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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's Carrie Champion, the host of Naked Sports.

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Speaker 1: I appreciate you listening and for this episode in particular,

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Speaker 1: I just wanted to let you all know that Ashlyn

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Speaker 1: Harris has shared a very personal, loving, and brave story

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Speaker 1: with us today. For some of you, the topic matter

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Speaker 1: may make you a little uncomfortable, but telling her truth

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Speaker 1: I believe can serve as a bridge to help others

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Speaker 1: really understand that they are not alone and whatever struggle

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Speaker 1: that they're dealing with in life. I am so grateful

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Speaker 1: that this brave woman decided to share her story with me.

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Speaker 1: We appreciate you for listening. Enjoy this edition of Naked Sports.

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Speaker 2: My name is Ashlyn Harris. I am a retired professional

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Speaker 2: soccer player. I'm a two time World Cup champion, and

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Speaker 2: I am now a creative consultant and producer when it

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Speaker 2: comes to film and sports, agency, sports firms, all the things.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Naked Sports, the podcast where we live at

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Speaker 1: the intersection of sports, politics, and culture. Our purpose reveal

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Speaker 1: the common threads that bind them all.

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Speaker 3: So what's happening in women's basketball right now is what

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Speaker 3: we've been trying to.

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Speaker 2: Get to for almost thirty years.

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Speaker 1: From the stadiums where athletes to break barriers and set records.

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Speaker 1: Kaitlin Quark broke the all time single game assists record.

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Speaker 2: This is crazy for rookies to be doing.

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Speaker 3: To the polls where history is written, and now we

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Speaker 3: have Kamala Harrison. It feels more like women are sort

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Speaker 3: of taken what they've always deserved, as opposed to waiting

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Speaker 3: on somebody to give them what they deserve.

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Speaker 1: Our discussions will uncover the vital connections between these realms

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Speaker 1: and the community we create. In each episode, we'll sit

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Speaker 1: down with athletes, political analysts, and culture critics because the

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Speaker 1: core of it all, how we see one issue shines

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Speaker 1: a light on all others. Welcome to Naked Sports. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host, Carrie Champion, so I already know you can

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Speaker 1: feel the vibes. I'm a huge fan of Ashlyn Harris.

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Speaker 1: I was a fan of her playing style on the field.

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Speaker 1: I'm a fan of her style when she's off the field.

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Speaker 1: I think she's beautiful and kind while also being careful

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Speaker 1: and guarded if need be. But I was sold when

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Speaker 1: I knew she was a sensitive soul that will be

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Speaker 1: that ass if need be. I totally get her. I

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Speaker 1: know that you have talked very honestly about what that

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Speaker 1: transition would be like once you got done playing professional soccer.

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Speaker 1: But I think you're landing pretty softly. How do you

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Speaker 1: feel about the landing?

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Speaker 4: You know?

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Speaker 2: I was always I was always so I played behind

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Speaker 2: Hope solo for ten years, and I knew at the time,

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Speaker 2: as long as I was, you know, really pursuing this

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Speaker 2: whole life in sports, the chances of me playing in

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Speaker 2: front of her would be slim to none unless something

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Speaker 2: catastrophic happened. So I started building a brand outside of sports.

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Speaker 2: So it wasn't about the next four to eight years

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Speaker 2: of my life. It was about the next forty to fifty.

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Speaker 2: So before Instagram and all of these things became a thing,

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Speaker 2: I knew I looked different. I was the only one

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Speaker 2: on the team absolutely covered in tattoos and looked the

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Speaker 2: way I did. I started modeling, and I started doing

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Speaker 2: stuff with brands and influencing and doing get readies with

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Speaker 2: me and doing T shirt lines, and I was just

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Speaker 2: really diversifying who I was because soccer wasn't enough for me.

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Speaker 2: I had a very very creative side, so I became

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Speaker 2: one of like heavily marketed players on the team based

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Speaker 2: on being outspoken, being queer, being an advocate, really talking

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Speaker 2: about hard topics like mental health, and it really just

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Speaker 2: shaped me into leading, leading me through doors that maybe

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Speaker 2: might be different than most people who retire who want

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Speaker 2: to be a coach and want to stay in the

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Speaker 2: sports world and commentate, and I wanted to do more

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Speaker 2: creative work when it came to having a brand strategy

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Speaker 2: to how to invest in women's sports and women's stories

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Speaker 2: and entertainment.

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Speaker 1: You are very and I'll just say the state the obvious.

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Speaker 1: You're very striking. So when you walk in a room,

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Speaker 1: people are going to be interested in you no matter

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Speaker 1: what you do. You could be like I make cookies,

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Speaker 1: Like what kind of cookies? Like peanut butter chocolate chip?

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Speaker 1: I am you know what I mean? So you are

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Speaker 1: used to getting a lot of attention. How was it?

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Speaker 1: Playing behind helped solo for ten years.

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Speaker 2: It was really great for me in a lot of

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Speaker 2: ways because her as a player, she was the best.

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Speaker 2: She worked really hard, She put her head down and

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Speaker 2: she just fucking worked. Can I cuss on this?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely?

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Speaker 2: Okay. I was just making sure it was like oh no, no, fine.

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Speaker 2: She was tough too, you know, we spent so much

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Speaker 2: time together. It was just tough personally for me because

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Speaker 2: she was very shut off and not very friendly and

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Speaker 2: when it came to having a relationship outside of sport.

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Speaker 2: But I knew it was professional and I respected that.

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Speaker 2: You know, just because we work together, we don't have

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Speaker 2: to be friends. But yeah, I would. I it was hard.

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Speaker 1: That's that's a mature attitude. Just because we were together,

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Speaker 1: it means that we don't have to be friends. There

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Speaker 1: is something about women, specifically women love to be friends

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Speaker 1: with their colleagues, and when it doesn't work out that way,

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Speaker 1: it's hard for us to separate our emotions because we

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Speaker 1: don't know how to compartmentalize. And I'm not taking for

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Speaker 1: all women, but by and large, did you feel like

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Speaker 1: she was jealous of you? Did you feel like she

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Speaker 1: was mean to you? Do you feel like she didn't

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Speaker 1: want to be your friend? Was it Brett Favor Aaron

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Speaker 1: Rodgers situation.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I think that she was there to

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Speaker 2: do a job. I think she was there to do

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Speaker 2: a job and her priority wasn't to make sure I

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Speaker 2: felt okay, truthfully, and that's okay.

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Speaker 1: I respect that. I respect that too, Like that a lot.

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Speaker 2: Listen, are young, what can show up? And gay girl

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Speaker 2: that's covered in tats, She's probably like take a seat,

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Speaker 2: you know, like I watch and learn, Yeah, watch and learn.

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Speaker 2: I don't. I don't hate on it. Listen. I didn't

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Speaker 2: like all my teammates. I still don't like all my teammates.

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Speaker 2: It's just because you know, we are in this chemistry

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Speaker 2: bubble where everyone thinks you have to have the best

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Speaker 2: chemistry to be the best team. No, you just have

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Speaker 2: to be the best, and you have to like put

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Speaker 2: work above yourself. And you know, all the bullshit off

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Speaker 2: the field. And she, you know, she she showed up,

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Speaker 2: she did her job. She wasn't there to make sure

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Speaker 2: I felt okay about myself.

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Speaker 1: I love it you say that. I remember when the

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Speaker 1: Las Vegas Aces won their second championship. I think it

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Speaker 1: was back to back, and one of the players said

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Speaker 1: the reason why we were able to beat the was

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Speaker 1: because they don't like each other.

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Speaker 2: Do you have to truly.

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Speaker 1: Like your teammate in order to win? I don't believe

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Speaker 1: that's true.

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Speaker 2: No. I mean, think about all the things that we've

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Speaker 2: you know, we've heard in the past, like you know, Kobe.

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Speaker 1: Bryant, I was the first person about us.

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Speaker 2: You know, he's like, pass me the ball. I don't

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Speaker 2: care how that makes you feel. You're not good enough

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Speaker 2: to have the ball in your hands. The last out second,

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Speaker 2: I don't trust you. I don't have to trust you.

