1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Chrissa's family contacted police Friday, 2 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:14,920 Speaker 1: saying they hadn't seen or her from her orders son, Billy, 3 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:18,279 Speaker 1: since the day after Mother's Day. Our Amy Frasier, is 4 00:00:18,360 --> 00:00:22,320 Speaker 1: live in northwest Salem right now outside of Chriss's apartment. 5 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:25,680 Speaker 1: What have you found out? Amy? Right now? Police are 6 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: releasing very little information about this case. Neighbors tell me 7 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:33,519 Speaker 1: twenty five year old Chrissa Fretwell was typically pretty quiet 8 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 1: and kept to herself. One neighbor believes she may have 9 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:41,360 Speaker 1: worked a security job. They also recall seeing her with 10 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 1: her son, Billy, who's three. Several neighbors say a family 11 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:48,479 Speaker 1: member came by a few days ago worried about Charissa 12 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: and her son, saying no one had seen or heard 13 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: from them since May thirteenth. A couple that lives right 14 00:00:55,560 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 1: behind Chriss's says they've noticed her TV has been on 15 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 1: non stop with the same screen displayed four days. I 16 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. Thank you for being 17 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 1: with us. Carissa and William Fretwell. Carissa, a twenty five 18 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:15,640 Speaker 1: year old mom, Little Bill, her three year old child 19 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:22,559 Speaker 1: go missing. That's not a good sign, very very ominous. 20 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:25,520 Speaker 1: For the TV to be on. Now, that in itself 21 00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:28,680 Speaker 1: is not unusual. Maybe she left it on while she 22 00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 1: was going to the grocery store. Maybe she left it 23 00:01:31,319 --> 00:01:35,199 Speaker 1: on for a number of reasons. But it clearly shows 24 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: they're not in the home for the same screen to 25 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:41,520 Speaker 1: be displayed. And when three days passed, you know something's 26 00:01:41,640 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: very very wrong. Listen to our friend Amy Frasier, a 27 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:50,520 Speaker 1: KOI N six. Carissa Fretwell and her son Billy disappeared 28 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 1: the day after Mother's Day. Our Amy Frasier, met with 29 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 1: police their neighbors in Northwest Salem. Neighbors here tell us 30 00:01:57,600 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 1: the young mother has always kept to herself. On her 31 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:04,640 Speaker 1: Facebook page, she writes, her son is her world. I 32 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 1: just saw it on Facebook. My daughter posted it. People 33 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:11,240 Speaker 1: who live near the Quintero apartments in Salem say they 34 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 1: never thought twice about seeing twenty five year old Carrissa 35 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 1: Fretwell and her three year old son Billy until now. 36 00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: I feel second to second my stomach. A white car 37 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: registered to the missing mom is parked outside her apartment. 38 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:29,400 Speaker 1: Right in front of it, a Green Mountaineer with a 39 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:33,440 Speaker 1: college financial aid application that appears to be signed by 40 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:37,400 Speaker 1: Fretwell in the front seat, but no one has seen 41 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:41,959 Speaker 1: or heard from mother or son since Monday, May thirteenth. 42 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 1: Straight out to syndicate A talk show host Dave Matt, Dave, 43 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:48,399 Speaker 1: I want to take this from the very beginning. First 44 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: of all, tell me about Carissa and Bill Fretwell, mom 45 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: and son. Yeah, she's a single mom, Nancy, and she 46 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 1: and Billy they do everything together. As you heard, very 47 00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: quiet why peel don't really know who she is, but 48 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:05,960 Speaker 1: they what they know of her is wonderful. She's shy, 49 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 1: she's got a loving family. But all of a sudden, 50 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:12,440 Speaker 1: out of the clear blue, she and Billy go missing, 51 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,600 Speaker 1: and we've got nothing. You mentioned the TV being on 52 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:19,400 Speaker 1: and being on the same screen for multiple days. Just 53 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:23,640 Speaker 1: got Morgan joining me, forensics expert, Professor Forensics Jacksonville State 54 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 1: University and author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon. 55 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:32,560 Speaker 1: Just got question. Two vehicles connected to Charissa Fretwell right 56 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:35,640 Speaker 1: there in front of her home. That tells me a lot. Yeah, 57 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: it does, Nancy. It gives us an indication that she 58 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:43,640 Speaker 1: is still in or at least the vehicles or in 59 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 1: this location. They have not been moved, so she has 60 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:51,440 Speaker 1: personally not gotten into the vehicles and exited this location, 61 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 1: so that gives us the question where is she and 62 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,440 Speaker 1: how did she get away from this place? The vehicles 63 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: being parked at her place tell me a little bit 64 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 1: more in my mind, or at least I can't a 65 00:04:02,560 --> 00:04:05,880 Speaker 1: little more conjecture. It tells me that may have been 66 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 1: the last place that she was, she was last known 67 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:12,800 Speaker 1: to be there. The TV is on, the vehicles are there. 