WEBVTT - The Lost Episode: Nazis for Ron Paul: Curtis Maynard, Pt. 2 0:00:01.680 --> 0:00:09.680 Cool Zone Media. In December of two thousand and seven, 0:00:10.640 --> 0:00:14.680 a neo Nazi named Bill White was very angry and 0:00:15.120 --> 0:00:20.480 very online. That wasn't out of character for him. His 0:00:20.520 --> 0:00:23.720 habit of lashing out that anyone he disagreed with would 0:00:23.920 --> 0:00:29.280 eventually land him in federal prison. He threatened and timidated, docked, 0:00:29.320 --> 0:00:33.680 and harassed people for years, members of the jury that 0:00:33.760 --> 0:00:38.120 convicted white supremacist leader Matt Hale, a prosecutor handling a 0:00:38.120 --> 0:00:41.239 case against members of a white supremacist militia, and Florida 0:00:42.159 --> 0:00:45.800 tenants who sued him for housing discrimination, and his own 0:00:45.840 --> 0:00:50.280 ex wife. He was a menace on the Nazi message boards, 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:55.520 and just before Christmas in two thousand and seven, he 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:58.480 got into a fight with a former friend that would 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:05.520 send that man into a deadly downward spiral. I'm Molly Conger, 0:01:06.440 --> 0:01:24.760 and this is the lost episode of Weird Little Guys. 0:01:27.440 --> 0:01:32.640 For all the side stories, digressions, tangents, and the months 0:01:32.680 --> 0:01:36.280 this episode has been lost, this has always been a 0:01:36.319 --> 0:01:41.600 story about Curtis Maynard, the Holocaust denial blogger who murdered 0:01:41.600 --> 0:01:44.920 his ex wife and then died by suicide in twenty ten. 0:01:46.840 --> 0:01:51.400 But if I'm being entirely honest with you, it's really 0:01:51.440 --> 0:01:56.600 only barely about Curtis Maynard. His story, told on its 0:01:56.600 --> 0:02:00.760 own is pretty short, and you already know it. It 0:02:00.840 --> 0:02:04.200 was in part one. He was a Holocaust denier who 0:02:04.280 --> 0:02:06.360 hoped to make a career as a white supremacist writer. 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:10.280 He had a short rise to minor fame in his 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:13.919 horrible little corner of the Internet, and then a sudden 0:02:13.960 --> 0:02:19.360 fall from grace. He spiraled after his second divorce, and 0:02:19.400 --> 0:02:21.920 he shot himself in the head while fleeing from the 0:02:21.919 --> 0:02:26.960 police after murdering the mother of his children. I'm not 0:02:27.240 --> 0:02:31.440 interested in a straightforward true crime narrative about an act 0:02:31.440 --> 0:02:36.360 of domestic violence. In the story about Curtis Baynard, that 0:02:36.480 --> 0:02:40.000 I think is more interesting. He's only a bit player. 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:44.959 The stories playing out all around him in the last 0:02:45.040 --> 0:02:50.640 few years of his life are full of weird little guys, 0:02:51.880 --> 0:03:01.160 guys like Bill White. William Alexander White is not a 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:06.359 man I'm quite ready to explain. Even still, his role 0:03:06.400 --> 0:03:11.280 in this story makes him unavoidable, and I will write 0:03:11.280 --> 0:03:16.280 about him eventually, because he's a man I've spent years 0:03:16.880 --> 0:03:22.399 thinking about and hundreds of hours reading, mostly by way 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:28.320 of his voluminous vexatious court filings from federal prison. He'll 0:03:28.320 --> 0:03:31.440 have his day on the show, I promise, But until 0:03:31.440 --> 0:03:35.040 then he is going to keep popping up in a 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:40.600 lot of other people's stories. He's almost always there. You 0:03:40.680 --> 0:03:43.360 might even remember him from a brief aside in an 0:03:43.360 --> 0:03:47.520 episode that aired last November, the episode about Ethan Melzer, 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:51.120 the US Army soldier who leaked classified troop movements to 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:54.560 what he thought was Al Qaeda, but it turned out 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:59.279 to be a mentally ill Canadian teenager. In that episode, 0:03:59.400 --> 0:04:02.560 I was talking about the ideological shift within the neo 0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:06.320 Nazi group Adam Woffin, as some of its members gravitated 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:10.280 towards the magical satanism of the Order of Nine Angles. 