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Speaker 1: Now, lady, it doesn't matter how old you are. We

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Speaker 1: all have to navigate love, life, work, and the rest

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Speaker 1: of the world. But you don't have to do it alone.

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Speaker 1: We want to introduce you to Taylor, Jennifer and Cheryl,

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Speaker 1: three black women speaking across three generations, tackling the questions

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Speaker 1: that bring us into focus.

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Speaker 2: This is What Magic Happens, a new weekly podcast made

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Speaker 2: by and four black women across generations. Today, we want

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Speaker 2: to share an episode where the women discuss body image,

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Speaker 2: body trends, and body acceptance. Plus you'll hear from their guests,

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Speaker 2: plus size model MICHAELA. Jewerson as she explains why everyone

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Speaker 2: is wrong. We hope you enjoy it and if you

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Speaker 2: want to hear more, search for When Magic Happens from

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Speaker 2: wb Z and start listening today.

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Speaker 3: You are flooding it. What are you going?

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Speaker 4: Are you?

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Speaker 3: What are you saying? You know, there's like that's one

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Speaker 3: of the thing why people do instead of giving you

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Speaker 3: a compliment, where are you going? Okay, Okay, that's a compliment.

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Speaker 5: From wb e Z Chicago, This is When Magic Happens.

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Speaker 5: I'm Taylor Coward and I'm here with Cheryl Jackson and

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Speaker 5: Jennifer shay Love long and today we're talking all things

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Speaker 5: body and body image.

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Speaker 4: I had to go to therapy for that.

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Speaker 3: Craig, let's roll up on Crig. Okay.

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Speaker 5: We're chatting about our bodies, our relationships to them, and

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Speaker 5: the lessons our bodies have taught us. And later we

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Speaker 5: talked to Mikayla Doorson. She's a Plus five model, photographer

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Speaker 5: and voiceover artists, and she tells us about the triumphs

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Speaker 5: and the challenges of working in an image based industry.

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Speaker 4: I developed a mantra that everything they made fun of

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Speaker 4: me for is going to make me money one day. Wow.

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Speaker 4: And I started saying it all the time.

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Speaker 3: That's coming up.

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Speaker 5: So, Cheryl Jennifer, what was your relationship like with your

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Speaker 5: bodies growing up?

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Speaker 6: I have a moment that I remember about my relationship

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Speaker 6: with my body. I was in my middle school's drill

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Speaker 6: team and I had to wear one of you know

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Speaker 6: those little skirts, those little cheerleader skirts. And at the time,

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Speaker 6: you know, we were wearing like pantyhose and then like

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Speaker 6: the skirt. But there was this guy in middle school.

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Speaker 6: Can I say his name? I almost say it, Craig

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Speaker 6: Walker own blasts, okay, and he you know, made the

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Speaker 6: comment thunder thighs, and I'm like, you know, in middle school,

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Speaker 6: that is when you are the most impressionable, right, Like

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Speaker 6: that stuck with me for so long, and I would

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Speaker 6: I would say that that's not necessararly something that I

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Speaker 6: thought about, but I certainly have thought about it since

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Speaker 6: that time, you know, and it certainly shifted how I

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Speaker 6: looked at my body. Just that one comment shifted how

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Speaker 6: I looked at my body.

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Speaker 4: I had to go to therapy for that.

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Speaker 3: Craig walking up on Crag.

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Speaker 6: But I know, in all seriousness, though, I feel like

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Speaker 6: I had a pretty healthy relationship with my body. Like

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Speaker 6: I like the feeling of working out, I like the

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Speaker 6: feeling of walking being outside. I grew up in a

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Speaker 6: space when I was outside, we used to go skiing

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Speaker 6: and hiking and all this other kind of stuff. And

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Speaker 6: so I grew up valuing a relationship with my body

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Speaker 6: that it was kind of my vessel to be able

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Speaker 6: to do all of these really you know, kind of

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Speaker 6: fun active things. How about you, guys.

