1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:03,360 Speaker 1: This podcast has content that may not be appropriate for 2 00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 1: all audiences. You'll hear about some difficult subjects like drug abuse, 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 1: domestic violence, suicidal thoughts, and sexual assault. Listener discretion is advised. 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:23,760 Speaker 1: Episode five, Drugs, doctors and Mormons. We all have what 5 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: if moments in our life. Moments we look back on 6 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:29,240 Speaker 1: and think, huh, my life could have turned out so 7 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: differently if I had taken that job or state in 8 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: that relationship. Moments where we zigged but we could have zagged. 9 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 1: I have plenty of these. When I'm feeling low. It's 10 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: easy to look back and feel upset, but I know 11 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 1: we often have a romanticized view of what could have happened. Often, 12 00:00:47,479 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 1: but not always, I realized I made the right choice 13 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 1: at the time. It's easier to do that when it's 14 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:57,640 Speaker 1: decisions I've made. But something I've been grappling with is 15 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: how to accept the decisions that other people have made 16 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 1: and how they've impacted me. After my parents got divorced, 17 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:07,400 Speaker 1: my mom had a string of relationships and an enduring 18 00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 1: love affair with drugs. Stories like how my mom and 19 00:01:10,920 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: I lived on a Mormon form for a while put 20 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 1: a different life that would have been or how she 21 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: dated a doctor, lem Leitcha. I love that one. Even 22 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:23,600 Speaker 1: now I look back and think, damn, I could have 23 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:26,560 Speaker 1: had a doctor for a dad. That would have solved everything. 24 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: If my mom had zigged instead of zagged, maybe my 25 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 1: life would have turned out differently. But like we just 26 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 1: learned with a kidnapping story, I bet reality is a 27 00:01:36,040 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 1: bit more complicated than I'm giving my mom credit for. 28 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: I revisited my whatifs, but now I want to revisit 29 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 1: her what ifs. I'm emmy and this is crumbs. It's 30 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: a show what the things we settle for and the 31 00:01:50,760 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: fits of ourselves that make us who we are. So 32 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 1: after the time I went missing, it sounds like Mimilita 33 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: took on a bigger role again. He moved back in 34 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:10,120 Speaker 1: with her and she took over. And then after that 35 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 1: life took some really strange turns. Take me back to 36 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:14,800 Speaker 1: that time. 37 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:18,720 Speaker 2: I stayed at Mamilicha's house for a long time. 38 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 1: That was my home. 39 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:23,639 Speaker 2: I didn't have to pay rent, I had a live 40 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:27,519 Speaker 2: in babysitter. I could come and go as I please, 41 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 2: so it was a perfect place to be. I did 42 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 2: go back to school for a while. I was going 43 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:39,359 Speaker 2: to high school second session in the evenings, and then 44 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 2: I'd go out and party on the weekends. So I 45 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 2: remember there was this Halloween party close by and everybody 46 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 2: was talking about and so I really wanted to go 47 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 2: to this party. There was a house party, there was 48 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 2: a lot of people, everyone was wearing costs to I 49 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:04,839 Speaker 2: was a nun. And then I remember there was this 50 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 2: one guy there. I thought he was so good looking 51 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,680 Speaker 2: and he was just so popular. I mean like all 52 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 2: the girls were trying to talk to him and dance 53 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:20,519 Speaker 2: with him. This guy was tall, he was blonde, he 54 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:24,440 Speaker 2: had beautiful green eyes. He had this confidence about him 55 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 2: that just attracted. 56 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:26,800 Speaker 1: Me to him. 57 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,079 Speaker 2: And I told my friend, I want to go home 58 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 2: with that guy. I'm going to go home with that guy. 59 00:03:40,640 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 2: And next thing you know, I'm waking up. I opened 60 00:03:43,760 --> 00:03:47,480 Speaker 2: my eyes and I don't know where I'm at, but 61 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,760 Speaker 2: there's this guy next to me in a bed, and 62 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 2: I'm like, what the fuck? I was in bed with 63 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 2: that guy at that party. And next thing you know, 64 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 2: there's noises and he wakes up and he's helping me 65 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,200 Speaker 2: jump out a window because his mom's about to walk 66 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 2: into the room. Good out of a window. I had 67 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,120 Speaker 2: no idea where I was or who I was with. 68 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 2: But yes, I was wearing a Nuns costume. 