0:04:11.240 --> 0:04:14.640 And it wasn't until several members of Adam Woffin ended 0:04:14.720 --> 0:04:18.000 up in court that it was revealed that Joshua Caleb 0:04:18.040 --> 0:04:20.400 Sutter had been working for the FBI for a decade 0:04:21.560 --> 0:04:24.440 and as a dedicated reader of Bill White's lawsuits against 0:04:24.480 --> 0:04:28.280 the government. I know that Bill had been saying that 0:04:29.080 --> 0:04:32.599 for years. I mean, Bill has a lot of theories 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:36.160 about who might be an informant, but you can't deny 0:04:36.200 --> 0:04:43.279 he was right about Sutter. Bill White is a Nazi. 0:04:44.279 --> 0:04:48.320 That much is probably obvious by now, but he's also 0:04:49.240 --> 0:04:53.240 kind of a drama queen. Before he became a jail 0:04:53.279 --> 0:04:58.760 house lawyer, he was an incessant blogger, and in all 0:04:58.880 --> 0:05:04.239 his years in the movement, he was never not a problem. 0:05:04.640 --> 0:05:07.480 He was stirring up shit in a way that can 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:13.680 only be described as pathological, and that might be because 0:05:13.720 --> 0:05:19.800 it was normally. I think it would be unfair to 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:23.880 speculate about someone's mental health based on what they're writing 0:05:23.880 --> 0:05:28.359 in their blog. But in Bill's case, I have some 0:05:28.480 --> 0:05:33.320 proof because for some reason, he once filed a complete 0:05:33.360 --> 0:05:36.839 copy of his own psyche vow as an exhibit in 0:05:36.880 --> 0:05:41.279 a court case. So I can tell you that several 0:05:41.360 --> 0:05:47.080 prison psychiatrists and court appointed forensic psychologists have diagnosed Bill 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:53.560 White with narcissistic personality disorder. That's a term that's seen 0:05:53.600 --> 0:05:57.960 a lot of abuse and popular online discourse, reducing it 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:01.640 to a meaningless epithet her that someone who's behaving badly, 0:06:02.839 --> 0:06:06.880 But it is a real clinical diagnosis, albeit a controversial one, 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:13.719 and it's a term with an actual meaning. Drawing directly 0:06:13.720 --> 0:06:18.400 from one of his evaluations, the doctor wrote the essential 0:06:18.440 --> 0:06:23.440 features of narcissistic personality disorder are a pervasive pattern of grandiosity, 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:27.680 need for admiration, and lack of empathy that begins in 0:06:27.760 --> 0:06:31.160 early adulthood and is present in a variety of contexts. 0:06:32.480 --> 0:06:35.200 Histrionic traits include a propensity for needing to be the 0:06:35.240 --> 0:06:39.120 center of attention, while antisocial traits refer to engaging in 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:45.719 activities that run counter to mainstream social norms. Now, I 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:49.320 want to be clear, I'm not saying that everyone with 0:06:49.360 --> 0:06:53.960 a personality disorder is a bad person. Having a personality 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:56.800 disorder doesn't make you a Nazi, it doesn't make you 0:06:56.839 --> 0:07:01.120 a criminal. It just so happens that Bill White has 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:04.920 a personality disorder and he is a Nazi and a criminal. 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:10.760 They don't always go together. This is a difficult condition 0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:14.960 to live with. There's no cure, and the nature of 0:07:15.000 --> 0:07:18.160 the condition often means that those living with it don't 0:07:18.200 --> 0:07:21.800 feel like they need treatment. But there are people who 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:25.360 manage to live relatively normal lives with the support of 0:07:25.400 --> 0:07:30.000 things like dialectical behavior therapy. So my intention is not 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:34.760 to slander everyone living with a personality disorder, but I 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:39.400 do think the diagnosis sheds some light on Bill White's behavior. 