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Speaker 3: So I grew up in Memphis, and you know, the

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Speaker 3: girls are curvy and big and chocolate lit, and I

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Speaker 3: wasn't those things. So I was a what they referred

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Speaker 3: to at the time as a bean pole. I was

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Speaker 3: so skinny, Yes, tall and skinny, and I just I

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Speaker 3: just didn't fit in in Memphis. You know, you gotta

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Speaker 3: be a big house. Okay. Was it thirty six, twenty

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Speaker 3: four six? I was twenty ten twenty Okay. But I

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Speaker 3: had great self reception and self confidence. And I think

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Speaker 3: I can thank my mother for that of normalizing my

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Speaker 3: body for me. And I didn't know that it was

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Speaker 3: a desirable thing until I left Memphis and went to Chicago.

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Speaker 3: I came to Chicago and they were like, where did

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Speaker 3: you get those abs? Where did you get it? Was

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Speaker 3: my body type was more valued or more appreciated outside

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Speaker 3: of the South.

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Speaker 4: What was for you, Jennifer.

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Speaker 5: Did you notice that there was a preferred body type

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Speaker 5: in New Mexico? Oh?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 6: That's That's such an interesting point because I I had

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Speaker 6: a similar experience where, you know, in New Mexico, I

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Speaker 6: was maybe I was too thick. You know, they used

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Speaker 6: to call me Bowers, but right that was my main name.

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Speaker 6: But anyway, and but when I went away to college,

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Speaker 6: it was like I went to Hampton, Okay, said yeah,

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Speaker 6: it was like, oh wow, it's a nice little budget

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Speaker 6: got on. So yeah, definitely a little bit different, how

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Speaker 6: about you, Taylor.

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Speaker 5: I feel like I'm fortunate to have grown up when

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Speaker 5: I did, because I feel like bodies were much more

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Speaker 5: accepted of different shapes and abilities by the time I.

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Speaker 4: Was coming up.

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Speaker 5: I watch a lot of the Golden Girls, and I

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Speaker 5: always tell people like I probably couldn't have survived the

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Speaker 5: eighties because the worst thing that you could say to

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Speaker 5: one of the Golden Girls is that their butt looks big.

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Speaker 5: They like, go up, you know, And now you know,

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Speaker 5: butts are the thing at this present moment, and so,

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Speaker 5: you know, bodies, it's so interesting.

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Speaker 4: They have trends.

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Speaker 5: They probably shouldn't, but we definitely have trends in what's

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Speaker 5: favored at the time, and so it's so interesting to

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Speaker 5: hear that despite the trends of you know, the mainstream,

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Speaker 5: there were still regional differences.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, the name I got a lot was Olive Oil.

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Speaker 3: I don't remember Papa, Oh I loved her though, Olive

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Speaker 3: Oil it was. It was a big nickname for me

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Speaker 3: and my brothers. You know, I have three brothers, and

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Speaker 3: they used to tease me, Cheryl, what's that hanging from

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Speaker 3: your skirt? And I looked down. I was thinking it's

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Speaker 3: a piece of thread. They were like, oh, my bad.

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Speaker 3: You know those are your legs. I thought there was

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Speaker 3: a piece of thread. Oh yes, So this is what

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Speaker 3: I grew up with, being so thin.

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Speaker 5: But it was it was once favored like olive oil.

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Speaker 5: Maybe was drawn after like a twenties flapper or something,

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Speaker 5: you know what I mean.

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Speaker 3: Like yeah, but then here's the darker side of it,

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Speaker 3: that people would assume I had a eating disorder, you know,

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Speaker 3: because of my size. And it was just frustrate me.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I'll be angry, like what are you

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Speaker 3: talking about?

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Speaker 5: I don't are you one of those people that just

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Speaker 5: struggle to put on weight.

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Speaker 3: I struggle to put on weight. I would like try

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Speaker 3: to drink milkshakes every day. And but I was is

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Speaker 3: my DNA? You know, It's just I was, you know,

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Speaker 3: my tall and lanky people or in my in my

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Speaker 3: in my family. And but then, you know, like I said,

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Speaker 3: in certain circles, it was just like, oh, wow, you

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Speaker 3: should be a model. You should. I was five ten

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Speaker 3: and and I fit a certain profile and so so

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Speaker 3: in certain circles, in certain places, it was really you know,

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Speaker 3: desired body type. But I'm liking today that you know,

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Speaker 3: the inclusiveness of a spectrum of body type is where

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Speaker 3: we should be.