68 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 1: That gives me kind of the beginning of a timeline 69 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 1: there at the home to doctor Ryan Fuller, Clinical Psychologists, 70 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: executive director of New York Behavioral Help, Doctor Fuller, thanks 71 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 1: for being with us. You know the way that Dave 72 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:37,840 Speaker 1: Mack described Chrissa a family person but very quiet, seemingly shy. 73 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 1: Her whole world was taking care of the three year 74 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:45,480 Speaker 1: old little boy Bill m You know, this is not 75 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 1: like a person that goes out a lot at night, 76 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:55,159 Speaker 1: that is an avid jogger, last seen on a wooded trail, 77 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 1: didn't have people that she didn't know very well trooping 78 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 1: in and out of her apartment all the time. That 79 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 1: tells me a lot about her way in. Yeah, I mean, 80 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 1: I think does an extent that someone's person personality style 81 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:14,960 Speaker 1: is focused on the home, focused on the child and 82 00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 1: the family, and you know, she's described as someone I 83 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:20,720 Speaker 1: guess it seems like she worked, but other than that, 84 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 1: she might have been around the house a lot. It 85 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:25,360 Speaker 1: seems like she's going to be protective, and we don't 86 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 1: we don't know for sure, but we can imagine someone 87 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: like that's going to be careful, and so a stranger 88 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 1: might have a rough time getting around. Another issue, Doctor Fuller, 89 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:38,599 Speaker 1: is that if you've got a homebody, it really closes 90 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:42,200 Speaker 1: in the circle of people you're exposed to. Of course, 91 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:45,600 Speaker 1: there's always the potential of a stranger on stranger, but 92 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:51,360 Speaker 1: when you have a smaller circle, that reduces the potential killers. 93 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:55,480 Speaker 1: The number of potential killers now, of course, to you, 94 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:59,919 Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan, there's always a nut at the gross 95 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:02,520 Speaker 1: store or in the parking lot. I spoke with a 96 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,600 Speaker 1: woman the other day who had her three boys with 97 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:09,479 Speaker 1: her and she went from Kroger across the street to 98 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:13,039 Speaker 1: the drug store and some nut follower from the Kroger 99 00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 1: jelly department and ended up in her van while she 100 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:20,520 Speaker 1: was in the drug store. I mean, so it does happen. 101 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 1: The point I'm trying to make, in a very roundabout 102 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: way is the smaller your circle friends or you know, acquaintances, 103 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:36,000 Speaker 1: is the smaller the net. Yeah, you're right, Nancy. Even 104 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 1: though those those stranger on stranger events are very, very scary, 105 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:42,279 Speaker 1: we have to admit that you go out and interact 106 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 1: with people like this and you come in contact with them. 107 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:50,840 Speaker 1: What's really really kind of from an investigative standpoint, a 108 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:54,039 Speaker 1: really key here is that those intimates, those people that 109 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: are in our orbit, those are the people that you 110 00:06:57,040 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 1: really have to keep your eye on. Well, let me 111 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 1: ask you this today, Max, syndicated talk show host, tell 112 00:07:01,839 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 1: me about the search for Charissa and Bill. What does 113 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 1: it entail everything? Nancy, it entails You mentioned the timeline 114 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 1: of tracking exactly when she was last seen, which is 115 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 1: the day after Mother's Day. The police began right there 116 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 1: at her apartment and went door to door, then neighborhood 117 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 1: by neighborhood. They've interviewed neighbors who really can't shed a 118 00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: lot of information. They've interviewed family members. It was family 119 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 1: members that actually reported her missing. They've interviewed them, and 120 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: they've continued to just spread out one by one. But 121 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 1: this is almost door to door, street to street right now, 122 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 1: just trying to get any kind of information you mentioned. 123 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,480 Speaker 1: Her vehicles are still there at the apartment complex, so 124 00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 1: there's no sign that she went anywhere. Willingly, You're absolutely right. 125 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 1: Take a listen to KOI n six. One neighbor tells 126 00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:53,040 Speaker 1: me he did notice something unusual at her apartment, but 127 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:56,200 Speaker 1: that was about two months ago and he has no 128 00:07:56,320 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 1: idea if it might be related. We heard a man 129 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 1: in a woman arguing incredibly loud. Man was swearing a lot, 130 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 1: and there was a kid crying in the background, and 131 00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 1: the woman was yelling at him to get out of 132 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:14,400 Speaker 1: her apartment. Dave, Mike, don't laid me on. What exactly 133 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: do they hear Nancy? A couple of months before she 134 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,960 Speaker 1: goes missing. Before she and Billy go missing, the neighbors 135 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:26,680 Speaker 1: said they heard a violent argument inside her apartment. They 136 00:08:26,720 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 1: heard a little boy crying in the background, They heard 137 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,600 Speaker 1: a lot of profanity coming from a man they didn't 138 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 1: identify who, and yet they heard Carissa repeatedly screaming, get 139 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 1: out of my apartment. Now that's like two months before 140 00:08:41,600 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 1: she and Billy go missing. Okay, we're learning a lot 141 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:49,439 Speaker 1: about her, but then we come upon this. She just 142 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 1: recently moved to another apartment and new job in West 143 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:56,599 Speaker 1: Salem while battling Wolf in court for child support. A 144 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:00,200 Speaker 1: paternity test last year proved he was Billy's father, but 145 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:04,400 Speaker 1: court record show Wolf, who's married and has other older children, 146 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:07,840 Speaker 1: petitioned to have the amount reduced. He was supposed to 147 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 1: begin payments soon. I think the child supporter kind of 148 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:16,560 Speaker 1: topped it off for Michael. I think he, I don't 149 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 1: want to think that he did anything, but it's just 150 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: super weird that it was the time frame crime stories 151 00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. She just recently moved to another apartment 152 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 1: and new job in West Salem while battling Wolf in 153 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: court for child support. A paternity test last year proved 154 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 1: he was Billy's father, but court record show Wolf, who's 155 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: married and has other older children, petition to have the 156 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: amount reduced. He was supposed to begin payments soon. I 157 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 1: think the child support kind of topped it off for Michael. 