Speaker 1: Hey there, folks, Welcome to a special episode of Amy
Speaker 1: and TJ, a breaking news episode. I guess robes many
Speaker 1: people have seen by now the tragedy in DC. A
Speaker 1: plane crash is one thing. The way this happened, a
Speaker 1: collision with an army helicopter. Everybody presumed dead, but we
Speaker 1: are getting some new details. Got a lot today, yes,
Speaker 1: from the first responders, but we got a lot from
Speaker 1: President Trump today as well.
Speaker 2: Yes, so I know that a lot of folks were
Speaker 2: expecting to hear what we know. Of course, the condolences
Speaker 2: going out to the sixty seven people, and the families
Speaker 2: and the friends and the folks who are mourning them,
Speaker 2: all those condolences, but we weren't expecting to hear from
Speaker 2: the president Already some fingerpointing going on and fingerpointing in
Speaker 2: a direction that I don't think many people were anticipating.
Speaker 2: We heard President Trump today at his press conference squarely
Speaker 2: put the blame on DEI policies within the FAA, saying
Speaker 2: that the air traffic controllers that we did not have
Speaker 2: our best based on Obama and Biden administration policies that
Speaker 2: we had. We didn't have the brightest, we didn't have
Speaker 2: the folks that we needed to at the HELM or
Speaker 2: at least within that agency to make sure that our
Speaker 2: planes and our passengers are safe. In fact, he said
Speaker 2: that the policies jeopardized the safety of Americans.
Speaker 1: This was, I guess, strange surprising. It was maybe somebody
Speaker 1: could argue in line, maybe shouldn't have been the surprise.
Speaker 1: Given Donald Trump, he has signed executive orders taking DEI
Speaker 1: out of pretty much all the federal government, and so
Speaker 1: this has been We're not surprised that he would go
Speaker 1: after die policies. It was a little stunning that he
Speaker 1: did it the first time. We were hearing from the
Speaker 1: President of the United States, after a damn national tragedy
Speaker 1: that is still playing out on.
Speaker 2: Television connected dots that no one was expecting him to
Speaker 2: within I mean fifteen hours of the tragedy actually happening
Speaker 2: before NTSB investigators actually were able to go through and
Speaker 2: they're still going through the wreckage and the evidence that
Speaker 2: they're trying to recover from the Potomac, and.
Speaker 1: We should say, and we are, I guess we fall
Speaker 1: into it a little bit here, and it's unfortunate, but
Speaker 1: it has to be talked about, and I think some
Speaker 1: folks pointed out in the press room, like their bodies
Speaker 1: are still being recovered and blame is being placed on people.
Speaker 1: I mean, you talked about DEI policies. We would just
Speaker 1: talk to someone a short time ago. We don't know
Speaker 1: the race of anybody involved, no, no of any pilot,
Speaker 1: of any air traffic control.
Speaker 2: We don't have names of anyone involved, any of the
Speaker 2: victims who died at this point as of this recording.
Speaker 2: And so to go ahead and place blame was it
Speaker 2: was shocking. I think that is a word that a
Speaker 2: lot of folks.
Speaker 1: Used, and so I want to be clear not putting
Speaker 1: words in the president's mouth. How many of you might
Speaker 1: have seen it by now, but we want to be
Speaker 1: clear on what the president said. Again, he walked into
Speaker 1: the briefing room himself and made some opening statements, but
Speaker 1: he then took questions from the media. There. He was
Speaker 1: asked directly if he is saying that diversity policies are
Speaker 1: to blame for the crash. This is a direct quote,
Speaker 1: it just could have been. He was asked again later,
Speaker 1: how can you be sure that DEI is responsible and
Speaker 1: played a role in the crash? His answer, because I
Speaker 1: have common sense. So this set off a different conversation
Speaker 1: when we should have been having the only conversation, which
Speaker 1: is I guess sending love to those families, to the
Speaker 1: US military that lost as well. But instead another group
Speaker 1: of folks felt attacked by the President in this moment.
Speaker 2: You know, and typically when we have national tragedies, and
Speaker 2: this was certainly one. This is an aviation tragedy that
Speaker 2: we haven't seen in this country in decades. So this
Speaker 2: sort of event is shocking, it's traumatizing, but oftentimes it's
Speaker 2: unifying because we come together as a nation. We come
Speaker 2: together as a country and figure out what went wrong
Speaker 2: and what went right, and how to make sure that
Speaker 2: we massively limit or make sure this never happens again.
Speaker 2: And that is typically the direction we see our leaders
Speaker 2: take us in these moments, and we went in a
Speaker 2: completely different direction unexpectedly today when we heard from President
Speaker 2: Trump we.
Speaker 3: Must have only the highest standards for those who work
Speaker 3: in our aviation system. I changed the Obama standards from
Speaker 3: very mediocre at best to extraordinary. You remember that only
Speaker 3: the highest aptitude have to be the highest intellect and
Speaker 3: psychologically superior people were allowed to qualify for air traffic controllers.
Speaker 3: That was not so prior to getting there. When I
Speaker 3: arrived in twenty sixteen, I made that change very early
Speaker 3: on because I always felt this was a job and
Speaker 3: other jobs too, but this was a job that had
Speaker 3: to be superior intelligence and we didn't really have that,
Speaker 3: and we had it. And then when I left office
Speaker 3: and Biden took over, he changed them back to lower
Speaker 3: than ever before. I put safety first. Obama, Biden and
Speaker 3: the Democrats put policy first, and they put politics at
Speaker 3: a level that nobody's ever seen because this was the
Speaker 3: lowest level.
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course we can have a DII debate the
Speaker 1: country should Why not have that debate? And that's fine,
Speaker 1: just the moment to have it through a lot of
Speaker 1: people off guard today, but the focus will remain on
Speaker 1: this strategy for quite some time. They have told us
Speaker 1: they expect the search. They went from a search and
Speaker 1: rescue to simply a recovery effort that happened earlier in
Speaker 1: the day today, which is Thursday, but the work will
Speaker 1: continue for several days. We have been talking to several
Speaker 1: folks to get their expertise, and also one in particular
Speaker 1: that you're going to hear from was a witness. A
Speaker 1: witness robes I think. He says he watched his planes
Speaker 1: take off and land from that airport all the time,
Speaker 1: but of course this was something he never thought he'd
Speaker 1: see before.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he has a rooftop in Arlington. He said he
Speaker 2: can walk to Bake a national airport, and so he
Speaker 2: was out there. It was a little bit of a
Speaker 2: warmer night last night on Thursday night, excuse me, Wednesday night,
Speaker 2: and he happened to see the unthinkable. It was an
Speaker 2: unimaginable moment to witness something like that.
