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Speaker 1: Pushkin.

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Speaker 2: It's always about the music. Music is everything to me.

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Speaker 2: Music is the food I eat, it's the blood in

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Speaker 2: my veins. Without music, I'm not here. I'm actually not here.

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Speaker 1: When world renowned musician Nin Kim first picked up a violin,

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Speaker 1: she knew immediately that it would define her, and it

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Speaker 1: did until one day in a London train station, everything changed.

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Speaker 2: I didn't know if I was ever going to play

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Speaker 2: the violin again. I didn't know if I could ever

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Speaker 2: listen to music again. I didn't listen to music, even

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Speaker 2: if it was the most healing music. I just couldn't

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Speaker 2: process it. And in that my life as I knew

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Speaker 2: it ended.

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Speaker 1: On today's episode, a different kind of identity theft, I'm

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Speaker 1: Maya Shunker and this is a slight change of plans,

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Speaker 1: a show about who we are and who we become

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Speaker 1: in the face of a big change. I felt an

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Speaker 1: immediate and close connection to me and Kim the first

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Speaker 1: time I heard her story. We both began playing the

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Speaker 1: violin at a young age, and it quickly became the

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Speaker 1: center of our identities. And then we both experienced a

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Speaker 1: plot twist. Many of you know what happened in my

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Speaker 1: musical career when I was fifteen, an injury to my

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Speaker 1: hand left me unable to play. Min's slight change of

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Speaker 1: plans arrived a little later in her life, but we'll

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Speaker 1: get to that in a bit. For now, let's start

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Speaker 1: with Min's love story with music. She says it began

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Speaker 1: before she was even born. Min's uncle would often send

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Speaker 1: Min's mom classical music records in the mail. Her mom

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Speaker 1: loved these recordings, especially the ones that featured the violin,

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Speaker 1: and when she became pregnant with men, listening to these

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Speaker 1: records became a sort of pregnancy craving.

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Speaker 2: It was sort of the highlight of her week to

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Speaker 2: get these records. And my parents had a very sort

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Speaker 2: of traditional career and marriage where my father would come

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Speaker 2: home pay his wages on the kitchen table. My mother

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Speaker 2: would budget for the week, but she'd always put some

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Speaker 2: money aside because she just so desperately wanted a high

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Speaker 2: fight system, and they were terribly expensive in those days.

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Speaker 2: But she managed it, and she didn't know she was

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Speaker 2: pregnant with me at the time, but she just had

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Speaker 2: this yearning to listened to as much classical music as possible.

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Speaker 2: She eventually got this hi Fi system and she was

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Speaker 2: listening to things like Sibelia's Violin Concerto, Mozart, violin concertos, Mendelssohn, Tchaikovski,

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Speaker 2: and I'm sure that exposure in my mother's womb. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: was my first violin lesson.

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Speaker 1: Wow, amazing, What is your first memory of the violin?

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Speaker 2: So my best friend at the time, we were both six,

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Speaker 2: she had started learning the trumpet for the Salvation Army

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Speaker 2: and her sister was playing the violin, and she had

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Speaker 2: a quarter sized violin, and I would look at this

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Speaker 2: viol and I just felt this sort of pang of

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Speaker 2: feeling like I'm at home. It's really difficult to describe

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Speaker 2: that sense of wow, everything makes sense. And I think

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Speaker 2: that is possibly as a result of we'd actually come

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Speaker 2: to England three years before that, and I know it

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Speaker 2: was tough. I know it was tough for my parents,

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Speaker 2: coming from you know, very Korean culture, not really speaking English,

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Speaker 2: learning a new language. So language became really really important

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Speaker 2: in my mind at the time, And all of a sudden,

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Speaker 2: seeing this violin, I realized that it's actually another vessel

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Speaker 2: for language and music, being the you know, the universal language.

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Speaker 2: I sort of realized that actually everything that can be

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Speaker 2: expressed can be done through music. And I actually taught

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Speaker 2: myself to play the violin before I had my first

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Speaker 2: violin lesson via my friend's instrument. I mean, it was

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Speaker 2: just twiggled to good. Little style wasn't but it was

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Speaker 2: just so exciting. You know that the sounds that the

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Speaker 2: violin was capable of making. I think, the freedom of

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Speaker 2: having this. You know, you put your finger down and

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Speaker 2: it makes a different note. I mean, for a six

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Speaker 2: year old, it just absolutely blew my mind.

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Speaker 1: It's really delightful for me to hear this story because

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Speaker 1: I also started playing the violin at age six, and

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Speaker 1: so we must have been an very similar stage of development.

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Speaker 3: Oh, I just away of that.

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Speaker 1: I remember they would put little pieces of colored tape

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Speaker 1: onto the fingerboard to help q where it is that

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Speaker 1: we were supposed to put our fingers, and so yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think I had a similar level of intrigue and like, ooh,

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Speaker 1: this is really cool. Okay, so you had this moment

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Speaker 1: at six where you're looking at your friend's violin and

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Speaker 1: you feel a sense of home and then I'm presuming

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Speaker 1: you ask your mom for your own violin. Can you

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Speaker 1: describe me your early relationship once you began playing the violin.

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Speaker 1: What was that like? Like, what were you drawn to?

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Speaker 1: What did it make you feel?

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Speaker 2: It made me feel free. So when I was talking

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Speaker 2: about language and things like that, it just felt like

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Speaker 2: there were no barriers. I mean, I look back now,

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Speaker 2: I did have this sense of destiny. It was like,

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Speaker 2: I remember there was a moment around the time that

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Speaker 2: I started playing the violin and it starts to rain

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Speaker 2: and I didn't have a number. I was in the

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Speaker 2: playground and I was looking up into the sky and

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Speaker 2: seeing these rain drops falling, and I just knew there

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Speaker 2: was a god and I knew that I was supposed

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Speaker 2: to play the violin. Right. It's kind of I mean

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Speaker 2: I think that now, and I put myself back into

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Speaker 2: that six year old mind, and I was deadly serious.

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Speaker 2: Do you know what. I think I was more serious

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Speaker 2: as a six year old. Now.

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Speaker 1: I was going to say, then you were a very

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Speaker 1: precocious six year old, because I think my six year

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Speaker 1: old brain was like, I love the violin. Also, how

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Speaker 1: do I convince my mom to give me more cookies?

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Speaker 1: Like that was the level of sophistication that I had.

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Speaker 2: Oh well, yeah, yeah, you know, I love cheese sawagy.

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Speaker 1: Wow, it's quite extraordinary that you had such a deep

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Speaker 1: attachment from such an early age. So how quickly did

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Speaker 1: you realize min that you had this incredible gift? And

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Speaker 1: I'll say it for you so that you don't have to,

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Speaker 1: but you were deemed a child prodigy? So when did

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Speaker 1: that happen?

