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Speaker 2: Former NFL scout. He hosts three and Out podcast Hardest
Speaker 2: working Guy in This business and totally tied into the
Speaker 2: San Francisco forty nine ers who hold on to beat
Speaker 2: Dallas thirty to twenty four.
Speaker 4: I didn't.
Speaker 2: I didn't think it would be that close. You know,
Speaker 2: we'll spend fifteen twenty minutes on this Listen their things.
Speaker 2: San Francisco does well. They run the ball. They had,
Speaker 2: you know, two hundred yards rushing. Dallas doesn't run the ball.
Speaker 2: We knew that going into the season. They had just
Speaker 2: I thought they adjusted really well at halftime tonight they
Speaker 2: were really struggling stopping Dallas in the first half. Dallas
Speaker 2: was getting a push and then the kind of exploded
Speaker 2: in the third quarter. I do not trust this Niner
Speaker 2: pass rusher team Laighton games. They've been burned late in games.
Speaker 2: I thought brought pretty really struggled low off target early.
Speaker 2: I thought later in the second half to gain confidence,
Speaker 2: he used his legs a little bit, started moving, kind
Speaker 2: of gain confidence, hit on some nice throws.
Speaker 4: Kittle had a great night.
Speaker 2: You know, I think there's a difference between Dallas and
Speaker 2: San Francisco. I think San Francisco is a good team
Speaker 2: that is just physically like the Rams in the first month,
Speaker 2: just beat up. They just don't have enough good players.
Speaker 2: I think Dallas is a bad team that actually played
Speaker 2: pretty well tonight. They got to break when the couple
Speaker 2: of Niners banged into each other and Ceedee Lamb got
Speaker 2: a you know, wide open touchdown. And I've been saying
Speaker 2: this for a while. Dallas almost if you're a cowboy
Speaker 2: fant and I You're like, wow, we made it competitive
Speaker 2: at the end. I think they got to take a swing.
Speaker 4: John.
Speaker 2: I think they have to do something in the offseason.
Speaker 2: I think they have to sell some pieces, get two
Speaker 2: high draft picks. I don't see the way out for Dallas.
Speaker 2: Dak is ordinary. They're paying him a fortune, They're locked
Speaker 2: into him. If Ceedee Lamb twisted his ankle. They don't
Speaker 2: have a guy on this offensive roster that you would
Speaker 2: be forced to roll coverage over. I think it's despite
Speaker 2: the score tonight, I think it's grimmer for Dallas than
Speaker 2: people think, especially with Washington now like looking like the
Speaker 2: next decade they're gonna be locked in with Jade Daniels.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, this is not a game. I guess
Speaker 1: you need to worry about most people box score scouting
Speaker 1: because everyone watches it. But that score, I mean, they
Speaker 1: scored two touchdowns in the last five or six minutes
Speaker 1: of the game. One of the drives was a seventy
Speaker 1: second drive, which you know is pretty unheard of in
Speaker 1: the NFL. Obviously the Niners the first touchdown drive playing
Speaker 1: way off. You know what hit me tonight is the
Speaker 1: forty nine Ers have beat these guys now four times
Speaker 1: in a row, twice in the playoffs. They molly wopped
Speaker 1: him last year on Sunday Night Football. They were up
Speaker 1: in this game twenty seven to ten, missing a lot
Speaker 1: of guys. This matchup, which is one of the biggest
Speaker 1: matchups of my life in terms of brands in the history,
Speaker 1: is currently Kyle Shanahan, who's you know for a young
Speaker 1: guy who's been coaching in the NFL for twenty years
Speaker 1: and his dad is one of the most famous offensive
Speaker 1: coaches of all times, so he's been around football's whole life.
Speaker 1: And John Lynch, who currently last year or two years
Speaker 1: ago just went into the Hall of Fame. That's the
Speaker 1: forty nine ers brass building this team against an eighty
Speaker 1: plus year old Jerry Jones. It just it was like,
Speaker 1: this is not really a fair fight, because it's not
Speaker 1: like they both hit on some high end players Micah
Speaker 1: cd nick Bosa, Right, I mean they've both hit on
Speaker 1: trade for Trent Williams paying a bunch of money. But
Speaker 1: the forty nine Ers team is littered with guys in
Speaker 1: the fourth, fifth, sixth round. That Isaac Grendo is a
Speaker 1: fourth round rookie running back and boom, plug and play.
Speaker 1: What's the whole thing? Cowboys? No running back? They're playing
Speaker 1: Zeke can't run away from me or you who's tough,
Speaker 1: physical guy but can't move. They draft Isaac, well, guess what,
Speaker 1: I think he went a couple picks right after the
Speaker 1: pick that they traded for Trey Lance, who is their
Speaker 1: third string quarterback. Right, and listen, I admire Jerry's clearly
Speaker 1: from a business standpoint. He's been incredible for thirty plus years.
Speaker 1: I mean, hell, they sell practice facility tours to make
Speaker 1: a little ex income. But that he tried to strike
Speaker 1: oil on that one, and sometimes he does that, and
Speaker 1: you're not gonna strike oil Jerry, like you're gonna take
Speaker 1: Kyle who are you bidding against? On that one? And
Speaker 1: the other quarterbacks in his draft class who are way
Speaker 1: better went for like six and seventh round picks Fields,
Speaker 1: Mac Jones, Zach Wilson. So that's kind of a microcosm
Speaker 1: of Kyle Shanahan, John Lynch. But you could just go
Speaker 1: right less need Sean McVeigh, Dan Brad Holmes, Dan Campbell,
Speaker 1: Guda Kin's lafor how is Jerry compete the NFC even
Speaker 1: you know the Eagles Sirianni's under but no one questions
Speaker 1: Howie's intelligence. So from a football standpoint, in that conference
Speaker 1: doesn't have the high end quarterbacks of the Mahomes, Alan Lamar,
Speaker 1: Burrow Herbert, but it does have very very high level
Speaker 1: front office and football guys, coach and GM combos that
Speaker 1: I would say and have built very very good teams.
Speaker 1: Because you watch the Cowboys, they got injuries. Like you said,
Speaker 1: how many guys are on the sideline for the Niners. Hell,
Speaker 1: halfway through the game, Deebo's got a seventeenth injury of
Speaker 1: the season and he's in the blue ten. Didn't even
Speaker 1: matter to me that score, Like, don't get me wrong,
Speaker 1: I mean it was You're on the edge of your seat.
Speaker 1: Those last couple of minutes not really indicative what we
Speaker 1: witnessed when the Niners really put a pedal in the
Speaker 1: medal there and when the game mattered.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean what's discouraging is for a long time
Speaker 2: the Niners were fifty percent on third down with a
Speaker 2: lot of time to play. They had four hundred and
Speaker 2: fifty yards.
Speaker 1: They didn't party. Was, like you said, atrocious in the
Speaker 1: first half, Miss Vase Carrolls.
Speaker 2: Yeah, underneath stuff like layups and beat up. I mean,
Speaker 2: they have like seven starters out. It's just it's this
Speaker 2: is almost encouraging for Dallas because they were competitive.
Speaker 1: I off a bye though, you know, with Jerry talking
Speaker 1: a bunch of crap, they were kind of motivating. I
Speaker 1: thought they threw the kitchen sink and they ran out
Speaker 1: of juice.
Speaker 4: That's what I think.
Speaker 2: I mean. Mike McCarthy, actually he's not Andy Reid, but
Speaker 2: he's top five or six coach in the league off
Speaker 2: a bye, so and they had a very solid first
Speaker 2: half and then and then again you can only tweak,
Speaker 2: you know. I mean it's just interesting to watch, Like
Speaker 2: Ricky Pearsol, he got a little run. I mean, they're
Speaker 2: using cowling on punts. They're they're getting a lot of
Speaker 2: different guys involved, you know, and it's funny in the
Speaker 2: NFL you're allowed to whift. I mean John Lynch is
Speaker 2: whiffed on some guys. I mean, you know, he's taken
Speaker 2: swings and missed on guys. That wide receiver from f
Speaker 2: m U he was a second or third round.
Speaker 4: Pick, Gray Terrible. Yeah, yeah, so, I mean.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean less and McVeigh missed on Logan Bruss,
Speaker 2: the second round guard, who's just a perennial backup second
Speaker 2: round guard to two at well, you know he'll be
Speaker 2: gone here soon. So I mean, it's okay to miss
Speaker 2: people miss all the time. Pete Carroll had hits, he
Speaker 2: had misses. I mean, he had Rashad Penny in the
Speaker 2: first round as a running back that never panned out really, so,
Speaker 2: but it's just I just feel San Francisco also the
Speaker 2: advantage that San Francisco has they're they're better at drafting,
Speaker 2: but they also have a coach that has a certain style,
Speaker 2: so stylistically, there are things you can draft that almost
Speaker 2: always work with Shanahan, like running backs, slot receivers. It's
Speaker 2: they almost always work because you know, it's like they're
Speaker 2: like with Andy Reid. I mean, they've missed on some
Speaker 2: wide receivers, which by the way, is the hardest position
Speaker 2: to draft in the first round in the NFL because
Speaker 2: I mean, for a lot of reasons. A lot of
Speaker 2: times you get a mature quarterback. He's just not patient.
Speaker 2: He just doesn't want to wait for some kid to
Speaker 2: figure out the routes. They don't trust.
Speaker 4: That was Brady in New England.
Speaker 1: He just did Historically. It was one of the bigger
Speaker 1: busting positions to the last six or seven years when
Speaker 1: the college football changed.
Speaker 4: Yep.
Speaker 2: But I feel like with San Francisco, when you when
Speaker 2: you got the coach right and you have a player
Speaker 2: and a GM and a coach relationship that's strong, you
Speaker 2: kind of know you kind of know where to draft.
Speaker 2: I mean, like the guy George Patten in Denver was
Speaker 2: Sean Payton. If you look at Sean Payton's history, Mickey
Speaker 2: Loomis and New Orleans drafting for Sean Payton. He knew
Speaker 2: positions that worked for Sean, so he didn't miss on
Speaker 2: certain positions. Dallas, it feels like you just kind of
Speaker 2: taken the best value in the draft and you're not
Speaker 2: quite I mean, they've hit on their first round picks,
Speaker 2: but a lot of misses, a lot of you know,
Speaker 2: Tyron Smith, they had on Zack Martin, do on Ceedee Lamb,
Speaker 2: they hit on Michael Parsons. They've been pretty good in
Speaker 2: the first round, but I don't feel like they find
Speaker 2: enough elite. They don't find like San Francisco Kittle fifth round,
Speaker 2: Jennings sixth round, brought pretty seventh round. I don't feel
Speaker 2: like Dallas creates that.
Speaker 1: Well, look at that last drive when they get the
Speaker 1: ball back. There wasn't forty five seconds left, There was
Speaker 1: almost three minutes with a two minute warning. You could
Speaker 1: just run a normal drive. What do they they can't
Speaker 1: run the ball? Well, Girndo is the forty nine ers.
Speaker 1: He's not their backup running back. He's their third string
Speaker 1: running back, because I mean, what would they do to
Speaker 1: have Girndo or Jordan Mason on their team? But they
Speaker 1: can't run a normal drive because they can't run the ball,
Speaker 1: so they have to attempt to throw it and they
Speaker 1: go basically four and out right in the game. The
Speaker 1: game immediately ends. And this gets back to building the team.