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Speaker 5: Where do you think you fit on that spectrum? You know,

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Speaker 5: I think we have many labels at the moment. You know,

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Speaker 5: we were introduced with slim thick from Fetti Wop. We

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Speaker 5: got just just different shapes of the black silhouette.

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Speaker 4: Where do you think that you fall on our spectrum?

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Speaker 4: What thick mean?

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Speaker 7: Like?

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Speaker 5: You know, unfortunately, I think when people say thick, they

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Speaker 5: are imagining, you know, thick in the places that are

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Speaker 5: not a gut or an arm. You know, it's like fine, yeah,

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Speaker 5: It's like it's a desired shape that's probably not that realistic.

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Speaker 5: So slim thick I brought that up because I when

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Speaker 5: I first heard that, I took that to mean, you know,

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Speaker 5: no belly, tiny ways, huge behind. Just yeah, just where

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Speaker 5: are we shape wise? I think I'll share first, I

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Speaker 5: think I'm a pair okay, yeah, not much up top,

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Speaker 5: a whole lot of southern at the bottom.

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Speaker 6: I think I would I would fall in the gosh,

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Speaker 6: I guess. Okay, So so there's pear shape, there's apples, apples,

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Speaker 6: more fruits, So you know, I guess I've maybe fall

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Speaker 6: maybe the I think I've been described as thick.

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Speaker 4: Are you an hour glass? Just come out and say it.

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Speaker 3: Okay, my body has changed over the years. You know

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Speaker 3: I was little on top and fuller on the bottom,

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Speaker 3: and you know we had breast cancer and had a mistectomy.

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Speaker 3: So he says, an opportunity to upgrade on the top.

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Speaker 3: So I got that upgrade going so uh so, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I got you know, up top and bottom. You know,

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Speaker 3: I got some junk in the trunk now. Uh so, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'm I'm what they call what I've been told statuesque all.

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Speaker 5: Yes, so you brought up your your breast cancer journey.

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Speaker 5: Are there were there any other pivotal events in your

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Speaker 5: life that changed the way you thought about your body

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Speaker 5: or how you perceived it.

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Speaker 3: Oh, that's a good question. The biggest for me was

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Speaker 3: breast cancer.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Now you know, I'm fighting menopause. So it's a thing.

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Speaker 3: It's a thing. Fight, fight, because I'm telling you what,

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Speaker 3: the devil is a lie.

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Speaker 5: Okay, you are conquering, and to conquer I go and

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Speaker 5: have a mental alsel belly.

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Speaker 3: You're not doing that today, not today or tomorrow. I'm

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Speaker 3: trying to take sexy to the end and so I

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Speaker 3: gotta you know, I'm gearing up for the fight. But

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Speaker 3: uh no, it's just it's it's it's a thing. Actually,

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Speaker 3: even before you know, my mental pauzzle period kicked in

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Speaker 3: because of breast cancer and other you know issues, I

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Speaker 3: had a hysterect I mean, these things turn your estrogen

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Speaker 3: levels off immediately, and so and that's what keeps you,

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Speaker 3: you know, from gaining this weight. We need estrogen to

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Speaker 3: control that. And then so my estrogen levels were cut

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Speaker 3: off overnight and they have a profound effect and impact

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Speaker 3: on your body. But you know, that last half full

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Speaker 3: is forcing me to be very healthy, okay, healthily and

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Speaker 3: uh uh and extras. But yeah, I think that's the

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Speaker 3: thing now with me and my crew. This is real.

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Speaker 6: I think having mine was having kids. I weighed more

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Speaker 6: than my ex at the time, and I was like,

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Speaker 6: you know, just feeling very new for you.

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Speaker 5: Uh yeah, okay, I like I like grew up that way.