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Speaker 2: So actually, one of the reasons why I think it

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Speaker 2: was recognized very quickly that I did have an unusual

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Speaker 2: talent was because I was actually allergic to rosin. It's

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Speaker 2: a substance that you used to oil the bow. That

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Speaker 2: the bow is made from horse hair, and so in

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Speaker 2: order to make it slightly sticky and produce the sound

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Speaker 2: so it's not sort of sliding everywhere, you put this

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Speaker 2: rosin on the hair. And in those days, I had

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Speaker 2: really really terrible asthma. I was being hospitalized every other month.

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Speaker 2: I was allergic to everything, including rosin, and so that

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Speaker 2: meant that I couldn't actually practice more than half an

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Speaker 2: hour at a time before I would start wheezing, and

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Speaker 2: so my mother would have to monitor me, like the

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Speaker 2: first sign of the wheezing should make me stop.

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Speaker 1: But what it.

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Speaker 2: Actually did show was with half an hour practice a day,

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Speaker 2: I was still able to progress at a pace that was,

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Speaker 2: you know, outside of the norm, and I think that's

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Speaker 2: why people called me a prodigy. I mean, I remember

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Speaker 2: actually going to the awards ceremony picking up this prize

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Speaker 2: that i'd won because I'd got the highest mark in

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Speaker 2: the country or something like that, and I'm looking around

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Speaker 2: and everybody else is sort of you know, in their

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Speaker 2: late teens, and I'm like a child, and yeah, I'm thinking, well,

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Speaker 2: I guess that's my life.

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Speaker 1: How did your devotion to the violin and your relationship

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Speaker 1: with the violin evolve during your teenage years? So, I mean,

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Speaker 1: was there a moment in particular where you decided I

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Speaker 1: want to be a professional or was that always in

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Speaker 1: the cards for you that you knew?

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Speaker 2: No, it was actually So that's the bit I suppose

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Speaker 2: of my life where I look back now and I

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Speaker 2: realized that I really didn't have any control over it

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Speaker 2: was already decided by the time I was eight, by

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Speaker 2: my teachers, by the school, that I was going to

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Speaker 2: be a violinist. I mean, I had no choice in

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Speaker 2: the matter. I wasn't complaining because I think I'd always

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Speaker 2: felt that that was the case. But I think it

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Speaker 2: make me develop a sort of love hate relationship with

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Speaker 2: the violin, not music, but with the violin, because I

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Speaker 2: think when that kind of expectation is on very young shoulders,

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Speaker 2: it does cause a sense of responsibility. I mean one

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Speaker 2: of the things that I would hear constantly was the

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Speaker 2: word potential. And what a loaded word that is. Expectation. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you can't help but pick up the subtext behind the

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Speaker 2: word potential, which is that the saddest thing is unfulfilled potential.

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Speaker 2: And to deal with that as a child, you know,

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Speaker 2: not even in double figures. By that we were talking

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Speaker 2: eight nine years old. It was Yeah, it was daunting.

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Speaker 2: And I remember saying to my mother, I don't think

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Speaker 2: I want to play the violin anymore if I'm not

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Speaker 2: going to enjoy it. And that was a really strong

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Speaker 2: message for her to hear. And she did sit me

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Speaker 2: down and say, look, if you don't want to do this,

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Speaker 2: you don't have to. And that was the moment that

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Speaker 2: I decided that that's what I wanted to do.

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Speaker 1: Wow, what a nice pressure test. Yeah, So I'd like

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Speaker 1: to fast forward over a decade to when you're twenty one,

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Speaker 1: and from the perspective of a violinist, you have this

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Speaker 1: once in a lifetime opportunity when it comes to the

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Speaker 1: violin that you play. Do you mind bringing us back

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Speaker 1: to that moment.

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Speaker 2: So I'd actually been borrowing violins since I was, oh gosh,

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Speaker 2: twelve years old from this dealership, but you know, I

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Speaker 2: always wanted to have my own instrument. It's a little

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Speaker 2: bit like a house, I suppose, or a home. When

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Speaker 2: you own your home, you feel like it's your home.

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Speaker 2: You can't be kicked out at any point. I mean,

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Speaker 2: the thing about borrowing a violin is that there's always

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Speaker 2: that sort of sense at the back of your mind

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Speaker 2: that it can be taken away times. So it became

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Speaker 2: very important for me to actually own my own instrument,

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Speaker 2: and so I asked the dealership if they wouldn't mind

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Speaker 2: just keeping an eye out for any instrument. They knew

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Speaker 2: my playing very well, and so I just asked them

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Speaker 2: to just, you know, to keep an ear to the

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Speaker 2: ground if they hear of any instruments that they might

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Speaker 2: feel suited me. And as it happened, after a few

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Speaker 2: years of nothing, two came along at the same time,

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Speaker 2: and so I got the phone call saying, well, we've

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Speaker 2: got two violins that we think might suit your playing.

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Speaker 2: They're both strads, and I'm thinking, wow, okay, this is

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Speaker 2: very unusual.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, tell us what makes the strad so spectacular in

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Speaker 1: the world of violinists.

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Speaker 2: So, Stradivarius was an incredibly prolific violin maker in the

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Speaker 2: sixteen hundreds all the way to the seventeen hundreds. He

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Speaker 2: actually lived unti a very ripe old age. He basically

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Speaker 2: revolutionized how violins were made. And I think it is

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Speaker 2: a real testament to his genius. That's how he visualized

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Speaker 2: the violin, how he understood the physics of the violin

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Speaker 2: has never been improved. I mean that is incredible. And

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Speaker 2: you know, there's no wonder that they're going for millions

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Speaker 2: of dollars. So a really quality instrument like a strad,

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Speaker 2: it shows you how to play, It teaches you how

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Speaker 2: to play, It makes you better, you know, and the

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Speaker 2: magic and you feel like, you know how when you

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Speaker 2: listen to great singing and it sends shivers down your spine.

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Speaker 2: And that's what a top violin playing on the top

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Speaker 2: violin does. You feel these electricity, it's magic, you know,

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Speaker 2: and you feel alive. So I was presented with two strads.

