: you know, all women, if they are capable of doing

97
00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,120
Speaker 4: that and if they really want that in life. And

98
00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,400
Speaker 4: I think that my healing process really had to start

99
00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:14,840
Speaker 4: with my mom. I was like trying to heal through

100
00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:18,760
Speaker 4: my stepfather's abuse, at Jeffrey Epstein's abuse and many other

101
00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,560
Speaker 4: men that abused me. But you know, I really realized

102
00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:23,839
Speaker 4: that in the beginning. If my mom had set boundaries

103
00:05:24,279 --> 00:05:27,240
Speaker 4: and limits for me and told me, hey, don't do that,

104
00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:28,960
Speaker 4: I would have never done it. You know.

105
00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:34,040
Speaker 1: So you mentioned the abuse from your stepfather. When did

106
00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:35,960
Speaker 1: he come into the picture? Because I know that you

107
00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:43,320
Speaker 1: were recruited by Epstein when you were just fourteen years old.

108
00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:46,320
Speaker 1: So I want you to if you feel comfortable by

109
00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:49,160
Speaker 1: the way anything I ask, If you're like not happening,

110
00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:50,400
Speaker 1: I'm so not offended.

111
00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:56,040
Speaker 2: I'll move on. But how did that come to be? Where?

112
00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,400
Speaker 2: Where were you? How did you meet.

113
00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:01,440
Speaker 1: Epstein at fourteen? And do you a tribute you know,

114
00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:08,400
Speaker 1: falling into his grips, I guess because of the abuse

115
00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:09,640
Speaker 1: that you experienced.

116
00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:15,120
Speaker 4: Well. I was born in Brazil and my mother first

117
00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:17,200
Speaker 4: came to New York when I was at the age

118
00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:20,039
Speaker 4: of seven. She left me behind for a year in Brazil.

119
00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:22,960
Speaker 4: When she left me that whole year behind, she met

120
00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:25,680
Speaker 4: my stepfather, which was her boyfriend. And when I arrived

121
00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:28,080
Speaker 4: to New York, I did not know she had a boyfriend.

122
00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:32,159
Speaker 4: It was kind of new to me. And within a

123
00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:35,400
Speaker 4: couple months he started to put on porn on the TV.

124
00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:37,719
Speaker 4: My mother would work nights. He had a crazy schedule,

125
00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:39,279
Speaker 4: so he would be in and out because he was

126
00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:42,360
Speaker 4: like a cab driver or a private driver. So he

127
00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:44,360
Speaker 4: would lay me on his lap and he would put

128
00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:46,320
Speaker 4: on porn and he would cover my face with a

129
00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:50,120
Speaker 4: cover and I started to peek under to see, like

130
00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:52,599
Speaker 4: what was happening. Just being eight years old and not

131
00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:56,040
Speaker 4: understanding why my face was being covered while the TV

132
00:06:56,279 --> 00:07:00,160
Speaker 4: was on was really you know, I was wondering why,

133
00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:03,520
Speaker 4: you know, And after a while he just started to

134
00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:07,000
Speaker 4: reenact what was happening to the porn to me, and

135
00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,480
Speaker 4: it went on for such a long time. My mom,

136
00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:13,240
Speaker 4: you know, caught us. You know, he was like moving

137
00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:16,000
Speaker 4: me around or doing something sexual in the bed when

138
00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,120
Speaker 4: I was ten and a half and my mother caught us,

139
00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:21,080
Speaker 4: and I didn't know that it was wrong, and so

140
00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:23,160
Speaker 4: she explained it to me. She got into a fight

141
00:07:23,200 --> 00:07:25,160
Speaker 4: with him, and she basically told me like, hey, that's

142
00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:27,400
Speaker 4: never going to happen again. I'm so sorry that is

143
00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:29,720
Speaker 4: happening to me. And she finally explained to me, like

144
00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:34,239
Speaker 4: what was going on, and I was completely confused because

145
00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:37,000
Speaker 4: I did not know that I was doing anything wrong.

146
00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:41,080
Speaker 4: And moving forward, I thought that it was going to

147
00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:43,120
Speaker 4: be over, but it just became a cycle where my

148
00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:46,520
Speaker 4: stepfather would abuse me again and I would tell her

149
00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:48,480
Speaker 4: and he would continue, and I would tell her and

150
00:07:48,480 --> 00:07:50,360
Speaker 4: he would continue, and then he got to the point

151
00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:52,720
Speaker 4: where he started to physically abuse me because I started

152
00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:55,600
Speaker 4: to tell on her to tell on him, and then

153
00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:57,800
Speaker 4: I just stopped telling her, and then I started to

154
00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:00,760
Speaker 4: argue with her, like why the hell are we still

155
00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:02,920
Speaker 4: in this house And I'm like eleven years old, like

156
00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:04,920
Speaker 4: I should not be talking to my mom like that,

157
00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:07,560
Speaker 4: And my mom would say to me, well, we are immigrants.

158
00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:10,280
Speaker 4: We cannot call the police. We are very scared. I

159
00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:12,360
Speaker 4: don't know if I can take care of you and

160
00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:15,080
Speaker 4: your sister. She ended up having my sister at that

161
00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:20,360
Speaker 4: time with my stepfather, and it just became a complete mess.

162
00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:24,360
Speaker 4: And when I finally went to the police, because we

163
00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:26,200
Speaker 4: had a roommate in that house, we had a four

164
00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,200
Speaker 4: bedroom and we rented out the other two rooms, and

165
00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,440
Speaker 4: I had a roommate and my stepfather not only had

166
00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:35,080
Speaker 4: been sexually abusing my friends that would come over. So

167
00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:37,400
Speaker 4: I lost all my friends. I had no more friends

168
00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:39,079
Speaker 4: because they would run back to their parents and their

169
00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,080
Speaker 4: parents would be like, well, you can no longer go there.

170
00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:43,520
Speaker 4: And sometimes to day I wonder, I'm like, why did

171
00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:46,080
Speaker 4: these parents ever say anything? Like why did my neighbor

172
00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:49,560
Speaker 4: downstairs who knew exactly what was happening. Why didn't my

173
00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:51,120
Speaker 4: best friend that I was around the corner when I

174
00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,920
Speaker 4: used to run to her house her parents knew about it.

175
00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:58,280
Speaker 4: Nobody ever said anything. And till today, I'm just so baffled, because, like,

176
00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:01,400
Speaker 4: if my daughter came home and said anything about any

177
00:09:01,400 --> 00:09:04,280
Speaker 4: of her friends, I would immediately ask questions and I

178
00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,600
Speaker 4: would tell the school. So this girl comes up to me,

179
00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,120
Speaker 4: who's the roommate, says, hey, listen, your stepfather has been,

180
00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:12,360
Speaker 4: you know, also doing the same things that he's doing

181
00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:15,480
Speaker 4: to you, he's doing to me. Let's go to the police.

182
00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:18,640
Speaker 4: I was twelve years old, and I literally did not

183
00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:23,160
Speaker 4: think about anything like immigration, my mom not getting a job.

184
00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:25,040
Speaker 4: I just jumped up and went to the police. And

185
00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:27,000
Speaker 4: when I went to the police, I was questioned so

186
00:09:27,200 --> 00:09:31,760
Speaker 4: hard that it made me. It was so intimidating to

187
00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:34,400
Speaker 4: the point where I had to demon like, you know,

188
00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:37,360
Speaker 4: I had to lie about like what my stepfather did

189
00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:41,320
Speaker 4: to me, because they started to tell me, well, you know,

190
00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:43,600
Speaker 4: your stepfather is going to go away for a long time,

191
00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:46,280
Speaker 4: and we think that you're jealous of your sister being born,

192
00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:50,000
Speaker 4: and this, this, this and that. So I started to minimize

193
00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:54,600
Speaker 4: the abuse. And he only did six months in jail,

194
00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:56,920
Speaker 4: and then he got out, and then when he got out,

195
00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:58,080
Speaker 4: my mother moved him back in.

196
00:09:58,480 --> 00:09:59,360
Speaker 2: Oh my god.