69 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:23,919 Speaker 1: Sounds it just sounds ridiculous. 70 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 2: I remember we stopped at a gas station he put 71 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 2: gas in his car. I was so embarrassed, and he 72 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:35,520 Speaker 2: asked me where do you want me to drop you off? 73 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 2: And so he dropped me off at my house. I 74 00:04:39,640 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 2: got out of the car and I thought I'd never 75 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 2: see him again. And he showed up that evening. He 76 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:49,279 Speaker 2: came back looking for me, and the next day and 77 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 2: the day after, and that's how my relationship with Robbie started. 78 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 2: And he was very different from what I was used to. 79 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:04,040 Speaker 2: Take me to a park, he would take me like 80 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 2: on real dates. He took me out to a really 81 00:05:07,880 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 2: nice restaurant. He took me skydiving, He took me to 82 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:17,160 Speaker 2: the bullfights, different things that I was used to. 83 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 1: Was it love? Were you in love with him? 84 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 2: I was in love with the different type of life 85 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 2: I was seeing with him. He was in a cholo 86 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 2: and so we started a more serious relationship. We moved 87 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:39,640 Speaker 2: in together to a cute little apartment in Schola Vista. 88 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:43,599 Speaker 2: You stayed with Mamilija. He was like a rich white 89 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,880 Speaker 2: boy exactly. He had a good job, he made good money. 90 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 2: We had a really good time. 91 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: At first. 92 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:58,200 Speaker 2: It was just a lot of fun. But he would change. 93 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 2: If he drank, he would change. He was like a 94 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:09,039 Speaker 2: doctor Jackal and mister Hyde. Once he drank, he became 95 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:16,919 Speaker 2: violent and very rude, and he was very jealous. 96 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 1: So what did you do? 97 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:27,800 Speaker 2: So I decided to move out. And then a few 98 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 2: weeks later I saw Robbie again and he told me 99 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 2: he was leaving town, that he was going to Utah 100 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:35,960 Speaker 2: to get sober. He was going to get clean from 101 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,720 Speaker 2: alcohol and drugs. Drugs that I didn't even know he 102 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 2: was using. 103 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 1: Wow. 104 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 2: So he leaves and we kept talking. He was trying 105 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:50,040 Speaker 2: to get clean, so he said. And he kept asking 106 00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 2: me to come to Utah. 107 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 1: Wait, why Utah? What's in Utah? 108 00:06:55,040 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 2: Family? He had a sister who lived on a farm. 109 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,960 Speaker 2: It was really remote, and she was helping him get clean. 110 00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 2: He would tell me about this life that we could 111 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 2: have together in Utah. 112 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:10,560 Speaker 1: We will both be. 113 00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 2: Clean and just like that, get away from everything. And 114 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 2: I'm talking to him, but I'm not really taking him 115 00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:23,480 Speaker 2: serious at first, right, he did sound different, just like better. 116 00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 2: When he was clean. He was a really great guy, 117 00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 2: and he sounded good when we talked on the phone, 118 00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 2: but I was like, Utah, what the hell am I 119 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 2: going to do in Utah? The same reaction that you had, 120 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 2: Just like, what's even in Utah? And then Mammi Licha 121 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 2: gets arrested and had changed everything for both of us. Yeah, 122 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 2: for both of us and my addiction, things got really bad. 123 00:07:56,440 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 2: And with Mammy Licha gun, I had to step in 124 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:02,360 Speaker 2: and be a parent to you. And so I'm still 125 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:04,960 Speaker 2: talking to Robbie and he keeps asking us to come 126 00:08:05,120 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 2: up to Utah, and one day I just bought the tickets. 127 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:18,240 Speaker 1: And we left. How did you make this decision to 128 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 1: just move to Utah, to just pick up and go. 129 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:24,920 Speaker 2: I think I was sort of vulnerable at this time. 130 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 2: I mean, my mother was in prison, the guy that 131 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 2: I loved was no longer there. I missed him, and 132 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:37,840 Speaker 2: because I had already started using heroin, this was like 133 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: my perfect chance to start over. 134 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:43,120 Speaker 1: And what made you take me instead of leaving me 135 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 1: with Mananna? 