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Speaker 1: Mmm, hello world, but specifically Australia. This is Robert Evans

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Speaker 1: hosted Behind the Bastards, and I just wanted my Australian

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Speaker 1: listeners in particular to know that I stood up for

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Speaker 1: you against Caitlin's cruelty. Just a minute ago, she pronounced

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Speaker 1: the name of your greatest city, Melbourne, Melbourne. I guess, savage, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he said Melbourne. And then okay, well, what about the

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Speaker 1: people who live in Sydney or or other cities in Australia.

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Speaker 1: One city in Australia its name is Melbourne. And that's

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Speaker 1: the end of this digression. Hello, Caitlin Duranty, guest for

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Speaker 1: today's episode. How are you doing? Uh well? I would

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Speaker 1: be doing better if you would pronounce my last name correctly.

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Speaker 1: Speaking of mispronunciation, Durante Durant, I think we've all learned

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Speaker 1: a lesson about maybe not judging each other, because it's

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Speaker 1: impossible to ever know how words are supposed to be say.

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Speaker 1: He thinks Ariana Grande's name is Arianna grand So you know, Sophie,

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Speaker 1: even give me guff about that one for a while,

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Speaker 1: as it deserves m. Well, now I'm sad. Don't be sad.

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Speaker 1: Robert if this is part two. If we didn't get

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Speaker 1: to pick on a white man at the beginning of

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Speaker 1: an episode, then like, what's the point? Yeah, this is

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Speaker 1: this is a whole episode about I don't know, let's

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Speaker 1: let's let's pass the Bechdel test right now, Sophie. Oh, Caitlin,

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Speaker 1: I I really enjoying the bluish shirt you're wearing right now.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, well, I'm so glad you brought it up, because,

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Speaker 1: um it's it's a Paddington shirt that says migration is

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Speaker 1: not a crime, which is relevant to today's episode. Wow,

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Speaker 1: it really is relevant today's episode. That. But then I

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Speaker 1: said Paddington and that that I was like, are we

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Speaker 1: gendering padding in right now because that Huntington is a

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Speaker 1: non binary a sexual icon. Yes, yes, yes, yes, So

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Speaker 1: I kind of passed it back to this. Okay, Robert,

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Speaker 1: you want to post your show behind the bastards right

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Speaker 1: now because I don't actually know if we passed the

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Speaker 1: Bechdel test there. But you know what test we did

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Speaker 1: pass is the writing for many hours about the border

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Speaker 1: patrol test. Yes, which is a more important test, I think, so, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know this one. We're splitting up a little bit

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Speaker 1: weirdly over the course of two weeks, because my entire

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Speaker 1: life and schedule has been continually thrown into casts. So

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Speaker 1: I do apologize for this one being done a little

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Speaker 1: bit differently than others are done. On December six, two

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Speaker 1: th eighteen, seven year old Jacqueline Call crossed the US

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Speaker 1: Mexico border near a place called Antelope Wells, New Mexico.

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Speaker 1: She was with her father, twenty nine year old Niry Call.

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Speaker 1: Both were Kecchi Maya and they lived most of their

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Speaker 1: lives in the Alta are A pause region of Guatemala.

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Speaker 1: Starving in desperate, she and her family turned themselves into

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Speaker 1: the Border Patrol. When Jacqueline was taken into their custody,

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Speaker 1: she was already beginning to show signs of illness what

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Speaker 1: would turn out to have been a streptococcle infection. DHS

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Speaker 1: maintains that they conducted an initial screening and that there

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Speaker 1: was no evidence of health issues and the little girl,

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Speaker 1: Jacqueline was placed on a border patrol bus feverish and

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Speaker 1: vomiting from severe dehydration. Eight hours after being taken into custody,

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Speaker 1: she began to suffer seizures. She died the next day.

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Speaker 1: Gomez Alonzo, age eight, crossed the Aos Mexico border sometime

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Speaker 1: around December eighteenth. He and his father, Augustine, were members

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Speaker 1: of the Choose People, another Mayan group who came from

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Speaker 1: the Huahoaitanango region of Guatemala. Spent six days in border

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Speaker 1: patrol custody, shuttled around from New Mexico to El Paso,

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Speaker 1: and then back to New Mexico to be interned in

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Speaker 1: an attention facility named near Alama Gordo. He started to

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Speaker 1: show symptoms of sickness on the twenty four He was

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Speaker 1: taken to the hospital, where he was tested for the cold,

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Speaker 1: but not for influence zone, which he had. He was

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Speaker 1: given medicine that could not help him and sent back

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Speaker 1: to jail, where he died on Christmas Eve, two thousand eighteen.

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Speaker 1: Ye good, good times. That's awful. Yeah, it's real bad.

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Speaker 1: The deaths of Gomez and Jacqueline were briefly very big

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Speaker 1: news in the United States. It was believed that the

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Speaker 1: two were the first child immigrant deaths in border patrol

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Speaker 1: custody since two thousand ten. In two thousand nineteen, though,

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Speaker 1: it was revealed that another child, Darylyn Cordova, val of

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Speaker 1: El Salvador had actually died back in September two eighteen

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Speaker 1: under similar circumstances. The Trump administration received a lot of blame,

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Speaker 1: both for covering this death up to try to influence

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Speaker 1: the midterm elections and for their failure to push DHS

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Speaker 1: to take any meaningful action to stop kids from dying

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Speaker 1: at the border. Three dead children is a tragedy, but

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Speaker 1: their little corpses are actually just the top of an

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Speaker 1: iceberg of dead people, many of them Guatemalan, that we

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Speaker 1: can lay at the feet of border patrol agents. And

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Speaker 1: you might be surprised to learn how that whole situation

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Speaker 1: came about. You want to hear about this, Caitlin, I

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Speaker 1: have to also what colorful language you used in terms

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Speaker 1: of the corpses or at the top of an iceberg.

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Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, you know, I I think if you're

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Speaker 1: gonna talk about dead kids, you should do it with

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Speaker 1: a little bit of panas pizzas, panas um. Alright, I'm

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Speaker 1: keep going, all right, so let's talk about the border

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Speaker 1: patrol and um in in Central America. We're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: about UM something I don't think a lot of people

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Speaker 1: know about because usually, as a rule, when we talk

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Speaker 1: about how bad the Border Patrol is. We talk about

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Speaker 1: like how mean they are to people who come up

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Speaker 1: to the border. Um, but we don't talk about what

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Speaker 1: a lot of Border patrol guys did uh in the

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Speaker 1: countries that these people are fleeing from before people started

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Speaker 1: fleeing from those countries. So this is gonna be fun. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna it's gonna be a good time for everybody.

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Speaker 1: Uh So. John P. Longan was a U. S Border

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Speaker 1: Patrol agent in the nineteen forties and fifties. He worked

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Speaker 1: near the Mexican border, close to where both Jacqueline and

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Speaker 1: Gomez crossed over. Most sources you find on the matter

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Speaker 1: will note that he had a reputation for violence, but

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Speaker 1: this was not at all uncommon among the men of

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Speaker 1: the Border Patrol, nor is it uncommon now. During operation

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Speaker 1: went back when the Border Patrol reformed itself into a

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Speaker 1: paramilitary force to wage war on Mexican immigrants, long End

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Speaker 1: run the Patrols ran the Patrol's equivalent of a military

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Speaker 1: intelligence service. Long AND's base was an unmarked building near Alameda.

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Speaker 1: He and his men interrogated, captured migrants, extracted information, and

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Speaker 1: used it to find and capture other groups of migrants.

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Speaker 1: Few of the men who endured these interrogations ever spoke

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Speaker 1: about it, but a lot of what happened in those

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Speaker 1: cells probably verged on what we considered torture. Long End

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Speaker 1: was good at his job, and his performance in Operation

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Speaker 1: Went Back earned him a transfer to the State Department's

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Speaker 1: Public Safety program. Now, this was, in reality a CIA

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Speaker 1: operation geared at providing counterinsurgency training and advice to Allied

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Speaker 1: nations combating communist insurgencies. The CIA hand picked a number

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Speaker 1: of Border Patrol agents to travel to places like Venezuela, Thailand,

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Speaker 1: the Dominican Republic in Guatemala. They particularly liked recruiting guys

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Speaker 1: like long End because they were likely to speak Spanish. Now,

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Speaker 1: the way the State Department framed this program was training

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Speaker 1: law enforcement. So uh yeah, the State Department frame this

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Speaker 1: program as training law enforcement. The reality, though, is that

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Speaker 1: long End and his fellow Border patrolmen were sent over

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Speaker 1: to places like Guatemala to create and train death squads.

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Speaker 1: During Operation Went Back, Border Patrol administrators had described their

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Speaker 1: work as fighting back against an invasion. In Guatemala, where

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Speaker 1: long End arrived in nineteen sixty five, he was finally

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Speaker 1: able to wage a real war using real weapons. I'm

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Speaker 1: going to quote now from an article in The Nation. Quote.

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Speaker 1: Long End taught local intelligence and police agencies how to

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Speaker 1: create death squads to target political activists, deploying tactics that

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Speaker 1: he had earlier used to capture migrants on the border.

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Speaker 1: He arrived in Guatemala in late nineteen sixty five, where

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Speaker 1: he put into place a paramilitary unit that early the

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Speaker 1: next year would execute what he called Operation the Pieza,

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Speaker 1: or Operation clean Up. Within three months, this unit had

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Speaker 1: conducted over eighty raids and multiple extra judicial assassinations, including

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Speaker 1: an action that, over the course of four days, captured, tortured,

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Speaker 1: and executed more than thirty prominent Left opposition leaders. The

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Speaker 1: military dumped their bodies into the sea, while the government

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Speaker 1: denied any knowledge of their whereabouts. According to Stuart Schrader

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Speaker 1: in his up forthcoming Badges Without Borders, How Global counterinsurgency

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Speaker 1: transformed American policing, it was common practice during the Cold

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Speaker 1: Wards and former border patrol agents like long End to

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Speaker 1: train foreign police through CIA linked to public safety programs,

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Speaker 1: since they were more likely to speak Spanish than agents

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Speaker 1: from other branches of law enforcement. In countries like El Salvador, Honduras,

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Speaker 1: and Guatemala. They did the dirty work that Reagan's envoys

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Speaker 1: said needed doing. Until the early nineteen seventies, the United States,

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Speaker 1: according to a nineteen seventy four Los Angeles Times report,

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Speaker 1: was flying its Latin American death squad apprintices up to

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Speaker 1: the Border Patrol Academy in Los Fresnos, Texas to receive

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Speaker 1: training from CIA instructors and the design, manufacture and potential

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Speaker 1: use of bombs and incendiary devices. Long and himself in

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Speaker 1: nineteen fifty seven clearly to scribe what he thought he

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Speaker 1: was doing at the border. We're fighting a war on

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Speaker 1: a wide battle front, so that's good. So they're just

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Speaker 1: basically training kill squads. They're just telling people to murder people. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and they're they're pulling Border patrol guys off the line

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Speaker 1: to do some of the training to be like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you already are good at like tracking down these groups

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Speaker 1: of people who are trying to facilitate movement of of

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Speaker 1: migrants through the United States. You can use those skills

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Speaker 1: to track down political activists, except that you know, since

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Speaker 1: it's in a foreign country, you can just have them

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Speaker 1: brutally murdered by death squads. And these guys are happy

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Speaker 1: to do it because they want to be murdering people anyway.