197
00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:03,000
Speaker 4: But before that, you know, the crazy part is when

198
00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:06,240
Speaker 4: we came home after my step father got you know, arrested,

199
00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:10,440
Speaker 4: I felt like, right there and then like my mom

200
00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:15,600
Speaker 4: our relationship right away, it was done. It was done

201
00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,560
Speaker 4: right there and done. She started to blame me. The

202
00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:21,280
Speaker 4: reason why I couldn't do ballet and jazz tap after

203
00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:23,640
Speaker 4: school was because my stepfather went to jail. The reason

204
00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:26,079
Speaker 4: why we couldn't have certain food, or certain clothes or

205
00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:28,240
Speaker 4: certain things was because my stepfather went to jail. She

206
00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,000
Speaker 4: started working in a catering company. I was already working

207
00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:34,040
Speaker 4: at a real estate office after school, and then I

208
00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:36,800
Speaker 4: started to work with her at the catering company as well.

209
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:41,720
Speaker 4: So I was working two jobs. I was going to school,

210
00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:46,600
Speaker 4: and I wasn't living a twelve year old life. And

211
00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:49,800
Speaker 4: then next thing, you know, when I was thirteen and

212
00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:52,920
Speaker 4: a half or fourteen, a friend of mine who I

213
00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:55,720
Speaker 4: knew for a very long time, was like, hey, listen,

214
00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,160
Speaker 4: I know exactly what you're going through, Like it was

215
00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:00,920
Speaker 4: all over a story. Everybody in New York Gastoria knew,

216
00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:05,640
Speaker 4: you know, what was going on. And she was like,

217
00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:08,880
Speaker 4: you know, I have this pretty well connected, rich, powerful

218
00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:12,680
Speaker 4: guy who like really may help you, and you know, listen,

219
00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:16,560
Speaker 4: he loves to get massages by young girls, and I

220
00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:18,280
Speaker 4: know him and I could hook you up with him.

221
00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:20,400
Speaker 4: And I was like, that's kind of weird, because I

222
00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:22,679
Speaker 4: don't know how to do, missa. I don't know how

223
00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:24,440
Speaker 4: to you know, I'm not a massuse and not a

224
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:27,480
Speaker 4: licensed missus. And she was like no, no, no, no, don't worry.

225
00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:30,079
Speaker 4: He really just likes young girls to be around him,

226
00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:32,680
Speaker 4: and he just wants to be massaged by a young girl.

227
00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,080
Speaker 4: The only thing is you have to take off your top.

228
00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:38,520
Speaker 4: It's just like being in a bikini. She's like, you know, Marina,

229
00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:40,959
Speaker 4: you've been through so much worse with your stepfather. This

230
00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:43,959
Speaker 4: is nothing. And in all realities, she was right, this

231
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,720
Speaker 4: was like nothing to me. I've been through much worse

232
00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,600
Speaker 4: with my stepfather. I mean there been times where my

233
00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:52,480
Speaker 4: mom and him fought and she would sleep in the

234
00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:54,079
Speaker 4: living room and I would sleep with her in the

235
00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:57,160
Speaker 4: living room, but he would come in the living room

236
00:11:57,360 --> 00:11:59,880
Speaker 4: in the in the sofa and they would have sex,

237
00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,080
Speaker 4: and I would be on the Yeah, i would be

238
00:12:03,160 --> 00:12:05,800
Speaker 4: on the floor, on the mattress on the floor, and

239
00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:08,679
Speaker 4: I'm like, what the hell is going on here? Like

240
00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:11,480
Speaker 4: you know, I'm like, I'm like ten and a half.

241
00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:14,080
Speaker 4: I went through so many things with my stepfather that

242
00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:18,640
Speaker 4: Jeffrey just seeing and hearing about Jeffrey Epstein didn't seem

243
00:12:18,679 --> 00:12:19,439
Speaker 4: so bad.

244
00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:22,240
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, It's like you it can't get worse, right,

245
00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:25,080
Speaker 3: Like you experienced the worst. Like you think, how much

246
00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:28,800
Speaker 3: more evil can a human being, a man become?

247
00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:32,040
Speaker 4: And you know, I think being fourteenth. I had just

248
00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:36,719
Speaker 4: turned fourteen when I met Jeffrey Epstein. I was so

249
00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:40,040
Speaker 4: vulnerable and I really wanted things to go back to

250
00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:42,440
Speaker 4: the way it was between my mom and I. And

251
00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:46,520
Speaker 4: I thought by being this person who could pay all

252
00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:49,800
Speaker 4: the bills and just be the head of household, things

253
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,600
Speaker 4: would change between my mom and I. I was infatuated

254
00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:54,839
Speaker 4: with my mom like we had We were so close,

255
00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:58,160
Speaker 4: like my real father and I just we never connected.

256
00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:00,280
Speaker 4: I think just because he had four other kids, two

257
00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:03,400
Speaker 4: other wives. I think we just never had that connection.

258
00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:06,560
Speaker 4: He never did anything wrong. I just think he was

259
00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:08,640
Speaker 4: he was twenty five years older than my mom. He

260
00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:12,400
Speaker 4: was just not really he was probably tired. He was like, God,

261
00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:14,680
Speaker 4: you're my fifth kid. I can't do it anymore, you know.

262
00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:19,839
Speaker 4: So I was really vulnerable and I really needed help.

263
00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:24,079
Speaker 4: And when she took me to Jeffrey Epstein's house. I

264
00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:25,640
Speaker 4: don't know, if you guys ever been to a story

265
00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:28,679
Speaker 4: of Queens, New York, It's you know, it's it's an

266
00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,520
Speaker 4: okay place. There's not many man there's no mansions. I

267
00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,520
Speaker 4: don't think in the story of you know, Queens and

268
00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:38,200
Speaker 4: just being a little being a teenager, just thinking what

269
00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:41,120
Speaker 4: a mansion is is completely different than what I walked into,

270
00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:44,120
Speaker 4: Like seeing a Jeffrey Epstein's house, like it looked like

271
00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:47,720
Speaker 4: a place where there were many apartments. Meanwhile, this is

272
00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:51,040
Speaker 4: like a whole mansion in New York City, you know,

273
00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,160
Speaker 4: coming in seeing those big brown doors and just the

274
00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:57,200
Speaker 4: je in the front, and then knowing later on that

275
00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,600
Speaker 4: he had like his front the front of his house,

276
00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:04,160
Speaker 4: he would have something where the snow would melt, you know.

277
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,600
Speaker 4: I was always like so amazed about all the things.

278
00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:09,600
Speaker 4: He had nothing that I knew about, right, And when

279
00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:13,920
Speaker 4: I got there, I was just like wow. When the

280
00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,200
Speaker 4: maid opened up the door, and just knowing that he

281
00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,760
Speaker 4: had a maid, I was like, wow, like he has

282
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:23,320
Speaker 4: a maid, you know, and cut me into it, I was.

283
00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:25,680
Speaker 4: I went into his office which was his like his

284
00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:28,880
Speaker 4: waiting room, and just sitting there and I was talking

285
00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,320
Speaker 4: to her and I kept whispering everything. I didn't know

286
00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:34,440
Speaker 4: how to even act in this person's house, like, you know,

287
00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:36,880
Speaker 4: and she's like, you know, you can talk, like you

288
00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:39,240
Speaker 4: can talk in a normal voice, and I'm like, I

289
00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:42,920
Speaker 4: don't know how to act, and you know, seeing all

290
00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:45,280
Speaker 4: these pictures which at the time I only really knew,

291
00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:50,280
Speaker 4: you know, President Bill Clinton and President Donald Trump, and

292
00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:53,800
Speaker 4: you know, and as time went on, you know, when

293
00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:55,600
Speaker 4: my friends and I went there were like, wow, like

294
00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:57,840
Speaker 4: he knows this, prince, he knows like this, he knows

295
00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:03,480
Speaker 4: like you know, many celebrities that were also on his desk,

296
00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:07,920
Speaker 4: and we were just I was just so amazed. And

297
00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:11,080
Speaker 4: then the maid comes it gets us and brings us

298
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:13,320
Speaker 4: to the elevator which leads to the third floor, which

299
00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,840
Speaker 4: is that's where his massage room is. And when you

300
00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:19,160
Speaker 4: open up the doors, it's a big hallway with all

301
00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:23,040
Speaker 4: these beautiful sketch of these women who are naked. And

302
00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:24,960
Speaker 4: the time I didn't think anything. I was like, this

303
00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:28,280
Speaker 4: must be some rich people stuff, like I don't know anything,

304
00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:32,480
Speaker 4: you know. We walk into his massage room. He has

305
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,320
Speaker 4: a massage table in the middle. He has this huge

306
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:40,440
Speaker 4: bureau with all these lotions with which at the time,

307
00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,800
Speaker 4: I don't know if you remember, Victoria's Secret was very expensive.