Speaker 1: So you're going to hear our conversation with him. You'll
Speaker 1: also hear our conversation with two pilots. One of them
Speaker 1: happens to be part of an organization that does work
Speaker 1: to promote diversity and is very much involved in DEI.
Speaker 1: You'll hear his reaction to what he heard the president say,
Speaker 1: and also explain why diversity is a positive and has
Speaker 1: never he made his point several times, never been attributed
Speaker 1: to being the cause of any.
Speaker 2: Any incident, any accident, and certainly not a tragedy on
Speaker 2: this scale.
Speaker 1: And then finally you'll hear from another pilot that we
Speaker 1: talked to and Ropes he said he's actually going to
Speaker 1: change some of his practices because of what happened in
Speaker 1: this stretchy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he said that he is going to when he
Speaker 2: lands his planes, he's going to behave differently after what
Speaker 2: happened and after what he's heard from other pilots. And
Speaker 2: certainly as we get more information from the wreckage, the
Speaker 2: black boxes, they haven't been found yet as of this recording,
Speaker 2: there will be I'm sure more changes, not only that
Speaker 2: pilots individually will make, but certainly policies within this country.
Speaker 2: But we thank you for coming to the podcast. We
Speaker 2: thank you for listening, and so we are going to
Speaker 2: now send you to the interviews with those three men
Speaker 2: we just described. Joining us now is Tennessee Garvey. He
Speaker 2: is a pilot at United Airlines First Officer where he
Speaker 2: flies the Boeing seven seven seventies. Also the chairman of
Speaker 2: the Organization of Black Aerospace Professionals.
Speaker 4: Tennessee.
Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us today.
Speaker 5: Oh, thank you, Amy, Thanks TJ for having me. It's
Speaker 5: a pleasure being here.
Speaker 2: I know you have been following the events, the tragic
Speaker 2: events of the last twenty four hours, and I'm sure
Speaker 2: you watched and followed President Trump's press conference this afternoon
Speaker 2: I'll first ask you just what your impressions, what your
Speaker 2: reactions were to what he had to say.
Speaker 5: Well, Kendily, my mouth was a jar. You know, it
Speaker 5: was just the events that happened. First and foremost, by
Speaker 5: heart goes out to the families because you know, there
Speaker 5: are six to seven lives lost and you know the
Speaker 5: impact of that can never ever be nicated. So you know,
Speaker 5: our heart just goes to the families, you know, with
Speaker 5: the Trump with President Trump, you know talking about you
Speaker 5: know DEI, you know, being the cause or being a
Speaker 5: contributing factor. There's really nothing further from the truth. You know,
Speaker 5: over the years, we've enjoyed a very robust safety culture
Speaker 5: here within the United States, especial when it comes on
Speaker 5: to aviation. And you know, just like with any incident
Speaker 5: or accident, you know there's a process to you know,
Speaker 5: you know, with the investigation and you know to try
Speaker 5: to find that cause. But you know, to come on
Speaker 5: the forefront with no evidence and with nothing you know
Speaker 5: to reference, it's it's very dishearten disheartening.
Speaker 1: Can you explain to folks, And let's get it straight,
Speaker 1: most of us are not looking at the qualifications where
Speaker 1: air traffic controllers on a daily basis, right, so we're
Speaker 1: we're not familiar. But what can you explain what he's
Speaker 1: he's talking about in suggesting because there was a change
Speaker 1: in criteria for applicants that I think you can help
Speaker 1: me on the years. I know you know it twenty fourteen,
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen, But can you help folks and explain what
Speaker 1: the president was talking about when he says the standards
Speaker 1: were changed and his words lowered, but there's a change
Speaker 1: in the standards for the applicants to become air traffic controllers.
Speaker 5: What I do know is that you know, when it
Speaker 5: comes to, you know, becoming under traffic controller, the attrition
Speaker 5: rate TJ is is very high. So you know there's
Speaker 5: so many hands that you know, they raise their hands
Speaker 5: there they apply and to go through the process. But
Speaker 5: the process is such that you know, not everyone makes
Speaker 5: it through. It's just one of those errors where you
Speaker 5: know it's the training program is very rigorous, and you know,
Speaker 5: the reality is, you know, only the best of the
Speaker 5: best make it through to the very end. So irrespective
Speaker 5: of you know, your gender, your race, your religion, creed,
Speaker 5: the process, the program doesn't factor any of that in,
Speaker 5: so you still all have to apply, you still have
Speaker 5: to be you know, you still have to meet the
Speaker 5: qualifications required, and the program is just designed such that
Speaker 5: only the best of the best will actually make it
Speaker 5: through to the very end.
Speaker 2: So what was your reaction then? And Trump said that
Speaker 2: the FAA has prioritized individuals with disabilities and other marginalized
Speaker 2: groups overqualified candidates, which therefore jeopardized the safety of everyone
Speaker 2: who flies.
Speaker 5: It was, it was very disappointing. Amy. So, you know,
Speaker 5: going back again to the training programs, So right now
Speaker 5: under the Biden administration, there's there's a conscientious effort to
Speaker 5: ensure that there are no barriers that existed for those
Speaker 5: that mean when to pursue a career within aviation airspace.
Speaker 5: And you know, Trump has since recented that, you know,
Speaker 5: via an executive order, but you know, there's so many
Speaker 5: barriers that tend to exist within aviation airspace, going back
Speaker 5: to even when our organization was founded, which is back
Speaker 5: in seventy six. You know, when the Tuskegee Airmen were
Speaker 5: transitioning out of you know, World War Two, only one
Speaker 5: to Skigee airmen actually made it to commercial aviation, and
Speaker 5: that was simply because our barriers that existed back then.
Speaker 5: Organization like ours is really geared towards workforce development, and
Speaker 5: our focus is to create an access to the underrepresented communities.
Speaker 5: So our aviation industry is very robust. But however, there's
Speaker 5: still a lack of representation in certain areas of aviation
Speaker 5: and aerospace, and organizations like US is really just geared
Speaker 5: towards workforce development and for those that may have, you know,
Speaker 5: the desire to pursecure within aviation aerospace, we're trying to
Speaker 5: create opportunities and provide access. We're not lowering to standards.