136 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 2: I took you with me because this was the perfect 137 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 2: opportunity for me to be that mom and maybe even 138 00:08:54,840 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 2: a wife to Robbie. I just had this perfect little 139 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:03,800 Speaker 2: visual in my head of the perfect family. We were 140 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 2: going to be in Utah, and then what happened. Robbie 141 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 2: was there to pick us up at the Greyhound station, 142 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,080 Speaker 2: so happy to see us. I was so happy to 143 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:24,400 Speaker 2: see him. I remember how. 144 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:24,840 Speaker 1: Cold it was. 145 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 2: It was snowing, and he had this little car that 146 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 2: barely ran. I feel like we were on the road 147 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 2: forever before getting to his sister's house. His sister and 148 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:47,440 Speaker 2: her husband were Mormons. They had five little boys, and 149 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:50,760 Speaker 2: she was really nice. It was a nice, comfortable house, 150 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:57,079 Speaker 2: and right away she told us you are not sleeping together, Hilda. 151 00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:01,200 Speaker 2: This is your room and your baby's room, and Robbie, 152 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 2: you'll be sleeping with the boys in this room over here. 153 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 2: I didn't really like that, but it was her house, 154 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,679 Speaker 2: so I was going to respect this, and he, of course, 155 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 2: was really mad. Turns out that Robbie already had a 156 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 2: job in the city, and so he would leave every 157 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:21,959 Speaker 2: morning super early to the city to work, and I 158 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 2: would stay home with the sister. And at first I 159 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:26,959 Speaker 2: remember thinking, what am I going to do all day 160 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:30,560 Speaker 2: while he's gone. I'm gonna be so bored. I guess 161 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:34,520 Speaker 2: I'll just watch soap operas or whatever. But little did 162 00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:37,400 Speaker 2: I know that I could not watch TV in a 163 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 2: Mormon house. 164 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:42,680 Speaker 1: You are like the most bold city girl ever. You've 165 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,320 Speaker 1: never even lifted a finger in your life for anything, 166 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:48,560 Speaker 1: well except to get your drugs, I guess. And now 167 00:10:48,559 --> 00:10:50,480 Speaker 1: you're on a farm in the middle of nowhere. 168 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 2: I never even made my own bed growing up. But 169 00:10:54,360 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 2: now I'm on this farm, and I'm waking up at 170 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:02,680 Speaker 2: the crock of dawn, and I would put on these 171 00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: big old plastic boots to go outside. God, it was 172 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 2: freezing over there. I'd have to spread all this animal 173 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:13,680 Speaker 2: feed in the snow and feed the chickens and the pigs. 174 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:18,920 Speaker 2: That was just the start. We did so many chores. 175 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 1: That's hilarious. 176 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:25,400 Speaker 2: It was. Then we'd have to bake bread. This lady 177 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:28,080 Speaker 2: had like seven kids, so we baked bread to make 178 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 2: the lunches. We had to sew curtains and go sell 179 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:36,000 Speaker 2: them at the thrift store. I've never worked so hard 180 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 2: in my life. 181 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:39,680 Speaker 1: Wait, so you know how a big bread? 182 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 2: I never made it after that, Like a chore for 183 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:46,319 Speaker 2: me is not fun. But I did learn a completely 184 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 2: different way of living. Like even you were having such 185 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:55,920 Speaker 2: a good time, a different type of fun. This lady 186 00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:58,880 Speaker 2: had all these kids, and they were used to the snow, 187 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,400 Speaker 2: so they were out there in the snow with no shirts, 188 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:05,679 Speaker 2: no shoes sometimes, and you were all bundled up with 189 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:10,280 Speaker 2: like two three jackets, a scarf, everything, But you were 190 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:14,839 Speaker 2: out there having a good time. This homestead thing. I mean, 191 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:17,920 Speaker 2: picture this chol on a fucking farm doing chores. And 192 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 2: Robbie's sister would also try to teach me about Mormonism. 193 00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 2: You're not exactly the Mormon type, mom, Yeah, I mean 194 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 2: I sort of figured that out quickly, but I still tried. 