308
00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:46,720
Speaker 2: Right I do remember?

309
00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:49,480
Speaker 4: Do you remember like walking into the store and just

310
00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:51,240
Speaker 4: wishing you could buy everything?

311
00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:55,200
Speaker 1: Of course yes, at that page too, the fourteen is

312
00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:57,080
Speaker 1: when I was like all I want is like every

313
00:15:57,120 --> 00:16:01,160
Speaker 1: wonder bray all the lotions. Y.

314
00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:05,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, all the lotions, and like everything smelled good, so

315
00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:08,680
Speaker 4: you know, and there was obviously other very much more

316
00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,440
Speaker 4: expensive lotions that I just did not know that, you know,

317
00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:14,200
Speaker 4: did not know the names of it and the brands,

318
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:17,240
Speaker 4: you know, And I was just like so amazed. And

319
00:16:17,840 --> 00:16:21,680
Speaker 4: on the ceiling he had these like clouds and like

320
00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:23,800
Speaker 4: it was like the sky, and I was like, I

321
00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:25,840
Speaker 4: was like, wow, this is like so cool. What a

322
00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:28,520
Speaker 4: what a what a zen place? You know what.

323
00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:33,160
Speaker 1: I think walking into that at any age would be

324
00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:37,720
Speaker 1: wild and very much intimidating. And I keep going back

325
00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:39,880
Speaker 1: as you're talking to the fact that you were only

326
00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:41,840
Speaker 1: fourteen years old, like a giant.

327
00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:44,560
Speaker 4: I was only fourteen. I have a twelve year old

328
00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,120
Speaker 4: now who's going to be thirteen. And I look at

329
00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:49,880
Speaker 4: her and I'm like, wow, my abuse just finished at

330
00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:52,280
Speaker 4: this age with my stepfather, and I thought I was

331
00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:55,720
Speaker 4: being free, and then my mother and I had like

332
00:16:55,800 --> 00:16:59,320
Speaker 4: this whole like just break up. I felt like we

333
00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:00,720
Speaker 4: broke up, me and my mom.

334
00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:01,080
Speaker 2: You know.

335
00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:05,359
Speaker 4: I think it's one of the worst things any human

336
00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:08,320
Speaker 4: can experience, is knowing that your mom really doesn't have

337
00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:11,800
Speaker 4: that true love for you, you know. So he comes

338
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:14,400
Speaker 4: into the room and he, you know, he puts out

339
00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,560
Speaker 4: his hand and he's like, Hi, my name is Jeffrey,

340
00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:19,000
Speaker 4: and I was like, Hi, my name is Marina. And

341
00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:21,480
Speaker 4: he says, I've heard some really wonderful things about you.

342
00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:23,800
Speaker 4: And I look over to my friend and I'm like

343
00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:26,679
Speaker 4: smiling at her, like yeah, you've already put in the

344
00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:29,840
Speaker 4: good word for me, you know, not thinking anything, just

345
00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:34,040
Speaker 4: so innocent. And he lays down and he starts to

346
00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:35,639
Speaker 4: ask me a whole bunch of things, like where am

347
00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:38,560
Speaker 4: I from, Like what's my life? Like do I go

348
00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:42,439
Speaker 4: to school? How old I am? He's trying to figure

349
00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:44,800
Speaker 4: me out, and I'm like, oh my god, this is

350
00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:47,240
Speaker 4: my moment. This is where I tell him everything I've

351
00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:49,120
Speaker 4: been through. I didn't tell him about my step father,

352
00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:52,280
Speaker 4: but I told him so many things about my family

353
00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:54,280
Speaker 4: and the things that I was doing. And I just

354
00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:57,919
Speaker 4: thought this man might just help me. This might be

355
00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:03,120
Speaker 4: my way out. And when we were giving him a massage,

356
00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:07,200
Speaker 4: he had gotten on the phone, which Jeffrey Epstein after

357
00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:10,520
Speaker 4: a while, because I you know, seeing how he moved,

358
00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:14,000
Speaker 4: he always got on the phone with very very important people,

359
00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:16,000
Speaker 4: and he would put us on the phone with these

360
00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:16,879
Speaker 4: important people.

361
00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:20,720
Speaker 1: You would talk to these people on the phone, Yeah,

362
00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:22,879
Speaker 1: about what what was the point of that.

363
00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:26,160
Speaker 4: He would just be like, you know, I'm over here

364
00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:28,679
Speaker 4: doing you know, I'm getting my massage. He was like,

365
00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:31,400
Speaker 4: I'm doing my ritual, like I'm getting my massage by

366
00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:34,800
Speaker 4: this young, beautiful Brazilian girl. And he would say sometimes,

367
00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,040
Speaker 4: you know, if it was in European wherever she was from,

368
00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:40,359
Speaker 4: and you know, this is my time of the day.

369
00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,320
Speaker 4: And then he would say like say hello girls and

370
00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:45,240
Speaker 4: be like hey, you know, and sometimes it would be

371
00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:47,880
Speaker 4: a celebrity and we'd be like, oh my god, this

372
00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:48,639
Speaker 4: is so cool.

373
00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:52,920
Speaker 3: I think for narcissists, just having my own experience, these

374
00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:59,520
Speaker 3: are just men that have narcissistic egos that they need

375
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,640
Speaker 3: to make them. It's like filling up their narcissistic cup

376
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:05,679
Speaker 3: to be able to show these young women to impress them,

377
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,080
Speaker 3: like hey, let me get Michael Jordan on the phone.

378
00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:09,760
Speaker 3: Let me get so and so on the phone, like hey,

379
00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:12,840
Speaker 3: say hi. It's like, oh my gosh to a fourteen

380
00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:15,040
Speaker 3: year old. I think to most adults, being able to

381
00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,000
Speaker 3: say any celebrity and having that interaction.

382
00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:19,920
Speaker 2: It's part of the grooming process.

383
00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,000
Speaker 4: One hundred percent. I mean listen. I went to the

384
00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:25,760
Speaker 4: State of the Union, and I was like, oh my god,

385
00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:30,040
Speaker 4: I thought it was a shit because, you know, like

386
00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:32,760
Speaker 4: I am, and I'm an adult, you know, and these

387
00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:36,880
Speaker 4: are like some real people, some politicians that are doing

388
00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:39,360
Speaker 4: some real things, you know. And I was like, oh

389
00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:42,040
Speaker 4: my god, I'm so honored to be here as an adult.

390
00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:44,560
Speaker 4: I was already amazed by that. So I can't, like,

391
00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 4: I bring myself to fourteen old me and I I

392
00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:50,040
Speaker 4: think of it now, I'm like, oh my god, how

393
00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:52,680
Speaker 4: stupid was that? But it's not. It's not stupid because

394
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:53,240
Speaker 4: if I tell.

395
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:56,000
Speaker 2: My daughter stupid and you were, you were fourteen years old.

396
00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:59,480
Speaker 1: I look at myself at fourteen years old and what

397
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,639
Speaker 1: I thought I knew and what was cool, And I

398
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,680
Speaker 1: was fortunate enough to have a mother who really kept

399
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:09,639
Speaker 1: me in line and was there for me, Babi me

400
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:11,360
Speaker 1: a father who was incredible.

401
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,119
Speaker 2: You were fourteen, and you had zero guidance.