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Speaker 2: This isn't about me and you being friends. This is

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Speaker 2: about winning. We get paid to win, we get paid

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Speaker 2: to perform. So I like, you know, I see all

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Speaker 2: these documentaries coming out about just this tiff and you know,

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Speaker 2: Hope solo this, and she's been in headlines forever being

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Speaker 2: controversial or this. Listen, she showed up, she did her

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Speaker 2: fucking job, how she treated people. She's got to sit

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Speaker 2: with that, not me. Like, she won at every level,

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Speaker 2: So what are you gonna knock her there? I mean,

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Speaker 2: her personal life had nothing to do with our work relationship.

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Speaker 2: Does that make sense.

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Speaker 1: At the time of this interview, Ashlynn is well into

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Speaker 1: a new life beyond playing soccer, a new relationship and

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Speaker 1: a new perspective about her future. But more importantly, she

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Speaker 1: has a new way to protect her peace by any

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Speaker 1: means necessary. You don't have to like me.

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Speaker 2: I'm good like I don't. I'm not here to make that.

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Speaker 2: I like a job at my job like, I'm just

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Speaker 2: that's too much energy for me. I'm gonna show up.

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna be the best I absolutely can be. I'm

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Speaker 2: gonna put my team first. And if you don't fucking

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Speaker 2: like me, great, keep a push in, but let's win.

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Speaker 1: I can relate to someone being like, Look, life has

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Speaker 1: taught me a few things, and the one thing I

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Speaker 1: know that I can depend on time and time again

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Speaker 1: is myself. And you carry yourself in that manner, and

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Speaker 1: I understand that deeply on my core. It is often

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Speaker 1: misconstrued by other people though as standoff, is not friendly, selfish,

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Speaker 1: all the things. Selfish gets a bad rap though I

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Speaker 1: don't mind selfish, but it can be labeled as not

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Speaker 1: a positive. How does that make you feel as your core?

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Speaker 1: Because you know who you are? How does that make

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Speaker 1: you feel at your core?

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Speaker 2: I think if I really cared what other people thought

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Speaker 2: of me, I probably wouldn't be sitting on this couch

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Speaker 2: with you. I think as someone who grew up in

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Speaker 2: the public eye, who has been constantly under some type

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Speaker 2: of scrutiny or this or that, like, you just get

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Speaker 2: to a point where, like I know, when I lay

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Speaker 2: my head down at night, am I showing up as

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Speaker 2: a human like am I a good mom? Am I

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Speaker 2: a good partner? Am I a good daughter? Like? Am I?

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Speaker 2: All of these things? Just you get to an age

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Speaker 2: where you just stop giving a fuck what other people

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Speaker 2: think of you because you can't change it anyways. So

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Speaker 2: I'm not gonna carry and a lot of it is

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Speaker 2: projected trauma when I'm learning very much so right now,

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Speaker 2: especially in therapy, especially after the last year, is the

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Speaker 2: projection that people have based on their own scars. It's

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Speaker 2: not my burden to carry. Like I'm good with the

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Speaker 2: decisions I've made. Do I always get it right? No?

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Speaker 2: But I continue to wake up to choose to be

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Speaker 2: excellent and everything I do, and that is the way

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Speaker 2: I lead my life is I put my ego aside

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Speaker 2: on a servant. I love to serve other people. However,

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Speaker 2: I've had to learn the balance of being an athlete

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Speaker 2: has taught me to suffer. I have been made into

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Speaker 2: a machine. So my ability to sit and suffer and

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Speaker 2: minimize what my wants and needs because that's what made

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Speaker 2: me a team player, That's what made me good at

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Speaker 2: my job. So I'm learning this balance and understanding that

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Speaker 2: I can't always focus on what people think. I'm not

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Speaker 2: everyone's going to like me? Okay? With that? Do I

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Speaker 2: like myself? Yeah, that's what's most important. And a year

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Speaker 2: ago I didn't. You know, I didn't. And sometimes you

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Speaker 2: have to do really hard and brave things that torch,

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Speaker 2: you know, your reputation or torch all of these things

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Speaker 2: which I have walked through, and I'm okay. I'm okay

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Speaker 2: because no matter how many people now have eyes and

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Speaker 2: access into saying whatever they want about me, I have

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Speaker 2: to learn it doesn't penetrate because if I'm secure and

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Speaker 2: confident and I love myself, it really doesn't matter what

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Speaker 2: people think of me.

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Speaker 1: What happened a year ago.

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Speaker 2: Soccer stars Ashlyn Harris and Ali Krieger break up after

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Speaker 2: almost four years of marriage. I decided to leave my

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Speaker 2: marriage after almost four years and a decade of being together.

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Speaker 1: How hard was that.

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Speaker 2: It's the hardest thing I ever had to do in

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Speaker 2: my life. And I think people miss that. People think

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Speaker 2: only one person was in pain, or people think you

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Speaker 2: have to choose a side that you know, you have

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Speaker 2: to really punish this person because the idea you had

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Speaker 2: through social media didn't manage your expectations. However, you haven't

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Speaker 2: lived my experience. That is one thing I'm not willing

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Speaker 2: to compromise after I've done so for so long, is

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Speaker 2: live my life for other people through this lens of

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Speaker 2: social media, which just I can't do it anymore. It

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Speaker 2: destroys you. It destroys you, and you get so caught

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Speaker 2: up in it that you think it's reality. It's not.

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Speaker 2: It's really not. And I just got to a point

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Speaker 2: where I didn't recognize the person I looked at in

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Speaker 2: the mirror, and I hated that person. Why. I just

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Speaker 2: was so broken. I was so damn it, I have

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Speaker 2: so broken, and I wanted someone to love me so bad.

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Speaker 2: I caved every bit of who I was inside to

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Speaker 2: try to be more lovable, to be enough. Just wanted

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Speaker 2: to be enough. I wanted to walk. I wanted to

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Speaker 2: be able to walk through the door and someone miss me,

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Speaker 2: want me, need me in a way that wasn't so business,

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Speaker 2: that wasn't so on the field, everyone thought it was

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Speaker 2: this way. But at home, I felt like I was

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Speaker 2: living with a stranger and I just had to take

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Speaker 2: my power back, and unfortunately, like people were hurt in

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Speaker 2: that process. And I want to make room for both

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Speaker 2: because it's not easy, Like everyone has an experience, however

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Speaker 2: only one experience played out in the media, which is

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Speaker 2: quite difficult.

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Speaker 1: You said something that I think is very fair. And

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Speaker 1: everybody can wrate the feeling of wanting to be loved

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Speaker 1: and the feeling of wanting to be needed and belonging

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Speaker 1: and feeling enough. There's not one person on this entire

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Speaker 1: planet that can't relate to that feeling of wanting that

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Speaker 1: or needing that. You get married, and are you happy

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Speaker 1: right away when you get married.

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Speaker 2: I was told by a lot of people and society

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Speaker 2: in general, that there's no such thing as a perfect human,

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Speaker 2: there's no perfect relationship. So I said, Okay, I love

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Speaker 2: this human so much. I want to make this work.

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Speaker 2: And even though I'm sacrificing, I'm sacrificing what makes me

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Speaker 2: happy inside and seeing this is for the greater good,

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Speaker 2: because this is compromise. This is what relationships are. And

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Speaker 2: I think when you get you know, into the relationship,

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Speaker 2: and then by convenience of being on the same team,

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Speaker 2: traveling all the time together, someone understanding like your experience,

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Speaker 2: and then it all ending and you no longer have

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Speaker 2: that tie that roots you and your core. Oh and

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Speaker 2: you you take the fucking blinders off, and now we're

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Speaker 2: in real life situations and I don't have that sense

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Speaker 2: of connection understanding like I'm in the real world. I'm

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Speaker 2: working a real job. I want to come through the

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Speaker 2: door and my wife be like, I love you, I

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Speaker 2: miss you, I see you. Let's do this, let's do that.

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Speaker 2: Let's you know, sleeping next to someone doesn't make a marriage. No,

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Speaker 2: Like yeah to me, I just I constantly wanted more,

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Speaker 2: and I constantly wanted the feeling of being loved the

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Speaker 2: same way I loved and I just dropped that because

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Speaker 2: I thought that's what I had to do to make

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Speaker 2: the relationship work. Until I no longer knew who I

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Speaker 2: was anymore. And it's like you, you kind of go

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Speaker 2: through this process of wanting something so bad you're willing

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Speaker 2: to sacrifice at all, But at what costs?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, at what cost your mental whomever's mental, like being

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Speaker 1: in an environment that doesn't make you happy. I hope

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Speaker 1: I'm hearing you correctly, and I'm just gonna mirror back

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Speaker 1: what I think I heard you say. Once you stop playing,

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Speaker 1: once you all stop having something in common, you had

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Speaker 1: nothing in common. H'steep. It's the reality It's like when

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Speaker 1: kids leave the nest and it's an empty nest and

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Speaker 1: parents have to decide that they have to talk to

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Speaker 1: each other and they don't have the kids in common anymore,

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Speaker 1: something like that, You know what I mean?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think that you're hearing me completely correctly.