Speaker 1: Like I get where Jerry's like, we didn't have the money,
Speaker 1: Derrick Henry would not have looked like he did on
Speaker 1: the Cowboys. But you should be able to find good
Speaker 1: running backs with ease midway through the draft, undrafted free agents,
Speaker 1: guys for a couple millions on the scrap heap instead
Speaker 1: of what did Jerry do? Kind of like Bill at
Speaker 1: the latter end of his career with coaches right brings
Speaker 1: back all these guys Zeke Elliott, Like who else? How
Speaker 1: is Zeke Elliott getting run for you? It doesn't make
Speaker 1: any sense. So this is what happens when like ultimately
Speaker 1: there has to be some checks and balances. Do you
Speaker 1: think John and Kyle agree all the time. No, But
Speaker 1: they have an offensive philosophy a defensive philosophy, and they
Speaker 1: can find middle ground and they can help each other out.
Speaker 1: Veitch and Andy are the best example. Like the personnel
Speaker 1: guys and coaches butt heads. It's natural. One guy's living
Speaker 1: in the moment the other guy sees it, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of from a forty thousand foot view sometimes, and
Speaker 1: Jerry has no balance. You're not listening to anything Mike's
Speaker 1: telling him. I mean, Stephen is in a tough position
Speaker 1: as his son. It's like maybe he can influence them
Speaker 1: a little. But at this point in time, we all know.
Speaker 1: Anyone that's ever been around a really, really old guy
Speaker 1: who has a lot of money, they're naturally very stubborn.
Speaker 1: And Jerry is that on steroids clearly right now. I
Speaker 1: mean the words he said, I mean that that article
Speaker 1: that came out this week about the tours, Yeah, to me,
Speaker 1: that is not coming out if everything hadn't happened the
Speaker 1: previous couple weeks. It was ripe for the taking right there, Jerry,
Speaker 1: Like that is a product of Jerry Jones. No one
Speaker 1: was talking about those tours were going on last year
Speaker 1: when they were twelve and five and hosting the playoff game.
Speaker 1: But no one cares, right, But the moment you start
Speaker 1: leaking oil, things get weird. Jerry's being I mean, he's
Speaker 1: he's being it's a little different, but he's got some
Speaker 1: mal Davis two thousand and seven vibes, right now doesn't.
Speaker 4: He Yeah, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2: The other thing watching this is that I don't see
Speaker 2: a big separation with Dak Prescott and Brock Purty. The
Speaker 2: difference is Brock is free and Dak's sixty million. I
Speaker 2: mean when I watch them play, you know, they both
Speaker 2: can be a little spotty with their accuracy. I think
Speaker 2: at this point, Brock runs better than Dak. I think
Speaker 2: Dak ran better about three years ago, but Daks from bank,
Speaker 2: so I think Brock runs better. I think accuracy, they're
Speaker 2: both kind of the same. Neither has a big arm
Speaker 2: down field good enough, they both see the field particularly well.
Speaker 2: They're both grown ups. I feel like pre snap they're
Speaker 2: both fine. But the difference is one's free and and
Speaker 2: one is now paid. Top of the league. And so
Speaker 2: I mean, and you got that thing hasn't even kicked
Speaker 2: in yet. So I just I look and I look
Speaker 2: at the NFC, John, and I've said this, I'm watching
Speaker 2: Detroit today kick the you know what, out of Tennessee,
Speaker 2: Detroit maybe the best team in the league. And here
Speaker 2: comes Washington and Chicago can play. Philadelphia had its best
Speaker 2: game in forever today. You know, green Bay is just
Speaker 2: stacked offensively. If Jordan Love can stay healthy, I think that.
Speaker 2: I think the Rams are going to go on a
Speaker 2: run here now now that they got their receivers healthy.
Speaker 2: If they can get their interior O line healthy, I
Speaker 2: think they'll go on a run. Hell Arizona is a
Speaker 2: tough out.
Speaker 1: With they're they're they're four and four. They're technically in
Speaker 1: first place right now and then in the division.
Speaker 2: So I just I I mean, let's concentrate on San
Speaker 2: Francisco instead of lamenting the Cowboys. I do think if
Speaker 2: they can get healthy in the next six weeks, what's
Speaker 2: their ceiling.
Speaker 1: I think they can compete for Super Bowl because they've
Speaker 1: beat all these teams, all the teams you just rattled off.
Speaker 1: I mean, they've owned Sean McVeigh. They actually play the
Speaker 1: Lions and the Packers here coming up, and they beat
Speaker 1: both those two teams. Now they got them at home,
Speaker 1: and right now they're not hosting those teams even if
Speaker 1: they pull off this division, right, I mean, it looks
Speaker 1: like Detroit's gonna be the number one seed. They get
Speaker 1: a buye right now. So you're four and four, you
Speaker 1: take a deep breath. This season has been the season
Speaker 1: from Hell. To me. Every team has it, But what
Speaker 1: are your standards? The Jets have it, They're done. The
Speaker 1: Niners have it. It's like four and four, Okay, does
Speaker 1: Christian McCaffrey come back in two weeks? And then their
Speaker 1: schedule opens up a little bit at Tampa, who just
Speaker 1: lost their best two players and they gave everything they
Speaker 1: had today and it's just not gonna be enough in
Speaker 1: there in shambles. Then they get Seattle, who they own,
Speaker 1: so you could look up pretty quick. And then the
Speaker 1: forty nine ers are six and four and they can
Speaker 1: take a deep breath. Now they have to. They have
Speaker 1: a trip where they go, oh, I don't know, I
Speaker 1: don't know the order, but it's at Green Bay and
Speaker 1: at Buffalo. Yeah, so I mean those two games, and
Speaker 1: then they played Detroit at home late in the season.
Speaker 1: So to me, if you can win one of those
Speaker 1: three games, handle some division games like this could be
Speaker 1: a ten and seven team will win the division. And
Speaker 1: then the one thing the advantage you have is a
Speaker 1: coach and a bright lights, battle hardened team like you
Speaker 1: saw George Kill. The night lights are the brightest. Dallas Cowboys.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna fucking dominate, Yeah, Samuel Fred Warner, same within
Speaker 1: Nick Bosa, so they are not gonna be intimidated by
Speaker 1: any of these teams. Now, they need Christian McCaffrey back.
Speaker 1: They need Deebo Samuel to stay healthy, and Drake Greenlaw
Speaker 1: would help as well. But these guys are all I mean,
Speaker 1: I think Debo will be fine, but if they can
Speaker 1: get Christian back like that would be a pretty big addition.
Speaker 1: There's not a if you tell me Christian McCaffrey's eighty
Speaker 1: eighty five percent of the guy we saw last year.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's not a team in the league that
Speaker 1: could trade for a better player given what he means
Speaker 1: to this team. Right.
Speaker 2: I do wonder about the defense, third coordinator. Defensively, in
Speaker 2: three years the pass they.
Speaker 1: Weren't that good. They weren't that good last year though,
Speaker 1: and they made the Super Bowl.
Speaker 2: But the NFC is better, I think. I mean, green
Speaker 2: Bay was too young, now they're not. Detroit was the hunter.
Speaker 2: Now that the hunted, I think they're better. Washington's real.
Speaker 2: I mean, I think Atlanta's a tough out and if Atlanta,
Speaker 2: if you had to go to Atlanta.
Speaker 4: You just you know Atlanta.
Speaker 1: I think the Niners would like their chances in that one.
Speaker 1: The NFC North would be a problem for them. I
Speaker 1: think Kirk Cousins they'd be licking their lips because but
Speaker 1: non mobile quarterbacks, they historically have been really good, even
Speaker 1: though their pass rush isn't as good. To me, the
Speaker 1: Jordan loves the Detroit They don't have a mobile quarterback,
Speaker 1: but their offense is so dynamic.
Speaker 4: Do you think the Niners are well coached defensively?
Speaker 1: Uh?
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think one thing that's hurt them that they always
Speaker 1: I think their coach has probably got too much credit.
Speaker 1: I mean, Demiko was legit, but Sala probably got too
Speaker 1: much credit. And when they've played well this year and
Speaker 1: last year is when you just got four great pass rushers.
Speaker 1: I mean, like that's a d line coach and just
Speaker 1: pure talent that makes everyone look better. I do think
Speaker 1: their defensive backs are pretty good, and so obviously Fred
Speaker 1: Warner is, you know, the best linebacker in the league.
Speaker 1: Do they have Steve Spagnola or you know Brian Flores? No,
Speaker 1: they do not, but they do have on every level
Speaker 1: good players. So I don't know what the hell happened
Speaker 1: there down the stretch. That was pretty embarrassing, especially like
Speaker 1: it's one thing of a couple of random guys break plays,
Speaker 1: but eighty eight like that, that cannot happen. But I
Speaker 1: do think they have the talent to compete with all
Speaker 1: these teams. Would I bet my money for them to
Speaker 1: win the Super Bowl as we sit here right now,
Speaker 1: or to win the NFC, I would not. But no
Speaker 1: team in the NFC, and it includes the Eagles who
Speaker 1: got to the Super Bowl a couple of years ago,
Speaker 1: have had more recent playoff success than the forty nine ers.
Speaker 1: They've won on the road, they've won at home. They
Speaker 1: are coaching mismatch, their player mismatch in terms of their
Speaker 1: comfortability in those moments. I mean that they have a
Speaker 1: lot of guys, guys who have been through the ringer,
Speaker 1: so they'll probably be an underdog if they're on the
Speaker 1: road in Green Bay or you know, Detroit or whatever.
Speaker 1: But you wouldn't just say a god, obviously, health, you know,
Speaker 1: impacts this. You wouldn't say they would have no shot
Speaker 1: in these games. The other things you saw in that game,
Speaker 1: you know, once Dak shattered his ankle, he clearly has
Speaker 1: never moved the same. Perty That looked a little like
Speaker 1: the second half in some of those playoff games where
Speaker 1: he just gets you some extra first downs and he
Speaker 1: doesn't turn the ball over. When he turns the ball over,
Speaker 1: the Niners offense bad. When he doesn't, and they run
Speaker 1: the ball, they tend to win.
Speaker 2: I thought at halftime it was fairly clear that Kyle
Speaker 2: had told him, you know what, we're gonna move, run,
Speaker 2: keep it yourself. And I also think, to Pretty's credit,
Speaker 2: I think, you know, I used to say this about
Speaker 2: Lebron for most of his career. He'd lose confidence in
Speaker 2: the jumper and he'd say, Okay, I'm just gonna take
Speaker 2: you to the basket, and then over the course of
Speaker 2: two or three games, he'd hit some jumpers and he'd
Speaker 2: get his confidence back. I thought, CURTI lost his confidence
Speaker 2: a little bit in the first half. He threw behind
Speaker 2: a couple of receivers. He threw low, and it kind
Speaker 2: of felt like and he knew it, and it kind
Speaker 2: of felt like, Okay, I'm just gonna start moving here
Speaker 2: a little bit, you know, I want to. I want
Speaker 2: to kind of get the mojo back. And I thought
Speaker 2: he did, and I thought, yeah, and I think, you know,
Speaker 2: he's a pro athlete. And then I thought he got
Speaker 2: confidence back. And then it's like getting your jumper back,
Speaker 2: and then he made a couple of big throws down
Speaker 2: the field. Couple won really nice though to Kidle, and
Speaker 2: so I thought in the second half was a truer,
Speaker 2: a truer copy.