Speaker 5: We're not lowering to barriers. Again, you know, to my
Speaker 5: earlier point. If anything, anytime there's an incident, accident within
Speaker 5: this industry, we're all about safety. We're all about learning
Speaker 5: from it and you know, put in processes or policies
Speaker 5: in place to help us be safer on the back end,
Speaker 5: which I know we will do with this with this event.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 1: But then I say, you said you aren't lowering standards,
Speaker 1: But how do you convent the public of that when
Speaker 1: the President of the United States stands up and says,
Speaker 1: this accident is deadly accident may have happened because we
Speaker 1: lowered standards letting too many diverse folks in. That's that's
Speaker 1: directly almost attributing this crash is deadly crash to the
Speaker 1: diverse group of folks getting opportunities.
Speaker 5: So I would my response to that TJ is, well,
Speaker 5: let's look at it twofold. Let's first look at look
Speaker 5: at it statistically. Statistically, you know, polots out look like
Speaker 5: myself represent only four percent of commercial pilots flying within
Speaker 5: the industry. So out of every hundred pilots, only four
Speaker 5: of us look like myself. When you talk about black
Speaker 5: African women, props beelw one percent. So there is the numbers.
Speaker 5: So you know, in terms of you know, diversity impact
Speaker 5: and safety, there's really no correlation. And then secondly, let's
Speaker 5: look at historical data. There hasn't been any accident or
Speaker 5: any incident that can and be attributed to DEI. We've
Speaker 5: never seen it as a contributing factor. We've never seen
Speaker 5: it as you know, the soul cause it's just never happened.
Speaker 5: So to say, you know, diverse individuals are compromised in safety,
Speaker 5: that is not true. It's not statistically true, it's not
Speaker 5: historically true. What I will say is when it comes
Speaker 5: to organization like ours, our ethos is inspiring excellence, even
Speaker 5: though our hashtag is oh about excellence. So for those
Speaker 5: that want to pursue a current aviation aerospace, we're here
Speaker 5: to support you, we're here to mint you through all
Speaker 5: the way, and we're all about workforce development, but at
Speaker 5: every step of the way, we're all about inspiring excellence.
Speaker 5: So whenever you see somebody who looks like myself, you know,
Speaker 5: whether they're in air traffic controller or they're a pilot,
Speaker 5: just know that they're they've been trained to the very
Speaker 5: highest level of safety possible because we're all about excellence.
Speaker 2: Tennessee, it was interesting hearing you very clearly state there
Speaker 2: is never been any sort of accident or incident aviation
Speaker 2: accident or incident attributed to any sort of DEI policy.
Speaker 2: So when you heard the president, and we know that
Speaker 2: those policies are now under fire with all of the
Speaker 2: executive orders he's signed, but still, when you heard the
Speaker 2: president today, were you expecting him to go there? Oh?
Speaker 5: Absolutely not. Again, anytime there is a major event where
Speaker 5: there's loss of life involved, the first thoughts go to
Speaker 5: are their survivors, what happened and how can we learn
Speaker 5: from this? Nowhere in that does anyone ever think about,
Speaker 5: you know, skin color was the cause. And to hear
Speaker 5: you know, what's being you know, basically presented, which I
Speaker 5: really think is just you know, furthering an agenda is
Speaker 5: to say that DEI you know, is a cause. And
Speaker 5: it's again it's just very disheartening because for those of
Speaker 5: us that were very passionate about aviation and aviation safety. Again,
Speaker 5: you know, they were still recovering bodies from the river
Speaker 5: when he said that, So it really it just left
Speaker 5: a lot of us just we were just stunned.
Speaker 1: But how do you combat no matter what facts you have, Tennessee,
Speaker 1: he has a much bigger microphone than you do, how
Speaker 1: do you combat now what will now be a continued
Speaker 1: swelling of a perception. I would argue, of this idea
Speaker 1: that DEI is bad, and now then we'll be able
Speaker 1: to point to DEI is so bad that it's deadly.
Speaker 1: How are you messaging wise, just going to go about
Speaker 1: convincing the public that that ain't the truth.
Speaker 5: So you make a great point, teacher, in the sense
Speaker 5: that DEI, from my perspective, has been weaponized, and you
Speaker 5: know it's not for us to you know, to fight
Speaker 5: that fight in the sense that you know, I'm all
Speaker 5: about you know, a lot of our works, you know,
Speaker 5: show for itself. So our focus is workforce development, and
Speaker 5: our focus is create an opportunity, is for the underrepresented,
Speaker 5: and our focus will always be, you know, providing access.
Speaker 5: So the narrative might be, hey, DEI is bad, but
Speaker 5: our goal is to still, you know, stay true to
Speaker 5: our mission and still you know, for those that look
Speaker 5: like myself and our minorities within the space, we are
Speaker 5: going to work to make their dreams become careers, irrespective
Speaker 5: of the noise with d I. Because again, statistically, there's
Speaker 5: nothing to suggest that DEI is bad having somebody diverse.
Speaker 5: If anything, what we've seen and learned in corporate culture
Speaker 5: is d I is good. The companies that thrive throughout
Speaker 5: because they enjoy diverse workforce. So our goal is not
Speaker 5: to go into a fight or you know, to try
Speaker 5: to change the narrative of what DEI is. We're all
Speaker 5: about just our works and we're all about creating access
Speaker 5: and created opportunities. But underneath all of that, it's all
Speaker 5: about inspiring excellence.
Speaker 2: Tennessee, I know your first response and all of ours
Speaker 2: has been as well. Is just this gutted, awful feeling
Speaker 2: of the loss of life and just how horrific so
Speaker 2: many Americans are feeling right now as they're learning the
Speaker 2: news and realizing that they're never going to see their
Speaker 2: loved ones again. That is the focus. Does it feel
Speaker 2: somewhat surreal to be already defending a program that you
Speaker 2: so passionately have made your life's work and to imagine
Speaker 2: that there's already finger pointing at this point. I'm just
Speaker 2: curious where your head is given all that we actually
Speaker 2: typically would be focused on today, at this early hour,
Speaker 2: at this early point in the tragedy.
Speaker 5: So, you know, like Oshrian earlier with my colleagues, I've
Speaker 5: been in this space for twenty two years, never have
Speaker 5: seen anything like this, especially in terms of the response
Speaker 5: to an accident like that. So you know, to pivot
Speaker 5: from you know, are there any survivors to where we're
Speaker 5: now talking DEI. It hasn't even been twenty four hours.
Speaker 5: It's it's it's it's just stunning. It's it's stunning, and
Speaker 5: it's just, you know, it's it's unfortunately that we're even
Speaker 5: in this space even having this conversation, because you know,
Speaker 5: first and foremost, you know the lives of those involved,
Speaker 5: especially the military. You know, they're just a routine training mission,
Speaker 5: and you know here we have a major loss of
Speaker 5: life event. The focus should always be on that d I.