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Speaker 2: I think she loved the game so much and all

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Speaker 2: she knew was how to sacrifice her life for the game.

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Speaker 2: Then when you add children, which is a whole different layer.

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Speaker 2: I just I just felt like I wasn't a priority.

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Speaker 2: I didn't feel that like I didn't feel that sense

296
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Speaker 2: of connection, whether emotional or physical. It was soccer, job, kids,

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Speaker 2: and then somewhere down the line it was like, okay,

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Speaker 2: but like what about me? What about me?

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Speaker 1: People function like that, I would I'd be hard pressed

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Speaker 1: to find couples currently male female female female male male

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Speaker 1: who have kids, in a life and everything else matters,

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Speaker 1: but their partner, their partner is the last person that

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Speaker 1: they pay attention to. That's like a that's every day.

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Speaker 1: I can tell my I have girlfriends who told me

305
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Speaker 1: that all the time. Without their lives. They're like, I

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Speaker 1: don't even know what's going on. I have a roommate, I'm.

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Speaker 2: Functuate, the intimacy stops.

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Speaker 1: Yes, you know it, and you wanted it, and by

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Speaker 1: the way, you deserve it.

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Speaker 2: I am a very anyone who knows me, I am

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Speaker 2: so touchy feeling, you know, the second I get you're

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Speaker 2: the storying, Hey, I'm lugging. I love you. I see you. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: but like you can only give, give, give, give, give, give,

314
00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:10,639
Speaker 2: gives so much until you really have nothing, nothing left,

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Speaker 2: and you your shell of a human. I became very,

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Speaker 2: very good at dissociating, and that's what my therapists knew

317
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Speaker 2: right away. It was my ability to sit and suffer,

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Speaker 2: my ability to disassociate, and my ability to serve other

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Speaker 2: people before my own ones and needs, which I genuinely

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Speaker 2: think probably kept me in that marriage for as long

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Speaker 2: as it did. And then I started, you know, I

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00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:39,200
Speaker 2: started trying all these things, let's do an open marriage,

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Speaker 2: and I'm like, that's just not even me, dude. Like

324
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Speaker 2: a year before we officially called it quits, that was

325
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Speaker 2: like my last attempt of you know, if I'm not

326
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Speaker 2: getting what I want, we want to keep this together,

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Speaker 2: which is also the strains of the public eye places

328
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Speaker 2: on you. You feel like you can't make the brave

329
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Speaker 2: and hard decisions because you know the impact and wave

330
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Speaker 2: that will come.

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Speaker 1: And that was my biggest fear. And imagine people saying

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Speaker 1: in marriages being unhappy and they don't have the public

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Speaker 1: eye I heard all the time. You're worried about the

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00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:17,040
Speaker 1: judgment of your friends and your family. Could you imagine

335
00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:18,520
Speaker 1: what the weight of the world looking at you too?

336
00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:21,280
Speaker 1: I mean, yes, yes you can.

337
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Speaker 2: I can, absolutely. It is the closest eye. And I've

338
00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:29,000
Speaker 2: lived through some shit, and you know, we are very

339
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:35,080
Speaker 2: open about our past. I've lived some really hard shit.

340
00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:40,120
Speaker 2: That was the first time I was like looking over

341
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Speaker 2: the edge. It was the first time I was like,

342
00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:45,159
Speaker 2: someone needs to take this nine milimeter and get it

343
00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:48,439
Speaker 2: the fuck away from me. Like I was at a

344
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Speaker 2: probably the lowest lowis lowis. I was like, I don't

345
00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:54,800
Speaker 2: think honestly, I was like, I can't survive this.

346
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Speaker 1: I don't love that.

347
00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,800
Speaker 2: I was like, and meanwhile, I was being torched while

348
00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,560
Speaker 2: I was trying to raise two K and go through

349
00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:06,920
Speaker 2: this process and make sure that my storm didn't become theirs.

350
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:10,480
Speaker 2: So it was hard. It was really And I don't

351
00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:11,840
Speaker 2: think people get.

352
00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,200
Speaker 1: No, they don't even think you're human. They don't even

353
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,960
Speaker 1: know who you are, they're writing and talk about you. Yeah,

354
00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:25,800
Speaker 1: at Haack, Why do you think you were vilified in

355
00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:26,520
Speaker 1: the breakup?

356
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:33,879
Speaker 2: I think because to everyone else. I was always taught

357
00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:37,640
Speaker 2: to not air your dirty laundry to your friends, to anyone,

358
00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:42,720
Speaker 2: so I kept it very quiet about you know, my

359
00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:47,800
Speaker 2: closest friends knew, right like people knew. You know, you

360
00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:52,439
Speaker 2: stop looking the same, and you stop smiling, and you

361
00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:57,080
Speaker 2: stop carrying yourself with the same intention you do when

362
00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:00,679
Speaker 2: you're light and you're at peace. And there was just

363
00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:04,359
Speaker 2: I didn't like the person I was. I didn't like

364
00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:07,760
Speaker 2: who I was as a teammate. I was angry because

365
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:11,480
Speaker 2: I felt like I couldn't get out and I felt

366
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:16,119
Speaker 2: like it was my outlet. Sport became my outlet to

367
00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,879
Speaker 2: get that pain out, and I felt like I couldn't

368
00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:22,119
Speaker 2: tell anyone because we were teammates and so much of

369
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:27,440
Speaker 2: our situation was so webbed and it was like a

370
00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:31,080
Speaker 2: really hard, painful process that you do alone. You sit

371
00:21:31,119 --> 00:21:36,200
Speaker 2: in silence alone, because I didn't want to disrespect her

372
00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:38,840
Speaker 2: by talking about it in the locker room or any

373
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,480
Speaker 2: conversation like in locker room, that's like the safest way,

374
00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:43,119
Speaker 2: of course.

375
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:44,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're like, I just you didn't want to do

376
00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:46,959
Speaker 1: that because you respected her and you couldn't. Really, it

377
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:48,160
Speaker 1: wasn't Yeah, it wasn't appropriate.

378
00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:50,960
Speaker 2: And it's not an easy conversation to have with anyone,

379
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 2: to carry the shame of not feeling loved and wanted.

380
00:21:55,359 --> 00:22:01,359
Speaker 2: It's like I didn't. I felt so embarrassed and I

381
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,600
Speaker 2: felt so much shame that I didn't know how to

382
00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:07,320
Speaker 2: tell people that, like, oh, my wife doesn't want to

383
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:10,479
Speaker 2: touch me or doesn't want to be intimate or doesn't

384
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:13,439
Speaker 2: want this, and it's like, how do you even fucking

385
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,280
Speaker 2: start that conversation that is uncomfortable?

386
00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:20,480
Speaker 1: Would she disagree with your assessment of the relationship. Would

387
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:22,359
Speaker 1: she say that's not true. I did want to touch her,

388
00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 1: I did want to be with her at all.

389
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:26,520
Speaker 2: No, she can't say that because we weren't intimate the

390
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:29,600
Speaker 2: entire part of our marriage. So that's I mean, facts

391
00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:32,840
Speaker 2: are just the facts. It is what it is, and

392
00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:37,880
Speaker 2: it's not you know, you have these conversations and this

393
00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:41,280
Speaker 2: isn't working for me. This feels hard, and you know,

394
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:44,800
Speaker 2: after week after week, month after month, year after year,

395
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 2: you're just like there's nothing left to say, and then

396
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:53,399
Speaker 2: you slowly if you're not growing together, you're growing apart.

397
00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:56,720
Speaker 2: We just yeah, I became a stranger, not only within

398
00:22:56,800 --> 00:23:00,880
Speaker 2: myself but within my relationship. And the worst thing that

399
00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,439
Speaker 2: you know you can do is start pushing that on

400
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,960
Speaker 2: your young children, because that's where you find that sense

401
00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,800
Speaker 2: of worth. Yeah, that's where you find that sense of need.

402
00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:11,480
Speaker 2: And I didn't want to do that to my kids.