195 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:31,840 Speaker 2: These people were really nice to me, so I gave 196 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 2: it my best shot, and part of me really wanted 197 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 2: to fit in. You were so happy to just running 198 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:46,040 Speaker 2: around with all these other kids. 199 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 1: So weird. I don't remember any of this. 200 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:48,440 Speaker 2: I mean, you had a really good time, and they 201 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:51,079 Speaker 2: took you in with lots of love. They were a 202 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 2: very loving family, and I think I wanted that for us, 203 00:12:56,040 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 2: and I think you did too, as young as you were. 204 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 1: And where was Robbie. 205 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:06,959 Speaker 2: Robbie was away at work a lot, Like we were 206 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:10,200 Speaker 2: in this tiny little town, like forty five minutes away 207 00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:12,719 Speaker 2: from the big city, and that's where he worked. So 208 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:14,839 Speaker 2: he would leave at the crack of dawn, just around 209 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:17,400 Speaker 2: the time we would get up to feed the animals, 210 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:21,400 Speaker 2: he'd be leaving to work, and I didn't see him 211 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:25,040 Speaker 2: that much. At night. I was so tired from all 212 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 2: my chores that I would just go to bed early. 213 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:31,800 Speaker 2: It was just so quiet out there. I was doing 214 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 2: so much work, and on top of all that, Robbie 215 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 2: would come home late and drunk. He was usually. 216 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:43,839 Speaker 1: Drunk, so he didn't really get sober then. 217 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 2: No, it turns out that he was still drinking and 218 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:51,480 Speaker 2: he tried to sneak into my room at night, so 219 00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 2: I'd kick him out of the room. I was like, 220 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:57,080 Speaker 2: there's no way we're going to disrespect your sister's house. 221 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 2: She was very nice to us. She was strict, but 222 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:04,040 Speaker 2: I think that I needed that as well, because I 223 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 2: was cleaned the whole time. 224 00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 1: It's a way to think that could have been my life. Utah, 225 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 1: a farm, Mormons, manual labor. That's the opposite. 226 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:20,359 Speaker 2: Of us completely. 227 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 1: But it sounds like things were okay. So what happened then? 228 00:14:26,560 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: Why did we leave the farm? 229 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:39,960 Speaker 2: Well, Robbie, so we're living in Utah and one night 230 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 2: again we argued and he went out. It was maybe 231 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 2: a Saturday night, because the next day, I remember, his 232 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:52,360 Speaker 2: sister was going to church. He left, and after he left, 233 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 2: his sister told me, I think there's something you need 234 00:14:55,680 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 2: to know. Robbie has been talking to his ex wife 235 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:05,800 Speaker 2: on the phone. She lived in San Diego, and he's 236 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 2: been promising to bring her over here, and she doesn't 237 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 2: know that you're here already. He's thinking of getting back 238 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 2: with her. And I was like, oh, really, well, I 239 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 2: think it's time we call his ex wife and let 240 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 2: her know that I'm here. So we did. His sister 241 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:27,040 Speaker 2: and I called her, and of course she had no 242 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 2: idea that we were there, and we exchanged what we knew. 243 00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 2: When Robbie got home later that night, he was very drunk. 244 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 2: I remember he snuck into my room and I chased 245 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 2: him out of there. And in the morning he was 246 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:52,640 Speaker 2: so mad that he called his wife, his ex wife, 247 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 2: in front of me, and so she told him that 248 00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:01,800 Speaker 2: I had called her, and he was feary. He called 249 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 2: me into the kitchen where he was talking to her 250 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 2: on the phone, and I remember he was asking me, 251 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 2: is this true? Why did you call her? And next 252 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:15,240 Speaker 2: thing you know, he's hitting me on the head with 253 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:19,600 Speaker 2: the phone, and then he's banging my head onto the ground, 254 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 2: and his sister steps in to try to stop him, 255 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 2: and he pushes her, so she runs out to get 256 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:36,880 Speaker 2: her husband, and then that's all I remember. When I 257 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 2: woke up, I was on a stretcher, I had a 258 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 2: brace on my neck, and there was some police officers 259 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:49,320 Speaker 2: taking pictures of me. They were putting me in an ambulance, 260 00:16:50,480 --> 00:17:00,240 Speaker 2: and then they took me to the hospital. I had 261 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:05,000 Speaker 2: a fractured cheekbone, a broken nose. I had stitches on 262 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:10,119 Speaker 2: my left eyelid. My skull was fractured or something. Something 263 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:15,199 Speaker 2: was wrong with my skull. I was a mess, and 264 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:23,560 Speaker 2: Robbie went to jail, and