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Speaker 5: But like, you know, I remember sitting next to a

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Speaker 5: boy and I would I had to have been like

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Speaker 5: fourth grade or something, and just this just this, the

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Speaker 5: comparison of our thighs. I was just like, I two

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Speaker 5: of your thighs is a quart a quarter of my

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Speaker 5: thigh and so I had to learn to be okay

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Speaker 5: with that, I guess really young of like my structure

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Speaker 5: in my frame is just going to be bigger than

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Speaker 5: most of the people around me. And so I'm curious

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Speaker 5: of like, as an adult, what was that experience, like

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Speaker 5: in that realization.

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Speaker 6: When you're carrying a child, it's like you're you're fueling it.

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Speaker 6: So I was very like, Okay, I'm gonna eat what

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Speaker 6: I want to eat. I'm doing all of these things

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Speaker 6: to nurture this human inside of me, and whatever that,

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Speaker 6: whatever that kind of takes, that's what I'm going to do.

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Speaker 6: And so I think as I've kind of grown, my

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Speaker 6: relationship with my body has been more about like, Wow,

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Speaker 6: the things this thing can do, you know, even in

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Speaker 6: the midst of illness, even in the midst of having children,

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Speaker 6: even you know, overcoming like you know, pushing yourself to

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Speaker 6: to do a hike that you've never done before. Like,

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Speaker 6: I think I have a different relationship with my body

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Speaker 6: in the sense that, like I value its strength and

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Speaker 6: I also reckon andies its vulnerabilities too.

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Speaker 5: For me, the pandemic was a big shift for me

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Speaker 5: of just like because I would be hesitant to wear

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Speaker 5: a swimsuit outside before, like in high school when people

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Speaker 5: were smaller than I was, or having my arms out

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Speaker 5: was a problem for me. But then when I saw

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Speaker 5: people like getting COVID and dying and like school having

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Speaker 5: to end and life being put on pause, you just

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Speaker 5: see that like you just got to live and the

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Speaker 5: body that you have right now, be grateful for it,

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Speaker 5: however it looks, whatever it.

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Speaker 4: Does, things maybe it can't.

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Speaker 5: Do, it's still yours, and just enjoy it as much

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Speaker 5: as you can. And I think a lot of people

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Speaker 5: in my generation are thinking of it as this is

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Speaker 5: my body and it does essential functions and I'm just

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Speaker 5: gonna accept it as it is. And I hope that

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Speaker 5: that can bleed into even older generations because we should

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Speaker 5: all feel that way.

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Speaker 6: I was walking through Target and I noticed, you know,

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Speaker 6: all of the different images. The imagery has changed, right,

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Speaker 6: the body type imagery has changed, and like even on Athleta,

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Speaker 6: the body type imagery has also changed. And I love that,

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Speaker 6: Like I think, you know, it is really empowering to

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Speaker 6: recognize that, like you, you could be any type you know,

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Speaker 6: and there is your there's just value yourself. Yeah, and

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Speaker 6: you can finally see yourself and.

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Speaker 4: There's a place for everybody.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely. I knew things had changed when Barbie Okay, when

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Speaker 3: Barbie changed, Okay.

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Speaker 6: So what was that? That's a pivotal moment, is Barbie

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Speaker 6: like seeing yourself?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, Taylor, when when did.

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Speaker 6: You you sort of say that's me, Like I get

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Speaker 6: to see myself.

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Speaker 5: I feel like that's that's happened more recently, you know,

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Speaker 5: with Lizzo's, Nicole Byers, even just a lot of influencers

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Speaker 5: on Instagram, and so just seeing that and it being

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Speaker 5: normalized and blowing up has been important to see.

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Speaker 4: I love Rihanna's.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and even and even for men, like she's really

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Speaker 5: doing it is.

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Speaker 4: Yes.

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Speaker 5: Coming up, we're talking to Mikayla Doers, Emmy Award winning

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Speaker 5: talent model and photographer who tells us why everybody is

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Speaker 5: wrong and why we should listen to our body. Mikayla

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Speaker 5: Doerson is a self made multi hyphen it. She's a

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Speaker 5: self taught photographer, professional model, and she's not here to

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Speaker 5: sugarcoat anything about growing into your body, redefining your body narrative,

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Speaker 5: and trusting your gut, whether it be flat or round.

