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Speaker 1: The Hunting Collective is presented by Element. I guess I

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Speaker 1: grew up on a Hey, everybody, welcome to episode one

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Speaker 1: forty two. I always have to check with Phil for

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Speaker 1: the episode number. I'm about with numbers, names, words, writing, math, geography, math, spelling,

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Speaker 1: pretty much every basic human sect of knowledge. But we're

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Speaker 1: joined by Phil Taylor. Of course. I always say Hi, Phil, Hello,

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Speaker 1: how you doing, buddy? Doing good? How are you? I'm fine,

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Speaker 1: I'm fine fine. That doesn't sound just sound positive. It's

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Speaker 1: the time. It's you will. You'll know this when you

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Speaker 1: start hunting. It's a time right before elk season. It's

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Speaker 1: just like the run up the hunting season, and you

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Speaker 1: gotta do everything normal in your life. But you also

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Speaker 1: have to prepare yourself mentally, physically. You gotta get your

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Speaker 1: archery game right. You gotta get your calls out, you

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Speaker 1: gotta rip the calls. There's a lot of stuff to do. Man,

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Speaker 1: it sounds exhausting. It fills the open space in your life.

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Speaker 1: You can't. No more TV, no more movies, no more

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Speaker 1: Netflix for you, no more video games help me out, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: no more Star Wars, nothing, dude. It's just whatever open

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Speaker 1: time you have spent thinking about this ship. So here

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Speaker 1: we are. We're also joined by Remy Warren. Say what's up, Remy?

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Speaker 1: What's up? Remy? What are you doing over there? Man?

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Speaker 1: I actually I just got done shooting my rifles this

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Speaker 1: morning because I'm headed out to Alaska to go caribou hunting,

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Speaker 1: and um, yeah, I'm excited about that, but I wanted

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Speaker 1: to give it one last little range range check, you know,

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Speaker 1: for a lock him in the case and head out,

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Speaker 1: and yeah, looking forward to it. Jason baron ground, what

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Speaker 1: are you doing up there? Uh? Yep, caribou off a

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Speaker 1: secret spot way north. We'll see. I mean, it's so secret,

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Speaker 1: I don't even know where I'm going. I'll do you

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Speaker 1: do you agree with me that, like this time before

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Speaker 1: season is run up to season and then when the

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Speaker 1: opening day is coming, you know this is people be

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Speaker 1: hearing this one Elk season is kicking kicking off hard.

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Speaker 1: But in the run up to elx Elk season, or really,

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Speaker 1: I'm sure for you for guiding or anything else and

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Speaker 1: preparing for trips, preparing for hunting, you just fill all

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Speaker 1: the open space in your life with that stuff, and

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Speaker 1: there's room for nothing else. Nothing else can can happen. Oh, absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I was even just telling my wife last night. I

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Speaker 1: was like thinking, I'm like getting everything ready for this trip,

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Speaker 1: and then I'm like, Okay, then it's ELK and this

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Speaker 1: and that, and I just thought like there's never a

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Speaker 1: time where I actually feel fully prepared because there's always

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Speaker 1: something to do, you know, And then I'm just for

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Speaker 1: me at least, I'm trying to do everything that I

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Speaker 1: need to do for the next however long now, because

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Speaker 1: as soon as the season kicks off, it's just go, go, go,

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Speaker 1: go go. Yeah. I mean, if you, what's your your

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Speaker 1: schedule looking like this year, because I know we talked

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Speaker 1: about a couple of haunts got canceled, and well, at

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Speaker 1: least we can travel within the states, right yeah, yeah, exactly,

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Speaker 1: so long as this COVID test comes back negative. Uh yeah,

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Speaker 1: my skit. Yeah. It's like I actually haven't been I

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Speaker 1: normally would have been on like all my hunts that

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Speaker 1: I had planned kind of got canceled for that August part,

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Speaker 1: but I did a few. I just picked up like

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Speaker 1: an over the counter tag and went to California for

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Speaker 1: a couple of days to bow hunt deer, just check

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Speaker 1: out a new spot. Really kind of scout hunt for

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Speaker 1: it's just like a real brief excursion, and then headed

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Speaker 1: over to Idaho for some Idaho Montana for some antelope hunting.

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Speaker 1: But my arrow hasn't found what I've been looking for yet.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I got a little picky and then

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Speaker 1: that kind of bit me later on. But now I'm

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Speaker 1: head to do Alaska and then after that it's just

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Speaker 1: all Uh, I'll be doing some milk hunting guiding pretty

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Speaker 1: much until December. So yeah, I mean what because normally,

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Speaker 1: what's the most days you spent in the field in

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Speaker 1: a year? Uh, the most in one year? Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: was like three three days. That was back when I

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Speaker 1: was a single fella. But it's still is still a

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Speaker 1: lot of days that I mean, it's most of the year.

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Speaker 1: It's aside from this year obviously, but between the guiding

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Speaker 1: and all the other stuff like my own hunts and

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Speaker 1: just being out. Um, yeah, it's it's pretty the majority

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Speaker 1: of the year. For folks who don't know. You recently

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Speaker 1: got married in New Zealand before COVID went well before COVID,

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Speaker 1: and yeah, I I that's the question I had for

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Speaker 1: you always when you were telling me about this, like, well,

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Speaker 1: how are you going to live this life that you

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Speaker 1: live while being married. Most people, most most men would

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Speaker 1: want to know that anyway, but like, what's the house

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Speaker 1: It turned out over the first year and some change. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was actually kind of funny because everybody was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna change when you're married, and then like the

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Speaker 1: first year I was married and even last year. I

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Speaker 1: think I've hunted more in the last couple of years

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Speaker 1: since I've been married than the few years before I

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Speaker 1: was married. So I don't know. I think that that

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Speaker 1: wasn't true for me. But obviously, like my wife understands

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Speaker 1: this is what I do, and she goes with me

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Speaker 1: a lot. Now, um helps run like our hunting camps

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Speaker 1: and stuff. So so it's actually we got to spend

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Speaker 1: more time together because we worked together doing that kind

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Speaker 1: of stuff. And um, we're together and we're working and

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Speaker 1: we're out there, so I get to spend just as

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Speaker 1: many days as I did before. It's awesome. Tell me

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Speaker 1: if this is too too overtold at this point, too cliche,

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Speaker 1: and will move on. But you saved her life one time.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I did. Yes, I feel like we

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Speaker 1: should tell that briefly. I know you probably told it

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Speaker 1: a million times, but give people a quick rundown of

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Speaker 1: that story. Yeah, I mean she essentially got lost. Um,

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Speaker 1: and this is like not we weren't actually dating at

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Speaker 1: the time, but um, she had got lost, and her

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Speaker 1: sister called me and was like, Daniel's lost, Like this

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Speaker 1: isn't good, and um, she'd gone out for a hike

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Speaker 1: and just never came back. And it was during the

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Speaker 1: summer high desert she's training for like marathons and other things,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know, just wasn't feeling good and decided

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Speaker 1: to go out. Never came home. And they had like

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Speaker 1: a black Hawk helicopters out their search and rescue and

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Speaker 1: couldn't find her. And it was getting to that point

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Speaker 1: where she probably wasn't going to make it another day.

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Speaker 1: And I loaded up my stuff and headed out into

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Speaker 1: the mountains and I ended up kind of like in

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Speaker 1: the middle of the night, cutting a set of tracks

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Speaker 1: and finding her, and uh, yeah, saved your life. So

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Speaker 1: that was pretty cool. Yeah, it was. It was what

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Speaker 1: was what like when you cut her tracks? How fartched

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Speaker 1: you from when you figured this probably is hurt? Um,

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Speaker 1: I don't know a long ways. Well, so I was actually,

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Speaker 1: I mean it was like dark. I mean, it was

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Speaker 1: just one of those weird experiences where I was literally

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Speaker 1: just like praying for a sign of anything and while

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Speaker 1: and I just looked down and see like some scuff marks,

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, huh, this is weird. Like right where

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Speaker 1: I was standing, I'm like, no way, you know, but

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Speaker 1: there's deer tracks everywhere, and so I kind of followed

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Speaker 1: them but lost them, like it's just like hard dirt,

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Speaker 1: big mountains, you know. And then I just got like

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Speaker 1: this weird feeling and this little it was like this

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Speaker 1: kind of like this bench midway up in the mountain

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Speaker 1: from what I could tell, I mean, it was like

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Speaker 1: midnight and um. And then I then I actually went

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Speaker 1: I saw it because I was trying to get a

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Speaker 1: flear system, uh and so like a night vision kind

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Speaker 1: of deal. And um, I saw this like light off

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Speaker 1: in the distance, and I thought, oh, maybe that's the guy, um,

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Speaker 1: one of the sheriff guys, because he was he was

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Speaker 1: going to get it in contact me, but I didn't

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Speaker 1: have any service or anything, and I forgot my satellite messenger.

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Speaker 1: So I started walking that way and it turned out

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Speaker 1: to just be like some random people at camping or

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Speaker 1: like backpacking and um, and then and then I just

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Speaker 1: like my brother and friend Joe were out there and

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Speaker 1: I UM, I radioed them and they were like looking

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Speaker 1: kind of where because they had dogs earlier, and they

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Speaker 1: were kind of like looking around where the dogs were.

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Speaker 1: And I just kind of was like, I'm just going

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Speaker 1: just wherever I feel like I want to go. And

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Speaker 1: I radioed them and was like, maybe we should kind

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Speaker 1: of regroup and figure out like the glassing first thing

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Speaker 1: in the morning or I don't know. And I was like,

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Speaker 1: but I'm gonna go back and check this spot out

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Speaker 1: that I just said, like, I don't know, this weird feeling,

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Speaker 1: so and that's kind of where I saw those tracks.

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Speaker 1: And then I went back to that spot about I

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Speaker 1: don't know, it's little ways away from where I was.

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Speaker 1: And then I was like I just literally just like

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Speaker 1: sitting there yelled out, Danielle, is Remy if you can

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Speaker 1: hear me, I'm not leaving until I find you like

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Speaker 1: a few seconds later here Remy. And then and then

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Speaker 1: nothing and I was like, oh, ship, let's just make

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Speaker 1: that up or no, that was real and and yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then I ended up like I only heard her.

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Speaker 1: I like radio my brethren said, Hey, I heard her, like,

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Speaker 1: get medical team up here now, Like I don't know

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Speaker 1: if that's and I'm turning my radio off because if

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Speaker 1: that's the last, if I only hear one more time,

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Speaker 1: you know, I don't want the radio being going off

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Speaker 1: and then miss it because it was so faint and

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Speaker 1: then it was like this big basin, so I couldn't

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Speaker 1: really actually tell where the sound was coming from. I

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Speaker 1: thought it was like across because there was like some

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Speaker 1: cliffs across that I remember before it got dark. Um,

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Speaker 1: and uh, just like from a long ways away, because

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Speaker 1: I was just looking up into this valley from the bottom,

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Speaker 1: and so then I was thinking maybe she was like

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Speaker 1: in those cliffs or whatever. And then I started like

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Speaker 1: running towards that direction and then heard her one more

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Speaker 1: time and found her, and she's like three hundred yards

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Speaker 1: below me at that second point. What was she? What

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Speaker 1: had she done when she just got lost and went

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Speaker 1: to and was trying to get down or got cliffed

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Speaker 1: out or what had happened? Yeah, I mean it's kind

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Speaker 1: of like foggy because I don't I mean, she essentially

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Speaker 1: probably got like some form of pete stroke for sure,

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Speaker 1: like made your massive dehydration. I think she like woke

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Speaker 1: up and had no clue where she was man man,

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Speaker 1: and like didn't and and didn't know like which way

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Speaker 1: to go. So it was kind of like it was

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Speaker 1: actually good that she stayed put, you know, like um,

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Speaker 1: and she she was like stayed put. She kind of

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Speaker 1: like was in like this tried to find some shade.

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Speaker 1: She did hear the helicopter go over a couple of times,

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Speaker 1: but it never saw her. Um. And then and then

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Speaker 1: they had to actually canceled the like the helicopter had

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Speaker 1: to go back and it was done because it had

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Speaker 1: used up all its time and had to go back.

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Speaker 1: So um, yeah, and they actually weren't even sure that

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Speaker 1: she was there. It's a really weird scenario because they

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Speaker 1: actually had like reports of like a vehicle with Mexico

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Speaker 1: plates leaving, and they're kind of like following this assumption

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Speaker 1: that maybe she had gone back, like because the dogs

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Speaker 1: like went up, followed the rocks and then came back

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Speaker 1: to the truck. So there's like this assumption that she

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Speaker 1: walked up, walked back and then was taken. So it

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Speaker 1: was just like a really mess the scenario. It was

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Speaker 1: like a lot of a lot of fear going on,

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Speaker 1: you know, like a lot of like thoughts of worst

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Speaker 1: case scenarios. Yeah. I shouldn't laugh at that, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, do you guys talk about it now? Because

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Speaker 1: she was you guys weren't dating then, it was some

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Speaker 1: time right before you started dating after that? Um yeah,

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Speaker 1: that well, like we had dated prior to that and

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Speaker 1: then um yeah, and then that kind of got us

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Speaker 1: back together. I mean it was like when I when

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Speaker 1: you save someone's life, they're kind you're kind of like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: now you should go out with me? Can I take

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Speaker 1: you out to dinner? Now? She pretty delirious when you

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Speaker 1: found her, Like did she know what was going on?

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Speaker 1: Or was she do you think she's no? No, she yea,

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Speaker 1: she had no clue. I mean, like I you know,

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Speaker 1: I like I ran up and was like, oh, you know,

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Speaker 1: like like I looked at her and I was just like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was. She just seems so confused, like I think

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Speaker 1: she thought she was hallucinating, because I'm sure she had

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Speaker 1: been like hallucinating while she was out there. Anyways. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's like major dehydration cold because she just went like

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Speaker 1: for kind of like for like had no supplies nothing.

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Speaker 1: Probably it was just like not a smart move, but

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Speaker 1: um and she and she wasn't feeling good anyways, so

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Speaker 1: she was like, oh, this might make me feel better,

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Speaker 1: like a nice run through the desert and um through

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Speaker 1: the wilderness and uh. And it was like she had

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Speaker 1: no water, no like warm clothes and that in the

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Speaker 1: high desert it'll be like a hundred degrees in the

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Speaker 1: middle of the day and then like freezing at night.

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Speaker 1: And it was that time of year where it was

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Speaker 1: like that or it is just super hot in the

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Speaker 1: daytime and then thirty two degrees thirty five degrees at night,

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Speaker 1: so huge temperature swings. Um. And I think that, like

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Speaker 1: you know, that obviously played a factor. I mean she

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Speaker 1: real she was like super cold at night, super hot

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Speaker 1: in the middle of the day, super thirsty. Um. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I was like do you know who? I

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Speaker 1: was like, do you what's your name? Like again, She's

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Speaker 1: like I don't know, Like do you know who I am?

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Speaker 1: I think so I don't know, Like she's like super

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Speaker 1: confused for sure. Yeah, Well I'm glad. I'm glad that

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Speaker 1: you found her. And now, uh, she is a very

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Speaker 1: understanding wife of a of a traveling hunter and so

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Speaker 1: and she I met her, She's awesome. It's that's what

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Speaker 1: one hell of a story. Although your life kind of

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Speaker 1: has a lot of those types of stories in it,

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Speaker 1: some life saving stories, some harrowing stories, some crazy things. Um,

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Speaker 1: I guess to live wild hunt hard fits right. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know you're like, well, when you spend three hundred

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Speaker 1: days a year in the field, you're gonna see some rain.

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Speaker 1: Something's gonna happen. Like, yeah, you're just like because it's

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Speaker 1: no two days are the same out there. It's like

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Speaker 1: that's what I love about it. But like you just

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Speaker 1: see some crazy stuff like in nature, just wild things happen,

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Speaker 1: or you're just in like interesting scenarios where yeah, crazy

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Speaker 1: things can happen. I mean, I don't know, do you

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Speaker 1: feel like when you when you think about that that time,

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Speaker 1: and I'm sure other things that have happened to you,

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Speaker 1: do you think about, you know, what are the things

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Speaker 1: that you have to do to keep yourself prepared out there?