Speaker 5: I don't even know who the names of the pilots are.
Speaker 5: So to even say DEI is a thing? How can
Speaker 5: we even you know, bring that into the conversation when
Speaker 5: they have any released photos of the cruise so you know,
Speaker 5: whether it's the air traffic controller or whether it's the pilots.
Speaker 5: You know, it's like we're trying to spend a narrative,
Speaker 5: but we don't, like, do we know if they're you know,
Speaker 5: what their backgrounds are? I don't, so I find it
Speaker 5: very discoursion that again we would even try to say, hey,
Speaker 5: deis involve when they're still overcovering to bodies.
Speaker 1: Tennesse, you can I ask you one last and this
Speaker 1: on your expertise as a pilot, can you help those
Speaker 1: of us understand a little better a pilot trying to
Speaker 1: land there at Reagan on exactly the flight path he's
Speaker 1: supposed to be on and lined up with that on
Speaker 1: that final approach, it's dark, it's pitch black. How much
Speaker 1: can a pilot see going at that speed. Do you
Speaker 1: do you have any time to react? I suppose or
Speaker 1: are you completely dependent on that air traffic controller to
Speaker 1: tell you where you need to be.
Speaker 5: So I really try not to quarterback. You know these
Speaker 5: things I have flown into the airport, I've phoned that
Speaker 5: exact approach. So to your question of you know, what
Speaker 5: can you see at night? So from understanding, they're clared
Speaker 5: for the visual approach to runway one and then they
Speaker 5: would later ask if they could circle the land on
Speaker 5: runway three three. It's very routine thing, nothing abnormal about it.
Speaker 5: And you know the pilots, you know, they're in a
Speaker 5: position where they could safely make that manever to land
Speaker 5: on you know, runway three three. So usually at night,
Speaker 5: you know, it's it's a shared responsibility with the pilot
Speaker 5: with air traffic to making sure that space, that airspace
Speaker 5: is safe. One thing I will say is that air
Speaker 5: within the Potomac River it's a very busy airspace. You
Speaker 5: do have flights taken off the land and in Reagan,
Speaker 5: but at the same time it's a very heavily trafficked area.
Speaker 5: When it comes on to low level flying helicopters an
Speaker 5: aircraft because there's a V four quarter that exists right
Speaker 5: within that area. So it's it's a shared responsibility. And
Speaker 5: you know, I know with crews, we have systems on
Speaker 5: board that help us see and avoid other aircraft. But
Speaker 5: as you get closer to the ground, whenever you come
Speaker 5: into land, that system becomes inhibited. So you know, it
Speaker 5: may have you know, alerted the crew to our traffic,
Speaker 5: but you know, if they're at a montraaltitude, would have
Speaker 5: given them a resolution advisory, so whether to climb or
Speaker 5: to pitch. But you know, because they're so low into
Speaker 5: the ground where we're talking four hundred feet, that system
Speaker 5: at that point would normally be inhibited. But again going
Speaker 5: back to the tapes, and you know, somewhere along the
Speaker 5: liner is a loss of visual separation. It's a very
Speaker 5: you know, the the approach that they were shooting again,
Speaker 5: it's a it's a published procedure. There is nothing abnormal,
Speaker 5: but you know, somewhere along the liner's loss of separation.
Speaker 5: So there's a lot to learn because the focus is
Speaker 5: really to not let this happen once again, which again
Speaker 5: it's so unfortunate that instead of focusing on that, you know,
Speaker 5: we're having conversations that I wish, you know, we really
Speaker 5: shouldn't be having, especially so soon.
Speaker 2: Well we Tennessee. We so appreciate your experience and expertise
Speaker 2: on all of this today. So thank you so much
Speaker 2: for joining us on the podcast. We really appreciate it.
Speaker 5: Now, thank you for the timing, and again thank you
Speaker 5: for just seeing reasing this issue. Thank you.
Speaker 1: All right, Thanks brother, thank you so much. Sorry for
Speaker 1: the circumstances, but really good to talk to you. Good
Speaker 1: to meet youa man.
Speaker 5: Oh it's a pleasure. And Amy, thanks again for having me.
Speaker 5: You take care of him, you wealthy.
Speaker 2: Roy Bess is joining us now on the podcast. He
Speaker 2: was actually on his rooftop in Arlington so close to
Speaker 2: the airport he actually says he can walk to it,
Speaker 2: but unfortunately he saw the tragedy. The disaster happened right
Speaker 2: in front of his eyes. Roy, thank you for being
Speaker 2: with us today. We appreciate it. How are you holding
Speaker 2: up after witnessing what you saw?
Speaker 6: Pretty well? Just shocked.
Speaker 7: I'm still in shock about what's going on and just
Speaker 7: feel bad, you know for the people on the plane,
Speaker 7: the family and friends.
Speaker 6: Right now, now, what did you see take us through?
Speaker 1: What what was it around eight.
Speaker 6: Forty five, I guess at night take us through right right.
Speaker 6: So I was on the rooftop.
Speaker 7: We're out there, a lot of washing planes take off
Speaker 7: and land on a daily basis.
Speaker 6: And it's been really cold out here, probably the last.
Speaker 7: Month or so, and yesterday it was probably in the fifties,
Speaker 7: so it was a little.
Speaker 6: Nicer night compared to how the weather was.
Speaker 7: I was talking with one of my neighbors and I
Speaker 7: heard a loud sound. I turned to the left because
Speaker 7: the airport was facing to the side of me the
Speaker 7: way I was standing at that point, So I turned
Speaker 7: to the left and I saw a big ball of fire,
Speaker 7: kind of explosion, and then we saw just the breed
Speaker 7: going down to the to the river there, and that's
Speaker 7: when my neighbor she howled out, oh my god, on
Speaker 7: my god, that's a plane.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 2: You go out there, you watch Lane's land and take off.
Speaker 2: It's beautiful to witness. I can't even imagine seeing that,
Speaker 2: and it's just a horrific thing to witness. Can you
Speaker 2: tell me what what you were feeling? Did you immediately
Speaker 2: realize what you were seeing, what you were hearing? What
Speaker 2: did it sound like?
Speaker 7: It was very loud and again I was just in
Speaker 7: shock at first. You know, you're kind of thinking, okay,
Speaker 7: you're buy the airport, but you don't. You don't think
Speaker 7: you're going to see anything happen like that. So I
Speaker 7: don't know, maybe for a split second, it was like
Speaker 7: kind of a denial, Okay, did we just see what
Speaker 7: we thought we saw? And then one of my uh
Speaker 7: once it was a girl I was speaking to and
Speaker 7: it was another guy.