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Speaker 1: They just can't quite usually murder people, um, you know

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Speaker 1: at the border. I mean they do it a lot anyway,

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Speaker 1: but like they have to be a little bit careful,

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Speaker 1: but you don't have to be careful at all in Guatemala.

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Speaker 1: So that's great. Oh, ge wiz, have ever been to Guatemala, Caitlin,

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Speaker 1: I have not, rules. Yeah, yeah, I spent a lot

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Speaker 1: of time there. It's a great country, beautiful, I uh,

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Speaker 1: completely dysfunctional government. Um. And you can see like signs

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Speaker 1: of the horrible civil war. They're all over the place.

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Speaker 1: Just like you cross the street and there'll just be

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Speaker 1: a bunch of guys who are all missing arms and legs. Um.

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Speaker 1: You'll be driving through the middle of nowhere and you'll

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Speaker 1: see like businesses that have been like we're shot up

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Speaker 1: decades ago with mortars and stuff, and it you know,

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Speaker 1: it's it all kind of descends from this. The the

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Speaker 1: series of political conflicts that launch in this period of time,

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Speaker 1: particularly in the early nineteen eighties, um, that are backed

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Speaker 1: by the United States and supported enthusiastically by the Reagan government,

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Speaker 1: and these kind of networks of right wing um murder

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Speaker 1: crews that were trained up and sent out by the

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Speaker 1: CIA and and their buddies and groups like the Border Patrol. Um,

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Speaker 1: this all starts now, and it's cool, it's great, and

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Speaker 1: it's probably it's I mean, it's refugees from Yep, these

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Speaker 1: conflicts that are seeking refuge in right up to today.

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Speaker 1: And then then they get here and they're like, well, sorry,

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Speaker 1: fuck you, We're either going to murder you or um

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Speaker 1: be diligent and let you die in our custody, or

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Speaker 1: send you back to this you know, war torn country

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Speaker 1: you're in. Yeah. If you listen to right wingers, they'll

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Speaker 1: usually say something like, oh, they should go back to

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Speaker 1: their own country and fix its problems. And the reality

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Speaker 1: is that, like, well, some of them tried to do that,

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Speaker 1: and then we trained death squads to murder them and

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Speaker 1: throw their bodies in rivers and stuff in the ocean,

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Speaker 1: and um, that's why people are less willing to try

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Speaker 1: to fix problems because they get killed and so did

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Speaker 1: their children because of the guys that we hired and

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Speaker 1: trained to kill them and their children when they attempt

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Speaker 1: to fight for economic justice. Oops, it's good, It's really good.

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Speaker 1: Is what I'm getting at so um. Operation Lympiasa, which

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Speaker 1: you know long and the Border Patrol guy orchestrated himself,

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Speaker 1: was a major moment in the history of Guatemala's collapse

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Speaker 1: to a nightmare. The military intelligence system he helped to

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Speaker 1: build would eventually eliminate tens of thousands of leftist, activist

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Speaker 1: sympathizers and random people mistaken for either. More than two

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Speaker 1: hundred thousand people were massacred openly. Tens of thousands more

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Speaker 1: were tortured in this way. The brave men of the

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Speaker 1: Border Patrol wound up at both sides of a tragedy.

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Speaker 1: The genocide they trained right wing Guatemalan militants to execute

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Speaker 1: fell heavily on various Maya peoples of the region, including

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Speaker 1: the Catchi and the Choose. The right wing dictator who

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Speaker 1: helped to organize much of this violence was General Afrain

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Speaker 1: Rios mont He rose to power in nineteen eighty one

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Speaker 1: and nineteen eighty two, cooing his way into command with

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Speaker 1: the help of his good friends the US. Ronald Reagan

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Speaker 1: described him as a man of great integrity who was

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Speaker 1: totally dedicated to democracy. The nation's right up makes continues

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Speaker 1: quote on June seventeenth, nineteen eighty two, Guatemalan soldiers under

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Speaker 1: the command of Rio's mont entered the San Francisco Catalla

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Speaker 1: estate immediately adjacent to yalm Bulock. The estate's owner, a

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Speaker 1: military colonel, had fled because of guerilla activity in the area.

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Speaker 1: Soldiers went house by house, rounding up workers in their

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Speaker 1: families whom they accused of supporting the guerrillas. They separated

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Speaker 1: children from their parents and killed them by slashing their

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Speaker 1: stomachs or smashing their heads against poles. Women were raped

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Speaker 1: and then burned alive. The soldiers killed them in with

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Speaker 1: bullets or by beheading. After a day of slaughter, three

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Speaker 1: hundred and fifty people were dead. Alone survivor made his

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Speaker 1: way into Mexico, where Guatemalan anthropologist and Jesuit priest Ricardo

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Speaker 1: Fala interviewed him. The San Francisco massacre was highlighted in

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Speaker 1: Guatemala's nineteen ninety nine Truth Commission report. After the massacre,

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Speaker 1: Yelling Block residents fled along with thousands of others, leaving

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Speaker 1: the border corridor between Guatemala and Mexico completely depopulated. As

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Speaker 1: government troops raised their villages, some were captured and killed

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Speaker 1: by the army as they fled. Others ended up in

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Speaker 1: refugee camps or dispersed throughout Mexico's southern states. Still, others

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Speaker 1: continued on to the United States, beginning the Great Movement

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Speaker 1: of Guatemalans to El Norte. And all told, one point

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Speaker 1: five million people were displaced by the Guatemalan army scorched

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Speaker 1: Earth campaign in nineteen one and nineteen eight too. Guatemala's

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Speaker 1: Commissioned for Historical Clarification called the violent displacement in the

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Speaker 1: Maya Choose Region and active genocide. Young Felipe Gomez Alazano's father.

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Speaker 1: He was the little kid, one of the little kids

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Speaker 1: who died. Augustin Gomez Perez was a child of eleven

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Speaker 1: during that execute. Yalla Ballocks villagers stayed away for fourteen years,

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Speaker 1: returning only after the signing of the Piece Accords in

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Speaker 1: So that's cool, mm hmm. What can you say? That's horrible?

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Speaker 1: You can say that, like we're focusing on Guatemala right here,

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Speaker 1: because it's uh one where there's a bit more documentation.

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Speaker 1: But like this ship happened in Al Salad or, it

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Speaker 1: happened in a bunch of different parts of Latin and

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Speaker 1: Central America UM, where you know, refugees come from all

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Speaker 1: the time. Now, UM, it was, it was, it's still

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Speaker 1: in a lot of ways going on today if you

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Speaker 1: want to read about like Plan Colombia and stuff like,

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Speaker 1: there's aspects of this that are very much still occurring, UM.

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Speaker 1: And that the border patrol still winds up getting tied

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Speaker 1: up been from time to time. And that's great, good grief. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is like the stuff that part of me that

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Speaker 1: like is optimistic wants to believe that, oh, if people

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Speaker 1: just knew this, like knew how this all, how how

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Speaker 1: US policy and and in US UM plotting UH played

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Speaker 1: into the tragedy being suffered by these people. Unlike the

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Speaker 1: insecurity of these regions, they would have better attitudes towards

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Speaker 1: you know, Guatemal immigration and whatnot into the United States.

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Speaker 1: And then the part of me that that has been

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Speaker 1: paying attention for the last several decades knows that like, no,

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Speaker 1: actually UM people would share the murders of the folks

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Speaker 1: and the destruction of these areas because UM Americans have

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Speaker 1: been so thoroughly broken by propaganda that the people who

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Speaker 1: are still on the right and still broadly pro American

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Speaker 1: UM can't be convinced by any reason that any amount

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Speaker 1: of murder or violence is not justified by the fact

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Speaker 1: that America is cool as hell. It is this what

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Speaker 1: a toxic mentality that we as Americans, or at least

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Speaker 1: some of us have, because like, and this is I'm

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Speaker 1: not about to say anything new or profound here, but

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Speaker 1: the fact that, uh, you know, the white European settlers

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Speaker 1: were escaping the same you know, kind of civil unrest

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Speaker 1: or religious persecution or whatever it was the custom to

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Speaker 1: fled their countries and uh then and then we settled here,

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Speaker 1: uh by killing millions of indigenous people. And now we're like, well,

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Speaker 1: our borders are closed now sorry everyone. And it's like,

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Speaker 1: how how can you live? How can these people live

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Speaker 1: with the hypocrisy of that simple fact? Um? Because they

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Speaker 1: there their ship anyway. Uh So most of these death squads, um,

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Speaker 1: we're trained in the United States because like, hey, if

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Speaker 1: you're gonna build a death squad for a foreign country,

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Speaker 1: you don't want to like train it there. Um that's

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Speaker 1: kind of gosh. Uh So you bring them into your

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Speaker 1: country to train them there because you're you're you're you know,

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Speaker 1: you're good at training death squads. So the facility where

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Speaker 1: they actually trained a lot of these death squads. And

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Speaker 1: again not just in Guatemala, but for places like Columbia

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Speaker 1: and El Salvador, are all throughout the fucking world. The

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Speaker 1: place where they would like take these men to teach

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Speaker 1: them how to be terrorists, how to make bombs and

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Speaker 1: all this ship was the Los Fresnos, Texas Border Patrol facility. UM.

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Speaker 1: It was an existing base, it was in a good location, UM,

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Speaker 1: and the Border Patrol was perfectly happy to have Minstila

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Speaker 1: over there to learn how to become murderous guerillas and

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Speaker 1: then set off terrorist bombs in the middle of their

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Speaker 1: own countries. UM, because they were like that sounds like

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Speaker 1: a thing the Border Patrol should be involved with. Now.

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Speaker 1: The technical Investigations course that was given to foreign police

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Speaker 1: there was taught by CIA instructors. It lasted for weeks

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Speaker 1: and it included curriculum like terrorist concepts, terrorist devices, fabrication

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Speaker 1: and functioning of devices and provides, triggering devices, incendiaries and

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Speaker 1: assassination weapons. A discussion of various weapons which may be

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Speaker 1: used by the assassin. And when you read it like that,

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Speaker 1: you can kind of trick yourself into thinking it might

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Speaker 1: not be like it might be a reasonable thing for

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Speaker 1: cops to learn. Right, of course, cops might need to

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Speaker 1: learn about terrorist concepts and the kind of weapons assassins use.

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Speaker 1: But these were not just informational courses. They were instructed.