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Speaker 1: Because that's when I'm thinking about what she did. You know,

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Speaker 1: as you said, not the smartest thing to do, and

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Speaker 1: each of us, I mean I'm up in the mountains

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Speaker 1: all the time, checking trail cameras. Sometimes I'm prepared. Other

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Speaker 1: times I'm just right after work we're running out there,

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Speaker 1: and that could be the time where something goes down,

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Speaker 1: you fall down a cliff, whatever. There's a lot of

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Speaker 1: scenarios out there, So you what's your do you have

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Speaker 1: like the basic preparedness stuff people have to do every

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Speaker 1: time they throw a pack on. I don't know. I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you should definitely have like water. Um, I think if

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Speaker 1: it's like desert hot, if it's hot, the water things huge.

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Speaker 1: I mean I've been like fairly dehydrated. Even just a

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Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago. I was like hunting and it's like,

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Speaker 1: all right, I hiked down into this valley and there's water,

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Speaker 1: and I've had this route and ever been there, planned

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Speaker 1: this route out, Like Okay, I'm gonna go up there.

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Speaker 1: I could see like some wet spots, so I'm like sweet,

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Speaker 1: and you know, do this big three ft climb and

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Speaker 1: ten miles later and there's no water and I'm like

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Speaker 1: a ship, you know, like how do I get out

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Speaker 1: of here? Um? Like that's that's especially when it's like

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Speaker 1: a hundred degrees out. That's that's key, is like having

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Speaker 1: having the basic essentials you need to survive, and mostly

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Speaker 1: that means some form of like water first, and then

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Speaker 1: you know, possibly having like an idea of how to

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Speaker 1: build or have a shelter, like if if the environment

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Speaker 1: gets pretty crazy. At least having those skills. It doesn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily mean that you have to have a lot of

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Speaker 1: stuff with you, but it just means that like you

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Speaker 1: have those skills or like that confidence to be able

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Speaker 1: to find the things that you need or like have

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Speaker 1: the things that you need with you. So this is Phil,

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Speaker 1: this is the time when you need to ask some questions, man,

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Speaker 1: because Remy, here's a man who's done it, most of

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Speaker 1: all of it, and Phils is about the step out

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Speaker 1: on this first hunting journey at some point in the

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Speaker 1: next five to ten years. So, yeah, what's what's going on? Phil?

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Speaker 1: Questions for Remy? Uh, you know you it's it's it's

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Speaker 1: tough because you you try to sell me on this

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Speaker 1: whole hunting thing, but how fun it is and fulfilling.

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Speaker 1: And then you bring on people like like Remy who

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Speaker 1: just have endless tales of near death experiences on like

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Speaker 1: couples like who say that it's like strain on their

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Speaker 1: marriage and all this stuff, and you're like, it's great,

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Speaker 1: You're gonna love it. You won't have any free time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you might die and you could get a divorce. What

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Speaker 1: a better way to live your life. It's better. It's

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Speaker 1: marketly better than playing video games. Yeah, which is a

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Speaker 1: very safe thing to do. I love it. Cozy, cozy, cozy,

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Speaker 1: unless you're doing it while driving. Um, but anyway, it's

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Speaker 1: it's Elk season now. If you Remy over there cutting

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Speaker 1: the Distance podcast, which is the thing that you need

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Speaker 1: if you want to learn anything about the outdoors, but

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Speaker 1: particularly Elk at this time of year. Well, that's the thing.

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Speaker 1: I don't have a whole lot of questions for Remy

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Speaker 1: because I've listened to every episode of You Know What

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Speaker 1: you need to Know? Um. Bill even gets the behind

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Speaker 1: the scenes stuff that like the extra stuff, that's right.

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Speaker 1: I get the outtakes. I've heard more hurt than anybody,

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Speaker 1: stuff like oh damn, damn, I say that again. I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna say that again. But we've heard like how fifty

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Speaker 1: some stories now, um, a bunch of Elk content. I

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Speaker 1: was the other day in the in the truck in

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Speaker 1: a parking lot, waiting for my son to get out

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Speaker 1: of doctors appointment. Blown on the alcohol, listening to cutting

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Speaker 1: the distance, you know, thinking about as you say, Remy

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Speaker 1: all the time, like this is kind of not fair.

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Speaker 1: You know, ten to twenty years ago, there wasn't this

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Speaker 1: information accessible. You couldn't download Remy warrants, ELK Hunting Brain,

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Speaker 1: and so it's it's kind of are you giving away

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Speaker 1: too many secrets? You feel like I am absolutely giving

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Speaker 1: away too many secrets? Is scaring the crap out of

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Speaker 1: maybe because I'm now I'm thinking, like, is the way

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Speaker 1: that I hunt work because other people aren't doing it?

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Speaker 1: And I think that that's the case. And now I'm

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Speaker 1: like running into people that are like hunting the way

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Speaker 1: that I'm hunting, or have listened or a successful especially

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Speaker 1: this spring man, like the whole Like I talked to

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Speaker 1: so many people that were like hunt maybe not even

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Speaker 1: the same areas that I do, but just like, oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I had success doing like so many people that had

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Speaker 1: struggled with bear hunting and then use those those tips

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Speaker 1: that I gave the calling and the other stuff and

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Speaker 1: have been successful. And I'm like, man, I think I

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Speaker 1: might be like shooting myself in the foot here. I

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Speaker 1: had a good thing going. Now everybody knows what I know.

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Speaker 1: You know, have you ever run into anybody in the

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Speaker 1: back country that got there from your tips? That would

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Speaker 1: be the ultimate, would be the worst. Oh yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 1: I have. Yeah, somebody's like, hey man, I love your podcast.

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Speaker 1: I'm only here because you told me to look in

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Speaker 1: high mountain basins. Yeah, yeah, exactly that. That has happened,

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Speaker 1: like I would say, at least a dozen times. Last

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Speaker 1: year was yeah, yeah, last year was pretty funny that well. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like this this one guy was just like, I actually

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Speaker 1: um was coming back down and this guy like saw

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Speaker 1: me and he was just like, first he's just like

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Speaker 1: looking at me, and he's like, that's so weird. I

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Speaker 1: was like, what's that. He was like, well, I mean

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Speaker 1: I was just following your tips and then I kind

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Speaker 1: of found and this is a spot that i'd never

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Speaker 1: been either, so it was just like a new area.

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Speaker 1: He's like, I was following your tips and then you know,

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Speaker 1: and I picked this spot and then I saw you

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Speaker 1: here and I was just like, I wasn't sure. He's like, okay,

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Speaker 1: we gotta get picture, you know, like a selfie in

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Speaker 1: the pictures, and I'm like, oh great, now this spot

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Speaker 1: is gonna be posted all over the place. I'm pretty

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Speaker 1: careful about keeping like backgrounds out of things, but I

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Speaker 1: thought it was just hilarious because it was like a

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Speaker 1: new spot place that I had never hunted. And then

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Speaker 1: here comes this guy that had just listened. He was like, literally,

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Speaker 1: I was just listening to this and I listened to

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Speaker 1: that episode three times. It was on the map, the

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Speaker 1: um reading the map, which one was yeah, exactly, and

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00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:10,200
Speaker 1: uh like scouting and picking areas, and he's like, he

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Speaker 1: essentially did the same thing I did. We came to

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Speaker 1: the same conclusion and then ended up in the same

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Speaker 1: freaking spot. Like, what are the odds of that? You're

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Speaker 1: like appears where for everyone they're like, Remy Warren, he

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Speaker 1: appears out of out of the trees. When I listen

395
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:29,080
Speaker 1: to your podcast, if I say Remy Warren three times

396
00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:32,960
Speaker 1: into the mirror, he'll appear. And then I just appear. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you're glassing and you go Remy Warrend, Remy Warren,

398
00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:37,280
Speaker 1: Remy Warrent, I just show up and start glassing. You

399
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Speaker 1: should if you see somebody. If you see somebody and

400
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:41,800
Speaker 1: they say, oh man, I know your podcast, be like, yes,

401
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:45,000
Speaker 1: I've traveled here to give you one last tip and

402
00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:47,359
Speaker 1: then say it and then just disappear into the trees,

403
00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,720
Speaker 1: like the Hunting Highlander. Yes, the hunting Remy Warren, the

404
00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:56,440
Speaker 1: Hunting Highlander disappearing on your on X maps. Maybe yeah,

405
00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:57,840
Speaker 1: maybe we should get with on X and have a

406
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Speaker 1: thing where they can follow you around and try to

407
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Speaker 1: find you, kind of like a treasure hunt. I feel

408
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:06,320
Speaker 1: like I feel like they already do that. That's true,

409
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:11,520
Speaker 1: that's true, that's true. Hunting media is the ultimate oxymoron. So, Remy,

410
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,600
Speaker 1: we're in elk season now, we're in it. That opened

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Speaker 1: the fifth here people who listen to this on the eighth,

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Speaker 1: ninth something like that, Um, we gotta give people just

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Speaker 1: I know your your last podcast. We gave people the

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00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:27,600
Speaker 1: essential tips from cutting the distance. But for a lot

415
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:29,280
Speaker 1: of people to listen to this will be going on

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Speaker 1: their first l con or or you know, one of

417
00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:34,680
Speaker 1: their first and we know that it's like a ten

418
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Speaker 1: percent success rate for do it yourself public land elk

419
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Speaker 1: hunters out there. One out of ten people kill a bull,

420
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Speaker 1: or you kill a bull one out of every ten

421
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Speaker 1: years you have a tag. And that's uh, that's a

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00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,960
Speaker 1: sketchy idea. And so I want I want you to

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Speaker 1: kind of give give a few things, maybe already secrets

424
00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:55,320
Speaker 1: you've already put out there, so we don't drain your

425
00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,760
Speaker 1: well of secrets, but some things that you know that

426
00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:00,480
Speaker 1: will get people at least in the in the right

427
00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:04,320
Speaker 1: area when they're trying to kill a bull. Yeah, I

428
00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:06,760
Speaker 1: mean September I think is the best time to kill

429
00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:09,720
Speaker 1: a bull because it's it's the one time that elk

430
00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:12,760
Speaker 1: are making a lot of noise their vocal they're rutting.

431
00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:16,000
Speaker 1: It's just like anything else you hunt white tails during

432
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:19,200
Speaker 1: the rut, they're the most active. So there's a lot

433
00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:22,480
Speaker 1: of different techniques you can use. It doesn't matter how

434
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:27,560
Speaker 1: like how experienced you are with elk hunting, just there

435
00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:29,920
Speaker 1: because there's so many different techniques you can use that

436
00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:32,280
Speaker 1: might even be similar to what you already use. But

437
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:35,120
Speaker 1: I think the key to real, like really being successful

438
00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,920
Speaker 1: is just understanding elk behaviors. And once you understand that,

439
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 1: or get a basic idea of elk behaviors, then you

440
00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:45,200
Speaker 1: can kind of capitalize and key in. So UM there's

441
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:47,160
Speaker 1: things A couple of the things that I was talking about,

442
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,120
Speaker 1: like wallow hunting and focusing on wallows, how to find wallows.

443
00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:55,080
Speaker 1: Um that's a great way for people just getting into it.

444
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 1: That's like, hey, maybe you have only tree stand hunted.

445
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,480
Speaker 1: I mean, you can take those same tree stand tactics

446
00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:04,120
Speaker 1: and use those over a wallow over a water hole.

447
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,920
Speaker 1: You know, understanding what a wallow is and how which

448
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 1: one is going to be productive, and mostly the productive

449
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,640
Speaker 1: one is going to be based on smell, Like, uh,

450
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:14,240
Speaker 1: a wall of that stinks real bad as a good

451
00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:17,000
Speaker 1: perfume station for these elk during the rut. So that's

452
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:19,320
Speaker 1: that's a great place to start. Yeah, I mean I've

453
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 1: I've personally had a man I've come across. I had

454
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,400
Speaker 1: four while as I was gonna hang cameras on this year,

455
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:27,320
Speaker 1: and each one of them was dry. It just felt

456
00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:30,919
Speaker 1: like somebody was messing with me out there. So how

457
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,080
Speaker 1: do you I mean finding wallows? If you go to

458
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 1: a place like I was in where there's a there's

459
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:38,359
Speaker 1: a spring fed creek, Well there's just like a spring

460
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:41,080
Speaker 1: that that was creating two wallows and it was dry

461
00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 1: this year, but there's a creek below, and I thought,

462
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,280
Speaker 1: I'll just go walk this creek. I'm gonna find a

463
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 1: wallow or something on this creek where it pulls up

464
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 1: at least where I know they're coming to water. Never

465
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 1: did find and I know it's there somewhere, But I mean,

466
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,600
Speaker 1: is there any other tactic other than those types of

467
00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:59,680
Speaker 1: things to find them. Yeah, I mean looking for those

468
00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 1: repair arean areas is good. But also like in the

469
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,520
Speaker 1: like where those creeks come down, if there's like a

470
00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 1: flowing side creek that starts maybe like midway down the mountain,

471
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:12,840
Speaker 1: following that area up to where like looking on your

472
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:15,600
Speaker 1: map on the TOEPO and finding like a little flat

473
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:19,119
Speaker 1: spot where it flattens out below a steep area, so

474
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 1: like a steep hill in a basin or just a

475
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,960
Speaker 1: draw and then it kind of has this flat spot

476
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,320
Speaker 1: and then goes into a creek. Generally the water will

477
00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: settle in pool there. That's a good spot to look

478
00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:33,120
Speaker 1: um And and like you did following the creeks, I mean,

479
00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: it's not an exact science. You do have to do

480
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 1: some groundproofing for it. So maybe that area just doesn't

481
00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 1: particularly have a lot um. Maybe start looking on some

482
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 1: of the more shaded side, like if it's a more

483
00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:48,119
Speaker 1: drought type year, look in some of those areas that

484
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,080
Speaker 1: might be a little bit more shaded um or like

485
00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:53,919
Speaker 1: maybe just another draw over. You know, maybe the elker

486
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 1: in that area, but they're gonna wallow one draw on

487
00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 1: either side, so you know, exploring a little bit is good.

488
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 1: But the nice thing about September is, hey, you don't

489
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:05,399
Speaker 1: know where the walls are, you don't know where the

490
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:08,919
Speaker 1: elk are at well, that you can just make noise

491
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:11,120
Speaker 1: and they should make noise back and tell you where

492
00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:14,160
Speaker 1: they are. So that's the key of like, that's why

493
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:18,080
Speaker 1: archery hunting, archery season, September season, I think is the

494
00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 1: best time to chase elk. I mean, actually, you know,

495
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:25,040
Speaker 1: if I was to think about it, um, people are like, oh,

496
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,240
Speaker 1: bow hunting is hard. I think that if if I

497
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:30,919
Speaker 1: was between a general archery season for elk or a

498
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,679
Speaker 1: general rifle season for elk, I would choose the archery season.

499
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 1: I think it's a lot easier to hunt elk with

500
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 1: a bow because they are it is during the rut,

501
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,080
Speaker 1: and they are vocal and they're easier to find, whereas

502
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,160
Speaker 1: once you get later in the season there was later

503
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,040
Speaker 1: rifle seasons. Man, it can be all you can. It

504
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:49,400
Speaker 1: can be really hard to even find elk. So it's

505
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,160
Speaker 1: really nice to have that option to bugle to call

506
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 1: and to get elk to tell you where the heck

507
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:57,919
Speaker 1: they are? Yeah, yeah, and especially when you know we

508
00:25:57,960 --> 00:26:00,479
Speaker 1: have shoulder seasons here in Montana, but even in La season, man,

509
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 1: a lot of these altre down in private land and

510
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:04,239
Speaker 1: it can be a struggle. You can be you can

511
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:07,840
Speaker 1: find yourself glass and all the elky one you know,

512
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 1: you know, kind of agg field standing under the pivot

513
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,679
Speaker 1: um in the snow. And so that's that's a huge one.