Speaker 6: He was like, yeah, it was playing this plane.
Speaker 7: And then the other guy was like, yeah, I think
Speaker 7: something else hit the plane. And because I wasn't able
Speaker 7: to see the helicopter when everything was falling, it just
Speaker 7: seemed like, yeah, a couple of pieces go side left
Speaker 7: and right, but it just felt like it was just
Speaker 7: one piece coming down the river.
Speaker 6: So it was just but after that we realized what happened.
Speaker 6: What happened?
Speaker 1: Well, I was gonna ask Roy, did you know pretty
Speaker 1: immediately that you were witnessing a major disaster?
Speaker 6: Oh? Definitely, definitely.
Speaker 7: Last night when I was looking at the news and everything,
Speaker 7: I just know I just new, excuse me, from what
Speaker 7: I saw that there was probably gonna be no chance
Speaker 7: of survivors.
Speaker 6: Wow.
Speaker 2: Wow, How how long did you did you keep watching
Speaker 2: how quickly did emergency crews arrive on the scene, Just
Speaker 2: watching the aftermath and the response to something that catastrophic,
Speaker 2: did you did you stay out on the roof to watch?
Speaker 6: Yeah, we stayed on the rooftop.
Speaker 7: I want to say the response from the airport was
Speaker 7: almost immediate. You just saw different cars and trucks going
Speaker 7: out on a floor on tarmac, and then I want
Speaker 7: to say, not even It's hard to say.
Speaker 6: Everything was just going so fast. Minutes ten minutes. You
Speaker 6: just saw emergency.
Speaker 7: Response coming from all different directions. Because where I'm located
Speaker 7: here in Arlton, I'm sure y'all have been to DC
Speaker 7: a lot.
Speaker 6: Crystal City.
Speaker 7: I'm right here where Amazon new headquarters is by the
Speaker 7: block Away.
Speaker 6: Everything is close. So they were just coming from highways,
Speaker 6: roads everywhere.
Speaker 1: Roy give folks an idea. We heard several people talk about,
Speaker 1: I don't anybody spend time in DC knows just how
Speaker 1: busy that air traffic is up and down the Potomac.
Speaker 1: Give us an idea from your perspective, just how high
Speaker 1: traffic is it. Usually you're there, of course with the planes,
Speaker 1: but also a lot of helicopters, a lot of military
Speaker 1: a lot of VIP traffic. How busy is it in
Speaker 1: the air Usually, I.
Speaker 7: Would say very busy, It's not It's normal for you
Speaker 7: to see helicopters, whether you're on the rooftop, on a
Speaker 7: bike or on a car, sea rooftop constantly, whether it
Speaker 7: be police helicopters, coastcard helicopters, and also the military helicopters,
Speaker 7: and those you see probably frequently because.
Speaker 6: Like I said, I'm right here in Crystal City.
Speaker 7: I'm only a minute or two or a few blocks
Speaker 7: away from the Pentagon and I'm only about two minutes
Speaker 7: away from DC, so it's almost.
Speaker 6: Like a taxi service. So yeah, they're back and forth constantly.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 2: And so you're watching all of this Eventually you said
Speaker 2: you went in and you watched the news coverage to
Speaker 2: see what was actually happening. What was that like knowing
Speaker 2: you had witnessed it with your own eyes and then
Speaker 2: actually hearing who was on that plane and just the
Speaker 2: level of the tragedy itself when you just saw the
Speaker 2: scope of it on the news.
Speaker 7: Just I wanted to say, once I started seeing everything
Speaker 7: unravel on the news, kind of reality set in to
Speaker 7: what happened. You know, when things first happen. You hear
Speaker 7: all different types of things and then you hear it
Speaker 7: was a jet. Any life is terrible to be lost,
Speaker 7: but you know you're a Jedi first. Okay, maybe it
Speaker 7: was five or seven or eight people, you know, which
Speaker 7: is bad in itself, but then you realize it was
Speaker 7: a slightly bigger plane and it ended up being sixty
Speaker 7: seven people, and that's just crazy.
Speaker 6: I think within the last.
Speaker 7: Year or so, we've actually had maybe two kind of
Speaker 7: close calls at d c A with planes.
Speaker 6: But you never think it's going to actually happen though.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you fly in and out of that airport, Roy, Yes.
Speaker 7: As you know, I'm close to Dulles Bwy. But I'm
Speaker 7: literally walking distance from National So even if the price
Speaker 7: is higher, I just right.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So how do you or what are your thoughts now
Speaker 1: about flying in and out? I know it's very very early,
Speaker 1: my man, but just the idea or the thought of
Speaker 1: flying in and out of that airport or DC and
Speaker 1: all that busy airspace.
Speaker 6: Now, I'm still.
Speaker 7: Pretty confident and the aviation and planes and everything.
Speaker 6: Uh like I would get on a plane tomorrow. Yeah,
Speaker 6: I don't. I don't feel anything way about it.
Speaker 7: Something you know went terribly wrong that shouldn't have went wrong.
Speaker 6: And you see the.
Speaker 7: Videos and then you hear there was some communications. I
Speaker 7: just have no idea how it happened.
Speaker 2: Wow, you were there to see it happen. And you know, Roy,
Speaker 2: we appreciate you telling us what you saw from your
Speaker 2: vantage point. Wasn't something you wanted to happen, It wasn't
Speaker 2: something you expected to happen. But we really appreciate you
Speaker 2: filling in what it was like to witness it, to
Speaker 2: see it. And thank you for joining us on the podcast.
Speaker 6: Are you welcome.
Speaker 7: I just want to say prayers to everyone that was
Speaker 7: on a plane and their family and friends as well.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Roy, thank you, thank you. And
Speaker 2: joining us now is Bobby Dutton. He is a licensed
Speaker 2: commercial pilot and a flight instructor. He's also has a
Speaker 2: platform called Think Like a Pilot, taking what he's learned
Speaker 2: in the cockpit and applying it to life. So Bobby,
Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. Sorry, it's under these circumstances.
Speaker 3: This is.
Speaker 2: A tragedy we have not seen in this country for decades.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a big one.
Speaker 8: I'm happy to be here, but yeah, I wish it
Speaker 8: was under better circumstances.
Speaker 2: So I know that everyone is trying to figure out
Speaker 2: what happened, and we're most likely not going to get
Speaker 2: an answer right away, investigators doing what they do with
Speaker 2: the NTSB there on the scene.
Speaker 4: But what have you seen?