0:07:41.000 --> 0:07:46.080 He needs to be right. He needs to be the 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:52.080 center of attention. He'll do almost anything to get that attention, 0:07:53.120 --> 0:07:58.600 positive or negative, it barely matters, and any perceived slight 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:03.360 against him all the justification He needs to go absolutely 0:08:03.880 --> 0:08:11.800 nuclear in response. The white power movement is full of 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:15.640 men who attack their enemies, and there are plenty of 0:08:15.680 --> 0:08:18.880 them in the movement going after each other. There are 0:08:19.000 --> 0:08:24.480 power struggles, ideological disagreements, and just plain friction between guys 0:08:24.480 --> 0:08:29.320 with poor social skills. None of that is that unusual. 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:35.680 But even in that milieu, Bill White stands out because 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:42.400 Bill White had beef with everybody, and it was Bill 0:08:42.440 --> 0:08:46.920 White and his insatiable need for attention that drew Curtis 0:08:47.000 --> 0:08:50.520 Maynard into an online argument in December of two thousand 0:08:50.520 --> 0:08:55.280 and seven. It was Bill White's irresistible urge to lash 0:08:55.360 --> 0:08:58.600 out at anyone who crossed him that ended up ruining 0:08:58.679 --> 0:09:02.040 Curtis Maynard's reputation among the racists who read his Holocaust 0:09:02.040 --> 0:09:08.160 denile blog. On December nineteenth, two thousand and seven, Bill 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:13.439 White made a pretty big claim. He logged onto Vanguard 0:09:13.520 --> 0:09:17.760 News Network, a neo Nazi forum, and started a thread 0:09:17.840 --> 0:09:22.320 with the title ron Paul lies about lack of involvement 0:09:22.679 --> 0:09:30.320 with white nationalists, the Post read comrades. I have kept 0:09:30.400 --> 0:09:33.160 quiet about the Ron Paul campaign for a while because 0:09:33.160 --> 0:09:35.080 I didn't see any need to say anything that would 0:09:35.080 --> 0:09:39.120 cause any trouble. However, reading the latest release from his 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:42.360 campaign spokesman, I am compelled to tell the truth about 0:09:42.440 --> 0:09:47.480 Ron Paul's extensive involvement in white nationalism. Both Congressman Paul 0:09:47.559 --> 0:09:51.240 and his aides regularly meet with members of the Stormfront, 0:09:51.280 --> 0:09:56.000 set American Renaissance, the Institute for Historic Review, and others 0:09:56.320 --> 0:10:00.800 at the Tara Tai restaurant in Arlington, Virginia on Wednesdays. 0:10:02.000 --> 0:10:04.240 This is part of a dinner that was originally organized 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:07.280 by Pat Buchanan, Sam Francis, and Joe so Braun and 0:10:07.360 --> 0:10:09.280 has since been mostly taken over by the Council of 0:10:09.320 --> 0:10:14.120 Conservative Citizens. I have attended these dinners, seen Paul and 0:10:14.200 --> 0:10:17.000 his aides there, and been invited to his offices in 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:21.080 Washington to discuss policy. For his spokesman to call white 0:10:21.200 --> 0:10:27.440 racialism small ideology and claim white activists are wasting their 0:10:27.480 --> 0:10:32.080 money trying to influence Paul is ridiculous. Paul is a 0:10:32.120 --> 0:10:34.800 white nationalist of the Stormfront type who has always kept 0:10:34.800 --> 0:10:37.640 his racial views and his views about world Judaism quiet 0:10:38.200 --> 0:10:42.560 because of his political position. I don't know that it 0:10:42.600 --> 0:10:47.040 is necessarily good for Paul to expose this. However, he 0:10:47.120 --> 0:10:50.640 really is someone with extensive ties to white nationalism, and 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:52.520 for him to deny that in the belief he will 0:10:52.559 --> 0:10:56.760 be more respectable by denying it is outrageous. And I 0:10:56.880 --> 0:11:00.400 hate seeing people in the press who denounce racialism because 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:05.559 they think it is not fashionable. Bill White, Commander American 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:14.480 National Socialist Workers Party, Now, is that true? The short 0:11:14.520 --> 0:11:19.920 answer is legally no. I won't say that this Nazi 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:28.800 is telling the truth. Is it possible? Kind of yeah? 0:11:29.000 --> 0:11:33.240 Probably not, not exactly, not down to the details, but 0:11:34.520 --> 0:11:42.280 