402
00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:16,919
Speaker 1: The one person who's supposed to protect you and have

403
00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:20,400
Speaker 1: your back and keep you safe fully dropped the ball

404
00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:24,720
Speaker 1: on that. You were floundering. You were in the middle

405
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:27,840
Speaker 1: of the ocean by yourself, trying to figure out how

406
00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:30,879
Speaker 1: to survive. At what point in time. Did you feel

407
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:35,320
Speaker 1: like what you had gone to do with the massages

408
00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,520
Speaker 1: and taking the top off? Was there a turning point

409
00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:39,880
Speaker 1: of this feels yucky, something is not right.

410
00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,440
Speaker 4: Well, you know, when we were in the middle of

411
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,399
Speaker 4: the masage, she turned around and he had a towel on,

412
00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,200
Speaker 4: and then his towel came off, so now he's naked,

413
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,160
Speaker 4: and that caught me off guard. But then I thought

414
00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:54,040
Speaker 4: he was just going to get up and say thank you,

415
00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:57,760
Speaker 4: and then he turns around. He's like, can you take

416
00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:02,040
Speaker 4: your bra off? And I'm like no, because now I'm frozen.

417
00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:05,240
Speaker 4: Now I'm like, oh my god, should I just do

418
00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:07,840
Speaker 4: what he's asking me to do? Because I've been in

419
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,240
Speaker 4: a place with my stepfather where I didn't do where

420
00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,920
Speaker 4: he wanted and then I got kicked and punched. So

421
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,640
Speaker 4: the last thing I wanted was to get physically abused

422
00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 4: in a how in a mansion where I'm in the

423
00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:21,480
Speaker 4: third floor, I don't know where anything is. This is

424
00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 4: my first time there. The only person I truly trust

425
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:28,119
Speaker 4: there is my friend who I know, and I'm like,

426
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:30,760
Speaker 4: I can no longer trust her because she has now

427
00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:32,919
Speaker 4: lied to me and put me in a situation where

428
00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:36,600
Speaker 4: as women it's hard to say no sometimes as adult

429
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:39,240
Speaker 4: because we you know, if some of us are very strong,

430
00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,719
Speaker 4: we can create boundaries and stand that ground and say no.

431
00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:45,119
Speaker 4: But as a child, it's so hard to say no sometimes.

432
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,679
Speaker 4: And I like, when I talk to my daughter, I'm like,

433
00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:49,800
Speaker 4: you have to say no, Like you have to be

434
00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:53,719
Speaker 4: strong enough to say no. She's like, but I'm so embarrassed.

435
00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:56,920
Speaker 4: I'm like, don't be embarrassed. There's nothing to be embarrassed about.

436
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:58,960
Speaker 4: I'm like, if it's if it's hard for you to

437
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:00,960
Speaker 4: say no, there's a reason why it's hard for you

438
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,399
Speaker 4: to say no. And there's a reason why you need

439
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:05,879
Speaker 4: to say no, Like there's a need to say no.

440
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:09,360
Speaker 2: Oh, I got the chills. That's so true. It isn't true.

441
00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:12,159
Speaker 4: There's a reason, there's a reason, there's a reason, and

442
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:14,159
Speaker 4: that's when you really have to say, we have to

443
00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:17,000
Speaker 4: empower our kids. It's not only women. It's not only

444
00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:19,600
Speaker 4: our daughters, our son as well. They men have boundaries

445
00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 4: as well, and women sometimes mistaken those boundaries for you know, well,

446
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:30,040
Speaker 4: he's being he's being you know, aggressive, or or he's

447
00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:31,960
Speaker 4: being you know, he's too jealous.

448
00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:32,280
Speaker 3: No.

449
00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:34,800
Speaker 4: Men sometimes have and it depends what they are, because

450
00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:37,600
Speaker 4: sometimes men are that way. But men have boundaries too.

451
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:40,159
Speaker 4: We just have to know what they really are and

452
00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:43,359
Speaker 4: if they make sense. But when he turned around and

453
00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:45,600
Speaker 4: asked me to take off my bra, I told him no,

454
00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 4: and then he just like leaned up to go grab

455
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:52,200
Speaker 4: my boob, and I was like, it was so instant,

456
00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:54,959
Speaker 4: it was like a slow like no, my hand just

457
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,359
Speaker 4: I was like, I'm not comfortable. And he turned around

458
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:02,280
Speaker 4: and he smiled and he said it's okay. It'll take

459
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:04,359
Speaker 4: some time, but she'll get comfortable with me.

460
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:09,480
Speaker 2: Oh wow, And what I worried? You were? Still? What

461
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:10,360
Speaker 2: age was this?

462
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:14,040
Speaker 4: I was fourteen, fourteen. I just met him. This is

463
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:14,800
Speaker 4: my first time.

464
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 1: So he jumped right into the here's my private parts,

465
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:22,639
Speaker 1: take your bra off mm hmm, and correct me if

466
00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:25,520
Speaker 1: I'm wrong. You got out of this situation when you

467
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 1: turned seventeen.

468
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:28,080
Speaker 4: Yes I did.

469
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:29,200
Speaker 2: I am so.

470
00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:36,639
Speaker 1: Him saying you'll get comfortable because he knew. Of course,

471
00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,040
Speaker 1: he knew. This was not his first rodeo. He was

472
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:45,280
Speaker 1: all about putting celebrities on the phone. He knew exactly

473
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 1: what to do to start that grooming process, and let me.

474
00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:50,960
Speaker 4: Tell you, he did it very well. When we left her.

475
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 4: My girlfriend was very upset with me because I didn't

476
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:57,119
Speaker 4: play along. And even during she was upset, she called

477
00:23:57,119 --> 00:24:01,800
Speaker 4: me a prude. She was like stop. She said it

478
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,000
Speaker 4: to be in Portuguese, you know, she was like, stop

479
00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:07,359
Speaker 4: being a prude. And I was like, I was frozen

480
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:09,600
Speaker 4: at her. I was like I'm not I wanted to

481
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 4: tell her, you know, what I've been through, Like what

482
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:15,840
Speaker 4: the fuck is your problem? And she's she comes to

483
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:18,480
Speaker 4: the other side and her and Jeffrey Epstein start to

484
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 4: aggressively get into this like I don't even know what

485
00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:27,879
Speaker 4: it was. It was just so aggressive, like it was

486
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:29,919
Speaker 4: like she was like pinching his nipples and he was

487
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:32,600
Speaker 4: like touching himself and it was like so and I

488
00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 4: just stood next to her like just frozen, frozen in

489
00:24:37,119 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 4: time and just thinking like, oh my god, please don't

490
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:41,359
Speaker 4: do that to me.

491
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:43,640
Speaker 2: How old was she?

492
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:45,600
Speaker 4: She was a year or two years older than me,

493
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:50,120
Speaker 4: so she was also yeah, sixty, Yeah, she was sixteen seventeen.

494
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,080
Speaker 4: I think I was fourteen. She was sixteen at the time. Yeah.

495
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 3: It's such a shame that, like, you know, it's almost

496
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,560
Speaker 3: like we have to train our bodies not to freeze

497
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 3: because we've been in those situations where even if I'm terrified, right,

498
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 3: I'm so scared because it's dark outside and I'm a

499
00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:07,560
Speaker 3: single mom, and you know, I also have a thirteen

500
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:09,400
Speaker 3: year old and a sixteen year old or twelve year

501
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:14,199
Speaker 3: old and six year old. Your body just freezes and

502
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,480
Speaker 3: you want to like, you want to scream, you want

503
00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:21,439
Speaker 3: to move, but you you're paralyzed. And it's such a

504
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 3: shame that, like I wish, you know, there was an

505
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:27,639
Speaker 3: easier way to even teach our you know, our daughters,

506
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,359
Speaker 3: how to like get out of that, you know, And

507
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:33,520
Speaker 3: it's just by experience in training yourself, you know when

508
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,639
Speaker 3: they say jiu jitsu is a great form of self

509
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:39,680
Speaker 3: defense for these little kids, but you know, you being fourteen,

510
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:42,400
Speaker 3: you're not going to win, you know, in that situation.