Speaker 6: What have you heard?
Speaker 2: Do you have any thoughts about what you think is
Speaker 2: a pilot could have happened in this guy there.
Speaker 5: Over the poet?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean, well, of course, all the pilot forums
Speaker 8: are going crazy this morning with speculation and rumors and
Speaker 8: cockpit recordings and things like that.
Speaker 4: Most of it's constructive, obviously at the bottom.
Speaker 8: At the end of the day, the bottom line is
Speaker 8: we want to see what we can do, what we
Speaker 8: can learn, what we can change to, of course, minimize
Speaker 8: the chances of this thing happening. And the reality is
Speaker 8: ninety nine point nine nine percent of the time everybody
Speaker 8: gets where they're going safely, and it's great, and it's
Speaker 8: it's terrible that the unlikely point one percent is something
Speaker 8: really horrible like this. I did listen to all the
Speaker 8: cockpit recordings and all that. The thing that I noticed
Speaker 8: was was obviously the tragedy part is what everybody's talking about,
Speaker 8: But what really was impressive to me was the efficiency
Speaker 8: of the response. And that's where this pilot thinking really kicks. In.
Speaker 8: The way aviators communicate and coordinate and prioritize things is
Speaker 8: pretty insane.
Speaker 4: And when you think.
Speaker 8: About that, the fact that the controller was obviously listening
Speaker 8: and watching all the traffic in the air at the time,
Speaker 8: and you heard one pilot say did you see that?
Speaker 8: Have you all heard heard this recording already? And you
Speaker 8: could hear the emotion in the response, because of course,
Speaker 8: this is terrifying. There's a fireball off the end of
Speaker 8: a runway. This looks serious, this is scary. We've already
Speaker 8: got our hands full, but oh my gosh, something, something
Speaker 8: needs to happen to help do the best we can.
Speaker 8: And yes, you heard that emotion because this was a
Speaker 8: terrifying moment. But the fact that that controller was springing
Speaker 8: into action as quickly as she did was pretty amazing.
Speaker 8: She paused all the ground traffic, she said, if.
Speaker 4: You're on the ground, in an airplane or anything.
Speaker 8: Else, stop, Getting you where you need to go is
Speaker 8: not the priority anymore. She talked to fire control, told
Speaker 8: him exactly where to go. She said, half a mile
Speaker 8: off the end of the runway about right in the
Speaker 8: middle of the river, and so before anything even hit
Speaker 8: the water, there was probably help on the way, which
Speaker 8: there's something to be said for how impressive that is
Speaker 8: that people could react. Because I don't know about you,
Speaker 8: but when scary things happened to me that life or
Speaker 8: death serious, I freeze, like I don't want to react
Speaker 8: or be part of that reality. And part of what
Speaker 8: we train for as pilots is we do need to act,
Speaker 8: and we need act fast because it could make a
Speaker 8: real difference, and I think we saw a lot of
Speaker 8: that in the in the aftermath immediately following this horrifying event.
Speaker 1: Bobby, we don't know you, but I assume people in
Speaker 1: your circle, your friends and family would call you the optimists.
Speaker 6: Because of all this tragedy.
Speaker 1: I know we will find answers to what went wrong,
Speaker 1: but it immediately jumped out at you what went right?
Speaker 1: And that's worth noting as well. You did mention Because
Speaker 1: we don't have access to these message boards and all
Speaker 1: these group chats of you pilots, so I know there's
Speaker 1: a lot of chatter. Give us an idea in those chats,
Speaker 1: what is kind of the leading theory or conversation about
Speaker 1: what happened over the Potomac.
Speaker 4: Sure.
Speaker 8: Well, let me preface this by saying I am not
Speaker 8: an NTSB investigator. Sources on Facebook chats do need to
Speaker 8: be verified before anyone takes them too seriously. That being said,
Speaker 8: I mean any airport with international flights anywhere in Boston
Speaker 8: and New York are Class B restricted controlled airspace, which
Speaker 8: means you need to be talking to someone to even
Speaker 8: enter in the first place. You need to be really
Speaker 8: clear on where you're going and what you're doing. On
Speaker 8: top of that, in d C, they've got obviously lots
Speaker 8: of sensitive restrictions around political sites and people and operations
Speaker 8: and military stuff on top of that, and there's a
Speaker 8: lot a lot going on there. So frankly, it's a
Speaker 8: wonder that people can operate efficiently and safely in these
Speaker 8: situations and environments in general. On top of that, it's
Speaker 8: at night, which obviously you can't.
Speaker 4: See much visually.
Speaker 8: And then on top of that, when you're landing in
Speaker 8: a plane that weighs tens of thousands of pounds, that's
Speaker 8: a controlled descent into the ground, so you are not
Speaker 8: very nimble, you can't see much, and so to change
Speaker 8: the direction or speed of an object that large and
Speaker 8: heavy is no easy feet and so there's a lot
Speaker 8: of you know, trust and coordination going on. Where if
Speaker 8: I'm in Class B airspace and the controller tells me
Speaker 8: where to go, that's where I'm going.
Speaker 4: Period.
Speaker 8: I can't I can't be expected to be looking for
Speaker 8: helicopters out the window while dealing with this normal landing
Speaker 8: on top of that. And that's that's scary, because putting
Speaker 8: your trust in other people who are looking at radars
Speaker 8: and controlling lots of different airplanes, that's that's a lot.
Speaker 8: And again usually it works great, but what it sounds
Speaker 8: like is in these situations sometimes a controller will say,
Speaker 8: do you see this other airplane? They're two o'clock three
Speaker 8: thousand feet away, and you look around, and you're supposed
Speaker 8: to wait till you see it, of course, and then say, yeah,
Speaker 8: I see them. Once you do that, they might say
Speaker 8: avoid them, or go behind them, or land after them,
Speaker 8: so they can put some of that control right back
Speaker 8: onto your plate. And what I learned from this, of course,
Speaker 8: watching the consequences if visual separation doesn't work, if a
Speaker 8: controller tells me that, especially if I was flying tomorrow
Speaker 8: and this were to happen. I would be really careful
Speaker 8: about what I tell them I can see and if
Speaker 8: I'm not one thousand percent positive i am clear on
Speaker 8: which airplane I'm supposed to be avoiding. I'm not gonna
Speaker 8: I'm not gonna tell them. Yeah, I should be able
Speaker 8: to find them and avoid them. I'm gonna say, listen,
Speaker 8: I'm sorry, I don't see them. I'm not positive. So
Speaker 8: let's let's if I need to climb or turn around
Speaker 8: or come back in fifteen minutes, you tell me what
Speaker 8: I need to do to stay safe, because we obviously
Speaker 8: need to all trust each other and use all this
Speaker 8: crazy information and moving parts to execute this stuff safely.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Bobby, you started with the odds that in ninety
Speaker 2: nine point nine nine percent of all of these takeoffs
Speaker 2: and landings you have zero problems. I'm curious when it
Speaker 2: comes to the odds to think, as you're describing this
Speaker 2: massive plane coming in in a controlled descent, with the
Speaker 2: air traffic controller telling you you're on the right path,
Speaker 2: what are the chances that at the exact same moment
Speaker 2: that helicopter came into the exact same place as that aircraft.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's mind blowing to me. That those two
Speaker 2: events could come together at the exact wrong time.