403
00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:15,119
Speaker 2: I don't want them. I don't want to project my

404
00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:20,040
Speaker 2: shame and insecurity in my marriage on them. Because I

405
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,840
Speaker 2: wasn't getting what I needed out of it. I had

406
00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:23,680
Speaker 2: to do the hard thing.

407
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:25,439
Speaker 1: I had to do the hard thing. And you know,

408
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:27,960
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody wants to go through a divorce.

409
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody wants to deal with that drama.

410
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:32,360
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody in silence for that point.

411
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 2: But I loved her so much like I was willing

412
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,440
Speaker 2: to sacrifice it all in it it cost me everything.

413
00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:44,000
Speaker 2: I lost myself, I lost my self worth, a sense

414
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:47,359
Speaker 2: of who I am, like I just was such. I

415
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:52,520
Speaker 2: was damaged. And you get to a point. I remember,

416
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,600
Speaker 2: once I had the hard conversation with one of my friends.

417
00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:01,160
Speaker 2: Once I told the truth, I could and stop telling it,

418
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:05,000
Speaker 2: And then I fucking ran because I knew once I

419
00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:07,720
Speaker 2: said it, and once I put it out there, there

420
00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,800
Speaker 2: was no taking it back. And that's when I knew

421
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,880
Speaker 2: it was done. And you know, we had all these

422
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 2: conversations about waiting till after the season and coming out

423
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 2: with the joint statement, and I had it literally became

424
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,640
Speaker 2: life or death for me. And that's when I knew

425
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,600
Speaker 2: if I wanted to be the parent for those children,

426
00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 2: I still had to figure out a life worth living.

427
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,560
Speaker 2: And I was not in a good place. I was

428
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:46,040
Speaker 2: not I was unsafe. I'll say that like I would

429
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 2: be driving a car and I would think about ways

430
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,479
Speaker 2: I could just end it or flip it or and

431
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 2: I just once it gets that dark, there's no playbook

432
00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:02,480
Speaker 2: to leaving something. There's no oh, right way. I mean,

433
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:05,600
Speaker 2: I dropped the rope and I ran, ooh, I ran,

434
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 2: and there's just no going back.

435
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 1: You're listening to Naked Sports back in a moment. So

436
00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:23,600
Speaker 1: we all know. Breakups are not easy, especially a public breakup,

437
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,359
Speaker 1: And when Ashland and Ali Kreeger separated, the rumors and

438
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:32,520
Speaker 1: the tabloids were just non stop. What's the biggest misconception,

439
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 1: the biggest lie, the misinformation about the breakup that bothers

440
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:38,600
Speaker 1: you to this day.

441
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 2: That I'm constantly pegged as a cheater, which is that

442
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 2: that is so far from the truth, and she knows it,

443
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:51,719
Speaker 2: and she knows it, and it torched me. And I

444
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 2: think she and you know exactly who I am. She

445
00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 2: was in so much pain and rightfully so yeah, and

446
00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 2: I want to make room for her experience. I really

447
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 2: thought she never thought I would leave. I just don't

448
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:07,880
Speaker 2: think all the comp I don't think she ever took

449
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 2: me seriously.

450
00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,600
Speaker 1: She just thought you'd be there no matter.

451
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,040
Speaker 2: What, even when I asked her. You know, she was

452
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:17,560
Speaker 2: my first phone call when I got the lawyer. She

453
00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:20,639
Speaker 2: was totally fine. Thanks for the heads up on the mediator,

454
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 2: send me the paperwork. It was. I called her right

455
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 2: after we had because we were already moved out, which

456
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 2: a lot of people don't know that. People think I

457
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:32,360
Speaker 2: just up and left. But I was living separately than

458
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,040
Speaker 2: her through the summer and I had my own apartment

459
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,280
Speaker 2: and people were starting to recognize me. So I was like,

460
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,199
Speaker 2: we have to come out with a joint statement, like

461
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,639
Speaker 2: people know I live here. But I think once it

462
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,439
Speaker 2: all blew up and it affected her last season, she

463
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 2: was pissed and she was angry and that's when and

464
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:54,760
Speaker 2: rightfully so, like there are things that if I could

465
00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:59,439
Speaker 2: have this perfect playbook ending where it was very it

466
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 2: just was, no, we're going to be that.

467
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: I don't know any breakup that it was.

468
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 2: Never going to be that. I remember calling her saying, Hey,

469
00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 2: the lawyer thinks like if we jointly file, it won't

470
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 2: be such an issue. Because the tabloids were calling our agents.

471
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:16,560
Speaker 2: They knew we got rid of the dogs. There was

472
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,159
Speaker 2: all these things going on that people were like catching

473
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:21,879
Speaker 2: wind of, so you know, people were reaching out to

474
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:24,720
Speaker 2: their agent, be my agent. Her agent at the time

475
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 2: were the same, like, hey, this is what we're figuring out,

476
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:30,919
Speaker 2: Like do you have any statements? So I kept being like,

477
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,639
Speaker 2: we have to we have to get ahead of this,

478
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 2: we have to say something. And you know, the whole

479
00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,360
Speaker 2: plan was to hold off until the end of the season.

480
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 2: And I remember calling and saying, you want to jointly file,

481
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 2: like this is going to be what's best and she said, na,

482
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:51,800
Speaker 2: you'll come crawling back in six months. And I filed,

483
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,040
Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden she was blindsided by it.

484
00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:57,720
Speaker 2: And I'm like, I gave you the opportunity and you

485
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 2: were like, I just don't think I ever believed it.

486
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:06,680
Speaker 2: So I'm not taking anything away from her experience. There's

487
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 2: always two sides to a story. Yeah, three, yeah, total,

488
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:12,720
Speaker 2: And I want to make space and room for her

489
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:16,080
Speaker 2: pain because that matters to me and her healing process.

490
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 2: And I understand that she was you know, listen, I'm

491
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 2: not an idiot. There has like for someone to not

492
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:29,239
Speaker 2: want to be intimate with me for that long, I

493
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 2: must not be like you must not be happy either, Like,

494
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,679
Speaker 2: but every time in therapy I would ask, like, you know,

495
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 2: what is it you know? And sometimes I'd be met

496
00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:42,040
Speaker 2: by we're together too much. I don't miss you. I

497
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 2: don't miss but those are things I can't correct or

498
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:46,440
Speaker 2: fixed to grow together.

499
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're on the same tam. I can't help that.

500
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 2: I can't. Yeah, like this is the choice we made

501
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 2: or are raising kids. I So I just I feel

502
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,360
Speaker 2: like I was damned if I do, damned if I don't.

503
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 1: How how have you? Because I met you at the

504
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,360
Speaker 1: end of things. And I say this for anybody listening

505
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: watching me whatever. I purposely don't google people's drama because

506
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 1: I've had my own, so I hate when people google

507
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 1: me and assume they know me. But when I met you,

508
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 1: I just saw, oh, well, she's so loving, so sweet,

509
00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 1: so kind, so beautiful, so dressed nice, all the things

510
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 1: that I love right very vain, nothing, no substance to

511
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:26,959
Speaker 1: what I was saying, just because I just But what

512
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: I did recognized right away was how kind you were,

513
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 1: how warm you are, how how giving you were. You

514
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 1: didn't know me, you could have been very standoffish, and

515
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 1: I felt to me I spoke to who you were

516
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 1: at your core. I think that I would have been

517
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 1: more guarded if I were you, meaning like meeting new people,

518
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,360
Speaker 1: because you were in the tabloids and still are. I

519
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:51,200
Speaker 1: think I would have been more guarded. You were very gracious,

520
00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:53,640
Speaker 1: and that has probably a lot to do with you

521
00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:57,120
Speaker 1: or what I say. You're seeing sense. You can see people,

522
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,960
Speaker 1: you can just see them at their core. Usually people

523
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 1: I've been through a lot understand and can identify all

524
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,480
Speaker 1: of those things. So here you are. I think you

525
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:09,960
Speaker 1: guys are so in love. You and Sophia. I love

526
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,360
Speaker 1: I love her. I think she's a mean, I mean,

527
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:16,880
Speaker 1: she's amazing. Yeah, And I see you guys interacting, and

528
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:21,400
Speaker 1: I think she's happy. Who doesn't want this? A lot

529
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 1: is happy. I'm like, who doesn't want? Why are we?