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Speaker 7: It all started when I was five years old. I

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Speaker 7: wanted to be a model. I always wanted to be

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Speaker 7: a model. My mom was a model, so I wanted

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Speaker 7: to be a model. And yeah, so I told my

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Speaker 7: mom I wanted to be a model, and she immediately

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Speaker 7: put me in gymnastics. I was so mad, but she

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Speaker 7: just said gymnastics would give me the confidence I needed

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Speaker 7: to model, and she wasn't wrong.

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Speaker 4: Wow. Can you talk.

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Speaker 5: About some of the things you learned in gymnastics that

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Speaker 5: you still use use and modeling.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: So one of the things which if you weren't if

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Speaker 7: you weren't a gymnast, you would not probably know this,

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Speaker 7: but you lose points if you pick a wedgie. Legit,

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Speaker 7: you will lose Back then, it was a tenth of

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Speaker 7: a point every time you adjusted your leotardest specifically if

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Speaker 7: you picked the weggie. And I was one of two

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Speaker 7: black girls on my team, and we were fuller than

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Speaker 7: the other girls, so like my booty.

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Speaker 4: Was eating up that leotard and point. Yeah.

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Speaker 7: So you're out there tumbling and like the thing is

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Speaker 7: saying like it's out yeah, and if you want your points,

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Speaker 7: you don't touch it, so you just it taught me

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Speaker 7: to focus on the task at hand outside of what

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Speaker 7: my body looked like. Wow, And I don't think I've

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Speaker 7: ever actualized their realization till just now, but that is

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Speaker 7: what it taught me, like, you had to focus on

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Speaker 7: the task at hand outside of what your body looked like.

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Speaker 5: So with a model mother, with gymnastics and being an athlete,

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Speaker 5: what was your relationship like growing up with your body?

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Speaker 3: Girl?

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Speaker 7: I developed boobs in fifth grade and big ones, bless

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Speaker 7: your heart, big ones. I remember my grandma, my grandma,

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Speaker 7: my mom's mom, pulled me to the side one summer

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Speaker 7: and she was like, baby, you're developing grapes.

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Speaker 4: Do you know what your grapes saw? And I was

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Speaker 4: looking at her and I was like, uh, yes, Grandma,

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Speaker 4: And she's like, we're gonna go get you some braziers.

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Speaker 7: And so she and my mom had set it up

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Speaker 7: for my dad to take me and it was made

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Speaker 7: in form oh, and I got measured and they gave

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Speaker 7: me braws and stuff. But yeah, I developed in fifth grade.

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Speaker 7: I was still competing and I had to wear a

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Speaker 7: sports bra in a regular braw underneath my leotards. At

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Speaker 7: some point my boobs got so big that I wore

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Speaker 7: a regular fire bra and a sports bra and two

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Speaker 7: leotards to tumble and hold them down.

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Speaker 4: Wow.

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Speaker 7: And I remember in like eighth grade, I was like

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Speaker 7: one hundred and twenty pounds, and maybe I was like

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Speaker 7: I don't know, maybe I was around the peak of

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Speaker 7: my height five six five seven, and I was a

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Speaker 7: double D. I was only thirty eight double D in

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Speaker 7: eighth grade at one hundred and twenty pounds. I'm one

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Speaker 7: hundred more pounds more than that right now, I imagine

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Speaker 7: that frame.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, did you have back problem?

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Speaker 7: Girl?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 7: I was on Celebres, which is like it's an arthritis medicine,

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Speaker 7: and it was causing people to have heart attacks and

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Speaker 7: my parents to be off of it.

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Speaker 5: You were like, I'm a little young for the seventh

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Speaker 5: grade heart attack.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean I was taking it partly because of

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Speaker 7: gymnastics I'd injured myself, but it was also like I

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Speaker 7: just had, you know, this heavy weight. So the way

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Speaker 7: I describe it to people is picture you know the

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Speaker 7: twenty five pound weights at the gym, the big ones.