514
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 1: Do you do you bring a call? Do you have

515
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:16,800
Speaker 1: a call with you? Oh? Yeah, I got some calls

516
00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:19,400
Speaker 1: sitting here. So do you like the basic I think

517
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:23,000
Speaker 1: obviously the more productive call out there, the call that

518
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,199
Speaker 1: you have to really perfect to get good at. This

519
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:29,199
Speaker 1: is a is a bugle. But you know, first I

520
00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:31,360
Speaker 1: started like, can I put up? But can I put

521
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:32,719
Speaker 1: a call in my mouth? Can I put a die

522
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: from call in my mouth? And start with making the

523
00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 1: sounds of a cow, and then without the bugle tube,

524
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 1: try to make the sounds, you know, the the elevation

525
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,439
Speaker 1: of sounds with the tongue pressure that I need to

526
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 1: make that kind of the bugle sound before I put

527
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:49,439
Speaker 1: you know, before I try to bring life to it

528
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:51,000
Speaker 1: and put the bugle tube to my mouth? Is that

529
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 1: is that a good way? Is that what your suggestion

530
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:55,680
Speaker 1: to learn or is there you know, the tips to

531
00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: picking something up with the first time and kind of

532
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 1: figuring it out. Yeah, I think like if you're I mean,

533
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,240
Speaker 1: I use diaphragm type calls for elk calling just because

534
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 1: they're so versatile and you can make so many different sounds. Um,

535
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 1: but you know, I mean, there's all different kinds there's exposed, Like, Um,

536
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 1: I can't even remember I used so many different ones

537
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,880
Speaker 1: over the years, and they've changed so much. I think

538
00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:20,640
Speaker 1: the first thing to do would be just like kind

539
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 1: of understand and master those cow calls, because you'll you'll

540
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:28,880
Speaker 1: get the idea of like changing the pressure and and

541
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,920
Speaker 1: getting those like good tones. So it's really good idea

542
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: to just try to get like a few different cow

543
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:37,080
Speaker 1: calls going and then you can kind of work into

544
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:40,320
Speaker 1: a bugle. And I've said this before and I even

545
00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 1: said it on my podcast. Um, the how good you

546
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 1: are with the bugle like it does make a difference

547
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:50,479
Speaker 1: in some ways, but it's more so how good you

548
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 1: sound than like knowing that when to call and kind

549
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:57,440
Speaker 1: of the movements and the type of actions you should take.

550
00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:00,679
Speaker 1: So there's a lot more to just the behavior than

551
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:03,919
Speaker 1: the actual sound itself and that and that goes a

552
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: long ways. Like, especially when you're starting out, I think

553
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 1: a lot of people are just they're like, I don't

554
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 1: know how to call I'm not really good at it, uh,

555
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 1: and are a little bit timid with it. But it

556
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,720
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily if you don't know what sound to make,

557
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 1: listen to the elk, just copy what you hear or

558
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 1: to the best of your ability, and you'll probably do

559
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:22,879
Speaker 1: all right. Yeah, that's one thing that you said in

560
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 1: your podcast that that I wanted to make sure you shared.

561
00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,040
Speaker 1: I'm glad you said that was was you know there's

562
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,479
Speaker 1: nothing yes, you sure, I'm sure you can make some

563
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,399
Speaker 1: some terrible noises with the bugle tube scare all the

564
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 1: elk in the in the drainage, but there's you're never

565
00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 1: gonna learn that interaction unless you have it, and so

566
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 1: go for it. Have it exactly. Yeah. And I think

567
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 1: part of it too is like, um, I think one

568
00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 1: key to calling elk because people think like, oh, bugle,

569
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,640
Speaker 1: they bugle, and they're like they get this bull bugling

570
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,160
Speaker 1: across the canyon and they're like the bull never came in.

571
00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, of course it didn't. Like that's not

572
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 1: what elk do. What elk do is they like make noise,

573
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,360
Speaker 1: and most most of the bugles, like just understanding that

574
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 1: a lot of the bugles aren't for another bull, it's

575
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 1: for the cows that are there. So they're displaying for

576
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 1: the cows. They aren't necessarily always like trying to talk

577
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: to the other bulls. And so just because one elk

578
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,560
Speaker 1: bugles and another elk bugles, doesn't mean that that elk's

579
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 1: going to come over to the bugle. And probably he

580
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 1: probably has cows and he's expecting other elk to try

581
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:29,880
Speaker 1: to come in and steal those cows, and he's not

582
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: going to leave those cows. So what One of the

583
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 1: ways that I've found a lot of success bugling is

584
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:38,680
Speaker 1: like going into the title of the podcast, cutting the

585
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,560
Speaker 1: distance between yourself and the bull. When that bull bugle

586
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: is just getting closer and closer and closer till you

587
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: get to a point where you aren't going to spook him,

588
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 1: but he really doesn't have as much of a choice

589
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:50,880
Speaker 1: than to come in because you're already kind of in

590
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:53,600
Speaker 1: the herd. Yeah, yeah, and I've I've I've figured that

591
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: out too, you know, And for everybody listening that's an

592
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:59,080
Speaker 1: East Coaster or you know, don't you're you don't live

593
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:01,200
Speaker 1: in a place where elk accessible and you can hunt

594
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 1: them like this is. We had I'll tell you this

595
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 1: the quick anecdote. We had a guy in here that

596
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: was coming on the Mediator podcast. It was from Austin.

597
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 1: He had a couple of of his team members, production

598
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:14,160
Speaker 1: team members with him and the young guys from the city.

599
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:18,520
Speaker 1: Yanni blew an alcohol when I was blowing on smell calls.

600
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:21,280
Speaker 1: And the look that these guys had they had never

601
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 1: heard somebody blow an alcohol before. They likely never heard

602
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:27,280
Speaker 1: an elk bugle before, or seen an elk before. The

603
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 1: look they had on their faces when we made those

604
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,720
Speaker 1: noises and showed them what an elk was was unbelievable.

605
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 1: It's like a little a little kid discovering dinosaurs for

606
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:39,800
Speaker 1: the first time. And so yeah, just to get out there,

607
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:42,080
Speaker 1: just to go out there and dive into it is

608
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,640
Speaker 1: is enough. You know, if if you've never done it before,

609
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 1: is that that's enough? It should be enough. It was

610
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 1: enough for me when I first really went hard and

611
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 1: learning the craft of hunting elk and so it can

612
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:55,760
Speaker 1: be I think, UM, just an amazing thing to do.

613
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:57,600
Speaker 1: And probably you know you have how many years you've

614
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:02,520
Speaker 1: been doing it now? Probably? Uh? Yeah, I mean I

615
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:06,240
Speaker 1: don't know, I've yeah, at least us, I don't know.

616
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 1: We need Phil to do Matheos checked out. Yeah, I mean,

617
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 1: I mean I have been yeah, chasing elk for like

618
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 1: twenty three years or something. That's never I'm and it

619
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 1: never gets old. I can't imagine you're you're jaded to

620
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 1: any part of it. Hope hopefully you're not. No, I

621
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 1: mean I think I And here's the other thing. I mean,

622
00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:34,280
Speaker 1: I would consider myself an elk expert of sorts. I

623
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: mean I've spent since I was eighteen years of the

624
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,239
Speaker 1: season an elk expert, an elk hunting expert. I mean,

625
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 1: I'm a professional elk hunter, like like take, I've taken

626
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,880
Speaker 1: people hunting every day. I've spent every day of the

627
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 1: Montana season, plus extra seasons you know, in other places

628
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 1: hunting elk um since I can, since I was eighteen

629
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 1: years old. But even then, there's things I don't know

630
00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,720
Speaker 1: about elk. So it's not that you know, you're you're

631
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 1: constantly learning you're constantly you'll get into a scenario and

632
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: you'll say, most of the scenarios end up being similar,

633
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: but you'll get into scenarios that are a little bit

634
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:14,760
Speaker 1: different and you go and you'll learn something and you'll go, oh,

635
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 1: that's a new way to trick them. Oh, that's um okay,

636
00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 1: I didn't really realize that they were going to do that.

637
00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 1: And over the years, you know, you just keep getting

638
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 1: better and better and learning more and more and having

639
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: more situations scenarios. And that's the cool thing about why

640
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 1: I say understanding elk behaviors, because the more time you

641
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 1: spend with them, the more you understand them, and the

642
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 1: easier it is to hunt them and take them. It's

643
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 1: like the same, the same ten percent of the people

644
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 1: shoot nine of the elk. Those guys are the people

645
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 1: that understand elk behavior and really just like how how

646
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,640
Speaker 1: to get close and how to bring them in. Yeah,

647
00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:52,200
Speaker 1: and and and that whole process is what interests me

648
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: to that intellectual property of knowing where the elk, you know,

649
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: spend a couple of years and moving to Montana, my

650
00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 1: my idea was like, nobody, nobody tell me where you go.

651
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:01,480
Speaker 1: I'm gonna find in my spots. I'm gonna get that

652
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 1: intellectual property. Um, I'm a new guy. I'm gonna I

653
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: want the new GUI process. I want to find spots,

654
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 1: find elk, understand them, understand what they're doing in July

655
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:14,960
Speaker 1: and August, September, October, and then five years in under

656
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 1: you know, have a full understanding of the landscape of

657
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:20,480
Speaker 1: the animal, of the habits out of the calling. That's

658
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 1: as fun as anything because then it starts to become

659
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:24,680
Speaker 1: a craft rather than just the thing you go doing

660
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 1: the weekends. I think that there's certain things that kind

661
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 1: of break down that learning curve and stuff like podcasts.

662
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of more information out there.

663
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 1: I just know like when I was getting into it

664
00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:44,080
Speaker 1: or or starting out, I would watch elk hunting videos

665
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 1: and it was it was nothing like the experiences that

666
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: I had calling out because because most of those videos

667
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:53,720
Speaker 1: are done on really like limited high I'm not I'm

668
00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 1: not necessarily high fence places, but just like very unhunted,

669
00:33:59,640 --> 00:34:03,240
Speaker 1: like premier tag kind of places where they call and

670
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:05,840
Speaker 1: elks seemed to just run in and it's like man

671
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 1: on public land in general, areas that just did not

672
00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 1: seem to be the case, there's a lot of miles

673
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: that didn't get shown in between, a lot of struggle

674
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 1: in between, but understanding like you know, you might do

675
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 1: something and nobody ever talked about you blow an elk

676
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:23,719
Speaker 1: calling and elk runs away and you think like, oh,

677
00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:25,879
Speaker 1: I did something wrong, and that's not actually the case.

678
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 1: It's just understanding that behavior of like, that's what elk

679
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 1: do when they're calling toward each other, and you might

680
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 1: have to put in some legwork and catch back up

681
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: and keep dogging them and do other things to get

682
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:38,959
Speaker 1: those elk to commit to your to your call, into

683
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:42,640
Speaker 1: your the whole thing that you're creating. And just understanding

684
00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,040
Speaker 1: that is huge. Do you ever look back, because I

685
00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:46,799
Speaker 1: do look back at the dichotomy of when you and

686
00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,560
Speaker 1: I were coming up and what was available. You know,

687
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:51,520
Speaker 1: I think about like Larry guys like Larry D. Jones

688
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 1: and and Will Primost and all these people that are

689
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,759
Speaker 1: that were making videos and making you know, I had

690
00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 1: tapes and then dv d s, and it was magazines

691
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: and stuff growing up, and a lot of that stuff

692
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:09,680
Speaker 1: was it all ended in in a kill, all of it, um,

693
00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:11,319
Speaker 1: you know, whether it was a white tailor an elk

694
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,440
Speaker 1: or whatever. The videos were like ten ten kills in

695
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 1: an hour, and it was all this kind of that's

696
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:19,080
Speaker 1: how it was set up, and it was meant to

697
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:23,040
Speaker 1: obviously sell calls or sell whatever product was going on. UM.

698
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:25,200
Speaker 1: But that's how it was. And it's only been I

699
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 1: don't know how recently that we started to experience like, hey,

700
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: here's all the things that go on in between and

701
00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 1: solo hunter the show that you do UM is important

702
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,320
Speaker 1: for that because you gotta show all of the struggle

703
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:40,000
Speaker 1: and you set up a camera by yourself and you

704
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:42,600
Speaker 1: show killing an animals. So there's a lot there. But

705
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 1: do you ever think about coming coming up and what

706
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:47,840
Speaker 1: wasn't there and maybe how that made made you be

707
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:49,239
Speaker 1: an expert you had to be because you had to

708
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:51,560
Speaker 1: go and do it yourself. There wasn't There wasn't remy warrants,

709
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:54,720
Speaker 1: cutting the distance to listen to. Yeah, I mean that

710
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:56,879
Speaker 1: that was the thing is you you'd only see that

711
00:35:56,960 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 1: like successful interaction and when it happens, you're like, yep,

712
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:06,640
Speaker 1: it seems easy, but it doesn't show all the stuff

713
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: in between to get to that point. And for me,

714
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, I think when people go out

715
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:14,600
Speaker 1: and hunt with me, they're like, Okay, I'm pretty I'm

716
00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 1: really good at getting ilk into bow range. But what

717
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 1: they didn't understand, or most of them are surprised, it's like, wow,

718
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: there's a lot of there's a lot of hard work

719
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 1: to get to that point. And if you can the

720
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: you know, it's like you gotta be in shape, you

721
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:31,240
Speaker 1: gotta be you know, you gotta keep after it. It's

722
00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 1: it's long days. It's like, but when it happens, damn

723
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,600
Speaker 1: is it good? You know, if you just and if

724
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:38,879
Speaker 1: you just take that highlight reel of the when it's

725
00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:41,400
Speaker 1: damn it's good, you're like, wow, that's easy. But it

726
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 1: doesn't show all the stuff in between. And I think

727
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: that that's important is just because I think, you know,

728
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:48,920
Speaker 1: if your first time going out, and it would be

729
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:51,360
Speaker 1: super easy to get discouraged when you think I should

730
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: be blowing this alcohol and milk should be running in

731
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 1: and not that that doesn't happen, like I've had that happen.

732
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:58,959
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just random. But for the most part,

733
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 1: those kind of scenarios are few and far between. It's

734
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:05,279
Speaker 1: mostly you're you have to play this game, and that

735
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:08,200
Speaker 1: game involves you know, a lot of different tricks, and

736
00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:10,960
Speaker 1: all those different tricks kind of come with experience or knowledge,

737
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:12,759
Speaker 1: and I think that it's awesome to be able to

738
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:14,239
Speaker 1: share that knowledge. So you could go out for the

739
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,320
Speaker 1: first time now and understand have a better picture, I believe,

740
00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 1: of what it takes to be successful, not just understanding calling,

741
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:23,440
Speaker 1: but understanding why you do it, how you do it,

742
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:26,520
Speaker 1: when you can do it, um, and then maybe some

743
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:28,560
Speaker 1: of the steps in between. And if you think of

744
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,880
Speaker 1: it as a series of lessons that that elk is

745
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,319
Speaker 1: teaching you, and that's that's how I look at It's

746
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,080
Speaker 1: like the obstacles of the way, and that elk is

747
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,319
Speaker 1: often the obstacle, and you're that's every time you get

748
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:42,080
Speaker 1: an interaction and something doesn't go right, or you get winded,

749
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 1: or he rounds up his cows and goes over the hill,

750
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: that's a lesson I need to learn. And you've got

751
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,319
Speaker 1: to kind of have that intuition to know what what

752
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:51,319
Speaker 1: is the lesson? What did not do right? Or what

753
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:53,920
Speaker 1: did I do right? Um? And so that's where I

754
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:55,480
Speaker 1: think your tip. You need to explain a little bit

755
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 1: about it. But we're gonna have it on on the

756
00:37:57,680 --> 00:37:59,640
Speaker 1: cutting of dis and so let's not we already have

757
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:03,359
Speaker 1: tall about it, or that your lesson for bulldogging is

758
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:06,200
Speaker 1: I think one of the better elk hunting lessons there

759
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:08,920
Speaker 1: is to learn because it seems like in in real

760
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 1: time that you did something wrong, but really um in

761
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:14,880
Speaker 1: your explanation of bulldog and you did something right, but

762
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 1: now you've got to capitalize on on what's going on. Yeah,

763
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:21,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I've heard it so many times

764
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:24,960
Speaker 1: and maybe like me saying these tips might actually make

765
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,520
Speaker 1: it not true in the future. Too many people do it.