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Speaker 2: I mean, can you imagine two stratavirus is. You know,

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Speaker 2: we were actually in my parents' home. The dealer actually

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Speaker 2: with a double case, and in that case are two

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Speaker 2: violins that's worth more than the house was standing in.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's just it's insane, right, And he opens

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Speaker 2: the case and I can feel everybody willing me to

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Speaker 2: choose the one that has the better pedigree. Gorgeous looking instrument,

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Speaker 2: I mean, was just so handsome, had a kind of amber,

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Speaker 2: dark amber hue to it. And I picked it up,

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Speaker 2: and I mean the sound was just incredible. It sounded

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Speaker 2: like Pavarotti. Okay, it had this incredibly rich, rich, vibrant

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Speaker 2: just tingles, you know, but you know what didn't feel

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Speaker 2: like me. It didn't sound like me. It was like

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Speaker 2: I was wearing the most beautiful gown and it just

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Speaker 2: didn't suit me. So the other one was smaller, It

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Speaker 2: had a much more slender body and neck. It was

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Speaker 2: made in sixteen ninety six, it'd been through the walls,

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Speaker 2: it had a hole in the top, and you know,

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Speaker 2: it didn't come from such a great pedigree year. But

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Speaker 2: I picked it up, and you know, I just knew

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Speaker 2: it was the one. It felt like you know, when

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Speaker 2: you meet someone and you on paper, you wouldn't necessarily

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Speaker 2: say this is the perfect fit for me, this is

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Speaker 2: this is you know, you might not necessarily know that

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Speaker 2: it's your match. But the chemistry, and I know it

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Speaker 2: sounds so strange talking about a chemistry with a violin,

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Speaker 2: but it was the chemistry was just right. It just

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Speaker 2: felt right. It felt it felt like it completed me.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's I don't know if you're a fan

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Speaker 1: of Harry Potter, but it does remind me. Okay, so

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Speaker 1: it does remind me of the you know, the one

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Speaker 1: chooses the wizard. And what I'm hearing in your story

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Speaker 1: is this particular strat of areas chose you.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: You know a lot of people might meet their life

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Speaker 2: partner at that age, and I'd never felt like that

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Speaker 2: about another person. I was twenty one. You're kind of

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Speaker 2: you know, you're on the cusp of leaving childhood, you know,

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Speaker 2: youth and really becoming an adult. I was becoming a woman,

255
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Speaker 2: and I think, yeah, it just came at that point

256
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Speaker 2: that I was ready for a new life, and this

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Speaker 2: violin really fulfilled that new life. I mean I basically

258
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Speaker 2: invested everything I had in that violin. I had been

259
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Speaker 2: earning since I was ten eleven years old. I won

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Speaker 2: a competition when I was eleven which the prize money

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Speaker 2: was a lot, which my parents actually invested for me.

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Speaker 2: So by the time I actually reached twenty one, I

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Speaker 2: actually had enough money to buy a flat. And I

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Speaker 2: think the normal thing would be you upgrade your flat

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Speaker 2: and buy a bigger place, you know, and so on

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Speaker 2: and so forth. Well for me, it was a no brainer.

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Speaker 2: I didn't care about my flat. I just need did

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Speaker 2: this violin for everything?

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Speaker 1: So rather than the flat upgrade, you were like going

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Speaker 1: all in and eventually wanting to own this violin.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I had loans, I had mortgages, but yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 2: you know, it.

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Speaker 3: Was my life. Wow.

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Speaker 2: But actually also I don't know, it was just it

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Speaker 2: gave me a sense of home. It gave me sense stability.

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Speaker 2: The thing about the violin as well. And I was

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Speaker 2: traveling a lot as well in those days, and whenever

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Speaker 2: I felt homesick or whenever I felt like a culture

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Speaker 2: shock or anything like that, and I felt like, oh gosh,

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Speaker 2: I'm you know, a bit anxious. I don't know where

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Speaker 2: I am. If I got out my violin, I played

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Speaker 2: a few scales and I would just sort of get

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Speaker 2: lost in the violin world. I just felt at home

285
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Speaker 2: so effectively, you know, you're sort of carrying your home

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Speaker 2: around with you wherever you go.

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Speaker 3: And I loved it.

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Speaker 2: It was just it meant everything to me.

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Speaker 1: Now, let's fast forward ten years to this called November Day.

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Speaker 1: It's twenty ten. You're thirty one years old at the time,

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Speaker 1: and everything changed for you. In a London train station.

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Speaker 2: So it was actually particularly cold November. I had actually

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Speaker 2: been in hospital a few days before with asthma. I

294
00:17:22,236 --> 00:17:25,036
Speaker 2: actually collapsed in the street. I was sort of on

295
00:17:25,076 --> 00:17:28,676
Speaker 2: these heavy duty steroids, you know, head all over the place,

296
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Speaker 2: and I was heading off to Manchester. So got to

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Speaker 2: the train station. I was with my boyfriend Matt. We

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Speaker 2: got there a little bit early, decided to get something

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Speaker 2: to eat. We were in prit Mages, which is our

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Speaker 2: Sandward shop, and because I wasn't feeling well, Matt wanted

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Speaker 2: to look after my violin. My default position sitting down

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Speaker 2: with my violin was to tie the strap around my

303
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Speaker 2: ankle and I would never let anybody carry my violin

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Speaker 2: for me. So my response was absolutely no way, and

305
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Speaker 2: we had an argument. We actually had an argument about it,

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Speaker 2: and you know, the thing is I'm the kind of

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Speaker 2: person I just really don't like creating any kind of

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Speaker 2: scene in public. And he was very insistent on looking

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Speaker 2: off my violin, and I said, promise me, you'll look

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Speaker 2: after it. And then about ten minutes later he said,

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Speaker 2: oh my god, where's your violin? And it had gone.

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Speaker 2: And in that moment, my life as I knew it ended.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back in a moment with a slight change

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Speaker 1: of plans. Min Kim's beloved violin was gone. Here's what

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00:19:07,716 --> 00:19:11,996
Speaker 1: happened in the London trains that day. Min had reluctantly

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Speaker 1: let her boyfriend watch over her instrument while she grabbed

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Speaker 1: a quick sandwich. He got distracted for a moment, and

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Speaker 1: someone snatched the violin. Security footage later revealed that three

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Speaker 1: men were behind the theft. The violin was valued at

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Speaker 1: one point two million pounds. As police began a search,

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Speaker 1: Min tried to adjust to life without her violin.

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Speaker 2: I was sort of struggling between feeling a sense of,

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Speaker 2: you know, just needing to be very practical, dealing with

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Speaker 2: the practicalities of it, like the assurance stuff like that,

325
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Speaker 2: and also feeling very guilty about feeling so devastated and

326
00:19:49,076 --> 00:19:55,796
Speaker 2: got it almost like you know, it was there were

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Speaker 2: some very well meaning people who loved me and were

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Speaker 2: basically just trying to help, and they, you know that,

329
00:20:01,396 --> 00:20:03,796
Speaker 2: they were saying, man, it's just a violin. You know

330
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Speaker 2: there are other violins, And of course they're right, there

331
00:20:07,636 --> 00:20:11,516
Speaker 2: are other violins. But I think for me it was

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00:20:12,116 --> 00:20:15,636
Speaker 2: like it was akin to say, you've lived somewhere since

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00:20:15,636 --> 00:20:19,676
Speaker 2: you're twenty one, you've lived somewhere that you've really made

334
00:20:19,716 --> 00:20:23,196
Speaker 2: your home, You've tended the garden, and you know everything

335
00:20:23,276 --> 00:20:25,956
Speaker 2: is your home. You know it's your safe place, it's everything,

336
00:20:26,036 --> 00:20:30,236
Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden it's destroyed. So that's

337
00:20:30,236 --> 00:20:35,556
Speaker 2: how it felt like for me, and well, I suppose

338
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Speaker 2: it was a sense of loss of identity. It was

339
00:20:37,796 --> 00:20:40,436
Speaker 2: a sense of a loss of everything that i'd actually

340
00:20:40,956 --> 00:20:43,676
Speaker 2: it was my life earnings as well. And at this

341
00:20:43,796 --> 00:20:47,116
Speaker 2: point I'm not even sure what's happening with the insurance,

342
00:20:47,196 --> 00:20:50,676
Speaker 2: so I don't even know if I've actually lost my

343
00:20:50,996 --> 00:20:56,956
Speaker 2: entire life earnings, my savings, my pension, everything. I didn't

344
00:20:56,996 --> 00:20:58,836
Speaker 2: know if I was ever going to play the violin again.