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Speaker 1: So the police who attended, we're just learning, Oh, here's

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Speaker 1: weapons that assassins sometimes used. They were learning, like, if

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Speaker 1: you're going to assassinate somebody, here's a variety of different

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Speaker 1: weapons that you can use to assassinate people. And we're

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Speaker 1: just learning, like, here's different ways terrorists build triggers for bombs.

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Speaker 1: They were learning, here's how to build triggers for the

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Speaker 1: bombs you're going to make to kill people. Um. The

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Speaker 1: the reality of the whole the whole program came out

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Speaker 1: during congressional investigations in the nineteen seventies. And I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: quote now from a book titled Instruments Instruments of state Craft,

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Speaker 1: US Guerrilla Warfare, Counterinsurgency, and counter Terrorism, which is available

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Speaker 1: for in full for free online right now. Quote. During

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Speaker 1: congressional investigations led by Senator James Albaresque in nineteen seventy three,

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Speaker 1: eight officials admitted that the Los Fresno sessions what the

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Speaker 1: press would call the bomb school offered lessons not in

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Speaker 1: bomb disposal, but in bomb making. The course is not

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Speaker 1: designed to nor does it prepare the student to be

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Speaker 1: a bomb or explosive technical disposal technician. There's thrust of

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Speaker 1: the instruction introduces trainees to commercially available materials and home

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Speaker 1: laboratory techniques and the manufacture of explosives and incendiaries. Different

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Speaker 1: types of explosive techniques and booby traps and their construction

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Speaker 1: and used by terrorists are demonstrated. And again, all these

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Speaker 1: classes were taught at a Border Patrol facility, And while

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Speaker 1: the main instructors were CIA agents, it was not just

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Speaker 1: the convenient location that made the agency use Los Fresnos.

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Speaker 1: The Border Patrol had always had within it the seeds

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Speaker 1: of a national secret police force. Decades before CBP agents

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Speaker 1: were operating an unmarked snatch fans on the streets of

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Speaker 1: Portland and it was Customs and Border Patrol who was

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Speaker 1: doing that. Um, they helped to train foreign police to

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Speaker 1: do the exact same thing and much worse. Besides, that's fun,

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Speaker 1: Like wanting to say, like what a fun thing? What?

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Speaker 1: I don't know what else to say. It's just like

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Speaker 1: this kind of litany of horrors that we've all just

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Speaker 1: kind of blithely funded our entire lives, even though a

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Speaker 1: great deal of information exists on how bad this agency

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Speaker 1: has always been. Um because the only real if you

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Speaker 1: actually like get into it as we are today, the

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Speaker 1: only real conclusion is that, like, oh, maybe when you

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Speaker 1: have people whose job it is to police the border,

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Speaker 1: they're they're they're just going to be the worst people.

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Speaker 1: And and maybe you shouldn't police the border at all

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Speaker 1: because this happened. But maybe border borders are completely arbitrary

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Speaker 1: and mean nothing. And why or why have we decided

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Speaker 1: that they that crossing them is a crime. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's bad. And the kind of people who decide that,

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Speaker 1: like they want to make their whole lives about punishing

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Speaker 1: desperate people for the quote unquote crime of crossing the border.

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Speaker 1: H our our our monsters, and when you start giving

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Speaker 1: them guns and power, h they use it to enable

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Speaker 1: genocides and political oppression abroad, and then inevitably do you

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Speaker 1: so back at home, which is what's happening now. So

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Speaker 1: when it comes to government agencies that Americans, particularly liberals,

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Speaker 1: rage against, customs and border patrol has spent most of

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Speaker 1: its history, kind of sliding under the mainstream radar. But

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Speaker 1: liberals who only started paying attention to the agency after

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Speaker 1: Trump took office might be surprised to know that NYT

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Speaker 1: Report or New York Times reporter John Crudeson won a

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Speaker 1: Pulitzer Prize in nineteen eighty for a series of articles

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Speaker 1: about the Border Patrol whose titles would not look at

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Speaker 1: all out of place. In titles like Border Patrol sweeps

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Speaker 1: of illegal aliens leave scores of children in jails. Um,

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Speaker 1: it sounds a little familiar. Uh The intercept summarizing his

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Speaker 1: work notes patrollers he reported regularly engaged in beatings, murder, torture,

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Speaker 1: and rape, including the rape of girls as youngest twelve.

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Speaker 1: Some patrollers ran their own in house outlaw vigilante groups.

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Speaker 1: Others maintained ties with groups like the Clan. Border Patrol

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Speaker 1: agents also used the children of migrants, either as bait

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Speaker 1: or as pressure pressure tactic to force confessions. When coming

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Speaker 1: upon a family, agents tried to apprehend the youngest member first,

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Speaker 1: with the idea that relatives would give themselves up so

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Speaker 1: as not to be separated. It may sound cruel when

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Speaker 1: Patroller said, but it often worked. Separating migrant families was

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Speaker 1: not official government policy in the years Crudsen was reporting

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Speaker 1: on abuses, but left to their own devices. Border Patrol

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Speaker 1: agents regularly took children from parents, threatening that they would

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Speaker 1: be separated forever unless one of them confessed that they

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Speaker 1: had entered the country illegally. Mothers, especially, an agent said,

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Speaker 1: would always break Once a confession was extracted. Children might

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Speaker 1: be placed in foster care or left to language in

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Speaker 1: federal jails. Others were released into Mexico alone, far from

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Speaker 1: their homes, forced to survive, according to public offenders, by

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Speaker 1: garbage cans, grounging, living on rooftops, and whatever. Ten year

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Speaker 1: old Sylvia Alvarado, separated from her grandmother as they crossed

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Speaker 1: into Texas, was kept in a small cinder block cell

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Speaker 1: for more than three months in California. Thirteen year old

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Speaker 1: Julia Perez, threatened with being arrested and denied food, broke

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Speaker 1: down and told her investigator that she was Mexican, even

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Speaker 1: though she was a US citizen. The Border Patrol released

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Speaker 1: Perez into Mexico with no money or way to contact

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Speaker 1: her US family. Such cruelties weren't one offs, but part

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Speaker 1: of a pattern encouraged and committed by officers up the

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Speaker 1: chain of command. The violence was both gratuitive and systemic,

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Speaker 1: including stress techniques later associated with the war in Iraq.

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Speaker 1: I mean, wow, what kind of truly in human monster

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Speaker 1: do you have to be to use to be yes

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Speaker 1: and more specifically to use children as bait or to

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Speaker 1: like snatch them first as just like I can't even

426
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:07,399
Speaker 1: form a sentence that is yeah, it's not great. I

427
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: mean the sentence that that you said, like I got

428
00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:14,919
Speaker 1: teary eyed with the mothers, the mothers broke first or

429
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 1: what yea horrible no, it's um. I don't know, you know,

430
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,720
Speaker 1: when I talk about how this all actually makes me feel,

431
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:27,760
Speaker 1: there's no way to do that without repeatedly urging other

432
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:32,160
Speaker 1: people to commit federal crimes um up to when including

433
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,360
Speaker 1: assaulted murder. So I'm just like gonna stop right there

434
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:39,119
Speaker 1: and continue talking about the border patrol instead, um, because

435
00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:42,399
Speaker 1: we shouldn't do that on a podcast. One tactic the

436
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 1: border patrol came to a door was the locking of

437
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:48,120
Speaker 1: migrants and freezing cold rooms called heliara's or ice boxes.

438
00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:50,880
Speaker 1: This goes back at least to the nineteen eighties. According

439
00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:53,919
Speaker 1: to Crudzen, agents would tell prisoners in this place, you

440
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:57,080
Speaker 1: have no rights. Since these people had committed no crime

441
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,440
Speaker 1: beyond crossing a line in the dirt, their detention serve

442
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:03,480
Speaker 1: no real purpose beyond cruelty. Cruelty was the point. Border

443
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,679
Speaker 1: Patrol agents throughout the seventies, eighties, and nineties were repeatedly

444
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:10,560
Speaker 1: documented torturing migrants. A popular method was handcuffing them to

445
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,399
Speaker 1: squad cars and then making them run alongside the video

446
00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:16,399
Speaker 1: as it half dragged them to the border. Outright murder

447
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:19,159
Speaker 1: was common as well. One Patrol agent told Crudeson that

448
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:22,280
Speaker 1: agents commonly pushed illegals off cliffs so it would look

449
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:26,359
Speaker 1: like an accident. Much of the agency's behavior wasn't distinguishable

450
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 1: from that of a straight up gang. Agents with I

451
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,560
Speaker 1: n S. Border Patrol's parent agency at the time, were

452
00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:34,600
Speaker 1: caught trading Mexican women to the Los Angeles Rams in

453
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:39,800
Speaker 1: exchange for season tickets. What yes, the thing that happened?

454
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 1: I can't brave men and women of the Border Patrol.

455
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,320
Speaker 1: We're in the green. Oh my god, it's time for

456
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:55,399
Speaker 1: an advert so that I can go vomit. Yeah, you

457
00:25:55,400 --> 00:26:01,920
Speaker 1: know who doesn't trade women for you can't even sports?

458
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 1: It's an ad break products and services, and we're back.

459
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: We're having a good time. So I n S agents

460
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 1: were also caught supplying Mexican prostitutes to congressmen and judges

461
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 1: in exchange for political favors. Over time, the Border Patrol

462
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,920
Speaker 1: found ways to get over their long standing conflicts with

463
00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,240
Speaker 1: with Texan ranchers. In numerous cases, they worked out deals

464
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 1: with ranch owners whereby they would hold off on immigration

465
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 1: raids until right before payday, giving ranchers the use of

466
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:42,639
Speaker 1: migrant bodies without the need to pay them. Border patrol

467
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:44,359
Speaker 1: men got to hunt and fitch for free on their

468
00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:46,919
Speaker 1: ranches as payments. This is kind of how they worked

469
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:50,440
Speaker 1: out that that little set of disagreements, that little the

470
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,320
Speaker 1: uprising in Texas that had been sparked by it. They

471
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:58,160
Speaker 1: would exploit the labor and and then have an agreement

472
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,360
Speaker 1: with the Border Patrol and be like, okay, see them

473
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 1: on this day, yeah, so that I don't have to

474
00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:06,679
Speaker 1: pay the Oh my god's good, yeah crude sent that.

475
00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:09,080
Speaker 1: New York Times journalists even documented that one of the

476
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 1: range the ranches Border Patrol worked out in arrangement with

477
00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,600
Speaker 1: was owned by President Lyndon B. Johnson while he was president.

478
00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:22,280
Speaker 1: Oh holy good stuff. Between nineteen eight five and nineteen ninety,

479
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: federal agents gunned down twenty two migrants just in the

480
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 1: area around San Diego. The Intercept reports quote on April eighteen,

481
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 1: nineteen eight six, for instance, patroller Edward Cole was beating

482
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 1: fourteen year old Edwardo Carrillo Estrada on the U S

483
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: side of the border's chain link fence when he stopped

484
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 1: and shot at Wardo's younger brother, Humberto in the back.