766
00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 1: But you know, like uh, you know, I mean I

767
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:36,759
Speaker 1: remember reading like articles from guys they would say, you know,

768
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:41,560
Speaker 1: elk er call shy or um, you know, you don't

769
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:44,319
Speaker 1: want a bugle to mean and too big because then

770
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 1: the elk go away. And I'm like, that's talk from

771
00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:50,920
Speaker 1: people that haven't done a lot of elk cunning, you know,

772
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: because if you, if you understand elk, you realize like

773
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 1: that's what elk do. It hasn't you gotta like you

774
00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 1: gotta take yourself and stop being so I get us

775
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 1: like human centric, egocentric and thinking that every time you

776
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:06,200
Speaker 1: do something it's because you're a human, Like if that

777
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:08,359
Speaker 1: elk thinks you're an elk, which is what you wanted

778
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,359
Speaker 1: to do. It's going to respond to you like you're

779
00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 1: an elk, and what elk do to other elk is

780
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:15,800
Speaker 1: they're going to round up their cows and go away.

781
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:18,160
Speaker 1: That means you did something right. That means that that

782
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:21,399
Speaker 1: elk thinks that that like something real is going on,

783
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,600
Speaker 1: and that doesn't necessarily mean that that's a bad thing. Like,

784
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:28,360
Speaker 1: there's definitely ways that you can capitalize on that just

785
00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:31,000
Speaker 1: takes a little bit of leg work and some some

786
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:34,440
Speaker 1: you know, maybe some fast moving and some more calling,

787
00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:37,719
Speaker 1: and you can make turn that scenario into success. I

788
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:40,960
Speaker 1: would say of the elk that I kill or get

789
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: hunters on, it's that kind of moving cat and mouse

790
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 1: game where they're going, you're going, and you're trying to

791
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,839
Speaker 1: get that bowl to get piste off enough to make

792
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,920
Speaker 1: to come fight you. Philip, We're gonna engage you now

793
00:39:52,920 --> 00:40:00,279
Speaker 1: in this conversation. You listen to all Ramy's elk podcasts, Yes,

794
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:03,880
Speaker 1: tell it. What do you remember about bulldogging? Do you

795
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:07,480
Speaker 1: remember anything at all? It's been a year since he's Yeah,

796
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:11,239
Speaker 1: here's here's the thing. I as a as a person

797
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 1: who knows absolutely nothing about hunting, essentially, like Remy's podcast

798
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:18,600
Speaker 1: is A is A is a tough entry point. I

799
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:19,960
Speaker 1: feel like you need to have at least like a

800
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:22,239
Speaker 1: one oh one understanding of what's going on. And then

801
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,799
Speaker 1: Renny's show is like incredibly helpful, and I don't even

802
00:40:25,840 --> 00:40:28,360
Speaker 1: have that one on one understanding. So yeah, where like

803
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:30,759
Speaker 1: Remy has guys he sees in the woods that are

804
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 1: that are saying you gave me the tips to get here,

805
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 1: I see people in like the liquor store that are

806
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 1: buying white Claw and they're like, hey, hey, thanks to you,

807
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 1: I got here. Thanks man, selfie appreciating selfie. Yeah, that's

808
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:43,520
Speaker 1: how it works. That's that's the answer. Is No, I know,

809
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 1: I just want to engage you in this conversation. I

810
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:50,120
Speaker 1: appreciate you thinking about me. Then, yeah, thinking about you.

811
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:52,919
Speaker 1: You're right there. I mean I'm looking at you, looking good.

812
00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:55,839
Speaker 1: M Remy, you want to try to do a little

813
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,400
Speaker 1: ELK call run through here? Maybe for Phil, Phil you

814
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 1: can kind of ask questions as a new hunter, Remy

815
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:04,080
Speaker 1: kind of take him through the learning if you're a

816
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:07,680
Speaker 1: brand new fellow. Yeah it sounds good. Okay, So we's

817
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 1: start with caw calls. Um, so just explain to Phil,

818
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,359
Speaker 1: and Phil please ask questions about if your first time

819
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 1: picking up a diaphragm putting it in your mouth, and

820
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:20,920
Speaker 1: then here here goes the lesson Feiel. Get ready, Okay,

821
00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:23,399
Speaker 1: so you got you got your cow call. We're gonna

822
00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:25,360
Speaker 1: start with the cow call. So the cow call is

823
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 1: basically just the sounds that really obviously cows make, but

824
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 1: they make a lot of different sounds, so they got there.

825
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:34,919
Speaker 1: The basic sound they make would be like a mew,

826
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:39,239
Speaker 1: and it's just a sound that's just with my voice. Like,

827
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:40,840
Speaker 1: if you can make that sound with your voice, you

828
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:42,640
Speaker 1: can pretty much make that sound with a call, I

829
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 1: believe because a lot of it. A lot of people

830
00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:47,200
Speaker 1: think like, oh, the call makes the sound, but it's

831
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:50,439
Speaker 1: the pressure and the way that you make that call

832
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:53,680
Speaker 1: that makes it better. So I I mean, the first

833
00:41:53,719 --> 00:41:56,040
Speaker 1: thing I would do is just practice making those towns,

834
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:59,640
Speaker 1: those tones and sounds with your voice, because you'll know

835
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:04,040
Speaker 1: when to make those tone changes. So like, uh, basic MEU,

836
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna do it with my voice. Yeah, yeah,

837
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:12,319
Speaker 1: And then I'll use a call here. I don't know

838
00:42:12,360 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: if it'll pick it up right or what might get loud.

839
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 1: I'll try to do it quiet. Ye o, just me

840
00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:32,080
Speaker 1: you meu mew, and you can talk back and forth

841
00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:35,160
Speaker 1: with those cow calls. Cows make a lot of different sounds.

842
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 1: I think one of the most effective cow calls would

843
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:41,240
Speaker 1: be more of like an estrus wine, especially later in season.

844
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:43,840
Speaker 1: That can be I've heard it so many different ways.

845
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 1: I mean, you talk about a cow call, and people

846
00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:49,040
Speaker 1: name these cow calls, and you expect it to be

847
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 1: a certain way. But you get into a herd of

848
00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: elk and listen, you'll hear about five different sounds that

849
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:57,280
Speaker 1: you're like, okay, just start making some of those sounds.

850
00:42:57,320 --> 00:42:58,480
Speaker 1: The only one you don't want to do is like

851
00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 1: a bark, where it's like a that one is a

852
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:05,320
Speaker 1: little dangerous, But outside of that, how is that dangerous?

853
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:09,040
Speaker 1: Just out of curiosity? That's just an alert, Like it's

854
00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 1: it's like danger. It's one cow like when you get busted.

855
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:14,640
Speaker 1: If you hear that sound, you know you did something.

856
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:18,560
Speaker 1: It's like a high pitched just when they're barking at you.

857
00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,600
Speaker 1: So it's like literally like a high pitched dog bark um,

858
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,280
Speaker 1: And that's like alerting all the other elk, like pay attention.

859
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 1: There's some danger around, but for the most part, you

860
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 1: know cow's wheel talk back and forth, and it can

861
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 1: be Cow calls can be a great way to locate

862
00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:36,840
Speaker 1: elk because you might be able to get those cows

863
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 1: to make noise, especially if it's like hot, they aren't

864
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:42,719
Speaker 1: making like the bulls aren't really bugling. You can use

865
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:45,239
Speaker 1: those cow calls to kind of identify where the elk

866
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:47,520
Speaker 1: might be. I was, I was out in the office

867
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,359
Speaker 1: trying to find a cow call, but I couldn't find one.

868
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:53,080
Speaker 1: I die. I'd say that the best place to look

869
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 1: as Yannie's desk. You did, okay, I like Steve's desk.

870
00:43:57,560 --> 00:43:59,799
Speaker 1: Desk nothing okay. So I was gonna see if Phil

871
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:01,759
Speaker 1: could try this for the first time. But we'll have

872
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:03,560
Speaker 1: to save that for another time. Oh yeah, that's one

873
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:07,560
Speaker 1: thing I've never I I I have turkey calls. I

874
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 1: have cow calls, just it's like sitting in my car

875
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 1: because Yanni's like here, take these feeling. It throws me

876
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 1: a handful, and I've never once tried to use any

877
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:18,040
Speaker 1: You got them in your car right end of call.

878
00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 1: I think I think I only have turkey calls in

879
00:44:20,080 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 1: my car. I've got a cow call at home. Though

880
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 1: turkey calls work, they're they're all the same. Let's yeah,

881
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 1: it's really latex and that's it. That's all it really matters. Yeah,

882
00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 1: I would say if you're getting started though, um, there's

883
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:36,600
Speaker 1: like pick up a cow call. There's different kinds of

884
00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:39,520
Speaker 1: cow calls you can get. Um, I would say, like

885
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:42,279
Speaker 1: start with maybe like I've got this open read one here.

886
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 1: I haven't used it in a long time, but I

887
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:46,319
Speaker 1: just grabbed it because I forged to be good to

888
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,279
Speaker 1: talk about um. So like these open read ones, you

889
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:51,160
Speaker 1: kind of put your teeth on them. I'll try it

890
00:44:51,239 --> 00:44:58,560
Speaker 1: right now and just yeah. So it's just biting down

891
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:01,279
Speaker 1: and adding pressure and blowing over this read. There's other

892
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:03,440
Speaker 1: kinds they call them like bite calls, where those are

893
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:05,520
Speaker 1: really easy to use to you just bite the call

894
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:09,880
Speaker 1: and then blow and make that you sound um through

895
00:45:09,920 --> 00:45:12,560
Speaker 1: the call. And then there's even push button calls. Those

896
00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 1: are I mean, they get a lot of hoochie mama,

897
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:20,120
Speaker 1: hoochie mama. The other one, I don't even what's there's

898
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: another one. It was called like the Budlow or something

899
00:45:23,120 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: like that. The button one. UM, I think it was

900
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:28,840
Speaker 1: either like a Carlton call or something like that. That

901
00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 1: one was I thought that one was a lot better.

902
00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:33,960
Speaker 1: It made a few more different sounds, and even when

903
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:35,640
Speaker 1: I was guiding for a long time, I mean I

904
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 1: would have one of those in my pocket so I

905
00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:41,280
Speaker 1: could do like a diaphragm call, like a bite call,

906
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:43,880
Speaker 1: and then that my pocket where it sounds like different

907
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: call Elk in different directions, like creating kind of this

908
00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:50,360
Speaker 1: party or this illusion of like multiple cows, and you

909
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:52,640
Speaker 1: can do that by yourself. It's like the you know,

910
00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:54,600
Speaker 1: like the one man band, you know, the guy that's

911
00:45:54,600 --> 00:46:00,239
Speaker 1: got the harmonica on the thing with the most fun

912
00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 1: I've ever had working on your podcast was the Elk

913
00:46:02,760 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 1: Party episode that just came out a couple of weeks ago.

914
00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:11,320
Speaker 1: I noticed, I was like, okay, actually I thought it

915
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,279
Speaker 1: was pretty funny because there's like this part where I'm

916
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 1: in my office and I was like, you cannot tell,

917
00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:19,080
Speaker 1: but I was literally sprinting back and forth, like jumping

918
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:21,759
Speaker 1: out in like my office is just like antlers and

919
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,240
Speaker 1: things all over the ground, and I'm just like jumping

920
00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 1: over ship and falling like ran into a stool. You know,

921
00:46:29,160 --> 00:46:32,960
Speaker 1: Like what am I doing? Just living? Man? That's you're

922
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:39,440
Speaker 1: giving people the real the realness, realness, all right, What's

923
00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:42,520
Speaker 1: like I was off looking for diaphragms, But did you

924
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 1: give a few uh like entry level beyond the just

925
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 1: like diaphragm calls that you're gonna do for cows. Um,

926
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:55,160
Speaker 1: let's hear a couple of them. Oh yeah, I mean here,

927
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:57,080
Speaker 1: I'll just use this. These open read ones are really

928
00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 1: good to do, like like wine sound, because you can

929
00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:02,440
Speaker 1: go like up and down like high low. I like

930
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:04,800
Speaker 1: to think of like the estra swine almost like a

931
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:09,080
Speaker 1: bugle with a kind of like a if a coward

932
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:11,520
Speaker 1: a bugle. And I mean I've heard these like calls

933
00:47:11,600 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 1: just in crazy like sometimes they're really aggressive or or

934
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:17,759
Speaker 1: even like cow two cows fighting. It just sounds like this.

935
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:20,960
Speaker 1: It's a weird. It's a weird sound. But um, yeah,

936
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 1: you can do that. I'll do that with this one.

937
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:23,600
Speaker 1: I'll give it a try and use it a while,

938
00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 1: try it so those like longer sounds would be more

939
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:39,880
Speaker 1: like that that maybe a cow coming into heat. But

940
00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:42,799
Speaker 1: I've even heard like a sound similar like to that

941
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 1: estras call of that lead cow when she's like the

942
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:49,040
Speaker 1: one that's in charge that they're paying attention to. Or

943
00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 1: that's a really good way to get other cows to

944
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:55,480
Speaker 1: kind of respond that long drawn out cow sound. Um.

945
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,480
Speaker 1: You know even with these some of these open read

946
00:47:57,480 --> 00:47:59,759
Speaker 1: calls to if you're like new to calling and you

947
00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:02,560
Speaker 1: just they're having trouble with the diaphragm calls. Mean you

948
00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:04,680
Speaker 1: can even rip a couple of bugles with these things,

949
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:07,799
Speaker 1: like it's good enough, bugle, I might. I'm gonna try it.

950
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:13,120
Speaker 1: I don't actually know if it'll work, but um van yeah,

951
00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 1: take the rubber band off. The hard part is my

952
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:18,280
Speaker 1: microphones by my head and the end of the bugle

953
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:20,719
Speaker 1: tubes like one of my well you prepare. One of

954
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:22,719
Speaker 1: my favorite things is the names of alcohols. I got

955
00:48:22,800 --> 00:48:27,520
Speaker 1: an open read call called the easy Estress by Phelps. Yeah.

956
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:29,680
Speaker 1: I just love the names. I want a couple of

957
00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:31,760
Speaker 1: my company just to make the names of the calls,

958
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 1: just naming them. Yeah, I've got I've got some calls

959
00:48:36,160 --> 00:48:39,680
Speaker 1: coming out that that have some good names. If I

960
00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:42,520
Speaker 1: should have known, you should let me help you, man,

961
00:48:42,560 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 1: I'm uh um yeah, so let's hear it. I don't know,

962
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:52,040
Speaker 1: but oh yeah, I was. I'll try this. This is um,

963
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:54,319
Speaker 1: this is just with the open reads. We'll see if

964
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 1: this works. Although I might take me a one or two,

965
00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:13,040
Speaker 1: but it wasn't too bad. That's better than that was

966
00:49:13,080 --> 00:49:15,960
Speaker 1: just with an open read call, like just biting down. Man,

967
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:17,960
Speaker 1: I feel like that's Michael Jordan, like shooting had half

968
00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:21,520
Speaker 1: cork and I'll see if this goes in it like

969
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:26,680
Speaker 1: oh yeah interesting sweet Uh yeah no. But I'm just saying, like,

970
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:28,759
Speaker 1: you can, you can. You don't have to be so

971
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:32,640
Speaker 1: wrapped up on when you're getting started the call or whatever.

972
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 1: I used um for a long time, calls that I

973
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 1: think people like maybe would say look down on, but

974
00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:42,680
Speaker 1: I you know, you just you get or like the

975
00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 1: you know, the pros or like that's a that's a

976
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:50,520
Speaker 1: over the whatever top latex style call, not a diaphragm call.