158 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,440 Speaker 1: I think he, I don't want to think that he 159 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:16,480 Speaker 1: did anything, but it's just super weird that it was 160 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: the time frame. It was like three or four weeks ago. Now, 161 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 1: the former volunteer Gaston firefighter sits behind bars while a 162 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 1: community searches for answers holding out. Hope a mother and 163 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 1: her son are found. That breaks my heart. I hope 164 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 1: she's okay, No, just on misera hold, okay, let me 165 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:41,800 Speaker 1: understand something joining you right now. Criminal defense attorney federal 166 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 1: trial lawyer, Paula Detari Paula. How can he have a 167 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 1: wife and children and nobody knows he's going to court 168 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 1: to get child support payments reduced? Well and Nancy, just 169 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:00,679 Speaker 1: like he had an affair and he impregnated this young woman. 170 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:03,679 Speaker 1: His family had no idea that he did that. I mean, 171 00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 1: I think he managed to ev there. You know, his 172 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 1: wife's knowing about this this court. Here's another thing. I mean, 173 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:20,120 Speaker 1: when you challenge paternity of a child, you say it's 174 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:22,959 Speaker 1: not my child, you go to court, there's a hearing 175 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:25,640 Speaker 1: for that because it had to be a court ordered 176 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:30,080 Speaker 1: paternity test. Then you get child support thrown on you, 177 00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 1: which you deserve that and more. But then he goes 178 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 1: back to court. I mean, how could he keep it 179 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:41,319 Speaker 1: a secret? You know, doctor Ryan Fuller, Executive director of 180 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:46,240 Speaker 1: New York Behavioral Health. Doctor Fuller, if you don't show 181 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: up to court, it gets printed in the paper for 182 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 1: Pete's sake, in legal notices. How in the world. Did 183 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 1: this guy lead such a double life that he could 184 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:59,559 Speaker 1: keep not one but two court proceedings and a whole 185 00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 1: other family. He's got Crissa Fretwell, the baby boy now 186 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 1: three Bill Fretwell. He's fought paternity in court. Now he's 187 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:15,080 Speaker 1: wanting a child support payment reduction. That's pretty public. How 188 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 1: did he manage? What kind of mindset is it that 189 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 1: you can keep all that a secret? Yeah, clinically and 190 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:23,679 Speaker 1: and I've had a number of clients who actually have 191 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:26,160 Speaker 1: sort of led two lives and have had, you know, 192 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 1: two separate families or people on the side. So one, 193 00:12:30,760 --> 00:12:34,280 Speaker 1: it's possible the family just wasn't on top of the news. 194 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:36,200 Speaker 1: But he also might be someone, I mean, I don't 195 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 1: know about him, but someone who could do this to 196 00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: be quite chrismatic or manipulative or try to convince the 197 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:45,079 Speaker 1: person they're wrong and what they're reading is it accurate, 198 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 1: and things like that, and just to convince the person 199 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:50,600 Speaker 1: they're trustworthy and they should be believed as opposed to 200 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:53,280 Speaker 1: others or news stories. Well, let me ask you this, 201 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:56,719 Speaker 1: doctor Fuller, is there a name for that personality? It's 202 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 1: some kind of personality disorder that you have a whole 203 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:04,480 Speaker 1: double life, including a secret baby. There's not a specific 204 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: personality this sort of money and caps like that, although 205 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 1: in the cases I've seen clinically sometimes there are aspects 206 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: of narcissistic personality disorder where the person just thinks they're 207 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 1: sort of grand and worthy of having more than that, 208 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:20,319 Speaker 1: and that the other person may not deserve them, and 209 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: something like that, But it's not specific to having two families. 210 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 1: Talk about leading a double life. Listen to our friend 211 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,079 Speaker 1: Emily Burris. Friends say the two met when Carrissa was 212 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 1: working at a sandwich shop in mcmanville. Wolf was working 213 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: at Cascade Steel, where Carrissa also began part time work 214 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 1: as a security guard. After getting pregnant. They say she 215 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,839 Speaker 1: co signed and moved into a new apartment with his help. 216 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:48,160 Speaker 1: He had like a second key maid, and there was 217 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:50,640 Speaker 1: multiple occasions that he was already in her apartment when 218 00:13:50,679 --> 00:13:56,160 Speaker 1: she got home. But then we come upon this listen. 219 00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 1: The Yamhill County District Attorney says they were back this 220 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 1: week in an area between the city of Yamhill and 221 00:14:02,559 --> 00:14:06,080 Speaker 1: Gaston that they had previously searched. This time, it took 222 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:09,079 Speaker 1: them just a couple of hours to find what crews 223 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 1: have been out looking for for weeks. The bodies of 224 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:18,400 Speaker 1: Carrissa and Billy Fretwell were confused trying to process everything. Still, 225 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 1: emotions are raw for friends and family of Carrissive Fretwell, 226 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,600 Speaker 1: as hopes that she and her son would be found 227 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 1: alive vanished over the weekend. She's gonna be very missed. 