511
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 4: No, And it's it's sad, you know that us at

512
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:52,320
Speaker 4: our age, we freeze. I mean, I think my one

513
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:54,800
Speaker 4: of my friends said to me that she went to

514
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:57,720
Speaker 4: a party and one of her girlfriends came up to

515
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:00,399
Speaker 4: her and like danced uff behind her, you know, and

516
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 4: she was like WHOA, Like I've never experienced this, and

517
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 4: she stood there and I was like, why did you freeze?

518
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 4: She's like I don't know. I was like, if that

519
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,200
Speaker 4: was a man, would you have been frozen? She was like, no,

520
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:11,920
Speaker 4: I would have not. I would have stood up to me.

521
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,159
Speaker 4: I said, but she's also disrespecting you. You should have

522
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,159
Speaker 4: not frozen. And she was like I did freeze. I

523
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 4: was like, yeah, because we all do that sometimes because

524
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 4: we just were not expecting it, and we're like, how

525
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:26,080
Speaker 4: do we respond to this? Like what message are we

526
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,119
Speaker 4: getting here? You know? I think it really it fucks

527
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,880
Speaker 4: with our brain, you know, and it's hard for us

528
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:35,920
Speaker 4: at this age. I can't imagine a twelve thirteen, fourteen,

529
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:39,120
Speaker 4: fifteen sixteen. It's like when Megan Kelly was like, well

530
00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 4: you know they were like fourteen sixteen and they looked older.

531
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:43,680
Speaker 4: Doesn't work like that.

532
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 3: No, I mean anything, I want to go back between

533
00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 3: in those those three years, three or four years that

534
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:03,120
Speaker 3: you were with and you were having these experiences, did

535
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,000
Speaker 3: it get any worse than just having to massage him?

536
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 3: Or was that pretty much like he had each girl

537
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 3: doing very specific tasks for him.

538
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 4: Well, it did get worse, right, I told her I

539
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 4: wasn't going to go back. She tried to. She really

540
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:19,800
Speaker 4: did convince me. She was like, listen, like You're not

541
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 4: going to meet anybody like this person is well connected,

542
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 4: he knows everybody, like he has money. You're not going

543
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 4: to meet anybody. You're from Brazil, you live in Astoria.

544
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,640
Speaker 4: She's like, you know, I live right next to Astoria.

545
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:34,160
Speaker 4: I know there's like nothing going on for you there.

546
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 4: So I'm just telling you he is going to call

547
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,160
Speaker 4: and ask for you again, and most likely you will

548
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 4: go back. And I was like, no, I won't. But

549
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,680
Speaker 4: you know, going back home and having that week where

550
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 4: my mom is telling me I'm not going to be nothing,

551
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:50,400
Speaker 4: and you know that I needed to get up from

552
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,639
Speaker 4: school because I was like barely making to get up

553
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 4: from school because I was so tired from working and

554
00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:01,159
Speaker 4: just having her you know, just you know, bad really

555
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,719
Speaker 4: hard on everything that I didn't. You know, I remember

556
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:05,960
Speaker 4: something she always told me. She was like, you'll never

557
00:28:06,040 --> 00:28:08,480
Speaker 4: be anything in America. You'll just be a better version

558
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:12,159
Speaker 4: of me. And that always that always stuck to me,

559
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:15,639
Speaker 4: Like I was like, oh my god, like and this

560
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 4: is the thing, like it made me want to do

561
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 4: so much more, but it wasn't the right things. Like

562
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,719
Speaker 4: it just made me want to win, win, win, and

563
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,560
Speaker 4: get you know, get a house and have her live

564
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 4: in a house. You know. I feel like any any

565
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:32,000
Speaker 4: person that is struggling and see their parents and love

566
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 4: their parents, they like first think about their parents. They're like,

567
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 4: I want to do something for them, because you know,

568
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 4: I always felt like, Wow, my mom, you know, brought

569
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 4: me to this country. I have to make it, you know,

570
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 4: And that that's what really brought me back to Jeffrey

571
00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 4: was eating those you know, we got to the point

572
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,600
Speaker 4: where we were eating the what is it called the

573
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,760
Speaker 4: cup noodles, the noodles cup? Is it the chicken?

574
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 3: Oh?

575
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 2: Cup of noodles?

576
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,040
Speaker 4: Cup of noodles. They were like, I think we're fifty

577
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,080
Speaker 4: cents at the time, me and my sister and my mom.

578
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 4: My sister was already eating at the time, and that's

579
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 4: what we would have for dinner, like and maybe we

580
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 4: would have ham and cheese at the house and other

581
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:13,800
Speaker 4: than that, like we were really following apart. We had

582
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 4: rented out all the rooms. We were living in one room,

583
00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:20,120
Speaker 4: and it was just we were barely making my mom

584
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 4: was barely making the rent, and I really wanted things

585
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:25,120
Speaker 4: to just go back to normal.

586
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 3: Was your stepfather gone at this point?

587
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 4: Yep? He was gone. Okay, he was very much gone

588
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:37,360
Speaker 4: and then he well, so then you know, Jeffrey did

589
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:39,479
Speaker 4: call my friend for me to go back, and I

590
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 4: was like, I'll go back. I'm gonna go back, And

591
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 4: in my head, I'm like, I'm gonna make this guy

592
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 4: really understand what I'm going through. I'm gonna explain more

593
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,280
Speaker 4: to him that I already did that there's more than

594
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,560
Speaker 4: just like what he wants, and you know, like he

595
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 4: can help me, like maybe he'll feel bad for me.

596
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,840
Speaker 4: And you know, when I went back, he was really nice.

597
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:07,040
Speaker 4: And this is what I tell everybody, like groomors are

598
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 4: not going to be mean to you, like unless you're

599
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 4: kidnapped in a room and he can fully abuse you

600
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 4: and have full control. Right now, he's trying to gain control,

601
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 4: and by gaining control, he's seeing that it didn't work

602
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 4: when he asked me to take off my bra, so

603
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 4: now he's like so nice to me. He didn't ask

604
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 4: me to do anything. It was just a massage, and

605
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 4: every time I went back it was like something new.

606
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,360
Speaker 4: It was like take off your bra, take off your pants,

607
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 4: take off your underwear. And it got to the point

608
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:36,880
Speaker 4: where you know, I have to say this. I went

609
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 4: to Virginia Guffrey's memorial here in West Palm Right, and

610
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 4: I'm meeting all these survivors. Some of these survivors I

611
00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 4: knew didn't bring them to Jeffrey, because that was another

612
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,440
Speaker 4: thing about Jeffrey, which I'll get back.

613
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 2: To a lot.

614
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:53,160
Speaker 4: Some of the Brazilian girls were there, and I was like,

615
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:55,160
Speaker 4: Oh my god, like I can't believe, Like I can't

616
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 4: believe we're connected, and like you were right next to

617
00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,080
Speaker 4: me and I didn't know about you, and I didn't

618
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 4: know you were going to Jeffres Right. And these are

619
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 4: people that I used to talk to all the time, right,

620
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:08,160
Speaker 4: And I'm listening to some of their stories, and some

621
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,880
Speaker 4: of these girls are telling me they're getting raped, and

622
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 4: I'm like, holy shit, like they've been through hell and back.

623
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 4: Just in my head, I'm like, you know, everything is

624
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,480
Speaker 4: all this information is coming into me. I'm listening to

625
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 4: Amanda and Sky talk about Virginia and I'm bawling, like

626
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 4: I did not even meet Virginia. Just her strength and

627
00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 4: her power is so resilient. And I had no idea.

628
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 4: After twenty nineteen, after two thousand and eight, two times

629
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:38,239
Speaker 4: FBI came looking for me, I did not google or

630
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 4: went on the Internet because there was no Google. I

631
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:42,560
Speaker 4: think in two thousand and eight, I did not look

632
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 4: for Jeffrey Epstein. I did not know about the West

633
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,240
Speaker 4: Palm Beach. I did not know anything. I did not

634
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 4: know about the I didn't know anything. I never looked

635
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:52,680
Speaker 4: into it. After two thousand and eight, I got really

636
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,280
Speaker 4: scared and I wanted nothing to do with Jeffrey Epstein.