530
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 1: Who cares? And I know that I am probably simplifying it,

531
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:30,200
Speaker 1: but do we have to get caught up in the

532
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 1: dates and the times and the exact moments when someone

533
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 1: is happy, Like shouldn't we want two people to be happy?

534
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:42,240
Speaker 2: Yeah? And this is what because you know, during this process,

535
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 2: I was very much so speaking to my therapist and

536
00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 2: even for me, I was like, I am damaged, Like

537
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 2: I am not ready for anything remotely, Like I just

538
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,600
Speaker 2: wanted to go out and rage. Yeah, like I did.

539
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 2: And I had these conversations with my agency because I

540
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 2: was worried. I was like, no one knows what has happened,

541
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 2: No one knows that this is what it is. If

542
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 2: I go out like and start dating around like people

543
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 2: are going to like, what do I do? I couldn't

544
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 2: hide anymore, Like I couldn't I fucking pretend. I've been

545
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:22,800
Speaker 2: pretending for years now. You want me to keep pretending?

546
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 2: And I just couldn't do it anymore. And I don't

547
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:30,640
Speaker 2: want to feel bad about that, but at the expense

548
00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:35,959
Speaker 2: of opening my life up to receive the type of

549
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 2: love I always imagined because of who that was, who

550
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 2: is heavily in the entertainment space. It blew everything wide open,

551
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 2: it really did it. That's that's you know, someone who

552
00:31:55,960 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 2: never was with women, you know, never was a relationship

553
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:04,040
Speaker 2: with like and then all of a sudden we went on,

554
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:07,280
Speaker 2: like I think we were two weeks. I think when

555
00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:09,640
Speaker 2: everything went public in October, we had gone on our

556
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 2: first date two weeks before that. So all of these

557
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 2: things are going on, and you know, rightfully, so she's

558
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:18,720
Speaker 2: Sophia is used to this. Yeah, You're like, you know,

559
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,520
Speaker 2: this world's message. She's like, hey, you got to get

560
00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 2: on this this call, So I call my agent. I'm

561
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 2: fucking panicked. I'm trying to like figure this out. And

562
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:33,800
Speaker 2: there were like people magazines calling and they're taking all

563
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:36,320
Speaker 2: these rumors and running with them unless we say something

564
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 2: and this and that, and I was always the one.

565
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm not saying shit. I don't know

566
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 2: anyone anything. I'm not saying anything to tabloids. I'm not

567
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:47,880
Speaker 2: saying anything to anyone any journalists. I'm not doing any podcasts.

568
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 2: I am sitting in my integrity because I don't want

569
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 2: to say something I can't take back because I was

570
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 2: in so much pain, right so, It's like at that time,

571
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:01,200
Speaker 2: I'm like, how on earth am I going to sit

572
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 2: down and tell my truth when I am in shambles.

573
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 2: I rather just sit in my integrity. However, this the

574
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 2: media wants to play this, They're going to play it.

575
00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:11,400
Speaker 2: I mean, there were bees.

576
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,960
Speaker 1: Sophia Bush says that she was just as surprised by

577
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 1: her blossoming relationship with Ashland Harris as was the rest

578
00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 1: of the world.

579
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:24,120
Speaker 2: The whole situation was so escalated, more than it should

580
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:28,080
Speaker 2: have been, and it was just so innocent and so

581
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 2: pure and so unexpected in a lot of ways. And

582
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 2: even through the fire, it was almost like the universe

583
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 2: pushed us closer together because we had no choice. We

584
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:47,360
Speaker 2: started blowing up and we were in this new found

585
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 2: space together because I was literally like, oh, I thought

586
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:52,800
Speaker 2: you were straight, and she goes, oh, I thought you

587
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:57,600
Speaker 2: were happy, and you know her like, she's fine, that's

588
00:33:57,640 --> 00:33:58,160
Speaker 2: that funny.

589
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 1: But because she's like, I thought you were calling me out.

590
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh, she spits it right back. Yeah, she's a firecracker.

591
00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:07,440
Speaker 2: But I told my therapist, I'm like, I am in

592
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:09,799
Speaker 2: the worst season of my life. I am in the

593
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:13,480
Speaker 2: worst version. I am the worst version of myself and

594
00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:19,320
Speaker 2: still like, you know me, I am this soft because

595
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:20,439
Speaker 2: of the trauma I.

596
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:22,960
Speaker 1: Have face, and you could be so hard. I could be.

597
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 2: So hard and I could. And this is what drove

598
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,920
Speaker 2: Sophia mad. She was like, just tell your truth. Just

599
00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 2: you know, she's about justice. Yeah, she fights for her

600
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 2: truth and her people. And I just was like, I

601
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 2: have two young children. I have I you know what

602
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:40,880
Speaker 2: my fight is protecting and showing up for them and

603
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 2: giving them the best version of myself.

604
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 1: I have to have a relationship with the mother.

605
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:48,359
Speaker 2: Yeah. There's just no part of me that felt like

606
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 2: I had to come back and say something or you know,

607
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:56,280
Speaker 2: really show the public all the truth and the receipts

608
00:34:56,280 --> 00:35:00,040
Speaker 2: and the text. Just I loved her. I still I

609
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 2: love her. She is the mother of my children. That

610
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:06,800
Speaker 2: love will never go away. And I would never try

611
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:11,280
Speaker 2: to torture reputation, torture her ability to provide for herself

612
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:14,759
Speaker 2: and the children, Like, That's not who I am. And

613
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 2: no matter how painful this process has been, and trust me,

614
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 2: there are moments when I'm like I just want to

615
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 2: fucking rip my hair out. I know I stand in

616
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:31,399
Speaker 2: my integrity. It will not make me feel better by

617
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 2: hurting her like I want her to be happy. I

618
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 2: want nothing but the best for her. I care about her,

619
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:42,839
Speaker 2: like genuinely care about her. There is a reason we

620
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,600
Speaker 2: decided to have children together. There's a reason we were

621
00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:51,520
Speaker 2: together for a decade. Some relationships just don't work, and

622
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 2: that's okay.

623
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 1: That's okay, by the way. As simple as that said,

624
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 1: it's so complicated. It's simple. As it said, it's so complicated.

625
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,360
Speaker 1: It just didn't work. And there are so many questions

626
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,160
Speaker 1: as to why. But once you make peace with the

627
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 1: fact that it didn't work, it just didn't work. I

628
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: don't know what I have to put together to make

629
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 1: you understand that, but I what I'm hearing is that

630
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 1: it didn't matter if it was Sophia. It could have

631
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:19,239
Speaker 1: been anyone who came along and lit your fire and

632
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:23,080
Speaker 1: and made you feel like you were miss you were

633
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: getting what you had been missing. And it could have

634
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 1: been true love with the person who connected with your spirit.

635
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 1: It just happened to be Sophia. You were already out

636
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 1: the door. You were already checked out in terms of

637
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:38,240
Speaker 1: I'm just walking through life. Yeah you weren't. It wasn't

638
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:41,000
Speaker 1: like you were like I'm looking for someone to cheat with.

639
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 1: I'm looking for a new person to.

640
00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:44,839
Speaker 2: Be what would have done that a long time ago.

641
00:36:45,080 --> 00:36:48,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds like you just you found someone, you

642
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: found your person.

643
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 2: Well, I you know, through trauma. I think your memory,

644
00:36:56,360 --> 00:37:02,200
Speaker 2: you know, I don't have much memory. I remember so beautifully.

645
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:06,960
Speaker 2: Is like I just have this visual of laying in

646
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:10,000
Speaker 2: the trenches because I was being burnt alive. I was

647
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:13,440
Speaker 2: in the trenches and she just came and laid right

648
00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:14,319
Speaker 2: right next to me.

649
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:16,640
Speaker 1: Oh so beautiful she did.

650
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:19,399
Speaker 2: She just came in and was like, if you're gonna burn,

651
00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 2: I'm gonna fucking sit right here with you in the dark,

652
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,359
Speaker 2: and when you're ready to get up, we're gonna walk

653
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:27,960
Speaker 2: to the light. Like she was so patient and so kind.