I think it was the 265 00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 2: next day. He sent his attorney to ask me for bail, 266 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 2: myne ear or to not press charges. I'm not even sure. 267 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:35,640 Speaker 2: And his sister told that man to leave, to leave 268 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 2: me alone. She was very nice to me, and I 269 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:45,440 Speaker 2: remember asking where's my baby, where's Emmy? And the sister said, 270 00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:49,560 Speaker 2: your baby's been outside in the lobby all this time, 271 00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:54,360 Speaker 2: asking for you wanting to come in, and I said, no, 272 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:58,880 Speaker 2: don't let my baby come in the room. And then 273 00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:03,119 Speaker 2: the nurse opened the door and here comes Emmy running 274 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:05,919 Speaker 2: into the room and jumps on the bed with me, 275 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 2: and Emmy grabs my face and just looks at me, 276 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:17,439 Speaker 2: and in Spanish says, Tolvis does we won't need the 277 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 2: mommy smiling in my face. And I was just trying 278 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:28,520 Speaker 2: not to cry. You're still beautiful, mommy. 279 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:28,920 Speaker 1: Wow. 280 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:31,880 Speaker 2: But you don't remember that at all. 281 00:18:32,800 --> 00:18:35,080 Speaker 1: I don't remember any of that. I mean, I've heard 282 00:18:35,119 --> 00:18:37,679 Speaker 1: parts of the story, but I never realized how awful 283 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:47,399 Speaker 1: that was. It's just it's really sad what happened after 284 00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:48,240 Speaker 1: the hospital. 285 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,400 Speaker 2: His sister took me home after I was discharged from 286 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:58,720 Speaker 2: the hospital, and I remember I was there a week maybe, 287 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:02,400 Speaker 2: and then she told me you're well enough to travel, 288 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:07,919 Speaker 2: you can't stay here. And she put my baby and 289 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:11,919 Speaker 2: I on a Greyhound bus and I remember when she 290 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 2: was going to buy the ticket, I said, I'm not 291 00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:17,640 Speaker 2: going back to San Diego. I was afraid of going 292 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 2: back home because, like I said, my face was all 293 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:24,400 Speaker 2: missed up. If my mom found out what this guy 294 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:28,200 Speaker 2: did to me, she would have had him killed. I 295 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 2: knew what my parents were capable of, and so I 296 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:36,239 Speaker 2: went to Oxnard to hide at a relatives home. We 297 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 2: stayed there for a month or two. 298 00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:46,119 Speaker 1: I never associate mim with eachha with that kind of 299 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:52,159 Speaker 1: level of violence. I think knowing what she did for 300 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 1: work and the people that she was connected to makes 301 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 1: total sense that that's probably what would have happened. I 302 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:02,919 Speaker 1: just I don't see her doing that, but I know 303 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: she would have, if that makes any sense. How did 304 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:11,119 Speaker 1: this relationship with Robbie impact you and what was it 305 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:14,239 Speaker 1: like just seeing like this vision of what you had 306 00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:16,119 Speaker 1: created in your head, of what your life was going 307 00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: to be like in Utah just be completely destroyed with 308 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:21,000 Speaker 1: this tragic thing that happened. 309 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:26,640 Speaker 2: When we got on that Greyhound bus back to Oxnard 310 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 2: and then ox start to San Diego, I remember feeling 311 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 2: like there was no hope for me. I went to 312 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 2: Utah with so many hopes and dreams of having a 313 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 2: family with Robbie and my baby, and on my way back, 314 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 2: I guess I felt like, fuck it. When I get 315 00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:54,200 Speaker 2: to San Diego, there's no hope for me. What's left heroin. 316 00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:58,119 Speaker 2: Heroin is the only thing that I have that's going 317 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 2: to make me feel whole, that's always going to be 318 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 2: there to take care of me. 319 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:12,439 Speaker 1: It's very sad to hear, you know, someone so young, 320 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:17,880 Speaker 1: just completely surrendered to addiction and say, I give up, 321 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:19,720 Speaker 1: like this is what my life is going to be like, 322 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 1: you know, someone's so young with their whole life ahead themselves. 