345
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Speaker 2: I didn't know if I could ever listen to music again.

346
00:21:02,196 --> 00:21:05,796
Speaker 2: I didn't listen to music actually, for gosh, the best

347
00:21:05,836 --> 00:21:08,356
Speaker 2: part of six months. I couldn't it was too painful.

348
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Speaker 2: And this is, you know, having been someone who's basically

349
00:21:12,036 --> 00:21:14,116
Speaker 2: been in love with music since I was born, well,

350
00:21:14,236 --> 00:21:17,636
Speaker 2: so as I was in the woomb to all of

351
00:21:17,676 --> 00:21:20,916
Speaker 2: a sudden actually reject music. I had to reject music

352
00:21:20,916 --> 00:21:24,156
Speaker 2: because it was just so painful. I didn't want to feel.

353
00:21:24,236 --> 00:21:27,596
Speaker 2: I didn't want, I couldn't feel. I couldn't cry. To

354
00:21:27,756 --> 00:21:31,676
Speaker 2: cry meant that I had to feel, and to feel

355
00:21:31,716 --> 00:21:37,516
Speaker 2: meant that I was human, and I just felt like

356
00:21:37,996 --> 00:21:41,916
Speaker 2: I was going through the motions. I slept. I was

357
00:21:42,076 --> 00:21:45,316
Speaker 2: just all I wanted to do was sleep. I didn't

358
00:21:45,356 --> 00:21:48,156
Speaker 2: want to get out of bed, just wanted to sleep.

359
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Speaker 1: You mentioned that for a long time after your violin

360
00:21:51,796 --> 00:21:56,196
Speaker 1: was stolen, you were not even able to listen to music. Yeah,

361
00:21:56,316 --> 00:21:59,996
Speaker 1: tell me about when that changed for you and what

362
00:22:00,236 --> 00:22:03,396
Speaker 1: cracked you open again and made music an option for

363
00:22:03,436 --> 00:22:04,076
Speaker 1: you once again.

364
00:22:04,996 --> 00:22:11,516
Speaker 2: So I needed silence, I felt so immediately after the theft.

365
00:22:12,316 --> 00:22:19,036
Speaker 2: I just needed silence. I couldn't process. I couldn't process

366
00:22:20,516 --> 00:22:26,476
Speaker 2: noise or sounds. Everything just sounded like noise and I

367
00:22:26,516 --> 00:22:29,916
Speaker 2: couldn't deal with it. You know how when you listen

368
00:22:29,996 --> 00:22:34,876
Speaker 2: to a song and they have very specific lyrics, very

369
00:22:34,916 --> 00:22:38,716
Speaker 2: meaningful lyrics to something maybe that you've experienced, and it's

370
00:22:38,796 --> 00:22:42,876
Speaker 2: just so exactly what you're going through, and you're just like,

371
00:22:43,116 --> 00:22:45,116
Speaker 2: get it away from me. I can't deal with it,

372
00:22:45,396 --> 00:22:48,276
Speaker 2: you know. And every single piece of music sounded like

373
00:22:48,276 --> 00:22:50,396
Speaker 2: that to me. It was like a dagger to my heart.

374
00:22:50,996 --> 00:22:54,076
Speaker 2: Even if it was the most healing music, I just

375
00:22:54,196 --> 00:22:58,916
Speaker 2: couldn't process it. I certainly couldn't play. And I really

376
00:22:58,956 --> 00:23:02,836
Speaker 2: didn't want to be self indulgent about grieving, and I

377
00:23:02,876 --> 00:23:06,476
Speaker 2: think that's why I denied myself the grieving process for

378
00:23:06,516 --> 00:23:10,876
Speaker 2: so long. I felt guilty that maybe I'm being massively

379
00:23:10,876 --> 00:23:14,036
Speaker 2: self indulgent. So I kind of went into sort of

380
00:23:14,196 --> 00:23:18,436
Speaker 2: soldier mode, giving myself a massive of doses of tough love,

381
00:23:18,516 --> 00:23:22,156
Speaker 2: not actually realizing that what I really needed was to

382
00:23:22,236 --> 00:23:26,916
Speaker 2: just take it easy, just you know, say it's okay

383
00:23:26,916 --> 00:23:31,436
Speaker 2: to cry, It's okay to cry over something so important

384
00:23:31,476 --> 00:23:35,116
Speaker 2: to me. And I think that delayed just sort of

385
00:23:35,116 --> 00:23:40,116
Speaker 2: reconnecting with my life. And the moment actually came through bach.

386
00:23:41,676 --> 00:23:46,676
Speaker 2: I was alone in the flat in Manchester and I

387
00:23:46,716 --> 00:23:51,076
Speaker 2: had this violin that borrowed that sort of be sitting

388
00:23:51,596 --> 00:23:55,676
Speaker 2: unopened for months. Took it out, took out the boat.

389
00:23:55,716 --> 00:23:57,876
Speaker 2: It felt like a golf club in my hand, you know,

390
00:23:59,516 --> 00:24:06,596
Speaker 2: just felt soulless. But I suddenly had an urge to

391
00:24:06,676 --> 00:24:09,396
Speaker 2: play Bach. And the reason, I think is because I

392
00:24:09,436 --> 00:24:12,716
Speaker 2: always think of Bach has been the ultimate detox. You know,

393
00:24:12,836 --> 00:24:21,236
Speaker 2: it's so pure, it's so clean, and my soul felt

394
00:24:21,276 --> 00:24:24,916
Speaker 2: ready to let go of some of the of the

395
00:24:24,916 --> 00:24:28,756
Speaker 2: real darkness. I didn't realize just how in such a

396
00:24:28,836 --> 00:24:33,356
Speaker 2: dark place that i'd been, I hadn't laughed in months.

397
00:24:34,156 --> 00:24:39,596
Speaker 2: I hadn't cried either. So I played a piece by

398
00:24:39,716 --> 00:24:43,836
Speaker 2: Bach called the Chakan, and I started shaking, like my

399
00:24:43,916 --> 00:24:47,636
Speaker 2: body actually started shaking in voluntarily, like it was trying

400
00:24:47,676 --> 00:24:50,596
Speaker 2: to feel something, like it was trying to connect with something.