485
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 1: Humberto was standing on the other side of the fence

486
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 1: on Mexican soil. A court ruled that Cole, who had

487
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,560
Speaker 1: previous incidents of shooting through the fence and Mexicans, had

488
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,120
Speaker 1: reason to fear for his life from Humberto and used

489
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:55,199
Speaker 1: justifiable force. Such abuses persisted through the nineteen nineties and

490
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,840
Speaker 1: two thousands. In nineteen nine three, the House Subcommittee on

491
00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:01,959
Speaker 1: International Law, Immigration and Refugee held hearings on border patrol abuse,

492
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,399
Speaker 1: and its transcript is a catalog of horrors. One former guard,

493
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: Toney Heffner, at the I n S Detention Center in

494
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:11,199
Speaker 1: Port Isabel, Texas, reported that a young Salvadoran girl was

495
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:14,439
Speaker 1: forced to perform personal duties like dancing the Lambada for

496
00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: I n S officials. In two thousand eleven, Hefner published

497
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,760
Speaker 1: a memoir with more accusations of sexual abuse by as

498
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 1: Hefner Rights the ion S brass. Roberto Martinez, who worked

499
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 1: with the San Diego based US Mexico Border program for

500
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:30,800
Speaker 1: the American Friends Service Committee, testified that human and civil

501
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 1: rights violations by board the Border Patrol run the gamut

502
00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:37,080
Speaker 1: of abuse is imaginable, from rape to murder. Agents regularly

503
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: seized original birth certificates in green cards from Latino citizens,

504
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 1: leaving the victim with the financial burden of having to

505
00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:45,680
Speaker 1: go through a lengthy process of applying for a new document.

506
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,760
Speaker 1: Rapes and sexual abuse and I I S attention centers

507
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 1: around the United States, Martinez said, seemed to be escalating

508
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 1: throughout the border region. Okay, I have to talk through

509
00:28:54,120 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 1: something here. So, in theory law and forcement is there

510
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: to prevent crime, stop crime, find criminals, et cetera. We

511
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,600
Speaker 1: know that that's barely what they do, right, but that's

512
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 1: in theory the purpose of law enforcement, and so by

513
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:21,640
Speaker 1: by extension border patrol if it is for since it

514
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:25,120
Speaker 1: is for some reason illegal to you know, cross a

515
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 1: border undocumented or without the proper documentation that is quote,

516
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 1: a crime according to ridiculous standards, right. And I also

517
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:41,920
Speaker 1: understand in theory the concept of like punishing things that

518
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 1: are actual crime. That makes sense to me as long

519
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 1: as it's done responsibly, which it never is. The idea

520
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 1: of seeing crossing a border without the proper documentation and

521
00:29:56,120 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 1: deciding that the punishment for that crime warrants things like

522
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 1: human trafficking, murder, sexual assault, uh all manner of other horrible, horrible,

523
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 1: unmentionable things like where I just it is the most

524
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:22,600
Speaker 1: disgusting thing. I think the problem here that you're having

525
00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 1: is in thinking that the goal, the purposes ever to

526
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:30,000
Speaker 1: prevent crime UM, whereas the reality is the purpose is

527
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 1: to UM is to protect it's to protect whiteness exactly, yes, yeah,

528
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 1: and and it's to provide an outlet for UM for

529
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 1: fascists in this country to do horrible violence on people

530
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:47,720
Speaker 1: UM in a way that is, rather than being disorganized

531
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:51,560
Speaker 1: and sort of being anti state and being something that

532
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 1: like causes disorder, being UM violence that they are allowed

533
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:02,080
Speaker 1: to carry out that UM that enforces the uh, the

534
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 1: the kind of the state itself that like that like

535
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 1: backs up the existence of the state. Um, like you

536
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 1: have all these you have all these tremendously violent people, right, um,

537
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 1: and you can do a couple of things to them. Um,

538
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:19,800
Speaker 1: but they're there. Uh So either you you try to

539
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:22,200
Speaker 1: like deal with them and and de radicalize them and

540
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 1: make them less dangerous, you kill them, or as we do,

541
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 1: you give them guns and make them unaccountable and allow

542
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:31,760
Speaker 1: them to to do horrible violence to large groups of

543
00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 1: people who have no political agency. Yes, that is exactly

544
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:38,480
Speaker 1: what it is. It's like people who are like, well,

545
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 1: the general population thinks that, you know, being a member

546
00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:48,400
Speaker 1: of a hate group like the KKK is bad. So

547
00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 1: I'm going to do the same exact things that the

548
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 1: KKK does, but it's being masked as a government agency.

549
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,360
Speaker 1: Like basically, this terror or terrorist organization, this hate group

550
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: is protected and quote justified because it is a government agency.

551
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 1: Even they're committing the same heinous acts in the name

552
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: of under the guise of some kind of protection. But

553
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,680
Speaker 1: truly it's the like you said, protection of of whiteness

554
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 1: and criminalizing being not white. And that's been and that's

555
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 1: the only way it ever will be as long as

556
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:42,040
Speaker 1: we have a border, um, and we consider there to

557
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 1: be some sort of fundamental value in um, the sanctity

558
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 1: of that border. Right, And that's good. I want to

559
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 1: cry about it. Yeah, it's it's good to do that sometimes.

560
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:56,960
Speaker 1: Other times it's good to continue reading a podcast script,

561
00:32:57,880 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 1: which I will now do, okay, because this is how

562
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 1: I deal with problems. This is the only way that

563
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:09,480
Speaker 1: I deal with problems is by reading podcast scripts. I

564
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:15,160
Speaker 1: mean informing Informing the people helps. Yeah, that's that's a

565
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 1: way that you can describe this as informing the people.

566
00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:22,080
Speaker 1: I don't know, you know. UM. In nineteen seventy nine,

567
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 1: Maria Contreris, nine months pregnant, crossed back into the United

568
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,880
Speaker 1: States from Mexico legally after shopping for food. Border patrol

569
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: agents found the suspicious and they tortured her to try

570
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,120
Speaker 1: to get her to reveal information about undocumented migrants. She

571
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 1: died under interrogation, leaving six children behind. UM. This sort

572
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:39,600
Speaker 1: of thing happened all the time. You know, we have

573
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,040
Speaker 1: documentation about Maria Contreriss case, but this is maybe even

574
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 1: a daily matter, and it's something that continues to this day. UM,

575
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:50,480
Speaker 1: in dark and terrifying corners of the border, where such

576
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 1: things are not documented most of the time, but which

577
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 1: we all pay for. Throughout all of this, the Border

578
00:33:57,440 --> 00:33:59,440
Speaker 1: patrol and I n S were sort of the redheaded

579
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 1: step child to federal agencies with law enforcement powers. They

580
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,959
Speaker 1: were barely funded because, if you can imagine this, illegal

581
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,799
Speaker 1: immigration was not something people cared about. So for most

582
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 1: of these periods, this period, while all of the horrible

583
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:13,720
Speaker 1: things we've been talking about have been happening, border control

584
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:18,759
Speaker 1: has basically no money, um and very few agents considering

585
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:21,000
Speaker 1: like what it's supposed to be watching in its purview,

586
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: it's just kind of a place where we keep all

587
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:26,319
Speaker 1: of our most violent law enforcement officers and they don't

588
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 1: have the money to do much um, but nobody's watching them,

589
00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: so they can carry out horrific acts of violence. And

590
00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 1: that's the Border Patrol and really I n s too. UM.

591
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 1: For the most part, Yeah, border states probably had you know,

592
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 1: not probably border states had debates on the matter of

593
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,320
Speaker 1: illegal immigration. It was certainly like you know, a political

594
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,240
Speaker 1: issue in Texas, in New Mexico and stuff. But random

595
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 1: people in Deluth, random Americans in Duluth or you know,

596
00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:55,399
Speaker 1: Wichita or bubble fuck Montana or whatever, didn't really care

597
00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,160
Speaker 1: about the border right eighties and nineties, it was not

598
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 1: a big vote getter for most of that period of time. Now,

599
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: at the start of the Clinton administration, there were only

600
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: about four thousand border patrol agents watching both Canada and

601
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:10,400
Speaker 1: Mexico UM, which is not a lot if you think

602
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 1: about how big both of those borders are. There are

603
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:16,800
Speaker 1: many miles long. Yeah, they're pretty big. In n NAFTA

604
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 1: became a thing, the North American free trade thing of

605
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:22,880
Speaker 1: the jigger UH, and illegal immigration grew by leaps and

606
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:27,320
Speaker 1: bounds alongside right wing fearmongering about illegal immigration. The border

607
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 1: patrol more than doubled in size by the turn of

608
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: the millennium. So this is like the first thing that

609
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:33,840
Speaker 1: really leads to a massive surge in the border patrol

610
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:36,560
Speaker 1: is NAFTA becomes a thing, and suddenly a shipload more

611
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:39,759
Speaker 1: people are trying to cross the border. UH. Illegal immigration,

612
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 1: by the end of the nineteen nineties is a major

613
00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 1: national political issue. In the border patrol more than doubles

614
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 1: under Clinton. UH. In the year two thousand, our nation's

615
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:52,919
Speaker 1: peak year for illegal immigration, border patrol agents apprehended one

616
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:56,239
Speaker 1: point six million people UH. This, though, was just a

617
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,240
Speaker 1: fraction of the total that got through. Border patrol agents

618
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: were unhappy about the fact that most undocumented migrants were

619
00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 1: still getting through the border, and that the many rules

620
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 1: and that there were many rules in place to stop

621
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,640
Speaker 1: them from you know, doing Operation Wetback type stuff and

622
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 1: basically carrying out an ethnic cleansing to get rid of

623
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,880
Speaker 1: uh non white people from border areas. From an article

624
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 1: in Politico quote quote. Near the top of the Border

625
00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 1: Patrol's list of complaints was the policy known internally as

626
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 1: CARP or catch, the catch and release policy. By the

627
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,520
Speaker 1: end of the Clinton administration, eighty percent of people who

628
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:30,600
Speaker 1: were caught and released with a notice who appeared a

629
00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 1: deportation hearing never showed up in a court. But despite

630
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:36,040
Speaker 1: millions of border crossings, the Border Patrol had the financing

631
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,799
Speaker 1: in two thousand one for just sixty detainees a day

632
00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:41,680
Speaker 1: across the entire country. They could turn themselves in and

633
00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 1: have a high confidence that they wouldn't be returned to

634
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,759
Speaker 1: their home countries require riccalls. Michael Cherdoff, who would go

635
00:36:46,760 --> 00:36:49,920
Speaker 1: on to become President George W. Bush's second second Secretary

636
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 1: of Homeland Security. Mostly agents just asked border violators for

637
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,359
Speaker 1: their names and then did a cursory background check before

638
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:59,400
Speaker 1: returning them to Mexico or releasing them into the United States.