977
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:52,600
Speaker 1: You can't call with that and be like yeah, okay,

978
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:57,560
Speaker 1: here's a photo album of all the call It's like,

979
00:49:57,640 --> 00:50:01,680
Speaker 1: don't it doesn't really matter. I mean, you know later Actually,

980
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:04,359
Speaker 1: when I was guiding, I would always start out with

981
00:50:04,400 --> 00:50:07,839
Speaker 1: my diaphragm calls and everything. That's what I use. But sometimes, uh,

982
00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:10,200
Speaker 1: you know, by by week five or six or as

983
00:50:10,239 --> 00:50:12,040
Speaker 1: you start to get in the rifle season, your mouth

984
00:50:12,160 --> 00:50:14,960
Speaker 1: just gets so tired. Um. I just like switch up

985
00:50:14,960 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 1: the different types of calls just to keep from getting

986
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:19,279
Speaker 1: like I'd have callouses on the roof of my mouth

987
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:22,920
Speaker 1: from calling all day every day. You know. Um, but

988
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:26,080
Speaker 1: you you know, like I said, just just start practicing

989
00:50:26,160 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 1: and just understand. Get that bugle down, get some and

990
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:33,440
Speaker 1: then understand those cow calls. And maybe you you know,

991
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:37,120
Speaker 1: maybe you aren't good at calling, aren't feeling confident calling. Well,

992
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,520
Speaker 1: look for scenarios where you the kind of calling you

993
00:50:40,560 --> 00:50:43,600
Speaker 1: can do. We'll call in a bowl. So let's say

994
00:50:43,640 --> 00:50:46,279
Speaker 1: you're out there, it's the first time l hunting, and

995
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:48,680
Speaker 1: you're glassing, like do a lot of glassing, and you

996
00:50:48,719 --> 00:50:52,399
Speaker 1: spot a bowl that's by himself, and you have got

997
00:50:52,440 --> 00:50:55,080
Speaker 1: these cow calls down, You've got some maybe you've got

998
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:56,880
Speaker 1: a push button call in your pocket, you've got an

999
00:50:56,880 --> 00:50:58,759
Speaker 1: open read call, you've got a bike call, and you

1000
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:04,000
Speaker 1: can make that sound you know, Okay, sweet, you will

1001
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:06,680
Speaker 1: call that bull in like that's that's a pretty good

1002
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:09,239
Speaker 1: scenario where you can where you can call that bull in.

1003
00:51:09,640 --> 00:51:12,480
Speaker 1: You know, watch him, see where he goes, if he's moving,

1004
00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:15,640
Speaker 1: go and cut him off, getting ahead of where you

1005
00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:17,800
Speaker 1: think he's gonna go. Get the wind right and start

1006
00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 1: throwing out some cow sounds, and that bowl will probably

1007
00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:23,200
Speaker 1: come in quiet, he'll come check things out and he'll

1008
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 1: probably be within range. And that's like just understanding once

1009
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:29,960
Speaker 1: if I see that scenario and I'm hunting him, like okay, yep,

1010
00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:33,359
Speaker 1: that bull is a dead bull, and just looking for

1011
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:36,000
Speaker 1: those scenarios that kind of match the type of hunting

1012
00:51:36,239 --> 00:51:38,520
Speaker 1: or maybe the techniques that you know how to do,

1013
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:41,880
Speaker 1: and then go for those scenarios. I personally love to

1014
00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:46,080
Speaker 1: bugle in bulls, so I like to get bulls fired up.

1015
00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:49,040
Speaker 1: I like that whole exchange of bugling. I mean there's

1016
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:51,080
Speaker 1: times where I'll be bugling and I'll get a bull

1017
00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 1: of respond, but he just doesn't seem like he's gonna

1018
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: get fired up, or he kind of quiets down. Instead

1019
00:51:56,160 --> 00:51:57,600
Speaker 1: of wasting a lot of time on that bowl, I

1020
00:51:57,640 --> 00:51:59,759
Speaker 1: might just go somewhere else, might just start looking for

1021
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 1: a old that wants to play with the type of

1022
00:52:02,640 --> 00:52:05,640
Speaker 1: tactics that I want to employ that day. And that's

1023
00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:08,319
Speaker 1: another thing to think about. Yeah, I love that, And

1024
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:10,960
Speaker 1: there's and I'll tell you I'm manning remy at the

1025
00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:13,080
Speaker 1: mediator dot com quite often that that stuff comes to

1026
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:15,360
Speaker 1: my inbox and I read a lot of it. I

1027
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:17,560
Speaker 1: love to do that just because I like to hear

1028
00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:20,480
Speaker 1: what's on people's mind, and um, I think that comes

1029
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:22,359
Speaker 1: I know you know this, but that comes in quite

1030
00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:25,160
Speaker 1: a lot. Um. Well, you know how Okay, I'm going

1031
00:52:25,200 --> 00:52:27,160
Speaker 1: on a d I Y L hunt in the public lands.

1032
00:52:27,160 --> 00:52:30,200
Speaker 1: I've got a whole chunk of national forest. Maybe it's

1033
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:32,480
Speaker 1: a million acres, maybe it's a hundred thousand, doesn't even matter,

1034
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 1: big chunky national forest to run through. When you're going

1035
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:38,000
Speaker 1: into something like that, say you're going in by yourself,

1036
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 1: you've got seven days to hunt. How many spots have

1037
00:52:40,520 --> 00:52:42,799
Speaker 1: you looked at on on X, how many how many

1038
00:52:43,040 --> 00:52:45,799
Speaker 1: you know basins or how many drainages have you looked at?

1039
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:49,280
Speaker 1: Because I've heard I've heard others say like I always

1040
00:52:49,320 --> 00:52:51,759
Speaker 1: have at least four spots that I'm gonna check out

1041
00:52:51,880 --> 00:52:54,239
Speaker 1: that I know that I can get to within you know,

1042
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:57,279
Speaker 1: half a day's time or whatever. But it's interesting to know,

1043
00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,799
Speaker 1: like what's the you know, what's the layout of a hunt? Um?

1044
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:02,759
Speaker 1: Or are you just kind of popping from place to

1045
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:06,480
Speaker 1: place if something doesn't work out? Uh? Yeah, I mean

1046
00:53:06,560 --> 00:53:08,279
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't spend a lot of time if

1047
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 1: I don't find what I like. I think some people

1048
00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:13,640
Speaker 1: might spend more time. I get like, I'm just like, yeah,

1049
00:53:13,640 --> 00:53:16,960
Speaker 1: I'll just go until I find what I'm looking for. Um.

1050
00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:18,600
Speaker 1: I mean, I have a lot of spots that I

1051
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:21,560
Speaker 1: like to check out, So it just depends. I mean,

1052
00:53:21,640 --> 00:53:23,360
Speaker 1: if I like a new area, like I've got an

1053
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:26,759
Speaker 1: ELK tag in an area I've never been this year, Um,

1054
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:29,480
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna actually most of my hunts, I like

1055
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:31,839
Speaker 1: to try to go to new spots now and just

1056
00:53:31,880 --> 00:53:35,080
Speaker 1: try try new new places. And I'll probably have a

1057
00:53:35,160 --> 00:53:38,080
Speaker 1: dozen places that I want to check out or something,

1058
00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:41,000
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, and I rank them. You know,

1059
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:43,439
Speaker 1: the first one I probably run into El Cat. But

1060
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:51,880
Speaker 1: if I if I get down to number twelve, right, yeah, exactly. Um,

1061
00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:55,439
Speaker 1: But you know you're you're kind of like I might

1062
00:53:55,520 --> 00:53:58,320
Speaker 1: just you know, kind of be mobile the first couple

1063
00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:00,640
Speaker 1: of days and and really just kind of check check

1064
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:03,040
Speaker 1: things out, get a lay of the land. I understand like, Okay,

1065
00:54:03,040 --> 00:54:05,360
Speaker 1: this has what I'm looking for, This doesn't have what

1066
00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:07,439
Speaker 1: I'm looking for. You might get in somewhere and say

1067
00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:10,000
Speaker 1: this isn't this isn't really what I was looking for.

1068
00:54:10,120 --> 00:54:12,480
Speaker 1: Or you get somewhere and there's eight trucks there and

1069
00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:15,160
Speaker 1: you're like not next, Like I'm already that already, Just

1070
00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:18,399
Speaker 1: I just write that off, you know, Um, I'd rather

1071
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:21,000
Speaker 1: go to it, maybe a less productive place with fewer

1072
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:24,279
Speaker 1: people and where I can work a bowl and have

1073
00:54:24,400 --> 00:54:27,520
Speaker 1: to mess with other people calling. And some places you

1074
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 1: go and you just can't even get away from that,

1075
00:54:29,120 --> 00:54:30,759
Speaker 1: so you just kind of gotta you gotta bite the

1076
00:54:30,760 --> 00:54:33,080
Speaker 1: bullet and say whatever. Now that's what I thought I've

1077
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:34,880
Speaker 1: had when I've had people say, hey, let me know

1078
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:36,719
Speaker 1: when you're going to this spot, if we both kind

1079
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:38,799
Speaker 1: of stumbled on the same spot, or if we if

1080
00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:40,719
Speaker 1: we're sharing a spot, like let me know when you're

1081
00:54:40,719 --> 00:54:42,759
Speaker 1: gonna be in there. So, man, I'm not there's so

1082
00:54:42,760 --> 00:54:45,319
Speaker 1: many places for me to go, like I've never if

1083
00:54:45,360 --> 00:54:46,600
Speaker 1: if you're gonna be in there, let me know, I

1084
00:54:46,640 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 1: just won't go. I'm not gonna fight anybody or a spot.

1085
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:51,920
Speaker 1: It's not worth it. It's just a public land. Especially

1086
00:54:51,960 --> 00:54:55,440
Speaker 1: like the philosophy, people kind of take ownership of a

1087
00:54:55,520 --> 00:54:57,279
Speaker 1: spot or an area and be like, man, I'm not

1088
00:54:57,440 --> 00:55:01,280
Speaker 1: if you're going in there, go I'll go somewhere else. Alway. Um,

1089
00:55:01,360 --> 00:55:02,960
Speaker 1: you know, maybe that's to the detriment, but that's just

1090
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:05,600
Speaker 1: how I look at it. Yeah, and I mean there's

1091
00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:09,600
Speaker 1: definitely room to roam in a lot of places. But UM,

1092
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:11,719
Speaker 1: I don't know. I I just like to I just

1093
00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:14,000
Speaker 1: like to have options and then kind of you know,

1094
00:55:14,280 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 1: keep I I like to stay. I would say, like

1095
00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:19,759
Speaker 1: mobile enough to where I'm not really bogged down in

1096
00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 1: one place that you know that's not going to be productive.

1097
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:25,640
Speaker 1: If it's not productive, it's not productive. Not saying it

1098
00:55:25,640 --> 00:55:27,759
Speaker 1: won't be productive two days later, not saying I won't

1099
00:55:27,800 --> 00:55:29,520
Speaker 1: check it again, not saying I won't go back, but

1100
00:55:29,880 --> 00:55:31,799
Speaker 1: it's not productive while I'm there, And then I'm gonna

1101
00:55:31,840 --> 00:55:33,879
Speaker 1: go try to find somewhere that's gonna be productive while

1102
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:36,480
Speaker 1: I am there. Sure well, I was just I just

1103
00:55:36,560 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 1: praed open, cracked open the remy at the mediator dot com. Um,

1104
00:55:41,800 --> 00:55:43,359
Speaker 1: do a couple of questions real quick. I don't want

1105
00:55:43,360 --> 00:55:45,160
Speaker 1: to drain your well for your next Q and A.

1106
00:55:45,239 --> 00:55:50,200
Speaker 1: But a couple of good A couple of anton mirnov.

1107
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:53,840
Speaker 1: He said, I'm prepping for in October Elkin, Idaho, and

1108
00:55:53,840 --> 00:55:57,400
Speaker 1: have some questions to help with my onyx Google Earth scouting.

1109
00:55:57,560 --> 00:56:01,440
Speaker 1: I've heard you all talk about the three things Elk need, feed, water, cover,

1110
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:04,600
Speaker 1: north facing slopes with thick timber being a choice betting area.

1111
00:56:05,239 --> 00:56:08,680
Speaker 1: My questions how much timber is enough? Does there need

1112
00:56:08,680 --> 00:56:10,600
Speaker 1: to be a large air of contiguous timber or are

1113
00:56:11,440 --> 00:56:15,120
Speaker 1: patches sufficient? If you ask what what is large? So

1114
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:19,120
Speaker 1: how many trees can an elk sleep under? I mean

1115
00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:22,239
Speaker 1: it really depends on the type of you know, like

1116
00:56:22,280 --> 00:56:25,360
Speaker 1: the type of terrain. If you're talking like high desert,

1117
00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:29,880
Speaker 1: open desert man four trees, you know, like might it

1118
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:32,759
Speaker 1: might not even you know an aspen well, actually more

1119
00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:35,799
Speaker 1: like high desert to be like those aspen patches in

1120
00:56:35,840 --> 00:56:38,560
Speaker 1: a canyon where everything else is open, but somewhere to

1121
00:56:38,600 --> 00:56:40,680
Speaker 1: just keep the sun off. I mean, think about an elk.

1122
00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:43,840
Speaker 1: One thing that I learned early on, and I remember

1123
00:56:44,280 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 1: one of the first outfitters that he would always say

1124
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:49,720
Speaker 1: this is like elk are always hot. It doesn't matter

1125
00:56:49,760 --> 00:56:52,160
Speaker 1: the time of year. They're always hot. You think about

1126
00:56:52,239 --> 00:56:56,480
Speaker 1: them like they're wearing a giant, massive fur coat all

1127
00:56:56,560 --> 00:57:00,320
Speaker 1: year round and they're always hot. So you got to

1128
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,359
Speaker 1: think about how is that hot animal going to cool

1129
00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:05,000
Speaker 1: itself down? Especially in September when it could be eighty

1130
00:57:05,040 --> 00:57:07,720
Speaker 1: degrees out. You know they're gonna want enough to where

1131
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:11,080
Speaker 1: it's shaded, it's you know, ten degrees cooler than out

1132
00:57:11,080 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 1: in the sun or more. And find those spots and

1133
00:57:14,560 --> 00:57:18,280
Speaker 1: that might even necessarily be Um, a hill that stays

1134
00:57:18,280 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 1: shaded longer is gonna stay cooler longer. And that hill

1135
00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:23,200
Speaker 1: has trees on it's gonna be cool. And maybe there's

1136
00:57:23,240 --> 00:57:25,880
Speaker 1: a creek or something nearby. Like they like, they like

1137
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:29,040
Speaker 1: to stay cool. So, uh, find those places, you know,

1138
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:31,160
Speaker 1: if it's somewhere that you feel like you could go

1139
00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:34,880
Speaker 1: into and stay shaded. Sweet. I mean I've seen twenty

1140
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:38,680
Speaker 1: elk bed in a patch of junipers that would be like, um,

1141
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:42,160
Speaker 1: like real thick pinion juniper stuff out in the desert

1142
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:46,960
Speaker 1: that's I don't know, thirty yards across maybe you know.

1143
00:57:47,040 --> 00:57:50,120
Speaker 1: So it's just like it just depends. Um, they just

1144
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:53,440
Speaker 1: need something. But uh, you know if the if the

1145
00:57:53,480 --> 00:57:57,400
Speaker 1: area does have a lot of thick timber, then that's

1146
00:57:57,440 --> 00:57:59,919
Speaker 1: good too. I mean, it just depends on where you're at.

1147
00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:04,880
Speaker 1: All right, we got Garrett and Moody. We'll do one more. Um.

1148
00:58:04,920 --> 00:58:08,000
Speaker 1: Garrett Moody says, I'm an alcanor from Washington State, UM,

1149
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:09,800
Speaker 1: new to Archie hunting. I was curious if you had

1150
00:58:09,840 --> 00:58:12,280
Speaker 1: any tips when calling loan bulls or elk and very

1151
00:58:12,320 --> 00:58:14,600
Speaker 1: small groups. He hunts roosevelts in an air with very

1152
00:58:14,640 --> 00:58:18,000
Speaker 1: little elk density, where he encounters loan bulls more often

1153
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:21,280
Speaker 1: than elk and herd's. I was curious of input on

1154
00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:24,919
Speaker 1: calling in these situations. Thanks for the show. Yeah, that's

1155
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:27,240
Speaker 1: what UM. I mean. I kind of already talked about that,

1156
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:29,840
Speaker 1: but I loan bulls are the easiest to call in

1157
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:32,280
Speaker 1: UM for a lot of reasons, Like they can be

1158
00:58:32,360 --> 00:58:36,240
Speaker 1: tricked so many different ways. They can be cow called

1159
00:58:36,280 --> 00:58:38,880
Speaker 1: in now. One one of the difficult things with a

1160
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:42,040
Speaker 1: loan bull is you might be calling to him and

1161
00:58:42,080 --> 00:58:44,720
Speaker 1: he may not call back. He may not he may

1162
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:48,360
Speaker 1: want to check things out before he commits to a setup.