Speaker 8: It's crazy and it's horrible. And when people see those
Speaker 8: maps of all the planes that are active over the
Speaker 8: US right now, and there's just thousands of them, it's
Speaker 8: a miracle. They're all avoiding each other most of the time.
Speaker 8: But think about that map you're looking at. It's two dimensional,
Speaker 8: and on top of the two D map, we've got
Speaker 8: tens of thousands of vertical feet too, separating them. So
Speaker 8: not only were those two aircraft in the unfortunate same
Speaker 8: latitude and longitude, but also the same altitude, and that,
Speaker 8: like you said, is just a horrible coincidence.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, that was my question. Just a horrible coincidence.
Speaker 1: We're trying to understand. This had to be a the
Speaker 1: pilots are at that time of night, you're totally dependent
Speaker 1: on what the air traffic controller tells you. I want
Speaker 1: to go back to what you said. They say, hey,
Speaker 1: do you see so and so on, You look out
Speaker 1: you in and say, yeah, I see it, and the
Speaker 1: air traffic controller kind of moves on. I'm sure you've
Speaker 1: seen the video where there seems to be a second plane.
Speaker 1: It is there. Okay, that's speculative. I don't want to
Speaker 1: go there, but there is a second plane. Even in
Speaker 1: seeing the videos, is watching it on TVs, I hear
Speaker 1: his video of the crash. I was for the first
Speaker 1: couple of times looking at the wrong plane and the
Speaker 1: wrong ball of light in the air because there was
Speaker 1: a second plane. Have you seen what I'm talking about.
Speaker 8: I'm not positive of the exact clip you're suggesting, but
Speaker 8: there were definitely at least a handful of other planes
Speaker 8: during working on a landing or departing. And that's that's normal,
Speaker 8: which is nuts. So within five miles of the airport
Speaker 8: there were probably a dozen planes, all already cleared for landing,
Speaker 8: all lined up in the right order.
Speaker 1: But Bobby the u all's practices are to generally the
Speaker 1: air traffic controller trust you. You say, hey, do you
Speaker 1: see it? You look out you in and say, yeah,
Speaker 1: I see it, and that's kind of the end of it.
Speaker 1: There's no further verification or anything.
Speaker 8: Yeah, once you get that landing clearance, you have the
Speaker 8: approval to use the runway.
Speaker 1: Wow, all that's an all clear right.
Speaker 8: Well yeah, and then again again not to I don't
Speaker 8: want to speculate too much, but what I believe happened
Speaker 8: is there's tons of people and traffic and aircrafts, then
Speaker 8: there's a military operation happening at the same time. Military
Speaker 8: does need to talk to the same tower and the
Speaker 8: same air traffic if they're in that same class B
Speaker 8: air space, so everyone should be on the same frequency.
Speaker 8: But what it sounds like is the helicopter was flying
Speaker 8: and they said do you see this other plane? And
Speaker 8: things were happening really fast in that moment, and I
Speaker 8: didn't hear helicopter pilots say yes, I see that plane.
Speaker 4: What do you need me to do about that?
Speaker 8: I just heard them then say, maintain visual separation, which,
Speaker 8: if I haven't confirmed I saw that plane, it's too
Speaker 8: much to ask me as a pilot to maintain separation
Speaker 8: of something I haven't confirmed I see.
Speaker 2: So yeah, And from when we heard that happening with
Speaker 2: the helicopter and the air traffic control, I believe it
Speaker 2: was thirteen seconds later, right, So, speaking of time, I'm
Speaker 2: also curious if the plane, if the American Airlines plane
Speaker 2: was only four hundred feet in altitude and was clearly
Speaker 2: over the Potomac, I mean, what were they thirty seconds
Speaker 2: one minute from landing? How close was that plane from
Speaker 2: actually hitting the ground.
Speaker 8: Oh yeah, less than thirty seconds from landing, which is
Speaker 8: hitting the ground in a good way. But yeah, there's nothing.
Speaker 8: I don't think there's any way they saw anything. They
Speaker 8: were focused on that landing. The runway was half a
Speaker 8: mile ahead. Everything was looking good, and then all of a sudden,
Speaker 8: it wasn't.
Speaker 1: Do we hear right from a pilot? I think earlier
Speaker 1: were saying a lot of the aircraft avoidance systems, those
Speaker 1: automated systems that of spose to alert you at that altitude,
Speaker 1: They're not going to help you.
Speaker 8: There's a lot going on. They're going to be warning
Speaker 8: you about terrain. They're going to say there's ground, which
Speaker 8: there should be.
Speaker 2: When I've sat close enough to the to the cockpit,
Speaker 2: I can hear that. Sometimes I can hear that's a ground.
Speaker 2: Oh no, are they supposed to be hearing that? Yeah,
Speaker 2: I have actually heard that when we're landing, and.
Speaker 8: I mean a normal landing. You know, I'm licensed as
Speaker 8: a flight instructor. I mean you see student pilots learning
Speaker 8: to land. It's it's a very difficult thing to teach
Speaker 8: because a good landing is, like I said, a controlled
Speaker 8: flight into the ground, and the one hardwired rule we
Speaker 8: all have as humans is good flying means don't ever
Speaker 8: fly into the ground, and sometimes you have to learn
Speaker 8: how to do that properly.
Speaker 2: Bobby with I know, obviously there are going to be
Speaker 2: so many lessons learned the very difficult way through this tragedy.
Speaker 2: But is there something that you're hoping will change. I
Speaker 2: know a lot of people have pointed to the traffic,
Speaker 2: the air traffic, and the obstacles as you mentioned so
Speaker 2: many no fly zones around the DC area, but specific
Speaker 2: to DCA, that there are some real changes that need
Speaker 2: to be made. As a pilot, what would you like
Speaker 2: to see happen?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean all the airspace management stuff is above
Speaker 8: my pay grade. But I know in the next week
Speaker 8: I'll get lots more notifications on pilot groups I'm in,
Speaker 8: I'll get a note from the place I rent airplanes
Speaker 8: for fun.