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Speaker 7: Take two of those, tie them together with one shoe

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Speaker 7: string and hang it around your neck and then live

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Speaker 7: like that forever. So now that you're in your career.

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Speaker 7: Have you found that the girls have been an issue girl? Yes,

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Speaker 7: and that people wouldn't I think if you're not in

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Speaker 7: the industry, you might not think so.

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Speaker 4: But there are still so many brands that are scared

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Speaker 4: of boobs.

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Speaker 7: Really, yes, people in general, Like I'm a Christian, so

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Speaker 7: there's the church and then there's the world, and they

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Speaker 7: both respond the same way to boobs, which is absolutely

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Speaker 7: utterly ridiculous to me, because we're all so offended by

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Speaker 7: something that fed us. Yeah, gave live literal nourishment. And

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Speaker 7: nine times out of ten, ten times out of ten,

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Speaker 7: eleven times out of ten, if I'm around another woman

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Speaker 7: with a big chest, we're not distracted. She could have

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Speaker 7: her whole chest out. I'm not distracted by her chest,

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Speaker 7: but everybody else is distracted. And so I dealt with

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Speaker 7: comments about body from a very very young age, and

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Speaker 7: it like it never stopped me from doing anything. As

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Speaker 7: a matter of fact, I developed a mantra during that

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Speaker 7: season of my life that everything they made fun of

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Speaker 7: me for is going to make me money one day. Wow,

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Speaker 7: And I started saying it all the time.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: And so now that you are making the money looking

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Speaker 5: the gigs, can we get into the story of your

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Speaker 5: first modeling gig.

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Speaker 7: That was Kirby Kate. A stranger told me they thought

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Speaker 7: I'd win this brad competition on Twitter, and I entered

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Speaker 7: and I made it to the top ten out of

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Speaker 7: like a thousand girls. Interestingly enough, when I did Kirby Kate,

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Speaker 7: you had to get votes, okay, And I was singing

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Speaker 7: in a choir at my church, my church at the

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Speaker 7: time that when I was going to it was like

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Speaker 7: one percent of Lake County's population, as a lot of

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Speaker 7: people go to that church. And I was like, I

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Speaker 7: get a lot of votes here. It was bra Molling,

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Speaker 7: so we have like this women's thing and I went

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Speaker 7: to the women of the church and I was like, hey, guys,

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Speaker 7: this was when I was a lot less bold, and

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Speaker 7: I was like, I'm in this model search and I

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Speaker 7: really need votes and it really means a lot to

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Speaker 7: me if you guys a vote. And one of the

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Speaker 7: mothers of the church was like she found out, you know,

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Speaker 7: it was bron modeling, and she's like, what.

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Speaker 4: Are you gonna do if a man sees you and

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Speaker 4: you know.

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Speaker 7: He's distracted from his wife or something like that. Oh,

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Speaker 7: modeling underwear. Some you know some of that like that.

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Speaker 7: And I looked at her and I said, when you

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Speaker 7: go to Walmart and you buypack underwear, do you sit

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Speaker 7: there and interced and pray for the woman on the.

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Speaker 4: Package or do you just hope they fit you right?

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Speaker 5: And she was like, ooh, since you are a plus

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Speaker 5: sized model that's in an industry that's based on body

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Speaker 5: and spectacle, do you feel like the mo modeling industry

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Speaker 5: has gotten to a place where it adequately holds space

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Speaker 5: for larger frames or plus sized bodies.

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Speaker 4: Almost? Okay, almost.

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Speaker 7: I think it's doing a great job starting to implement

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Speaker 7: men love seeing.

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Speaker 4: Like a savage. Yeah, but you know, I think Target

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Speaker 4: might have been first.

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Speaker 7: Okay, out of all the brands, I think Target does

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Speaker 7: the best job.

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Speaker 5: Okay, So what are some more specific things that you

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Speaker 5: if you could change today about your industry you would do?