228 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 1: The young mother from Salem and her three year old son, Billy, 229 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 1: were discovered Saturday on a private rural property just miles 230 00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:40,760 Speaker 1: from the home of Michael Wolfe, the man accused in 231 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 1: their murders. But this is the area where we were, well, 232 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:49,480 Speaker 1: where the investigators were un Ultimately, the two bodies were found, 233 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 1: the bodies of not only Carrissive Fretwell as twenty five, 234 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 1: but her little boy, three year old Bill Fretwell found 235 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:04,120 Speaker 1: Dad listen. The Yamhill County District Attorney says growing evidence 236 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:07,160 Speaker 1: pointed them to that property, where they learned wolf had 237 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: previously fished and cut firewood. The DA says, ultimately their 238 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:15,120 Speaker 1: bodies were recovered on private property in an area further 239 00:15:15,320 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 1: up Turner Creek Road. But there were about forty to 240 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:21,400 Speaker 1: fifty members of a search crew out here, and this 241 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: gives you an idea of the heavily forested conditions they 242 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:28,080 Speaker 1: were dealing with. The bodies were partially hidden. Members of 243 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:32,000 Speaker 1: the mcmonville Fire Department made the discovery. By Sunday. Medical 244 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:36,080 Speaker 1: examiners confirmed the remains were Carrissa and Billy. Officials say 245 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 1: Carrissa died of a single gunshot to her head. They're 246 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:42,280 Speaker 1: still trying to figure out how Billy was killed. The 247 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 1: news providing some closure, but little comfort. Billy didn't get 248 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 1: a living didn't get a live life. Aren't going to 249 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: do anything. It's he's a sick man for doing that. 250 00:15:55,920 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 1: I know why, just I'll never understand it. The family, 251 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:05,000 Speaker 1: the loved ones of this gorgeous young mom, Charissa Fretwell, 252 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,680 Speaker 1: and even more upsetting, her three year old little boy, 253 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 1: Bill Fretwell, absolutely distraught. It's hard enough to lose somebody 254 00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 1: you love, I know, but then to discover they were murdered. 255 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:24,120 Speaker 1: And it sounds to me to Joseph Scott Morgan, author 256 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: of Blood Beneath My Feet, death investigator, the killer went 257 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 1: to a lot of trouble to hide their bodies. They 258 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:34,120 Speaker 1: stayed hidden for a long time, Yeah, they did, Nancy. 259 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:38,720 Speaker 1: And this area is so isolated. I'm really wondering how 260 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 1: the investigators got onto this particular location. But needless to say, 261 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: it's it's not an easy task to get to this location' 262 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:52,800 Speaker 1: And this is key. You're not going to find a 263 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:57,760 Speaker 1: young mother and this beautiful little child just aimlessly wandering 264 00:16:57,800 --> 00:17:00,960 Speaker 1: around out there. They went out there with us specific purpose. 265 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 1: This would give us an indication they were taken to 266 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:06,360 Speaker 1: this location. Well, now hold on just a moment. I mean, 267 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:11,000 Speaker 1: let me go to Paula Natari, criminal defense attorney. Paula 268 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:15,200 Speaker 1: it's just like Scott Peterson, he goes fishing. Where does 269 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:18,159 Speaker 1: he hide the body in his old fishing hole the 270 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 1: San Francisco Bay. And if you take a look at criminals, 271 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:26,440 Speaker 1: so many of them, it's like when a purp goes 272 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 1: on the run. And I would be talking to a 273 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:32,560 Speaker 1: Bill bondsman in the hall of the courthouse. I'm like, 274 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 1: go to his mother's house and look under the bed. 275 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 1: If he's not there, look in the closet. It's it 276 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 1: goes back to what he knows. And here this was 277 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: the fishing hole of Michael wolf Bam. There are the bodies, 278 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:55,960 Speaker 1: and in my experience, exactly investigators look at the likely polaces, 279 00:17:56,200 --> 00:18:01,200 Speaker 1: where where suspects might hide bodies, and here in this 280 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:04,800 Speaker 1: particular case, this was his backyard. This is practically the 281 00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:08,080 Speaker 1: place where he did all of his fishing, and he 282 00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 1: had access to this area. He knew the ground, so 283 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: was this was the perfect place for them to search, 284 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:17,119 Speaker 1: and they exactly they found what they were looking for. 285 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:41,360 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. The DA says, ultimately their 286 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 1: bodies were recovered on private property in an area further 287 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:47,760 Speaker 1: up Turner Creek Road. But there were about forty to 288 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:50,920 Speaker 1: fifty members of a search crew out here, and this 289 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:54,119 Speaker 1: gives you an idea of the heavily forested conditions they 290 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:58,400 Speaker 1: were dealing with. The news providing some closure but little comfort. 