637
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 4: I'm listening to all this and I'm just heartbroken. I'm like,

638
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 4: I can't fucking believe he did this, right. So I

639
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,480
Speaker 4: come back home and I call one of the survivors

640
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 4: who I'm very close with, and I'm like, girl, you're

641
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 4: not gonna believe it, like Jeffrey Epstein raped these women.

642
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,000
Speaker 4: So she's like so quiet on the phone, and I'm

643
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 4: telling her about the memorial and I'm like, I'm just

644
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 4: in shock, like he did this. And she's like, marine,

645
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 4: are you okay? Are you like or is someone around you?

646
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 4: Because I think she thought somebody was around me that

647
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 4: I was like not wanting to be honest about what

648
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,720
Speaker 4: Jeffrey Epstein did, and I was like, yeah, I'm okay.

649
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 4: I'm like no, I'm home alone, and she's like, you

650
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:42,240
Speaker 4: don't remember nothing. I said, I do remember. She was like,

651
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 4: you don't remember that. Jeffrey Epstein used to put us

652
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 4: in the room, three or four of us, and he

653
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 4: used to PLoP you on top of him and rape

654
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 4: you in front of us and tell us like, this

655
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 4: is how you're supposed to be doing things to make

656
00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 4: me happy. This is what a good girl does. She's like,

657
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 4: we used to be like three or four of us

658
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 4: in the room watching you. And I'm like what. She's

659
00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 4: like yeah, She's like, oh my god. She's like, you

660
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 4: don't remember this. I just every time I say this,

661
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 4: I get chills because I think trauma just completely blocked

662
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:15,880
Speaker 4: that out of my head.

663
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:19,880
Speaker 1: Of course, you it's survival. The brain is such an

664
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 1: insane thing. What it the length it will go to.

665
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 1: It knows that you are in survival mode. It will

666
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: disassociate you from an experience like that just so you

667
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,720
Speaker 1: can go on with your life the best that you can.

668
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 2: It's it's wild, insane how it works.

669
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:40,080
Speaker 4: It's so true. People ask me like, why did you

670
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:42,000
Speaker 4: keep going back. I'm like, I just wanted to survive.

671
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 4: I just wanted to take care of my mom. My

672
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:48,440
Speaker 4: stepfather eventually moved back home. My mom put him back there.

673
00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:51,240
Speaker 4: I had to move out with a boyfriend who started

674
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 4: to who had a great family. He did not need

675
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:55,680
Speaker 4: to move out. He started to sell drugs so he

676
00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 4: can so he can pay for the bills. I'm going

677
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 4: to Jeffrey Epstein's house. He does not know that I'm

678
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 4: working at night at that point, and we're just in

679
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 4: survival mode. You know this, this boyfriend of mine, who was,

680
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:09,040
Speaker 4: you know, seventeen at the time. I must have been

681
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:11,400
Speaker 4: fifteen when I moved out. He did not need to

682
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 4: move out, and he did not definitely did not need

683
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 4: to sell drugs, and you know, unfortunately he got deported,

684
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 4: but it was the best way for him because he's

685
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:20,839
Speaker 4: a very successful person today and married. But you know,

686
00:34:21,040 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 4: I just look at it, and people when they ask me,

687
00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 4: I'm like, have you ever been in survival mode? You

688
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 4: will do anything to survive? Like me as a mom,

689
00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:32,960
Speaker 4: if God forbid, anything happens and I don't have money

690
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:36,120
Speaker 4: to support my daughter, I will go above and beyond

691
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 4: for anything that my daughter needs. I will never put

692
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 4: her in charge of, you know, the bills or the

693
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:46,799
Speaker 4: I would never even tell her. I would just be like,

694
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,360
Speaker 4: don't worry about it be a kid, go be happy

695
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 4: and go to school and do your cheer because that's

696
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:55,640
Speaker 4: what she loves. Because I guess that's like the popular

697
00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:56,160
Speaker 4: thing now.

698
00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:58,600
Speaker 2: Oh the kids love cheer right now.

699
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 4: I mean, it's gonna make us broke, I think at

700
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:01,399
Speaker 4: this point.

701
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,040
Speaker 3: But Marina, I have to say something though. You guys

702
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:06,719
Speaker 3: kept you guys keep using the word survival. But let's

703
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:11,800
Speaker 3: not forget because it's really important that the listeners it's brainwashed.

704
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:15,799
Speaker 3: You were brainwashed first, and then now you're just surviving,

705
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 3: so you're not even operating in a conscious state. You're

706
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:24,200
Speaker 3: unconscious moving forward in a way of life that feels

707
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 3: like survival. This is just my opinion, but I really

708
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 3: I don't want you to like just use that word

709
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 3: survival because to me, it feels so much deeper than

710
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:32,120
Speaker 3: just that.

711
00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:35,000
Speaker 4: I think you're definitely right, and I don't think we

712
00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 4: looked at that when we are. It's something that Hayley

713
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 4: Robinson said, and she said in one of the press conferences,

714
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,839
Speaker 4: she said, we're traumatized. We are not stupid, you know,

715
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 4: and we've been traumatized, We've been through all that, and

716
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:54,000
Speaker 4: we've been brainwashed. Because at that point Jeffrey Epstein was

717
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 4: putting all of us against one another to compete on

718
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,440
Speaker 4: who would bring him the most girls, who would be

719
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:05,279
Speaker 4: the best, and who would be a good girl for

720
00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 4: him and would listen to him, because he was all

721
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:11,319
Speaker 4: about controlling things, and when he needn't have control, he

722
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 4: did not like it.

723
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:14,799
Speaker 3: I'll tell you how much did you meet Maxwell at

724
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:17,319
Speaker 3: that point? Along those three years, I.

725
00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:20,799
Speaker 4: Did meet Maxwell, And it was very weird how I

726
00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:24,319
Speaker 4: met Maxwell because I was with a Jane Doe who

727
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:28,440
Speaker 4: Jeffrey Epstein was absolutely in love. But this girl was

728
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 4: also in survival mode. Brazilian immigrant, didn't have her parents

729
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:37,279
Speaker 4: sending all the money back to Brazil, her parents not

730
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:40,240
Speaker 4: asking where she's getting this money. She's eighteen at the time,

731
00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:45,000
Speaker 4: doing her modeling gig, working also side with me at

732
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:47,960
Speaker 4: this Greek place that we worked at nighttime. We were

733
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 4: selling flowers, and Jeffrey Epstein met her and he fell

734
00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 4: in love with her, but she would not want to

735
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,719
Speaker 4: go there by herself, so she would I would go

736
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:58,440
Speaker 4: with her, and he would get upset because he didn't

737
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 4: want me there. So he allowed me to hang out

738
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 4: in the house and wander around and she would be

739
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 4: in the room. But one day, he asked for me

740
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:08,400
Speaker 4: to stay in the room, which was weird because he

741
00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:10,160
Speaker 4: never asked me to stay in the room while she

742
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:12,719
Speaker 4: was there. And when he asked me to stay in

743
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:14,439
Speaker 4: the room, he was like, I want to go into

744
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 4: my bedroom, which he didn't do it either with myself

745
00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:21,239
Speaker 4: or any of my friends. And we went into the

746
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:25,360
Speaker 4: bedroom and he had these white sheets, and I remember

747
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 4: laying in the bed and going like, Wow, this is

748
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 4: a real comfortable bed. And look at the things that

749
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 4: are going through my head, you know, because you know, again,

750
00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,120
Speaker 4: I'm living by myself at this point. Now I don't

751
00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:38,680
Speaker 4: have the best bed, and I don't have the best apartment.

752
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:41,040
Speaker 4: And I just want to remind people, you know, I'm

753
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:44,920
Speaker 4: fifteen and a half and I have my own apartment

754
00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:47,720
Speaker 4: with my name on it. I still have the least today.

755
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,400
Speaker 4: Literally like that apartment, I would turn on the water

756
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:51,800
Speaker 4: and I would get shocked.

757
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:55,759
Speaker 2: Oh my god, it was so bad.

758
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,000
Speaker 4: It was like we had rats everywhere. I was like,

759
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:01,760
Speaker 4: oh my god. But you know, again, I'm in survival mode.

760
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 4: I was. It just this is what you go through,

761
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:08,319
Speaker 4: you know, And I just think that we don't we don't.