401
00:24:50,636 --> 00:24:54,036
Speaker 2: And I think it's also because the Chakon being such

402
00:24:54,076 --> 00:24:58,996
Speaker 2: an incredibly powerful piece that he wrote after learning that

403
00:24:59,076 --> 00:25:03,276
Speaker 2: his wife had died, and it's not a sentimental piece,

404
00:25:03,876 --> 00:25:12,196
Speaker 2: but it really does capture life. I'm a huge believer

405
00:25:12,516 --> 00:25:16,036
Speaker 2: in the subconscious mind, just knowing what it's going to do,

406
00:25:16,156 --> 00:25:18,196
Speaker 2: what you're going to do before you even do it.

407
00:25:18,236 --> 00:25:21,996
Speaker 2: And I clearly chose the Bach on a very deep

408
00:25:22,436 --> 00:25:24,356
Speaker 2: level because I think it's the piece that I always

409
00:25:24,396 --> 00:25:27,636
Speaker 2: go back to if I ever feel like I need

410
00:25:27,956 --> 00:25:32,196
Speaker 2: to not even have answers for anything, because I don't

411
00:25:32,236 --> 00:25:35,436
Speaker 2: have answers for anything really, but just that feeling of

412
00:25:35,476 --> 00:25:38,196
Speaker 2: something so much greater that, you know, that wonderment.

413
00:25:38,396 --> 00:25:38,716
Speaker 1: Yeah.

414
00:25:38,756 --> 00:25:41,396
Speaker 2: So it was almost like going back to being a

415
00:25:41,476 --> 00:25:45,316
Speaker 2: child and that wonderment of music and the awe that

416
00:25:45,396 --> 00:25:50,716
Speaker 2: you feel of oh, of discovering music. You're thinking, wow,

417
00:25:51,596 --> 00:25:53,596
Speaker 2: this is nature, this is life.

418
00:25:53,996 --> 00:25:54,196
Speaker 1: You know.

419
00:25:54,516 --> 00:25:56,796
Speaker 2: It was almost like discovering music for the very first

420
00:25:56,796 --> 00:26:02,036
Speaker 2: time again and just realizing that everything, every language is

421
00:26:02,076 --> 00:26:07,196
Speaker 2: in music, every emotion, every thought, everything that's ever been

422
00:26:07,556 --> 00:26:08,836
Speaker 2: discovered is in music.

423
00:26:10,116 --> 00:26:10,356
Speaker 3: Yeah.

424
00:26:10,396 --> 00:26:13,756
Speaker 2: It just freed my mind to stop being so closed.

425
00:26:13,916 --> 00:26:16,236
Speaker 2: And you know, at that point, I was actually living

426
00:26:16,956 --> 00:26:19,396
Speaker 2: in my head with so many walls. There was just

427
00:26:19,396 --> 00:26:22,756
Speaker 2: so many walls around my thought process, and the bars

428
00:26:22,796 --> 00:26:26,636
Speaker 2: chak on just somehow just shattered those walls and it

429
00:26:26,716 --> 00:26:31,156
Speaker 2: helped me. It was almost like I felt I felt

430
00:26:31,756 --> 00:26:36,516
Speaker 2: touch God. I you know, I get really emotionalized remembering

431
00:26:36,516 --> 00:26:44,156
Speaker 2: that feeling of He helped me live again, you know,

432
00:26:44,236 --> 00:26:46,036
Speaker 2: And that's the power of music.

433
00:26:48,196 --> 00:26:50,876
Speaker 1: I love that you use r to describe this moment

434
00:26:51,076 --> 00:26:53,796
Speaker 1: because it I'm just thinking back to your childhood and

435
00:26:53,836 --> 00:26:58,036
Speaker 1: how it was music's are inspiring qualities that led you

436
00:26:58,076 --> 00:26:59,476
Speaker 1: to fall in love with it in the first place,

437
00:26:59,476 --> 00:27:03,156
Speaker 1: and now here you are in adulthood reclaiming those are

438
00:27:03,276 --> 00:27:06,276
Speaker 1: inspiring aspects of music to help you heal from this

439
00:27:07,116 --> 00:27:10,716
Speaker 1: traumatic event in your life, and it's just so beautiful.

440
00:27:10,716 --> 00:27:12,676
Speaker 1: It's like you arde your way through this heartbreak.

441
00:27:13,916 --> 00:27:18,876
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that sense of awe it led me

442
00:27:19,036 --> 00:27:23,596
Speaker 2: to understand the importance of really getting out of the way,

443
00:27:24,356 --> 00:27:26,756
Speaker 2: you know. I think the times that I felt the

444
00:27:26,756 --> 00:27:29,956
Speaker 2: most blocked was because I was kind of getting in

445
00:27:29,996 --> 00:27:32,996
Speaker 2: the way of myself. So when I was blocking the

446
00:27:33,076 --> 00:27:34,916
Speaker 2: music out, it was because I was getting in the

447
00:27:34,916 --> 00:27:40,876
Speaker 2: way of it and allowing the music to wash over,

448
00:27:41,556 --> 00:27:45,916
Speaker 2: like being in a bath and just letting it flow,

449
00:27:46,276 --> 00:27:47,956
Speaker 2: not trying to control it in any way. And I

450
00:27:48,036 --> 00:27:53,796
Speaker 2: think that's when whatever I'm doing, whether it's practicing, performing, composing,

451
00:27:54,716 --> 00:28:00,356
Speaker 2: even listening, letting go of control is key for everything,

452
00:28:01,476 --> 00:28:01,636
Speaker 2: you know.

453
00:28:01,636 --> 00:28:04,756
Speaker 1: I recently spoke with the psychologist dak Or Keltner, and

454
00:28:04,956 --> 00:28:08,476
Speaker 1: he talks about the fact that one feeling we have

455
00:28:08,636 --> 00:28:12,556
Speaker 1: with art is perceived vastness that we are in the

456
00:28:12,596 --> 00:28:15,236
Speaker 1: presence of something that is so great and big and

457
00:28:15,236 --> 00:28:18,676
Speaker 1: bigger than ourselves, and it can make us feel like

458
00:28:18,756 --> 00:28:23,036
Speaker 1: we are part of a larger hole. They think. When

459
00:28:23,076 --> 00:28:25,516
Speaker 1: you said you kind of got out of the way,

460
00:28:26,556 --> 00:28:28,676
Speaker 1: it aligned with my understanding of all, which is what

461
00:28:28,716 --> 00:28:31,916
Speaker 1: all can do to us is allow us to see

462
00:28:31,956 --> 00:28:34,796
Speaker 1: beyond ourselves. It diminishes the self in a way that's

463
00:28:34,796 --> 00:28:37,036
Speaker 1: actually quite powerful and perspective giving.

464
00:28:37,596 --> 00:28:40,436
Speaker 2: What happened when I lost my violin was because I

465
00:28:40,556 --> 00:28:43,356
Speaker 2: had wrapped so much of my identity with the violin.