291 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:02,200 Speaker 1: Bilious get a live in, didn't get a live life, 292 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:06,480 Speaker 1: didn't get to do anything. That's he's a sick man 293 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:10,239 Speaker 1: for doing that. I know why, I'll never understand it. 294 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 1: The Yamhill County District Attorney says growing evidence pointed them 295 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:17,400 Speaker 1: to that property, where they learned Wolf had previously fished 296 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 1: and cut firewood. The bodies were partially hidden. Members of 297 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:25,159 Speaker 1: the mcmonville Fire Department made the discovery by Sunday. Medical 298 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 1: examiners confirmed the remains were Carrissa and Billy. Officials say 299 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:32,520 Speaker 1: Carrissa died of a single gunshot to her head. They're 300 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 1: still trying to figure out how Billy was killed. I 301 00:19:35,119 --> 00:19:40,040 Speaker 1: want to go to doctor Tim Gallagher, renowned medical examiner 302 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:44,240 Speaker 1: out of the Florida jurisdiction. Doctor Gallagher, the bodies had 303 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 1: been there, I mean once they started searching, they were 304 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: found fairly quickly, but a long time had passed many 305 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:58,840 Speaker 1: many days until they started searching. Question is that why 306 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:02,480 Speaker 1: they can't determine cod cause of death on the little boy? 307 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:05,199 Speaker 1: Doctor Gallagher. There are a few things that happen to 308 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:07,840 Speaker 1: a body when it's exposed to the elements. Number one 309 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:13,639 Speaker 1: is the decomposition. Another thing that happens is animal predation. 310 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,760 Speaker 1: So there could be a few compounding variables that have 311 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: the medical examiner trying to determine what the cause of 312 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:29,520 Speaker 1: death is. Animal predation certainly is one. Other damage from 313 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 1: that may have been caused after the person had died 314 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 1: can also be another variable in trying to determine the 315 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 1: cause of death. So toxicology will also be another example. 316 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,320 Speaker 1: So these things have to be determined. These things take 317 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,680 Speaker 1: time to determine, and the cause of death cannot be 318 00:20:50,119 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 1: determined until all of these variables are either eliminated or 319 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:57,680 Speaker 1: included to come up with the cause of death. Well, 320 00:20:57,720 --> 00:21:01,480 Speaker 1: doctor Gallagher or everyone medical and rejoining me out of Florida. 321 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:06,639 Speaker 1: This occurs in Salem, Oregon. And I don't know what 322 00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: the temperature was at the time, but it's getting really hot. 323 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:15,480 Speaker 1: How does that affect the decomposition of the bodies. The 324 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:19,879 Speaker 1: decomposition of the human body is directly related to the temperature, 325 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 1: so it would be higher the temperature the greatest rate 326 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 1: of human flesh decomposition. In places where it's very cold, 327 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:33,359 Speaker 1: the rate of decomposition is very slow, so this also 328 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:37,160 Speaker 1: must be taken into account when determining a the time 329 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 1: of death and then be the cause of death. You 330 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,400 Speaker 1: know an interesting thing to J. Scott Morgan her bank card. 331 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 1: I'm talking about christophred Well, the young mom. Her bank 332 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:51,199 Speaker 1: card and her glasses were left at home. Family members 333 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:57,439 Speaker 1: reported they go in, the apartment, was unlocked. Things that 334 00:21:57,480 --> 00:22:00,920 Speaker 1: she normally would have had with her, we're still there. 335 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: What does that tell you about the way her death 336 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:08,639 Speaker 1: went down? I think that whatever happened happened rather swiftly. 337 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: It kind of took her unawares. Nancy, this is a 338 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:15,479 Speaker 1: young mother who has a small child. If she's required 339 00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:17,919 Speaker 1: to wear glasses in order just to make it around 340 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:20,000 Speaker 1: in this world, she's not going to walk out of 341 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:23,080 Speaker 1: the door without her classes on, you know, trying to 342 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:25,679 Speaker 1: take care of a child. Also, what kind of means 343 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 1: did she have? Well, if she's using her bank card, 344 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:30,840 Speaker 1: which most of us do, she has to have means 345 00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:33,399 Speaker 1: to buy gas or buy food, or whatever the case 346 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 1: might be. And she leaves this behind two. All of 347 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:40,280 Speaker 1: these elements come into play when we're trying to paint 348 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:43,200 Speaker 1: the picture of what actually happened in her last moments, 349 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:48,159 Speaker 1: you know, speaking of it being potentially a sudden a 350 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:55,399 Speaker 1: sudden decision on the killer's part, I don't necessarily agree 351 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:59,160 Speaker 1: with that, Joe Scott. I'll tell you why. I believe 352 00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:03,240 Speaker 1: that this was long planned. I think that this was 353 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: planned the day he had to go to court and 354 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:09,880 Speaker 1: fight about whether Bill Fretwell the three year old little 355 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:14,080 Speaker 1: boy was his child, the day he started fighting paternity, 356 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 1: the day he wanted that child support payment reduced. I mean, 357 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,840 Speaker 1: this guy has been living in a very carefully constructed 358 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:29,760 Speaker 1: double world for a long time. Okay, I think this 359 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:33,719 Speaker 1: was very carefully planned for one reason, so his wife 360 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 1: and family would not find out. To Dave Maxon to 361 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:42,040 Speaker 1: get a talk show host, what if any is the evidence. 