maybe a little yeah. But we'll get to that almost instantly, 0:11:43.000 --> 0:11:47.280 I mean, with a curious quickness. Conservative blogger Charles Foster 0:11:47.440 --> 0:11:50.720 Johnson picked up the story and he got a post 0:11:50.800 --> 0:11:55.000 up on his blog Little Green Footballs within hours of 0:11:55.040 --> 0:11:59.800 Bill posting this on the Nazi Forum and Johnson dug up. 0:12:00.000 --> 0:12:06.040 But looked like pretty damning receipts. Ron Paul's campaign finance 0:12:06.080 --> 0:12:10.640 reports filed with the Federal Election Commission do show that 0:12:10.720 --> 0:12:14.240 someone used campaign funds at a restaurant called Tara Tie 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:19.160 in Arlington eleven times in two thousand and seven, spending 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:24.319 about forty dollars once a month or so. Now, there's 0:12:24.320 --> 0:12:28.640 no proving anything here. This was too many years ago, 0:12:28.840 --> 0:12:31.679 and no one who could still tell the truth about 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:36.240 this has any incentive to do so. But I can 0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:40.040 tell you what I think happened here. Bill White made 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:44.920 up a pretty convincing story that has some elements of truth, 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:50.480 but he messed up some of the details. The white 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:55.160 nationalists dinner meetings he's talking about were real, but he 0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:59.960 got the name of the restaurant wrong. Until his death 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:03.800 in two thousand and five, white supremacist writer Sam Francis 0:13:04.360 --> 0:13:07.400 did host monthly yet togethers at a Thai restaurant in 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:13.200 northern Virginia, but that restaurant was called Sala Tie, not 0:13:13.400 --> 0:13:18.079 Tara Tai. It just so happens that Tara Tai was 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:20.920 about a quarter a mile away from Ron Paul's campaign 0:13:20.960 --> 0:13:24.760 headquarters in two thousand and seven, So far from being 0:13:24.760 --> 0:13:27.560 a smoking gun that proves Ron Paul was going to 0:13:27.600 --> 0:13:31.840 a monthly Nazi dinner party, It just looks like that 0:13:32.000 --> 0:13:36.000 was the preferred takeout destination for someone on the campaign staff. 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:41.040 But in two thousand and seven, those white nationalist dinners 0:13:41.040 --> 0:13:45.800 at Sala Tie were still going on, organized by a 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:51.320 longtime Council of Conservative Citizens member named Peter Gemma. Gemma 0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:53.720 responded to White's allegation, writing. 0:13:56.880 --> 0:14:00.439 I read those dinners. Rob Paul was never there, nor 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:03.200 did we run some sort of neo Nazi meeting. We 0:14:03.240 --> 0:14:06.679 had academics and activists of national repute. The audience were 0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:10.320 people who work at government, businessmed and grassroots types too. 0:14:10.880 --> 0:14:13.240 Bill White ever came to the meetings. He didn't use 0:14:13.280 --> 0:14:15.439 his real name. He doesn't even get the name of 0:14:15.480 --> 0:14:16.520 the restaurant correctly. 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:25.360 I don't think anybody's telling the whole truth here. Jemma 0:14:25.400 --> 0:14:27.880 claims he never saw Ron Paul or Bill White, and 0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:32.360 that might be true. But he also claims the dinners 0:14:32.360 --> 0:14:38.760 weren't Nazi meetups, and that's not true. He was at 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:41.880 the time the media relations director for a nonprofit called 0:14:41.920 --> 0:14:48.680 the National Policy Institute. Yes, that National Policy Institute, the 0:14:48.760 --> 0:14:51.880 same one that would later appoint Richard Spencer as chairman, 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:56.720 and Peter Jemma had more than a few ties to 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.920 the movement. He was quite publicly associated with this kind 0:14:59.920 --> 0:15:02.560 of stuff, at least as far back as two thousand 0:15:02.600 --> 0:15:05.240 and four, when he gave a speech at the annual 0:15:05.280 --> 0:15:09.280 Holocaust Denial conference held by the Institute for Historic Review. 