Speaker 1: Of what.
Speaker 2: Brought pretty is. I thought he had a bad first half.
Speaker 2: I thought in the second half, that's that's a truer
Speaker 2: version of him.
Speaker 1: I think the thing with him is we just need
Speaker 1: to put him into context, like, separate from the contract.
Speaker 1: He's not as good as the top guys, but when
Speaker 1: he plays well, he can be good as that next
Speaker 1: here that you can win a lot of games with
Speaker 1: as you build the team. And my whole thing is
Speaker 1: if you have any question marks, like you would just
Speaker 1: play it again next year. This isn't one of those where,
Speaker 1: right the Niners are some poverty franchise like the Jags.
Speaker 1: We got to give him two hundred million and then
Speaker 1: you regret it. No, take a deep breath. He's making
Speaker 1: a bunch of money. He loves being here. There's no
Speaker 1: better spot for him, and you just this is a
Speaker 1: fluid situation. But he plays like that, plays winning football,
Speaker 1: like he's got a place with Kyle. Because that's the
Speaker 1: other thing with this coach, you kind of need a
Speaker 1: specific type quarterback. The one problem with the Niners is,
Speaker 1: and we talk about this all the time, is you
Speaker 1: know their offense can be so run dependent because the
Speaker 1: pass then comes off that they can't really the one
Speaker 1: thing that McCarthy and Dak have no problem doing, spread
Speaker 1: it out, playing the shotgun like they're comfortable with a
Speaker 1: lot of teams all over the NFL. It's not really
Speaker 1: the forty nine ers passing game, you know.
Speaker 4: No, they're not. They're not a come from behind team necessarily.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 2: I mean, I think they tend to get leads because
Speaker 2: I think they're really schematically ahead of the curve. So
Speaker 2: I mean when you watch them play, there's just two
Speaker 2: or three things. I always feel like they always have
Speaker 2: a good early drive, They always run the football, they
Speaker 2: almost always have a pass rush, They create turnovers. I mean,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of really good things that they do.
Speaker 2: They're not special at quarterback. But in this second half,
Speaker 2: when you watch perty, you're like, oh, I get it,
Speaker 2: they moved the pocket. I just I think you have
Speaker 2: to feel if you're San Francisco tonight thirty twenty four
Speaker 2: of Dallas, you played a pretty poor first half your
Speaker 2: quarterback was off, You're missing seven to eight key players,
Speaker 2: Deebo gets hurt in the game, and you're like, we won.
Speaker 2: I mean we got five hundred yards of offense. I
Speaker 2: think in the end, I mean they lose tonight they're
Speaker 2: three and five.
Speaker 1: Oh, it would have been it would have felt like
Speaker 1: the season and it would have.
Speaker 2: Been I mean, you would have had to look yourself
Speaker 2: in and go, do we peel off a guy or
Speaker 2: too at the trade deadline, like we have to get picks.
Speaker 1: It would have been one of the worst losses I've
Speaker 1: ever seen in my entire life of watching this franchise,
Speaker 1: and for a minute, you're on the edge of your seat,
Speaker 1: You're like, this isn't really gonna happen. I do think
Speaker 1: there's something to be said when you have a coach
Speaker 1: and you have the core of your team that has
Speaker 1: seen it all good and bad. And that's one thing
Speaker 1: the Chiefs have. I know, they've they've won the two
Speaker 1: Super Bowls, but they've also gone through some crazy bad
Speaker 1: stretches these last couple of years. They're very comfortable in
Speaker 1: every environment, and the forty nine ers over the course
Speaker 1: of these last three years have had slow starts I
Speaker 1: think twenty two. They started three and five, So it's
Speaker 1: like they are used to some madness for a really,
Speaker 1: really good team, and they're comfortable in these environments. Now
Speaker 1: they got some big games. I gotta get guys back.
Speaker 1: But it all comes down if Perty's playing well, they
Speaker 1: have a chance to beat anybody. When he plays like
Speaker 1: he did last week against the Chiefs, they become very
Speaker 1: average to below quick because their defense, like you said,
Speaker 1: it's not as dominant in years past, but at any
Speaker 1: moment they could get an interception, Fredkin forms a fumble.
Speaker 1: They have like they can be disruptive at a moment's notice,
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden they get the ball and
Speaker 1: flip a field like that that they're not as likely
Speaker 1: to hold you to two hundred yards and those days
Speaker 1: are done.
Speaker 2: Thirty twenty four, San Francisco over the Cowboys. Thursday Night
Speaker 2: Football is on. It's only on Prime video, best season
Speaker 2: yet pack with big rivalries and even bigger stars al Michaels,
Speaker 2: Kirk Kirkstreek, Kaylee Hartung. Every week, games you can't miss
Speaker 2: Coverage begins at seven Eastern with Football's Best Party TNF Tonight.
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Speaker 2: Seeamazon dot com slash Amazon Prime for details. Are Week
Speaker 2: eight reaction presented by Uber Eats Get almost almost Anything
Speaker 2: for Game Day greatest ugly game in the history of
Speaker 2: the NFL. Washington beats the Bears eighteen to fifteen on
Speaker 2: a hail Mary. Let me just start with this. Washington
Speaker 2: was the better team. They were the better coached team.
Speaker 2: I thought Chicago's offensive coaching at the end of the
Speaker 2: game was egregiously horrible. Late in the game, and I
Speaker 2: give me, let me just say, Caleb and his movement
Speaker 2: and his side arming stuff. You can see the Mahomes comps.
Speaker 2: He's running around the old lines getting overwhelmed. I mean,
Speaker 2: first of all, it was nine to nothing at half.
Speaker 2: Chicago had thirty three yards passing in the first half.
Speaker 2: I thought the game was over. But Chicago, you know,
Speaker 2: their defense, you know, kind of kept him in the game.
Speaker 2: And then Washington's offense stalled. But I got us John
Speaker 2: the third and goal where the Bears did the fridge perry.
Speaker 2: The following drive on a third down to win the game.
Speaker 2: You thought they did a draw, essentially putting in the
Speaker 2: hands The whole game came down one play, Thank god,
Speaker 2: Keenan Allen.
Speaker 4: It was past interference. I didn't get that. I mean,
Speaker 4: they made no attempt.
Speaker 2: It felt like the third down was just setting up
Speaker 2: fourth down and they had to have a touchdown to
Speaker 2: take a lead. So I just couldn't stand Chicago's offensive coaching.
Speaker 4: And I know it to hail.
Speaker 2: Mary, but my was Washington was a better team.
Speaker 1: One could not agree more. There was a stat that
Speaker 1: popped up, I think in the second half that said
Speaker 1: he was four of thirteen for thirty six yards. That
Speaker 1: being Caleb. I thought, on this drive can't be the game,
Speaker 1: and I had a double check it was the game.
Speaker 1: Their offense was horrendous, their defense was outstanding. I wrote down,
Speaker 1: I mean even when it was nine to nothing, it
Speaker 1: felt I mean twenty eight to nothing. Yeah, complete control.
Speaker 1: Jayden didn't just look like the best player in the game.
Speaker 1: He looked like one of the best players in the league.
Speaker 1: The thing I wrote down is if you could pick
Speaker 1: these two coaching staffs, Ibra flus Waldron and Dan Quinn
Speaker 1: Cliff Kingsbury, the gap is like going from a star
Speaker 1: starting quarterback to some random backup. You're like, it's not
Speaker 1: even close. That's why when they take the lead, I'm like, listen,
Speaker 1: it's sports. Crazy things happen. But there haven't been many
Speaker 1: games this season where a team would have came away
Speaker 1: with a victory that was like, oh, you didn't. You
Speaker 1: didn't even come close to call the play to a
Speaker 1: backup offensive lineman on like I was one years old
Speaker 1: with the refrigerator Perry plays, but he did it a
Speaker 1: lot right. It was part of their arsenal. They weren't
Speaker 1: a good obviously Walter Payton, but they weren't some dynamic offense.
Speaker 1: You got, you drafted the receiver nine, you got Keenan Allen,
Speaker 1: you got DJ Moore. Your running backs are the reason
Speaker 1: you're in the game. Yes, I mean if it wasn't
Speaker 1: for Swifts whatever, huge run, oh huge, we wouldn't even
Speaker 1: have been close. It was like that gave them life
Speaker 1: because they had none none, They had none to give
Speaker 1: him that play, even they ended up taking the lead
Speaker 1: with twenty seconds left. That's I think that has to
Speaker 1: go down as the most egregious play call of the season.
Speaker 1: Second would probably be that. Remember that fake play the
Speaker 1: Bills ran, I think against the Ravens when they were
Speaker 1: storming that, But that was way worse to get backup
Speaker 1: offensive lineman. I mean, it's not even you can't even
Speaker 1: blame him. Belichick would say, it's not on the player,
Speaker 1: it's on the coach. Yeah, you can't call. You can't
Speaker 1: put that guy in that position, right, It'd be like me, hey, John,
Speaker 1: make this video edit?
Speaker 4: Do I what do I do?
Speaker 1: That was crazy calling. It really was. They got lucky
Speaker 1: the bounce or something didn't land where the guy did
Speaker 1: take it to the house. That could have been historic
Speaker 1: disaster on a given play.
Speaker 2: And here's the other thing, you know, I beat up
Speaker 2: on defensive coaches. The Bears were off a bye the
Speaker 2: first half. No clever nothing. They weren't quick to the line,
Speaker 2: they weren't quick out of the huddle. It was just
Speaker 2: it was just plotting. There wasn't any energy. And I
Speaker 2: understand off of bye. You know, you when we watch
Speaker 2: a McVeigh off a bye or some of these really
Speaker 2: well coached teams, I mean, and or even Shanahan, you're
Speaker 2: like Shanahan otens with the Jets. You're like, this is
Speaker 2: a mismatch. You can see the plays off a bye.
Speaker 2: It like was a Syriani. It's like you got nothing,
Speaker 2: you have no you have no design plays. And it's
Speaker 2: one of those things where in the first half, Jaden
Speaker 2: Daniels was the best player on the field. I will
Speaker 2: say Caleb won't show up in the box score, but
Speaker 2: his ability because I mean Washington's pass rush John, especially
Speaker 2: in the early portions. I think what happened sometimes Washington's
Speaker 2: defensive line control the first half. These are three hundred
Speaker 2: pound guys. I thought they wore down in the fourth
Speaker 2: and it gave Caleb another second to a maneuver around.
Speaker 2: They just they're big. They mean these guys like pain.
Speaker 2: You can't get sixty snaps out of these guys at
Speaker 2: the same energy level. And I thought Caleb bought time.
Speaker 2: I thought he made a couple of really really high
Speaker 2: end throws in the fourth quarter. But John that drive
Speaker 2: that gave them the lead on third down, This is
Speaker 2: not a field goal situation you're going to score. They
Speaker 2: run another quarterback draw and I thought, just after running
Speaker 2: a previous one, I thought, well, what are we doing
Speaker 2: here now?
Speaker 1: First down, they ran a fade into the corner of
Speaker 1: the end zone, Like, what are you doing to slam
Speaker 1: the ball in? You run the ball right down the throat.