362 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 1: Let me just add one little thing to this. Nancy, 363 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:50,200 Speaker 1: his wife did find out prior to their last court appearance, 364 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:54,000 Speaker 1: and that was what forced him to push for lowering 365 00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:57,439 Speaker 1: that child support payment. On top of that, she was 366 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 1: seen outside of Charissa's arguing about wanting custody of little Billy, 367 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:07,119 Speaker 1: So they were already in the last week before she 368 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,400 Speaker 1: goes missing. There was a lot of activity where Wolfe's 369 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,200 Speaker 1: family did find out about Billy, found out he had fathered, 370 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:16,600 Speaker 1: and his wife wanted that boy. According to what we're 371 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 1: hearing from other neighbors, Okay, everybody in the studio's mouth 372 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:25,359 Speaker 1: is still dropped open. Okay, we need a shrink, and 373 00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:28,640 Speaker 1: we need one fast start to Ryan Fuller helped me out. 374 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 1: So his wife, they already have children. He's got children 375 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 1: with his wife. She wants to launch a legal campaign 376 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,200 Speaker 1: to take Bill, three year old Bill away from Caissa 377 00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:45,200 Speaker 1: and get custody. What, as I said before, in the 378 00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 1: conical cases I've seen oftentimes in those couples, there's really 379 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:54,160 Speaker 1: a dominant player and so the person leading a double life. 380 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,480 Speaker 1: They might have convinced this spouse, you know, that they're 381 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 1: really an empathetic character and needs to be done. And oftentimes, 382 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 1: you know, you can see in these couples where this 383 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 1: sort of dependent person goes along, doesn't want to see 384 00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:09,639 Speaker 1: what's there in the first place, this double life, it's 385 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 1: kind of hiding it from themselves, are in denial, and 386 00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: then it comes to light and they're they painted in 387 00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:17,439 Speaker 1: a picture that's much different. And you know, it sounds 388 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,239 Speaker 1: like in this case it's possible she, you know, had 389 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 1: already forgiven and was even even open to bringing in um. 390 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 1: You know, this biological sign into the family. Well, you 391 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,080 Speaker 1: know what, you sure are putting perfume on the pig. 392 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 1: Doctor Fuller wanted to welcome the little boy into the family. 393 00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,439 Speaker 1: It's a heck of a lot different then standing in 394 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:44,120 Speaker 1: front of the lover's house screaming about getting custody of 395 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,320 Speaker 1: the little boy. That's a heck of a lot different. 396 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, the question of custody of 397 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:53,480 Speaker 1: Bill is a powder keg. Listen, and if there's a 398 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 1: custody issue, and I can't say that Charissa has sole 399 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:01,959 Speaker 1: custody of William they do reside together in West Salem. 400 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 1: I know they had some problems because he was married 401 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 1: and she was a little scared of him from the 402 00:26:08,119 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 1: very beginning. Chris's friends, who knew of the relationship wondered 403 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:15,960 Speaker 1: whether he had something to do with her disappearance after 404 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 1: she got pregnant. He did threaten her. He didn't want 405 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,639 Speaker 1: his wife to find out Doctor Fuller boy in. It 406 00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:22,720 Speaker 1: just seems like this is prevented long. Either she was 407 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 1: unaware of her options about getting help from law enforcement 408 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:27,919 Speaker 1: of the legal system, she was too scared of the 409 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:31,200 Speaker 1: repercussions that he would act against her, or she didn't 410 00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:33,199 Speaker 1: trust they'd be able to protect her. And this is 411 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:34,879 Speaker 1: one of the things that always frustrates me when I 412 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: have people talking about people in their lives where it 413 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,399 Speaker 1: just seems like the stalking laws and harassment laws are 414 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:45,439 Speaker 1: not strong enough to give law enforcement enough resources to 415 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,720 Speaker 1: be able to go out and take care of someone 416 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: like this who's obviously a threat to her and her 417 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,160 Speaker 1: son before something happens. And I just figured this panel 418 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:58,479 Speaker 1: knows more than than I knew about that, and wonder 419 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 1: what can be done to sort of help people protect 420 00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:06,639 Speaker 1: themselves before something so horrible like this tragedy happened, Doctor Fuller. 421 00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:11,280 Speaker 1: In addition to working as a prosecutor in intercity Atlanta 422 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:14,240 Speaker 1: for ten years, I volunteered at night at the Battered 423 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:17,680 Speaker 1: Women's Center. I can't tell you how often I begged 424 00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:22,280 Speaker 1: women to go forward to prosecute, to move out, to 425 00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 1: start over. They're just paralyzed with fear and they hope, 426 00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 1: they believe falsely that things will get better. I have 427 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,640 Speaker 1: no doubt in my mind this guy, Michael Wolfe, had 428 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 1: threatened her on many occasions. She told her friends she 429 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 1: was afraid, and you're absolutely right. I believe along with you, 430 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 1: doctor Fuller, it was completely avoidable. She was just paralyzed 431 00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:53,680 Speaker 1: in fear and in hope that somehow things would turn around. 432 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. We have taken into custody 433 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:17,960 Speaker 1: Michael John Wolfe. He has been taken into custody in 434 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: the Portland area by Sailing Police Department detectives. Currently, he 435 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:27,000 Speaker 1: is going to be charged with aggravated murder on two 436 00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:30,240 Speaker 1: counts and two counts of kidnapping in the first degree. 437 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 1: He will be lodged in the Yamhill County Jail later tonight. 