Speaker 4: I'll hear all kinds of stuff.
Speaker 8: And my own vigilant is just going to say, next
Speaker 8: time I'm landing, I'm gonna be twice as aware of
Speaker 8: every inch of sky I can see, and I'm going
Speaker 8: to be paying really close attention to the radio traffic.
Speaker 8: And you know what if I hear something on the
Speaker 8: radio that says, oh, there's some other operation going on.
Speaker 8: I think it's below me in a place I can't
Speaker 8: see very clearly. I might even ask the tower like, hey,
Speaker 8: is are we good? Like would it be helpful for
Speaker 8: me to come back in a minute. Obviously that's tough
Speaker 8: to do, and you've got lots of passengers trying to
Speaker 8: get on the ground safely, but get to get the
Speaker 8: landing done properly is definitely the priority we need to
Speaker 8: adjust to boost boost safety from that ninety nine point
Speaker 8: nine to nine percent as close as we possibly can
Speaker 8: to one hundred.
Speaker 1: Well, we do pilots how their favorites when it comes
Speaker 1: to airports, like I love flying into that one. I
Speaker 1: hate flying into that one cause it's tricky. That one's annoying.
Speaker 1: Do you all have that? And I guess where to
Speaker 1: do what a DCA rank for pifficulty?
Speaker 8: I have never personally flown in there, and just looking
Speaker 8: at the chart, I did that to get ready for
Speaker 8: this conversation.
Speaker 4: And even on a normal day when.
Speaker 8: Everything's fine, even if the President's not in town, the
Speaker 8: quietest day there is in DC, it is all read
Speaker 8: all restriction and if you drill down into what these
Speaker 8: restrictions are about.
Speaker 4: It's it's scary.
Speaker 8: I did a flight once down the Hudson Corridor, New York,
Speaker 8: which was challenged to see.
Speaker 4: Okay, this is this there's a lot going on. I
Speaker 4: got JFK and Laguardi and Teterborough.
Speaker 8: And lots of helicopters, lots of helicopters. But I did
Speaker 8: this training. I want to use this knowledge. I want
Speaker 8: to understand it. And I can remember just how busy
Speaker 8: that frequency was, and it's I remember reading the briefings
Speaker 8: that says you can be at this altitude, you can
Speaker 8: be from here to hear, but if you go this
Speaker 8: way twenty feet, we reserve the right to use lethal
Speaker 8: force to remove them from that space.
Speaker 4: They will shoot your airplane.
Speaker 8: Yes, and so like for somebody trying to have a
Speaker 8: learning flight, you know, that's pretty high stakes.
Speaker 4: So it's it's a lot.
Speaker 8: And any international airport is going to be really intense
Speaker 8: and really restricted and really controlled.
Speaker 4: And this is a good thing.
Speaker 8: But when you've got military operations, politics, restricted airspace, nighttime,
Speaker 8: heavy airplane, no visibility, it's it's a lot. So pilots
Speaker 8: love their jobs, but it can be it can be
Speaker 8: a lot mentally, especially at the end of a flight.
Speaker 8: You know they've been they've been going hard for a while,
Speaker 8: and it's it's hard to stay sharp and make it
Speaker 8: all work. But obviously everybody does the best they can,
Speaker 8: and there's a lot of training and procedures to make
Speaker 8: it work.
Speaker 2: Now we've been hearing that about air traffic controllers as well,
Speaker 2: and it makes perfect sense. I just wanted to ask
Speaker 2: you one last question, Bobby. You know, I was even
Speaker 2: saying I have taken for granted, how walking onto a plane,
Speaker 2: I just assume it's all going to be good. I
Speaker 2: haven't had fear, I haven't had any trepidation. But certainly
Speaker 2: people are going to feel that way now, people who've
Speaker 2: traveled today, people who have flights scheduled for the next
Speaker 2: days or weeks to come. What do you say to folks,
Speaker 2: how do you feel about the current status of this
Speaker 2: country's ability to land plane safely?
Speaker 8: Yeah, I think if you're nervous about flying, listen to
Speaker 8: the pilots.
Speaker 4: Listen to how they sound.
Speaker 8: Even in that recording, like I said, they weren't. They
Speaker 8: weren't out of control, they weren't too emotional. They immediately
Speaker 8: said Okay, what can I do given the situation. Yes,
Speaker 8: there was just a fireball in the sky, and yes
Speaker 8: this looks serious, but let's start acting right now.
Speaker 4: And that, to me is very impressive.
Speaker 8: And even the way when you hear a captain on
Speaker 8: a flight come over the intercom, like, think about how
Speaker 8: they sound. They don't sound stressed, where all of us
Speaker 8: on the ground we sound overwhelmed and stressed all the time.
Speaker 8: We're always I've got fifty text message unread, I've got
Speaker 8: sixty emails, I'm worried about this meeting tomorrow. I'm overwhelmed
Speaker 8: even on a normal day. And I think a lot
Speaker 8: of humans on the ground feel like that these days.
Speaker 8: And yet pilots are the one group that whenever you
Speaker 8: hear them, they sound so in control that we like
Speaker 8: to make fun of them as sounding bored. You know,
Speaker 8: they say, ladies and gentlemen, we're going to be flying
Speaker 8: at thirty eight thousand feet today. We're going to Miami.
Speaker 8: It's three thousand miles. Whether it's seventy degrees, it's a
Speaker 8: little windy, should be.
Speaker 4: Fine, have a great flight.
Speaker 8: I got this Like that kind of relaxation is not
Speaker 8: a a it's not put on for show. They've done
Speaker 8: this flight, they've trained an insane amount for everything that
Speaker 8: could go right and everything that could go wrong in
Speaker 8: the next couple hours, and they are relaxed, even though
Speaker 8: they're working on something that's much more high stakes than
Speaker 8: all this drama that's stressing us out as normal people.
Speaker 8: So put some faith in that process and the people
Speaker 8: that get through the filters to be qualified to be
Speaker 8: in that cockpit. They're there to take care of you,
Speaker 8: and they know what they're doing.
Speaker 2: Well, Pilot Bobby Dutton, we really appreciate your perspective and
Speaker 2: your expertise. It certainly helped us understand what happened today
Speaker 2: and what happened last night actually, and just the reaction
Speaker 2: that's going on today. So Bobby, thank you so much
Speaker 2: for your time today.
Speaker 4: Thank you for having me