639
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 1: Sometimes they ran fingerprints, sometimes they didn't. In June nine,

640
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 1: agents captured one of the FBI's ten most wanted fugitives,

641
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:10,680
Speaker 1: a rapist and serial killer named Angel Maturino Rascinde's a

642
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:14,239
Speaker 1: k a. The Railway Killer, and unknowingly released him back

643
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,840
Speaker 1: into Mexico, whereupon Rascindez promptly sneaked back into the United

644
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 1: States and murdered four more people before being apprehended by

645
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:24,239
Speaker 1: Texas rangers. So the story of the railway Killer was,

646
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 1: of course used to justify the need for more funding

647
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 1: to the Border Patrol. What the whole story really illustrates

648
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 1: is that even when the Border Patrol had occasional chances

649
00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:36,200
Speaker 1: to actually protect Americans by apprehending people, they were as

650
00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:38,359
Speaker 1: likely to funk up as anything, because most of them

651
00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:42,799
Speaker 1: were shitass, incompetent, and anything besides doing violence. So nine

652
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: eleven happens. Do you remember nine eleven? I remember? It's good.

653
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:50,800
Speaker 1: You're not supposed to forget it. Now. Nine eleven happens.

654
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: And if you were alive in Cognizant at the time,

655
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:55,480
Speaker 1: you might remember that basically everybody in their grandma was

656
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:58,319
Speaker 1: obsessed with the imminent possibility that al Qaeda might drive

657
00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:01,200
Speaker 1: a regiment of terrorist nuclear hanks or whatever across the

658
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 1: Texas border. As someone who lived in Texas at the time,

659
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 1: where a bunch of people freaking out about how like

660
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:08,239
Speaker 1: terrorists hit squads we're gonna be making their way up

661
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:11,000
Speaker 1: through the border. Kids at my like suburban Texas high school,

662
00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:12,840
Speaker 1: We're certain that al Qaeda was going to be sending

663
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 1: people to shoot up our school because like plane Oh,

664
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 1: Texas was real high on fucking Osama bin Laden's Hitlas.

665
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: What did they think they were going to like go

666
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,920
Speaker 1: to Mexico first and then cross the border? What they

667
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 1: think It didn't It didn't really scan a lot. I mean,

668
00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,640
Speaker 1: I'll say this, I think that it's maybe not talked

669
00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 1: about enough that agree to which guys like John Milnius

670
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:37,160
Speaker 1: and movies like Red Dawn prepared everybody to believe the

671
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 1: bullshit the Bush administration said about how terrorists we're gonna

672
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:43,280
Speaker 1: be sneaking through the border. Um, but like yeah, whatever,

673
00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:45,759
Speaker 1: Um it was very dumb. It was a very dumb time.

674
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 1: But also like you know, a bunch of guys had

675
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 1: worked together to ram planes into the Pentagon and destroy

676
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 1: two skyscrapers in New York City. People were willing to

677
00:38:54,680 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 1: believe a lot of terrible things were possible. And because

678
00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:01,600
Speaker 1: the border, you know, right wing pundits had been convincing

679
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 1: everybody that the border was this dangerous and and unmonitored

680
00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:07,399
Speaker 1: place for so long. People were like, oh my god,

681
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:09,919
Speaker 1: of course the terrorists will try there. They never did,

682
00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:15,000
Speaker 1: um but you know they still might any day, now, Caitlin,

683
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:18,520
Speaker 1: any day al kaas finally get a squad up there.

684
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:23,520
Speaker 1: Nobody will notice all of the anyway whatever. Uh So, yeah,

685
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:26,800
Speaker 1: Tom Ridge, the former governor of Pennsylvania, was made President

686
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:29,480
Speaker 1: Bush's homeland securities are Now this was before the Department

687
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,280
Speaker 1: of Homeland Security existed. That came about in like November

688
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,800
Speaker 1: of um but as soon as like nine eleven is

689
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 1: a thing, Bushes like, we gotta have somebody whose job

690
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: is to think about safety for the country, which like

691
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:45,279
Speaker 1: there were already a bunch of people doing that and

692
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:49,439
Speaker 1: it hadn't helped. And but anyway, whatever, um so Tom

693
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 1: Ridge is like is made the Czar of Homeland Security,

694
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,880
Speaker 1: and he made border control one of his priorities. He

695
00:39:56,960 --> 00:39:59,640
Speaker 1: realized pretty much immediately that the border patrol was going

696
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:01,719
Speaker 1: to be an is shoe for him. Robert Bonner, who

697
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:03,719
Speaker 1: worked with Ridge and later became the first head of

698
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 1: Customs and Border Patrol, told Politico quote, within the I

699
00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:09,719
Speaker 1: n S structure, they were the poor step child. That

700
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,839
Speaker 1: was how most of ions viewed them at every level.

701
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:14,400
Speaker 1: They weren't appreciated and weren't viewed with respect, and that

702
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,560
Speaker 1: created this defensiveness and in celerity within the Border Patrol.

703
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:19,839
Speaker 1: There was a lot of debate about what to do

704
00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 1: with the organization and whether or not to just take

705
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:24,800
Speaker 1: all the different groups that handled various border related things

706
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:27,839
Speaker 1: and merge them into one border agency. But that would

707
00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 1: have meant several different cabinet secretaries would have each lost

708
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: tiny amounts of power and money. Because you know, you

709
00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 1: have this group that's like, you know, your your job

710
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:37,840
Speaker 1: is to look for war criminals who might have like

711
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 1: accidentally gotten citizenship or green cards. You have this other

712
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:44,240
Speaker 1: group his job as to like, you know, handle customs enforcement.

713
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:46,200
Speaker 1: You know, you have the Border Patrol. You have like

714
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 1: the group that's job is to go around and look

715
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,239
Speaker 1: for people who might be violating immigration law. You have

716
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,200
Speaker 1: all these different groups that are like under different sort

717
00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:56,680
Speaker 1: of people's perview and putting them all in one like

718
00:40:57,000 --> 00:40:59,560
Speaker 1: organized border patrol that does everything would have meant that

719
00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:01,880
Speaker 1: all of the different cabinet secretaries lost a little bit

720
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:04,280
Speaker 1: of money and power. So they all vetoed that idea

721
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: in unison no no, no, no, funk that ship. Um. Instead,

722
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:10,839
Speaker 1: the decision was made to dissolve I n S and

723
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:13,839
Speaker 1: put the border patrol under the purview of the new

724
00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:16,880
Speaker 1: Customs and Border Patrol, which would itself be part of

725
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:20,359
Speaker 1: the brand new Department of Homeland Security. The final nail

726
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:22,920
Speaker 1: in ion SS coffin was the fact that the agency

727
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 1: had approved visas for two of the nine eleven hijackers

728
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: after nine eleven UM. So this is kind of what like, yeah,

729
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:34,320
Speaker 1: that's the that's the wrong time to do that. Somebody

730
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 1: probably should have like gotten on the phone immediately after

731
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:39,800
Speaker 1: that and been like, hey, we should run these names,

732
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:42,239
Speaker 1: like just make sure we're not going to embarrass everybody,

733
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:45,359
Speaker 1: But they did um. And when the news kind of

734
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: came out that ion S had approved visas for two

735
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:50,880
Speaker 1: of the people who had just carried out the biggest

736
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 1: terrorist attack in the US history, the Bush administration was

737
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: really not happy with ion S UM and that kind

738
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:59,640
Speaker 1: of that kind of spelled their doom. Uh And in fact,

739
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:02,439
Speaker 1: we they dissolved the agency. No one from the White

740
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:04,880
Speaker 1: House even thought to call the I n S commissioner

741
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:10,359
Speaker 1: and tell him, um, yeah, I'm gonna quote again from

742
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 1: Politico's article, I and S was such a broken bureaucracy

743
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:16,920
Speaker 1: that it would be the single agency in the entire U. S.

744
00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:20,400
Speaker 1: Government to receive the ultimate death penalty. After nine eleven,

745
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 1: in the wide arranging bureaucratic reorganization that led to the

746
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:26,759
Speaker 1: Department of Homeland Security, I and S was completely disbanded,

747
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:30,840
Speaker 1: its responsibilities removed from the Justice Department, and it's duties

748
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:35,560
Speaker 1: reassigned among three new DHS agencies, Immigration and Customs Enforcement ICE,

749
00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:39,200
Speaker 1: Citizenship and Immigration Services c i S, and Customs and

750
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,960
Speaker 1: Border Protection CBP. And the newly created DHS would be

751
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:45,279
Speaker 1: a reality in less than a year. So that's the

752
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 1: situation um now. The man tasked with creating the CBP

753
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 1: was Robert Bonner, a federal judge and a former d

754
00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:56,400
Speaker 1: E A head. His most first and most pressing decision

755
00:42:56,680 --> 00:42:59,560
Speaker 1: was whether or not to change the agency's famous Green

756
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:03,360
Speaker 1: Unit form, which is obviously more important than like the

757
00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 1: rape training of women for sports tickets and stuff. Why

758
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:10,279
Speaker 1: is that the first order of business? Why are the

759
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 1: orders These brave men of the Border Patrol who only

760
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:19,120
Speaker 1: occasionally commit mass rape and sex trafficking that includes sex

761
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,240
Speaker 1: trafficking of twelve year olds and only occasionally torture pregnant

762
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 1: women to death. Those brave men have a lot of

763
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:26,880
Speaker 1: pride in their uniform, and they want to know that

764
00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:30,440
Speaker 1: uniform is not going to change. You know. They have

765
00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:35,239
Speaker 1: to be presentable. That's the most that's important thing. The

766
00:43:35,239 --> 00:43:37,680
Speaker 1: most important thing is that they get to still feel

767
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:39,760
Speaker 1: like they're part of the part of the old Border

768
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 1: Patrol that they love, you know, the old Border Patrol.

769
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,680
Speaker 1: But let some torture all those people and throw kids

770
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:49,839
Speaker 1: into into dank, freezing cells for months on end, many

771
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:53,719
Speaker 1: of whom are actually American citizens. That's just how it's

772
00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:59,840
Speaker 1: it's important, you know, yeah so uh from Politico quote weeks.

773
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: But for the new agency officially launched on March first,

774
00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 1: two thousand three, he invited all of the Border Patrols

775
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,160
Speaker 1: twenties sector chiefs to Washington to discuss the transition. They

776
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:11,360
Speaker 1: all arrived in d C in full dress, green uniforms, shoes,

777
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:14,279
Speaker 1: polished brass buttons gleaming. As Bonner walked into the room,

778
00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 1: everyone stood and snapped to attention. The new commissioner began

779
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:21,120
Speaker 1: his remarks, simply, the Border Patrol will remain green. The

780
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:24,359
Speaker 1: room erupted in applause and cheers. They're proud of the green.

781
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:27,200
Speaker 1: They were very proud of that uniform, Bonner recalls today.