323 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:29,160 Speaker 2: For me, there was nothing left. I had a failed marriage, 324 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:33,720 Speaker 2: a second filed relationship, you know, I just I just 325 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 2: felt really low about myself, and that's when my my 326 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 2: addiction took off full force. I don't think that there 327 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:47,600 Speaker 2: were any hopes of stopping for a long time after that. 328 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 1: What did you do then? 329 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 2: I just remember that I was so strung out, and 330 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 2: I was out of money, and I was I had 331 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 2: no more jewelry to s and I was really scared 332 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 2: of my mom finding out. And I went to my 333 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:09,960 Speaker 2: sister and I told her. I told her about my addiction, 334 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:14,840 Speaker 2: and she took me to a private clinic in Mexico 335 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,439 Speaker 2: and they gave me some medication that just helped me 336 00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 2: withdraw from the heroine. I'd stay there a couple of 337 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:27,560 Speaker 2: weeks and then go home. But I kept in touch 338 00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 2: with the nurse and he invited me out to dinner. 339 00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:41,400 Speaker 2: But I was interested in the doctor. He owned a pharmacy, 340 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 2: and so I befriended the doctor and I started going 341 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 2: out with him, and I started getting valuum and rohip 342 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:56,439 Speaker 2: nol and whatever I wanted, and we started dating. This 343 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,840 Speaker 2: was the perfect man in the eyes of Mommy Lee Champapa. 344 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 2: They wanted me to marry this man and live happily 345 00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 2: ever after. He was the answer to all my problems. 346 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:16,520 Speaker 2: So Ma Relisha liked him very much because he was 347 00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:20,960 Speaker 2: a doctor. He was good enough for you in her eyes. Yes, 348 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:26,880 Speaker 2: superficially he was great. But I mean the doctor had 349 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 2: his own demons. You know, he was an addict himself. 350 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 1: Wait what, I never knew that. 351 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:40,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, he was addicted to cocaine. And I just remember 352 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 2: one time it was his birthday and we were on 353 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 2: our way to his party, but we had to go 354 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:47,920 Speaker 2: all the way to LA to pick up his coke. 355 00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,120 Speaker 2: So we drive to LA and he picks up this 356 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:54,680 Speaker 2: massive bag of coke and I'm talking like a sandwich 357 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 2: bag filled with coke. That's what I remember, anyway, And 358 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:01,840 Speaker 2: so we're driving back to San Diego and by the 359 00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:04,120 Speaker 2: time we got back to San Diego, like a two 360 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:07,840 Speaker 2: hour drive with no traffic, his party goodies are gone. 361 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 1: Holy shit. Yeah. Growing up, I always had this image 362 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:18,560 Speaker 1: of someone who was respected and established now he's wondered 363 00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: why you didn't go for him. I thought maybe he 364 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:22,439 Speaker 1: was too vanilla for you, But it sounds like this 365 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:23,880 Speaker 1: guy was a nightmare too. 366 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:28,159 Speaker 2: Well yeah, I mean he was very respected and he 367 00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 2: had like a double life. 368 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 1: But like you said, it was a good deal for you. 369 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:37,680 Speaker 1: He was giving you all these drugs, and Mamicha loved him. 370 00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:39,680 Speaker 1: So why did it end? 371 00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:44,040 Speaker 2: Well? I ended up meeting this other guy, and he 372 00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:48,199 Speaker 2: was an addict to a heroin addict, and so I 373 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 2: could probably relate better to him, and we started using together. 374 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 2: Then when his sister kicked him out of the house, 375 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,679 Speaker 2: we got married. So that ended everything with the doctor. 376 00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:00,439 Speaker 1: What the fuck you got married? 377 00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:04,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, we got married in Mexico, so I don't even 378 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:08,239 Speaker 2: know if it's legal, if it ever was legal. I 379 00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 2: did check the records one time, and I didn't find anything. 380 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:14,560 Speaker 1: I mean, what were you thinking? 381 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:17,600 Speaker 2: I think this was a time in my life where 382 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:22,520 Speaker 2: love was a factor for me. My only love was heroin. 383 00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:28,199 Speaker 2: I nothing else mattered. And if there was someone that 384 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,120 Speaker 2: was going to make it easier for me to have 385 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:37,080 Speaker 2: my heroine, then they were welcomed into my life. It 386 00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:39,120 Speaker 2: was more I was in love with what they had 387 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:43,480 Speaker 2: to offer me as far as my addiction, if that 388 00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:44,359 Speaker 2: makes any sense. 