654
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:32,080
Speaker 2: I'll never forget when there was a self magazine cover

655
00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:34,959
Speaker 2: that came out and Ali had things to say that

656
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 2: are not my truth. But I'm not going to take

657
00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 2: away her truth. Sure, just not mine. Sure, and just

658
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,400
Speaker 2: broke me. It broke me because you know what, the

659
00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:46,920
Speaker 2: thing that broke me the most is I had an

660
00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:51,799
Speaker 2: emergency therapy session and I just was like, her experience

661
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 2: is just so false and further from mine, and and

662
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:59,759
Speaker 2: my therapist was so wonderful, and they said, this is

663
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:04,319
Speaker 2: her experience and you can't change that. She's allowed to

664
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 2: grieve this way if this is her truth. This is

665
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:11,200
Speaker 2: her truth. But if she would have saw you and

666
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:14,799
Speaker 2: your side, you wouldn't even be in the position you are.

667
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 2: Stop expecting the change, stop expecting to be heard, stop

668
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 2: expecting to be seen and be met with. That is

669
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 2: that is literally the single handed reason why you're not

670
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:29,800
Speaker 2: together anymore. And it was I'm that person. I always

671
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 2: want to see the best, and I always want to

672
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:35,239
Speaker 2: see it through and even at the expense of my happiness.

673
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh wow. And that's when I

674
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 2: really was like, we're just going to have two versions

675
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 2: of this which are very different, and she's going to

676
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 2: have to be okay with my version and I'm going

677
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,279
Speaker 2: to have to be okay with hers. But the whole

678
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:53,719
Speaker 2: point is we never spoke the same language which got

679
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:54,800
Speaker 2: us here in the first place.

680
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 1: You guys never saw it the same. You guys are

681
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:01,439
Speaker 1: communicating differently all the time.

682
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 2: And she said that in therapy, she was like some

683
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 2: version of like I like was listening, I just didn't

684
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 2: hear you.

685
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 1: And that's something like that and not the case for

686
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: all relationships when they break up.

687
00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know, it's also like it's a hard

688
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:20,759
Speaker 2: lifestyle that we live, you do, and we are you know,

689
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:25,239
Speaker 2: I said this about retirement. People talk about retirement. I

690
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 2: felt like, you know, I retired at thirty seven. I

691
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 2: felt like, for probably thirty years, someone was chasing me.

692
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:32,279
Speaker 1: What was that mean?

693
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 2: I worked so hard because I always knew I had

694
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,520
Speaker 2: a target on my back, and I always knew people

695
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 2: were chomping at my heels wanting to take my position.

696
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 2: So I did the work when no one was looking.

697
00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 2: I never cut corners. But it was this, this life

698
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,080
Speaker 2: I was constantly chasing because I didn't want someone to

699
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 2: pass me. I didn't want someone to be better than me.

700
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 2: I didn't want someone to be working harder than I was.

701
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 2: So I I lived this life of being chased for

702
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:04,320
Speaker 2: a long time, and I was tired.

703
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, like I was tired. Have you ever and you have?

704
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:15,799
Speaker 1: So I'm asking you this knowing the answer. When you

705
00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: got with Sophia and you guys were together, were you

706
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:26,800
Speaker 1: able to exhale, sleep better, feel better, move better?

707
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:27,880
Speaker 2: Yeah?

708
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 1: What what felt easier when you were with her? I

709
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,400
Speaker 1: felt safe for the first time in probably a decade.

710
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:36,400
Speaker 1: You felt safe.

711
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:39,680
Speaker 2: I felt safe. Yeah, there was something about her that

712
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,319
Speaker 2: made me feel safe and seene and that was even

713
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,960
Speaker 2: like just as friends at the beginning, she was just

714
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:52,319
Speaker 2: a kind, safe heart and someone I could talk to

715
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:55,719
Speaker 2: those And the best part is is she introduced me

716
00:40:55,840 --> 00:41:00,040
Speaker 2: to this group of women and it was like I

717
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 2: couldn't tell my teammates or my colleagues anything. You know.

718
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:09,520
Speaker 2: At the time, I was the creative consultant for Gotham

719
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:11,880
Speaker 2: and my agent called me and said, they want you

720
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:15,040
Speaker 2: to stop coming, to stop coming to games because it's

721
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 2: distracting how And I just was like, Wow, I can't

722
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 2: see my friends because they feel the need to choose.

723
00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:28,719
Speaker 2: I can't go to my job because you know, I

724
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 2: worked so hard to build the future of that club

725
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 2: and the second anything and the club knew from the beginning.

726
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 2: They were the one helping us draw out statements. You know.

727
00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,920
Speaker 2: I was very open and honest, this is what's coming.

728
00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:48,359
Speaker 2: I don't want you guys to be blindsided, so you're

729
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:51,880
Speaker 2: ready for it, Like everyone knew in that club. And

730
00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 2: then they were like, stop coming.

731
00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 1: How many did you lose friends? You were surprised that

732
00:41:57,760 --> 00:41:59,279
Speaker 1: you lose that you lost I.

733
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 2: Lost everything besides my worth, like I lost everything. I

734
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:12,960
Speaker 2: lost friends, I lost jobs, I lost money, I lost

735
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 2: my marriage. I walked out of my home with trash

736
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:21,319
Speaker 2: bags like I lost everything. But it was the It

737
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 2: would have been that, or it would have been a funeral.

738
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:28,279
Speaker 2: There was there was no there was, there was. The

739
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 2: teeter was so real, it was it was bad. And

740
00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:36,920
Speaker 2: how much is one person willing to flirt with fire?

741
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:40,200
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm lucky to be sitting here and that's

742
00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 2: not a this or that or like you know, it

743
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 2: just was the realness and the magnitude and the effect

744
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:47,200
Speaker 2: it had on me.

745
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:59,360
Speaker 1: I hate that for you, but I'm here.

746
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:08,359
Speaker 2: And this is life. But it And I said this

747
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 2: to so If not long ago, because she's always like,

748
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:16,720
Speaker 2: why don't you just say you're truth? Like you're too kind.

749
00:43:23,080 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 2: My trauma has made me this gentle.

750
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:27,800
Speaker 1: I agree.

751
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:33,120
Speaker 2: I understand that, and what she chooses to do with

752
00:43:33,239 --> 00:43:38,359
Speaker 2: it is up to her, because I will not change.

753
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:44,880
Speaker 2: This won't make me hard. It will make space for

754
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:49,400
Speaker 2: people struggling who I have no idea what they've bought.

755
00:43:53,480 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 1: I understand. I think everything that you're saying in terms

756
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 1: of your trauma making you this gentle is really beautiful

757
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:11,440
Speaker 1: because there's so much, especially in today's world, there's so

758
00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:13,720
Speaker 1: much for us to be mad at, so many things

759
00:44:13,760 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 1: for us to be angry and upset about. And I

760
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:28,720
Speaker 1: think that when I see you for the wind, thank

761
00:44:28,760 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 1: you for the tissue, thank you, I think that I

762
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:41,280
Speaker 1: am encouraged my behavior. I'm encouraged. I'm glad. You're so sweet.

763
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:45,160
Speaker 1: It makes me feel like there's a world where, no

764
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:52,080
Speaker 1: matter how shitty things are, especially now, there are still

765
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:54,840
Speaker 1: ways to find joy and to find peace and to

766
00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 1: find gentleness. And that's what you consistently display. But I

767
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:02,400
Speaker 1: think why I'm kind of emotional is because I think,

768
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:04,560
Speaker 1: no matter how kind and sweet you are, I think

769
00:45:04,560 --> 00:45:07,080
Speaker 1: it's I think it hurts you that people cut you

770
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:10,239
Speaker 1: off and they want your friend, Yeah, and they have

771
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 1: judged you and they don't know who you are, and

772
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,320
Speaker 1: that hurts. It hurts. I know it hurts.

773
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:26,279
Speaker 4: It is, But I have a choice every day how

774
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:28,879
Speaker 4: I choose to show up in a world that's so dark.

775
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:35,000
Speaker 2: I have a choice. And as hard as this has

776
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 2: been and as much pain as like it's been for

777
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 2: her my ex wife, yeah, because she's in pain. She's

778
00:45:44,239 --> 00:45:45,719
Speaker 2: in pain, she's pain too.

779
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:49,240
Speaker 1: She might display it differently, she might tell people express

780
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:50,640
Speaker 1: it differently, but she's in pain too.

781
00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:55,600
Speaker 2: But it doesn't change like the decade I was with

782
00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:58,480
Speaker 2: her in the life. I belt with her, we belt

783
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:02,280
Speaker 2: and I always we'll have love for her, and that's changed.