0:15:10.920 --> 0:15:13.040 In two thousand and five, the Washington Post ran a 0:15:13.080 --> 0:15:16.480 story about him hosting a book signing for David Irving, 0:15:17.840 --> 0:15:21.520 but for some reason, it took until twenty eighteen for 0:15:21.600 --> 0:15:25.240 the Republican Party Committee in Sarasota County, Florida to vote 0:15:25.280 --> 0:15:30.080 to remove him from their executive committee. He passed away 0:15:30.160 --> 0:15:34.040 in January of twenty twenty five, and his obituary mentions 0:15:34.040 --> 0:15:37.080 his work as a staffer for Ronald Reagan and says 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:41.160 he wrote articles for many publications, but the obituary does 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:45.480 not mention that many of those publications were explicitly white 0:15:45.480 --> 0:15:51.680 supremacist outlets like Occidental Quarterly and v Dair. But on 0:15:51.720 --> 0:15:54.720 the subject of these dinners, we have a lot of 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:58.080 claims from a lot of men who aren't telling the truth. 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:04.280 Bill White is claiming he saw ron Paul attend. Were 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:08.760 definitely real. I mean, the dinners were real. It's just 0:16:08.800 --> 0:16:12.400 a question of who was there. We know they were 0:16:12.440 --> 0:16:17.080 attended by the intellectual giants of the white supremacist world, 0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:21.400 such that those exist as well as white supremacists with 0:16:21.440 --> 0:16:28.160 connections to more mainstream conservative politics. Peter Jemma himself was 0:16:28.200 --> 0:16:31.840 a senior staff member of Pat Buchanan's two thousand election campaign, 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:38.120 and he probably met Bill White back then. White claims 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:42.680 that he led the petition drive for Buchanan's candidacy in Maryland. Sure, 0:16:42.680 --> 0:16:45.880 Bill White's a liar, But a photo taken by a 0:16:46.000 --> 0:16:49.800 Washington Post photographer in March of two thousand shows Bill 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:53.560 White standing right behind Pat Buchanan at a campaign event 0:16:53.640 --> 0:16:58.840 in Bethesda. But the question at hand is still, did 0:16:59.000 --> 0:17:04.400 Ron Paul ever attend those dinners? I don't know. 0:17:06.000 --> 0:17:06.200 When. 0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:09.320 Virginia Heffernan, writing for the New York Times, picked up 0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:13.400 the story from the blogisphere. The Ron Paul campaign quickly 0:17:13.480 --> 0:17:16.399 issued a denial, and The New York Times pulled the 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:21.480 story and issued a correction. The campaign flatly denied that 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:25.480 Ron Paul had ever attended such a dinner or met 0:17:25.520 --> 0:17:31.160 Bill White, although they did admit that Norm Singleton, ron 0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:36.320 Paul's legislative director, had met Bill White quote at a 0:17:36.400 --> 0:17:41.760 dinner gathering of conservatives several years ago, after which Singleton 0:17:41.840 --> 0:17:45.600 expressed his indignation that the views espoused by White to 0:17:45.680 --> 0:17:50.840 the organizer of the dinner. So it seems like the 0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:55.000 nugget of truth in Bill's post as that he did 0:17:55.080 --> 0:17:58.440 meet a man who worked for Ron Paul at one 0:17:58.480 --> 0:18:02.200 of those Nazi dinners, but it was a few years ago, 0:18:02.320 --> 0:18:05.200 so he didn't quite get the name of the restaurant right, 0:18:07.040 --> 0:18:10.640 And the timing tells us something about Bill White's decision 0:18:10.840 --> 0:18:15.679 to make this story up too. December nineteenth, two thousand 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:19.800 and seven, was the exact same day that the Ron 0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:23.560 Paul campaign issued a statement that they would not be 0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:28.080 returning a five