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Speaker 7: Oh my gosh, I'm so bad that I'm here. I

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Speaker 7: am the underrepresented frame. Okay, I'm gonna shake the table.

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Speaker 7: I'm gonna shake the room because let me tell you something.

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Speaker 7: I have been in plus size conversations where they're.

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Speaker 4: Like, yeah, but you're big, titty fat, you don't count.

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Speaker 4: Get into it.

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Speaker 7: Quote unquote, So like I still have to purchase things

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Speaker 7: and wonder what they're gonna look like me on me,

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Speaker 7: I buy two simsuits and guess what my mom does.

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Speaker 4: So's the tops.

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Speaker 7: Together get out because they don't show it on a

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Speaker 7: bustier frame. What you'll see and thank God that you

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Speaker 7: see it. You'll see our glass which depending on my angle,

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Speaker 7: I will look that way because I know how to pose,

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Speaker 7: you'll see apple. You'll see more hips than chest more

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Speaker 7: often than not. Almost everybody that's booking a whole bunch.

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Speaker 3: It's a look.

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Speaker 4: Is light skinned, its curly, hairy, is no belly.

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Speaker 7: But the reason why they have a small waist is

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Speaker 7: because it's hips and their chest is very small, like

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Speaker 7: a lot of those girls are like B and A cups.

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Speaker 7: Maybe it's small sea, but that's why the waist looks

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Speaker 7: so small, because your breast it fills in some of

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Speaker 7: that area like it actually like wraps around you. Those

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Speaker 7: are the body types you will see more often than not.

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00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 7: You're not going to see very many inverted triangles or

442
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 7: bust your girls. So I think the industry needs to

443
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 7: wake up because you and your mama look like.

444
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 4: That, and so come on.

445
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 5: Is there I hear curve model and I see plus

446
00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:26,000
Speaker 5: size model. Are some of those differences that you named

447
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:30,040
Speaker 5: what dictate which you are or are those interchangeable phrases?

448
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:35,200
Speaker 7: It depends on the region that you're in and who

449
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:40,680
Speaker 7: you're talking to, and possibly the race of the person

450
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:42,600
Speaker 7: you're talking to, because I believe at the end of

451
00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 7: the day, most black models we built like this. So

452
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,119
Speaker 7: like even like the straight sized models that are black

453
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 7: still got like like butt or like something about them.

454
00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 7: I think like plus size and body positivity, if it

455
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,639
Speaker 7: didn't start this way, almost feels this way, but it

456
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,800
Speaker 7: kind of just feels like a way for white women

457
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:10,320
Speaker 7: or those that are really attached to a Eurocentric idea

458
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 7: of beauty to make themselves feel better because I feel

459
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,439
Speaker 7: like more of my white friends their moms like growing up,

460
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 7: were like, you need to lose weight, you need to

461
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:19,120
Speaker 7: eating that, you need to, you need to.

462
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:20,120
Speaker 4: But like I don't.

463
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 7: I didn't experience that in my family, and like, so

464
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:27,359
Speaker 7: I think there's there's more to it than just that,

465
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,200
Speaker 7: But a lot of the decision makers are still of

466
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,320
Speaker 7: one type of person.

467
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:38,040
Speaker 5: So I wonder it sounds like maybe we need we

468
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 5: need plus size, and maybe even plus size black people.

469
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 4: We need way Yes, yeah, yes, yes.

470
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 5: So do you have any career advice or encouragement for

471
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 5: aspiring models, particularly those who feel like they may differ

472
00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:59,240
Speaker 5: from the current favored Look.

473
00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:03,959
Speaker 7: Yeah, the first thought I had was everybody is wrong. Okay,

474
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 7: most people didn't think I would do the things I've done,

475
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,760
Speaker 7: been the places that I've been. I've walked in New

476
00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 7: York Fashion Week, in Spring studios, I've been in Harper's Bazaar,

477
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 7: Now Magazine online, i won an Emmy. I did all

478
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:24,120
Speaker 7: these things around thirty three and two hundred and twenty

479
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:29,280
Speaker 7: five something pounds. Everybody's wrong. Whatever you believe, it will

480
00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:36,840
Speaker 7: be as Bible. That's some philosopher, but it's the honest truth.