784
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:05,719
Speaker 2: No matter what. Yeah, no matter what is said or

785
00:46:07,120 --> 00:46:11,840
Speaker 2: you know, I can take it. It doesn't make it easy.

786
00:46:12,040 --> 00:46:21,320
Speaker 1: You're listening to Naked Sports Back in a moment, Welcome

787
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:24,759
Speaker 1: back to Naked Sports. So Ashland is in love with

788
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:29,880
Speaker 1: Sophia Bush, co parenting with an ex, and now reintroducing

789
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 1: her new self to old friends.

790
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 2: It's it's understanding that things aren't always perfect and life

791
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:38,960
Speaker 2: is tough. It's so tough.

792
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:42,840
Speaker 1: But this is the realness of living in a canceled culture.

793
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 1: You know, so you officially feel as if you were canceled.

794
00:46:47,160 --> 00:46:50,560
Speaker 2: Not that I was officially canceled. I just think that

795
00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:55,160
Speaker 2: my friends didn't want to be seen with me because

796
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:59,880
Speaker 2: I was too big of a liability.

797
00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:01,839
Speaker 1: Like because you because you do. You see how silly

798
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:04,040
Speaker 1: this sounds to me. Because you fell in love with

799
00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:07,560
Speaker 1: someone else, you were a liability. How is that even

800
00:47:07,600 --> 00:47:09,239
Speaker 1: possible in today's America?

801
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:12,400
Speaker 2: And anyone who has spent like five to ten minutes

802
00:47:12,920 --> 00:47:16,560
Speaker 2: and can see the joy in which I bring when

803
00:47:16,560 --> 00:47:19,280
Speaker 2: I am not carry I am not the same person

804
00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:19,680
Speaker 2: I was.

805
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:21,439
Speaker 1: No, I've only known you after.

806
00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:25,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's like I have to reintroduce myself to

807
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:30,600
Speaker 2: a lot of people because that damage broken puppy that

808
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:36,480
Speaker 2: was just following and try. You know, I'm not hurt. Yeah,

809
00:47:36,520 --> 00:47:37,240
Speaker 2: I'm not hurt.

810
00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:40,040
Speaker 1: And they have to allow you to evolve. Yeah, they

811
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:41,919
Speaker 1: have to allow you to be someone new.

812
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:45,040
Speaker 2: The hardest part for me too, especially when it comes

813
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:48,960
Speaker 2: to my friends and my teammates, is I know so much.

814
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:55,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, damn, I know so much. It's staying eyroad right,

815
00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:59,719
Speaker 1: it stocks stay put your shit in the nose. Yeah

816
00:47:59,920 --> 00:48:00,400
Speaker 1: I won't.

817
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 2: It's really interesting to know.

818
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:05,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know what you're saying.

819
00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:10,000
Speaker 2: Oh to know, I know, I know. God, people were

820
00:48:10,080 --> 00:48:13,719
Speaker 2: so quick to use the side. I'm like, Okay, I still.

821
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:17,000
Speaker 1: Have receipts, but I'm gonna leave that here. I totally

822
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 1: can relate to that. I totally know what you're saying.

823
00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:25,759
Speaker 1: You talked about how you lost a lot this this transition.

824
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:29,240
Speaker 1: I know that you're working, you have a lot of opportunities,

825
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:32,680
Speaker 1: but there still will be more do you see the

826
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:36,920
Speaker 1: beautiful alchemy and it all maybe it was everything had

827
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,200
Speaker 1: to burn down so I can rise again and it

828
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:42,120
Speaker 1: can be true and pure. Everything that you work on,

829
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:44,680
Speaker 1: everything that you touch, all of the relationships that you

830
00:48:44,760 --> 00:48:47,360
Speaker 1: make have to be authentic and if they're not, that's fine.

831
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:51,640
Speaker 1: But you know what, You're introducing yourself to new people

832
00:48:51,680 --> 00:48:54,919
Speaker 1: every single day and you're making new relationships and working

833
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 1: on new things, and that is you at your highest self.

834
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:00,880
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe that's what you feel.

835
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:07,319
Speaker 2: Well, it has allowed me to I think, so it's it.

836
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 2: And you said this before. When you were in sports, right,

837
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:15,120
Speaker 2: everyone just pegged you as this like commentator in sports,

838
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 2: but there was so much more to you. There's so

839
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:20,279
Speaker 2: much more you wanted to do and check off and

840
00:49:21,160 --> 00:49:23,120
Speaker 2: how you wanted to show up in the space and

841
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:27,359
Speaker 2: not just be grouped into this one type thing. I

842
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 2: think I knew I was special. I've always known I'm special.

843
00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:34,640
Speaker 2: Soccer was never you know, we spoke about this the

844
00:49:34,719 --> 00:49:38,360
Speaker 2: other day. Soccer was my way out. It was my

845
00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:41,400
Speaker 2: way to provide a better life for myself. So I

846
00:49:41,560 --> 00:49:45,040
Speaker 2: had a different vision of what it looked like. I

847
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 2: didn't necessarily do it because I loved it. It just

848
00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:50,719
Speaker 2: was my fucking job. That was it? Right, So I

849
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:55,040
Speaker 2: knew once life changed for me, I'd be okay because

850
00:49:55,040 --> 00:50:00,359
Speaker 2: it wasn't a happiness, wasn't correlated to how successful I

851
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:02,680
Speaker 2: was as a soccer player. Was I getting my money?

852
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:03,040
Speaker 3: Yeah?

853
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:03,360
Speaker 1: Sure?

854
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:04,680
Speaker 2: Was I getting a lot of it?

855
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 1: Yeah?

856
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:08,120
Speaker 2: And then it was like I'm ready to balance, and

857
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:11,000
Speaker 2: now it's opened Otherwise. You know, I was the creative

858
00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:14,040
Speaker 2: director of Gotham, and I was doing all these things,

859
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:16,560
Speaker 2: and I was going to start this fashion line. I

860
00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 2: was doing all these you know, in my mind, I

861
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:25,880
Speaker 2: really wanted to show how I could do things differently

862
00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 2: than the coach or the commentator. And now I'm in

863
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:35,279
Speaker 2: this space where I'm in film, I'm in docs, and

864
00:50:36,320 --> 00:50:40,279
Speaker 2: I am consulting and creatively producing things now that I

865
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:43,960
Speaker 2: never thought I could imagine I would be sitting in

866
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:49,000
Speaker 2: such a privileged space like hello Sunshine, where bosses are

867
00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:51,120
Speaker 2: reaching out being like, God, you're just so good at

868
00:50:51,120 --> 00:50:53,880
Speaker 2: this and we love having you here. And I walked

869
00:50:53,920 --> 00:50:57,160
Speaker 2: into this like, oh, I'm not deserving of it, right,

870
00:50:57,239 --> 00:51:00,399
Speaker 2: because if this is the mentality we carry with us,

871
00:51:00,440 --> 00:51:03,840
Speaker 2: I thought I was one dimensional and sports was my

872
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:04,720
Speaker 2: thing and.

873
00:51:05,360 --> 00:51:06,240
Speaker 1: Blah blah, blah.

874
00:51:06,280 --> 00:51:08,319
Speaker 2: It's all the things you tell yourself that's just so

875
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,160
Speaker 2: fucking far from the truth. And I walked in there

876
00:51:11,360 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 2: and I was like, whoa, this is like a sense

877
00:51:13,680 --> 00:51:17,319
Speaker 2: of belonging and worth. I'm good at this, Like I'm

878
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:20,600
Speaker 2: actually good at it, and I could do this. And

879
00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:24,640
Speaker 2: it's not even because I've met with so many people

880
00:51:24,680 --> 00:51:28,360
Speaker 2: in the space who who are directors, who are filming,

881
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:30,799
Speaker 2: are doing sportstocks and they were like, why the fuck

882
00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:32,279
Speaker 2: do you want to be behind the camera? We need

883
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:32,960
Speaker 2: you in front of it.

884
00:51:33,200 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, you can do both.

885
00:51:34,719 --> 00:51:37,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, And now I'm like, yeah, how you do?

886
00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:38,840
Speaker 1: You could do both?

887
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:42,160
Speaker 2: And you know, starting this new show with iHeart and

888
00:51:42,920 --> 00:51:48,759
Speaker 2: being a part of Deep Blue and bringing money into

889
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 2: women's sports and doing it strategically and doing it creatively

890
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:56,640
Speaker 2: and doing it different. I'm just I'm doing Yeah, I'm

891
00:51:56,680 --> 00:51:58,560
Speaker 2: working all these jobs and I'm like, holy shit, how

892
00:51:58,560 --> 00:52:00,880
Speaker 2: do I even keep up? And I'm a parent. But

893
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:05,680
Speaker 2: I love it. I love working this month. I love creating.