hundred dollars campaign donation made by Don Black, 0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:34.320 the webmaster of the Naziside Stormfront. Don Black was a 0:18:34.760 --> 0:18:40.040 vocal supporter of the Paul campaign, as were many Stormfront posters, 0:18:41.359 --> 0:18:44.480 and Don Black boasted on Stormfront that dozens of his 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:50.760 members were active campaign volunteers and donors. A photo had 0:18:50.800 --> 0:18:53.399 recently surfaced of Ron Paul and Don Black at a 0:18:53.400 --> 0:18:57.800 campaign event in Fort Lauderdale in September. Actually, if you 0:18:57.840 --> 0:19:02.280 look at Don Black's Wikipedia page right now, the photo 0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:07.000 of his face on that page is actually cropped from 0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:09.640 this picture. So if you go to Don Black's Wikipedia page, 0:19:09.680 --> 0:19:13.119 there's a picture and it's just Don Black's face. But 0:19:14.000 --> 0:19:17.720 know that if you zoom out, Ron Paul is right there. 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:23.440 By December, there were calls for Ron Paul to return 0:19:23.640 --> 0:19:28.679 these Nazi campaign donations, and it's obvious that this is 0:19:28.720 --> 0:19:32.680 the story Bill White is responding to. He quotes directly 0:19:32.720 --> 0:19:35.119 from the campaign press release that had been issued just 0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:39.040 a few hours earlier, with a Paul campaign aid saying quote, 0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:43.600 if someone with small ideologies happens to contribute money to 0:19:43.680 --> 0:19:48.000 Ron thinking he can influence Ron in any way, he's 0:19:48.000 --> 0:19:54.000 wasted his money. End quote. But Ron Paul himself refused 0:19:54.000 --> 0:19:57.720 to disavow the support of what nationalists, saying quote, if 0:19:57.720 --> 0:20:00.479 they want to endorse me, they're endorsing what I do 0:20:00.560 --> 0:20:04.000 or say. It has nothing to do with endorsing what 0:20:04.080 --> 0:20:11.720 they say. I think the best explanation is that Ron 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:19.760 Paul hurt Bill White's feelings. That small Ideology's comment clearly 0:20:19.760 --> 0:20:22.600 got under his skin. He echoed it in his post. 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:29.280 He felt disrespected. If Nazee money is good enough for 0:20:29.359 --> 0:20:32.680 Ron Paul, why does Ron Paul think he's too good 0:20:33.160 --> 0:20:39.000 for Nazis? So he lashed out. Ron Paul hurt him, 0:20:39.440 --> 0:20:42.439 and he wanted to hurt Ron Paul. Right back, and 0:20:42.480 --> 0:20:45.840 he was media savvy enough to understand that Paul was 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:49.560 particularly vulnerable at that moment when it came to stories 0:20:49.560 --> 0:20:54.960 about his associations with white supremacists. So my best guess 0:20:54.960 --> 0:20:58.960 here is that the claim he's making is not technically 0:20:59.760 --> 0:21:04.280 entire true. I don't think it's likely that Bill White 0:21:04.960 --> 0:21:08.720 ever sat at a dinner table with Ron Paul at 0:21:08.720 --> 0:21:11.800 a meetup organized by the Council of Conservative Citizens at 0:21:11.800 --> 0:21:15.600 a Thai restaurant in Arlington, Virginia. I don't think every 0:21:15.600 --> 0:21:18.280 single one of those details was ever true. At the 0:21:18.280 --> 0:21:22.879 same time, I do think it's almost certainly true that 0:21:22.960 --> 0:21:26.800 Bill White met Ron Paul's legislative director Norm Singleton at 0:21:26.800 --> 0:21:29.040 one of those Nazi dinners back in two thousand and two. 0:21:30.560 --> 0:21:35.920 That seems to align with the campaign's owned admissions. There 0:21:35.960 --> 0:21:40.920 are things in the story that are definitely true. Paul 0:21:41.000 --> 0:21:45.760 campaign's staff did have dinner with white supremacists. Ron Paul 0:21:45.840 --> 0:21:50.200 did take money from Nazis. Nazis did volunteer for the campaign. 0:21:51.400 --> 0:21:54.960 Ron Paul did speak at events organized by white supremacists. 0:21:56.600 --> 0:22:00.760 And then there are elements that could be true. Things 0:22:00.760 --> 0:22:05.960 you can't prove or disprove, but sound possible. Did Ron 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:10.320 Paul campaign staff attend other dinners? Did Paul himself ever 0:22:10.359 --> 0:22:14.440 meet privately with any of the men from those dinners? 