Speaker 2: So I just hated the Bears play calling and and
Speaker 2: not not just because I had Washington as aside, but
Speaker 2: there are moments in the season where I feel bad
Speaker 2: for teams where like they outplay, they out scheme, they
Speaker 2: out and they just they end up on the wrong
Speaker 2: side of a game. I always kind of root for
Speaker 2: the team that looks like they put the effort in,
Speaker 2: they had a plan. I don't like luck wins, but
Speaker 2: they happen in football, and shit happens. I mean, guys
Speaker 2: get hurt, you get bad breaks.
Speaker 1: But I will it happens in all sports. Could have
Speaker 1: happened last night in the Yankee game, if they would
Speaker 1: have came back in the ninth inning. It's like they
Speaker 1: deserved to win that game. It's just that's what we watched.
Speaker 2: But let's let's let's just say this right now. In
Speaker 2: terms of entire staff, Washington's gonna have. I think it
Speaker 2: has a top five to six staff in the league
Speaker 2: if you're counting both coordinators.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: This pass defense was egregiously bad in the first month.
Speaker 2: Even that's gotten better. It was the worst pass defense
Speaker 2: for three weeks, so they're coaching.
Speaker 1: The hell out of that thing. Well, the ross the
Speaker 1: two rosters a lot of money on their offensive line
Speaker 1: in Washington and it's actually pretty solid. But the rest
Speaker 1: of the roster relative to the Bears, right, I mean,
Speaker 1: the Bears got better wide receivers, they definitely got a
Speaker 1: way better defense. I mean they got a fantastic secondary.
Speaker 1: I mean, how good does Montes sweat look? I mean, Jesus,
Speaker 1: you know, Miles Garrett or something. A couple things. I
Speaker 1: think you give Caleb credit for competitive character because that
Speaker 1: was a game where he could have just folded like
Speaker 1: a cheap tent, and he you know, you could tell
Speaker 1: he was pretty down on the sideline. And then those
Speaker 1: last couple drives, the second to last one, he made
Speaker 1: a couple miraculous plays little out Allen iverson juke move
Speaker 1: of a defensive lineman to keep a play alive, throwing
Speaker 1: across his body. It looked like like USC last year
Speaker 1: versus Arizona. Remember when he was just making some of
Speaker 1: these players, You're like, holy shit, he did that tonight.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Another thing, I think if Chicago could have a do
Speaker 1: over I'm a huge Roma Dunes fan. He says, going
Speaker 1: to be an excellent player, he would play for any
Speaker 1: team in the league. They had an opportunity with a
Speaker 1: top ten pick, and their offensive line is not good. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and there were several offensive linemen on the board. It's
Speaker 1: you know, I get it. Receivers are sexy. You can
Speaker 1: find wide receivers all over the league. You can trade
Speaker 1: for him in the middle of the season to not
Speaker 1: draft the Penn State guy, the Oregon State guy who
Speaker 1: can play five different positions. Yeah, so everyone, and I
Speaker 1: would imagine, you know, the way the game ending that ended,
Speaker 1: that's going to be the headline. But if it had
Speaker 1: just been a Washington just dominant victory, it would have
Speaker 1: been shitting on Caleb and he did not play well.
Speaker 1: That offensive line was getting worked work, And this was
Speaker 1: my concern, Like, I don't give you. You get credit
Speaker 1: because you've been an underachieving team. So you take care
Speaker 1: of teams like Carolina. That's the first step of like
Speaker 1: becoming good. You got to beat the bad teams. But
Speaker 1: it doesn't translate when you play better teams. It's why,
Speaker 1: like you watched that first half, you're like this team,
Speaker 1: they're gonna let a lot of people down in that
Speaker 1: city because they're not gonna be able to play with
Speaker 1: good teams. And it starts with their five offensive linemen.
Speaker 1: Washington is not Joe Gibbs, I would imagine had a
Speaker 1: pretty good defense line. That's not what they're rolling out.
Speaker 1: I mean, this defensive line. I'm happening to google some
Speaker 1: of these guys. It's really more dan Quinn raw Rock
Speaker 1: coaching these guys up, and they are getting beat like
Speaker 1: a drum on like every other play. So yeah, Caleb,
Speaker 1: obviously you're you're kind of freaking out back there. You
Speaker 1: don't have any time and balls start flying all over
Speaker 1: the map. But how many times did he step back
Speaker 1: two seconds later and there's like three guys coming at him.
Speaker 4: It's crazy. Well, it's funny.
Speaker 2: I was talking to somebody this weekend Hardball was either
Speaker 2: going to take Joe Alt or Thomas, the wide receiver
Speaker 2: in Jacksonville, Mike Thomas the fifth pick. He apparently this
Speaker 2: is what I was told. I mean, he loved Mike Thomas,
Speaker 2: and he's like, we got to protect our asset. We
Speaker 2: got to get Joe Alt and that you know, people
Speaker 2: had Mike Thomas at like fifteenth, twentieth.
Speaker 1: Apparently he's good. He had to touchdown today, he plays
Speaker 1: every week.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's just And Harball was like, I think Harball
Speaker 2: recruited him, you know, at Michigan could get it and
Speaker 2: so and so unlike the Bears. And the Chargers needed
Speaker 2: to receive much more than the Bears did, and they
Speaker 2: went with Joe Alt because the take was, I gotta
Speaker 2: protect I gotta protect Justin Herbert.
Speaker 4: So I like it.
Speaker 1: Remember Harbass said that we view offensive lineman his weapons
Speaker 1: the tip of the spear.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and today it was a classic ugly Chargers win
Speaker 2: where yeah, it was just you know, boy, we'll talk
Speaker 2: about it later. But Jesus Herbert's talented, fricking talented, not
Speaker 2: working with much talented. All right, next game, New England
Speaker 2: beats the Jets twenty five, twenty two, so you know
Speaker 2: it's we could just beat up on Aaron. But I
Speaker 2: mean the field goal. They can't hit a field goal,
Speaker 2: they can't hit a pat But here's here's my bigger takeaway.
Speaker 2: You haven't won since Robert Sola left. And when they
Speaker 2: fired him, I said, you just let your best coach
Speaker 2: leave the room. You just let him leave and the
Speaker 2: defense is not as good, John, They're not as good.
Speaker 2: I mean, actually, I mean look at that final drive
Speaker 2: by Brissett.
Speaker 4: He had time to.
Speaker 2: Throw and so in Aaron is a pocket quarterback who
Speaker 2: had seventeen completions and no longer moves. Well, I mean
Speaker 2: they have weapons. They've got Lazard, they've got Garrett Wilson,
Speaker 2: they've got Devonte Adams who had you know, five catches
Speaker 2: fifty yards whatever, four catches fifty yards. But you can't
Speaker 2: say they don't have Breeze Hall. You can't say they
Speaker 2: don't have weapons. But it's actually it's the truth is
Speaker 2: they're not as good defensively. Now, this is this is
Speaker 2: classic Jets. They are now a mediocre defense with a
Speaker 2: forty year old quarterback who's a total pocket quarterback. And
Speaker 2: Ian O'Connor had a tweet during this game. He said,
Speaker 2: the Jets talk about energy. They're slow out of the huddle,
Speaker 2: they're slow to the line. He said, they're just applodding, slow,
Speaker 2: energy less offense. Well, that's on Rogers, that's on Aaron
Speaker 2: and so I can I can blame it. But the
Speaker 2: Jets had eight penalties, knowing didn't have as many penalties
Speaker 2: in New England's the younger team. I think it's just
Speaker 2: a systems failure. It's just a mass of an organization.
Speaker 1: I think they got so many things going on. One.
Speaker 1: When they fired Sala and they make Olbrick become the
Speaker 1: head coach, you're basically losing out twice. Right, Your defense
Speaker 1: is gonna get worse because he has to focus on
Speaker 1: other things, and the things he has to focus on,
Speaker 1: he has no clue what he's doing because he's never
Speaker 1: done it. He'd be like, hey, John, we need to
Speaker 1: keep rolling with the podcast and now also be the
Speaker 1: head of sales. We would probably lose out on both.
Speaker 1: The podcasts would get worse and sales might go down.
Speaker 1: Why because it makes no sense to put me in
Speaker 1: that position, So you put Olbrich Colin. I don't think
Speaker 1: I've ever seen this in my entire life, high school,
Speaker 1: college or the pros. Going into the second quarter of
Speaker 1: the football game, the Jets had zero timeouts. They used
Speaker 1: all of their timeouts in the first quarter, and it
Speaker 1: was offensively. I mean, I don't know how many delay
Speaker 1: of games they had. They literally had a delay of
Speaker 1: game when they scored the final touchdown to take the
Speaker 1: lead in the game on the two point conversion. On
Speaker 1: the two point conversion, So Olbrik's gonna take a lot
Speaker 1: of shit. I can't blame him for the delay of games.
Speaker 1: He has nothing to do with Aaron Rodgers try offense nothing,
Speaker 1: I mean absolutely nothing. Now, in fairness to Aaron, they
Speaker 1: go down to get they score, not in a million years.
Speaker 1: And I'm rooting for this Jets collapse because it's pretty fun.
Speaker 1: I never thought Jacoby perssecond lead him down the field
Speaker 1: and score a touchdown, even how bad the Jets defense
Speaker 1: has played the last couple of weeks since Robert Sli
Speaker 1: has left. That was that was jarring to watch that.
Speaker 1: And now I think we have to acknowledge their defense,
Speaker 1: which has been held to highest team, is just it's
Speaker 1: not only ever, it's just not good at all.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And this notion that like you can just have a
Speaker 1: team full of mercenaries, We've learned over the last five
Speaker 1: six years it doesn't even work in the NBA, which
Speaker 1: is much more individual meets team. It one hundred percent
Speaker 1: over the history of football, you can sign a big
Speaker 1: name guy who shows up in OTA's income, they're just
Speaker 1: The Reddick thing is a classic example of Drew Rosenhouse
Speaker 1: when they signed him, was quoted of saying, yeah, I
Speaker 1: just went right to the owner, like, how is that normal?
Speaker 1: You know, in a situation, so your GM is useless
Speaker 1: this guy, you basically give him all. And then I
Speaker 1: even saw to day He's like, yeah, it's pretty rusty.
Speaker 1: Of course he's rusty. I mean he showed up three
Speaker 1: days ago. I mean, this team is really an embarrassment
Speaker 1: to football, and it's something that Listen. I'm not trying
Speaker 1: to give myself credit or anyone that bet against him,
Speaker 1: but I didn't think it would be this bad obviously
Speaker 1: today is I mean, this is one of the lowest
Speaker 1: points for any high priced team of my lifetime. I mean,
Speaker 1: to be two and six Colin, well, right, you've played
Speaker 1: what you've played eight games, so you got nine games left.
Speaker 1: To get to nine games, you'd have to go seven
Speaker 1: and two down the stretch. This seems like they can't
Speaker 1: be the Patriots. They're not going seven and two. They'd
Speaker 1: be lucky to go like five and four.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and and and you know, as I watched that game,
Speaker 2: whereas I mean we both said this, I thought the
Speaker 2: Bears were a poorly coached s show. Today it's the
Speaker 2: Bears have talent. New England doesn't have much.
Speaker 4: I mean the Jets.
Speaker 2: The Jets have of the twenty two starters would probably
Speaker 2: have seventeen sixteen to seventeen starters of these two teams.
Speaker 1: Patriots were missing a bunch of guys today too. On
Speaker 1: the they were sure.
Speaker 4: So, I mean, it is hold on. I'm getting texts here.
Speaker 4: It's just as we do the podcast.