894
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:08,319
Speaker 2: And it's also I live life through storytelling. You do

895
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:11,400
Speaker 2: so to be able to work with the Hello Sunshine,

896
00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:13,960
Speaker 2: to tell the story of the stories of women in

897
00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:18,080
Speaker 2: sports by women, women who have lived it, who've lived,

898
00:52:18,120 --> 00:52:22,000
Speaker 2: who've experienced it. I just get it. I come with

899
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:28,759
Speaker 2: a different, unique perspective. But I'm also given the platform

900
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,560
Speaker 2: and leverage to run with it. Like we talked about

901
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:34,960
Speaker 2: this the other day of women pulling back their egos

902
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:40,759
Speaker 2: and allowing other people to come in and shine. My

903
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:44,600
Speaker 2: bosses and my executives and my teams literally will come

904
00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:47,080
Speaker 2: in and say you take this meeting. You're like wait,

905
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:47,759
Speaker 2: and I'm like.

906
00:52:47,719 --> 00:52:52,239
Speaker 1: Oh god, the meeting. Are you sure you want me?

907
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:56,520
Speaker 2: And to be able to do it and nail it

908
00:52:56,960 --> 00:52:59,960
Speaker 2: and have your boss be like, well done, you did.

909
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:02,160
Speaker 2: You did a great job. I love working with you.

910
00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:05,160
Speaker 2: We love your perspective, we love your passion, we love

911
00:53:05,200 --> 00:53:05,800
Speaker 2: your insight.

912
00:53:06,400 --> 00:53:09,359
Speaker 1: I always feel like, just your time to be celebrated.

913
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:10,000
Speaker 2: It's time.

914
00:53:10,120 --> 00:53:12,680
Speaker 1: It's your time to be celebrated. It's your time to

915
00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 1: be and I don't want to say validated, but it's

916
00:53:15,200 --> 00:53:18,640
Speaker 1: your time to know that everything that you have done

917
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:21,879
Speaker 1: for was for this moment, the good and the bad,

918
00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:30,080
Speaker 1: especially the bad. You're brave. You are brave. People are

919
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:32,319
Speaker 1: sitting betimes. You don't have a choice. You don't have

920
00:53:32,320 --> 00:53:34,759
Speaker 1: a choice. But some people may not have a choice

921
00:53:34,760 --> 00:53:37,759
Speaker 1: and still sit in misery and refuse to just deal

922
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:40,839
Speaker 1: with all the shit that comes with being brave. That's

923
00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:44,759
Speaker 1: why it's called brave. You have a new podcast, tell

924
00:53:44,760 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 1: Me Wide Open, which I love the title because you

925
00:53:48,600 --> 00:53:51,440
Speaker 1: are so open. I mean, you're completely naked. When you

926
00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 1: and I both have titles that speak to what we

927
00:53:53,600 --> 00:53:58,120
Speaker 1: want to put out in the world. Why did you

928
00:53:58,160 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 1: decide why to open in terms of the cattle and

929
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:02,360
Speaker 1: what do you want to do with your podcast?

930
00:54:03,360 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 2: So I came up with the name. Which is the

931
00:54:06,040 --> 00:54:09,360
Speaker 2: best part of working with is they're giving me so

932
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:12,760
Speaker 2: much creative control, which is a lot of the reason

933
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:15,399
Speaker 2: why I'm doing it. I think for so long I've

934
00:54:15,440 --> 00:54:17,839
Speaker 2: been told to act and say and be a certain way,

935
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:21,400
Speaker 2: and I want to just strip all those layers. And

936
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:24,480
Speaker 2: for me, wide open is you know, clearly everyone in

937
00:54:24,560 --> 00:54:28,239
Speaker 2: sports knows wide open. It's really just seizing the opportunity

938
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 2: to separate yourself and attack whatever you're doing, you know,

939
00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:40,000
Speaker 2: really going after this moment in sport of separating yourself

940
00:54:40,040 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 2: from the pact, and then you've got to execute right.

941
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:46,080
Speaker 2: So for me, I've been wide open my whole life.

942
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:49,520
Speaker 2: I'm what you see is what you get, and I

943
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:54,000
Speaker 2: have a unique ability, which is such a privilege, but

944
00:54:54,040 --> 00:54:58,080
Speaker 2: it's also a responsibility. I see people, and whether I

945
00:54:58,120 --> 00:55:00,879
Speaker 2: see you for three minutes or a hour or fifth,

946
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:03,640
Speaker 2: it doesn't even matter. I want to make space for

947
00:55:03,960 --> 00:55:09,560
Speaker 2: people's experience. And in this world, especially the climate we're

948
00:55:09,560 --> 00:55:12,960
Speaker 2: living in right now, it's so dark, and we have

949
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:16,200
Speaker 2: to show up for each other because people need each other. Like,

950
00:55:16,280 --> 00:55:18,480
Speaker 2: this is literally the first time we've talked. We've had

951
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:20,680
Speaker 2: this conversation one hundred times, and it's the first time

952
00:55:20,719 --> 00:55:24,000
Speaker 2: you and I are like, really, the emotion is really

953
00:55:24,040 --> 00:55:28,240
Speaker 2: coming through. And I think the ability to feel safe

954
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:31,600
Speaker 2: enough to share, to share to I think you and

955
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:36,319
Speaker 2: I have a unique opportunity to allow people to have

956
00:55:36,480 --> 00:55:40,400
Speaker 2: space to really show up as themselves, to be vulnerable,

957
00:55:40,640 --> 00:55:44,479
Speaker 2: to be open, to be all of these things we're

958
00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:46,720
Speaker 2: told not to be because it's a sign of weakness.

959
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:49,719
Speaker 2: Oh it's not. I'm just taking my narrative back. I'm

960
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:55,200
Speaker 2: taking my power back. I'm tired of the media destroying

961
00:55:55,280 --> 00:56:00,680
Speaker 2: us and you know, really putting people again to each other,

962
00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:07,759
Speaker 2: and I just I want to softly, respectfully do the

963
00:56:07,840 --> 00:56:11,160
Speaker 2: right thing by telling people's stories and telling stories that

964
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:15,239
Speaker 2: matter and being vulnerable and knowing that that that is

965
00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:18,320
Speaker 2: what makes life so special, and I think we've gotten

966
00:56:18,360 --> 00:56:21,560
Speaker 2: away from that. And that's why I told iHeart. I

967
00:56:21,600 --> 00:56:24,360
Speaker 2: was like, I want my interviews to be in person.

968
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:29,120
Speaker 2: I want to feel the space and connection. I want

969
00:56:29,200 --> 00:56:32,200
Speaker 2: someone to be like, oh, I am held in this

970
00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:35,720
Speaker 2: moment in a way maybe I never have, Like even Brooke,

971
00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:37,799
Speaker 2: you know, I had Brooke on my show and she's like,

972
00:56:37,840 --> 00:56:39,600
Speaker 2: this is the first time I'm telling the story.

973
00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:43,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, because she feels you yeah, and she feels safe,

974
00:56:43,680 --> 00:56:46,279
Speaker 1: it feels seen, And I think this is a part

975
00:56:46,320 --> 00:56:47,719
Speaker 1: of my healing journey too.

976
00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:51,360
Speaker 2: It really is. It's like I need to be able

977
00:56:51,880 --> 00:56:54,880
Speaker 2: to feel safe enough to have these conversations because it

978
00:56:55,520 --> 00:56:58,839
Speaker 2: makes me who I am and I'm not ashamed of it.

979
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:02,319
Speaker 1: And your healing other people in the process, and how

980
00:57:02,440 --> 00:57:08,080
Speaker 1: we will do that's life. Naked Sports written and executive

981
00:57:08,120 --> 00:57:12,360
Speaker 1: produced by me Carrie Champion, produced by jacqueses Thomas, sound

982
00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:16,880
Speaker 1: design and mastered by Dwayne Crawford. Associate producer Olabusaio. Shabby

983
00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,360
Speaker 1: Naked Sports is a part of the Black Effect podcast

984
00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:20,640
Speaker 1: network in iHeartMedia