782
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 1: They were concerned about losing that identity. Who cares about

783
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:42,000
Speaker 1: your green uniform? The Border Patrol caressers. See this is why,

784
00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:45,520
Speaker 1: as as I've always said, uh and so if you

785
00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 1: can back me up on this, Caitlin, you would be

786
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 1: a terrible head of the Border Patrol m because I

787
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:55,440
Speaker 1: don't respect the green exactly. Well, I don't even understand,

788
00:44:56,640 --> 00:45:00,040
Speaker 1: but it's because I hate the Celtics. So I and

789
00:45:00,120 --> 00:45:04,360
Speaker 1: happy see Sophie, you'd be bad at this too, because

790
00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:07,960
Speaker 1: as a Border Patrol agent, you should be trading kidnapped

791
00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:10,759
Speaker 1: women to the Celtics in exchange for season tickets. Oh

792
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:12,760
Speaker 1: my god, can we just go to an ad break?

793
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:17,120
Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, speaking of the Celtics. You know who else

794
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:20,279
Speaker 1: supports this podcast? Hey? You know who else is whore

795
00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: No no predace and services. And we're back that that Celtics.

796
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:36,600
Speaker 1: Dig I just would like to denote that I will

797
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:40,120
Speaker 1: keep doing that and also high prop. Yeah, it's that

798
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:43,759
Speaker 1: I don't understand who the Celtics are Celtics. I don't

799
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:46,440
Speaker 1: understand any of this. This is also because if you

800
00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:49,960
Speaker 1: love that team, if you love that team, send your

801
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,000
Speaker 1: death threats to Sophie. Yeah, if you love that if

802
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:54,920
Speaker 1: you love that team, just don't follow me because we

803
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 1: will never be friends. Also because I don't know who

804
00:45:57,040 --> 00:46:00,719
Speaker 1: they are. If you if you don't give a ship

805
00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:07,880
Speaker 1: about sports teams in existence tenness, follow me. Yeah, except

806
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:11,040
Speaker 1: for soccer. Soccer is allowed. Soccer's cool. Soccer is the

807
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:14,880
Speaker 1: only sport. Soccer is definitely not allowed. What soccer soccer

808
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: is there is. There is one sport allowed in my

809
00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 1: ideal world, and it's that that game they play in

810
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 1: Afghanistan where they all ride around on horseback with a

811
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,000
Speaker 1: goat head and people get killed sometimes because they it's

812
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:30,480
Speaker 1: it's yeah, you just fully Robert died this entire thing. Anyways,

813
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:33,080
Speaker 1: followed Caitlin on Twitter. On Instagram, She's a great follow

814
00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:37,120
Speaker 1: continue with your go to Afghanistan to play sports anyway. Uh.

815
00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:40,040
Speaker 1: They were not particularly concerned the border patrol with making

816
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:42,279
Speaker 1: any changes to reduce the number of migrants killed by

817
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 1: border patrol agents. Since two thousand three, border patrol agents

818
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:48,120
Speaker 1: have killed at least ninety seven people. Six of those

819
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 1: people were children. They've also taken repeated action to stop

820
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:54,080
Speaker 1: other people from saving lives. As summers grew more brutal,

821
00:46:54,120 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 1: more and more migrants started dying in the Sonora and desert.

822
00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:59,480
Speaker 1: In two thousand four, the faith based organization No More

823
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:02,520
Speaker 1: Deaths leading gallant leaving gallon jugs of water out in

824
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:05,040
Speaker 1: near common footpaths and the desperate hope that it might

825
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 1: stop a few people from dying horribly in the desert.

826
00:47:07,760 --> 00:47:10,360
Speaker 1: They soon noticed that their water bottles were being slashed open.

827
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:13,759
Speaker 1: No More Death set up hidden cameras. They found in

828
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 1: every case border patrol agents destroying water caches, almost with

829
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:20,360
Speaker 1: visible glee. You can see one of these videos for

830
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 1: yourself and the PBS documentary Need to Know. Salon dot

831
00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:28,120
Speaker 1: COM's description is quite good. Quote three border patrol agents,

832
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:30,400
Speaker 1: two men and a woman, are walking along a migrant

833
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:32,719
Speaker 1: trail and approaching a half half a dozen one gallon

834
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:35,200
Speaker 1: jugs of water. The female agent stops in front of

835
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:37,239
Speaker 1: the containers and begins to kick them with forced down

836
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:40,760
Speaker 1: a ravine. The bottles crash against rocks, bursting open. She's smiling.

837
00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:43,120
Speaker 1: One of the agents watching her smiles as well, seemed

838
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:45,800
Speaker 1: to take real pleasure in the spectacle. He says something

839
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 1: under his breath, and the word talk is clearly audible.

840
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:51,680
Speaker 1: Do you know what talk means? I don't. So we

841
00:47:51,719 --> 00:47:54,040
Speaker 1: talked about wet back in episode one and how that

842
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,720
Speaker 1: was the Border Patrols kind of old term for for

843
00:47:57,360 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 1: particularly Mexican immigrants because of the river they have to cross.

844
00:48:01,040 --> 00:48:04,520
Speaker 1: Talk is new the new slur that the Border patrol

845
00:48:04,600 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 1: uses for a documented immigrants, and it comes from the

846
00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:10,120
Speaker 1: sound that a flashlight makes when you hit someone in

847
00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:14,840
Speaker 1: the head. Oh my god, you'll hear this if in

848
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:17,279
Speaker 1: any article you read about the modern border Patrol, that

849
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:20,040
Speaker 1: that they the word talk is like their their standard

850
00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:23,400
Speaker 1: term for for migrants, and it's a term because of

851
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:25,799
Speaker 1: what it sounds like when they beat these people with flashlights.

852
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:33,560
Speaker 1: Well mm hmm, okay, let me just process that. New

853
00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 1: slurs were, of course, of course, far from the only

854
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:38,480
Speaker 1: changes to hit border patrol during the Bush years. By

855
00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:40,960
Speaker 1: the time President Obama took office, the Border Patrol had

856
00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:43,799
Speaker 1: gone from an underfunded force of about nine thousand to

857
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,800
Speaker 1: a twenty one person army. The largest federal law enforcement

858
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:51,520
Speaker 1: agency in the country. Um, there are actual armies smaller

859
00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:55,279
Speaker 1: than the Border Patrol and less well equipped. Uh. They're

860
00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 1: the largest law enforcement agency in the country now, Um,

861
00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:01,360
Speaker 1: so that's good. All those new officers had to be

862
00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:03,319
Speaker 1: trained up quick, and this did not leave time for

863
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 1: rigorous vetting and background checking that other federal agents go through.

864
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:10,120
Speaker 1: Border Patrol agents today still have the least average years

865
00:49:10,120 --> 00:49:13,040
Speaker 1: of experience of any federal law enforcement agency. They also

866
00:49:13,080 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 1: have the lowest standards for new recruits. This may have

867
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:17,840
Speaker 1: something to do with the fact that Border Patrol agents

868
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:20,560
Speaker 1: are involved in more fatal shootings than any other federal

869
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 1: law enforcement agency. Uh. Yeah, you know. Probably. It's not

870
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:27,479
Speaker 1: like any federal LA enforcement agency is good about giving

871
00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:30,280
Speaker 1: us numbers about how many people they shoot. But probably

872
00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:32,680
Speaker 1: they kill more than any of the others. Okay, I

873
00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:36,560
Speaker 1: believe it. Yeah. One senior DHS official even admitted to

874
00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:39,800
Speaker 1: Politico quote, the agency has created a culture that says,

875
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:41,759
Speaker 1: if you throw a rock at me, you're going to

876
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:45,120
Speaker 1: get shot. Between two thousand and five and two thousand twelve,

877
00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:48,800
Speaker 1: roughly one CBP officer was arrested for misconduct every single

878
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:51,839
Speaker 1: day during President Obama's first term. Things got so bad

879
00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 1: that DHS Secretary Janet Napolitano ordered the CBP to change

880
00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:58,720
Speaker 1: its institutional definition of the word corruption so they wouldn't

881
00:49:58,719 --> 00:50:00,759
Speaker 1: have to admit to as many problems When they were

882
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:06,160
Speaker 1: questioned by Congress about all of the murders. It's yeah,

883
00:50:06,200 --> 00:50:15,080
Speaker 1: again under Obama, it's pretty much impossible. No, I just like,

884
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:19,399
Speaker 1: uh yeah, Like we're not even really going to get

885
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:22,399
Speaker 1: into the Trump years in this two parter because that's

886
00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:25,440
Speaker 1: like a whole another thing to start talking about. Yeah,

887
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:29,040
Speaker 1: like most of this that we're talking about today, I

888
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:34,759
Speaker 1: mean it's Reagan, uh Bush Senior, Clinton Bush Jr. And Obama, Right,

889
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:36,879
Speaker 1: those are the guys that this is happening under. Those

890
00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:40,279
Speaker 1: are the guys funding this right enthusiastically. All of the

891
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:44,480
Speaker 1: politicians that everybody thinks they're fine now because Trump is

892
00:50:44,480 --> 00:50:49,040
Speaker 1: such a such a dick anyway. Um, yeah, it's pretty

893
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 1: much impossible to exaggerate how bad border patrol isn't was like,

894
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:56,160
Speaker 1: I'm gonna guess that most of our listeners come from

895
00:50:56,160 --> 00:50:59,279
Speaker 1: a broad position that like Feds are not good, um,

896
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:02,680
Speaker 1: which is mine and accurate. But even among that company,

897
00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:04,840
Speaker 1: like even if you're like, oh, federal agents are pretty

898
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:08,200
Speaker 1: much all bad, it's shocking how bad the agents of

899
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:13,040
Speaker 1: the CBPR. Like it's like, it's it's staggering, how shitty

900
00:51:13,160 --> 00:51:17,279
Speaker 1: they they particularly become in the odds. Uh. And I'm

901
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:20,319
Speaker 1: gonna quote from Salon again. There was my There was

902
00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:23,360
Speaker 1: the Miami CBP officer who used his law enforcement status

903
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:26,880
Speaker 1: to bypass airport security and personally smuggle cocaine and heroin

904
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:30,160
Speaker 1: into Miami. There was the green uniformed agent in Yuma, Arizona,

905
00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 1: who was caught smuggling seven dred pounds of marijuana across

906
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:35,280
Speaker 1: the border in his green and white border patrol truck.