Speaker 2: I'm getting a text from a general manager in the
Speaker 2: league that says he cannot believe.
Speaker 4: What he saw with the Bears.
Speaker 1: It was great.
Speaker 2: He goes, oh, it's great. I wish I could share
Speaker 2: this with the audience. I'm getting a text in real
Speaker 2: time here on. I mean, everybody's going to talk about this.
Speaker 2: It was the worst code. Okay, let's let's stay on
Speaker 2: task here. So yeah, I think the question becomes does
Speaker 2: Aaron come back? Does Aaron say to himself, this isn't
Speaker 2: going to work. Aaron tends to get into his manifesting
Speaker 2: vision board, you know, the darns saying when he used that,
Speaker 2: you know, that optimistic kind of metaphor this week or word.
Speaker 2: I think he would come back. But if you're the Jets,
Speaker 2: you have to draft a quarterback. You have to draft
Speaker 2: the quarterback because the roster doesn't have a ton of eats.
Speaker 2: You have to go get a quarterback. And it's a
Speaker 2: bad quarterback class.
Speaker 1: You know. One thing with these YouTube TV four boxes,
Speaker 1: sometimes you have a game right above each other. And
Speaker 1: I had the Packer game right below the or above
Speaker 1: the Jets game. And Jordan loves who got hurt again.
Speaker 1: I mean, the guy's been pretty banged up this season.
Speaker 1: But what a job by Lafloor. But his mannerisms are
Speaker 1: just like a young prime Rogers. The way he moves,
Speaker 1: the way he just flings it and lets his arm go,
Speaker 1: and you're watching him just throw some of these balls,
Speaker 1: and he can be a little ratic with is such
Speaker 1: confidence to those guys, And then you look down and
Speaker 1: one thing I wrote down is Rogers used to throw
Speaker 1: with such confidence in the prime of his career, and
Speaker 1: then even those couple of years when he really got
Speaker 1: a roll to the floor. And you watch him now,
Speaker 1: like we have to acknowledge he no longer can move.
Speaker 1: He's getting peppered. Okay, he's forty years old coming off
Speaker 1: of Achilles, understandable. I feel like he just throws these
Speaker 1: lollipops like sometimes you see with Caleb, like he doesn't
Speaker 1: really know where it's going. Rogers never really played like that.
Speaker 1: It was either thrown it away or thrown a dart
Speaker 1: to a guy and hitting him in the hand. And
Speaker 1: now these balls go up into traffic like, well, I
Speaker 1: can't move to save this. I gotta get rid of it.
Speaker 1: Fuck it. Well, I mean what it's the Jets, I
Speaker 1: mean what, Yeah, it feels like he's as loosey goosey
Speaker 1: because you've been on him as much as by far
Speaker 1: anybody that talks about, you know, football, that he really
Speaker 1: is sneaky, like kind of hides from risk taking. It's
Speaker 1: not really his thing. And now it's like he just
Speaker 1: kind of lets it go all over the place. So
Speaker 1: they have gone all in on this player who is
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, if Pete Rogers was a ninety
Speaker 1: eight out of one hundred, the guy they're getting now
Speaker 1: is like seventy or something on good series. And he
Speaker 1: can look sometimes like a fifty and sometimes the ball
Speaker 1: just flies up. You're like, that could be a disaster.
Speaker 1: And that was never his thing, ever, his thing. So
Speaker 1: they got this player who is no longer good enough,
Speaker 1: like he's not a top ten quarterback in the end.
Speaker 4: No, God, no, no.
Speaker 1: But I'm saying, like when last year and even coming
Speaker 1: back into this year, it's like, hey, if we get
Speaker 1: a guy between like eight to twelve and be really good,
Speaker 1: like he's floating like he's I mean, look it is
Speaker 1: at all these really talent. I'm watching Josh Allenday like
Speaker 1: he's in a different y versus Aaron.
Speaker 2: Baker, Mayfield and Sam Darnold this moment.
Speaker 1: Are better than wagers for sure, much better, better player.
Speaker 1: I mean, all these guys are better players.
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Speaker 2: and Morgan is easy. Okay, I got to talk about this.
Speaker 2: Texans beat the Colts twenty three to twenty. It's not
Speaker 2: an overly sexy game. I have so many notes on
Speaker 2: this game. So Chris Ballard is built. It's a good roster.
Speaker 2: Just offensive players. Jonathan Taylor, Stud Pittman, Josh Downs, workable
Speaker 2: tight ends with Shane Steinken. He cannot get close to
Speaker 2: completing fifty percent of his throws. His judgment's horrific. He
Speaker 2: is totally big play reliant.
Speaker 4: I'm watching that game today. He left. I think it
Speaker 4: was the third quarter. I wrote it down.
Speaker 2: He left the game, he said afterwards, I was just tired,
Speaker 2: Like I'm sitting there watching this and they have players.
Speaker 2: This team had opportunities to beat the Texans. They have dudes.
Speaker 2: I know it's I mean, CJ. Stroud's going twenty five
Speaker 2: to thirty seven, three hundred yards dominates time of possession.
Speaker 2: The Colts can't sustain drives with Anthony Richardson. They were
Speaker 2: horrific on third John there are to I knew he
Speaker 2: was young coming in, but the bottom line.
Speaker 4: Is he is so far behind that.
Speaker 2: If you stay with it, maybe two to three years
Speaker 2: for Anthony Richardson to be able to go to the line,
Speaker 2: audible to third play scan the field.
Speaker 4: I watched him.
Speaker 2: He's a great athlete, jump he can You cannot win
Speaker 2: in this league. That's a bad division. You can't win
Speaker 2: in this league. They have players in indianappol like today.
Speaker 2: I watched the game, and with young quarterbacks, I always
Speaker 2: feel like, let's give him Thanksgiving of the second.
Speaker 4: Year unless he makes. Unless he makes.
Speaker 2: I mean, you watch Jaden Daniels and Caleb Williams, they're
Speaker 2: self awareness in these bone next today is chopping it up.
Speaker 2: This kid is not even in the stratosphere of those
Speaker 2: guys in self awareness pocket awareness. It was jawdropping how
Speaker 2: bad he was today.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he was two or thirteen in the first half
Speaker 1: and the only, I mean one of the passes was
Speaker 1: a blown coverage for a touchdown where the guy was
Speaker 1: wide open, and even when the ball left his hand,
Speaker 1: you're fifty to fifty in the air if it's gonna
Speaker 1: hit the guy. He's an horrendous football player, and let's
Speaker 1: face it, when he came back from injury, they chose,
Speaker 1: we have to see if this guy's gonna be good
Speaker 1: enough to let's development over making the playoffs. Joe Flacco
Speaker 1: plays out this season like they're gonna win nine ten
Speaker 1: games and be in the playoffs. They could barely beat
Speaker 1: Miami last week with Huntley and Tim Boyle, I mean
Speaker 1: barely won that game. And it's because of the quarterback
Speaker 1: Jonathan Taylor. Every time I looked up today, he looked
Speaker 1: like Walter Payton out there jukend guys breaking tackles.
Speaker 4: Nobody even here.
Speaker 1: First CJ Cowd NonStop.
Speaker 4: You can't bring down Jonathan Taylor on the first hit, can't.
Speaker 1: They were peppering CJ. Stroud today. So their defense, which
Speaker 1: you know, most people don't think is the most talented,
Speaker 1: and people are very critical. August Bradley was I think
Speaker 1: I read today hit him on like twenty nine or
Speaker 1: thirty something drop. I mean they were hitting him constantly,
Speaker 1: and they're right in the game and this guy just can't.
Speaker 1: You cannot function as an NFL quarterback. Like to be
Speaker 1: a great quarterback, you have to be able to do
Speaker 1: it all. But just to play quarterback, you have to
Speaker 1: be able to hit a wheel route, you have to
Speaker 1: be able to hit a quick out route, you have
Speaker 1: to be able to run the plays when they are working,
Speaker 1: and he cannot. And you get to a point where
Speaker 1: you know, for up until Josh Allen, most people thought
Speaker 1: it was impossible to improve accuracy. That's why most people
Speaker 1: wouldn't touch you if you were an inaccurate quarterback. Like really,
Speaker 1: one of the only examples in like NFL history is
Speaker 1: like Warren Moon, who got dramatically more accurate as he got,
Speaker 1: but he was an complete outlier. And then Josh Allen, like,
Speaker 1: I'm pro just in generle in life, take a big swing,
Speaker 1: totally understood Anthony Richardson. But there's a huge risk reward
Speaker 1: in that. Like this isn't like invested in the apple,
Speaker 1: Like this is invested in something that could go belly
Speaker 1: up or five hundred x. And right now you are
Speaker 1: staring bankruptcy in the face because you can't play. Obviously,
Speaker 1: the Texans are a playoff team. But you're you're playing
Speaker 1: shitty teams like Miami and getting by by the skin
Speaker 1: of your teeth because this guy can't complete basic routes.
Speaker 1: Everyone likes the high character guy works hard at the
Speaker 1: highest level of pro sports. It's like, well, there gets
Speaker 1: to a point where all that stuff, Okay, we're rooting for,
Speaker 1: but are you good enough? And he's not even remotely
Speaker 1: close to like average on basic things. Yea, the most
Speaker 1: inaccurate quarterback in the NFL.
Speaker 2: Oh, listen, it is t Bow just didn't have the
Speaker 2: arm strength or the mechanics. This kid's got arm strength plus.
Speaker 2: And you know the other thing that you have to
Speaker 2: think about. Remember when the Niners moved off.
Speaker 1: Tree, what do you do, Colin? I mean they drafted
Speaker 1: them fourth overall. Yeah, betjum and just go to Flacco
Speaker 1: and try to win games. I want to make the playoffs.
Speaker 1: That's what you have to do.
Speaker 2: Yes, I would, and they can go in a six
Speaker 2: game winning streak with Flacco. There's no question they have players.
Speaker 1: They would have won to day probably.
Speaker 2: But it's when when Kyle Shanahan moved off Trey Lance,
Speaker 2: You're like, wow, Kyle made Matt shab a pro bowler.
Speaker 4: So if Kyle gives up on you, you.
Speaker 2: Don't give up a fourth round pick for Trey Lance
Speaker 2: unless you're the Cowboys. When Shane Steichen and these weapons,
Speaker 2: I mean two of thirteen, these are the scripted plays
Speaker 2: with one of the smartest coaches in the league in
Speaker 2: Shane Steichen, who we saw him with a rookie Justin Herbert.
Speaker 2: We saw him make Jalen Hurtz, who has regressed into
Speaker 2: an m VP level player. So I think you just
Speaker 2: have to say, listen, we're just gonna go. We're just
Speaker 2: gonna roll with Flacco and go. Because I wouldn't be
Speaker 2: shocked if Flacco won five out of six games, I
Speaker 2: wouldn't be shocked. I like the Colts weapons, downs, Pittman, Taylor.
Speaker 2: I like their players.
Speaker 1: Well up until probably five or six years ago, a
Speaker 1: guy like Anthony Richardson, based on his small, small collegiate
Speaker 1: history and inaccuracies, would not have sniffed the first round.
Speaker 1: I mean, we entered this quarterback inflation post mahomes in
Speaker 1: Josh Allen, where everyone thinks like those guys are both
Speaker 1: like once in a generation players. Yeah, if I'm never
Speaker 1: been a big believer in you know, and I think
Speaker 1: we saw like the Kenny Picketts and Mac Jones versions
Speaker 1: are the worst case, Like they don't even have the
Speaker 1: physical skills and they're clearly not good enough the physical skills.