0:22:15.040 --> 0:22:19.160 We don't know. Bill White invented a story that has 0:22:19.200 --> 0:22:23.760 a loose lineage that trace us back to some kind 0:22:23.800 --> 0:22:24.359 of truth. 0:22:25.359 --> 0:22:25.520 Right. 0:22:25.640 --> 0:22:30.359 He made up a story based in some snippets of truth, 0:22:31.359 --> 0:22:34.840 and he crafted this story to capitalize on the headline 0:22:34.880 --> 0:22:39.479 news of the day to soothe his own ego. He 0:22:39.520 --> 0:22:42.440 didn't care what happened to Ron Paul. He didn't care 0:22:42.560 --> 0:22:46.240 about anything other than creating a shit storm that he 0:22:46.280 --> 0:22:52.600 could be in the middle of. But honestly, he didn't 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:56.720 actually need to make things up if he wanted to 0:22:56.760 --> 0:23:00.640 remind everyone that Ron Paul was palling around with white Soprists. 0:23:16.600 --> 0:23:20.000 Just two months before Bill White made that post, back 0:23:20.040 --> 0:23:23.680 in October of two thousand and seven, Ron Paul had 0:23:23.680 --> 0:23:26.879 in fact been the guest of honor at a different 0:23:26.920 --> 0:23:32.439 restaurant at an event hosted by Nazis. And there's no 0:23:32.520 --> 0:23:36.639 doubt this time about whether or not Ron Paul accepted 0:23:36.640 --> 0:23:40.840 the invitation, because, in addition to the two hundred sum 0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:43.880 people packed into the Boulevard Wood Grill in Arlington, Virginia. 0:23:45.160 --> 0:23:51.120 There were cameras. A c SPAN camera crew captured the entire. 0:23:50.920 --> 0:23:56.240 Event before we began. I'd like to thank there are 0:23:56.280 --> 0:24:01.000 other members of the executive board, Dan McCarthy and Kevin 0:24:01.040 --> 0:24:03.879 Deanna and Marcus Epstein who actually founded the club just 0:24:03.880 --> 0:24:05.959 around a year and a half ago, and their Tyler's 0:24:05.960 --> 0:24:07.359 efforts are invaluable. Thank you. 0:24:11.400 --> 0:24:15.160 Do you recognize that voice? I think some of you might. 0:24:16.600 --> 0:24:20.280 Maybe you're normal and that fifteen second clip didn't make 0:24:20.320 --> 0:24:23.160 you almost drop your phone in surprise as you demanded 0:24:23.160 --> 0:24:29.840 to know. Is that Richard Spencer? Because it is. That's 0:24:29.920 --> 0:24:34.679 Richard Bertrand. Spencer, best known for such highlights as getting 0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:37.560 punched in the face on camera at Trump's first inauguration 0:24:38.560 --> 0:24:41.720 or having a screeching meltdown at an Airbnb because he 0:24:41.760 --> 0:24:43.399 didn't get to give his speech at the Unite the 0:24:43.440 --> 0:24:49.080 Right rally in Charlottesville in twenty seventeen, ten years before 0:24:49.119 --> 0:24:51.800 he helped plan the Nazi rally that killed Heather Higher, 0:24:52.680 --> 0:24:54.879 he had just dropped out of a PhD program at 0:24:54.960 --> 0:24:58.879 Duke University to pursue his career in racism full time. 0:25:00.080 --> 0:25:03.040 He was living in Arlington and working as the assistant 0:25:03.160 --> 0:25:07.920 editor at the American Conservative magazine. The event Ron Paul 0:25:08.000 --> 0:25:09.679 was speaking at that night was put on by a 0:25:09.720 --> 0:25:13.360 group called the Robert A. Taft Club, founded a year 0:25:13.400 --> 0:25:19.560 earlier by Richard Spencer, Kevin Deanna and Marcus Epstein. Epstein 0:25:19.600 --> 0:25:24.080 described the club as a forum for lively debate about 0:25:24.080 --> 0:25:28.919 the important issues that divide the right. And while Richard 0:25:28.960 --> 0:25:31.640 Spencer's name is probably the only one of those three 0:25:31.680 --> 0:25:35.440 that sounds familiar to you, Kevin Deanna and Marcus Epstein 0:25:35.600 --> 0:25:42.680 were and are deeply entrenched in white supremacist circles. Kevin 0:25:42.720 --> 0:25:45.720 Dianna and Marcus Epstein met in college at William and Mary, 0:25:46.200 --> 0:25:49.239 where they both wrote for and edited these school's right 0:25:49.359 --> 0:25:54.320 leaning student newspaper, The Remnant. Both men were named as 0:25:54.320 --> 0:25:56.920 defendants when the paper was sued for defamation in two 0:25:56.960 --> 0:26:01.600 thousand and six. The paper had been putting up flyers 0:26:01.640 --> 0:26:05.199 all over campus naming a female student who had recently 0:26:05.240 --> 0:26:11.040 accused another student of rape. In their articles defending this practice, 0:26:11.760 --> 0:26:15.720 which they justified by accusing women of lying about