907
00:51:35,600 --> 00:51:37,839
Speaker 1: The brand new twenty six year old border patrol agent

908
00:51:37,880 --> 00:51:40,480
Speaker 1: who joined a drug smuggling operation to distribute more than

909
00:51:40,520 --> 00:51:43,440
Speaker 1: a thousand kilograms of marijuana and del Rio, Texas. The

910
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:45,680
Speaker 1: thirty two year old border patrol agent whose wife would

911
00:51:45,680 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 1: tip him off on which buses filled with illegal immigrants

912
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:50,680
Speaker 1: uh to let through his checkpoint on I thirty five

913
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:53,760
Speaker 1: in Laredo, Texas. Some cases were more obvious than others,

914
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:55,920
Speaker 1: like the new border patrol agent who took an unusual

915
00:51:55,960 --> 00:51:58,720
Speaker 1: interest in maps of the agency's sensors along the border,

916
00:51:58,880 --> 00:52:00,879
Speaker 1: and was arrested just seven and months into the job

917
00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:05,400
Speaker 1: after he sold smugglers those maps for dollars. In November

918
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:08,960
Speaker 1: two thousand seven, CBP official Thomas Winkowski wrote an agency

919
00:52:08,960 --> 00:52:11,719
Speaker 1: wide memo citing numerous incidents, or, as he called them,

920
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:15,040
Speaker 1: disturbing events, saying that the leadership was concerned about the

921
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:18,759
Speaker 1: increase in the number of employee arrests. The memo, never

922
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:21,880
Speaker 1: made public, but obtained by the Miami Herald, reminded officers

923
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:24,760
Speaker 1: and agents, it is our responsibility to uphold the laws,

924
00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:28,840
Speaker 1: not break the law. Now. Right around that time, internal

925
00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:32,319
Speaker 1: CBP investigations uncovered that the agency had, in dozens of

926
00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:35,680
Speaker 1: cases hired members of Mexican drug cartels and gangs like

927
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:38,480
Speaker 1: m S thirteen to be agents. They had also hired

928
00:52:38,520 --> 00:52:42,400
Speaker 1: at least one serial killer, Juan David Ortiz, who murdered

929
00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:45,040
Speaker 1: five women during his time as an intelligence analyst for

930
00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:48,120
Speaker 1: the agency. He has also suspected of kidnapping a woman.

931
00:52:48,360 --> 00:52:50,680
Speaker 1: Will never really know the exact extent of his crimes,

932
00:52:50,719 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 1: and in that regard he fits in with another Border

933
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:57,360
Speaker 1: Patrol veteran Estebon Manzanares. It is possible that Estebon Manzanares

934
00:52:57,440 --> 00:52:59,440
Speaker 1: was not a serial killer. He hasn't been convicted of

935
00:52:59,480 --> 00:53:02,480
Speaker 1: any murder, but he was caught abducting three migrant women,

936
00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:05,319
Speaker 1: a mother and her two teenage daughters. He attempted to

937
00:53:05,360 --> 00:53:08,879
Speaker 1: bury one alive, and he raped another. Uh and yeah.

938
00:53:08,920 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 1: Earlier this year, in appeals court ruled that his victims

939
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:13,920
Speaker 1: could not sue the federal government as Menzonaras was not

940
00:53:14,040 --> 00:53:17,040
Speaker 1: acting in his official capacity as a border patrol agent

941
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:20,399
Speaker 1: when he assaulted those women. Sure, he arrested them during

942
00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:22,560
Speaker 1: his duties as a border patrol agent, and he took

943
00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:25,279
Speaker 1: them to a border patrol processing facility before taking them

944
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:27,879
Speaker 1: to a gated compound to assault them. But he wasn't.

945
00:53:28,120 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 1: He wasn't acting as a border patrol agent. Oh wow,

946
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:41,839
Speaker 1: the mental gymnastics people do just legal ones. Yeah okay, yeah. Now.

947
00:53:41,960 --> 00:53:44,319
Speaker 1: The good news is that a few bad apples like

948
00:53:44,440 --> 00:53:47,120
Speaker 1: man Sinara's and Ortiz, and also all of the thousands

949
00:53:47,120 --> 00:53:50,000
Speaker 1: of agents who got arrested on a nearly daily basis

950
00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:53,440
Speaker 1: for seven straight years, didn't stop the orchard from detaining

951
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:56,480
Speaker 1: more migrants than ever before during the Obama years. DHS

952
00:53:56,520 --> 00:54:00,439
Speaker 1: deported more undocumented migrants than ever four of the year.

953
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:03,680
Speaker 1: As President Obama said in two thousand eleven, the presence

954
00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:06,160
Speaker 1: of so many illegal immigrants make a mockery of all

955
00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:10,919
Speaker 1: those who are trying to immigrate legally. Now, yeah, that's

956
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:16,319
Speaker 1: good to Obama. It's pretty cool. It's pretty cool. What

957
00:54:16,400 --> 00:54:21,759
Speaker 1: a problem this was. Yeah, so and again, all of

958
00:54:21,760 --> 00:54:23,960
Speaker 1: these legally immigrants make a mockery of everyone trying to

959
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:27,200
Speaker 1: immigrate illegally. The the data shows that during this period,

960
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:30,000
Speaker 1: that's like fucking seven year period, an average of one

961
00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:33,240
Speaker 1: border patrol agent per day almost was arrested for serious

962
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:36,840
Speaker 1: crimes like ranging from like rape and sexual assault to

963
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:40,800
Speaker 1: attempted murder um too, you know, drug smuggling. Like every

964
00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:43,959
Speaker 1: day a border patrol agent basically was getting arrested during

965
00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:48,240
Speaker 1: these years. But that's not that's not making a mockery

966
00:54:48,360 --> 00:54:55,480
Speaker 1: of law enforcement or whatever. Yeah, yeah, Now, there were

967
00:54:55,480 --> 00:54:57,799
Speaker 1: a number of reasons why things got so bad in

968
00:54:57,960 --> 00:55:00,200
Speaker 1: border patrol. We've talked about some of them, just of

969
00:55:00,239 --> 00:55:03,480
Speaker 1: like the inherent racist nature of of the the existence

970
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:06,040
Speaker 1: of the border patrol um. But there are also just

971
00:55:06,080 --> 00:55:09,480
Speaker 1: sort of some um uh, some reasons that you would

972
00:55:09,520 --> 00:55:12,640
Speaker 1: describe as kind of broadly, uh, bureaucratic. There were a

973
00:55:12,640 --> 00:55:15,080
Speaker 1: bunch of bureaucratic reasons why it happened to write kind

974
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: of outside of the inherent you know, problems of policing

975
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:24,120
Speaker 1: a border. Um. For one point, like they were increasing

976
00:55:24,160 --> 00:55:27,120
Speaker 1: the size of the border patrol faster than any law

977
00:55:27,200 --> 00:55:30,640
Speaker 1: enforcement agency had ever been increased. UM, and that meant

978
00:55:30,640 --> 00:55:33,399
Speaker 1: bringing in a shiplet of people who weren't qualified. Um.

979
00:55:33,560 --> 00:55:35,480
Speaker 1: They had all of this money and they did not

980
00:55:35,520 --> 00:55:38,200
Speaker 1: have enough people who could actually responsibly do the jobs.

981
00:55:38,239 --> 00:55:40,799
Speaker 1: They were just throwing people in shares and giving them

982
00:55:40,840 --> 00:55:44,759
Speaker 1: guns and badges. Um. Now, the issues of hiring a

983
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:47,279
Speaker 1: bunch of people for an agency based on assaulting non

984
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:51,520
Speaker 1: white people, um and giving them you know, broad powers

985
00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 1: were compounded by structural problems within the board, like the

986
00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:57,160
Speaker 1: way the border patrol was set up. Most border patrol

987
00:55:57,200 --> 00:56:01,160
Speaker 1: men are agents. UM. This differs from special agents, which

988
00:56:01,160 --> 00:56:03,399
Speaker 1: are the cool dudes like Fox molder that everyone who

989
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:06,759
Speaker 1: becomes a FED wants to be special agents can both

990
00:56:06,840 --> 00:56:11,960
Speaker 1: arrest people and investigate crimes. Agents only have arresting powers.

991
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:16,239
Speaker 1: They cannot investigate crimes. Now, because CBP is seen as

992
00:56:16,280 --> 00:56:19,319
Speaker 1: the shittiest federal law enforcement agency the dumping ground for

993
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:22,160
Speaker 1: all of the violent assholes. Our government doesn't like to

994
00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:25,879
Speaker 1: make them special agents. According to Politico quote. In many ways,

995
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:28,719
Speaker 1: the difference between the two is CBPS original sin, a

996
00:56:28,800 --> 00:56:32,120
Speaker 1: seemingly minor technical distinction made in the harried heat of

997
00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:35,200
Speaker 1: DHS creation a decade ago that would allow hundreds of

998
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:38,160
Speaker 1: caraces of corruption in CBP's Office of Field Operations and

999
00:56:38,239 --> 00:56:40,800
Speaker 1: use of force abuses in the patrol border patrol to

1000
00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:43,719
Speaker 1: fester for years. The problem was that no one at

1001
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:48,200
Speaker 1: CBP received what's known as eighteen eleven authority. When DHS

1002
00:56:48,280 --> 00:56:51,240
Speaker 1: was set up, Ice was given exclusive eighteen eleven authority

1003
00:56:51,320 --> 00:56:54,600
Speaker 1: to conduct investigations in the border region. CBP was only

1004
00:56:54,600 --> 00:56:57,560
Speaker 1: given so called eighteen o one authority, a lesser classification

1005
00:56:57,600 --> 00:57:00,440
Speaker 1: that allowed border patrol agents and customs officers to make

1006
00:57:00,560 --> 00:57:03,759
Speaker 1: arrests and enforced federal law, but not investigate. They could

1007
00:57:03,800 --> 00:57:07,080
Speaker 1: be cops but not detectives. This didn't particularly matter in

1008
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:10,240
Speaker 1: the daily performance of CBPS duties. The borders were patrolled

1009
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:13,319
Speaker 1: to the ports of entry watched, except that CBP was

1010
00:57:13,480 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 1: legally prohibited from policing its own workforce. Yeah, and it's

1011
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:22,160
Speaker 1: again one of these things every single person who's ever

1012
00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:24,920
Speaker 1: been involved in running the CBP agrees like, yeah, this

1013
00:57:24,960 --> 00:57:27,480
Speaker 1: is a real big problem because it means that they're

1014
00:57:27,480 --> 00:57:30,800
Speaker 1: even less accountable than other law enforcement agencies. Because like

1015
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:34,520
Speaker 1: ones are barely accountable, and those ones are barely accountable.

1016
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:37,160
Speaker 1: But like, even when Border Patrol agents commit a crime

1017
00:57:37,200 --> 00:57:41,160
Speaker 1: that other border patrol agents think is horrible, like they

1018
00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:50,160
Speaker 1: can't investigate, no accountability, Holy crap. Um. Yeah, other law

1019
00:57:50,240 --> 00:57:53,360
Speaker 1: enforcement agencies look at Border Patrol and go Jesus Christ,

1020
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:56,640
Speaker 1: those people are unaccountable when they commit acts of unspeakable violence.

1021
00:57:57,200 --> 00:58:01,720
Speaker 1: That is bleak. That's bleak, very bleak. By two thousand

1022
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:05,000
Speaker 1: and twelve, the problems in Border Patrol were obvious enough

1023
00:58:05,040 --> 00:58:07,760
Speaker 1: that they spilled out into the public sphere. The Arizona

1024
00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:10,680
Speaker 1: Republic conducted an investigation which showed that agents had killed

1025
00:58:10,680 --> 00:58:13,200
Speaker 1: at least forty two people, thirteen of whom were citizens,

1026
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:15,840
Speaker 1: since two thousand five, and none of these killings was

1027
00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:18,360
Speaker 1: any agent known to have faced consequences of any kind.