Speaker 1: I mean, he says, I was exhausted. Well, no shit,
Speaker 1: they have to run you because they can't pass because
Speaker 1: when they passed, they got a punt. And I think
Speaker 1: we all acknowledge, like this guy's a really good coach
Speaker 1: and he's proven it now with countless different type quarterbacks.
Speaker 1: Like this is not a coaching thing, this is a
Speaker 1: basic Like some guys in basketball just can't shoot. They
Speaker 1: get with every coach under the sun, and that's ever
Speaker 1: gonna be able to shoot. Yeah, he could the best
Speaker 1: shooting coach in the history of the league. Nothing would change.
Speaker 1: And I think that's the more you watch this kid play,
Speaker 1: You're like he would be inaccurate for the next ten years.
Speaker 1: But how much longer is he going to get to play?
Speaker 1: Because you could pull the trigger right now and go
Speaker 1: to Flacco Monday morning and just say, hey, we're gonna
Speaker 1: we're gonna give you a breather, buddy.
Speaker 2: I mean, listen, Cam New, we struggle struggled with mechanics
Speaker 2: in accuracy, but Cam would have Cam would have a
Speaker 2: twenty three of thirty three game. I mean Cam's when
Speaker 2: Cam cleaned his mechanics up and threw off his back
Speaker 2: foot because he could get a little sloppy Cam. Cam
Speaker 2: had beautiful, a beautiful looking posture mechanics.
Speaker 4: He got loose.
Speaker 2: Hell Stafford can get loose, Mahomes gets loose. But it
Speaker 2: was always within Cam to be a.
Speaker 4: Beautiful thrower the football.
Speaker 2: Like with Anthony, it's just again the layups he misses badly.
Speaker 1: Yeah to me, Cam, when you look at that Auburn season,
Speaker 1: even though it was only one year, like kind of
Speaker 1: knows how to win. Yeah, Like he just knew how
Speaker 1: to get shit done. And then over a course of
Speaker 1: a couple of years, once the team in Carolina got better,
Speaker 1: they were just obviously they were up and down because
Speaker 1: he was a roller coaster ride. But when he was
Speaker 1: on it was clear like this is a top five quarterback.
Speaker 1: Then he could turn into like the thirteenth best. He
Speaker 1: was all over the map, but his high end, like
Speaker 1: you don't even really see that with the Anthony Rigson.
Speaker 1: Beside one give and throw, the other thing is Cam
Speaker 1: was a way more dominant runner I mean, Cam's the
Speaker 1: most physical runner in the history of the NFL. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean he was just bigger and stronger and played
Speaker 1: more powerful and he didn't break down early. I mean,
Speaker 1: this guy, every time he goes down, You're like, is
Speaker 1: he gonna get back up? Like right now, Bryce Young
Speaker 1: is obviously has a chance to be a historic bust.
Speaker 1: He's probably not going to be on the Panthers next year.
Speaker 1: I don't know if this guy is that far away.
Speaker 1: He's just bigger, stronger, faster, right, I mean they're they're
Speaker 1: kind of similar, Like, what the hell's the difference of
Speaker 1: the two. Well, one guy plays actually in a better organization,
Speaker 1: one that when other functional quarterbacks come into play Minshew
Speaker 1: and Flacco, they win. Yeah, so you could argue that
Speaker 1: there's really he's just bigger. He's a bigger, stronger, throws
Speaker 1: harder version of Bryce Young.
Speaker 2: I thought Philadelphia Eagles thirty seven, Bengals seventeen. I was
Speaker 2: on the wrong side of this one. Bengals had no
Speaker 2: run game, and first of all, I thought this was
Speaker 2: about as important a Philadelphia win the way they won
Speaker 2: no turnovers. Saquon ran fifty percent on third down seven
Speaker 2: yards of play, nearly hurts again ten rushes, sixteen to
Speaker 2: twenty touchdown, no mistakes. This was a game very easily
Speaker 2: against Burrow. Burrow's a very good first quarter quarterback. Eagles
Speaker 2: are not a good first quarter offense. This is a
Speaker 2: game he could have gotten behind and it could have unraveled.
Speaker 2: But as I watched this game, I had two big takeaways. Philadelphia,
Speaker 2: it feels like, to me, John, you're a former scout
Speaker 2: for the team and you have good context there. It
Speaker 2: feels like they're asking Jalen to do less in the
Speaker 2: passing game. They've just come to terms with We're not
Speaker 2: throwing at thirty eight times. That's not what we're gonna be.
Speaker 2: We're not gonna do that, and that's fine.
Speaker 4: I think. I think the.
Speaker 2: Houston Texans sometimes without Nico Collins, kind of feel like
Speaker 2: we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna box in what we
Speaker 2: can do offensively.
Speaker 4: Let's not put our young quarterback at risk. That was
Speaker 4: my first take. My second take is.
Speaker 2: We've always both of us have felt like Herbert doesn't
Speaker 2: have the support he deserves. But Herbert, now they've paid
Speaker 2: for Khalil Mack. I mean, they they've paid for Jim Harbaugh.
Speaker 2: They've paid Herbert, They're gonna pay Rashawn Slater. They paid Keenan,
Speaker 2: they paid my Mike Williams. The Chargers have spent money
Speaker 2: for Justin Herbert. He's had some bad breaks. But we
Speaker 2: can't call the Chargers cheap anymore. Sinnati team they let
Speaker 2: go of mixing, which, by the way, even even very
Speaker 2: good quarterbacks need run games, right like even the good
Speaker 2: ones need run games. They've already moved off defensive players
Speaker 2: a year before they're gonna pay pay Jamar Chase.
Speaker 1: And I just on the team next year. Yep.
Speaker 2: And I watched Cincinnati and I thought, you know, we
Speaker 2: can say what we want about the Chargers, but they
Speaker 2: have damn good players. They moved off Keenan and Mike
Speaker 2: Williams because they were older receivers that couldn't stay healthy consistently.
Speaker 2: They kept Mosa, they kept Khalil Matt Those are expensive players.
Speaker 2: They paid Herbert, They're gonna pay Slater, they paid Hardbaugh.
Speaker 2: I feel bad for Joe Burrow. I think the Bengals
Speaker 2: are what the Charger's reputation was like.
Speaker 4: They won't spend the money.
Speaker 2: Joe Burrow has. You take Burrow and Chase and that
Speaker 2: pass rusher off his team, John. They don't have a
Speaker 2: lot of players in Cincinnati. They don't have a lot
Speaker 2: of dudes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I would say this if they fired
Speaker 1: their coach tomorrow or at the end of the season.
Speaker 1: He's not getting rehired. So they have a coach that
Speaker 1: no one else would want if we just play that
Speaker 1: game with most good teams, right, the Eagles have such
Speaker 1: a good roster because you would say they fire Sirianni,
Speaker 1: no one's hiring them.
Speaker 4: That's true.
Speaker 1: But like I do think their coach. Once you have
Speaker 1: less talent, you have to lean on them a little more.
Speaker 1: Like why are the Chargers gonna end up winning ten
Speaker 1: or eleven games? Star quarterback, star coach. Yeah, it's not
Speaker 1: because they have a roster like they have. I would
Speaker 1: say for a lot of the last twenty years. Joe
Speaker 1: did miss the throw a little bit short today that
Speaker 1: led to the interception and this snowball right then they
Speaker 1: got a touchdown, then they fumbled the kick off and
Speaker 1: it just snowballs and the Eagles ate them alive. To me,
Speaker 1: there was a talent gap today overall on the team.
Speaker 1: Oh god, yeah, pretty clear. I do think the Eagles,
Speaker 1: and this gets ties into the Giants, who will see
Speaker 1: Monday Night, Saquan's elevated their team. He's clearly one of
Speaker 1: the best players in the league. Jalen throws as pretty
Speaker 1: I would say, wouldn't you say Jalen is like the
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen version of Russell Wilson in terms of that
Speaker 1: deep ball in the air. You think it's going to
Speaker 1: be completed to one of those two guys.
Speaker 2: No, and we've come to realize there are limitations to
Speaker 2: Russell Wilson, and once he loses sort of the magical elusiveness,
Speaker 2: you get what you can get out of Russell. I
Speaker 2: think we elevated because of Steichen. We elevated Jalen hurts
Speaker 2: to a level that's unfair. He was a second round pick.
Speaker 2: He's not a great pocket thrower. I think he throws
Speaker 2: a pretty deep ball. I think the Russell Wilson cops
Speaker 2: very accurate. One's a second round pick, one's a third
Speaker 2: round pick. And I think I think Philadelphia, it's easy
Speaker 2: to fall in love with a player because he was
Speaker 2: so damn good with steiking. But since he's left and
Speaker 2: this is your reality, you know, today was the classic
Speaker 2: sixteen to twenty some runs. I think they just kept
Speaker 2: the game in front of Jalen Hurts.
Speaker 1: He's definitely running it a little bit more, and he
Speaker 1: is a fan. To me, he's a better runner because
Speaker 1: of his power than even Pek Russell, who was a
Speaker 1: really good runner as well. I mean, he's got to
Speaker 1: be one of the more powerful running quarterbacks we've ever seen.
Speaker 1: He turns into a running back. And then once you
Speaker 1: get to the goal line, I mean, we've never seen
Speaker 1: a playlight. I've been watching football for thirty plus years.
Speaker 1: I mean, they get to the one or two yard line,
Speaker 1: it's like an automatic touchdown. There's nothing you can do.
Speaker 1: When have we ever seen that? Even if you stop
Speaker 1: it once, they go right back to it and then
Speaker 1: they score. Yeah. I mean they've had some injuries on
Speaker 1: the offensive line, so he was running around a little bit.
Speaker 1: But do I totally trust their defense, not but their talent.
Speaker 1: I mean, you get aj Brown, DeVante Saquan him, you'll
Speaker 1: end up getting god her back. Like how many Lions
Speaker 1: and the fully healthy forty nine ers. I mean there's
Speaker 1: a short list. I watched the Chiefs, like, do they
Speaker 1: have one guy that would start on that team beside
Speaker 1: like of their skill guys, you know, even Travis Kelsey
Speaker 1: when he's now thirty five. If god HER's healthy, so
Speaker 1: you're just it is a special and Saquon clearly has
Speaker 1: this chip of proving himself and he's healthy. I mean
Speaker 1: he today he ran a guy over you get him
Speaker 1: in the open field. They've had good you know, the
Speaker 1: DeAndre Swift used to be their running back. They've had
Speaker 1: Miles Sanders in the past, They've never had anything like this.
Speaker 1: This feels a little bit like remember when Jalen was
Speaker 1: at Oklahoma with Lincoln Riley. It's like, this feels like
Speaker 1: a collegiate offense. And the one thing that I think
Speaker 1: slows him down sometimes the coaching staff can kind of
Speaker 1: get a little tricky, and Jalen, you know, sometimes wants
Speaker 1: to prove he can be a pocket guy and get
Speaker 1: himself in a little bit trouble. But I thought that
Speaker 1: second half, that's the best half of football the Eagles
Speaker 1: have played. It feels like in two years. No.