being raped, 0:26:16.520 --> 0:26:18.879 they brought up what they felt was a similar case, 0:26:20.080 --> 0:26:22.680 charges against a fraternity brother that had been dropped in 0:26:22.720 --> 0:26:27.240 two thousand and four. The editors of the Remnant didn't 0:26:27.240 --> 0:26:31.880 seem at all troubled by complicated truths like the fact 0:26:31.920 --> 0:26:34.120 that the victim had been a sixteen year old high 0:26:34.160 --> 0:26:39.040 school girl, or that the fraternity brother accused of raping, sodomizing, 0:26:39.080 --> 0:26:43.000 and penetrating her with an object admitted to getting the 0:26:43.000 --> 0:26:48.040 miner drunk to have sex with her. He was ultimately 0:26:48.040 --> 0:26:51.440 convicted only of two counts of contributing to the delinquency 0:26:51.520 --> 0:26:57.000 of a minor. The paper called that teenage girl a 0:26:57.080 --> 0:27:03.560 wannabe victim, a con artist, a liar, and a fraud. 0:27:03.880 --> 0:27:06.880 The lawsuit was settled out of court just a few 0:27:06.920 --> 0:27:12.520 weeks before this event with Ron Paul. After graduation, Kevin 0:27:12.600 --> 0:27:16.000 Deanna and Marcus Epstein founded a group called Youth for 0:27:16.119 --> 0:27:20.879 Western Civilization and started establishing chapters of this white supremacist 0:27:20.920 --> 0:27:25.640 student group on college campuses future where Little Guy's subject, 0:27:25.640 --> 0:27:28.920 Matthew Heinbach would later serve as president of the chapter 0:27:29.000 --> 0:27:32.720 of Youth for Western Civilization at Tawson University in Maryland, 0:27:34.480 --> 0:27:38.200 and Kevin Deanna, under the pseudonym Gregory Hood still writes 0:27:38.240 --> 0:27:41.480 for American Renaissance, the white nationalist outlet that holds annual 0:27:41.560 --> 0:27:46.080 race science conferences. Just a few months before this event 0:27:46.119 --> 0:27:49.680 with Ron Paul, Marcus Epstein was stumbling home drunk one 0:27:49.760 --> 0:27:52.280 night when he saw a black woman minding her own business. 0:27:53.560 --> 0:27:57.359 Unable to control himself, apparently, he screamed the N word 0:27:57.400 --> 0:28:02.280 at her and then charged at her and, according to 0:28:02.400 --> 0:28:07.359 multiple news reports about this incident, tried to karate chop her. 0:28:09.200 --> 0:28:12.359 He would eventually plead guilty to assaults, but his boss, 0:28:12.400 --> 0:28:16.480 Congressman Tom Tancredo, didn't think the incident was serious enough 0:28:16.480 --> 0:28:21.320 to fire him, and Pat Buchanan's sister, Babe Buchanan, told 0:28:21.359 --> 0:28:24.680 reporters that the incident was out of character for Marcus 0:28:25.440 --> 0:28:31.359 and chalked it up to some problems in his personal life. 0:28:31.520 --> 0:28:34.320 So in the fall of two thousand and seven, Ron 0:28:34.359 --> 0:28:38.760 Paul was photographed with his arm around Stormfront webmaster Don Black, 0:28:39.640 --> 0:28:42.760 and he got a standing ovation after an introduction from 0:28:42.840 --> 0:28:46.280 Richard Spencer and an event organized by a guy who'd 0:28:46.320 --> 0:28:49.680 recently assaulted a woman he didn't know just because she 0:28:49.800 --> 0:28:54.640 was black. Bill White didn't need to make things up 0:28:55.240 --> 0:28:58.560 if he wanted to draw attention to Ron Paul's cozy 0:28:58.600 --> 0:29:02.360 relationship with men who were outlaw interracial marriage or whatever. 0:29:04.360 --> 0:29:08.720 But Bill White loves to start drama, so he logged 0:29:08.760 --> 0:29:14.760 onto that Nazi message board and he started posting. The 0:29:14.880 --> 0:29:18.720 response was intense. There were four hundred and forty one 0:29:18.800 --> 0:29:23.160 replies to his original thread. Most of the posters on 0:29:23.240 --> 0:29:27.560 Vanguard News seemed to have been ardent Ron Paul supporters, 0:29:28.000 --> 0:29:33.360 so they were frustrated with Bill for hurting Ron Paul's campaign. 0:29:33.840 --> 0:29:39.840 But beyond that, opinions varied. Some users felt very confident that, 0:29:40.560 --> 0:29:43.280 of course Ron Paul was really one of them, but 0:29:44.080 --> 0:29:46.600 they understood that it would be political suicide for him 0:29:46.640 --> 0:29:51.960 to admit it. Others felt that Ron Paul wasn't quite 0:29:51.960 --> 0:29:54.680 aligned with them in that way, but they agreed with 0:29:54.760 --> 0:29:57.640 him about a lot of other issues, and his campaign 0:29:57.680 --> 0:30:02.160 events were a great recruitment pool for the movement. One 0:30:02.280 --> 0:30:05.880 user posted, I know a lot of white supremacists involved 0:30:05.880 --> 0:30:08.760