466
00:28:43,596 --> 00:28:46,636
Speaker 2: With the violin gone, suddenly I'm left with just me.

467
00:28:47,676 --> 00:28:49,996
Speaker 2: I don't know what to do with it. So that

468
00:28:50,116 --> 00:28:53,876
Speaker 2: sense of awe, I sort of temporarily lost it because

469
00:28:53,916 --> 00:28:57,356
Speaker 2: I'm sort of dealing with me as a human being,

470
00:28:57,396 --> 00:29:01,036
Speaker 2: and I'm thinking, well, there's nothing awesome there, you know,

471
00:29:02,196 --> 00:29:07,116
Speaker 2: and finding that awe again, that feeling of awe is

472
00:29:07,836 --> 00:29:14,276
Speaker 2: forgetting yourself and allowing the music to take shape to

473
00:29:14,436 --> 00:29:19,836
Speaker 2: fill your being, and it's for gosh, it's so powerful, actually,

474
00:29:19,836 --> 00:29:22,196
Speaker 2: and I think that was the reason why I couldn't

475
00:29:22,236 --> 00:29:25,716
Speaker 2: actually let it in. It's such strong medicine actually, that

476
00:29:25,796 --> 00:29:27,956
Speaker 2: sometimes you've got to be a little bit strong and

477
00:29:27,996 --> 00:29:31,836
Speaker 2: I was so weak and I needed to just get

478
00:29:31,836 --> 00:29:35,076
Speaker 2: a little bit stronger in order to be able to

479
00:29:35,076 --> 00:29:36,796
Speaker 2: receive the medicine of music.

480
00:29:39,436 --> 00:29:41,276
Speaker 1: I of course want to know, and I know listeners

481
00:29:41,276 --> 00:29:45,956
Speaker 1: will want to know, if investigators ever found your strativarius.

482
00:29:47,756 --> 00:29:53,236
Speaker 2: Yes, after three very long years, I got the phone

483
00:29:53,276 --> 00:30:03,676
Speaker 2: call and it was elation, followed by the bittersweet realization

484
00:30:04,156 --> 00:30:08,996
Speaker 2: that the violin no longer belonged to me. Who did

485
00:30:09,476 --> 00:30:14,516
Speaker 2: to It belonged to the insurance company within that three years,

486
00:30:14,876 --> 00:30:18,596
Speaker 2: in the normal protocol, the normal way that these things

487
00:30:18,636 --> 00:30:21,316
Speaker 2: are dealt with. You know, my vinyl was insured. I

488
00:30:21,356 --> 00:30:25,356
Speaker 2: had collected the insurance money, and the moment I did that,

489
00:30:25,396 --> 00:30:28,676
Speaker 2: the violin belonged to the insurance company. That's completely fair,

490
00:30:29,436 --> 00:30:33,516
Speaker 2: that's you know, and I had to come to terms

491
00:30:33,596 --> 00:30:33,836
Speaker 2: with that.

492
00:30:35,236 --> 00:30:37,796
Speaker 1: Did you use the insurance money to buy a new violin?

493
00:30:38,036 --> 00:30:38,396
Speaker 2: I had?

494
00:30:38,476 --> 00:30:41,436
Speaker 1: Yes, Okay, yeah, Did it ever feel like you were

495
00:30:41,516 --> 00:30:44,556
Speaker 1: cheating on your strad with this new violin? It's kind

496
00:30:44,596 --> 00:30:45,716
Speaker 1: of a bizarre question, but.

497
00:30:46,156 --> 00:30:48,796
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, well, I mean I think it says everything

498
00:30:48,916 --> 00:30:53,636
Speaker 2: that I resented it. Oh interesting, I resented this VI.

499
00:30:53,756 --> 00:30:56,396
Speaker 2: I mean I know that sounds kind of you know

500
00:30:56,476 --> 00:30:59,876
Speaker 2: what what's you're talking about? But yeah, I mean I

501
00:30:59,916 --> 00:31:01,996
Speaker 2: was being massively unfair, you know, I mean, it's not

502
00:31:02,356 --> 00:31:05,116
Speaker 2: It wasn't violence thought that was the rebound instrument.

503
00:31:08,356 --> 00:31:11,436
Speaker 1: Absolutely out of I was trying its investment to fill

504
00:31:11,476 --> 00:31:12,836
Speaker 1: the void, you know what I mean.

505
00:31:13,716 --> 00:31:17,316
Speaker 2: And I never really truly bonded with it though. And

506
00:31:17,356 --> 00:31:22,476
Speaker 2: I didn't have enough time though to you know, to

507
00:31:22,556 --> 00:31:25,836
Speaker 2: sell it and rebuy my vine only. I only had

508
00:31:25,916 --> 00:31:29,236
Speaker 2: ninety days, and because I had actually purchased this other violin,

509
00:31:30,116 --> 00:31:31,436
Speaker 2: it just wasn't enough time.

510
00:31:32,476 --> 00:31:36,996
Speaker 1: Yeah, did you get a chance to say goodbye to

511
00:31:37,476 --> 00:31:40,236
Speaker 1: your strad like? Were you ever physically reunited with it?

512
00:31:40,276 --> 00:31:41,636
Speaker 1: Once investigators found it?

513
00:31:42,156 --> 00:31:47,156
Speaker 2: I did, I did, and it was it was painful.

514
00:31:47,716 --> 00:31:51,956
Speaker 2: It was really really painful. I played the last thing

515
00:31:52,516 --> 00:31:54,436
Speaker 2: that I had actually recorded on it, which was the

516
00:31:54,476 --> 00:32:00,676
Speaker 2: Brahms Concerto. I played the slow movement because it seemed

517
00:32:00,676 --> 00:32:05,196
Speaker 2: to sum up. So Brahms wrote this slow movement as

518
00:32:05,196 --> 00:32:09,076
Speaker 2: a love letter to his great unrequired love Clara Schumann

519
00:32:09,396 --> 00:32:13,636
Speaker 2: who so Clara Schumann was married to Brahms's best friend,

520
00:32:13,716 --> 00:32:19,156
Speaker 2: Robert Schumann, and he had been in love with Clara

521
00:32:19,396 --> 00:32:24,476
Speaker 2: forever and then when Robert died everybody expected, including Clara herself,

522
00:32:24,716 --> 00:32:29,476
Speaker 2: that Brahms would, you know, make overtures and you know,

523
00:32:30,036 --> 00:32:33,316
Speaker 2: and he didn't. And it was almost as though the

524
00:32:33,356 --> 00:32:38,676
Speaker 2: pain of unrequirted love was what drove him more than

525
00:32:38,916 --> 00:32:42,596
Speaker 2: the possibility of a real relationship. And you really feel

526
00:32:42,636 --> 00:33:00,116
Speaker 2: that in the slow movement of the Broms. It just

527
00:33:00,156 --> 00:33:04,716
Speaker 2: felt very just felt very fitting to play something that

528
00:33:04,916 --> 00:33:08,796
Speaker 2: is so emotional but in a very kind of painful way.