438 00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,080 Speaker 1: Further charges will be determined by the Amhill County District 439 00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 1: Attorney's Office. A couple of things that come up during 440 00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:44,040 Speaker 1: this investigation, one of which being whether or not a 441 00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 1: Wolf is a biological father of William Fretwell. As you 442 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,840 Speaker 1: all have reported, based on some other court records, we 443 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:57,240 Speaker 1: do believe that he is the biological father of William Fretwell. Okay, 444 00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 1: we know this god. Michael Wolfe, the married lover, the 445 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 1: father of three year old Bill Fretwell, has been taken 446 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,880 Speaker 1: into custody. But listen to our friend Emily Burris. Investigators 447 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: released probable cause documents revealing a timeline of surveillance video 448 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,600 Speaker 1: and cell phone evidence from the night Carrissa was last 449 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:20,240 Speaker 1: seen at eight forty five. Surveillance video shows Wolf leaving 450 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 1: Cascade Steel during the shift he told investigators he was working. 451 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 1: Detectives say Wolf parked a golf cart next to bushes 452 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 1: near the parking lot. Cell Phone records then show his 453 00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:34,680 Speaker 1: phone moving south, being placed in an area near Carrissa's 454 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 1: apartment from nine to almost nine forty five that night. 455 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:41,720 Speaker 1: From there, phone records show him heading north after midnight, 456 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,560 Speaker 1: pinging off a tower near Kaiser, then back at his 457 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:48,200 Speaker 1: work in Mcminville Cascade Deal Surveillance video then shows him 458 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 1: emerging from the same bushes he left through around two 459 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 1: thirty on the fourteenth, with a backpack and a white treshbag. 460 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 1: About twenty minutes later, he's seen walking out another door 461 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:02,120 Speaker 1: in a different shirt, again carrying that trash bag. More 462 00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:05,400 Speaker 1: cell phone records later show both his and Curiss's phones 463 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,400 Speaker 1: using a tower near Wolf's work, and a text from 464 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 1: her phone sent that afternoon using a tower near his home. 465 00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:16,320 Speaker 1: Detectives say the circumstantial evidence places the two of them 466 00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:19,160 Speaker 1: in the same areas the night she was last seen, 467 00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 1: despite Wolf telling detectives he hadn't seen her or bend 468 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,960 Speaker 1: Aileen over a year. Detectives also say that they believe 469 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:30,040 Speaker 1: the only known person who would benefit from the disappearance 470 00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:34,200 Speaker 1: or criminal homicide of Clarissa and William is Michael Dave Mack. 471 00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: What can you tell me about any actual evidence against him? Well, 472 00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:43,080 Speaker 1: what they have is they actually have been able to 473 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 1: track through cell phone records and video. You know, we 474 00:30:46,760 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 1: have surveillance cameras everywhere. It seems they've been able to 475 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:53,560 Speaker 1: track his movements. Now, he was on the radar immediately 476 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 1: based on great detective work with interviews and neighbors and 477 00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,160 Speaker 1: things like that, so they were able to track his 478 00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:02,880 Speaker 1: whereabouts by his cell phone pinging off different towers. On 479 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: top of everything else they've been able to tie and 480 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,000 Speaker 1: again it goes back to the investigator where not necessarily 481 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:12,840 Speaker 1: DNA evidence, they've been able to trace his whereabouts during 482 00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 1: the different times involved where they suspect that she was 483 00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 1: taken and how she was found. Where she was actually found, 484 00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:22,960 Speaker 1: as you mentioned, very remote area, so they've been able 485 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 1: to physically tie him to that area and to her body. 486 00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:29,080 Speaker 1: On top of everything else, they did recover a gun 487 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,520 Speaker 1: in one of those search warrants, although it has yet 488 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: to be tied directly to the gun that shot Karissa. 489 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:39,320 Speaker 1: You know, just Goot Morgan forensics expert, weight in on 490 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: the evidence that we've got. What do we know about 491 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 1: the evidence and how, if at all, does it tie 492 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,680 Speaker 1: Michael Wolfe to the murders. Well, relative to as Dave 493 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:52,680 Speaker 1: was talking about, relative to the weapon. We do know 494 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:55,840 Speaker 1: that they've talked about that she died as a result 495 00:31:55,960 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 1: of a gunshot wound. If in fact they can tie 496 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:04,480 Speaker 1: that weapon to him, as well as the projectile that 497 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:08,240 Speaker 1: ended her life, then they put that in his hands 498 00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,040 Speaker 1: at that point in time, if he's the owner of 499 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:12,400 Speaker 1: the weapon, this sort of thing, the ballistic evidence can 500 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,840 Speaker 1: tie it back, not to mention, you know, the familiarity 501 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 1: with the area that he had specific to this location 502 00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,640 Speaker 1: where the bodies were found, and most importantly Nancy, his 503 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:27,000 Speaker 1: access to this woman and Billy you know, just got Morgan. 504 00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:30,160 Speaker 1: When you have a known bullet, for instance, the one 505 00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:34,720 Speaker 1: taken out of Christoph Fretwell, then you find a gun, 506 00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 1: for instance, the gun found pursuant to search warrant in 507 00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:43,760 Speaker 1: his belongings Michael Wolf the Lover. You take a bullet 508 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:47,960 Speaker 1: of the same caliber and you shoot it from the 509 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: known gun. Then you put it under a microscope and 510 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:55,959 Speaker 1: you compare it to the bullet taken out of the body. 511 00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:01,720 Speaker 1: It's just like a fingerprint. Explain, Yeah, each of these 512 00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:07,680 Speaker 1: rounds that's fired, as it passes down the barrel of 513 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 1: the weapon itself, it leaves a unique ballistic fingerprint through 514 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,800 Speaker 1: the lands and grooves, the rifling on the bullet itself, 515 00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:19,960 Speaker 1: the rifling marks on the bullet itself. And what you 516 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,480 Speaker 1: do is you take the tested bullet that's been fired 517 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,640 Speaker 1: many times into a water tank or into cotton swabs, 518 00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:29,320 Speaker 1: and you take it out and then you compare it 519 00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:33,120 Speaker 1: to what's left behind. Is doctor Gallagher mentioned Sometimes bullets 520 00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: can be deformed that are removed at autopsy. Sometimes you 521 00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:38,800 Speaker 1: can find them that are relatively intact, but you'll compare 522 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:40,959 Speaker 1: it based upon the markets on the bullet and the 523 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 1: weight of the bullet, and then you get a ballistic match. 