Speaker 2: I literally sat there and I want my takeaway was,
Speaker 2: if you took the best twenty two players in this game,
Speaker 2: Philly's got seventeen to eighteen of those twenty two players
Speaker 2: like the talent gap. But again, Philadelphia spends money. Jeffrey Lurie,
Speaker 2: he'll spend money on anything, weight room, everything. I mean,
Speaker 2: Cincinnati doesn't have an outdoor practice facility. Still, they're the
Speaker 2: only Northern team that doesn't.
Speaker 1: You know what I wonder is like, let's say the bit.
Speaker 1: You know, the Bengals end up six or seven wins, right,
Speaker 1: obviously they're in a tough spot. Now they fired the coach,
Speaker 1: Like what peers he fishing off to go get his
Speaker 1: head coach? Historically it's Taylor's There weren't a lot of
Speaker 1: people lined up for him, and he's cheap, like he's
Speaker 1: not talking to the very bulls, to the Belichicks, to
Speaker 1: you know, the big name guys. That's just not where
Speaker 1: they're gonna go. So when you sign up, this goes
Speaker 1: back to Carson Palmer, like this organization, Like a lot
Speaker 1: of the complaints haven't just been entitled athletes bitching and moaning.
Speaker 1: This is this is, this shouldn't be this way, And
Speaker 1: you have to wonder, like what hell it took Dean Spanos,
Speaker 1: who's down in LA around the Dodgers and Lakers a
Speaker 1: long time to go Okay, I need a fifteen million
Speaker 1: dollar coach yep. And he wants to bring his three
Speaker 1: four million dollar defensive coordinator. We'll do that too. It's
Speaker 1: gonna be the best thing he's ever done, because I mean, eventually,
Speaker 1: if they I trust, they'll build the thing up, they'll
Speaker 1: they they'll be in a super Bowl in three years. Yep.
Speaker 1: And they would not have been hiring these four or
Speaker 1: five million dollar coaches. And I listen, you can't tell
Speaker 1: me would Joe. I thought for most of the game
Speaker 1: like I was like, God, Joe looks good, and people
Speaker 1: wouldn't be lined up. But they're also not taking the
Speaker 1: job for six million dollars. That's right, you're telling me
Speaker 1: Belichick wouldn't be interested in coaching Joe Burrow. I don't
Speaker 1: think he would be. I jut if the organization paid
Speaker 1: and they would listen to him. But they're not gonna change.
Speaker 2: I mean, they kept Marvin Lewis forever. I don't think
Speaker 2: they'll fire Zach Taylor because the Brown family won't pay
Speaker 2: a dead cap coach money.
Speaker 4: They won't pay it.
Speaker 2: They just refuse to pay it. It's time for this
Speaker 2: week's player. I thought might give almost almost anything to
Speaker 2: redo his game. Brought to you by Uber Eats, Anthony
Speaker 2: Richardson disaster ten for thirty two in a loss to
Speaker 2: the Texans. A pick a fumble left the game.
Speaker 4: At one point.
Speaker 2: He said he was tired. Every game this season, Richardson
Speaker 2: has failed to complete fifty percent.
Speaker 4: Of his throws. That was this week's Uber eats Player.
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Speaker 2: And I want to PI to this game Denver twenty eight,
Speaker 2: Carolina fourteen. Denver's now five and three. So here's a
Speaker 2: prime example of coaching. One team has Joe Burrow, Jamar Chase,
Speaker 2: elite pass rusher. One team has bon Nicks, Courtland Sutton
Speaker 2: and no elite pass rushers. Now Patrick's certain, Patrick Sartan.
Speaker 2: I wrote this down today. He may be a top
Speaker 2: ten defensive player in the league. He is just absolutely
Speaker 2: phenomenal good. But this is what coaching does. With Sean
Speaker 2: Payton Boone Nicks today who in his last game, I
Speaker 2: text Sean, I said, man, his mechanics are off. Sean's like, hey,
Speaker 2: the kid's great. We're gonna get it. Cleaned up three touchdowns,
Speaker 2: no picks, two hundred eighty yards, nine different wide receivers,
Speaker 2: tight end targets, only one penalty. When I was watching
Speaker 2: the game, there may have been more, but when I
Speaker 2: wrote it down, only one penalty. They were tremendous on
Speaker 2: third down. No Carolina, I get it. Denver was picked
Speaker 2: to win five games by Vegas. They're at five and
Speaker 2: three halfway through the season. They are coaching the you
Speaker 2: know what out of this team, John, This is the
Speaker 2: defensive personnel. Remember, because of Russell Wilson, they didn't have
Speaker 2: any draft picks. They got the LS kid out of Utah.
Speaker 2: I think third round. They got Franklin, the wide receiver
Speaker 2: who dropped the ball right through his hands today, a
Speaker 2: deep ball. And I don't even think bo Nix would
Speaker 2: be this good, and he struggled in the first month,
Speaker 2: but I watched him today backfoot confidence this. If you
Speaker 2: think we're being hard on Zach Taylor, Denver is squeezing
Speaker 2: every ounce of juice. You tell me how they're generating
Speaker 2: this pass rush. You tell me how bo Nix is
Speaker 2: thrown for three hundred yards behind kind of an okay
Speaker 2: offensive line. I watched Denver and I think that is coaching.
Speaker 4: That is coaching. That's what I see.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I totally agree. I mean I don't
Speaker 1: think Denver's roster is very good. I also think I
Speaker 1: think Vance Joseph last year when they scored what Miami
Speaker 1: scored seventy on him, Yeah, and Sean Payton stuck with him,
Speaker 1: and by the end of the season they were playing
Speaker 1: good defense. Their defense. Like you said, beside the corner,
Speaker 1: you have to google some of the guys the team. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this is not Neil Smith and Bill Romanowski that You're like, oh,
Speaker 1: these I don't even know who these guys are, and
Speaker 1: now we're gonna find out a lot more about him.
Speaker 1: On Thursday night playing that New Orleans team a week ago,
Speaker 1: I mean, that was kind of a joke squad. And
Speaker 1: I didn't eve think bo Nix was that good in
Speaker 1: that game. The Ravens and the Chiefs coming up. But hell,
Speaker 1: they don't have to win those games. If you get
Speaker 1: to nine to eight with this roster and a rookie quarterback,
Speaker 1: what a great building spot. Now, this is the thing
Speaker 1: with hiring good coaches, Like look at Lafloor. He's six
Speaker 1: and two at a starting quarterback in and out of
Speaker 1: the lineup, completely unfaced. You're gonna look up. I don't
Speaker 1: know how many games Jordan Love who knows how long
Speaker 1: he's out. They're gonna be an eleven twelve win team
Speaker 1: no matter what. The power of that position in this
Speaker 1: sport flies by everything else. Is it Aaron Boone's fault
Speaker 1: that Aaron Judge has no clue what's coming out of
Speaker 1: the pitcher's hand. There's nothing he can do right where
Speaker 1: in coaching you watch in college last night, Texas A
Speaker 1: and M has been one of the biggest jokes in
Speaker 1: college football the last couple of years, and you watch
Speaker 1: them now, you're like, Holy hell, this looks like Alabama
Speaker 1: or something. And it's because it's not even just about
Speaker 1: the play calling. It's about the messaging. It's about the structure,
Speaker 1: it's about the discipline. It's about basic things like you know,
Speaker 1: how you practice the first ten minutes of warm ups,
Speaker 1: what is okay and what is not okay? If you
Speaker 1: come out with the wrong stuff, do I make you
Speaker 1: go back in and change or do I let it slide?
Speaker 1: And I think you just see the separating you see.
Speaker 1: The Jets are a good example. They got no clue
Speaker 1: what they're doing. It's one of the worst coaching staffs
Speaker 1: in the league.
Speaker 4: It is the staff.
Speaker 1: And then you look. I think Denver and the Chargers
Speaker 1: are very, very good examples. They have no business. You
Speaker 1: could say the Chargers a little bit because they do
Speaker 1: have a good quarterback, you know, an experienced quarterback to
Speaker 1: win ten games with their roster. If I give half
Speaker 1: the coaches in the NFL, those teams, they don't sniff
Speaker 1: ten wins, right, But I give Jim Harbaugh and Sean Payton,
Speaker 1: and what do they make a combined thirty five million dollars?
Speaker 1: They make it for a reason because you're gonna feel
Speaker 1: pretty good about them winning double digit games every year
Speaker 1: going forward. And the other thing that we don't talk
Speaker 1: a lot about with coaches, who do you hire your staff?
Speaker 1: It's one of the Harboff families great attributes. I would
Speaker 1: say Sean Payton for the most part, has always had
Speaker 1: good coaching staffs. Yes, Dan Campbell was assistant. Dennis Holland's
Speaker 1: not a good head coach, but he's an excellent defensive coordinator,
Speaker 1: so he had a staff. And now, listen, I was
Speaker 1: skeptical of Vance Joseph. You gotta give him a lot
Speaker 1: of credit. Like their defense is flying around. So that's
Speaker 1: your job is more than just calling plays or the draft,
Speaker 1: like it encompasses a lot.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they're the other thing. This is one of
Speaker 2: the things Sean mcvaye does so well. You are you're
Speaker 2: often asking yourself, how did Cooper Cup and Cooka Nakua
Speaker 2: get so open? Well that scheme. I mean, it's like
Speaker 2: in the Super Bowl and Andy Reid has sky More
Speaker 2: in the red zone wide open. You're like, there's only
Speaker 2: so much space. How is sky More not covered at
Speaker 2: the twelve? I'm watching Denver and there were multiple times
Speaker 2: today You're like, now again it's Carolina. But I'm seeing
Speaker 2: this time and time again when they beat the Jets,
Speaker 2: we thought it was a fluke. No, Denver is better
Speaker 2: with Bo Nicks. They're a better football team than the
Speaker 2: Jets with Aaron Rodgers, and the Jets have significantly better
Speaker 2: players overall.
Speaker 4: No, not even close.
Speaker 2: And so I'm just watching Denver today and I'm like,
Speaker 2: this is like and I've text Peyton a couple of times, like,
Speaker 2: this is what a well coached team looks like. They
Speaker 2: should have beaten Carolina badly. They did they should have
Speaker 2: beaten New Orleans badly. They did, but they're also winning
Speaker 2: this That Jets game you look at and you think, God,
Speaker 2: it was terrible weather. Bow Knicks had no There's no
Speaker 2: reason in the world Bo Nicks goes and plays cross
Speaker 2: country if I recall, their travel was bad and beats
Speaker 2: Aaron Rodgers in a like a semi tropical storm. Peyton
Speaker 2: won't get Coach of the Year, but he should be
Speaker 2: honorable mention because I think what he's doing with this
Speaker 2: roster is incredible.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think you just see so many examples of
Speaker 1: guys that like as sometimes they might inherit some talent
Speaker 1: and then as time goes on. I think Mike McDaniel
Speaker 1: is a good example. Listen, he's got a lot of
Speaker 1: friends in the media. I think I don't know him personally,
Speaker 1: but I just think his teams have been one of
Speaker 1: the most overrated squads over the last couple of years.