1028
00:58:18,640 --> 00:58:21,800
Speaker 1: Congressional pressure forced the agency to submit to an investigation

1029
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:24,960
Speaker 1: by the Police Executive Research Forum, a Washington, d c.

1030
00:58:25,120 --> 00:58:27,840
Speaker 1: Based law enforcement think tank. The p e r F

1031
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:31,400
Speaker 1: investigated sixty seven cases of lethal force by Border Patrol agents.

1032
00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:34,200
Speaker 1: They found, among other things, cases of agents firing at

1033
00:58:34,200 --> 00:58:37,560
Speaker 1: fleeing vehicles. The report concluded too many cases do not

1034
00:58:37,600 --> 00:58:40,400
Speaker 1: appear to meet the test of objective reasonableness with regard

1035
00:58:40,440 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 1: to the use of deadly force. The pr F report advised,

1036
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:46,160
Speaker 1: among other things, that agents should not use lethal force

1037
00:58:46,200 --> 00:58:49,360
Speaker 1: on unarmed drivers or rock throwers. The agency rejected this

1038
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:51,280
Speaker 1: out of hand, with the head of Border Patrol saying

1039
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:53,400
Speaker 1: in an interview, I have known agents who have almost

1040
00:58:53,480 --> 00:58:55,800
Speaker 1: died from being rocked along the border, and I think

1041
00:58:55,880 --> 00:58:58,960
Speaker 1: it was completely ridiculous that they wanted that prohibition. I

1042
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:01,480
Speaker 1: should note here that no Border Patrol officer has ever

1043
00:59:01,520 --> 00:59:03,560
Speaker 1: been killed by a rock, and I can't really find

1044
00:59:03,600 --> 00:59:06,720
Speaker 1: evidence of one being seriously injured by Iraq either. What

1045
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:09,640
Speaker 1: I can find is that in two thousand fourteen, CBP

1046
00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:13,960
Speaker 1: leadership estimated a full of their force was corrupt. Attempts

1047
00:59:13,960 --> 00:59:15,680
Speaker 1: at reform were made in the last two years of

1048
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:19,000
Speaker 1: the Obama administration, and in two thousand sixteen it looked

1049
00:59:19,000 --> 00:59:21,720
Speaker 1: like things might finally be headed in a less murdery direction.

1050
00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:24,800
Speaker 1: But then Donald Trump became the president, and here we

1051
00:59:24,840 --> 00:59:28,400
Speaker 1: are a presidential administration filled with literal Nazis was handed

1052
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:31,560
Speaker 1: a vast, heavily armed force of sociopaths and rapists who

1053
00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:33,520
Speaker 1: just spent the last two years being told that they

1054
00:59:33,520 --> 00:59:35,360
Speaker 1: had to rape and murder less, and then all of

1055
00:59:35,400 --> 00:59:37,120
Speaker 1: a sudden they were told, whatever you want to do

1056
00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:39,080
Speaker 1: is find just get these brown people out of the

1057
00:59:39,160 --> 00:59:41,800
Speaker 1: United States. And that's kind of where things stand today

1058
00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:45,400
Speaker 1: with the Border Patrol as sort of the turning into

1059
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 1: the official armed wing of the the racist right. Uh,

1060
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:53,439
Speaker 1: with these CBP and bor tech units set up using

1061
00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:57,480
Speaker 1: Border patrol men being sent into American cities to police

1062
00:59:57,520 --> 01:00:01,000
Speaker 1: dissent because they're the most dedicated, in least accountable, and

1063
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:05,880
Speaker 1: most violent law enforcement officers the country has um And yeah,

1064
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:08,840
Speaker 1: there's a lot more I could and should get into

1065
01:00:08,880 --> 01:00:13,640
Speaker 1: about where things are at the moment with Border Patrol,

1066
01:00:13,960 --> 01:00:16,760
Speaker 1: But this is it took me this long just to

1067
01:00:16,760 --> 01:00:19,440
Speaker 1: get us up to the fucking Trump administration, right, and

1068
01:00:19,520 --> 01:00:21,880
Speaker 1: yeah we're not even at the you know, the whole

1069
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:31,280
Speaker 1: the frenzy around Yeah, build the wall, and just like yeah, yeah, yeah,

1070
01:00:31,440 --> 01:00:37,000
Speaker 1: So I guess that's another podcast. Yeah, it's another kind

1071
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:41,080
Speaker 1: of podcast. And I guess if I'm gonna leads leaves

1072
01:00:41,080 --> 01:00:46,120
Speaker 1: somewhere or or in this somewhere. I probably it would

1073
01:00:46,160 --> 01:00:51,640
Speaker 1: probably be good to end by talking again about Harlan Carter.

1074
01:00:52,400 --> 01:00:54,560
Speaker 1: Um for just a little bit. You remember Harlan Carter.

1075
01:00:54,680 --> 01:00:57,080
Speaker 1: He was the former Border Patrol head it was in

1076
01:00:57,200 --> 01:01:00,000
Speaker 1: charge during Operation wet Back, and who was a convicted murderer.

1077
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:03,040
Speaker 1: He in N one he shot a Mexican boy in

1078
01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:07,160
Speaker 1: the chest. Uh so yeah, the the young uh Mexican

1079
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:09,640
Speaker 1: boy that he murdered was named Raymond Cassiano. And there's

1080
01:01:09,640 --> 01:01:12,560
Speaker 1: actually a really good song about the Border Patrol and

1081
01:01:12,600 --> 01:01:15,280
Speaker 1: about Raymond Casiano by a band I quite like called

1082
01:01:15,400 --> 01:01:18,160
Speaker 1: Drive By Truckers, And there's a there's a line in

1083
01:01:18,200 --> 01:01:21,480
Speaker 1: it about Harlan Carter. You know, this former head of

1084
01:01:21,520 --> 01:01:23,080
Speaker 1: the Border Patrol who goes on by the way to

1085
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:24,760
Speaker 1: become the head of the n r A. And it's

1086
01:01:24,800 --> 01:01:26,000
Speaker 1: like one of the guys in charge of the n

1087
01:01:26,120 --> 01:01:27,840
Speaker 1: r A when it turns into the n r A

1088
01:01:27,920 --> 01:01:31,959
Speaker 1: we all know today from the organization that was like, oh,

1089
01:01:32,160 --> 01:01:35,040
Speaker 1: people should learn how to shoot accurately so they can

1090
01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:36,840
Speaker 1: hunt deer. Right Like the n r used to just

1091
01:01:36,840 --> 01:01:39,000
Speaker 1: be like a normal, pretty normal thing, and then it

1092
01:01:39,040 --> 01:01:41,280
Speaker 1: turns into this crazy thing that it is today is

1093
01:01:41,360 --> 01:01:45,320
Speaker 1: quasi military or not quasi military, but like this explicitly

1094
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:50,560
Speaker 1: fascist organization urging political violence anyway, Harlan Carter is the

1095
01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:53,720
Speaker 1: guy behind that too. So not somebody we'd want to

1096
01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:56,160
Speaker 1: get a drink with, not somebody you would want to

1097
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 1: get a drink with. And there's there's a couple of

1098
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,880
Speaker 1: lines about him in this song Ray in Casiana, which

1099
01:02:00,920 --> 01:02:05,360
Speaker 1: is named after the guy that Um, Harlan Carter killed. UM,

1100
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:07,560
Speaker 1: and it's it's a song yeah, really about not just

1101
01:02:07,640 --> 01:02:10,160
Speaker 1: Harlan Carter, but about the kind of men who become

1102
01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:14,160
Speaker 1: border patrol agents. Um. He had the makings of a

1103
01:02:14,280 --> 01:02:16,880
Speaker 1: leader of a certain kind of men who need to

1104
01:02:16,920 --> 01:02:19,320
Speaker 1: feel the world's against him, out to get him if

1105
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:23,000
Speaker 1: it can, men whose trigger pull their fingers, of men

1106
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:26,680
Speaker 1: who'd rather fight than win united in a revolution, like

1107
01:02:26,840 --> 01:02:30,880
Speaker 1: in mind and like in skin. Yeah, yeah, it's a

1108
01:02:30,880 --> 01:02:35,320
Speaker 1: good song. I'll give it a listen. So Caitlin, you

1109
01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:40,720
Speaker 1: wanna you wanna plug your plug doubles. Sure well, thank

1110
01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:44,480
Speaker 1: you for for enlightening me with this information. A lot

1111
01:02:44,520 --> 01:02:48,680
Speaker 1: of it I did not know, UM, so I I

1112
01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:53,440
Speaker 1: appreciate now knowing UM depressing and upsetting, though it may be.

1113
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:58,760
Speaker 1: It's good to be informed. Um. You can follow me

1114
01:02:58,800 --> 01:03:03,840
Speaker 1: on Twitter, UM and Instagram at Caitlin Darante, and you

1115
01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:08,280
Speaker 1: can check out my podcast on this network called the

1116
01:03:08,320 --> 01:03:12,360
Speaker 1: Bechtel Cast. So you know, that little conversation that Sophie

1117
01:03:12,360 --> 01:03:15,439
Speaker 1: and I had at the beginning was a reference to that.

1118
01:03:15,520 --> 01:03:21,959
Speaker 1: We talked about the representation of women in film. A M. Yeah,

1119
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:26,560
Speaker 1: check check, check it all out, check it all out.

1120
01:03:26,720 --> 01:03:29,360
Speaker 1: And you can follow Robert on Twitter at I right, okay,

1121
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:32,000
Speaker 1: you can follow this podcast on Twitter, at Instagram at

1122
01:03:32,040 --> 01:03:36,960
Speaker 1: Bastard's Pod. You can now email us at behind the

1123
01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:41,280
Speaker 1: Bastards at iHeart media dot com. And you can buy

1124
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:43,520
Speaker 1: merch at our TA Public store. You can also buy

1125
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:46,680
Speaker 1: merch from Caitlin and Jamie's TA Public Store, which has

1126
01:03:46,800 --> 01:03:51,920
Speaker 1: some of my absolute favorite items in the entire planet.

1127
01:03:52,440 --> 01:03:57,400
Speaker 1: How's that for a plug? Great? Thank you, Sophie. Feminist icons.

1128
01:03:57,560 --> 01:04:00,280
Speaker 1: You know who else is a feminist icon? I can't

1129
01:04:00,280 --> 01:04:07,280
Speaker 1: wait to see who? Thank you? All right? This end also,

1130
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:13,200
Speaker 1: very very very very warmly thank you. That's that's the

1131
01:04:13,240 --> 01:04:22,800
Speaker 1: episode by guys. Episode m M