524 00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:47,600 Speaker 1: What we know right now is that the married lover, 525 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:52,760 Speaker 1: Michael Wolfe, has been in jail and Yamo County no bond. 526 00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:57,200 Speaker 1: He was indicted by a grand jury on kidnapping and 527 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:04,000 Speaker 1: aggravated murder charges. Okay, when you say aggravated murder, Dave 528 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:10,120 Speaker 1: Mack in that jurisdiction of Oregon, is there a death penalty, Nancy, 529 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:13,120 Speaker 1: there is a death penalty on the table for the 530 00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:16,920 Speaker 1: aggravated murder charge. Well, in most jurisdictions Dave that do 531 00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:20,640 Speaker 1: have the death penalty, more than one body under the 532 00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:25,480 Speaker 1: law is mass murder. So that is a special circumstance 533 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,120 Speaker 1: under which the state could seek the death penalty. This 534 00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:32,000 Speaker 1: guy has not entered a plea yet. To Paula Natari, 535 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:35,400 Speaker 1: criminal defense attorney, what do you expect is going to 536 00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:38,279 Speaker 1: happen when he is in court. And if he goes 537 00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:42,440 Speaker 1: to trial, well, I think that his lawyers are probably 538 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:45,959 Speaker 1: trying to get him a plea deal because right now 539 00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 1: things are just not looking good for this guy. If 540 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,400 Speaker 1: he goes to court, I think he's going to be 541 00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:58,520 Speaker 1: quickly convicted. There's moodus, there's opportunity. We've talked about. The 542 00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:01,600 Speaker 1: cell site evidence shows that he was in the location. 543 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,719 Speaker 1: The fact that this the bodies were hidden in a 544 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,839 Speaker 1: place where he had access to, he was connected. There 545 00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:10,960 Speaker 1: was just no The way in which mom and the 546 00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:15,520 Speaker 1: son disappeared shows that it was unlikely a struggle, that 547 00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:20,160 Speaker 1: she probably knew the person, and they probably took her 548 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:23,000 Speaker 1: away forcefully. But all of these things are just adding 549 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:26,120 Speaker 1: up in a very concrete way, and and and it's 550 00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:29,680 Speaker 1: looking very damning. They have a babysitter who can can 551 00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,719 Speaker 1: say that there was there was strife, there was arguments, 552 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:36,440 Speaker 1: it was a very heated custody or support and hearing 553 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,160 Speaker 1: that happened. He had just been forced to pay um, 554 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,800 Speaker 1: you know, child support, which he was unhappy about. So 555 00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 1: so everything is just really adding up in a nice 556 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,359 Speaker 1: little meat package for the prosecutor against him. I think 557 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 1: if if they go for the death penalty. This might 558 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:56,400 Speaker 1: just be a plea. If his lawyers could negotiate a 559 00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:59,239 Speaker 1: life plea, that that might be Um, that might be 560 00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:03,080 Speaker 1: a probability. What were you just saying about the babysitter evidence, Well, 561 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 1: the babysitter, Um, she's a crucial witness because she's saying that, 562 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:13,040 Speaker 1: you know, she was taking care of Um, of Carrissa, 563 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:15,560 Speaker 1: she was taking care of a little boy. And the 564 00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:18,880 Speaker 1: babysitter said that she had several conversations with Carrissa that 565 00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:22,680 Speaker 1: he has threatened to take William and get custody of him. Um. 566 00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:27,000 Speaker 1: And so she's she's just the witness to the fact 567 00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,840 Speaker 1: that there was strife in their relationship and he was 568 00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,480 Speaker 1: angry and it was this heated child support hearing. So 569 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:36,840 Speaker 1: I think it goes along with motives. He may want 570 00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:40,400 Speaker 1: a plea, but if they're seeking the death penalty, not 571 00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,640 Speaker 1: for the just for the death of the mother, but 572 00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:46,160 Speaker 1: for the three year old little boy, he'll never bla 573 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:50,319 Speaker 1: to the death penalty. So that very likely would go 574 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:53,320 Speaker 1: to trial. Yeah. So so in all of these cases 575 00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:57,960 Speaker 1: we see nationally covered, these cases where there's death, they're 576 00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:01,640 Speaker 1: they're seeking the death sentence. You know, people don't plead 577 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,279 Speaker 1: to death scent penalty. You know cases, So if they're 578 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,400 Speaker 1: seeking a death penalty, we're going to see a trial. 579 00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:10,640 Speaker 1: But I just don't think that, you know, he's this 580 00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:14,160 Speaker 1: guy has a chance at trial right now. Michael Wolfe 581 00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,319 Speaker 1: sitting behind bars. If you have information, please dial five 582 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:22,960 Speaker 1: zero three five eight eight eight four seven seven. We 583 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 1: wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace crime story, signing off, 584 00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:29,040 Speaker 1: goodbye friend,