Speaker 1: And now you watch him today lose to Arizona. They're soft,
Speaker 1: I mean, and they really have been down the stretch
Speaker 1: of the last last year when they should have cruised
Speaker 1: to that division championship right in the AFCs. Then you
Speaker 1: watch them this year I'm not blaming them for poor
Speaker 1: offense when TWA gets the concussion, but the whole team
Speaker 1: just falls apart. And then you get him back and
Speaker 1: they look dramatically better. Like Mike McDaniel like, yeah, you
Speaker 1: can scheme up some good plays, but can he be
Speaker 1: a good head coach, And to me, the answer is no,
Speaker 1: and they're gonna be terrible. And then you look around
Speaker 1: the league at some of these other guys, like like Demiko,
Speaker 1: he's got injuries, he's got all sorts of shit going,
Speaker 1: his quarterback's not playing well. And then you just look
Speaker 1: up there's like, yeah, they're gonna be like twelve five
Speaker 1: like you just some guys just really know what they're doing.
Speaker 1: And because like when times get tough, Tom Win's a
Speaker 1: good example of this, the standard in which you make
Speaker 1: guys practice every day has to be really fit. It's
Speaker 1: really easy now to just another walk through. You don't
Speaker 1: need to do pads today, Like that's just not allowed
Speaker 1: certain places. And then that translates to these games, because
Speaker 1: eighty percent of the games you play in the NFL
Speaker 1: are gonna be pretty tightly contested in the second half.
Speaker 1: This is not college football where you look up and
Speaker 1: it's thirty to ten in half the games. That's not
Speaker 1: the way the NFL works.
Speaker 4: And even the morning.
Speaker 1: You look at the slate this morning when I when
Speaker 1: I turn on the TV, he's at ten o'clock. I'm like,
Speaker 1: it's a shitty slate. Halfway through it's like, ah, that's
Speaker 1: pretty entertaining.
Speaker 4: Okay, great stuff.
Speaker 2: John Middlecoff, former NFL scout three and out. I'll tell
Speaker 2: you the Chicago Bears, there is gonna be stories written
Speaker 2: for the next two weeks on that coaching mess. Yes,
Speaker 2: you say they should have won. I say, I can't
Speaker 2: believe it was that. I've never been happier. I root
Speaker 2: for better coaching. Chicago's coaching was a disaster today. Go
Speaker 2: back and listen to the first ten to fifteen minutes
Speaker 2: of this podcast and check that out.
Speaker 4: John, we'll talk soon.
Speaker 1: You see the ratings on the old Yankees Dodgers. There's
Speaker 1: like fourteen million people watching these games.
Speaker 2: Sixteen and a half million watched Game two, the last
Speaker 2: two or three innings, sixteen and a half.
Speaker 4: Let's talk about that for a second. So for years.
Speaker 2: People have said to me, I would say, about twelve
Speaker 2: years ago, I just stopped baseball. I just said I'll
Speaker 2: talk about it in October. And a lot of that
Speaker 2: was I was getting more and more information from ESPN
Speaker 2: and Fox on minute to minute ratings and cable you
Speaker 2: can get minute to minute ratings, and what you were
Speaker 2: finding out is that. And I've just poured over these
Speaker 2: ratings every day for years and years. This is what
Speaker 2: you found out. The audience rewards you when you talk
Speaker 2: two things, urgency, the games have to matter and stars. Well,
Speaker 2: there's no urgency in baseball until October, like none, and
Speaker 2: the sport doesn't have a bunch of stars. And then
Speaker 2: Otani goes to the Dodgers, Aaron Judge, Yankees start, you know,
Speaker 2: get to the World Series and Mookie Betts and Bryce Harper.
Speaker 2: Now you got about four guys who you can just
Speaker 2: put on the screen and people go, oh, that's Mookie Betts,
Speaker 2: Oh that's show. Heyo, Tani, I'm watching that game. I
Speaker 2: don't remember a world I grew up with the Reds
Speaker 2: Red Sox in nineteen seventy six, Bench Rose, Morgan, Perez,
Speaker 2: Carlton Fisk, you know, like like like you go back.
Speaker 2: I can remember the names now. Yeah, but I'm looking
Speaker 2: at that game and I'm thinking Jesus, there's seven Hall
Speaker 2: of Famers here. Now Judge is having a terrible World Series.
Speaker 2: And I had said before the series, I think shoe
Speaker 2: Hey is the best player in the series. I think
Speaker 2: Mookie Betts is actually the second best player. Is versatility, shortstop,
Speaker 2: second base, outfielder, speed, average power. But it proves once again,
Speaker 2: the consumer is always right. The consumer was telling you
Speaker 2: for years, we're just not that interested in Alabama. Georgia
Speaker 2: college football dipped for about a six year eight year stretch.
Speaker 2: It got too regional. The audience said, we're fatigued with
Speaker 2: Alabama Clemson. Now college football ratings are going up. Alabama
Speaker 2: doesn't dominate. George's not quite as good. Here comes Texas,
Speaker 2: Here comes Ohio State, Here comes Oregon. The audience tells
Speaker 2: you what to do as a talk show host. And
Speaker 2: I watched the National League Playoffs the Dodgers Padres, and
Speaker 2: I'm like, there's like, there's like eight great players here, Dodgers.
Speaker 1: Metts, Phillies, Mett's Phillies great.
Speaker 2: And it's like, so sixteen and a half million people,
Speaker 2: that's that'll beat some NFL games. And it's like, yes,
Speaker 2: we'll talk baseball. You have to give US urgency. I've
Speaker 2: argued for years, I'd cut the I'd cut out April in.
Speaker 4: Half a May.
Speaker 2: I'd have one hundred and twenty games. I'd get rid
Speaker 2: of forty. I'd start the playoffs August eighth, and by
Speaker 2: Labor Day you'd be heading to the World Series, playing
Speaker 2: in the same weather you did for the entire series,
Speaker 2: instead of night game in October November. So I just
Speaker 2: think the series has been you can't take your eyes
Speaker 2: off it.
Speaker 1: No, it's it's riveting theater, I do think, And it
Speaker 1: really hit me last night watching Judge, who looks like
Speaker 1: you know me, and Little League or something. Right now,
Speaker 1: it's the only sport where the you know, the guy
Speaker 1: that has the best season, you could argue the best
Speaker 1: player in the American League this year, he's gonna win
Speaker 1: the MVP. Can you know even Russell Westbrook or Lamar Jackson,
Speaker 1: guys that have had bad playoffs, They have bad games,
Speaker 1: but they are not completely useless. When you can't hit
Speaker 1: like that, I mean he could barely make content. You're
Speaker 1: just useless. Remember a Rod had some moments when he
Speaker 1: was on the Yankees. When he got there, You're like, ah,
Speaker 1: they're gonna move him down in the lineup. You're just
Speaker 1: you're just worthless. And to me that's even more riveting.
Speaker 1: It's like, is this guy gonna get it? Can this
Speaker 1: guy even get back to the ball? And to me
Speaker 1: that I just think we've obviously haven't seen this matchup
Speaker 1: since when like nineteen eighty one, So it's part of it.
Speaker 1: You know, you said the Alabama Georgia thing, you felt
Speaker 1: if we got Dodgers Yankee seven years in a row,
Speaker 1: wouldn't quite feel as cool.
Speaker 2: That's right.
Speaker 1: We've been We've been feels like we've been waiting for
Speaker 1: this thing for a decade because both these two teams
Speaker 1: have been so good. I think Yankees are in trouble.
Speaker 1: I mean clearly. I mean they've lost some nozety there.
Speaker 1: Guys can't run. That's the thing with the Dodgers. I mean,
Speaker 1: Showyotani's six foot five, he runs like he's justin Jefferson. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Mookie Betts is an NFL athlete. Stam can't run, but
Speaker 1: he hits home runs. But if he's not hitting on
Speaker 1: runs and just didn't they got no shot?
Speaker 4: Well, I mean Tommy Edmond, who's that guy?
Speaker 1: He's incredible. Where do they find that guy.
Speaker 2: He was the National League MVP. In Game one he
Speaker 2: hit eighth. I mean people talk about the Big Red
Speaker 2: Machine was the greatest offense in seventy five, but by
Speaker 2: the time he got to, like the seventh in the
Speaker 2: batting order, it was Dave Concepcion. And says our Geronimo,
Speaker 2: I mean, you have the last three guys couldn't hit.
Speaker 2: When you have guys like I mean, like Will Smith
Speaker 2: and Tommy Edmund, he's like, these guys are on fire.
Speaker 2: They run, they can hit for power. That the Dodgers lineup.
Speaker 2: I mean, it was really interesting in Game one when
Speaker 2: Aaron Boone and I thought to him myself, this is
Speaker 2: gonna be a bullpen series, especially for the Dodgers.
Speaker 4: It's gonna be a bullpen series. So you know, keep.
Speaker 2: Yamamoto in or a Flaherty as long as you can
Speaker 2: because you're gonna You're gonna just test your bullpen. Dodgers,
Speaker 2: don't cross your fingers on Walker. Bueller gives you five innings.
Speaker 2: But the Yankees they have better starting pitching, you could argue.
Speaker 2: And when Aaron Boone pulled Garrett Cole after eighty eight pitches,
Speaker 2: I'm like, Aaron, you have like seven elite hitters in
Speaker 2: this lineup. If you have to go to a second
Speaker 2: and a third bullpen guy, you're in big trouble until
Speaker 2: you face the Dodgers lineup. It's I mean you and I.
Speaker 2: I watch it because it's in the summer. I just
Speaker 2: keep baseball games are on in the house. The Dodgers
Speaker 2: have had forty different pitchers and they're in the World Series.
Speaker 2: What does that tell you about their lineup? Forty different pitchers.
Speaker 1: I know that Bruce Bochi wouldn't need his third stint
Speaker 1: before he pulled out wear a cole in that moment,
Speaker 1: and he's the best postseason manager of the last twenty
Speaker 1: five years. That that's I get that. You know, the
Speaker 1: front office that's insane, that really is, And that to
Speaker 1: me is the deterioration of baseball. Like when I was
Speaker 1: a kid in the nineties, base ball is huge. Their
Speaker 1: star players weren't just Kann Griffey and Barry Bonds. They
Speaker 1: were the pitchers. Yes, you know, because those guys on
Speaker 1: any given moment could go one hundred and thirty pitches
Speaker 1: complete game and he had eighty eight. It's not like
Speaker 1: it's one thing. It's like, well, we didn't want to
Speaker 1: push him past one ten eighty eight pitches and he
Speaker 1: was mowing people down, mowing that That's that's insane. Even
Speaker 1: last night with Otani's buddy from Japan, what they pull
Speaker 1: him with like eighty five, Like what are we doing here?
Speaker 1: What's this is the World Series? This isn't this isn't August.
Speaker 1: But well, that's the sport.
Speaker 2: And I would argue, at least with the Yankees, Judge
Speaker 2: isn't hitting, and the in the middle, the back part
Speaker 2: of their lineup isn't as scary.
Speaker 1: No, they're in trouble.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jazz Chisholm's not hitting. So but you you look
Speaker 2: down to the Dodgers and you get into I mean
Speaker 2: Max Munsey got on base twelve straight times. I said,
Speaker 2: you don't see that in Williamsport twelve straight times in
Speaker 2: the playoffs.
Speaker 1: I mean, I grew up in northern California. I hate
Speaker 1: the Dodgers and the Lakers, and right now Anthony Davis
Speaker 1: looks like wil Chamberlain and the Dodgers looking like they're
Speaker 1: about to sweep the Yankees. This is my worst nightmare.
Speaker 4: John Middlecoff, great stuff, Bud, see if.
Speaker 1: The volume.
Speaker 2: Thanks so much for listening. If you've enjoyed the podcast,
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