762
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:10,360
Speaker 4: I don't think about these things that I was getting

763
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:12,560
Speaker 4: shocked with the water. I could have possibly died. Every

764
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 4: time I would turn it out.

765
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 2: It was like, it's just like your dorm. Yeah, that

766
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:19,359
Speaker 2: was your dorm, right, it was.

767
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,200
Speaker 4: So I bring this girl and he's like, let's go

768
00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 4: into the bedroom, and you know, there's these white sheets,

769
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:27,279
Speaker 4: and that's all I could really remember. It was like

770
00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:30,799
Speaker 4: being in this bed with these white sheets, like this

771
00:38:31,600 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 4: cotton feeling. And he said it was me and this

772
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:38,279
Speaker 4: Jane Doe and him, and he says, I have a

773
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:40,840
Speaker 4: friend that's going to be joining us, and she walks

774
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:44,719
Speaker 4: in and he never introduced us to her. Now, I

775
00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,680
Speaker 4: have seen pictures of Gilay with him and his house

776
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:49,759
Speaker 4: and me and my friends, and he always had a

777
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:51,799
Speaker 4: picture with a little girl, like an eight nine year

778
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 4: old girl. And we always used to say, Jeffrey definitely

779
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 4: has a family and is lying to us, But like,

780
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:00,880
Speaker 4: how is he so open about letting us come in

781
00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 4: here when he has a whole family. So one day

782
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:05,000
Speaker 4: we asked him, We're like, do you have a wife

783
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:07,840
Speaker 4: and a kid? He's like, absolutely not, and we're like

784
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,680
Speaker 4: thank god, because if you didn't, that'd be a problem.

785
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,239
Speaker 4: But he never said he had a wife. And a kid.

786
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 4: And we're just like, that's so weird because like we

787
00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,120
Speaker 4: just figured he would have a wife and a kid.

788
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:19,799
Speaker 4: I don't know why. I guess as kids, you just

789
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 4: always I guess you jumped to that conclusion. So Glaine

790
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 4: walks in. At the time, I didn't know who she was.

791
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 4: Now they both raped both they both raped me and

792
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,839
Speaker 4: this girl, right, But I always want to come to her.

793
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 4: This girl is so traumatized by this. She has never

794
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:44,239
Speaker 4: spoken about it. She has never come after any little gay.

795
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:46,280
Speaker 4: She has done absolutely nothing.

796
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:51,560
Speaker 2: So even now to this day, she remains quiet.

797
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,320
Speaker 4: She remains very silent. And her reason why is because

798
00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 4: she's scared that her husband will leave her. And I said,

799
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 4: and I tell her all the time, I'm like why,

800
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:06,160
Speaker 4: why do you feel like that? But she also has

801
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 4: her son has an autoimmune disease and he's not going

802
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 4: to live a very long time. So I kind of understand.

803
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:16,400
Speaker 4: She's like, I have to be there for my kids,

804
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:19,000
Speaker 4: like my family are like everything to me, and this

805
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:22,359
Speaker 4: is what's important to me. And I'm like I get it,

806
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,440
Speaker 4: like I respect it, but I always want to talk

807
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 4: to her, like, hey, I want details of like what

808
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:30,239
Speaker 4: happened that day to us in that bedroom. But she

809
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:34,120
Speaker 4: doesn't even like to hear the word Jeffrey. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

810
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 4: And I only realized it was Glaine in two thousand

811
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 4: and like twenty or twenty one because I saw her,

812
00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 4: you know, in the news and all that, and I'm like,

813
00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:47,839
Speaker 4: oh my god, I'm like, that's the woman that Jeffrey

814
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:50,680
Speaker 4: brought into the room. And you know, because he never

815
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 4: introduced her as like this is my friend Gallaine, like

816
00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:55,080
Speaker 4: this is you know, he just she just came into

817
00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:55,480
Speaker 4: the room.

818
00:40:57,480 --> 00:40:59,399
Speaker 3: I want to fast forward a little bit and talk

819
00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:05,160
Speaker 3: about what's happening now. I've fortunately, and unfortunately can't help myself,

820
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 3: but I have read a lot of the stuff that's

821
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:10,240
Speaker 3: going on on the DJ website, and I've read some

822
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 3: pretty horrific thing that has really shaken me to my core.

823
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 3: And you know, I've called all on said like this

824
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:22,000
Speaker 3: is the most insane things. Have you had an opportunity

825
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 3: to read some of the other the three million, I mean.

826
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 4: Not the whole three million, but I you know, being

827
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:35,440
Speaker 4: in the political side now, which we wanted to be bipartisan,

828
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:37,839
Speaker 4: we kind of have to keep up with all this

829
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:42,480
Speaker 4: all these news, including Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton's deposition

830
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:45,320
Speaker 4: that took me about I only got to Bill Clinton,

831
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:46,880
Speaker 4: which I only got to two and a half hours.

832
00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:48,399
Speaker 4: But I have to get on it because these are

833
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:50,439
Speaker 4: things that we do talk about. So yes, I am

834
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:52,880
Speaker 4: very familiar with the three million files, but not the

835
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:55,480
Speaker 4: whole three million files. And whoever'sday they've been through three

836
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:56,880
Speaker 4: million files is lying.

837
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 1: There was a part of the files where they talked

838
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 1: about a calendar girl party and there are names listed

839
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:17,240
Speaker 1: of who was there for you and what you experienced.

840
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:22,200
Speaker 1: Do you think that every person that attended any party

841
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:26,359
Speaker 1: or gathering of Jeffrey Epstein knew good and goddamn well

842
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:29,399
Speaker 1: who that man was and what he was capable of one.

843
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:32,839
Speaker 4: Hundred percent got one hundred percent. I mean, we don't

844
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 4: have to be it's you know, like Jeffrey Epstein's we

845
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:37,879
Speaker 4: don't have to be a brain surgeon because he told

846
00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:40,719
Speaker 4: us that we don't have two guys. This is not

847
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:44,080
Speaker 4: science rocket like. We have to understand there are six

848
00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:46,799
Speaker 4: pages of allegations and we have to go back to

849
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 4: Maria Farmer in nineteen ninety six. Her allegations at the

850
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:56,320
Speaker 4: time were just allegations what now are very much proven

851
00:42:56,400 --> 00:42:59,120
Speaker 4: to be true. And it has taken us two decades

852
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,480
Speaker 4: to understand this and realize that it's not a hoax.

853
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,760
Speaker 3: I have not read them, which I would like to amber.

854
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:12,120
Speaker 1: You said the one that you read the measuring and

855
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 1: the list of names on the side, and you asked

856
00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:16,960
Speaker 1: me about this person, do you still talk to them?

857
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:18,839
Speaker 1: And I read it and I said, well I did

858
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 1: until now.

859
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:21,640
Speaker 2: You know what's so crazy you guys?

860
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,920
Speaker 3: And now I remember this is a perfect example of

861
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,719
Speaker 3: everything that I read. It was so disturbing that I

862
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:32,000
Speaker 3: actually my brain just forgot blocked it. I am so disgusted.

863
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:33,759
Speaker 4: What are we doing about it?

864
00:43:33,960 --> 00:43:36,319
Speaker 2: What are we doing about anything about it? And that's

865
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:37,040
Speaker 2: the sick part.

866
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:41,440
Speaker 1: We are watching the news and who is it? Prince

867
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 1: Andrew arrested on like his fifty something birthday at five

868
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 1: in the fucking morning. Meanwhile, the one of the biggest

869
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:54,439
Speaker 1: pieces of shit is running the free world and we're

870
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:58,880
Speaker 1: not doing a damn thing. We have been hearing about

871
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:03,319
Speaker 1: these files for years on end. We have women who

872
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 1: have band together to finally share their story.

873
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:11,719
Speaker 4: We have everybody doing everything around the world. We have

874
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:15,960
Speaker 4: Norway taken down Prime Minister, we have Norway taking down

875
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 4: asking Princess I was just there, Princess Meta why she

876
00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:24,840
Speaker 4: was in contact with Epstein. We have monarchies being takeover

877
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:28,799
Speaker 4: taken down, and we Americans are who is the United

878
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:31,600
Speaker 4: States of America who believes in justice and the land

879
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 4: of free We are doing absolutely nothing.