1163
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:50,360
Speaker 1: So if you if you've got a loan bull that's

1164
00:58:50,360 --> 00:58:53,440
Speaker 1: like responding bugling, and you know he doesn't have any cows,

1165
00:58:54,120 --> 00:58:56,400
Speaker 1: you can bugle back. You can pretty much do whatever,

1166
00:58:56,560 --> 00:58:58,959
Speaker 1: just kind of maybe throw out some of that elk

1167
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:02,240
Speaker 1: party action, make some cow calls, some bowl calls, and

1168
00:59:02,280 --> 00:59:04,320
Speaker 1: you'll probably and then I would just switch to bull

1169
00:59:04,360 --> 00:59:07,600
Speaker 1: calling and you'll probably bugle that bull right in if

1170
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:10,680
Speaker 1: he's just kind of by himself and maybe he's like, uh,

1171
00:59:11,200 --> 00:59:13,520
Speaker 1: maybe he'd been kicked out or beat up by another elk.

1172
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:15,920
Speaker 1: You know, making some of those cow calls might be

1173
00:59:16,120 --> 00:59:19,360
Speaker 1: a better way to just draw him in without the

1174
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:23,200
Speaker 1: potential of pushing him off. Because another thing that in

1175
00:59:23,400 --> 00:59:27,000
Speaker 1: low density areas to what you'll like at an elk

1176
00:59:27,240 --> 00:59:29,200
Speaker 1: in an area that maybe only has a couple of cows,

1177
00:59:29,240 --> 00:59:31,680
Speaker 1: what you'll notice is he's pretty likely to just around

1178
00:59:31,680 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 1: those cows up and push him off because they're hard

1179
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:36,240
Speaker 1: to find. It's like, it's not it's not one of

1180
00:59:36,280 --> 00:59:39,120
Speaker 1: those things where he can just um get in there

1181
00:59:39,160 --> 00:59:41,680
Speaker 1: and keep them. They can they're easier. Those elk kind

1182
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:44,040
Speaker 1: of like may not even want to be pushed around

1183
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:48,240
Speaker 1: by a bull. They can disperse pretty easy. So you know,

1184
00:59:48,280 --> 00:59:50,440
Speaker 1: if you get real aggressive right off the bat, it

1185
00:59:50,520 --> 00:59:52,560
Speaker 1: might be something where you push that elk away as

1186
00:59:52,600 --> 00:59:55,960
Speaker 1: opposed to draw him in. But I think one thing

1187
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:58,320
Speaker 1: in those scenarios you've got to be careful of is

1188
00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:01,400
Speaker 1: just thinking that the bull isn't coming in because you

1189
01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:03,880
Speaker 1: aren't hearing him, because those lone bulls do tend to

1190
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:05,920
Speaker 1: come in silent and it's not as fun, but it

1191
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:09,040
Speaker 1: can still be successful. Yeah, we had that a couple

1192
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:10,880
Speaker 1: times last year where you can hear him coming in

1193
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:13,120
Speaker 1: but they're not bugling like you can hear him crashing.

1194
01:00:13,200 --> 01:00:14,840
Speaker 1: You can hear you know, you here coming. I heard

1195
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:16,360
Speaker 1: we had last year, Will come up the bottom of

1196
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:18,120
Speaker 1: the strainage that was splashing through a creek and you

1197
01:00:18,160 --> 01:00:20,040
Speaker 1: can just hear him. But he never viewed. One time

1198
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:22,160
Speaker 1: you hear him breathing and we never did see him.

1199
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:24,160
Speaker 1: He knew he was there. So the beauty of elk,

1200
01:00:24,480 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 1: the beauty of el Gunning, is that mystery. So I

1201
01:00:26,960 --> 01:00:28,680
Speaker 1: just going through this man, you know, it's beautiful about

1202
01:00:28,680 --> 01:00:31,320
Speaker 1: this that's going through all the emails you receive about

1203
01:00:31,360 --> 01:00:35,600
Speaker 1: your podcasts, and you know there is so much diversity.

1204
01:00:35,640 --> 01:00:38,880
Speaker 1: I mean, looking at an email from Tori Sulmanson. She's

1205
01:00:38,920 --> 01:00:41,920
Speaker 1: fifty nine, uh fifteen ye on year old female and

1206
01:00:41,960 --> 01:00:44,640
Speaker 1: she's going out on her first hunt this year. We

1207
01:00:44,760 --> 01:00:47,560
Speaker 1: have Phil Will know I can't pronounce anybody's name, but

1208
01:00:47,600 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 1: look at this one. Phil Maylan Bala Jadiya, Uh Maylan

1209
01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:57,640
Speaker 1: bala Jadiya from Alaska. Yeah, I'm not even gonna try

1210
01:00:57,640 --> 01:01:00,400
Speaker 1: to give a crack. Anton Mere and Off we talked about,

1211
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:03,080
Speaker 1: I mean, people from all walks of life, all across

1212
01:01:03,240 --> 01:01:08,360
Speaker 1: this country. Gender's ethnicities doesn't matter, man, um, all this

1213
01:01:08,400 --> 01:01:11,160
Speaker 1: stuff brings people together. So it's good man, just straight

1214
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:14,680
Speaker 1: knowledge at cutting the distance. And uh, it's knowledge that

1215
01:01:14,760 --> 01:01:18,200
Speaker 1: it's bringing people together. So well done, Remy, Warren. I

1216
01:01:18,280 --> 01:01:20,560
Speaker 1: like it. I like it too. You want to send

1217
01:01:20,640 --> 01:01:24,280
Speaker 1: us out with just as just a beautiful earth shattering

1218
01:01:24,560 --> 01:01:28,480
Speaker 1: forest changing bugle, Just rip one for us and then

1219
01:01:28,480 --> 01:01:31,920
Speaker 1: we'll say goodbye. Yeah, it'll mostly be throwing my throat.

1220
01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:35,400
Speaker 1: I'm gonna take my head shut off seat, just ripping thing.

1221
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:54,360
Speaker 1: I'm good, feel nearly fainted. I grated to grab the

1222
01:01:54,400 --> 01:02:01,160
Speaker 1: table for stability like well to Warren, good looking at

1223
01:02:01,160 --> 01:02:03,480
Speaker 1: life to dude, Um, let us know how it goes.

1224
01:02:03,800 --> 01:02:06,160
Speaker 1: And all you people have to be listening to cutting

1225
01:02:06,160 --> 01:02:07,880
Speaker 1: the distance. Um, I was. We were just gonna do

1226
01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:09,840
Speaker 1: kind of like an opening segment here, but it's gonna

1227
01:02:09,840 --> 01:02:12,040
Speaker 1: be a whole dayn podcast because why he'll not sure

1228
01:02:12,280 --> 01:02:15,640
Speaker 1: how we roll. So we'll talk. We'll talk to you soon. Man,

1229
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:29,000
Speaker 1: thanks for Remy. All right, calculator, that's it. That's all

1230
01:02:29,480 --> 01:02:32,560
Speaker 1: another episode in the books. Now we have to have

1231
01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:36,400
Speaker 1: a little conversation again behind the scenes. I was, I

1232
01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:38,920
Speaker 1: was intending for for this podcast. As I was just

1233
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:41,280
Speaker 1: telling Remy for this podcast to be like an intro

1234
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:43,920
Speaker 1: to you know, another interview we're gonna do later with

1235
01:02:44,240 --> 01:02:47,959
Speaker 1: the great powerful Fred Eichler. Um, if you don't know Fred,

1236
01:02:48,000 --> 01:02:50,240
Speaker 1: like litterally, look it up, go follow them on Instagram.

1237
01:02:50,240 --> 01:02:53,720
Speaker 1: He's the best. He's the funniest. Also in ELK Guide

1238
01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:55,720
Speaker 1: in Colorado, and so we're gonna like have two ELK

1239
01:02:55,720 --> 01:02:58,280
Speaker 1: Guides talking. Remy's gonna be like the intro. But it

1240
01:02:58,320 --> 01:02:59,840
Speaker 1: was such a great conversation. It went for so long,

1241
01:02:59,840 --> 01:03:02,880
Speaker 1: it's gonna be one whole episode. Sure. And then Phil said,

1242
01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:06,800
Speaker 1: great idea, do it more often. He was like, stop

1243
01:03:06,800 --> 01:03:10,120
Speaker 1: making all this work for yourself, idiot. Just have cool

1244
01:03:10,120 --> 01:03:12,840
Speaker 1: conversations with people and then just let it be a podcast.

1245
01:03:12,920 --> 01:03:16,640
Speaker 1: So um, Phil's stage advice always heated here at the

1246
01:03:16,720 --> 01:03:22,320
Speaker 1: Hunting Collective. Never not listen to Phil. Ever, Hey, the

1247
01:03:22,360 --> 01:03:25,280
Speaker 1: Barry Kay Gilbert thing by the Bye worked out great.

1248
01:03:25,320 --> 01:03:28,440
Speaker 1: See see Yeah, so in that case I was wrong. Yeah,

1249
01:03:28,480 --> 01:03:30,680
Speaker 1: in this case, I think you're right. Like, you're right.

1250
01:03:31,040 --> 01:03:33,720
Speaker 1: So next week we are going to have I'm going

1251
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:38,120
Speaker 1: hunting with my dad. He's coming for opening Day. As

1252
01:03:38,160 --> 01:03:40,840
Speaker 1: I was just saying, to Remy and so we're gonna

1253
01:03:40,880 --> 01:03:42,320
Speaker 1: do a little bit of that. Next week. We got

1254
01:03:42,320 --> 01:03:46,000
Speaker 1: Fred Eikler coming up. UM. We are going to interview

1255
01:03:46,280 --> 01:03:48,640
Speaker 1: a guy named Paul Baser, as we talked about a

1256
01:03:48,640 --> 01:03:50,960
Speaker 1: little bit last couple of weeks ago. He is one

1257
01:03:51,000 --> 01:03:55,800
Speaker 1: of the premier animal rights activists. He's coming out of Australia. UM.

1258
01:03:56,160 --> 01:03:58,400
Speaker 1: His group is called Anonymous for the Voiceless and they

1259
01:03:58,400 --> 01:04:01,200
Speaker 1: did protest one of our live shows and Sacramento last year,

1260
01:04:01,920 --> 01:04:04,360
Speaker 1: which is how I was introduced to them, and it

1261
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:07,640
Speaker 1: was an interesting time. But as I was preparing for

1262
01:04:07,640 --> 01:04:11,520
Speaker 1: that podcast phil Um I was writing down, I was

1263
01:04:11,600 --> 01:04:14,680
Speaker 1: kind of going through, not, hey, here's the data to

1264
01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:18,800
Speaker 1: to tell this guy why animal rights activism is wrong

1265
01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:22,080
Speaker 1: or what I feel about it. One part of the

1266
01:04:22,080 --> 01:04:26,560
Speaker 1: conversation I want to have with Paul is, hey, I

1267
01:04:26,600 --> 01:04:28,880
Speaker 1: would like to understand why you do what you do,

1268
01:04:28,920 --> 01:04:32,280
Speaker 1: which is a discussion and exploration of why you feel

1269
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,120
Speaker 1: the way you do. I mean, why you feel killing

1270
01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:38,040
Speaker 1: an animal is murder, why you feel we shouldn't eat

1271
01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:42,520
Speaker 1: animal flesh as a society, and and that are human

1272
01:04:42,520 --> 01:04:45,560
Speaker 1: evolution has come to a point where now we can

1273
01:04:46,560 --> 01:04:49,880
Speaker 1: live in a world with no meat, and that's what

1274
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:51,880
Speaker 1: he believes, and he believes it's strongly enough to commit

1275
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:55,240
Speaker 1: his life to activism around it. So that's interesting enough

1276
01:04:55,280 --> 01:04:57,400
Speaker 1: to me. But then I was also thinking, you know,

1277
01:04:57,440 --> 01:04:59,440
Speaker 1: how do I how do I take break that all

1278
01:04:59,440 --> 01:05:01,520
Speaker 1: down and then explain to him why I personally do

1279
01:05:01,560 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 1: what I do and what why it's important to me

1280
01:05:03,760 --> 01:05:09,640
Speaker 1: because I think that is the strongest way to convince

1281
01:05:09,680 --> 01:05:13,840
Speaker 1: someone that hunting has value. And that's really the question

1282
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:16,200
Speaker 1: that I think Paul asked. I think I was saying, I.

1283
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:17,960
Speaker 1: I don't know if I said this before, Phil, but

1284
01:05:18,000 --> 01:05:21,080
Speaker 1: I think Paul Basher is kind of like the head

1285
01:05:21,160 --> 01:05:23,919
Speaker 1: like we're giving a video game analogy. He's like the

1286
01:05:23,920 --> 01:05:29,640
Speaker 1: the last boss in the Hunter Versus Vegan argument debate podcast.

1287
01:05:29,680 --> 01:05:35,800
Speaker 1: Is that sure? He's like Bowser and Mario. Yeah, all

1288
01:05:35,920 --> 01:05:38,800
Speaker 1: right in a way, because this dude, I was really confused,

1289
01:05:38,840 --> 01:05:41,040
Speaker 1: but now they get that way, you get it. I

1290
01:05:41,080 --> 01:05:43,280
Speaker 1: totally understand. Well, yeah, you play like three or four levels,

1291
01:05:43,320 --> 01:05:45,240
Speaker 1: you finally get to Bowser. He's starting fireballs at you,

1292
01:05:45,360 --> 01:05:48,400
Speaker 1: exactly similar to what this is like. And so when

1293
01:05:48,400 --> 01:05:51,080
Speaker 1: you get to that point, this is the guy who

1294
01:05:51,080 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: spends his life debating and reasoning and talking out one worldview,

1295
01:05:55,520 --> 01:05:58,200
Speaker 1: one ideology. That's what he does, that's what his group

1296
01:05:58,320 --> 01:06:01,200
Speaker 1: is trying to convince people to come to their to

1297
01:06:01,280 --> 01:06:04,400
Speaker 1: their side where we as hunters, you know, especially in

1298
01:06:04,440 --> 01:06:05,960
Speaker 1: this podcast, we're not trying to get everybody to go

1299
01:06:05,960 --> 01:06:08,080
Speaker 1: do what we do. We just want some understanding UM

1300
01:06:09,040 --> 01:06:12,080
Speaker 1: and some social and cultural acceptance where it's it's currently not.

1301
01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:14,360
Speaker 1: And so I wrote some things down, Phil, would you

1302
01:06:14,400 --> 01:06:16,760
Speaker 1: allow me to read a few things too. This is

1303
01:06:16,840 --> 01:06:19,360
Speaker 1: kind of the why if I was talking to a vegan,

1304
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:21,760
Speaker 1: which I will be very soon, kind of the things

1305
01:06:21,800 --> 01:06:24,400
Speaker 1: I want to go through. And I start off by

1306
01:06:24,400 --> 01:06:27,200
Speaker 1: saying that, you know, we talk a lot about the

1307
01:06:27,200 --> 01:06:29,840
Speaker 1: North American model of wildlife conservation. We talk a lot

1308
01:06:29,880 --> 01:06:31,800
Speaker 1: about Pittman Robertson, We talk a lot about kind of

1309
01:06:31,800 --> 01:06:36,880
Speaker 1: the mechanisms of conservation. But sometimes those things fall short

1310
01:06:37,280 --> 01:06:42,320
Speaker 1: because they are tangible, they do their their mechanical there

1311
01:06:42,160 --> 01:06:44,840
Speaker 1: that there's not enough emotion there. And I don't wake up.