389 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 1: It's hard for me to hear that because I've never 390 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:54,560 Speaker 1: been able to have a relationship with someone based solely 391 00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 1: on what they could give me. But also just I'm 392 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:02,800 Speaker 1: saying this without judgment because I've never been addicted to heroin, 393 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 1: but I know lots of people who have been, and 394 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:09,640 Speaker 1: I know how powerful it can be. 395 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:13,919 Speaker 2: Yes, it's like you learn to play this game what 396 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:17,360 Speaker 2: will benefit me most? Who will benefit me most. It's 397 00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,439 Speaker 2: not about who will give me a better life like 398 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 2: stability or whatever, as far as a good marriage or whatnot. 399 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:27,840 Speaker 2: I mean, who's going to provide what my needs are? 400 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:32,359 Speaker 2: You know? And the only love I had was for 401 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 2: this drug. 402 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: I spent years resenting my mom for some of the 403 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,640 Speaker 1: choices she made when I was a kid, like why 404 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 1: didn't you date someone stable and hard working, like a doctor? 405 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,119 Speaker 1: Why didn't you get clean or be more present in 406 00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:52,080 Speaker 1: my life? And those feelings are fair. She really hurt me. 407 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 1: But hearing her version of events, I'm reminded that there's 408 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,879 Speaker 1: always more to the story. I always look back on 409 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 1: these better options, only to find out that it was 410 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:05,919 Speaker 1: more of the same. Robbie offered the simple life in Utah, 411 00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,439 Speaker 1: but he was also an addict, and he was brutal 412 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,239 Speaker 1: and violent. And the doctor was an ethical and an 413 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 1: addict too, so my life wouldn't have been that much different. 414 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:17,840 Speaker 1: It's like those movies where a hero is sent back 415 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,720 Speaker 1: in time to try and stop some catastrophic event, but 416 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 1: no matter how hard he tries, no matter what changes 417 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 1: he makes, he just can't prevent it from happening. It's 418 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:29,240 Speaker 1: clear that my mom did try to start over to 419 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 1: escape these cycles of addiction and violence. She definitely made 420 00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 1: her mistakes, but in her own fuck up little way, 421 00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:37,400 Speaker 1: she kept trying to make a better life for us. 422 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:42,200 Speaker 1: In my mind, what came next always felt like the 423 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 1: worst possible outcome, but now I realize it probably wasn't. 424 00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:52,600 Speaker 1: She met another man, an addict. Even though he was complicated, 425 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,560 Speaker 1: he was still the most present partner and father figure 426 00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:57,880 Speaker 1: in our lives. 427 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:05,040 Speaker 2: Next time on Crumbs, I realized that what I felt 428 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:09,040 Speaker 2: for Robbie or anyone else was nothing compared to what 429 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:10,240 Speaker 2: I felt for this guy. 430 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,760 Speaker 1: And you left me alone with a newborn baby. So 431 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:22,359 Speaker 1: where did you go? Hey, listeners, There's a lot of 432 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,480 Speaker 1: difficult subjects that we cover in this show. If you're 433 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 1: someone you know needs help, you can reach the Substance 434 00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:31,960 Speaker 1: Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration Hotline at one eight 435 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 1: hundred six six 'S two four three five seven. They'll 436 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 1: connect you with information and resources on treatment. There's also 437 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 1: the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at one eight hundred two 438 00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: seven three TA l K. Both are available twenty four 439 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 1: to seven. You don't have to be in crisis to 440 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:54,080 Speaker 1: reach out either. They're available for anyone who needs help. 441 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,600 Speaker 1: Crumbs is a Sonato production in partnership with Iheart's Michael 442 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:07,760 Speaker 1: Dura Network and Trojan Horse. It's produced by Hannah Bottom 443 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:13,160 Speaker 1: and edited by Margaret Catcher, Rodrigo Crespo and Alex Umero, 444 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:17,960 Speaker 1: with support from Elizabeth Schutzel. Original music by Die Peter 445 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:23,600 Speaker 1: Schmidt and engineering by Carols Magagna Emanuel Barra Studio, Recording 446 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 1: by j TV Recording and Podcasting Studio. Executive produced by 447 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: Cono Byrne and Giselvan Says for iHeart, Alex Fumetro and 448 00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:36,000 Speaker 1: Margaret Catcher for Trojan Horse, Gamila Victoriano and Joshua Weinstein 449 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: for Sonoro and me Emmi OLEA special things to Marina 450 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:45,960 Speaker 1: Coronella gire and of course my mom Il Gambois. Listen 451 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:49,880 Speaker 1: to Crumbs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 452 00:29:49,920 --> 00:30:03,120 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.