529
00:33:08,956 --> 00:33:12,196
Speaker 2: You know, how you have a relationship where you do

530
00:33:12,356 --> 00:33:14,356
Speaker 2: learn a lot about love, but you also learn a

531
00:33:14,356 --> 00:33:18,156
Speaker 2: lot about pain. And I think that's what I associate

532
00:33:18,756 --> 00:33:20,916
Speaker 2: the relationship that I had with my strad with I

533
00:33:20,996 --> 00:33:23,236
Speaker 2: learned a lot about love, but I also learned a

534
00:33:23,276 --> 00:33:28,316
Speaker 2: lot about grief and a lot about pain. I'm glad

535
00:33:28,356 --> 00:33:30,916
Speaker 2: I said goodbye to it. I think it was really

536
00:33:30,956 --> 00:33:34,596
Speaker 2: important to say goodbye. I don't want to do it

537
00:33:34,636 --> 00:33:38,276
Speaker 2: again again. I don't want to sort of make too

538
00:33:38,356 --> 00:33:40,956
Speaker 2: much of an analogy with a human relationship, but it was, Yeah,

539
00:33:40,996 --> 00:33:42,516
Speaker 2: it was kind of like the final goodbye.

540
00:33:43,036 --> 00:33:46,676
Speaker 1: Wow, I'm glad you had that moment of goodbye. So,

541
00:33:46,916 --> 00:33:49,676
Speaker 1: in reflecting back then, I'm wondering if you can tell

542
00:33:49,716 --> 00:33:55,396
Speaker 1: me what this lass has taught you about yourself and

543
00:33:55,436 --> 00:33:57,796
Speaker 1: how you had defined yourself, how you had defined your

544
00:33:57,796 --> 00:33:59,556
Speaker 1: self identity.

545
00:34:00,436 --> 00:34:04,796
Speaker 2: What I learned mainly was that I'm not in control

546
00:34:04,836 --> 00:34:07,836
Speaker 2: of anything. I can make all the plans in the world,

547
00:34:08,196 --> 00:34:12,036
Speaker 2: and control of anything. You know, life is so much bigger.

548
00:34:12,676 --> 00:34:15,356
Speaker 2: But actually, what was quite surprising that came out of

549
00:34:15,396 --> 00:34:18,516
Speaker 2: it was that I rediscovered my love of writing music,

550
00:34:19,316 --> 00:34:21,836
Speaker 2: which I'd always had as a child, but you know,

551
00:34:21,876 --> 00:34:24,436
Speaker 2: it was always on the back burner. And I met

552
00:34:24,996 --> 00:34:28,356
Speaker 2: a wonderful composer called Drew Masters a few years ago,

553
00:34:28,916 --> 00:34:32,836
Speaker 2: and he's, oh, gosh, I love his music so much,

554
00:34:32,876 --> 00:34:35,356
Speaker 2: and I'd always loved his music, and so when we met,

555
00:34:35,516 --> 00:34:40,996
Speaker 2: we just clicked and this energy just suddenly emerged. It

556
00:34:41,036 --> 00:34:43,916
Speaker 2: was like this energy was born. And so it was

557
00:34:43,956 --> 00:34:46,476
Speaker 2: almost like this, So this relationship that I had with

558
00:34:46,516 --> 00:34:49,636
Speaker 2: my violin where we were a unit, I discovered in

559
00:34:49,676 --> 00:34:54,076
Speaker 2: this partnership with Drew as a composer. So we started writing,

560
00:34:54,916 --> 00:34:58,316
Speaker 2: nothing really serious, just sort of messing around a little

561
00:34:58,316 --> 00:35:01,876
Speaker 2: bit in the studio, and we discovered, actually that we

562
00:35:01,956 --> 00:35:05,236
Speaker 2: almost have this telepathy with each other. I'll have an idea,

563
00:35:05,276 --> 00:35:07,356
Speaker 2: He'll have an idea, and we just go. We just

564
00:35:07,436 --> 00:35:09,636
Speaker 2: go with it. We just go with the flow. I

565
00:35:09,636 --> 00:35:13,436
Speaker 2: feel like my identity as Minca, and that's the name

566
00:35:13,476 --> 00:35:17,196
Speaker 2: of the collaboration between Drew and me. I feel like

567
00:35:17,316 --> 00:35:22,876
Speaker 2: Minca is now massively part of my identity. But then

568
00:35:22,996 --> 00:35:26,556
Speaker 2: so was my violin. So what happens when one identity

569
00:35:27,516 --> 00:35:30,596
Speaker 2: goes and another one is born? What happens to the

570
00:35:30,636 --> 00:35:33,836
Speaker 2: old identity? Is it just part of my past? Am

571
00:35:33,876 --> 00:35:37,716
Speaker 2: I bringing part of that identity into Minca? There's questions

572
00:35:37,716 --> 00:35:41,676
Speaker 2: I ask myself every day, actually, because I think there's room.

573
00:35:42,596 --> 00:35:46,076
Speaker 2: I think there's room for all of these different identities.

574
00:35:47,036 --> 00:35:50,876
Speaker 2: And I'm not the same person that I was. It's

575
00:35:50,916 --> 00:35:55,756
Speaker 2: almost like there's me pre violin, there's me. There was

576
00:35:55,796 --> 00:35:58,716
Speaker 2: me pre my violin. There was me and my violin,

577
00:35:59,276 --> 00:36:02,716
Speaker 2: and there's me post my violin, and we are three

578
00:36:02,716 --> 00:36:06,076
Speaker 2: different people. I mean, obviously, you know, the essence, the

579
00:36:06,116 --> 00:36:09,676
Speaker 2: core of a person doesn't change. My soul the same,

580
00:36:10,196 --> 00:36:13,716
Speaker 2: my heart is the same, but I have changed. And

581
00:36:14,356 --> 00:36:18,356
Speaker 2: I look at those years with my violin, like there

582
00:36:18,356 --> 00:36:22,316
Speaker 2: were these sort of ten technically years where everything was

583
00:36:22,356 --> 00:36:25,996
Speaker 2: just massively, massively vibrant. I think I was scared. I

584
00:36:26,116 --> 00:36:30,876
Speaker 2: was fearful that I would never find joy, real joy again.

585
00:36:31,316 --> 00:36:33,876
Speaker 2: But you know what, I feel so joyful now.

586
00:36:34,076 --> 00:36:37,356
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, that's so wonderful, I really really do. I

587
00:36:37,396 --> 00:36:39,036
Speaker 1: can see it. I can see it in your face.

588
00:36:39,076 --> 00:36:40,796
Speaker 1: I can see it in your smile. I mean, the

589
00:36:40,876 --> 00:36:43,756
Speaker 1: joy is so evident. What I'm hearing is that you

590
00:36:43,916 --> 00:36:48,476
Speaker 1: found that there are many mins you can be yes

591
00:36:48,596 --> 00:36:49,956
Speaker 1: when it comes to loving music.