1312
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:47,160
Speaker 1: Phil is not gonna win. When Phil starts hunting. You're

1313
01:06:47,200 --> 01:06:49,840
Speaker 1: not gonna wake up at three am because you're participating

1314
01:06:49,880 --> 01:06:52,360
Speaker 1: in the federal duck Stand program. You're gonna wake up

1315
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:54,920
Speaker 1: at three am because it's really fun and it's your

1316
01:06:54,920 --> 01:06:59,000
Speaker 1: favorite thing to do, and it even though it's hard

1317
01:06:59,280 --> 01:07:01,800
Speaker 1: and your tie aired and you've got to drink of

1318
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:04,040
Speaker 1: monster energy just to get through the morning. And you're

1319
01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:05,640
Speaker 1: not even there with your kids when they wake up

1320
01:07:06,280 --> 01:07:08,600
Speaker 1: and all that stuff all the time, the energy, the money,

1321
01:07:09,600 --> 01:07:11,600
Speaker 1: the you're not out there going like, hey, kids. The

1322
01:07:11,600 --> 01:07:14,200
Speaker 1: reason why I'm out here duck hunting at three am,

1323
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:16,520
Speaker 1: we're putting my decoys out three am, slashing through the

1324
01:07:16,520 --> 01:07:18,560
Speaker 1: water is because the Federal Ducks Stand program. That's not

1325
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:22,080
Speaker 1: why you do that ship now, no way, And so

1326
01:07:22,200 --> 01:07:25,959
Speaker 1: trying to justify your hunting in that way often falls short.

1327
01:07:26,160 --> 01:07:28,560
Speaker 1: These are side pieces to the explanation, right, Phil, I mean,

1328
01:07:28,600 --> 01:07:30,520
Speaker 1: these are these are things that I'm saying right, feel

1329
01:07:30,560 --> 01:07:33,840
Speaker 1: like you're gonna just say right without listening to what

1330
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:37,040
Speaker 1: I'm saying next, right PHILM yeah, right. So these are

1331
01:07:37,120 --> 01:07:41,400
Speaker 1: these are parallel. These are side benefits to hunting. They're

1332
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:43,120
Speaker 1: not the reasons we go. So when you're trying to

1333
01:07:43,480 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 1: explain something to a vegan, you might fall into the

1334
01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:49,640
Speaker 1: trap of of explaining the North American model as though

1335
01:07:49,800 --> 01:07:53,000
Speaker 1: you're some altruistic hunter that you're out there doing it

1336
01:07:53,040 --> 01:07:55,000
Speaker 1: because the money, where the money comes from and where

1337
01:07:55,000 --> 01:08:00,800
Speaker 1: the money goes um, and often that's not exactly the case. Summa, Summa,

1338
01:08:00,840 --> 01:08:05,760
Speaker 1: read this, Philly ready. Um. No matter who you're talking to,

1339
01:08:06,320 --> 01:08:08,760
Speaker 1: where and where they come from, or what they're struggling

1340
01:08:08,760 --> 01:08:11,120
Speaker 1: within their own lives, there will be something in your

1341
01:08:11,120 --> 01:08:15,040
Speaker 1: explanation of hunting that speaks to them. I've had so

1342
01:08:15,080 --> 01:08:17,400
Speaker 1: many non hunters sat during conversations like the one that

1343
01:08:17,400 --> 01:08:20,640
Speaker 1: I'm going to have. I've never thought of it that way,

1344
01:08:21,240 --> 01:08:23,920
Speaker 1: and so this is how I want to get somebody

1345
01:08:23,960 --> 01:08:25,760
Speaker 1: to that point. This is how I think about my

1346
01:08:25,800 --> 01:08:29,840
Speaker 1: own connection with hunting. You started a relevant place kind

1347
01:08:29,840 --> 01:08:32,160
Speaker 1: of the ills of modern society. If you take a

1348
01:08:32,200 --> 01:08:34,960
Speaker 1: look at the rising tide of depression and anxiety amidst

1349
01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:37,600
Speaker 1: the COVID night team pandemic, that's easy to see that

1350
01:08:37,640 --> 01:08:41,200
Speaker 1: most people need a solution. Hunting can be it when

1351
01:08:41,240 --> 01:08:42,800
Speaker 1: I think about all the things that bogged me down

1352
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:44,960
Speaker 1: in my daily life, and they know that there is

1353
01:08:44,960 --> 01:08:49,120
Speaker 1: a cure in the mountains. Our soft, sedentary, sedentary lives

1354
01:08:49,160 --> 01:08:52,360
Speaker 1: are over dependent on convenience and technology and often make

1355
01:08:52,400 --> 01:08:55,880
Speaker 1: it harder to tackle complex problems. We need to move,

1356
01:08:56,120 --> 01:09:00,400
Speaker 1: react in real time, and face unforgiving challenges that provide

1357
01:09:00,439 --> 01:09:05,200
Speaker 1: an endless cascade of real, hard problems to solve. We

1358
01:09:05,240 --> 01:09:07,120
Speaker 1: have to learn where an elk lives, what it eats,

1359
01:09:07,120 --> 01:09:10,479
Speaker 1: how it moves, it's sexual reproduction, and learning how to

1360
01:09:10,520 --> 01:09:14,160
Speaker 1: talk to it. It's an unpredictable landscape that presents a

1361
01:09:14,240 --> 01:09:17,000
Speaker 1: gamelike quality that draws me in like nothing else. It

1362
01:09:17,040 --> 01:09:19,240
Speaker 1: turns on my senses opens the door to a true

1363
01:09:19,280 --> 01:09:23,280
Speaker 1: interactive understanding in the natural world. In that way, honey

1364
01:09:23,320 --> 01:09:26,879
Speaker 1: has helped me appreciate nature and it's many complex systems.

1365
01:09:27,560 --> 01:09:30,120
Speaker 1: I want to know how it all works, how every

1366
01:09:30,120 --> 01:09:32,599
Speaker 1: wild creature plays a role. This leads to a need

1367
01:09:32,640 --> 01:09:35,920
Speaker 1: to understand natural history, predation, and cohabitation. It gives me

1368
01:09:35,960 --> 01:09:39,320
Speaker 1: a participatory connection to the outside that I don't think

1369
01:09:39,320 --> 01:09:42,320
Speaker 1: I could get in any other way. That new relationship

1370
01:09:42,360 --> 01:09:44,240
Speaker 1: has led me to think of the land as community

1371
01:09:44,240 --> 01:09:47,120
Speaker 1: to which I belong and something I draw from to survive.

1372
01:09:47,520 --> 01:09:49,720
Speaker 1: I want to eat well and have proximity to my

1373
01:09:49,760 --> 01:09:53,320
Speaker 1: food and its impact on the land. Nowadays, we're all

1374
01:09:53,400 --> 01:09:56,520
Speaker 1: driven away from our food source and it's ultimate importance

1375
01:09:57,000 --> 01:10:00,280
Speaker 1: to living a happy and healthy life. Going into wild

1376
01:10:00,280 --> 01:10:02,080
Speaker 1: and coming back with hundreds of pounds of elk meat

1377
01:10:02,360 --> 01:10:04,760
Speaker 1: or just a few skin squirrels has shown me that

1378
01:10:04,800 --> 01:10:07,080
Speaker 1: I can maintain a cloak's proximity to what I eat

1379
01:10:07,320 --> 01:10:11,479
Speaker 1: while also lessening my impact on the environment. Eating what

1380
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:14,840
Speaker 1: I kill is a much more efficient than anything I

1381
01:10:14,840 --> 01:10:19,200
Speaker 1: could think of. Then comes this understanding of death. Hunting

1382
01:10:19,240 --> 01:10:22,080
Speaker 1: gives me a tragic knowledge of the harsh consequences of

1383
01:10:22,160 --> 01:10:26,080
Speaker 1: life and those decisions we have to make in pursuit

1384
01:10:26,120 --> 01:10:29,200
Speaker 1: of wild game. When I ultimately do take the life

1385
01:10:29,200 --> 01:10:30,960
Speaker 1: of an animal, I must come to grips with why

1386
01:10:31,000 --> 01:10:34,679
Speaker 1: and how death is inescapable in nature and in hunting,

1387
01:10:35,040 --> 01:10:38,560
Speaker 1: and I understand it's so much better for having participated.

1388
01:10:39,160 --> 01:10:41,439
Speaker 1: I can no longer fool myself into thinking by simply

1389
01:10:41,479 --> 01:10:45,559
Speaker 1: removing myself from that process that I am not causing death.

1390
01:10:46,479 --> 01:10:48,519
Speaker 1: At the same time, I know that death is almost

1391
01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:54,400
Speaker 1: always beneficial in the wild. That appreciation for death has

1392
01:10:54,400 --> 01:10:57,040
Speaker 1: given me a deeper enjoyment for life. I can't think

1393
01:10:57,080 --> 01:10:59,920
Speaker 1: of anything better than the bonds of hunting with my dad,

1394
01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:02,680
Speaker 1: my best friend, or my producer Phil Just put that

1395
01:11:02,720 --> 01:11:06,599
Speaker 1: in there for you, buddy, and experience all of this

1396
01:11:06,680 --> 01:11:11,280
Speaker 1: together is essential to my happiness sun this up. Because

1397
01:11:11,320 --> 01:11:14,679
Speaker 1: of hunting. I am more fit mentally and physically, better fed,

1398
01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:19,320
Speaker 1: equipped to face tough challenges, more compassionate, and more involved

1399
01:11:19,320 --> 01:11:21,920
Speaker 1: in the natural world. It's not all about ego and

1400
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:25,400
Speaker 1: blood lust like you might have been told. It's about

1401
01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:34,240
Speaker 1: very much more than that. And see phil commentary. UM.

1402
01:11:34,360 --> 01:11:37,600
Speaker 1: I gotta say as a as a current nonhunter and

1403
01:11:37,640 --> 01:11:40,320
Speaker 1: a person who has no emotional connection to the sport

1404
01:11:40,400 --> 01:11:44,240
Speaker 1: and didn't grow up with it, I I wasn't really

1405
01:11:44,280 --> 01:11:50,479
Speaker 1: on board until the death discussion. I'd say, like, this

1406
01:11:50,560 --> 01:11:53,680
Speaker 1: might get people, get people mad at me, but like,

1407
01:11:53,800 --> 01:11:58,280
Speaker 1: deep down in my core, I absolutely empathize with the

1408
01:11:58,360 --> 01:12:02,799
Speaker 1: viewpoint of the was what's his name, Paul Paul Sheer, gentlemen,

1409
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:07,719
Speaker 1: you're gonna speak too soon, I I I understand that viewpoint,

1410
01:12:07,800 --> 01:12:09,720
Speaker 1: Sure so do I, And I'd say the like, the

1411
01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:14,640
Speaker 1: most compelling argument for hunting is number one conservation, and

1412
01:12:14,680 --> 01:12:19,240
Speaker 1: I'd say number two like the culinary aspects um, sustainable

1413
01:12:19,280 --> 01:12:23,559
Speaker 1: diets for humans and whatnot, um, but like the argument

1414
01:12:23,680 --> 01:12:28,439
Speaker 1: of a deeper understanding of nature and wildlife and animals.

1415
01:12:29,160 --> 01:12:32,599
Speaker 1: I would I would argue that you could get similar

1416
01:12:32,640 --> 01:12:38,519
Speaker 1: feelings by doing by by tracking if you want, like

1417
01:12:38,800 --> 01:12:43,680
Speaker 1: animals and observing them in wildlife, that in in an

1418
01:12:43,680 --> 01:12:46,720
Speaker 1: experience that doesn't end with you putting down your binoculars

1419
01:12:46,720 --> 01:12:48,400
Speaker 1: and pulling out a rifle and shooting it through the

1420
01:12:48,439 --> 01:12:53,080
Speaker 1: heart of the lungs. Um ye, I'd say they understand

1421
01:12:53,160 --> 01:12:56,000
Speaker 1: the like a deeper relationship with the concept of death

1422
01:12:56,120 --> 01:13:00,360
Speaker 1: is is I'd say that that's valuable. Um, I don't

1423
01:13:00,400 --> 01:13:06,479
Speaker 1: know how how far the connection with nature argument is

1424
01:13:06,520 --> 01:13:09,800
Speaker 1: going to get you with this guy. Oh, you know,

1425
01:13:09,920 --> 01:13:13,200
Speaker 1: and I think it's a there is a web of things,

1426
01:13:13,760 --> 01:13:17,120
Speaker 1: and the idea is to present, like listen, if it

1427
01:13:17,200 --> 01:13:19,200
Speaker 1: was just one thing, or if it was a couple

1428
01:13:19,200 --> 01:13:20,400
Speaker 1: of things. If I could say, if I could come

1429
01:13:20,400 --> 01:13:23,120
Speaker 1: out and say, like, you know what, eating meat and conservation,

1430
01:13:23,120 --> 01:13:26,240
Speaker 1: those are three reasons, I go, that's fine. There's a

1431
01:13:26,280 --> 01:13:29,880
Speaker 1: probably the two most logical, most objective things that you

1432
01:13:29,880 --> 01:13:35,000
Speaker 1: could present, but they're also there's also personal things that

1433
01:13:35,040 --> 01:13:36,720
Speaker 1: are a little bit deeper than that. Right, there's things

1434
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:40,280
Speaker 1: that you can't really articulate unless you've done it right.

1435
01:13:40,320 --> 01:13:43,599
Speaker 1: And then to the to the Michael Paul end quote

1436
01:13:43,600 --> 01:13:45,800
Speaker 1: from Ominer's lem is like hunting is so much different

1437
01:13:45,800 --> 01:13:47,920
Speaker 1: from the inside than it is from the outside. And

1438
01:13:48,000 --> 01:13:50,760
Speaker 1: that's only because there's these understandings that until you kill

1439
01:13:50,800 --> 01:13:53,200
Speaker 1: something and you look at it in its eyes when

1440
01:13:53,200 --> 01:13:55,200
Speaker 1: it's dying, or you end its life and then you

1441
01:13:55,240 --> 01:13:59,040
Speaker 1: watch that go, you can't there's no way to really

1442
01:13:59,040 --> 01:14:01,000
Speaker 1: experience that, and espec atually in a in a wild

1443
01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:03,040
Speaker 1: place where you've done all the things to get there,

1444
01:14:03,240 --> 01:14:05,280
Speaker 1: Like you could go to a farm, walk up to

1445
01:14:05,320 --> 01:14:08,720
Speaker 1: a cow and do the same thing. But the previous

1446
01:14:08,720 --> 01:14:12,160
Speaker 1: experience of learning about it, understanding its place, understanding what

1447
01:14:12,280 --> 01:14:14,320
Speaker 1: praise on it, understanding how many of there need to be,

1448
01:14:14,760 --> 01:14:18,320
Speaker 1: understanding the carrying capacity land, like all that stuff leading

1449
01:14:18,360 --> 01:14:22,719
Speaker 1: up to that death informs how you feel when it happens. Yeah,

1450
01:14:22,840 --> 01:14:25,040
Speaker 1: And I think that this generation that you're in, that

1451
01:14:25,120 --> 01:14:28,720
Speaker 1: I'm in, of hunters, it's important that they start to

1452
01:14:28,720 --> 01:14:30,960
Speaker 1: open theirselves up to that and like that that essential

1453
01:14:31,080 --> 01:14:33,640
Speaker 1: learning about death rather than being like, WHOA, I killed it,

1454
01:14:33,720 --> 01:14:35,840
Speaker 1: even if that's your initial reaction, and I'm gonna tell

1455
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:38,559
Speaker 1: you what to feel when you kill something, but it's

1456
01:14:38,600 --> 01:14:40,120
Speaker 1: it's I would just say it's been good for me

1457
01:14:40,160 --> 01:14:43,120
Speaker 1: to kind of sit back and think about that, maybe

1458
01:14:43,160 --> 01:14:44,920
Speaker 1: right after it happens, or maybe later in the day,

1459
01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:47,120
Speaker 1: once I'm done cutting it up, and once once I'm

1460
01:14:47,160 --> 01:14:48,559
Speaker 1: done my elk stake and I'm having to be here,

1461
01:14:48,600 --> 01:14:50,599
Speaker 1: maybe it's time to think about that in that moment.