880
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:41,400
Speaker 1: It makes me so terrified to rate kids in this country.

881
00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 4: I just said it. I was like, oh my god,

882
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:46,120
Speaker 4: I just said it in Laura coachs. I was like,

883
00:44:46,160 --> 00:44:48,360
Speaker 4: the question is do we even want to be here anymore?

884
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:50,839
Speaker 4: This was the place where everybody wanted to be and

885
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:53,040
Speaker 4: now it's coming down to I go to Europe and

886
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:55,160
Speaker 4: I'm like, oh my god, I'm like, this is where

887
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:57,800
Speaker 4: we need to be. They have the best healthcare system,

888
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 4: They have real food. We don't even have real food

889
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:04,280
Speaker 4: here anymore. We don't like, whether we want to believe

890
00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:07,560
Speaker 4: it or not, cheesus, fake meet us, fake. Everything is

891
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:09,840
Speaker 4: fake here, and if you're buying the real stuff, we

892
00:45:09,920 --> 00:45:12,160
Speaker 4: don't even know if we're buying real groceries anymore.

893
00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 1: Well, because we're being lied to about everything. There's not

894
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 1: one there's not one thing that people are being honest about.

895
00:45:19,080 --> 00:45:21,000
Speaker 2: And what makes me the most sick.

896
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:25,759
Speaker 1: Is that it has been years on end of the

897
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:29,960
Speaker 1: rich and powerful trying to desensitize us to be okay

898
00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:32,680
Speaker 1: with this shit, and now here we are and no

899
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 1: one's okay with it, but nothing's being done, so we're

900
00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:37,560
Speaker 1: being forced to be okay with it.

901
00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:39,320
Speaker 2: Everyone is afraid.

902
00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 3: That's why, because of the powers that be, the fact

903
00:45:43,120 --> 00:45:45,840
Speaker 3: that we were able to cover up all these names,

904
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:48,279
Speaker 3: and by the way, the list of names that are

905
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:49,800
Speaker 3: still redacted.

906
00:45:49,680 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 1: It is utter insanity. I am of the mindset and

907
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 1: I wholeheartedly believe in this, and I'm not just saying

908
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 1: this to make anyone feel better. A day will come,

909
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:03,640
Speaker 1: and I know that it's so hard to think that

910
00:46:03,719 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 1: way because you were directly involved, Marina, and you have

911
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:13,200
Speaker 1: direct trauma. I know in my heart that what's done

912
00:46:13,239 --> 00:46:16,520
Speaker 1: in the dark will always come to the light, and

913
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:21,440
Speaker 1: these people are going to have the hardest and longest

914
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 1: fall from grace and it's going to be fucking beautiful

915
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:25,440
Speaker 1: when it happens.

916
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:27,879
Speaker 4: I most certainly agree with you.

917
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 1: I'm just in awe of all of you, Marina, and

918
00:46:32,880 --> 00:46:36,400
Speaker 1: I am so grateful that you came on this podcast.

919
00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:40,240
Speaker 1: The fact that you can like make jokes and laugh

920
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:42,480
Speaker 1: talk about your sweet daughter.

921
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:46,000
Speaker 2: I'm just please never shut the fuck up.

922
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:50,320
Speaker 4: I won't shut the fuck up. You know. The reason

923
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:52,880
Speaker 4: why I speak is obviously I want to bring awareness,

924
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 4: but I also want to explain to people that, like

925
00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:59,600
Speaker 4: I don't live my life every day thinking about what

926
00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 4: happens to me in the past, there is a healing

927
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:06,120
Speaker 4: process women and men that have been abused. I always

928
00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:08,880
Speaker 4: want to give them this side of me because sometimes

929
00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:11,200
Speaker 4: when I do different platforms, I did one yesterday and

930
00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:13,879
Speaker 4: we were taking pictures and it was like me being sad.

931
00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:16,000
Speaker 4: I'm like, but this is not who I am. This

932
00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 4: is who I was. Who I am today is a

933
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:22,279
Speaker 4: woman that wants to represent other women and men who

934
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 4: have been abused and say, listen, we're not going to

935
00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:27,440
Speaker 4: live in the past. We have a life to live.

936
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:31,560
Speaker 4: We will be living this life like it's the last

937
00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:34,120
Speaker 4: life out because I do believe like there is recarnation.

938
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:36,360
Speaker 4: I believe there like you said it earlier, like you know,

939
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:38,839
Speaker 4: this is it right here, and we have to live

940
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 4: it every day. It's like it's last, and we have

941
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:42,440
Speaker 4: to live this life like it's last. We can't just

942
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:44,560
Speaker 4: be like, well I have another life come, it's recarnation.

943
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:46,840
Speaker 4: It doesn't work like that. We have to live it,

944
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 4: and we have to enjoy these even sweet and bitter moments,

945
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:53,480
Speaker 4: because it is part of what shapes us in life

946
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 4: later on. I always think of it. When I was

947
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:58,800
Speaker 4: going through all these things, I was like, why God,

948
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 4: Why me? Why me? Why me? And I always tell

949
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:03,759
Speaker 4: people if you are going through and abuse, you are

950
00:48:03,840 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 4: going through something you know in your life. I think

951
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,279
Speaker 4: the best thing to do, because obviously I'm not a

952
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:12,080
Speaker 4: therapist and I don't have all the right answers, just

953
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,280
Speaker 4: know that God does give you what you can handle.

954
00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:17,719
Speaker 4: He won't give it to you if you can, and

955
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:20,120
Speaker 4: it will be a light at the end of the tunnel.

956
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,600
Speaker 4: I don't know when it is for that person, but

957
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:24,400
Speaker 4: there was a light at the end of the tunnel

958
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:27,480
Speaker 4: for me, and I have to say it was the

959
00:48:27,520 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 4: best thing ever. It made me a strong person. It

960
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:33,480
Speaker 4: made me have confidence, It made me believe that I

961
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,359
Speaker 4: do have self worth. It made me understand that it

962
00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:39,800
Speaker 4: doesn't fucking matter what people think. That's why I spoke.

963
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:42,000
Speaker 4: It took me so long to speak, and when I

964
00:48:42,040 --> 00:48:44,640
Speaker 4: did speak, everyone was like, everyone's going to say this.

965
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:47,040
Speaker 4: Everyone's gonna say you're whore. Everyone's gonna say I'm like,

966
00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:50,160
Speaker 4: I don't give a shit. I'm tired of living how

967
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:52,600
Speaker 4: other people want me to live. I'm done with that,

968
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:56,040
Speaker 4: and nobody should do that. Everyone needs to follow their heart.

969
00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 4: And I have come to a conclusion where I don't

970
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:01,239
Speaker 4: care about what people think about me. I am here

971
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:06,000
Speaker 4: to empower every person, man, woman, a boy, a girl.

972
00:49:06,360 --> 00:49:08,800
Speaker 4: It doesn't matter what you are. Speak about your abuse,

973
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:11,880
Speaker 4: because it's not only for you, but this perpetrator, this

974
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:14,759
Speaker 4: person who's abusing you will continue to abuse, so you

975
00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:17,800
Speaker 4: do need to speak about it. So I always always

976
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:22,359
Speaker 4: encourage girls, boys, men, women. Doesn't matter how old you are,

977
00:49:22,440 --> 00:49:25,560
Speaker 4: it is your story is just as important as the

978
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 4: survivors of Jeffrey Epstein.

979
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:31,160
Speaker 1: What a grateful way to end this. You are an

980
00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 1: incredible woman. I'm so grateful you came on an Unlikely Affair.

981
00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:38,640
Speaker 4: Thank you, Thank you always real lazy.

982
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:41,720
Speaker 2: You all get the justice that you deserve.

983
00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:43,160
Speaker 4: We will continue to fight.

984
00:49:43,280 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 2: That's going to happen, Yes, it will. Best day you guys.

985
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:50,640
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to another episode of an Unlikely Affair.

986
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:51,800
Speaker 1: We're going to catch you next week.

987
00:49:52,120 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 3: Bye,