481
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 7: And so if you're believing something about you at any age,

482
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 7: in any condition, if I think that I can up

483
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 7: until the point of ninety nine million, no's everybody's wrong.

484
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 3: I love that. That was the line for me, big

485
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:13,479
Speaker 3: titty fat Look when she said that if we all

486
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:16,600
Speaker 3: knew what she meant, we all knew it. Okay, maybe

487
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 3: Jennifer didn't know, but girl, first of all, you toned

488
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 3: us all get out. Okay, So that number one, But

489
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:32,920
Speaker 3: it resonated like big titty fat nel said it needed

490
00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 3: no explanation. I loved it.

491
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 5: And she doesn't sugarcoat and she's no nonsense, and I

492
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 5: there is a push for the word fat to be accepted.

493
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:48,719
Speaker 5: It's not derogatory. It's just the shape of a body.

494
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,760
Speaker 5: And so I think that, you know, the more that

495
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 5: we just say what it is.

496
00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 3: Then it's like big titty fat exactly, what about you, Jennifer.

497
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 6: I liked her story about losing points for the wedgie

498
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 6: if you pick the wedgie, you know, and mainly because

499
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,400
Speaker 6: I'm like, you know there she What she was saying

500
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 6: to in my mind was like, I'm going to do

501
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 6: this regardless, regardless of these sort of parameters that are

502
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 6: sent or set around me losing points if I pick it.

503
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 6: You know, I just I still. I was inspired that

504
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 6: she was like, I'm I'm gonna do it anyway. And also,

505
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:37,960
Speaker 6: everybody is wrong. If they tell you not to actually

506
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 6: go for your dream and do what is meant for

507
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:45,960
Speaker 6: you to fulfill your purpose, then you know they wrong.

508
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:49,959
Speaker 3: She she gave this conversation with her it was like

509
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:55,200
Speaker 3: a masterclass and being unshakable about who you are, being

510
00:31:55,520 --> 00:32:00,040
Speaker 3: holy centered and cozy in your.

511
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:06,120
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean that was the mic drop we've done.

512
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 5: And then Beyonce sue us the high Hell love you girl,

513
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:24,000
Speaker 5: See you in July. And that's it for our body episode.

514
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 5: If you like what you heard, be sure to subscribe,

515
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,560
Speaker 5: rate us on Apple Podcasts and tune in every Friday

516
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 5: for your dose When Magic Happens, and follow us on

517
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 5: Instagram at When Magic Happens Podcast and.

518
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 3: Girl, we want to add you to the group chat.

519
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:41,920
Speaker 3: Our email address is Magic at wbe z dot org.

520
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 3: Send us an email or a voice memo. What do

521
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:47,920
Speaker 3: you want to hear on the show? The questions do

522
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 3: you want us to get to the bottom of let

523
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 3: us know we want to hear from you.

524
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 5: Special thanks to our guest Mikayla Dourson for joining us today.

525
00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 5: You can find more about her on Instagram at Mikayla Dourson.

526
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:05,240
Speaker 5: When Magic Happens is a production of WB Easy Chicago.

527
00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 5: Our Truly Magical producer is Brianna Garrett. Kevin Dawson is

528
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:13,640
Speaker 5: our executive producer, Tracy Brown as Chief Content Officer. Editing

529
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 5: by Justin Bull, Engineering by Dave Miska, Haley Bloomquist and

530
00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:18,120
Speaker 5: j R.

531
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 4: Strauss. See y'all next week.

532
00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 1: O m G. Such a great episode, Lady. We hope

533
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,480
Speaker 1: you enjoyed this week's featured episode. If you want to

534
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 1: hear more, search for When Magic Happens from WBEAZ and

535
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:37,920
Speaker 1: start listening today. You can catch Domini on the Cultivating

536
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:42,360
Speaker 1: her Space podcast every single week. We drop episodes every

537
00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 1: single Friday like clockwork, so we hope to see you there,

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00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 1: and Lady, we'll talk to you soon