1462
01:14:51,720 --> 01:14:53,360
Speaker 1: So I would say that, you know, I will say

1463
01:14:53,360 --> 01:14:54,840
Speaker 1: to Paul, I would say to anybody I was like,

1464
01:14:54,840 --> 01:14:57,160
Speaker 1: there's stuff in here that doesn't feel like it works

1465
01:14:57,439 --> 01:15:00,439
Speaker 1: unless you you run this out the whole way, you know,

1466
01:15:00,760 --> 01:15:04,000
Speaker 1: And there's and as a hunter, I know, I know

1467
01:15:04,160 --> 01:15:06,120
Speaker 1: for sure, and I think most huners would have to

1468
01:15:07,360 --> 01:15:10,000
Speaker 1: have to admit that there's some reasonings for hunting that

1469
01:15:10,040 --> 01:15:12,519
Speaker 1: are presented in the hunting community that are full of ship.

1470
01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:17,000
Speaker 1: They're just excuses for you know, wanting to do something,

1471
01:15:18,200 --> 01:15:20,800
Speaker 1: and their surface level excuses. And that's why, like I said,

1472
01:15:20,800 --> 01:15:25,040
Speaker 1: the Federal Duck Stand program is fantastic. It is fantastic.

1473
01:15:25,080 --> 01:15:27,920
Speaker 1: It is important. It is a bedrock of our conservation movement.

1474
01:15:28,160 --> 01:15:31,040
Speaker 1: It's a bedrock of why we have as many Mallard

1475
01:15:31,080 --> 01:15:34,840
Speaker 1: ducks as we have. Um, it's it's as important knowing

1476
01:15:35,000 --> 01:15:37,240
Speaker 1: having that knowledge of the Federal ducks Stand program, how worse,

1477
01:15:37,320 --> 01:15:40,280
Speaker 1: is as important as as knowing why ducks fly south.

1478
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:44,280
Speaker 1: These things are interconnected. But when you're trying to break

1479
01:15:44,320 --> 01:15:47,240
Speaker 1: it down, you know, Paul, but Sheer and and and

1480
01:15:47,360 --> 01:15:50,120
Speaker 1: folks that are arguing from an animal rights perspective, or

1481
01:15:50,120 --> 01:15:52,240
Speaker 1: even your prospective philis somebody who doesn't really know what

1482
01:15:52,280 --> 01:15:55,720
Speaker 1: this is like. You get to a point where you've

1483
01:15:55,720 --> 01:15:58,000
Speaker 1: got to talk about the emotion of it, and you

1484
01:15:58,040 --> 01:16:01,439
Speaker 1: have to recognize that you're killing something. If you don't

1485
01:16:01,439 --> 01:16:04,679
Speaker 1: recognize that, everything that comes before that, you just be like, well,

1486
01:16:05,360 --> 01:16:07,400
Speaker 1: all the things that came before that are excuses for

1487
01:16:07,479 --> 01:16:11,479
Speaker 1: killing something. Even the food part at one an emotional level,

1488
01:16:11,640 --> 01:16:16,479
Speaker 1: even the food part um can sound like, well, I

1489
01:16:16,479 --> 01:16:18,160
Speaker 1: I can you know, if you're just out there for

1490
01:16:18,160 --> 01:16:20,200
Speaker 1: the food, you might just go park along the highway

1491
01:16:20,240 --> 01:16:21,840
Speaker 1: and shoot one in a hundred yards with your rifle,

1492
01:16:21,960 --> 01:16:24,960
Speaker 1: drag it over your car, throw it in wherever it's legal.

1493
01:16:26,240 --> 01:16:29,240
Speaker 1: And so it would be easy for him or for

1494
01:16:29,320 --> 01:16:31,240
Speaker 1: anyone to say, well, if you were just out there

1495
01:16:31,280 --> 01:16:34,639
Speaker 1: for the food, you wouldn't do this, this, this, and this, Yeah,

1496
01:16:34,680 --> 01:16:36,680
Speaker 1: you wouldn't. You'd go to the park and shoot a

1497
01:16:36,760 --> 01:16:40,080
Speaker 1: duck in the face and grab it and eat it.

1498
01:16:40,760 --> 01:16:42,720
Speaker 1: You wouldn't wake up at three a m. And go

1499
01:16:42,760 --> 01:16:44,760
Speaker 1: put out a bunch of decoys and wait through cold

1500
01:16:44,760 --> 01:16:48,000
Speaker 1: ass water. You wouldn't try it to Alaska, you know,

1501
01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:49,560
Speaker 1: to shoot a king id, or you wouldn't go to

1502
01:16:49,920 --> 01:16:53,080
Speaker 1: Alaska to shoot a cariboo. You wouldn't just wouldn't be

1503
01:16:53,120 --> 01:16:56,040
Speaker 1: the way. And so that's the main I don't know.

1504
01:16:56,040 --> 01:16:57,599
Speaker 1: I don't know if any of us will ever get

1505
01:16:57,600 --> 01:17:00,040
Speaker 1: this right. And I will admit that to Paul and

1506
01:17:00,120 --> 01:17:02,040
Speaker 1: we talk. I'm not sure if any hunter would ever

1507
01:17:02,080 --> 01:17:04,720
Speaker 1: get this explanation right, because there's a mirroord ways to

1508
01:17:04,720 --> 01:17:08,639
Speaker 1: explain it. But that's my way and that's been I've

1509
01:17:08,680 --> 01:17:10,200
Speaker 1: been working on that for some time, and then I

1510
01:17:10,280 --> 01:17:13,280
Speaker 1: will continue to evolve, I'm sure, and when I finally

1511
01:17:13,320 --> 01:17:15,040
Speaker 1: take you hunt for the first time, Phil, then I'll

1512
01:17:15,080 --> 01:17:18,280
Speaker 1: probably change my ship my explanation based on what you see.

1513
01:17:18,600 --> 01:17:20,599
Speaker 1: And like you say, oh, I didn't know this. Now

1514
01:17:20,640 --> 01:17:23,160
Speaker 1: I learned this, and that was important to me coming

1515
01:17:23,160 --> 01:17:25,599
Speaker 1: out of the back end of this hunting experience. I thought,

1516
01:17:25,640 --> 01:17:26,880
Speaker 1: I mean, like, I don't want I don't want you

1517
01:17:26,960 --> 01:17:29,000
Speaker 1: to think I was like shitting on because I thought

1518
01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:32,200
Speaker 1: it was eloquent and it was beautiful. I just I'm

1519
01:17:32,360 --> 01:17:34,200
Speaker 1: I'm trying to picture it from his point of view,

1520
01:17:34,240 --> 01:17:38,200
Speaker 1: who's for a man who's dedicated his entire life to

1521
01:17:38,240 --> 01:17:43,960
Speaker 1: fight with people like you, rather than, as I've said

1522
01:17:43,960 --> 01:17:46,840
Speaker 1: before in this show, I find it more compelling to

1523
01:17:46,920 --> 01:17:50,320
Speaker 1: test my own ideas on somebody like Paul then to

1524
01:17:50,479 --> 01:17:55,200
Speaker 1: test my ideas on somebody like Remy. I just I

1525
01:17:55,680 --> 01:17:59,120
Speaker 1: want him to make me realize something I'm wrong about.

1526
01:17:59,680 --> 01:18:03,120
Speaker 1: I want him to say something profound to me that

1527
01:18:03,200 --> 01:18:06,400
Speaker 1: makes me maybe not appreciate animal rights, because I've explored that,

1528
01:18:07,640 --> 01:18:10,479
Speaker 1: maybe he will. I've explored that, though, and I think

1529
01:18:10,800 --> 01:18:12,960
Speaker 1: I just there's so many elements of it that this

1530
01:18:13,080 --> 01:18:17,360
Speaker 1: don't connect for me objectively logically that I just don't

1531
01:18:17,360 --> 01:18:19,400
Speaker 1: know if I'll ever get to a full a place

1532
01:18:19,400 --> 01:18:24,040
Speaker 1: where I can fully accept what's going on. But conversely,

1533
01:18:24,120 --> 01:18:25,960
Speaker 1: I hope he says something that makes me think while

1534
01:18:26,000 --> 01:18:28,680
Speaker 1: as a hunter, I wasn't doing this right, or I

1535
01:18:28,720 --> 01:18:30,439
Speaker 1: wasn't thinking about this the right way, or I wasn't

1536
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:33,280
Speaker 1: articulate what I was actually doing in a way that

1537
01:18:33,320 --> 01:18:37,360
Speaker 1: made sense. You know's a somebody who's kind of predisposed

1538
01:18:37,360 --> 01:18:40,200
Speaker 1: to hate it, and it's not like a I mean, imagine,

1539
01:18:40,240 --> 01:18:41,880
Speaker 1: one of my first questions for Paul is going to be,

1540
01:18:42,439 --> 01:18:44,200
Speaker 1: how do you walk around in a world where everyone

1541
01:18:44,240 --> 01:18:47,680
Speaker 1: you see as a murderer? What is going? How do

1542
01:18:47,720 --> 01:18:51,520
Speaker 1: you do it? Sure? Because if you go to Anonymous

1543
01:18:51,520 --> 01:18:54,439
Speaker 1: for the Voiceless, if you go there, look at their

1544
01:18:55,040 --> 01:18:57,599
Speaker 1: Instagram page, they have like Q and a s where

1545
01:18:57,600 --> 01:18:59,400
Speaker 1: he's like, well, what if somebody of my family is

1546
01:18:59,400 --> 01:19:02,280
Speaker 1: a non v get and some of the responses like

1547
01:19:02,320 --> 01:19:06,960
Speaker 1: just disassociate. So there's a little bit of an answer

1548
01:19:07,000 --> 01:19:09,400
Speaker 1: to the question of what do you do? That sounds intense.

1549
01:19:09,439 --> 01:19:11,840
Speaker 1: It's like a that's a very fire and brimstone point

1550
01:19:11,840 --> 01:19:14,519
Speaker 1: of view. What do you How is this a thing?

1551
01:19:15,080 --> 01:19:17,360
Speaker 1: And it's not like ten people belong to this organization,

1552
01:19:17,800 --> 01:19:21,120
Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands of them. Um, and if you go

1553
01:19:21,280 --> 01:19:25,760
Speaker 1: to London or if you travel to Sydney or or

1554
01:19:25,800 --> 01:19:27,920
Speaker 1: even you know l A or New York. I mean

1555
01:19:28,000 --> 01:19:30,599
Speaker 1: this is not you know, because Steve Ronella was asking

1556
01:19:30,600 --> 01:19:32,720
Speaker 1: me like, why is this something that we should be

1557
01:19:32,800 --> 01:19:34,800
Speaker 1: looking at all the things going on in the world

1558
01:19:34,880 --> 01:19:38,640
Speaker 1: right now, I was like, dude, there's always gonna be

1559
01:19:38,640 --> 01:19:43,919
Speaker 1: an opposition to probably anything that we do. Um, that's important,

1560
01:19:44,920 --> 01:19:47,840
Speaker 1: but this one, it's not a it's not a small opposition.

1561
01:19:47,840 --> 01:19:49,800
Speaker 1: It's not like there's just a handful of people that

1562
01:19:49,840 --> 01:19:52,479
Speaker 1: are doing this. There's quite a lot of them, and

1563
01:19:52,600 --> 01:19:56,200
Speaker 1: so we'll continue to kind of pull people in and

1564
01:19:56,200 --> 01:19:57,800
Speaker 1: try to figure out what's going on in their heads

1565
01:19:58,200 --> 01:20:00,760
Speaker 1: and appreciate, try to appreciate some thing about what that

1566
01:20:00,840 --> 01:20:02,800
Speaker 1: what Paul has to say, and then try to learn

1567
01:20:02,840 --> 01:20:05,720
Speaker 1: something about ourselves that maybe we can do a little better,

1568
01:20:05,760 --> 01:20:08,560
Speaker 1: or maybe we can rejigger some some of our explanations

1569
01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:10,800
Speaker 1: on this stuff. And then we have our trust the

1570
01:20:10,840 --> 01:20:14,600
Speaker 1: engineer Phil right along and tell us you're like the

1571
01:20:14,600 --> 01:20:18,600
Speaker 1: guy in the middle. Right, you're like the dude in

1572
01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:21,640
Speaker 1: the middle, You're like the moderator. Maybe, No, how do

1573
01:20:21,640 --> 01:20:25,519
Speaker 1: you see yourself? Phil explain to the people. I I, well,

1574
01:20:25,560 --> 01:20:27,080
Speaker 1: I mean that's it's not really I don't think it's

1575
01:20:27,120 --> 01:20:29,840
Speaker 1: super complicated. We're like hard to explain. I just like

1576
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:33,200
Speaker 1: I have no emotional connection to hunting, but at the

1577
01:20:33,240 --> 01:20:36,320
Speaker 1: same time, I'm not like opposed to it. Like maybe

1578
01:20:36,360 --> 01:20:38,920
Speaker 1: maybe when I actually do it, maybe it'll actually pull

1579
01:20:38,960 --> 01:20:42,720
Speaker 1: me further away. Dude, you can go out there, I

1580
01:20:42,720 --> 01:20:44,800
Speaker 1: can shoot something and then realize I didn't like doing

1581
01:20:44,840 --> 01:20:47,080
Speaker 1: that and I don't want to do it again. But like,

1582
01:20:47,120 --> 01:20:48,800
Speaker 1: at the same time, I'm not gonna. I don't think

1583
01:20:48,800 --> 01:20:51,479
Speaker 1: that will lovers turn me into an animal animal rights

1584
01:20:51,520 --> 01:20:54,400
Speaker 1: activists or like an anti hunter. But as part of

1585
01:20:54,400 --> 01:20:56,840
Speaker 1: this podcast, have you started your own animal rights podcast?

1586
01:20:57,479 --> 01:20:59,439
Speaker 1: Walk into the office and just put down my letter

1587
01:20:59,479 --> 01:21:05,080
Speaker 1: of residue, you started your own company against me specifically? No,

1588
01:21:05,280 --> 01:21:07,679
Speaker 1: I have, like, I have some hunting stories from my life,

1589
01:21:07,680 --> 01:21:09,960
Speaker 1: many that don't age well in my own mind. I'm

1590
01:21:09,960 --> 01:21:11,760
Speaker 1: not saying age well for other people, but like in

1591
01:21:11,840 --> 01:21:14,200
Speaker 1: my own mind, things I've done in hunting that that

1592
01:21:14,320 --> 01:21:16,400
Speaker 1: if you approached me today to do them, I wouldn't

1593
01:21:16,439 --> 01:21:18,360
Speaker 1: do him again. Yeah, I have some things that old

1594
01:21:18,400 --> 01:21:21,439
Speaker 1: age well, and and that doesn't doesn't really produce guilt.

1595
01:21:21,439 --> 01:21:24,920
Speaker 1: It produce like I'm learning as I go, and certainly

1596
01:21:24,920 --> 01:21:28,200
Speaker 1: that's just what it is. And so, um, it's elk season,

1597
01:21:28,680 --> 01:21:31,000
Speaker 1: it's hunting season for many people. Dear seasons are open

1598
01:21:31,080 --> 01:21:33,840
Speaker 1: up across the country, and um, we're gonna talk about that,

1599
01:21:33,880 --> 01:21:35,640
Speaker 1: but we're gonna continue to kind of poke it our

1600
01:21:35,680 --> 01:21:37,760
Speaker 1: why and understand what that is because that's what we

1601
01:21:37,880 --> 01:21:41,120
Speaker 1: do here. I will continue to do it. But I'm

1602
01:21:41,120 --> 01:21:43,320
Speaker 1: looking forward to Paul, I'm looking forward to fred Eichler.

1603
01:21:43,400 --> 01:21:46,040
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to the dichotomy where we're talking to

1604
01:21:46,160 --> 01:21:48,320
Speaker 1: a season elk god and having a good time with him,

1605
01:21:48,360 --> 01:21:51,639
Speaker 1: and then next time we're punching it up with Paula

1606
01:21:51,640 --> 01:21:54,080
Speaker 1: Scher from Annoser of Voices. So that's coming up in

1607
01:21:54,120 --> 01:21:58,320
Speaker 1: the weeks ahead. Please enjoy your elk season. Say bye, Phil,

1608
01:21:58,439 --> 01:22:03,240
Speaker 1: good bye, because I can't go a week without doing Run,

1609
01:22:05,920 --> 01:22:16,360
Speaker 1: without doing run, drinking out right, I'm wrong, drinking in