592
00:36:50,116 --> 00:36:50,276
Speaker 2: Right.

593
00:36:50,356 --> 00:36:53,356
Speaker 1: So, I think before you had a very tight grasp

594
00:36:53,436 --> 00:36:56,676
Speaker 1: around Okay, min is the concert violinist who plays this

595
00:36:56,796 --> 00:37:01,476
Speaker 1: strad and you're still a musician, You're still a violinist.

596
00:37:01,516 --> 00:37:04,836
Speaker 1: But I sense that there's a greater capaciousness there, like

597
00:37:04,876 --> 00:37:06,996
Speaker 1: there's more space and more freedom for you to be

598
00:37:07,076 --> 00:37:08,916
Speaker 1: many things within that category.

599
00:37:08,876 --> 00:37:12,316
Speaker 2: Yeah. I actually feel as though what's happening is I'm

600
00:37:12,356 --> 00:37:15,956
Speaker 2: actually going through what most people go through in their adolescence,

601
00:37:16,316 --> 00:37:21,556
Speaker 2: which is, you know, experimenting, testing the boundaries, pushing the boundaries,

602
00:37:21,916 --> 00:37:25,996
Speaker 2: you know, finding who you are, and having done that,

603
00:37:26,036 --> 00:37:30,916
Speaker 2: I accidentally realized that there's this whole new world of music.

604
00:37:30,996 --> 00:37:35,036
Speaker 2: It's like I actually physically feel something in me blossoming.

605
00:37:35,076 --> 00:37:39,196
Speaker 2: I feel every day I wake up and I'm so happy.

606
00:37:39,276 --> 00:37:40,876
Speaker 2: I'm so happy to get out. I mean, I don't

607
00:37:40,916 --> 00:37:44,556
Speaker 2: mean that I'm kind of always ecstatic or anything like that,

608
00:37:44,676 --> 00:37:48,836
Speaker 2: but there's always a point in the day where I

609
00:37:48,956 --> 00:37:51,756
Speaker 2: just have this massive sort of dopamine hit because the

610
00:37:51,876 --> 00:37:54,716
Speaker 2: music is just so beautiful and I just can't bear it.

611
00:37:54,396 --> 00:38:14,196
Speaker 3: It's yeah, so free.

612
00:38:15,356 --> 00:38:18,476
Speaker 1: This is Men playing an original song called Queen's Gambit

613
00:38:18,676 --> 00:39:38,676
Speaker 1: from her new project Minka. Hey, thanks so much for listening.

614
00:39:39,356 --> 00:39:42,196
Speaker 1: Join me next week when we finish our series on AWE.

615
00:39:42,876 --> 00:39:45,996
Speaker 1: In our first episode of the series, psychologist Daker Keltner

616
00:39:46,076 --> 00:39:49,556
Speaker 1: spoke about a surprising source of AWE called collective effervescence.

617
00:39:50,196 --> 00:39:53,196
Speaker 1: It's the feeling we get when we experience something transcendent

618
00:39:53,316 --> 00:39:56,676
Speaker 1: with other people. Next week, I talked to doctor Shira

619
00:39:56,756 --> 00:40:00,316
Speaker 1: Gabriel about the science of collective effervescence and how we

620
00:40:00,356 --> 00:40:03,396
Speaker 1: can access it more in our everyday lives. See you

621
00:40:03,476 --> 00:40:16,676
Speaker 1: next week. A Slight Change of Plans is created, written

622
00:40:16,716 --> 00:40:20,116
Speaker 1: and executive produced by me Maya Schunker. The Slight Change

623
00:40:20,156 --> 00:40:24,236
Speaker 1: family includes our showrunner Tyler Green, our senior editor Kate

624
00:40:24,316 --> 00:40:29,036
Speaker 1: Parkinson Morgan, our sound engineer Andrew Bstola, and our producer

625
00:40:29,156 --> 00:40:33,196
Speaker 1: Tricia Bobita. Louis Scara wrote our delightful theme song, and

626
00:40:33,276 --> 00:40:37,036
Speaker 1: Ginger Smith helped arrange the vocals. Special thanks this week

627
00:40:37,076 --> 00:40:40,356
Speaker 1: to Min Kim and Drew Masters, who write and perform

628
00:40:40,436 --> 00:40:43,556
Speaker 1: as the musical duo Minca. You heard part of their

629
00:40:43,596 --> 00:40:46,796
Speaker 1: song Queens Gambit in this episode. You can find more

630
00:40:46,836 --> 00:40:50,156
Speaker 1: of their music at sounds like ninca dot com that's

631
00:40:50,316 --> 00:40:53,396
Speaker 1: m I n Ka. We also heard a bit of

632
00:40:53,436 --> 00:40:57,116
Speaker 1: Min's performance of Brahms from her album Gone, released as

633
00:40:57,156 --> 00:41:00,516
Speaker 1: a companion to her memoir by the same name. Special

634
00:41:00,556 --> 00:41:03,356
Speaker 1: thanks also to my friend Rachel Lee, who I've known

635
00:41:03,396 --> 00:41:06,196
Speaker 1: since I was nine years old, for letting us play

636
00:41:06,236 --> 00:41:09,076
Speaker 1: a bit of her performance of the Mendelssohn Violin Concerto.

637
00:41:09,636 --> 00:41:12,396
Speaker 1: A Slight Change of Plans is a production of Pushkin Industry,

638
00:41:12,516 --> 00:41:15,876
Speaker 1: so big thanks to everyone there, and of course that's

639
00:41:16,076 --> 00:41:19,156
Speaker 1: very special thanks to Jimmy Wing. You can follow A

640
00:41:19,196 --> 00:41:22,316
Speaker 1: Slight Change of Plans on Instagram at doctor Maya Schunker.

641
00:41:46,276 --> 00:41:49,076
Speaker 2: I have that thing, what's it called earworm where you

642
00:41:49,156 --> 00:41:52,436
Speaker 2: hear music and it's constant, and even now I'm always

643
00:41:52,436 --> 00:41:54,396
Speaker 2: hearing music in my head and sometimes it drives me

644
00:41:54,476 --> 00:41:57,116
Speaker 2: mad because i can't sleep because I've got music going

645
00:41:57,116 --> 00:41:59,116
Speaker 2: on in my head and i can't put ear plugs

646
00:41:59,156 --> 00:42:02,716
Speaker 2: in block out people snoring, but I can't block out

647
00:42:02,756 --> 00:42:03,196
Speaker 2: the music.

648
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Speaker 1: I hear you, by the way, like every Taylor Swift

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Speaker 1: song eventually finds its way into my head right right,

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Speaker 1: So yeah, I'm glad it's Beethoven for you. For me,

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Speaker 1: it's Tess

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Speaker 2: Mhm